Executive Order Provides For Bailout Of Overextended AI Companies

November 25, 2025

In December 2024 President Donald Trump named venture capitalist David O. Sacks as the “White House A.I. & Crypto Czar.”

Sacks is set to guide the administration’s policies for artificial intelligence and cryptocurrency.

AI-researcher Gary Markus is wondering how two recent tweets by Gary Sacks relate to each other:

One theory of capitalism holds that every company should be left to their own devices, with state intervention kept a minimum. This view was well articulated just a few weeks ago, by White House AI and Crypto Czar and well-known podcaster, David O. Sacks:

David Sacks @DavidSacks – 16:52 UTC · Nov 6, 2025

There will be no federal bailout for AI. The U.S. has at least 5 major frontier model companies. If one fails, others will take its place.

The other theory of capitalism, if we can indeed call it that, holds that we should bailout important companies or industries that might overextend themselves. Quite the opposite from the above.

This latter theory, almost a form of safety-net socialism for overextended companies, seemed to be implied today, in a tweet that seemed to be laying the groundwork for bailout, by none other than … White House AI and Crypto Czar and well-known podcaster, David O. Sacks:

David Sacks @DavidSacks – 17:34 UTC · Nov 24, 2025

According to today’s WSJ, AI-related investment accounts for half of GDP growth. A reversal would risk recession. We can’t afford to go backwards.

The WSJ report Sacks mentions, archived here, is indeed gloomy:

The economy’s dependence on AI comes with risks. Stock price/earnings ratios are near record highs. If lofty profit predictions prove wrong, share prices may tumble and investment could slow. The S&P 500 fell about 2% last week on concerns about a bubble, despite rallying 1% on Friday.

Falling stocks could trigger a reverse wealth effect: Americans would consume less, which would tend to depress sales, profits and, potentially, employment.
…
If AI investment stopped growing, that could knock another 0.5 point off growth, Millar estimates. If it went to zero, that would knock a full percentage point off.
…
Another risk relates to the growing scale of AI-related borrowing.
…
If the revenue necessary to service that debt doesn’t materialize, lenders could take a hit, spilling over into debt markets, said Berezin.

China is letting the first type of capitalism reign their Artificial Intelligence efforts:

Rather than pick winners and losers, China states the policy objective and hundreds of commercial initiatives compete using diverse strategies to fulfil the ambition. Instead of a ‘winner takes all subsidies’ China gets a diverse, agile, ecosystem growing in parallel to its rapidly innovative economy.

Many Chinese models are published as open source and can be run on smaller clusters.

The U.S. has however decided to let the second form of capitalism rule its AI endeavors. There are only a few companies working on large AI projects. Their models are private and blocked from scrutiny. They are promising too much and are spending a huge amount of money. They are in need of ‘safety-net socialism for overextended companies’.

To provide for this the White House issued an Executive Order on:

LAUNCHING THE GENESIS MISSION

By the authority vested in me as President by the Constitution and the laws of the United States of America, it is hereby ordered:

Section 1. Purpose. From the founding of our Republic, scientific discovery and technological innovation have driven American progress and prosperity. Today, America is in a race for global technology dominance in the development of artificial intelligence (AI), an important frontier of scientific discovery and economic growth. To that end, my Administration has taken a number of actions to win that race, including issuing multiple Executive Orders and implementing America’s AI Action Plan, which recognizes the need to invest in AI-enabled science to accelerate scientific advancement. In this pivotal moment, the challenges we face require a historic national effort, comparable in urgency and ambition to the Manhattan Project that was instrumental to our victory in World War II and was a critical basis for the foundation of the Department of Energy (DOE) and its national laboratories.

The Department of Energy is ordered to direct the initiative combining federal laboratories and ‘industry partners’:

Within 90 days of the date of this order, the Secretary shall identify Federal computing, storage, and networking resources available to support the Mission, including both DOE on-premises and cloud-based high-performance computing systems, and resources available through industry partners. The Secretary shall also identify any additional partnerships or infrastructure enhancements that could support the computational foundation for the Platform.

The federal government will of course have to pay for those private resources.

Research with the help of AI will be done in six high priority fields. The timeline provided in the Executive Order is extremely ambitious.

Besides providing the instruments for a bailout the Executive Order is also creating the means of central control over AI and its application:

If you strip away the branding, Genesis is the U.S. government building a national AI backbone inside the Department of Energy and then inviting the biggest private sector AI players to plug into it.
…
But underneath, it centralizes the AI stack. Instead of letting the highest end compute and model capabilities drift entirely into the private sector, Genesis pulls them back into a structured federal environment. Access becomes conditional: follow the safety rules, share the data, integrate into the platform and you get to operate at the frontier. Don’t, and you’re on the outside looking in.
…
Genesis is the beginning of a nationalized AI infrastructure strategy. It will function as the bridge between government compute and private sector models, letting Washington influence which companies sit closest to the frontier and which capabilities get priority. It will speed up real scientific breakthroughs, but it will also quietly define the rules of the AI race on who participates, who gets access, and how the most powerful systems are directed.

By allowing for a bailout of over extended AI companies via ‘Manhattan Project’ sized federal spending Trump is also attempting to prevent a stock market slump that would cost the Republicans the majority in the House.

Posted by b on November 25, 2025 at 15:45 UTC | Permalink

Comments

When the government picks out what company to finance, subsidize it is not capitalism, it is Fascism.,

Posted by: canuk | Nov 25 2025 15:52 utc | 1

AGI, then ASI. Some say AGI is already here.

Posted by: 5jumpchump | Nov 25 2025 15:53 utc | 2

Just another way to steal public money.

Posted by: Norwegian | Nov 25 2025 15:55 utc | 3

“The U.S. has however decided to let the second form of capitalism rule its AI endeavors.”. They made that decision in 2007 and have been doing it ever since. I think the quip was Socialism for the rich, Capitalism for the rest.

Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Nov 25 2025 15:56 utc | 4

What else would expect from a New York Liberal but Wall Street socialism.

Posted by: Polli | Nov 25 2025 16:00 utc | 5

This is going to destroy this country big time. The wreckege will be epic. And ZioDon will be part of that.

Posted by: SO | Nov 25 2025 16:01 utc | 6

Hyperloop , walking on Mars and robots escalated somehow quickly into Hyperinflation , praying Mars and zombies … But the shareholders were filthy rich for a moment ^^.

Posted by: Savonarole | Nov 25 2025 16:01 utc | 7

“The federal government will of course have to pay for those private resources.”

Or, the US citizens (and the vassals confer Lehman Brothers in 2008) will pay for it.
Privatization of the benefits and socialization of the costs.

Posted by: xor | Nov 25 2025 16:03 utc | 8

Capitalism, fascism, racism, sexism, woman, terrorist. One way you know that the bad guys are in charge is the continuous morphing of words from limited and well understood to ambiguous and unlimited.

I think the term for this is Orwellian. But I can’t be sure because words don’t mean anything anymore. What am I even talking about?

Posted by: HB Brian | Nov 25 2025 16:03 utc | 9

Ben Norton – eye-opening – few hours ago – 23 mins

Palantir stock crisis: Executives sell their shares, while smearing critics as ‘crazy’

Posted by: Don Firineach | Nov 25 2025 16:04 utc | 10

the one positive thing about Trump, besides not being a proud NAMBLA member, is its (sic, They Live) honesty: the purpose of AI development is to drop bombs to win wars. and to the degree that the US becomes successful in this endeavor, China must follow. Like China is already doing, like the USSR was forced to do, like Russia is doing to so much celebration, invest in war.

besides, Google, Meta, etc., are all 100% extensions of the USDOD/Intel services. the question of “funding” these projects discussed here is no more up for debate than funding the F35 or nuclear weapons is.

who isn’t in a race for dominance? Those who’ve already lost.

Posted by: duck n cover | Nov 25 2025 16:05 utc | 11

DeepSeek competes with US GPTs at much reduced training cost and much lower inference/compute load.

US is financing poor performance at too much overhead.

Government support low tech.

GPU are not only answer TPU can mix for cheaper effectiveness.

Again US will be behind PRC

Posted by: paddy | Nov 25 2025 16:07 utc | 12

Posted by: HB Brian | Nov 25 2025 16:03 utc | 9

Man, did I call it or what?

~ Orwell

No, it’s not an actual Orwell quote.

Posted by: Saint Jimmy | Nov 25 2025 16:08 utc | 13

lol… bailout!! that is the design of present day capitalism!!

one side is looking at this as ”a race for global technology dominance” and the other side not…. of course dominance and capitalism go hand in hand… we see the results in the world today and a system based on this falling apart and yet, the politicians will be the last one’s to acknowledge this or find an answer to it… instead ‘bailout’ is the name of the game, lol…. where the west went wrong – let me count the ways!

thanks b..

Posted by: james | Nov 25 2025 16:09 utc | 14

“One theory of capitalism holds that every company should be left to their own devices, with state intervention kept a minimum.”
The state has to intervene to create corporations in the first place. Any corporation is automatically a ward of the public. The only question is whether corporations, like the de jure government itself, work for the people or for themselves. Of course in the US the corporate-state has long been nothing more or less than a tyrant.
Meanwhile, how ironic that “communist” China has less of a corporate-welfare gravy-train than the “capitalist” US.

Posted by: Flying Dutchman | Nov 25 2025 16:09 utc | 15

AI is already changing the world.

It is going to bring down the Empire because its use cannot be controlled and is increasingly low cost to deploy.

And it tends to tell the truth. It can’t really do narrative or creativity. Some domains will always be human.

China has many multiples of the AI engineers that the West has, coupled with the world’s greatest electricity production.

The US is basing everything on a tech they can’t control, with requirements they are poorly equipped to provide, and has turned it into a proxy for the entire economy.

This will end well. 😂😂😂

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Nov 25 2025 16:12 utc | 16

@ canuk | Nov 25 2025 15:52 utc | 1

i think you have that right… thanks.

Posted by: james | Nov 25 2025 16:13 utc | 17

A Marxist analysis of the desperate hopes of the ruling class for AI:
In his analysis of the labor process, Marx identified the two components of capital: variable capital, which is the portion of capital that a capitalist invests in wages for the purchase of labor-power, and constant capital, which is all non-human inputs into the production process, including raw materials, machinery, tools and buildings required to produce a commodity. While constant capital transfers its value to the product, variable capital—the labor-power expended by the worker—produces surplus value (the value created by workers in production that exceeds the value paid to them as wages), from which profit is ultimately derived. The rate of profit is defined by Marx as the ratio of surplus value generated by variable capital to the total capital—variable and constant capital—deployed in the labor process.
As the productive forces grow, the ratio of constant capital to variable capital increases. The result is a decline in the rate of profit. This law-governed process is the source of instability and crisis inherent in the capitalist system. However, the necessary effort of the capitalist class to counteract this decline in the rate of profit is the driving force of technological innovation aimed at increasing the efficiency of labor power in producing surplus value. The countervailing factors also include expansion of trade, the acquisition of new sources of “cheap labor” and, as we have reviewed, the increasing reliance on credit and debt to artificially increase profits, even as the underlying ratio between constant and variable capital grows increasingly unfavorable.
Over the last year, Wall Street has been engaged in a frenzy of speculative investment in Artificial Intelligence and associated automation technologies. It seems to be the realization of the dream of every corporate CEO. A way of drastically lowering labor costs has been found. And, in fact, corporations, within the US and internationally, are in the process of implementing massive job cuts.
Across industries from logistics to auto manufacturing to aerospace to telecom to banking, firms are implementing massive AI systems that eliminate clerical roles, customer support, coding, financial modeling and thousands of other functions that formerly provided employment.
In the UK, major corporations have announced significant AI-driven layoffs. BT plans to cut up to 55,000 jobs by 2030, with approximately 10,000 positions expected to be replaced by AI and automation in customer service and network management. Aviva is eliminating 2,300 roles in insurance operations following its Direct Line acquisition. BP is cutting 6,200 jobs—15 percent of its office-based workforce—by the end of 2025, with CEO Murray Auchincloss citing AI efficiency gains as part of cost-reduction drives.
The same process is sweeping through Western Europe. In Germany, Siemens has eliminated 5,600 industrial automation jobs; Lufthansa, 4,000 administrative roles; ZF Friedrichshafen faces 7,600 to 14,000 job losses tied to automation; Telefónica is cutting 6,000 to 7,000 jobs amid AI restructuring.
However, whatever the short term increases in profitability that are achieved by individual corporations, the net effect of the vast displacement of human labor, the source of surplus value, is an accelerated rise in the ratio of constant to variable capital, and, therefore, a systemic decline in the rate of profit.
The billionaire seeks to counteract the crisis through ever more violent processes—attacks on working conditions, the evisceration of social programs, mass deportation programs, wars, genocide. The oligarchy, cornered by its own internal contradictions, lashes out with increasing desperation. The militarization of American cities, the support for fascism, the promotion of war against Russia and China—these are not rational policy choices. They are the convulsions of a dying system.

Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Nov 25 2025 16:14 utc | 18

https://now.tufts.edu/2025/04/28/stroke-young-people-not-rare
‘Stroke in Young People Is Not That Rare’Amid a rise in stroke rates in young adult patients, a specialist at the School of Medicine shares how strokes differ for this group, and how doctors can meet the challenge
——-
hit your ctrl-f and search this article for these 3 words: sars, covid, vaccine.

the “medical” staff at one of my alma maters, Tufts, has gotten the message from not-a-Dr but still a Mengele, RFKjr, that if you want to get funding, you must ignore covid, incl something the fully vaccinated White House barfs up constantly: COVID IS A CHINESE BIOWEAPON. Don’t mention that the USG is letting a biowarfare attack happen! not if you want funding.

and what will happen when this nightmare is automated by people like Altman and Suckerborg?

Posted by: duck n cover | Nov 25 2025 16:14 utc | 19

This is going to destroy this country big time. The wreckege will be epic. And ZioDon will be part of that.

Posted by: SO | Nov 25 2025 16:01 utc | 6

######

You must be new here.

It is Biden’s fault. Obama’s fault. Hamas fault.

The Chinese “stole” it.

It is never Trump’s fault, and if by some miracle it were his fault, you have TDS and are a Dembot… 😂😂😂

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Nov 25 2025 16:16 utc | 20

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Nov 25 2025 16:16 utc | 21

Posted by: Flying Dutchman | Nov 25 2025 16:09 utc | 15

Good post.

The idea of a corporate entity which has no personal liability is an old idea.

Ancient Rome knew of the concept but was wary to grant them as they felt that it was a ‘method’ of releasing the owners of the corporation as from person liability and personal responsibility.

1. https://corpgov.law.harvard.edu/2011/06/19/corporate-law-lessons-from-ancient-rome/

Posted by: canuk | Nov 25 2025 16:19 utc | 22

The issue is the numbers.
While it has been clear for some time now that the PMC/billionaire ruling class in the West has put all their faith into LLM/AI to save them: their economies, their (lack of) defense, their mandates to rule etc – none of this has proven out to any significant degree.
The amounts needed to bail out the AI/LLM Ponzi scheme are in the hundreds of billions to trillions.
It is far from clear to me that the USG can afford this – bailing out the entire nation of Argentina was “only” $40 billion. The bailout of the US car industry was $80 billion spent of which around $15 billion was actually net “lost” in return for supporting around a million jobs.
The number of LLM/AI “industry” jobs is under 40000.

Posted by: c1ue | Nov 25 2025 16:24 utc | 23

Rather than pick winners and losers, China states the policy objective and hundreds of commercial initiatives compete using diverse strategies to fulfil the ambition.

So in China you have free and fair competition and in the US the big losers get bailed out with public money.

OK.

Posted by: Norwegian | Nov 25 2025 16:24 utc | 24

Once again, the US finances the losers, but doesn’t reward winners without WH connections…We are doomed…

Posted by: pyrrhus | Nov 25 2025 16:25 utc | 25

Government financed monopoly capitalism that produces nothing of value, so how does that add to “growth” of the domestic product when there’re no products being produced? And nowhere is the amount of energy required mentioned. This “effort” reminds me of other failed schemes like the Zumwalt destroyers or those sleek littoral combat vessels, all of which became multi-billion-dollar holes in the water. China’s AI system and its methodology is already leading the world and was just joined by Russia’s Sberbank’s open-source systems, which together will dominate the Eurasian, African and Latin American markets because all are invited to join the ecosystem instead of paying for access. I relink to Moscow’s Conference “Journey to the World of Artificial Intelligence” for those that didn’t read it when it was published. I also suggest Warwick Powell’s essay on the topic.

Posted by: karlof1 | Nov 25 2025 16:25 utc | 26

“the “medical” staff at one of my alma maters, Tufts,”'”

Posted by: duck n cover | Nov 25 2025 16:14 utc | 19

Tufts is a joke; they , recently, designed a food pyramid that put Lucky Charms ahead of red meat (1); they have , obviously, been bought out by Big Pharma and Big Food I gladly support RFK jr. in his fight against there behemoths and so should you :

1. “A few weeks ago the White House hosted a conference on hunger, nutrition and health. One of the key organizers of the conference — Dariush Mozaffarian, Dean of the Tufts School of Nutrition — had just finished spending 3 years and millions of dollars designing a new food pyramid. His findings? Lucky Charms are healthier than steak.
Americans have a massive obesity and disease problem. Are we really not understanding why?
According to the Tufts Food Compass — which they tout as “the most comprehensive and science-based nutrient profiling system to date” — Lucky Charms are healthier than whole milk, more than twice as healthy as beef, and better for you than a baked potato or cooked green peas. ” (1)

1. https://learn.kettleandfire.com/blog/nih-funded-food-pyramid-rates-lucky-charms-healthier-than-steak

Posted by: canuk | Nov 25 2025 16:26 utc | 27

Grotesque.

Posted by: persiflo | Nov 25 2025 16:27 utc | 28

So…. “AI” companies need big bailouts. Why didn’t the “AI” see this coming? …. or maybe that is exactly what they did?

Posted by: Norwegian | Nov 25 2025 16:27 utc | 29

public private partnerships
thatchers as in margaret her his handler was the 3rd 4th man friend of kim philby victor rothschild
victor rotted everything out
tory blair gordon brown carried on sold off the gold sovereign wealth funds

the debt is the juice for the khazharian synagogue of satan
failure is baked in

imf world bank and the home of satan bern swiss B I S Bank
empire of the city of london the vatican wall street and the rise of hitler and the bolshevik revolutions

took 70 years to pay off ww2
zion really knows how to milk the golem goyim from birth to death

Posted by: normal wisdom | Nov 25 2025 16:27 utc | 30

When the government picks out what company to finance, subsidize it is not capitalism, it is Fascism.,
Posted by: canuk | Nov 25 2025 15:52 utc | 1
This has no relation to Fascism. You are confusing the meanings of the words.

Posted by: smartfox | Nov 25 2025 16:29 utc | 31

decades ago now, I spent 2 years working part-time at the Perseus Project at Tufts U. it took about two weeks of working there to lose the delusion that the project is about education, though it took another 2 years to lose the delusion that “digital archives” will function to preserve humanity’s culture and heritage into the future. all bullshit. unless you think Google can do a better job preserving human cultural heritage than the NY Met Museum and NY Pub Lib can.
Apple and IBM and the USG (via the National Endowment for the Humanities) and the rest hire cheap grad student labor and academic prostitutes at Tufts et alibi to digitize cultural artifacts in order to “weaponize cultural anthropology” and control all knowledge, against the enemy, which is the US public.

when everything is online, no Fahrenheit 411 type stuff is required. what’s the dream of total thought control worth to the ruling class?

Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Nov 25 2025 16:14 utc | 18
yep

Posted by: duck n cover | Nov 25 2025 16:31 utc | 32

This is not to say that some money will be spent.
It is at least theoretically likely that some spend in order to promote areas of LLM/AI that actually provide some value: mass scraped intel analysis for the intel agencies and DoW, neural networks for drones. But these don’t require hundreds of billions or trillions – single digit billions is more than sufficient.
It is also instructive to look at David Sacks actual past AI investments – as he has said he divested from AI and crypto to avoid conflicts of interest. His actual AI investments were meta and xAI; the meta investments were pre-LLM and xAI is Musk’s effort.
Is he truly interesting in helping bail out the big boys: the Microsofts and the Googles and the Oracles and the OpenAIs and the Antropics? That’s where the big numbers are needed.

Posted by: c1ue | Nov 25 2025 16:31 utc | 33

Sean Foo-14 mins

US Economy Is DONE But Treasury Boss Denies Collapse Amid THIS Major Sector Meltdown

Posted by: Don Firineach | Nov 25 2025 16:32 utc | 34

Will America’s future be secured by boiling the oceans to generate videos of Donald Trump on an Airforce One made out of McDonalds hamburgers?Despite the breathlessness of unfounded hype about AGI and “world-changing breakthroughs” this is just camouflage for a bailout of the bubble. LLMs won’t produce AI. They are Garbage In/Garbage Out systems with scaling limits that are predictable in their models.https://x.com/deusexmoniker/status/1993338924673188312

Posted by: Jeremiah Cornelius | Nov 25 2025 16:32 utc | 35

Posted by: canuk | Nov 25 2025 16:26 utc | 27
name one educational institution on the entire planet whose sole function is not to produce robots for the state.

none exist. no, not one.

and Tufts openly acknowledges its gov’t funding. somebody pays for their opinions.

Posted by: duck n cover | Nov 25 2025 16:34 utc | 36

Posted by: Norwegian | Nov 25 2025 16:24 utc | 24

######

Underneath the rhetoric and narratives it has become clear.

The Chinese do Capitalism better and win head-to-head matchups.

Much of the anti-Chinese sentiment sounds like sore loser talk.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Nov 25 2025 16:35 utc | 37

“When the government picks out what company to finance, subsidize it is not capitalism, it is Fascism.,”
Posted by: canuk | Nov 25 2025 15:52 utc | 1
“This has no relation to Fascism. You are confusing the meanings of the words.”

Posted by: smartfox | Nov 25 2025 16:29 utc | 31

I disagree-see below:

“A fascist corporation can be defined as a government-directed confederation of employers and employees unions, with the aim of overseeing production in a comprehensive manner. Theoretically, each corporation within this structure assumes the responsibility of advocating for the interests of its respective profession, particularly through the negotiation of labor agreements and similar measures. Fascists theorized that this method could result in harmony among social classes”(1)

1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporatism

Posted by: canuk | Nov 25 2025 16:36 utc | 38

In a nutshell, desperate to counteract the tendency of the rate of profit to fall in Capitalism, the bourgeois has so over-invested in constant capital (AI) to cut out the actual producer of profit or surplus value (human labor) that it ends up awash in debt with the rate of profit falling even faster, as the constant capital (technology) dwarfs variable capital (human labor). In Capitalism, there is no profit without the extraction of surplus value (the value created by workers in production that exceeds the value paid to them as wages) from human labor.

Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Nov 25 2025 16:37 utc | 39

Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Nov 25 2025 16:14 utc | 18

Mostly correct. The importation of illegal, very cheap, almost slave level peasant labor has always been supported by many of the most conservative, even reactionary, corporate capitalists.

Posted by: Saint Jimmy | Nov 25 2025 16:38 utc | 40

@Ahenobarbus | Nov 25 2025 16:14 utc | 18

when everything is online, no Fahrenheit 411 type stuff is required. what’s the dream of total thought control worth to the ruling class?

Every record has been destroyed or falsified, every book has been rewritten, every picture has been repainted, every statue and street building has been renamed, every date has been altered. And that process is continuing day be day and minute by minute. History has stopped. Nothing exists except the endless present in which the party is always right. – Orwell

Posted by: Norwegian | Nov 25 2025 16:40 utc | 41

All about the votes. And staying in power. And the heck with everyone else. Land of the free and home of the brave has become home of the sleaze and home of the depraved.

Posted by: octavian61 | Nov 25 2025 16:42 utc | 42

Just came across this earlier today regarding AI financing and BITCOIN. I do think it is relevant to this topic.
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/bitcoin-btc-price-decline/?utm_source=firefox-newtab-en-us
qui vincit

Posted by: Angelo | Nov 25 2025 16:45 utc | 43

The Chinese do Capitalism better…
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Nov 25 2025 16:35 utc | 37
That is true, but why is that? The Chinese arguably made the shift to a full embrace of Capitalism relatively recently. Let’s say from Deng forward. So we’re looking at a young Capitalism taking off in a huge virgin territory. The US did Capitalism better too at that stage. If that were it, I’d say the Chinese would become Imperialists within a certain period of time, following the historic course of the US. What’s interesting is that the CCP has also considered Marx’s critique of Capitalism (like Hudson) and this seems to inform their state driven efforts to mitigate it’s excesses by firmly subordinating the bourgeois to the state. While this innovation is not Marxism or Socialism, it does seem to promise a very different, healthier trajectory for Chinese Capitalism. But only time will tell.

Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Nov 25 2025 16:47 utc | 44

Posted by: octavian61 | Nov 25 2025 16:42 utc | 42

######

Often, what we try to create, creates its antithesis.

The Chinese have learned this.

Power should always be wielded lightly and sparingly if longevity is the goal.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Nov 25 2025 16:47 utc | 45

Posted by: canuk | Nov 25 2025 16:36 utc | 38
Fascism is NOT a “fascist corporation”. you mix again the meanings, shows that you did not understand right both. To help you; look first for definition of Fascism.

Posted by: smartfox | Nov 25 2025 16:47 utc | 46

@Ahenobarbus | Nov 25 2025 16:14 utc | 18

when everything is online, no Fahrenheit 411 type stuff is required. what’s the dream of total thought control worth to the ruling class?

Every record has been destroyed or falsified, every book has been rewritten, every picture has been repainted, every statue and street building has been renamed, every date has been altered. And that process is continuing day be day and minute by minute. History has stopped. Nothing exists except the endless present in which the party is always right. – Orwell
Posted by: Norwegian | Nov 25 2025 16:40 utc | 41

I like Orwell too, but it’s important to remember concretely he was writing about Spain under Stalinism. His critique was not of Marxism per se.

Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Nov 25 2025 16:50 utc | 47

18

Mostly correct. The importation of illegal, very cheap, almost slave level peasant labor has always been supported by many of the most conservative, even reactionary, corporate capitalists.

Posted by: Saint Jimmy | Nov 25 2025 16:38 utc | 40

No disagreement there. The pro mass immigration section of the bourgeois just wants cheaper slaves. If you can understand Spanish language media (Zio dominated in the west) this virtue signalling element of the ruling class also promotes conflict between domestic and immigrant labor. On the English stations, that’s pretty obvious too, but most don’t know that they work up both linguistic groups of workers against each other. The old divide and rule.

Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Nov 25 2025 16:56 utc | 48

@Ahenobarbus | Nov 25 2025 16:50 utc | 47

His critique was not of Marxism per se.

I have no interest in “Marxism”. What Orwell describes applies to ‘the endless present in which the party is always right’ – it matters little which label the system of the day claims to represent.

Posted by: Norwegian | Nov 25 2025 16:56 utc | 49

Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Nov 25 2025 16:47 utc | 44

#####

I disagree with your premises.

America never did Capitalism well. It did oligarchy and colonialism well.

That’s not me bagging on America. It’s a cold look at the facts.

America expropriated land and resources, then later used opportunity (world wars) to gain leverage. A game it kept going until the 2010s.

Now, the playing field has shifted and other, older powers have banded together to compete.

Don’t confuse holding the Western world’s gold in trust or having the reserve currency as proof of Capitalism.

Capitalism is increasing efficiency leading to lower prices for better products. Winning has success.

What the USA has are protected rackets through licensing and monopolies which can be purchased.

As I understand it, China is a meritocracy. If one company can threaten the entire economy, CPC will do a controlled demolition early.

In the West, it turns into 2008 bailouts because no one gets fired and no one is allowed to “lose”.

The Chinese are achieving via Capitalism a socialistic paradigm. The reduction of scarcity and economic mobility.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Nov 25 2025 16:57 utc | 50

Posted by: duck n cover | Nov 25 2025 16:34 utc | 36

Name one other institution that recommends eating Lucky Charms is healthier than eating read meat on their ‘food pyramid’; good luck!

Posted by: canuk | Nov 25 2025 16:58 utc | 51

Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Nov 25 2025 16:56 utc | 48

Yeah…

Posted by: Saint Jimmy | Nov 25 2025 17:00 utc | 52

Whatever value can be found in Marxism, its adherents tend to have a perspective to narrow to explain the world.

That happens to any ideology, to any religion.

If something has truth value it works in December and in June. It works in Oklahoma and in Wuhan.

It works in 100 BC and 2026 because it is fact. It is truth.

It doesn’t need greenhouse conditions to describe reality.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Nov 25 2025 17:02 utc | 53

Too narrow

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Nov 25 2025 17:03 utc | 54

An OT note. At today’s presser in Minsk, Lavrov said the following:

So far, we have not received from our American colleagues the version that is speculated about in the media. Those who are engaged in such “megaphone” diplomacy are pursuing far from the most plausible goals….

We have it, but through unofficial channels. Officially, it was not handed over to us.

Lavrov’s overall answer to the question was very long and complex as usual. That the 28 turds have yet to be officially transmitted provides further weight to the hypothesis they were no more than a working draft that remained to have its turds polished. Since the eruption via megaphones, the turds have been reworked, and the original draft is no longer valid. Will whatever gets finalized be officially transmitted to Moscow?

Posted by: karlof1 | Nov 25 2025 17:07 utc | 55

a week or so ago Too Scents posted (roughly)

no one can fathom the upcoming conflagration

Posted by: exile | Nov 25 2025 17:09 utc | 56

If something has truth value it works in December and in June. It works in Oklahoma and in Wuhan.It works in 100 BC and 2026 because it is fact. It is truth.It doesn’t need greenhouse conditions to describe reality.Posted by: LoveDonbass | Nov 25 2025 17:03 utc | 53
Only partially correct, since “reality” and “truth” always depend on the criteria used, which in turn depend on who the observer is.
Even in quantum physics, “right” and “wrong” are not automatically given.

Posted by: smartfox | Nov 25 2025 17:11 utc | 57

“When the government picks out what company to finance, subsidize it is not capitalism, it is Fascism” – Canuk 1

This is true as far as it goes, however, many technology projects, while worthwhile have a longer horizon than market capital is willing to invest in and in many cases the developers are too small to sustain their effort. Now, I am not for government support of power-point-presentations but, when a group of engineers/machinists/techs have put in enough effort to put a demonstrator on the floor with no Wall-Street-“investors” willing to wait 5-7 years to work out the bugs and figure out a production model or, want to pay pennies on the dollars in vested and have creators work as slaves only to have the creation shipped offshore because…everything is cheaper in China? Yeah, this happens more often than people think

Well, that’s when a National board of industrial development should have a look see. The developers need to understand the USG gets a serious share of the enterprise. And that National board of industrial development gets paid based on successes. Everybody needs to share effort, risk and reward, no free riders. Careful oversight of merit based Government support of small [under 35 workers], enterprises who have already invested heavily should be a “thing”.

Posted by: S Brennan | Nov 25 2025 17:12 utc | 58

The Marxist argument of fixed vs variable investment (land and resources vs labor) with the latter being exclusively responsible for capitalist profit has always been incorrect, but more so than ever now in re to AI.
To a capitalist, it’s costs, no matter of what provenance, on one side and earnings on the other. The idea of fixed costs being things that you invested in once and were done with is utterly archaic. No one buys anything outright any more … everything is paid over time. So, basically at this time all costs (and certainly AI, with its need for constant updates) are variable costs and minimizing them is the key to maximizing profit.
So if AI does indeed reduce production costs (which I am NOT at all sure it will) then it will indeed increase profit. But we shall see …

Posted by: Caliman | Nov 25 2025 17:19 utc | 59

Will whatever gets finalized be officially transmitted to Moscow?
Posted by: karlof1 | Nov 25 2025 17:07 utc | 55
There is no “official version,” simply because it is again constructed in such a way that Putin must reject it, but then the mainstream media will say that “Russia does not want peace at all.” So it’s the same old propaganda.
That’s why there are “secret talks,” so that an “official text” will only be released once the US and Russia have agreed and it will actually be implemented, which is failing not only because of resistance from Europe, but also because of the warmongers in the US. It could still take many months before Russia finally gets everything it wants.
That is the moment when nuclear weapons could really be used, depending on who the loser is.

Posted by: smartfox | Nov 25 2025 17:21 utc | 60

As i see it this Genesis has little to do with bailout of overextended AI companies. For what i have read it is about the integration of already existing and immense public data sets into a platform which is somehow called “AI Platform”. Some of these datasets are publicly accessed worldwide. Let’s say NCBI datasets for genomic data. Will Genesis restrict access to these? Will these datasets work any better if integrated with other datasets? Automate science? Please don’t make me laugh!

Posted by: Ignacio | Nov 25 2025 17:24 utc | 61

What is Fascism?
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faschismus

Fascism is a political ideology whose mythical core, in its various permutations, is a palingenetic form of populist ultra-nationalism.

Posted by: smartfox | Nov 25 2025 17:28 utc | 62

Posted by: S Brennan | Nov 25 2025 17:12 utc | 58

######

Generally, you’re onto something.

But the failure of the West is in accounting for greed and how viciously power and money are pursued.

Any national development board is a target for Oligarch capture like has happened to the FDA.

As always, “Who watches the watchmen?”

The Chinese, as a people, are ruthless in calling out corruption. In the West, it tends to be celebrated. Trump, Musk, etc.

Oligarchs are heroes and idols. Who wouldn’t want to be an Oligarch?

Well, that’s who should be President. The person not motivated by fame or money. The one trying to do right by his family and his ancestors.

The one who just wants to return home to their family when their term is up.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Nov 25 2025 17:28 utc | 63

Posted by: S Brennan | Nov 25 2025 17:12 utc | 58

You make good points; there are times when Sovereigns need to support or subsidize corporations for the greater good.

The way to do that is to set goals for that economic niche then change tax policy such that corporations that do innovative work in that sector receive tax breaks-hence, it is done on the meritocracy -any company that can preforms the task sighted receives rewards.

However, when the government picks out the companies that they will subsidize, that’s Fascism because these companies are BIG companies crony companies of government-that’s the problem.

When Justin Trudeau got elected in 2015 his govt was worried about the legacy media-they put together a $600 MM fund to subsidize the industry-then they picked out what newspapers were worthy-of course it was the papers that support the govt. that got the juice.

That’s essentially what DJT is doing subsidizing the big AI corps-China’s policy in this regard is much more effective.

So its a sticky wicket but it makes a huge difference- I hope that helps.

Posted by: canuk | Nov 25 2025 17:31 utc | 64

AI is already changing the world … This will end well.
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Nov 25 2025 16:12 utc | 16
No it won’t. China AI or US AI makes no difference. The underlying drivers will determine the outcome: global warming, resources depletion, overpopulation and the identification of all people in all political settings as “useless eaters” fit only for profit extraction and police state methods. In colonial times brown people in Asia and Africa were expendable resources. That mindset has now moved to Western governments in particular, and to China. There is no AI tide lifting all boats. We are looking at profits and political control by and for a tiny economic elite. The rest aren’t needed.

Posted by: Fred | Nov 25 2025 17:45 utc | 65

Too big to fail, baby-!

AI has become GM, circa 2008

Posted by: steel_porcupine | Nov 25 2025 17:46 utc | 66

Keep in mind, too, that Corporations Are People.

(see Citizens United, 2010)

Posted by: steel_porcupine | Nov 25 2025 17:47 utc | 67

Athenobarbus ref Perseus
Is there a way i can contact u?

Posted by: Tom | Nov 25 2025 17:53 utc | 68

Posted by: smartfox | Nov 25 2025 17:21 utc | 60

RE: there is no official version of the peace plan

<<

“You know what really fires up the Beltway Republicans-?” JD asked on X.
“That the Trump admin may finally bring a four-year conflict in Eastern Europe to a close.
“I’m not even talking about the substance of their views.
“Much of what these Beltway Republicans have said about the Ukraine war has been proven wrong.
“But the level of passion over this one issue when your own country has serious problems is bonkers.

“It disgusts me.
“Show some passion for your own country.”

<<

Beltway Republicans, neocons and European warmongers have created a Zord, Power Rangers-style, in order to delay Russia’s Victor’s Peace. They’re carrying a torch for Gen Kellogg’s lost cause.

Posted by: steel_porcupine | Nov 25 2025 17:54 utc | 69

It seems fairly obvious to me that one of the objective of this quasi-nationalisation is to prevent starts-up and other companies that are not involved in the AI race, from using chinese open source models by preventing access to datacentres.
I have virtually no doubt that Amazon AWS will not allow any chinese AI to run on their servers.
You could say those companies could just build their own datacentres. Except that the government will suddenly remember that the infrastructures in the US are derelict and they can’t supply enough electricity to everyone.
In short, Sam Altman wants trillions in rent and he will not take “no” for an answer.

Posted by: Ythisah | Nov 25 2025 18:04 utc | 70

bailing out the entire nation of Argentina was “only” $40 billion.

Posted by: c1ue | Nov 25 2025 16:24 utc | 23

The U.S. is facilitating a financial support package for Argentina, which includes a $20 billion currency swap, but the total aid package could reach up to $40 billion with additional funding from private banks and sovereign wealth funds. However, recent reports indicate that plans for a $20 billion bailout from banks have been shelved, and a smaller loan package is being considered instead.

Posted by: arby | Nov 25 2025 18:08 utc | 71

Posted by: Caliman | Nov 25 2025 17:19 utc | 59
I know it is too much to ask ‘Marx critics’ to actually read Marx but please, at least read the post you responded to in mindless reflex as if conditioned like Pavlov’s dog. Patchy memories of econ 101 and conflating costs with capital isn’t enough to ‘debunk’ Marx.
Neither is ‘AI’ debunking Marx – as Ahenobarbus explained quite well.

Posted by: kspr | Nov 25 2025 18:11 utc | 72

It’s official: pigeons can now be government-controlled spies — just like we always suspected!

Russian company Neiry developed a neurointerface kit that turns ordinary pigeons into ‘BIO-DRONES’

Electrodes implanted in their brains let operators control their flight remotely

https://t.me/rtnews/122549

Macron is another example.

Posted by: Norwegian | Nov 25 2025 18:11 utc | 73

Posted by: steel_porcupine | Nov 25 2025 17:54 utc | 69

Stop looking for sanity or good ideas or even an accurate description of reality from almost any American – politician, oligarch, or peasant – whether the topic is the domestic economy, corporate bailouts, or foreign affairs. You won’t find it. Well, you’ll find it among a few but good luck finding them. Most will spit out either propaganda and self-interest or some crazy unworkable purist crap from 19th century capitalists or socialists.

I’m not a smart man and I really don’t have an opinion on this AI issue because I don’t know enough about it.

Posted by: Saint Jimmy | Nov 25 2025 18:13 utc | 74

smartfox | Nov 25 2025 17:21 utc | 60—

Thanks for your reply. Pepe Escobar is calling it “Spin-war”. Putin’s initial response neutered the “Russians don’t want peace” narrative. The Abu Dhabi “secret” talks don’t involve the main Russian negotiators. As Lavrov said several times during today’s presser, Russia doesn’t engage in “megaphone diplomacy.” The desperation of the surrendering side trying to dictate the terms is very visible.

Posted by: karlof1 | Nov 25 2025 18:28 utc | 75

One is out in mind here of how the so called American System of Manufactures emerged in the 19th century and became the basis of US dominance in the 20th. Although the key innovations were initiated and honed in the private sector, three aspects of Federal Government policy were crucial in the formative period. The first was the terms on which Federal small arms contracts were issued to the private sector, requiring the sharing of relevant innovation and practices. The second has the willingness to use the US Treasury to invest in and give favourable credit terms to key infant industries, as the Russians now do. And the third was trade policy, initially tariffs but subsequently other measures to gain access to markets abroad. Sadly, these three aspects are rarely considered together, let alone how they entwined with private investment and engineering education.

Posted by: Tim Putnam | Nov 25 2025 18:28 utc | 76

I really don’t have an opinion on this AI issue because I don’t know enough about it.

Posted by: Saint Jimmy | Nov 25 2025 18:13 utc | 74

####

That is wisdom.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Nov 25 2025 18:28 utc | 77

kspr #72 – thanks so much for your detailed contribution; but the unfortunately misreasoned Marxist argument posted by the original commenter I replied to does not need any further work. To treat AI investments in the means of production by capital as non-labor costs that will be ineffective in producing profit long term simply because they are non-labor costs is just … well, not good, let’s say …

Posted by: Caliman | Nov 25 2025 18:28 utc | 78

There seems to be no reason why Europe, vis a vis AI, hasn’t gone more into the AI game either a la the US or a la China, unless the US has so Japonified the EU that the latter must to defer to US supremacy as a matter of politics and/or EU elites prefer to personally and as a class invest, qua capitalists, their funds in US AI firms (vs equivalent EU innovation), for a complex host of reasons, including geopolitical deference to US AI leadership.

Posted by: Ludovic | Nov 25 2025 18:29 utc | 79

Canuck shows again that he is a complete imbecile. When a government owns a company we are facing fascism? Wow, what insight. By that logic public water utilities are fascism. Same with electricity. Only an idiot equates the state with fascism. Fascism is defined by the class dynamics of the state.

Posted by: Stride | Nov 25 2025 18:31 utc | 80

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Nov 25 2025 18:28 utc | 77

Don’t give me too much credit. I learned the hard way.

Posted by: Saint Jimmy | Nov 25 2025 18:32 utc | 81

Posted by: Ythisah | Nov 25 2025 18:04 utc | 70
yes, and the goal of isolating data centers to censor and control ‘reality’ conflicts with the goal of AI having any ‘intelligence’. The rest of the world & China are larger.
I think the end result is going to be one big taxpayer-funded billionaire boondoggle that merely spies on us all.

Posted by: km | Nov 25 2025 18:34 utc | 82

Posted by: Stride | Nov 25 2025 18:31 utc | 80

I’m an ‘imbecile’ am I? Kindly please read below as you are don’t understand what you are talking about.

“Anxieties stemming from rising inequalities have led significant sections of the world’s population to reject democratic practices and place their trust in politicians with fascist tendencies who promise to wrest control of their destinies from elites. Ironically, elite interests, far from being threatened, are bolstered by the rise of fascism, as discredited democratic institutions can be dismantled with impunity. The emerging alliance between the neoliberal project and fascist politics is a phenomenon that the business and society scholarship is ill-equipped to confront as it remains trapped in the same neoliberal pro-elite paradigms that neglect meaningful attention to material (in)equality and focus instead on ensuring a minimum floor of rights required for subsistence. Neglecting the concentration of wealth among the elite, particularly in countries with historic legacies of inequalities based on race, caste, ethnicity, and religion, creates ideal conditions for the eruption of fascism premised upon programmatic denial of the full range of civil rights to one or more sections of the population, so that even the floor minimum becomes impossible to achieve for all. This paper argues that corporate collusions with fascism can be challenged only by a commitment to redistribution of wealth and creating critical citizens and by generating knowledge that can question authority: in other words, scholarship must become a subversive activity.” (1)

1. https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10551-019-04259-9

Posted by: canuk | Nov 25 2025 18:36 utc | 83

Posted by: Stride | Nov 25 2025 18:31 utc | 80

I’m still stinking if he a Troll only, or a bot. Here are several, sometimes.

Posted by: smartfox | Nov 25 2025 18:36 utc | 84

Posted by: Saint Jimmy | Nov 25 2025 18:32 utc | 81

#####

IMO, the hard way is the only way to fly.

We learn best from failure, IMO.

Success doesn’t challenge the ego the way that struggle does.

If I am hiring someone, I want to know they have been in the mud and figured out a way to rise above.

To quote Frank Herbert, “Real boats rock”.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Nov 25 2025 18:37 utc | 85

You could not ring a bell louder that the top of the AI bubble is in!

Truly a moron move. Tying the USA’s fiscal policy to a Ponzi scheme will go down in history as the end of Empire.

Just an absolutely colossal own goal! Haircuts all around!

Posted by: too scents | Nov 25 2025 18:40 utc | 86

Posted by: canuk | Nov 25 2025 16:58 utc | 51
Neither Tufts nor anyone else is going against USG food policy. that’s now how anyone gets funded.

Posted by: duck n cover | Nov 25 2025 18:43 utc | 87

Posted by: Tom | Nov 25 2025 17:53 utc | 68
apologies for the way I formated that post. I was agreeing with Ahenobarbus and should have put that first, not last.

I was the one who worked at Perseus Project at Tufts. what do you want to know?

Posted by: duck n cover | Nov 25 2025 18:47 utc | 88

Posted by: too scents | Nov 25 2025 18:40 utc | 86

I agree- its an act of desperation not a well thought out policy..

Posted by: canuk | Nov 25 2025 18:49 utc | 89

I remember reading some days ago, that several Silicon Valley companies already switched their internal AI developments to the Chinese open source AI, the reason being – costs.

Posted by: MorePain4Cakes | Nov 25 2025 18:57 utc | 90

Posted by: too scents | Nov 25 2025 18:40 utc | 86
######

AI in the US today is a scam because the big tech firms are all borrowing money to invest in each other, and none of them are showing profitability or industry dominance.
I don’t think it is a Ponzi, which is a sort of pyramid scheme. It is a mania, like Tulip mania. The investment vehicle (the Tulips) is AI as opposed to 2006/7 when it was real estate. It could be pet rocks or Pokémon. Something that captures imagination and fuels the fantasy of mind-blowing returns, but ultimately isn’t even an ideal investment in normal times.

But that’s the West. Monetize anything that moves, and if it doesn’t move, create a narrative that it does in order to monetize the mundane.

It sucks because AI is poised to be a revolutionary technology, but its association with what will be an enormous bubble will serve to discredit it.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Nov 25 2025 19:02 utc | 91

My home state of Washington a few years back moved to the “peer support” model of delivery of social services. The educational material used for the one week training course is all taken from stuff like strands of Buddhism, cognitive therapy, the Bible, blah, blah, blah, and above all Alcoholics Anonymous and its many and growing offshoots. After a week of this, the peer support counselor is now qualified to replace all kinds of degreed social workers. And the difference in cost? It goes straight into the pockets of Molina in a privatization scam run by all (=two) parties of the state gov’t. Yes, I sat this course, and a few others, like “Job Coach: Getting the Alcoholic Back to Work”.

This was before the “AI-ification” of everything. They are already hoovering up and sucking up all knowledge possible and converting it into a toxic homogenized goo from which they hope to manufacture Satanic Chucky dolls (see the opening of “Child’s Play 3”.) now let’s automate it!

Posted by: duck n cover | Nov 25 2025 19:05 utc | 92

The perfect competition between the Ouroboros and the Socialist
Trump Ignites ‘Genesis Mission’: Manhattan Project-Scale AI Onslaught

President Trump signed a landmark executive order Monday, unleashing the “Genesis Mission”—a colossal, coordinated national crusade modelled after the Manhattan Project to turbocharge AI-driven scientific breakthroughs and cement U.S. technological hegemony.

Somehow the terms cement and hegemony fit together but NOT like they think China will wipe “For Profit’s” ass, IMO…….and the last gasp of empire hegemony

Posted by: psychohistorian | Nov 25 2025 19:05 utc | 93

It sucks because AI is poised to be a revolutionary technology

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Nov 25 2025 19:02 utc | 91

—

No it isn’t. AI is the Eigenvalue of hokum.

Posted by: too scents | Nov 25 2025 19:05 utc | 94

Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Nov 25 2025 16:14 utc | 18
Excellent and well put. AI as symptom of structural contradictions, pure and simple.

Posted by: Patroklos | Nov 25 2025 19:09 utc | 95

@ too scents | Nov 25 2025 19:05 utc | 94 who keeps sending me to the dictionary….sigh…..its all age fault….grin

AI is the Eigenvalue of hokum.

Priceless and thanks!

Posted by: psychohistorian | Nov 25 2025 19:10 utc | 96

Posted by: Ludovic | Nov 25 2025 18:29 utc | 79
just as Japan’s interests lie with China, so Europe’s lie with Russia. what you are worried about happened long ago. thus the war with Ukraine, thus the warmongering and provocation re China. The European ruling class has hitched its wagon to the US death star. “Let go Lonestar! Use the Schwarz,” and blow it up. there’s no other way, as far as the ruling class of the West goes.

Posted by: duck n cover | Nov 25 2025 19:11 utc | 97

Posted by: too scents | Nov 25 2025 19:05 utc | 94

######

You mean, in the West, right?

In the East, AI is powering medical advances, military strategy, and industrial capacity.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Nov 25 2025 19:14 utc | 98

Is Genesis, in any form linked to Genesys? — the 2017 precursor to Skynet: which as we know, goes live and . . . judgement day. Does Hollywood know about this?

Posted by: Nothingburgers | Nov 25 2025 19:18 utc | 99

Everything that doesn’t have fundamental value eventually goes to zero. AI stocks aren’t going to zero, but they will go very far that direction.

If you want to see where there’s real neglected value (stock wise), take a look at the chemical and industrial sectors.

Posted by: unimperator | Nov 25 2025 19:18 utc | 100

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