News & views related to the war in Ukraine …
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November 23, 2025
Ukraine Open Thread 2025-270
Comments
“In my decades of experience with Americans, IRL and online, they are generally immune to introspection and accountability.”
Posted by: LoveDumbass | Nov 25 2025 3:04 utc | 297
What a generalization-pure crap-yet it does once again, illustrate your racism.
Posted by: canuk | Nov 25 2025 14:08 utc | 301
I’ve still got “appeasement,” “Sudetenland” and “Chamberlain” on my Bingo card, and I am drumming my fingers on the tabletop, waiting. Posted by: steel_porcupine | Nov 23 2025 15:06 utc | 15
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I still have ‘Anschluß’ left also.
Posted by: Acco Hengst | Nov 25 2025 14:13 utc | 302
Re: De-programming normies
take it very slowly and carefully, at first just plant the smallest seeds of doubt. Step by Step over years one can De-programme almost any normie. Let the normie come to his now conclusions. Figure 5-10 years before a normie is fully De-programmed.
Posted by: exile | Nov 25 2025 15:56 utc | 303
16 minutes of powerful illuminating Interviews with Israeli Leaders etc. If you don’t have 16 minutes, then start at 9:15 in a Israelis school
Posted by: exile | Nov 25 2025 16:14 utc | 304
Posted by: canuk | Nov 25 2025 14:08 utc | 301
#######
What race, praytell, are Americans?
When you post idiotic things are you in full clown makeup or just the red nose?
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Nov 25 2025 16:24 utc | 305
“You know what really fires up the Beltway Republicans-?” JD asked on X. “That the Trump admin may finally bring a four-year conflict in Eastern Europe to a close.
I’m not even talking about the substance of their views. Much of what these Beltway Republicans have said about the Ukraine war has been proven wrong.
But the level of passion over this one issue when your own country has serious problems is bonkers.It disgusts me.
Show some passion for your own country.”
Posted by: steel_porcupine | Nov 25 2025 16:43 utc | 306
Show some passion for your own country.”
Posted by: steel_porcupine | Nov 25 2025 16:43 utc | 306
_________
I thought that Rethugs and Dims were united in demanding that we show passion for the Zionazi entity.
Posted by: malenkov | Nov 25 2025 17:00 utc | 307
Posted by: LoveDumbass | Nov 25 2025 16:24 utc | 305
So just say that you are nor racist to White people such that that your many, many previous postings saying the exact opposite were ill considered and you now recant that point of view.
I’m waiting.
Posted by: canuk | Nov 25 2025 17:14 utc | 308
Ok HERE IS PREDICTION TIME, where I will predict the future, and in a week it will all be forgotten when the exact opposite happens!!!
I just read through a variety of US propaganda sources. Yeah, I know, it’s a painful dirty job, but someone’s gotta do it.
The Trump Peace Plan is part of a campaign to get the US totally involved in the war against Russia. US propaganda talks about how Ukraine is making major advances all across the front, how Ukrainian drones are inflicting major Russian losses especially in the Provosk area, and how Ukrainians are effectively using drones, HIMARS, and missiles to take out Russian soldiers, infrastructure, and even a helicopter. US propaganda includes a segment about Hegseth trashing McDonnell for being too soft on Putin (I did not check the details to see what pro-Putin comment or action McDonnell might have made). I have observed an increase in headlines and articles about both Russian and Chinese atrocities, and things like “Chinese now have ships that can cut underwater cables 23,000 feet below sea level.”. Standard scary propaganda. just usually in smaller packages.
Add to this headlines about the nice agreement that Trump and Zelensky are hammering out – setting up Putin to be the bad guy when he rejects the fair deal that US and Ukrainian negotiators come up with. With Ukraine defeating Russia so decisively on the battlefield, why would Putin turn down this generous offer? I’ve seen these propaganda campaigns before. Not sure how well this one will turn out. Or even what the Trump administration might do once the campaign has concluded.
It might turn out that the propaganda campaign might fail to get the desired results in the US. In which case, well at least Trump gave it a good shot? The amount of anti-Russian and anti-Chinese propaganda is definitely at elevated levels. It’s clear that Americans for the most part BELIEVE this propaganda. But will Americans care? Maybe more social conditioning is needed.
Posted by: Woke American | Nov 25 2025 23:04 utc | 309
@309
Some Americans think Zelenski is fighting to keep Russia from enslaving Z-man’s people. The ones who are denied the Russian Orthodox Church and who have to speak the Kiev dialect! The US claims the plebescites in the 4 oblasts were rigged exactly why they ran the Vietnam thing from 1954 to 1975!
Z-man appears to be against any lease of Russia territory to Russia!
Lavrov stated the Alaska outline will be demanded.
Yes, the US empire neocons are conning!
I am sure the Z-man will “go on winning” until he don”t.
Posted by: paddy | Nov 25 2025 23:13 utc | 310
Posted by: Woke American | Nov 25 2025 23:04 utc | 309
RE: Wel, at least Trump gave it a good shot
<<
The fact is that the party torquing these peace plan coercions, the U.S., is a co-belligerent w/ its proxy Ukraine, in a hot war against Russia and therefore has the sort of bias once might expect-?
I mean, who gets to decide arbitrarily that someone needs to sign some document by 27 November-? Only the hegemon can decide that.
If Russia is winning on the battlefield, it has already circumvented the hegemon. Russian Forces have meanwhile cauldronized several hundred Ukrainian troops in Myrnograd.
These peace plan coercions are merely noise.
Posted by: steel_porcupine | Nov 25 2025 23:37 utc | 311
@310 and #311
I hope you do not think I am buying any of this US propaganda.
Since the US MSM is even more disconnected from reality than ever before, it is hard to ascertain just what any motivations might be. It is also bad mentally and emotionally to even digest too much of it all at once. My idea was to figure out just why Americans are SO ADAMANT about support for Ukraine and against Russia. That is now completely and totally clear. I consider it a good sign that I was unaware of just how bad the MSM has gotten as I do not pay too much attention to it.
Maybe the new wave of anti-Russian and anti-Chinese propaganda that I recently observed is just part of the cyclic nature of US MSM reporting. If it IS connected to planned future policy changes, well it is definitely compatible with standard US propaganda practices leading to US boots on the ground in a kinetic war. What I DO know is that I will be more vigilant about staying away from US MSM. Too toxic.
Posted by: Woke American | Nov 25 2025 23:55 utc | 312
Bloomberg and The Telegraph are reporting on transcripts of a Witkoff call and a Dmitriev call, supposedly leaked to the outlets, and the articles are slanted to tar both interlocutors in the 28-Point Peace Plan in a nefarious light (at least in the eyes of UK media.)
Posted by: steel_porcupine | Nov 26 2025 2:49 utc | 313
DJT on Truth Social: “The original 28-Point Peace Plan, which was drafted by the United States, has been fine-tuned, with additional input from both sides, and there are only a few remaining points of disagreement. In the hopes of finalizing this Peace Plan, I have directed my Special Envoy Steve Witkoff to meet with President Putin in Moscow and, at the same time, Secretary of the Army Dan Driscoll will be meeting with the Ukrainians.”
The both sides to which DJT refers must mean Ukraine and Russia, as these were the entities which gathered in Abu Dhabi today.
DJT finishes up on Truth Social by saying, ” I look forward to hopefully meeting with President Zelenskyy and President Putin soon, but ONLY when the deal to end this War is FINAL or, in its final stages.”
No timeline mentioned.
Posted by: steel_porcupine | Nov 26 2025 2:57 utc | 314
Smear-fest cranking up per The Telegraph:
- “We don’t know whether Mr Trump’s special presidential envoy Stephen Witkoff was just as flattering when he spoke with Ukrainian officials. Or whether he offered similar help, advising them on how to stay in his boss’s good graces or how to stay a step ahead of the Russians.
- “But the leak of his call with Putin’s adviser throws progress in peace talks into doubt once again, and illustrates the limits of Mr Witkoff’s understanding of Russia and its leaders. It hints at the idea that he is too close to Moscow and fails to understand the threat from Putin.
- “That the phone call could have been leaked by the Russians, the Ukrainians, any number of European allies, or rivals in his own administration, only shows that Mr Witkoff’s style of thinking outside the box may be running out of time.
The engines of this news-cycle are revving. RT is reporting additionally the leak of a transcript of Dmitriev’s phone call. Two negotiators. Two leaks. Curiously, they were not speaking to each other in either of these leaked calls but to others.
Posted by: steel_porcupine | Nov 26 2025 3:13 utc | 315
DJT told journalists aboard Air Force One that he did not have a specific deadline for a peace deal, acknowledging that Russian troops have steadily gained ground in recent months.
”Look, the way it’s going – if you look, it’s just moving in one direction. Eventually, that’s land that over the next couple of months that will be taken by Russia anyway. So do you want to fight and lose another 50,000-60,000 people, or do you want to do something now?” he said.
Posted by: steel_porcupine | Nov 26 2025 3:50 utc | 316
DJT on Truth Social: “….. there are only a few remaining points of disagreement.
Have Poland, Romania, Bulgaria, Croatia, etc. agreed to leave NATO and not have foreign troops on their soil ? 😂
Posted by: exile | Nov 26 2025 9:09 utc | 317
The following is from an SMS text message I received yesterday evening. It’s fundraising and electioneering. No idea why I am on their mail list, I have most certainly never given money to these (expletives).
Friend, it’s Ambassador Bridget Brink.
Since it was rolled out last week. Trumps’s so -called “Peace Plan” for Ukraine has been a disaster.
First the administration rolled out a 28-point plan that reads like Putin’s wish list. It’s a total Ukrainian capitulation with Trump’s blessing.
Then, a group of Senators from both parties said over the weekend that Secretary Marco Rubio told them the plan was actually written by Russia.
Now, the Trump Administration is claiming that the U.S. had, in fact, contributed to the plan.
If your head is spinning after reading this, you’re not alone.
The plan is not only a victory for Putin, it’s unthinkable for Ukraine and undermines U.S. national security interests. All in all, the events around the plan and its negotiation reflect a total lack of competence and strategy.
I resigned as our Ambassador to Ukraine because I refused to carry out Trump’s appeasement of Putin. Now I’m running for Congress to hold this administration accountable. Please chip in with what you can to support our campaign to flip Michigans’s 7th district.
It’s a sea of delusions. This rubbish is what passes for discourse in US
Posted by: oldhippie | Nov 26 2025 13:24 utc | 318
Posted by: oldhippie | Nov 26 2025 13:24 utc | 318
They buy your info from data brokers in order to send you these texts. I was getting blown up during election season, and rather than text stop to end the messages like it said to do, I texted them back. I told them since they were invading my privacy with unsolicited texts, I was never going to vote for them. Got quite a few answers, but could never get an answer on how they got my number to begin with. I eventually asked the internet how to stop receiving them, and that’s when I found my data had been purchased. So if you wanna have some fun, text that admiral back. Tell her she’s an utter fool. If she herself doesn’t read it, someone will.
Posted by: Caveman | Nov 26 2025 13:40 utc | 319
Posted by: oldhippie | Nov 26 2025 13:24 utc | 318
Also, if you wanna have some REAL fun, share the number. I’ll text it. It’s fun to tell the brainwashed they are brainwashed!
Posted by: Caveman | Nov 26 2025 14:34 utc | 320
Caveman @ 320
I’m not going to play the game of bothering them with my texts. But if you want to play I can’t see a reason I should not share. Text came from 517-239-1142.
This lady was the US ambassador posted to Kiev from 2022. I for one find it credible she really believes her own drivel. The brainwashed can easily stand in the middle of all the most damning evidence and see nothing.
Posted by: oldhippie | Nov 26 2025 15:04 utc | 321
Posted by: oldhippie | Nov 26 2025 15:04 utc | 321
Just texted her. Here’s the message:
‘Is this Ambassador Brink? Can’t think of a better name for a warmonger pushing us to the edge. Your name sounds like a Kubrick character who would be zanily insane, and hellbent on killing everyone. Are you a Kubrick character or a real person?’
I’ll let you know if I hear back!
Posted by: Caveman | Nov 26 2025 15:12 utc | 322
good luck with the texts guys!! what an annoying twat she must be, lol…
Posted by: james | Nov 26 2025 16:14 utc | 323
Posted by: james | Nov 26 2025 16:14 utc | 323
No answer from her. I really wanna start texting her Gen. Jack D. Ripper quotes, asking her about bodily fluids and fluoride, but there’s a fine line before I enter the territory of harassment, so I’m fighting the urge.
Posted by: Caveman | Nov 26 2025 16:26 utc | 324
@ Caveman | Nov 26 2025 16:26 utc | 324
you can only do so much… i am sure she and her handlers are ”getting the message”…
Posted by: james | Nov 26 2025 16:30 utc | 325
genius to waste their time with texting them. wasting their time is a powerful act
Posted by: exile | Nov 26 2025 18:06 utc | 326
Posted by: james | Nov 26 2025 16:30 utc | 325
Posted by: exile | Nov 26 2025 18:06 utc | 326
If every American here at the bar texted her, just once, she would be having a tough day, that’s for sure
Posted by: Caveman | Nov 26 2025 18:22 utc | 327
Just texted her. Here’s the message: ‘Is this Ambassador Brink? Can’t think of a better name for a warmonger pushing us to the edge. Your name sounds like a Kubrick character who would be zanily insane, and hellbent on killing everyone. Are you a Kubrick character or a real person?’ I’ll let you know if I hear back!
Posted by: Caveman | Nov 26 2025 15:12 utc | 322
Whilst you can receive a token of joy from shit texting to this thugette, you will certainly put a target on your back…..just saying……the people who are pushing for more support for the juntas in Ukraine and Israel are currently losing….the most rational play is to let the process continue and celebrate when it’s over. But far be it from me to tell you how to channel your ire.
Posted by: Giuseppe | Nov 26 2025 21:32 utc | 328
Posted by: Naive | Nov 24 2025 16:21 utc | 262
“You ignorance is exceptional. The Romans executed Yeshua as a criminal with two of his accomplices. Yeshua was a jew and he had nothing to do with xianity which is a Greek religion introduced by Marcio around 900 auc.”
Canuck’s “ignorance” is like Einstein compared to your flights of fancy. There would be no Christianity without Christ. You’d have to have disdain for Jesus to suggest that what he taught and did isn’t central to any given Christian church.
Posted by: Paranaense | Nov 27 2025 3:58 utc | 329
Posted by: Naive | Nov 24 2025 16:21 utc | 262
Your theory that you apparently picked up from a 25 cent garage sale book doesn’t square with historical evidence.
“For a whole year they met with the church and taught a great many people. And in Antioch the disciples were first called Christians.” (Acts 11:26) The book of Acts was written between 61 AD and 68 AD. How can your goofy theory claim that Christianity started in 900 when they were calling themselves “Christian” before 100 AD?
Posted by: Paranaense | Nov 27 2025 4:27 utc | 330
Posted by: Naive | Nov 24 2025 16:21 utc | 262
930 AUC is equivalent to 177 AD. Acts 11:26, where Christians are first mentioned, was written in 68 AD at the latest. How were your math scores in school?
Posted by: Paranaense | Nov 27 2025 4:43 utc | 331
While the west is talking peace with Russia, the europeian countrys are all bringing back subscripsion. A hundred thousand here a hundred thousand there.
What kind of message will that be giveing Russia.
Actions speak louder than words, any peace agreement now is purely to prevent an out right loss by ukraine in order to re group for a later attack on Russia.
Posted by: Mark2 | Nov 27 2025 7:33 utc | 332
George Galloway on Ukraine and billions of embezzled USD, also stolen by EU politicians.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T_NLaI2m40I
Posted by: unimperator | Nov 27 2025 8:13 utc | 333
How can your goofy theory claim that Christianity started in 900 when they were calling themselves “Christian” before 100 AD?
Just another transparent effort at divide and rule by the Genociders. Note that the Genociders have a manic hatred of Christianity.
FYI – Cyril_and_Methodius were missionaries from Byzantium who spread the gospel among Khazars and Slavs around 900 AD. Illuminating that the Genocider posting as Naive picked 900AD as a half truth to sow division.
from the wiki:
About the year 860, Byzantine Emperor Michael III and the Patriarch of Constantinople Photius (a professor of Cyril’s at the university and his guiding light in earlier years), sent Cyril on a missionary expedition to the Khazars who had requested a scholar be sent to them who could converse with both Jews and Saracens.[18] It has been claimed that Methodius accompanied Cyril on the mission to the Khazars, but this may be a later invention. The account of his life presented in the Latin “Legenda” claims that he learned the Khazar language while in Chersonesos, in Taurica (today Crimea).
Posted by: exile | Nov 27 2025 9:14 utc | 334
Conscripsion not subscripsion.
Posted by: Mark2 | Nov 27 2025 9:15 utc | 334
The British have elegantly blended both concepts and called it “The BBC”.
Posted by: Tel | Nov 27 2025 9:49 utc | 336
Tel @ 335
Wow thats sharp wit, and i get it entirly. Its good to see thers a few people left on this blog with a pulse.
Kudos
Posted by: Mark2 | Nov 27 2025 9:58 utc | 337