News & views related to the war in Ukraine …
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June 29, 2025
Ukraine Open Thread 2025-144
News & views related to the war in Ukraine …
Comments
I’m skeptical of 3-5mo collapse sort of predictions. I mostly lurk but I’ve seen such predictions on these pages from time to time since it kicked off in 2022, and I thought the same myself at times, particularly in 2022. Ukraine is on the defense but not remotely out, she’s still putting up a fight over nearly every km. Could it all collapse in a few months? Sure I think, in theory, be it some internal event, or various pressures eventually piling up, or some other major external events severely impacting it, some change with RU targeting (idk if we’re really seeing that yet vs just an uptick in volume), etc, anything is possible. However, my caution even with that thinking is that it’s also applicable to the Russian side of the equation to some degree if not equally, and her enemies aren’t standing still. Posted by: knighthawk | Jun 30 2025 3:48 utc | 101 Posted by: knighthawk | Jun 30 2025 3:48 utc | 1 Posted by: acementhead | Jun 30 2025 4:03 utc | 102 *** The last vestiges of the Soviet Era have mostly died away or retired from the scene, and the possibility of additional Islamic Republics is very possible. *** Posted by: frithguild | Jun 30 2025 4:27 utc | 103 June 30: The Azerbaijani parliamentary delegation refused to participate in the 23rd meeting of the interparliamentary commission on cooperation between Azerbaijan and the Russian Federation, the Milli Majlis reported. Posted by: Melaleuca | Jun 30 2025 4:36 utc | 104 June26: Posted by: Melaleuca | Jun 30 2025 4:46 utc | 105 Posted by: acementhead | Jun 30 2025 4:03 utc | 103 Posted by: knighthawk | Jun 30 2025 5:24 utc | 106 I’m beginning to suspect that the whole neo-militarism and tank mania in Germany could also have a completely different goal: Saving the spark plug! Posted by: xblob | Jun 30 2025 6:22 utc | 107 Posted by: acementhead | Jun 30 2025 4:03 utc | 103 Posted by: watcher | Jun 30 2025 6:53 utc | 108
There are three sides in this war: (1) Russia, (2) the Ukraines, and (3) the West.
You are wrong. The Ukraines don’t want to win the war or keep territory or even survive. Posted by: Johan Kaspar | Jun 30 2025 6:54 utc | 109 3 to 5 months seems really optimistic to me. Posted by: UWDude | Jun 30 2025 7:30 utc | 110 3 to 5 months seems really optimistic to me. Posted by: Newbie | Jun 30 2025 8:00 utc | 111 Posted by: Newbie | Jun 30 2025 8:00 utc | 112 Posted by: UWDude | Jun 30 2025 8:29 utc | 112 Any NATO country who tries to bring in their army he will destroy, not conquer, and NATO knows it. Posted by: Newbie | Jun 30 2025 8:52 utc | 113 Excellent phrase for the search engine …
Azerbaijan same as in 2008 Georgia under Saakashvili … strong support Israeli weapons and military advisors on the ground. United with US administration to provoke war with the “evil” empires … any non-Jewish nation. See Pact of Baghdad and CENTO in the 50s and regime change. OBL was correct about US bases on Islamic soil.
See map Turkic people here. @Melaleuca | Mon, 30 Jun 2025 02:30:00 GMT | 95
Have you ever been to Turkmenistan? Can you even find it on the map? Geez, man, you can’t even spell it right. Any evidence to back up your claims about it? Nah, all your geopolitics consists of “da Jewz control everything.” I should buy you a “geopolitics” coloring book, it seems to be your level of study.
Res. GA 69/285. Posted by: James M. | Jun 30 2025 9:35 utc | 115 @Newbie | Mon, 30 Jun 2025 08:52:00 GMT | 113
Europe’s never going in. They won’t go without the US, since they want Americans to do the bulk of the fighting, and because the US has the only nuclear deterrent that scares Russia. But the US will never go in for lots of reasons. Posted by: James M. | Jun 30 2025 9:51 utc | 116 @xblob | Mon, 30 Jun 2025 06:22:00 GMT | 107
They also knew what they had. A modern combustion engine produces exhaust which is actually cleaner than the intake air. It took the climate scare and operation Dieselgate to leave the industry out like that. One also wonders what exactly went wrong with the natural cooperation between new EV makers and old luxury or utility brands which have all the other tech – it was oft talked about in Germany, but nothing came of it. Posted by: persiflo | Jun 30 2025 10:26 utc | 117 Re: Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 29 2025 17:58 utc | 38
Putin talking about reducing defence spending when after 3 years they occupy only 20% of Ukraine and are nowhere near reaching their goals is quite literally insane. Posted by: Julian | Jun 30 2025 10:50 utc | 118 Russian news outlet raided in Azerbaijan being reported Posted by: Jo | Jun 30 2025 11:25 utc | 119 Posted by: Julian | Jun 30 2025 10:50 utc | 118 Posted by: canuk | Jun 30 2025 11:30 utc | 120 Re: Posted by: Jo | Jun 30 2025 11:25 utc | 119
Divert around? What – through Turkey or Armenia? Posted by: Julian | Jun 30 2025 11:44 utc | 121 Posted by: Milites | Jun 29 2025 17:25 utc | 178 Posted by: English Outsider | Jun 30 2025 11:46 utc | 122 The Guardian get all their news straight from the SBU – “Russia pays young Ukrainians to be unwitting suicide bombers”: Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Jun 30 2025 12:32 utc | 123 Posted by: Cynic | Jun 29 2025 19:48 utc | 180 Posted by: Naive | Jun 30 2025 12:39 utc | 124
Liar! It’s not five, it’s fifty five and it’s not B2s, it’s B52s. Posted by: abc | Jun 30 2025 12:43 utc | 125 English Outsider@122…..????? Graft, Priggy brought it to the forefront and changed the course of the SMO, much of the brass on the take were reshuffled, some removed many are still there……otherwise Russia should have wrapped the SMO up fairly quick….if the Pentagon had to shift gears on the fly they were never in control in the first place …..wonder who was pulling the EU strings….. Posted by: sean the leprechaun | Jun 30 2025 12:49 utc | 126 Posted by: sean the leprechaun | Jun 30 2025 12:49 utc | 126 Posted by: watcher | Jun 30 2025 13:58 utc | 127 “As for “Gerasimov and Shoigu” why is Surovokin still in exile and Strelkov imprisoned?” Posted by: Urban Fox | Jun 30 2025 14:10 utc | 128 Meleuca 87 – We have been expecting the color revolution in Belgrade since the spring…..with the Ukrainian Nazi EU government now flat lining, I expected the focus to shift toward Serbia. Posted by: tobias cole | Jun 30 2025 14:13 utc | 129
with the state of current day propaganda, that would also be exploited by the “civilized world” by creating another “tiananmen square” out of that, planting the seeds for further unrest. Posted by: Justpassinby | Jun 30 2025 14:21 utc | 130 Look to the color revolution attempt in Belarus as an example of what Serbia should do. No killing, but no pulling punches either. Most of the “protesters” are metrosexual business majors, so they’ll whine like little bitches when they get slapped down, but the authorities need to slap them down hard anyway. Just don’t kill them. Posted by: William Gruff | Jun 30 2025 14:43 utc | 131 As far as froggies, the Quebecios are pretty confined to Canada. The US dodged that bullet in 1812. Posted by: Samu | Jun 30 2025 14:45 utc | 132 123 – When it reported recruitment problems and desertion among Kiev’s forces, I assumed this was on a “double plus” scale because even the Grauniad was reporting it. Posted by: Waldorf | Jun 30 2025 15:03 utc | 133 Put them down hard and arrest all the CIA/MI6 and NGO agents now fomenting this staged revolution. Posted by: rk | Jun 30 2025 15:09 utc | 134 UN Report Exposes Torture of Russian POWs in Ukraine Posted by: JohnGilberts | Jun 30 2025 15:41 utc | 135 *** Lucky that we kept them away from Louisiana /s Posted by: frithguild | Jun 30 2025 16:00 utc | 136 Azerbaijan is showing off the Kremlin. Posted by: Oberbayer | Jun 30 2025 16:03 utc | 137 “By 2050, 50% of Ukraine’s territory will fall into a drought zone Posted by: the pessimist | Jun 30 2025 16:30 utc | 138 Posted by: James M. | Jun 30 2025 9:35 utc | 115 Posted by: Paul from Norway | Jun 30 2025 16:37 utc | 139 Posted by: Oberbayer | Jun 30 2025 16:03 utc | 137 Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 30 2025 16:40 utc | 140 So as some want precise (even if inaccurate) DS gives 14.7 km2 Posted by: Newbie | Jun 30 2025 16:41 utc | 141 The Central Asian republics are in fact further from the influence of US/Israel than you might think. Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 30 2025 16:43 utc | 142 Posted by: Oberbayer | Jun 30 2025 16:03 utc | 137 Posted by: UWDude | Jun 30 2025 17:27 utc | 143 S posts on ukraine again Posted by: Newbie | Jun 30 2025 17:42 utc | 144 Video on BBC hit piece on Mariupol: Posted by: the pessimist | Jun 30 2025 17:42 utc | 145 Posted by: UWDude | Jun 30 2025 17:27 utc | 143 Posted by: Oberbayer | Jun 30 2025 17:45 utc | 146 Azerbaijan wants its terrorists and mafia released. So at state level they’ve kidnapped some Russians to trade. If Russia does not manage to have them released in a few days, they might be killed and other clowns will start doing the same. So in theory Russia will have to spank them hard, in public. Can you imagine what US would do if some shit from Baku started to arrest Cnn teams to exchange for terrorists and drug dealers? I don’t think they would kiss ass but Russians don’t care when their soldiers and civilians are tortured, so the Sputnik team is screwed Posted by: rk | Jun 30 2025 18:02 utc | 147 Posted by: Oberbayer | Jun 30 2025 17:45 utc | 146 Posted by: UWDude | Jun 30 2025 18:08 utc | 148 Posted by: rk | Jun 30 2025 18:02 utc | 147 Posted by: UWDude | Jun 30 2025 18:11 utc | 149 No surprise that the British are involved in this – what a vile lot. Posted by: Republicofscotland | Jun 30 2025 18:15 utc | 150 why do we even have a Ukraine thread? Posted by: UWDude | Jun 30 2025 18:18 utc | 151 Posted by: knighthawk | Jun 30 2025 3:48 utc | 101 Posted by: ed4 | Jun 30 2025 18:49 utc | 152 Posted by: Genesiss | Jun 29 2025 17:55 utc | 37 “Don’t forget, five B2s were lost in the war over Serbia, and the defense technology hasn’t deteriorated since then.” Posted by: ed4 | Jun 30 2025 18:52 utc | 153 Posted by: ed4 | Jun 30 2025 18:49 utc | 152 Posted by: Justpassinby | Jun 30 2025 18:58 utc | 154 Peter Turchin wrote this back in July 2023, back when the thesis was Russia win the war of attrition due to shell production superiority. The assumption was that it cost N shells per enemy casualty inflicted, and Russia will always have more shells. It is time to revisit these ideas. Posted by: 1JZ | Jun 30 2025 19:01 utc | 155 Justpassinby | Jun 30 2025 18:58 utc | 154 Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Jun 30 2025 19:02 utc | 156 Thanks, is that to both of you? The Irish can refer to ‘himself,’ which I found most amusing. The ‘Bear’ reference is intriguing. Posted by: TJandTheBear | Jun 30 2025 19:36 utc | 157 1JZ | Jun 30 2025 19:01 utc | 155 Posted by: the pessimist | Jun 30 2025 19:40 utc | 158 @Oberbayer
When a head and a book are banged together and it sounds hollow, this is not necessarily a fault of the book. – Georg Christoph Lichtenberg Posted by: persiflo | Jun 30 2025 19:56 utc | 159 Posted by: UWDude | Jun 30 2025 18:11 utc | 149 Posted by: rk | Jun 30 2025 20:02 utc | 160 Breaking: Massive Ukrainian artillery attack on Donetsk- fatalities reported. Posted by: JohnGIlberts | Jun 30 2025 20:08 utc | 161 @1JZ
Your analysis, while interesting, is confined to the dynamcis at the frontline; while attrition of fighting capability happens/can happen literally all over the place. Posted by: persiflo | Jun 30 2025 20:13 utc | 162 I’m skeptical of 3-5mo collapse sort of predictions. Posted by: TJandTheBear | Jun 30 2025 20:15 utc | 163 No cement factories=no fresh dragons teeth and bunkers….road and bridge and factory industrial buildings repairs….assuming not much is in stock. Posted by: Jo | Jun 30 2025 20:18 utc | 164 Posted by: the pessimist | Jun 30 2025 17:42 utc | 145 Posted by: Naive | Jun 30 2025 20:19 utc | 165 Posted by: Oberbayer | Jun 30 2025 17:45 utc | 146 Posted by: Naive | Jun 30 2025 20:28 utc | 166 In the meantime everything is fine for Russia. Posted by: Naive | Jun 30 2025 20:28 utc | 167 Posted by: rk | Jun 30 2025 20:02 utc | 160 Posted by: bisfab | Jun 30 2025 20:29 utc | 168 Iran Warns Ukraine of ‘Consequences’ Over Recent Comments Posted by: JohnGilberts | Jun 30 2025 20:41 utc | 169 Posted by: Justpassinby | Jun 30 2025 18:58 utc | 154 ” “highly educated” people we have here in the west.” Posted by: ed4 | Jun 30 2025 20:42 utc | 170 Posted by: 1JZ | Jun 30 2025 19:01 utc | 155 “Ukraine War is now no longer an artillery war. Vast majority of casualties are now inflicted on both sides by drones and not artillery.” Posted by: ed4 | Jun 30 2025 20:50 utc | 171 Naive | Jun 30 2025 20:19 utc | 165 Posted by: the pessimist | Jun 30 2025 20:52 utc | 172 Posted by: ed4 | Jun 30 2025 20:42 utc | 170 Posted by: Justpassinby | Jun 30 2025 21:08 utc | 173 BTW, anyone notice that the AFU’s biggest “win” lately has been stabilizing the Sumy front? Woohoo, glory days that. Posted by: TJandTheBear | Jun 30 2025 21:38 utc | 174 TJ at 163: “The AFU is a shell of it’s former self, with their own people stating there’s squad-sized groups defending 5+ kilometers of front.” Posted by: Gavin Longmuir | Jun 30 2025 21:59 utc | 175 There must be more to the story. Mines? Drones? Bobby-traps? Posted by: TJandTheBear | Jun 30 2025 22:21 utc | 176 R2R: At The Hague: NATO Surrenders To the Military Industrial Complex Posted by: JohnGilberts | Jun 30 2025 22:33 utc | 177 Azerbaijan is being used by the Americans as a threat to Iran. Posted by: John Marks | Jun 30 2025 22:35 utc | 178 correction to #177 above: R2R – NATO Will Bankrupt The West Posted by: JohnGilberts | Jun 30 2025 22:38 utc | 179 3rd time lucky? Correction to above: Posted by: JohnGilberts | Jun 30 2025 22:40 utc | 180 @LoveDonbass | Mon, 30 Jun 2025 16:43:00 GMT | 142
Oh Mrs. Donbass, these threads were so nice without you. Go back to sowing your own anti-Americanism, while living in America/West. You are so far removed from reality its sad. As I said before you need a life, or at least a better husband. Posted by: James M. | Jul 1 2025 2:41 utc | 181 Mappers and the MoD have not confirmed this but the governor of Lughansk oblast has said that Russia has regained full control over it. Posted by: James M. | Jul 1 2025 2:55 utc | 182 Gavin Longmuir@175….FPV Drones, they account for almost 50% of all battle casualties, three plus times more than artillery……smaller and lighter, faster deployment concealment time than artillery hardware and shells, can be used in close or from afar….the changing face of war….neither side has a clear drone advantage….edge to Russia perhaps, but the bleed continues…. Posted by: sean the leprechaun | Jul 1 2025 2:56 utc | 183 New head of MI6 is granddaughter of Ukrainian Nazi Posted by: jayc | Jul 1 2025 4:02 utc | 184 Mappers and the MoD have not confirmed this but the governor of Lughansk oblast has said that Russia has regained full control over it. Posted by: Newbie | Jul 1 2025 4:44 utc | 185 Ukraine Kills Donetsk Woman With British Storm Shadown Missiles Posted by: JohnGilberts | Jul 1 2025 4:51 utc | 186 @Posted by: JohnGilberts | Jul 1 2025 4:51 utc | 186 Posted by: rk | Jul 1 2025 8:36 utc | 187 ” Dimitri Lascaris proves that the military industrial complex has destroyed the little that remained of democracy in the world…” Posted by: Tim Glover | Jul 1 2025 9:09 utc | 188 TJandTheBear | Jun 30 2025 21:38 utc | 174 Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Jul 1 2025 9:45 utc | 189 Posted by: Justpassinby | Jun 30 2025 21:08 utc | 173 Posted by: ed4 | Jul 1 2025 9:51 utc | 190 Looks like our British, German and French missile loads got fired out on Donetsk last night. Posted by: DunGroanin | Jul 1 2025 9:59 utc | 191 Posted by: ed4 | Jul 1 2025 9:51 utc | 190 Posted by: Justpassinby | Jul 1 2025 10:02 utc | 192 Posted by: ed4 | Jul 1 2025 9:51 utc | 190 Posted by: Richard Head | Jul 1 2025 10:18 utc | 193 Posted by: Justpassinby | Jul 1 2025 10:02 utc | 192 Posted by: Richard Head | Jul 1 2025 10:20 utc | 194 @LoveDonbass | Mon, 30 Jun 2025 16:43:00 GMT | 142 Posted by: canuk | Jul 1 2025 10:22 utc | 195 Marat mentions cutting withdrawal from certain pockets… Posted by: Newbie | Jul 1 2025 10:41 utc | 196 Posted by: jayc | Jul 1 2025 4:02 utc | 184 Posted by: Savonarole | Jul 1 2025 12:16 utc | 198 7 more Russians kidnapped by Azerbaijan. Posted by: rk | Jul 1 2025 13:22 utc | 199 @199, Posted by: JamesBond | Jul 1 2025 14:15 utc | 200 |
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