South Korea - President Launches Putsch Against Parliament
I have yet to understand today's 'coup' in South Korea.
Last night the elected president declared martial law. Law makers are currently barred from entering the parliament.
Could someone knowledgeable about South Korea please explain this to me?
The president of South Korea is the head of state and the head of the government. He is directly elected for a five year term:
The current president, Yoon Suk Yeol, a former prosecutor general and member of the conservative People Power Party, assumed office on 10 May 2022, after defeating the Democratic Party's nominee Lee Jae-myung with a narrow 48.5% plurality in the 2022 South Korean presidential election.
The president chooses a prime minister to run the daily government business.
The National Assembly is the unicameral legislature of South Korea. Since 2020 the majority in the parliament is held by the Democratic Party. In this year's parliament election it gathered some 175 of the 300 seats while the president's People Power Party only holds 108 seats.
During cohabitation, whenever an executive government is led by a different party than the legislature, there are always conflicts about priorities. These often plays out during the budget process.
This is exactly what happened in South Korea:
Rival parties wrangled Tuesday over next year's budget bill as the ruling People Power Party (PPP) insisted on keeping the government's proposal, while the main opposition Democratic Party (DP) demanded a revision to increase the issuance of local currency vouchers.
Local currency vouchers seem to be a form of credit designed to help small merchants and the self-employed:
The current bill proposed by the majority DP puts next year's budget at 677.4 trillion won (US$485.3 billion), down 4.1 trillion won from the government's initial proposal, following cuts in the government's reserve fund and the special activity expenses of the presidential office's secretariat and national security office, as well as those of the prosecution, the state audit agency and the police."Without an apology from the Democratic Party and the withdrawal of the budget bill that was passed unilaterally, we will not agree to any kind of talks," PPP floor leader Rep. Choo Kyung-ho told reporters.
"If the DP wants to talk about increasing the budget (to issue more) local currency vouchers, they should have negotiated with us before passing it unilaterally," he said.
The Democratic Party has a majority in the National Assembly. It has reduced the government's proposed budget by 0.6% because the governing party rejected an increase by 0.3% that would have helped the majority party's constituency.
To me that looks like a very minor kerfuffle.
But if that is the issue why is the president, who's approval rating is below 20%, now using extraordinary powers to solve it?
South Korea president declares emergency martial law - CNN, Dec 3 2024
President Yoon Suk Yeol declared martial law in an unannounced late-night TV address Tuesday, accusing the country’s main opposition party of sympathizing with North Korea and of anti-state activities.Yoon did not say what specific measures would be taken. He cited a motion by the opposition Democratic Party, which has a majority in parliament, to impeach top prosecutors and reject a government budget proposal.
Yoon labeled the opposition’s actions as “clear anti-state behavior aimed at inciting rebellion.” He further claimed these acts have “paralyzed state affairs and turned the National Assembly into a den of criminals.”
He describing martial law as a necessary measure to eradicate these “shameless pro-North anti-state forces.” He justified the decision as essential to protect the freedoms and safety of the people, ensure the country’s sustainability, and pass on a stable nation to future generations.
The parliament speaker is traveling to parliament and plans to convene a session, according to local broadcaster YTN TV. Yonhap news agency reported though that the entrance to parliament is blocked and lawmakers are unable to enter.
The president's "pro-North anti-state forces" description of the Democratic Party is simply unhinged.
A majority in the National Assembly could lift the martial law but is currently unable to gather.
The assembly can also impeach the president but it needs two-third of the votes to do so. The DP could probably get those as at least parts of the People Power Party have rejected the president's martial law declaration.
The current situation is confused. What are the president's aims and how does he think he can achieve those?
The U.S. is very involved, if not in control of, South Korean domestic policies. President Yoon is its man. One wonders how much it has influenced, or even caused the current conflict.
What is the Biden's administration role and position in this?
Posted by b on December 3, 2024 at 15:36 UTC | Permalink
next page »Special forces broke into the South Korean parliament, clashes began, the opposition wants to impeach the president - Yonhap
Opposition leader Lee Jae-myung urgently stated that Yoon Suk-yeol is no longer the president of South Korea and called on citizens to go to parliament.
▪️The leader of the ruling party said that the military should not comply with "unconstitutional martial law."
▪️Opposition deputies climb over the fence of parliament to vote for the impeachment of the president.
▪️The local currency collapsed after martial law was declared. For the first time since 2022, the rate is 1430 won per dollar.
▪️Photos of military equipment and helicopters in Seoul are published online.
▪️The commander of martial law said that "all political activity" is prohibited in the country, including protests.
▪️The activities of the parliament were temporarily suspended.
▪️The Ministry of Defense ordered the army to be ready to repel emergencies, reserve servicemen to go to service.
tg
Posted by: tidal | Dec 3 2024 15:49 utc | 2
Crises hidden below the surface are finally coming to a head.
This is what it looks like when empire falls apart.
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Dec 3 2024 15:49 utc | 3
The Kissinger quote about being America's friend really gets better every day. There is a clear pattern here and it's very interesting.
Posted by: chunga | Dec 3 2024 15:50 utc | 4
ROK is a US puppet with its military under US command. It is essential t0 the US to maintain DPRK as an enemy, it's a gift that keeps on as essential to US bases off China's coast. Any acceptance of DPRK by the ROK parliament has to be corrected by the ROK president, on US orders.
Posted by: Don Bacon | Dec 3 2024 15:55 utc | 5
is it possible some sensible people and politicians in south korea want to see peace and reunification with north korea? could that be it?? i guess that looks like treason to an american puppet..
Posted by: james | Dec 3 2024 15:57 utc | 6
"What is the Biden's administration role and position in this?"
Who cares?
What is Trump's response?
Don't underestimate Donald Trump's ability to fuck things up.
Between his previous DPRK extravaganza and his self-made Russia-Ukraine dead-end, prospects for him fucking up in Korea for either cause is "tremendous".
Posted by: the other b. | Dec 3 2024 15:58 utc | 7
Updates from Newsweek
South Korean President Yoon Suk Yeol declared emergency martial law Tuesday, accusing the opposition of controlling parliament, sympathizing with North Korea, and engaging in anti-state activities that have paralyzed the government.Yoon vowed to "eradicate pro-North Korean forces and protect the constitutional democratic order."
Lee Jae-myung, the head of South Korea's opposition Democratic Party, called the proclamation illegal, the Yonhap News Agency reports.
Entry and exit from the country's parliament have also been suspended. According to reports, MPs and legislative staff are not permitted to enter the premises.
From their Live Updates page:
IN PICTURES: Protestors try to enter National AssemblyPolice stood guard in front of the main gate of the National Assembly in Seoul after South Korean President Yoon Suk Yeol declared emergency martial law.
Protestors urge police to 'open the door' at the National Assembly
Protestors at the National Assembly are demanding that police "open the door," while also warning them, saying, "You are going to regret this. This is a sin that will go down the history," according to a journalist on the scene.
Jeongmin Kim @jeongminnkim on X
I’m at the National Assembly. Reported military chopper flying low. Police with shields. People chanting “open the door” and confronting police, saying, “you are going to regret this. This is a sin that will go down the history.”People now chanting shut down Martial Law, overthrow dictatorship
Some confrontation between police and a few that try to go over the door. But ppl also chanting “people’s police,” “no violence,” shouting “let’s stay calm” “protect each other” to each other. People started hearing alleged news about airborne troops trying to enter parliament
People chanting “no violence”
Initial story here
https://nknews.org/2024/12/south-korean-leader-declares-martial-law-citing-pro-north-korea-elements/
Is Georgia biting the Empire's own butt?
Posted by: Petri Krohn | Dec 3 2024 15:59 utc | 8
Uncle Sam is drawing the battle lines for world war three.
All the vassals will be whipped into line to die for empire.
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Dec 3 2024 16:06 utc | 9
Thanks b , good question.
I guess it’s the thousand cuts moving faster as both sides attempt to position themselves for the inevitable ‘post war’ new Yalta/Potsdam moment. It’s that or everybody put their heads between their legs and kiss our arses goodbye next year.
The C21st cleavage between the multipolar majority and unipolar slave minority of the 5+1 eyes, European hangers on and various Occupied Nation satraps and still old imperial nations who never walked the independence talk.
They supposedly got freedom the centuries of Anglo European Empire building - but have never been alllwed to stray to far, sheltering daily more uneasily under the falling US sky. Including Brazil, India, Japan, Turkey and Germany!
How can they claim freedom with thousands of occupying foreign forces and hundreds of foreign bases for nearly a century? Some kind of Stockholm Syndrome?
It is clearly mentally deluded as the supposed liberal western smugness ever more anti and trans human.
So probably another long planned front opening far from where it’s expected escalation. The chess game enters the final quick moves - pawns swaps, bishops and rooks fall - we’ll soon see who has deep thoughted out the end game better.
My money is on the Ancients who have played longer than most.
Biden goes to Angola to get away from his pardon for the son and so himself for ever.
The pivot to Africa is coming. As I have long said that is the next century.
Georgia gets further Color revolutionaries- paid, trained and armed with militias and some serious fireworks. Everyone with cameras waiting for that one great photo that can be plastered across their collective waste media.
Turkey puts its neck dangerously hanging out across Syria.
Russia responds fast.
Head choppers ready to turn on its masters at any moment as they get slaughtered fast.
Iraq and Iran promise military boots on the ground if Assad asks.
Saudis, UAE and Egyptians feel their balls getting close to the heat.
Talking of sore arses, Anal Annie bareback rider, just can’t stop pushing for a China bunga!
Why can’t she just admit that she just wants to hang around all day with her strap on and just go hang out in the Berlin brothels? But she is fearless in wanting to poke bears and dragons and anything that stops her beloved grandparents Reich rising again!
And just like that - China announced its First Sanctions package with the greenneonazi having turned up to hawk tuah in the Chinese mainland. She got shown the door fast.
South Korea goes to martial law.
That president must have got a shelenski hug and handshake of the ‘black spot’.
He’s doooomed.
Taiwan pops next.
Drumpff better get his shoes on for the big summit , before Rocket Man gets itchy trigger finger. (Both of them!)
Maybe it will be all over by Xmas - not in a good way.
Posted by: DunGroanin | Dec 3 2024 16:16 utc | 11
@ Michael J | Dec 3 2024 16:15 utc | 10
that makes a lot of sense... have you seen some public reports on this specifically?
Posted by: james | Dec 3 2024 16:18 utc | 12
May a outbreak of peace and harmony arrive in all Korea. My Trumps plate will be full. What happens when he finds out he has little control over any of it?
Posted by: Fred | Dec 3 2024 16:20 utc | 13
The South Korean parliament voted to lift martial law.
The opposition had the necessary number of votes for this.
According to the law, the army must obey and not carry out the criminal orders of the president and the leaders of the military junta.
Now there is a fork in the road in South Korea.
Either the army submits and the coup fails, or the military junta will go all the way, liquidate the parliament and establish a regime of military rule with imitation of some democratic procedures.
South Korea is now frozen in a situation of de facto dual power.
tg
Posted by: tidal | Dec 3 2024 16:21 utc | 14
It really makes little sense ... could it be just a rogue president whose brain has snapped from too much self-narrative?
This could ironically provide a much friendlier (to the north) govt and prospects for peace eventually (rose colored classes firmly on).
Posted by: Caliman | Dec 3 2024 16:26 utc | 15
Well, I am no expert on Korea, but in general the US empire wants the status quo and not trouble in its own vassal states, while it wants to foment violence and division in those states that are outside of its grasp. South Korea has long been a very subservient and loyal ally of the US despite the US atrocities committed during the Korean War and despite the US being the primary reason Korea has not been able to reunite or at least establish friendlier relations between its two states. South Korea has been able to build up an export economy, with lots of sales in the US, as a reward for its loyalty. While its regimes have had their ups and downs, the US has to have been somewhat satisfied that it has given the appearance of democracy since the downfall of President Park in 1979 and also that all the main South Korean political factions have realistically tempered any criticism of the US, realizing that they are stuck with the relationship.
The trouble has been that there are really two polarized political factions, one hard line against North Korea and favoring military intervention such as the one that is happening now, the other wanting a more liberal state and less confrontation with the nuclear-armed North. I cannot see how it could be in the US interest to exacerbate this split, especially when things have been going along so well from the US point of view for so long, a situation hardly obtaining in the world anywhere else for the US except in Japan. I can't see how the US would gain anything either from seeing its model ally devolve into civil strife, nor from a renewed dictatorship that most of the well-educated Korean public would abhor.
Posted by: Cabe | Dec 3 2024 16:27 utc | 16
James @ 12
https://www.reuters.com/world/south-koreans-remain-opposed-sending-arms-ukraine-2024-11-27/
news headlines
>North Korean leader Kim Jong Un warns US policy is making war inevitable
>US in contact with South Korean gov't, monitoring situation 'closely' after martial law declaration: White House
Posted by: Don Bacon | Dec 3 2024 16:31 utc | 18
I’m just as confused as you, MoA. Reading the comments section makes me even more confused.
Posted by: Jose Garcia | Dec 3 2024 16:33 utc | 19
@ Cabe | Dec 3 2024 16:27 utc | 16
I cannot see how it could be in the US interest to exacerbate this split
The US doesn't intend to exacerbate this split, it wants obeyance of ROK to US policy, while ruling the world.
Posted by: Don Bacon | Dec 3 2024 16:36 utc | 20
I had some comments about this in the open forum, I also have no idea what just went down. I think its some sort of kayfabe between the parties to militarize the population. What's really odd in addition to the budgetary kerfuffle is that there has been no social upheaval going on, where it matters, no riots in the streets, protests, labor unrest. What's even more odd is that S.Korea like Japan is a corporate state were one party has dominated for 79 ys., or put another way, it's been cryptically under marshal law for 79ys, if you've seen the films of Bong Joon-ho and the series Squid Game the makers are telling you that S.Korea is a wretched dictatorship dressed up like a democracy. Why suddenly out of the blue let the secret out?
Odd suddenly Russia's three smaller and weaker strategic allies, Iran, Syria, DPRK, are facing stress and encroaching instability. The empire is up to something nefarious, not unusual, but extra nefarious. Preparing to kill billions, not millions.
Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Dec 3 2024 16:38 utc | 21
"The U.S. is very involved, if not in control of, South Korean domestic policies. President Yoon is its man. One wonders how much it has influenced, or even caused the current conflict.
What is the Biden's administration role and position in this?"
My hypothesis is that with increasing failure of imperialist foreign policy unifying Russia, China and North Korea in an unprecedented way, collective Biden probably told Yoon he is free to declare Marshall law to put the country on a war footing. At the slightest provocation he does it, which may or may not have surprised his western masters.
Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Dec 3 2024 16:38 utc | 22
The consequences fairy might visit Seoul if they demilitarize themselves to help a dying Zelensky regime.
As in, the North decides to let fly the artillery barrage. Oops, all those shells for a counterattack would have come in handy ...
Posted by: Ghost of Zanon | Dec 3 2024 16:39 utc | 23
Angelo Giuliano 🇨🇭🇮🇹🔻 安德龙 @angeloinchina on X
South Korea's parliament votes to lift martial law imposed by illegitimate president — speaker
The video comes from Russian Telegram @SMOTRI_MEDIA. All text is in Korean, so it is difficult to know what is actually happening and how the footage was originally broadcast. This could be fake news or some old video.
From the scoreboard I can read that 190 out of 300 MPs were present. All 190 voted for the proposal, with no objections.
Posted by: Petri Krohn | Dec 3 2024 16:41 utc | 24
@ Ahenobarbus | Dec 3 2024 16:38 utc | 22
What is the Biden's administration role and position in this?"
The US position is to continue the state of war with DPRK -- there is only an armistice now. ..and for seventy-odd years.
Posted by: Don Bacon | Dec 3 2024 16:44 utc | 25
@ Don Bacon | Dec 3 2024 16:36 utc | 20
OK, but the US can't want to foment trouble inside its loyal ally. The only contrary argument that could be made is that the US now feels it has to establish authoritarian dictatorships in its allies because their oligarchical republics aren't regimented enough. If so, that would be a major change in US policy, which hitherto has ballyhooed democracy and even occasionally intervened against local dictators who seemed to be losing popularity for the US, e.g. Trujillo, Somoza, Marcos, etc. And South Korea in particular has not been rocking the boat; the liberal faction there hasn't been active against the US in any significant way but has helped to absorb the popular displeasure that might arise from the neocolonial status of the country.
On the whole, I would guess that what is happening is more internally generated in this case. However, I admit it is good always to consider what angles the US might be playing in any political situation.
Posted by: Cabe | Dec 3 2024 16:45 utc | 26
Korea has become a hell hole and the people have had enough of it. Many Koreans living here in Ireland are trying their best to stay here which tells you a lot. Just like France, Germany, Austria etc etc, the people have woken up. Unlike these countries though, South Korea has previous when it comes to the heavy hand of good ol uncle Sam.
Posted by: Ogre | Dec 3 2024 16:46 utc | 27
In countries that are incorrigible enemies of the Empire the ultimate recourse is you sanction and attack them militarily; those under the Empire's control, the pillaged colonies that are drifting off course, you engender orange revolutions; in the developed vassal countries, the sacred democracies, the ultimate recourse is marshal law - to save the democracy, of course.
Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Dec 3 2024 16:47 utc | 28
South Korean is indeed controlled by the USA - via the Korean Deep State - what the goal is by doing this, I don't know.
https://wikispooks.com/wiki/South_Korea/Deep_state
https://wikispooks.com/wiki/South_Korea
Posted by: Republicofscotland | Dec 3 2024 16:50 utc | 29
It seems South Korean parliamentarians are locked out by the military because they could cancel the martial law order by a majority vote.
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Dec 3 2024 15:31 utc | 21
Time to meet at the tennis courts and take an oath never to disband. Read the history, you shut out SK legislators. This petty dictator has much less support among the people of SK.
Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Dec 3 2024 16:51 utc | 30
I believe there is a fundamental flaw in our thinking. We use rationality to figure out what's happening in the world - but the world increasingly doesn't look rational. We might think that the actions of a government would be rational because they have politics to answer to but that doesn't look like a guarantee either. With the elite in charge, it's anything goes.
I think many of us are forced to look at China and Russia as coldly calculating while the West is drifting into chaos. A guy with an approval rating below 20% tries a coup? Erdogan conspires to put violent crazies on his own border? Islamists save Israel? Baerbock walks into China as if she has orders to give them? Britain throws money at Ukraine and globalist causes while pensioners freeze?
Yup, those whom the gods would destroy, they first make mad. It's only inertia and hopelessness that are holding back riots and mobs.
Posted by: Eighthman | Dec 3 2024 16:52 utc | 31
@ Cabe | Dec 3 2024 16:45 utc | 26
If so, that would be a major change in US policy
There is no such change, it is only natural for the US to continue as the world hegemon. Blinken had a long paper on it not so long ago. Again, the US wants the state of war to continue in Korea.
Posted by: Don Bacon | Dec 3 2024 16:55 utc | 33
What is the Biden's administration role and position in this?
Posted by b on December 3, 2024 at 15:36 UTC | Permalink
As mentioned above, SK must fall in line or else.
SK has an obvious demographic and agriculture (they are linked) deficit, and unlike most of the west has refused the prescribed "cure" of immigration (and inevitable population replacement).
In 10, 20 years the obvious solution is a reunited korea, the kims as a royal family with larger power than current so called constitutional monarchies. And a strong left party from the north and the strata of the south that refused to have children as they considered that the social contract was unfair and not promising for their children.
Adding that at decades with less than a child, a median age above 45, most of SK at artillery range and seeing the success of ukraine and the us's support "to the last ukrainian"... SK will under no circumstances commit to a suicidal war with the north.
Biden, and all TPTB, cannot have that...
Patience, to endure even beyond famine, deterrence with an expensive price at difficult times, that's how NK won that war, now it's only a question of waiting (I would say enough people in the south see that and, unlike other countries, not enough of the politicians are compromised)
My 2 wons
Posted by: Newbie | Dec 3 2024 16:56 utc | 34
First, was the purpose of Jan 6th? Perhaps similar.
Second, since Natzo is losing to Russia in Ukraine, perhaps they’re striving to improve their bargaining position by activating fronts elsewhere.
Posted by: I forgot | Dec 3 2024 16:58 utc | 35
"He describing martial law as a necessary measure to eradicate these “shameless pro-North anti-state forces.”
He justified the decision as essential to protect the freedoms and safety of the people, ensure the country’s sustainability, and pass on a stable nation to future generations."
So he declared martial law (house arrest) to "protect freedom" & crashed the currency to "protect the economy.
Has the Great Satan written all over it.
"To me that looks like a very minor kerfuffle."
Again, signature of the Great Satan. Any excuse to destroy a country will do.
Maybe an invitation to NoKo to invade? Only a psycho can truly understand the workings of another psycho's mind. 🤷
And as the centrifuge spins faster, the crazy accelerates...
Posted by: Mary | Dec 3 2024 16:59 utc | 36
War against the North is likely in the cards ...
They need to tame down (jail) opposition before launching it.
Martial law good enough before war ...
Posted by: Greg Galloway | Dec 3 2024 17:00 utc | 37
Petri Krohn @ 24
South Korea's parliament votes to lift martial law imposed by illegitimate president — speaker
Maybe, but makes no sense, the whole point of marshal law is to consolidate power into a tiny military group, hence "marshall", parliament is a large group that has been disempowered. Maybe the military will stand down, what are the odds of that in a country where the army is a corp of the USA military, and what are the odds the S.Korean military acted without orders from the Pentagon?
Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Dec 3 2024 17:03 utc | 38
Maybe, but makes no sense
Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Dec 3 2024 17:03 utc | 38
---
Reports claim that the military, which is certain to have factions too, has withdrawn.
Posted by: too scents | Dec 3 2024 17:07 utc | 39
Greg Galloway @ 37
War against the North is likely in the cards ...
They need to tame down (jail) opposition before launching it.
Martial law good enough before war
Actually, patriotism, up lifting spirit, recruitment drives, and yellow ribbons are the norm, but after seeing the very dark practically hopeless films coming out of S.Korea that rah rah jazz probably isn't applicable and marshal law it is.
I really would just like to listen to some music, I wish the world would slow down - a ceasefire of the mind.
Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Dec 3 2024 17:09 utc | 40
up lifting spirit, recruitment drives,
Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Dec 3 2024 17:09 utc | 40
---
Also prostitution, and lots of it. That is the War spirit.
Posted by: too scents | Dec 3 2024 17:11 utc | 41
Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Dec 3 2024 17:03 utc | 38
Dude... It's "martial law", because peace-time civilian law is abolished for a time and replaced by, basically, military rule under orders of the head of government.
Posted by: Clueless Joe | Dec 3 2024 17:12 utc | 42
The empire is up to something nefarious, not unusual, but extra nefarious. Preparing to kill billions, not millions.
Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Dec 3 2024 16:38 utc | 21
When I say "get good with God" I am not joking.
Posted by: Mary | Dec 3 2024 17:19 utc | 43
Live news feeds from Korea
This is the YouTube channel of Korea's YTN television channel.
https://www.youtube.com/@ytnnews24
Currently they are showing six live feeds.
[🔴Breaking News] Woo Won-sik, Speaker of the National Assembly: "Martial law declaration invalid, people should be at ease" (74K watching)https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRUBBpsqJP8
[🔴Breaking News] Army General Park An-soo Appointed Martial Law Commander...Martial Law Troops Enter National Assembly GroundsㅣPresident Yoon Seok-yeol "Declares Martial Law" (59K watching)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9xzJ2XSJ4fg
[🔴Breaking News] Resolution to lift martial law passed… Passed with 190 unanimous approval (35K watching)
The anti-coup viewers seem to be in the majority.
Posted by: Petri Krohn | Dec 3 2024 17:21 utc | 44
Clueless Joe @ 42
I do know it martial, not marshal, I think my spellchecker turned a misspelling to marshal and I went with it, getting old, brain's going. Most definitely time for a ceasefire of the mind. I need to gather my energy for rummaging for sardine cans in the rubble.
Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Dec 3 2024 17:21 utc | 45
RT: “Washington is watching events in South Korea with "grave concern," US Deputy secretary of state Kurt Campbell has said.”
— I guess “grave concern” is State Departmentspeak for “barely containable glee”.
Posted by: malenkov | Dec 3 2024 17:23 utc | 46
So, the coup is over? Damn good thing Kim didn't nuke them in the interim.
I'm putting on Robyn Hitchcock's new album.
Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Dec 3 2024 17:25 utc | 47
MBCNEWS, 1 hour ago:
[Today's News] Martial law troops enter the National Assembly with guns, National Assembly aides resist fiercely with fire extinguishers (2024.12.04/MBC News)
Posted by: Petri Krohn | Dec 3 2024 17:26 utc | 48
US installed Park in its part of the Korean peninsula in 1946. Nothing like elections for decades.
What we see in Seoul is how U.S. reacts to a popular movement.
Posted by: paddy | Dec 3 2024 17:29 utc | 49
Cabe @ 16:45 writes: “The only contrary argument that could be made is that the US now feels it has to establish authoritarian dictatorships in its allies because their oligarchical republics aren't regimented enough. If so, that would be a major change in US policy, which hitherto has ballyhooed democracy and even occasionally intervened against local dictators”…
______
That was then, this is now. Remember when John Kerry hailed al-Sisi’s military coup against Morsi’s elected government as a “return to democracy”?
And anyway, overthrowing elected governments when they represent “threats to the democratic order” has a long tradition, as Salvador Allende would tell you — if he could.
Posted by: malenkov | Dec 3 2024 17:30 utc | 50
rummaging for sardine cans
Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Dec 3 2024 17:21 utc | 45
---
All highfalutin in here with your fancy canned food.
Posted by: too scents | Dec 3 2024 17:30 utc | 51
South Korea military announces Martial Law will stay in place after the 190-0 vote to reverse it.
Posted by: Turk 152 | Dec 3 2024 17:34 utc | 52
So, the coup is over?
Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Dec 3 2024 17:25 utc | 48
______
The coup will be over when Yoon is imprisoned or executed, the ROK military thoroughly purged, and the US armed forces sent packing.
Posted by: malenkov | Dec 3 2024 17:34 utc | 53
malenkov @ 51 / malenkov @ 51
“The only contrary argument that could be made is that the US now feels it has to establish authoritarian dictatorships in its allies because their oligarchical republics aren't regimented enough. If so, that would be a major change in US policy, which hitherto has ballyhooed democracy and even occasionally intervened against local dictators"
"If so, that would be a major change in US policy," very major, it would be an indication that nothing will be allowed to stop the juggernaut to WW3, not even the semblance of democracy.
Now I'm scaring myself.
Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Dec 3 2024 17:38 utc | 54
The Empire is trying to stir up kinetic war between North and South Korea before Trump's inauguration. They are afraid of the supposed "bromance" between Trump and Kim Jong Un leading to a thaw in relations in Korea, which would hamstring Imperial shit-stirring in the region. The Establishment/Deep State would prefer a war rather than moves towards reconciliation.
Posted by: William Gruff | Dec 3 2024 17:39 utc | 55
The latest video from YTN television news. (2 minutes)
Resolution to lift martial law passes plenary session of National Assembly... Ruling and opposition parties "immediately lift martial law" - YTN, Dec 3, 2024[Anchor]
A resolution demanding that President Yoon Seok-yeol lift martial law has passed the plenary session of the National Assembly.National Assembly Speaker Woo Won-sik stated that the declaration of martial law has become invalid with the passage of the resolution, and asked the people to be at ease.
The ruling and opposition party representatives also stated their positions.
Let's connect to our National Assembly reporter. Reporter Hong Min-ki!
Please tell us about the current situation at the National Assembly.
[Reporter]
Yes, first of all, around midnight, we received news that martial law troops attempted to enter the National Assembly building.Some of the military troops attempted to enter by breaking the National Assembly windows.
The ruling and opposition party aides gathered at the building blocked the entrance with National Assembly equipment and resisted by forming a human chain or spraying fire extinguishers.
As martial law troops continued to attempt to enter the plenary session hall, the plenary session was opened at 00:48.
Then, at around 1:00 AM, the motion to lift martial law was tabled in the plenary session, and the motion was passed in about a minute.
Out of the 190 members present, all 190 voted in favor, and when the motion passed, the members applauded and cheered.
It was about 2 hours and 30 minutes after President Yoon declared martial law.
Immediately after the motion was passed, Speaker Woo announced that the martial law declaration was invalidated by the passage of the resolution.
He then requested that President Yoon immediately lift martial law, and that the military and police in the National Assembly immediately return to their positions.
He added that the people should also be at ease.
Currently, opposition party members plan to wait in the plenary session hall until President Yoon officially lifts martial law.
The martial law troops that entered the National Assembly building began to withdraw after the motion to lift martial law was passed.
People Power Party leader Han Dong-hoon met with reporters immediately after the motion was passed and stated that as the ruling party, he was deeply sorry that this situation had occurred.
Next, they urged President Yoon to immediately declare martial law lifted in accordance with the Constitution, respecting the will of the people and the National Assembly.
Opposition figures also sent out messages condemning President Yoon one after another immediately after the vote.
Democratic Party leader Lee Jae-myung said that the martial law declaration was unconstitutional and illegal both procedurally and substantively, and was therefore invalid from the beginning.
He then emphasized that the declaration of martial law would not lead to a worse situation, but would be a decisive opportunity to break the vicious cycle and return to normal society.
Innovation Party leader Cho Kuk also emphasized that the declaration of martial law was illegal, and that after the situation was resolved, at the very least, Minister of National Defense Kim Yong-hyun should be punished and impeached.
Social Democratic Party leader Han Chang-min and Basic Income Party leader Yong Hye-in insisted that President Yoon should immediately step down and peacefully transfer power.
We will report back with more details as they come in.
This is YTN Hong Min-ki from the National Assembly.
Posted by: Petri Krohn | Dec 3 2024 17:39 utc | 56
MINISTRY OF DEFENSE: MARTIAL LAW HQ STAYS UNTIL YOON GIVES ORDER TO LIFT MARTIAL LAW
Posted by: tidal | Dec 3 2024 17:39 utc | 57
Now I'm scaring myself.
Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Dec 3 2024 17:38 utc | 55
_______
What scares me most of all is the prospect that hundreds of protesters will be gunned down for protesting. That’s the way the ROK military has always responded to anyone who challenges ROK dictators.
Posted by: malenkov | Dec 3 2024 17:47 utc | 58
From my understanding. There's a whole bunch of nonsense going on there. From war sponsorship to the economy. But the trigger was the recent talk of investigations into the presidents wife and staff over bribery and corruption.
Posted by: Feck | Dec 3 2024 17:50 utc | 59
South Korea military announces Martial Law will stay in place after the 190-0 vote to reverse it.
Posted by: Turk 152 | Dec 3 2024 17:34 utc | 53
############
As I have said at the bar dozens of times, democracy is a delusion. The state military decides who rules and always has.
I get that people want to feel engaged and empowered.
That is NOT how the world works. That is not how power works.
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Dec 3 2024 17:51 utc | 60
Does Biden now rule Korea?
There can be no martial law in South Korea without US involvement and orders. The South Korean military is not independent. The supreme commander of the South Korean military is US general Paul LaCamera. He serves as commander of the United Nations Command in Korea and and ROK/US Combined Forces Command. All military and police in South Korea ultimately answer to him.
If Biden gives the order for the South Korean military to stand down, they must and will obey.
Posted by: Petri Krohn | Dec 3 2024 17:52 utc | 61
Paging Syngman Rhee...
I may be heading in to K-Town here in LA. I'll let you know if there are any protests. There's often something going on at Western and Wilshire.
DunGroanin, you are brilliant. In my mind you are Pete & Bas meets John Cooper Clark. Sorry to go off topic with the music links.
Posted by: lex talionis | Dec 3 2024 17:54 utc | 62
Live stream from Reuters: https://youtu.be/YBJTZvkB28U
Animated but peaceful crowds, no overt sign of military personnel.
Posted by: Jeremy Rhymings-Lang | Dec 3 2024 17:59 utc | 63
The vast majority of Western leaders are unhinged. That is a requirement to hold power in the West. Looks like concentration camps will also be making a comeback in the West. Am assuming this nutjob SK president's term is over. SK embracing it's own destruction courtesy of the US once again? Never learn.
Posted by: Thurl | Dec 3 2024 18:00 utc | 64
@ b
Agree that there are some "deranged" comments within the President's address.
I have no idea at the mo. 'Martial Law' - Weird.
Posted by: Don Firineach | Dec 3 2024 18:01 utc | 65
They're trying to prime us to revile it when Donald does it. I don't know if it's constitutional in South Korea, but it is in America.
It's a pathetic sight , to see how desperate Empire is to distract attention from first its defeat in Ukraine and now against Hezbullah in Lebanon, with a sofa shoved in the path of justice by pardoning their seedy follies in Nazi Ukraine, a cupboard kicked over in Syria and now desperately trying to barricade the door against China by inventing shit in South Korea.
What can it all possibly mean?
It means that even though the cops are bent as fuck and you don't get benter than a Trump cop, when you hear the cop sirens outside your latest criminal heist, you don't get caught red-handed with the stolen bullion.
You let the wheels of corruption make enough of a racket at the crime scene to let you get across the Mexico border in the nick of time. Happy days for Gangster Bidens projected onto the back screen.
Posted by: Giyane | Dec 3 2024 18:05 utc | 67
President Loon/Yoon is the hardline pro-American leader of South Korea who has rejected the "Sunshine policy" of de-escalating tensions on the Korean Peninsula.
So it is likely his declaration of Martial Law is being greenlighted by the United States—with a nod and a wink.
Remember kids: The negative label “Autocracy” doesn't apply to America or its vassal states.
Posted by: ak74 | Dec 3 2024 18:06 utc | 68
Videos via Twitter
They said that the soldiers entered the National Assembly with guns and that they were special forces. The special forces said that they had prepared a car since 10 PM.https://x.com/youlu_v0v/status/1863961532478235045
This woman is very brave. She tries to take the gun from the soldier and ends up being shot at, but she never gives in.
https://x.com/youlu_v0v/status/1863967680728088658
"The police are still there, and there are so many people in front of the main gate that they can't get in, so it looks like they're coming from the side. I think they're waiting for people to go home."
https://x.com/netsukei/status/1864003960488763833
The army bus made a U-turn and is heading home. It doesn't look like it's going home. It looks like it's looking for a route.
https://x.com/netsukei/status/1864004531975225614
The citizens blocked it [army bus] with their bare hands... If they hadn't, martial law wouldn't have been lifted...
https://x.com/cvbzvm/status/1863986347196965207
The members had barely gathered, and while the aides were blocking the entrance to the main conference hall on each floor and waiting for the agenda to be tabled, armed troops who had already arrived by helicopter had entered the main building and were confronting each other. Everyone knows what would have happened if there had been an accident outside...
https://x.com/cvbzvm/status/1864003587254505730
Posted by: Petri Krohn | Dec 3 2024 18:07 utc | 69
Considering the amount of logistics involved in declaring martial law, such as locking down parliament, separating Yoon loyalists so that only they are armed and ready to go when martial law is declared, this was planned ahead of time (and Yoon definitely isn't acting alone).
The fact that there is a good possibility of charges of treason for involved parties if the putsch fails, the fact that the military is willing to go with it means that this is not over by a long shot.
Posted by: Sid Victor Cattoni | Dec 3 2024 18:09 utc | 70
@ Petri Krohn | Dec 3 2024 18:07 utc | 70
---
It is better to concede that to lose bigly.
Posted by: too scents | Dec 3 2024 18:12 utc | 71
malenkov @ 59
What scares me most of all is the prospect that hundreds of protesters will be gunned down for protesting. That’s the way the ROK military has always responded to anyone who challenges ROK dictators.
Were there even any protesters on the street, in front of parliament? I need to go check TG etc but initially I just saw empty nighttime streets and military vehicles, no crowds of NED paid supporters waving rainbow flags, maybe people showed up later, are there updated images in front of parliament?
Seems like a coup where the public wasn't invited, which is worrying too, maybe insider bickering about not sending arms to Ukraine? South Korea is probably the last big arsenal of democracy still well stocked, at least for artillery. Maybe this coup was to inform those resisting sending weapons that resistance is futile, and they just got assimilated with a unanimous vote. We will know in a few days if S.Korea quietly decides to pour weapons into Ukraine.
Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Dec 3 2024 18:12 utc | 72
The budget differences are minor in absolute value, but the showdown has been going on since 2022.
I am equally sure that this situation is occurring now specifically to hinder Trump's domestic plans for once he assumes the US Presidency.
This has all the earmarks of the typical Yale/dumbfuck/US intel agency/US elite/Blinken "12D chess" road to ruin.
Posted by: c1ue | Dec 3 2024 18:13 utc | 73
that to lose bigly.
---
Stoopid keyboard.
Than to lose large.
Posted by: too scents | Dec 3 2024 18:13 utc | 74
BBC video
South Korea's parliament votes to block martial law - BBC News, 1 hour ago
Posted by: Petri Krohn | Dec 3 2024 18:17 utc | 76
specifically to hinder Trump's domestic plans
Posted by: c1ue | Dec 3 2024 18:13 utc | 74
---
What do you suppose Trump will do about the debt ceiling. He has to suspend or raise it or else his government cannot fund his programs.
Posted by: too scents | Dec 3 2024 18:17 utc | 77
The South Korean military reports to the US general that also commands the US occupying forces - the SK president is simply a US vassal and right wing extremist. The Biden administration is trying to open up as many fronts as possible against Russia. It must have been disappointed that SK was not manipulated by the "North Korea troops in Kursk region" bullshit and refused to supply weapons to Ukraine (one of the few Western nations not to have emptied its military stocks to dangerous levels).
I would not be surprised to see this escalate due to North Korean "provocations" as a prelude to some kind of open conflict with a North Korea which threatens to become much richer and less isolated with the help of Russia and China. Also, of course North Korea is now a major exporter of weapons and munitions to Russia, and a nuclear power.
Posted by: Roger Boyd | Dec 3 2024 18:20 utc | 78
It will be interesting to compare South Korea and Georgia.
EU Foreign Affairs Kaja Kallas has said "It is clear that using violence against peaceful protesters is not acceptable, and the Georgian government should respect the will of the Georgian people".
Do you think she will say the same about South Korea?
Posted by: Passerby | Dec 3 2024 18:20 utc | 79
@Posted by: Petri Krohn | Dec 3 2024 18:17 utc | 77
Constitutionally that vote overrides the president's declaration of martial law and it must end immediately, otherwise the president becomes the leader of a coup. Either way, I can't see him surviving this politically. A great outcome would be a new presidential election after impeachment, with the more progressive forces winning (the current president only won a narrow victory). Less warmongering that way. Perhaps another US establishment "bridge too far", just like in Belarus, Kazakhstan, and probably Georgia.
Posted by: Roger Boyd | Dec 3 2024 18:24 utc | 81
Well, from the live stream I’m watching it all looks remarkably calm. I’ve seen much more aggro at an Irish wake.
Posted by: Jeremy Rhymings-Lang | Dec 3 2024 18:26 utc | 82
Remember kids: The negative label “Autocracy” doesn't apply to America or its vassal states.
Posted by: ak74 | Dec 3 2024 18:06 utc | 69
#########
Autocracy is the only form of government.
We dress it up under different schemes and labels to mask the truth about power.
Without a singular vision, nothing of magnitude gets done.
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Dec 3 2024 18:29 utc | 83
ZH says it's over. So it must be, right?
We may have witnessed history!
"South Korea Ends Shortest Marial Law in History."
Posted by: lex talionis | Dec 3 2024 18:32 utc | 84
https://x.com/inside_nk/status/1864011066889417094
BREAKING | Arrest teams sent for the following South Korean politicians (Yonhap):
Lee Jae-myung - Leader of the Democratic Party of Korea
Han Dong-hoon -People Power Party leader
Woo Won-sik -Democratic Party of Korea
https://x.com/sentdefender/status/1864013080339841025
Arrest Teams have entered the Political Offices near the National Assembly in Seoul, with Warrants reportedly issued for Lee Jae-myung, the Leader of the Democratic Party of South Korea; Han Dong-hoon, the Leader of the People’s Power Party; and Woo Won-shik, the Leader of the National Assembly.
Posted by: tidal | Dec 3 2024 18:35 utc | 86
Without a singular vision, nothing of magnitude gets done.Posted by: LoveDonbass | Dec 3 2024 18:29 utc | 84
A ridiculous assertion. The Roman republic would have a word. Not an autocracy. That all systems inherently lean towards autocracy due to the venal and weak character of most humans does not make autocracy the only way power is wielded or societes can be structired effectively.
In times of war an autocracy is preferable, centralizing decision making. In times of peace, it's detrimental and destructive, because there is no guarantee or way to ensure your particular autocrat is competent.
What you assert is the kind of thing criminals excusing their own behavior tell themselves.
Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Dec 3 2024 18:36 utc | 87
too scents @ 78
What do you suppose Trump will do about the debt ceiling.
Declare bankruptcy to screw the creditors? /sarc
Actually, it's one of the few things I like about the guy.
Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Dec 3 2024 18:36 utc | 88
Remember kids: The negative label “Autocracy” doesn't apply to America or its vassal states.
Posted by: ak74 | Dec 3 2024 18:06 utc | 69
And of course the loaded word "regime" cannot be used either.
Posted by: Waldorf | Dec 3 2024 18:40 utc | 89
Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Dec 3 2024 16:38 utc | 22 The Biden administration's position is that of a lame duck presidency. It's silly to ask this question, our host is just pandering to Trumper delusions. The better questions are, what is the US military's position. Because of all the nonsense peddled about the Deep State and the PMC, people forget the generals can and do have tremendous sway over foreign policy in their commands. So we have to ask: Is the ROK military backing the martial law because their local US superiors do? What does Yoon hope for or fear from Trump? Are Yoon and the ROK generals fearful that their fictions about massive DPRK forces fighting in Russia can be exposed? (Seems unlikely, but maybe?) What is Trump's reaction? For Yoon, that's what matters most.
Given the domestic turbulence and the lack of buildup in the US forces, an invasion by ROK is at the moment unlikely. My assessment is that the DPRK has strongly recently disavowed reunification precisely because at this juncture it could only be violent. I recall the DPRK has blocked routes into the south, blowing up railroads/bridges? That would mean blocking any invasion routes for the DPRK south. I conclude there is no significant threat from the DPRK.
Posted by: steven t johnson | Dec 3 2024 18:41 utc | 90
Ignore me, off topic sorry.
I have no idea what to make of this event in Korea. It does seem unlikely in the extreme this world be happening without Maerican approval. It's incredibly unwise and it's unclear what the motivation would be as others have stated, but I don't know Korean politics.
If this is really just a local mafia boss cum El presidente showing a fit over being caught, it will end soon. If it had Maerican support, which I think I can smell even thousands of KM away, the crisis will deepen as the hegemon goes full retard.
Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Dec 3 2024 18:42 utc | 91
Passerby | Dec 3 2024 18:20 utc | 80--
The "will" of the Georgian people is expressed by the parliamentary majority and its PM, not the French citizen who is no representative of Georgia but is somehow the figurehead president. Suddenly the second round of Romania's presidential election merits watching closely. And the mask over Erdogan was finally removed. So, there appears to be some linkage and some spontaneity as the Big War struggles to be hatched.
@ karlof1 | Dec 3 2024 18:48 utc | 94
At the invitation of Iran’s First Vice-President Mohammad Reza Aref, Member of the Political Bureau of the CPC Central Committee and Vice Premier of the State Council Zhang Guoqing will visit Iran from December 3 to 4.https://www.fmprc.gov.cn/eng/xw/wsrc/202412/t20241202_11536388.html
Posted by: too scents | Dec 3 2024 18:53 utc | 94
What you assert is the kind of thing criminals excusing their own behavior tell themselves.
Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Dec 3 2024 18:36 utc | 88
#########
Friend, I usually enjoy your comments. This pearl-clutching is unbecoming as I usually view you as an honest and realistic commentator.
There is a reason why every so-called democracy has an executive. And in the West, those executives are controlled by the bureaucracies around them. There is no equivalent to Putin, Xi, the Ayatollah, or Chairman Kim.
You're making my argument with the Roman angle. Military power is necessary for political power. Julius Caesar was a military autocrat.
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Dec 3 2024 18:54 utc | 95
Don't forget the history of authoritarian Occupied Korea where the dictator's corrupt daughter was ousted, the DP came in and then the "right wing" was back. He claimed they are "North Koreans" too. Another excuse for spending more and getting its way from the yankee puppet war mongers and their MIC (https://warontherocks.com/2024/08/south-koreas-growing-role-as-a-major-arms-exporter-future-prospects-in-latin-america/ / https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Aerospace-Defense-Industries/South-Korea-and-Japan-arms-industries-grow-nearly-as-fast-as-Russia-s) for fiscal profligacy. Much like back home with ZOG.
It is not unlike Taipei where POT is the same and the legislature is not controlled by his war mongers who would rather keep relations with the mainland for economic reasons.
As the infamous war monger and destroyer of relations with Russia, clinton said: "It's is the economy, stupid."
ps-interesting you bring up biden. As we have seen in the last week, the dems clearly want to disrupt the transition to not accept the result in an opaque way and throw a tantrum as to make trump's first 100 days a nightmare. 1. Russia strikes, 2. Syria and 3. Korea (trump met Kim twice)
pps- Dunno how that is gonna work now since Kim is happily ensconced with a more reliable partner in Russia now.
Posted by: Sal | Dec 3 2024 18:59 utc | 96
I don’t know what to make of all this; there’s some sporadic chanting and whistles being blown, but the parliament building does not look like it is under siege or attack. The doors are open, the lights are on, people coming and going with no sense of urgency or stress. There’s a couple of civilian security bods by the open doors but they just seem to be checking passes and nodding.
Posted by: Jeremy Rhymings-Lang | Dec 3 2024 19:01 utc | 97
As we watch MOA topics of war it goes from one to ???? Ukraine. Israel> Gaza> West bank. Lebanon. Syria. Korea. Georgia. Iran.
Over half a dozen
Posted by: Fred | Dec 3 2024 19:04 utc | 98
SOUTH KOREAN PRESIDENTS DONT GO VOLUNTARILY!https://t.me/Slavyangrad/114630South Korea presidential history:
1. Syngman Rhee (1948–1960) – Overthrown
2. Yun Bo-seon (1960–1962) – Overthrown
3. Park Chung-hee (1962–1979) – Assassinated
4. Choi Kyu-hah (1979–1980) – Removed by a military coup
5. Chun Doo-hwan (1981–1988) – Sentenced to death after his presidency
6. Roh Tae-woo (1988–1993) – Sentenced to 22 years in prison after his presidency
7. Kim Young-sam (1993–1998) – Imprisoned during the term of President No. 3. As president, secured convictions against two of his predecessors
8. Kim Dae-jung (1998–2003) – Imprisoned under President No. 3 and sentenced to death under President No. 5 (later pardoned). Nobel Peace Prize laureate.
9. Roh Moo-hyun (2003–2008) – Impeached (later overturned by the Constitutional Court). Investigated for corruption after his term and committed suicide.
10. Lee Myung-bak (2008–2013) – Arrested for corruption after his presidency; sentenced to 15 years in prison.
11. Park Geun-hye (2013–2016) – Impeached and arrested for corruption; sentenced to 24 years in prison.
12. Moon Jae-in – Recent president; no imprisonment.
13. Yoon Suk Yeol – Impeachment and imprisonment likely now
Posted by: Norwegian | Dec 3 2024 19:06 utc | 99
The comments to this entry are closed.
The US probably found some reason to foment disturbance. It's just what we do.
Posted by: comrade simba | Dec 3 2024 15:44 utc | 1