Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
February 4, 2025
Lavrov vs. Rubio On Multipolarity

I have lauded Marco Rubio's view which declared that the short period of a unipolar world has come to an end.

The new Secretary of State had said:

"So it’s not normal for the world to simply have a unipolar power. That was not – that was an anomaly. It was a product of the end of the Cold War, but eventually you were going to reach back to a point where you had a multipolar world, multi-great powers in different parts of the planet."

If find that a much better concept than the 'rules based order'.

There are however different flavors of multipolarity.

The one Rubio likely thinks of is one in which might makes right. Several 'big dog' countries are sharing the globe, avoiding each other, while a number of small nations must do as they are told by whatever big power that can make them do so.

Witness the recent interactions between the U.S. and Colombia, Panama, Mexico and Canada. The Trump administration has threatened these countries with tariffs and other measures. After it had got what it wanted it pulled back at least a part of the threat (tariff). Unless it meets strong resistance it will repeat doing that again and again.

Another flavor of multi-polarity, one which Russia and China will likely support, is acknowledging that all countries, big or small, have equal rights. This is the base of the United Nations system which was born during allied talks in Yalta and Potsdam at the end of World War II.

Sergei Lavrov, the long term Foreign Minister of the Russian Federation, is arguing for upholding it:

The UN Charter Should Become the Legal Foundation of a Multipolar WorldGlobal Affairs, Feb 4 2025

Eighty years ago, on 4 February 1945, the leaders of the victors of World War II―the Soviet Union, the United States, and Britain―opened the Yalta Conference to determine the contours of the postwar world. Despite ideological differences, they agreed to eradicate German Nazism and Japanese militarism. The agreements reached in Crimea were reaffirmed and elaborated upon at the Potsdam Conference in July-August 1945.

One result of the negotiations was the creation of the United Nations and the approval of the UN Charter, which to this day remains the main source of international law. The Charter set forth goals and principles for countries’ international behavior, which are designed to ensure their peaceful coexistence and sustained development. The principle of states’ sovereign equality laid the foundation for the Yalta-Potsdam system: none may claim dominance, as all are formally equal regardless of territory, population, military capabilities, or other metrics.

It was at the UN that, with a key role played by the USSR, the foundation was laid for the multipolar world that is now emerging before our eyes.

As Russian scholars rightly note, any international institution is, above all, “a way to limit the natural egoism of states.” The UN, with its consensus-adopted Charter, is no exception.

With this in mind Lavrov set out to criticize Marco Rubio's (and Donald Trump's) word-view. 

Lavrov is specifically aiming at Rubio's January 15 Opening Remarks Before the Senate Foreign Relations Committee. Rubio stated in these:

So while America too often prioritized the global order above our core national interest, other nations continued to act the way nations have always acted and always will: in what they perceive to be their best interest. And instead of folding into the post-Cold War global order, they have manipulated it to serve their interests at the expense of ours.

The post-war global order is not just obsolete, it is now a weapon being used against us. And all this has led to a moment in which we must now confront the single greatest risk of geopolitical instability and of generational global crisis in the lifetime of anyone alive and in this room today. Eight decades later, we are once again called to create a free world out of the chaos, and this will not be easy. And it will be impossible without a strong and a confident America that engages in the world, putting our core national interests once again above all else.

Eight decades after the declaration of the UN Charter Rubio has set out to demolish it. He rejects the 'principle of states’ sovereign equality' and replaces it with an 'America First' and might makes right order.

Lavrov is warning, staunchly, that this will lead to chaos:

In 2025, with Donald Trump’s Republican administration back in power, Washington’s interpretation of international processes since World War II has taken on a new dimension, as vividly described to the Senate by new Secretary of State Marco Rubio on 15 January: not only is the postwar world order outdated, but it has been turned into a weapon against U.S. interests. In other words, not only the Yalta-Potsdam order is undesirable; so, too, is the ‘rules-based order’ that had seemed to embody the selfishness and arrogance of the U.S.-led West after the Cold War. “America first” is alarmingly similar to the Hitlerite slogan “Germany above all”, and a wager on “peace through strength” may be the final blow to diplomacy. Not to mention that such statements and ideological constructs show not even the slightest bit of respect for Washington’s international legal obligations under the UN Charter.

Brazen attempts to reorder the world in one’s own interest, violating UN principles, may beget instability, confrontation, and even catastrophe. Given the current level of international strife, recklessly rejecting the Yalta-Potsdam system, with the UN and UN Charter at its core, will inevitably lead to chaos.

(A few years ago the German 'above all' slogan was copied by the U.S. Air Force but later pulled back.)

China has a more guarded but similar take. A recent op-ed in a Spanish language newspaper by the Chinese Ambassador to Panama has been taken up as the lead headline in China's Global Times:

Chinese ambassador to Panama calls on US to 'learn to respect' as Rubio visits the country to exert pressureGlobal Times, Feb 04 2025

Xu's article came as US Secretary of State Marco Rubio visited Panama in his first trip abroad since taking office. Rubio aimed to exert pressure on the country concerning its relations with China.

Xu wrote that while chanting "Make America Great Again," the US delegation's visit to Panama caused a stir greater than a tropical storm.

In the international community, all countries are equal and have the right to independently develop diplomatic relations. No one has the right to dictate to others or issue commands. If the US wants to create the golden age of the Americas, it must first respect other countries and listen to Latin American nations about their vision for the future, Xu wrote.

The Trump administration's version of multipolarity is incompatible with the one China and Russia have in mind. It contradicts the UN Charter.

If that does not change we will be in for a big clash.

/Sidenote:/

Under pressure from Rubio Panama declared that it would not renew its participation in China's Belt and Road Initiative (BRI). This was lauded as Rubio's victory.

However there were only three BRI projects ever in Panama:

Panama is contracting with Chinese companies for a fourth bridge over the Panama Canal, as well as a third line for the Panama City mass transit system.

China has also submitted a $4.1 billion proposal to build a 391-kilometer (243-mile) high-speed rail line from Panama City to the town of David near its border with Costa Rica — a project to be carried out under the rubric of the Belt and Road.

After some planing hustle the fourth bridge over the Panama Canal is finally being build. The third line for Panama city was and is however a Japanese project. The high-speed rail line from Panama City to David is not economically feasible. Five years after the initial plans its construction has not even started. It is unlikely to ever being build.

Neither Panama, nor China, will thus lose anything from Panama's BRI retreat.

Rubio's 'victory' in Panama was pure propaganda.

/End sidenote/

 

Comments

Thanks for the posting b. Now we are getting down to brass tacks.
When do we start talking about the implications of public versus private global finance arrangements?
I continue to ask the above question because it is the basis of might makes right.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Feb 4 2025 17:07 utc | 1

great post b… thank you!!
and i think lavrovs warning is especially prescient here.. i share your viewpoint as stated here –
“Eight decades after the declaration of the UN Charter Rubio has set out to demolish it. He rejects the ‘principle of states’ sovereign equality’ and replaces it with an ‘America First’ and might makes right order.”
nowhere is it more clear then in his attitude towards cuba, latin and south america…

Posted by: james | Feb 4 2025 17:15 utc | 2

@ psychohistorian | Feb 4 2025 17:07 utc | 1
you might enjoy alex krainers post from earlier today.. he is more sanguine about trumps role here..
The hidden hand: monstrous conspiracies and the swamp
The trail of evidence almost always leads to the moneylending oligarchies.
Alex Krainer
Feb 04, 2025

Posted by: james | Feb 4 2025 17:17 utc | 3

Sergie Lavrov is the problem and not a solution. He single handedly resurrected when he induced the then president mad edev to go against Gaddafi in Libya and gave new lease of life to NATO.He talks sot of no substance.
Foreign ministry is to promote nations interest -in his long useless unelected poison. He has been utter failure in getting any resolution passed in Russia’s favour.
Lavrov and pesko are British agents inside Kremlin and Putin is too lazy to change such people in 15 years!!
Russia should fire the entire Foreign Ministry. And this is a HISTORICAL MEME by now, Russian diplomats ALWAYS give away shit that the military wins.
Lavrov made some ridiculous statement re: Syria about following some worthless U.N. resolution, totally clueless. This is a huge defeat for Russia on the international stage, BRICS and any claimed multi-polarity have correspondingly just lost a shit-ton of momentum. I have lost faith in Putin and Russia to make any difference in our chaotic world, Mordor is winning.

Posted by: Sam | Feb 4 2025 17:36 utc | 4

Lavrov
                              6/4/2014
What it is that lavrov is smoking ? Must be very potent hallucinogen. He still talks of negotiation with Ukraine junta after Odessa atrocities by the Zionist and fascists goons? Thereby giving legitimacy to the kieve junta despite all crimes?
The east ukraininas shouldn’t wait for russian help because Rus leadership is sold out and feel satisfied as junior member of west with a few crumbs under the table- (though even then Russia will get nothing –remember 90s

Posted by: Sam | Feb 4 2025 17:39 utc | 5

it was fun going back to 2008 and reading the comments in the link b provided. A lot of those posters no longer contribute and I sorely miss them. They were kinder gentler commenters. Now we have more than our fair share of mean people. Scusami for the off topic

Posted by: dan of steele | Feb 4 2025 17:40 utc | 6

@ james | Feb 4 2025 17:17 utc | 3 with Alex Krainer link….thx
Yes, Alex and I are closely aligned on the God Of Mammon cult issue. Will this foray into remaking the sausage of our form of social organization include touching on the public/private finance issue?
I damn well hope so, for humanity’s sake.
Finance needs to be a public utility provided by sovereign nations and not a might makes right jackboot controlled by the God Of Mammon cult and followers..HI, Pope Frank and King Chuck! Tell us who your friends are.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Feb 4 2025 17:40 utc | 7

2014.
I have been saying for long that rearmament programme of Russia till 2020 is too slow and that anglos will strike before that to dismantle Russia. not only that, russia herself has been too weakling and accommodating to west so much that it betrayed her potential allies in Iran, Syria and Libya to please her anglo enemies. Those allies would have occupied russia’s enemies while Rus rearms herself-but no, the idiot lavrov the foreign minster being a weakling and possible western stooge has been too considerate to the western enemies of Rus.
Even in Syria what has Russ done except disarming her ally Syria of her chemical weapons/ the usa still arms the terrorists while rus has not even given –s300 to Syria let alone s-400. This shows the attitude of Rus who does not like to be respected but simply loved by the anglos enemies who are out to destroy that country by any means for last 200 years.
World wars first and second was plotted and started by the English to destroy both Russ and Germany and this world war 3 has been running since Iraq war in 2003 –only the victims Russia, china and India does not know about it.
President putin is wrong when he says that russia should or will target the missile on europe if america goes with anti missile defence plan in Europe.
Russia must target england because this cold war -like the one before- is being started by england for the benefit of english race only-.it is race war between the english parasite race versus the rest of the world-the sooner the rest of the world realizes that better it is for the world.

Posted by: Sam | Feb 4 2025 17:40 utc | 8

http://en.ria.ru/world/20140617/190577391/Lavrov-Says-West-Must-Influence-Kiev-to-Implement-OSCE-Road-Map.html
This is high time that Russia must kick out this traitor lavrov and hang him for his treachery. His actions remind me of another foreign minster the Georgian Sehnarvazade who was with garbochow and garbachow along with him destroyed soviet union..
This lavrov knows that all plots are done by anglos controlled west and still he asks west to reign in Ukraine as if latter has any say in this destabilisation of Ukraine and Russia other than as being western slave.!
In any other country such a failure as foreign minster this lavrov would have been kicked out long time ago but alas in Russia! #

Posted by: Sam | Feb 4 2025 17:42 utc | 9

Rubio basically called US ‘Might make Right’, multipolarity. There effectively is no relation between both and it’s just deception.
https://nitter.poast.org/MenchOsint/status/1886649126395236430
US military operating over Mexican airspace. Or how Mexican sovereignty was thrown out of the window just like that by Claudia Sheinbaum.
Surprised how easily she fell in line. In the end these kind of spineless ‘leaders’ give in without much hesitation as long as their personal interests are catered for. Putin was right when he said these (and EU) leaders now put up some show resistance but soon follow the US master with their sweetly wagging tails.

Posted by: xor | Feb 4 2025 17:51 utc | 10

Rubio:
The post-war global order is not just obsolete, it is now a weapon being used against us. And all this has led to a moment in which we must now confront the single greatest risk of geopolitical instability and of generational global crisis in the lifetime of anyone alive and in this room today. Eight decades later, we are once again called to create a free world out of the chaos, and this will not be easy. And it will be impossible without a strong and a confident America that engages in the world, putting our core national interests once again above all else.
Such paranoid bullshit (!) which can only lead to aggression, attempts at territorial expansion, and all variety of threats as “foreign policy” which is allegedly to lead to “peace based on strength” and the “creation of a free world”!
What utter nonsense!
Not even a kid would say such things, for fear of embarrassment. If it weren’t the US Secretary of State spewing such BS, no one would pay any attention.
It’s not an analysis, a philosophy or an ideology, it is a distorted view of the world and ones place and role in it, divorced from reality. To be expected from uneducated, narrow-minded, corrupt members of the Trumperican ruling class in positions of power which big money has put them in. By big money, for big money.
Of course they’re paranoid when the world is changing and they are losing position, profit and control.
Dealing with paranoid individuals in high places who have delusions of grandeur and a huge military stick is tricky, but one must not take their bullshit for anything than bullshit, and look for ways to prevent them from breaking everything. That should be the focus.

Posted by: JB | Feb 4 2025 17:56 utc | 11

I think “MAGA über alles” is a perfect slogan for an administration that has Elon Musk as its right hand (pun intended), he is after all AfD’ number one fan.

Posted by: Rubiconned | Feb 4 2025 18:03 utc | 12

Lavrov’s reading is more correct in my opinion. Rubio’s nor more Mr. Nice Guy stance, which is how I too read it, is not the kind of multi-polarity I favor. I will still be so stubborn as to point out that the UN Charter, itself imposes a kind of inequality of nations. The equality of acreage built into the provisions for the General Assembly are as limited as its powers. The Security Council embodies an inequality of nations right there in the charter, with the provision for permanent members whose concurrence is required for a majority. (The veto, in other words.) And there is no provision at all for a demographic representation at any point whatsoever.
You could imagine the Framers of the US Constitution devising a House of Representatives where all states had equal representation in issuing recommendation to the Senate. And the Senate had only New York and Virginia as permanent members who had to agree for any actions or laws to pass.

Posted by: steven t johnson | Feb 4 2025 18:05 utc | 13

It helps to have powerful friends: Putin opens the door to Mexico to enter into Russia’s financial market. This is big.
https://mexicodailypost.news/2025/02/03/putin-opens-the-door-to-mexico-and-six-other-countries-in-his-currency-market/

Posted by: hispanidad | Feb 4 2025 18:11 utc | 14

The contradiction between the sanctity of current national borders and the right to self-determination (which is also the right to national unity) is not spelled out in the UN charter. By the letter, presumably the Security Council could determine (subject to the veto) that the Donbas or Taiwan were issues of self-determination? But decades-old precedent is against this.
Going back to the UN Charter technically means the Republic of China holding the Security Council seat alongside the USSR. There’s a certain black humor in calling for the Russian Federation to lose its seat, Ukraine or Belarus could be designated the holders!

Posted by: steven t johnson | Feb 4 2025 18:11 utc | 15

Rubio is a mental pygmy compared to Lavrov.

Posted by: Sun Of Alabama | Feb 4 2025 18:12 utc | 16

It’s also funny how China loves calling out the US for its bullying and muse about how “it must first respect other countries and listen to Latin American nations about their vision for the future” … but when it comes to Filipino or Vietnamese fishermen, Tibetan farmers or anyone else in Asia who has different ideas to China, can it really claim the moral high ground??

Posted by: Rubiconned | Feb 4 2025 18:15 utc | 17

I haven’t yet read the piece by Lavrov but it’s worth mentioning that the origin of the UN was accompanied by plenty of wary suspicion by, e.g., the Soviet leadership.
For example, the Soviets carried out a kind of boycott of the UN, or abstained on important votes (Korea ~ 1950). I’m sure readers could mention plenty of others.
It’s interesting to see the current Russian leadership, and the leadership of other BRICS and “Global Majority” countries, defend the UN institution when the latter has been so beneficial for the US regime which now sabotages it.
It’s similar to the class war (by the rich) in which austerity, privatization, de-regulation and all the other “blessings” of neo-liberalism take aim against the post-WW2 class “compromise” in the Western regimes.
They sabotage what was, and is, to their benefit, rather like a parasite eating the host.

Posted by: NH | Feb 4 2025 18:19 utc | 18

The latest signal of multipolarity from Trump via Reuters
Trump set to reimpose ‘maximum pressure’ on Iran, aims to drive oil exports to zero
We all know this is a BS “negotiating” position that cannot be achieved but it sounds like might makes right bullying to me….someone with the US dollar under “their” control

Posted by: psychohistorian | Feb 4 2025 18:20 utc | 19

Ukraine needs you at the front Sam.

Posted by: Fred776 | Feb 4 2025 18:21 utc | 20

supplemental:
I see that I’ve written “UN institutions” when, to be more precise, I’m talking about the principles: the sovereignty of all states, big and small, the principle of self-determination, yadda yadda.

Posted by: NH | Feb 4 2025 18:22 utc | 21

Posted by: psychohistorian | Feb 4 2025 17:40 utc | 7
“Finance needs to be a public utility provided by sovereign nations”
Let’s give the magic-money-printing machine power to other despots – no! We need democratic (i.e., power of the people) money. Gold is a proven option. Can’t be created – not in the big bang, not in a supernova, not in the earth’s depths – but when two stars collide. Can’t be destroyed – or even combined with other elements, won’t even rust/oxidize.
If you had a magic-money-printing machine, would you use it? Only in a limited way? Only for “good”? To what ends would you go to protect it, buy up armies, bribe/corrupt officials, etc? If you’re such a decent person, what do you think a psychopath would do to get and protect this power?
Absolute power corrupts absolutely, but it also attracts those psychopaths who crave it most.
The magic-money-printing machine is truly the modern day manifestation of Jesus’s “love of money is the root of all evil”.

Posted by: HB Brian | Feb 4 2025 18:27 utc | 22


The Security Council embodies an inequality of nations right there in the charter, with the provision for permanent members whose concurrence is required for a majority. (The veto, in other words.) And there is no provision at all for a demographic representation at any point whatsoever.
You could imagine the Framers of the US Constitution devising a House of Representatives where all states had equal representation in issuing recommendation to the Senate. And the Senate had only New York and Virginia as permanent members who had to agree for any actions or laws to pass.
Posted by: steven t johnson | Feb 4 2025 18:05 utc | 13

Good points.

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Feb 4 2025 18:30 utc | 23

“Gold is a proven option. Can’t be created – not in the big bang, not in a supernova, not in the earth’s depths – but when two stars collide. Can’t be destroyed – or even combined with other elements, won’t even rust/oxidize.”
Posted by: HB Brian | Feb 4 2025 18:27 utc | 22
Excellent commentary!
Gold backed currencies, like any human endeavour, can be compromised; but not in the logarithmic compromise of QE-ie money printing without any corresponding value-which will, eventually, inflate any currency to zero value.
Gold backed currencies keep Sovereigns honest.

Posted by: canuck | Feb 4 2025 18:31 utc | 24

Rubio’s win was actually a major loss.
https://x.com/NuryVittachi/status/1886210773774745721

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Feb 4 2025 18:40 utc | 25

I think “MAGA über alles” is a perfect slogan for an administration that has Elon Musk as its right hand (pun intended), he is after all AfD’ number one fan.
Posted by: Rubiconned | Feb 4 2025 18:03 utc | 12
“US über alles” anagrams to
Useable Slur

Posted by: librul | Feb 4 2025 18:47 utc | 26

The Trump administration is trying to operate like it’s 2016 and still hasn’t realized the ROTW has moved on without the US

Posted by: Ezzie | Feb 4 2025 18:49 utc | 27

Did not get what it wanted. This is theater.
What Musk is doing is not theater; and everyone is simulating helplessness about that.

Posted by: JAB | Feb 4 2025 19:06 utc | 28