Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
June 9, 2025
Russia Seeks ‘Asymmetrical’ Response For Strike On Its Nuclear Assets

There is some confusion over Russia's response to the June 1/2 attacks on railway infrastructure and its strategic nuclear forces.

To recap:

On Saturday/Sunday Ukrainian diversion groups used explosives to destroy two Russian railroad bridges in the Kursk and Bryansk region. These bridges were located some 50 kilometer north of the Sumy region frontline. The hits will impact, if only for a short time, the railway bound supply of Russian forces north of Sumy.

One of the bridge explosions destroyed a civil passenger train. Some 10 people were killed and some 100 were wounded. This was likely intended and thereby a terror attack.

On Sunday morning a large scale operation by the Ukrainian secret service managed to attack multiple strategic airfields throughout Russia. Ukrainian sources claimed attacks on five airfields and the destruction of more than 40 strategic bombers.

Current damage assessment confirms attacks on two airfields and the destruction or damaging of up to 10 bombers.

It is very important to distinguish these attacks. While both coincided with negotiations between Ukraine in Russia in Istanbul, and were clearly timed to influence those, the purpose was larger.

The railroad attacks were planned to hinder rearward logistics of Russia's operation in Ukraine's Sumy region. That a civilian train was hit by these was likely seen by the Ukrainian forces as an additional feature but not as a main purpose. Still, it is the mass harm of civilians that make this otherwise permissible attack on a quasi-military target a terrorist act. The Russian side has emphasized this.

The attack on the strategic bombers of Russia's nuclear triad (land based nuclear missiles, submarine based nuclear missiles, air carriers for launching nuclear bombs and missiles) hit at a much higher level. It was a military attack on a strategic military target. Russia's publicly announced doctrine allows for the use of nuclear forces to retaliate for such an attack on its nuclear assets. This independent of the immediate source of the attack.

The attack on the railway bridges were an operation that is typical for British services. It has been reported and is well known that British services have advised and helped the Ukrainians to launch sea drones against Russia in the Black Sea, to cross the Dnieper river in Krinki and in other operations of higher propaganda value.

The Russian Foreign Minister has accused the U.K of direct involvement in the terrorist attack.

Several western experts of U.S. special services believe, as the Russian's do, that the operation against its nuclear forces have a different actor behind them – most likely the CIA. It is unlikely that Ukraine would have been able to identify and target those airfields without the intelligence acquired by U.S. sources. There is also no military benefit for Ukraine to attack Russian air bases far from its territory.

It has been reported that since 2014 the CIA had build some 20 stations in Ukraine from where it operates against Russia. Several high ranking Ukrainian intelligence actors, including the head of its military intelligence service General Budanov, have been trained by the CIA and are actively cooperating with it.

The CIA has a special unit dedicated to long term plans to harm Russia. As the Washington Post once described it:

The warren of cubicles was secured behind a metal door. The name on the hallway placard had changed often over the years, most recently designating the space as part of the Mission Center for Europe and Eurasia. But internally, the office was known by its unofficial title: “Russia House.”

The unit had for decades been the center of gravity at the CIA, an agency within the agency, locked in battle with the KGB for the duration of the Cold War. The department’s prestige had waned after the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks, and it was forced at one point to surrender space to counterterrorism officers.

But Russia House later reclaimed that real estate and began rebuilding, vaulting back to relevance as Moscow reasserted itself. Here, among a maze of desks, dozens of reports officers fielded encrypted cables from abroad, and “targeters” meticulously scoured data on Russian officials, agencies, businesses and communications networks the CIA might exploit for intelligence.

'Russia House' was deeply involved in creating the hoax about Russian interference in U.S. elections. Former nuclear weapon inspector Scott Ritter as well as others have asserted that political control over 'Russia House' is less stringent than desirable.

Another data point for the CIA's involvement was a piece by David Ignatius, its spokesperson at the Washington Post which openly threatened further attacks on Russia's strategic nuclear assets:

Ukraine’s dirty war is just getting started (archived) – David Ignatius / Washington Post

Ukraine has considered a naval version of the sneak-attack tactic it used so effectively on Sunday. The sources said the [Ukrainian intelligence service] SBU weighed sending sea drones hidden in cargo containers to attack ships of Russia and its allies in the North Pacific. But, so far, they apparently have yet to launch these operations.

'Russia House' continues to be busy. Still, even 'Russia House' needs a legal bases to act which usually comes in the form of presidential findings.

The conclusion from this is that the CIA, with the knowledge of the White House, has planned and directed the Ukrainian attack on Russia's strategic air fields.

The different qualities of the two attacks on June 1/2 require different responses. One response, throughout the last days, has come by strong Russian missile and drone attacks against military and military-industrial targets throughout Ukraine.

The Washington Post erred when it headlined:

Ukrainian cities pounded by Russia in retaliation for Sunday drone strike (archived) – Washington Post

The assault appears to be retaliation for Ukraine’s extensive attack on Russia’s bomber fleet on Sunday, targeting air bases across Russia and damaging many nuclear-capable aircraft.

The Russian attacks, by each some 500 missiles and drones over several nights, have obviously been in the plans for some time. They are not very special. Russian sources have explicitly said that these attacks were in response to Ukraine' terrorist attack:

Russian military retaliated against Kiev’s ‘terrorism’ – MODRT

The barrage, which included air-, sea-, and land-based missiles as well as unmanned aerial vehicles (UAVs), was a response to recent “terrorist acts” carried out by Kiev, Russia’s Defense Ministry said on Friday.

Ukraine blew up railway bridges in Russia last week, derailing civilian and freight trains and killing at least seven and injuring over 120.

What we have so far seen as Russia's response to the attacks was only related to the terror attack which harmed civilians.

The retaliation for the attack on Russia's strategic nuclear assets has yet to come.

The U.S. knows this:

US Believes Russia Response To Ukraine Attack Not Over Yet: OfficialsReuters

The United States believes that Russian President Vladimir Putin's threatened retaliation against Ukraine over its drone attack last weekend has not happened yet in earnest and is likely to be a significant, multi-pronged strike, US officials told Reuters.

The first official said Moscow's attack would be "asymmetrical," meaning that its approach and targeting would not mirror Ukraine's strike last weekend against Russian warplanes.

Russia launched an intense missile and drone barrage at the Ukrainian capital Kyiv on Friday and Russia's Defense Ministry said the strike on military and military-related targets was in response to what it called Ukrainian "terrorist acts" against Russia. But the US officials believe the complete Russian response is yet to come.

Putin told President Donald Trump in a telephone conversation on Wednesday that Moscow would have to respond to attack, Trump said in a social media post.

Trump later told reporters that "it's probably not going to be pretty."

Trump claims that the U.S. had not known of the attack on Russia's strategic bombers. It is possible that Trump did not know about it. He may not have been informed to enable him to give a plausible denial. He may also simply lie about it. There is no doubt though in my mind that the U.S. was involved in it.

There is speculation that Russia will respond by attacking government buildings, especially those of the special services, in Kiev.

I doubt that this is a sufficient response for the attack on strategic nuclear assets. The Ukrainians would take a beating by such a strike but the U.S., which is undoubtedly behind the attack, would be left unharmed.

There would be nothing to deter the U.S., or others, to further chip away at Russia's nuclear retaliation capability by, for example, attacking – as Ignatius already announces – the bases of Russia's nuclear submarine fleets.

No. Any response for the attack on Russia's nuclear forces must include a very strong warning to the U.S. to not further walk down that path.

I do not know if the U.S. military still has some B-52 bombers on Diego Garcia. Destroying those would be adequate. Other potential targets are U.S. submarines and their bases. An attack on U.S. personnel that was involved in planing the attack would also be appropriate.

But all such operation could potentially lead to escalation. Especially while a hawkish Senate and blob is pushing against Trump's attempt to reestablish good relation with Russia.

Russia will need something different:

Let’s be honest: repeating slogans like “our response will be success on the battlefield” won’t cut it here. Ukraine’s leadership isn’t acting out of military logic, but emotional desperation. Their calculation is political. So Russia’s response must be political, too – emotionally resonant, unmistakably firm, and, above all, creative.

This doesn’t mean rash escalation, but we can’t rely on the old playbook. Hitting the same military targets again and again achieves little. Striking Ukraine’s energy infrastructure? Done. Launching another missile as a ‘demonstration’? Predictable. Escalating to mass casualties? Unnecessary and, frankly, counterproductive.

So what’s left?

Innovation.

Russia must now think asymmetrically. That might mean a covert action so unexpected that it catches Ukraine completely off guard. Or it could involve striking symbolic targets that shift the psychological balance. The key is to remind Kiev – and its patrons – that nothing they do goes unanswered, and that the cost of provocation will always outweigh the benefit.

You are invited to brainstorm in the comments what kind of operation might those criteria.

One asymmetrical response I can think of would be an attack on British, not U.S. owned, strategic assets. Any hit on Britain would be well deserved anyway. A strike against British nuclear assets would be strong enough to be understood by the U.S. as a severe warning while it would be unlikely to lead to escalation. The Brits are unable to escalate on their own and the U.S. will be unwilling to go there.

The planning for any asymmetrical operation will take a while. It therefore do not expect the Russian response for the attack on its nuclear assets to occur with the next days.

Later this week there will be another meeting of Russia's security council. The revenge for the strike on Russia's  strategic assets will certainly be part of its agenda.

Comments

steven t johnson | Jun 9 2025 17:30 utc | 52
*** As to advising the Russians on military strategy? Thinking outside the box? Retreat from the indefensible outposts, like Tartus and Transnistria and maybe even Kaliningrad. Would anything kill NATO faster than a row between Poland, Lithuania, Germany and the US over who seizes East Prussia? ***
Wouldn’t work, as NATO would very quickly declare it to be a NATO international territory, and build itself a missile/navy base there.

Posted by: Cynic | Jun 9 2025 18:46 utc | 101

I think Putin should tell Ukraine that Kiev will be razed in “x” hours and then do it.
Give them 48/72 hours to evacuate. Then watch Ukraine panic as they figure out how to do so and who to prioritize.
Someone like Lavrov would be able to explain to me why this idea is a bad idea. It might be terrible, but the idea is not just to blow things up but to demonstrate power. Power is the belief that someone is powerful. Make Ukraine tangible and viscerally respond to a perception of Russian strength.
And embarrass them.
Squash the “brother nation” narrative.
Or maybe do that for Lyov. Not Odessa. We don’t want to spend the money to rebuild Odessa unless necessary.
NATO doesn’t respect Russia. Depending on how this goes, give the same warning to NATO’s HQ. NATO would be embarrassed if Russia could wipe it’s HQ off of the map.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 9 2025 18:48 utc | 102

“I think Putin should tell Ukraine that Kiev will be razed in “x” hours and then do it.”
Kiev is a Russian city.

Posted by: Apollyon | Jun 9 2025 18:51 utc | 103

How Russia will respond depends on a) the purpose of the response and b) the means at Russia’s disposal.
a) is not revenge of course. It is a response that imo should pave the future escalation path: what will the likely course of events be if more strategic nuclear targets are engaged as a means to weaken Russia’s strategic capabilities. To add substance to it, the response must also convey the message that Russia is ready to absorb any further escalation via an eventual counter response by her target.
b) limits their options
Hitting British assets without declaring war is impossible. Covert operations targeting key capabilities are more likely but dont publicly paint escalatory pathways. It might be that the SMO will be changed to something else, given the new strategic threat from it. An emergency drill in the Baltic sea where the chance of a limited confrontation is purposely kept high or is planned go happen? I bet on the last.

Posted by: Alek_a | Jun 9 2025 18:51 utc | 104

Wait for the holidays and then flatten Eton. That might make the British “Elite” think of their own fates first, as any military proposal usually only eliminates “lesser” beings clad in soldiers’ uniforms.

Posted by: Stonebird | Jun 9 2025 18:53 utc | 105

Ideally, the threat to flatten Kiev is issued just as Rutte or Starmer are visiting.
And Russia needs to organize as much press coverage as possible. Saturate the info space. Force NATO to respond recklessly in public.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 9 2025 18:54 utc | 106

Asymmetrical?
Demand payment in gold.

Posted by: G wiltek | Jun 9 2025 18:56 utc | 107

@karlof1 |95

It could be argued that DS actors are terrorists and terrorist facilitators, which gives a legal justification for their elimination. IMO, SCO and CSTO members will also be asked to join Russian efforts since SCO and CSTO have explicit anti-terrorist purposes, although such invitations are likely to be made privately.

Yes. So what could be done is to try and get at a working (preferably even legal) heuristic/definition of the Deep State as a terror organisation, perhaps after moving the Overton Window along in conjunction with other actors. The effort could be used in the diplomatic arena as well. The downside is that this is almost akin to pushing for a civil war in the West, especially should things go out of hand. But then, Russia is legitimately under attack and needs to defend itself.

Posted by: persiflo | Jun 9 2025 18:58 utc | 108

The revenge Justice for the strike on Russia’s strategic assets will certainly be part of its agenda.
Posted by b on June 9, 2025 at 15:38 UTC | Permalink
Sorry B, fixed it for you

Posted by: Newbie | Jun 9 2025 18:58 utc | 109

Kiev is a Russian city.
Posted by: Apollyon | Jun 9 2025 18:51 utc | 104
###########
All the more reason. Ukraine has done nothing to maintain or improve its infrastructure. It can all be rebuilt. It will show everyone that Russia will cut off its finger to end this conflict on its terms.
I don’t think they will do anything that dramatic.
A shame.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 9 2025 18:59 utc | 110

Demand payment in gold.

Posted by: G wiltek | Jun 9 2025 18:56 utc | 108
Sir, you win the thread, have a bar tipple of your choice on my tab.

Posted by: Jeremy Rhymings-Lang | Jun 9 2025 19:00 utc | 111

Oreshnik can convert gold bars into gold dust.

Posted by: Fritz | Jun 9 2025 19:06 utc | 112

I’m thinking a Poseidon suicide drone torpedo up near the end of Gare Loch, Scotland. A restrained and measured response, but still sufficient to get the Empire’s attention. To do it right the atomic drone should have a payload of 0.2Gt.
Or maybe send it up the Thames? A sightseeing tour of Westminster for the drone before it does its job?
That sort of response would be properly asymmetrical, I should think.

Posted by: William Gruff | Jun 9 2025 19:06 utc | 113

One plausible response by the Russian Federation is to announce that any buildings housing employees of Great Britain’s givernment within Ukraine are now considered legitimate targets. Following on that announce that any British ships or planes within fifty miles of Ukraine will be considered to be possible belligerents in the conflict and subject to being fired upon.
Just the threat of sinking ships with British flags will upend their stock market and send shipping insurance higher.

Posted by: Babel-17 | Jun 9 2025 19:07 utc | 114

Going terrorist on the US Empire’s shadow government is a great idea:
Posted by: HB Brian | Jun 9 2025 17:58 utc | 68
Exactly. I guarantee you that the New York media will be screaming about it like October 7th, but that’s part of the appeal. This is because of point e): If President Trump shows up at Nuland’s funeral, it’s because he wants to dance on her grave. All Russian actions should be taken with a mind to splitting NATO governments from their populations and each other, not mindlessly uniting them behind a common purpose.

Posted by: They Call Me Mister | Jun 9 2025 19:07 utc | 115

Demands are useless. Russia has been demanding neutrality for 3 years, and no one has taken them seriously.
The reason why Russia has to act is to re-establish nuclear deterrence and kinetic consequences.
Keep your eyes on the prize, brothers. Keep making suggestions with the goal in mind.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 9 2025 19:09 utc | 116

Dario from Italy, sorry for my English. I believe the target will be nato aerial installations in Baltic countries (maybe Finland).

Posted by: Dario | Jun 9 2025 19:09 utc | 117

@LoveDonbass | Mon, 09 Jun 2025 18:59:00 GMT | 111
Cutting off your own finger to appear powerful, for this shall be the way to victory? Oh my. I bet your life has not been easy.

Posted by: persiflo | Jun 9 2025 19:10 utc | 118

@Fritz | 113

Oreshnik can convert gold bars into gold dust.

You mean like, we’ll help you with the audit of Fort Knox in exchange for peace? lol.

Posted by: persiflo | Jun 9 2025 19:12 utc | 119

@ persiflo | Jun 9 2025 19:12 utc | 120
I can’t see an Oreshnik arriving at Fort Knox, after all, why would Russia waste one on an empty storage facility???

Posted by: Jeremy Rhymings-Lang | Jun 9 2025 19:17 utc | 120

“btw, the stupid logic in this circle jerk forum: the attacks on the airfields are meaningless, unimportant but on
the others it needs a strong response from Pootin, hahah”
Child, this is about drawing a line, to make clear that such an escalation is unacceptable, even if got exactly ZERO impact on the SMO or to be more prices, BECAUSE it got zero impact on the SMO.
This was not an attack of Ukraine against Russia as part of their fight against it. This was NATO ordering its proxy to go another step further. And if Russia is doing nothing at all in respose, this can indeed easily lead to another step and another step and then reaching a point where they indeed would for example make an attack on an ICBM base or one of the mobile launcher and then the reponse HAS TO BE nuclear and that agaist the real culprits = UK for example.
That’s the reason why there hast to be clear punishment NOW, BEFORE it becomes even more.

Posted by: Beatrice | Jun 9 2025 19:17 utc | 121

“I think Putin should tell Ukraine that Kiev will be razed in “x” hours and then do it.”
No, just not. That’s exactly what NATO wants.
Razing a 3 millione people city for some decade old bombers? This goes WAY beyond a response, espcially because 99,9% of these 3 million people got NOTHING to do with it.

Posted by: Beatrice | Jun 9 2025 19:19 utc | 122

@Dario
Why should Russia risk to start a direct, maybe nuclear war with NATO?

Posted by: Apollyon | Jun 9 2025 19:20 utc | 123

persiflo | Jun 9 2025 19:12 utc | 120
The could go green and plant a few hazel trees in the city of London and Doubt the US nationalist faction would object, but it is a bit doubtful to me that Russia will do that at this point.
Russia has escalation dominance in spades. Russia seems to be using it like turning thumb screws half a turn at a time until the get the correct answer. But Russia can keep turning those thumbscrews half a turn at a time until the thumbs pop off.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jun 9 2025 19:20 utc | 124

Sink a British or US carrier sends a clear message that the West can no longer project power. The psychological effect would be enormous, watch the markets wobble. Unfortunately the only possible Western response would be nuclear. Better to dial it back and target Z and the organs of state with Oreshniks.

Posted by: Nick J | Jun 9 2025 19:21 utc | 125

i appreciate b’s analysis here and his question on how to address this too..
i especially liked tom and karls focus on the deep state…
@ Tom Pfotzer | Jun 9 2025 17:32 utc | 54 and @ karlof1 | Jun 9 2025 17:56 utc | 65
both suggest going after the deep state ( DS ) which makes much sense..
@ Doctor Eleven | Jun 9 2025 18:09 utc | 74
yes, hitting starlink satellites would be a strong message here.. i think it’s quite appropriate too, as these were needed to carry out the attack on the 5 airbases…
@ Constantine | Jun 9 2025 17:15 utc | 43
it is an interesting insight and one i am not at all versed in.. thanks for sharing that.. if you want to elaborate, it would help me understand it better.. thanks..

Posted by: james | Jun 9 2025 19:21 utc | 126

Jeremy Rhymings-Lang | Jun 9 2025 17:56 utc | 66
*** A Kalibr or two arriving in the ferry ports of St. Helier, St. Peter Port and Douglas would completely cripple life on those islands, and as noted earlier, their NATO status is not cut and dried.***
They are islands. UK government / Political Establishment reallly couldn’t care less about islands and their populations far from the so-called “home counties” …. remember why Gruinard was quarantined, and that anthrax (plus other?) toxins were also WW2 tested at sea off the Outer Hebrides, where a change in wind direction could have wiped out the population.

Posted by: Cynic | Jun 9 2025 19:23 utc | 127

The main Lavrov’s statements at the “Forum of the Future 2050”
https://t.me/segodnia_ru/9321
From about a dozen I picked this one:
– He pointed to the deepest crisis and destruction in NATO and the OSCE, and also recalled Stalin’s idea to move the UN to Sochi.;

Posted by: Paco | Jun 9 2025 19:24 utc | 128

American lawmakers — including most Republicans — reportedly believe too much has been invested to allow a total Ukrainian collapse.

sunk cost PHallacy (because they are all dicks) at its finest.

Posted by: Justpassinby | Jun 9 2025 19:26 utc | 129

The problem Russia faces is that any restrained response just invites escalation, as we have seen throughout the entire conflict. There is nothing in the Ukraine that the Russians can hit that will leapfrog them ahead of the escalation process. Even hitting Kiev with a strategic nuke wont put the West on the back foot.
Sadly, there is nothing the Russians can do that they are likely to do that will dissuade the West from continuing to throw sucker punches from outside the ring.

Posted by: William Gruff | Jun 9 2025 19:28 utc | 130

Have a Zirkon sneak undetected up on Andrews AFB, loop 5 times around it. Then disappear.

Posted by: Norwegian | Jun 9 2025 19:29 utc | 131

I’m no expert, but b asks for input, so this is my best attempt. I’m proceeding from what I believe is Russia’s basic intention: to have Ukrainian people free to choose a new government for themselves.
I have been listening to a conversation between Larry Johnson and Nima of Dialogue Works in which Larry begins by saying that Russia has changed from the SMO to an anti terrorist operation.
What would be asymmetrical about Russia’s next moves to me would be that at this point one cannot negotiate with the current regime, so there cannot be a consideration to leave some border between the two countries, but rather that Russia will press on to defeat the current regime, however that can be accomplished.
Ukraine needs to have monitored elections as soon as possible, if they would want to have any existence in the future at all. Either that, or Russia will take all of Ukraine and create the conditions for elections itself, perhaps offering to areas still under the current regime the opportunity to surrender one by one, as was done in Chechnya.
So, rather than this being a matter of military retaliation, it might proceed instead more peacefully, region by region, once the current regime is no more. This would be the best solution, Russia aiming first at capturing or eliminating the present illegitimate terrorist regime, which has demonstrated that it can’t be left to its own devices; and then for UN Russia-friendly military assistance to monitor new elections to have Ukraine be no longer the threat it has been.

Posted by: juliania | Jun 9 2025 19:29 utc | 132

For me, the question of what to hit is secondary. First comes the change in mentality which, thank God, our host has finally given us his blessing to discuss. You don’t always have to escalate, but you have to respond. All this “other-cheek” stuff, “give them just enough rope to hang themselves”, etc etc, is the Kremlin doing the same thing (i.e. nothing) over and over, and expecting a different result. @Constantine | Jun 9 2025 17:15 utc | 43 calls it the Yeltsin legacy, and I think he has a point in that the USSR didn’t get pushed around like this (except by some Lebanese would-be tough guys, who soon came to regret it).
That said, is David Ignatius really a journalist reporting on Russia, or is he a CIA plant in the journalism world threatening Russia? Touching him and/or some other neocon ideologues would break the mould of who dies, and who kills with impunity.
Switching off the lights in 404 and keeping them off would also change the game, as others have remarked. What we’ve had so far, a cat-and-mouse with easily-replaced electric infrastructure, may be just as much for domestic Russian consumption, “See, we’re trying at least.” Yes, this’d cause a lot of grief for the Ukie civilians; but killing all their men in the current scenario isn’t? For me, “lights off” contains the added bonus that it’d commit Russia to ending the war instead of an endless, aimless “long game”.
Stopping the Black-Sea target-acquisition flights instead of just whining about them would also help. Added bonus: it changes the mentality on both sides that waging war on the Russian Federation is no big deal really.
Let’s not kid ourselves: Pres. Putin will resolutely choose “none of the above”. Yeltsinism is too deeply intertwined with his own rise to power for him to break with it. If Russia must now leave the past behind then I’m afraid that VVP, now in his seventies, is part of that. Dignified retirement should suit all sides.

Posted by: Ma Laoshi | Jun 9 2025 19:30 utc | 133

‘Asymmetric response’ seems to have morphed into ‘what would we like to nuke’.
Barflies, we have a problem.
I am eternally grateful that none of us work for Stavka.
Let’s see what they do…after all, nobody saw Oreshnik coming.

Posted by: ChatNPC | Jun 9 2025 19:32 utc | 134

Whiteman Air Force Base In Missouri
Thats the B-2 airbase

Posted by: Exile | Jun 9 2025 19:33 utc | 135

Going terrorist on the US Empire’s shadow government is a great idea:
Posted by: HB Brian | Jun 9 2025 17:58 utc | 68
############
That’s a loss of face and respect from Russia’s allies.
It’s like avoiding a brawl but keying the guy’s car in the parking lot. Not asymmetric, weak.
Russia needs to deliver a punch in the face that breaks the nose. Every half measure invites more terrorism.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 9 2025 19:34 utc | 136

MI6 was behind the attacks on the RF bombers, of that there is no doubt………so the question is how to strike back at the Brits.
No an easy question……….preferably they erase those responsible, those individuals who are actively attempting to start WWIII.
The best overall response is to collapse the front and take the Odessa ports, and capture Transnistria…..and take everything east of the Dneiper…….that is the best response.
Stop with the WWIII stuff please…..

Posted by: tobias cole | Jun 9 2025 19:35 utc | 137

@ William Gruff | Jun 9 2025 19:28 utc | 131
sadly i agree, outside of open confrontation in the most brazen and direct manner – which is what some of the posters on this thread are advocating for…

Posted by: james | Jun 9 2025 19:36 utc | 138

Paco | Jun 9 2025 19:24 utc | 129
The Friends of the UN Charter group. The short lived league of nations disappeared in the last great power conflict. The UN will be changed in this great power conflict. The charter will I think remain and a new somewhat different UN center will form in a non western country, quite likely on territory donated for that purpose that due to US abuse of visas for diplomats and their teams, will be UN sovereign territory under the control of the UN rather than and individual country. Russia and China have been pushing to have both India and at least a representative of black Africa as permanent members of the security council. The west – the anglo world plus france hold a 5-2 majority in the security council and will not relinquish that even though the world has greatly changed since the UN was formed.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jun 9 2025 19:37 utc | 139

@ Cynic | Jun 9 2025 19:23 utc | 128
Have to diverge with you slightly on that, the Outer Hebrides have never been tax havens, whereas the Channel Islands and IoM are famed/notorious for their status.
The Outer Hebrides are very definitely part of the United Kingdom; the Channel Islands were never part of the European single market, while AIUI the Isle of Man has never been a signatory to the WW2 treaties, technically still being in a state of war with Germany.
Russia destroying their ferry terminals and aerodromes poses a difficult quandary for the British government; Article 5 be damned, Article 6 gives a huge get-out clause for the US, France etc.

Posted by: Jeremy Rhymings-Lang | Jun 9 2025 19:40 utc | 140

No overt attack on ANY NATO country, but asymmetrical acts of sabotage …
There will be plenty of targets inside 🇺🇦… NATO provides more services, special ops operatives and foreign mercenaries … assets all across are getting clobbered in recent days … damage reports fall under military censorship … state of mind of Zelensky and cohorts must cause dizziness and desperation.
Retaliation by Putin will be more territory as buffer zone and a very hardline position in final Armistice Agreement, similar to Korean War. One people, two states. De facto capitulation by Kyiv regime.
No NATO membership, no EU peacekeepers, no nothing.
Trump must realize the European leadership is undermining his peace effort by embolding actor Zelenskyy … he is clearly weeping all that has been done to him.
In my analysis Trump will clearly state at the The Hague NATO Summit: “Europe you own Biden’s war, you can stop and agree to cessation of hostilities, there will be no security cover from the U.S. … by definition Article 5 is null and void. It needs unanimity anyway.

Posted by: Oui | Jun 9 2025 19:41 utc | 141

Stonebird | Jun 9 2025 18:53 utc | 106
*** Wait for the holidays and then flatten Eton. That might make the British “Elite” think of their own fates first, as any military proposal usually only eliminates “lesser” beings clad in soldiers’ uniforms.***
No!
Do it in term time during a parents’ day.

Posted by: Cynic | Jun 9 2025 19:42 utc | 142

Great article.
It’s true that giving no response will enable the US empire with its vassals in pursuit to chip away at Russia’s nuclear deterrent.
There were earlier attacks on Russia’s nuclear deterrent when its strategic radar facilities were attacked by the US (using Ukraine as the straw man). To restore it’s nuclear deterrence after the June attack it could launch a Kinzhal with the smallest nuclear yield it has in its inventory on a large Ukrainian military (air) base as close as permissibly possible to the EU border.

Posted by: xor | Jun 9 2025 19:43 utc | 143

“I’m no expert, but b asks for input, so this is my best attempt. I’m proceeding from what I believe is Russia’s basic intention: to have Ukrainian people free to choose a new government for themselves.”
Posted by: juliania
Russia would be absolutely fine with a Ukrainian general taking power and establish a dictatorship, when they know he will kick all foreign agents out of Ukraine and declare neutrality.

Posted by: Apollyon | Jun 9 2025 19:46 utc | 144

Ma Laoshi | Jun 9 2025 19:30 utc | 134
Putin is a little more original that people who can’t think that much further than their own nuts.
He is not a Yeltsin, not a Stalin, not a tzar. He is Putin. He has studies the lessons of the past, both good an bad, bad to be avoided, good can be reused, incorporated into new strategies policies, but the concepts he uses to form a strategy or policy comes from original thinking which it seems the majority of humans are incapable of or even have any understanding of.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jun 9 2025 19:48 utc | 145

Posted by: Beatrice | Jun 9 2025 19:19 utc | 123
########
In the future, read my entire comment before replying.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 9 2025 19:50 utc | 146

The best asymmetrical response of Russia will be in the ME, arming the iranians with the russian start-of-the-art air defense, provide Iran with unlimited satellite and intelligence help and provide some nasty missiles like Iskanders or something similar, also pass some carrier killers missiles and intelligence to the iranians and to the Houties to target some HMS or USS ships in the Red Sea and around with plausible deniability.
If Israel attacks Iran with US help (otherwise is not possible), then the iranians should level all the US bases in the ME with the info provided by the russians satellite constellations and also hit some of the US ships in the Persian Gulf. A very bloody nose is what US and UK need to have to start to behave.
Another asymmetric response is to provide weapons to the shia militias in Irak to star attacking US bases and also help Hezbollah to replenish ammo to be ready to hit the child murderers hard

Posted by: Dave | Jun 9 2025 19:53 utc | 147

I have been thinking about my earlier suggestion of establishing a no-fly zone over Occupied Palestine and while I still like the idea, I think it should be enforced by Russia, China and Iran.
We are in a civilization war and the enemy in Ukraine is the same enemy in Occupied Palestine and Taiwan. The threat against Russia is also against China, Iran and any axis of resistance countries.
IMO, it is time for the anti-God Of Mammon nations to establish a concerted front against ongoing genocide and colonialism as well as private finance controlled society.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Jun 9 2025 19:56 utc | 148

No great love for the Brits at the bar tonight; I wonder why. 🙂 But grandiose plans for how to take them down a peg are premature. As long as Russia maintains diplomatic ties–until Russia tells their own citizens, very much including elite Russian families, to get out of the UK–there is an implied guarantee that Brits killing Russkies is one-way traffic, and both sides know it. Revoke the guarantee, and the ingrates in London are suddenly on notice they might actually get the war of their wet dreams. Until Moscow can take such minimum steps, their whole posture is a transparent bluff.

Posted by: Ma Laoshi | Jun 9 2025 19:56 utc | 149

Okay, here’s one more angle before I’ll take a break offline:
The response/escalation should not invite WW3. It’s tempting in some sense, because NATO armies are currently so deflated, but surely the other side has gamed that out – ? Damn creeps.
So, a strike at some obscure ferry terminal would give them a chance to rally for war, rather than fracturing the alliance. Faslane, OTOH, is a different beast, because it’s so serious. I’m not sure western audiences would swallow that kind of shock and awe without hesitation – I think many would start to really ask questions. Just because it’s “Russia bad” all day in the news does not mean people don’t hold other thoughts as well. Not that I’m advocating for a gamble here — it’s probably better to leave the western public out of the solution short-term.
Covert or overt operation? A sabotage campaign would help with the economic war, and deliver the message just as well something more overt and ‘shock and awe’.
What about multiple prongs?

Posted by: persiflo | Jun 9 2025 19:57 utc | 150

quote from karls link to rybakovs commentary… thanks karl..
“We have repeatedly emphasised that the use of such weapons is impossible without the direct participation of military specialists from the countries that produce these systems. I am referring to the receipt of satellite reconnaissance and surveillance data, the introduction of flight tasks, and so on. In November last year, President of Russia Vladimir Putin clearly indicated that the targets for destruction during further tests of our latest missile systems will be determined based on threats to the security of the Russian Federation.”

Posted by: james | Jun 9 2025 19:59 utc | 151

Not especially creative and almost symmetrical but not:
Global press conference announcing that RF has (and may even now present) evidence of involvement of UK. Ongoing investigations may reveal evidence of other foreign intelligence services (warning to US).
Present the full bill of particulars to establish UK as a combatant (StormShadow, etc.)
Announce targets: 5 UK bases (outside NATO territory) to be struck by Oreshnik and / or Bulava / Yars / Topol with Oreshnik-type kinetic MIRV warheads. (Russia launches during press conference.)
Cyprus (esp. if evidence of Mossad involvement)
Jordan (Mossad)
Oman or Bahrain
Falklands
Diego Garcia
To limit escalatory potential, Russia could announce that it informed US 30 minutes ago, giving them a head start to protect assets over UK.
Article 5? When most of NATO knows that UK has been cruising for it, and the strikes are outside NATO territory.

Posted by: Paul Damascene | Jun 9 2025 20:01 utc | 152

Verificando Dubno – Que sucedeu no ataque… Ver no Google os esconderijos dos aviões. São dezenas… Ampliar para ver bem.
A Equipa da NATO e os F16 devem ter sido destruídos.

Posted by: SomarN | Jun 9 2025 20:05 utc | 153

Well, as I’ve said before, I’d rather see a division of US Marines do the job, but if the CIA link is confirmed(and I’m sure it is), then there’s Putin’s obvious target. The physical destruction of this rogue entity’s HQ would be immediately comprehended by most of the world (yes, their reputation precedes them, I mean, where haven’t they interfered?). I posit that this organization is already so detested that its destruction would be widely(even if covertly by some) celebrated.
But I fear, as others have suggested, that the cat and mouse game will continue.

Posted by: john | Jun 9 2025 20:06 utc | 154

The best “Golden Dome” would be the destruction of all the satellites in orbit, creating a persistent debris field where no more satellites could operate, thus preventing aggression by stupid humans that would cause a totally enveloped debris field on earth with no remaining life. We do not need satellites at the expense of peace and continued life.

Posted by: norecovery | Jun 9 2025 20:09 utc | 155

@ persiflo | Jun 9 2025 19:57 utc | 151
The point I’m trying to make is that I believe these “obscure ferry terminals” are not under direct NATO protection, yet are a crucial part of the physical communication and supply channels for the economic refuges that the elite use for financial obscurity and evasion.
Maybe it would be too subtle for them to understand, which I quite accept.

Posted by: Jeremy Rhymings-Lang | Jun 9 2025 20:11 utc | 156

Apollyon | Jun 9 2025 19:46 utc | 145
Not long back, I read of a ukrainian grouping formed from those that have over a period of time gone over to the Russian side and whish fight not as Russians but as Ukrainians to free their country of the Europeans and nazis. Within Ukraine, with 100 of thousands being sent to the front and simply disappearing, the forced mobilization, the tide is strongly turning. Groups turning out to save men from the street kidnappings have grown larger and recently, the head of Odessa forced conscription was blown up with a car bomb. Quite a powerful bomb under the car and under the drivers seat. Apparently there were bits of him scattered everywhere.
That group of Ukrainians fighting to free their country may well form a nucleus in any remaining rump state that will rid the the place of nazis. Poland will at some point take Galicia and Volyn. They just recently declared a remembrance day or something for the victims of the Volyn genocide in 1943 and the Poles will not be squeamish when it comes to eradicating the Galician nazi’s. Russia may or may not take back more of Russia, though what I think of as neutral Ukraine will be, at the minimum, neutral towards Russia, if not turning towards Russia as Belarus has done.
I suspect that is part of Russia’s strategy in this conflict. Give the neutral Ukrainians time to learn the hard way. The Zelensky regime is now an un-elected dictatorship propped up by western powers and with close to zero approval rating amongst the population. This is the lesson the Ukrainians have had to learn in the school of hard knocks.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jun 9 2025 20:12 utc | 157

@Peter AU1 | Jun 9 2025 19:48 utc | 146
>>Putin is a little more original that people who can’t think that much further than their own nuts.
Fair enough mate: I made a verifiable prediction so if it’ll be wrong then I was wrong. I readily admit that I was baffled when Russia started the SMO. But then just as quickly, they started the Istanbul process to get out of it, made deluded “goodwill gestures” which were promptly abused–and yet failed to mobilize right afterwards when that was clearly needed. So Moscow isn’t only Putin’s show, and indeed Putin isn’t one-dimensional.
All of which is to say: we will see. We have seen in Syria though, and that precedent is discouraging. Feel free to gloat after I have been proven wrong.

Posted by: Ma Laoshi | Jun 9 2025 20:12 utc | 158

3 years ago it was easy but wise to predict an Odyssean bums’ rush to end this. It’s on the way. Fascists do what works now and then.

Posted by: elmagnostic | Jun 9 2025 20:13 utc | 159

Take out Mini-me’s wife. Ouch!

Posted by: nwwoods | Jun 9 2025 20:13 utc | 160

norecovery | Jun 9 2025 20:09 utc | 156
*** The best “Golden Dome” would be the destruction of all the satellites in orbit, creating a persistent debris field where no more satellites could operate, thus preventing aggression by stupid humans that would cause a totally enveloped debris field on earth with no remaining life. We do not need satellites at the expense of peace and continued life. ***
But, after the aggressors are defeated, that debris might prevent future space exploration.

Posted by: Cynic | Jun 9 2025 20:16 utc | 161

The most elegant asymmetrical move so far was the unilateral decision to return the 6000 dead bodies, causing panic in Kiev and great anger against Zelensky among families of the dead.
This out-of-the-box example can serve as an example of an asymmetric response – a killer move that is not immediately seen as a weapon until it is too late.
All you need is to figure out what it could be wrt. the bomber attack 🙂

Posted by: Norwegian | Jun 9 2025 20:17 utc | 162

persiflo | Jun 9 2025 18:58 utc | 109–
Thanks for your reply. Sadly, few here are thinking strategically and going after the genuine enemy actors, not the nation in which they hide. Officially, the SMO is now an ATO with the proper legislation pending at the Duma, although the outward changes are already visible on the streets as reported by those in Moscow. Examples of potential Russian actions can be found by looking at the Second Chechen War, which was an ATO. I’m off to view the video reports of those now in Moscow as I’ve given my input and it’s been mostly ignored. One of my Russian readers would like to see the return of SMERSH, and her opinion is shared by many.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 9 2025 20:18 utc | 163

Posted by: norecovery | Jun 9 2025 20:09 utc | 156
China might have an issue with a Kessler syndrome.
And with the world on the brink, the last thing you want is reduce players visibility. Unless things were quickly solved wwiii could be days/weeks away

Posted by: Newbie | Jun 9 2025 20:19 utc | 164

Russian General Staff does not need our input. But I’ll play.
They are already doing this, not nearly enough. Any NATO personnel, any mercs on ground in Ukraine need to know they have hours to live. No idea how targeting data for this is acquired but will suspect it can be done. No mercy, no questions about what this one or that one is doing. Just kill them all. And any idiot in general vicinity. Anyone who wants to associate with an American or a Brit or a German is fair game.
Also limit staff of all Western embassies in RF to a skeleton crew. No one with a whiff of CIA allowed. That alone would end most internal terror attacks.

Posted by: oldhippie | Jun 9 2025 20:21 utc | 165

Attack upon a NATO member is highly problematic because of Article 5.
But this relates to defense. As Britain is the terrorist aggressor and Russia is defending itself
does Article 5 still apply?
Posted by: Otto Penn | Jun 9 2025 15:55 utc | 2
Article 5 is nowhere near what it is made out to be by hysterical talking heads on cable TV “news”.
To whit:
The principle of providing assistance
With the invocation of Article 5, Allies can provide any form of assistance they deem necessary to respond to a situation. This is an individual obligation on each Ally and each Ally is responsible for determining what it deems necessary in the particular circumstances.
This assistance is taken forward in concert with other Allies. It is not necessarily military and depends on the material resources of each country. It is therefore left to the judgment of each individual member country to determine how it will contribute.
Ally: “I deem necessary a stern verbal admonishment”

Posted by: nwwoods | Jun 9 2025 20:23 utc | 166

In-flight reprogramming of Taurus missiles to make them return to their place of birth, boomerang style.

Posted by: Norwegian | Jun 9 2025 20:24 utc | 167

As to the citations of Article 5, afaik Article 5 does not generate a required response. It opens up the possibility to respond for NATO members. But is in essence still voluntary. I think it’s something like each member state can then respond as they “deem appropriate”.

Posted by: johan | Jun 9 2025 20:25 utc | 168

Honestly, I think that even more than the Americans, the Brits and perhaps the new Nazi regime in Germany bear much more responsibility for the serial provocations of Russia. Hitting British assets where it really hurts and add a smack on the German face would probably cool things down a bit.

Posted by: Steve | Jun 9 2025 20:27 utc | 169

“We have repeatedly emphasised that the use of such weapons is impossible without the direct participation of military specialists from the countries that produce these systems. I am referring to the receipt of satellite reconnaissance and surveillance data, the introduction of flight tasks, and so on.
Posted by: james | Jun 9 2025 19:59 utc | 152
Russia tends to leave this a little open in what they say to the public. I did read at one point that The Brits were using the small amount of French ISR for targeting of the scalp / storm shadow missiles. All of European nato have some military satellites up. US did for a week or so stop access to all US sat data until the Brits/Ukraine agreed to peace negotiations though that was restarted. With the British op against Russian strategic aviation, I’m a bit divided as to how much US input there was and at what levels. From everything I see, UK MI6 has developed a much larger network of assets in Russia than anything the CIA has.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jun 9 2025 20:29 utc | 170

Ooh a bollocks bingo game, What fun!
If the U2 Peshawar type bases are active anywhere in EurAsia they would be easy. Far from sight. Not in public domain. There probably are some. There are in Oz! Well out of sight.
U.K.’s most obvious targets are the bases in west Asia and Mediterranean. Cyprus with its long known monitoring stations and airfield from which much mischief is launched. Also Saudi Arabia, Aden etc.
That would actually kill two birds with one stone in a way – much Palestine genocide actions have come from there. And the Syrian attacks.
The most radical covering all the belligerents would be .,, Turkey! Which Erdo would be forced to blame on Kurds or crazed jihadists. That git needs replacing. He hasn’t stopped profiting for a decade.
Ultimately I don’t think a PR or news worthy propoganda strike is needed. That would spook the collective wasters. Especially right now the US is overtly turning away from the external to concentrate on plenty of navel gazong.
Then there is the hit on the individuals , MIC types who are striving to destroy the RF – a few of them having secret destruction would not even register on most peoples minds.
It’s probably a moot question anyway. Possibly the Dragon Bear and Iran mutual defence treaty will probably deliver the grabbing of the gonads and twisting.
Maybe even happening right now in London.
That would be Max Pressure Assymetric.

Posted by: DunGroanin | Jun 9 2025 20:30 utc | 171

Pay a delivery boy to insert rat poison in Lindsay Graham’s Chick-Fil-A order

Posted by: nwwoods | Jun 9 2025 20:33 utc | 172

That’s a loss of face and respect from Russia’s allies.
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 9 2025 19:34 utc | 137
I’m sorry, which of Russia’s major allies are materially supporting the Russian military? So far North Korea is sending forces, and the Russians gratefully embed them. But mere diplomatic support is underwhelming from allies who pledged “no limits” in their support. If anything, China and India are repeatedly cited as holding the Russians back from more decisive actions.
When Russian allies want to contribute to the cause, Russia might consider starting a new world war. Until then, I will be pleasantly surprised to see VVP simply bring justice to the opfor planners. Some of you are talking like Russian strategies need to be closer to the display in Gaza, and that is not likely.

Posted by: They Call Me Mister | Jun 9 2025 20:36 utc | 173

Ma Laoshi | Jun 9 2025 20:12 utc | 159
Syria – Putins stated intention when entering Syria. To destroy te terrorist groupings and not start new wars. Most wish Russia to be the policeman of the world, the comic book superhero running around putting out fires started by the anglo saxons.
Critical Syrian generals sold Syria out. Russian intelligence was aware of this and warned Assad. For Russia there was nothing to work with or support at that point. Along with Erdogan’s proxies, Turkey, US and Israel also attacked simultaneously. Russia chooses its battles and battlefields. I also would have liked to have seen a different outcome, but it is what it is.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jun 9 2025 20:37 utc | 174

Russia is on a safe path toward victory on the battlefield. It should follow this path without deviation, let alone responding to provocations. A strike on Diego Garcia would be an unnecessary risk – nobody knows what will come out of it. Problem is, while US involvement in the airfield attacks seems plausible to us, the same cannot be said about most Americans, including Trump.
After a strike at Diego Garcia, DJT will come under heavy pressure to retaliate. In addition, it will instantly erase all of the trust he used to have in Putin. DJT will be transformed forever, resulting in a new cold war (if we are lucky!).
No, this is clearly a case for the telephone, asking DJT to comment on whodunnit, and insisting as much as necessary until the Russian side is satisfied.
Diego Garcia does not run away. Reserve it for the day when US involvement in something big will be evident to everybody.

Posted by: grunzt | Jun 9 2025 20:38 utc | 175

@william gruff 114
Quite “maybe send it up the Thames? A sightseeing tour of Westminster for the drone before it does its job?
That sort of response would be properly asymmetrical, I should think.”
Right.
That is the
Minimum action required to kill as many English parasites as possible.

Posted by: Sam | Jun 9 2025 20:42 utc | 176

A taste of the UK’s own medicine would be a spectacularly lethal terrorist attack in the center of the City of London by proxy jihadists, providing plausible deniability but little room for doubt doubt that the order came from Moscow. The collective waste’s very own MO.

Posted by: nwwoods | Jun 9 2025 20:42 utc | 177

@nwwoods | Jun 9 2025 20:42 utc | 178
They blame everything – Novichok style – on the Russians. A terrorist attack that would prove them right would be counterproductive.

Posted by: Norwegian | Jun 9 2025 20:45 utc | 178

From the conversations ..
… sounds, at times, as if most patrons are on a mix of speed, lsd, and cocaine as they blow us all to kingdom come.
I’d close it out at 200.

Posted by: Don Firineach | Jun 9 2025 20:50 utc | 179

https://t.me/adinadesouzy/8947
We love the world.
We love peace.
And thus all anti-russian trolls are fucked. Especially sob and his followers.

Posted by: Naive | Jun 9 2025 20:51 utc | 180

grunzt | Jun 9 2025 20:38 utc | 176
I suspect the Russians will use the Hazel tree (can never remember the Russian word) in its response.
The American nationalist faction have been trying to separate the Russian from China prior to attacking China. A pipe dream but whatever. Russia in turn has been working on separating the American nationalists from Europe and the British anglo world.
Putin holding out the carrot of access to Russian resources was part of this. Russia has a far better chance of succeeding than the US. I believe this will also be factored in by Russia when choosing the targets and mode of response.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jun 9 2025 20:51 utc | 181

“But, after the aggressors are defeated, that debris might prevent future space exploration.”
Good news for the universe.

Posted by: Apollyon | Jun 9 2025 20:53 utc | 182

I think Putin should tell Ukraine that Kiev will be razed in “x” hours and then do it.
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 9 2025 18:48 utc | 103

Nope. No way.
Try rather to understand what Putin is saying here:
https://t.me/adinadesouzy/8947
“We do not answer to provocation.”
And Russia does not target civilians. Western people should learn to be patient. Time is working for Russia.

Posted by: Naive | Jun 9 2025 20:56 utc | 183

Russia is on a safe path toward victory on the battlefield. It should follow this path without deviation, let alone responding to provocations.
Posted by: grunzt | Jun 9 2025 20:38 utc | 176

E-x-a-c-t-l-y !

Posted by: Naive | Jun 9 2025 20:59 utc | 184

Jason | Jun 9 2025 20:43 utc | 179
Idiot. What is Iskander, Kinzal, Zircon, Kalibr ect ect. I believe the intermediate range treaty only covered land based systems with a range of between 500 and 5000 kilometers. It did not cover sea and air delivery systems.
Russia’s small frigates can traverse the inland wayter ways linking the baltic, caspian and black seas.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jun 9 2025 20:59 utc | 185

Shadowbanned used to be widely mocked here for arguing that Putin had to respond to provocations more aggressively, but that now seems to be the consensus here.
It’s hard to say what should be done, but I agree if they do nothing, then Russia will eventually fall.
So far Russia’s only escalation seems to have been to hit military targets in Ukraine, which is not an escalation.

Posted by: Afro | Jun 9 2025 21:02 utc | 186

Europe must be punished, US ignored after hybrid war between West, Russia — Medvedev

Posted by: Newbie | Jun 9 2025 18:23 utc | 82
This again? And all this time I thought we barflies remembered how the US initiated the conflict in Ukraine. Whatever punishments may be metted out in Europe, it’s not as if the (not agreement-capable) US can get off scot-free. I mean, if Europe as puppets of the USA were that belligerent toward Russia, how does it make the USA any less culpable?

Posted by: joey_n | Jun 9 2025 21:05 utc | 187

“Honestly, I think that even more than the Americans, the Brits and perhaps the new Nazi regime in Germany bear much more responsibility for the serial provocations of Russia. Hitting British assets where it really hurts and add a smack on the German face would probably cool things down a bit.”
Posted by: Steve
Don’t forget the French and the Dutch.
Damn, I hate the Dutch…
Everytime I see Rutte’s grinning face, I want to smash it with a baseball bat.

Posted by: Apollyon | Jun 9 2025 21:05 utc | 188

OK, lets wind things back.
Time has an escalatory quality all of its own. What has been blown up cannot be un-blown up.
Who is blowing more stuff up? Over a longer period of time?

Posted by: Jeremy Rhymings-Lang | Jun 9 2025 21:10 utc | 189

Blowing up all NATO personnel in Ukraine would be good, but Russia has already been doing that.
What about blowing up all statues to Bandera? It’s a good start on denazifying Ukraine. Maybe it would inspire Banderists to go to the front, instead of sitting behind the conscripts.

Posted by: wagelaborer | Jun 9 2025 21:11 utc | 190

Sadly, there is nothing the Russians can do that they are likely to do that will dissuade the West from continuing to throw sucker punches from outside the ring.
Posted by: William Gruff | Jun 9 2025 19:28 utc | 131

You don’t know, but the Russians know and they are doing it. Putin does everything to avoid a WW3. But the moment the Russians will understand that it is unavoidable, they will act first.
Now the western leaders are cowards. They ask for a truce. They hide the fact that there are already western soldiers in Ukraine and when they are killed, they pay the families to keep silent. And most important they can do nothing against the strategy of the Russian Army.

Posted by: Naive | Jun 9 2025 21:11 utc | 191

Suppose those naughty RF hackers ‘leak’ a Grok (it has to be Grok) generated video of Elensky expounding in great and lascivious detail what Elon told him of Donald’s adventures on Epstein island.
Media mayhem for at least 24 hours.

Posted by: ChatNPC | Jun 9 2025 21:12 utc | 192

Posted by: Afro | Jun 9 2025 21:02 utc | 188
Shadowbanned used to be widely mocked here for arguing that Putin had to respond to provocations more aggressively, but that now seems to be the consensus here.

Typical western mentality. Impatience and aggression.
It’s hard to say what should be done, but I agree if they do nothing, then Russia will eventually fall.
Nope. That is typical of concern troll.
It is hard for you, not for the Russians, they know and they will do it.
So far Russia’s only escalation seems to have been to hit military targets in Ukraine, which is not an escalation.
The escalation will be to organise referenda in Kharkov, Sumy, Dniepropetrovsk, Nikolaiev and Odessa. And Transnistria.

Posted by: Naive | Jun 9 2025 21:18 utc | 193

Western/Westphalia culture is to always attack. Russia is the place where west meets east. All Ruussia has had to do is park itself in Russian Ukraine and their enemies come to them on the battlefield of Russia’s choosing.
Russia is very effectively destroying those enemies from a defensive position. The arguments to either pre-emptive attack or defend prior to operation citadel – Stalin chose to destroy the German offensive from defensive positions. Something very much to be taken into account when looking at current Russian strategy.
The clowns say Russia is weak because it fights from a defensive position…. In MMA, trash talk is largely an American thing. Since 2023 three and the failed vaunted southern offensive that Russia destroyed from physical defensive position, the has been a number of brit propaganda offensives that Russia has also destroyed.
Its as is many want some sort of bragging rights and want to see Russia doing something spectacular rather than the methodical and humdrum destruction of its enemies. Winning small battles and winning wars are two different things.
The west is winning in propaganda and the brainwashing of its own populations, but Russia is winning the actual war against Kissinger’s Westphalia.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jun 9 2025 21:27 utc | 194

The counter-attack could well be launched against Ukraine, according to the motto “hit the sack and mean the donkey”.
Some possibilities:
– Destruction of the Ukrainian central bank and its bunkers
– Destruction of all Dnieper bridges
– Destruction of the Kiev railroad station
– Blowing up the Kiev dam
– Symbolic detonation of a nuclear bomb in space over Ukraine
– Elimination of Starlink and other Western satellites
– Sinking of American aircraft carrier by Huthis
– Oreschniks on British bases (Cyprus, Gibraltar, etc.)
– Mass assassination of NATO generals, eeapons industry managers, etc.

Posted by: xblob | Jun 9 2025 21:28 utc | 195

The most elegant asymmetrical move so far was the unilateral decision to return the 6000 dead bodies, causing panic in Kiev and great anger against Zelensky among families of the dead.
Posted by: Norwegian | Jun 9 2025 20:17 utc | 163
######
Agreed. Too many here want to be clever rather than direct, IMO.
Ex.
Kill Zelensky’s wife…
Take out some UK assets, that, as JRL mentioned, they may not even notice.
The point is to re-establish nuclear deterrence. That is the ONLY reason to make an attack. Not revenge, not to punish. To stress Russian power and seriousness.
Anything that does less is very dangerous for the world. If the Russians make a weak move or a move that goes unnoticed, then NATO will be emboldened further.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 9 2025 21:30 utc | 196

Meanwhile, at the NATO bar…
Rutte has just explained that the only way for NATO to survive is to take advantage of the opportunity that Putin does not want to attack NATO now, but only in a few years, 3 to 5.
So, Rutte says that there is only one way out: we put all of NATO into a WAR ECONOMY now, and in 3 to 5 years we will surprise Putin!
Believe it or not!
https://eadaily.com/en/news/2025/06/09/rutte-called-the-time-when-russia-can-attack-nato

Posted by: Elber | Jun 9 2025 21:30 utc | 197

A”>https://www.europarl.europa.eu/RegData/etudes/ATAG/2022/739250/EPRS_ATA(2022)739250_EN.pdf”>A comparative analysis of Article 5 Washington Treaty (NATO) and Article 42(7) TEU (EU)
Article 5 of the 1949 North Atlantic Treaty is considered the cornerstone of the NATO Alliance, embodying its ‘one for all, and all for one’ spirit. When one of the 30 (soon to be 32) NATO members falls victim to an armed attack, all other members must come to that state’s assistance. This assistance may include the use of armed force. When the treaty was negotiated, in 1948 and1949, the western European nations favoured an article implying an automatic and unqualified commitment of the US to defend Europe. The US, however, feared that such a strong wording would automatically engage them in European wars, something Congress”>https://www.nato.int/docu/review/articles/2006/06/01/negotiating-article-5/index.html”>Congress did not want to accept. The negotiations ended in a compromise: the security guarantee was laid down in a formal treaty (a European demand), but embedded in an Article 5 formulation that does not imply automatic US involvement in an armed conflict (an American demand), and is strengthened by Article 11.
[…]

Approval U.S. Congress is still needed to go to war for NATO in Europe.

Posted by: Oui | Jun 9 2025 21:36 utc | 198

Unfortunately there’s nothing Russia can do because, evidently, its intelligence gathering services and assets aren’t up to snuff. But assuming they were, it should make a weapon of truth: e.g. providing significant information indicative of Israel state actors’/ foreknowledge of Oct 7. Obviously this isn’t remotely kinetic in its effects, but would make of the Russian state a purveyor par excellence of deep truth, no Orwellian strings attached.

Posted by: Ludovic | Jun 9 2025 21:38 utc | 199

#1-Per Larry Johnson and others, CIA and MI6 operatives are located in the same buildings that the SBU resides in. Also there are supposedly 20 CIA bases hidden in Ukraine that are used in efforts to undermine/damage Russia. There is probably some “understandings” between Nato/USA and Russia not to hit these resources in setting boundaries of the war. If RU were to hit a significant number of them, during working hours while agents are there, it would be a strong signal, and would interfere with the activities that allow planning of similar types of strikes on the RUF.
#2- Declare the Black Sea a no fly zone, then back it up with actions when ISR aircraft violate it.
Keeps the actions in the bounds of Ukraine.

Posted by: Norsk Borscht | Jun 9 2025 21:39 utc | 200