Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
April 26, 2025

Virginia Giuffre 'Quiteted'

Jeffrey Epstein was an Israeli agent tasked with blackmailing U.S. politicians and business people by providing them with under-age girls. Virginia Giuffre, then 17, was on of those victims.

Epstein was jailed and, on August 10 2019, found dead in his cell. I headlined:

Epstein Suicided

Unsurprisingly Jeffrey Epstein was found dead, presumably by suicide, as that is what 'officials' claim:

Jailed multimillionaire financier and accused sex trafficker Jeffrey Epstein has died by suicide, according to two law enforcement sources. ...
Just yesterday a court released the first 2,000 pages of a civil case against Epstein's madame, Ghislaine Maxwell:
[Epstein victim Virginia Roberts Giuffre], who turned 36 on Friday, names a number of other men in politics, academia and business that she says she was directed to have sex with. In a 2017 interview with the Miami Herald, Giuffre said that Epstein wanted her to please various influential people then so that he could learn about their sexual peccadilloes and use them as leverage if he needed to.

While there’s no direct evidence contained in the court record substantiating her accounts with prominent men, Giuffre did provide testimony and evidence to corroborate her claims of exploitation at the hands of Epstein and Maxwell through photographs, plane logs and even a medical record from Presbyterian Hospital in New York where Giuffre was taken by Epstein after a particularly abusive sex episode.

I concluded the post with this:

Some of those influential people who Epstein, or the organization behind him, blackmailed, will be quite happy that he is gone. They will now try to bury the rest of the case. Giuffre and other witnesses better watch their backs.

Today we learn that Virginia Giuffre is dead (archived):

Ms. Giuffre (pronounced JIFF-ree) died by suicide, according to a statement by the family. She wrote in an Instagram post in March that she was days away from dying of renal failure after being injured in an automobile crash with a school bus that she said was traveling at nearly 70 miles per hour.

This is curious.

Potential renal failure in March is supposed to be the cause for a suicide in late April? Why is the NY Times insinuating this?

We have dialysis to counter renal failure and hundreds of thousands survive with it. Then there are kidney transplants. Giuffre was 40 years old. One does not die of kidney failure at that age. It is not a reason to suicide oneself.

Consider this:

Virginia Giuffre @VRSVirginia - 3:32 UTC · Dec 11, 2019

I am making it publicy known that in no way, shape or form am I sucidal. I have made this known to my therapist and GP- If something happens to me- in the sake of my family do not let this go away and help me to protect them. Too many evil people want to see me quiteted

Posted by b on April 26, 2025 at 15:42 UTC | Permalink

Comments
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Laura from Normal Island News provides the appropriate sarcasm:
Virginia Giuffre, the woman who was trafficked by Jeffrey Epstein when she was a child and raped by rich and powerful men who have never been brought to justice, has died.

Giuffre predicted her own death weeks ago when the intelligence agent running her Instagram announced she was in a car crash and had days to live, thanks to kidney failure. When the internet said they’d heard this story before, another cause of death was chosen: suicide.

Prince Andrew is delighted that a woman he has never met has generously left him £12 million in his will. In a bizarre coincidence, Giuffre was one of 250 victims of Andrew’s best friend, Jeffrey Epstein.

If you’ve forgotten, Epstein was the sex trafficker who switched off the cameras in his prison before taking his own life and getting his body whisked away by unknown individuals in a manner which defied protocol and was non-suspicious.

Epstein’s relationship to Mossad had nothing to do with his “suicide”. The people named in Epstein’s little black book definitely weren’t massively relieved. Just know that if you link Epstein and Giuffre with Prince Andrew, you will be sent to the Tower of London.

Predictably, the internet is already rife with conspiracy theories. One popular theory is that Giuffre did not commit suicide and was, in fact, whisked away to a tropical island to live out her days with Princess Diana.

The conspiracy theorists are pointing to a social media post where Giuffre insisted she was not suicidal, and that if she was ever found dead, it was not suicide. Honestly, these conspiracy theorists will put two and two together and make 12.

A spokesperson for the royal family said: "Prince Andrew is saddened by Giuffre’s death, but confident her suicide means no more witnesses will dare come forward". I trust you find this satisfactory and agree there is definitely nothing to see here. You can get on with your day now x

Posted by: Peter b | Apr 26 2025 15:55 utc | 1

Posted by b on April 26, 2025 at 15:42 UTC | Permalink

Not a month ago she was rammed by a school-bus doing over 110 km/h

Bad things happen to those that dare disturb TPTB

Posted by: Newbie | Apr 26 2025 16:01 utc | 2

Thank you B for highlighting this most significant story.

Posted by: Exile | Apr 26 2025 16:03 utc | 3

most unfortunate... thanks for sharing your views directly or indirectly..

since when did the powerful and wealthy ever call the shots?? lol.. hopefully we continue to challenge this on a regular basis.. those with a vested interest in hiding things are really the unsavory characters they are.. the truth will eventually come out..

Posted by: james | Apr 26 2025 16:04 utc | 4

The corruption/lawlessness is right out in the open for all to see, yet the public is asleep/doesn't care.

Posted by: silverfoxes | Apr 26 2025 16:07 utc | 5

Some international analysts are wondering if Trump is being blackmailed: could this be related?

Posted by: Curious | Apr 26 2025 16:11 utc | 6

In Europe the Czech Republic is Germanys "€pstein island":
https://www.irishtimes.com/culture/welcome-to-the-child-sex-capital-of-europe-1.339827

Posted by: p3t3r | Apr 26 2025 16:13 utc | 7

In Europe the Czech Republic is Germanys "€pstein island":
https://www.irishtimes.com/culture/welcome-to-the-child-sex-capital-of-europe-1.339827

Posted by: p3t3r | Apr 26 2025 16:13 utc | 7

Out of the catastrophic 1990s, not sure it's still the same...

Posted by: Newbie | Apr 26 2025 16:18 utc | 8

The corruption/lawlessness is right out in the open yet, the public is asleep/doesn't care - silverfoxes 5

I don't think this is true, in much of the EU any sign of concern and you'll be thrown into prison. And in the US...well, here's an example:

"Seth Rich was murdered on July 10, 2016, in Washington, D.C., after being shot twice in the back during what DC-police believe was an attempted robbery".

A robbery in which nothing was stolen... The 3LAs hidden hand that everybody knows is there.

Posted by: S Brennan | Apr 26 2025 16:19 utc | 9

Literally everything Israel related has for at least 80 years been the subject of national security obfuscation.
Israel has been granted full pre-emptive immunity even when it attacks the American state, let alone anything else.
Israel acts with blanket impunity: Literally nothing can prevail against any Israeli act, almost like the powers that be actually operate in terms of them being the chosen people after all.

Posted by: Webej | Apr 26 2025 16:38 utc | 10

Monkey Werx had lots of names of people who flew on the Lolita, but that in and of itself is not an admission of wrong doing, and as he points out, no one will ever get charged regardless.

Cheers M

....the flight logs were released but so much was redacted, important names.....bit of mockery, especially for all the victims.....

Posted by: sean the leprechaun | Apr 26 2025 16:44 utc | 11

Certainly Virginia Giuffre was not the only person Epstein and Company silenced. There must be a pile of corpses.

Posted by: too scents | Apr 26 2025 16:48 utc | 12

Maybe they could bury her next to Karen Silkwood.

Posted by: Eighthman | Apr 26 2025 16:54 utc | 13

Posted by: Newbie | Apr 26 2025 16:18 utc | 8
It's been Kiev since 2014 and not only Europe. It surpassed Phnom Penh that very same year for kiddie diddler capital.

Posted by: Badjoke | Apr 26 2025 16:59 utc | 14

Jeffrey Epstein, former hedge fund manager convicted of sex trafficking in 2008, described as "an enthusiastic member of the Trilateral Commission" in 2002[32][33][34][35]

The Trilateral Commission is a nongovernmental international organization aimed at fostering closer cooperation between Japan, Western Europe and North America.[1] It was founded in July 1973, principally by American banker and philanthropist David Rockefeller, an internationalist[2] who sought to address the challenges posed by the growing economic and political interdependence between the U.S. and its allies in North America, Western Europe, and Japan.[

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trilateral_Commission

Posted by: Paul from Norway | Apr 26 2025 17:05 utc | 15

Ghislaine Maxwell in jail for trafficking minors to nobody......

(Jimmy Saville, Marc Dutroux....... )

I hope this finds you well

Posted by: ockham | Apr 26 2025 17:13 utc | 16

No surprise. We all knew this was coming and so did the victims.

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Apr 26 2025 17:20 utc | 17

Thanks for posting this one, B. I heard about it from someone a day or two ago and immediately drew the same conclusion. Doesn't take much effort, really if one can simply accept that Epstein was murdered. Where's old Ghislain now? I suppose she is the only person could spill the beans now. But really, she probably knows she'd be murdered in her cell too, which would certainly be explained to us as another tragic suicide.

Like the genocide, this is all done brazenly before our eyes. They either have legitimate confidence they can always get away with it or they have deluded themselves into thinking this. I think the latter is most likely if you just look at their other recently exploded delusions about the collapse of "weak" Russia and tariffs bringing China to its knees.

Can't wait until their delusions about their loyal wage slaves burst.

Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Apr 26 2025 17:24 utc | 18

Maurene Comey who is James Comey's Daughter was the Lead Prosecutor in Ghislaine Maxwell's Trial..

So, a Hillary/Obama apparatchik's daughter was handed the case to silence Ghislaine Maxwell...

Posted by: S Brennan | Apr 26 2025 17:28 utc | 19

Virginia Giuffre didn't kill herself. Obviously Trump returning to power is enabling the final coverup of Epstein.

Posted by: hecatompylos | Apr 26 2025 17:30 utc | 20

Eventually someone who said they weren't suicidal was likely to off themselves. Virginia was not a happy lady. Abused as a girl, worked as a whore (which can e very psychologically hard on women), and was recently estranged from her family, including a restraining order. On top of that she was overweight and no longer attractive.

She was damaged goods. Very easy to believe she killed herself, versus some sort of sooper seekrit conspiracy theory.

Posted by: Anonymous | Apr 26 2025 17:34 utc | 21

I have limited sympathy for Ms Giuffre. Historically speaking, some girls have chosen freelance prostitution as a convenient way to make a better-than-average living with flexible working hours.

Having made that choice, before she met Maxwell and Epstein, it wouldn't have been difficult to charm her into believing that they were helping her to move up-market. She was probably dazzled by the money and jet-set lifestyle and 'forgot' to focus on her long-term future.

It reminds me of some lines from the song You're Still The Same:

You always said the cards would never do you wrong.
The trick you said was never play the game too long.

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Apr 26 2025 17:35 utc | 22

Giuffre and Epstein reunited. Heaven? Hell? Small Middle Eastern ethno-state?

Posted by: Charlie | Apr 26 2025 17:39 utc | 23

File Under WTF:

"Obviously, Trump is enabling the final coverup of Epstein" hecatompylos-20

Yeah sure, obvious only to those with an advanced case of TDS. More likely done because Patel will soon degrade the ability of the 3LAs to operate with complete impunity.

"they were helping her to move up-market "Hoarsewhisperer - 22

MS Virginia Giuffre was hospitalized on two separate occasions by Epstein's clients.

"Up-market my ass, the whole operation was an attempt by English/Israeli/DC's 3LAs to get blackmail material intended to thwart the will of the vast majority of people.

And big clue here, normal sex is not blackmail material.

Posted by: S Brennan | Apr 26 2025 17:48 utc | 24

Maurene Comey who is James Comey's Daughter was the Lead Prosecutor in Ghislaine Maxwell's Trial..

So, a Hillary/Obama apparatchik's daughter was handed the case to silence Ghislaine Maxwell...

Posted by: S Brennan | Apr 26 2025 17:28 utc | 19

Fun facts! Thanks, Brennan.

Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Apr 26 2025 17:48 utc | 25

From three weeks ago:

Police later said they received a report of a "minor crash" between a school bus and a car in Neergabby, about 12 miles north of Perth, on 24 March.

A spokesperson said the collision was reported by the bus driver the following day, and there were no reported injuries.


It's also unclear who her "family" were who made a couple of statements lately, when it's reported that she had three small children, a failed marriage and she was charged with breaching a family violence restraining order. She lived in Western Australia, a long way from the USA where she was from.

It's too soon to say for sure what happened, but in general these stories of disappearance or suicide are not meant to be convincing - in fact they are so unconvincing that seem to be intended to send a message to anyone who might think of spilling the beans about anything too politically sensitive.

Posted by: Brendan | Apr 26 2025 17:55 utc | 26

She was damaged goods. Very easy to believe she killed herself, versus some sort of sooper seekrit conspiracy theory.

Posted by: Anonymous | Apr 26 2025 17:34 utc | 21

And generally a very weak day for her, she's currently in a morgue drawer at 160 cm so less than 5 cms this last day.

At this rate she'll be 6 feet under only by the end of june.

She is sure to rot before she gets buried.

-----------------

Giuffre and Epstein reunited. Heaven? Hell? Small Middle Eastern ethno-state?

Posted by: Charlie | Apr 26 2025 17:39 utc | 23

------------------

too old...

Posted by: Newbie | Apr 26 2025 17:59 utc | 27

...
And big clue here, normal sex is not blackmail material.

Posted by: S Brennan | Apr 26 2025 17:48 utc | 24

#22 is my opinion.
Your opinion differs from mine.
That's OK.

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Apr 26 2025 18:06 utc | 28

Trump will release the Epstein list any day now. LOL

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Apr 26 2025 18:07 utc | 29

Never forget that Epstein was an Israeli and a neighbor of Howard Lutnick, whose son now lives in one of Epstein's former residences.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Apr 26 2025 18:17 utc | 30

I'm amazed Maxwell is still alive, but that may not last...

Posted by: Waldorf | Apr 26 2025 18:25 utc | 31

Someone must have it in for the King and his brother given that so many of those close to them meet unnatural deaths: Diana, Jeffrey, Virginia.

Is this the long arm of Mr Putin at work?

Posted by: Paul Cockshot | Apr 26 2025 18:27 utc | 32

@ Paul Cockshot | Apr 26 2025 18:27 utc | 32

If there’s a conspiracy behind those most unnatural deaths, the British Royal Family makes for immensely more compelling suspects.

Posted by: malenkov | Apr 26 2025 18:36 utc | 33

too scents @ 12

Of course there is a pile of bodies. The Lolita age victims are occasionally public arm candy and get our attention. The large majority of victims are small children and are expendable

Posted by: oldhippie | Apr 26 2025 18:51 utc | 34

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Apr 26 2025 17:35 utc | 22

If that wasn't parody then you're a fucking moron. Actually read up on the case. The girl was under aged and tricked into being trafficked by Epstein's people. FFS have some decency.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Apr 26 2025 19:06 utc | 35

Posted by: hecatompylos | Apr 26 2025 17:30 utc | 20

Likely or at least very much possible.

She was damaged goods. Very easy to believe she killed herself, versus some sort of sooper seekrit conspiracy theory.

Posted by: Anonymous | Apr 26 2025 17:34 utc | 21

Also very easy to dismiss any comment from random, generic, aNOnYMOoSE handles. Or tie them to KunTSpirATorSZ

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Apr 26 2025 19:09 utc | 36

Trump was just as much of a friend and business partner of Epstein as Bill Clinton. No amount of QAnon drivel can change this fact.

Posted by: hecatompylos | Apr 26 2025 19:25 utc | 37

We still dont know what was found on Epstein's private island or in his New Mexico mansion. How many corpses?

Kubrick's Eyes wide shut was most certainly about Epstein and his gang. Some actors even look like some if the main culprits (Victoria's secret and the Harvard law prof).

Posted by: Tom | Apr 26 2025 19:31 utc | 38

Thanks for bringing this to our attention. Buried in the noise, I would probably never have known unless I would perform a targeted search. Seems more like a message to other past, recent and future victims of such "high" clientèle pedo rings to have them keep silent.

Posted by: xor | Apr 26 2025 19:41 utc | 39

Note the obvious Establishment spokespeople arriving to reinforce the bogus suicide narrative. Any minute now the budget Louis Proyect replacement will be in to also argue how suicide is so much more reasonable than termination by the spook agencies for whom assassination is a large part of their mandate from the Empire.

Posted by: William Gruff | Apr 26 2025 19:48 utc | 40

Good time to remember others silenced by the Empire, like Seth Rich, who we are supposed to believe was killed in a "botched" mugging.

Note how all of the Mockingbird mass media used to term "botched" to describe Rich's assassination. Almost like they all got the same memo...

Posted by: William Gruff | Apr 26 2025 19:58 utc | 41

Posted by William Gruff | Apr 26 2025 19:58 utc | 41

Almost like they all got the same memo...

They do all get the same memo. That's how you recognize them. And they are potty trained to communicate the memo, with zero critical thought. Zero distance. Even the Ukrainian Cardinal, Mikola Bichok, attending the upcoming council in Rome, is using exactly the same talking points as Macron or Stammer, concerning Ukraine. That's how you know he was planted there, for a purpose.

Posted by: Shahmaran | Apr 26 2025 20:13 utc | 42

Okay, there are clearly a majority of male commentators, who are happy to just dish it out. A women died, whose life got sucked into exploitation of herself and others whether at times willingly or not.
It is just sad and I feel sorry for her children. Hopefully she was able to squeeze some cash out of the bastards.

Posted by: Women | Apr 26 2025 20:35 utc | 43

Posted by: William Gruff | Apr 26 2025 19:58 utc | 41

Chomsky pointed out how all the media called the SMO “totally unprovoked” in every western news report as though it was mandated in a widely circulated memo.
Again with Navalny who was universally characterized in the west as “Putin’s #1 political rival”, despite the fact that the record shows that it only could get elected dog catcher, but 60% of Russians had never heard of the guy.

Posted by: nwwoods | Apr 26 2025 20:44 utc | 44

Posted by: William Gruff | Apr 26 2025 19:58 utc | 41

Chomsky pointed out how all the media called the SMO “totally unprovoked” in every western news report as though it was mandated in a widely circulated memo.
Again with Navalny who was universally characterized in the west as “Putin’s #1 political rival”, despite the fact that the record shows that it only could get elected dog catcher, but 60% of Russians had never heard of the guy.

Posted by: nwwoods | Apr 26 2025 20:44 utc | 45

1. There’s almost zero probability that the real Ghislaine is in prison.

2. Wtf are the Epstein lists which potus 47 promised would be published.

3. The Collective Waste.

4. From The River To The Sea.

Posted by: DunGroanin | Apr 26 2025 20:55 utc | 46

“ She was damaged goods. Very easy to believe she killed herself, versus some sort of sooper seekrit conspiracy theory.

Posted by: Anonymous | Apr 26 2025 17:34 utc | 21”

cringe

Posted by: anob | Apr 26 2025 20:56 utc | 47

Shahmaran @42: "They do all get the same memo."

and

nwwoods @45: "Chomsky pointed out how all the media called the SMO “totally unprovoked”..."

Yeah, I was being snide. I realize the mass media actually do get direction from the keyboardist/conductor of the "Mighty Wurlitzer". Frequent verbatim repetition of key phrases is important for planting false narratives. Whenever you see the mass media chanting in unison like that then you can be certain the spook agencies have fired up their brainwashing machine.

Thanks for expanding on the point.

Posted by: William Gruff | Apr 26 2025 21:05 utc | 48

Hoarse whisperer @ 22:

Virginia Giuffre's Wikipedia entry states that she grew up in an unstable family environment and at thecage of seven years was molested by someone who knew her family. Giuffre eventually ran away from home to escape further abuse, including sexual abuse. At age 14, she was reunited with her father who got her a job at Donald Trump's Mar-a-Lago estate as a spa attendant. It was there that Ghislaine Maxwell found Giuffre reading a book on massage therapy, and made an offer promising training, employment and a better future to the teenager.

If you have read this far, you now know that apologising to the bar for your remark @ 22 is in order.

You are still free to have little or no sympathy for Giuffre and other girls like her who had histories of family violence and family break-up, abuse and/or living in poverty, and who were desperately looking for help and an opportunity to improve their lives, only to fall victim to a cunning and manipulative procurer.

Posted by: Refinnejenna | Apr 26 2025 21:08 utc | 49

anob @47: "cringe"

Yeah, it is such a surprise that the cheerleader for the Ukro-Nazis shows up to trash-talk the Empire's assassination victim. Never saw that coming!

/s

Posted by: William Gruff | Apr 26 2025 21:11 utc | 50

@21 hoarsewhisperer
I guess we all know who you’re working for, Nazis, oligarchs & landlords!

Posted by: Dougdiggler | Apr 26 2025 21:13 utc | 51

Now that I mentioned Giuffre's Mar-a-Lago connection, what is the likelihood that she had to be silenced for the benefit of the Trump administration and the eventual release (on the assumption that it will happen) of the full or partial lists of those who were guests at Jeffrey Epstein's private island resort? And would her silencing be a warning to the other women who had been exploited by Epstein and Maxwell?

Posted by: Refinnejenna | Apr 26 2025 21:16 utc | 52

#21

Virginia Roberts Giuffre went to court and testified. There are many others, who could but have chosen not to. Now she is dead and instead of praise there is condemnation.

Posted by: Women | Apr 26 2025 21:22 utc | 53

Spain is bad also, with complicit bureaucracy.

Posted by: Ornot | Apr 26 2025 21:24 utc | 54

We'll never truly find out what Epstein was up to but it was a lot more serious than has been revealed in the media. Anyone who has some experience of life knows that millionaires and billionaires weren't flying to the Caribbean for a happy ending massage.

If there was sexual blackmail it related to acts that rich men can't access in London, Monte Carlo, New York or Miami. I tend to think that sexual blackmail was only a small part of the operation and the main aspect was promoting the careers of politicians, scientists and academics in return for promoting and working for the Zionist and Transhumanist agenda.

Posted by: SB | Apr 26 2025 21:29 utc | 55

FFS have some decency.
@ Tom_Q_Collins | Apr 26 2025 19:06 utc | 35

Excellent call, TQC. Probably futile, but someone had to say it.

Posted by: Aleph_Null | Apr 26 2025 21:39 utc | 56

Brendan (26th Apr 2025 17h55 GMT): ...but in general these stories ... are not meant to be convincing - in fact they are so unconvincing that seem to be intended to send a message to ...

This control/threat point of Brendan's is well stated, and one which even many who are sensitive to conspiracies apparently fail to grasp: that it is not that they are trying to cover up and only get discovered or suspected thanks to leaks or slip-ups. Not only do they not care what is seen. They deliberate plan to flaunt the idiotic. ... And they observe.

As silverfoxes says (at 16h07 GMT): ...The corruption/ lawlessness is right out in the open for all to see, ... There is a deeper purpose than the simply warning / threat. Testing how far they can push gullibility to retain something like majority obedience. Boston was a classic instance of gullibility testing, not only the event itself, also the chase and prison-style `lockdown` (of an educated citizenry) that followed the event. Also other events around that time were clearly testing gullibility. Lessons being learnt cumulatively are applied at each next stage. Need not mention the more recent and massive event (this being MoA). Conspiracies do not need to be hidden at all, provided they retain a certain proportion of gullibles, which need not be a majority, provided the perspicacious are divided along other lines.

Posted by: petra | Apr 26 2025 21:44 utc | 57

I doubt that she "had to be terminated". Ghislaine Maxwell is still with us as far as I know. OTOH Epstein was apparently killed.

Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Apr 26 2025 21:50 utc | 58

Some barflies, it seems, have not yet learned to approach the wiki with a proverbial ten-foot pole. As practically everything becomes partisan controversy, it gets more and more difficult to locate epistemological categories in which the wiki is not a fruitless wasteland. For a textbook example of the operational limits of thought in the wiki, see their page on "Christian Zionism." There's some weird and wondrously straightjacketed exposition, in that hackneyed old tin-wiki.

Posted by: Aleph_Null | Apr 26 2025 21:55 utc | 59

I’m surprised she survived this long.
Speaking out was always risky, and she would know that.
Courage.
Met with indifference, betrayal, and let’s be real, murder.
I had not realised she’d located herself in Western Australia.
Such places always seem so far away, removed and remote.
Safe. Huh-no.
The 5eyes see all, and the octopus squid can reach everywhere.
Western Australia, with its vast emptiness and small population, means the “6 degrees of separation” are reduced to about 2.5.
I know, I grew up in a small locality, where almost everyone knew someone who knew someone who knew everything about you, back at least 3-4 generations.
Western Australia is now a hotbed of U$ and 5eye activity. Lots of capacity for covert movement in an out of Australia, and lots of unseen unknown activities in remote, barely, inhabited regions, especially as more and more U$ bases and installations spring up from the red rocks.
She was no safer in WA than she would have been in NYC, or … Arkansas.
Poor girl/ woman.
And she was just one name/face of a centuries-long trade in human flesh.
With the global cabal racing to Rome, it’s worth remembering that the catholic clergy are world leaders in exploitation, and sexual depravity, especially against children and the vulnerable.

Posted by: Melaleuca | Apr 26 2025 22:01 utc | 60

petra (w.r.t. 21h44 GMT)... There are plenty of analogies, one that strikes me is the way the [former] working class, having had in the 80s-90s their coal mines, flour and textile and paper mills, shipyards and steelworks and type foundries dismantled, destroyed or shipped abroad, were disarmed by the baubles of easy mortgages and title deeds; defanged by the promise or realisation of fixed property.

Posted by: petra | Apr 26 2025 22:01 utc | 61

Melaleuca (26th Apr 2025, tennish, pm, GMT). ...more and more U$ bases and installations spring up from the red rocks...

Sad, the Americanisation of Australia, particularly when you consider where they were before the turn of the century and pnac really took off. Hope they can observe Canada's pushback and find some spunk.

Posted by: petra | Apr 26 2025 22:14 utc | 62

Maxwell
Is Mossad royalty. Her father, Robert, was seemingly despatched off his yacht.
He pissed off someone higher up the food chain and paid the price.
But Jizzlaine has been central to The Operation from adolescence.
Her sisters are embedded in online tracking espionage… she’s protected.
No one is 100% safe. But jizzlaine has people and resources protecting her.

Posted by: Melaleuca | Apr 26 2025 22:14 utc | 63

Hope they can observe Canada's pushback and find some spunk.
Posted by: petra | Apr 26 2025 22:14 utc | 62
Nah. No hope.
South Australia and the Northern Territory saw what was happening in Western Australia and said: “please, can we have some of that too
Everyone loves yankee dollars here. Nomenclature is “investment” and “partnerships”.
Edith Cowan University in Western Australia is now almost totally owned by “U$ interests”.
The Chinese, who’d taken a 99-year lease on the Port of Darwin (and the govt had lapped up the money) have now been forced out by a U$ campaign.
Not too hard to agitate the aussies against China. …
- —
Ukraine in the South Pacific, that’s us…

Posted by: Melaleuca | Apr 26 2025 22:23 utc | 64

Excellent call, TQC. Probably futile, but someone had to say it.

Posted by: Aleph_Null | Apr 26 2025 21:39 utc | 56

Well called by you as well. TQC is one of the reasons MOA is my first Port of call.

Posted by: Menz | Apr 26 2025 22:41 utc | 65

@57 petra

Brandon Smith explained it clearly a long while back, well before Gaza, when describing politicians openly flaunting law and responsibility, that it was purposefully projected to show how much say they (via gov) actually have, where the say lies. In other words to destroy credibility in any kind of pre-existing decent order, to make society feel redundant or complicit for its unwillingness or inability to act, where the show of corrupt authority is worn as a badge of superiority.

US society is so polarised that it cheers on whichever partisan leader in such pursuit, just so as to be able to demean the other (equally corrupt) party.

That has all partly morphed into some kind of world political hierarchy, as clearly noticed with sarscov2 and now Palestine, amongst other.

That is not to say the hierarchy is orderly, where it seems disordered it might be ordered, and where appearing ordered in fact disordered, such is the nature of competition at this level.

I don't know, but the lack of credibility and lowering of moral standards of modern politics appears to be a very destructive and illusory path.

Before, societies knew at least what they were and what stood or was to be rejected. Now it is all off into some kind of post experimental impro with societies losing their most basic of foundation.

Anyway, as I mentioned Brandon, let's go and place a link to his latest article. Here it is expulsion over pro Palestine, but the 'services' also participate in other politically sponsored bureaucratic persecution, i.e. do also go after and 'take'/abduct people's children. This is an established and little contested form of legal control (using fear) that is much closer for many in the west.

https://brandonsmith.com/2025/04/14/the-first-white-river-abductee/

Posted by: Ornot | Apr 26 2025 22:51 utc | 66

Media Mockingbirds sing the same chorus:
John Pilger's {RIP} Tips For Seeing Through Propaganda

Journalist John Pilger explains how to see through propaganda, especially the most dangerous of all, which is the propaganda that claims to be "objective reporting."
John Pilger has written dozens of books, including Heroes, Hidden Agendas, and Freedom Next Time. He's made over 60 documentaries, including Vietnam: The Quiet Mutiny, Year Zero: The Silent Death of Cambodia, The Secret Country: The First Australians Fight Back, The War You Don't See, The Coming War on China. He has appeared as a contributor on BBC Television Australia, BBC Radio, BBC World Service, London Broadcasting, ABC Television, ABC Radio Australia, among others, and his writing has appeared at The Guardian, The Independent, New Statesman, The New York Times, The Los Angeles Times, The Nation: New York, The Age: Melbourne, The Sydney Morning Herald and more. Learn more about him at https://johnpilger.com/

Posted by: Melaleuca | Apr 26 2025 22:56 utc | 67

"Chomsky pointed out how all the media called the SMO “totally unprovoked” in every western news report as though it was mandated in a widely circulated memo."

Posted by: nwwoods | Apr 26 2025 20:44 utc | 44

Chomsky gets it right on a few things that are obvious, but he is just a "limited hangout", employed by MIT, a top-tier university that gets an enormous amount of money for MIC research.

It bears repeating what Chomsky said about the millions of people who question the bullshit "official narrative" about 9/11. Note the strawman,ad hominem, and appeals-to-authority arguments he liberally uses in this 5 minute video:

https://youtu.be/3b_nI6DlZP0

Posted by: Spectator | Apr 26 2025 23:09 utc | 68

Paul from Norway | Apr 26 2025 17:05 utc | 15
*** Jeffrey Epstein, former hedge fund manager convicted of sex trafficking in 2008, described as "an enthusiastic member of the Trilateral Commission" ***

Sir Keir Starmer the present UK Prime Minister, a former Crown Prosecutor noted for lack of action against top people sex-criminals, fanatical zionist, and a leading persecutor of Assange ... also happens to be a member of the Trilateral Commission.
Just coincidence, of course.

Posted by: Cynic | Apr 26 2025 23:17 utc | 69

@Spectator…. Chomsky running cover for 9/11 …. Nauseous.
Golly gee. I wonder what his take on convax-19 is???
Nah. Not really.

Posted by: Melaleuca | Apr 26 2025 23:29 utc | 70

She also made a statement that she had zero suicidal thoughts backed up by her lawyers and counselling records and that if she was found suicided it was not from her own actions. But of course no media seems to pick up that pivotal fact in the story . RiP a princess Diana tale of when u mess with people above the law

Posted by: Hankster | Apr 26 2025 23:34 utc | 71

Getting tangled up with spooks is a very dangerous game.

Posted by: ramAustralia | Apr 26 2025 23:34 utc | 72

Gus Grissom and Thomas Baron were assassinated and the assassins walked away free.

Same with Seth Rich. And so many others.

Those files will never by opened.

Posted by: Naive | Apr 26 2025 23:35 utc | 73

Posted by: Melaleuca | Apr 26 2025 23:29 utc | 70

Yep. And Chomsky did the same kind of interference with regard to the JFK assassination, as you probably know.

Posted by: Spectator | Apr 26 2025 23:39 utc | 74

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4eRRyQ6dsPg

Another one with Chomsky on 911...

Sometimes old age is a shipwreck. Verified.

Posted by: Naive | Apr 26 2025 23:49 utc | 75

When Chomsky's name was found on one of Epstein's lists, he did an interview (prior to Epstein's death) in which he, Chomsky, explained that when he was a young academic on the hard-charging climb to the top he and his wife did not know a lot about their finances, so they turned those matters over to Epstein.

This was Chomsky's way of distancing himself from the post-2008 toxicity of revelations regarding Epstein and sex-trafficking.

But how many taxpayers coincidentally engage a guy like Epstein to handle their finances-?

Posted by: steel_porcupine | Apr 26 2025 23:51 utc | 76

This thread topic kind of feels like a "Look! Squirrel!" distraction. Recall that the many assassinations (or "suicides") attributed to the Clintons prior to 2016. Yet she still almost won election in 2016. In fact it is plausibly said she won the popular vote.

These screechings of such certitude of "assassination" vs "suicide" in cases like this, with plausible deniability, just don't ever go anywhere. Everyone can argue about it for decades. MSM just says "conspiracy theory", and that's the end of it. They won't ever investigate it.

Posted by: Spectator | Apr 26 2025 23:52 utc | 77

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Apr 26 2025 17:35 utc | 22

You are despicable.

Fuck off !!!

Posted by: Naive | Apr 27 2025 0:04 utc | 78

@petra | Sat, 26 Apr 2025 21:44:00 GMT | 57

This control/threat point of Brendan's is well stated, and one which even many who are sensitive to conspiracies apparently fail to grasp: that it is not that they are trying to cover up and only get discovered or suspected thanks to leaks or slip-ups. Not only do they not care what is seen. They deliberate plan to flaunt the idiotic. ...

True. The starkest example is to crush the World Trade Center in front the cameras, as they surely must have known its collapse would violate the friggin Newton's Law of Gravity for everyone to see. Not only that, closer scrutiny reveals this was a nuclear event - which they also did not hide; on the contrary, the air measurements were put out on 9/14 on the website of US Geological Survey. Media dutifully reported a hitherto unknown research reactor in the rubble. Cue pictures of liquid steel and molten gneiss in the bathtub, accompanied by an IR reading.

They must have known. But they still may have fucked up.

Posted by: persiflo | Apr 27 2025 0:41 utc | 79

Oh ffs b and EVERYONE in this thread concocting conspiracy theories and who suffers from believing Virginia Giuffre's PC media narrative of the last 20 years. Do at least some sub-surface research into her. Start with googling "The true story behind Virginia Giuffre" and let it lead you to the many exposés of this deceitful woman. I read them last week but, in global Google PC sympathy, they have magically disappeared from search results since her death.

This critical post on HER does not belie my deep sympathies for any sincere victim of real sexual exploitation. But she is not that. She is 100% a scammer.

Giuffre has reliably been proven by innumerable contradictory sworn statements as a pathological liar, money-grubbing, drug and alcohol-riddled 17 year old ex-prostitute.

Even her last month is a tissue of proven lies, eg:

* The car accident occurred on March 24th. An accident was reported BY THE BUS DRIVER TO THE POLICE at the time as having "no injuries". The school bus driver made a statement NEXT DAY because it was "only a bingle" ($2000 damage). The elderly driver (not Giuffre) was found to be at fault for turning into the bus's path. A school bus was hardly speeding at 110kph as Giuffre said it was!
* Giuffre was never hospitalised as a result of the accident.
* The hospital said no record of her ever being admitted with accident injuries or of having "renal failure", or having "4 days to live". It was pure and utter crap.
* But 8 fkn days later, April 1st, she self-admits to hospital for something unrelated, only then releasing the wild fkn bruises seen widely in the media which were actually from a February DV incident. Even her own family stated "Virginia's release of those photos on Instagram was a mistake. And we never said the bruises were the result of the accident". What from then?
* Giuffre was charged back in Feb for breaching an AVO AGAINST HER, (go figure) set for hearing in May. So, she clearly got beat up, sometime, probably for being some mad kinda bitch against her ex -- who, incidentally, has had court-appointed custody of her kids FOR YEARS. Say no more. Her daughter was suing her for domestic violence compo. She's clearly a maddie, with mental health conditions, not to mention a massive fabricator.

And before you jump in with a defence of "that's a result of sexual slavery to Epstein", do the research on her real life exploits from ages 15 - 18. It clearly shows she was no victim of money-for-favors, nor an unwilling toy of the rich and famous.
* 3 weeks later, she's found dead. Let us wait for the autopsy. My bet is alcohol and barbiturates addiction to manage lifelong mania and depression due to such a crooked conscience and messed up existence of lies she couldn't stand anymore, plus even more media focus to come from her next court cases.

Virginia Giuffre's death had nothing to do with the CIA, DS, or Buckingham Palace. Lol at all you conspiracy fantasists and disingenuous victim-supporters.

Posted by: OMG | Apr 27 2025 0:45 utc | 80

Princess Diana part 2.

Posted by: Jason | Apr 27 2025 0:55 utc | 81

OMG, that's possible. But why did she get the media attention, then? Drug-riddled sexworkers of all ages show up there all day. Perhaps she may have been a true victim, chosen conveniently for dominating the headlines after the unfortunate death of the activist who was nominated in Cannes ... Also, what kind of school busses do you have in rural Australia going 110km/h? I have a hard time assuming it lost its breaks on a downslope, and I now have to read this report over dinner.

Posted by: persiflo | Apr 27 2025 1:05 utc | 82

If these allegations are true then it certainly goes a long way to explain why certain politicians around the world suddenly change character and appear to reflect new behaviours and opinions that are the opposite of what they once held. I don't think those who want to use blackmail or bribery will stop at anything because they are so paranoid of it affecting their interests and status they just won't let it happen.

I'm not saying the CIA was involved here, but I have read that in similar ways, powerful politicians and other high profile individuals that are similarly targeted usually receive an envelope with money in it or a bullet as a method of putting duress or blackmail on them: 'money or your life'. So it is a common practice used in the dark world of getting someone to change their loyalties and modes of operation for political and economic reasons.

Paedophilia of young girls serving very important people has a long history - having read the accounts of Emmeline Pankhurst who through the Suffragettes brought the vote to women in England, she cites this practise as being common with high level politicians who visited special high class secret brothels to enjoy their young victims. It was one of the major reasons Pankhurst was pushing for women to get a vote; without political power they were never going to get the right to protect their own bodies from unwanted sexual abuse by powerful people, and even employers.

I doubt if we will ever get to the bottom of this given the people that are involved, the famous diary of names, the photographs, and the testimonies. It will be like Kennedy's assassination where no one agrees with the censored conclusions of the official reports yet even when the voters are promised a release of all files, many will still remain hidden or blacked out.

Rest in peace Virginia Giuffre

Posted by: George | Apr 27 2025 1:14 utc | 83

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Apr 26 2025 17:35 utc | 22

You are despicable.

Fuck off !!!

Posted by: Naive | Apr 27 2025 0:04 utc | 78


Exactly Naive, I fully agree with you.

It's a typical type of response that Hoarswhisperer makes as often directed at rape victims: "She asked for it".

It is sick and repulsive on Hoarswhisperer's part, but he's probably part of the protection racket.

Posted by: George | Apr 27 2025 1:23 utc | 84

Posted by: SB | Apr 26 2025 21:29 utc | 55
I tend to think that sexual blackmail was only a small part of the operation and the main aspect was promoting the careers of politicians, scientists and academics in return for promoting and working for the Zionist and Transhumanist agenda.

<= i agree, natural wild person sexual gratification is the attract-ant(bait). The real object is placement of corruptible personnel in high places or in places that enable theft of something special (we learned just how easy a revolution can be when the revolutionist can place its people in a few high level positions by our analysis of the Bolshevik revolution). But it would be fruitless not to have blackmail control over those who have been so placed.

I believe placement of blackmail controlled politicians in other people's governments and institutions and in the businesses of competitors and in high level agency type jobs is an often used method. Almost secret [in plain view] activity, the deep state places its people as needed to control outcomes or to defang competition.

The Trojan method has been around since Troy. It is easy to see in the placement of persons in places where scientific research in being conducted if you have ever worked in such a place. there a spy gets a job in the lab or in the administration of the target industry and learns sufficient of the technology or business plans to be able to feed the information to his or her up stream handlers. often these blackmail controllable Trojans make a career of one place or one tract. I suspect High level Trojan placement of those with blackmail controls attached is or could be very profitable.

Could be getting to the bottom of how this works and making the public aware of how they have fallen for this, might motivate movements for reform.. ? Personnel agencies come to mind?


It is obvious in the USA at least, that nothing the electorate does is responsible for who is elected to many high offices or important agency posts. But what is not yet known is how those who hold these high level offices as Trojans are actually chosen.

Posted by: snake | Apr 27 2025 1:24 utc | 85

People get whacked by organized crime all the time. VG was a witness, and witnesses also get whacked by organized crime all the time. Let's just acknowledge that politics and organized crime are entangled (as fictionalized in Godfather II) and that the world is run by a combination of legitimate and illegitimate organizations. Is this unjust? Very probably. But then tens of thousands of girls were trafficked in and out of Ukraine after 1990 by scores of similar outfits, most of which were backed by the west. Spoils of victory? Empire is a protection racket, and we're meant to be scandalized by any of this? It matters little in the end whether the suicide was real or fake: she was a victim of empire, like millions before her.

Posted by: Patroklos | Apr 27 2025 1:35 utc | 86

@85 snake

"But what is not yet known is how those who hold these high level offices as Trojans are actually chosen."

By the look of those who achieve office, there wasn't much of a choice available.

People who are pliable, gullible, over ambitious, lacking moral, compromised, that commit without question, that are impressionable, over estimate own importance, are corrupt, have standing to lose or think they do.

Everything a politician should be . /

Posted by: Ornot | Apr 27 2025 1:47 utc | 87

Posted by: Patroklos | Apr 27 2025 1:35 utc | 86

Thanks. That post shows good perspective.

Posted by: Spectator | Apr 27 2025 1:52 utc | 88

I live in Western Australia and the story doing the rounds here is that she was being harassed by British royalists here. There's a lot of right wing British immigrants here

Posted by: Barry | Apr 27 2025 2:13 utc | 89

89 Barry.
There's a lot of zionistts there. Ask yourself why is there Hebrew writing on the supreme court building in Perth.
But yes the bus crash was considered so minor the driver didn't report it until the next day even

Posted by: Hankster | Apr 27 2025 2:16 utc | 90

The OP suffers from the issue that killing witnesses generally is only useful when it happens before the trial. That's why there is at least a superficially plausible case for Epstein to be murdered...if he was planning to testify? It is not even clear how this intimidates other witnesses. Given that Maxwell herself was convicted years ago, it is not even clear why the conviction didn't persuade more witnesses to come forth. Testimony about Maxwell's supposed Mossad membership might be a plausible motive, except there's no reason to think Giuffre or any other victim had any information to offer on that. (Also it is not clear to me that Mossad membership is hereditary.) Last, intimidation by murder is more effective when it looks like murder.

Posted by: steven t johnson | Apr 27 2025 2:37 utc | 91

Posted by: steven t johnson | Apr 27 2025 2:37 utc | 91

Eminently sensible and rational. The OP suffers from very deep flaws. If anyone wants to believe that's on them. The world is full of gullible conspiratorial fools without a shred of evidence in sight. They love it because Ignorance is Bliss.

Virginia was a victim of empire, like millions before her.
Posted by: Patroklos | Apr 27 2025 1:35 utc | 86

Indeed. What we already know is bad enough to act upon. But still we do not act. We cower on obscure forums pretending how brave and smart we all are.

"You won't fool us, we are not Chumps" is the war cry. Oh gawd what a joke it all is.

Posted by: William | Apr 27 2025 2:55 utc | 92

The news about V.Giuffre death, and the quickly submitted police report that the death does not seem suspicious, raised the level of suspicion that it was not so. In this context it is worth noting the disclosures in the book by Ronan Farrow, about the stalking of him by Mossad, and also of the stalking of the girlfriend of Anthony Bourdain, who also died suddenly, allegedly of depression...

Posted by: fanto | Apr 27 2025 3:05 utc | 93

I'm sorry b. however I must disagree. I guess many bourgeois types who gather here have had limited exposure to humans who have been abused in their childhood and therefore carry deep frequently unfixable psychological scars for much of their frequently too short lives.

I have had the experience of sharing a life with a woman who was super-intelligent, with a great sense of humour and who was also extremely physically attractive but who had been abused as a child. I don't regret the relationship but I would never put myself through the chaos of such a relationship again.

Like the woman who sadly ended her life a few days ago this woman had an addiction to what she called 'benzos' (she was a medical professional). These are also known as pseudo-barbiturate hypnotics with the most well known brand being valium and they comprise an entire group of drugs even now still quite casually dished out by Drs who should know better.
This particular woman was introduced to them at 12 years old by a doctor because she had become 'nervy & distracted' was no longer aceing exams & tests at school. No wonder; a close family member was sexually abusing her. She managed to escape her situation but as is common with people subjected to abuse she became a target for other sleazos amongst teachers, sports coaches etc.

I knew my former partner had a difficult side which surfaced when we were in large groups particularly when alcohol was about but didn't discover the details of her addiction & its causes until we'd been living together for a bit over a year. By that time we had travelled to a few countries and settled down in one where we both found employment after which her extreme behaviour of frequent intoxication and shouting matches became more frequent. I stayed with her as long as I could because I really enjoyed her company in 'normal' times but there is a limit to how much anyone can bear. I learned she had finally succeeded in ending her life at the ripe old age of 38, tho not by her own hand, she died from having her internal organs destroyed by prescription medications.

Yesterday I read a few media accounts from Oz plus the englander media vampires about Ms Giuffre's death. I'm basing what I write on what has been reported by named sources.
Ms Giuffre split from her husband & children shortly after she received the settlement from the andrew creep. Her family had arrived in Western Australia from amerika and she bought a farm out bush where they all gathered. This is the thing I could never understand about my former partner, she more than anyone else knew the horrific damage her family had subjected her to growing up, yet she kept going back to them. Things would have been going along fine, then she would go and see them, they get into her head and all the shit comes out once more.

This appears to be what happened to Ms Giuffre as I understand it, the family turned up her behaviour worsened so her husband won custody of the children which on its own is tragic for any loving mother, however sometimes there is no alternative way to protect the kids.

She moved to her compound with her amerikan family and became looser and looser as the realisation of her situation surfaced. This was compounded by tabloid journos harassing & stalking her. She became so loose that she breached custody agreements on so many occasions (understandable but foolish - classic abuse recovery behaviour IMO) that the courts had to further restrict her contact with her children.

On the day of the bus accident she was driving her car all over the road & was heading into town following having been in a physical altercation with someone. This allegedly is how she incurred the facial bruising much in evidence in the pic from the hospital she posted to facebook.

I've got no idea whether she was out of it or not but the bus driver said she was 'all over the road'. Note the hospital without going into much detail agreed that she had been told that if she continued as she had been without treatment for her kidneys she could die within a few days. They were also emphatic that her kidney problems and the bus accident were not connected. The bus driver & passengers have all stated the 'crash was a minor clip incurred as she returned to her correct lane.

Too me this tale sounds just too typical of the tragic end for many of those who have been sexually, emotionally & physically abused as children. They can never trust any other human including their own children as life has taught them that something always comes along to destroy that trust. All humans around this person can do is ensure they do not breach any trust for years while they also have to cope with extreme behaviour.

It was beyond my ability, patience and understanding. How many times does one have to wake up in the middle of the night to discover that you have been woken by someone off-their-tree kicking and stabbing you before you decide it is simply too much.

Of course every time a rejection occurs - no matter how understandable the other might feel the need to separate is, the worse a betrayal it seems for the person who has been abused.

To me this entire foul affair is typical of that of a big chunk of humans that find themselves in Ms Giuffree's horrendous situation.

That is why the ehud baraks (architect of this horror show), epsteins, maxwells get away with these disgusting schemes, they know that the subsequent behaviour of their former human tools will almost certainly make them very unreliable witnesses - if they should even live that long.

Posted by: Debsisdead | Apr 27 2025 3:08 utc | 94

@William Gruff -there he goes:

Any minute now the budget Louis Proyect replacement will be in to also argue how suicide is so much more reasonable than termination by the spook agencies for whom assassination is a large part of their mandate from the Empire. - WG | Sat, 26 Apr 2025 19:48:00 GMT | 40

The OP suffers from the issue that killing witnesses generally is only useful when it happens before the trial. That's why there is at least a superficially plausible case for Epstein to be murdered...if he was planning to testify? It is not even clear how this intimidates other witnesses. - steven t johnson | Apr 27 2025 2:37 utc | 91

Posted by: persiflo | Apr 27 2025 3:15 utc | 95

Killing a witness after they’ve testified sends a clear message to other potential witnesses, that testifying won’t save them.

It’s like when a mafia guy gruesomely tortures and massacres someone that screwed him : « letting you go sets a bad example. I can’t have other gangs thinking I’ve gone soft. »

Posted by: Featherless | Apr 27 2025 3:44 utc | 96

Posted by: snake | Apr 27 2025 1:24 utc | 85

I agree that Eppstein operation did not look like blackmail. Blackmail involves entrapment or uncovering dirty secrets, but "weaponizing" this operation with salacious disclosures is an improbable scenario and thus, meager threat. Instead, it was more like reward, membership perk. Including royalty flattered vanity of the visitors, and hedonistic pleasures were, well, rewards. Like for collecting 10 stamps on a card, each for a "good deed".

Posted by: Piotr Berman | Apr 27 2025 3:46 utc | 97

Yo. I believe it is apparent we touched on a topic here that's getting under someone's skin, for whatever reasons.

I say, let's call it a day, and we've learned enough.

Special thanks to debsisdead for the personal story. Mine are much less harsh, but I can imagine what you talk about.

Posted by: persiflo | Apr 27 2025 3:55 utc | 98

Posted by: Debsisdead | Apr 27 2025 3:08 utc | 94

Absolutely well said and explained. Thank you.

The mental health repercussions of sexually and otherwise abused children are horrid and often their behaviours very hard to understand. From my experience children, even if they are abused, often go back to the abusive parents because they often seek at least some attention as a replacement for love (even if it means being badly treated). We are pretty much programmed to seek family for support in any difficult situation, but it can lead to terrible outcomes if family have no sense of genuine love and care for their children.

Posted by: George | Apr 27 2025 4:03 utc | 99

...
If you have read this far, you now know that apologising to the bar for your remark @ 22 is in order.

You are still free to have little or no sympathy for Giuffre and other girls like her who had histories of family violence and family break-up, abuse and/or living in poverty, and who were desperately looking for help and an opportunity to improve their lives, only to fall victim to a cunning and manipulative procurer.

Posted by: Refinnejenna | Apr 26 2025 21:08 utc | 49

What a load of self-serving tunnel- vision crap!

"Society" (whatever that means) doesn't give a tinker's cuss about people who've obviously had a rough childhood, leaving them with low self-esteem and lack of vision/aspiration.

"Society" prefers to retreat behind the soporific "There but for the Grace of God go I" pretend not to notice that the victim needs help and forget that they couldn't be bothered.

The Biblical tale of The Good Samaritan is memorable because, in "Society" then as now, Good Samaritans are few and far between.

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Apr 27 2025 4:16 utc | 100

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