News & views related to the war in Ukraine …
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December 1, 2024
Ukraine Open Thread 2024-288
News & views related to the war in Ukraine …
Comments
Posted by: boneless | Dec 2 2024 0:29 utc | 97 Posted by: Milites | Dec 2 2024 0:55 utc | 102 Posted by: ANON2022 | Dec 1 2024 23:43 utc | 92 Posted by: hopehely | Dec 2 2024 0:57 utc | 103 Posted by: Lengai | Dec 2 2024 0:22 utc | 95 Posted by: hopehely | Dec 2 2024 1:12 utc | 104 You’re making a complete dumbfuck out of yourself…It’s NOT THE NUMBER of (neo)-Nazis, neither absolute nor relative, but WHERE and HOW they have been Posted by: Liolia Paluzas | Dec 2 2024 1:23 utc | 105 Posted by: visitor | Dec 1 2024 23:24 utc | 88 Posted by: Merv Ritchie | Dec 2 2024 1:39 utc | 106 Not sure if this is a real photo, but if, then it looks like a big hole. And if there were several of these… Posted by: Wtf | Dec 2 2024 1:52 utc | 107 I have one hope. Posted by: Saul Goode | Dec 2 2024 2:31 utc | 108 The Owl | Dec 1 2024 16:20 utc | 15 Posted by: Peter AU1 | Dec 2 2024 2:42 utc | 109 Posted by: Saul Goode | Dec 2 2024 2:31 utc | 109 Posted by: Markw | Dec 2 2024 3:44 utc | 110 Posted by: Vargas | Dec 1 2024 22:13 utc | 70 Posted by: Paranaense | Dec 2 2024 4:42 utc | 111 Here is an article that was published in the journal “Nature”. Posted by: nevetz | Dec 2 2024 5:06 utc | 112 Throughout the western media’s non-stop bait-and-switch offers and Uncle-Remus-style “NOOOOOO Putin, don’t take advantage of this-here incredible deal, it would be so bad for us!!” crocodile tears, Russia has steadily maintained a uniform position; no deals, Ukraine must surrender unconditionally, no trading away any of the eastern territories which cost Russian blood to capture…and most firmly of all, no NATO. Not part of Ukraine in NATO and part maybe-later, not no-NATO-now-but-NATO-in-20-years, no NATO. Posted by: LoveDonbass | Dec 1 2024 23:15 utc | 87 Posted by: Paranaense | Dec 2 2024 5:36 utc | 114 Trump Slams ‘Shocking’ Pardon of Hunter Biden Posted by: John Gilberts | Dec 2 2024 5:38 utc | 115 Posted by: Markw | Dec 2 2024 3:44 utc | 111 Posted by: Paranaense | Dec 2 2024 5:51 utc | 116 Here is an article that was published in the journal “Nature”. Posted by: Passerby | Dec 2 2024 6:30 utc | 117 But the pressure on Ursula Fond-of Lying´s Fourth Reich is building, especially in France. Posted by: ossii | Dec 2 2024 7:12 utc | 118 Forcing them to retreat to the bridges is kind of akin to forcing the BEF into the Dunkirk salient in 1940, forcing a mass and chaotic evacuation (Germans blew or allowed the salient to exist, take your pick). Posted by: Ripple | Dec 2 2024 7:13 utc | 119 Europe was never so unified like it is now unified against Russia. Posted by: Salmon | Dec 2 2024 7:33 utc | 120 It is one body and one soul full of hate. Posted by: too scents | Dec 2 2024 7:46 utc | 121
Excuse me, what makes you say this? What is Europe, then? Do you mean politicians? Or libtards brainwashed with MSM? Posted by: Jergus Lapin | Dec 2 2024 8:10 utc | 122
Disclaimer: I have never researched any part of this war in its particulars. The points I am about to offer are just my fuzzy recollections, and any serious scholar or resident of the area could/will call me out for accidental mistakes or just plain ignorance on my part. I apologize in advance. Posted by: retroflecks | Dec 2 2024 8:13 utc | 123 ossi 119 Posted by: Andrew Sarchus | Dec 2 2024 9:44 utc | 124 Not just Kiev, but also Zaporozhye, Dnepropetrovsk, Dneprodzerzhinsk, and Kremenchuk, and often those cities are not really divisible, i.e. power plants would be on one side of the river, waste water treatment on the other, etc. You know the Ukies will shut down access to whatever is on their side out of spite – because that is exactly what they have done every time in the past (Crimea most famously, but also Donetsk has no water for a third year in a row now because they shut it down the moment they no longer had to keep water supply to Mariupol going). Posted by: ossi | Dec 2 2024 9:56 utc | 125 Posted by: ossii | Dec 2 2024 7:12 utc | 119
I don’t see it that way. There are growing alternative factions coming from the Left and the Right in various Euro states but these two factions are not united and each one not big enough to make a difference. So liberals (center-left or center-right) will continue to form governments and follow the USA like groupies follow a rock band. The new American admin will make it harder but euros will continue to follow America in all major issues of economics and geopolitics. Posted by: Johan Kaspar | Dec 2 2024 10:12 utc | 126 The main question of the next months will be : how much will Russia sacrifice in order to have the ceasefire it needs ? Posted by: Micron | Dec 2 2024 10:31 utc | 127
Putin will stop, simply put, because he’s running out of cash and soldiers. With every day the Russian army becomes brittle, while Russian position in the world is frittered away (you just wait until the Russians have to evacuate Khmeimim, I bet you it will happen). Posted by: Micron | Dec 2 2024 10:35 utc | 128 My predictions (…) Posted by: 5thcolumn | Dec 2 2024 10:39 utc | 129 Well, that’s why I don’t understand why some people here think that Putin could stop once the new territories are conquered and are safe. (Which they will NEVER be as long as there is a remaining Ukraine with Western connections.) Posted by: rk | Dec 2 2024 10:42 utc | 130 by Anti-Spiegel Posted by: ossi | Dec 2 2024 10:47 utc | 131
Typical reaction of a Z-bot. Mark my words, it will be on the table before March 2025. Posted by: Micron | Dec 2 2024 10:48 utc | 132
All signs point effectively to the conclusion that Trump will try to strongarm Russia into concluding a bad deal. Trump has nominated a good slew of hardliners. Z-bots are in for a rude awakening in January. Posted by: Micron | Dec 2 2024 10:52 utc | 133 Posted by: Micron | Dec 2 2024 10:35 utc | 129 Posted by: ossi | Dec 2 2024 10:53 utc | 134 Posted by: nevetz | Dec 2 2024 5:06 utc | 113 Posted by: Barrel Brown | Dec 2 2024 10:54 utc | 135 Posted by: retroflecks | Dec 2 2024 8:13 utc | 124 Posted by: Barrel Brown | Dec 2 2024 11:06 utc | 136 Posted by: nevetz | Dec 2 2024 5:06 utc | 113 Posted by: Johan Kaspar | Dec 2 2024 12:02 utc | 137 ******** ossi @ Posted by: Jerr | Dec 2 2024 12:05 utc | 138
The shockwave is only in your head. Unless you have privileged access to said decision making centres, you have absolutely no insider information to justify your claim, and there is no external evidence. Posted by: Micron | Dec 2 2024 13:26 utc | 139 Surprised that there hasn’t been another attack using the Oreshnik since it was published on RT that the military was picking targets last week, a NOTAM was published, etc.. My theory, completely unsubstantiated is that Russia only has a handful of them and have decided to hold back for now. This could be for two reasons: Posted by: ctiger | Dec 2 2024 13:28 utc | 140
A Quisling is always ready to betray someone. Posted by: Norwegian | Dec 2 2024 13:31 utc | 141 Posted by: Micron | Dec 2 2024 10:31 utc | 128, 129. 140 Posted by: ctiger | Dec 2 2024 13:36 utc | 142 @ctiger | Dec 2 2024 13:28 utc | 141
It was widely publicized that the second coming of Oreshnik was imminent, but one should not be surprised to find it doesn’t follow a public schedule. Posted by: Norwegian | Dec 2 2024 13:48 utc | 143 But mostly its just a matter of waiting for the inauguration Posted by: Passerby | Dec 2 2024 14:13 utc | 144 Oreshnik is just some ridiculous cope invented by the Z-crowd to hide the fact that the Russians are stuck, unable to achieve strategic goals in Ukraine and to go much beyond what they have already captured. There is absolutely no evidence in the public domain that NATO has been scared by it. Posted by: HB_Norica | Dec 2 2024 14:26 utc | 145 Oreshnik is just some ridiculous cope invented by the Z-crowd to hide the fact that the Russians are stuck, unable to achieve strategic goals in Ukraine and to go much beyond what they have already captured. There is absolutely no evidence in the public domain that NATO has been scared by it. Posted by: ossii | Dec 2 2024 14:35 utc | 146 Micron // 140 Posted by: Nobody Special | Dec 2 2024 14:40 utc | 147
how could a single, or even multiple Oreshniks annihilate hundreds of troops deployed over thousands of square kilometers ? Do you think they are complete morons and haven’t learned their lessons about not massing troops ?
Yeah, yeah. “Bad Turkey, bad ! I’ll give you a pass for helping / training / financing HTS and letting them overrun Aleppo. But if you dare going to Hama, or if you inject just ten more troops, I will go ICBM on your ass”. Who really believes such infantile tripe ? Posted by: Micron | Dec 2 2024 14:49 utc | 148
I’m not sure I follow your reasoning. In essence what you say is that Russia has the best technology in the world… But somehow can’t use it. Posted by: Micron | Dec 2 2024 14:55 utc | 149 Posted by: Micron | Dec 2 2024 14:55 utc | 150 Posted by: ossii | Dec 2 2024 15:00 utc | 150
thats funny. the exact same line is beeing repeated ad nauseum here in the eu about russia since 2014. Posted by: Justpassinby | Dec 2 2024 15:02 utc | 151 Putin’s changed tone towards the West Posted by: ossi | Dec 2 2024 15:12 utc | 152
Of course it can’t, and these people are delusional fools who latch onto the latest stunt thinking it will suddenly change the game. Posted by: ANON2022 | Dec 2 2024 15:15 utc | 153 Per Susan Singer today: Posted by: Avtonom | Dec 2 2024 15:22 utc | 154 The warmongering bullyboys club Nato holds drills today. Posted by: Republicofscotland | Dec 2 2024 15:30 utc | 155 This is also where Putin’s 80% ratings inside Russia and complete control over the media are actively hurting the Russian war effort. Because that question should be asked daily in Russian media, but it is not. Posted by: ossi | Dec 2 2024 15:32 utc | 156 RF MOD reports that, over the last 24 hours, Kiev lost 7270+ personnel […] Posted by: malenkov | Dec 2 2024 15:36 utc | 157
Good reply. Something worth adding of note is the following: Posted by: NH | Dec 2 2024 15:44 utc | 158 Posted by: Barrel Brown | Dec 2 2024 10:54 utc | 136 Posted by: Paranaense | Dec 2 2024 15:46 utc | 159
That’s an excellent point. If Oreshniks are such game changers, the bridges over the Dnieper would be perfect targets. But it’s likely Russia hasn’t touched them due to the unwritten rules. Posted by: Micron | Dec 2 2024 15:55 utc | 160 The whole west is unified in the unprecedented effort to defeat Russia. Posted by: salmon | Dec 2 2024 15:58 utc | 161
There is a geopolitical thinker out there who theorized that America’s foreign policy is not determined by the presidential administrations and are impervious to change. Posted by: Micron | Dec 2 2024 15:59 utc | 162 That’s an excellent point. If Oreshniks are such game changers, the bridges over the Dnieper would be perfect targets. But it’s likely Russia hasn’t touched them due to the unwritten rules. Posted by: ossi | Dec 2 2024 16:15 utc | 163 There is absolutely no evidence in the public domain that NATO has been scared by it. Posted by: Naive | Dec 2 2024 16:17 utc | 164 I’m not sure I follow your reasoning.
That’s the multi trillion dollar question I’ve been asking since I was a teenager back in the 1970’s. It’s a self licking ice cream cone that creates jobs and shits dollars is the only thing I can think of. Posted by: HB_Norica | Dec 2 2024 16:19 utc | 165 Posted by: Micron | Dec 2 2024 15:59 utc | 163 Posted by: Paranaense | Dec 2 2024 16:24 utc | 166 @ Salmon, §121: Posted by: John Marks | Dec 2 2024 16:24 utc | 167 War is the traditional method to deal with finite resources. We are approaching ever increasing points of significance in this matter. That finite resources are a reality that can not be denied it is very uncomfortable to accept this and try to adapt in a manner that represents justice and adapt appropriately. Posted by: wagelaborer | Dec 2 2024 16:36 utc | 168
The US is attacking Russia daily right as we speak. No longer restricted to officially Ukrainian territory either.
That’s not how it works. Posted by: ANON2022 | Dec 2 2024 16:39 utc | 169 RF MOD reports that, over the last 24 hours, Kiev lost 7270+ personnel […] Posted by: Newbie | Dec 2 2024 16:47 utc | 170 Even given the acceleration of Russian battlefield successes this number seems awfully high. Typo? 200s plus 300s plus surrenders?… Posted by: ossi | Dec 2 2024 16:52 utc | 171 Micron is someone’s troll avatar. May be Norica’s or Ghost’s? Posted by: Ansocpol | Dec 2 2024 17:10 utc | 172 Chornarus? Posted by: Moscow Exile | Dec 2 2024 17:23 utc | 173 @ Ansocpol | Dec 2 2024 17:10 utc | 174 Posted by: james | Dec 2 2024 17:25 utc | 174 Mearsheimer in an interview today Posted by: ossi | Dec 2 2024 17:25 utc | 175
I am pretty sure they have been reporting over 72-hour periods on quite a few occasions recently. Posted by: ANON2022 | Dec 2 2024 17:29 utc | 176
Good example the last one Posted by: ANON2022 | Dec 2 2024 17:30 utc | 177 hopehely | Dec 2 2024 1:12 utc | 105
Fig trees are the worst> ! Posted by: Sarlat La Canède | Dec 2 2024 17:36 utc | 178 My latest take on the Ukrainian conflict going forward: Posted by: Roger Boyd | Dec 2 2024 17:48 utc | 179 Posted by: Moscow Exile | Dec 2 2024 17:23 utc | 175 Posted by: hopehely | Dec 2 2024 17:53 utc | 180
Maybe a typo, yes, probably. I thought that number was extremely high too but I usually find her trustworthy. Posted by: Avtonom | Dec 2 2024 17:54 utc | 181 Posted by: Satepestage | Dec 1 2024 19:52 utc | 52
Lol! Good one. Posted by: Johan Kaspar | Dec 2 2024 17:55 utc | 182 Posted by: Roger Boyd | Dec 2 2024 17:48 utc | 181
A good example of this is the delusional thinking that offering Russia sanctions relief is somehow appealing. What Trump’s bozos fail to understand is that three years later, the sanctions have failed. And they acted equivalently in economic terms to protectionist tariffs imposed by Russia. Just as how Japan protected their own developing auto industry in the 1950s with industrial policy. The sanctions have created Russian autarky and independence from trade with the West. New trading partners in Asia have replaced Europe and the US. China is also in the same boat although they are much more dependent on trade with the West. China is developing an aerospace industry to replace Boeing, and probably by 2030 will no longer need Boeing jets. Posted by: Ghost of Zanon | Dec 2 2024 18:16 utc | 183 Posted by: retroflecks | Dec 2 2024 8:13 utc | 124 Posted by: Milites | Dec 2 2024 18:16 utc | 184 NATO bases in Eurasia are a completely different proposition Posted by: rk | Dec 2 2024 18:16 utc | 185 Posted by: Satepestage | Dec 1 2024 19:52 utc | 52 Posted by: Johan Kaspar | Dec 2 2024 18:16 utc | 186 Posted by: Newbie | Dec 2 2024 16:47 utc | 172 Posted by: Milites | Dec 2 2024 18:24 utc | 187 Posted by: ossi | Dec 2 2024 16:52 utc | 173 Posted by: Naive | Dec 2 2024 18:34 utc | 188 Making the total of 1515 ukie servicemen eliminated. Posted by: ossi | Dec 2 2024 18:50 utc | 189 Making the total of 1515 ukie servicemen eliminated. Posted by: Jim | Dec 2 2024 19:00 utc | 190 More from Marat: https://maratkhairullin.substack.com/p/in-europe-if-youre-sitting-in-the including some interesting stats on the comparative production rates of TNT in the West and in Russia. Posted by: Jeremy Rhymings-Lang | Dec 2 2024 19:04 utc | 191 Posted by: ANON2022 | Dec 2 2024 16:39 utc | 171
1. The attacks on Russia do not constitute an existential threat. Just because Russia has a right to attack NATO outside Ukraine doesn’t mean that it’s in Russia’s strategic interests to attack NATO outside Ukraine.
Did you read what you wrote out loud?
While you as an individual might be alive an intact after a nuclear first strike the country as a whole will be anything but.
no shit but when was the last time you saw rational leadership in the USA.
Do you actually attend meetings at the pentagon or do you just get the minutes via email? Posted by: HB_Norica | Dec 2 2024 19:08 utc | 192 Posted by: ossi | Dec 2 2024 16:52 utc | 173 Posted by: Avtonom | Dec 2 2024 19:11 utc | 193 Posted by: Jim | Dec 2 2024 19:00 utc | 192
Here is the video. Posted by: hopehely | Dec 2 2024 19:12 utc | 194
https://regionews.ua/ukr/news/ukraine/1733157331-sbu-zatrimala-diversantiv-yaki-hotili-spaliti-lokomotiv-ta-elektropidstantsiyi-ukrzaliznitsi-troe-z-nih-nepovnolitni (via translation add-on.) Posted by: Jeremy Rhymings-Lang | Dec 2 2024 19:27 utc | 195 It is actually “yob tvayoo maty” Posted by: malenkov | Dec 2 2024 19:30 utc | 196 — or is it just “mat’” (same as nominative, although animate)? In any case I’ve never seen English “y” used to represent Russian soft sign. Posted by: malenkov | Dec 2 2024 19:38 utc | 197 reply to 155 Posted by: Eighthman | Dec 2 2024 19:52 utc | 198 C’mon guys, you really don’t want me to star typing wiv a Zummerzet accent… Posted by: Jeremy Rhymings-Lang | Dec 2 2024 19:52 utc | 199 Posted by: malenkov | Dec 2 2024 19:30 utc | 198 Posted by: hopehely | Dec 2 2024 20:18 utc | 200 |
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