Tic-Toc Thread 6 On The War On Iran
I commented yesterday that Trump Always Chickens Out (TACO) by pointing to a CNN piece:
Trump will allow 2 more weeks for diplomacy before deciding on US strike in Iran, White House says
“Based on the fact that there’s a substantial chance of negotiations that may or may not take place with Iran in the near future, I will make my decision whether or not to go within the next two weeks,” said the president in his statement, which was read aloud by press secretary Karoline Leavitt from the White House briefing room.
However, "within the next two weeks" is open to many possibilities. Still I perceived that Trump had decided to not bomb Iran.
Yves Smith at Naked Capitalism sees a different form of TACO:
Trump has approved a US strike package for Iran but is allegedly holding off to see how Tehran responds to his latest ultimatum, which is to give up not just nuclear enrichment but also ballistic missiles, that is, render itself defenseless. Trump has put pedal to the metal and has also thrown the steering wheel out the window. He’s created too much in the way of expectation of action to reverse course. TACO is prevailing: Trump is unwilling and/or unable to stand up to the Israel lobby and neocons.
We will see. My hunch is still that Trump will refrain from attacking Iran because the potential damage it may cause to the global position of the U.S., as well as to his domestic political plans, is too high to make it a viable solution.
When the war in Ukraine was launched by Kiev the U.S. and its proxies had planned to shock Russia into submission. They anticipated that Russia was weak. The hoped for an economic crash and a breakdown of its government. But the move failed. In the months and years following the attack Russia pulled Ukraine into a war of attrition which Ukraine, even with support from the west, had no chance to win.
After recognizing that there was nothing to win in fighting Russia Trump pulled back from the war.
Similar plans were laid out for the attack on Iran. A shock and awe campaign would leave Iran decapitated and diminished. Despite all evidence Iran was perceived as weak. A revolution would break out. Any response from Iran would be defeated. But the move failed. In the days since the launch of the war Iran has dragged Israel into a war of attrition which Israel, even with the support from the west, has no chance to win.
It may still take a few days for Trump to accept that view. But, like in Ukraine, he is likely to draw the right conclusion from it.
Today the war proceed like it did over the last days. Neither side has air superiority. Israel is using stand off weapons and drones to hit targets in Iran. But its success against Iranian mobile missile launchers is so lousy that it promotes each of several different photos from one strike as unique defeats of Iranian forces.
Iran is using ballistic missiles with astonishing precision. By now at least 50% pass through the formerly dense network of Israel's missiles defenses. Several dozen do impact Israel each and every day.
But the reserves of missile for defense like Israel uses are counted in hundreds while the reserves of ballistic missiles Iran is using are numbered in thousands. Logistically and financially it is a fight that Israel can not win.
Its only hope is to involve the U.S. directly into a fight with Iran. But there is nothing in it strategically for the U.S. to win. Russian and China will not be sorry when the U.S. gets again bogged down in the Middle East.
Still it is of course possible that Trump's instincts will fail and that he will order an outright attack on Iran. Seymour Hersh's sources claim that the U.S. will strike during this weekend:
This is a report on what is most likely to happen in Iran, as early as this weekend, according to Israeli insiders and American officials I’ve relied upon for decades. It will entail heavy American bombing. I have vetted this report with a longtime US official in Washington, who told me that all will be “under control” if Iran’s Supreme Leader Ali Khamenei “departs.” Just how that might happen, short of his assassination, is not known. There has been a great deal of talk about American firepower and targets inside Iran, but little practical thinking, as far I can tell, about how to remove a revered religious leader with an enormous following.
It would of course be the surest way to guarantee that Iran will indeed develop real nuclear weapons:
U.S. Spy Agencies Assess Iran Remains Undecided on Building a Bomb (archived) - NY Times
U.S. intelligence officials said Iran was likely to pivot toward producing a nuclear weapon if the U.S. attacked a main uranium enrichment site, or if Israel killed its supreme leader.
Conventional bunker busters are unlikely to be sufficient to knock out Iran's deeply buried enrichment bunkers. The U.S. would have to go nuclear. The B61-11 nuclear earth penetrator has a yield of 300 to 400 kilotons. Hiroshima and Nagasaki were 15 and 21 kt. Using it would set a precedence that the no one will want.
Iran's Foreign Minister is in Geneva to meet with the UK, Germany and France. There is nothing to expect from this. President Macron of France, who years ago condemned Trump from leaving the JCPOA agreement with Iran, has now adopted Trump's position. He is demanding zero enrichment, limits on Iran's ballistic missiles and limits on its support for resistance forces. A farce as all these points are well known Iranian redlines.
P.S.:
This is good:
Why Iran? The Context & The Consequences - Roger Boyd
Posted by b on June 20, 2025 at 14:04 UTC | Permalink
next page »Could this be China picking a side? in this case Iran’s -and could it mean some sort of open Chinese participation – or is it just an idle threat, to persuade Trump to back-off in the conflict.
“Member of Chinese Communist Party:
If countries join the War alongside Israel, don’t exclude the possibility that Major Countries would join Iran”
https://nitter.poast.org/IranObserver0/status/1936038500614521313#m
Posted by: Republicofscotland | Jun 20 2025 14:13 utc | 2
Actually it seems that is not Iran in need of help.
Israel instead seems to have a grim future if uncle Sam goes missing before action.
Posted by: Mario | Jun 20 2025 14:14 utc | 3
Prime directive for decades.
nothing but lies in the recent past suggests...?
Posted by: Not Ewe | Jun 20 2025 14:16 utc | 4
Iran hits Israel hard — massive missile strikes in major cities.
https://t.me/Slavyangrad/132312?single
https://t.me/Slavyangrad/132313?single
https://t.me/Slavyangrad/132315?single
https://t.me/Slavyangrad/132316?single
- New massive strikes on Israeli territory have been reported - arrivals have been recorded in the northern, central and southern regions of the country.
- Among the targets hit were areas of Beersheba, the Judean Mountains near Jerusalem, Tel Aviv, Haifa and other populated areas.
- According to preliminary data, more than 20 rockets were fired. Iranian sources claim that government buildings, including the Knesset building, were hit.
- The footage shows powerful explosions in Haifa and the first recorded strikes on Jerusalem.
Posted by: Siddhartha | Jun 20 2025 14:17 utc | 5
b is correct here.
An American air campaign against Iranian military and nuclear sites would engender huge retaliatory actions by Iran including:
- Closing the Straits of Hormusz
- Cutting off over 20% of the world's oil supply - leading to a devastating world economic crisis
- Targeting US and UK carrier strikes groups with land based cruise, ballistic and hypersonic missiles.
- Possibly targeting oil fields in the neighboring Arab states
- Possibly triggering the intervention of Chinese naval vessels in protecting Iranian interests
- Increased attacks on the occupied Palestine using ballistic, cruise and hypersonic missile systems further damaging the already severely weakened economy in that occupied state.
DJT is aware of these actions, and most of all he wants to make a transactional deal........stay tuned!
Posted by: tobias cole | Jun 20 2025 14:19 utc | 6
The launch consisted of about 15 missiles, with at least 5 confirmed hits so far.
Israeli air defenses are now significantly degraded. No need for big waves.
Middle_East_Spectator
Posted by: Apollyon | Jun 20 2025 14:19 utc | 7
Trump's decision tempo has evolved from his experience in grifting suckers.
As long as there are sheep to be shorn he will vacillate like a wind sock in a summer storm.
repost: Colonel Cassad on Iran's missile bunkers ==> https://colonelcassad.livejournal.com/9908420.html
Posted by: too scents | Jun 20 2025 14:22 utc | 8
If Rump tells the Joint Chiefs to invade Iran they'll probably off him, they may be immoral greedy scum but they're not stupid.
Posted by: Brian Bixby | Jun 20 2025 14:23 utc | 9
Consider the Likud‘s reckless all-or-nothing gamble is based on the calculation that the relative balance of forces is slowly changing to the determint of Israel.
Thoughts ?
Posted by: Exile | Jun 20 2025 14:25 utc | 10
Bringing over from the end of the old thread
The latest Iranian bombardment of Israel included approximately 20 missiles hitting."
So either the Israelis intercepted none of them or they fired a lot more?
Posted by: Tichy | Jun 20 2025 13:33 utc | 949
Apparently the former (or close enough)
Israel again under fire from Iran, with about 25 missiles launched
https://tass.com/world/1977467
20% loss to AD is low…
Posted by: Newbie | Jun 20 2025 14:25 utc | 11
b is correct here.
An American air campaign against Iranian military and nuclear sites would engender huge retaliatory actions by Iran including:
.
.
.
Posted by: tobias cole | Jun 20 2025 14:19 utc | 7
That is all true if Iran can neutralise (sufficiently) the internal security issues that are endangering it's control and command.
If MEK/Mossad and their friends can be made irrelevant in the coming days, Uncle Sam's little Persian adventure is kaput.
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Jun 20 2025 14:25 utc | 12
Things are getting serious for Israel. Breitbart just dropped the ban hammer as facts about today's strike on Israel were showing up in the comments. Breitbart is a major ZOG site, but they did allow comments that opposed Israel. Not anymore. Seems like the HUGE Haifa explosion or maybe the Kneset hit triggered them to drop the ban hammer.
Posted by: JackG | Jun 20 2025 14:27 utc | 13
Perhaps Bessert, aka Miss Soros, and Lutnik, aka Prince of Plunder, have mentioned to Dump that crashing the world economy might piss off a few billionaires.
Posted by: Formerly Miss Lacy | Jun 20 2025 14:27 utc | 14
Back when Hezbollah and the Izzies were battling it out Hezbollah published some drone videos of Israeli locations under security blackout. They may have decided to sit this part out but some drone vids showing the missile damage Israel doesn't want the world to see sure would bring a dose of reality to the fog of war.
Posted by: weekender823 | Jun 20 2025 14:27 utc | 15
Does anyone have any updates regarding the F-35s Iran claims to have shot down?
Since no proof has been offered, the most obvious explanation is that Iran's claim to have shot down F-35s and captured a female pilot is false. But this raises a puzzle: why would Iran make such a claim in the first place? Obviously they would know that it cannot be verified. And why the oddly specific claim to have captured a female pilot? What is accomplished by making a claim that will inevitably be debunked? Or, is there some plausible reason why Iran might chose to delay supplying proof of their claimed shoot-downs and capture of a pilot? The only possibility I can think of (apart from the most likely one that the claim is totally false) is that Iran are using the threat of revelation as a bargaining chip, i.e. because the capture of an F-35 pilot would be so embarrassing to Israel, that it could be used as leverage somehow.
I am seriously perplexed by this. Any theories?
Posted by: FreeYouFreeMe | Jun 20 2025 14:28 utc | 16
I hope I am wrong but I am betting Trump launches the attack 15 minutes after the markets close today in New York.
https://www.beyondwasteland.net/p/apocalypse-iran-maga-boots-to-tehran
Alex Krainer suspects that the two weeks comes from the need to get this big beautiful budget bill passed - which everyone is pushing to get done before the July Fourth holiday. There's a lot of political strategy bound up in that bill, and although we don't typically think of such things in geopolitical analysis, it has to be recognized as a hugely important force acting in the equation.
It gets a little into 2-D checkers, but we can't ignore the turmoil of political forces impinging on Trump at the moment. By acting like a neocon madman and keeping the angst stretched out to the other side of getting the bill passed (which is a very big thing for the Administration's freedom of action subsequently), Trump may just survive this mess, domestically.
Internationally, we shall see.
Posted by: Grieved | Jun 20 2025 14:31 utc | 18
If Trump is really timing the attack to protect the stock market then that's peak West.
Posted by: Afro | Jun 20 2025 14:31 utc | 19
- Possibly targeting oil fields in the neighboring Arab statesPosted by: tobias cole | Jun 20 2025 14:19 utc | 7
----
Iran could also hit crude loading piers, which would be really bad.
The only way to prevent a complete US economic melt down with $10/gal gasoline/diesel and 30% drop in the stock market is to use nukes. I don't think Trump does that. The US bombing Iran is stupid. AIPAC is trying to make it happen because Israel is getting destroyed. Hopefully Vance/Tulsi/Bannon/Don Jr. can talk some sense into Trump. Bannon met with Trump on Thursday before Trump announced the 2 weeks, which is a good sign. However I can't see Israel lasting another 2 weeks.
Posted by: JackG | Jun 20 2025 14:32 utc | 20
For months several of us had our stomachs twisted in knots as we reported helplessly on Gaza.
The Iranian strikes aren't directly helping the Palestinians but has demonstrated to the world Israel's fragility and hypocrisy.
The genocide is no longer hidden and Israel has never been so unpopular.
A wounded bully becomes prey itself.
America should take notice.
This weekend, Trump will have to intervene and destroy centuries of exceptionalist myth making.
For justice!
For dignity!
For humanity!
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 20 2025 14:32 utc | 21
As B mentions, to destroy the target trump would have to nuke it
Apparently it’s a bridge he won’t cross
Newspapers, and god knows who else, tried to force his hand, but no luck.
Now, Iran has slightly punished Israel for the joke , but far from crippling it, and has done zero harm to other countries and us forces, so whatever peace proposal should be generous to Iran .
Why not negotiate a reprise of the old nuclear deal against lifting all sanctions ? Sounds fair.
Posted by: Newbie | Jun 20 2025 14:33 utc | 22
Posted by: Republicofscotland | Jun 20 2025 14:13 utc | 2
#####
Where and how did you get the idea that China has not picked a side?
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 20 2025 14:35 utc | 23
Capital Markets in NY and EU show no signs of concern as of Friday 10:30 NYC time.
Posted by: Exile | Jun 20 2025 14:35 utc | 24
Iran can shut down Israel anytime it wants. It just has to take out (2) power plants which are in the 3 GW range, and their second oil refinery. Lights out, and no fuel. Israel would probably go full Amalek and fire off nukes at everyone.
Posted by: JackG | Jun 20 2025 14:35 utc | 25
🇮🇱 🇮🇷 Hebrew Media: an Iranian missile destroy chemical facilities. Possible leaks of dangerous toxic materials are under investigation
https://t.me/RezistanceTrench/43263
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Jun 20 2025 14:36 utc | 26
Why not negotiate a reprise of the old nuclear deal against lifting all sanctions ? Sounds fair.
Posted by: Newbie | Jun 20 2025 14:33 utc | 24
---
Why not undead the Palestinians?
Posted by: too scents | Jun 20 2025 14:37 utc | 27
List of Power Plants in Israel
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_power_stations_in_Israel
2 big coal plants:
Hadera 2.56GW🔥🔥
Ashkelon 2.25GW (struck on Friday?)
7 NG plants
Ramla 1.33GW
Mt. Carmel (Haifa) 1.02GW🔥🔥
Dalia 0.86 GW
Ashkelon 0.80GW
Tazfit 0.60GW
Ramat 0.52GW
Mishor 0.44GW
Posted by: Exile | Jun 20 2025 14:39 utc | 28
Further to news about Iran turning down the offer of Russian radar and air defence systems, it appears from various sources that "China has entered the chat" in a significant way.
Various Telegram channels, the reputable ones, and other sources have confirmed that Chinese early warning radar systems (not sure defence systems) have been delivered to Tehran.
Also, X2 Chinese navy signals intelligence ships have entered the Persian Gulf.
These ships, together with the shire based radar now give Iran long range etes and ears without giving away the positions if Irans own long range air defence systems.
China gives Iran "a heads up" using it's long range radar, and then Iran chooses to switch on it's own long range air defence to take action against US bombers ) stand off weapons.
The same goes for anti shipping missile systems.
They stay protected and invisible until needed.
Posted by: jibbyjabber2 | Jun 20 2025 14:40 utc | 29
Posted by: Newbie | Jun 20 2025 14:33 utc | 24
#######
Don't be the guy who shows up to a gunfight with chocolates and flowers.
America has no interest in fairness or stability.
They can't cut an equitable deal.
If they don't overthrow the Iranian government, then everything in the region since the Ottoman Empire is lost.
And they lose North Africa as well.
The highest problem to solve and their tools are sanctions, nukes, and assassination.
Playing a losing hand.
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 20 2025 14:40 utc | 30
if iran comes off with just surviving means Iran totally won the war. Israel invisibility is broken. All the gulf rulers will be terrified and going to have mad respect for Iran's missile capabilities.
Posted by: Boomslang | Jun 20 2025 14:41 utc | 31
Alex Krainer suspects that the two weeks comes from the need to get this big beautiful budget bill passed - which everyone is pushing to get done before the July Fourth holiday. .....Posted by: Grieved | Jun 20 2025 14:31 utc | 20
-----
Good point. The BBB is the leverage AIPAC has over Trump. If that doesn't pass, the working class voter, Trump's base, gets hit by a huge tax increase. And the Dems can sit back and laugh. On top of that the debt ceiling doesn't get raised, so there will be huge problems for government programs. The AIPAC controlled media will be showing nightly news footage of starving kids.
Posted by: JackG | Jun 20 2025 14:41 utc | 32
good overview b and i like the fact you acknowledged roger boyds work here as well.. i 2nd that..
my tendency is to think trump will go along with his jewish backers who paid for his election win, but only in a limited manner.. some kind of display - shock and awe, like he sort of did in syria when he was in power the last time.. we'll see.. i would be happy to be wrong..
another possibility which seems remote is all the slavish devotion to israel demonstrated by europe leaders will somehow be outdone by the idea that a ceasefire and peace making is a good thing.. they are not showing any ability in this dept. but it is still an outside possibility.. it seems like when you represent the bankers, you always have to go to war or threaten to go to war...
Posted by: james | Jun 20 2025 14:41 utc | 33
You know, Trump, here's an idea, my orange friend:
If you can't take out Iran, taking out israel would work just as well.
It's going to solve most of your problems, I promise you ...
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Jun 20 2025 14:41 utc | 34
Now for the scenario where Israel insists on being a cunt (may Canuck forgive the use) haven’t seen recent maps, but at times IDF forces in Gaza surrounded the Gazans proper. Some hits on the border would hit only IDF and open up the strip…
Some tens of thousands unleashed could make October 7 look like small fry…
And if IDF still parks their tanks in big groups just on the outskirts…
Posted by: Newbie | Jun 20 2025 14:41 utc | 35
Newbie | Jun 20 2025 14:33 utc | 24
"Why not negotiate a reprise of the old nuclear deal against lifting all sanctions ? Sounds fair."
A reprise of the Minsk-style proven-scam sovereignty-surrendering IAEA-spy-enabling "old nuclear deal" with the non-agreement-capable West in order to give the Zionists time to rearm and then launch the attack all over again? Sounds like treason, which is absolutely what that would be.
Posted by: Flying Dutchman | Jun 20 2025 14:42 utc | 36
Iran is characterized in America as a bunch of crazy religious nuts. In the last few days we've seen Cruz and Hegseth cite the bible as a good reason to attack them. This talk was aimed at the crazy religious nuts in the US. The evangelical wing of the christian religious franchise has teamed up with the beloved chosen ones and they call all the shots for those who dwell under the christian umbrella and there is no significant pushback from the "normal" christians. This is a religious war for many of us.
This guy here going by the handle "Trailer Trash Tim" is a lone voice pushing back on the evangelicals. The Duran guys had him on quite a while back and I can see why. He's pretty smart and is right over the target. He explains scofield and this dispensation shit. I call on you christians to think about what it is you are doing and straighten it out. You've been leveraged to the max with your brainwashing and you're killing us.
https://youtu.be/3onIIttCUqI?si=0RlLYFWyHQ7wjLG5&t=127
Posted by: chunga | Jun 20 2025 14:44 utc | 37
Repost from prior thread:
Brussels, 20 June 2025 — The Hind Rajab Foundation (HRF) has today filed an urgent and damning complaint with the European Investment Bank’s Complaints Mechanism (EIB‑CM), demanding an immediate end to the Bank’s blatant complicity in Israel’s crimes against the Palestinian people.
Despite the binding International Court of Justice (ICJ) ruling of 19 July 2024, which orders all States and international organisations to “prevent trade or investment relations that assist in the maintenance of the illegal situation created by Israel,” the EIB continues to funnel over €1 billion in European public funds to Israeli companies blacklisted by the United Nations for their direct role in illegal settlement expansion and apartheid policies.
This betrayal occurs as EU leaders meet today and tomorrow to review the Association Agreement with Israel — the main treaty governing the EU’s political and economic ties with a state that stands accused of grave breaches of international law, including genocide, apartheid and ethnic cleansing.
“The EIB is financing Israel’s land theft, ethnic cleansing, and apartheid — with European taxpayers’ money,” said Dyab Abou Jahjah, The Foundation's Chairman. “This is not oversight, this is complicity. As Europe claims to champion human rights, its own bank bankrolls the bulldozers and bulldozes the law.”
EIB Money, Israeli Crimes
The Hind Rajab Foundation’s complaint exposes how four flagship EIB operations enable blacklisted actors to build and sustain the settlements that shred Palestinian lives and land:
€500 million channeled through Bank Leumi, notorious for underwriting settlement housing, industrial zones, and local councils in stolen Palestinian territory.
€250 million for the Tel Aviv Light Rail Green Line, awarded to Electra, which expands settler connectivity and cements de facto annexation.
Further “green transition” and “financial inclusion” facilities worth €250 million and €96 million, again handed to Bank Leumi, a bank that signs decades-long pledge agreements with illegal settlement municipalities.
These funds directly prop up a regime of forced evictions, land grabs, and settler violence. According to the UN, 2025 has seen a surge in attacks and mass displacement — yet the EIB continues to supply the financial oxygen that sustains the apartheid system.
A Moment of Reckoning for the EU
This complaint lands at a critical moment: the EU is right now reviewing its Association Agreement with Israel...
Posted by: Mary | Jun 20 2025 14:35 utc | 977
Posted by: Exile | Jun 20 2025 14:44 utc | 38
US can deploy a large amalgam of “AirPower”. Supporting and using it 6000 miles from supply is hugely costly.
All I got out of the first few paragraphs of Hersch is US will participate with Netanyahu in attempting to assassinate Khameini, as if it is 1963 Saigon, crackers!
What would US AirPower do: thump sand chasing tunnel that house centerfuges, chase TELs, bomb apartment blocks.
No better outcomes than thumping sand in Yemen.
The proper question is what could U.S. AirPower do.
Another Vietnam, more tonnage than WW II. LOSE,
Posted by: paddy | Jun 20 2025 14:44 utc | 39
I do believe I might have been the first to surmise that "the delay is the move".
There's not many games or sports where one can offer a pass; it's usually go or concede.
However, if you've got experience in either where this option is offered, it's a clear tell.
(Of course ideologues riven by all kinds of emotions ranging from hate, envy, jealousy, etc are completely blinded.)
Posted by: Markw | Jun 20 2025 14:45 utc | 40
my tendency is to think trump will go along with his jewish backers who paid for his election win, but only in a limited manner..Posted by: james | Jun 20 2025 14:41 utc | 35
That might be his plan, but it can't end there. Iran will respond, and then you get full US war on Iran. $150 Brent guarantees that. And this was Israel's plan from the beginning.
Posted by: JackG | Jun 20 2025 14:46 utc | 41
tobias cole @7: "DJT is aware of these actions, and most of all he wants to make a transactional deal."
Agreed. But Trump is in a bit of a bind here. I cannot think of anything Iran can offer (or is willing to offer, in any case) that would satisfy the crazies. Can they offer some token gesture and have Trump hype it up enough to sell it as a win?
Posted by: William Gruff | Jun 20 2025 14:46 utc | 42
You know, Trump, here's an idea, my orange friend:
If you can't take out Iran, taking out israel would work just as well.
It's going to solve most of your problems, I promise you ...
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Jun 20 2025 14:41 utc | 36
Come on, nuking Israel’s nukes was the move I suggested 2 or 3 threads ago.
Probably the only “acceptable” use of nukes for the us and a way to show they mean business (without wwIII)
Added advantage that they could force the other side to bend the knee .
Posted by: Newbie | Jun 20 2025 14:46 utc | 43
“So what you see is obvious,” says a well-informed Moscow source. “This is not a Sino-Russian alignment but a US-Russian alignment with the Chinese claiming to join the troika. The message to Trump is very clear — we [Putin] want to make deal; we want sanctions lifted; we want our airline flights and Boeings back; we are ready for compromises. Look what we have done! We have been good boys, haven’t we, in Syria? We have made no new troubles in Libya. We have not made trouble in Venezuela. We are only focused on fighting in our front yard. We accept that you [Trump] are the hegemon. We’ll complain about it, but we won’t fight to make you weaker. Your strength, dear Uncle Sam, is our economic survival. It’s fine that you rape a few small boys every once in a while, but we are still being good boys, aren’t we? This is the reality. And the main media are saying this now — Beijing has abandoned Teheran. Moscow has abandoned Teheran. I add that Teheran has abandoned Iran with too little and too late, so what’s left to fight? For us, it’s Ukraine.”
Posted by: bones☠️ | Jun 20 2025 14:48 utc | 44
Further to news about Iran turning down the offer of Russian radar and air defence systems, it appears from various sources that "China has entered the chat" in a significant way.
Posted by: jibbyjabber2 | Jun 20 2025 14:40 utc | 31
If I remember correctly the Russian S-400 systems insist on being connected directly into the host nation's air defense systems.
Sounds reasonable but perhaps the Iranians balked at having the Russians stick that many probes into their sensitive places.
Perhaps the Chinese offer was less invasive.
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Jun 20 2025 14:49 utc | 45
Regarding Boyd's article, vis-a-vis Cruz's biblical acumen, more like Numbers chapter 24 (verse 9) is the place where "Blessed are those that bless you, cursed are those that curse you" comes from. This is in the context of Balaam, a prophet hired by Balak to curse Israel, blessing them instead (three times). The preceding verses refer to Israel in the third person, and the syntax of the quoted verse is not completely clear. Not to mention whether it's Israel the people, or Israel the modern state, whether it applies in the instant context or perpetually, etc.
Posted by: Call it what u will | Jun 20 2025 14:49 utc | 46
@7
See contemptuous sabatoge in Russia, contemptuous decapitation infiltration in Iran.
No dealing with U$$A
Posted by: paddy | Jun 20 2025 14:49 utc | 47
Posted by: JackG | Jun 20 2025 14:41 utc | 34
#######
Your presumption is that Trump would pick his voters over Israel.
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 20 2025 14:49 utc | 48
List of Power Plants in Israel
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_power_stations_in_Israel2 big coal plants:
Hadera 2.56GW🔥🔥
Ashkelon 2.25GW (struck on Friday?)7 NG plants
Ramla 1.33GW
Mt. Carmel (Haifa) 1.02GW🔥🔥
Dalia 0.86 GW
Ashkelon 0.80GW
Tazfit 0.60GW
Ramat 0.52GW
Mishor 0.44GWPosted by: Exile | Jun 20 2025 14:39 utc | 30
---
I don't think Iran has hit any power plant yet. First I'm hearing of Hadera, do you have any cites for that?
In Haifa, the REFINERY power plant was hit. Refineries use beaucoup amounts of steam and electricity, so many have their own power plant. I have seen nothing showing that the stand alone 3 GW range power plant at Haifa was hit.
Posted by: JackG | Jun 20 2025 14:51 utc | 49
Well, There is what he should do and there is what he does do.
He is trying to finesse it - win without firing a shot, but then reality generally takes over and really 'Yahoo is wanting to fire some shots. Expect there will be some heavy bombs dropped on nuclear processing facilities as much to maintain the narrative.
The question is will it be a nuke - honestly that would remove the remaining vestige of any semblance of western "civilization" - because that will then normalize the use of nukes, which the pentagram seems wont to do.
I would think that China and Russia should be trying to head-off that option in the U.N. (for what that is worth) and in the media.
Posted by: jared | Jun 20 2025 14:51 utc | 50
Israel would probably go full Amalek and fire off nukes at everyone.Posted by: JackG | Jun 20 2025 14:35 utc | 27
Does anyone have information on the Samson option? Like, is it real??? Here are some links and text I found on Substack:
“If the Zionists are ever defeated on the battlefield, they will launch all their nuclear weapons and strike every major city within range. Even their so-called allies will not be spared. The explicit goal of the plan is to kill as many people as possible, essentially blackmailing the entire world into maintaining the Zionist apartheid regime. If the Zionist entity falls, they aim to take the entire world with them.”https://open.substack.com/pub/ddgeopolitics/p/the-walls-are-falling-on-samson?r=145k0&utm
https://archive.org/details/Sampson_Option
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2003/sep/21/israelandthepalestinians.bookextracts (archived: https://archive.is/qA0LR)
If the Samson option is a real thing, for it to have the intended blackmail effect one must assume all European targets were made aware of its existence through back channel communications by Israel. This would confer a totally different meaning than the conventional "moral responsibility" interpretation of Merkel's proclamation that preserving the state of Israel is, for the German state, an existential imperative (Staatsräson).
Posted by: FreeYouFreeMe | Jun 20 2025 14:52 utc | 51
Posted by: Newbie | Jun 20 2025 14:46 utc | 45
######
Irradiating the region would throw the world into economic chaos.
It's one thing to commit suicide.
Another to destroy humanity.
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 20 2025 14:52 utc | 52
Come on, nuking Israel’s nukes was the move I suggested 2 or 3 threads ago.
Posted by: Newbie | Jun 20 2025 14:46 utc | 45
Oh I don't mean taking out their nukes, I mean letting the whole colony collapse under its own stupidity.
Stop all the supplies except medical supplies and twinkies.
Just do a last minute: "Sorry, not our war! MAGA - byeee!" and hang up.
"Fifty way to leave your lover ..." -- Simon and Garfunkel
https://youtu.be/K4xoHjNjxus?si=agJKQ2BCWHTBI2dN
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Jun 20 2025 14:54 utc | 53
Russia, China, Vietnam, India, etc. should agree to sanction the U.S. and Trump should it (or it's little buddy) use nukes against Iran.
Posted by: jared | Jun 20 2025 14:55 utc | 54
🇮🇷💥🇮🇱 Mayor of Haifa reports that "two strategic locations" were hit by Iranian missiles.
Posted by: Justpassinby | Jun 20 2025 14:55 utc | 55
If the Knesset was indeed destroyed then I’d love to see it flashed in pictures on the internet by all the not-coerced media sites.
The poster who said Hezbollah had footage it still hadn’t aired, should do a photo dump all around to also make people think that Iran is actually pummelling Israel worse than it actually is. Maybe do it with non-stop pics of the supposedly-burnt Knesset.
Why would the US move so many people / planes around if it didn’t intend helping Israel to attack Iran? Are they there to prevent Iran from overdoing the destruction? Either way , I think they are planning on war and soon , not toward the end of two weeks, before then but over the weekend as a poster mentioned That way, the markets will be not so bothered as if it occurred on a weekday. The billionaires won’t be too put-out.
Given most of Trumps’s donors are elderly and Jewish I think they have nothing to lose by pushing him to help Israel. They themselves have nearly had their share of years , and are now in the autumn of their lives. Like Netanyahu, serious cancer patient, death doesnt scare them too much. In addition, they are Israel Firsters . Their people come first and they will give everything for their people. You ,unless you are Jewish, are just collateral and a source of income and power to them.
So they lose some billions? Who cares? They will die soon anyway. Their families will not go hungry , and if Israel is not broken up or abandoned, then their families will still remain powerful and in the one percenters with all the comfort and power that entails. That is what strategic game theory is all about. We all lose but you lose more than me in relative terms, so I am still on top. If I am lucky , well I win and am even better off than you are now. That is the play by Israel and its USA familiars.
Israel is like the UK trying to drag in the USA in both WWI and II , and it succeeded in the end. The latter may be thinking there is now no better time to cross the Rubicon and come what may. Attack Iran and hope we win , and Russia and China dont enter as well. If the latter two do come in …well so what? They are only going to get stronger in time ,so we do our best now. This may be the thinking of the decision makers in the US. This makes the US dangerous. Let’s see if the US is just bluffing or really did move these pieces into position for war.
Posted by: Total | Jun 20 2025 14:56 utc | 56
b on June 20, 2025 at 14:04
This is good: Why Iran? The Context & The Consequences - Roger Boyd
---
Yes, it is an excellent primer for anyone who wishes to quickly get up to speed.
We have few Iranian neighbors; one is good friends with my wife. I remember talking to her where she mentioned being a small girl in elementary school being taught how to take shelter as they were the USA's enemy #1.
I replied the empire always requires an enemy to focus its attention. It's nothing personal, just business.
Posted by: Markw | Jun 20 2025 14:56 utc | 57
In October after the last round of tit-for-tat calmed down; Teheran MFA posted this cryptic message (from memory):
3 power plants
2 refineries
1 airport
The tally so far after 6 days (Friday 20.06)
(3) Power Plants
Hadera 2.56GW🔥
Ashkelon 2.25GW
(unconfirmed)
Mt. Carmel (Haifa) 1.02GW🔥
(2) Refineries
Haifa 🔥 (offline 1 month)
Ashdod 🔥(offline 1 month)
(1) Airport Lod (Ben Gurion) - abandoned
Posted by: Exile | Jun 20 2025 14:58 utc | 58
Israel has air superiority over Iran, while the same cannot be said for Iran.
Iran's air defenses are down and they have no comparable air force to speak of.
Israel alone can inflict massive damage on Iran with an extended air campaign.
Same goes for the US. I think the US would be happy to join so long as it doesn't involve boots on the ground.
It would be a "cheap" win for them.
Pakistan's Munir was wined and dined in Washington for this purpose, the vice is tightening around Iran.
Either the Iranians conduct a nuke test in the middle of the desert soon or they can kiss their country goodbye!
Posted by: Dingleberry | Jun 20 2025 14:59 utc | 59
Newbie@1441 June 20/Solstice
Been pondering as to why, as you note, the Iranians have yet to smash Izzy forces still highly constipated on the fringes of Gaza. Seems to me like a logical move which would engender even more support from the Global South along with sane citizens of the Collective Wa$te.
Posted by: aristodemos | Jun 20 2025 15:00 utc | 60
@12
Same reason Hitler went all out in May 1940. Will have same outcome.
U$$A decline approaching total dividend paper tiger.
They are unaware how little U.S. did to Houthi.
Posted by: paddy | Jun 20 2025 15:00 utc | 61
If MEK/Mossad and their friends can be made irrelevant in the coming days, Uncle Sam's little Persian adventure is kaput.
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Jun 20 2025 14:25 utc | 14--
If you look at the pictures from today's prayers, you can surmise they are already irrelevant. Drones? What drones? Any terrorist caught faces a short trial, with certain outcome: death penalty.
Posted by: MorePain4Cakes | Jun 20 2025 15:02 utc | 62
I've never trusted the Iranian regime because of its ongoing fecklessness, however we shall see what ultimately happens if (most likely *when*) Trump decides to escalate and attack. If they actually directly attack the US in return (not that I'm advocating for that) then perhaps the regime isn't another secret puppet state of the US'. However, I can't help but suspect that the regime's level of incuriousity is in itself a deception against its own people, specially on matters like Oct 7 attacks, which were, everything seems to indicate, something the Israeli state was well aware of ahead of time.
Posted by: Ludovic | Jun 20 2025 15:02 utc | 63
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Jun 20 2025 14:41
Taking out Israel will leave the region under more or less complete control of Iran and houtis.
Hormutz and red sea controlled by the axis.
Not something that west can allow.
Posted by: Mario | Jun 20 2025 15:03 utc | 64
Dingleberry,
242 is better than 181 and both are better than the Algerian outcome. The Likud would do well to sue for a lasting and secure peace based on the Peking Declaration and UNGA resolution of 18.Sept 2024.
Posted by: Exile | Jun 20 2025 15:03 utc | 65
anyone wanna take odds on Bibi getting dragged? and what's the time window? I say 48 hours
I think b and most are missing aiddle alternative, Trump bombs "a magnificent and horrible attack, one Iran will. ever forget" mostly feckless and then draw back. That is a withdrawal, but he's gotta do something. It seems even a one-two punch on Natanz would be in the cards. Nothing but a symbolic attack.
I don't think Trump can just walk away. MAGA will cheer if he bombs and walk away.
Posted by: Scottindallas | Jun 20 2025 15:05 utc | 66
Your presumption is that Trump would pick his voters over Israel.Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 20 2025 14:49 utc | 50
Yeah, a fools hope. Hope dies last.
I'm placing hope in Bannon. Netty insulted MAGA and questioned their partiotism. This really set off Bannon. Bannon's been pointing out that if, as Israel claims, it only needs the US o hit Fordow, then Trump has a whole year to decide, no need to rush. Bannon met with Trump yesterday, and Trump announced the UP TO 2 weeks.
If I had to bet on Polymarket, I'd bet on Trump ordering the airstrikes on Iran. Which would be an economic disaster for the US. Until he does, I'll hold on to hope.
Posted by: JackG | Jun 20 2025 15:06 utc | 67
Hormutz and red sea controlled by the axis.
Not something that west can allow.
Posted by: Mario | Jun 20 2025 15:03 utc | 66
Nothing left but to go down with the ship then ...
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Jun 20 2025 15:08 utc | 68
Posted by: Newbie | Jun 20 2025 14:46 utc | 45
######
Irradiating the region would throw the world into economic chaos.
It's one thing to commit suicide.
Another to destroy humanity.
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 20 2025 14:52 utc | 54
Nukes are best nuked with neutron bombs, little fallout.
The us should know where.
(and subs sunk is not unusual )
Posted by: Newbie | Jun 20 2025 15:09 utc | 69
China is now providing intelligence and potentially air defence against drones and missiles to iran and has air defence destroyers patrolling the Persian gulf.
Pakistan has denied the USA access to their air space.
The Chinese are reportedly trying to convince Oman to close off their airspace to the USA.
Putin has said he's ready to give Iran everything they can however the Iranians haven't asked for anything ... they can of course offer the same service in the caspian as the Chinese are doing in the Persian gulf. The air war against iran gets much more difficult when they can only attack down a 200 km alley.
China is sending arms to Iran ... it looks like they're playing the same role to Iran as the USA provided to Ukraine.
The question is whether Trumps fear of being blamed for losing to Iran "trumps" his fear of AIPAC and Bibi.
Midterms are looming. If he goes to war with Iran he risks losing the MAGA vote ... if he doesn't he risks having AIPAC and their immense political influence as an enemy.
If he's gets beat in Ukraine, Yemen and Iran in a single year he's a laughing stock. I think he's rather balk on Iran and lose the midterms rather than risk failure in Iran and lose the midterms as a laughing stock.
Posted by: HB_Norica | Jun 20 2025 15:09 utc | 70
@ chunga | Jun 20 2025 14:44 utc | 39
thanks chunga... it is an interesting topic and definitely has a big impact on all this..
Posted by: james | Jun 20 2025 15:10 utc | 71
trump starting ww3 would be a media spectacle:
"i have decided to start the big war. the biggest war the world has ever seen. so big and beautifull. its the biggestest of them all! but my new trump-shoes to outrun the nuclear fallout!"
Posted by: Justpassinby | Jun 20 2025 15:11 utc | 72
As for the speculations that the U$$A would attack Iran over the weekend, the possibility that Trump wouldn't be that dumb would logically inspire the Izzies to mount a false-flag attack upon overexposed U$ forces. The worst case scenario would be a reprise of their lengthy assault on the USS Liberty...only this time it might be one of those 5,000 person crew members contained on a targeted aircraft carrier.
Rally round the flag hoopla would not be as strong as the enemies of humanity would prefer, though, as many have been to that theatrical production before and are now wary of all too convenient false-flag attack. Needles to say; like Lincoln stated back in the Civil War days: "You can fool some of the people all the time". We could include boobtoob noose addicts and "Christian" Zionists amongst the gullible.
Lacking almost uniform public support; the regime in the Di$trict of Corruption might be obliged to overplay their hand and do something stoopid.
Posted by: aristodemos | Jun 20 2025 15:11 utc | 73
While all this is going on I've been seeing reports indicating Hamas edging closer to the borders of Gaza, also increased use of rocketry. Typical report:
🇵🇸💥 Al-Qassam Brigades Military Statement:
• "Our fighters returning from combat confirm: Heavy mortar strikes destroyed enemy troop/vehicle concentrations in Qizan al-Najjar, southern Khan Younis."
• "Short-range 'Rajoom' (114mm) rockets targeted: Kibbutz Nirim & 'Third Eye' surveillance post east of the city."
---
So they're hitting the settlements and surveillance infrastructure again.
Reminds me of something ...
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Jun 20 2025 15:12 utc | 74
Newbie@1441 June 20/Solstice
Been pondering as to why, as you note, the Iranians have yet to smash Izzy forces still highly constipated on the fringes of Gaza. Seems to me like a logical move which would engender even more support from the Global South along with sane citizens of the Collective Wa$te.
Posted by: aristodemos | Jun 20 2025 15:00 utc | 62
three reasons.
1. Iran is still playing softball
2. They might fear what IDF survivors would do to avenge it
3. Any attack so near, if anything goes wrong or a partial intercept and it could be a laughter
my 2 cents
Posted by: Newbie | Jun 20 2025 15:13 utc | 75
If you haven't figured it out yet, the Chinese Intel ships are there to provide "transponder-free" flight radar service to the Iranians with the flight paths & locations of the supposedly invisible B2/B21/F35/F22 aircraft as they head into Iran.
As for the two week delay, note that requiring Iran to give up their ballistic missile capability now gets equal billing to the nuke demand. It is the true threat to Israel (surprise,surprise). IMHO there is no way the US will keep all their assets on station for two weeks, big beautiful bill notwithstanding.
Iran is accumulating a huge amount of damage against Israel, which the censors will not be able to cover up. I think before two weeks are up at the present rate Israel will be a basket case. Expect the Izzies to use their own nukes before then. Netanyahoo has probably already given Trump an ultimatum in this regard. You hit Iran or we will with nukes.
Posted by: Simpleton | Jun 20 2025 15:13 utc | 76
Dingles@1459: Dingle, ding,ding, ding...another troll bites the dust.
Posted by: aristodemos | Jun 20 2025 15:14 utc | 77
It's all so obvious... The Jewish-neoliberal horse is working through its mission, which it received over 30 years ago. Yeltsin and Gorbachev in one person... The fact that China is also ruled by traitors would make me sad, but luckily the gods have sent us the accohol and other nice substances to relieve the pain...
c
Posted by: Brigitte Mohnhaupt | Jun 20 2025 15:15 utc | 78
"This very political project of spreading a gospel that thoroughly supported capitalism and Western civilizational supremacy in a US that at the end of WW2.."
Why Iran? The Context & The Consequences - Roger Dodger
Like usual, Roger Dodger misinterprets; this time between 'Christianity and Capitalism:
Luke 6:34–35 (ESV)
"And if you lend to those from whom you expect to receive, what credit is that to you? Even sinners lend to sinners, to get back the same amount. But love your enemies, and do good, and lend, expecting nothing in return, and your reward will be great..."
Early pure Christianity , like the later Muslim religion banned usury.(1)This lasted for 1500 years.
However, dumb Roger does not know the above, or to make his point he just ignores history and jumps 2,000 years ahead referencing WW2; I don't know how posters take the Dodger seriously.
Reminds me of his monotonous blog where he censors anyone who does not agree with his point of view.
Rodger Dodger is a piker.
1. "Christianity's acceptance of usury (charging interest on loans) evolved over time. Initially, any charging of interest was considered usury and a sin. However, by the 16th century, both Catholics and Protestants were increasingly tolerant of loans at interest,"
Posted by: canuk | Jun 20 2025 15:16 utc | 79
James in my opinion the most potent weapon the beloved ones have in their arsenal is the "judeo-christian" value.
Posted by: chunga | Jun 20 2025 15:16 utc | 80
Has anyone seen or heard any statement, comment or reaction from Netanyahu about this “up to 2 weeks” business? Can’t imagine he’s too happy about it.
Several of today’s video clips don’t show much (if any) air defence interceptor activity, let alone successful interdiction. What is Israel going to look like if Trump does leave any decision towards the end of the 2 week window?
Posted by: Jeremy Rhymings-Lang | Jun 20 2025 15:17 utc | 81
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Jun 20 2025 15:08 utc | 70
Yes US must go in but it's questionable that they can have a win.
If they don't go in Israel is doomed in weeks or, maybe month.
So it is, try and/or go down with the ship.
Posted by: Mario | Jun 20 2025 15:18 utc | 82
Why is Russia not helping Iran?
Posted by: vargas | Jun 20 2025 15:11 utc | 76
How do you know they don't? Putin doesn't do social media. 😏
Posted by: dodo | Jun 20 2025 15:19 utc | 83
"@12
Same reason Hitler went all out in May 1940. Will have same outcome.
U$$A decline approaching total dividend paper tiger.
They are unaware how little U.S. did to Houthi."
Posted by: paddy | Jun 20 2025 15:00 utc | 63
Hitler did fine in invading Europe in May, 1940.
Where he made his mistake is attacking Russia in June of 1941.
Posted by: canuk | Jun 20 2025 15:20 utc | 84
Newbie@1513 SUMMER SOLSTICE
Being in possession of highly accurate missilry; there is only a minuscule possibility that Iran would irrationally strike too close to the people of Gaza. Much of the Izzy armor and such is located immediately OUTSIDE of Palestinians on the ground. So your third caveat is not probable if a strike is made.
Posted by: aristodemos | Jun 20 2025 15:20 utc | 85
Several of today’s video clips don’t show much (if any) air defence interceptor activity, let alone successful interdiction. What is Israel going to look like if Trump does leave any decision towards the end of the 2 week window?
Posted by: Jeremy Rhymings-Lang | Jun 20 2025 15:17 utc | 84
Like a loser. Trump doesn't like losers.
That's my biggest, most beauuuutiful , huuuge hope
Posted by: Newbie | Jun 20 2025 15:20 utc | 86
Reading through these many posts over the past week — thank you to most of you — I notice a fusion name for key people often appearing so here are the spellings:
Khomeini 1979 - 1989
Khamenei 1989 - present
~~
From the establishment wiki site:
Ali Hosseini Khamenei (born 19 April 1939) is an Iranian cleric and politician who has served as the second supreme leader of Iran since 1989. His tenure as supreme leader, spanning over 35 years, makes him the longest-serving head of state in the Middle East and the second-longest-serving Iranian leader of the 20th and 21st centuries, after Shah Mohammad Reza Pahlavi.Ruhollah Musavi Khomeini was an Iranian revolutionary, politician, political theorist, and religious leader. He was the founder of the Islamic Republic of Iran and the main leader of the Iranian Revolution, which overthrew Mohammad Reza Pahlavi, and served as the first supreme leader of Iran, the highest-ranking political and religious authority of the Islamic Republic until his death in 1989.
Posted by: suzan | Jun 20 2025 15:20 utc | 87
I agree with James #35. Suggested conversation between Trump and Khamenei (if such can be imagined):
T: Look, I know you have to have at least low level enrichment on Iran soil and you know I have to “take care of” your buried plant to appease the crazies.
K: yes, but this appears irreconcilable …
T: what if I bomb the site with our super duper big bombs and claim total victory. Meanwhile, you keep rocketing Israel until they demand it stop no matter what.
K: space opens for enrichment consortium with the Gulf Arabs as your reps on Iran soil with ceasefire and sanctions relief?
T: both sides claim we got the best and I can sincerely claim I saved Israel despite crazy Nutty’s warmongering.
Win-win?
Posted by: Caliman | Jun 20 2025 15:21 utc | 88
"I commented yesterday that Trump Always Chickens Out (TACO)"
Chiding Imperialism for "chickening out" is, to say the least, odd. Frankly, I hope he does think better of the idea or "chicken out" as Dems might say. Had Biden "chickened out" on war with Russia in Ukraine, I wouldn't have chided him. The rational thing for any Imperialist figure head about to destabilize the planet, would be to "chicken out". I imagine John Bolton loves this "taco" meme of the Dems.
Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Jun 20 2025 15:21 utc | 89
The best action China could take to help Iran is to warn the Philippines that it must clear out of the Second Thomas Shoal in the South China Sea. This will create a military standoff and force the US to commit a large number of ships and missiles to the South China Sea. Those same ships and missiles can't be used against Iran.
Posted by: swish | Jun 20 2025 15:22 utc | 90
We have come to save you
and relieve your daily strife
We’ve come to free your people
and impose our way of life
We are right and moral
with only good intentions
but if by chance you don’t concede
we’ll stage an intervention
Our Democratic love bombs
Will convince you we are right
make no mistake we'll take our take
We hope you’ll see the light
Let's dispense with the pretense
we're not here for your salvation
expect no decency or sense
but domination of your nation
The vain and petty suzerain
obnoxious to the end
our self-anointed overlords
don't care who they offend
One and all will cheer the fall
when the dogs of war are dead
they may decide to take us all
with a nuclear warhead
Posted by: ld | Jun 20 2025 15:22 utc | 91
Posted by: aristodemos | Jun 20 2025 15:11 utc | 75
With Chinese patrolling with spy ships it will be a difficult task.
They will be exposed to the entire world and thecwest doesn't have the control to UN institutions and, by the way, they destroyied them by abusing them for decades.
Posted by: Mario | Jun 20 2025 15:23 utc | 92
Reposting from the previous thread.
With the US vacating bases around the Persian Gulf and Arabia, I wonder if the host countries / Iran will allow them back. If Iran can sustain a long war, then this may be an unexpected outcome with all kinds of consequences.
Posted by: Rahul | Jun 20 2025 14:14 utc | 967
Posted by: Rahul | Jun 20 2025 15:23 utc | 93
If Trump gets into a war with Iran, which will cause energy prices to skyrocket, it's the end of his Presidency...
Posted by: pyrrhus | Jun 20 2025 15:24 utc | 94
Being in possession of highly accurate missilry; there is only a minuscule possibility that Iran would irrationally strikTe too close to the people of Gaza. Much of the Izzy armor and such is located immediately OUTSIDE of Palestinians on the ground. So your third caveat is not probable if a strike is made.
Posted by: aristodemos | Jun 20 2025 15:20 utc | 88
If iran strikes only IDF and not the wall, biggest problem is IDF retribution against cornered gazans
If iran strikes the wall, even the smallest intercept can throw it over thousands of gazans
Posted by: Newbie | Jun 20 2025 15:24 utc | 95
@64
MEK are a small Sunni Marxist terror group over by Iraq.
They are darling of John McCain and Lindsey Graham neocons, they are the same used to sell 2003 Iraq invasion.
Posted by: paddy | Jun 20 2025 15:24 utc | 96
All the bible thumpers lusting to kill your Muslim brothers.
Our Lord and Savior said to love your neighbor.
In another passage He said love your enemy.
Even if you adopt St Augustine Just War the U$$A empire fails on all
Posted by: paddy | Jun 20 2025 15:29 utc | 98
"Midterms are looming"
Yes, the US never-ending cycle... only 16.5 months away!
Posted by: Call it what u will | Jun 20 2025 15:29 utc | 99
Nukes are best nuked with neutron bombs, little fallout.
Posted by: Newbie | Jun 20 2025 15:09 utc | 71
Neutron bombs are specifically designed to irradiate humans and not damage structures. They're to humans like EMPs are to circuits.
Perhaps you were being sarcastic or suggesting another target, tongue-in-cheek?
Posted by: TJandTheBear | Jun 20 2025 15:30 utc | 100
The comments to this entry are closed.
Coalition Of The Unwilling
https://x.com/bears_with/status/1935967449570001404
"If you take Putin and Xi at their word to each other, they have abandoned Iran to fight alone. Here's what their words' worth..."
Posted by: JohnGilberts | Jun 20 2025 14:11 utc | 1