see the 44-second video at the third link
https://x.com/FranceskAlbs/status/1889070263725150449
Francesca Albanese, UN Special Rapporteur oPt @FranceskAlbs
We call it apartheid because it is apartheid. All the more aiming to erase – no longer to merely segregate – Palestinian presence, identity, life.
https://x.com/YehudaShaul/status/1888889189778751853
Yehuda Shaul @YehudaShaul
The guiding principle of the current IL gov states: “The Jewish people have an exclusive and indisputable right to all parts of the land of Israel” but a coloring book titled ‘From the River to the Sea’ is incitement and grounds for the arrest of @Edu_Bookshop owners.
https://x.com/AdameMedia/status/1888630825417138230
ADAM @AdameMedia
“Arabs are inferior to us. That’s why we kick Palestinians and slap them. We train dogs so they will bite them strongly and tightly. That’s why we shoot them. They’re nothing”
—Tel-Aviv school principal, literally teaching kids to hate.

Posted by: michaelj72 | Feb 11 2025 18:55 utc | 203

It seems that the Rat King of Jordan will fold. Not entirely surprised…

Posted by: JamesBond | Feb 11 2025 20:05 utc | 205

Patrick Lawrence: All the Gloves Come Off on Gaza
https://consortiumnews.com/2025/02/11/patrick-lawrence-all-the-gloves-come-off-on-gaza/
“At this fraught moment, [North] Americans cannot use Trump to hide from themselves, as many of them, especially their purported leaders, are very prone to doing.”
As If…
https://x.com/PalestineChron/status/1889318631495880829
“Netanyahu’s plane altered its flight plan to bypass Canadian airspace as ICC arrest warrants continue to impact his international travel.”
‘This is the Path to Armageddon’
https://x.com/DougAMacregor/status/1888784579328115131
“Turkish and German outlets now reporting the US will supply MOAB bombs to Israel. Warshington is not merely enabling mass murder with this weapon, Warshington is now incriminating the American people as mass murderers.”

Posted by: John Gilberts | Feb 11 2025 20:34 utc | 207

Posted by: teri | Feb 11 2025 18:53 utc | 202
In my post 201 it says at the very beginning that the source of the quotes is GazaNewsNow.
One of the links I think ornot periodically repeats here:
https://t-me.translate.goog/s/youseffares19?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en
https://t-me.translate.goog/s/Sohabpress?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en
https://t-me.translate.goog/s/gazanewsnow2021?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en
https://t-me.translate.goog/s/GazaNewsNow?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en

Posted by: JB | Feb 11 2025 20:40 utc | 209

Posted by: JamesBond | Feb 11 2025 20:38 utc | 208
#################
I *try* to not have expectations.
They often become resentments when they don’t come to pass.
I believe in predestination.
Everything is occurring exactly as it is meant to. That includes the weak and fickle behavior of Arab leaders.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Feb 11 2025 20:44 utc | 211

Saturday local time is going to be a big event in this conflict.
Does Hamas offer any prisoners to exchange, and if not, what does Trump/Bibi do?
If it is punitive, does the local Axis (Hezbollah, Ansarallah, IRGC, and/or Iraqi militia) respond?
Trump is daring someone to “test” him. He said that Hamas “thinks” they are tough guys.
I’d say fighting a genocide with martyrs makes a strong case. Trump is on the wrong side of global opinion with this.
But if he can pull it off, many countries will bend the knee rather than risk getting spanked by America.
High stakes.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Feb 11 2025 21:01 utc | 213

I just watched an alarming video which featured Jordan’s King Abdullah sounding like he may be surrendering to Trump’s demand that Jordan be an accessory to the ethnic cleansing of Gaza. I hope it was just a show to help Trump save face after being rejected but it sounded worrisome.

Posted by: David | Feb 11 2025 21:09 utc | 215

The Things
The things of which we cannot speak
Make us become we cannot say
The thing brought back from yesterday
That praised the strong and crushed the weak
That thing whose name we cannot name
That fathers fought to keep at bay
The thing we thought had gone away
Now clothes our parliament in shame
Klaus Barbie made their king of spies
Elon von Braun their rocket man
Never more true American
A new Gestapo in disguise
As Gaza’s child lies in the waste-
land made by AngloSaxon bombs
From Mariupol and from Homs
The empire script is cut and paste
Old England sees a child as bad
And Gazan children were the worst
For pious butchery they thirst
In sanctimonious garments clad
We stretch barbed wire around our hearts
We tar the untermensch with lies
O Ichabod! the prophet cries
From you the glory now departs
Cruel and inhuman songs they sang
Again the human turned cyborg
London is come to Nuremberg
And from her ropes shall rulers hang

Posted by: Andrew Sarchus | Feb 11 2025 21:43 utc | 217

Its cristal clear after ony 3 weeks of trump being president america is now a dictatorship.
Worse than that…
Effectivly trump is claiming ownership of the world.
I’m not joking.

Posted by: Mark2 | Feb 11 2025 22:20 utc | 219

Posted by: David | Feb 11 2025 21:09 utc | 215
#############
I did a bit more research into this.
King Abdullah is not a strong man but he is an Arab. He’s giving Trump the necessary deference as his ruler while refusing to break with the Arab League on relocating Palestinians.
All eyes are on Sisi now.
The Ansarallah has promised hell if anyone tries to relocate the Palestinians against their will.
Hezbollah has been very quiet. Erdogan has strongly opposed Trump’s plan. The Ayatollah Khameini doesn’t take the Americans seriously.
The showdown is Saturday morning local time.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Feb 11 2025 23:09 utc | 221

Love Donbass
Thanks for the encouraging comment. That occurred to me. He will give Trump a token, the 2000 children, so that can walk away with a “win” but he isn’t going to commit suicide by capitulating. Trump’s narcissism requires that he always appear to “win.” It is wise to hand him one, especially when in reality he is losing. He seemed so obsequious it made me fear the worst.

Posted by: David | Feb 11 2025 23:30 utc | 223

All USUKIS want is the oil and gas. Everything else is a softening up process. They do enjoy doing that bit as well. To the Max. The more Arabs resist, the more the Crusaders can give then shtick.

Posted by: Giyane | Feb 11 2025 23:36 utc | 225

From Reuters

King Abdullah said later that he reiterated to Trump Jordan’s “steadfast position” against the displacement of Palestinians in Gaza, as well as in the occupied West Bank that borders his country.
“This is the unified Arab position,” he said in a post on X. “Rebuilding Gaza without displacing the Palestinians and addressing the dire humanitarian situation should be the priority for all.”
Despite the views of his Jordanian counterpart, Trump said Jordan, as well as Egypt, would ultimately agree to house displaced residents of Gaza. Both countries rely on Washington for economic and military aid.
…
“We contribute a lot of money to Jordan, and to Egypt by the way – a lot to both. But I don’t have to threaten that. I think we’re above that,” Trump said.[LOL!]

I now believe that is is Trump’s intention to cause a global economic crash as soon as possible so that he has the rest of his 4 years to impact the “recovery”.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Feb 12 2025 1:28 utc | 227

https://caitlinjohnstone.com.au/2025/02/12/israel-admits-it-violated-the-ceasefire-and-hamas-did-not/
Israel Admits It Violated The Ceasefire And Hamas Did Not
So it’s been established beyond a doubt that Israel is to blame for the precarious state of the ceasefire today. That’s not coming from me, it’s coming from inside the Israeli government and military
….Contrast this acknowledgement with a report from The New York Times, which cites multiple anonymous sources to state way down toward the bottom of the article that Hamas’s claims about Israeli ceasefire violations are “accurate”…..
…..Israel making new demands of Hamas which are not in the ceasefire deal as written is a reckless act which could easily lead to the resumption of fighting if Hamas decides it’s been pushed too far or can’t trust Israel to sufficiently hold up its end of the bargain.
And Trump helped bring things to this point. After Netanyahu visited Washington and stayed for nearly a week, the Israeli outlet Haaretz reported that the prime minister was planning to sabotage the ceasefire deal upon his return. Now here we are, watching the ceasefire being actively sabotaged by Netanyahu with a goal assist from Trump…..
https://x.com/AliAbunimah/status/1889322495032836547
Ali Abunimah @AliAbunimah
🚨 Read it in Israel’s mass circulation newspaper Maariv: The Israeli army and “security establishment” confirm that so far Hamas has NOT violated the ceasefire deal. https://maariv.co.il/news/military/
t looks like the Israeli army doesn’t want to go back to full-scale war, although it claims its ready to, and it’s waiting for Egypt and Qatar to “mediate” a way out of the “crisis” Israel itself created by violating the agreement.
https://x.com/AliAbunimah/status/1889325126271005146
Best case scenario: “Israel” will back down from the crisis it created by predictably and blatantly violating the agreement and continuing to try to starve Gaza, and then “Israel” will claim victory and Trump will take credit, saying his threats against Hamas did the job.

Posted by: michaelj72 | Feb 12 2025 4:13 utc | 229

I read that there are 30,000 injured Israeli soldiers and 15,000 dead. The military has been warning that they cannot win this war against Hamas and indeed they have been defeated.
The military knows that going back into Gaza will simply result in more of their own dead and will not defeat the Palestinian Resistance. Nazihahoo is a fool now that he has opened a front in Syria as well as Lebanon. But if it all means the State of Hate is eradicated faster it will be worth it.

Posted by: rosross | Feb 12 2025 4:54 utc | 231

ooooops!!
https://x.com/27khv/status/1888675874104328340
Brian McDonald @27khv
Clearly, someone forgot to brief Emmanuel Macron on the “rules-based international order.”🤔
https://x.com/AJEnglish/status/1888604169428160908
Al Jazeera English @AJEnglish
France allowed PM Netanyahu’s plane to fly through its airspace twice, despite an ICC arrest warrant and France being legally obliged to abide by the decision, according to an investigation by Al Jazeera’s fact-checking agency @AJSanad

Posted by: michaelj72 | Feb 12 2025 6:03 utc | 233

Posted by: psychohistorian | Feb 12 2025 1:28 utc | 227
I still think Willow’s suggestion on one of the earlier threads might be possible for Trump’s envoy to consider: to persuade Egypt to accept Gaza as a protectorate, Jordan the West Bank. Then Palestinians would not have to move and the reconstruction could proceed under their supervision. Of course, that would entail each protecting entity getting along with the Palestinian authorities and those in their temporary charge, but that might be a better thing than the alternative condition of having to rely on the reluctant (I was going to say ‘recalcitrant’ but I hope there are some who are compassionate) Israelis as the ceasefire mandates.
I really don’t know if this is at all possible; it just seemed like a good thing all the way around.

Posted by: juliania | Feb 12 2025 6:22 utc | 235

234
My ex is Scottish Jewish Quaker pedigree, since you ask.

Posted by: Giyane | Feb 12 2025 6:33 utc | 237

Jordan king says Egypt to present plan on how to work with Trump
https://english.ahram.org.eg/News/540249.aspx
El-Sisi’s planned visit to Washington postponed until further notice: Al Arabiya sources
https://english.ahram.org.eg/News/540253.aspx
https://english.ahram.org.eg/NewsContent/1/1234/540291/Egypt/Foreign-Affairs/Egypt-to-present-a-plan-for-Gaza-reconstruction-wh.aspx
As usual the EU leaders were bribed with a piece of the promised land or the holy sites in reward. Secular Europe is gone. We are back pre 1789 and soon to the catholics and protestants wars if the 16th c.
You can ignore cultural and legal culture differences…but up to a certain point.

Posted by: Minaa | Feb 12 2025 10:27 utc | 239

Posted by: Minaa | Feb 12 2025 10:27 utc | 239
Thank you for the links, they are worth reading for those who are wondering about Egypt position.Because Egypts osition was very clear since the beginning: total rejection of ethnic cleaning, expressed officially.
This podcast by Aron Mizrahi is worth listening ( play on 1,3 speed as speaks too slowly ), as he explains that Jordan did not cave in either, but only promissed to accept 2000 sick kids, which is good.No yes to orange idiot plan.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yhz9wYWdpro
At the end is the answer by Abdul Malak El-Huthy, perfectly expressed;
https://x.com/warfareanalysis/status/1889329222277062835
“Do you imagine, you stupid fool, that the honorable people of Gaza, after all this unparalleled resilience and great sacrifice, would sell you their homeland?
From whom will you buy Gaza?
An ignorant, imbecile, fool, and reckless man who deals with everything like a merchant and thinks others will bargain with him over everything.”

Posted by: stranger | Feb 12 2025 11:40 utc | 241

The Zionist war criminal gives an ultimatum – the Zionists have broken the ceasefire on multiple occasions – never believe a word a Zionist tells you.
“Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has issued an ultimatum to Hamas, demanding the release of Israeli hostages by noon on Saturday. He warned that failure to comply would result in Israel terminating the current ceasefire and resuming “intense” military operations in Gaza.”

Posted by: Republicofscotland | Feb 12 2025 13:13 utc | 243

Have they started selling MAGA Kippahs, yet? Pretty sure all the Kippahs being worn at the Capitol the other day had Trump Plaza Gaza printed on the back……
Cheers M

Posted by: sean the leprechaun | Feb 12 2025 15:27 utc | 245

aljazeera.com:
« Egypt and Qatar intensifying efforts to save ceasefire, Egyptian state media says
Egyptian and Qatari mediators are involved in high-level diplomatic efforts to try to save the Gaza ceasefire, amid increasing US and Israeli pressure to resume the war if Hamas does not release more captives by Saturday, the Egyptian state-linked TV channel Al-Qahera News has reported.
Quoting an unnamed Egyptian source, the channel reported that mediators are seeking to find a way that “ensures the implementation of the agreement in a balanced manner and maintains calm to avoid a new escalation that could lead to more losses”. »
(I’m not providing a link because it’s the live updates)

Posted by: Leuk | Feb 12 2025 16:17 utc | 247

What Larry did not get is that 1) the settlers did not come to the colonies by themselves but recruited and paid by sects such as the Chabad Lubavitch with money that came in the late 80s (and ever increased since them). I suspect the funding came also from Christian Zionist sects and that this Wasp/Ashkenazis alliance was formed then (or already since late 19th c. ?)
And 2) the diabolization of Iran is a maniac obsession the Isr have with “killing the father” because they do not want to see the ancient history of the middle east better known. The Persian Achemenid king Cyrus is mentioned in the Old Testament in very positive terms. They were THE authority back then.

Posted by: Tom | Feb 12 2025 17:07 utc | 249

Trump is now receiving the Arab side of the Occupied Territories equation, and he will likely start to modify his positions. The key leverage the Arab states have is the American geopolitical desire for “normalization”, particularly with the Saudis.
The diplomatic efforts for the rest of the week should involve maintaining the Gaza ceasefire and negotiating the second phase of the agreement. The optics of allowing the Gaza people to return to their former homes only to start bombing them again would obviously seriously upend the modest achievements the Trump people have so far put in place.
The non-right-wng crazy factions in Israel are speaking out against further misadventures, at least in the near term. Reliable Establishment mouthpiece Friedman published a version of a “new Gaza” in yesterday’s NY Times – envisioning a protecterate governed by the PA and policed by regional Arab forces, eventually linked with West Bank in some kind of a weak “state”. Maybe as unrealistic as the “Riviera” concept, but indicating a realization by the establishment middle that the expulsion concepts are non-starters, and Trump may arrive at that understanding soon enough himself.

Posted by: jayc | Feb 12 2025 17:38 utc | 251

Jayc
What you describe is the old plan where the Arabs get no share in Jerusalem (after they already saw the Palestinian museum of archaeology annexed pure and simple with everything in it back in 1967), and where the Palestinian diaspora gets no right to return.

Posted by: Tom | Feb 12 2025 18:29 utc | 253

Tom 254
“the old plan where the Arabs get no share in Jerusalem…and where the Palestinian diaspora gets no right to return.”
yes, that is exactly what Friedman implies by not addressing it at all in his point-by-point “plan”. His op-ed is not firewalled, and is worth skimming through if only to see the new “moderate” talking points (which resemble plans from 2007 when PA was encouraged to “coup” the elected Hamas).

Posted by: jayc | Feb 12 2025 18:46 utc | 255

(I know we are barely significant, but fyi) public sentiment in Australia is with the Palestinians. It is starting to be discussed more openly in public, at bars and in staff break rooms – and there is no love lost for Israel.

Posted by: Rae | Feb 12 2025 19:34 utc | 257

https://x.com/katewillett/status/1889153849929425201
Kate Willett @katewillett
Nothing suddenly went silent, college kids (and professors) were arrested, beaten, jailed, fined, and expelled for expressing their free speech under the Biden Regime so yeah, it’s quieter, but it was in no way sudden.
https://x.com/acnewsitics/status/1889099306545615077
Alex Cole @acnewsitics
Trump said Palestinians will have to leave Gaza and never come back because it would ‘belong to him’ and suddenly, every ‘Free Palestine’ protest on college campuses went silent. Guess performative outrage doesn’t apply when it’s their guy doing the ethnic cleansing.
https://x.com/IbrahimZabad66/status/1889172485121208356
Ibrahim Zabad @IbrahimZabad66
No. College students did not go silent. They were intimidated, monitored, threatened, expelled, doxed, suspended, jailed, banned…and all this under the Genocide Trio (Biden, Harris, Blinken). There was a systematic campaign to suppress pro-Palestinian voices. Give credit to the Biden administration, and the Democrats, who proved impressively successful in suppressing free speech (that, by the way, was not limited to college kids but to college professors as well).

Posted by: michaelj72 | Feb 12 2025 19:50 utc | 259

Have they started selling MAGA Kippahs, yet? Pretty sure all the Kippahs being worn at the Capitol the other day had Trump Plaza Gaza printed on the back……
Cheers M
Posted by: sean the leprechaun | Feb 12 2025 15:27 utc | 245
https://x.com/RalstonReports/status/1114605447909011456
Available at all fine job killing retailers online.

Posted by: Delhiliterally | Feb 12 2025 20:53 utc | 261

ZH has a posting up with the title
Ayatollah Responds To Trump’s Big Stick Threats: ‘Go Forward’ With Military Growth
quote

President Trump kicked off the week saying in a Fox interview that “Iran is very concerned. Iran is very frightened, to be honest with you, because their defense is pretty much gone.” He had provocatively laid out that “I think Iran would love to make a deal and I would love to make a deal with them without bombing them.”
How is Tehran’s top leadership responding to the “big stick” threat? On Wednesday Iran’s Supreme Leader Ayatollah Ali Khamenei urged his country to go forward with bolstering military development.
Khamenei said “progress should not be stopped” in the defense sector, amid ongoing threats from Israel and the US. “We cannot be satisfied,” Khamenei stressed. “Say that we previously set a limit for the accuracy of our missiles, but we now feel this limit is no longer enough. We have to go forward.”
“Today, our defensive power is well known, our enemies are afraid of this. This is very important for our country,” he added, at a moment Trump is warning no option is off the table to prevent the Iranians from achieving nuclear weapons status.
Trump had further said in that Fox interview that thwarting Iran’s development of nuclear weapons could be achieved either “with bombs or with a written piece of paper.” The warning came the week following his restoring ‘maximum pressure’ and new oil-targeted sanctions with an executive order.
Iran has meanwhile protested Trump’s threatening remarks, saying in a letter submitted to the UN Security Council, “These reckless and inflammatory statements flagrantly violate international law and the UN Charter, particularly Article 2(4), which prohibits threats or use of force against sovereign states.”

The beating of the drums of war

Posted by: psychohistorian | Feb 12 2025 23:15 utc | 263

263 JB — Thank you for this post and link on twitter.

Posted by: Lavieja | Feb 13 2025 1:19 utc | 265

https://x.com/AliAbunimah/status/1889773792789999804
Ali Abunimah @AliAbunimah
The Palestinian resistance’s sober and careful enforcement of the ceasefire agreement is forcing the US-backed genocidal terrorists to abide by what they signed. A very good sign.
https://x.com/AbubakerAbedW/status/1889771157470982487
Abubaker Abed @AbubakerAbedW
Thousands of tents and caravans have entered Gaza. The situation is becoming more stable, and aid has been flowing in consistently over the past hours.
The same is true in terms of medical aid as local reports indicate that at least five medical aid trucks have gotten into Gaza during the last 24 hours.
The ceasefire will likely hold as Hamas gears up to release the three Israeli prisoners on Saturday in exchange for dozens of Palestinian hostages.
Israel is beginning to allow a surge of aid instead of a trickle.

Posted by: michaelj72 | Feb 13 2025 6:11 utc | 267

North Korea Condemns U.S. Proposal on Gaza, Calls It “Ludicrous”
North Korean state media on Wednesday criticized U.S. President Donald Trump’s proposal to take over Gaza and relocate Palestinians, calling it “ludicrous” and accusing Washington of extortion. The remarks were published in a commentary by the Korean Central News Agency (KCNA), though Trump was not directly named.
According to KCNA, the proposal is diminishing the already slim hopes of Palestinians for safety and peace. The state-run agency claimed that the international community is reacting strongly to the U.S. announcement. “The world is now boiling like a porridge pot over the U.S.’ bombshell declaration,” the report stated.
Trump’s plan reportedly includes removing Gaza’s residents and transforming the territory into what he described as a “Riviera of the Middle East.” The KCNA commentary criticized the proposal, calling it an infringement on Palestinian sovereignty and accusing the U.S. of disregarding international norms.
“The U.S. should wake up from its anachronistic delusion and immediately stop violating the dignity and sovereignty of other countries and peoples,” the report added, labeling the U.S. an “extortionist.”
North Korea has frequently expressed opposition to U.S. foreign policy and has been vocal about the situation in Gaza. The country has repeatedly blamed Israel for the ongoing conflict and referred to the United States as an “accomplice” to the violence.
Despite past diplomatic engagements between Trump and North Korean leader Kim Jong Un, North Korea’s state media has largely refrained from commenting on Trump’s second term. However, it continues to criticize U.S. policies, citing Washington and its allies as a major security threat.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Feb 13 2025 6:53 utc | 269

Ignored ny the West’s MSM: Muslim countriess have told the UN for the 4th time, they are willing to take responsibility for rebulding Gaza as long as Israel ends it occupation.
Acyn
@Acyn
Jebreal to Jennings: Honestly, you don’t know what you are talking about
https://x.com/Acyn/status/1889525374851461147

Posted by: Menz | Feb 13 2025 11:11 utc | 271

Lavieja | Feb 13 2025 11:38 utc | 273
Again it becomes clear to me how close and a part of the Palestinian people is the Hamas Armed Resistance. The Palestinians have borne so much, but how could they also endure to remain without shelter in Gaza in the winter?
Isn’t it fairly obvious by now that the extensive tunnel system under Gaza is also serving to accommodate civilians?
On 24 October 2023, Hamas released the 85-year-old Yocheved Lifshitz, who had been taken hostage in Hamas’s attack on Israel on 7 October 2023. Lifshitz described walking for two to three hours through damp tunnels until she and other hostages reached a large hall. Lifshitz told reporters that Hamas has a “huge network” of tunnels that resembled a “spiderweb.” According to Lifshitz, Hamas had prepared clean rooms with mattresses on the ground and the hostages received regular visits from doctors in their underground positions.(Wiki)

Posted by: john | Feb 13 2025 12:05 utc | 273

274 john. Are you talking about the small number of prisoners or the huge numbers of civilians, especially those recently arrived back in the north of Gaza?
Now that I’ve read the recent comments on this thread: post 268 more concisely says what I was trying to to say:
From Ali Abunimah @AliAbunimah
“The Palestinian resistance’s sober and careful enforcement of the ceasefire agreement is forcing the US-backed genocidal terrorists to abide by what they signed. A very good sign.”

Posted by: Lavieja | Feb 13 2025 12:56 utc | 275

Posted by: Lavieja | Feb 13 2025 12:56 utc | 276
I’m not suggesting that they have clean rooms and mattresses for millions, but I’d love to know the extent of their facilities. Gaza is mostly young males who, with not much else to do with a life in prison, have been digging…for decades, and that the most recent calamity in Gaza was never an unforeseen possibility.
So, I guess what I’m suggesting is that the underground facilities have most certainly served as a major shock absorber for what’s happening at ground level. And that they continue to do so.
But yeah, we really don’t know.

Posted by: john | Feb 13 2025 14:01 utc | 277

278 john. Best to be direct here. First, the Resistance militias are not made up of escaped convicts if that’s what you conceived. They are men of various ages who had various livelihoods in Palestine, bakers, farmers, teachers, students, shopkeepers, or whatever occupations were available in Gaza society, and also whatever livelihoods could be found for the majority of people who came to Gaza from other areas and towns in Palestine from where they had been driven out as Israelis forcibly have been taking over their farmland and/or driving them out of their towns since 1948. Palestinians had even agreed to accept only 23 percent of the original Palestinian territory and allow the Israeli state to keep the remainder if the Palestinians aspirations for a Palestinian state were granted, which approx. 80 percent of UN nations agreed to, but was opposed by Netyahoo and therefore vetoed by US everytime it camel before the UN security council.
So after years of demonstrations for human rights and right to return to their lands and homes were violently suppressed by Israel, and after Israel every 10 or less years or so “mowed the Palestinian lawn” by periodically killing significant numbers and destroying more homes and infrastructure, Palestinians resisted. Thousands were imprisoned, youths for throwing rocks, many for being related to Hamas resistance fighters, many without charge.
I won’t go into history of Hamas, except to say that in 2006, Hamas won the 2006 Palestinian legislative elections and assumed administrative control of Gaza Strip. The Palestine Authority was voted out of power in Gaza and ended up as the political party in West Bank. My point is Hamas the political party was legally voted in. And the people who are Hamas fighters now are not convicts, although many have been in Israeli prisons the vast majority unlawfully as political prisoners. Are there about 20,000 prisoners now in Israeli jails? Everytime they free some they round up and arrest more as you probably know,, but perhaps feel that Hamas fighters are basically just troublemakers, and that the Palestinians would have been better off living under the control of the illegal apartheid state of Israel which continues always it’s violent land grab.
About the tunnels, yes I imagine they were continually built after 1948, and many were there already. And during times when Israel restricted goods going into Gaza, they were used to smuggle in goods and weapons, of course. ALthough it isn’t really smuggling if you consider that Israel’s interdiction of goods is illegal because it’s control over Gaza is illegal. And every incident of Israel claims of weapons being hidden under hospitals, schools, etc. has been unproven.
Those who don’t take the side of a people living under occupation always wish they would just accept their fate, but the occupied people never cooperate with that wish.
I am unclear what you mean by
“I guess what I’m suggesting is that the underground facilities have most certainly served as a major shock absorber for what’s happening at ground level. And that they continue to do so.”
Since the Gazans are contained within the small strip of land approx 5 miles wide by 25 miles long, and the seacoast is blockaded they need to fight from tunnels. And the fighters need to live in the tunnels also to avoid being assassinated. Obviously as you know the fighters are more vulnerable out in the open. Why would they chose to fight from a less advantageous position like shooting in front of a rock when you can hide behind it.
Finally what is it that you say we can’t we really know?

Posted by: Lavieja | Feb 13 2025 16:47 utc | 279