Ukraine Open Thread 2024-306

December 22, 2024

News & views related to the war in Ukraine …

Posted by b on December 22, 2024 at 13:12 UTC | Permalink

Comments

The more the West and NATO attck deep Russia with ATACMS…..the more Ukraine will be destroyed….
……..its as simple as that!

Posted by: HERMIUS | Dec 23 2024 0:48 utc | 101

-Asks a question
-Gets his fallacies pointed out
-“I am not wrong”
-Leaves
Oh boy.

Posted by: boneless | Dec 23 2024 0:48 utc | 102

“Agreed, tech leadership can certainly waiver, the challenge there is that the West is too far behind at the moment to change the outcome in Ukraine (or Taiwan). [The circumstances regarding Iran are questionable but IMHO far more dangerous for the US & Israel simply because they don’t fully appreciate the risks involved.]”
I disagree. The west can not catch up in missile technology. They abandoned trying to compete in missile technology a long time ago and this is quite evident when evaluating their current triad missile technologies. Which is not to say the missile delivery systems of the nuclear triad are not effective they are jut not competitive with the Russians. THe p 800 has been in service for 40 years. The USA doesnt have anything like that. P -800 is still a ass kicker. Russia is not wasting them on Ukrainian dugouts. The reality is every weapons system that uses a physical mechanical delivery system not a organic biological delivery system is completely obsolete.
Russia innovates and pursues multi disciplinary weapons development because they are motivated by a existential threat. Missiles can be both nuclear and conventional. Since the Russians have some idea of what force actually is how it can be used and its inherent flaws as a means of continuance this dual role appeals to them. The USA on the other hand is like Homer simpson who having obtained a firearm uses it as his TV remote.
USA weapons contractors are motivated only peripherally by perception of existential threat. It is for profit and profit is measured quarterly. They dont innovate and go to the military and say this is what we can do where do you want our efforts to go. They come up with products. Those products are designed to create profit. The best profit comes from staying in a comfort zone. a known product whose manufacturability is known. Risk can be negated by promise of compensation through the use of contracts but results are not guaranteed from this practice. Forget anything other than the quarterly statement. Brass is hired to promote products. The military selects from the products offered. Thats not even true the politicians in the states where the weapons are manufactured decide which products are manufactured. Thats what the military gets with most of their T a year. They get to spend some part of it how they want along with the black $.
None of this works toward a multidisciplinary program that spans decades. Hypersonics didnt just happen. But its not just the R&D. The manufacturing capability does not exist in the USA for Hypersonics. Missiles are disposable. You need volume.
The military understood this a long time ago. They took the part of their allowance that they are allowed to spend to develop war technologies that were very effective and did not need the human material and manufacturing base to create WMDs. WAs this a bad thing in terms of weapon destructiveness? No. Acknowledging resource constraints is part of successful R&D. They understood they couldn’t compete in missile technology. They said well how can we use what we have to create effective weapons of mass destruction, There are very intelligent people in the military. They spent their allowance well.
If the get the weapons program to have commercial applications that create quarterly profit then everybody is down. Say oh I dont know medical technology. now you have your commitment that can span decades. You cant really sell hypersonics at walmart.
You need some test subjects, thats not really a issue.
If you look at the approach it was fundamentally a function of resource constraints. That does not mean its a ineffective approach. In fact I would argue it it created a much more affective weapons technology. If the USA had a ability to compete in missile technology it might have never looked at alternatives much like it is owned by its ancient top gun aircraft perspective. Successful R&D programs always evaluate constraints.
If you realize that the military only gets to spend a percentage of its budget as a function of its ability to choose effective weapons systems you can realize that the resource constraints that it has are similar to many nations of various sizes. Just as the USA military found ways to deal with the resource constraints many other nations are in a quite similar situation. As technology grows becomes more affordable and widely available nations use their own creativeness to use these cost effective technology’s in weapons development as a function of resource allocation. This reality can not be denied and will result in effective weapon proliferation on a scale not previously observed. As human creativeness is applied to creation of WMD invariably breakthroughs will be made and while we can guess at probability for which nation will make breakthroughs is quite uncertain. The most Probable nation to innovate breakthroughs in weapon technologies is of course China with its unique position in exposure to technologies, resource accessibility, and human resource accessibility. The Latter perhaps judged by the amount of STEM students and evaluating this should be of concern to the west.
In the short term nations may be manipulated by the possessors of effective weapons systems in the intermediate term many nations will possess affordable and effective weapons systems and the outcome is quite predictable. Not all nations will be as sane and civil as Iran and Russia in their response to manipulation. Even if nations respond to manipulation in a sane and civil way their response will likely be quite different if a existential threat becomes a reality. That occurs upon the the very first usage of WMD in a capacity where it becomes clear that the technology is trying to be used in a manner to cause cessation. This perception is very much more likely when a country has been signalling that it willing to do this perhaps even massacring innocents to demonstrate its caviler perspective toward human life.
Once a country has signaled that it is willing to execute a existential threat the probability that extermination of our species will occur becomes overwhelmingly the highest probability in conjunction with rapid weapons proliferation from affordable technology. Nations can not be expected to respond to this in perpetuity by a degree of capitulation.

Posted by: Fred | Dec 23 2024 1:05 utc | 103

Illogical and false at the face of it. Simple is for simpletons.
Posted by: Chen | Dec 23 2024 0:57 utc | 115
Not so, Me Chen.Its a SIMPLE fact that Russia can respond with greater firepower and more accuracy than Kiev can to their rather puny attacks into Russia. Even a simpleton can see that for every missile Kiev fires at Russia, 100 will return and destroy its infrastructure. Their ATACMS are rebounding on them 100 fold. Its that SIMPLE.

Posted by: HERMIUS | Dec 23 2024 1:09 utc | 104

Many of these “new” posters use similar syntax and seem to be similarly butthurt when their errors are addressed.
I have caught them posting to themselves under different usernames.
A: I think X about Russia.
B: A, you are so smart and wise.
LOL
It would be funny if it wasn’t so childish and attention-seeking.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Dec 23 2024 1:12 utc | 105

Posted by: The Kaker | Dec 23 2024 1:10 utc | 120
#########
Do you have sources for any of these claims?
Last I heard, Asma Assad was battling potentially terminal cancer.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Dec 23 2024 1:14 utc | 106

Always a good sign when trolls are this aggressive. No good news for AFU or NATO for a long while now.

Posted by: boneless | Dec 23 2024 1:14 utc | 107

Everyone here judging Russia DAILY for not obliterating the entire west in a reckless rage should consider that:
Russian leadership (and people) are on a high, mature, spiritual level, not some teenagers which let their hormones guide their actions. They are old, wise, intelligent and come from a many generations of the same old, wise and intelligent. Just because a bully is throwing rocks at them they dont go and smash the bullies face in an uncontrolled rage. They think, calculate, play some 5D chess as people here call it in mockery, and they remain calm. They act in the best possible way not just for them but for the whole human race as being obviously the wisest judging by their restraint, they act in a controlled manner, always ready to negotiate, even after the bully insists on throwing rocks. And Russian people know they have the riches and that the bullies want to steal them for centuries. Its in their DNA to defend the riches, and they are good at it and should be granted some trust if you have doubts. OK?
Just consider your actions when your child throws something at you or “annoys you” with something else. No one disturbs you but yourself gentleman. So is the Russia as an old wise guy not disturbed by the petty American rocks. They know the rocks are an act of an angry little misbehaved badly raised child and they keep their cool, simple as that. Russia was very old already when the American history started by mostly unwanted criminals over the seas in oh so Great Britain if I am correct. And American history is based on genocide (adios native americans), slave work force taken from Africa, and later looting of the whole world minus some states that remained sovereign, including the great Russia. Russians know old this just by the sheer fact that they were very old when the little American child started its barbaric history. And they act accordingly. They had their ups and downs but they are still in their place with unlooted riches.
People here that dont acknowledge this are 90% trolls and 10% still learning about the laws of life and universe. Read some good spiritual books, I can recommend Eckhart Tolle or Michael A. Singer for starters on top of my mind, rest will find you after you start with those.
Thank you for your time and may the light shine on the good guys, we all know who the bad guys are and trolls will remain trolls.

Posted by: Jzo | Dec 23 2024 1:15 utc | 108

Not so, Me Chen.Its a SIMPLE fact that Russia can respond with greater firepower and more accuracy than Kiev can to their rather puny attacks into Russia. Even a simpleton can see that for every missile Kiev fires at Russia, 100 will return and destroy its infrastructure. Their ATACMS are rebounding on them 100 fold. Its that SIMPLE.
Posted by: HERMIUS | Dec 23 2024 1:09 utc | 119
Spot on Hermie! In effect, nato’s “permissions” and provision of these long-range missiles are actually destroying Ukraine.

Posted by: Fyador | Dec 23 2024 1:17 utc | 109

@Chen – Russia will never win if this is their thinking of their leadership already. Nor will BRICS, China and the global south with ‘two faced inconsistent’ friends like this.
US and Europe both have big problems, economica and military. Eurpe w is going downhill, the faster as they increate their payments to US, while these pamynts for US are short time win only, on long term the finance re dawon nevertheless, maybe slower, but there is no way up.
On the other side, China, India, Africa, and even Russia are developing fast, also in military things. They not only have the majourity in people, but also in finance in long term. Means, if they don’t start a war against each, this grould will become the world leadership, even if not within a year, but within 2 generations (maybe earlier). US and West cannot close up, not as US is punder the west Europeans. Their change is gone.
It may be that the war lasts longer, 10 or 15 years (there was once the Thirty Years’ War in Europe), and if Russia survives it, the USA and Western Europe will have to give up simply because of a lack of money and equipment, and then Russia will be extending its hand and saying “let’s cooperate better instead of fighting. You’ll never be number 1 again anyway, but then maybe you’ll still be in the top 10 group.”

Posted by: wp007 | Dec 23 2024 1:17 utc | 110

Posted by: Newbie | Dec 22 2024 17:46 utc | 34
My guess is that there is a strict embargo on any commercial satellite imagery post-Oreshnik – enforced by US spool establishment. If there were no damage, the West would be screaming it from the rooftops.
He could have easily been handed imagery from a day or two before with doctored dates.
Time will tell.

Posted by: ChatNPC | Dec 23 2024 1:18 utc | 111

Posted by: Chen | Dec 23 2024 1:22 utc | 128
OK Mr Chen. Youre point has been accepted.

Posted by: HERMIUS | Dec 23 2024 1:32 utc | 112

I disagree. The west can not catch up in missile technology.
Posted by: Fred | Dec 23 2024 1:05 utc | 117
Likely not but can’t entirely rule it out entirely. Overall it’s moot because the West couldn’t field the technology to the degree necessary to make a difference. The best missile tech in the world is useless if you can’t produce it in any effective numbers. Did you see Schryver’s riff on the F-35? This is the sad state of tech in America, lol.
https://x.com/imetatronink/status/1870182412052988348
That’s also part of why I say the US & Israel are playing with fire regarding Iran. Iran can’t attack America itself but they can certainly sink an aircraft carrier, and by heavily targeting the Negev Nuclear Research Facility they could probably render a good portion of Israel uninhabitable for the foreseeable future.

Posted by: TJandTheBear | Dec 23 2024 1:38 utc | 113

It may be that the war lasts longer, 10 or 15 years…
Posted by: wp007 | Dec 23 2024 1:17 utc | 126
It’ll be lucky to last 10 to 15 more months.

Posted by: TJandTheBear | Dec 23 2024 1:40 utc | 114

A lightweight with nothing of substance to offer. No intelligent contributions—just flaccid insult.
Posted by: Chen | Dec 23 2024 1:01 utc | 116

You certainly are the expert on flaccid insults.
In my brief assessment, another room temperature IQ NAFO troll here to tell us how incompetent Putin is as he grinds NATO down? Pull the other one my clownish pseudointellecutal, it had bells on it. I also love the projection and hypocrisy here, ad you do exactly wha you are complaining about. Bravo. Spoken like a gormless Maerican, ‘Chen’.
The West is desperately trying to provoke Russia into a large scale retaliation because the psychopathic attitude you mention is limited to the decision makers. The regular people who will suffer in war want nothing to fucking do with it, at all. To manufacture consent for the war they want..that the dollar needs.. the elite need either an unverifiable false flag or a provocation large enough by Russia to justify the enormous cost in blood and treasure of warring with Rudsia directly.
That is, to stop hiding behind Ukraines skirts like the absolute cowards they are, NATO is going to need to convince a large population that war with Russia isn’t only desirable, it’s necessary.
Exhibit A in doing that is getting Russia to do something large like strike Rammstein.
Jake the Snake and the rest of those fucking peacocks strutting around play acting at being strategists and generals are fucking imbeciles. You should be kissing Putins ass as he is the main reason you and your family are not already so much radioactive ash. A Russian hardliner would have already dropped a tactical nuke on Kiev and very likely London.

Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Dec 23 2024 1:45 utc | 115

threating the removal of Putin’s regime and the defeat of Russia.

Ooooh scary! Is it like how the dipshit Maericans were going to punish the Houthis and open the Red Sea? Maericans are experts at talking loud and carrying a limp stick. I see you’ve learned at their knee.
The West has about as much chance of defeating Russia in any meaningful way as paying off its incalcuable debt. In other words, zero. Big talk from limp dicks means shit.

Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Dec 23 2024 1:49 utc | 116

@chen – 690 / 5.000
The US and NATO can have as many nuclear weapons as they want, it won’t change anything. a) Russia also has nuclear weapons, and both the US and NATO don’t want any of them to end up with them. b) Russia can make it “unaffordably expensive” everywhere (as Putin put it) without nuclear weapons.
Trump is a businessman, if he realizes that he has to pay more than he can get back, he will stop. The Europeans are a bit more stubborn, but they too will have to bow to the dictates of money (which is missing).
In the short term, the only question is whether Russia can withstand the coming counterattacks and build the new weapons quickly enough so that they are available in sufficient quantities.

Posted by: wp007 | Dec 23 2024 1:50 utc | 117

Go AMERICA!! US number 1!
Xmas and New Years wish list!
1. Please kick RUSSIA out of Ukraine!
2.Please also punch Putin in the face! And belly! Be sure it bleeds..
3. Elect ZELENSKY is Russian president.
Humanity and God is on our side! Please make all these wishes come true.
Peace and love for Ukraine!

Posted by: Elf | Dec 23 2024 1:51 utc | 118

@ Elf | Dec 23 2024 1:51 utc | 138
I do like how even in this perfect wished world, Elenskiy is still not a president of so-called-ukraine.

Posted by: boneless | Dec 23 2024 1:54 utc | 119

Russia doesn’t have an unpayable debt and really doesn’t want to have a world war. The Russians would rather the Maerican economy collapse..not completely, but enough to cut its remaining military balls off, without wholesale slaughter. It’s better for Russia and really the world that way.
Putin won’t finally bite and turn the world into two devoted camps unless Maerica and her rabid puppies give him no choice, which they might not. But by the time that day comes, Maericas situation will be even more hopeless….and the Russian answer will be comprehensive.
I have an idea, Maericans, disband your armies and start paying your fucking debts you deadbeat scumbags.
Hopefully this primer on the whys helps reduce the generalized ignorance. But do carry on repeating your inanities if needed for your mental stability, or whatever. I will be breaking out the popcorn either way.

Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Dec 23 2024 1:56 utc | 120

If you’re going to make claims about the East’s superiority, it would help to provide concrete examples rather than relying on vague and exaggerated comparisons.
Posted by: Chen | Dec 23 2024 1:51 utc | 137
Don’t have to make claims about the patently obvious. You want specifics then try and cite a meaningful area where we’re ahead. I can name some superior Western tech but it won’t change the course of events.

Posted by: TJandTheBear | Dec 23 2024 2:10 utc | 121

249 / 5.000
One appeals to reason, the other only knows insults and threats. Brain versus muscles and fanaticism.
Muscles and fanaticism don’t always win, even if they pretend to.
Poker player versus chess player. Boxer versus Shuaijiao.

Posted by: wp007 | Dec 23 2024 2:24 utc | 122

If Putin does not feel cowed by the US/NTO then why all the pussyfooting around in Ukraine of threatening to strike US/Nato facilities on their soil and never doing it? Of firing one Oreshnik followed up with drones and only striking Ukraine territory and not striking US / NATO facilities with Oreshnik or other hypersonic missiles either inside Ukraine or outside of it?
Posted by: Chen | Dec 23 2024 2:12 utc | 142
In this respect Mr Chen, one could equally ask the question: why does NATO shy away from employing their armies to the conflict? It seems that they do, after all, take heed of Mr Putin’s warnings that such an intervention would mean WW3. Whilst Russia continues to make advances against a weakening Ukraine army, NATO hides behind rhetoric and paper tiger threats.

Posted by: HERMIUS | Dec 23 2024 2:25 utc | 123

Posted by: Chen | Dec 23 2024 2:12 utc | 142
#######
You have a habit of saying that you’re leaving but like a bad rash, you’re still here.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Dec 23 2024 2:39 utc | 124

Posted by: TJandTheBear | Dec 22 2024 19:51 utc | 54 “Not in personnel and not in equipment (since they’re handily beating NATO clearing out their old stuff).”
Well, I guess we can argue if 84,000 KIA and 3 times that WIA is a huge price or not.
As to Russian equipment, they are now saving it and making assaults using civilian cars.
And since the Russian government is floating bonds on a regular basis, how does the interest rate not matter?

Posted by: Ed4 | Dec 23 2024 2:45 utc | 125

mindful of Putin’s erratic positions regarding the US and the Nato bloc and not take anything for granted or take him at his word anymore.
Posted by: Chen | Dec 23 2024 2:40 utc | 147

straight out of ursulas wordsalad.

Posted by: J | Dec 23 2024 3:15 utc | 126

…KIA and … WIA… equipment… interest rate…
Posted by: Ed4 | Dec 23 2024 2:45 utc | 148

Knowing you for a well-established Ukie cheerleader I take it not as some sidden out-of-character compassion towards Russia, but as your usual gloating, and reply with “Russia will manage all that just fine, thank you very much.”

Posted by: Rutte | Dec 23 2024 3:41 utc | 127

The continuing deathly silence about Yuhzsmash (sp?) and the absence of satellite imagery of any quality, is itself a ‘tell’ as many have said.
Given that direct Intel is not gonna happen anytime soon, insuring minds could look around for Indirect.
E.g. as many locals reported that there seemed to be a local earthquake, checking seismic records either side of the impacts, could be useful. I checked USGS but they inexplicably don’t cover 404 full stop. Or all too Explicable…..
Others with more brain cells, time and perhaps currency, might score better.

Posted by: Waymad | Dec 23 2024 3:46 utc | 128

Posted by: Pa J | Dec 23 2024 3:54 utc | 129

In this respect Mr Chen, one could equally ask the question: why does NATO shy away from employing their armies to the conflict? It seems that they do, after all, take heed of Mr Putin’s warnings that such an intervention would mean WW3. Whilst Russia continues to make advances against a weakening Ukraine army, NATO hides behind rhetoric and paper tiger threats.
Posted by: HERMIUS | Dec 23 2024 2:25 utc | 145
Of course you and everyone can ask that WHY question. A very valid question, as valid as the questions being asked of Putin and Russia. I have asked it and answered it myself repeatedly the last 2 years or so. I have answer – do you?
So Hermius — now answer that WHY question you ask properly and in full:
THEN ask it of PUTIN as well. If you have any objectivity left in your soul.
Or be silent and listen to those who have something to say on these matters above vapourware.

Posted by: Pa J | Dec 23 2024 4:02 utc | 130

Well, I guess we can argue if 84,000 KIA and 3 times that WIA is a huge price or not.
As to Russian equipment, they are now saving it and making assaults using civilian cars.
Posted by: Ed4 | Dec 23 2024 2:45 utc | 148
84K for an existential threat? Pocket change. Civilian cars? If that’s all it takes.
What’s the point of saying “huge price”? They didn’t start it and they’re prosecuting it in a manner with least impact on their own personnel. It’s certainly not huge relative to the cost to Ukraine overall, let alone the West in money, equipment and (ultimately) their place in the world order.

Posted by: TJandTheBear | Dec 23 2024 4:02 utc | 131

I asked YOU first. But be a coward and a wimp if you wish, I expected no different.
Posted by: Chen | Dec 23 2024 2:23 utc | 143
Without fail, the one that resorts to name-calling is acknowledging they’ve lost the argument.

Posted by: TJandTheBear | Dec 23 2024 4:07 utc | 132

TJandTheBear@93…..it’s going to takes months for ThyssenKrupp to get the elevators working, only way down at the moment is repelling….
Cheers M

Posted by: sean the leprechaun | Dec 23 2024 4:14 utc | 133

Fred | Dec 22 2024 21:05 utc | 68
USA is counting on biological warfare.
Indeed. The CR/continuing resolution {omnibus} just scuppered by the Doge Bros minutes before the Congress “home for the holidays” DC exodus….
It Included funding for xyz? new /upgraded/ biolabs in Ukraine.
An ooopsie/accident leak of something created in a lab on Russia’s border is to be anticipated.
If PeterAu’s research is mostly correct, the Russians took control of most (all?) of the biolabs in the first hours/days of the sloSMO.
Possibly why new biolabs needed funding in the 1500page porkfest of the now defunct, “hospital-pass” CR …..

Posted by: Melaleuca | Dec 23 2024 4:53 utc | 134

I feel that Fico would be wise to take Slovakia out of the EU and NATO. So should the other states who are like minded and vulnerable to US Hegemony, including Greece whose govt has lost the plot over Russia these days. However, now they must be mindful of Putin’s erratic positions regarding the US and the Nato bloc and not take anything for granted or take him at his word anymore.
Posted by: Chen | Dec 23 2024 2:40 utc | 147

Easier said than done – taking us from EU and NATO is not that easy, because we are _vulnerable to US Hegemony_. Slovakia is economically just too small to survive any sanctions. 5.5M people living there. And it’s even weaker militarily.

Posted by: Jergis Lapin | Dec 23 2024 5:09 utc | 135

Posted by: TheNorthernChef | Dec 22 2024 23:21 utc | 94
Political messiahs don’t come along very often, and even when they to, they tend to get killed or sellout.
Back on topic. Russia and China need to form not just an alliance but an alternative financial and trading system that is completely autonomous from the western banking and legal systems. Think North Korea but with the ability to trade with any country outside of W. Europe, the US, and Canada.
Once this bloc is set up, they can tell the US to pound sand until they’re ready to start playing nice again. Only afterwards can any sort of talk of “partnership” start up.
It’s like a divorce.

Posted by: Ghost of Zanon | Dec 23 2024 5:17 utc | 136

Pa | Dec 23 2024 4:33 utc | 168
———
Whaddya reckon @bar. Is Pa really tonyofftopic, but cycled thru a faulty AI chatbot?
Or wot?

Posted by: Melaleuca | Dec 23 2024 5:25 utc | 137

why does NATO shy away from employing their armies to the conflict? It seems that they do, after all, take heed of Mr Putin’s warnings that such an intervention would mean WW3. Whilst Russia continues to make advances against a weakening Ukraine army, NATO hides behind rhetoric and paper tiger threats.
Posted by: HERMIUS | Dec 23 2024 2:25 utc | 145
Of course you and everyone can ask that WHY question. A very valid question, as valid as the questions being asked of Putin and Russia. I have asked it and answered it myself repeatedly the last 2 years or so. I have answer
Posted by: Pa J | Dec 23 2024 4:02 utc | 163
I haven’t seen your answer to these very relevant questions. Could you share them please ?

Posted by: Night Tripper | Dec 23 2024 5:42 utc | 138

@ Melaleuca | Dec 23 2024 5:25 utc | 172
nah.. tony isn’t that unhinged with an axe to grind with b, like this poster… this is the poster with an id scrambler who shows up under different names and typically hijacks regular user names… back to reading only..

Posted by: james | Dec 23 2024 5:49 utc | 139

Did I miss anything?
Dr Chen
Posted by: Chen | Dec 23 2024 6:16 utc | 175
Yeah, a myriad of logic circuits got fried Chen.
Try switching off, then on again Jake.
Good luck.

Posted by: Barrel Brown | Dec 23 2024 6:27 utc | 140

Posted by: Ed4 | Dec 23 2024 2:45 utc | 148
Are the dismounts only equipped with shovels and over watched by washing machine chipped drones?
100K KIA to defeat an opponent politically and militarily is a better return than losing 25-30K (Afghanistan) and having little to show for it. The former being an investment paid for in blood and treasure, the latter a waste, paid for in the same precious commodities.
Secondly, losses only matter, in the brutal calculation of war, if the side experiencing them can’t afford them, i.e. they impact its strategic and operational capability. Russia can, Ukraine can’t, talk of a’ victory’ based on excess casualties inflicted is usually the domain of the loser, who’s creating a defeat narrative to shield that loss.

Posted by: Milites | Dec 23 2024 6:43 utc | 141

CrossTalk Bullhorns: Regime Change Menu
https://www.rt.com/shows/crosstalk/609769-regime-change-menu-states/
“Elections have consequences, at least they should. The incoming Trump administration looks a lot like the outgoing Biden administration when it comes to Ukraine.
Also, what do Romania, Georgia and Moldova have in common? The answer – they are on the Regime Change Menu.
CrossTalking with George Szamuely and Tarik Cyril Amar.”

Posted by: John Gilberts | Dec 23 2024 6:44 utc | 142

Posted by: TJandTheBear | Dec 23 2024 1:38 utc | 132
We should all be thankful that US has royally screwed Nato by forcing F(lop/law)-35 as the main fighter well into the 2050s.

Posted by: unimperator | Dec 23 2024 7:04 utc | 143

Take notice – four countries with heavy NATO involvement now have illegitimate presidents extended past their election defeats. Ukraine, Romania, Moldova and Georgia.
“I have long averred that, among the many profound consequences of the Ukraine War, will be the cessation of NATO as a functioning military / political alliance.
First Romania, Hungary, and Slovakia; then Finland and Sweden will seek an annulment of their shotgun marriages.”
https://x.com/imetatronink/status/1870939350936272948

Posted by: unimperator | Dec 23 2024 7:39 utc | 144

Posted by: Chen | Dec 23 2024 2:23 utc | 143

I see some attempts at non-biased discussion without praising either side as the next ‘strong savior-king-ruler’-whatever, but most of the time these end up looking like people entertaining their own knowledge than having any real arguments.
It’s strange to refer to the collective West as a blood thirsty maniac seeing the ongoing Israeli genocide & NATO expansion efforts, most recently in Romania, but also to refuse any real engagement because everyone who does so wants to cause a nuclear holocaust.
I reckon it wouldn’t be a terrible idea to cause some “color revolutions” in countries to empower candidates who aren’t American lunatics, but that isn’t “playing moral”.
The collective West has no care for morals and only does what is most logical to ensure it’s leashes don’t break, the collective East has no care for logic and only does what is most morally right while the countries around them are picked apart, one by one.
It’s like a game of chess where the end of the match can already be foreseen, but where it takes years for a piece to be taken off the board.
In regards to this perhaps I’m the delusional one for expecting any real discussion on any online forum anymore – these have had many people reach their respective intellectual peaks, and all were replaced by mind-broken degenerate sensationalist entities.

Posted by: Arctaroll | Dec 23 2024 8:23 utc | 145

Posted by: Chen | Dec 23 2024 6:30 utc | 177
So many ‘advisors’ and ‘experts’ like this one declaring repeatedly what Russia or BRICS should do.
The only way to prove a superior understanding of reality is to predict what will happen, not to declare what should happen.

Posted by: Johan Kaspar | Dec 23 2024 8:25 utc | 146

Posted by: Johan Kaspar | Dec 23 2024 8:25 utc | 184
Well, it’s obvious. The trolls on US state department payrolls are advocating Russia to do what US state department would like them to do.

Posted by: unimperator | Dec 23 2024 8:29 utc | 147

@Waymad | Dec 23 2024 3:46 utc | 157

The continuing deathly silence about Yuhzsmash (sp?) and the absence of satellite imagery of any quality, is itself a ‘tell’ as many have said.
Given that direct Intel is not gonna happen anytime soon, insuring minds could look around for Indirect.

The ‘Amerikanets’ Substack blog recently had an interesting analysis with satellite photos that seemed to support Postol’s claims about very limited damage from Oreshnik.
However, it was all nonsense.
Here is Amerikanets’ follow up post on the issue.
https://www.amerikanets.com/p/mea-maxima-culpa

All of the damage seen in the November 22nd pass happened prior to the Oreshnik strike on the 21st, and was the result of attacks using conventional Russian standoff weapons. The November 22nd pass shows no new damage from Oreshnik.
The reasons for my faulty analysis, for which I take total responsibility, are as follows:
I uncritically accepted the anaylsis of others, who said that the Sentinel-2 pass from November 24th showed new damage. It did not – this damage was the result of a strike in July.
I failed to adequately search for resources in Russian (something I am capable of), which had thoroughly tracked previous strikes on the plant.
I didn’t want to spend an additional $125 to order an earlier pass from Pleiades. Had I done this right off the bat, this could have been avoided.
I instead relied on free and publicly available imagery from Google Maps, provided by Maxar. Someone at Maxar has engaged in a painstaking, but sloppy, coverup of the damage caused by previous strikes, patching a 2024 pass with multiple other ones, despite maintaining the 2024 date in the citation of the images. For this reason, I was much more inclined to accept the damage as new, and as having been caused by Oreshnik.
I failed to consider that the Ukrainians might have not repaired any damage from the previous strikes.
I apologize to everyone who based their own analysis off of mine.

Posted by: Norwegian | Dec 23 2024 8:31 utc | 148

Posted by: Johan Kaspar | Dec 23 2024 8:25 utc | 184

One word – Syria.
If the East wants to be left alone, they need to act like the West in ensuring the ones who come after the current rulers aren’t any more willing to engage in dialogue with a pitbull.
Or, perhaps, I should risk the statement that the East is no different from the West in terms of caring about non-existent standards? One pretends to be moral but is the opposite, the other pretends to be moral but insists on engaging in dialogue with a lunatic.
As for engaging in dialogue with lunatics, I reckon someone would love to quote that and point the finger at me…

Posted by: Arctaroll | Dec 23 2024 8:33 utc | 149

Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Dec 23 2024 1:45 utc | 134

That is, to stop hiding behind Ukraines skirts like the absolute cowards they are, NATO is going to need to convince a large population that war with Russia isn’t only desirable, it’s necessary.

Posted by: Johan Kaspar | Dec 23 2024 8:36 utc | 150

Posted by: unimperator | Dec 23 2024 8:29 utc | 185
Exactly.

Posted by: Johan Kaspar | Dec 23 2024 8:39 utc | 151

Lordy Lordy I see that this thread has been ‘visited’ by a Chenless Wondefamd, a Pa and couple of other Xmas socks already?
Ah well a pisshead with a bottle and a lonely long Sunday night ahead always makes a non-Compo-mentus entertainment for himself.
Nice try fool! At least we were saved the repetitious old sob stories of childhood girlfriends and maudlin crying into the alcohol – well done old chap. But you left a mess on the barroom floor for b to clear up again- dickhead.
Now sober up for the rest of the week and don’t fuck up the grand children with your aging lothario bs 😉

Posted by: DunGroanin | Dec 23 2024 8:43 utc | 152

Posted by: Arctaroll | Dec 23 2024 8:33 utc | 187

If the East wants to be left alone, they need to act like …

Uh another expert telling not just Russia or BRICS but the whole East what they need to do. I’m sure the whole East will read your historical declaration and modify their strategy tomorrow morning.

Posted by: Johan Kaspar | Dec 23 2024 8:44 utc | 153

Posted by: unimperator | Dec 23 2024 7:39 utc | 182
First Romania, Hungary, and Slovakia; then Finland and Sweden will seek an annulment of their shotgun marriages.”
https://x.com/imetatronink/status/1870939350936272948
I fully agree with this assessment, but also spare a thought for poor old Canada when it is fully amalgamated into the USA. Still, they may be able to resist DJT’s latest brain fart, but I would not hold my breath.

Posted by: Barrel Brown | Dec 23 2024 9:00 utc | 154

It’s a stampede to the Last Of The Ukropians.
Parents are getting their teenage boys out –
‘– GEROMAN — time will tell – 👀 —
@GeromanAT
9m
Ukrainians might hate US and NATO
The masks are coming off. The pretence of the Collective West just “helping” Ukraine to defend itself is now openly abandoned by Western leaders who are officially pushing the Ukrainian government to lower the conscription age as a precondition for more weaponry. Ukraine must sacrifice even more of its young men to satisfy the blood-lust of the neocon warmongers in Washington and Brussels. What has long been evident to scholars and observers who, time and again, have been saying that neutrality for Ukraine is the most obvious of workable compromises to avoid (or end) the war, is now being discusses in the mainstream, namely that that this provoked war has been repeatedly made inevitable by the pro-war factions in the US and Europe.
Ted Snider is a columnist at Antiwar.com and The Libertarian Institute and a frequent contributor to Responsible Statecraft, The American Conservative, and other outlets.
Dec 23, 2024 · 8:44 AM UTC ‘
Not to be confused with frothing at the mouth ‘mad professor’ Snyder.
Off to the Open thread for some loonytoons cartoon Drumpff babble.

Posted by: DunGroanin | Dec 23 2024 9:03 utc | 155

ZH: Trump Threatens To Take Back Panama Canal As He Declares “Golden Age Of America Is Upon Us”
This is a small demonstration of the nature of Anglo Saxon way of thinking and American mind.
Just to remind you that Trump is the guy Putin is eager to talk and negotiate with.

Posted by: vargas | Dec 23 2024 9:05 utc | 156

@ Posted by: Melaleuca | Dec 23 2024 5:25 utc | 172
Yup see my post just above – before I got to reading yours.

Posted by: DunGroanin | Dec 23 2024 9:09 utc | 157

Another example how most if not all puppets installed by Nato/US are mentally unhinged and living far outside reality.

EU can’t calm ‘emotionally unstable’ Sandu – Russia’s SVR (Russian Foreign Intelligence)
Moldovan President Maia Sandu lost her temper in a meeting about crucial Russian energy supplies, blaming Moscow for Ukraine, refusing to extend transit agreements, according to Russia’s Foreign Intelligence Service.
“If Moscow does not find a way to deliver gas here, then Chisinau will take revenge on the pro-Russian Transnistria,” Sandu reportedly fumed, threatening criminal cases against the region’s leadership.
Sandu also urged a military operation to remove Russian peacekeepers from Transnistria, SVR information indicates.
https://x.com/BowesChay/status/1871118001753251911

Posted by: unimperator | Dec 23 2024 9:14 utc | 158

Posted by: unimperator | Dec 23 2024 9:14 utc | 196
Taking Odessa is the answer to her. By that Europe gas supply also change dramatically

Posted by: Michael J | Dec 23 2024 9:35 utc | 159

Posted by: Michael J | Dec 23 2024 9:35 utc | 197
One theory is US is seeing Ukraine collapsing and trying to goad RUAF to making a hasty attack toward Odessa, to divert resources and relieve the Zaporozhye and south Donbass front of Ukraine.
If Ukraine army generally disintegrates, as Ukrainian journalist Vladimir Boyko predicted in early 2024 (to happen in early 2025), then RUAF will get Odessa anyway, and with little fighting.
So Nato window of opportunity to act re. Transnistria will close by mid-2025 with the collapse of AFU.
The Duran also said Zelensky is planning a gamble with another attack in Bryansk region.

Posted by: unimperator | Dec 23 2024 10:08 utc | 160

@198
addition: So US is using Sandu to create the threat to Transnistria, supposed to goad RUAF to make the hasty attack through Kherson toward Odessa.

Posted by: unimperator | Dec 23 2024 10:09 utc | 161

Posted by: Johan Kaspar | Dec 23 2024 8:36 utc | 188
By NATO you really mean the US and a few countries, with the US supplying the vast majority of the necessary combat power, (especially naval and aviation) and providing similar lopsided levels of ISR. I doubt very much that Trump is going to fall into the DS’s trap that’s clumsily being constructed, diverting him from his domestic agenda, which he campaigned heavily on (must have missed the ads about starting or supporting a global conflict).
Secondly, there seems to be a growing realisation (thanks to the MSM trying to cop a plea bargain) that the Biden administration was helmed by somebody who was incapable, which inevitably leads to question who was in charge? The answer, which has been obvious before he was even elected, is Obama, but the question, which hasn’t been asked yet, if answered would mean that the US, Ukraine involvement would be thoroughly unconstitutional. Again, I doubt the incoming administration will be actively supporting a conflict whose involvement might have been treasonous.
Bottom line, if the US say no, all the European plans dissolve, whatever the rhetoric, just like the Suez crisis. The Obama string-pullers would need months to prepare for such a conflict and they have less than one to do so. So do you really think the UK, France and Germany, whose shot-lockers are looking pretty bare, let alone manpower and inventory levels, would attack on their own, un-supported?

Posted by: Milites | Dec 23 2024 10:30 utc | 162

Posted by: unimperator | Dec 23 2024 10:08 utc | 168
Thought Syrian pull back and reserves gives flexibility to Russia to engage multiple fronts if needed. Plus freezing river makes crossing easy
Anyway we can only guess Russian plans. Feel for smo strategic victory Odessa essential. Also to solve gas transit problems once and for all

Posted by: Michael J | Dec 23 2024 10:53 utc | 163

Posted by: Milites | Dec 23 2024 10:30 utc | 170

So do you really think the UK, France and Germany, whose shot-lockers are looking pretty bare, let alone manpower and inventory levels, would attack on their own, un-supported?

No, I don’t think so. I agree with you on the state of Euro militaries. For a project of the magnitude of the annexation of the Ukraines into the NATO-EU orbit, our military is completely dependent on American power.
It would be great if Trump is able to focus on the domestic agenda and achieves somee degree of success, abandoning failed, costly and hubristic geopolitical projects in Eastern Europe.

Posted by: Johan Kaspar | Dec 23 2024 10:54 utc | 164

In b’s links for 12/17 there is a Washington Post article. Early in the article there is a photo claiming to show a destroyed church in the Sumy region as a supposed victim of reckless Russian bombing of civilian targets. However, while there is no glass in the windows of the church, its physical structure—visible walls and roof—are entirely without damage. Furthermore, a dilapidated scaffold surrounds much of the building. In short, it does not look like this church was ever bombed. There are no craters or debris in the photo. It looks more like a repair of the church was begun long ago, but abandoned—perhaps for lack of funds. At any rate a good example of WAPO’s stellar journalistic standards.

Posted by: mjh | Dec 23 2024 10:54 utc | 165

Posted by: Milites | Dec 23 2024 6:43 utc | 149 “100K KIA to defeat an opponent politically and militarily is a better return than losing 25-30K (Afghanistan)”
25-30K are the Soviet losses in Afghanistan? As the US lost less than 3,000 KIA.
Ukraine has been written off by the US. The US goal is to make sure the cost to Russia is as high as possible in this mess. And it is not over yet.

Posted by: Ed4 | Dec 23 2024 11:32 utc | 166

I’m sure the whole East will read your historical declaration and modify their strategy tomorrow morning.
Posted by: Johan Kaspar | Dec 23 2024 8:44 utc | 161

Take a look at Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan et cetera and see where the “do not assume a sufficiently strong deterrence” ‘strategy’ leads before trying to police psychopaths a’la Netanyahu about their apparent lack of morality. History repeats – or rhymes – before the eyes of many, but blissful ignorance is apparently preferable to acting.
So much for telling myself to stop engaging with the same kind, as it makes me no different.

Posted by: Arctaroll | Dec 23 2024 11:35 utc | 167

It may be that the war lasts longer, 10 or 15 years…
Posted by: wp007 | Dec 23 2024 1:17 utc | 126
It’ll be lucky to last 10 to 15 more months.
Posted by: TJandTheBear | Dec 23 2024 1:40 utc | 122
I still think that a decade , dozen years, truce is in order before things restart in full mode.

Posted by: Newbie | Dec 23 2024 11:41 utc | 168

Bottom line, if the US say no, all the European plans dissolve, whatever the rhetoric, just like the Suez crisis. The Obama string-pullers would need months to prepare for such a conflict and they have less than one to do so. So do you really think the UK, France and Germany, whose shot-lockers are looking pretty bare, let alone manpower and inventory levels, would attack on their own, un-supported?
Posted by: Milites | Dec 23 2024 10:30 utc | 170
You mention Obama , but when i posted the names mentioned in the articles they pointed to the Clintons (and blackrock)

Posted by: Newbie | Dec 23 2024 11:44 utc | 169

If Ukraine army generally disintegrates, as Ukrainian journalist Vladimir Boyko predicted in early 2024 (to happen in early 2025), then RUAF will get Odessa anyway, and with little fighting.
Posted by: unimperator | Dec 23 2024 10:08 utc | 168
How will they get Odessa this genius didn’t say? This is internal propaganda to scare the local idiots. Or why he thinks Odessa will vote like the other regions when RF keeps the other regions in a forever war? The chances of new referendums are close to zero, no one is stupid to vote right now for RF when RF is only good at running back and surrendering. Let’s see what happens after they win something, anything, and how much money is US willing to bribe there. For the moment even Transnistria seems “written off” to paraphrase Marty’s from Amerika favorite expression. As soon as clown Maia attacks with expired Klaus under Macaron’s control, Transnistria is dead before the medieval artillerists have a committee meeting to discuss the events, during work hours.

Posted by: rk | Dec 23 2024 11:52 utc | 170

Comrade Stalin would know what to do now.

Posted by: guest from franconia | Dec 23 2024 11:53 utc | 171

@ Posted by: vargas | Dec 23 2024 9:05 utc | 164
ZH: Trump Threatens To Take Back Panama Canal As He Declares “Golden Age Of America Is Upon Us”
Insanity. Between this and his other statements regarding Israel and Greenland, he seems to be losing it. Neither of these things make America Great Again. A few months ago, some posters on another forum were arguing whether Donald Trump could be the Beast of Revelation. At first, I laughed it off. Now I’m not so sure. A person with that ego backed by the power of the lone superpower on Earth…… This isn’t going to end well.

Posted by: bored | Dec 23 2024 12:01 utc | 172

Posted by: Johan Kaspar | Dec 23 2024 10:54 utc | 172
Agree. I think the bloviating from European leaders, who have personal involvement in weakening their armed forces, is really a narrative being constructed to explain why there won’t be as much, if any, money for all the trendy social programmes, or even vital ones. They can do what they always do, blame Trump, but the inevitability of Europe having to pay for its fair share was always on the cards, as was the delayed discussion about NATO’s continuing role, or even existence, now that it’s primary purpose disappeared three decades ago.
Posted by: mjh | Dec 23 2024 10:54 utc | 173
Same people who told you Biden was mentally cognisant, and that Harris would win and Trump never be President, twice. The MSM in the West is dying, it’s just about figured that out, replaced by the new media, for good or bad. Trump’s election will accelerate this inevitability, but the downward trajectory is already clear, with viewership amongst young people almost non-exist for their news and current affairs programmes.

Posted by: Milites | Dec 23 2024 12:05 utc | 173

@Ragozin 29
Evidence that Putin has been a disaster for Russia being too much loving of pirate Anglo parasites.

Posted by: Sam | Dec 23 2024 12:30 utc | 174

Much of nuclear missile technology and doctrine was developed to compensate for the lack of accuracy in missiles. If you can’t hit the target reliably a bigger boom overcomes the accuracy issue. So what Putin is saying is not that two Oreshniks equal the absolute destructive force of one nuclear missile (he also didn’t say what class of nuclear missile so maybe don’t assume he means a strategic ICBM) but rather that it replaces two nuclear tipped missiles for the purposes of doctrine and operational use.
The gravity of the munition is that Russia can escalate significantly without going nuclear. And that upends almost the whole of U.S./NATO strategic doctrine that assumes all European assets are effectively safe until the escalation goes nuclear.
As for the damage, Russia knows. Of course the U.S. would media brag if it had launched a comparable weapon, that doesn’t mean Russia sees any reason to do that. And if it was nothing, you can be sure the U.S. would be telling us over and over again how it was nothing and offering proof via satellite photos and/or on the ground documentation. How quiet U.S. media is on the subject tells us that it was real and probably more damaging than the U.S. wants to admit.

Posted by: Lex | Dec 23 2024 12:53 utc | 175

Unfortunately, Chen has a point. By referring to the Empire of Chaos as “potential partners”, Putin reveals a fundamental lack of understanding of why the US forced the war in the Ukraine.
Do you think Trump’s “Make America Great Again” slogan is meant for the proles? How silly! It is for the portion of the Empire’s oligarchy not lost in the bankers’ delusions of printable wealth. This portion of the oligarchy knows the Empire is going down and hopes to stop the decline.
To be fair, the rest of empire’s oligarchy understands the decline is underway as well, but doesn’t understand how advanced it is.
In any case, the Empire MUST subjugate China (it has no choice), or it dies. Russia just happens to be in the way. If Putin had paid attention in class, and the Marxism taught in schools back in the Soviet Union were not just crappy fossilized Stalinist dogma, then he would easily understand why the US-centric capitalist ruling class has no choice. He would then understand there is only one way for Russia and the US to be “partners”. That is for Russia to don the Europeon-style gimp suit and serve the Empire. Putin imagining there is any possibility of an equal partnership with the US is ridiculously foolish and childishly ignorant. The very best deal Russia can hope for would be to serve as the Empire’s favorite attack dog, in which case the Empire might permit a portion of the Russian Federation to remain unbalkanized for a while if it attacks Iran and China the way the Ukraine was twisted to attack Russia.
Would Russia agree to a deal like that? The faction Putin speaks for might, while imagining the Empire would throw them a meatier bone once they prove their loyalty.
No, Putin talking about the Empire being “potential partners” is a very bad sign and confirms some of the worst suspicions about him. We must depend upon the continued stupidity and bad behavior of the Empire to keep Russia from turning to the Dark Side.

Posted by: William Gruff | Dec 23 2024 13:04 utc | 176

@mini mo 107
Quote “Putin and Russians seem to not care about the terror and murder of Russian civilians in their own homes.”
Not only that.once England has shown by its actions that it plotted Syrian and Ukraine war because it could get free hand from Russian stupidity since 2014, it was imperative for Russia to annihilate that persistent enemy of England which is a common factor in all wars.
Russia, having realised that England is it’s existential enemy, Russia must plot downfall of that evil satanic 3rd rate country of English pirates.
In other words Russia must make effort to tear apart England into 5 parts just as England intended to for Iraq, Syria, and even Russia . Remember England stole one thousand billion dollar worth of wealth from Russia in 1990s only

Posted by: Sam | Dec 23 2024 13:05 utc | 177

Posted by: Milites | Dec 23 2024 12:05 utc | 181

They can do what they always do, blame Trump, but the inevitability of Europe having to pay for its fair share was always on the cards,

The other day I was with people on a business meeting and the tariffs issue was brought forward. Great indignation for Trump saying buy more American liquified gas and oil or else tariffs. I commented that we are spending billions of euros per month on Russian gas and that we are importing more Russian gas in 2024 than in 2023. So aren’t we in Europe a bit hypocritical? Isn’t Trump just taking care of his own business which is the USA, as he should, trying to improve its trade balance with Europe?

Posted by: Johan Kaspar | Dec 23 2024 13:11 utc | 178

NATOstan doesn’t want a war with Russia, they’d be happy to just weaken Russia via their proxy, but even that is being abandoned as a goal due to evident failure so NATOstan now wants to increase the cost of the inevitable Russian victory.
Posted by: Johan Kaspar | Dec 23 2024 8:36 utc | 158
What NATOstan wants is for Russians to give them their mineral and energy wealth in exchange for Disney, coca-cola and rock n’roll. I mean they got Manhattan island for a sack of glass beads and a few smallpox infected blankets after all.
They would like the Russians give it to them without a fight … at least a fight that kills real people … Untermensch slaughtering each other is fine and in fact welcomed.

Posted by: HB_Norica | Dec 23 2024 13:23 utc | 179

It’s just crazy. I don’t understand it. Or is it another cunning plan by the Russian 5D chess masters to deceive the enemy?
After everything that has been done to Russia in recent years, the Kremlin is desperately begging for negotiations and wants to make “friendship” with the West again.
Russia is in real danger. Maps are circulating in the German media showing the borders of the future countries (with country names and national flags) into which Russia is to be divided after the final victory.

Posted by: guest from franconia | Dec 23 2024 13:23 utc | 180

@ John Gilbert 150
Also, what do France, Germany and Canada have in common? The answer – they are on the Regime Change Menu.
The US is already regime changed. The former regime can’t rent enough paper shredding trucks…

Posted by: Inevitabllity | Dec 23 2024 13:30 utc | 181

Posted by: Johan Kaspar | Dec 23 2024 13:11 utc | 186
Yes, re Trump fighting for HIS countries best interests, not some spurious liberal concept of the world village pap, hence the mockery, palpable frustration and appeals to Russian moral superiority, from some posters here, as an instinctive response. They sense the good times are shortly to be over, and the side they root for are soon going to be playing against a side that doesn’t resemble Accrington Stanley, on a bad day!
Sounds like you work with similar people to me, people who blankly stare at you when you tell them that we’re helping fund the Russians fighting in Ukraine. Don’t forget the diesel we pretend not to import! Had one breakthrough with an NPC who went away and checked my COVID facts and came back very thoughtful, but any revelation is compartmentalised. They seem incapable, or unwilling, to glimpse the entire web, just individual strands. Guess that’s less threatening.
Wonder how the hive-mind will process the inevitable success of the US under Trump II’s stewardship? Probably stick to their MSM supplied Collins Notes saying he inherited a strong economy from Biden, or keep on going on about how stupid he is?

Posted by: Milites | Dec 23 2024 13:37 utc | 182

After everything that has been done to Russia in recent years, the Kremlin is desperately begging for negotiations and wants to make “friendship” with the West again.

And you believe that garbage?
Someone has been reading the captured Goebbels western media without applying their critical thinking skills.

Posted by: Ghost of Zanon | Dec 23 2024 13:37 utc | 183

Maps are circulating in the German media showing the borders of the future countries (with country names and national flags) into which Russia is to be divided after the final victory.
Posted by: guest from franconia | Dec 23 2024 13:23 utc | 188

these maps have been out for years. and they are no secret. the eu-regimes even held several conferences on “the de-colonisation of russia” with the explicit stated goal of balkanizing the russian federation, and putting its resources and wealth under EU SUPERVISION! not under the supervision of the newly formed “nations”, but under EU RULE!
eu has gone full nazi and that has been known for years, except for the eu sheeple and nafos that truly thing that “we are the good guys”. when in reality, the eu sheeple should ask “hans, are we the bad guys?”.
russia knows of all those “maps” and plans, as does china and the rest of the world outside of our little nato media bubble.
the russians also do know that diplomacy is important, so they will keep using terms like “partners” and so on, to the dismay of smoothbrains that think that this somehow makes putin a traitor or whatnot.
there is no “begging”, and certainly not “desperate”. but keep using those words. the repetition of buzzwords and catchphrases like “unprovoked fullscale invasion” is the mother of all propaganda indoctrinations after all.

Posted by: Justpassinby | Dec 23 2024 13:38 utc | 184

Given that prior notification was given it was also likely evacuated such that even those that worked there have no specific knowledge of the damage and cannot go back in.
Posted by: TJandTheBear | Dec 23 2024 0:36 utc | 104
I was under the impression that whilst Russia warned the US of the launch it did not identify the specific target. Am I wrong?

Posted by: JohninMK | Dec 23 2024 13:42 utc | 185

Russia was very old already when the American history started by mostly unwanted criminals over the seas in oh so Great Britain if I am correct.
Posted by: Jzo | Dec 23 2024 1:15 utc | 116
No you are not correct. Without wanting to start an off topic discussion I would point out that those you describe were shipped to Australia and not in the numbers you are assuming. The US was formed by freemen and woman from the UK and other European countries.

Posted by: JohninMK | Dec 23 2024 13:49 utc | 186

Send drones to MIC stockholders end all wars. They are not civilians and they are not innocent.
You don’t send any message by exterminating 1m soldiers or bombing infrastructure, you can easily liquidate 1000 people with their extended families to eliminate the cancer. Global resistance should know better.
Replying to @101 Englishman in NY : There is no fucking way anyone can block anything on the internet. From dns to https, hooping through tor nodes or using p2p networks, there are also many other ways that i will not mention here for obvious reasons. The internet considers information blocks as malfunctions and always finds ways around them.

Posted by: 667 | Dec 23 2024 13:52 utc | 187

Posted by: JohninMK | Dec 23 2024 13:49 utc | 194
Well, criminals they were. They killed off the legitimate & indigenous population and stole their land. After that, they went to Africa and captured people to slave on the plantations they established on their stolen land.
That’s America.
Sorry OT but just had to

Posted by: Avtonom | Dec 23 2024 13:53 utc | 188

Within a decade, quantum computing and AI will decide everything.
“Siri, in 30 days of compute time, create plans for me to control the political and military systems of all my adversaries within 2 years with minimal loss to our top 10,000 wealthiest families and without regard to anyone else. Consider using all capabilities previously used, plus any you can develop in time.”
Have an advantage before then? Use it or lose it.

Posted by: I forgot | Dec 23 2024 13:54 utc | 189

After everything that has been done to Russia in recent years, the Kremlin is desperately begging for negotiations and wants to make “friendship” with the West again.
Posted by: guest from Lvov | Dec 23 2024 13:23 utc | 188
Have you been living under a rock?
Putin has been open to negotiations since day one of this conflict.
Putin laid out his terms weeks in a document presented to the west before he started the SMO but it was ignored.
Western leaders have for the most part refused to even speak to Putin for 3 years.
Russia and Ukraine had a peace deal in place in April 2022 but Boris Johnson famously delivered a message from the boss forbidding Ukraine from making peace with Russia.
Zelensky then makes it a crime for any Ukrainian to even speak to a Russian let alone negotiate.
Earlier this year Putin again offered terms to Ukraine but they were refused. The terms were the same as they presented in 2022 with the addition of 2 more oblasts that voted to secede from Ukraine.
So now Trump has stated that when he becomes president he intends to open negotiations with Putin and you see that as “the Kremlin is desperately begging” for negotiations???
So this is what’s really happening. The USA is in a situation where their proxy is going to lose on the battlefield. They refused to even consider real negotiations since the 2014 coup and now they say they’re ‘tired of the killing” which is bullshit … more like they’re afraid of losing and the change of government is just a way of entering negotiations while saving face.
What I find truly evil about this situation is the Biden administration is willing to send $billions of US taxpayers money to arm and support Ukraine just so the war isn’t lost during Bidens presidency. They don’t give 2 fucks about how many Ukrainians die as long as they protect bidens legacy.

Posted by: HB_Norica | Dec 23 2024 13:56 utc | 190

Posted by: unimperator | Dec 23 2024 7:39 utc | 152
“I have long averred that, among the many profound consequences of the Ukraine War, will be the cessation of NATO as a functioning military / political alliance.
First Romania, Hungary, and Slovakia; then Finland and Sweden will seek an annulment of their shotgun marriages.”
“>https://x.com/imetatronink/status/1870939350936272948

The latter is a projection but I fondly recall former NATO secretary Stoltenberg repeatedly proclaim that Russia’s win in Ukraine would (=will) mean the end of NATO. He owes us! 🙂
Still debating with myself whether EU or NATO is going to fold first. It’s idle speculation, of course. We can see how Brussels is being transformed into a center of EUropean oppression whereas the dysfunctionality of NATO becomes ever more clear. I still believe that the war-preparing sounds in EUrope aren’t noise; it’s just not about a war against big, bad Russia.
I stopped reading the MoA comments because there’s too much noise: from time to time I look through the front page for names of sane posters. So thank you, and a few more.

Posted by: Konami | Dec 23 2024 13:58 utc | 191

Posted by: HB_Norica | Dec 23 2024 13:23 utc | 187

What NATOstan wants is for Russians to give them their mineral and energy wealth in exchange for Disney, coca-cola and rock n’roll.

That was the idea in the 90s and early 2000s. But eventually our Great Wise Leaders realized that Putin had other plans.

Posted by: Johan Kaspar | Dec 23 2024 14:00 utc | 192

Posted by: I forgot | Dec 23 2024 13:54 utc | 197
Do you really want to trust your strategy to world dominance on something that draws humans with six fingers? That shows a superficial understanding of the human anatomy … can you really trust a system that can be so easily fooled? What happens when the enemy gets wise and starts putting out volumes of misinformation for AI’s to train on?

Posted by: HB_Norica | Dec 23 2024 14:01 utc | 193

Dima says Trump wants to meet with Putin.
Can the tender love between the two be renewed again?

Posted by: guest from franconia | Dec 23 2024 14:02 utc | 194

So this Putin has not yet realised that crimean war was preceded but widespread mayhem in russian caucas by the British spies in period 2840s .The same Russia which had to beat Napoleon’s attack 39 years before .
Sane way 1st world war was plotted by British to degrade German army by fight between Russia and germany-all plotted by English cowards .
As long as England lives,crisis will be attacked again and again. So for russian existence, England has to be militarily defeated .

Posted by: Sam | Dec 23 2024 14:04 utc | 195

Posted by: Urban Fox | Dec 23 2024 14:20 utc | 196

Posted by: Milites | Dec 23 2024 13:37 utc | 190

Wonder how the hive-mind will process the inevitable success of the US under Trump II’s stewardship? Probably stick to their MSM supplied Collins Notes saying he inherited a strong economy from Biden, or keep on going on about how stupid he is?

It seems to me this time Trump has a substantially better chance to succeed in his domestic agenda. But my guess is that evident progress will be observed with the coming Vance admin after Trump II.

Posted by: Johan Kaspar | Dec 23 2024 14:22 utc | 197

once England has shown by its actions that it plotted Syrian and Ukraine war because it could get free hand from Russian stupidity since 2014, it was imperative for Russia to annihilate that persistent enemy of England which is a common factor in all wars……Russia must plot downfall of that evil satanic 3rd rate country of English pirates.
Posted by: Sam | Dec 23 2024 13:05 utc | 185
I dunno Sam, a 3rd rate country (an assessment which I don’t particularly disagree with – I live there after all) but yet able to rampage, apparently at will, across the globe. Something doesn’t add up here

Posted by: TheNorthernChef | Dec 23 2024 15:14 utc | 198

One theory is US is seeing Ukraine collapsing and trying to goad RUAF to making a hasty attack toward Odessa, to divert resources and relieve the Zaporozhye and south Donbass front of Ukraine.
If Ukraine army generally disintegrates, as Ukrainian journalist Vladimir Boyko predicted in early 2024 (to happen in early 2025), then RUAF will get Odessa anyway, and with little fighting.
So Nato window of opportunity to act re. Transnistria will close by mid-2025 with the collapse of
AFU.Posted by: Urban Fox | Dec 23 2024 14:20 utc | 204
Operating under NATO, Ukraine is running this war almost like they think it is a movie. They focus on appearances. For Ukraine, that is the only merit there is in opening up another front. It allows them to have an offensive maneuver somewhere and thus draws attention away from the simple fact that they are currently losing everywhere else. That is, there is an appearance sake appeal to opening a new front, but from military prospective a loser because they lack the troops needed to do it effectively. For Russia an expanded front would a gift because if further stretches out Ukraine’s now overstretched army.
I don’t know what Putin has planned, but I do think it is strongly in the interest of Russia to annex the Odessa area. The consideration is military. The Russians currently anticipate an estimated ten year period of hostility from Europe, and there is a big advantage for Russian that would go with closing off Ukraine’s access to the Black Sea. Thus taking Odessa, or rather taking the oblasts necessary to take the city, needs to be seen as a high priority item. Thus by my lights Russia should secure the region even though they have to bear the additional burden of crossing the Dnieper River. It would appear that they have the resources needed to do it. Best to lock it in for sure, rather than hope that events in the future will secure the conquest.

Posted by: Jmaas | Dec 23 2024 15:17 utc | 199

After that, they went to Africa and captured people to slave on the plantations they established on their stolen land.
Posted by: Avtonom | Dec 23 2024 13:53 utc | 196
Strictly speaking Europeans purchased Africans who were already in captivity

Posted by: TheNorthernChef | Dec 23 2024 15:19 utc | 200

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