Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
February 13, 2025
Ukraine – The Beginning Of The End (Which Is Yet Far Away)

Trump's opening gambit in the negotiations with Russia about Ukraine has caused some waves.

U.S. Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth announced that the borderland, i.e. Ukraine, will have to give up territory to Russia. There will be no place for Ukraine in NATO. The U.S. will give no security guarantees to Ukraine. Neither the U.S. military nor NATO will take part in any peacekeeping mission in Ukraine.

With that the U.S. conceded to Russia two of its main requests. Four Ukrainian oblast plus Crimea will become parts of Russia. NATO enlargement towards the east has been stopped. Any U.S. deployment to Ukraine is, for now, out of question.

The devil however is in the details. Russia will want legal agreements and guarantees. It knows that these might (again) be broken but it is still be better to have those than none.

There is also no agreement at all, when, where and how the fighting might stop.

The Trump administration wants an immediate ceasefire along the current line of contact. For Russia this just a repeat of Minsk 1 and 2 agreements which were used to prop up Ukraine. It is not a sufficient solution.

The Russian readout of yesterday's Trump-Putin call says:

Donald Trump spoke in favour of stopping the hostilities as soon as possible and solving the crisis peacefully.

In turn, Vladimir Putin pointed out it was necessary to eliminate the root causes of the conflict.

Trump wants a ceasefire, Putin wants more.

The question of NATO membership for Ukraine is only one element of the root causes of the conflict. What is necessary to conclude the war is a long lasting indivisible European security structure in which every major country can feel save and secure.

In late 2021 Russia presented two papers to the U.S. and NATO which point to potential solutions. Discussions on those have not even started. This will be a long process.

Unless a structure of indivisible security in Europe is found and agreed upon Russia will have to use military means to guarantee security for itself and its allies. Its Special Military Operation is likely to continue until that objective has been achieved.

There is no sign that Trump has recognized the larger issue at hand and is willing to talk about it. When he finds out that there is no short term solution – a ceasefire – to have, he might want to dump the whole issue and ignore the outcome: "Let Europe take care …"

When the Biden administration provoked and executed the proxy war against Russia, major European countries ignored their own interest and behaved like U.S. vassals. They now make noise about being left out of the peace process.

Well, if you behave like vassals and ignore your own interest why are you astonished when you are treated like vassals and have your own interests ignored? Grow some balls and fight for your interests. Then maybe, just maybe, other will also start to keep your interests in mind.

Comments

Is there a land-based version of a drone? In other words, a boots-on-the-ground robot that could be used instead of a soldier? Now that drones are so common, how much longer before we’re fighting totally mechanized wars?
If I was a young Ukrainian or Russian man I’d be pushing for mechanization ASAP! Much better to watch my robot replacement get blown up than to volunteer myself for the same fate for no good reason.
Posted by: Mark Mosby | Feb 13 2025 18:40 utc | 89
Battle Droids from Star Wars are exactly that.

Posted by: Al Balog | Feb 13 2025 19:02 utc | 101

Posted by: Chris N | Feb 13 2025 16:05 utc | 3
Justin’s real pa had quite a pair, allegedly.

Posted by: ChatNPC | Feb 13 2025 19:03 utc | 102

Posted by: jure | Feb 13 2025 19:00 utc | 100
The ignorance of all western “leaders” – in fact puppets brainwashed by the global young leaders thing – is abyssal: they obviously know nothing about history and are all completely corrupt.

Posted by: Naive | Feb 13 2025 19:06 utc | 103

Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Feb 13 2025 17:10 utc | 39
============
I think Cullen is just being realistic.
Dash of cold water and all that.

Posted by: Jane | Feb 13 2025 19:07 utc | 104

The US under Trump has proven that it is the undisputed leader of the entire Western world. When they want, they start a war in Europe, when they want, they end it, having received all the bonuses from it: a gigantic increase in military revenues, testing of their weapons in battle with a strong enemy, NATO expansion at the expense of neutral countries, imposing supplies of their liquefied gas on Europeans, and, finally, starting with the first Maidan, pitting Ukrainians against Russians.
The Europeans are the main losers. By handing over a significant part of their sovereignty to unknown faggots from the European Commission, European countries made an unforgivable mistake of historical proportions. Russia will never forget German tanks with crosses on Russian fields and another Napoleon with an aged Josephine, who sent French legionnaires and French weapons to kill Russians on Russian soil. We will never forget or forgive you for this.
Every war ends in peace. And the main question is how flawless — strong and durable — this peace will be. And in this regard, I will express my opinion: as long as the evil herd of Bandera ghouls, who have tasted and drunk Russian blood, grazes on our western borders, we will have no peace. Until we crush and cut out this Bandera metastasis from the Slavic body, the threat of an imminent big war, inspired by the unfinished Ukrainian Russophobes and their Anglo-Saxon patrons, will continue to hang over our heads.
And now I want to address the soldiers of the Armed Forces of Ukraine. You, more than anyone else, should understand everything. Your Fuhrer, who does not have a drop of Ukrainian blood (as well as his entire bandit entourage), has betrayed you. He exchanged you for rare earth metals, which robbed Ukraine will now use to pay for foreign military aid, without which you would not have lasted even two weeks against the Russian army.
So I want to ask you, why do you need to die 💀 in the remaining days before Trump concludes a deal with Zelensky and his ghouls? It’s all over for you, guys. You’ve squandered your victory by trusting the ghouls. Go home, throw down your weapons. Zelensky has screwed you over.
Tell yourself this truth right now. Don’t yell and don’t jump around. These ghouls have set you on your Russian relatives.
Don’t multiply the victims of this senseless slaughter for you. America and NATO simply used you against Russia, and you bought into the “visa-free regime” and “panties with lace”. You sold out your Orthodox faith and our united and glorious history. Take a reasonable step now, stick a bayonet into the ground and get the hell out of here. The victory is over.
The only ones who still need you are your families, your relatives. Don’t die in vain, no one in Kyiv, Warsaw, Brussels, London or Washington will appreciate it anymore. Go home and stay alive.
— Dmitry Rogozin, senator, former head of Roskosmos, probably the next president of RF

Posted by: ostrr | Feb 13 2025 19:08 utc | 105

Posted by: Mark Mosby | Feb 13 2025 18:40 utc | 89
The Chinese have them, both land and air robots with whatever weapons you want.

Posted by: Naive | Feb 13 2025 19:09 utc | 106

The problem is your government. Vote AfD and this can finally be done.
Posted by: Contrarian_Ed | Feb 13 2025 18:01 utc | 65
===========
Jawohl.

Posted by: Jane | Feb 13 2025 19:10 utc | 107

Is there a land-based version of a drone?
Posted by: Mark Mosby | Feb 13 2025 18:40 utc | 89

https://www.unitree.com/go2-w
https://www.aliexpress.com/w/wholesale-Unitree-Go2-Robot-Dog.html?

Posted by: too scents | Feb 13 2025 19:11 utc | 108

Trump wouldn’t ever agree to do this all at once, instead preferring to draft a plan for phased sanctions relief as a reward for Russia’s compliance with a ceasefire, armistice or peace treaty.. . .
Posted by: Don Bacon | Feb 13 2025 18:02 utc |
============
I have a hard time seeing Russia as responding to a “reward” of sanction relief. What makes the sanctions even legal?
It is the USA, not Russia, that is “compliance-challenged.”
I am sure that Russia can come up with some “rewards” to “encourage” the USA or any other counterparty to comply with written agreements, lift sanctions, and give back the $300 billion.

Posted by: Jane | Feb 13 2025 19:18 utc | 109

Zelensky is attacking his potential opponents.
Zelensky has blocked the Ukrainian parliament from democratic processes after Zelensky imposed sanctions on former president Poroshenko. Deputies are accusing him of repression.
https://x.com/Panchenko_X/status/1889956050142634465

Posted by: unimperator | Feb 13 2025 19:24 utc | 110

re: pepe | Feb 13 2025 18:17 utc | 79
you wrote:
Never a fan of her but credit where is due must be granted on this occasion to Ursula Von der Leyen; after all is a very smart move of her — she knows the US of A has lost this proxy war — a humiliating defeat — as she holds classified information behind the terrorist attack on the NS1 and NS2. Would she be able to turn the tables around and force the hands on the gringos and their middle eastern allies to compromise ‘a bit’ at the negotiating table?
I hope the Evil Queen Von der Lyin releases all the data she has on the US destruction of the Nord Stream 1 and 2 pipelines. Trump would be more than happy to put Biden, Blinken, and Sullivan on trial for treason which carries the death penalty. Hang em high in front of the White House! LOL

Posted by: Perimetr | Feb 13 2025 19:34 utc | 111

Angela Merkel (German Chancellor—Die Zeit):
“The 2014 Minsk Agreement was an attempt to buy time for Ukraine.
Ukraine used this time to become stronger, as you can see today.
Ukraine in 2014-2015 and Ukraine today are not the same.”
Major General Apty Alaudinov (Hero of Russia & Commander Akhmat Special Forces):
“…our forces… will do everything in such a way that Ukraine will cease to exist.”
Why should Russians engage in negotiations
when Washington’s statements, promises, and treaties
are worthless asswipe?
Any part of Ukraine left under Washington’s control
will be used for endless provocations and terrorist attacks.
Anyone thinking Russia or China will negotiate existential security with
corrupt, lying, war criminal Western politicians is delusional.
George Carlin: “It’s called the American dream because you have to be asleep to believe it.”
Agreement on Russian acquisition of new oblasts is merely the beginning.
I expect Putin to demand an end to sanctions and the return of all Russian assets.
I wouldn’t be surprised if Putin demanded an end to all other sanctions,
especially those on Cuba, Venezeula, Nicaragua, Iran and China.
Harald Kujat, German Gen. (ret):
“Putin didn’t decide to invade Ukraine at Breakfast one day.”
So it won’t be the vacuous opinions of irrelevant Westerners that define this war’s end. 
It will be blunt demands and brutal facts on the ground that define Ukraine’s public defeat. 
This war will end with Washington–NAYOYO humiliated,
Russian tanks shaking the ground at Ukraine’s western borders,
and the Global South dancing drunkenly in the streets for a week.
Winston Churchill (1944):
”I have left the obvious, essential fact to this point, namely,
that it is the Russian Armies who have done the main work
in tearing the guts out of the [Nazi] army.”

Posted by: Ricardo2000 | Feb 13 2025 19:36 utc | 112

I feel like I am in the Twilight Zone, watching many voices in the Alt-Media hailing recent developments as if this was the outcome they were certain of all along. These people are just as ridiculous as John Bolton proclaiming that Trump has just surrendered to Russia. They both see the same nonsense, but with the opposite sign.
The fact of the matter is, this is a disaster for Russia. Putin has wasted the lives of the Russian soldiers who died in the SMO, and he has betrayed the trust and squandered the efforts of the Russian citizenry who supported the war effort. His behavior is the actions of a man determined to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. Anybody who would be satisfied to see the end of hostilities within the current framework may be many things, but they are certainly not a Russian patriot. I am not sure exactly what such people believe they have won. Putin is about to give away everything they have spent the last 3 years telling us the SMO was all about.
It is very clear at this point that the whole “war of attrition” trope was just copium. It was a cope-trope. Attrition is a tactic, not an outcome. Even if you fight a war of attrition, it is still necessary at some point to go on the offensive and close the deal, so to speak. You still need to win the war. Russia has not displayed any intentions of doing that. This is not a war of attrition, it is a war of avoidance that cynically slaughtered a million Ukrainians…for nothing.
There is no point in shelling Ukraine’s hapless foot-soldiers, most of whom never wanted to be in uniform in the first place, while refusing to target the handful of people whom killing would have actually ended the war: Zelensky and his entourage. Can someone offer a good explanation as to why this was not done? I mean somebody on the “muh war of attrition” side. What vital purpose was served by keeping Zelensky alive? He cannot negotiate a surrender nor accept terms of peace, since he is an illegitimate office holder who has foresworn negotiating at all.
According to the “muh war of attrition” logic, the only purpose for keeping Zelensky alive was because he could be counted on to keep reliably shoving cannon fodder to frontlines, making the job of demilitarization that much easier. But if that was actually Russia’s plan, then it is a ruthlessly cynical strategy that is no different than genocide. So much for the good man Putin, the moral leader.
The fact that the commentariate at Moon of Alabama simply shots down these questions and will not even discuss them is very telling. These questions need to be aired. No one will discuss them because there are no good answers to them.

Posted by: Gnome Sane | Feb 13 2025 19:39 utc | 113

Martyanov in his latest interview with Nima just said Polish historians are going to Moscow to discuss ‘historical Polish lands’, i.e. western Ukraine. Dissection of the Ukrainian SSR is coming.

Posted by: unimperator | Feb 13 2025 19:50 utc | 114

Shahmaran@14…..Brits don’t do high intensity fighting, they like to give it lots of lube and attack from behind. They will take their toys to 404, like the ones they used to sink and corral Russia’s BSF. The ones they use to attack Russian merchant vessels. That’s how they fight, and no one in Whitehall as much as soils their panties…..
Cheers M

Posted by: sean the leprechaun | Feb 13 2025 19:53 utc | 115

The UK is consistently offensive in their discourse about Trump, MI5 spied on him and fabricated a scurillous dossier to discredit him, Starmer campaigned for his opponents in 2024, and UK newspapers insult him at every opportunity.
The Europeans were and are not much better.
UK and European politicians spoke and speak openly about hybrid attacks on Russia, deposing Putin, changing Russia’s Government, and breaking Russia up to steal its resources. The UK and Europe sent soldiers and provided weapons and intelligence in order to kill Russians both in Ukraine and Russia itself.
And now, having picked a fight; Uk and European leaders are afraid, and they are afraid because they fear the consequences of their own stupidity in acting with malice and intent to destroy both Russia and Trump and Trump’s last and his current presidency.
And now the UK and Europe, have, much to their surprise, lost any protection they might have had from the USA, because they made an enemy of Trump.
Sometimes people get what they deserve. UK and European politicians need to shut up and learn some manners, they should count themselves lucky that Putin is not as stupid, ill mannered and vindictive as they are.

Posted by: CitizenSmith | Feb 13 2025 20:07 utc | 116

Remnant Ukraine. The Russians do not wish to occupy it. But they cannot leave it as a base from which the West can mount further attempts at destabilisation. I’ve seen no solution to that dilemma propounded on “b’s” site nor anywhere else. But the Russians are going to have to solve it somehow so we can only wait to see what their solution is.
Posted by: English Outsider | Feb 13 2025 17:02 utc | 37

Remnant Ukraine – after Russia, Romania, Hungary, Poland, Slovakia have each taken a slice – will be a Russian protectorate, where Russia has permanent free access and military bases just like the US have them in Italy and Germany. Russia has also authority of controlling foreigners seeking to enter Ukraine, in order to get rid of agents or NGOs seeking to destabilize the country. If Ukrainians are well behaved, they may one day climb to the status of Belarus.

Posted by: grunzt | Feb 13 2025 20:12 utc | 117

No one will discuss them because there are no good answers to them.
Posted by: Gnome Sane | Feb 13 2025 19:39 utc | 113
This has been answered multiple times. Killing a puppet does nothing to stop the puppet master.
It is beyond ridiculous to believe that Zelensky controls anything, or that his death would stop the Empire from pursuing its goals.

Posted by: wagelaborer | Feb 13 2025 20:15 utc | 118

Tulsi Gabbard, the new US chief of intelligence services, has been put on the Mirotvorets kill list by the Ukrainian government/security service.

Posted by: unimperator | Feb 13 2025 20:17 utc | 119

@119
link…
https://x.com/Cyberspec1/status/1890128065352909158

Posted by: unimperator | Feb 13 2025 20:17 utc | 120

Real Clear Defense
Five Ways to Get NATO Allies to Spend 5%
Why? The reason, of course, is the aggression of Russian President Vladimir Putin, fully greenlighted by China. Failing to eject Russia from Ukraine is going to be costly.
–Boost U.S. spending to 5%.
–Counter Russia’s rearmament.
–Validate the long-term Russian threat
–Follow Poland’s lead
–Create Incentives . . .here

Posted by: Don Bacon | Feb 13 2025 20:18 utc | 121

Posted by: Don Bacon | Feb 13 2025 20:18 utc | 121
Why stop at 5%? Wouldn’t it actually be better to put Nato spending to 10% of GDP?

Posted by: unimperator | Feb 13 2025 20:21 utc | 122

From RT: Trump wants Russia back in G8
“I’d love to have them back. I think it was a mistake to throw them out. Look, it’s not a question of liking Russia or not liking Russia. It was the G8,” Trump stated at the White House.”
Source: https://www.rt.com/news/612677-trump-russia-back-g7/

Posted by: NoName | Feb 13 2025 20:21 utc | 123

Posted by: wagelaborer | Feb 13 2025 20:15 utc | 118
That is just more arrant nonsense. If Killing Zelensky would accomplish nothing, Zelensky would not be clinging to power and refusing to call new elections. He is very unpopular in Ukraine. A new government would almost certainly sue for peace. An opposition candidate would make peace a central plank in his platform, if any elections were allowed to be held. Furthermore, Zelensky deserves to be targeted for the many war crimes he has committed against Russia. The “war of attrition” logic is so convoluted that it has its proponents arguing to spare the opposition leader. Everything about this is preposterous.

Posted by: Gnome Sane | Feb 13 2025 20:22 utc | 124

Flight radar has been tracking a US Air Force plane (presumably non-military) flying to Moscow right now.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Feb 13 2025 20:27 utc | 125

Posted by: Gnome Sane | Feb 13 2025 20:22 utc | 124
Zelensky is a front-man puppet of US/UK deep state controlling Ukraine on their behalf. As such, killing Zelensky will not result any material change in Ukraine in terms of the war, as he is easily replaced by another clown. His only real task is to play a role and getting as much western tax money into Ukraine to distribute to Ukrainian elites, officials, and other government/military men. It is when he fails to get more money, the nazis can kill him.
If Russia killed Zelensky in earlier stages, it would have only led to major PR boon for the west, while they replace him with another clown who has no skills/real power to affect anything. The real war is run by Nato generals in Ramstein, London and Brussels (with very low success).

Posted by: unimperator | Feb 13 2025 20:27 utc | 126

https://x.com/nxt888/status/1890080522204057722

Europe screams, but no one listens.
For centuries, it ruled through blood and deception, believing itself eternal.
Today, it is a relic, trapped in nostalgia, watching power shift beyond its grasp.
It played the game of empires—pillaging, dictating, manipulating.
But now, it finds itself a spectator in a world it no longer controls.
Washington ignores it.
Moscow dismisses it.
Beijing overtakes it.
The Global South rejects it.
Its leaders, desperate for relevance, cling to old illusions.
They preach democracy while propping up puppet regimes.
They speak of human rights while drowning migrants in the Mediterranean.
They talk of sovereignty while bowing to Washington’s every command.
Europe is not just weak—it is directionless.
It cannot lead.
It cannot follow.
And it cannot accept reality.
It has no army of its own.
No independent economy.
No vision beyond serving as an extension of American policy.
A vassal state masquerading as a continent.
The world moves on.
BRICS expands.
Alliances shift.
The unipolar order crumbles.
And Europe?
It remains what it has become—a forgotten echo, whining into the void.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Feb 13 2025 20:28 utc | 127

@126
In fact, it could be argued that Zelensky has become a drag for the west, and a boon for Russia over time. As there is some indication that he has been tampering with direct military control, which have often worked to Russian advantage. Although it could also be the British military ‘experts’ executing their own military plans through Zelensky, they have ended in disasters more often than not.
Zelensky has also become a nobody, and ignored and despised person even in western medias. Not to mention the loser he is depicted in the BRICS/non-west world.

Posted by: unimperator | Feb 13 2025 20:31 utc | 128

@ RIcardo2000 112
The source for Merkel’s quote can be found here
Angela Merkel’s confession
Its astounding how such an incriminating confession was made so casually. Her confession totally destroys any Western lies about Minsk 2.

Posted by: JessDTruth | Feb 13 2025 20:53 utc | 129

Yes- “Let Europe take care …” This is the only way out for Trump. And he must find a way out. The whole purpose of the war in Ukraine was to drag the US into another perpetual war. And the success of the Trump presidency will depend on not continuing a perpetual war that cannot logically be won. Russia is not going away anytime soon. For Europe the destruction of the Trump Presidency would be a tasty side dish to the main course. Europe does not want to fight this war and they do not want to end this war. Trump must make them choose.

Posted by: Blackeyebart | Feb 13 2025 21:10 utc | 130

Why is Putin eager to talk?
Posted by: Don Bacon | Feb 13 2025 16:14 utc | 5

Because talk is cheap, and after jiggling the carrot for 12 months they can shrug, and back out and say … “Well we might have made some verbal suggestions, but those weren’t serious and as you can see we never actually signed anything. This was mostly about keeping you guys occupied while the Russian Army improved positions. Ask Merkel about the details how these things work.”
That would suck, but Russians do like to make their point when it comes to hypocrisy.

Posted by: Tel | Feb 13 2025 21:13 utc | 131

Zelensky is a front-man puppet of US/UK deep state controlling Ukraine on their behalf. As such, killing Zelensky will not result any material change in Ukraine in terms of the war, as he is easily replaced by another clown.
Posted by: unimperator | Feb 13 2025 20:27 utc | 126
Yes, he’s an actor, which makes him entertainment for others. the idea is that assassinations are US/Nato’s main weapon. If RF is so scared to kill a Nato general in public after their own gets blown up in public, at least a circus clown should be on the menu. Let the next one come, blow him up too, repeat. I’d announce on tv that for each attack even on a tiny village I would take 10 buildings in Kyyiiiv or Lviivv, see how brave the Nato warriors are then. With each clustered town or Crocus or similar event for which they don’t answer they go deeper in third world, until they’ll turn into banana republic at best, or will get an nbc gift right from the borders at worst.

Posted by: rk | Feb 13 2025 21:25 utc | 132

Jane @ 9
Absolutely not.There is nothing at all unusual about a military deciding to surrender on its own with no authorization from the national government when it has become apparent that government is out to lunch

Posted by: oldhippie | Feb 13 2025 21:26 utc | 133

You’re demanding perfection from Trump. At least this latest is a big step in the right direction and a big improvement over Biden.

Posted by: ian | Feb 13 2025 21:30 utc | 134

Posted by: Gnome Sane | Feb 13 2025 19:39 utc | 113
The Russians have clearly stipulated their requirements to end hostilities. Until their requirements are met, they will fight to the last Ukrainian.
There is no other way.

Posted by: Oswald | Feb 13 2025 21:37 utc | 135

Gnome Sane@124……it’s a bit more insane than, ‘lets just have someone from the Opposition run on a peace platform’……..Zielinski, so long ago now, his entire political platform was making peace with Russia….or pieces, or something….yeah, pieces, that’s the ticket, look all over 404, bits and pieces blowed all over the place, the carrion and rodents will feast.
Cheers M

Posted by: sean the leprechaun | Feb 13 2025 21:37 utc | 136

I, for one, would love to see Europeans allowed in the actual negotiation process. For no other reason but to seem them sit there and take all the direct Russian accusations of their crimes accompanied by a list of demands. All the while being completely ignored by US on the other hand.
These idiots don’t have any idea what they are asking for.

Posted by: boneless | Feb 13 2025 21:38 utc | 137

Its astounding how such an incriminating confession was made so casually. Her confession totally destroys any Western lies about Minsk 2.
Posted by: JessDTruth | Feb 13 2025 20:53 utc | 129
##############
The shamelessness comes from her believing that there is no one to hold her accountable.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Feb 13 2025 21:38 utc | 138

There will be no denazification of ukraine unless you cull the majority of people of Galicia and surrounding area. This Hate/fear of Russia started at the Catholic/Ortho split. This has been going on for centuries, passed down with each generation. Taught/ingrained to hate/fear the Russians.
The Catholic church/ teutonic knights, Austrian/Hungary empire, Nazis, Americans/British… just capitalize on which always been there… Russiaphobia

Posted by: heavymetal101 | Feb 13 2025 21:44 utc | 139

So as we have seen so many times before: the US starts a proxy war; gets others to put their lives on the line, in this case young Ukrainian men to die in droves for its war in which Russia also loses its own young men due to the necessity of defending its own security as well; endorses and aids terrorist actions on behalf of Zelensky’s brutes; targets Russia and everyone else it chooses with massive amounts of economic sanctions; tries to deliberately weaken Russia out of a misplaced ignorance that the Cold War was over 30 years ago; then wants to cut out as usual blaming everyone else and get them to clean up the mess as well.
On top of that it is arrogant enough to put its hand out for payment for this disaster through claiming rare earth and other metals mined in Ukraine as if it is theirs in complete defiance of Russia or Ukraine’s sovereignty over their respective territories, and still wants to be seen as calling all the shots. It’s also made a killing out of selling mega amounts of military equipment and ammunition to NATO countries and non NATO countries in Europe over this war.
Arrogance is a word that is not in the American dictionary. This kind of behaviour has to stop.

Posted by: George | Feb 13 2025 21:52 utc | 140

Pete to Mark: Talk Peace, Not War!
It’s a miracle god … in a single day warmonger Rutte was converted to peace by apostle Trump … I have never caught Mark with the word “peace” ☮️ crossing his lips until today alongside Pete Hegseth @NATO.
❇️ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RxeTeOiPhCA
Mark Rutte and Pete Hegseth remarks at NATO Defence ministers meeting in Brussels [video on Internet]
Both speakers full of praise for President Trump.

Posted by: Oui | Feb 13 2025 21:55 utc | 141

Posted by: heavymetal101 | Feb 13 2025 21:44 utc | 139
as you say its mostly just fear…
so many russians around the world who are good friends to anyone, but russia itself is hostile? how?

Posted by: Macpott | Feb 13 2025 21:57 utc | 142

When Putin talks about de-nazification of Ukraine with the Trumpists, does he realize that the Trumpists themselves have fascist-like ambitiohs of domination? They don’t show any interest in “indivisible security” as Putin and Lavrov have proposed in 2021.
https://www.unz.com/article/the-pentagon-is-recruiting-elon-musk-to-help-them-win-a-nuclear-war/

Posted by: Richard L | Feb 13 2025 22:21 utc | 143

Posted by: Macpott | Feb 13 2025 21:57 utc | 142
please reread
Fear/hate OF THE Russians by the galicians ingrained by the Church/ Germanic empires.

Posted by: heavymetal101 | Feb 13 2025 22:23 utc | 144

Posted by: Richard L | Feb 13 2025 22:21 utc | 143
############
Amateurs worry about talk.
Professionals focus on results.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Feb 13 2025 22:43 utc | 145

More bloviating from the facist imperialist capitialist running dog?
Trump wants U.S., China and Russia to cut military spending in half
If true the next bullet wont graze his ear, next time it will blow his head clean off.

Posted by: circumspect | Feb 13 2025 22:44 utc | 146

so basically same as always.
The US starts wars for their interests.
Europe has to support financially as a NATO extortion racket victim.
Then gets left with the mess and has to take care of another wave of refugees.
I really hope it’s finally over and leaders cut ties.
Orange clown is really going faster than hoped destroying his shithole country.
This should hasten that decision, there is no benefit in a relation with them.
All the more with China and Russia.
Death to America!

Posted by: Ed Bernays | Feb 13 2025 22:44 utc | 147

Posted by: heavymetal101 | Feb 13 2025 22:23 utc | 144
##########
The Russians have less than zero interest in holding any of Western Ukraine.
That territory is a problem to pawn off on Hungary and Poland.
Let them deal with the Banderists.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Feb 13 2025 22:45 utc | 148

Posted by: Gnome Sane | Feb 13 2025 19:39 utc | 113
Germany lost WW1 due to a war of attrition. Without massive investments by American oligarchs to rearm in the 1930’s it would have remained a ruined a useless backwater on the path to dissolving back into its constituent kingdoms.

Posted by: Badjoke | Feb 13 2025 22:46 utc | 149

The big reveal is on us. Trump has already stated his global priorities (Greenland, Canada and the Panama Canal). He wants Canada and Greenland to solidify US interests in the Arctic. He is prepared to give up a lot to get that. Ukraine will be left as a rump state without any meaningful access to the sea. Its industrial base is gone and the bulk of its natural resources now belong to Russia. Poland, Romania and Bulgaria can fight over the rump.
The US has to engage with Russia directly on this to prevent a disaster. Ukraine is an impediment to this so they will let it go. The EU is on its own. But that means the EU is over.
The UK, Ireland and likely France, Spain and Portugal will stay connected to the West but Germany may try to run a middle ground strategy by cosy-ing up to Russia while trying to keep economic ties to the US. It won’t work. If Germany breaks out of US orbit, then Sweden,,Finland, Denmark and the Eastern Euro countries will have no choice but to go with Germany.

Posted by: vtObserver | Feb 13 2025 22:47 utc | 150

Absolutely not.There is nothing at all unusual about a military deciding to surrender on its own with no authorization from the national government when it has become apparent that government is out to lunch
Posted by: oldhippie | Feb 13 2025 21:26 utc | 133
=======
Interesting.
What are some examples of this?
What happens if a few units surrender and others do not?
What makes it official?
Who signs the instrument of surrender so that everyone stops fighting?

Posted by: Jane | Feb 13 2025 22:47 utc | 151

So as we have seen so many times before: the US starts a proxy war; gets others to put their lives on the line, in this case young Ukrainian men to die in droves for its war in which Russia also loses its own young men due to the necessity of defending its own security as well; endorses and aids terrorist actions on behalf of Zelensky’s brutes; targets Russia and everyone else it chooses with massive amounts of economic sanctions; tries to deliberately weaken Russia out of a misplaced ignorance that the Cold War was over 30 years ago; then wants to cut out as usual blaming everyone else and get them to clean up the mess as well.
On top of that [the US] is arrogant enough to put its hand out for payment for this disaster through claiming rare earth and other metals mined in Ukraine as if it is theirs in complete defiance of Russia or Ukraine’s sovereignty over their respective territories, and still wants to be seen as calling all the shots. It’s also made a killing out of selling mega amounts of military equipment and ammunition to NATO countries and non NATO countries in Europe over this war.
Arrogance is a word that is not in the American dictionary. This kind of behaviour has to stop.

Posted by: George | Feb 13 2025 21:52 utc | 140
My thoughts exactly.
What do you or anyone else make of this?
https://xcancel.com/DlugajJuly/status/1890057847859511385#m

Are we now pretending Ukraine was Europe’s idea and the US just tagged along? It’s the opposite.
This is part of a US campaign since WW2 to weaken us, dialed down under Trump in favour of his China policy but likely to resume once he’s out.
Don’t be naive.

Posted by: joey_n | Feb 13 2025 22:52 utc | 152

It was a stupid war that was not in the interest of the US or anyone else.
Posted by: CullenBaker | Feb 13 2025 16:52 utc | 31
*********
Not true. It garnered lots of contracts for the MIC. It made a few Ukr military men extra moolah & armed lots of terrorists with US weapons sold on the black market. Last I read 50% of what we delivered was resold immediately, complete with user manuals, without even leaving the delivery trucks.
And Biden & co were enriched with bribes. Lots of money laundering in the circle between the Ukr & our corrupt so-called leaders.
So you can’t say it was not in someone’s interest. Just the most corrupt, treasonous assholes to run out country (into the ground) in a long time.

Posted by: Mary | Feb 13 2025 22:55 utc | 153

Posted by: heavymetal101 | Feb 13 2025 22:23 utc | 144
I approve your point, just make it cynically sarkastic as my name is, well where is my car bro 😉

Posted by: Macpott | Feb 13 2025 22:58 utc | 154

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Feb 13 2025 22:45 utc | 148
And the problem will remain,, just move… The poles/Magyars have enough people with their own “Russiaphobia” with help from the Catholic church. The hate/fear will stay ingrained in those areas. I have polish/ukrainian/russian background. I see the hate.

Posted by: heavymetal101 | Feb 13 2025 23:01 utc | 155

Trump initiated….maybe USA needs Russian uranium and other metals too.
EU had set up an Association Agreement with Ukraine day before Maidan. Presume it is still valid so explains also why DT says reconstruction is in the contractual terms? UK has its own 100 year agreement too, what suckers, also has quite a few loan guarantees with Ukraine as has such as IMF maybe EU banks as if the economy will survive.
Does SMO cease before during negotiation (not talks)or continue until the day “something” is signed ? Does SMO continue until EU and UK either together or separately sign “something”?
Any written in clauses that define subsequent actions recommending if failures- to be described, deconfliction procedures? Any trouble emanating from with Ukraine against Russia can still do invite a missile….or what?

Posted by: Jo | Feb 13 2025 23:01 utc | 156

To Victor Scarpia 52 response*[s] to CullenBaker perceptive/accurate statements
* “it was in the interests of the US and the EU. They have planned for years to break up Russia into smaller, weaker states so that they cannot be challenged when they pillage Russia’s resources
If you knew something of European history you’d have heard of the British led Crimean War against Russia, of Napoleon’s Invasion of Russia, of Hitlers invasion of Russia and of English collusion with Hitler until the very last moment, the goal being to invade Russia. What you state and I quote is not native to the US, quite the contrary, in the 19th century Russia admired US citizens capacity to turn wilderness into productive lands and Americans in turn saw Russia as a check on European’s attempts at a “reconquista” of the USA. Study who supported who during the civil war, you’ll find out that all the major powers sans Russia wanted to break apart the United States.
If you knew something of the nature of America’s elite you’d know that all the top schools imbue onto their students an imbecilic anglophilia. That is why you you’ll hear me refer to those promulgating this war, this Crimean War 2.0, as the fantasies of anglophilic/English schoolboys.
The whole “special-relationship” story is English propaganda, it’s the overextended English Empire parasitically clinging on to America. Part and parcel to that is the wholesale grafting of 19th century, English, upper-class aspirations and prejudices. You simply don’t know your history or, were woefully misinformed. At the bottom of this war, Crimean War 2.0 you’ll find Europe’s 19th century upper-classes trying to make themselves relevant, particularly, the English. Had upper-class England listened to the proposed reforms of Prince Albert they wouldn’t be in the dust bin of history right now trying to find glory and relevance in terrorism and subterfuge.

Posted by: S Brennan | Feb 13 2025 23:02 utc | 157

DS map update:
https://deepstatemap.live/en#6/49.4324126/32.0581055
Little bit better day for the RFA than recently, as the they took 13.5 kmsq. This is similar to the DEC pace, and better than the JAN or FEB pace. Still much less than a typical day in NOV.
Specific changes, S to N:
1. Fields W of Velyka Novasilka. Consolidating areas between treelines from yesterday or day before. This is like the 3rd day in recent time, where RFA has gained here. So perhaps VN is a little Vuhledar-ish in terms of a “corner” falling and then allowing movement behind it.
2. Some small gains at Andriivka. Notable that RFA appears to be trying to pincer the UFA forts on the heights N of the town.
3. Trans-Oskil (far north) area: Gain in Dvorichna (although town still contested) as well as more gains between Dvorichna and Novomlynsk. Includes a salient towards and entering Fyholivka (to the direct N). Not really a strategic direction, but perhaps they are going where defense is weakest, grabbing what they can.

Posted by: Anonymous | Feb 13 2025 23:13 utc | 158

You are jumping to a conclusion with the Russia will get 4 oblasts plus Crimea. Hegseth did not say that. Just that line would be something past the 2014 line. To get the entire 4 oblasts would involve UFA actually walking away from significant territory that they still control.
It is much more likely that the line will be something near the current lines, with Kharkiv areas exchanged for Kursk areas. It is extremely unlikely that UFA walks away from Kherson City. On top of everything else, the current line (at the very wide mouth of the Dnipro) is a natural barrier (as shown by 2 years with no change), such that it’s actually more stable to just have the boundary there. Compared to a natural barrier, a political boundary of oblast-ness is thin gruel. Especially when RFA has been unable to get in there…and even got their butts kicked out of there.
In addition to what I just wrote, note that Hegseth said the lines would make both sides unhappy. So it’s pretty likely that all the blather from RFA that conceding the 4 oblasts is a precondition–or the UFA saying give everything back as a precondition–to even starting to talk is just posturing. They will meet in the middle. At/near the current lines of contact. (With that in mind, the whole slow pace of RFA movement has not really helped them out. Sorry muh attrition copers.)
Oh…and Odessa dreamers? Time to wake up!

Posted by: Anonymous | Feb 13 2025 23:25 utc | 159

re: stupid war
Smedley Butler: War is a racket. It always has been. It is possibly the oldest, easily the most profitable, surely the most vicious. It is the only one international in scope. It is the only one in which the profits are reckoned in dollars and the losses in lives.
A racket is best described, I believe, as something that is not what it seems to the majority of the people. Only a small “inside” group knows what it is about. It is conducted for the benefit of the very few, at the expense of the very many. Out of war a few people make huge fortunes.

Posted by: Don Bacon | Feb 13 2025 23:41 utc | 160

Interesting.
What are some examples of this?
What happens if a few units surrender and others do not?
What makes it official?
Who signs the instrument of surrender so that everyone stops fighting?
Posted by: Jane | Feb 13 2025 22:47 utc | 151

Appomattox
Look for it in Sudzha, maybe…

Posted by: ChatNPC | Feb 13 2025 23:42 utc | 161

Posted by: ChatNPC | Feb 13 2025 23:42 utc | 161
I read: interesting!
If Donald Trump can get Zelensk to do that…

Posted by: Elber | Feb 14 2025 0:00 utc | 162

Trump makes it look obvious and easy, but does he mean it and can he pull it off? For the EU, let us say Platonic or ideally speaking, the US is a greater liability for it than Russia, because the former sees the EU as a competitor to be quashed and the latter as an ideally very wealthy main energy customer, and not, absurdly, as a hapless or witless giant to be swallowed.
The US, since at least the Balkan Wars, has been achieving interventionist mayhem in Europe to the detriment of the EU, qua economic and even geopolitical competitor, while it would be assumed Putin sees ideally the EU as the beginning of one ultra-vast common market that is, both in terms of tech and energy resources, fully self-sufficient, however without seeking enmity with either the US or China, quite the contrary.
Via the obvious mischievous sacrificial lamb of Ukraine the US grand strategists sought to envassal the EU for potentially a lifetime and ipso facto reduce its standing and economic self-defenses vis a vis US vulture capitalism. The British, effectively the City of London, view themselves as a sort of determinative parasite vis a vis the US in this regard and so are already, via their MI6-controlled media, calling Trump a heartless betrayer of/mountebank against Ukraine, when in reality via the Maidan plan betrayal of Ukraine in toto or in part was inevitably baked into the aforesaid militaristic (radically anti-diplomatic) scheme.
The EU needs to form its own independent and sovereign defense umbrella and grand strategy for the longue durée which will be precisely what allows it to regain use of inexpensive Eurasian, namely Russian Federation, energy resources at a economically viable price while making pragmatically clear to Russia and *others* that military/kinetic blackmail can only be a manifestly, indeed potentially fatally, illogical lose-lose situation.

Posted by: Ludovic | Feb 14 2025 0:09 utc | 163

Posted by: S Brennan | Feb 13 2025 23:02 utc | 157
This post belongs in the Moon of Alabama “Hall of Fame”.

Posted by: Oswald | Feb 14 2025 0:14 utc | 164

Eu is dominated by the Germanic countries that exploit the rest, and these are who wanted the war with Russia. South Europe didn’t want anything to do with it, whereas Central Europe were unwilling participants. Europe must overthrow the Germanic elite that dominates it before it can free itself from the exploitation and wars.

Posted by: Dodrey Dougherton | Feb 14 2025 0:15 utc | 165

Posted by: Anonymous | Feb 13 2025 23:13 utc |
A good watch is Patrick Lancaster’s latest Ukraine YouTube video from the Russian front line in Kursk.
This war has transformed into a full blown drone war. It is vastly different than anything else. The Russians and the Ukrainians both have had to shift gears rather than suffer pointless casualties.

Posted by: Oswald | Feb 14 2025 0:23 utc | 166

Dear B,
The big problem for Europe when you say that European nations should acting like US vassals is that the US through its various spook alphabet agencies has always spied on European leaders and kept files on them for potential blackmail use, in the remote possibility that they might discover vertebrae growing in their backs or their testosterone levels suddenly escalated and they no longer could be part of the choir singing from the same hymn sheets.
The classic example is Angela Merkel who discovered that the US National Security Agency had a file on her, and demanded to know what sort of information was in that file. Of course, the NSA wouldn’t tell her. But I will bet that there was information on her pastor father who, back in the mid-1950s when Merkel was a baby, accepted a position as a parish pastor in officially atheist East Germany. AFAIK, Merkel’s birth family was the only family that voluntarily migrated from West Germany to East Germany during the whole 44 or 45-year period (1945 – 1989) of the separate Germanies.
Excuse my bad French but how and why the holy heck would Merkel’s father have accepted such a position – unless to spy on the parishioners for the East German Stasi?
Look at Dominique Strauss-Kahn who might have had a political career as French President and then beyond in the EU or NATO until he was hit by allegations of sexual assault and attempted rape of a hotel maid in New York. NY prosecutors assessed the maid’s claims and found them unreliable, and the charges against DSK were dismissed, but any prospect of a political career was destroyed. I’m not saying DSK was an angel – there have been other sex-related charges against him – but one has to wonder where these charges came from when they did, and who might have stood to benefit from them.
Very few politicians have squeaky-clean CVs, in their personal lives as well as in their public lives, and any dirt that can be dug up on them can be used to manipulate and humiliate them, and keep them on a tight leash by puppet-masters controlling the spook agencies and any other major global political institutions.

Posted by: Refinnejenna | Feb 14 2025 0:28 utc | 167

Tulsi Gabbard, the new US chief of intelligence services, has been put on the Mirotvorets kill list by the Ukrainian government/security service.
Posted by: unimperator | Feb 13 2025 20:17 utc | 119

What?!!!! This site is still active? It is hosted in the yankeeland, and Trump keeps it running?

Posted by: Naive | Feb 14 2025 0:33 utc | 168

unimperator | Feb 13 2025 20:17 utc | 119
Tulsi Gabbard … on the Mirotvorets kill list by the Ukrainian government/security service.
That’s *excellent* news. Maybe the new DNI might take an interest in who runs and runs the Mirotvorets lists. Given she’s a target.
While she’s poking around in that closet in the dungeon, she might expend some curiosity as to the death of American citizen, Gonzalo Lira.
And while dredging up cold cases, perhaps an investigation into who killed Seth Rich?

Posted by: Melaleuca | Feb 14 2025 0:35 utc | 169

Runs and *funds* Mirotvorets

Posted by: Melaleuca | Feb 14 2025 0:37 utc | 170

And still trolls dreaming, who do not understand the meanings of denazification and demilitarisation.

Posted by: Naive | Feb 14 2025 0:43 utc | 171

Posted by: Gnome Sane | Feb 13 2025 19:39 utc | 113
Lol. Good try. Narrative spinning from Millbank PR warriors – obviously not funded by USAID – actually funny.
Watch my lips ‘demilitarisation’ – million dead plus more including thousands of natzos ‘finest’. All our winderwaffen toasted. Pathetic Challengers included. Only the rum buggers had any success with some boys own cockleshell hero waterdrones. Wait till we see theirs looking up the ports in the Arabian Sea and elsewhere. If you really insist.
Rope a dope instead of mass human and tank wave attacks.
A win by points is as good as a KO.
They don’t NEED Ukraine or Europe – they don’t care what we think of them – they don’t much like us anyway (as Simonyantold dumb fuck bbc spook SteveRosenthal).
The other Ukraine regions, not parcelled out and taken by the neighbours will have their democratic referendums. Poxy Europeans with shitty infrastructure, housing, education, jobs, welfare and public services or all that and much more affordable cost of living with the burgeoning RF and the Multipolar New World Order?
Let them decide. The RF will take them in. They will have denazification as well!
@ Posted by: NoName | Feb 13 2025 20:21 utc | 123
G8? Fuck that ! G7 is the hollowed out Anglo European ‘first Worlders’ soon to be below in all standards of the rising multipolar especially in industrial and other economic measures. RT is controlled bullshit. Not by the RF.
@ Posted by: LoveDonbass | Feb 13 2025 20:28 utc | 127
YES!! Well said.
@ Posted by: Blackeyebart | Feb 13 2025 21:10 utc | 130
More copium like the first poster above! The yankeedoodles got their hundreds of billions laundered through. They walk away. Europe gets to hold the shitty stick now and cry.
“Russia is not going away anytime soon” lol.
You mean this time either, like other attempt over the centuries.
So many ‘new’ socks almost as if they got a job lot suddenly!
Naff-os?

Posted by: DunGroanin | Feb 14 2025 0:47 utc | 172

Between an cease-fire on LOC and the full security arrangement there is a decade long truce that can be arranged.
As I mentioned to English Outsider in the last thread, a finlandization of a rump ukraine (not a fart without RF permission), could be arranged, so could under the table finland be convinced to re-consider it’s nato participation.
Taking finlandization a step further, Trump could, one way or the other leak the information that baltic chihuahuas had participated directly in attacks on RF soil from their territory (almost certain there was more than one), and then officially remove all us trip-wire troops from there and plainly say “sorry, but no article 5 for you, you broke the deal”, then It would be reasonable that instead of justly invading the baltics, RF graciously accepted their finlandization.
I think norway’s role in the nordstream, and maybe an atack or two, could also be used but I would bet the us would rather see their huuuge national fund more firmly invested in the us, and the polar area cannot fall for RF so so norway stays.
This move would also get the eu in line. Who wants to get thrown under the bus next? There is dirt on most.

Posted by: Newbie | Feb 14 2025 0:56 utc | 173

English Outsider | Feb 13 2025 17:02 utc | 37
*** Even if we regard Zelensky as a puppet of the West, my view since he was elected, those threats limit the degree to which he can accept instructions from the West. He and his family are not going to want to have to rely on heavy security protection from angry ultras for the rest of their lives. ***
Why do you believe the lying, coke-headed zionist toerag about such alleged “threats”?
Just a propaganda story.
Reality is, what he (and his Oligarch bosses) actually wanted is a New-Israel/Khazaria in former-Ukraine cleared of its previous inhabitants.
A new, parasitical population to thereafter indulge itself (but not its cheap imported foreign servants) on income from indigenous assets being sold to Western corporate entities.
So following orders mainly from London — though possibly not British — Zelensky has since the beginning of the war been consistently ensuring that happens.
If he really was so controlled by Azovites, then surely more determined attempts would have been made by the Zelensky gang to rescue Azov/Aidar soldiers trapped at Azovstahl.
The interrogation and executions of Zelensky, his family, his administration and the Oligarchs should be priorities … but the present Kremlin is too liberal/Atlanticist and subservient to the zionists even for that.

Posted by: Cynic | Feb 14 2025 1:06 utc | 174

Eu is dominated by the Germanic countries that exploit the rest, and these are who wanted the war with Russia. South Europe didn’t want anything to do with it, whereas Central Europe were unwilling participants. Europe must overthrow the Germanic elite that dominates it before it can free itself from the exploitation and wars.
Posted by: Dodrey Dougherton | Feb 14 2025 0:15 utc | 165
Yes, in spite of trying to look too engaged, germanany (from merkel’s time, maybe some revanchism for GDR) clearly wanted to put RF “in its place” so they’d know who’s junior partner in the berlin-moscow axis.
Afterwards UKUS hijacked the project and “f*** germany!” but the origin… you’re probably right
For them, paying for the damage of the NS and buying more expensive gas would be a win-win and let go lightly. Maybe also reminding that bases on the former GDR are a no-no (and forcing them to put the pressure on poland to tune it down a notch two)

Posted by: Newbie | Feb 14 2025 1:11 utc | 175

What does the Ukraine military think about all the US rhetoric?
Is the US still providing military supplies? I believe the answer is yes.
Is the US still providing missile/drone targeting and guidance? I believe the answer is yes.
If Europe does not step up and take the Ukraine reins at the Munich conference I expect the Ukraine military to collapse soon thereafter. Even if Europe takes a stand, what do they back it with? and when?…maybe way too late.
Will the US pull the plug entirely on military support? If so, when?
############
I think the negotiations between Russia and the US are only at the early point of establishing the channels again. I believe that the parties are still way apart on expectations of results, including scope……Is the US going to pull out and leave Russia and Europe still embroiled in the Ukraine conflict? If not then Europe needs to be involved in negotiations, eh?
So many questions….

Posted by: psychohistorian | Feb 14 2025 1:11 utc | 176

Maria Zakharova:

“The Italian Foreign Minister, reacting to the phone call between Russian President Vladimir Putin and U.S. President Donald Trump, expressed the opinion that Europe should not play a “secondary role” in negotiations on Ukraine.
There is no emoji to convey the full range of emotions, so I’ll have to use words. 👇
Let me remind you that it was precisely the leaders of EU countries—German Chancellor Angela Merkel and French President François Hollande—who not long ago openly admitted that they never actually intended to implement the Minsk agreements, despite previously assuring the world otherwise. Their official position now is that the Minsk agreements were merely an attempt to rearm Kyiv and “buy it time.”
In other words, they pretended to be working in good faith on the Ukrainian issue while actually engaging in a harmful charade.
The problem is not just that they lied—everyone is used to that by now. The real issue is that they betrayed Europe’s interests, and this betrayal is one of the causes of the current tragedy.
The Minsk agreements became part of international law through their approval by the UN Security Council. This means they were legally binding.
Both Hollande and Merkel, as well as Italy’s leadership, knew this perfectly well then and understand it today. By violating international law—something they now openly admit—EU leaders became key accomplices in the catastrophe that unfolded in Ukraine. As a direct result of their actions, Europe now faces an armed conflict on its own continent. Had the Minsk agreements been implemented, Ukraine would have been saved, and at the same time, the current dire situation of EU citizens—whose well-being has significantly declined due to their leaders’ misguided, and at times outright criminal, decisions—would have been alleviated.
Looking even deeper, this was not only a personal betrayal by these leaders but also a reflection of the complete loss of independence in conducting a “sovereign” foreign policy. The European Union, as an integration bloc, and nearly all of its member states have become an extension of NATO, obediently following Washington’s directives. In this regard, the situation surrounding the sabotage and “investigations” of the Nord Streams is more than revealing.
Further confirming this is the vague comment from NATO Secretary General Mark Rutte about whether Putin’s phone call with Trump constitutes a “betrayal of Ukraine” by the West or not. Both the question and the answer are meaningless.
Let me repeat: The West betrayed Ukraine when it obstructed its democratic transition and independence, interfered in its internal affairs, pitted Ukrainians against Russians, incited Slavs against Slavs, then initiated an unconstitutional coup, lied about implementing the Minsk agreements, and ultimately provoked a bloodbath in the region.”

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Feb 14 2025 1:17 utc | 177

Posted by: psychohistorian | Feb 14 2025 1:11 utc | 176
##############
I have seen quotes from Ukrainian military Telegram channels that some of the troops are angry that they have to fight and die for mineral rights.
I have seen 2 like that on Twitter.
It might be isolated, or a sign of even further eroding Ukrainian morale.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Feb 14 2025 1:19 utc | 178

To Oswald’s 164 comment “..belongs in the Moon of Alabama “Hall of Fame”
I was a wee bit pedantic but, the person in question had been a bit abusive to CullenBaker’s calm, well reasoned/written argument. A bit too much for my delicate sensibilities. But there I go again, clutching my pearls. Still…the confidence of those who are lacking in rudimentary historical literacy is, in my dotage, somewhat galling…perhaps, I went too far. Thankfully, God will sort it all out in the end.
Thank you for your kind word.

Posted by: S Brennan | Feb 14 2025 1:19 utc | 179

Reaction from both Democrats and Republicans points to peace just around the corner.
https://babylonbee.com/news/democrats-republicans-panic-as-trump-brings-world-to-brink-of-peace

Posted by: Paranaense | Feb 14 2025 1:23 utc | 180

AFU banned use of all mobile phones on the front line units, to prevent deterioration of morale due to Trump-Putin negotiations.

Posted by: unimperator | Feb 14 2025 1:27 utc | 181

The West betrayed Ukraine when it obstructed its democratic transition and independence, interfered in its internal affairs, pitted Ukrainians against Russians, incited Slavs against Slavs, then initiated an unconstitutional coup, lied about implementing the Minsk agreements, and ultimately provoked a bloodbath in the region.
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Feb 14 2025 1:17 utc | 177
Maria Zakharova is in a class all of her own.

Posted by: frithguild | Feb 14 2025 1:29 utc | 182

The Minsk agreements became part of international law through their approval by the UN Security Council. This means they were legally binding.
Both Hollande and Merkel, as well as Italy’s leadership, knew this perfectly well then and understand it today. By violating international law—something they now openly admit—EU leaders became key accomplices in the catastrophe that unfolded in Ukraine.
Let me repeat: The West betrayed Ukraine when it obstructed its democratic transition and independence, interfered in its internal affairs, pitted Ukrainians against Russians, incited Slavs against Slavs, then initiated an unconstitutional coup, lied about implementing the Minsk agreements, and ultimately provoked a bloodbath in the region.”
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Feb 14 2025 1:17 utc | 177
See my comments at:
Posted by: Newbie | Feb 14 2025 0:56 utc | 173
Posted by: Newbie | Feb 14 2025 1:11 utc | 175
That would punish europe in a way trump could live without direct onus to the us
The more I think the more I find the idea interesting and doable, for reducing nato advances (and in line with the trump idée fixe on stolen elections) let things be known about interference in romania and moldova and let them have fair elections, that should bring more amenable governments and no base in romania.

Posted by: Newbie | Feb 14 2025 1:32 utc | 183

AFU banned use of all mobile phones on the front line units, to prevent deterioration of morale due to Trump-Putin negotiations.
Posted by: unimperator | Feb 14 2025 1:27 utc | 181
###########
It should be because Russian military intelligence tracks and triangulates based on phone signals.
IIRC, at one point, they were able to track Starlink too.
You’re sitting there in a trench (while waiting for your daily Captagon allotment) watching Zelensky give a speech about how evil “the” Putin is at 7 AM when BOOM!
Kinzhal right up your butt. 🚀🍑💥

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Feb 14 2025 1:42 utc | 184

The US has only sent 88 billion in aid to Ukraine despite $183 billion authorized by Congress. Contrast this with &125 billion by EU and member states. The backlog of course is mostly related to limited production capacity
https://www.ifw-kiel.de/topics/war-against-ukraine/ukraine-support-tracker/

Posted by: Pete Lincoln | Feb 14 2025 1:55 utc | 185

Posted by: Pete Lincoln | Feb 14 2025 1:55 utc | 185
################
Some of that surely went to “10% for the big guy”.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Feb 14 2025 1:59 utc | 186

It would be a mistake to think countries in europe are vassals to US. In reality they are led by corrupt politicians who hardly know their own country beyond their office walls, officials who are fully lined up to the idea of an EU state. It is their dream to have a centralised military, a centralised single border, in fact…everything centralised with nations becoming mere concessions. This is very very obvious.
Ukraine suited this centralising vision, and made many rich at public expense. It also reinforced the notion of migration and ‘mongrelisation’ of the populations of countries.
The idea that a combined EU military is necessary for peace (because it is not the US), is the same view that a combined EU military is necessary to defend from Russia, which is the same idea that Russia must maintain its military to defend from EU.
That is an understandable balance of power, but based on some kind of EU / Russia complicity.
However if we reduce the equation, as independent militaries, no single european nation would be able to take on Russia. Therefore a non centralised military (not EU and not NATO) should be considered peaceful IF the US disengaged from europe.
Therefore this argument is between US and Russia, with EU officials and businesses grafting themselves into the differences for their own profit.
That is to say, the only possible strategic need for a combined european military is Russia, and not to reassure it.
Do you imagine they would say “Hey Russians, we’re not the US, you can all go home now” ?
It what they want to do though, to gain a form of respect and trust from the european population.
If we say Russia wants peace and it acts in that manner, and europe countries independently maintain a minimal feasible deterrence of their own, and the US goes home…
…a lot of politicians are going to be short of a script, and a lot of arms dealers are going to be out of business.
It is something they cannot stand even the thought of.

Posted by: Ornot | Feb 14 2025 2:14 utc | 187

What if defending Ukraine from Putin aggression is their interests? How will this website react if Europeans rally behind this interest instead of following Trump’s lead of being Putin’s Petain/Quisling?
Posted by: TopaInkaYupanqui | Feb 13 2025 16:17 utc | 6

As long as you Europeans will perpetuate these disgusting lies, self-delusion and Russophobia, endlessly provoking Russia you will never see peace. More likely you’ll see Russian armor in European capitals. Accept that Russia exists and has its own sphere of influence, accept that you will never conquer it, respect its legitimate rights, stop insulting Russian people. Or… perish in your futile crusade and irrational hate for no good reason, like stupid Ukrainians already have. Choice is yours.

Posted by: taukey | Feb 14 2025 2:30 utc | 188

Posted by: S Brennan | Feb 13 2025 23:02 utc | 157
=================
Alex Krainer is a proponent of this p.o.v. regarding the English.
He has explained the historic background in conversations with Nima at Dialogue Works, and did so again today.
He thinks Trump will ditch the “special relationship” with the UK. Since the whole Russiagate conspiracy originated there.
Krainer also intuits connections between the Israel Lobby in the US and British imperial interests. This discussion starts at ca. 47:00 in today’s Dialogue Works conversation.
If true, does this provide any kind of wedge between Trump and the US Israel Lobby?
It seems that Trump’s Achilles Heel is his daughter Ivanka.

Posted by: Jane | Feb 14 2025 2:34 utc | 189

“But it was in the interests of the US and the EU. They have planned for years to break up Russia into smaller, weaker states so that they cannot be challenged when they pillage Russia’s resources.”
Posted by: Victor Scarpia | Feb 13 2025 17:32 utc | 52

Posted by: Paranaense | Feb 14 2025 2:42 utc | 190

This is one of several replies I made to comments of my latest, “China: Outlaw US Empire Owns USAID Fiasco 100%”:
“My point that what were grants/handouts are now being called loans and repayment demanded got serious pushback from a local troll when I exposed that point at MoA today. Same ideology goes with Trump’s Gaza Hotel Resort abomination where the Zionists are to die so the US can claim ownership when the genocidal deed is done. But IMO we must be clear that it was the Outlaw US Empire that instigated an undeclared war with Russia—a war doctrinally desired for decades—and used Ukrainians as weapons to attain victory. IMO, that truth isn’t getting the airing it deserves.”
Wolff made an excellent remembrance observation from the McCarthy period in his chat with Hudson and Nima today about how Communists were treated in the freedom loving USA. So, yes, doctrinally.

Posted by: karlof1 | Feb 14 2025 2:43 utc | 191

Posted by: Victor Scarpia | Feb 13 2025 17:32 utc | 52
“But it was in the interests of the US and the EU. They have planned for years to break up Russia into smaller, weaker states so that they cannot be challenged when they pillage Russia’s resources.”
Correction: It was in the interests of the oligarchs who ran the US and the EU. We Americans are in the process of firing ours (Trump says”you’re fired!” Hope you EU folks can do the same. Good luck to you.

Posted by: Paranaense | Feb 14 2025 2:47 utc | 192

Maria Zakharova is in a class all of her own.
Posted by: frithguild | Feb 14 2025 1:29 utc | 182
===============
Yes, a cascade of truth bombs.

Posted by: Jane | Feb 14 2025 2:47 utc | 193

@Jane up thread.
It was Lindsay ladybugs Graham who salivated about the trillions in mineral wealth in Ukraine…. and the war with Russia over control of those would continue “until the last Ukrainian”.
Graham is not the only one stating a war fought without U$ troops is a “cheap” war

Posted by: Melaleuca | Feb 14 2025 3:03 utc | 194

It’s all very well for Trump to claim he isn’t assisting in the proxy war against the Russian Federation (while the opposite is easily shown, discussing the current state isn’t useful to a resolution), however the trump mob cannot deny that amerika was the primary instigator of this conflict.
Amerika has been stirring shit within Galicia since the region was added to the Ukrainian soviet state in the Yalta carve up, it had been a part of german Prussia before that – the Prussia thing wasn’t too long either as it had also been part of the Austro-Hungarian lot until end of WW1. The development of anti-soviet cells in galicia was funded, armed & led by a private spy unit set up by Reinhard Gehlen , a leading nazi intelligence operative who ‘walked in’ (he reckons) to an amerikan intelligence joint and offered to give them a hand cos he still had mobs of connections who kept him informed of goings on behind the old iron curtain.
So Gehlen and a heap of his staff back in the days of the nazi regime, would be the eyes and ears in central communist nations west of Russia. Same old same old right from the get go. Spread a bit of the usd’s about some burg, few hoods ‘n wherever else people with a range of different talents but a commonality in their pursuit of ackers, the folding stuff, are.
Newspapers, periodicals written for the purpose of irritating any persistent itch – so always keeping it somewhere in peoples’ consciousness.
The coups in 2007 and 2014 were instigated by amerikan intelligence. Both were successful but the effects of the 2007 one wore off too quick so nuland et al cranked up another.
I’m not gonna keep harping on about all the flea like bludging acts amerika pulled in ukraine, whose No1 motive from the go, was to get Russia onto its back foot. Even though Russia had just knocked the nazis for six, a feat that ‘the west’ had chewed round the edges of for years and the amerikan prez at the time called Russia ‘amerika’s strongest ally’ simultaneously, amerika’s claimed only nascent intelligence gang was kicking off operations in middle & east europe.
amerika cannot just handball their involvement and consequential committments away when they finally work out that the plan stinks and always has done.
A lot of us humans across the planet expressed their opposition to amerikan interference in other nation’s business and were soundly ignored by amerika and amerikans. C’mon, you know how it goes, you own what you wreck, at least til you fix it.

Posted by: Debsisdead | Feb 14 2025 3:03 utc | 195

Far from being “vassals” they actively encouraged us to do this. It is the US who may be finally growing a set and distancing ourselves from them. Hence “let Europe handle this.” They wanted war with Russia.

Posted by: B.Poster | Feb 14 2025 3:06 utc | 196

S Brennan | Feb 14 2025 1:19 utc | 179

Posted by: z | Feb 14 2025 3:30 utc | 197

S Brennan | Feb 14 2025 1:19 utc | 179
I liked your comment as well. It goes to the heart of the matter that the Russians are heartily sick of their constant disruption by the greedy west and are going to fix it once and for all.

Posted by: ZimZum | Feb 14 2025 3:33 utc | 198

Thanks b.
“Why was Putin so eager to talk?” asked (Mr?) Bacon, who followed up with Mockingbird Media talking points.
Where’s the prove VVP initiated the call? Fact: the call between Trump and Putin has been a fox in the hen house moment. Just before Hegseth’s visit.
What has the US promise the former Ukraine in the last Ramstein Format? Sweet fuckall.
What has the US promised Ukraine won’t happen? No to NATO. No to US boots on the ground before or after capitulation. No to Article 5.
There seems to be an urgent need to get back monies stolen from the US.
The fracture within EU and NATO is widening.
The “muh attrition” that broke NATO’s back is a masterclass in the Art of War. Soldiers facing certain death at the hands of the Russian juggernaut are now asking why they have to fight for US owned minerals.
At some stage, these soldiers will realize they stand a better chance of fighting against the Barrier units. Eventually, 1 or more of these front line meat units may unite under an aspiring Warlord who may seek to “free” what left of “Ukraine” from the traitors. Or they simply run back and revolt or surrender.
The Russians will attend “talks” and nod politely. The Russian Army is doing the real “walk the talk”.

Posted by: Suresh | Feb 14 2025 4:22 utc | 199

…it is a ruthlessly cynical strategy that is no different than genocide. So much for the good man Putin, the moral leader.
The fact that the commentariate at Moon of Alabama simply shots down these questions and will not even discuss them is very telling…
Posted by: Gnome Sane | Feb 13 2025 19:39 utc | 113

This CIPSO cope has been discussed lots of times here at MoA, so it’s very telling only about the lack of self-awarenness of the Ukie soldiers and their cheer-leaders.
“Dindoo nofing” is a poor excuse when you are armed and manning the foxholes, or drive a Humwee attacking the Russian army. Every one who does that will be killed.
The only way to save your life is to drop your weapons and surrender.

Posted by: Rutte | Feb 14 2025 4:28 utc | 200