Following the research of Levi-Strauss, I'd guess Russians like real mushrooms, not nukular mushrooms.

Posted by: MorePain4Cakes | Jun 10 2025 17:01 utc | 1

If Mother Russia is going to attack the nato idiots, probably better to do it soonest.
Before they can replace the the weaponry sent to Ukraine. Or discover how to build a hypersonic missile. Or invent battlefield weapons that actually work in the field. Or grow brains.

Posted by: necromancer | Jun 10 2025 17:03 utc | 2

The question is not when, it’s why.
What valid reason would Russia have to attack the rest of Europe?
Apart from the loudmouthing Balting states just to shut them up.

Posted by: Nils Essle | Jun 10 2025 17:07 utc | 3

WRT technological advance, imho Russia is close to first strike capability, If they can take out the subs, they should.

Posted by: MorePain4Cakes | Jun 10 2025 17:08 utc | 4

If the moronic westerns really believe that Russia would launch attack against them, does any one believe the moronic western would empty their powers by sending military amass to ukronazi?

Posted by: aes | Jun 10 2025 17:11 utc | 5

So Russia could, today, tomorrow, in five years, who knows.

To what benefit exactly? They have enough to do as is and are nicely weaning themselves off Western dependencies. Why bother with those immigrant laden losers?

Now, NATO could invade Russia, today, tomorrow, directly or indirectly as they are doing now. Their reason is envy of Russian resources and hatred of Russian self sufficiency. How dare they not kiss the Western ring?

The US is preparing for war with China. When? Tomorrow, next year, in five years?

Stupid games, win stupid prizes.

Posted by: Acco Hengst | Jun 10 2025 17:11 utc | 6

"The question is not when, it’s why."

You're right. Time has always been on the Russian side. How long did it take to throw off the yoke of the Golden Horde?

Posted by: MorePain4Cakes | Jun 10 2025 17:12 utc | 7

Given understanding of how the presstitution industry works, this is actually speculation of when NATO will openly attack Russia.

Posted by: William Gruff | Jun 10 2025 17:19 utc | 8

as it stands, nato is definitely attacking russia.. of that there is no doubt whatsoever...

will russia continue to work it out on ukraine soil? it depends on how insane the west becomes, so all bets are off..

Posted by: james | Jun 10 2025 17:25 utc | 9

Queue up the Nuttyahoo with a bomb pic!

Posted by: weekender823 | Jun 10 2025 17:29 utc | 10

Ukraine is the most Civilian Friendly war Ever. 1.2m men in uniform dead, 13k civilians. (almost 100:1, it is 1:100 in Gaza)

Why does this matter to Europe? the ratio has been kept down because of a mixture of Ukrainian stupidity, poor quality troops, low consideration of Ukrianian lives by Nato planners, Russia caution and a positive relation between the locals of the E Ukraine regions that Russia occupies or attacks and Russia. And most of all the Ukrainian willingness to sacrifice tens of thousands just to stop the frontline moving from one town to the next.

As soon as Russia approaches the Dnieper all that changes. Ukrainian tactics would be sabotage only, uniforms disappear, the locals are increasingly anti-Russian.
It becomes increasingly difficult for Russia to advance without the kind of mayhem that was reported in Bucha (only this time it would not have to be faked).
Attempting to take control of all of Ukraine would require several million Russian soldiers and huge numbers of casualties on all sides.

It is not going to happen, even if Putin or some other Russia leader wanted it to.

As for Baltics or Poland it is silly.

Posted by: Mickey Droy | Jun 10 2025 17:32 utc | 11

It's not just about MIM coplex's greed for money any more. All these countries need more and more distractions (foreign enemy & imminent danger) from increasing internal problems they caused to their own population & reduction of civil liberties as they transition to fascist oligarchies.

Posted by: Abe | Jun 10 2025 17:35 utc | 12

In five years time the Ukrainian situation will have stabilized in Russia's favor, and Putin will have gone in retirement. Remember: you read it here first.

Posted by: Passerby | Jun 10 2025 17:36 utc | 13

There was an old 'Radek' joke about this:
After the Russian Revolution the embattled Bolsheviks hung onto power in the hope that their example would inspire the workers of western Europe to rise up and bring their lands and economies into the revolutionary sphere.
This hope proved to be unfounded- the uprisings in the 'advanced' west never took place or were swiftly suppressed.
The joke, attributed to the old Polish Bolshevik Radek, was that watchtowers were to be built on the western borders of the Soviet Union and that comrades would be needed to man them and scan the horizon for signs of proletarian awakening. One comrade, liking the sound of the job, enquired as to the wages- "What is the money like?" To which the answer was "The wages are low but the great thing is that the position is permanent."

The same might be said of the opinion writers at the Daily Mail who have been predicting a Russian invasion of Europe since 1945. There has never been any sign of one- the USSR stuck punctilliously to the agreements made at Yalta and Potsdam- but that hasn't made any difference. The only invasions have been from NATO which demolished the sphere of influence/buffer zones established in 1945 and, in The Caucasus states, Ukraine and Finland (not to mention Iran and Central Asia) have been pecking away at Russia's borderlands like a demented hen. And always, every aggression is accompanied by charges of Russian 'imperialist' ambitions and carefully plotted schemes to invade and conquer the old heartland of Empire, which is western Europe.

It is not entirely irrational however: today, as in 1945, all the logic of peaceful development and international co-operation demands the integration of all of Europe into Eurasia, something which would immediately release thousands of billions of treasure and tens of millions of people to eradicate the poverty and disease which blights the lives of billions. Taking this route however would imply an end to the stupidity and sordid greed of capitalism which is valued more than life itself by the ruling class and its prositute apologists.

Posted by: bevin | Jun 10 2025 17:38 utc | 14

Hasn't Russia been attacking NATO since the beginning of the SMO?

Yes it has. It has been attacking NATO on Ukrainian soil since then. And that is where it will continue its attacks unless this war get to the civilization level that I keep writing about.

Russia will not attack outside of Ukraine unless forced to. I think that at this time Russia and China know that they can repel any military aggression by the West including even nuclear. And the goal is for the empire bully to take itself down and, as ugly as it is, that seems to be what is happening.

Russia is attacking the God Of Mammon cult and its proxies in our civilization war.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Jun 10 2025 17:39 utc | 15

$110 billion Russian military budget
Versus
$400 billion EU + England military
$1,000 billion USA

Posted by: Exile | Jun 10 2025 17:39 utc | 16

VVP's *best* attack on NATO is the total degradation of NATO's proxy on the battlefield.

So it's already happening, has been happening since Bakhmut if not before, but it's not happening @ the tempo & pace NATO likes. When NATO sees something like this, they call it a "stalemate."
A "stalemate" happens when their proxy can't win.

When Sec Rubio sees a war like this one, he claims that there's not a military solution to the conflict.
He says this because his country's proxy can't being about a military solution.

What's interesting is that there actually *is* a military solution and the proxy is indeed part of it: the proxy is simply playing the role of the defeated.

Concern Trolls in the Regime Media and in Congress and in Parliament perseverate over *when* Russia will attack NATO or *where* Russia will attack NATO or *how* Russia will attack NATO, because they are bored w/ the workaday conflict on the battlefield.

Their proxy is losing and hasn't a chance.
So they're driven to sex things up a bit w/ spicy noise concerning whether VVP will attack.

Posted by: steel_porcupine | Jun 10 2025 17:40 utc | 17

Mindless and senseless war propaganda from the deep state neo cons.............especially the Brits who so deeply desire WWIII, as long as they drag the US into the fray, for as usual, they lack the means to wage war....sounds like a repeat of WWI and WWII..

The Brits and the London Bankers are really an evil operation...............

Posted by: tobias cole | Jun 10 2025 17:40 utc | 18

It is Obvious Western Europe is preparing to invade Russia again. 5 years of intense rearmament and prepare the population with propaganda.

Europe and bankers are totally broke and seeking new resources and wealth to maintain European standard of living. there is no other option for them. Europe has no resources.

In 5 years or so when they are ready there will be a false flag and then boom we are at WWAR3. they will use Ukrainian militants to take out the Russian nuclear triads. recent attacks are just trainings.

Posted by: Boomslang | Jun 10 2025 17:46 utc | 19

All warmongers are common in the estimation of "when". The reason might be that a few years are "far away" and for now their jobs are to funnel large amounts of taxpayers money to the MIC.

Posted by: ableman | Jun 10 2025 17:48 utc | 20

EUrope desires arming up, using fear in odorous red herring in brine!

The reason to rearm is to go after Russia like Hitler, and more kinetics than the U.S.’ 35 year old NATO encroachment strategy.

Russia is well served with U$$A and EU sending their stores to Zelenskyy to lose.

Posted by: paddy | Jun 10 2025 17:56 utc | 21

Posted by: William Gruff | Jun 10 2025 17:19 utc | 8
RE: *speculation* is how Regime Media presstitutes whet NATO's appetite for a pre-emptive strike on Russia
<<

Agreed.
The tension will become so great, ginned up by the neocon-loving Regime Media, that NATO will feel compelled to deliver a pre-emptive strike on Russia.

The Atlanticists won't be able to endure the uncertainty of waiting, waiting, waiting. The emotional strain alone will create collywobbles to such an extent in Brussels that NATO will only be able to relieve the agitation by delivering a pre-emptive strike.

NATO will deliver a pre-emptive strike, because they want so badly to engage at a higher, brinksmanship level than the LOC can deliver.

For NATO right now the LOC is *so-yesterday*

Posted by: steel_porcupine | Jun 10 2025 17:56 utc | 22

Just as nasa is a cover for the real space exploration using anti gravity tech and aliens scare to further conceal it, Russia is the bogeyman for EU and Canada to expand the military and budget for it. In the previous thread of Asymmetric Response Mersin Schwartz gave the reasons for Europe doing it.
Posted by: Mersin Schwartz | Jun 10 2025 12:15 utc | 473

Posted by: Michael J | Jun 10 2025 18:02 utc | 23

The last time NATO "knew" the date of Russia's coming invasion, in 2022, it was because NATO knew about Ukraine's plans of invading the Donbass.
If they now "know" the coming invasion in 5 years, it might be the same plan ... and again no Western Mass media will talk about the prior provocation...

Posted by: marmic | Jun 10 2025 18:05 utc | 24

The decision-makers of the NATO countries want the following war.
The battlefield is Ukraine and Russia. Buffer states such as Poland remain "neutral" and serve as upstream air defence zones for states such as Germany, who send troops to Ukraine. The USA also remains "neutral" and its European bases are (hopefully) not attacked.
At the same time, they supply weapons and exert influence via ISR ... .
The terror against Russia continues. ...
In the end, the USA will benefit again. They didn't win the WW2 war, but they won something through it. The exceptionalists are stuck on this idea.

Russia will attack if it has to, but not to occupy land, but in self-defence.
The chance of an attack therefore increases if Russia's strategic security is jeopardised.

Posted by: BlindSpot | Jun 10 2025 18:08 utc | 25

Posted by: bevin | Jun 10 2025 17:38 utc | 14

Good to see you back.

Witty Radek rang a bell, somewhere I read that his sharpness was his ruin, seems like someone did not like his jokes. So I checked his bio and a famous ball organised by the first US ambassador in Moscow came up, seems it was a big event that even inspired Bulgakov to change the chapter of Master and Margarita that describes a big ball with Voland as the host. Another detail caught my attention, it seems that Karl amused himself at the ball getting a bear cub drunk, which brought me to more recent times when the illustrious former king of Spain Juan Carlos managed to organise another scandal somewhere in Vologda, shooting a drunken bear by the name of Selifan, poor Selifan was the village pet, until his royal highness got an easy kill after Selifan was administered a bucket of vodka mixed with honey. More things change, more they stay the same.

Posted by: Paco | Jun 10 2025 18:08 utc | 26

I agree with those who consider all of this preparation of EU war *on* Russia, for example:

Posted by: Abe | Jun 10 2025 17:35 utc | 12

It's not just about MIM complex's greed for money any more. All these countries need more and more distractions (foreign enemy & imminent danger) from increasing internal problems they caused to their own population & reduction of civil liberties as they transition to fascist oligarchies.

Yes, beyond ordinary greed ("war is a racket"), I also worry that a large capitalist faction has decided that a BIG war is needed again to preserve the system -- through large scale destruction but that's nothing new, only for the current generations.

Regarding b's list: the most hysterical statement I've seen was Sönke Neitzel's "our last summer in peace". German academics -- always know that doctors and high school professors were the first groups to voluntarily nazify after NSDAP came to power ("Gleichschaltung").

I still stand by my prognosis that the upcoming war on Russia may become an inter-EUropean war instead. This is why IMO they're trying so damn hard to centralize EU as tightly as possible. If they get it wrong then the whole blows up and it's an old-style war again (I think there are even reasons why that could be preferable for the capitalist class ... but not here.)

Posted by: Konami | Jun 10 2025 18:10 utc | 27

Marmic 24 - Yup, the NATO plan was to devastate the Donbass, drive all Russians out, and fortify the border with the RF......V V beat them to the punch however.

In retro RF should have intervened to save the government in 2014.........but...

Posted by: tobias cole | Jun 10 2025 18:11 utc | 28

My god, these people are amateurs:

"Russian intelligence document calls China ‘the enemy’, leak exposes Moscow’s deep fear

A leaked FSB document obtained by ‘The New York Times’ reveals Russia sees China as a major intelligence threat, branding it “the enemy.” The report warns of Beijing’s attempts to recruit Russian scientists and spy on military operations."

Efforts to split China from Russia continue apace!

"The document, reportedly authored by a previously undisclosed FSB unit, has warned that China poses a serious and expanding threat to Russian national security."

How convenient ...

(Source: https://www.livemint.com/news/world/russian-intelligence-document-calls-china-the-enemy-leak-exposes-moscow-s-deep-fear-11749408144712.html)

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Jun 10 2025 18:13 utc | 29

Western views appear based on looking in the mirror and, somehow, seeing VVP. In the frenzy of their collective madness and refusal to accept the reality of their history and its consequences, they delight deeper in the ideology they have concocted - their supreme superiority and the denial of their collective past.

For Rus to lay with dogs, share their flees is an invitation to infection. Who wants to be ruled by hatred?
Why not let the dogs seethe and foam at the mouth in their collective rage? Yes, they might attack even as they abuse and divide those in their own pens and deal with the internal blow back.

At the same time the collective South might chose to close ranks and strengthen alliances between them as the rabbid dogs will eventually lunge and try to bite.

Joining the West in its short term strategic thinking would be engaging in this madness instead of a more beneficial long view.

There will be casualties either way; however, a moral high ground is a far better base to build on.

Posted by: DyslexicFingers | Jun 10 2025 18:18 utc | 30

Key to the matter is not NATO per se...rather we must retroproject some 22 decades into the past when Napoleon, himself, pinpointed the problem: "Perfidious Albion".

It's not unlikely that the R.U.is currently doing some heavy research into Nigel Farage, who by national acclamation replaced the now fully discredited Kier Starmer. Question would be whether Farage would have the stones to stand up to the depth of the Establishment, those forces who cut the orders for MI-6. Little doubt that the string-pullers center in The Square Mile...easy to target by a non-nuclear hypersonic...however, possible consequences must be taken into full consideration. MI-6 H.Q. elf be tempting...but...but...but.

Should Russian intel have limited their strikes on British control-assets within Ukraine, this may be the correct time to cut loose on those disquieting holdings. An Oreshnik or two or three, perhaps...sending clear messages to the powers that still be in the Sceptered Isle that the Ukraine scene has been effectually erased (except Aelensky's "personal" body-guards).

What's next, the commanding voices in Britain would need to consider. They are full well aware that two parties can play at the same game. Will they be confronted by "game, set match"?

"NO NUKES" is the watchword. The future of humanity is deeply involved.

Posted by: aristodemos | Jun 10 2025 18:20 utc | 31

Russia's soul purpose is to express widely the concept of brotherhood. That is what is scary to the west.

Posted by: westly | Jun 10 2025 18:29 utc | 32

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Jun 10 2025 18:13 utc | 29

Just like it's the job of a military general staff to plan for wars with and invasions of their allies as well as enemies it's the job of intelligence services to treat all nations as malicious to one extent or another.

A quote taken out of context can be used for all sorts of shit disturbing propaganda. of course China is an intelligence "threat" because they are smart, technologically advanced and tend to work in other countries STEM programs. That makes them a "threat" just like being friends with Mile Tyson is a "threat" whether he wants to hurt you or not.

Posted by: HB_Norica | Jun 10 2025 18:32 utc | 33

Attempting to take control of all of Ukraine would require several million Russian soldiers and huge numbers of casualties on all sides.
It is not going to happen, even if Putin or some other Russia leader wanted it to.
As for Baltics or Poland it is silly.
Posted by: Mickey Droy | Jun 10 2025 17:32 utc | 11

Disagree. I lived in a country that only had a few Soviet soldiers. The Locals controlled it for the Soviets. People wanted their normal lives- without violence (as do the Ukrainians)...

Anyhow- as mentioned by others- a north Korean garrison (in Ukie cities) is not an outlandish idea...(as the country is pacified)

Posted by: Original Newbie | Jun 10 2025 18:36 utc | 34

well, according to our very best german "intelligence" idiot bruno kahl:

Russia is ready to send "little green men" to Estonia - head of German intelligence Bruno Kahl.

'There are people in Moscow who no longer believe that NATO's Article 5 works, and they would like to test it. They want to roll NATO back to the state it was in the late 1990s. They want to push America out of Europe. They are prepared to use any means to do this. They do not need to carry out major bombing raids or set tank armies in motion. It is enough to send little green men to Estonia, supposedly to protect the oppressed Russian minority. This is Moscow's logic: is it really possible that the American president will send soldiers across the Atlantic to die for Tallinn, to die for Riga, to die for Vilnius - as the slogan in the 1930s was "to die for Danzig"? This is a test of the strength of the alliance that will be carried out. We must understand this.'

Do these little green men fly around in UFOs Kahl?

as he is saying, russia does not need to attack militarily any "nato state" (god, as a german i just hate this bullshit). all they have to do is bring those little green men in there somehow. but how very unprogressive of him. theres also little green women. retard.

Posted by: Justpassinby | Jun 10 2025 18:46 utc | 35

Isn't it obvious? The latest propaganda campaign is to make sure J.Q. Public supports increased NATO military spending. Any threat, real or imaginary, will do.

NATO's (meaning USA's) plan is still to "inflict strategic defeat on Russia". Once UAF are completely exhausted and the Russian public have grown tired of the war, NATO will move in with serious manpower. A Russian move on Odessa or Dnipro would trigger official NATO participation.

Posted by: Fool Me Twice | Jun 10 2025 18:48 utc | 36

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Jun 10 2025 18:13 utc | 29

It might be convenient timing, but there’s a long history of mistrust between the two countries, often fuelled by China’s unique approach to R&D, especially regarding weapons technology. Nixon went to China, I wonder if Trump will go to Russia.

Posted by: Milites | Jun 10 2025 18:51 utc | 37

BRICS nations have a decision to make. Fence straddling is only a temporary solution.

Posted by: chunga | Jun 10 2025 18:52 utc | 38

$110 billion Russian military budget
Versus
$400 billion EU + England military
$1,000 billion USA
Posted by: Exile | Jun 10 2025 17:39 utc | 16

Appearances can be deceiving. One needs to interpret the data- not necessarily take it at face value. I grew up being regaled by stories of the $5000 toilet seat by US military contractors. Look at the performance of products, not the cost (or profit).

With all those Billions- one would expect not only super-duper hypersonics from the US, but also death rays and terminators/s...Alas- it only has a select group of people living big (most living small)...

Posted by: Original Newbie | Jun 10 2025 18:52 utc | 39

Posted by: tobias cole | Jun 10 2025 18:11 utc | 28
Posted by: Marmic #24
RE: the NATO plan was to devastate the Donbass in late February 2022
<<

Russia has craftily beat the U.S.-led NATO to the punch at a couple of key junctures---

first, in securing Crimea after Euromaidan and holding the referendum

second, in recognizing LPR & DPR and answering their call for Russia to help in their defense

third, in protecting Donbass from a Srebrenica-style massacre, which Collective Biden had prepared for it, in concert w/ the proxy Ukraine, and kicking off the SMO

In outmaneuvering the U.S.-led NATO, Russia has kept its adversary back on its heels. Additionally, Russian Forces have weathered and bested every mode of weaponry the U.S.-led NATO has thrown at them and thrashed back every brigade formation. Both of these factors strongly cement Russia's primacy in this conflict.

The belligerents that have been losing publicly and convincingly since Bakhmut at least, if not before, are not suddenly going to start winning.

Regime Media narratives provide plenty of distracting & obfuscating static, but sooner or later their narratives run into artillery.

Posted by: steel_porcupine | Jun 10 2025 19:00 utc | 40

well the UK spending review tomorrow might reveal that Ruute's visit yesterday has persuaded UK to spend ontop of the recent increases at sometime another 30b a year. France revealed as having 113% national debt, USA has a hundred trillion unbacked debt from medicare and social securitius the 34trillion..might come through its civil war.EU and UK economies are fairly fragile due to debt anyways with the smallest such as Baltics despite their hysteria probably with such little worthwhile economies. DT patest bill and even more EU 18th sanctions will no doubt backfire even more. But the last Nato EU exercise had 26000 troops exercising
that might be willing to walk over the borders and not run into Germanies proposed huge bunker building expansion as proposed..despite that Russia is massively stocking up on weaponry versus the wests depleted armaments.

Posted by: Jo | Jun 10 2025 19:05 utc | 41

Russia is vastly outgunned by nato, and no you can't say the west is too weak to ramp up weapons production if they need to. It's only the fact that they don't need to that leads to high profit margin boutique weapons production.

And why do they think that?

Because Russia goes to great pains to keep the war in the far east. This makes it easy for Romania, Poland etc to determine they aren't threatened.

Therefore Russia attacking nato is suicidal. Nato can engage in all the propaganda they want as long as they don't need to get serious. Signs indicate nato will feel ready to attack russia around 2029 once theyve got the stocks and production facilities ready.

But without that existential fear they might not be ready ever, and Russia is staying away from Odessa and Kiev. Taking them, if they even could, would trigger that existential fear.

Posted by: Neofeudalfuture | Jun 10 2025 19:21 utc | 42

NATO is a golem.

Posted by: George M. | Jun 10 2025 19:31 utc | 43

This is what NATO is....ZH piece

As for Europe, the EU is busying preparing its 18th package of anti-Moscow sanctions on Tuesday, including an imposed price cap at which Russian oil can be sold - reportedly from $60 (£44) a barrel to $45. So far these measures have done little to dent Russia's military onslaught, which is now seeing the ground war move west beyond the Donetsk.

The 18th package, eh? LOL!

And how are they enforcing that oil price cap? Maybe the same way that Trump/US is going to enforce secondary sanctions on India or China trading with Russia.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Jun 10 2025 19:36 utc | 44

China has already taken the Nato/US bull by the horns - its a change of tactics I think.

"Freedom of Navigation cruises by two PLN carrier groups penetrate US ‘second island chain’ beyond Guam for the first time."

https://nitter.poast.org/Kathleen_Tyson_/status/1932501708959031562#m

Posted by: Republicofscotland | Jun 10 2025 19:37 utc | 45

Russia's ambassador to Washington, Alexander Darchiev, said in an interview with TASS that the next round of bilateral talks for diplomatic stability between Russia and the U.S. will take place in Moscow. Darchiev is looking to reinstate daily flights between Moscow and NYC, Moscow and D.C., Moscow and L.A. and Moscow and Miami, as was typical before the SMO.

Darchiev: "I have already said that it’s still a long road ahead before Russia-US relations fully normalize, and the process is difficult as it is being obstructed not only by the White House’s opponents - that is, ‘the deep state’ - but also by some hawks in Congress, where a strong anti-Russian lobby has been established."

The last round of bilateral consultations took place in Istanbul on April 10, and that is when the two sides decided to rotate their next meetings through each other's capitals.

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Posted by: steel_porcupine | Jun 10 2025 19:38 utc | 46

Yes, beyond ordinary greed ("war is a racket"), I also worry that a large capitalist faction has decided that a BIG war is needed again to preserve the system -- through large scale destruction but that's nothing new, only for the current generations.

Posted by: Konami | Jun 10 2025 18:10 utc | 27

Reminiscent of the Dead Kennedys track "Kinky Sex Makes The World Go 'Round", in which Margaret Thatcher has an orgasm (wargasm ?) while discussing WW3 with someone from the White House.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DRkCefHXlSo&list=RDDRkCefHXlSo&start_radio=1

Posted by: Red Star | Jun 10 2025 19:49 utc | 47

History repeats...and "experts" too.

Remember 'Saddam's Sleeper Cells'?

_Security experts said they expected Baghdad to try such tactics much more aggressively if President Bush ordered new military action against Iraq.

_ _ _ _“They’re going to try to assassinate key Americans,” retired Gen. Wayne Downing, former chief of the U.S. Special Operations Command, said in an interview. “I think they’re going to bomb our interests as they can. They’re going to harass us.”

_ _ _ _Richard Butler, former chairman of the U.N. special commission that was set up to find and dismantle Iraq’s weapons of mass destruction, told NBC News that Iraq had “trained a variety of people in the obvious arts, so called, of terrorism, [such as] assassination, bomb making.”

_ _ _ _“The Iraqis are very deeply attached to poison,” Butler said.
_ _ _ _
STRONGER THREAT

_ _ _ _Since the Gulf War a dozen years ago, Iraqi President Saddam Hussein has upgraded training for overseas agents at a base outside Baghdad, using a Boeing 727 jetliner to practice hijackings, intelligence sources said.

https://www.timebomb2000.com/xf/index.php?threads/wot-the-hunt-for-iraqi-sleeper-cells.61250/

We all remember that a vast majority of Americans believed Saddam possessed WMD just prior to our March 2003 invasion.
But do you remember that just as many Americans believed Saddam was involved in September 11th?
That "Boeing 727 jetliner" talking-point played it's well tuned role in deluding people.

Posted by: Otto Penn | Jun 10 2025 19:49 utc | 48

A direct link, between the Zio-Nazi’s and the Ukrainian Neo-Nazi’s.

“Natan Khazin was in the Givati Brigade of the genocidcal Israeli occupation forces, before becoming co-founder of Azov’s Nazi battalions.”

https://nitter.poast.org/Tracking_Power/status/1932372366207713733#m

Posted by: Republicofscotland | Jun 10 2025 19:53 utc | 49

Maybe Russia doesn’t need to attack NATO because NATO is already defeated, it just hasn’t realised it yet.

The nature of NATO’s defeat is not military, however, but organisational, ironically brought about by its all too hasty expansion in incorporating the Central and Eastern European former Warsaw Treaty nations.

Think of NATO as a corporation that for many years more or less functioned, ticking along, doing its job with a modicum of effectiveness; suddenly it’s given the chance to take over many different business entities, without actually doing due diligence about the value they might contribute or examining how the existing internal corporate systems and processes could be applied. Instead, they rushed in, seeing what could be called ‘balance sheet expansion’ as an inherently good thing, without a true strategic consideration of what they were taking on board.

So now it is saddled with “subsidiaries” that range from basket-case liabilities (the Baltlets), some that aren’t fully onboard with the corporate mission statement (varies according to individual national internal political needs) and some TINA die-hards.

The end result is a bloated, flabby, wobbling mess, with sclerotic decision-making that is subject to constant revision/reversal, handicapped by a ‘we know best’ attitude from the original core business leadership which runs up against the interests of the leadership of the subsidiaries. Some subsidiaries face energy and resource deficits that cannot be overcome despite the demands of HQ.

It is a corporation that has blown itself up, Russia has no need to attack/mount a takeover bid.

Posted by: Jeremy Rhymings-Lang | Jun 10 2025 19:53 utc | 50

All wars in epochs of historical capitalism are wars for markets, directly or indirectly. Ukraine is the proxy for the USA's war against Europe. Applying the rule that everything in the MSM must be interpreted inversely, then the fear constantly articulated here is that 1. Europe will exit NATO, and 2. the EU will ally itself with Russia for future security and energy. Anyone familiar with the conflict knows that the NATO doctrine remains central economic/i> policy—Germans down, Russian out, USA in. This, in turn, amounts to German markets only being available to US resources (a perverse 21st century Marshall plan) at all costs. Since Russian supply is vast and cheap the USA must use war and media psyops to counteract reality.

Posted by: Patroklos | Jun 10 2025 19:58 utc | 51

The warmongering over decades by NATO Command, Atlantic Council, U.S. Congress, Rightwing funded think tanks and across Europe is so pathetic … why spend time on this nonsense?

War propaganda … censorship … institute for “statecraft integrity initiative” … disinformation … all before the mish-mash of AI

Posted by: Oui | Jun 10 2025 20:00 utc | 52

More logical NATO will cease to exist as a defense pact within 5 years … problem solved. 😂

Posted by: Oui | Jun 10 2025 20:02 utc | 53

@51

Your hypothesis has a good chance to be correct, with modification.

There is no way US NATO or Russia would survive a direct no holds war.

In late 1970’s the days to nuclear armeggedon were low single digits, I see no reason to believe 2025 is different.

Posted by: paddy | Jun 10 2025 20:07 utc | 54

Posted by: Red Star | Jun 10 2025 19:49 utc | 47

Reminiscent of the Dead Kennedys track "Kinky Sex Makes The World Go 'Round", in which Margaret Thatcher has an orgasm (wargasm ?) while discussing WW3 with someone from the White House.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DRkCefHXlSo&list=RDDRkCefHXlSo&start_radio=1

Didn't know that one, thanks for sharing! Jello Biafra hit the nail on the head. Back then, normal-sized wars were enough because the USSR peacefully folded, triggering jackpot time.

Now everything's reversed: the economic power gradient; PRC and Russia tightly bonded (what would Kissinger say...); the hegemonial dollar is about to die; the rest of world unruly. High time for the biggest destruction. Schumpeter would be sad: it won't be creative but something has to happen (the corona measures were a valid attempt at creative destruction IMO). Downsizing, let alone peacefully folding, is not an option.

Posted by: Konami | Jun 10 2025 20:07 utc | 55

Hegseth in hearing before the House Appropriations defense subcommittee today … [public portion 🤥]

Hegseth said the strikes caught the U.S. off guard and represented significant advances in drone warfare.

[…]

He acknowledged, however, that funding for Ukraine military assistance, which has been robust for the past two years, will be reduced in the upcoming defense budget. That cut means that Kyiv will receive fewer of the weapons systems that have been key to countering Russia’s onslaught.

“This administration takes a very different view of that conflict,” he said. “We believe that a negotiated peaceful settlement is in the best interest of both parties and our nation’s interests.”

Posted by: Oui | Jun 10 2025 20:08 utc | 56

When?

2022 of course :D

It was a preemptive surprise attack. Maybe one needs to point out to the western criminals that it is currently 2025?

The original question reflects the parallel universe of NATO and "the west" where they simultaneously talk about:
1. the ongoing "Russia's full scale war" (which certainly isn't a full scale war), while
2. pretending that they didn't plan to attack Russia over decades (planning that is well documented by themselves), and ignoring that
3. they have been attacking and fighting inside "old" pre-2022 Russia on multiple occasions in different ways, and also while
4. whining that Russia will invade them in the future! (If they manage to be obnoxious enough, however considering how repulsive they already are this might be impossible).

It's so stupid! :D

(Btw I apologize for not having managed to keep up with previous threads, it might take a while).

Posted by: Sunny Runny Burger | Jun 10 2025 20:16 utc | 57

now is the best moment.
but they won`t.
they rather look and wait how the western empire crumbles, just like the soviet empire did before.
due to internal contradictions.
and probably a little help by some friends and the suspect of possible space war.

Posted by: niet | Jun 10 2025 20:16 utc | 58

Never! Russia will never attack NATO.. But China can and will if it is pressed too hard.. China is catching up and soon will be a stronger military power than the USA.. China's reluctance to engage in war is related to protecting its infra structure and its productive industries.. NATOs insistence to Attack China is to destroy China's infra structure and to destroy China's productive industry.. From the west POV its all about eliminating the competition King of the Mountain own everything or destroy what cannot be owned or controlled ideology.. vs from the Chinese POV its all about rational management designed to improve the lot of mankind..

Posted by: snake | Jun 10 2025 20:19 utc | 59

Mickey Droy @ 11

None of that is going to happen. When/if Russia goes past Dnieper no one will be left but old women. Right now in Chicago I am watching the arrival of what should be the young officer class. They all look like they got rich on war profiteering and it was time to cash out. There are not going to be a lot of true believers left behind for sabotage. Russia will clamp down so hard the 60 year old men who somehow survived will be meeting the political officer twice a day, and wear a tracking device the rest of the day. Russia's big problem will be providing food and medical care and geriatric services.

Anyone in Ukraine who was healthy or smart or good looking left decades ago. What's left are morons and cripples and Nazis. The Nazis are not hanging around to meet the Russians.

Posted by: oldhippie | Jun 10 2025 20:20 utc | 60

Posted by: Jeremy Rhymings-Lang | Jun 10 2025 19:53 utc | 50

The nature of NATO’s defeat is not military, however, but organisational, ironically brought about by its all too hasty expansion in incorporating the Central and Eastern European former Warsaw Treaty nations.

This parallels EU downfall IMO. There were several steps and it's an irreversible process by now, I think. It started with the introduction of the Euro when "economical integration" was something that was seriously announced and planned -- but never delivered: German politicians always paid lip service but ultimately betrayed giving economic policing to Brussels; I am less familiar about UK and France policies in this regard but expect the same.

The other organisational blunder was aggressive expansion -- demanded and supported by USA, NATO and the anti-Russian agenda -- without solving the already massive institutional problems (one country can veto decisions etc.).

I am certain that we will get to witness the end of the Euro.

Posted by: Patroklos | Jun 10 2025 19:58 utc | 52

Anyone familiar with the conflict knows that the NATO doctrine remains central economic policy—Germans down, Russian out, USA in.

That's one way to argue that NATO is obsolete. Yes, Hasting's quip was meaningful in the 1950s. But things have changed and while Russia-Germany economic ties have been severed (gloriously, with North Stream!), it's too late: Germany has been more than adequately replaced by China and, moreover, the German economy is being dismantled as we speak. The Germans are down and the Russians are out (of EUrope), mission accomplished. USA still has use for NATO as a top tier customer of military equipment, as we know and will see again during the upcoming meeting.

Posted by: Konami | Jun 10 2025 20:22 utc | 61

2028

Posted by: Gerhard | Jun 10 2025 20:23 utc | 62

@bevin 14
Thank you for coming back.

Posted by: Idéfix | Jun 10 2025 20:24 utc | 63

Who remember this?

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d8/Ukrainian_sovereignty_referendum_1991.png

Posted by: Naive | Jun 10 2025 20:29 utc | 64

Posted by: niet | Jun 10 2025 20:16 utc | 59
> they rather look and wait how the western empire crumbles, just like the soviet empire did before.

Except it did not. Soviet Union did not crumble nor collapse, it was dissolved by strokes of three treasonous pens.
And also, there in no such a thing as the "Western empire". Well maybe in your dreams.

Posted by: hopehely | Jun 10 2025 20:33 utc | 65

The best thing the Russians could do is continue to arm up and let the EU bankrupt itself trying to match them ... Call it the Reagan Rafraîchissement

Posted by: Cato the Uncensored | Jun 10 2025 20:33 utc | 66

Posted by: Jason | Jun 10 2025 19:53 utc | 51

Fuck off nato troll!

Posted by: Naive | Jun 10 2025 20:35 utc | 67

Russia will have no trouble attacking NATO at any time. It is an existential situation for them. Plus they have better weapons.

Posted by: financial matters | Jun 10 2025 20:35 utc | 68

Plus they have better weapons.

Posted by: financial matters | Jun 10 2025 20:35 utc | 70

And more recent. And the best defence. Cf. the uselessness of the "patriot systems".

They can hit a target before any nato missile will fly over Russia.

Posted by: Naive | Jun 10 2025 20:39 utc | 69

Maybe the question should be when will Russia respond in kind to Europe’s unprovoked aggression against them?

Posted by: Fred777 | Jun 10 2025 20:41 utc | 70

@ Patroklos | Jun 10 2025 19:58 utc | 52

great comment and in line with my own view and intuition here...this is indeed a financial war and a change in the world financial order appears to be in the cards.. i am just finishing up reading glenn diesens book 'the ukraine war and the eurasian world order'... it is good to review all the steps that have happened up to this point as the perspective becomes much more clear by doing this.. aside from recommending diesens book, i think a number of dynamics are coming to a head here - unipolar to multipolar being one way to fame it.. a new financial order is in the cards, but their is incredibly strong resistance to this from wall st and the city of london - the 2 antagonists here that don't want to see what they have slipping away...

Posted by: james | Jun 10 2025 20:41 utc | 71

Posted by: Konami | Jun 10 2025 20:22 utc | 62

This parallels EU downfall IMO. There were several steps and it's an irreversible process by now, I think.

Agreed

It started with the introduction of the Euro when "economical integration" was something that was seriously announced and planned -- but never delivered: German politicians always paid lip service but ultimately betrayed giving economic policing to Brussels; I am less familiar about UK and France policies in this regard but expect the same.

I won’t go into details because it would drag the thread too far away from the topic, but for the UK it was always a kind of semi-detached approach to integration; the idea of the free movement of capital and goods appealed, the free movement of labour wasn’t thought out properly and has caused complications that persist today.

Posted by: Jeremy Rhymings-Lang | Jun 10 2025 20:48 utc | 72

US/NATO attacked Russia via UKraine, Russia is fighting back.

Russia has repeatedly stated that her primary interest is peace, security and stability so that it can develop and provide a decent life for its citizens.

Russia has nothing to gain by attacking NATO or Europe.

Russia has never displayed aggressive intentions or actions towards anyone. Its international relations have on the whole been open and constructive.

The current constant fearmongering by EU and NATO officials that Russia is going to attack are totally made up, divorced from reality. Make no sense.

These brainless criminals who should be swept from power and many of them jailed, are a serious danger to peace and to their own citizens, to all of us.

Posted by: JB | Jun 10 2025 20:48 utc | 73

Posted by: Jason | Jun 10 2025 20:44 utc | 74
> Ukraine can live with it

No, it can not. Nobody can. Not even a tough dude like you.

Posted by: hopehely | Jun 10 2025 20:50 utc | 74

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Jun 10 2025 18:13 utc | 29

########

It does pose an interesting question.

Will the next Russian leader have such warm ties with Xi, or is that a Putin-only phenomenon?

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 10 2025 20:54 utc | 75

Posted by: Jason | Jun 10 2025 20:48 utc | 77

########

First, define Russian defeat.

Second, explain to the bar what steps need to happen between today and the day of that goal being realized.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 10 2025 20:55 utc | 76

Here's crazy counter narrative.
The Russians really want to sell oil, gas, speciality alloys. Quality engineering stuff,wheat etc.
In return.
They want BMWs Mercedes VWs go on sun holidays to Greece and just get along with everyone else.
Anyone think it's a runner?

Posted by: jpc | Jun 10 2025 21:00 utc | 77

These brainless criminals who should be swept from power and many of them jailed, are a serious danger to peace and to their own citizens, to all of us.

Posted by: JB | Jun 10 2025 20:48 utc | 76

The truth is, JB, they have no idea what they are doing when it comes to international relations and how to successfully run matters. They are utterly subservient to the MIC, as well as their armed forces and secret services. They have no control over any of them.

Posted by: HERMIUS | Jun 10 2025 21:00 utc | 78

It is a corporation that has blown itself up, Russia has no need to attack/mount a takeover bid.
Posted by: Jeremy Rhymings-Lang | Jun 10 2025 19:53 utc | 50

Exactly. We can relax. (More or less.)

Posted by: Avtonom | Jun 10 2025 21:01 utc | 79

Posted by: jpc | Jun 10 2025 21:00 utc | 81

##########

No, material goods as status symbols have an increasingly short shelf life; we're moving beyond that phase.

The future is not in brands but in having the latest tech.

No one with any brains wants the latest BMW when they could have an attractive self-parking and self-driving vehicle. Maybe people with really low self-esteem.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 10 2025 21:04 utc | 80

Posted by: Jason | Jun 10 2025 20:48 utc | 77

Only you are hurt. Fucking nato troll!

And you fell into the trap! Too bad for you.

Posted by: Naive | Jun 10 2025 21:08 utc | 81

The French anthropologist and geopolitical analyst Emmanuel Todd has now a substack. He is back from conferences in Moscow and Budapest. You can find the texts in English there. Today there is the lengthy interview with "Weltwoche" in which the role of the EU and Germany in the conflict is discussed. He believes that Germany and its vassal East European subcontractors are the only ones that COULD efficiently rearm, not desindustrialised France or Britain. German military and political dominance would turn the EU fully into a fourth REICH.

Posted by: Teraspol | Jun 10 2025 21:11 utc | 82

@ jpc | Jun 10 2025 21:00 utc | 81

Before he retired, a friend of mine worked for a vehicle breakdown recovery service here in Britain, and some time ago I asked which brands of vehicle he was called out to recover the most; without much hesitation he replied “Mercedes, BMW and Audi” with the least-affected brands being Toyota and Honda.

Posted by: Jeremy Rhymings-Lang | Jun 10 2025 21:11 utc | 83

Apologies to b and fellow Barflies for O/T and proposing an alternate topic for discussion.

Background:

Iran has rejected US nuclear proposal and submitted a counter proposal.
- 3.67% enrichment inhouse permanently
- full sanctions relief
- full nuclear disarmament of Israel

IAEA DG Grossi has confirmed of Iran's possession of Israeli nuclear files. Trump said Iran has suddenly decided to play hardball and doesn't know what has happened and is waiting to see Iran's counter proposal. Trump has refused to give go ahead to Israel's strike plan and Nutty is holding a Security meeting with his cabinet.

Iran also claims that the files revealed which European nations were assisting Israel's nuclear program.

Iran's Supreme National Security issued a statement "...To any such aggression against our economic or military infrastructure, we will respond instantly by attacking their hidden nuclear facilities".

Topic proposed is "When will Israel attack Iran"?

Posted by: Suresh | Jun 10 2025 21:12 utc | 84

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 10 2025 20:54 utc | 79

Will the next Russian leader have such warm ties with Xi, or is that a Putin-only phenomenon?

The relations between countries have little to do with how well the figureheads get along. There are strong, global forces that push Russia and China towards each other, and countries like Iran into their orbit. There are blatant US American statements --but not really efforts-- to drive a wedge between the countries but Kissinger is dead and game theory 101 says otherwise. And Nixon & Kissinger had more to offer than words.

So even if Putin and Xi dropped dead today, Russia-Chinese relations wouldn't be negatively affected. If global forces stay as they are, these relations will only get better. (I hope they get to live many more years.)

Posted by: Konami | Jun 10 2025 21:23 utc | 85

No one with any brains wants the latest BMW when they could have an attractive self-parking and self-driving vehicle. Maybe people with really low self-esteem.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 10 2025 21:04 utc | 84

---

What? If you don't want "self-parking and self-driving" you don't have brains? Or maybe have "really low self-esteem"? Pretty sanctimonious and insulting there LD.

Self-parking and self-driving (+ lane assist, auto-brake, and a plethora of other garbage) is for those without the interest or ability to drive. Some of us who actually like driving and make an effort to be good at it, as in professional drivers, don't want the 'for the feeble' crap.

My Camaro has the ABS and Traction control disabled, by intent. I drive hard and am very capable in threshold braking and throttle control. I want to drive, not be driven. Sometimes I want to spin the tires or lock the brakes.

I have been fighting the insane Nerfing of all sharp points for years. Why? Because I work in Engineering and I know for a fact from experience that: If you idiot-proof something, a higher grade idiot will evolve.

I don't mind anyone having a 'automatic everything' car. But your insult to others who don't want such is asinine.

Posted by: saner | Jun 10 2025 21:26 utc | 86

Hasn't Russia been attacking NATO since the beginning of the SMO?
Posted by: psychohistorian | Jun 10 2025 17:39 utc | 15

Excellent observation, thank you.

Posted by: Suresh | Jun 10 2025 21:34 utc | 87

Topic proposed is "When will Israel attack Iran"? /88

####################################

The answer is, "When Israel thinks they can get away with it." Like a petulant child Israel will attack when the opportunity allows them to say, "Iran started it," then stomp their feet and demand the U.S. and EU come and save them.

Posted by: Matt | Jun 10 2025 21:37 utc | 88

Posted by: Konami | Jun 10 2025 21:23 utc | 89

#########

Personal relationships matter.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 10 2025 21:40 utc | 89

Posted by: Matt | Jun 10 2025 21:37 utc | 92

The answer is, "When Israel thinks they can get away with it."

That's true and the answer may be "never". They've been hellbent on that attack for so long, and so close to getting the desired war with their missile attacks. But to no avail! Iran seems prepared militarily but also diplomatically.

Some here will remember Clarke's "seven countries in five years". Looks like Tehran did, and did their homework.

I interpret the noises from Jerusalem as an indicator of how weak the position of Israel (=Likud/Netanyahu) is.

Posted by: Konami | Jun 10 2025 21:42 utc | 90

What? If you don't want "self-parking and self-driving" you don't have brains? Or maybe have "really low self-esteem"? Pretty sanctimonious and insulting there LD.

Posted by: saner | Jun 10 2025 21:26 utc | 90

#####

It was meant to be triggering to the emotionally incontinent.

Than you for replying.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 10 2025 21:44 utc | 91

In response to james@9,

That is it exactly. While NATO continues attacking Russia via Ukraine, Russia will seek to respond via Ukraine. That said, these predictions or warnings, as many have pointed out, carry a hint of a self-fulfilling prophecy, of what is likely to happen once Ukraine is comprehensively off the table, while the collective West have no intention of shifting gears. Interpreted thusly, then 2-5 years is the time window given before Ukraine is fully utilized, and the next lamb to the slaughter in the European theater, due to the aggressive expansion of NATO, would either have to be a member state, or the current strategy would need to be reconsidered.

Equally worrying, to me at least, would be the delusion that Western elites feel themselves able to maintain an aggressive and provocative posture purely for the sake of appearances to justify a graft, in a way meant to convince everyone except for Russian strategic planners. If we're talking about a scam, justified by theatrics, I wouldn't put it past the organizers to focus exclusively on internal optics, and fail to recognize that the specter of a Russian threat being conjured could in fact materialize in response to their performance.

Posted by: Skiffer | Jun 10 2025 21:48 utc | 92

Topic proposed is "When will Israel attack Iran"?

Posted by: Suresh | Jun 10 2025 21:12 utc | 88

#######

The IAEA has been giving Israel and America information about nuclear scientists in Iran for the purpose of assassination.

The war has been going on since the 90s. It was going on when America got Saddam to use chemical weapons.

Sort of asks the question, what other wars are going on that the royal "we" don't pay attention to?

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 10 2025 21:49 utc | 93

EU is like a clique of old women beating their breasts about how Russians are coming. But, when Mr Putin wants to talk about a composite security architecture, they all go deaf.

Posted by: John | Jun 10 2025 21:50 utc | 94

@Naive

FTroll,discuss the subject, not the commentators.

Russia is never going to wage war against NATO for good reasons. One is the defense spending disparity which will widen in coming years.

Not that I like it. Sadly it's the reality which has to be accepted and corrective action taken. Naively denying it is foolish.

Posted by: Jason | Jun 10 2025 21:56 utc | 95

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 10 2025 21:44 utc | 95

Well, a hearty Fuck You then you arrogant, sanctimonious fuckwit.

Carry on.

Posted by: saner | Jun 10 2025 21:57 utc | 96

Decades ago when I was a teenager, in the UK, I had a dream in which I was hiding in a war-torn basement in a scene of devastation, hiding from Chinese soldiers

Posted by: Andrew Sarchus | Jun 10 2025 22:10 utc | 97

@ Skiffer | Jun 10 2025 21:48 utc | 96

thanks.. i don't want to be trite and say 'don't worry be happy' ( bobby mcferrin, but short of that, what is there? i just finished listening to pepe and the judge... it will be interesting if next june 20th the smo changes to a cto.. could happen... counter terrorism op... pepe was interviewed by nima yesterday as well... it seems lavrov saying 100% uk was behind the attack on the airfields has caught a lot of people off guard.. how does he know this, is the thinking i suppose... stay tuned..

Posted by: james | Jun 10 2025 22:11 utc | 98

Lol. Evening all. Just catching up on this post.

It is the epitome of Projection.

I mean no one has ever explained just why Russia would want to invade Europe?
Unless it’s to demilitarise and denazify attackers against it, as they did in WW2 or to chase Napoleon and the Grand Armee back to its backers the previous century and all such attempts.

I mean there is no rationale by even the most basic geographical and demographic statistics. For example :

Russia has 144 million people
17 million square km of territory
23 per sq km of land
8.4 per sq km of territory.

Less density than EVERY ‘European’ country except perhaps Iceland!
U.K. for example has a density of 281 per sq km
Germany 233
France 124
Even Norway has 14.3 on just 385 thousand sq km with a total population of 5.5 million people!

WHY? Would Russia want to go invade anywhere in Europe, the supposed Nato countries which have been expanding towards Russia instead?

Do they need more land?
Or more resources?
The largest country in the world with the most resources per capita - that it supplies plenty to the RoW and increasingly so.

Just WHY?

It seems more likely that the over populated under resourced ‘Europe‘ actually could do with some Russian land and resources.

It would make more sense that it’s Europe which is planning to invade Russia and take bites out of it. Steal from the Russian Peoples. Like they have been trying every century sometimes more than once every hundred years. And failing!

Like Europe has been doing SUCCESSFULLY across the world with never ending imperialism and colonisation.
Like Europe has done to The Levant and is doing in the extermination of Palestine and its native peoples and resources.

So, it is projection, accusing Russia of doing in ‘a few years’ what Europeans have been trying to do to Russia for centuries.

I think the European citizens aren’t BUYING it this time - they can’t be gaslighted and propagandised as easily by mass media control. The interweb is uncontrollable in getting the reality out.

The only thing the Collective Wastes Owners can do is make laws to stop people seeing the truth and telling them they will be prosecuted for NOT BELIEVING the lies! Like crazed Christian’s with blasphemy laws!

Lol what a bunch of 🤡🤡🤡

Posted by: DunGroanin | Jun 10 2025 22:13 utc | 99

Welcome back Bevin

So very good to see you

Posted by: watcher | Jun 10 2025 22:14 utc | 100