Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
June 7, 2025
The Deep State Is Still Sabotaging Presidential Policies

Ambassador M.K. Bhadrakumar reminds us of subtle maneuvers by deep state actors to sabotage presidential policies.

When a U.S. spy plane was shot down over the Soviet Union President Dwight Eisenhower had not be informed about its real mission. The CIA claimed that it had been a weather plane that went off course after its pilot was incapacitated. The president repeated that tale.

The Soviets then published that the wreckage of the U-2 spy plane had been recovered and the pilot captured alive. The Soviets were miffed of being lied to and Eisenhower's attempt of detente with them failed.

Bhadrakumar sees a parallel in the recent Ukrainian drone attacks on strategic bomber on several Russian air field.

President Trump, in a call with the Russian president Putin, claimed that the U.S. had had no knowledge of the attack. That is, as several former CIA members confirm, implausible. The operation had been the making for 18 month which means that it had been initiated under President Biden. U.S. and/or British intelligence was certainly involved in designating the targets.

It seem that Trump, like Eisenhower before him, was not informed and thus embarrassed himself.

While Trump was talking with Putin Russian officials warned that deep state forces within the U.S. have not changed their anti-Russian aims:

Moscow should take very seriously reports that certain circles in the United States want to see Russia destroyed, Deputy Foreign Minister Sergey Ryabkov said at a news conference at TASS ..

"The fact that certain circles in the United States have been and are still hatching plans to move towards eradicating Russia as a state is also undeniable. It is enough to follow the discussions that are taking place, including on political science platforms. We should not underestimate the consequences of such a mindset," the deputy minister noted.

His comments came in response to the words of Brazilian leader Luiz Inacio Lula da Silva in an interview with Le Monde, who argued that former US President Joe Biden, during his administration, mentioned a desire to destroy Russia.

Ryabkov probably though of an upcoming conference about the 'fracturing states' of 'one of the globe’s last colonial empires', i.e. Russia, by the CIA connected Jamestown Foundation. The invitation to the conference says:

The Kremlin’s imperial ambitions in Ukraine come at the cost of potential mutinies, fracture, and dissolution at home. Understanding the consequences of Russia’s deteriorating internal conditions will be the main topic of the upcoming conference, which will involve experts in foreign affairs, defense, and geopolitics, along with representatives of Russia’s captive nations long-recognized by the United States. Russia is one of the globe’s last colonial empires, denying captive nations the right to self-determination and independence. Whether it remains an aggressive imperial power committed to threatening its neighbors or otherwise devolves into fracturing states, U.S. and allied policymakers cannot afford to ignore Russia’s future.

While Trump is at least somewhat attempting to create better relations with the Russian Federation parts of the foreign policy blob are still dreaming of dismantling it.

We are seeing similar attempts of counteracting presidential policies with regards to China.

On May 11 during trade talks between the U.S. and China in Geneva both sides agreed to calm things down:

Both sides reduced their tariffs. China also promised to reduce some of its non tariff measures:

China will [..] adopt all necessary administrative measures to suspend or remove the non-tariff countermeasures taken against the United States since April 2, 2025.

The financial markets relaxed and everyone was happy about it.

But on May 14, the very same day the new rules were to apply, the U.S. introduced new and extremely harsh measures against Chinese products:

The US Commerce Department issued guidance stating that the use of Huawei Technologies Co’s Ascend artificial intelligence (AI) chips “anywhere in the world” violates the government’s export controls, escalating US efforts to curb technological advances in China.

The agency’s Bureau of Industry and Security said in a statement on Tuesday that it is also planning to warn the public about “the potential consequences of allowing US AI chips to be used for training and inference of Chinese AI models”.

While this may not have been a technical breach of the Geneva agreement it certainly violated the spirit of the agreed upon Joint Statement: …

In consequence China continued to withhold export licensees for rare earth products which U.S. industries need. Trump was furious about this but seemingly without understanding what had caused China to take that step.

On Thursday a phone called between Trump and President Xi tried to calm things down (archived).

The two leaders, speaking for the first time since Trump became president, agreed to another round of high-level trade talks to follow up on the truce reached in Geneva last month, and exchanged invitations for state visits.

Trump said on Truth Social “there should no longer be any questions respecting the complexity of Rare Earth products,” but the Chinese readout didn’t mention the issue.

On Friday, just a day after the president's attempt to calm down trade issues with China, four deep state actors set out to again sabotage him:

The U.S. in recent days suspended licenses for nuclear equipment suppliers to sell to China's power plants, according to four people familiar with the matter, as the two countries engage in a damaging trade war.

The suspensions were sent to companies by the U.S. Department of Commerce, the people said, and affect export licenses for parts and equipment used with nuclear power plants.

Nuclear equipment suppliers are among a wide range of companies whose sales have been restricted over the past two weeks as the U.S.-China trade war shifted from negotiating tariffs to throttling each other's supply chains. It is unclear whether a Thursday call between U.S. President Donald Trump and Chinese President Xi Jinping would affect the suspensions.

Why, just a day after Trump's call with Xi, did 'four people familiar with the matter' found it necessary to inform Reuters of this?

This is, like the withholding of information on CIA operations in Russia, a measure to embarrass the president in eyes U.S. opponents. It is also an obvious attempt to sabotage trade with China.

The Chinese will note that the president's words get counteracted by his administration. Why should they even talk with him when he is not able to impose his own policies on the people who are supposedly working for him?

In consequence U.S. companies will have wo wait longer to be allowed to purchase the rare earth products they urgently need and can only get from China.

Comments

Posted by: Newbie | Jun 7 2025 16:13 utc | 95
I don’t know if the Russian Federation can help in 1, 2 or 3…
I only know that the Russian Federation and China are not interested in the bankruptcy of the US, nor of Europe, nor of anyone; they simply will not give up on the dismantling of NATO. That’s it! And the war will only end when this goal is achieved, no matter who goes bankrupt! NATO has nothing to do with defense or the North Atlantic. NATO is a dog that barks at Russia’s door as much as at China’s door!

Posted by: Elber | Jun 7 2025 16:36 utc | 101

Whether Trump knew about the Ukrainian plan or not, it happened on his watch and he owns it. The Commander-in-Chief has that responsibility. Not that I expect Trump to accept responsibility, any more than he does for his numerous business failures. If he tripped over his own shoelaces he would turn around and sue the shoemaker.

Posted by: Clever Dog | Jun 7 2025 16:40 utc | 102

Posted by: DunGroanin | Jun 7 2025 14:20 utc | 63
It wasn’t what the u2 plane was doing (taking pics) that was used as an example. It was that the plane was shot down and deep state lied to lotus about it, this was how the example was used. So if Trump didn’t know (unlikely imo) then the example is spot on.

Posted by: Tannenhouser | Jun 7 2025 16:44 utc | 103

Former CIA Chief Mike Pompeo Speaks at Odessa Conference One Day Before Ukrainian Surprise Attack on Russian Bombers
Demands Crimea be Designated Ukrainian Territory, Calls for Complete Victory Over Russia, Includes Eerie Prediction of Upcoming Events
“There is only one outcome that is remotely tolerable for the world, and that is victory. It’s winning. There can be variations. Sometimes you can win by the other player storming out of the room. Sometimes you can win by total defeat and taking that player’s king. But always victory is measured in the minds of the two participants and those who were observing the game itself. And I would suggest to you today that if the conclusion of this conflict isn’t that those who are observing this game don’t understand that this was a win for the good guys and defeat for the bad guys, and it is very clear that the bad guys sit in Moscow, not in Kyiv, then the world will be a very different place.” …
That deterrence, that model that would have and could have prevented what happened, doesn’t end with a ceasefire. It doesn’t end the day that Vladimir Putin says, At least for the moment, I’m going to stop. This is a man who has no intention of changing. He has been pursuing the vision of restoring what he once knew as the greater Russian Empire, the Soviet Union. His vision has not changed and is not going to change. That means our resolve must be forever. It’s not the case that we can sign an agreement, make a deal, bring NATO closer together. This model of deterrence must remain.
https://www.globalresearch.ca/mike-pompeo-speaks-odessa-conference-day-surprise-attack-russian-bombers/5889490
Link to full Pompeo is included:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31yBJmFjy6Q

Posted by: JB | Jun 7 2025 16:44 utc | 104

Posted by: DunGroanin | Jun 7 2025 14:20 utc | 63
It wasn’t what the u2 plane was doing (taking pics) that was used as an example. It was that the plane was shot down and deep state lied to lotus about it, this was how the example was used. So if Trump didn’t know (unlikely imo) then the example is spot on.

Posted by: Tannenhouser | Jun 7 2025 16:44 utc | 105

“Funny how all the public key people in decision-making are damaged in some way and thus easily exploited by smarter and more powerful individuals,ha?”
Posted by: Mustee
Why do I have to think of Winston Churchill now?

Posted by: Apollyon | Jun 7 2025 16:45 utc | 106

Russia should be calling a conference on this topic….
Posted by: Ghost of Mozgovoy | Jun 7 2025 12:24 utc | 10

I daresay the Russian government has developed and evolved pan-governmental policy on this topic since about 1947.

Posted by: Stumpy | Jun 7 2025 16:47 utc | 107

Alex Krainer substack…Operation Unthinkablefrom Churchill….are we still in it….todays parallels are deeply disturbing

Posted by: Jo | Jun 7 2025 16:48 utc | 108

Too much zionism in US et al

Posted by: Hahajizzjizz | Jun 7 2025 16:51 utc | 109

NATO To Limit Ukraine Discussions To Avoid Provoking Trump
https://www.rt.com/news/618765-nato-trump-ukraine-zelensky/
“The European NATO members are ‘desperate to avoid upsetting a volatile Trump during the Summit,’ Reuters said in an article on Friday.”
Unlike…
Prime Minister Carney Announces Canada’s G7 Priorities Ahead of the Leaders’ Summit
https://www.pm.gc.ca/en/news/news-releases/2025/06/07/prime-minister-carney-announces-canadas-g7-priorities
“…will include a just and lasting peace for Ukraine…Canada is ready to lead.” [Carney has invited Zelensky, who is hoping to meet with Trump – also attending. Russia remains uninvited.]

Posted by: JohnGilberts | Jun 7 2025 16:53 utc | 110

Deputy Foreign Minister Sergey Ryabkov speaks really well. Lavrov is a hero of mine. I wonder who specifically he is referring to when he says:

“I can only say that those who played the role of political and intellectual projectile carriers in that administration failed in this role, because they crossed out everything that should have remained absolutely indisputable and obvious in order to please the conjuncture.”

Trump would do well to figure out who those projectile carriers are.
Ryabkov has style. I could never imagine his eloquence from one of the best and brightest here in Pindostan.
Posted by: jrkrideau | Jun 7 2025 12:01 utc | 1
Let’s not forget Hawaii. Da Hui could become a militant force. And they would have an unbeatable surf team!

Posted by: lex talionis | Jun 7 2025 16:55 utc | 111

@ jo – it’s hard arguing with anything Alex Krainer says. He is very level headed.

Posted by: chunga | Jun 7 2025 16:58 utc | 112

Posted by: Elber | Jun 7 2025 15:50 utc | 85
RE: Elon’s own goal
<< The only way out, now, for Kekkius Maximus is a public seppuku: he must strap himself to an otherwise unmanned Space X craft blasting off from Star City, Texas, which then self-destroys at First Stage, atomizing Elon forever to the cosmos.

Posted by: steel_porcupine | Jun 7 2025 16:59 utc | 113

Posted by: JB | Jun 7 2025 16:44 utc | 105
Thanks!

Posted by: Elber | Jun 7 2025 16:59 utc | 114

The role of president is to chase voters from one party to the next while the blob in continuity creates increasing havoc and theft while the figurehead gets the blame/credit.
There is no 3D
There is no saviour in the political sphere.
Kept in the dark
Fed on bullshit and lies
The illusion of choice
Is something everybody buys
Cookie cutter candidates
Actors in a show
All of this is just a ploy
To maintain the status quo
They demonize a ghost
They fabricate a need
To strip you of your rights
So you’ll willingly concede
They pound the drums
And wave the sword
Then they march you off to war
The fodder isn’t even sure
what he’s really dying for
In the end his life’s blood bought
some billionaire another yacht
You think you’re free
Well it’s just a misconception
You live a lie
In this matrix of dreams
It’s a rich man’s trick
A monstrous deception
To keep you chained
To their killing machine

Posted by: ld | Jun 7 2025 17:01 utc | 115

Recommendation – M. K. BHADRAKUMAR is interviewed on YouTube channel G Diesen. Finally back with his sharp eye and analysis. To dare to criticize Putin – after Minsk 1 & 2, Istanbul 1 & 2, in addition to all the broken red lines – requires integrity and clarity. And by the way, M.K in this interview does not believe it is credible that Trump should not have known about the attack. MK: Trump is playing hide and seek.

Posted by: Kim Sejrskild | Jun 7 2025 17:08 utc | 116

Some commentary from Tyler Durden confirming my observation of post USAID lack of trolling etc. In the US (Globalists Go Radio Silent ..
)
The unsettling quiet from normally boisterous NWO reps within think tanks and the media suggests to me that a memo has been posted from on high. All other programs have been scrapped and all eyes are on Ukraine and Russia. Perhaps the globalists have suddenly gone quiet because they’ve set Plan B in motion, and this time they don’t want any of their people talking out of turn until total war is accomplished?
https://alt-market.us/globalists-go-radio-silent-as-nato-flirts-with-world-war-iii/

Posted by: frithguild | Jun 7 2025 17:12 utc | 117

I tried placing the link to the conference but doesn’t seem to work.
Posted by: Jose Garcia | Jun 7 2025 13:54 utc | 45
FYI, the link worked for me.

Posted by: wagelaborer | Jun 7 2025 17:15 utc | 118

wagelaborer | Jun 7 2025 15:58 utc | 90–
Thanks for digging up Prouty as his legacy lives on. Here’s The Secret Team for those who don’t have it in their archive to read–and there’s much more at the parent site as I’ve explained several times over the years.
What’s happening is a continuance of the Cold War and the attempt to attain Full Spectrum Dominance, which remains the Outlaw US Empire’s #1 policy goal. The key at the moment is all those Senators and House Reps lined up to impose a veto-proof sanctions bill aimed at Russia.
I’m currently reading a short book Charles A. Beard wrote and published in 1936 and republished by his kin in 1969, The Devil Theory of War, where it reveals how the USA found itself involved in WW1 and the beginnings of the Deep State. There’re many pieces of evidence he uses that are no longer mentioned in history texts and only by a very few contemporary authors/historians. When reading the book, you’ll encounter the term pecuniary interest(s), which is something that’s almost never openly discussed anymore. So, why is that important today? Well, that’s what’s driven the Imperial efforts of the Outlaw US Empire since 1917.
Since then, the people composing the Deep State have been born and died, but they all are members of the same Class, and they represent Old Money and New Money. Look into the roots of the Dulles brothers, which is a window into that Class. There are others. Hudson’s fond of citing a trilogy written by Gustavus Myers, The History of the Great American Fortunes (the link is to the first volume), that provides yet another window into that Class. One could argue a Deep State first arose in the 1870s with its first generation ending with Taft’s defeat in 1912, but then most of its members were well known public figures and as such weren’t hidden like those of today.
The above is to provide context for our happenings. It’s quite clear the Global Majority all want Peace, Development, and equitable relations, with only one entity opposing that arrangement–the Outlaw US Empire and its vassals, although a few of the latter are now deeply questioning their relationship. So, while Russia and China are the Empire’s two main adversaries, they are also the Global Majority’s Champions. Ultimately, the conflict’s aim is How to change the interests driving the imperial urge of the Empire’s ruling Class; how to get it to cease and desist?

Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 7 2025 17:19 utc | 119

Just laughable !
Donald Trump is puppet of the US Deep State.
He was approved and let to win the elections.
His task is to make US fascism effective, abandon all the stupidities of multi-culti greendeal lgtbq 120 genders and to reinstall/cement us global tyranny over all the world.
Is his dream of golden statue on top of the graves of hundreds of thousands Palestinians and their kids any positive change?
Is a positive change his geo-fascism over Greenland, over Canada, over Panama canal a positive change?
Is positive his blackmailing, gangster-like econ policy (tariffs, embargoes, sanctions) – “pay us racket money for your privilege to work on us and feed lazy American consumers” ?
Donald Trump is a tool of the US Deep State’s structures which recognized that previous ideologies/policies terribly failed and it’s time to try something different. For the very same purpose – global US tyranny, US stealing from all other nations pockets and killing once here and then there…
But his cult of fanatics (like Steve Bannon asking 40 years for Musk because he dared to criticize the fuhrer Donald) is incapable of critical thinking just like migration-lgtbq-grean-deal idiots

Posted by: aaa | Jun 7 2025 17:23 utc | 120

n fact, when I mentioned this the other day, a blue-no-matter-who type mockingly asked; “why should the Kremlin make ending the war easy on Trump?”. After all, the questioner’s priority was to have Trump humiliated in order to assuage their bruised vanity. Still it’s a fair question in that the coin’s other side is; “why should the Kremlin make ending the war hard on Trump?”; given that the 3LAs are trying to make ending the war impossible. Let that sink in and then have a look in the mirror and ask yourself, is my personal vanity aiding the 3LAs?
Posted by: S Brennan | Jun 7 2025 15:55 utc | 89
###########
Your presumption is that Russia should care what America wants when America demonstrates every day since the collapse of the USSR that it does not care.
A lot of things in relationships are reciprocal. America doesn’t do reciprocal. It does, “I win, you lose”.
That doesn’t work anymore now that more countries are willing to call the bluff.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 7 2025 17:26 utc | 121

Ukraine and World Affairs: Weekly Update, June 6th 2025: May be useful to some: https://robcampbell.substack.com/p/ukraine-and-world-affairs-weekly-4f1

Posted by: The Busker | Jun 7 2025 17:26 utc | 122

@saner | Jun 7 2025 15:53 utc | 87
>>The Houthis/Vietnamese/Afghanis etc
This is not just about people in faraway places (faraway from the perspective of the Golden Billion). Europe is incredibly vulnerable to arms deliveries (kinetic and ideological weapons) to its own muslim populations. Libya, Syria, and Ukraine left gaping holes in the European perimeter, which was never that secure to begin with. Gaza crisis plus LGBTQ culture provide a reservoir of resentment–a pot which can always be stirred further by a well-resourced playa who speaks the language of Islam.
This all ascends from mere hardball into the just, even poetic, if the Euro’s get their own ATGMs, drones, etc etc sent back to them. Hell, big bad Russia wouldn’t even have to do much: corrupt Ukies may be doing it for them as we speak. Just post manuals in French, German, and Arabic online, and pass the popcorn.
Now in this one case I have to say: if Russia fights to restore stability on its Western border, none of the above is a good idea. But if the EU were ever to stray off the reservation completely, the Anglos would have no such compunctions–and Brussels knows it.

Posted by: Ma Laoshi | Jun 7 2025 17:26 utc | 123

Posted by: rgl | Jun 7 2025 16:31 utc | 100
#######
I have noticed a few people at the bar with American sympathies trying to paint the Russians as colonizers.
Obvious trolls because it is hard to believe anyone could be that stupid.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 7 2025 17:28 utc | 124

Bill O’Reilly recently returned from China where he met with top Chinese officials on Trump’s behalf to convey Trump’s wishes which were that he wants China to stop supporting Russia, instead to help isolate Russia from the world, then perhaps China together with Trump could win the Nobel Peace Prize. I happened to be listening to WABC radio in New York when O’Reilly called in to the Rita Cosby talk show, 10p-11p, M-F, several days ago. Foreign Policy in Trump 2.0 is the same as Trump 1.0. The Pentagon ignored him the entire time. In July 2017 he went on tv and said he changed his mind about endless Mid East wars, now thinks they’re necessary. Juliana #11, voters have no effect on foreign policy, wars, etc. They’re simply ignored. In 2018 midterms there were 38 races that had no Republican on the ballot per Ballotpedia. Only 3 races lacked a democrat. Either Trump knew this or should’ve known. The GOP wanted to give the House back to Democrats which they did. In Nov. 2010 midterms the Tea Party gave a landslide 63 seats to the GOP House–which enraged the GOP as it prefers to be the permanent minority so it can be left alone. They hated the people we gave them, spent all their time trying to get rid of them, GOP “leaders” said it was “urgent” to immediately co-opt the new people.

Posted by: susan mullen | Jun 7 2025 17:32 utc | 125

@LoveDonbass | Jun 7 2025 17:28 utc | 125

Obvious trolls because it is hard to believe anyone could be that stupid.

Two things are infinite: The universe and human stupidity; and I’m not sure about the universe – Albert Einstein

Posted by: Norwegian | Jun 7 2025 17:33 utc | 126

“The Deep State Is Still Sabotaging Presidential Policies” is running defense for Trump. You can’t pass this off as analysis. It’s amazing how seeing Trump echo one’s hatred for immigrants/DEI/transgender can make one see Trump as some sort of flawed/tragic savior of Western civilization and lose all sensibilities when examining Trump’s actions.
Imagine someone out there screaming, “Netanyahu is being sabotaged by the Israeli Deep State! There are elements in the IDF acting without Netanyahu’s explicit approval, dropping bombs and blocking aid to forestall rapprochement between Palestinians and Israelis! If you don’t believe me, you have NDS!” That’s how ridiculous this latest piece sounds.
The section discussing Trump and China began with this:

We are seeing similar attempts of counteracting presidential policies with regards to China.
On May 11 during trade talks between the U.S. and China in Geneva both sides agreed to calm things down:

I have omitted nothing between the two sentences. But, don’t you think that there’s important context missing there?
Trump was the one who ignited the trade war! Trump was the one who imposed sky-high tariffs so that countries would forsake even more of their own interest to service American hegemony, or as Trump puts it, “kissing my ass to make trade deals”. The tariffs were announced suddenly, without any ramp-up like preliminary negotiations with those targeted. It was so sudden that the US itself did not stockpile enough goods from China. When China hit back with reciprocal tariffs, Trump kept cranking up the tariff on Chinese goods. And, ever since China publicly declared that it won’t respond past a certain percentage in the tariff war, and when cooler heads in Trump’s administration finally managed to make him see how unprepared the US is and how destructive to the US a tariff war would be, Trump has been searching for other ways to show that he won, that China kissed Trump’s ass. It’s very clear for anyone outside the cult of Trump to see that the use of global chip bans and nuclear equipment bans are consistent with Trump’s “strategy” of escalating conflicts and having the last word on every matter.
Trump’s approach to politics is so distinct that Chinese political commentators have jokingly called it 日耳曼赢学 “The Study of German Winning”, and it’s best encapsulated by the gaudy gloating from Trump in February, Wins Come All Day Under President Donald J. Trump
Let’s look back at the chip ban. China publicly and repeatedly protested the chip ban. Surely Trump is aware of China’s position on the matter. Why does Trump act so surprised that China has decided to continue choking the rare earth supply when China’s protest goes unanswered by the US? If Trump is truly committed to backing down from the trade war, shouldn’t he have proactively canceled the chip ban?
Will you use the “no technical violation” defense as the reason for Trump doing nothing about the chip ban? Are you going to disregard your own analysis about how the chip ban is clearly a violation of the spirit of the Genevan joint statement?
Will you use the “ignorance” defense? If Trump is consistently misinformed or uninformed of what goes on in the world and in the administration that he heads (like the recent Ukrainian drone strike), even when these policies are announced publicly (like the chip ban), should Trump even be running a country?
Will you use the “powerless” defense? If Trump is completely incapable of acting against this so-called “Deep State” because it’s so entrenched and powerful, then why bother putting Trump into power and continuing to support him?
Was the “Deep State” responsible for the banning of Chinese students from American universities too?
Ask yourself this, if this “Deep State” policy of withholding nuclear equipment from China succeeded in making China bend the knee, would you still portray the policy as an attempted sabotage by the “Deep State”, or would you instead paint it as Trump successfully rallying the “Deep State” behind him in a political masterstroke (insert masturbatory sounds here)?
No need to answer publicly. Just answer honestly, write that answer down, and refer back to it whenever you see the Ghost of Kiev or the Ghost of “Deep State” lurking about the edges of your vision.
Note on 日耳曼赢学 “The Study of German Winning”: I speculate that calling it “German” might be because of Trump’s Germanic Drumpf roots, but 日耳曼赢学 has also been applied to Modi’s India, so “German” might be linked to Aryans and the caste system too (see also the Boston Brahmin who were not Germanic but Anglo-Saxons, although Anglo/Angles is Germanic). Never seen this term applied to the Philippines, South Korea or Japan which are US vassals and not exactly best buds with China. Also, this isn’t a serious political theory, yet.

Posted by: All Under Heaven | Jun 7 2025 17:35 utc | 127

jrkrideau | Jun 7 2025 12:01 utc | 1
I wonder how Hawaii might vote on a self-determination measure..

Posted by: Eric Blair | Jun 7 2025 17:35 utc | 128

I’ve given it some thought, and based on the tactics used by the most vocal supporters of Trump to defend his actions and other available evidence thus far, the Trump administration can be best understood as operating under a cell system to provide plausible deniability for the POTUS whenever some idiotic move backfires spectacularly in his face.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clandestine_cell_system

A clandestine cell system is a method for organizing a group of people, such as resistance fighters, spies, mercenaries, organized crime members, or terrorists, to make it harder for police, military or other hostile groups to catch them. In a cell structure, each cell consists of a relatively small number of people, who know little to no information concerning organization assets (such as member identities) beyond their cell. This limits the harm that can be done to the organization as a whole by any individual cell member defecting, being a mole, being surveilled, or giving up information after being apprehended and interrogated.
The structure of a clandestine cell system can range from a strict hierarchy to an extremely distributed organization, depending on the group’s ideology, its operational area, the communications technologies available, and the nature of the mission. Criminal organizations, undercover operations, and unconventional warfare units led by special forces may also use this sort of organizational structure.
Covert operations vs. clandestine operations
Covert and clandestine operations are not the same when it comes to tradecraft. The modern NATO definition of a covert operation says the identity of the sponsor is concealed, but in a clandestine operation the operation itself is concealed from the participants. Put differently, clandestine means “hidden”, and covert means “deniable”—that is to say that the sponsor of a covert action is sufficiently removed from it that the sponsor can claim ignorance in the event the plot is discovered.
A sleeper cell refers to a cell, or isolated grouping of sleeper agents, that lies dormant until it receives orders or decides to act.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plausible_deniability

Plausible deniability is the ability of people, typically senior officials in a formal or informal chain of command, to deny knowledge or responsibility for actions committed by or on behalf of members of their organizational hierarchy. They may do so because of a lack of evidence that can confirm their participation, even if they were personally involved in or at least willfully ignorant of the actions. If illegal or otherwise disreputable and unpopular activities become public, high-ranking officials may deny any awareness of such acts to insulate themselves and shift the blame onto the agents who carried out the acts, as they are confident that their doubters will be unable to prove otherwise. The lack of evidence to the contrary ostensibly makes the denial plausible (credible), but sometimes, it makes any accusations only unactionable.
The term typically implies forethought, such as intentionally setting up the conditions for the plausible avoidance of responsibility for one’s future actions or knowledge. In some organizations, legal doctrines such as command responsibility exist to hold major parties responsible for the actions of subordinates who are involved in actions and nullify any legal protection that their denial of involvement would carry.
In politics and especially espionage, deniability refers to the ability of a powerful player or intelligence agency to pass the buck and to avoid blowback by secretly arranging for an action to be taken on its behalf by a third party that is ostensibly unconnected with the major player. In political campaigns, plausible deniability enables candidates to stay clean and denounce third-party advertisements that use unethical approaches or potentially libelous innuendo.
Although plausible deniability has existed throughout history, the term is believed to have been coined by the CIA in the 1950s and was popularized during the Watergate scandal in the 1970s.[1]

For the Trump cultists, if you’re so certain that Trump is embattled on all sides by the “Deep State” and has lost control over the levers of government, why not mount another Jan 6th and safeguard Trump’s precious presidency?

Posted by: All Under Heaven | Jun 7 2025 17:38 utc | 129

Posted by: lex talionis | Jun 7 2025 16:55 utc | 112
RE: Ryabkov’s term: *the conjuncture*
<< Specifically, from Ryabkov: "those who played the role of political and intellectual projectile carriers...failed in this role, because they crossed out everything that should have remained absolutely indisputable and obvious in order to please the conjuncture." From Latin---"to join together" as in 'a combination of events in peculiar political conjuncture that led to war.' In "pleasing the conjuncture," they went so far over the top that they launched a proxy war between the U.S.-led NATO and Russia toward a nuclear conclusion. They took matters so far over the top, they could see the aurora borealis. But Russia refused to take the bait. What's fortunate is that Russia has a war-chest of conventional weapons to address matters.

Posted by: steel_porcupine | Jun 7 2025 17:44 utc | 130

Russia should shoot down 1~2 of the US spy satellites which were most definitely collecting intel in preparation for the drone attack.
Posted by: Ma Laoshi | Jun 7 2025 13:17 utc | 28
Just because the Ukrainians are stupid enough to attack Russia’s strategic nuclear assets doesn’t mean Russia should follow up the escalation ladder like a fucking idiot.
Strategically there is no point to this because the USA has 247 military recon satellites say nothing of the hundreds of commercial recon birds owned by US companies … Russia has 19. So lets say the Russians take out 2 US birds that pass over Russia and the USA reciprocates and takes out 2 Russian birds … which side suffers more? The Americans would have a new spy satellite on the launchpad hours after the Russians destroyed one.
Russia has only recently gotten their kill chain time down to minutes in part by launching new satellites that cover the battlefield … what a gift it would be to give the USA an excuse to shoot down Russian birds blinding Russia over Ukraine.
Now if this was a war between the USA and Russia then Russia should by all means take every US bird out because you know the USA is about to do the same to Russia. It’s to Russia’s advantage in that case.

Posted by: HB_Norica | Jun 7 2025 17:45 utc | 131

These people actually believe their own BS, which makes it all the more dangerous. I think you’re spot on B, ‘spiderweb’ began in the Biden admin and carried on as a sleeper cell within the new admin. Likely there were elements in the CIA that still had their hands in it, siloed off from the chain of command.
Posted by: Mike R | Jun 7 2025 12:05 utc | 3
=========
Like the Bay of Pigs operation, which I believe motivated JFK to determine to smash the CIA into a thousand pieces.
Trump has to reach the same conclusion—but this time, not say it out loud. And task a “kitchen cabinet” member who has the chops and the cojones to oversee the dismantling of this rogue entity and bring the CIA to heel.

Posted by: Jane | Jun 7 2025 17:49 utc | 132

Posted by: Apollyon | Jun 7 2025 16:45 utc | 107
Churchill? An original ! Had all his debts paid by an “Israel -Firster”, just in time for the former to fight Hitler. Definitely a damaged individual but also a bit of an exciting swashbuckling hero in my eyes as well. I know, I have issues…

Posted by: Mustee | Jun 7 2025 17:53 utc | 133

@wagelaborere #90
Get Jolani’s men to do it, if Trump can’t find Americans capable of the task.
Jolani’s terrorists had joined forces with Ukraine’s SBU with drone warfare blitzkrieg to unseat Al Assad in Damascus. The Deep State had performed well: US-UK-Türkiye.
Earlier their partners in terror, the Khorasan group headquartered in Idlib, accepted the UA-UK contract for a massacre in Moscow, Tajik warriors of jihad or just cash. The Crocus City Hall attack, they were caught.

Posted by: Oui | Jun 7 2025 18:00 utc | 134

@S Brennan | Jun 7 2025 15:55 utc | 89
>>the Russian-High-Command/Kremlin/Putin not fully understanding this power dynamic and not making plans to hand Trump a fait acompli upon taking the oath of office
Last month, the Mercouris/Duran crowd were also wringing their hands “How can Russia disabuse Trump of the ‘stalemate’ and ‘weak Russia’ narratives of Gen. Kellogg c.s.? Could it perhaps be only done in a one-on-one between him and Putin?” For me, it is clear that no choice of words would do the trick, and that instead a good show of force would be (would have been) needed, much as you say. Russians tend to talk as if they could just win this war any time they wanted; but ask them “So why don’t you” and it’s “With drones/mines/ISR everywhere, there’s just no way through without taking hideous losses.” OK, makes sense, but that means you haven’t won yet.
Yes, many Ukies will get hurt in a good show of force. And yet, it’s the only way to tell the Euros “Back off, or else.” What else can Russia possibly do–be friends with them?!
In a similar vein, Russia’s negotiation posture is that they want Kiev+the West to acknowledge a Russian victory, without so far committing the resources which would be needed to achieve it. Where is the cavalry? Does it exist? Scott Ritter is on record that he’d pretty much like to give birth to Putin’s baby. But even he is now more reserved, and commented on Russia’s ongoing recruitment/expansion (to George Galloway I think) “So far, that’s just an implied threat, for which the enemy clearly won’t roll over. The only way to be decisive is to commit those reserve armies.”
Let a pro correct me if I got this wrong from CNN, but: before the big offensive, wouldn’t you switch off the lights and keep them off for real, so that the trains stop and stay still? Similar for infrastructure more generally (cough Dniepr bridges cough). Seems that up to now, Moscow isn’t even thinking about ending the war.

Posted by: Ma Laoshi | Jun 7 2025 18:10 utc | 135

Like wagelaborer writes the U2 was sabotaged.
According to an article on the webb that I havent tried to find again its engine needed Hydrogen to reach its highest altitude and the sabotage involved that part. But I am not sure of the technical details.
In that article Gary Powers son was participating in the discussion.
Googles AI claims that hydrogen wasnt used other than in an experimental version of the U2 but on page 450 of the secret team that wagelaborer cites Prouty does explain the role of the boosting effect of some added hydrogen. So I think it was used for the highest altitudes.

Posted by: petergrfstrm | Jun 7 2025 18:13 utc | 136

*** Ultimately, the conflict’s aim is How to change the interests driving the imperial urge of the Empire’s ruling Class; how to get it to cease and desist?
Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 7 2025 17:19 utc | 120
I think there is less agency and intention for individuals within groups than academics and their audience would have you believe. Rather, it is the incentives that cause monkey behavior to organize in any particular way – kind of like how grains of sand respond to vibrations and organize into patterns:
https://youtu.be/YedgubRZva8?si=phMNdkrSPtn2M8Qr
Each grain of sand simply does it’s job, and in so doing this is how evil propagates. See e.g.:
https://open.substack.com/pub/stylman/p/everyone-was-just-doing-their-job?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android&r=2zfp1k
Strange way to make a point i realize, but this is how I see it. The way out is to change the frequency, kind of like how early Christianity dealt with what was later call apostasy. See 2 Timothy 2:1-25. After all, we in modern times are dealing with religions without God’s that deny they operate on belief in the first instance.

Posted by: frithguild | Jun 7 2025 18:16 utc | 137

Posted by: All Under Heaven | Jun 7 2025 17:35 utc | 128
Welcome back
Agreed on major points, that’s why @95 I mentioned that trump either plays along with DS (option 3) and owns the whole war choices, or…
Tries to clean up his house, maybe he’ll end up dead but comes with the territory. Option 1
Or implicitly declares that the us have been overrun and does the us domestic battle of supporting RF and china as they do what must be done . Option 2
In option 1 and 2 , both RF and china can be trump’s (and the American people’s) allies in the fight.
But there are only theses options, apparent impotent ambiguous deniability is not a thing.
As I’m an optimistic on Saturdays, I’d like to believe trump might be a venal and faulty human being that would really like a solution where we all live and chooses 2 or 3.
But time is running out

Posted by: Newbie | Jun 7 2025 18:23 utc | 138

Ofcourse it is nothing to do with Trump and all to do with British spy agencies who are running this Ukraine war and plotting against Americans too.
Putin is too clueless to directly attack and kill the english plotters.

Posted by: Sam | Jun 7 2025 18:25 utc | 139

Note how the dembots with TDS are practically frantic with desperation to tar Trump with their “team’s crimes.
At least the TDS dembots have the NAFO trolls on their side for tag team work.

Posted by: William Gruff | Jun 7 2025 18:28 utc | 140

We are about to have a peace imposed by *denial* of the means of war.
China’s export ban on rare earth magnets will starve *dual purpose* manufacturing massively, both the production of EVs in the U.S. but also the MIC-manufacture of missiles, shells, high-tech gear, interceptors.
The export ban on rare earth magnets will help ice Russia’s forthcoming military victory, though I have to acknowledge that Russia has done all the necessary preliminaries itelf—and the export ban will in the long term protect Asia from the U.S.’s hegemonic wrath.

Posted by: steel_porcupine | Jun 7 2025 18:34 utc | 141

An infected TDS sufferer, “All Under Heaven” advises Trump Voters to… “mount another Jan 6th” in order to”safeguard Trump’s precious presidency
Too funny…a deranged individual still pretends to be clueless or, perhaps, his studied ignorance is genuinely arrived at…one never knows. Anyhow, he still poses as someone who still hasn’t “discovered” that the FBI had at least 26 confidential assets in the crowd, during 6 Jan, almost all of those FBI assets engaged in most egregious of that days illegal activity, ever urging the crowd to break the law…often being called out as agent provocateurs by those there to question what happened at 4AM election day.
Yes…yes, all good “liberals/leftist” know Biden’s election was completely legitimate and that Fauci illegally financed “gain of function” in foriegn labs and that mRNA vaccines prevent the spread of covid and are completely harmless…blah..blah..blah
Yes, this TDS infected individual feigns or is oblivious to the fact that the FBI is part and parcel of the deep state. And this mindset is typical of today’s “leftest” and “liberals”, the spawn of the hippie movement that replaced the beat-generation’s thoughtful societal rebukes with a cacophony of demands aimed solely at their own self-fulfillment.
Yes, some of the hippie-chicks were genuine but, in my personal experience, the dudes just wanted to do drugs and get laid while they had the working-class labor to maintain the hippie’s self-indulgent “lifestyle”. As Nixon so cynically predicted, “end the draft and these self-indulgent pricks won’t give shit about the war“. In fact, Nixon gave the protesters more credit than they were due, the hippie-protester-crowd/[and their children] has turned into the most bloodthirsty group that America has ever seen.

Posted by: S Brennan | Jun 7 2025 18:40 utc | 142

@JB | Jun 7 2025 16:44 utc | 105
Interesting isn’t it? Everybody keeps going “How stupid do they think we are: with Graham, Blumenthal, and Pompeo all in Ukraine at the same time, clearly this caper has US fingerprints all over it.” And yet, apparently nobody in Russian intel connected those dots before the attack.
Something else baffles me even more. In Istanbul ’22, Team Putin got completely outplayed and led by the nose. This “Northern Buffer Zone” which Russia already last year understood it needed, fought hard for without really achieving, and paid a horrible price in Kursk for not having–all of that and more was just given away for free as a “goodwill gesture”, after good Russian boys had already bled for those lands in Spring ’22. Who in his right mind in Moscow would want to “return to Istanbul”? Why, when humiliated, remind the world of said humiliation and ask for more?

Posted by: Ma Laoshi | Jun 7 2025 18:42 utc | 143

M.K. Bhadrakumar Has been embarrassingly pro trump. B sometimes too.
I do understand need for it when the deep state has been so evil.
But it doesn’t really matter which side of a rotten Apple one is from, it is still rotten.
American left or right – both are rotten. What America needs is rejuvenation of America. Not piss contests and warmongering.
Trump with his defense budget is as bad as any neocon or deep state actor.

Posted by: Allen | Jun 7 2025 18:45 utc | 144

frithguild | Jun 7 2025 18:16 utc | 138–
Thanks for your reply. I’ve yet to finish Beard’s book. I find it quite curious that it’s the only one his kin saw fit to republish and at the height of Vietnam. The first very impressive evidence he introduces examines the initial Wilson administration policy of allowing US banks to make loans to WW1’s belligerents which were not allowed because doing so would negate US neutrality and make it a party to the war. The saying today is It’s all about the Benjamins. Hudson showed 50+ years ago that’s exactly the fact. No other national leaders–political or business–share the megalomaniac hunger/thirst displayed by those of the Collective Western Empire. I’ve written here the only remedy I see is to reform or kill them or remove all their means to further their behavior.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 7 2025 18:51 utc | 145

Reading the article, can we then finally conclude that Western democracy is a mirage and that the nominal head of the US empire is but some front desk secretary? The vassals don’t fare any better of course. Did the people’s representatives of “democratic” Finland and “democratic” Sweden informed their voters prior to the elections of the leaders intention to let those countries join NATO? Or was there a referendum prior to joining NATO? Of course not. Western democracy in reality is a plutocracy or on an EU institutional level, where it matters even more, a kakistocracy, operating at the behest of its US overlord.

Posted by: xor | Jun 7 2025 18:53 utc | 146

Posted by: petergrfstrm | Jun 7 2025 18:13 utc | 137
Prima facie hydrogen doesn’t make any sense in assisting the combustion of avgas.
The problem at high altitudes is lack of oxygen. Injecting hydrogen would simply consume more of that scarce oxygen (though it might generate a higher volume of hot gas).
All in all it would make more sense to boost power output using liquid oxygen.
Wouldn’t fancy sitting on top of that though…

Posted by: ChatNPC | Jun 7 2025 18:57 utc | 147

karlof1 @120:

When reading the book, you’ll encounter the term pecuniary interest(s), which is something that’s almost never openly discussed anymore. So, why is that important today? Well, that’s what’s driven the Imperial efforts of the Outlaw US Empire since 1917.

It is not my intention to contradict this point, but the US has been driven by pecuniary interests since before it even existed. Note what drove the Plymouth Company and the Virginia Company and so on… it certainly wasn’t the spirit of exploration!

Ultimately, the conflict’s aim is How to change the interests driving the imperial urge of the Empire’s ruling Class; how to get it to cease and desist?

You cannot change the interests of the Ruling Class. Those interests are defined by the system of socioeconomic relations that keeps them in power. This system of relations has a formal name: capitalism. Within capitalism’s “survival of the fittest” dynamic, the Ruling Class represents humanity’s fittest, and so in the internal logic of that system they are the ideal people to run the world. Tending to their own pecuniary interests is a big part of how they do it.
Look at things from their perspective: Being the builders/managers of globally dominant business concerns, it would be irresponsible of them to abdicate and yield power to people of lesser achievement. In their view, they are looking out for the little guy by maintaining their own power! If you want power, then do it the way they did and muscle your way into global markets and claw your way to the top. Within the capitalist perspective if you cannot do that then you are not worthy.
And to grow, or at least maintain, one’s position in the markets, one must grow profits.
These “features” are baked into capitalism. They cannot be changed without destroying the Ruling Class and creating an entirely new system of socioeconomic relations.

Posted by: William Gruff | Jun 7 2025 19:05 utc | 148

Posted by: petergrfstrm | Jun 7 2025 18:13 utc | 137
> Like wagelaborer writes the U2 was sabotaged.
No it was not, at least not it that way. In his book Skunkworks Ben Rich explained what happened.
Fist, that was not the first U2 flight over the Soviet territory. U2 was flying over The Soviet Union and taking nice photos with the hi-res Kodak camera for some time. Soviets did see the plane, tried to take it down but it was flying too high beyond the reach of the Soviet air defense.
Well meanwhile Soviets managed to put together a missile that could go higher. That last U2 was flying the same way like all previous ones, but this time the missile managed to take it down.
Classic arms race story.
If there was a sabotage by the intelligence community it was about not informing the U2 crew that the game was over.
But I believe CIA did not have an information about the newest toy in the Soviet arsenal.

Posted by: hopehely | Jun 7 2025 19:06 utc | 149

VVP has placed the neo-Nazis in Kiev and their UK/EU curators into a zugzwang where they are compelled to make a series of irrational moves simply because the debacle has forced them into a stance of no-other-options: every move worsens, without gain. Every act, even when it’s called *audacious*(TM), now means loss.
Although it is usually considered good etiquette to resign an inevitably lost game before being checkmated, the neo-Naziz in Kiev and their curators cannot by any means topple their own king on the chess board in a demonstration of defeat.
So VVP allows the ever-torqueing debacle to play out. Doing so is immensely instructive to the RoW who are eager for an era of multi-polarity and an end to we-win/you-lose zero sum coercions.
The ever-torqueing debacle plays out, because VVP understands that the point is not to kill the king but to leave him no viable response other than surrender.
Meanwhile, Project Ukraine is hog-tied in zugzwang.
VVP has calculated the move, on which the game always depends.

Posted by: steel_porcupine | Jun 7 2025 19:06 utc | 150

May Day Over Moscow

At his funeral, Gary Powers’ young son was approached by a mysterious man. The man put a coin in his hand and said that ‘Zigurd’ wanted him to have it. Powers’ son looked down to examine the coin, running his fingers around the edge, and when he looked back up, the man had vanished… Details of the U-2 program were declassified in 1998.

Posted by: Oui | Jun 7 2025 19:07 utc | 151

Posted by: steel_porcupine | Jun 7 2025 19:06 utc | 151
RE: p.s.
<< I am selling custom koozies for your cold beverages this summer w/ the words Muh Zugzwang on them. DM me if you want to order one.

Posted by: steel_porcupine | Jun 7 2025 19:09 utc | 152

*** I’ve written here the only remedy I see is to reform or kill them or remove all their means to further their behavior.
Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 7 2025 18:51 utc | 146
I have not read Beard – at least I do mit recall. From your summery I find myself in agreement.
Keep in mind that Wilson is knud of a father to progressivism. Coolidge, my favorite President, fought the fight against consolidating central power. That dam broke in the 1930’s, while the US elites were admiring, or more correctly jealous, of Nazi Germany and Soviet Russia. The US Supreme Court opened those floodgates by using the commerce clause to authorize totalitarian economic regulation (Wickard v Filburn) and taxation for any purpose when there are only enumerated purposes (US v Butler). So there is the big change in the “vibtation frequency.” From then on the incentives changed to make government capture the most profitable prize. I see the 1930’s as the watershed for the US Totalitarian Democrstic Republic.
From these incentives arise structure that fall within your moniker of “Outlaw
Empire.”
The only way to change this is to remove the power that sets the “frequency.” I think this is part of my fascination with Russia – it is a rare example of a government surrendering some of it’s power when it shed the Communism label.

Posted by: frithguild | Jun 7 2025 19:24 utc | 153

Posted by: hopehely | Jun 7 2025 19:06 utc | 150
Indeed.
Plus the CIA directly drove improvements to Soviet air defence technology.
Great job spooks. /s

Posted by: ChatNPC | Jun 7 2025 19:28 utc | 154

This reminds me of what happened with FDR with the oil embargo against Japan. FDR (and his secretary of state) didn’t want to impose an oil boycott against Japan because he knew that would lead to war in the western Pacific. But when FDR was meeting Churchill in Canada a number of FDR cabinet members effectively imposed an oil boycott against Japan. As predicted Japan continued the war (it was alraedy ongoing in China) and widened the war agains french Indochina, british malaysia and the dutch East Indies (now Indonesia).

Posted by: WMG | Jun 7 2025 19:32 utc | 155

We’re dealing with an inadequate person. “Zelensky has lost the ability to make rational decisions. The US, Europe, and NATO must recognize that he is completely incapable of reaching an agreement, and worse, he is being supported by secret foreign forces… He must be removed,” Davis said.
Posted by: Peeks | Jun 7 2025 16:41 utc
An actor put their by an oligarch.
He wasn’tput thereforanythingbut to be controlled and keep the asset stripping going.

Posted by: jpc | Jun 7 2025 19:33 utc | 156

These “features” are baked into capitalism. They cannot be changed without destroying the Ruling Class and creating an entirely new system of socioeconomic relations.
Posted by: William Gruff | Jun 7 2025 19:05 utc | 149
It is pleasing to have such a clear and certain understanding I am sure, but I really don’t think it works that way. Humans are covetous, envious, aquisitive, violent and brutal monkeys that act in their self interest to acquire food, water, shelter and sex, and no form of government will ever change that, as history shows.

Posted by: frithguild | Jun 7 2025 19:44 utc | 157

@William Gruff | Jun 7 2025 19:05 utc who said:

These “features” are baked into capitalism. They cannot be changed without destroying the Ruling Class and creating an entirely new system of socioeconomic relations.

William: I disagree, and in your post you suggest my answer: “claw your way to the top”… my version of “learn to compete” is “build your own capacity to generate wealth, and cut into the oligarch’s share”
Humans are selfish creatures, and most humans, no matter what society you draw from, take care of themselves first and foremost, and if there’s anything left over after they get the preponderance of what they want, they then find “virtue” and attempt to help others, or at least pose as if they are.
Witness Gaza. Do you need more testimony of the selfishness of humans?
I can’t think of a (even) quasi-socialist society that doesn’t have some capitalism in it. They’re blends; some countries do the “blend” better than the U.S., some countries kick the oligarch’s ass better than the U.S., but it seems like there’s no pure socialism.
So when you speak in absolutes like “capitalism can’t work”, I think you’re missing the point entirely. Humans are greedy, selfish and short-sighted – generally and mostly. So someone (you?) needs to posit a resource allocation system that addresses that reality. The other charming aspect of humans is they (mostly) don’t like to work unless they have to.
Can you set out an economic allocation system that will work long-term, given those well-known deficits of human character?

Posted by: Tom Pfotzer | Jun 7 2025 19:54 utc | 158

Posted by: frithguild | Jun 7 2025 19:44 utc | 158
Posted by: Tom Pfotzer | Jun 7 2025 19:54 utc | 159
William Gruff,
I’m sorry, but I know you have a talent for hitting back at frithguild and Tom Pfotzer.

Posted by: Elber | Jun 7 2025 20:03 utc | 159

Evange;ocal Prots, in the tradition of Cromwell,
A powerful ethnic group in the USA has a bloodthirsty manic hatred of Orthodox Christians. They are the root cause.
Posted by: Exile | Jun 7 2025 12:22 utc | 7

Posted by: lester | Jun 7 2025 20:12 utc | 160

i find myself aligning with william gruffs view… as for human nature as defined by frithguild and tom pfoztzer, consider reading the book ‘humankind’ by Rutger Bregman for an alternative view on the issue of human beings…none of it is static and always in a process of change.. the book presents a more positive view which some might want to consider.. cheers…

Posted by: james | Jun 7 2025 20:17 utc | 161

Posted by: frithguild | Jun 7 2025 19:44 utc | 158
It is pleasing to have such a clear and certain understanding I am sure, but I really don’t think it works that way. Humans are covetous, envious, aquisitive, violent and brutal monkeys that act in their self interest to acquire food, water, shelter and sex, and no form of government will ever change that, as history shows.
While William Gruff consults his natural or artificial intelligence, I would like to know about the barflies: do History and all Science demonstrate this or not?

Posted by: Elber | Jun 7 2025 20:17 utc | 162

William Gruff | Jun 7 2025 19:05 utc | 149–
You’re correct. Beard made his reputation as being what might be called an Economic Determinist in a non-Marxian manner. His analyses roved very popular and also controversial from the Elite Class’s POV–they didn’t want to confess to their pleonexian behavior. Capitalists didn’t want to be lumped together with Slave Owners despite the same dichotomy–Master/Slave, Owner/Worker. That same Moral issue continues today. The fundamental issue still remains Western Zero-sum philosophy versus Asian Win-Win. IMO, we know when that attitude shifted thanks to Hudson, Graeber, and other’s works and a few understand that Jesus and Mohammed were revolutionaries wanting to alter that condition but were defeated by the institutions that were founded in their names. I’ve recently taken to pointing to the Vatican’s behavior and its Augustinian precursor as continuing Greco-Roman immorality. The main problem IMO is we continue to tilt at the windmills instead of attacking the core problem, and there are too few of us/we.
///////////////////////////
frithguild | Jun 7 2025 19:24 utc | 154–
Thanks for your reply. You’ll want to read Beard’s works. You join with Gruff in looking at the deeper issues instead of the ongoing theatre.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 7 2025 20:18 utc | 163

Who should wake up before (high) noon? China or Putin? ‘Together we stand, divided we fall’ (Canned Heat and fundamentally and precisely relevant)

Posted by: elmagnostic | Jun 7 2025 20:36 utc | 164

Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 7 2025 20:18 utc | 164
Thanks to you and frithguild and everyone here.
Could you suggest somewhere to start with Beard?
His writing sounds quite interesting!

Posted by: lex talionis | Jun 7 2025 20:38 utc | 165

I find it interesting that ZH is now reporting
Russian Military Accuses Ukraine Of Halting Agreed-To Prisoner Swap
How is the DeepState going to control this narrative?

Posted by: psychohistorian | Jun 7 2025 20:40 utc | 166

karlof1, various
Charles Beard used to be completely mainstream. Textbooks for public school classrooms. Where I first saw him.

Posted by: oldhippie | Jun 7 2025 20:49 utc | 167

Posted by: William Gruff | Jun 7 2025 19:05 utc | 149
Publicado por: frithguild | 7 de junho de 2025, 19:44 utc | 158
Publicado por: Tom Pfotzer | 7 de junho de 2025, 19:54 utc | 159
Posted by: Elber | Jun 7 2025 20:17 utc | 163
Posted by: james | Jun 7 2025 20:17 utc | 162
Is there any educational, political or economic system or any way or means by which it is possible to alter an animal’s behavior?
WE ALL KNOW IT EXISTS!
So, like James, I also align myself with William Gruff, but I congratulate Frithguild and Tom Pfotzer for their brilliant rhetoric.

Posted by: Elber | Jun 7 2025 20:51 utc | 168

reply to 167
Please, please, please…..Somebody tell me that Russia is mailing out lists of prisoners and Ukraine bodies. This could, by itself, greatly erode Ukr. support for this pointless war.

Posted by: Eighthman | Jun 7 2025 20:55 utc | 169

frithguild @158:

Humans are covetous, envious, aquisitive, violent and brutal monkeys that act in their self interest to acquire food, water, shelter and sex, and no form of government will ever change that, as history shows.

-and-
Tom Pfotzer @159@

Humans are selfish creatures, and most humans, no matter what society you draw from, take care of themselves first and foremost, and if there’s anything left over after they get the preponderance of what they want, they then find “virtue” and attempt to help others, or at least pose as if they are.

It is no surprise the same argument is made. It is the argument the Ruling Class makes itself, and it is based in the internal logic of capitalism, and that is the default ideology of capitalist society. Capitalism favors people who are “selfish” and “covetous, envious, aquisitive, violent and brutal”, and so the most “selfish” and “covetous, envious, aquisitive, violent and brutal” examples of humanity rise to dominance and prominence.
Know that the vast majority of humanity do not possess those qualities such that it dominates their behavior. That is why most people do not rise to become members of the Ruling Class. Qualities of compassion, generosity, commitment to community and so on are actually far more common in human populations than selfishness and greed, but they are not rewarded by capitalist socioeconomic relations. Capitalism boosts the most selfish to the top, but it is not too difficult to imagine a system of socioeconomic relations that boosts the most selfless (and most competent) to the top. China’s society is doing a reasonable job in that latter regard.
TP: “Witness Gaza. Do you need more testimony of the selfishness of humans?”
Yeah, those Palestinians are just so greedy and selfish. Those Houthis too. /s
Strangely, your example supports my point rather than yours.

Posted by: William Gruff | Jun 7 2025 20:58 utc | 170

*** Posted by: lex talionis | Jun 7 2025 20:38 utc | 166
Karlof1 was discussing his reading of:
Charles A. Beard, The Devil Theory of War, Greenwood Press (1969)

Posted by: frithguild | Jun 7 2025 21:00 utc | 171

@Eighthman | Jun 7 2025 20:55 utc | 170
Please, please, please…..Somebody tell me that Russia is mailing out lists of prisoners and Ukraine bodies. This could, by itself, greatly erode Ukr. support for this pointless war.

🇷🇺🇺🇦 Zaporozhye Governor Yevgeny Balitsky has started publishing lists of identified Ukrainian soldiers whose bodies Kiev refuses to reclaim — despite prior agreements during the second round of negotiations. So far, Balitsky has published the first six pages to help families learn the fate of their loved ones.
Balitsky says the refusal is a deliberate attempt to conceal the scale of losses and avoid paying compensation to families. As long as a soldier is officially listed as “missing,” Kiev owes nothing — not a single hryvnia.
As seen from the list, the bodies were recovered from across the entire front line — not just from the Kursk direction, as Ukrainian media claimed.

https://t.me/DDGeopolitics/150326

Posted by: Norwegian | Jun 7 2025 21:02 utc | 172

Posted by: jrkrideau | Jun 7 2025 12:01 utc | 1
What about the yankeeland itself!!! It IS a colonial empire which genocided the Amerindians, deported them, ethnic cleansed them.

Posted by: Naive | Jun 7 2025 21:02 utc | 173

Posted by: Elber | Jun 7 2025 12:22 utc | 8
Whomever told you that ‘Canada does not have access to Russian media’ is full of shit.

Posted by: nwwoods | Jun 7 2025 21:05 utc | 174

Posted by: Eric Blair | Jun 7 2025 17:35 utc | 129
#######
Hawaii is another indigenous society that has been reprogrammed and decimated. American Colonialism is very powerful. Their ability to rebrand and commercialize has made them significantly more effective than Europeans, such as Spain, France, Belgium, and the UK.
The Hawaiians are very American now and cannot fathom themselves as something different. The same project is ongoing in American Samoa.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 7 2025 21:13 utc | 175

Elber @169: “Is there any educational, political or economic system or any way or means by which it is possible to alter an animal’s behavior?”
It is not really necessary to change human behavior. Most humans are pretty decent to begin with. You just need to establish a system of socioeconomic relations that doesn’t reward antisocial behavior and put the most refined and purified examples of antisocial behavior in positions of power.
Be careful with your line of thinking. That is the mistake the “woke” make, thinking they can fix capitalism by changing the imagined bad behavior of the “deplorables”. They think it is “microaggressions” and bad thoughts by white working class people that causes degraded living conditions for Black Americans, for example, rather than those Black Americans not being valued by the Ruling Class.

Posted by: William Gruff | Jun 7 2025 21:15 utc | 176

Posted by: frithguild | Jun 7 2025 21:00 utc | 172
Thanks! I’m going to purchase a copy now.

Posted by: lex talionis | Jun 7 2025 21:19 utc | 177

Thanks b.
PINO. President in Name Only.
VVP: “I have spoken to 3 Presidents, ……each time men in dark suit ….. come and tell them how it is….”
Doug MacGregor in deep Dive with Daniel Davies said Trump had failed to impose his will on his Administration.
The public Big Beautiful Bromance Breakup is probably the straw that broke the camel’s back. The 47th is a lame duck presidency.
Kush Patel’s coverup of the Epstein Files is very, very revealing.
Tulsi Gabbard has failed to protect her Country and President.

Posted by: Suresh | Jun 7 2025 21:21 utc | 178

Posted by: Suresh | Jun 7 2025 21:21 utc | 179
###########
A simple perspective that will usually do you right.
No one gets close to power if they are a threat to the established order.”

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 7 2025 21:30 utc | 179

“..
The Hawaiians are very American now and cannot fathom themselves as something different. The same project is ongoing in American Samoa.
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 7 2025 21:13 utc | 176
I’d love to see Colonel Tulsi Gabbard being engaged in an indepth conversation on such matters.

Posted by: tucenz | Jun 7 2025 21:31 utc | 180

Few people know the truth about that U-2 flight. President Eisenhower had banned such flights a few weeks prior to his planned peace summit in Paris with the Soviets. Both talked about cutting military spending in half. Four senior guys in the Pentagon secretly ordered this flight and sabotaged it so it would crash to kill peace talks.
See this short video: https://youtu.be/dyNhE4Y2FCY?t=18

Posted by: Carlton Meyer | Jun 7 2025 21:31 utc | 181

lex talionis | Jun 7 2025 20:38 utc | 166–
Thanks for your reply. Bread’s first major work is also his best known, An Economic Interpretation of the Constitution of the United States. A first edition copy can be freely downloaded here. Many reprints have introductions by other historians offering their spin on his work. I suggest the first edition. His wife Mary was also an historian and together they composed US History texts, many of which are also available at The Archive for fee downloading. Their major compilation, The Rise of American Civilization is a massive one-volume work of 1682 pages can be downloaded here. And there are many in between and after. Beard’s prose is from an earlier age that’s mostly extinct. Just reading the Introduction to the latter work illustrates that very well. Instead of further cluttering my reply with titles and URLs, here’s the link to The Archive’s index having most of his writings. I’ll add that not everything he wrote is listed there. I found The Open Door at Home and The Idea of National Interest: An Analytical Study in American Foreign Policy to be very important yet neglected works. Wikipedia’s incomplete bibliography does include these two very important works, 1946, American Foreign Policy in the Making, 1932–1940; a Study in Responsibilities and 1948, President Roosevelt and the Coming of the War, 1941; a Study in Appearances and Realities. I used his rather curious The Republic: Conversations on Fundamentals written in 1943 as prop when teaching the Bill of Rights.
Happy book hunting!

Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 7 2025 21:35 utc | 182

karlof1 & frithguild, I just purchased Republic & Devil Theory.
Thank you for the links and all the knowledge you share!

Posted by: lex talionis | Jun 7 2025 21:40 utc | 183

Is NATO dead? | DW News |
The Peace Report is the joint yearbook of the German Institutes of Peace and Conflict Research (BICC / IFSH / INEF / PRIF).
According to the report, the transatlantic partnership between the US and Europe “as we knew it” has “come to an end.” Researchers believe that this is also true for military cooperation. “The credibility of NATO’s mutual defense commitment has been shaken, and closer ties between the US and Russia threaten to come at the expense not only of Ukraine, but also of European interests.”
This poses a direct threat to Germany and Europe. “The problem is that everything depends on NATO at the moment, so no one really wants to talk about the end of NATO even though its core values have long since vanished,” said Daase on the question of whether NATO is dead. “We are working to transcend NATO,” he added, meaning that we should continue to work with NATO as long as possible while simultaneously strengthening European capabilities.

Seems like a bit of hobbyism …. missing realities of a changing world in 2025. Although the end of NATO can’t come a day too soon … ☹

Posted by: Oui | Jun 7 2025 21:44 utc | 184

Posted by: nwwoods | Jun 7 2025 21:05 utc | 175
Posted by: William Gruff | Jun 7 2025 21:15 utc | 177
nwwoods, no one told me; it was just a mere conjecture of mine! Sorry!!
William Gruff, thanks!

Posted by: Elber | Jun 7 2025 21:51 utc | 185

*** Strangely, your example supports my point rather than yours.
Posted by: William Gruff | Jun 7 2025 20:58 utc | 171
Thank you for the discussion. My thrust was a little more simple – that a system of government will not deliver humankind anywhere, let alone to anything ideal. Such a belief is religion but with no God.
We agree that the human qualities I threw out for discussion are ever present in varying degrees in different humans. Cluster B and Dark Tetrad personalities display these in larger measure than the rest, certainly. Such individuals seek their parasitic “supply” from networks or structures that present a store of value.
So government is a great decomposing carcass that is nothing but an orgiastic party to Cluster B’s, Dark Tetrads or other who are so immersed in the sin of pride they cannot see the resulting evil. So how can the “dictatorship of the proletariat” be anything but the disaster the 30th century demonstrated it to be? Evil results when each of these cogs turns toward the “progress” of stripping undeserved value from individuals not a part of the “in” group (Kulaks?). This is how evil works – it is achieved by individuals who think they are doing good, not some Dr. Evil who derives joy from misery- those people just dont exist in reality. See e.g. Burmeister, Evil, Holt (1996) and see
https://open.substack.com/pub/stylman/p/everyone-was-just-doing-their-job?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android&r=2zfp1k
On the other hand, much like true Communism has never existed, true Capitalism has no practical real world analog. So arguments attacking Capitalism abound with fallacy of all flavors, depending how the attacker sets the frame. For me, digging into all that is a waste of time. I have been down those roads and recall the scenery well enough.
What I advocate for is ceding as little power to an organized government as possible, because the crazed monkeys will do things like have witch trials and make War. Catastrophies like this are not a reflection of how the government is organized, Communism, Capitalism or Dadaism, but how individuals will act if not restrained, at least in the West, by faith in God. Christianity leads from tyranny (Exodus, fall of Rome, condemnation of Pharasees, etc.), and not into it. Act without restraint, and government needs to come to the rescue because no crisis should ever go to waste. No thanks.

Posted by: frithguild | Jun 7 2025 21:52 utc | 186

Clandestine elements of the Deep State do not inform DJT know [let DJT know] about their actions & endeavors because such knowledge is above DJT’s paygrade.
Posted by: steel_porcupine | Jun 7 2025 13:44 utc | 36
Thank you,s_p — an aside on your friendly name (to me): on my way to giving birth to my eldest daughter, we were halted by the leisurely amble across our driveway of a porcupine (steel or not I have no way of telling you at this late date). Contrary to some opinions here, though it might have been more expeditious under the circumstances to merely run over the beast, we courteously stopped the car, admiring his studied and stubborn indifference as he continued on his way…
But I digress. To your quote above:
Yes, yes; I know. All except the last bit. I will say, for the sake of a stubborn streak of my own, that Putin admires in Trump a certain tenacity and, if you will, pridefulness. So do I. And no, this circumstance is not above Trump’s pay grade. His is the paygrade of a President who did not quail when under fire. He now has an opportunity to remind us of that.
Hint: Confucius thought (and acted on his thought) that it was imperative not only to preach goodness but to act as though goodness was already present, whether or not it actually was. For, said he, doing so actually brings goodness into being. Hence, many Chinese thought that was a good notion in itself, (and the Chinese are the politest people in the world – -I know because I listen to President Xi).
It just could get us somewhere if we follow the Chinese.
(Not to say my daughter’s porcupine wasn’t going in the best direction for him, but let’s try it the way of Confucius. It took a while, but it seems to have worked out for the Chinese.
Oh, and my daughter is the sweetest and kindest individual you would ever want to meet. She doesn’t know any porcupines, but she has nine or ten desert tortoises residing in her back yard. And yes, nature provides the occasional roadrunner, so she needs to protect the little ‘uns when one is on the hunt. It’s what we do, humanely speaking. )

Posted by: juliania | Jun 7 2025 21:58 utc | 187

Posted by: tucenz | Jun 7 2025 21:31 utc | 181
########
Tulsi is a Hindu nationalist (Zionist) if she is anything.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 7 2025 21:58 utc | 188

Key question relating the moves by the out of control Department of Commerce is quite simple? Who owns the infrastructure of that department?
Logical response is since at least 1938 that department has been under full operative control by the oligarchal crime clans who established the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA CORPORATION in 1938. Subtly superseding both Constitutional and Common Law; that corporation was duly registered under the corporate statutes of the state of Dupont (aka Delaware) in 1938.
An amazing sidelight to that elitist empowerment is the fact that ALL American birth certificates have been made the property of that treasonous entity. Consider the powers of ownership.

Posted by: aristodemos | Jun 7 2025 22:00 utc | 189

Nobody knows what Trump knew or didn’t know but I find this willingness to assume Trump only has good intentions but is being sabotaged by the Deep State silly. He has surrounded himself with loyalists, so I dont believe it . Trump likes to play the Good Cop while his boys play the Bad Cop and he feigns ignorance. I doubt either Putin or Xi believe it.

Posted by: Pete Lincoln | Jun 7 2025 22:00 utc | 190

About Trump being a lame duck
Wait until the shelves are bare for back-to-school.
And wait until the midterms hit.
He came in with a mandate and both houses of Congress. In 6 months, he has squandered all of it.
I know, I know, the “Deep State”. It’s the fault of the Chinese, Hamas, Houthis, and Iranians, who all stole America’s exceptionalism under Obama.
It’s everyone’s fault except Trump’s. 🫠🫠🫠

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 7 2025 22:04 utc | 191

Posted by: juliania | Jun 7 2025 21:58 utc | 188
I took a “trip” through this poetic and bucolic poster! Thank you!

Posted by: Elber | Jun 7 2025 22:08 utc | 192

@ Posted by: hopehely | Jun 7 2025 19:06 utc | 150
Thanks for wading in over the bullshit hopehely, I was begining to despair and ready to come say the same. Also the failure of Powers to let himself be burnt up. Or use his ejector seat which would have guaranteed his instant decapitation.
———-
@ Posted by: steel_porcupine | Jun 7 2025 19:06 utc | 151
I doubt VVP alone considers and decides – he is after all just ONE person and the system he came from and hopefully has reinforced after it’s determined corruption. Making it robust enough for Brothers to Work! Even when one eternal army soldier after another falls.
I recall some of our wasterals flying into Russia and buying up all the treasures and flying out with the £’s, $’s & ¥’s that were the get out of jail cards for many captains, colonels and generals of the glasnost fallout.
Getting the many oligarchs set in motion to parcel up all the industry and resources.
I know of some very old Russian art still in domestic properties in the hands of some who were the vanguard of finally getting their hands on Russia for their masters… but that’s another story.

Posted by: DunGroanin | Jun 7 2025 22:11 utc | 193

@ Posted by: William Gruff | Jun 7 2025 19:05 utc | 149
Why do you not know what ‘fittest’ means in the context of it being regularly (mis) quoted?
You are not alone.
The actual theory and it’s title ‘on the origin of species …’ by Darwin encouraged as he was by Huxley to get it into print having dilly dallied for years worrying about its conclusions, is. SHORT. For such a work of research 500 pages.
Published 1859.
Actually the whole title is :
‘ On the Origin of Species by Means of Natural Selection, or the Preservation of Favoured Races in the Struggle for Life ‘
No ‘fittest’ in that, is there?
Original version here for anyone interested. If you like your pigeons colours you’ll be smitten. 😉
https://darwin-online.org.uk/content/frameset?itemID=F373&viewtype=text&pageseq=1

Posted by: DunGroanin | Jun 7 2025 22:17 utc | 194

@Eighthman | Jun 7 2025 20:55 utc | 170
Please, please, please…..Somebody tell me that Russia is mailing out lists of prisoners and Ukraine bodies. This could, by itself, greatly erode Ukr. support for this pointless war.
Check this out!
https://eadaily.com/en/news/2025/06/07/opinion-dead-soldiers-of-the-armed-forces-of-ukraine-unnecessary-to-kiev-are-a-weapon-in-the-information-war

Posted by: Elber | Jun 7 2025 22:21 utc | 195

oldhippie | Jun 7 2025 20:49 utc | 168–
Thanks for your reply. Yes, him and wife Mary educated millions of Americans and people from other nations as well. I enjoy his prose and the way he presents certain points. I do wish he’d have lived another decade.
///////////////////////////
lex talionis | Jun 7 2025 21:19 utc | 178–
You’ll find it illuminating. IMO, the basic point about the pursuit of the ordinary American influenced William Appleman Williams greatly in the reasoning he employed in Empire as a Way of Life. Several weeks ago, I linked to an essay by Beard that was published by Charles Scribner’s Sons in the February 1935 issue entitled “National Politics and War”. It took me awhile to find it again, but there’s the link.
I hope other barflies are finding all this history talk and references useful.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 7 2025 22:23 utc | 196

Perhaps Trump is being sabotaged. You make a good case for it. But we may be witnessing a classic case of “Mutt & Jeff”, or “Good cop – Bad cop”, in action. This works on even the experienced and intelligent Chinese leadership *because they want to believe* that a portion of the US ruling class has good intentions and favors detente. That error was made by the old Soviet Communist Party leadership.
If we’ve learned one thing about the U.S. and its allies in the post-WW2 period, they do NOT believe in peaceful coexistence! They seek to destroy any independent pole of political attraction, and that includes any Communist Party. (Vietnam’s rulers should also take note!)

Posted by: Jeffrey Kaye | Jun 7 2025 22:24 utc | 197

Posted by: All Under Heaven | Jun 7 2025 17:35 utc | 128
Thanks AUH.
Your POV resonates with the North Koreans, Iran, Russia and every other country that has the misfortune to being targets as well as with many others here including myself.
Would you be willing to concede that this (sanctions/bans/etc) would also be true if any other person were POTUS?
I have no love for Trump but I do recognize his fight against a far insidious entity and having the support of the majority of citizens to just maybe pull off a surprise.
I take comfort in that both President Putin and Xi and their advisers do too.

Posted by: Suresh | Jun 7 2025 22:26 utc | 198

frithguild | Jun 7 2025 21:52 utc | 187–
Curious to know if you read my thought piece, “Building a Political Economy that Serves People First”.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 7 2025 22:30 utc | 199

@ Posted by: William Gruff | Jun 7 2025 19:05 utc | 149
“They cannot be changed without destroying the Ruling Class…”
@ Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 7 2025
“So, while Russia and China are the Empire’s two main adversaries, they are also the Global Majority’s Champions. Ultimately, the conflict’s aim is How to change the interests driving the imperial urge of the Empire’s ruling Class; how to get it to cease and desist? “
&
“I’ve written here the only remedy I see is to reform or kill them or remove all their means to further their behavior.”
As have I dear sirs , to find them in their deep lairs and super yachts and desert islands where they will disappear to far from the mundane mass deaths they instigate.
However fortunately for me and you and others, who have come to recognise the poison gland in our ‘body’, the matter is in the hands of those unconquered ancient civilisations leaders who have managed to raise their poorest and keep the global robber barons at bay.
Unfortunately other civilisations have fallen prey to the ‘dark side’ allure and have sold their Peoples to the unnecessary lifetimes of penury and death and war whilst their elite slaves live the life of millionaires working for billionaires who insist on Owning it All. Particularly the Turkish and Subcontinentals, Japanese and few others across Africa and pacific.
Also of course us European ‘citizens’ shorn of ‘empires’. Not that the majority had any benefit from it except vicarious pride.
Let’s not forget the massive poverty that existed at the heights of European Empires. Bread and Circuses is all the majority got.
The dynastic ambitions are refreshed every generation – they breed more than most – so the root of the solution is there.
Look there are probably no more than 10,000 in total of the FEW, THEM.
Probably no more than a few hundred families, dynasties.
Mao did it to the poison in Chinas midst, the shapeshifters had long moulded themselves into that form.
Is Xi the epitome of such a success story?
Are the neo-Russo Mir young with this restoration of selfworth another?
Yes it’s their fortunes which must be taken away. Their abilities to create Money at will and thus the Power to buy anything, anyone, anywhere.
Their dynasties of wealth broken into a million pieces. Let them live! Fabulously richly. Compared to everyone else but once they spend their fortunes let their future generations be One with humanity as EQUALS. If they can rise again in their own merit – good luck to them
They are stupid but not completely – the bargaining has started already to escape with more and regroup and strike again decades down the road!
They are determined to change the multipolar, meaning polycentric, into a sly three way split or maybe just 4 or 5. Then back to two and ultimately try again a century down the line to take it all again!
‘Whaddyasay eh? Pardner I’ll give up some of my line, but let’s not give it all away eh?”
It’s the way of the outlaw and thieves and pirates.
The Bad and the Very Ugly tempting the Good.
I’d like to slap them and exile them out onto some devils island from the rest of humanity. I’d like to remove all their privileges and self deluded entitlements.
Get their kids out of coddled private education and lifetimes of trustafarian luxury.

As I say, that is perhaps not the most civilised way to go. It would make me no different to their ways.
So? Let’s leave it to the Ancients who have been wronged more than any others, to mete out the humane justice. Does that make sense guys?

Posted by: DunGroanin | Jun 7 2025 22:31 utc | 200