Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
June 7, 2025
The Deep State Is Still Sabotaging Presidential Policies

Ambassador M.K. Bhadrakumar reminds us of subtle maneuvers by deep state actors to sabotage presidential policies.

When a U.S. spy plane was shot down over the Soviet Union President Dwight Eisenhower had not be informed about its real mission. The CIA claimed that it had been a weather plane that went off course after its pilot was incapacitated. The president repeated that tale.

The Soviets then published that the wreckage of the U-2 spy plane had been recovered and the pilot captured alive. The Soviets were miffed of being lied to and Eisenhower's attempt of detente with them failed.

Bhadrakumar sees a parallel in the recent Ukrainian drone attacks on strategic bomber on several Russian air field.

President Trump, in a call with the Russian president Putin, claimed that the U.S. had had no knowledge of the attack. That is, as several former CIA members confirm, implausible. The operation had been the making for 18 month which means that it had been initiated under President Biden. U.S. and/or British intelligence was certainly involved in designating the targets.

It seem that Trump, like Eisenhower before him, was not informed and thus embarrassed himself.

While Trump was talking with Putin Russian officials warned that deep state forces within the U.S. have not changed their anti-Russian aims:

Moscow should take very seriously reports that certain circles in the United States want to see Russia destroyed, Deputy Foreign Minister Sergey Ryabkov said at a news conference at TASS ..

"The fact that certain circles in the United States have been and are still hatching plans to move towards eradicating Russia as a state is also undeniable. It is enough to follow the discussions that are taking place, including on political science platforms. We should not underestimate the consequences of such a mindset," the deputy minister noted.

His comments came in response to the words of Brazilian leader Luiz Inacio Lula da Silva in an interview with Le Monde, who argued that former US President Joe Biden, during his administration, mentioned a desire to destroy Russia.

Ryabkov probably though of an upcoming conference about the 'fracturing states' of 'one of the globe’s last colonial empires', i.e. Russia, by the CIA connected Jamestown Foundation. The invitation to the conference says:

The Kremlin’s imperial ambitions in Ukraine come at the cost of potential mutinies, fracture, and dissolution at home. Understanding the consequences of Russia’s deteriorating internal conditions will be the main topic of the upcoming conference, which will involve experts in foreign affairs, defense, and geopolitics, along with representatives of Russia’s captive nations long-recognized by the United States. Russia is one of the globe’s last colonial empires, denying captive nations the right to self-determination and independence. Whether it remains an aggressive imperial power committed to threatening its neighbors or otherwise devolves into fracturing states, U.S. and allied policymakers cannot afford to ignore Russia’s future.

While Trump is at least somewhat attempting to create better relations with the Russian Federation parts of the foreign policy blob are still dreaming of dismantling it.

We are seeing similar attempts of counteracting presidential policies with regards to China.

On May 11 during trade talks between the U.S. and China in Geneva both sides agreed to calm things down:

Both sides reduced their tariffs. China also promised to reduce some of its non tariff measures:

China will [..] adopt all necessary administrative measures to suspend or remove the non-tariff countermeasures taken against the United States since April 2, 2025.

The financial markets relaxed and everyone was happy about it.

But on May 14, the very same day the new rules were to apply, the U.S. introduced new and extremely harsh measures against Chinese products:

The US Commerce Department issued guidance stating that the use of Huawei Technologies Co’s Ascend artificial intelligence (AI) chips “anywhere in the world” violates the government’s export controls, escalating US efforts to curb technological advances in China.

The agency’s Bureau of Industry and Security said in a statement on Tuesday that it is also planning to warn the public about “the potential consequences of allowing US AI chips to be used for training and inference of Chinese AI models”.

While this may not have been a technical breach of the Geneva agreement it certainly violated the spirit of the agreed upon Joint Statement: …

In consequence China continued to withhold export licensees for rare earth products which U.S. industries need. Trump was furious about this but seemingly without understanding what had caused China to take that step.

On Thursday a phone called between Trump and President Xi tried to calm things down (archived).

The two leaders, speaking for the first time since Trump became president, agreed to another round of high-level trade talks to follow up on the truce reached in Geneva last month, and exchanged invitations for state visits.

Trump said on Truth Social “there should no longer be any questions respecting the complexity of Rare Earth products,” but the Chinese readout didn’t mention the issue.

On Friday, just a day after the president's attempt to calm down trade issues with China, four deep state actors set out to again sabotage him:

The U.S. in recent days suspended licenses for nuclear equipment suppliers to sell to China's power plants, according to four people familiar with the matter, as the two countries engage in a damaging trade war.

The suspensions were sent to companies by the U.S. Department of Commerce, the people said, and affect export licenses for parts and equipment used with nuclear power plants.

Nuclear equipment suppliers are among a wide range of companies whose sales have been restricted over the past two weeks as the U.S.-China trade war shifted from negotiating tariffs to throttling each other's supply chains. It is unclear whether a Thursday call between U.S. President Donald Trump and Chinese President Xi Jinping would affect the suspensions.

Why, just a day after Trump's call with Xi, did 'four people familiar with the matter' found it necessary to inform Reuters of this?

This is, like the withholding of information on CIA operations in Russia, a measure to embarrass the president in eyes U.S. opponents. It is also an obvious attempt to sabotage trade with China.

The Chinese will note that the president's words get counteracted by his administration. Why should they even talk with him when he is not able to impose his own policies on the people who are supposedly working for him?

In consequence U.S. companies will have wo wait longer to be allowed to purchase the rare earth products they urgently need and can only get from China.

Comments

Jeffrey Kaye | Jun 7 2025 22:24 utc | 198–
“…the U.S. and its allies in the post-WW2 period, they do NOT believe in peaceful coexistence!”
Agree, that’s why the #1 policy goal is Full Spectrum Dominance, which is the same goal Hitler had and the WEF’s goals are quite similar to Plan Ost.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 7 2025 22:35 utc | 201

Posted by: Jeffrey Kaye | Jun 7 2025 22:24 utc | 198
This works on even the experienced and intelligent Chinese leadership *because they want to believe* that a portion of the US ruling class has good intentions and favors detente.

Why do you think that Beijing falls into this trap? This is not a rhethorical question, I am curious about empirical evidence here.

Posted by: Konami | Jun 7 2025 22:36 utc | 202

Tulsi is a Hindu nationalist (Zionist) if she is anything.
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 7 2025 21:58 utc | 189
Not sure how Science of Identity Foundation Hinduism relates to Zionism? What is a Hindu Nationalist?

Posted by: frithguild | Jun 7 2025 22:39 utc | 203

Its not mission imposible to run a sat link and give access to imagery. I am pretty sure those links are always on and freely used and shared. Trump and company would have to set out a National Security directive to cut it off and even then the EU has the same capacity.
What Trump knew or did not know is irrelevent. What is revlevant is setting National Security Police about Ukraine. Trump is leaning towards dropping Ukraine and that why the two Neocons in the Sentate went to Ukraine to offer a 500% tarriff on anyone who takes Russian oil.
What is Trump inclined to do due to the pressures on him? Time will tell to some degree. One must watch the shuffleboard games behind the scenes.

Posted by: circumspect | Jun 7 2025 22:40 utc | 204

I don’t get this post.
usually we get well-sourced articles and sensible nuanced commentary.
Now it’s about the so-called ‘deep state’?
That is a term mostly heard in unfunded conspiracy videos, invariably by paranoid Trumpers or Alex Jones types.
I think B really missed the ball on this one.
Can anybody explain where’s the ‘sabotage’?
Another term and excuse used by Trumpers to whitewash his afwul performance.
The U.S. Department of Commerce has decided on these suspensions.
The head of it is appointed by Trump and a member of his cabinet.
One of his most loyal servants.
He donated heavily to his 2 campaigns and had a big role in forming his government.
He is even seen as the architect of Trump’s trade war.
As far as I’m concerned the decision is made by, or at least with approval from Trump.
There is nothing that would indicate otherwise.
flip-flopping on decisions is a constant in Trumps behavior.

Posted by: Ed Bernays | Jun 7 2025 22:44 utc | 205

@205
Commercial satellite imagery is not sufficient for even a tiny part of the terrorist kill chain Trump facilitates for the nazis in Kiev and the US Senate.

Posted by: paddy | Jun 7 2025 22:47 utc | 206

Trump quietly pressuring US Senate to weaken Russia sanctions: WSJ
The White House reportedly asked Graham to insert waivers into the bill allowing Trump to choose which entities get sanctioned and changing the word “shall” to “may.” Removing the mandatory language from the text would essentially defang the bill, staffers said.

Posted by: Oui | Jun 7 2025 22:48 utc | 207

DunGroanin | Jun 7 2025 22:31 utc | 201–
With apologies to Dylan, “All elites must get stoned,” which is an ancient way.
Gruff’s point about the need for Humanity to be enculturated with a humanistic sociopolitical philosophy which was 60 years ago said to be futuristic:
The Needs of the Many Outweigh the Needs of the One.
That’s the logic all Elite-based arrangements have always fought against, and the same is true today.
There’s only one war that matters: The Class War.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 7 2025 22:51 utc | 208

Posted by: Elber | Jun 7 2025 16:36 utc | 101
That is a good thought, Elber! Thank you!

Posted by: juliania | Jun 7 2025 22:55 utc | 209

Posted by: psychohistorian | Jun 7 2025 20:40 utc | 167
RE: Ukraine refusing to accept their 6000 dead
<< "How is the DeepState going to control this narrative?" Eventually, the narratives run out, and there's a hard-nosed incontrovertible reality staring you down. Ukraine has no pivot point for that. Wowza, the upcoming NATO summit in The Hague is a *well-chosen* locale, and the summit looks to be a calamity.

Posted by: steel_porcupine | Jun 7 2025 23:08 utc | 210

I hope other barflies are finding all this history talk and references useful.
Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 7 2025 22:23 utc | 197

From the point of view of a barfly, all this wealth of information, is pure gold.
I am pretty sure that there are many more quiet lurkrers that do appreciate the discussions, and links, and ideas.

Posted by: RandomLurker | Jun 7 2025 23:08 utc | 211

It’s quite clear the Global Majority all want Peace, Development, and equitable relations, with only one entity opposing that arrangement–the Outlaw US Empire and its vassals, although a few of the latter are now deeply questioning their relationship. So, while Russia and China are the Empire’s two main adversaries, they are also the Global Majority’s Champions. Ultimately, the conflict’s aim is How to change the interests driving the imperial urge of the Empire’s ruling Class; how to get it to cease and desist?
Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 7 2025 17:19 utc | 120
Goodness! Thank you, karlof1. Happy Pentecost. In ‘Crime and Punishment’ the distraught wife of the ne’er-do-well drunkard sings a folksong about a French general who never comes to defeat the enemy. The line I remember goes “…but maybe on Pentecost…” Martin Luther King’s famous words were “…I may not get there with you…” spoken the night before he was assassinated I believe.
We just have to help the process along, not hinder it. And meantime, love life; it’s really very very good.

Posted by: juliania | Jun 7 2025 23:11 utc | 212

my young friend recommends reading ABC of Anarchism by alexander berkman..
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Now_and_After
he was discussing this in light of the other book he lent me by lenin – the state and revolution.. he had come around to seeing the beauty in anarchism… one example of anarchism would be cooperatives… i haven’t read the book, but it is next on my list of reads..

Posted by: james | Jun 7 2025 23:11 utc | 213

Curious to know if you read my thought piece, “Building a Political Economy that Serves People First”.
Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 7 2025 22:30 utc | 200
“From historical experience, those who seek public approval for governance must possess certain meritocratic qualifications to expose corruption and keep them out of governance. Also based on historical experience, a parliamentary form of government that can attract many political factions and thus offer citizens the widest possible choice seems most appropriate. ”
For me, those who strive for power disqualify themselves on psychological grounds. I also believe this is historically proven.
Parliaments in Germany, for example, have provided A.H. and Annalena with influence, naturally more for one and less for the other.
Without the direct influence of the citizens, it always remains a rule and it is not necessarily exercised benevolently. Materialistic competition for luxury or survival does not promote a basic level of education, nor does it lead to social motives of togetherness. Then there are the religions and . I also believe that this is historically proven.
The parliaments in Germany, for example, have given A.H. and Annalena influence, naturally more to one and less to the other.
Without the direct influence of the citizens, it always remains a rule and it is not necessarily exercised favourably. The materialistic competition for luxury or survival does not promote a basic level of education, nor does it lead to social motives of togetherness. In addition, there are the religions and the need not to get into difficulties militarily, in terms of water technology, due to environmental pollution from neighbouring countries and much more.
We can see in Ukraine how a parliament has courted oligarchs since the state was founded, then allowed itself to be taken over by the CIA and a state was created which, with its anti-Russian character, became a NATO hammer.
If your goal is an improvement for the majority, I think that only the random election of representatives and the possibility of deselection will prevent corruption, concentration of power and abuse. In order to take the representatives out of the line of fire, they should only represent, i.e. moderate the votes in which the people exercise democracy.
Assuming communism was the solution, which you are not talking about and neither do I, it would have to defend its existence externally rather than internally. That also applies to your concept. Positions in offices, state, government, police, … only ever occupied by good people, chosen by good people?
How do you develop people? Is it possible? Find empathy, recognise yourself!
Translated with DeepL.com (free version)

Posted by: BlindSpot | Jun 7 2025 23:16 utc | 214

In response to

frithguild @158:
Humans are covetous, envious, aquisitive, violent and brutal monkeys that act in their self interest to acquire food, water, shelter and sex, and no form of government will ever change that, as history shows.
-and-
Tom Pfotzer @159@
Humans are selfish creatures, and most humans, no matter what society you draw from, take care of themselves first and foremost, and if there’s anything left over after they get the preponderance of what they want, they then find “virtue” and attempt to help others, or at least pose as if they are.

Let me add my $0.02
About our basic drive
Our Stupid Brain quotes from “Technical Foundations of Neurofeedback” by Thomas Collura.
“There is a tendency in Western society to think of human actions in terms of “voluntary”, in the sense that we first create a desire to do something and then instruct our brain to take care of the details. The reality is that this is somewhat backwards. As we have seen in our earlier example of the movement-related potential, the brain activity that leads to a voluntary movement precedes the movement by up to 1 1/2 seconds. That means that the very idea of the desire to perform the movement comes after the brain activity. As would seem necessary, the very desire to perform the action is a brain event, and hence is the result of brain processes. This challenges the idea that the conscious mind is “in charge” of the brain, and puts the cart on quite the other side of the horse……
The driving force for thought and action consists in the dynamic instability of the brain and its proclivity to always seek novelty, fulfillment, stimulation, safety, power, and other goals that it perceives.“
About the cultural anthropology of our drive
The Dawn Of Everything by Graeber/Wengrow is a good summary of the 40K years of human social organization before the 2K+ years of barbaristic patriarchal monotheism.
IMO, anyone with half a brain can see that our species is quite imbalanced to the patriarchy side and humanity could use a heavy does of real feminism….not the “We came, we saw, he died.” brass ovaries of Clinton.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Jun 7 2025 23:19 utc | 215

Curious to know if you read my thought piece, “Building a Political Economy that Serves People First”.
Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 7 2025 22:30 utc | 200
Interesting and wide ranging piece. This may lead me to tap out my own think piece about what I think is the best way to end the harm the World Bank wreaks – I’d call it the “World Bankruptcy Court”. Put it in Dubai, Hk or Moscow. It will cram down or sell discounted World Bank loans, whether the World Bank likes it or not.
Banking and currency are gigantic issues for staying decoupled from Outlaw Empire (“OE”) influence. I have heard Jeffrey Sachs describe how he lobbied hard for a World Bank bailout for post Soviet Russia. It seems there were other plans at that time. As I have said in this baroom, Russia dodged a bullet there – it would not have the stregnth and independence it has now, if it was filled with World Bank style Bengalese shrimp farms and massive flooding during ordinary monsoons.

Posted by: frithguild | Jun 7 2025 23:24 utc | 216

RandomLurker | Jun 7 2025 23:08 utc | 212–
Thanks very much for your reply. Feedback is important.
///////////////////////////////
juliania | Jun 7 2025 23:11 utc | 213–
Thanks for your replies as I’ve not responded to all. I came across a 1919 anthology Beard co-edited, National Governments and the World War, where one chapter is entitled, “Our Democracy: Privileges and Duties of Citizenship,” which happens to be the first time I’ve ever seen that in any text. Unfortunately, the PDF file isn’t allowing me to copy/paste as there’s an extremely important sentence that I’ve paraphrased many times that deals with the pitfalls of our polity:
“It is necessary therefore to remember that in our democracy there can be no rights without duties; no privileges without responsibility.”
The abdication of the above by the vast majority of those residing within the Outlaw US Empire is the main reason we have what almost fits the definition of anarchy at the federal level–there’s close to zero accountability within the legislative and executive which fit into so many of Bastiat’s examples of malgovernance.
In so many cases, we’re experiencing behaviors that history’s seen before but most never knew about so we’re reliving them yet again.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 7 2025 23:39 utc | 217

What if trump/musk split is just plausible deniability for option 2?
An extended option 2 where musk brings to bRiCs starlink, spacex and the DOGE data?
Reminding what I said
Agreed on major points, that’s why @95 I mentioned that trump either plays along with DS (option 3) and owns the whole war choices, or…
Tries to clean up his house, maybe he’ll end up dead but comes with the territory. Option 1
Or implicitly declares that the us have been overrun and does the us domestic battle of supporting RF and china as they do what must be done . Option 2
In option 1 and 2 , both RF and china can be trump’s (and the American people’s) allies in the fight.
But there are only theses options, apparent impotent ambiguous deniability is not a thing.
As I’m an optimistic on Saturdays, I’d like to believe trump might be a venal and faulty human being that would really like a solution where we all live and chooses 2 or 3.
But time is running out
Posted by: Newbie | Jun 7 2025 18:23 utc | 139

Posted by: Newbie | Jun 7 2025 23:42 utc | 218

It’s hardly an accurate assessment of how power works in a vast and labyrinthine bureaucracy to reduce everything to a Manichean stand-off between two actors, Mr President and Mr Deep State. It must surely be a better form of political analysis to see the USA as a set of competing fiefdoms and interests, no? For a chief executive to wield power with certainty such that a straight line can be drawn from executive will to policy outcomes you need only study how long Putin and Xi themselves carefully built consensus and blocked opposition. It took skill, time, allies and interest-alignment. Does anyone think that Lavrov is merely Putin’s lackey? He sits at the head of his own fiefdom, which Putin needs to respect and acknowledge in order to rule, not least because Lavrov brings competence and diplomatic credibility to the regime. One must cultivate talent and bind them to you.
Trump has nothing like that and believes the myth that the President is a kind of elected king. But any successful king will tell you that rule is won through politics, and politics is about consistency, loyalty, timing, etc. Trump is where he is 1. because Israel has his back, 2. his faux-populism played among the masses and 3. because for a brief moment he won the support of Big Tech. But personally Trump thinks he’s there because of his own charisma, genius, whatever. Never drink your own kool-aid, it gives you hubris.
Trump is a moron frankly: his terms will be remembered as unstructured chaos where each interest group jostled for a share of his ADHD-ridden brain. A good president would see themselves as chair of a committee with decision-making power. He would invite all stake-holders, assert the agenda, firmly run the meeting but take interests seriously into consideration, then make a decision, after first gaining a public declaration from all committee members that his decisions are sovereign. If anyone acted against this, then remove them. Everything points to Trump as a clown who behaves as such because he already saw politics as a circus. I never see evidence that he takes governance seriously.
As a student of Roman history it’s clear what governance means. It means starting from the premise that the state needs to work for the prosperity of the whole. The ruling senatorial elite in Rome could not grasp it. The final limit-case iteration of that worldview was Julius Caesar, who thought that the world would tolerate the identification of himself with the res publica when he declared himself dictator perpetuus. But he had no plan other than his own self-aggrandizement. The difference, and revolutionary character, of Augustus’ regime could not be more opposite. At the end of his life Augustus left behind a state geared to imperial governance, which meant concessions to the interests of the provinces. Within a generation there were senators from the provinces and in positions of public and military power.
Trump is a Caesar-type. No plan other than turning the state into a narcissist feedback-loop. The USA needs to be dismantled from within and a new type of authority crafted. Either the USA commits to imperial governance (i.e. disband Israel, serious detente with Russia and China, abandon Europe, support its allies properly) or else abandon an international role. All this must also start from a position of domestic credibility. The US needs to get serious about its own population, cultivate them, nurture them, heal them and educate them. So long as a US senatorial elite sees the rest of its population and the world as a source of expropriation and grift, it will march into the dustbin of history.
I’m sorry but Trump is the pied piper.

Posted by: Patroklos | Jun 7 2025 23:43 utc | 219

Scuttlebutt has it that Zelensky hitched a ride on the Friedrich “uses the small spoon” Mertz Express on Thursday, ready to swoop in to the White House if DJT showed any sign of relenting on green-lighting the use of Taurus missiles to target pre-2014 Russia.
Which DJT did *not* do.
So Zelensky slinked back to Europe w/ Mertz.
All of which exposes the pecking order.
The Deep State is in charge of The Directive overall, an endeavor that spans many presidential admins and is intent on crushing Russia, regime-changing Russia & dismembering Russia.
So the Deep State sits at the top of the food pyramid.
Then comes the U.S. executive in the person of DJT, who can green-light the initiatives of low-lying vassals like Mertz or deny them.
After that is a feeding trough of vassals far & wide. They can hold their pan-Euro summits and agree to x, y & z—but those objectives will not see the light of day unless the U.S. executive signs off on them.
Interestingly, in spite of the *audacity*(TM) of the drone attack on Russia’s airbases last week, nothing has moved the needle in the over-arching power structure as far as the U.S. president’s relationship w/ the Project Ukraine vassals is concerned: he calls the shots.
He permits them to launch Taurus missiles, or not. They sit begging on the sidelines.
What’s interesting is to identify those hinge-points when the Deep State comes more assertively to the fore, as happened last weekend.
Those hinge-points signify a breach.

Posted by: steel_porcupine | Jun 7 2025 23:47 utc | 220

….
I hope other barflies are finding all this history talk and references useful.
Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 7 2025 22:23 utc | 197
From the point of view of a barfly, all this wealth of information, is pure gold
Damn straight!

Posted by: Ledovik1 | Jun 7 2025 23:48 utc | 221

BlindSpot | Jun 7 2025 23:16 utc | 215–
Thanks very much for your feedback. IMO, it’s possible to create–enculturate–good people just as the opposite is possible as we’ve seen historically. In 1949, it was made public that people had to be “carefully taught how to hate and fear” despite attempts by the US government to get the playwrights for South Pacific to purge that song and its other messages from their production. Those messages all made it into the film version as well again despite political pressure. Thus, I’m optimistic that a truly decent society’s possible.
//////////////////
frithguild | Jun 7 2025 23:24 utc | 217–
Thanks for your reply and feedback. As you read, there are many problems I avoided discussing. On your World Bank Court, perhaps the new IOMed could fulfill that function.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 7 2025 23:58 utc | 222

***
“There is a tendency in Western society to think of human actions in terms of “voluntary”, in the sense that we first create a desire to do something and then instruct our brain to take care of the details. ***
Posted by: psychohistorian | Jun 7 2025 23:19 utc | 216
Grader & Wingrow, Dawn of Everything was an absolutely delicious takedown of everything Rousseau. As I have said in this bat, lightning bolts and electric chairs arc, not history.
Agree with your proposition based upon Collura. Our monkey brains are far more limited than we give ourselves credit for. Recursive thought has been a human characteristic for 50,000 years or so. So our thought is really based upon story based heuristic and not so much upon “reason.” So we only approximate true reason. So humans are not seeking “reason,” we are genetically impelled to seek the hero’s journey – that’s the far better way to get laid!
Not sure where your going with the feminism – is that one of those isms like Communism BTW? In Genesis, the Serpent took the place of a baby in Eve’s eyes – it needed nurturing and caring for, as any good mother feels the need to do. Had Adam been just a little protective of her, he would have said, “That’s not a baby it’s a goddam snake!” Rather, he followed along and then threw her under the bus. So that kind of feminism?

Posted by: frithguild | Jun 7 2025 23:59 utc | 223

IMO, anyone with half a brain can see that our species is quite imbalanced to the patriarchy side and humanity could use a heavy does of real feminism….not the “We came, we saw, he died.” brass ovaries of Clinton.
Posted by: psychohistorian | Jun 7 2025 23:19 utc | 216
I will just recommend the first few chapters of the Gospel according to Saint Luke.
Sorry, dear psychohistorian; I couldn’t resist. It’s Pentecost.
😉

Posted by: juliania | Jun 7 2025 23:59 utc | 224

Posted by: tucenz | Jun 7 2025 21:31 utc | 181
########
Tulsi is a Hindu nationalist (Zionist) if she is anything.
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 7 2025 21:58 utc | 189
She is so much more!!!
Some of her genetics/upbringing might instal in her an innate sense of superiority – a quality a Samoan will not be outdone in!
My reservations about Tulsi stem from my politically jaundiced perspective – she’s too good to be true!
And for some “mark of the beast” evidence – there can be seen on youtube footage of her singing “Imagine” with her husband accompanying on ukelele.

Posted by: tucenz | Jun 8 2025 0:17 utc | 225

It is not my intention to contradict this point, but the US has been driven by pecuniary interests since before it even existed. Note what drove the Plymouth Company and the Virginia Company and so on… it certainly wasn’t the spirit of exploration!. . .
Posted by: William Gruff | Jun 7 2025 19:05 utc | 149
==============
A historical note—you decide whether minor or major.
Exploration of northeastern North America was to a great extent motivated by the need for timber—in particular, for masts for the ships of the Royal Navy. England was already deforested, but there were seeminly endless stands of huge eastern white pines (Pinus strobus) with straight trunks growing throughout what came to be called New England (and Canada)—right in the coastal areas! Convenient!
The tale is nicely told here:

Ray Asselin and Bob Leverett, directors, Eastern White Pine: The Tree Rooted in American History (Springfield, MA: New England Forests, 2019), documentary film narrated by Bob Leverett. Accessible on Youtube, “>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bQs7novlvtA.

A lot of early political activity and scuffles revolved around the Crown’s monopoly on these trees.
The film includes some great vintage footage, photos, and artwork depicting the realities of logging and transporting these giant mast trees during the Colonial period and after.

Posted by: Jane | Jun 8 2025 0:18 utc | 226

*** The US needs to get serious about its own population, cultivate them, nurture them, heal them and educate them. So long as a US senatorial elite sees the rest of its population and the world as a source of expropriation and grift, it will march into the dustbin of history.
I’m sorry but Trump is the pied piper.
Posted by: Patroklos | Jun 7 2025 23:43 utc | 220
I can’t disagree with much of what you call attention to. However, anthroplogically, Russia and China are organized diffetently than basically the rest of the world. The both have an exogenous communitarian family structure. See e.g. Todd, E. (1985), Explanation of Ideology: Family Structures and Social Systems, Oxford: Blackwell. So loyalty within an organization is second nature
The US is predominantly nuclear and much of it is nuclear authoritarian. Think of an Irishman building loyal organizations containing other Irishmen. It’s just not going to happen. Same is true for much of the US. Trying to nurture a bunch of Rednecks will be the start of a brawl.
Ontop of that, the head of the snake is subject to decapitation every 4 or 8 years.

Posted by: frithguild | Jun 8 2025 0:22 utc | 227

Badrakumar’s U2 analysis is slightly flawed.
A total of 11 U2 were shot down, right up 1967.
SR71s replaced U2s and when Russia managed to intercept one employing clever vectoring tactics, SR71s were quietly retired.
Now, Satellites carry out those missions and drones too until Iran plucked one out of the sky.
As someone commented earlier, Plan B is definitely in action. Plan B is the Nuclear Genie.
Isreal needs it to finish off Iran and complete its Greater Colonisation project.
India needs it to wipe off its shameful defeat against superior Pakistani tactics and Chinese weaponry.
US needs it to win any war against sandal wearing indigenous natives.
The Empire needs it to wound the Bear fatally.

Posted by: Suresh | Jun 8 2025 0:26 utc | 228

Jane | Jun 8 2025 0:18 utc | 227–
Thanks for providing that. “Naval Stores” was the term applied to all those goods–trees, tar, turpentine, and more.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 8 2025 0:31 utc | 229

Could you suggest somewhere to start with Beard?
His writing sounds quite interesting!
Posted by: lex talionis | Jun 7 2025 20:38 utc | 166
====================
I haven’t read any books by Beard, but he is mentioned in Ron Unz’s recent long essay on the real causes of WW2, and the suppression of historians who tried to explain them to the American public. Beard was one of these:
“. . .the historian Charles A. Beard. Since the early years of the 20th century, Beard had been regarded as one of the towering figures of American scholarship, co-founding The New School in New York City and serving terms as president of both the American Historical Association and the American Political Science Association. Yet when he attempted to publish a book analyzing America’s entrance into World War II, publishers shut their doors to him and only his personal friendship with the head of Yale University Press allowed his critical 1948 volume “President Roosevelt and the Coming of the War, 1941″ to even appear in print.”
Here it is at Amazon:
https://www.amazon.com/President-Roosevelt-Coming-War-1941/dp/0765809982/

Posted by: Jane | Jun 8 2025 0:31 utc | 230

“Now it’s about the so-called ‘deep state’?”
Also known as the Imperial Court to our ancestors.
Thomas

Posted by: Thomas | Jun 8 2025 0:34 utc | 231

DunGroanin @195: “Why do you not know what ‘fittest’ means in the context of it being regularly (mis) quoted?”
Because obviously “the fittest” in the context of the capitalist socioeconomic system and society are the ones who dominate the market. Elon Musk has 14 kids, most of whom will themselves go on to be elites in capitalism. Musk has already won the capitalist (and biological) game. He’s just enjoying himself now.

Posted by: William Gruff | Jun 8 2025 0:47 utc | 232

My two cents on the human nature issue. Where there is abundance, people are happy, generous, and loving.
Where there is scarcity, things are different. For one, it depends on how many humans are involved. If it is a tribal situation, most likely what is available will be evenly distributed.
If it is a situation where there are hundreds of millions of people who are not related and don’t know each other, and there is obscene wealth at the top, while millions on the bottom struggle, there will be strife, mostly among those at the bottom, although there will be inchoate and impotent rage towards those at the top.
The way the US is set up at this time, the nastiest and most vicious rise to the top, while those inclined to cooperate are disadvantaged. Unfortunately, the ideas of society are those of the ruling class, so most people accept the viciousness of American society as “human nature”.
Back in the 1930s, there was open class struggle, and many people at the bottom saw clearly what the problem was. The USSR stood as an example of a country where there was full employment and equal distribution, and many people advocated for communism.
The USA could have had a revolution if the commies prevailed. Instead, FDR came in, took down some of the wealth and power of the ruling class, put people to work, and improved the lives of Americans enough to make it possible to stop those scary revolutionary ideas. That is the MAGA dream, although most MAGA believers would be shocked at the 90%+ tax rates that made it possible, and would oppose it, as their rulers have taught them.
Look at the rhetoric of the president in the 30s and compare it to the rhetoric of any president or Congress member now.
“In such a spirit on my part and on yours we face our common difficulties. They concern, thank God, only material things. Values have shrunken to fantastic levels; taxes have risen; our ability to pay has fallen; government of all kinds is faced by serious curtailment of income; the means of exchange are frozen in the currents of trade; the withered leaves of industrial enterprise lie on every side; farmers find no markets for their produce; the savings of many years in thousands of families are gone.
More important, a host of unemployed citizens face the grim problem of existence, and an equally great number toil with little return. Only a foolish optimist can deny the dark realities of the moment.
Yet our distress comes from no failure of substance. We are stricken by no plague of locusts. Compared with the perils which our forefathers conquered because they believed and were not afraid, we have still much to be thankful for. Nature still offers her bounty and human efforts have multiplied it. Plenty is at our doorstep, but a generous use of it languishes in the very sight of the supply. Primarily this is because the rulers of the exchange of mankind’s goods have failed, through their own stubbornness and their own incompetence, have admitted their failure, and abdicated. Practices of the unscrupulous money changers stand indicted in the court of public opinion, rejected by the hearts and minds of men.
True they have tried, but their efforts have been cast in the pattern of an outworn tradition. Faced by failure of credit they have proposed only the lending of more money. Stripped of the lure of profit by which to induce our people to follow their false leadership, they have resorted to exhortations, pleading tearfully for restored confidence. They know only the rules of a generation of self-seekers. They have no vision, and when there is no vision the people perish.
The money changers have fled from their high seats in the temple of our civilization. We may now restore that temple to the ancient truths. The measure of the restoration lies in the extent to which we apply social values more noble than mere monetary profit.
Happiness lies not in the mere possession of money; it lies in the joy of achievement, in the thrill of creative effort. The joy and moral stimulation of work no longer must be forgotten in the mad chase of evanescent profits. These dark days will be worth all they cost us if they teach us that our true destiny is not to be ministered unto but to minister to ourselves and to our fellow men.”
https://avalon.law.yale.edu/20th_century/froos1.asp

Posted by: wagelaborer | Jun 8 2025 0:48 utc | 233

Gruff’s point about the need for Humanity to be enculturated with a humanistic sociopolitical philosophy which was 60 years ago said to be futuristic:
The Needs of the Many Outweigh the Needs of the One.
. . .
Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 7 2025 22:51 utc | 209
==============
I think most regular, normal people recognize this and are already inculurated with a sensible philosophy. Otherwise life, even in one’s own small community, becomes untenable. Everyone “knows” who the bad apples and cheats are—and also, who the good people are.
On the level of international cut-throat competition, “regular” citizens want none of the warmaking, despite the inroads made by relentless propaganda. The ones who do, such at the crazies in Ukraine and Israel, stand out. The latter because the “normal” populace is just as blood=thirsty as their leaders.
Despite the presence of plenty of conflict within societies, it is the elites that with their dreams of conquest and riches for themselves and their own families have always driven the invasions sieges, looting of other societies, etc. The regular people couldn’t even get there physically, out of their own territory, without the power of the state transporting them to the scenes of conquest.

Posted by: Jane | Jun 8 2025 0:50 utc | 234

[ This is a break from all the deep conversations 😀 ]
Okay so there are some questions that seem to be glossed over (maybe because everyone already knows what they want their own conclusions to be and are happy enough to drift away from reality?).
Why wasn’t the more capable Russian nuclear-capable aircraft attacked?
Pure luck?
Too provocative?
Were any of those other aircraft on any of the airfields that they meant to target but didn’t get to?
Were any of them on those they did hit?
Were the military airfields chosen first and then whatever they came across targeted in an opportunistic manner? (This would argue against much of the talk about the use of US/NATO high-end image satellites).
Both the narratives and the counter-narratives can be wrong.
They supposedly according to some “trained” on this in the US with the “mysterious” drone swarms but still couldn’t ensure all the drones were launched?
What exactly were they training and why?
Were they testing independent automated “last mile” targeting of aircraft by the drones?
Why couldn’t they get all their trailers to reach their point of dispersion?
Why couldn’t they simply give those trailers more time or if for some other reason something went wrong just let them reach their “fake” destination?
Was their planning laughably rigid?
Slapdash?
Doesn’t this strike anyone else as peculiar?
The Russians and the Usians already know or will find the answers and if relevant have taken or will take them into account.
Are anyone else interested in this?

Posted by: Sunny Runny Burger | Jun 8 2025 0:55 utc | 235

Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 7 2025 23:39 utc | 218
Thank you, karlof1. I am humbled by your dedication, and that’s a good thing! I will see if I can get the first book you recommend on interlibrary loan — I’m best with actual book in hand. And I do intend to vote in the midterms; will do my homework! Maybe midterms will be where it is at for me in future – and more time listening to speeches on C-Span — I used to do that a lot.
Thanks for the motivation – it is infectious, that!

Posted by: juliania | Jun 8 2025 1:00 utc | 236

wagelaborer @235:
Much angst and confusion in the West, no doubt about it. Still, I stand by human nature, with the Yemenis as my example. The poorest people on the planet putting their lives on the line for the Palestinians not for profit or any other form of gain (certainly not the virtue signalling of western middle class dooshes!), but simply because it is the right and humanistic thing to do.

Posted by: William Gruff | Jun 8 2025 1:07 utc | 237

Posted by: Thomas | Jun 8 2025 0:34 utc | 233
Yep and we call modern day astrologers ‘economists’. Although at least astrologers could basically tell you when a planet was going to be in a particular part of the sky and not get that wrong.

Posted by: Badjoke | Jun 8 2025 1:12 utc | 238

The US is predominantly nuclear and much of it is nuclear authoritarian. Think of an Irishman building loyal organizations containing other Irishmen. It’s just not going to happen. Same is true for much of the US. Trying to nurture a bunch of Rednecks will be the start of a brawl.
Ontop of that, the head of the snake is subject to decapitation every 4 or 8 years.
Posted by: frithguild | Jun 8 2025 0:22 utc | 229
================
Huh?
Can you please explain your point in simpler language?

Posted by: Jane | Jun 8 2025 1:16 utc | 239

anyone else interested in this?
Posted by: Sunny Runny Burger | Jun 8 2025 0:55 utc | 237
Yes.
——-
This thread… nostalgia for times I lurked threads of yore.
Well done those contributing.

Posted by: Melaleuca | Jun 8 2025 1:17 utc | 240

@Norwegian – Gonzalo made a prediction quite some time ago that I believe will eventually come true because the logic for it remains overwhelming. He predicted that eventually that Europeans would come to understand who destroyed Nord Stream and would speak of it out loud. Fences would be mended with Russia…on one condition. That the troublemakers that committed that sabotage be expelled from Europe. We are at a stage now where humanity itself is on trial.
Posted by: chunga | Jun 7 2025 12:58 utc | 21
For that to happen EU fractured.
Possible.

Posted by: Michael J | Jun 8 2025 1:27 utc | 241

Posted by: juliania | Jun 8 2025 1:00 utc | 238
RE: a kind of fire has burned all day on this thread, and you have been instrumental in tending its hearth and its flame
<< Peace be with you

Posted by: steel_porcupine | Jun 8 2025 1:28 utc | 242

Posted by: Michael J | Jun 8 2025 1:27 utc | 243
RE: Europeans will want to know-?
<< *Europeans* already know about NordStream 2. It is difficult to imagine any 'up' side into mounting public inquiries or investigations into the matter, even after the bloc fractures. Until Europe accomplishes meaningful autonomy/separation from the hegemonic U.S. such inquiries or investigations will only reinforce the status quo explanations: Andromeda yacht, drunken Ukrainians-gone-rogue, etc. Does Europe really need a faux/fig-leaf investigation to buttress the lie it has already swallowed hook, line & sinker-?

Posted by: steel_porcupine | Jun 8 2025 1:34 utc | 243

My reservations about Tulsi stem from my politically jaundiced perspective – she’s too good to be true!
Posted by: tucenz | Jun 8 2025 0:17 utc | 226
My issues with Gabbard stem from her being a lying little cunt. “Great work and effects.”
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2025/3/27/full-transcript-of-trump-teams-yemen-attack-plan-that-was-shared-on-signal

Posted by: Tichy | Jun 8 2025 1:36 utc | 244

@Posted by: Patroklos | Jun 7 2025 23:43 utc | 220
Have you read “The Assassination of Julius Caesar: A People’s History of Ancient Rome” by Michael Parenti? Also Hudson’s take on the wonders of the Roman Republic? Augustus seems to have implemented the performative aspects of republican rule but in reality been the de facto emperor. He greatly expanded the Roman Empire and improved its administration, but for the benefit of the many instead of his own power and that of the aristocracy? Hs brutal and autocratic subjugation of dissent is well documented.
Trump is in no way Caesar, he certainly does not possess the administrative and military abilities of Caesar no matter what you think of Caesar’s motives. Trump is a clown front man behind which the US oligarchy rules the country.

Posted by: Roger Boyd | Jun 8 2025 1:37 utc | 245

Are anyone else interested in this?
Posted by: Sunny Runny Burger | Jun 8 2025 0:55 utc | 237
I am and I’m sure smarter folks in the RF are studying closely.
With the passing of time the attack does not look nearly so impressive as portrayed in the Western media.
If anything it relied a lot on luck and it only had limited material impact.
Strategically it has been disastrous.

Posted by: ChatNPC | Jun 8 2025 1:43 utc | 246

Okay so there are some questions that seem to be glossed over …
Why wasn’t the more capable Russian nuclear-capable aircraft attacked?
… Are anyone else interested in this?

Posted by: Sunny Runny Burger | Jun 8 2025 0:55 utc | 237
I wondered if the Russians had some intel that the attacks on the five airbases was going to occur and had prepared a counter move to minimize the damage. Three of the five targets were not touched. Harm to RF military capabilities was next to nothing. The scale of the planned attack on one leg of their nuclear triad, however, as revealed by the attackers in their gleeful news coverage immediately after the event, shouted out to the world what we everywhere are up against — fascist lunatics like in Operation Unthinkable.
I have not seen anyone else wildly speculate on this. Mostly just lots of humble pie served up for russia by media here yet who came out with the upper hand in the long game? Was it a case of let it happen in part to gain a stronger hand in the long game?

Posted by: suzan | Jun 8 2025 1:46 utc | 247

I put the comment below on the old Ukraine thread but maybe it should go here as well
From Reuters

The United States believes that Russian President Vladimir Putin’s threatened retaliation against Ukraine over its drone attack last weekend has not happened yet in earnest and is likely to be a significant, multi-pronged strike, U.S. officials told Reuters an hour ago.

Alright then……unconditional surrender coming soon, eh?
A pinprick or a red line crossed….or both?

Posted by: psychohistorian | Jun 8 2025 2:07 utc | 248

Bolton had a reputation for sorting out recalcitrant bureaucracy.
Posted by: Justin | Jun 7 2025 12:23 utc | 9,

Trump chose Bolton because he enjoyed the sensation of Bolton’s mustache whiskers on his small, thin dongle.
Also, Bolton was famous as being the member of Trump’s admin with the smallest volume of active brain tissue. It was measured by fMRI to be slightly smaller than a walnut, while Mike Pompeo came in second at the size of an overripe avocado pit.
Trump’s own active brain volume cannot yet be measured because it is too diffuse and the activity is too random.

Posted by: Clever Dog | Jun 8 2025 2:15 utc | 249

“Russia, by the CIA connected Jamestown Foundation. The invitation to the conference says:
The Kremlin’s imperial ambitions in Ukraine come at the cost of potential mutinies, fracture, and dissolution at home. Understanding the consequences of Russia’s deteriorating internal conditions will be the main topic of the upcoming conference, which will involve experts in foreign affairs, defense, and geopolitics, along with representatives of Russia’s captive nations long-recognized by the United States. Russia is one of the globe’s last colonial empires, denying captive nations the right to self-determination and independence. Whether it remains an aggressive imperial power committed to threatening its neighbors or otherwise devolves into fracturing states, U.S. and allied policymakers cannot afford to ignore Russia’s future.”
Boy, that sure is a whole lot of PROJECTION, isn’t it? That is one thing our psychopaths know how to do well!
I believe similar sabotage happened in Trump’s first term too.
It’s been clear to me for a VERY long time, that our politicians are mere puppets, who answer to their billionaire donors, who also run the US deep state. An unelected canal of slimy characters with ZERO empathy remorse or regret. Problem with psychopaths, is not only that they are dangerous, but most of them are emotionally fossilized 12 year old’s, which makes them appear as INCOMPETENT as they really are!

Posted by: Kay | Jun 8 2025 2:24 utc | 250

.. Go live in a madrassa with Giyane, you bigotted cunt [LD].
Posted by: WTF People | Jun 8 2025 2:22 utc | 252
Cruel!

Posted by: tucenz | Jun 8 2025 2:34 utc | 251

Huh? Can you please explain your point in simpler language?
Posted by: Jane | Jun 8 2025 1:16 utc | 241
Poorly worded by me, apologies.
Mr. Patrolkos was suggesting, “The US needs to get serious about its own population, cultivate them, nurture them, heal them and educate them Todd,
The Explanation of Ideology: Family Structure and Social Systems.” My proposition was that this may work well in Russia and China, which, anthropologically speaking, have an exogenous communitarian family structure, but not in the US which ha Authorian and Absolute Nuclear Family structures. This branch of Anthropology rests largely with Emanuel Todd,
The Explanation of Ideology: Family Structure and Social Systems. Here is a nice summary of this work:
https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/LvRL8442Cp7An6uqd/book-review-the-explanation-of-ideology
Todd posits that family structure bear a large imprint on government structures. Both Authoritarian Nuclear and Absolute Nuclear produce isolationist cultures that resist assimilation more than do most other family systems, with Athoritaroan producing fairly small, homogeneous countries, or fragmented groups such as in Germany, Sweden, Japan, Korea, Scotland, Catalans, and Jewish culture.
My point was that the US government structures are characterized by these family structures, especially authoritarian “rednecks” throughout the northern and western parts of the US South. An example would be Andrew Jackson – one not likely at all to work cooperatively in a beaurocratic system.
I can tell you from experience, trying to “mentor” men with this mindset is more likely to end in a brawl that a cohesive beaurocracy.
Hope this clarifies.

Posted by: frithguild | Jun 8 2025 2:37 utc | 252

@ frithguild | Jun 8 2025 2:37 utc | 255
I haven’t read Todd’s work but have always suspected there was a relationship between the nuclear family snd authoritarianism. In an extended family, after all, the presence of grandparents and other elder family members would serve to mitigate bad parenting.
The extended family died with the Industrial Revolution and especially in the USA with its mass waves of immigration from Europe. It might be unfair to single out “rednecks” because I doubt the rest of the country fares much better in this regard. It will be interesting to see how, or how long, China maintains its communitarian attitude with its rural-to-urban migration.

Posted by: malenkov | Jun 8 2025 2:52 utc | 253

@ Posted by: WTF People | Jun 8 2025 2:22 utc | 252
Easy does it, little brother. I sense you spinning out of balance like a poorly centered piece of clay on a potter’s wheel. Take a few deep breaths and take your meds and find your center. It’s for your own good. I would not like to see you crash and burn.

Posted by: Clever Dog | Jun 8 2025 2:52 utc | 254

Posted by: Roger Boyd | Jun 8 2025 1:37 utc | 247
You misread my post and its point. First I compared Trump to Caesar only on the level of personal self-aggrandizement. Second, I attributed governance to Augustus without positively evaluating his regime. It’s a subtle point I guess, but Augustus is the culmination of Gaius Gracchus’ attempts to reform governance in 122-121. GG wanted to work within the system; Augustus had to break the system to install imperial governance. It goes without saying that he had to use ideological ‘back to the future’ to do so, like any quasi-fascist. Hudson and Parenti are not Roman historians however much they claim to understand its processes, but yes, I have their works and have read them. I’ve been teaching Roman history for a long time. You might do me the honour of accepting that I prefer not to bore this site with a lengthy scholarly excursus. But some posters only want to listen to how clever they are with their superficial point scoring and petty ‘gotchas’. Same old MoA comment board.

Posted by: Patroklos | Jun 8 2025 2:56 utc | 255

addendum to @ frithguild | Jun 8 2025 2:37 utc | 255
All that said, I imagine that the fruits of the struggle to recognize women as people with human and civil rights has served to mitigate nuclear family authoritarianism in some areas.

Posted by: malenkov | Jun 8 2025 2:57 utc | 256

@HB_Norica | Jun 7 2025 17:45 utc | 132
Let me assume you are ballpark right about those satellite numbers. The other side of that coin is that the US military and the US economy are much, much more reliant on those assets than Russia is–they would not like to see their precious toys being put on the menu.
But OK, I’ll play. If in your view, US satellites are an inappropriate target for Russia, then in what other way should Russia respond, to deter the West from attacking the Russian strategic triad ever again? Refresh my memory but I think that not mere warnings, but “stern warnings” were already tried when Russia’s over-the-horizon radar was attacked. As we see now, that didn’t help. If there’s just no Western asset that can be touched without triggering WW III, while said West can touch the Russkies in every orifice it pleases, then maybe this is a good time to accept that the West is the completely superior party here and that Russia is well advised to sign Trump’s ceasefire deal as a face-saving off-ramp?
Much here follows the Syrian war. Russia intervened with the best of hopes, announcing a strategy that they’d kill the proxies without touching the principals. Combined with prayer, that’d surely do the trick; MoA assured us “the outcome is not in doubt.” In practice, even the proxies weren’t touched that much, instead receiving a guided tour of Syria in endless “green-bus deals.” Either way, the West said “Oh no you won’t,” and sent in the Marines.
So for Ukraine, the strategy was fine-tuned by indeed slaughtering the proxies by the hundreds of thousands. I mean come on, those are Russian speakers, what future use could Moscow possibly have for them? And to restore balance, the proxy decision-makers were designated as completely off-limits, because they are not Russian in ways which we won’t talk about. But again, the West refuses to play by the rules for how the SMO should go according to the Kremlin.
In Syria, the assumption that Putin was smart enough to win on the cheap, without actually confronting anyone that mattered, turned out to be a path towards abject defeat. In Ukraine, we will see.

Posted by: Ma Laoshi | Jun 8 2025 3:07 utc | 257

*** It will be interesting to see how, or how long, China maintains its communitarian attitude with its rural-to-urban migration.
Posted by: malenkov | Jun 8 2025 2:52 utc | 256
The research indicated that the influence of family structure remains very stable over time. The major factor in the formation of the exogamous communitarian (Russia and China) was Mongul raids.
Also interesting is that Authoritan family structure areas end up with efficient governments because the people are more accepting of unfairness – so their society actually ends up more egalitarian.
When I examine that my family has elements of Authoritarian and Absolute Nuclear, my libertarian predispositions make some strange sense.

Posted by: frithguild | Jun 8 2025 3:14 utc | 258

Thanks for providing that. “Naval Stores” was the term applied to all those goods–trees, tar, turpentine, and more.
Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 8 2025 0:31 utc | 231
===================
It was the mast trees that could not be found elsewhere.

Posted by: Jane | Jun 8 2025 3:20 utc | 259

@hopehely | Jun 7 2025 19:06 utc | 150
Source for your claims about U2 that dont agree with Prouty’s version in the secret team
ChatNPC | Jun 7 2025 19:28 utc | 155
Source for your claims that the CIA improved the Soviet defenses
in the early 1960s

Posted by: petergrfstrm | Jun 8 2025 3:21 utc | 260

Errol Musk, Dad of Elon, is in Moscow for the “Future 2050 Forum”.
Proof: Pic in front of St Basil’s Red Square
In keeping with the thread theme of Deep State.
Funny how all these people mix n match and all seem to gravitate to Moscow.

Posted by: Melaleuca | Jun 8 2025 3:31 utc | 261

The extended family died with the Industrial Revolution and especially in the USA with its mass waves of immigration from Europe. It might be unfair to single out “rednecks” because I doubt the rest of the country fares much better in this regard.. .
Posted by: malenkov | Jun 8 2025 2:52 utc | 256
===========
I can’t follow the argument here.
1. The people already ere before the Industrial Revolution were also from europe, just a different part. A more “nuclear family” part?
2. Rednecks certainly used to be members of clans.
3. I have been under the impression that the appearancen of the nuclear family can be traced to the postwar years, as families left crowded urban ethnic neighborhoods and moved to the suburbs, bought a car, had nice big lawn, and anomie promptly set in. Isn’t this what Bowling Alone was about? Especially among the women trapped in their suburban homes driving the kids to school and Girl Scouts . . .
Then there was concurrently the phenomenon of people leaving the land and farming communities. So, no more communal parties, dances, quilting, barn raisings etc. that had characterized agricultural communities’ social life. Not to mention the elevated importance of churches and church-based activities in rural America, north and south.
Is it possible that Todd, a Frenchman, can only see the extended family pattern as it appears through a European lens?

Posted by: Jane | Jun 8 2025 3:40 utc | 262

@Posted by: Patroklos | Jun 8 2025 2:56 utc | 258
Thankyou, its good to get an informed view.

Posted by: Roger Boyd | Jun 8 2025 3:49 utc | 263

Posted by: Dave Pollard | Jun 7 2025 14:31 utc | 67
Maybe the first step should be to default on all America’s debt?
<= You may be about to get your wish.. Any idea what a 500% tariff on Chinese imports would mean to the American Consumer? imagine the supply chain chaos, massive unemployment 1930s style poverty? The last time this happened was in 1930s. At that time Congress's passed the Smoot-Hawley Tariff, the Federal Reserve's used high interest to protect its gold standard, and Hoover balanced the federal budget. TITS = 1930s level economic depression. IMO, the combination of High Tariff, High Interest rate, High Taxes, and Sanctions from hell are certain to sink the level of the domestic US economy and the global economy below the 1930s levels. And guess what.. Graham and Blumenthal 500% direct tariffs aimed a Russia and those countries that do not support the armed forces of Ukraine with money and weapons will likely accelerate and deepen that depression. IMO, Millions are about to starve to death.. because Russia cannot be defeated? Musk argues Trump should be impeached.. over his big Beautiful and it looks like the deep state and its British allies strike nuclear strategic assets deep within Russian territory without consultation with el Presidente . ..

Posted by: snake | Jun 8 2025 4:05 utc | 264

Posted by: Jane | Jun 8 2025 3:40 utc | 266
Try reading this for a better understanding about Todd’s family structure categories and how they are predictive for government structures and attitudes:
https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/journal-of-institutional-economics/article/testing-todd-family-types-and-development/08591ED67D7CBF6B79F0A06A2659C20D#
Here is a fun video:
https://youtube.com/shorts/R7NNVe76RfY?si=UU9i7mM5cONrp0PV
Hope it helps.

Posted by: frithguild | Jun 8 2025 4:08 utc | 265

@Konami | Jun 7 2025 22:36 utc | 203
>>Why do you think that Beijing falls into this trap? This is not a rhethorical question, I am curious about empirical evidence here.
Not sure whether Beijing is actually falling into anything. Aren’t they making a rational calculation that trading with the USA, in dollars, is still a significant net positive for the PRC? If so, then they’ll have to play along to a certain extent, aware that “net positive” implies that there are downsides as well. Playing along and keeping a low profile was the explicit prescription of Deng Xiaoping, and it worked in building up China post-Mao; so only too human if bureaucratic inertia is playing a role as well.
But playing along was never blind: the Party never relinquished control, China never put the IMF collar around its neck. Most crucially, China didn’t fully embrace Western ideas: their polity kept thinking for themselves, even if many of them were Western educated. Going forward, any further distancing from the West is bound to be gradual. But, and correct me if I’m wrong about this, China is gradually liquidating its holdings of Treasuries. My guess is, Scott Bessent hasn’t made enough friends in Beijing for the latter to reverse that policy. 🙂
———————
@frithguild | Jun 7 2025 22:39 utc | 204
>>Not sure how Science of Identity Foundation Hinduism relates to Zionism? What is a Hindu Nationalist?
Not sure I agree about everything with the OP, but this is an old story. PM Modi has some skill in presenting starkly different images at home and overseas. His BJP Party has much time for concepts such as the One True Faith, and the pure blood of the superior race (for this and that reason, some Indians see themselves as the true Aryans–perhaps overlooking that pronounced ethnic differences between North and South India can be spotted at first sight). If that’s how you roll, then only natural that you feel affinity for the ideas of Likud, while Putin and Xi look like boring technocrats in comparison.
Oh well, let’s not make this more complicated than it really is: if you practice the Islamophobia which others merely preach mostly, then you’re in the club. Tulsi Gabbard has always been Hindu or at least sympathetic; however, her criticism of Obama’s Syria war would seem to put her at odds with the Zionist agenda. But that was then: like everyone else Donald included, if she wanted a seat on the Trump Train then she had to kiss the ring and swear “Zion all the way.”

Posted by: Ma Laoshi | Jun 8 2025 4:11 utc | 266

Jane: fun video tossing Todd’s ideas around that I meant to post:
https://youtu.be/-RFFwhbVqeU?si=ZvGPAQzM62PcAnN6
Sorry to the bar that this has gone off topic

Posted by: frithguild | Jun 8 2025 4:17 utc | 267

Dealing with the Russians may be like eating like a pig in a restaurant where the menus don’t show the unit prices. The waiter is super patient and brings you whatever you ask and some more, the music makes you comfortable and relaxed, you don’t want to leave, so you order tons of dishes….
Then, when you are about to leave, the 150kg bouncer shows you the check, the bathtub with ice where they will collect both of your kidneys. They will pay you for your uber home though. Elegant and friendly

Posted by: Asian Frog | Jun 8 2025 4:36 utc | 268

Posted by: wagelaborer | Jun 8 2025 0:48 utc | 235
Don’t forget the Wobblies. The IWW seems like it was a much better option for the workers back then. And they had great songs.
Dump The Bosses Off Your Back

Posted by: lex talionis | Jun 8 2025 4:48 utc | 269

From a [Margarita Simonyan] X posting within Al Manar

Vladimir Medinsky spoke to us about Kiev’s sudden refusal to take back 6,000 bodies of their dead.
“Families will have opportunity to bury their close ones in a Christian manner. We are here, we are ready to fulfil our agreements. Accept the bodies, the POWs, and the sick. Let us act as human beings should act.”

Us human beings should not be allowing the genocide in Occupied Palestine to continue either…..as a species we are not showing well.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Jun 8 2025 5:03 utc | 270

The dismemberment of RU is of course an old issue. For many years it only simmered among crazy groups disregarded by media. This has changed unfortunately. And Western media have made it their task to spread and propagate the idea. Not too openly but its there and its not being questioned. Which means it most likely has been implemented by the lobby groups to some extent in the institutions. Which is the major worry. If this will go on unchanged, the EU will probably issue an official policy for the disintegration of RU which would make it normal and desired to talk about it and introduce into educations and finance corresponding events and organisations. The destructin of RU statehood would then become official EU policy.

Posted by: AG | Jun 8 2025 5:08 utc | 271

Question:
Will the Mexican-Americans in the US Marines follow orders to attack the Mexican-Americans in East LA ?

Posted by: Exile | Jun 8 2025 5:20 utc | 272

There is no such a thing as the deep state. There is just bureaucracy that is not sufficiently controlled. The concept of deep state is created to give the falls impression that only a few people in it are bad but the others are at our service. Any bureaucracy that is not constantly controlled by the politicians will start serving other parties. The real problem is that the politicians in the west have become very weak, mainly due to laws and institutions they have created in the past. Politicians have just become part of the bureaucracy with the very specific role of giving the people the impression of a real democracy.

Posted by: hubert | Jun 8 2025 5:46 utc | 273

Posted by: Exile | Jun 8 2025 5:20 utc | 274
It’s the National Guard being sent from what I understand, and I’m sure they will.

Posted by: lex talionis | Jun 8 2025 5:59 utc | 274

“These people actually believe their own BS”
No, the people who eat that BS do.
The people who create it just use one of the standard methods of western propaganda:
Just take reality, turn it around 180° and put the blame all YOU do on the others.
And it does not even need to have a 100% success, this massive distortion of reality by making it pretty much the opposite will be enough to trick most of the uneducated, who don’t use their brain, into thinking, that those who actually did all just this did not, while constantly starring in fear at those who are blamed instead.
None of our ‘evil overlords’ are stupid. All this shit is not happening by mistake. It’s on purpose. The only ‘stupid’ part is more coming from their god complex, that they really think that they can rule the world, that they really are these uberhumans who are just better than anyone else and by that destined to rule.

Posted by: Beatrice | Jun 8 2025 6:11 utc | 275

The last time this happened was in 1930s. At that time Congress’s passed the Smoot-Hawley Tariff, the Federal Reserve’s used high interest to protect its gold standard, and Hoover balanced the federal budget. TITS = 1930s level economic depression.
Posted by: snake | Jun 8 2025 4:05 utc | 268

Federal Reserve interest rates in the 1930’s were unequivocally lower than they had been during the 1920’s. It is well worth looking at actual data first instead of using your imagination.
https://fred.stlouisfed.org/graph/fredgraph.png?g=1Jus8
To spell it out in words for people who struggle with charts … coming into the “Roaring 20’s” the FRBNY had rates at 7% but steadily dropped this to a brief low point of 3% during 1924, then it stabilized around 4% for the next 4 years, then up to 5% … President Hoover was sworn into office March 1929 and rates were at 5% … and then very briefly rates hit 6% which was just before the big stock market crash in October 1929.
Immediately after the crash, the Fed started dropping rates … Smoot–Hawley went into effect June 1930 and therefore could not possibly have been the cause of the 1929 crash … but by June 1930, interest rates had hit 2.8% and were falling fast. By the end of the 1930’s rates were 1.5% and dropped further to 1% right before the war, and stayed down throughout the war.
It is possible that the brief 6% rates were the trigger which pushed the stock market over … but that would not have been possible unless things were very overheated already in the leadup. After the crash, the Fed acted as fast as it possibly could under the circumstances … unless you believe that somehow they should have had the power to see into the future.

Posted by: Tel | Jun 8 2025 6:36 utc | 276

@hubert | Jun 8 2025 5:46 utc | 275
Since most anglosaxons never even mention the existence of the angloamerican establishment erected and controlled by Britain, chances are that establishment is an important component in the deep state of the US.
Most anglosaxons dont know that the US celebrated the day of interdependence in London in 1918 when normally they would celebrate the day of independence.
Since such things pass under the radar there is a good chance that is where one ought to look for hidden power.
All the thinktanks were created on British initiatives.
Neoconservatism is sometimes said to have been started by Leo Strauss who was the top student of the nazi-german ideologue Carl Schmitt, but there is an other connection via Oxford through James Burnham.
And in the case of the Iraq wars the British historian Niall Fergusson adviced the americans to use american convicts to colonise Iraq.
Such things are seldom mentioned but illustrate the thesis.
And there is the circumstance that the US space hoax of simulating the moon landings was carried out in a British studio, the Cardington II in Bedfordshire and the instructions for Walter Kubrick were delivered from the British NATO HQ in London.
In 2012 a thinktank connected to Chatham House fittingly published a paper titled All Roads go through London.

Posted by: petergrfstrm | Jun 8 2025 6:36 utc | 277

“There’s only one war that matters: The Class War.”
True, but ‘stoning the Elites’ is not the solution nor is fighting that class war.
The only way out of this is to get rid of the classes. No classes, no class war.
The existence of classes alone already IS the war – AND the victory of the ruling class.
—-
“There is no such a thing as the deep state.”
The ‘deep state’ is simply what does not switch every four years. It’s that ‘mass’ that remains and creates its own, lasting system of power, while the elected government is only a small puddle the camera’s point at on that giant cancer growth.
You could say, that this oh so ‘democratic’ thing about switching governments ever few years is mainly used as a cover up, especially in the USA.
They love to condemn China for their one party syste, but guess what: when you only got one party, there is no fake fight between the parties, where mainly the lies and false promises win, but the focus HAS TO be on the politics. China’s elections are all about painting that country sized picture of where the problems are which have to be solved. Western eletion’s are ignoring most problems, creating false ones as distraction and for PR and even if a real problem is mentioned, then just make fake promises around them which will be instantly forgotten after the election.
It already starts with the talk which reveal the whole problem. “Party X has won”. Why do the parties win or lose? What is that? A game show? And the citizens are just the audience? Elections should be about the country and its people. THEY win – or lose. Mainly lose…
If a shit party comes into power that keeps ruining the country and exploiting the people, who is the loser? Party Y in opposition? Or the people who now have to pay for the shit politics of the ‘winning’ party X?
—-
“How is the DeepState going to control this narrative?”
He doesn’t. In case you did not see it, but the MSM will just keep spewing more propaganda and stop reporting about the former lies. That’s enough. The majority will just forget about it. I call it the ‘event brain’. It’s all just events. No matter what or how big how impactful, everything is just an event like some saturday night life show and the next day forgotten. This way you can keep the show running endlessly, because such an even brain will never learn, it will just enjoy the next event you throw at it.
NOTHING of what we got now is in any ways new. It is like that since decades, partly like centuries and much longer. The event brain does not learn from any of that. Else we would live in a completely different world already.

“Why wasn’t the more capable Russian nuclear-capable aircraft attacked?
Pure luck?
Too provocative?”
You can only guess. IMO it indeed points to the western control of that, because for Ukraine it made zero sense. Their main problem are the tactical bomber, which constantly drop those FABs. The strategical bomber make zero difference, even if you would destroy ever single one of them, because what they do in that SMO can easily be done by other means, including those tactical bombers, land units and ships.
When it comes to PR, it would also have much more impact if much more advanced prestige bombers like the TU 160 or those tactical bombers would have been attacked – instead of all those incredible old and slow soviet time “trucks” (and in constrast to something like the TU 160, those TU 95 are pretty much that).
So yeah, it seems the ‘too provocative’ part is the point and that points again at UK or US deep state (so CIA and their shenanigans), which went for a provocation to make Russia snap.
NEVER FORGET:
The goal of NATO is to destroy Russia without being turned to dust in return. The pretty much only way for that is to make Russia crumble under inner tumult and outer, non military pressure, so if the whole world is against Russia, something NATO constantly tries to do, what is of course pretty much impossible hard to do, when the big rest of the world knows you as that bloody monster you are, often enough with a whole row of ugly, personal experiences with that bloodthirst.
But Russia going completely lunatic over their precious bombers being attacked and nuking Kiev or whatever, that would be the absolut dream of NATO. That was likely the whole idea behind it. Hoping for Russia being braindead stupid over it, killing itself in blind rage.
Yes, it’s obviously absurd that this would happen if not going for FAR, FAR more to the level where pretty much no one would doubt anymore, that NATO is now going for a nuclear attack on Russia, but that’s the problem of NATO: their dream is stupid and unreachable and would only work if Russia, China and pretty much the rest of the world would be as stupid (and evil) as our western propaganda loves to make them out to be.
NATO just despertaly clinges to that ill dream, because it’s the only thing it got left. If they give that up, they would admit, that their time of being the big bad overlord who whoops the world is over.

Posted by: Beatrice | Jun 8 2025 6:44 utc | 278

Will the Mexican-Americans in the US Marines follow orders to attack the Mexican-Americans in East LA ?

Posted by: Exile | Jun 8 2025 5:20 utc | 274
Yes.

Posted by: Melaleuca | Jun 8 2025 6:50 utc | 279

PEACE
Let’s keep fingers crossed and watch NATO disintegrate before our eyes June 25-26 in The Hague, the former world City of Peace. That would be very nice.
BTW there is no “Left” left in the USA, nor in most EU states. At least of any relevance and significance. On the previous thread you are still searching for answers, but reached the French Revolution, the guillotine and end of Aristocrats. Enjoy.
Paris rive gauche de la Seine

Posted by: Oui | Jun 8 2025 7:14 utc | 280

Posted by: Oui | Jun 8 2025 7:14 utc | 282
Was it not the home of the VOC? Not exactly what I would call peaceful.

Posted by: Badjoke | Jun 8 2025 7:54 utc | 281

😁 no it was not the “home” of the VOC and Dutch Reformed slavery and colonialism … the Netherlands did not exist as a unified state but Seven Provinces. The sailing nation was the Northern cities on the IJsselmeer, Amsterdam, Southern Zeeland and Antwerp. The area between Amsterdam and The Hague was a large lake where Schiphol airport was later build.
At the beginning of the 20th century the European Peace movement and Carnegie established the Peace Palace in The Hague, later followed by the UN World Court ICJ and recently the ICC now under heavy sanctions by Israel and the U.S.
https://www.vredespaleis.nl/peace-palace/history/125-years-since-the-first-hague-peace-conference/1899-first-hague-peace-conference/?lang=en

Posted by: Oui | Jun 8 2025 8:28 utc | 282

@ Posted by: Thomas | Jun 8 2025 0:34 utc | 233
In Britain it is called the Privy Council and the Crown, it is the Deepstate. The Civil Service high mandarins are raised to be the perma state from childhood, going to the same schools, universities and same sports and entertainments, the same Masonic lodges etc.
@ Posted by: Badjoke | Jun 8 2025 1:12 utc | 240
Amen to that. Economists are the modern snake oil salesmen and pulpit bashers. Selling the taxes pay for everything brimstone and fire bs.

Posted by: DunGroanin | Jun 8 2025 8:41 utc | 283

Trump asked Graham to water-down his senate bill about secondary sanctions.
The Don didn’t understand Lindsey is a Duracell Bunny with a wardrum … he last longer ! (And it’s not easy to stop once it run.)

Posted by: Hiro Masamune | Jun 8 2025 8:46 utc | 284

Posted by: steel_porcupine | Jun 7 2025 23:47 utc | 221
Thanks! Steel_porcupine. That is a clarifying perspective.
A breach you say?
Well, well … that does seem to explain it. What can they do??
Throw their meat fronts under the bus to escape into the future again?
The green goblin narco fuehrer – brought to DC to be readily whisked into the WH – just as zippily as he was given the bums rush last time?
Let’s tune into one of NuttyYahoo’s mics.
‘Hi Donny, Hi JD – I’m back for my lunch.
Come on give me the hug – you guys! had me worried!
Open the banks let’s get this job done, pass me the spoon Mertz; he’s the best, ain’t he guys, cute hair, better than that bald clown Shultz; he was a midget! I like tall guys. Like you fellas you’re the best; not like HerrStarmztrooper- he has a squeaky little man’s voice, not gruff like us eh? Nice haircut though, the boys like it a lot. They are funny with their fire starting… but I could get my hair cut like that too you know… but the directors say not until my next role!
I was thinking going bald and getting black faced …like Ben in Gandhi.. sniff ahh ..that’s some good stuff ..’
Breach confirmed 😉

Posted by: DunGroanin | Jun 8 2025 8:48 utc | 285

Posted by: ChatNPC | Jun 8 2025 1:43 utc | 248


I am and I’m sure smarter folks in the RF are studying closely.
With the passing of time the attack does not look nearly so impressive as portrayed in the Western media.
If anything it relied a lot on luck and it only had limited material impact.
Strategically it has been disastrous.

Disastrous for whom? You didn’t specify.
If one looks at the material impact alone, and based on the photos and reports, strategic bombers and AWACS type planes were hit. If you wish to stick with the notion that the impact is limited, then one has to wonder why Russia expends resources to maintain a fleet in the first place. By the way, this also applies to previously targeted assets. Why pay for an expensive warship or a bridge across the Kerch strait if it isn’t important? Would anyone argue that the cost of assets used against assets destroyed is very much in favour of the attacking side?
This operation demonstrates the lack deterrence and strategic depth on the Russian side. Also, the lacklustre aspect of the attack that you have pointed out suggests that Russia can expect more operations of this type and that there is a wide margin from improvement on the attackers side.
One could debate whether the West has handed Russia its own Vietnam, but it is undeniable that the conflict has created new opportunities to strike Russia.

Posted by: robin | Jun 8 2025 9:10 utc | 286

Posted by: DunGroanin | Jun 8 2025 8:48 utc | 287
RE: a breach
<< Euro-members of NATO are trying to coast on Deep State lubricant at this point. All at once Project Ukraine has a ‘how dangerous can we make this’ aspect. With DJT, however, the important signifier is the bluff: you’ve got to look for the bluff. In both his policies and in his rhetoric, he goes over the top, but then pares matters back. The bluff is his fingerprint. The attack last weekend on Russia’s airbases had nothing of the bluff about it. Lacking the characteristic signature, it seemed mechanically grafted onto Project Ukraine, imposed from *without* from earlier in the thread, as you reference: "What's interesting is to identify those hinge-points when the Deep State comes more assertively to the fore, as happened last weekend. Those hinge-points signify a breach." Posted by: steel_porcupine | Jun 7 2025 23:47 utc | 221

Posted by: steel_porcupine | Jun 8 2025 9:17 utc | 287

Posted by: William Gruff | Jun 8 2025 0:47 utc | 234
Lol thanks for the reply. I did get what you meant.
It’s just a bug bear of mine when it comes to the supremacists hijacking ‘Natural Selection’ as being able to adapt to changing environment/eco system reality of the Tree of Life on Earth – ie the random genetic variations all life carries that might allow an otherwise dead end spectrum of a species’ offspring to fare better than the majority had in the previous environment.
Thus becoming the new majority in the new changed world.
The old majority (‘fittest’ in that old environment wasting away and dying; their progeny unable to survive in the new environment, their genes dying out)
In capitalism – if it is being considered as an equivalent to the cauldron of life (a huge misperception in my opinion) – Musk won what?
He is a scion of the Old Bastards and as such was selected (yes that sort of fits the Darwinian model on some way I suppose) because of his natural born ability to be ‘sciencey’?
I dare say the idiot Gates was equally so chosen; and the other TechBro super whizkids (mostly all-American stereotypes); hey they even made a TV series (Big Bang!) to spread the meme about that, a modern parable, from the modern pulpit of the TeeVee shrine in every home.
14 kids you say? That’s a success? There are poor folk who have more! Perhaps one of Elons will be able to adapt to the changing environ of Capitalism on planet Earth (unlikely) or maybe achieve the grand dream of owning Mars instead!
It’s the truth that many such born to rule types at once advocate population control for humanity as a whole but practice spreading their genes with lots of kids of their own!
In the U.K. toffs, aristo types, who were hothoused into politics by their dynasties prove that – Bozo the clown king of England Johnson, has sprogged yet another future obnoxious mini-me.
Another high profile slap worthy Rees-Mogg is already building the future PM with his brood that he ‘hilariously’ names by their number of birth in Latin! He is currently building the family profile and celebrity worship with a TeeVee series on his ‘family’. (The original Reese-Mogg was the propogandist general of the BBC at its inception – a piece of work! )
Ooh they are such clever guys and girls aren’t they?
They think that since they were ‘born high’ they are natural geniuses, good at anything they turn their attention to, because they have so many sycophants paid to be around them to validate their delusions.
Have you seen that junior emperor prince of Soros?
The guy can barely speak yet is given platforms where everyone bows and nods in approval at his grunts and stutters – because he is the son of the high emperor; the Chosen One!
Fuck them. All of their entitled born to rule dynasties.
I doubt a single Musk or any of their shapeshifter progeny could last or succeed in capitalism, Red in Tooth and Claw, in say China, now.
As is evident with their crying like babies Techbros, about their slipped grasp on the AI and semiconductor monopolies. Which they have been assigned by their Deepstate dynasties.
They dominate less every day as real innovative Chinese (and others) create more millionaires and billionaires in the Capitalist ecosystem where the playing field is LEVEL. Only sanctions tariffs and ban on free trade of products and services can save them! Drumpff didn’t come up with that by himself he ain’t clever/dumb enough for that.
Their fake super intelligent fame will have turned to dust and blown away into oblivion long before the end of this century. In a hundred years no one will have heard of them. Like a whole lot of ozymandii (sic)

Posted by: DunGroanin | Jun 8 2025 9:36 utc | 288

@ Posted by: Beatrice | Jun 8 2025 6:44 utc | 280
Ding ding ding ding … hitting the target a lot there,bravo Beatrice.
All the right notes, all in the right order. Ta very much.
The specific part of getting a stereotypical ‘Big Russian Move’ out of poking the bear, has been the raison detre of pushing the Ukraine Red Line since the begining of the century – its in all the diplomatic messages on wikleaks!
Having tried for centuries to attack and invade Russia only to fail and have them come to Paris and Berlin to collect their bill, it was the clever plan to get them to attack first!
‘See it’s them invading, UNPROVOKED! ‘
Never mind the full on neo Nazi and old Nazi! Never mind the full on natzio recruitment, training, command and control and yes boots on the ground as mercenaries! They will still have to pay their pensions (if they survive) and prosthetics and hand out medals, secretly eventually.
They failed. Again 🤡🤡🤡.

Posted by: DunGroanin | Jun 8 2025 9:50 utc | 289

Delightful thread barflies – a great read catching up this Sunday morning- Thankyou very much ALL.
MoA is best. Cheers b, drinks on me all around.
I’ll finish with a final take on the o/p.
I think Natzios wanted to see oreshnik launched again and record it better this time.
Probably didn’t get enough launch data and telemetrics first time.
A job for the Great Gamer SAS deep cover James Bond Boys with their Toys.

Posted by: DunGroanin | Jun 8 2025 9:59 utc | 290

Posted by: Tel | Jun 8 2025 6:36 utc | 278
It is well worth looking at actual data first instead of using your imagination
<= i did not look at actual data, I relied on Hillsdale College article entitled Tariffs in American History, John Steele Gordon.. You might have asked before you blamed May 2025, Volume 54, number 5.. and I qualified high interest as follows " the Federal Reserve's used high interest to protect its gold standard," you might have read more carefully my post and at least asked about the source before you spoke? Thanks for reading it, and BTW AFAIAM concerned what I said @266 (not 268 as you wrote) still stands.. TITS is a formula for global economic disaster. and BTW couple TITS with de industrialization begs the question why have presidents, congress, embedded bureaucracies, think tanks, and NGOs since 1946 been recommending and do things that have and are systematically destroying America? I thought the idea of electing Trump was to MAGA?

Posted by: snake | Jun 8 2025 10:21 utc | 291

Posted by: robin | Jun 8 2025 9:10 utc | 288
One could debate whether the West has handed Russia its own Vietnam, but it is undeniable that the conflict has created new opportunities to strike Russia.

With so much Western treasure, materiel and personnel lost in the Ukraines, it is undeniable that the conflict has created great opportunities for Russia to strike NATO inside the Ukraines.

Posted by: Johan Kaspar | Jun 8 2025 10:25 utc | 292

Posted by: AG | Jun 8 2025 5:08 utc | 273
Lol! As if what you describe was possible. You just fell for a propaganda cope by losers that cann’t even fight Russia openly but only thru proxies and failing at that.

Posted by: Johan Kaspar | Jun 8 2025 10:29 utc | 293

Posted by: Johan Kaspar | Jun 8 2025 10:25 utc | 294


With so much Western treasure, materiel and personnel lost in the Ukraines, it is undeniable that the conflict has created great opportunities for Russia to strike NATO inside the Ukraines.

And inside Ukraine alone. That’s the point I’m making.
NATO now has countless new opportunities to strike Russia in just about every sector it so chooses. That’s what the sleeper drone attack all across Russia’s vast territory demonstrates. Energy grid, refineries, industrial infrastructure, just about anything is within reach.
If full spectrum attrition is the name of the game, and I do believe that’s what the zero-sum West has in mind, then it certainly has a strategic advantage when all Russia can do is strike Ukraine. Ukraine, the most Russian place on earth after Russia itself.

Posted by: robin | Jun 8 2025 10:51 utc | 294

🤡 🇺🇸 NASA and the Pentagon are looking for replacements for SpaceX rockets and ships after the spat between Trump and Musk, The Washington Post reported.

https://t.me/ZandVchannel/154813
LOL

Posted by: Norwegian | Jun 8 2025 10:53 utc | 295

It’s unbelievable so many idiots claiming than Trump didn’t know.

Posted by: Trump | Jun 8 2025 11:01 utc | 296

Posted by: paddy | Jun 7 2025 22:47 utc | 207 “Commercial satellite imagery is not sufficient for even a tiny part of the terrorist kill chain Trump facilitates for the nazis in Kiev and the US Senate.”
It absolutely is.
In addition France, Germany, Italy and the UK all have military reconnaissance satellites. Some operated jointly, some by a single country. They are still suppling information to Ukraine from these satellites.
There are NATO air breathing assets also still providing information to Ukraine.

Posted by: ed4 | Jun 8 2025 11:02 utc | 297

Here comes the sun… https://t.me/DDGeopolitics/150417

Posted by: Apollyon | Jun 8 2025 11:20 utc | 298

https://www.rt.com/russia/618791-ukrainian-soldiers-names-list/
I didn’t see this posted. Good move by Russia.

Posted by: Eighthman | Jun 8 2025 11:20 utc | 299

Posted by: HB_Norica | Jun 7 2025 17:45 utc | 132 “Just because the Ukrainians are stupid enough to attack Russia’s strategic nuclear assets” “Russia has only recently gotten their kill chain time down to minutes in part by launching new satellites that cover the battlefield”
One or two of those bombers Ukraine hit look like they had KH-101 hanging on them in the video taken as the drones attacked.
How many new military satellites has Russia launched lately? And how much time is spent over the battlefield? I think those satellites played only a small part in the increase in Russian capabilities.

Posted by: ed4 | Jun 8 2025 11:21 utc | 300