Zelenski, Having Failed, Blames His Sponsors
Simon Shuster is Time's senior correspondent for Ukraine and Russia.
For writing laudatory pieces about (former) president Zelenski Shuster received extraordinary access to the Ukrainian's president's office. A later portrait by Shuster depicted Zelenski as delusional. In his latest piece he asserts that the Biden administration never intended for Ukraine to win:
When Russia invaded Ukraine nearly three years ago, President Joe Biden set three objectives for the U.S. response. Ukraine’s victory was never among them.
Preventing a war between Russia and NATO, not Ukraine winning, was one of Joe Biden's three aims.
That is why, throughout the war in Ukraine, the U.S., together with Germany, had blocked the accession of Ukraine to NATO.
In September Zelenski's last attempt with Biden to gain NATO access ended without success:
[Zelenski's] appeals got a mixed reception. On the question of Ukraine’s NATO membership, Biden would not budge.
That had always and will always be the case.
Despite having been rejected again and again Zelenski used the hope of gaining NATO (and EU) membership for Ukraine to market the war he was waging.
Now, as he is obviously losing it, he is blaming those who never promised NATO membership to him for not receiving it (machine translation):
The West's promises to one day accept Ukraine into NATO were a "lie." This was stated by President Vladimir Zelensky at the World Economic Forum in Davos.Moreover, according to him, the United States and Germany maintained contacts with Russia throughout the war.
"From some states, I think it was initially not a very transparent policy, they did not support us in NATO. And they were just false words that yes, Ukraine will be in NATO. It was not fair to Ukraine and to the Ukrainians. And it was also not fair from our leaders. When some of our leaders said and promised that we would be in NATO. And it wasn't fair either. And I believe that there was a weak position of Germany and the United States. Because they had a dialogue with the Russians. And I believe that they lost this dialogue. We lost, because they always appeal to the fact that there were once some agreements with the Russians," Zelensky said.
That false accusation against foreign countries, of promising access to NATO but not giving it, will not be received well.
As Strana remarks (machine translation):
Recall that Zelensky himself has repeatedly stated that Ukraine will be in NATO.
Also, Kiev is now demanding admission to the Alliance as a condition for making peace with Russia. At the same time, Zelensky admits that the United States and Germany are against this .
Alexey Arestovich, a former advisor to Zelenski, responds to his claim (edited machine translation):
- What are you saying? ..)Who is the main person responsible for the massive spreading of this lie to Ukrainians, for the persecution of those who said that there will be no NATO, that this is a scam, that we are being swindled, and that we signed up to sacrifice our lives for this, do you have the strength to name him?
To which Professor Glenn Diesen adds:
[T]he Western media is also responsible: Anyone arguing against setting up and sacrificing the Ukrainians in a proxy war were smeared as propagandists for Russia. Only relentless vile war propaganda has been permitted in the media.
The U.S. proxy war on Russia, which has sacrificed Ukraine, was based on research on how to 'extend Russia' published in 2019 by the Pentagon think-tank RAND Corp. That research was initiated by three questions:
- What are Russia's greatest anxieties and vulnerabilities?
- In what ways can these anxieties and vulnerabilities be exploited and extend Russia?
- What are the costs and risks associated with each option, and what are the prospects of success?
RAND found that the most favorable way to 'extend Russia' was to use Ukraine in a war against it by providing it with lethal weapons:
The United States could increase its military assistance to Ukraine—in terms of both the quantity and quality of weapons.
...
The United States could also become more vocal in its support for NATO membership for Ukraine. [...] While NATO’s requirement for unanimity makes it unlikely that Ukraine could gain membership in the foreseeable future, Washington’s pushing this possibility could boost Ukrainian resolve while leading Russia to redouble its efforts to forestall such a development.
At the time the RAND advice was published it had already been followed. Shortly after the 2014 Maidan coup the CIA had launched an intensive cooperation with the military intelligence service of Ukraine.
The partnership saw the CIA help Ukraine to rebuild its Main Directorate of Intelligence, known by its acronym HUR, which has become renowned for its audacious operations. The CIA eventually directed millions of dollars in funding to help train and equip Ukrainian intelligence officers, and to construct facilities, including around a dozen secret forward-operating bases on the border with Russia. The two services also began conducting joint operations together around the world, the highest level of trust for intelligence services, according to the former U.S. officials.
In 2017 the Trump administration started to openly deliver Javelin anti-tank missiles to Ukraine. In 2021, when Biden took over, the U.S. continued to follow the RAND advise. The flow of lethal weapons to Ukraine increased. Verbal support for NATO membership in Ukraine was given through media and anonymous briefings. But it was never stated as an official aim because the U.S. knew that there was no way to achieve it.
RAND listed 'benefits' the U.S., not Ukraine, would probably get by doing this. But those benefits were from weakening Russia, not from making real gains for the U.S. itself.
It also listed risks:
Alternatively, Russia might counter-escalate, committing more troops and pushing them deeper into Ukraine. Russia might even preempt U.S. action, escalating before any additional U.S. aid arrives. Such escalation might extend Russia; Eastern Ukraine is already a drain. Taking more of Ukraine might only increase the burden, albeit at the expense of the Ukrainian people. However, such a move might also come at a significant cost to Ukraine and to U.S. prestige and credibility. This could produce disproportionately large Ukrainian casualties, territorial losses, and refugee flows. It might even lead Ukraine into a disadvantageous peace.
The risks described by RAND are now the obvious outcome of the war.
All this was known and available through readily accessible sources.
Why Zelenski, or any other Ukrainian, had ever expected anything different is hard to conceive.
One explanation is that Zelenski is really as deluded as Shuster had described him:
[H]is belief in Ukraine’s ultimate victory over Russia has hardened into a form that worries some of his advisers. It is immovable, verging on the messianic. “He deludes himself,” one of his closest aides tells me in frustration. “We’re out of options. We’re not winning. But try telling him that.”
Dead set against any peace negotiations Zelenski's demands are getting more shrill by the day.
Next to immediate NATO membership he now demands a peacekeeping force that does not exist:
Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky, who is seeking a meeting with US President Donald Trump, says that at least 200,000 European peacekeepers will be needed to prevent a new Russian attack after any ceasefire deal.
...
"From all the Europeans? Two hundred thousand, it's a minimum. It's a minimum, otherwise it's nothing," Zelensky said when asked about the idea of a peacekeeping contingent on an interview panel after delivering his speech.That number is around the size of the entire French armed forces, estimated at just over 200,000 by France's defence ministry in 2020.
He also wants U.S. forces to be part of it.
There is no chance of getting either.
Zelenski is done with and he knows it. It is unlikely that he, in three month or so, will still be in place.
Posted by b on January 22, 2025 at 18:28 UTC | Permalink
next page »Hitler in his bunker was similarly rigid and that without the assistance of cocaine.
The green cokehead is protecting himself with fantasies. He is hard nut to crack, maybe a hazel nut will do it.
Posted by: Acco Hengst | Jan 22 2025 18:37 utc | 2
zelensky is a liar and a con man, and not as good a one as trump..
fact is war = money... always has.. the military, banking and energy complex are all in on this.. the media is their servant.. politicians who aren't beholden to this same ongoing agenda, don't get to be in power politically... that is what constitutes democracy today in the western world...
Posted by: james | Jan 22 2025 18:38 utc | 3
Great description of the 'unprovoked' war and it's inevitable results.
Posted by: ZimInSeattle | Jan 22 2025 18:42 utc | 4
Trump has all but promised the gravy train will continue to Z today with his laughable 'threats' of sanctions against Russia.
Posted by: Night Tripper | Jan 22 2025 18:43 utc | 5
side note: link in https://www.moonofalabama.org/2025/01/zelenski-having-failed-blaims-his-sponsors-.html#:~:text=providing%20it%20with%20lethal%20weapons%3A points to local c drive ...
Posted by: w | Jan 22 2025 18:43 utc | 6
Zelensky was a puppet taking orders from the US; he will be the sacrificial goat served up to receive the blame for the defeat of the Ukraine military.
The ongoing war against Russia via Ukraine continues. "Biden" attempted to escalate this to a direct conflict with Russia via the invasion of Russia and the attacks on Russian territory with missiles and drones (which are not only provided by NATO but also programmed by NATO technicians using US aerial and satellite reconnaissance; the US and UK choose the targets in Russia).
Will Putin choose to continue to prosecute the war in the face of threats by Trump?
Posted by: Perimetr | Jan 22 2025 18:44 utc | 7
After blaming Z and his cocaine-fuelled rants, let us not forget to also blame the Ukrainian people at large. This madness was relatively popular in the Ukraine for a long time, and very popular in the first 15 months or so. They have sent their husbands and children to die for the promise of Western-paid prosperity. They have made their own bed, and can’t really blame Zelensky for something that was very easy to see.
Posted by: Oracle | Jan 22 2025 18:46 utc | 8
difficult for z to agree to a ceasefire. his nazi backers will hang him and his trophy wife. and if he does agree to not join nate, the populace will kill him for sending their men to the meat grinder. so he has to continue fighting. besides he can't stop stealing the dollars
Posted by: Toxik | Jan 22 2025 18:51 utc | 9
Trump really should have been honest with Zelensky instead of providing Javelins with which to kill Russians.
I suppose a normal person like me can never comprehend the galaxy-brain peacemaking of a stable genius like Trump ...
He will try to claim this is Biden's war, when Trump literally stoked the fire, loudly and proudly at the time.
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jan 22 2025 18:54 utc | 10
the clown in the white house pitching his sanctions threat is again making the russians laughing. not a good start to make a deal.
Posted by: andreweed | Jan 22 2025 19:02 utc | 11
Kiev's military is NATO trained, NATO equipped, and NATO commanded. There are tens of thousands of sheep dipped NATO inside Kiev's territory.
Posted by: Exile | Jan 22 2025 19:03 utc | 12
For three years we've been hearing blahblahblah about Ukraine joining NATO. Its territory is disputed by active warfare so is not eligible to join nato. Full stop. Why this isn't in every newspiece/comment mentioning NATO membership seems a fundamental error, purposeful or otherwise.
Posted by: comrade simba | Jan 22 2025 19:03 utc | 13
Those whom the gods would destroy, they first give a standing ovation in the US Congress.
Posted by: TG | Jan 22 2025 19:04 utc | 14
The RAND study is a key piece of evidence detailing the US plans, long in the public domain, and completely ignored by the media. Media corruption and slavish obedience to the ptb sold the war to the western public. The lies have become common knowledge 'truth' dredged up to counter any reality based reporting. A remarkably successful strategy.
Posted by: the pessimist | Jan 22 2025 19:05 utc | 15
“We can do it the easy way, or the hard way - and the easy way is always better,” Trump warned Moscow.
That'll surely work. Moscow has never dealt with a cartoon mafia don before.
Posted by: Aleph_Null | Jan 22 2025 19:08 utc | 16
Trump has all but promised the gravy train will continue to Z today with his laughable 'threats' of sanctions against Russia.Posted by: Night Tripper | Jan 22 2025 18:43 utc | 5
The extent of the delusion at the intersection of the MAGA and Zanon crowds (which is quite an overlapping set actually) is simply astonishing.
Is there are a "gravy train" of corruption in Ukraine in the West taking advantage of the war? Sure.
But you don't go to direct war with the largest nuclear power on the planet just to grift. There is too much at risk.
You do that for much more serious reasons, and the grift is more of an epiphenomenon.
The much more serious reasons are that the world is running out of resources and the climate is going to shit, meaning that the fight for what is left is on. And of what is left in terms of both mineral resources and fertile land that will not disappear beneath the waves the largest cache is in northern Eurasia, i.e. Russia. Thus Russia has to be defeated, conquered, and the people living on that territory disappeared and/or enslaved.
In essence, Operation Barbarossa 2.0 and Generalplan Ost 2.0, but much more carefully prepared and executed, and with even more urgency behind it. Because back in the 1930s and 1940s the world was in purely economic crisis with still a lot of resources left. Today the actual resource limits have been hit.
Ukraine has been a multi-decadal project of the Western ruling class going back to the 1940s in terms of American involvement, and you can go back even further, to the 19th century in terms of Europeans stirring Ukrainian nationalism to destabilize Russia.
How is it possible for anyone in their right mind considering all of the above to think that Trump can just take office and just abandon Ukraine is quite difficult to understand. Except, of course, if the people who have been repeating that delusional nonsense for months have no grasp of the above, which indeed is true for most of them.
The even bigger problem is that Russian leadership has been behaving as if it does not understand it either...
Posted by: ANON2022 | Jan 22 2025 19:08 utc | 17
The destruction of Ukraine was evidently the desired outcome within certain Western circles, not least of all the oligarchic, inter alia, because it would harm Germany economically, potentially make EU more dependent on US energy resources, and because Ukraine's dismemberment and population collapse could be minutely studied by the US permanent military state keen on the idea of using chaos to rule in the context of the new challenges presented by the rising Chinese superpower: this means reducing large countries into smaller ones, wherein consequently rootless oligarchic "freedom" is aggrandized at the expense of the citizenry of the recently shrunken country.
Fill the world with shrunken states and the power of US-based or US-aligned oligarchs increases substantially via the various dimensions of their exercise of power, not least of which, military. It also may serve as an essay or real life simulation of the prospective dismantling of Russia itself (or at least other states within the Russian Federation or wider outer boundaries of association), since Ukraine is culturally, historically, and even politically in a smaller scale model of Western Russia (sans nukes). In any case, by sacrificing Ukraine Russian military capabilities were amply tested by the West. Obviously those within Ukraine who perceived the nature and likely futile purpose of this catastrophe have either been severely repressed by their own state or were traitors to the same.
Posted by: Ludovic | Jan 22 2025 19:08 utc | 18
@b
somehow this is the moment we have been waiting for 3 years now xD
we knew it would come, but we didnt know how much efforts would be put in to extend it that long xD cheers bro thank you for your contribution may you live even longer than you already do old man <3
Posted by: Macpott | Jan 22 2025 19:11 utc | 19
b- masterful post-one of your very best!
I rate Glenn Diesen very high as a pundit, just slightly below yourself.
Posted by: Acco Hengst | Jan 22 2025 18:37 utc | 2
Hitler was completely spun on high quality methadrine and was known for taking cocaine with Georing at social events. Then there was the syphilis.
Posted by: Badjoke | Jan 22 2025 19:19 utc | 21
For three years we've been hearing blahblahblah about Ukraine joining NATO. Its territory is disputed by active warfare so is not eligible to join nato. Full stop. Why this isn't in every newspiece/comment mentioning NATO membership seems a fundamental error, purposeful or otherwise.Posted by: comrade simba | Jan 22 2025 19:03 utc | 13
Ukraine is much more useful in its current form. It is already very successfully used as a platform for actively attacking Russia.
But actual NATO countries could not be used in the same way because then Russia would be forced to wipe out NATO in Europe. Of course, Finland, Estonia and Latvia have already been used as platforms for attack, but it was on a small scale that made it possible for the Kremlin to ignore/hide it. Even if Toropets was definitely not a "small scale" attack, but such is the pathological desire of the Kremlin scumbags to be part of the club again, that they let even that one slide as long as it could be passed as "drone debris detonating an ammo depot", which was not hard because of how propagandized into submission the Russian public is.
NATO tanks rolling into Russia from Ukraine is just a non-NATO proxy doing it, as long as the ridiculous pretense it is not NATO attacking is maintained. That pretense is impossible to maintain if NATO tanks are rolling into Russia and Belarus from Finland, the Baltics and Poland, and then that will have to be met with a decisive nuclear response.
But this is all on the Kremlin. Once the missiles started flying into Russia, the farcical nature of the Kremlin gibberish about the inadmissibility of Ukraine becoming a NATO member was fully exposed (how can things become worse than they already are if Ukraine becomes officially a member?). And yet despite making very public statements that launching missiles into Russia will finally change the game, they still accepted it as the new set of rules under which the game will be played. Destroying whatever little credibility those fools had left.
Because once again, the loyalty of the scoundrels there is not towards Russia the country, it is the interests of the small criminal oligarchic elite that runs the place that matter.
Posted by: ANON2022 | Jan 22 2025 19:21 utc | 22
Did anyone need Rand?
All one needed was a map, know populations, industrial production and natural resources. Personally, I didn't have to look it up. Most people probably here already knew.
Most of the people who read this site could have told you Russia would win any war against Ukraine.
They should have given the money to MoA and gotten as good a prediction as from Rand. Probably for a lot less money.
Posted by: Rabbit | Jan 22 2025 19:22 utc | 23
IMO, the primary failure here is Outlaw US Empire policy, not Zelensky. Did Zelensky organize the 2014 coup or the entire post-USSR policy that led to it? No, that was the Empire's gig--"Fuck the EU." As Russia insists, the conflict's roots must be examined for a proper settlement to be attained. Those roots go to 1989 and then further back to 1917, and in the UK's case to the 1840s. But for current purposes, the roots go to 1989. One can then move forward to 1992 and the formulation of the Wolfowitz Doctrine that then became the basis for "Joint Vision 2010" and the announcement of Full Spectrum Dominance as the Outlaw US Empire's #1 policy goal that was again reiterated in 1999 with "Joint Vision 2020." What took the Empire's vision off Russia was the false flag needed to instigate the conquering of five nations in seven years that would make Greater Israel possible as outlined by Netanyahu in "A Clean Break: A New Strategy for Securing the Realm" in 1996. That failed effort allowed the space of time for Russia to rebound and recoup its power, although the Establishment Meme continued to be the debilitated Russia of the 1990s.
The "extended" entity is now the Outlaw US Empire. No matter how hard and many the denials, the conflict was between the Empire/NATO and Russia, with Ukraine's role to supply the Orcs for the mission. And that's what occurred beginning in 2014 with the coup--Orcs were dispatched to subdue--kill--all who resisted the US Coup. In other words, all the deaths by the Orcs were done on Obama's orders. Same with the refusal to implement Minsk2 despite the US agreeing to its UNSCR status--Obama's orders. It really bothers me that Obama's name isn't properly attached to this conflict for he's at its secondary root, the 2014 Coup, and is just as responsible for all the deaths and destruction as Biden is. How guilty is Trump? He continued to allow Minsk2 to be violated, so he's also guilty. He'll deny that, but his hands are just as bloody as Obama's and Biden's.
Why did Zelensky promise peace when he ran for president? Didn't he have any clue that would be impossible given those actually in charge? Is he not just another Orc acting out his assigned role? If he now says he wants to negotiate, why doesn't he negate his no negotiation directive? Can he be faulted for believing the West's oft repeated promise of support: For as long as it takes? Will his prosecution be valid if it isn't shared by Obama, Trump, Biden and a host of others?
The negotiation initiation tango (from RT)...
The Kremlin has not yet been contacted by the White House to schedule a phone call between Putin and Trump, the Russian president’s foreign policy aide Yury Ushakov said on Tuesday.
Moscow is “following media reports… that Trump allegedly instructed his team to contact Russia,” Ushakov stressed, adding that the Kremlin is open for discussions with the new US administration.
I'm broken hearted cuz I can't get started with you... My (terrically limited) understanding is that, in cases of misunderstanding, the boy is supposed to call the girl. Because the girl has something the boy wants.
Please correct me if I'm wrong here.
Posted by: Aleph_Null | Jan 22 2025 19:25 utc | 25
I believe Zelensky is feeling the heat generated by the internal corrosion within Ukraine, as it rots from the inside.
I could post link after link after link about the corruption and embezzlement that is endemic in Ukrainian society, even affecting the press-gang commissioners, the civil police and the secret service. Arrests are made daily.
I could post link after link after link detailing the activities of those opposed to the Kiev junta, doing things like blowing up press-gang officers, setting their houses and vehicles on fire; shots fired at the civil police, grenades being thrown at railway stations etc. Oh, and how about the “Walk Of The Widows” taking place regularly in Kiev and other cities, as wives and mothers protest the loss of their menfolk; Western legacy media never covers this.
Zelensky must know he is a dead man walking; he‘s just waiting for Pontius Trumpilate to pronounce sentence. His only way out, and it would be one heck of a “hail Mary”, is to call for snap elections in Ukraine and then gracefully lose and retire from political life, or so he hopes.
Posted by: Jeremy Rhymings-Lang | Jan 22 2025 19:30 utc | 26
Preventing a war between Russia and NATO, not Ukraine winning, was one of Joe Biden's three aims.In that case he didn't aim very well, from his aiming you would conclude the opposite.
Posted by: Norwegian | Jan 22 2025 19:34 utc | 27
The negotiation initiation tango (from RT)...The Kremlin has not yet been contacted by the White House to schedule a phone call between Putin and Trump, the Russian president’s foreign policy aide Yury Ushakov said on Tuesday.Moscow is “following media reports… that Trump allegedly instructed his team to contact Russia,” Ushakov stressed, adding that the Kremlin is open for discussions with the new US administration.
Posted by: Aleph_Null | Jan 22 2025 19:25 utc | 25
Imagine that in 1943 Stalin had begged Hitler for negotiations offering him to keep Ukraine, Belarus and the Baltics permanently in exchange for a pinky promise never to attack again.
This is exactly what Putin is doing now.
Yes, the Bolsheviks did Brest-Litovsk, but everyone understood this is temporary. The current Kremlin wants to permanently sign over some of the most important Russian land to the West and to permanently set up there a rabidly anti-Russian entity that will be used to attack Russia forever.
What should happen to the inhabitants of that Kremlin in such a case?
Posted by: ANON2022 | Jan 22 2025 19:34 utc | 28
I see we have a flea in the works that abhors Putin more than anything else and will tell any lie to get its jollies.
Actually, I think Zelenski is telling the truth for once, I'm certain behind the scenes the US was telling Zelenski that Ukraine would join NATO as soon as they beat Russia and that they would do everything possible to ensure his victory. But, now that the US has realized Russia has won war, they are slowly backing out of the room and Zelenski is doing everything possible to keep them from dipping out entirely. What I dont know is will Ukraine collapse entirely, or will Zelenski get the President of South Vietnam Ngô Đình Diệm treatment and get assassinated to put a more compliant lacky in charge of their disposable vassal state
Posted by: Kadath | Jan 22 2025 19:37 utc | 30
@ karlof1 | Jan 22 2025 19:23 utc | 24
It's very good of you to focus on US leaders, especially Obama's neglected culpability in Ukraine. Your post is overall great, as usual. But I don't think it helps your case to adopt the Nazi-style dehumanization previously aimed at Russians -- calling them "orcs," painting them green -- as an insult for Ukranian collaborators with Empire. It's jarringly inappropriate in an otherwise thoughtful post.
Posted by: Aleph_Null | Jan 22 2025 19:38 utc | 31
He will try to claim this is Biden's war, when Trump literally stoked the fire, loudly and proudly at the time.
@Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jan 22 2025 18:54 utc | 10
There is a more nuanced view, rather than, "Trump literally stoked the fire, loudly and proudly at the time."
https://foreignpolicy.com/2019/11/15/trump-resisted-ukraine-sale-javelin-antitank-missile/
[you may need to access the archived version of this article] https://archive.ph/VqK60
In a transcript released this week, Croft testified that in response to a request for Javelins made by then-Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko, Trump said that Ukraine should pay for the weapons itself. The U.S. president said that Ukraine was capable of being a wealthy country if it wasn’t for corruption.Current and former officials told Foreign Policy that only when aides persuaded Trump of the business case to give Ukraine the Javelins did he sign off on the decision. They successfully argued that if the United States provided the missiles first as aid paid for by a U.S. grant, then the Ukrainians would come back later to buy more out of their own pockets.
Posted by: librul | Jan 22 2025 19:40 utc | 32
The quality of the Servant of the People's Pervitin must still be pretty good. Will the citizens of Kiev be playing tether ball with him anytime soon?
Cabaret Voltaire - Do the Mussolini(Headkick)
Posted by: lex talionis | Jan 22 2025 19:40 utc | 33
If I were Zelensky I would be worried. No invite to the Trump inauguration, and criticisms like this are probable straws in the wind - mainstream discourse about Zelensky in the USA and Western Europe is normally about what a hero he supposedly is.
Posted by: Waldorf | Jan 22 2025 19:45 utc | 34
Trump has all but promised the gravy train will continue to Z today with his laughable 'threats' of sanctions against Russia.Posted by: Night Tripper | Jan 22 2025 18:43 utc | 5
Yup, there's no off ramp. It's either bring the Ukronazi's to their knees or submit to America's demands.
Posted by: bored | Jan 22 2025 19:45 utc | 35
Posted by: Oracle | Jan 22 2025 18:46 utc | 8
I agree. I was on a chat forum with Ukrainian women at the war’s inception and tried to convince them that aligning with the U.S. is a death sentence for the country. They were completely outraged by my advice and only wanted me to hear me say Russians were animals.
In the immortal words of Kissinger, “It may be dangerous to be America's enemy, but to be America's friend is fatal.”
Posted by: Denjz 152 | Jan 22 2025 19:47 utc | 36
"The United States could also become more vocal in its support for NATO membership for Ukraine. [...] While NATO’s requirement for unanimity makes it unlikely that Ukraine could gain membership in the foreseeable future, Washington’s pushing this possibility could boost Ukrainian resolve while leading Russia to redouble its efforts to forestall such a development."
B quotes here from the RAND report.
That bombshell quote is not in there.
Did they take it out because: "Russian entities and individuals sympathetic to Putin's decision to invade Ukraine have mischaracterized this research in recent weeks" as the added editor's note says?
Then who has (a link to) the original version?
Or B, please explain.
Posted by: Ed Bernays | Jan 22 2025 19:51 utc | 37
Posted by: librul | Jan 22 2025 19:40 utc | 32
############
I remember what Trump was saying at the time.
He was very proud of giving weapons to the Ukrainians, emphasizing that Obama only gave blankets.
That he was only trying to make a buck for his masters is a lousy justification for enabling Nazis to commit rape and murder.
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jan 22 2025 19:58 utc | 38
Arresting generals now, what could possibly go wrong?
Generals who failed to defend Kharkiv region were taken into custodyYesterday, on January 21, the Pechersk District Court of Kiev chose preventive measures for the ex - commander of the OTU "Kharkiv", Brigadier General Yuri Galushkin and former commander of the 415th separate rifle battalion of the 23rd separate mechanized brigade Ilya Lapin. They are suspected of inadequate defense of Kharkiv region during the Russian offensive in May 2024
This is reported by RegioNews with reference to Suspilne.
The court decided that Yuriy Galushkin will spend the next 60 days in custody, with the possibility of posting bail in the amount of five million hryvnias. The prosecutor's request was partially granted.
Ilya Lapin was also given a preventive measure-detention for 60 days.
According to reports, the hearing of the case of the excombrig of the 125th TrO brigade Artur Gorbenko was suspended until January 22, because " new data has emerged."
We will remind, the other day the SBU and the State Security Bureau detained three officials of the Armed Forces of Ukraine who failed to protect Kharkiv region during the Russian offensive in May 2024. The defendants face up to 10 years in prison.
https://regionews.ua/ukr/news/kiev/1737545139-generaliv-yaki-provalili-oboronu-harkivshchini-vzyali-pid-vartu (via translation add-on.)
Posted by: Jeremy Rhymings-Lang | Jan 22 2025 19:58 utc | 39
"That false accusation against foreign countries, of promising access to NATO but not giving it, will not be received well."
Zelensky is a deranged liar in general, but I absolutely believe him that the US and Europe has promised him a hundred times that the Ukraine's reward for obediently fighting Russia would be quick NATO membership.
Posted by: flying dutchman | Jan 22 2025 20:03 utc | 40
@ TG 14
Very good.
@ Aleph_Null 25
Agree. The Ukrainians have shown their mettle. They had a legitimate reason in the centralization of their Kulak system under the Soviets to be wary of Russia and nationalistic. I sympathize with nationalists when they have a legitimate chance at exercising their authority in realpolitik, as in the case with the U.S. who, as of late, has been struggling against its own nationalist-spirit.
In the case of Ukrainians, those dumbasses will sure be surprised when the war stops and their lot improves under Russia's guiding hand.
The reason being: it would be infinitely wise to spend great wealth in building eastern Ukraine back up in dignity and glory if I were Putin. And this is exactly what Russia will do. It makes no sense to win a war against a well-meaning though deluded people and then terrorize them with austerity and repression of their native spirit.
Putin and Russia will have to be far more generous to the Ukrainians on the edge of their territory than Blackrock or western finance could ever or would ever be.
When the dust settles, the Ukrainians will be very happy that they lost.
Posted by: NemesisCalling | Jan 22 2025 20:04 utc | 41
Trump is a stupid cunt. He knows nothing of geopolitical events and geography itself. Loook at how he mixed up the "S" in BRICS claiming it was Spain. He knows nothing.
He's therefore dependent on advisors for his infomation, like, eg, "Russia lost 1 million while Ukraine lost 700,000",
Hes a thick bastard. Simple as.
Posted by: HERMIUS | Jan 22 2025 20:05 utc | 42
Posted by: Acco Hengst | Jan 22 2025 18:37 utc | 2 Hitler was completely spun on high quality methadrine and was known for taking cocaine with Georing at social events. Then there was the syphilis.Posted by: Badjoke | Jan 22 2025 19:19 utc | 21
Nope: https://www.academia.edu/4919617/Did_Hitler_have_syphilis_Letter_response
Posted by: ReinhardvonSiegfried | Jan 22 2025 20:06 utc | 43
Addendum
@31 Aleph
My post to you above was actually in regards to your comment to Karlof1 to which I was in agreement with.
Posted by: NemesisCalling | Jan 22 2025 20:06 utc | 44
Like many at MoA, Zelensky doesn't understand Real Politik.
If he did, he would be back channeling a settlement with Putin and bringing Ukraine East instead of being suckered by the queer West by selling out the Nazis to face Russian justice in return for his personal security.
I have no pity for him.
As the expression goes, "Play stupid games, win stupid prizes."
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jan 22 2025 20:06 utc | 45
39 - That said, when I first glanced at this I thought it was Russian generals being disciplined, because in my view they withdrew unnecessarily at one point earlier in the conflict in Kharkov region.
Posted by: Waldorf | Jan 22 2025 20:08 utc | 46
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jan 22 2025 20:06 utc | 45
win stupid prizes... like people here in the bar that have become active since 2014 ;) we are a "prize" of that kind of game
Posted by: Macpott | Jan 22 2025 20:10 utc | 47
Imagine that in 1943 Stalin had begged Hitler for negotiations...
This is exactly what Putin is doing now.
@ ANON2022 | Jan 22 2025 19:34 utc | 28
You perceive or predict that Putin is bowing down. Kissing the ring. Where do you get that from? Who else sees it that way besides you? I've seen all sorts, up to and including flat-affect, humanoid-like tech zillionaires, getting into Disneyland-length lines to kiss the ring. But I haven't seen Putin kiss the ring; not yet.
Can you substantiate your disrespect in any way (for instance, with some relevant fact), or are you just a source of static? My tentative bet is on the latter. Someone observed that posters with "anon" in their handle tend to be fly-by-naughts; That might be a good online heuristic.
Posted by: Aleph_Null | Jan 22 2025 20:11 utc | 48
Posted by: ANON2022 | Jan 22 2025 19:34 utc | 28
Look, we can understand that you are trolling. But you really have to get your act together. Coming out with stuff which is obviously nonsense doesn't get you anywhere. You have to put together a story which is on the face of it at least, plausible. Then add subtle little touches to cast doubt on whatever it is you want to discredit. What you do just now is just boring, because it is so obviously made-up rubbish, and offers no challenge even to a half-wit to reject as such.
Please try harder, make life interesting - even amusing if you can stretch to that. (Maybe amusing is for later - try for interesting first).
Posted by: Jams O'Donnell | Jan 22 2025 20:12 utc | 49
🇺🇦 NATO membership is the cheapest security guarantee - The Narcoführerhttps://t.me/DDGeopolitics/136952There has never been a more delusional man alive. Hands down.
🤡🇺🇦🏴☠️👉🇷🇺 Russia should at least return to the 2022 borders "for fair negotiations," Zelenskyhttps://t.me/ZandVchannel/141134
🇷🇺⚔️🇺🇦 The "cauldron" in Velika Novoselka is boiling: The Russian Army has blocked and is destroying Ukrainian forces.https://t.me/DDGeopolitics/136954
Posted by: Norwegian | Jan 22 2025 20:13 utc | 50
"Hitler in his bunker was similarly rigid and that without the assistance of cocaine.
The green cokehead is protecting himself with fantasies. He is hard nut to crack, maybe a hazel nut will do it."
Posted by: Acco Hengst | Jan 22 2025 18:37 utc | 2
Actually Hitler did use cocaine:
"Hitler's drug use was of epic proportions, Post said. In addition to cocaine, the German dictator also took amphetamines, sedatives, and hormones, prescribed by a doctor Post described as a “quack.” And he was not the only world leader dependent on drugs." (1)
"Actually, I think Zelenski is telling the truth for once, I'm certain behind the scenes the US was telling Zelenski that Ukraine would join NATO as soon as they beat Russia and that they would do everything possible to ensure his victory. But, now that the US has realized Russia has won war, they are slowly backing out of the room and Zelenski is doing everything possible to keep them from dipping out entirely. What I dont know is will Ukraine collapse entirely, or will Zelenski get the President of South Vietnam Ngô Đình Diệm treatment and get assassinated to put a more compliant lacky in charge of their disposable vassal state."
Posted by: Kadath | Jan 22 2025 19:37 utc | 30
best post I have read today-thanks.
I read that Trump says Russia is needing to settle Ukraine and will initiate discussions.....any bets on who calls who first?
I read somewhere but no link that Trump intends to fire the military that led the US to Ukraine debacle. Anybody with details?
If Ukraine is a proxy war, why is Trump going to get involved before Z?
Its Hollywood!
Posted by: psychohistorian | Jan 22 2025 20:18 utc | 53
@ Kadath | Jan 22 2025 19:37 utc | 30
zelensky is just a useful tool and a liar to boot.. their is very little usefulness in someone like that, but he has served his purpose... now he has to go, lol.. some other fool can take his place...
Posted by: james | Jan 22 2025 20:18 utc | 54
For me, what will happen - to what's left of Ukraine once Russia defeats the Neo-Nazi dictatorship and redraws the border, is that Western businesses will continue to exploit what's left of the country - and Ukrainians will be much poorer for it.
The Neo-Nazi brigades - will find terrorist work provided by the West - whether they work from Syria or wherever - they will reek havoc - and the blame will be placed on other groups.
I doubt what will be left of Ukraine will be in Nato - it was one of Putin's red-lines, and I doubt Trump will attempt to cross it.
The West, gambled on a combination of sanctions and a proxy war with Ukraine - to break Russia - or at the very least remove Putin - they failed, now the West is on the verge of abandoning Zelensky and Ukraine - as Trump (The Head of the Nato Snake), looks to new horizons such as Canada - Mexico, and Greenland, and the Panama Canal, not to mention an invasion of Venezuela.
Posted by: Republicofscotland | Jan 22 2025 20:21 utc | 55
@Ed Bernays (37)
I have 2 copies of the documen,t downloaded 31 May 2022 and 29 Jan 2023, and they both have the quote. Page 98, bottom of page. Chapter 4 Geopolitical Measures, Measure 1: Provide Lethal Aid to Ukraine.
Posted by: aletsan | Jan 22 2025 20:24 utc | 56
Trump "froze" support for the Kiev regime for 90 days
Many people noticed how on the first day of work in the chair of the 47th president of the United States, Trump simultaneously signed documents and communicated with journalists.
He "froze" aid to third countries for 90 days, without naming specific countries, but everyone understands that we are talking about Ukraine. This is a trump card for the upcoming negotiations, which has an element of blackmail. After all, when the 90 days are over, support for the Kiev regime may continue.
In other words, he simultaneously signaled that the United States is ready to decide the fate of the Kiev regime at the negotiating table and hinted that instead of a "carrot", a "stick" could follow.
He said this in a live broadcast of the #BolshayAgra program on Channel One.
Nikolay Starikov @nstarikov_bot School of Geopolitics
Starikov also said that Trump may sanction Russia after 90 days. Since Starikov calls it blackmail it means that Trump is fishing for concessions from Putin
Posted by: petergrfstrm | Jan 22 2025 20:26 utc | 58
NemesisCalling | Jan 22 2025 20:04 utc | 41
"In the case of Ukrainians, those dumbasses will sure be surprised when the war stops and their lot improves under Russia's guiding hand."
They may be surprised, but it'll do nothing to change their congenital viciousness or their indelible hatred of the real Russia. Which is why I've said all along that the Borderland is where the Morgenthau plan really should be imposed.
But of course there's no profit in that, for the Russians or for the West which Putin continues to call his "partners", so that'll never be done.
Posted by: flying dutchman | Jan 22 2025 20:27 utc | 59
The genocide supporting EU - calling for more weapons and support, for the Neo-Nazi dictatorship in Ukraine.
"As the fighting continues in Ukraine, NATO states may be gaining additional time to prepare for a potential military confrontation with Russia, Andrius Kubilius, EU commissioner for defense and space, has said.
Kubilius, a noted hawk on Russia and two-time prime minister of Lithuania, was approved by the European Parliament in November as the EU’s first-ever defense commissioner. He made the remarks on Wednesday during an address to the annual conference of the European Defense Agency.
“Every missile, every drone shot down by Ukraine – is one that will not threaten Europe, one that will not threaten NATO,” he claimed, adding that “Every day Ukraine fights on is a day the European Union and NATO can grow stronger.”
The EU commissioner called on governments to boost military support for Kiev, suggesting this would supplement the time needed to present a deterrent to potential “Russian aggression.”
Citing NATO Secretary-General Mark Rutte’s claims about a threat of a potential attack by Russia, Kubilius also urged conference attendees to “turbo charge” defense spending at national and EU levels.
“Russian factories are working day and night, pouring out weapons and ammunition,” he claimed, stressing that it is crucial to “outspend, outproduce – and outgun Russia.”
The EU is investing €300 million (over $312 million) into five cross-border projects to produce ammunition, air and missile defenses, as well as modern armed vehicles, Kubilius said, praising it as a true “big bang” in defense production.
Similar statements were made on Wednesday by the EU’s foreign policy chief Kaja Kallas, who claimed that, by fighting Russia, “he Ukrainians are buying us all time.”"
Posted by: Republicofscotland | Jan 22 2025 20:27 utc | 60
Posted by: Ed Bernays | Jan 22 2025 19:51 utc | 37
Check out https://archive.org/details/rand-rr-3063/page/98/mode/2up page 99.
Posted by: kvp | Jan 22 2025 20:30 utc | 61
Trump is working both sides, he is being conciliatory with Putin while also talking tough about sanctions and all that. I don’t agree that the tough talk about sanctions is all that useful, but Trump is Trump.
But I know exactly how he is handling Zelensky. He hasn’t told Zelensky anything, nada. He hasn’t called him. He won’t take his calls. He fired everyone in the State Department and Pentagon that had anything to do with Ukraine. Not one single person is out there to tell Zelensky where he stands with this administration. Zelensky is one hundred percent twisting in the wind and he will be until Trump is damned good and ready to tell him how high to jump. This malignant little dwarf got used to calling the tune and he is being put in his place.
Posted by: CullenBake | Jan 22 2025 20:31 utc | 62
Looks like the Orange Yankee POTUS - wants to end the conflict with Russia and Ukraine - or more like, he knows Ukraine has lost - and wants the whole messy and embarrassing mess (for the West) over and done with.
"US President Donald Trump has said that he is ready to meet with his Russian counterpart Vladimir Putin anytime in order to discuss a diplomatic settlement to the conflict between Moscow and Kiev.
During a press conference at the White House on Tuesday, Trump repeated his earlier claim that if he had been president in 2022, the Ukraine crisis “would have never happened.”
“Russia never would have gone into Ukraine. I had a very strong understanding with Putin,” he stressed.
Trump described the Russian leader as “smart” and insisted that Putin launched the military operation in the neighboring country only because “he disrespected [then-US President Joe] Biden.”
The US head of state again insisted he is now interested in swiftly finding a way to stop the Ukraine conflict, saying: “I would like to see that end.”
Ukrainian leader Vladimir Zelensky “would like to have peace. He has told me that very strongly… but it takes two to tango,” Trump explained.
When asked about when he is going to hold face-to-face talks with Putin, he replied by saying: “Anytime they want – I will meet.”
“We are talking to Zelensky. We are going to be talking with President Putin very soon and we will see how it all happens,” "
Posted by: Republicofscotland | Jan 22 2025 20:32 utc | 63
@ Ed Bernays | Jan 22 2025 19:51 utc | 37 who owes b an apology, eh?
Posted by: psychohistorian | Jan 22 2025 20:36 utc | 64
*the use of the word "begging"*Posted by: ANON2022 | Jan 22 2025 19:34 utc | 28
what is it with you british idiot nafos constantly using the word "begging"? do you idiots even know the meaning of it? because in the context you are using it, you clearly dont!
Posted by: Justpassinby | Jan 22 2025 20:36 utc | 65
I've said it before, but it's worth repeating (especially in the face of the RAND memorandum):
1. Most people are unreflective, easily manipulated, deferential toward perceived authority and, well, stupid.
2. In history bet on incompetence rather than conspiracy.
3. Follow the money, or at the very least, what people believe to be in their interests (rational or not).
Z was strung along because he was always meant to be no more than the anchorman. When vassal leaders start to drink their own koolaid (never a good idea) they have to be clipped. He was given a part to play because he was a showman. All he needs to do is learn his lines. The actor who says back to the writer-director "hey, I think this script would be a better fit for my character" ain't gonna last. 'My' character... it ever ceases to amaze me how power confuses the wielder into believing that they alone constitute the sole source of their success. The Devil is always around the corner waiting for his cut.
Posted by: Patroklos | Jan 22 2025 20:39 utc | 66
Trump threatens Putin. Mobilises troops to Mexican border | ABC NEWS
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oeP1OPIKWW0
§| “US President Donald Trump has threatened Russian counterpart Vladimir Putin with further sanctions if his Moscow does not end the Ukraine war”.
__
Trump has posted @Putin on Truth Social.
That’s how world leaders communicate and negotiate in 2025…. They post on X or in Trump’s case his own virtual megaphone.
I’d luv luv luv to be manning a hidden microphone as Lavrov Putin Peskov Off-his-Medvedev parse and likely guffaw at the Carnival Barker in Chief deploying pixel-raging as a tactic.
Posted by: Melaleuca | Jan 22 2025 20:44 utc | 67
@ Melaleuca | Jan 22 2025 20:44 utc | 67 reporting about Trump pixel-raging...thx...good term
Wait until Trump starts using ALL CAPS and then we will know he is really pixel-raging.
Trump is the perfect face of dying empire
Posted by: psychohistorian | Jan 22 2025 20:51 utc | 68
@Ed Bernays | 37
Current posted PDF in rand.org site contains the quote.
Please explain your comment.
Did you even check the validity of your claim?
Ignorance of misinfo?
Posted by: aletsan | Jan 22 2025 20:52 utc | 69
You perceive or predict that Putin is bowing down. Kissing the ring. Where do you get that from? Who else sees it that way besides you? I've seen all sorts, up to and including flat-affect, humanoid-like tech zillionaires, getting into Disneyland-length lines to kiss the ring. But I haven't seen Putin kiss the ring; not yet.Can you substantiate your disrespect in any way (for instance, with some relevant fact), or are you just a source of static? My tentative bet is on the latter. Someone observed that posters with "anon" in their handle tend to be fly-by-naughts; That might be a good online heuristic.
Posted by: Aleph_Null | Jan 22 2025 20:11 utc | 48
If the Kremlin was not begging for a deal, it would be doing what has to be done to win the war. There is a rather 100% one-to-one relationship between these things, so the vice versa applies too.
But the Kremlin is not doing what has to be done to win the war, quite the opposite. It is firmly refusing to do it.
And it also constantly puts out statements about openness towards negotiations.
Don't mistake what the likes of Medvedev put out on personal Telegram/Twitter accounts or what Patrushev said in an interview for the official position. Nothing that has been said officially signals any kind of seriousness about the war, and the begging for a deal is incessant in the official statements.
And again, much more importantly, the situation on the ground is not one suggesting the Kremlin is looking for a victory.
Even the little things such as taking out Zelensky are vetoed.
The usual reminder that the joint Ukronazi and NATO-Nazi forces have:
-- slaughtered thousands of Russian civilians in Kursk directly with their hands after doing a proper combined arms invasion of Russia
-- killed approaching a four-digit number of Russian civilians on official Russian territory with drones and missiles
-- killed a five-digit number of Russian civilians on formerly Ukrainian territory
-- killed a lot of Russian civilians on territory controlled by Ukraine
-- struck many sensitive civilian and military objects in Russia proper.
Nobody has touched Zelensky and co. in response even though that is a very small thing to do that requires little effort. He and those around him are cockroaches, squash them, for several reasons:
1) They fully deserves it
2) It is mandatory to enforce deterrence (see the list above)
3) It is mandatory for the purpose of maintaining morale inside Russia (when leadership is directly stopping its people from defending themselves even though they have the tools to very effectively make sure nobody dares touch them, that does absolute wonders for internal cohesion)
4) It is mandatory to signal seriousness about solving the problem internationally so that other countries to do not sense weakness and star acting accordingly (which is precisely what has been happening since mid-2022 if you have been paying attention).
5) It does not take much effort, just do it.
There is also a firm refusal to mobilize manpower and industry to properly win the war on any kind of reasonable time scale. The ship on winning it on time has already sailed long ago, but the next best thing is to fix that mistake now.
And there is a firm refusal to commit to winning it in the first place. Putin's June speech was actually raising the white flag, not a commitment to winning. He effectively said "Give us the four regions and the war is over", which is a total strategic defeat. The absolute minimal condition for winning is getting to the Polish border. Nothing short of that will suffice. Kazan is being bombed every other day now, some 800 miles from the border. But it's only 500 miles from the Polish border to Kursk. Meaning that Russia proper will always be bombed daily even if takes Kiev but does not take all of Ukraine. And, of course, if it takes Kiev, then it will have to protect Kiev, just as it the case with Donetsk now, meaning the ruinous if having to do it in perpetuity and with less-than-100% success rate (which it will always be) daily expenditure of air defense assets will not stop.
Has the Kremlin committed to taking Lutsk and Lvov? No.
Has the Kremlin committed to taking Kiev? No, in fact Putin said "we will need to raise another 500,000 to a million men to do that", meaning that is firmly not on the table.
Has the Kremlin committed to even taking Sumy, Chernigov and Kharkov in order to push short-range weapons out of range of Russia proper? No, not even that.
Well, what are we talking about here then?
Posted by: ANON2022 | Jan 22 2025 20:54 utc | 70
45 - I think he does understand Realpolitik. I despise him but I don't think he is stupid. The trouble is that he is trapped. If he starts to attempt rapprochement with Russia, NATO/the Azov types will kill him. He will be JFKed, or perhaps Wallensteined.
Posted by: Waldorf | Jan 22 2025 21:02 utc | 71
Posted by: CullenBake | Jan 22 2025 20:31 utc | 62
Very good, keep it up.
Posted by: guest from franconia | Jan 22 2025 21:04 utc | 72
Yay !! (insert Fluttershy meme here)
Big news : Hellenskyi's toasted ... so 2022.
Well anyway.
The fun thing in all that "stop sponsoring" operations is that all the usual beggars of US foreign policies will be dry out from cash. The end of the gravy train.
My pinky(pie) said me this thing is gonna end up in some kind of parties anywhere around the globe ...
Posted by: Hiro Masamune | Jan 22 2025 21:07 utc | 73
The foreign aid freeze probably won't apply to anything in the pipeline, and Joebiden packed it full on his way out. However, most of what has been "sent" is phantom hardware yet to be manufactured, let alone shipped.
Looks like a clever dodge - neither does or doesn't do anything but buys time to let something we are not privy to shake out. It is still the #1 thing to watch as the signal for Trump draining the swamp or being swamped by the blob like what happened in his first term.
Posted by: comrade simba | Jan 22 2025 21:10 utc | 74
Don't US allies if all our wars-of-vanity end up screwed, blued and tatooed? Zelensky, the TV commedia, if just one more.
I hope you've saved your money, Z., and have a good escape plan for your family!
Posted by: lester | Jan 22 2025 21:11 utc | 75
But the Kremlin is not doing what has to be done to win the war, quite the opposite.
Posted by: ANON2022 | Jan 22 2025 20:54 utc | 70
##############
I have to ask, which wars have you won in order to claim that someone is not following the appropriate strategy?
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jan 22 2025 21:14 utc | 76
Trump couldn't even last one week before returning to his first term form. LOL
The jokes write themselves.
He probably shouldn't have promised 24 hours, as the American media are determined to hang him on that.
Under promise, OVER deliver.
Always.
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jan 22 2025 21:16 utc | 77
Posted by: ANON2022 | Jan 22 2025 20:54 utc | 70
Some desperate flailing in this post:
But the Kremlin is not doing what has to be done to win the war, quite the opposite. It is firmly refusing to do it.The Kremlin is operating within its TOE and COFM.
And it also constantly puts out statements about openness towards negotiations.Recent statements from various Russian government officials have consistently used the word “dialogue”, not “negotiations”.
Even the little things such as taking out Zelensky are vetoed.Zelly is on many peoples target list, why should Russia waste their time when others will do the job for them?
-- slaughtered thousands of Russian civilians in Kursk directly with their hands after doing a proper combined arms invasion of RussiaPlease provide a credentialled citation for your claims. Kursk has been, and remains, “suicide alley” for the AFU; a disastrous operation that has had a directly negative impact on their ability to defend or shore up the Donbass frontline.
Nobody has touched Zelensky and co. in response even though that is a very small thing to do that requires little effort.More repeats than the BBC.
And on and on and on it goes:
Well, what are we talking about here then?How about your complete and total misreading of the SMO, your absolute disregard of the aims of the SMO, which have been clearly and repeatedly set out by Russia, and also repeatedly posted here and in other online forums.
Or how about we talk about you posting reams of gormless verbiage with no actual evolution or development in your viewpoint?
~~~
PS: don’t forget to donate...
Posted by: Jeremy Rhymings-Lang | Jan 22 2025 21:20 utc | 78
I recently bought a copy of "The CIA as Organized Crime: How Illegal Operations Corrupt America and the World" by Doug Valentine. It was published in 2017 and has a chapter devoted to CIA and Ukraine (Chapter 9), in which he lays out how the multi-decade project to install a "civil base" in Ukraine has been accomplished. For those who automatically dismiss "conspiracy theories" I highly recommend reading that whole book, and/or the chapter on Ukraine. Here's an excerpt:
VALENTINE: I’ll give you an example. When the CIA moved into Vietnam, which had a culture the US hadn’t dealt with before, the first thing it did was buy a lot of property. This was during the First Indochina War and they did this clandestinely, through cut-outs, so they’d have safe houses to set up organizations later on. It’s always best for them to buy real estate during times of crisis when prices are down. Like Trump always says, “Buy low.” And when are prices lowest? As Baron Rothschild famously said, “When there’s blood in the streets.”The CIA bought huge tracts of property in Saigon in between 1952 and 1955, during the First Indochina War, when there was blood on the streets. The CIA bought prime property at ten percent of its value. That’s the first step – get your nose in the tent. These buildings served as places where CIA officers could meet their agents and plot dirty deeds. They passed some to NGOs and civil organizations to operate.
William Colby introduced me to one of his cohorts, Clyde Bauer, the CIA officer who ran Air America in Vietnam in the early days. Bauer told me he set up South Vietnam’s Foreign Relations Council, Chamber of Commerce and Lions Club, “to create a strong civil base.” That’s what the CIA is doing in Ukraine through the Centre UA. It’s creating a pro-American civil base, from which political candidates emerge.
The CIA influences politics in foreign nations in many ways. CIA officers are constantly funneling money to all political parties, right and left, and establishing long-range agents to monitor and manipulate political developments. That’s standard operating procedure.
The next thing the CIA does is seize control of a nation’s secret services. That’s what they did in Vietnam, and in Ukraine. As I’ve explained elsewhere, they offer training and high tech gadgetry to people in the secret services; they corrupt them and use them for their own purposes, like they used SAVAK in Iran. It’s highly illegal to suborn officials in foreign nations. We don’t like it when it’s done to us, and it’s not something even an influential billionaire like Omidyar is trained to do (although his private security force is probably staffed by former CIA officers who do know how to do it).
The CIA infiltrates all the political parties and as soon as a politician they own is in place, right or left, they can elevate him or her to Defense Minister or Interior Minister. These ministers are on the CIA payroll and appoint military, security and police officials who do the CIA’s bidding. The CIA tries to place its people throughout the captive nation’s government and civil society. In South America they recruit junior military officers via the School of the Americas (now innocuously renamed) and when the time is right, have them stage a coup with the support of all the other people they’re been cultivating for years, sometimes decades.6
US corporations need the CIA to put these parallel governments in place. The CIA penetrates the military and security services, and simultaneously creates a civil base through deniable organizations like Centre for UA. This is how societies are ruled when there’s no overwhelming popular support: through the ownership of property and by having the proper people in government and civic institutions.
The CIA recruits people in place like Lech Walesa in Poland. Often the people running the unions are on the CIA payroll; people running the education system too. The CIA can recruit these people because it has so much money. The Russians can’t compete, when billionaires like George Soros are sprinkling a million here and five million there – money that goes into building civic institutions that are ideologically attuned. Whether people do it for love or money, or belief of a brighter future, the CIA is manipulating the social and political processes. Its officers and their agents are recruiting people and putting them in place, having them sign contracts that effectively say, “In exchange for working for us in advancing our interests here in Kiev you will get $100,000 in a Swiss bank account and your life will be rosy.”
It’s illegal. It’s treasonous. You can’t take money from a foreign intelligence agency and work against your own country, but that is what the CIA is doing in the Ukraine right now and around the world on a massive scale.
The chapter is much longer (both prior to and after that excerpt) and, to me, a great benefit is that it was written years before the SMO and during the middle of the period during which the Minsk Accords were being intentionally not adhered to by the "west."
Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Jan 22 2025 21:20 utc | 79
More from the book:
DAWSON: They did the same thing in Japan. They got Yakuza and former Japanese spies to spy on the Chinese. They needed that intelligence, and they didn’t have enough Chinese speakers or people who could infiltrate. So they kept the same imperial Japanese who had been there during World War Two.VALENTINE: All of this is illegal, but this is what the CIA does all around the world. It’s been doing it in the Ukraine for generations. It has the grandchildren of Nazis on its payroll, an incredible infrastructure of neo-Nazi secret agents who’ve been battling against Russia for seventy years.
The Russians know their names, where they live, where the CIA has its safe houses. But the American public has no clue. They think the crisis began today because of the way the news is presented. The journalists, their editors, the industry owners, the publishers – which now include Omidyar – don’t want you to know about all the illegal activities the CIA is involved in on their behalf. So the owners of The New York Times and the Washington Post hire editors who will direct reporters in such a way that they never report on what the CIA is doing.
DAWSON: Some of them are CIA.
VALENTINE: Journalism in the US is a traditional cover for CIA officers. And when the owners of the media aren’t covering for the CIA, they’re selling commercial time slots to the multi-national corporations that in turn are selling you commodities made in sweatshops in foreign nation that have been subverted by the CIA. You could almost say there’s no such thing as factual reporting. It’s as valuable as most of the over-priced commodities people buy to elevate their status. Everything is twisted and delivered in nine second sound bites, so you’ll buy something, not know something, or forget about something.
DAWSON: If anyone is confused, just look at the reporting on Ukraine, or the reporting during the build-up to the Iraq War. Look how uniform all these three-letter networks were. The reporting got debunked online. Yet on television you had a completely one-sided story. It’s pro-war, pro-coup d’état.
VALENTINE: The problem, in my opinion, is not that the CIA infiltrated journalism, but rather that the CIA is promoting the business of journalism – which is actually the advertising branch of capitalism. They’re working together. The “reliable” journalists who report on the CIA – guys like Seymour Hersh – never say the things I’m saying here. The CIA and the media are part of the same criminal conspiracy. You’re never going to learn anything substantive by reading what mainstream reporters dish out about the CIA. You can’t take a journalism course in CIA Criminal Conspiracies 101.
DAWSON: That’s why I made a documentary film called “Decades of Deception” that went over a bunch of covert operations – that have been busted wide open – that the CIA was involved with or completely in control of.9 But, getting that out there is a drop in the bucket compared to what the mass media disseminates, and how much bull we’re fed in school and from television.
Zelenski was likely cultivated by the CIA and its cutout groups, not just his oligarchical benefactors, who themselves have no real interest in "Slava Ukraini" or any remotely genuine sense of nationalism. It's all about the BIG $$ and the CIA and US gov't are capitalism's shock enforcer wing.
Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Jan 22 2025 21:27 utc | 80
There's words, then there's action.
Take for example the fact that every single Pentagon personnel involved with Ukraine and Ukraine aid has either been reassigned or dismissed.
https://x.com/KyivPost/status/1881807949267665171?mx=2
Posted by: Suresh | Jan 22 2025 21:37 utc | 81
Lovely stuff b!
This is why we frequent this esteemed bar. Keep up the good work. D.
Posted by: Don Firineach | Jan 22 2025 21:38 utc | 82
Too much utter bullshit has been talked about Joe Stalin to ever get many of the drongos who leapt at this site in the last few years to ever acknowledge that he was a man dedicated to his beliefs who more than anyone else knew that barbarossa, the murderous invasion of the USSR instigated by nazi germany & funded by the west could ever be successfully opposed cost free. The defeat of the nazis by the USSR cost Russia 27 million soviet lives plus the material costs of rebuilding afterwards, not just within the USSR but also within the buffer states surrounding it. This played on Secretary Stalin's thoughts constantly and now President Putin has had the same situation forced upon Russia for the same reason as Stalin had to confront it.
Russia's careful husbandry of resources has ensured that those resources have outlasted instant western puppet states such as saudi arabia, but now that means that they have once again become a 'juicy' target for the amoral, rapacious western elites. All this blather about Russian oligarchs from derps never fails to ignore the fact that compared to western oligarchs Russia's business leaders possess a tiny fraction of the assets the likes of amerikan oligarchs' control, their ability to influence the RF government is also negligible which is why so many of 'em eagerly shot through & shifted to the west where their funds could buy power and influence.
eg Evgeny Lebedev aka Baron Lebedev of Hampton.
Whilst all the galoots, drongos and derps continue to whine about 'what Russia needs to do', they conveniently forget the vast cost of Russian lives, lives that will be lost if the Russian Government were to make the wrong move.
Here in the west where everyone has been indoctrinated into believing that the west won ww2 at minimal cost, so consequently have largely forgotten ww2, citizens of Russia remember the decades of hardship following victory that the fascist assault upon them cost.
I am frankly sick of reading the continual tosh from dropkicks about what Putin's next move should be as if he were some sort on tyrant dedicated to fleecing the masses instead of a man tasked with leading by consensus the way outta this greed driven attack upon Russia at as little cost as possible to Russia's citizens.
Posted by: Debsisdead | Jan 22 2025 21:41 utc | 83
Posted by: Debsisdead | Jan 22 2025 21:41 utc | 83
Good comment, thanks. It reminds me of a piece I saw at Covert Action Magazine the other day and after reading it, I had a follow up email conversation with the author, mainly about the controversy surrounding rumors that Trotsky was an MI6 asset.
https://covertactionmagazine.com/2025/01/21/who-was-antony-sutton/
The info I found on Trotsky is here:https://sovinform.net/Trotsky-MI6-agent.htm (which I believe is a pro-Stalin site)
Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Jan 22 2025 21:46 utc | 84
Posted by: Suresh | Jan 22 2025 21:37 utc | 81
##############
They will all be back with the next Democrat administration.
Nothing is permanent in the Empire of Lies.
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jan 22 2025 21:51 utc | 85
Posted by: Debsisdead | Jan 22 2025 21:41 utc | 83
I agree, but Putin is not Stalin and 2025 Russia is not 1942 Russia. The fight is different: it's about markets. It's about whether Germany can achieve the long-term relationship with Russia it needs or forever bend the knee to the US. Let's not forget it.
Posted by: Patroklos | Jan 22 2025 21:53 utc | 86
Posted by: CullenBake | Jan 22 2025 20:31 utc | 62
Yup, the TDS posters are so wrapped up in their hyperbolic vituperation that they don’t see the Trump play book. He’s removed the security clearances of 51, high ranking intel officers who lied about Hunter’s laptop, plus Mr Bolton’s, he’s about to sack or reassign dozens of senior officers, who’ve failed in their primary duty, all people Z was relying on to feed him intel during 47’s return. He’s siloed the silos of the IC, restricted their ability to launch coordinated actions against his agenda and put vetted officials to monitor their output.
Z’s swinging in the wind, aid is frozen, logistics support will be cut back and I wonder how many more ATACMS missiles will be fed coordinates, or AFV’s repaired back in Poland. He’s given Putin a window to wrap this up, with a threat of sanctions, and repeating the official KIA/lost conflation, previously discussed, stressing his belief that wars are usually a waste of resources and lives (a central plank of his campaign), whilst immunising himself from accusations by the IC/MSM conduit of being pro-Russian. In three days he’s upended the liberal globalist orthodoxy, that ruled the US for 30 plus years, and he’s only just started getting going. I said before, the first 100 days will be critical to establish the counter-revolution and Z’s not part of the plan, hence the increased rumblings from Ukraine’s General staff, as the front buckles even more and the army is stripped to support it (visions of units made up of Ukrainian sailors and UAF ground crews, as in ‘45).
Posted by: Milites | Jan 22 2025 21:56 utc | 87
Can I make a plea for links to any and all sources of estimates of Kiev Ukraine battlefield deaths during the course of the conflict?
Seems to be still very much an unknown and contentious.
Even out of date links would be useful.
Posted by: arthur brogard | Jan 22 2025 21:59 utc | 88
Don't forget Vicky Nuland the right hand of Dick Cheney - VP Biden - President Joe.
NATO membership was never on the radar as it requires unanimity and tranquillity ... no border or territorial disputes. Old man Joe couldn't keep his zipper up and had to engage Russia because of the loss and retreat of Kabul, losing a foothold in Central Asia. A decision in Ukraine would leave Crimea with a NATO naval base and entry to the Black Sea.
It too was payback for the embarrassment in Syria from September 2015 forward. The US-UK-NATO kept pushing logistical and military support to the terrorists holed up in Idlib district. ... harsh economic sanctions killed any and all economic options for Syria ... the Assad regime collapsed. The HTS-Al Nusra-Al Qaeda rebels posted the victory with support from Ukrainian SBU. Sultan Erdogan of Türkiye is Satan, a Judas.
Same effort Biden put in the sanctions for Iran and Russia. Joe needed VDL and Europe as a client state for fossil fuel. Always is a battle of capitalism, not about democracy, freedom or sovereignty of a nation.
Leaving terror and chaos behind is victory for Washington DC – US Congress – the Pentagon and the White House. Lives don’t matter to Joe. A white racist supremacist all his damn life. Blue, not Red. A Zionist.
Soon Elon too will convert to Judaism.
“NATO tanks rolling into Russia” is Kafkaesque nonsense on so many levels. With Trump’s U.S. withdrawal from NATO, that organisation’s lifetime is measured in months.
What NATO tanks? They’ve all already been destroyed in Ukraine. Germany burned through all their Leopard 2s - heavy and useless anyway, and now are sustaining Ukraine with 1950’s leopard 1s. France’s “tanks” with tyres and British challengers are also useless and gone. Nazi east Europe have already sent everything to Banderafatherland and for what?
It’s an interesting question - what will disappear first, Europe’s car industry, the EU or NATO?
Likewise gibberish about “Russian oligarchs” somehow overlooks the inconvenient fact that they don’t exist. The first thing the Kremlin did on the outset of the Ukraine war in 2022 was kill off the oligarchs. Sometimes their whole families. Did this somehow escape your notice?
Vladimir Putin does not exist. Just like Satan does not exist, or Baba Yaga. Except in the microscopic diseased mind bubbles of some nonce Anglo-Saxons. These are fairy tale bogeymen.
Russia’s oligarchs and opposition likewise exist only in the minds of BBC types but not in reality. Russia itself as believed in micro Anglo nonce world does not exist either.
Posted by: Andrew Sarchus | Jan 22 2025 22:07 utc | 90
@arthur brogard | Wed, 22 Jan 2025 21:59:00 GMT | 88
Can I make a plea for links to any and all sources of estimates of Kiev Ukraine battlefield deaths during the course of the conflict?Seems to be still very much an unknown and contentious.
I think Newbie has all those details.
Posted by: James M. | Jan 22 2025 22:07 utc | 91
When Russia invaded Ukraine nearly three years ago, President Joe Biden set three objectives for the U.S. response. Ukraine’s victory was never among them.Preventing a war between Russia and NATO, not Ukraine winning, was one of Joe Biden's three aims.
So basically Biden and Putin had the same war aims - keeping Ukraine sovereign and out of NATO, and no war between Russia and NATO.
Posted by: James M. | Jan 22 2025 22:11 utc | 92
All the idiots professing they know what Trump is doing never even read "The Art of the Deal", and that includes b and karl, who I normally enjoy.
Trump's outrageous demands are his hallmark opening ploy. He sets his negotiation boundary so far away from 'normal' that everyone is frightened - looking at the various chickens running around looking for a chopping block in Canada - and expects that's what he's going to demand. Then, he backs off, and accepts something more reasonable (but still more favourable than the status quo ante) and everyone breathes a sigh of relief. It's all so predictable.
Plus with Russia, he still has the "russia, russia, russia" crowd to deal with, so he can't just walk over offering olive branches. Don't you people realize that? He has to look tough, and convince everyone that he got the 'madman' Putin to back down. To accomplish that while holding no cards is the art of a master poker player. Patience is a better response than panic.
Posted by: KevinB | Jan 22 2025 22:13 utc | 93
Now here is something from the “cat among pigeons” file; could President Trump appoint a Special Prosecutor to investigate Bill Browder? From what I have seen, Mr. Browder has not received a blanket pardon from the outgoing administration...
Posted by: Jeremy Rhymings-Lang | Jan 22 2025 22:15 utc | 94
Zelensky is an example of what happens when you pick a TV comedian to rule your country. You end up in trouble because your false messiah is more ignorant than than the average boar hog and can't actually make anything good happen. When offered a peace treaty that offers an end to a war and to NOT kill shitloads of young men, and Zelensky (skilled at playing the piano with his pecker) lets himself be talked out of it by Boris Johnson, another no-nothing with big mouth. Result: lots more dead young Uki men! And losing the struggle to Russia anyway.
Insh'allah, Trump-a-dump will not kill shitloads of Americans in yet another war of vanity. (Imagine the US partition 4 ways, between Canada, Mexico, Cuba and China, like Germany, 1946).
Posted by: lester | Jan 22 2025 22:20 utc | 95
South Korea: another CIA-MI6 coup fails. The U.S.-Ukraine supported traitor ex President was finally arrested, notwithstanding the crowd of nonces outside his residence waving pathetic Korean-U.S. flags. The USA and the wonderland they lead is no longer a threat but a nuisance.
https://youtube.com/shorts/J0CC_lkZLTM?si=MVnaRWDKx3mGwhYe
Posted by: Andrew Sarchus | Jan 22 2025 22:20 utc | 96
@Exile | Wed, 22 Jan 2025 19:03:00 GMT | 12
There are tens of thousands of sheep dipped NATO inside Kiev's territory.
Prove it, with evidence. Units deployed, dates deployed, from which countries. I'll accept properly sourced MoD records from NATO member states, including unit records and PCS orders, satellite footage of troop movements, official published lists of casualties, that sort of a thing.
Oh, but they're sheep dipped, super secret, no one knows they are there. But you wrongly use that term. "Sheep dipped" means they are clandestine, and well hidden. You can sheep dip ten troops for a while, but not tens of thousands (20,000-100,000?). That number of troops moving to Ukraine would be noticed, and their absence would also be noticed, so it should be easy to find evidence they are there.
Posted by: James M. | Jan 22 2025 22:21 utc | 97
Andrew [email protected] all of NATO's tanks have been destroyed why is Russia slogging it out up and down the LDPR LOCC and not standing at the Polish border dictating the outcome of the, it's still a SlogMow, conflict? This may come as a surprise to you and many Russophiles here, but NATO's best kit sits on the NATO block border, from north to south. Ready and waiting.
If Russia was serious and not back footed reacting, they'd be at NATO's border, bit of a yawn, we wait.
Cheers M
Posted by: sean the leprechaun | Jan 22 2025 22:21 utc | 98
Posted by: petergrfstrm | Jan 22 2025 20:26 utc | 58
Trump may have offered a 90-day-"carrot", but he also has a stick - what kind of a stick would that be that would impress Putin? Europe has tried everything sanctionwise - their latest sanction package has the number 16. And they have tried everything military-wise - short of Taurus, thanks to Scholz. So there is little what Trump could still use as a "stick", it makes no difference any more after all the Russians have endured at the hands of Biden. He should, instead, completely refrain from using any threats - for all they would reveal is the typical American arrogance and dumbness.
Posted by: grunzt | Jan 22 2025 22:24 utc | 99
I'll check back in three months. You've got a long history of bad predictions.
Posted by: Anonymous | Jan 22 2025 22:25 utc | 100
The comments to this entry are closed.
Zelenski is done with and he knows it. It is unlikely that he, in three month or so, will still be in place.
How soon will the US stage manage another coup in Ukraine?
I am betting Zelenski is coup-ed in the 2nd quarter of 2025.
Any takers?
Posted by: librul | Jan 22 2025 18:35 utc | 1