Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
November 6, 2024
Election 2024 – Random Thoughts

Some random thoughts on Trump's reelection.

Trump's win in 2024 does not prove that the 2020 election was stolen by Democrats but it raises a new stink about the issue.


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When Biden was pushed out of the race there were calls among Democrats not to rush a choice, but to hold full-fledged primaries. Barack Obama had called for it. But Nancy Pelosi and the Clinton clan kept pushing for Harris. As a vacuous and unlikable person – carrying all the baggage of the Biden administration – she was the most likely to lose.

This is, hopefully, the end of wokeism and DEI nonsense. And of 'trans' children and teens.



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To send Bill Clinton to Michigan to justify the mass killing of Palestinians was not a good idea. The 2024 result in Dearborn, Michigan, a 90% Muslim area that Biden had won with 88% of the vote:

  • Trump: 46.8%
  • Harris: 27.68%
  • Stein: 22.11%

The Democrats will blame various groups – Muslim, progressives, youths – who's opinions and desires they had ignored, for their loss. And of course Russia.

Trump won the working class:

Jeff Stein @JStein_WaPo – 14:27 UTC · Nov 6, 2024

Staggering class realignment/shift in working class
Harris lost DESPITE major shift of affluent voters her way

2020: Trump wins voters over $100K, 54-52
2024: *Harris* wins voters over $100K, 54-45

2020: Biden wins voters $50K-$100K, 57-42
2024: *Trump* w/ voters $50K-$100K, 49-47

2020: Biden wins voters under $50K, 55-45
2024: Trump massive improvement w/ voters under $50K, 49-48

Harris had more billionaires on her side:

The Billionaire-ification of the U.S. Election

For the 2024 election, a staggering $15.9 billion has been spent on ads and campaigning by both Democrats and Republicans, making it the most expensive election in history; in just one week, nearly $1 billion has been poured into political ads.

Eighteen percent of all political ad funding has come straight from the pockets of a tiny handful of America’s mega-rich. In fact, according to USA Today, Harris has 83 billionaires supporting her—making up 6% of her campaign funds, according to Al Jazeera—while 52 are backing Trump, but they’re extremely generous donors, making up 34% of his campaign fund.

In other words: the country’s wealthiest are bankrolling the election, wielding political power and influence like never before. Not only is this bad news for democracy, it’s catastrophic for the planet.

Trump is unlikely to have a full term. J.D. Vance will become president. He is the future of the Republican party.

Comments

But, you are right. Trump can only be elected to the office of President twice – unless the 22nd Amendment is repealed like the 18th was – so this term is his last and he can only serve until 2028.
Posted by: kukulkan | Nov 7 2024 3:41 utc | 194
—————————————————————-
Thank God!

Posted by: Ed | Nov 7 2024 3:54 utc | 201

Trump hates the CIA and FBI, expect these agencies to look very differently in the next six months….they set up two assassination attempts and two impeachments…..payback will be a bitch………..

Posted by: Tobias Cole | Nov 7 2024 3:55 utc | 202

Sorry, that should be:
… steps down on 21st January 2027.
I keep getting thrown by the fact that the US has this weird three-month gap between the election and the inauguration. Makes all the fuss about knowing the outcome of the election as soon as possible rather odd, since the counting could take a week or a month and it wouldn’t make any difference.

Posted by: kukulkan | Nov 7 2024 3:56 utc | 203

Posted by: Ed | Nov 7 2024 3:18 utc | 190
========
Excellent summary and reminder of how destructive the Clintons were, and the ongoing dilemma for working-class Americans.
I think Citizens United was another nail in the coffin of “regular” citizens’ ability to affect the two-party agenda.
Then add in the Israel Lobby and its financial and grip on the American government and media and even the Deep State of the CIA and other security agencies via Mossad entanglement.

Posted by: Jane | Nov 7 2024 4:04 utc | 204

Kulkan 194:
“no person who has held the office of President, or acted as President, for more than two years of a term to which some other person was elected President shall be elected to the office of the President more than once.”
======
To me that reads that if Vance takes over as president and serves more than two years of Trump’s term he, Vance, can only run once. The first 2+ years count as the first term.

Posted by: jANE | Nov 7 2024 4:08 utc | 205

Posted by: james | Nov 7 2024 0:30 utc | 147
Thanks james. Stormy weather for my speeded up food trek today – cottonwoods in full color poor things, freeze will take most of them out, plus early snow conditions. It happens. I drank in their beauty as much as I could today. So, I will go to the link tomorrow. Body needs rest.

Posted by: juliania | Nov 7 2024 4:11 utc | 206

@ juliania | Nov 7 2024 4:11 utc | 202
my friend in northern colorado was saying they had some snow on the ground the past 24 hours.. not a lot.. the cottonwood colours sound pretty… the fall colours are very nice here right now too..

Posted by: james | Nov 7 2024 4:18 utc | 207

jANE | Nov 7 2024 4:08 utc | 201
LBJ was eligible to run in ’68 after taking over in ’63 after the Kennedy hit and winning the ’64 election against Goldwater (running as the peace candidate!). But Vietnam did him in politically and he decided to hand over to his vice, who lost to Nixon (running as the peace candidate!). Peace is always (yet never) on the ballot in the US! Will Trump make it through another term without starting a major war?

Posted by: pauledwrds@gmail.com | Nov 7 2024 4:32 utc | 208

I doubt Trump is a Jew.
And as for the 2020 election being fraudulent, of course it was. And this time it was so massive and in your face, you have to be blind not to notice.
It is amazing that the public can be so trusting as not to doubt. It is called cognitive dissonance.
And here we are. Without it, 911 and the man on the moon idea, would never have gotten any traction.

Posted by: g wiltek | Nov 7 2024 5:31 utc | 209

Goldman Sachs cuts UK growth forecast following Trump’s election victory
Goldman Sachs has cut its growth forecasts for the UK and the eurozone following Donald Trump’s election as President of the United States.
The investment bank warned that Trump’s proposed tariffs would have a noticeable impact on economic growth in European economies next year.

“Renewed trade tensions are likely to weigh materially on growth,” analysts at Goldman Sachs said.
The investment bank now expects the UK economy to grow by 1.4 per cent next year, down from a previous forecast of 1.6 per cent. It expects growth to remain at 1.4 per cent in 2026.
Goldman also reduced its forecasts for the eurozone, anticipating that the bloc will grow 0.8 per cent this year, a downgrade from its earlier forecast of 1.1 per cent.
full story ==> https://www.cityam.com/goldman-sachs-cuts-uk-growth-forecast-following-trumps-election-victory/

Posted by: too scents | Nov 7 2024 5:38 utc | 210

MOATS, Ep 393, with George Galloway
https://x.com/MoatsTV/status/1854236140846690464
Election Special with Max Blumenthal and Gerald Celente.

Posted by: John Gilberts | Nov 7 2024 5:52 utc | 211

b, can we please get normal topics tomorrow?
Yankee Capitalist politics has little intellectual appeal.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Nov 7 2024 5:58 utc | 212

jANE | Nov 7 2024 4:08 utc | 201

To me that reads that if Vance takes over as president and serves more than two years of Trump’s term he, Vance, can only run once. The first 2+ years count as the first term.

Yes, that’s right.
Which is why in my hypothetical I said if Trump steps down on 21st January 2026, so Vance serves the remaining one year and 364 days, one day less than two years. That would make him eligible to run two more times and, if he wins both times, he could be President for 9 years and 365 days (allowing for the two extra days in the leap years) – which most people would just round up to 10 years.
Seriously, it’s just basic arithmetic.

Posted by: kukulkan | Nov 7 2024 6:09 utc | 213

An analysis by the French think tank Centre d’études prospectives et d’informations internationales makes the following projection on the impact of Trump’s proposed economic policies

For other countries, the effect is negative, but moderate. France saw its exports fall by 0.5% and its GDP by 0.1%. For Germany, the impact on GDP is identical, and slightly greater for exports (-0.6%).

So, while Donald Trump claims to want to protect American workers, this trade war would have the effect of lowering American wages (by 0.9% for unskilled workers, by 1.6% for skilled workers) and raising Mexican wages (by around 5%).

Le prix du protectionnisme de Donald Trump ==> https://www.cepii.fr/PDF_PUB/lettre/2024/let450.pdf
The paper argues that the primary protectionism beneficiaries will be Mexico and Canada.
Boomerang.

Posted by: too scents | Nov 7 2024 6:16 utc | 214

Lil yt short about how Trump ensured the safety of scared frightened students, traumatised by antisemitism.
>…~ “She spoke DIRECTLY to President Trump about the safety of Jewish students “
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/-0qOP8lRs6c
“… Trumps Executive Order expanded the definition of Judaism from a religion that is faith-based, to an ethno-religion, thereby affording all protections, including Title 6 of the Civil Rights Act.”
>… When a syndicate owns both horses in a two horse race, it’s a win win win, amirite?

Posted by: Melaleuca | Nov 7 2024 6:37 utc | 215

https://x.com/pagan_online/status/1854283835569209847
molly 🇵🇸 @pagan_online
I’m sorry I just don’t think I have the patience to deal with liberals acting like the events of the election are a bigger tragedy than every single day since October 7th 2023
I hate Trump, I’m aware of how much damage he and his republican majority can do, but I don’t want to hear about how brave you are for going to work today when there are people whose entire lineages have been wiped out who have had to go on for a year. Some perspective please!!!!
People have been waiting to hear whether or not their family and friends will be pulled out from under the rubble of their home for a year now. We watched people burn alive in hospital beds!! A bureaucratic loss is not on par with that. Not even close!!!

Posted by: michaelj72 | Nov 7 2024 6:49 utc | 216

The USA is full of bs same as the rest of it’s you know who empire. Who cares what they do. No longer believe

Posted by: Sadness | Nov 7 2024 7:01 utc | 217

Jonathan Pie
@JonathanPieNews
Trump wins the White House. Again.
The Democrats blew it. Again.
A depressing yet predictable result.
https://x.com/JonathanPieNews/status/1854194551625282017

Posted by: Menz | Nov 7 2024 7:28 utc | 218

Mehdi Hasan
@mehdirhasan
Last week, Trump was posturing as an antiwar dove with Muslim voters in Dearborn, Michigan.
Today it’s revealed that one of DC’s veteran Iran hawks, Brian Hook, will be leading the transition team for Trump’s State Department.
Quote
Kylie Atwood
@kylieatwood
·
10h
Brian Hook, a top State Department official during the first Trump admin, is expected to lead the transition team at the State Dept for President-elect Donald Trump, sources tell me + @jmhansler.
https://x.com/mehdirhasan/status/1854329483312181345

Posted by: Menz | Nov 7 2024 7:29 utc | 219

@ Sun of Alabama
“Just tax them all at 90%”.
If you taxed them at 99.99% they would still be multimillionaires.

Posted by: Tim | Nov 7 2024 7:31 utc | 220

Repost from up thread:

… I’ve posited many times that Trump was allowed his victory (without interference) to engineer and manage a controlled collapse.
Billionaires didn’t acquire/steal their wealth without at least a basic understanding of fractional reserve lending. It must always expand otherwise it will collapse. No Russian resources stolen to feed the machine, no more dollar.
It’s really just that simple and nothing really to cry about. The players are all big boys and know the stakes; after all, it’s not personal, just business….
…But for that to occur, a negotiated and managed series of devaluations, structured defaults and rebalancing of national economies will need to be performed with the cooperation (and approval) of the ROW.
Posted by: markw

Comment: The maths of Federal Finances is inescapable.

Posted by: Exile | Nov 7 2024 8:03 utc | 221

@ Jams O’Donnell | Nov 6 2024 19:47 utc | 5
You ask why thew US would want to remove Batista.
My answer may use what you cited from Wikipedia and add something they fail to bring up. Namely that the US had a Nickel cartel and didnt want more Cuban Nickel on the market since they had too much stored and wanted the Cuban Nickel to stay in the Ground until later needed by the Cartel. When Castro was the leader he let them have it.
So you see there is more to this. However both Batista and Somosa wanted to develop the economy. To have an educted middle class and to follow the american example as it is sometimes taught by americans although its rare today.
That example was admired by a long range of nations and it puts the emphasis on national development infrastructure etc.
Paraguay France Germany Russia and China and Japan all attempted to copy the method during different eras.
But all those efforts were twarted by Britain and later also by the US. Today BRICS is having a hopefully successful strategy along those lines.
Thus both Cuba and Nicaragua were aiming to do what the US had (earlier) done not what the US was telling them to do. Somosa had difficulties in understanding why the US was battling him.
He admired the american model and didnt understand that his role was to do what they say not what they do.
His low status in the eyes of the colonial masters was not to attempt towards national development.
The imperial strategy is clever and also very old. They create a controlled opposition and support it like they did with the Sandinistas and earlier with Castro’s fighters who never won any battle, but benefitted from being allowed by the US to receive their weapons deliveries while Batistas already paid weapons were withheld.
The last ambassador Earl E T Smith, who did not fall from grace after having revealed how the State department the NYT and the CIA had supported the rebels in Smiths contributions in the senate hearings of 1961, the year after added in his book the 4th Floor (meaning one floor beneath Ike and J F Dulles) that the CIA directly handed over weapons to the rebels.
I think Che Guevara may have been in good faith thinking that the whole world gets the idea about what a great thing socialism is so the old world is fallig apart and there are good people within the ruling class or something.
When things seem to run smoothly or at least are workable you may fool yourself like that not to be suspicious.
But like I speculated there could have been more serious aspects also connected with missile technology.
I recommend not to trust any socialist analysis about these matters. Always seek sources that widen the perspective.
Never be afraid of learning new things and put ideology aside while learning.

Posted by: petergrfstrm | Nov 7 2024 8:11 utc | 222

Posted by: Melaleuca | Nov 7 2024 1:05 utc | 158 and Posted by: Melaleuca | Nov 7 2024 6:37 utc | 215
On the 2020 shenanigans.
So far no mention of that MIA CIA head at the end of that last Trump presidency in the comments – (Va) Gina Haspell – yes a complete utter nasty twat, if there ever was one for her role in torture and terror in the WoT, running black sites across the world – hell even McCain got shivers from her! Which is quite something if true.
Anyway if we recall , Trump put her at cia when he elevated up-Pompeo to State , or was given no choice to. That’s a fly on DJT.
Did she then deliver the big fix on him with the computer fraud from Europe on election night ? Did she really fly there on polling day? Was there some interservice shootout?
‘ In December 2020, she became the subject of a death hoax. According to social media claims, Haspel was either killed, injured, or arrested in a CIA raid on a server farm in Frankfurt. Several fact-checking projects debunked these claims, and were unable to find any evidence that Haspel had died or that a raid had taken place.[77][78][79] The CIA announced her retirement after 36 years of service, via a tweet, on January 19, 2021, one day prior to the presidential transition from Trump to Joe Biden.[80][81]’ says wiki.
But she mysteriously wasn’t seen after and was replaced immediately as Biden was inaugurated. It seems a rather sharp exit didn’t it? Any opinions?
Meanwhile, another fly lands on Donald already, as the ziofascists directly conflate their agenda of Ukraine and the illegal apartheid entity. I have been saying they are connected now as they were back at the Nazis defeat in WW2.
So is DJT a practicing Judaeo Zionist and has kept it quiet-ish all along ?
https://nitter.poast.org/mossrobeson__/status/1854308131020443794#m
‘Moss Robeson 🇵🇸
@mossrobeson__
8h
🇺🇸🇮🇱🇺🇦Ukraine’s Trump-loving “Chief Rabbi” (there are two) wrote a letter to the president-elect (h/t @lingerence). Maybe he’ll attend the inauguration with the below Azov veteran “Wikipedia” that he blessed in 2023? “Wikipedia” goes by “WP,” which also refers to “White Power.”
Moss Robeson 🇵🇸
@mossrobeson__
10h
Azov Brigade veteran: “Official headgear for the next trip to Washington.” I wonder if some 🇺🇸 liberals will discover they don’t like 🇺🇦 neo-Nazis after all?
Nov 6, 2024 · 11:41 PM UTC ‘
So if ‘Gauntlet’ Pompus arse is back in the frame as someone has stated above (and other turds that DJT should keep at several arms lengths) and the crazed eschatological ziofascist rabbis and their bandera natzo Ukrops are already circling, well before inauguration… my earlier question suddenly takes on urgency – is Trump really a Fascist as some have been calling him forever?
Will he allow himself to be defined by the two wars of ziofascists proxies against the Christian Russians and Mostly Muslim Semites and the crazed deepstate hoodlums and c***’s or will he grab them by their proverbials this time as he infamously allowed some Hollywood celeb reporter to get him on record back in 2016?
I guess we have to wait until we see what he actually does or will he kowtow to his backers demands like a grabbed pussy?
It’s been a great thread so far – having just caught up predawn , look forward to more great comments.

Posted by: DunGroanin | Nov 7 2024 8:16 utc | 223

Take a break from a mad, baad, bAAD, BAAD World and fly
Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart: Clarinet Concerto in A major, K.622
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YT_63UntRJE [30 mins

Posted by: Don Firineach | Nov 7 2024 8:55 utc | 224

b, can we please get normal topics tomorrow?
Yankee Capitalist politics has little intellectual appeal.
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Nov 7 2024 5:58 utc | 212
Oh you precious selfish little prick.
1, you think YOU should suggest/select Bernard’s agenda?
2, Wtf is “normal”? What is intellectual appeal?
3, A country of 300 million have just landslided a total change of political leadership and want/need to talk about it, praise and/or vent.
4, You can always go read or post in the other threads.
5, What a control freak you must be around the house.

Posted by: ScoobyDoo | Nov 7 2024 8:57 utc | 225

Posted by: markw | Nov 6 2024 18:26 utc | 15
Interesting comment markw.
So Dems and their apparatchiks were weakened and couldn’t impose their will, by the various mechanisms of ballot inflation introduced in 2020, due to the successful stopping of NATO expansion by Putin and co.
It’s similar to my view that Dems lacked the will to power this time so they didn’t implement their ballot inflation system. I didn’t think it was because of losing to Putin in the Ukraines but it is a fairly reasonable hypothesis.

Posted by: Johan Kaspar | Nov 7 2024 9:02 utc | 226

Posted by: kupkee | Nov 6 2024 21:16 utc | 86

Jeez, the Deep Cesspool is getting trolls with the intellect of Adam’s Apple Kamala.

With the loss of power in the USA of a certain group, my guess is our best trolls are now looking for jobs fippling burgers or delivering parcels.

Posted by: Johan Kaspar | Nov 7 2024 9:13 utc | 227

thomas massies as agriculture secretary.
Posted by: Jerr | Nov 6 2024 22:23 utc | 121
interesting rumor, but worrying. Massie is probably the best peace congressman. he recently pushed for a bill to prohibit dual citizens from congress and senate, does not take AIPAC money, opposes funding ukraine and Israel, I could go on…
with tight house, he could easily join dem resistance to Trump war.

Posted by: UWDude | Nov 7 2024 9:22 utc | 228

Posted by: Melaleuca | Nov 7 2024 0:02 utc | 144
20+ years ago i used to watch cable news. my roommate said one day, “all they do is yell at each other”.
yeah, i stopped inviting those aggro vibes into my mind. Didn’t need them, dont miss them, cant stand to hear them now.

Posted by: UWDude | Nov 7 2024 9:37 utc | 229

DunGroanin | Nov 7 2024 8:16 utc | 223
…CIA head Gina Haspell. “Did she fly to Germany to personally oversee the electronic redirect of the voting machines.?
A:There was enough chatter and some intriguing pics and posts briefly online that gave such mumblings some credence. Shootout? Again. Something seems to have happened. Strange pics were in circulation (briefly). Possession of discs, thumbdrives and hard drives seem to have been hotly contested within the Agencies.
Remember, Murdoch [Fox] had to payout Big Bucks for the coverage of the Dominion machine voting discrepancies. Rupert is powerful, and takes pleasure in wielding his power, but he knows even someone as powerful and embedded as Robert Maxwell can be disappeared if he becomes inconvenient. He caved. (O/T, is Jizzlaine still in jail?)
Tucker says he was “let go” at Fox for his Ukraine coverage. But those who know, know it was him poking the Dominion anthill. He’s been smart enough to leave it alone, meaning he’s been allowed to i) live ii) build a multi million private alt-media enterprise.
Him being loud in opposition to U$ money to Ukraine annoys NAFO and the Kagan-Nuland contingent, but there’s a sizeable cohort within the military/Pentagon and Congress that agree money to Ukraine is wasted. His outrage is safe and mostly harmless. Tricky Questions about Dominion…. could shorten his life expectancy dramatically.
~~~~
And to reiterate on the absurdity of those bleating “There’s no *proof*….. If they cheated there’d be be *proof*, baaargh, baaargh.”
Here’s a tweet from Jeremy Harrell:

Remember when the Governor of Georgia relented and allowed forensic examination of the Dominion voting machines in his state; but then his car exploded on the highway, killing his daughter’s boyfriend and then he immediately changed his mind, and then the investigating officer committed suicide about 4 days later? I’m sure you remember.

It’s only with Elon owning X that allows tweets like these to be posted.

Posted by: Melaleuca | Nov 7 2024 9:50 utc | 230

https://www.dropsitenews.com/p/trump-iran-hawk-hook-pompeo-israel-netanyahu-russia?utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web
“Brian Hook, a hawkish fixture of the first Donald Trump administration who formerly served under George W. Bush, is reportedly getting the call to start staffing the State Department for a new Trump term…
Hook served as U.S. Special Representative for Iran and advisor to Secretary of State Mike Pompeo during the last two years of Trump’s presidency, which saw the killing of Iranian general Qassem Soleimani and expansion of crushing sanctions intended to spur regime change in Iran”
RFK, Tulsi are the mildest exponents of an already Zionist filled Trump transition team. Even in a best case scenario, i doubt Trump will lead with dovish figures to head the State Dept, they may get assigned number 2 and 3 positions with specific portfolios, perhaps RFK to EU and Tulsi to ME affairs for example under and proper hawk as Sec of State, because Trump likes to project an image of ‘strength’ first and thinks about policy second. His arrogance also underestimates his subordinates’ ability to undermine him.
IMHO, Trump is most likely to dump Ukraine and try to subjugate and coerce Europeans by further sinking their economies with defense spending blackmail and heavy tariffs on their exports. Long term, this could eventually lead to UVDL and other overcommitted Atlanticist types being marginalized as reality common sense prevails and efforts are made to restore Russia and China trade in order to survive, but the road looks very rough. The US has most of the leverage and Europe has few leaders with any balls or brains to navigate this self inflicted quagmire.
Trump allies like Orban will happily carve out deals for themselves and let the rest of the continent pay for all the pressure they have put on him. Russia will happily take any peace offerings Trump offers, but will make sure they only come at the expense of Europeans and won’t undermine its strategic partnerships with China and BRICS, no matter how hard the US will try to delude itself.
On the Middle East front, this could spell very bad news for Iran, unless they somehow manage to reinstate deterrence in the next 2 months by hitting Israel so hard that Trump will be forced to take in the military realities in his plans. The US will only ever respond to force and strength, so buckle up. Appeasement will only lead to further abuse, just look at how Europeans ‘friends’ have been treated, now try and imagine what awaits those evil brown people..
In Asia, China is still sitting relatively pretty, as militarily the US will struggle to unwind the other 2 theaters and has limited long term attrition capabilities. Economically/diplomatically, China has many more cards to play, provided it can continue to handle tariffs, threats and provocations in a calculated manner, as it has so far.
I don’t share the same optimism on the speculation the a Trump 2.0 will yield a wiser and less hawkish cabinet and policy approach. We will find out soon enough as soon as more names are added to Brian Hook’s…

Posted by: Rubiconned | Nov 7 2024 10:02 utc | 231

@Ed #194
Given your quite obvious TDS – should I even bother comparing Biden’s 4 years with Trump’s and their respective effects on the working class?
Even beyond that – it is apparent you don’t actually know anything about Trump.
For example: he never talks about the things he does for those around him.
These range from the $100 bills he gives to store clerks of stores he patronizes (yes, like McDonald’s) just because he can, to the mortgage he paid off for a couple that stopped to help his limo driver when said limo got a flat tire, to the Miss Wisconsin that he wrote a letter to – unrequested, years later – when he heard that she had developed a terrible disease.
The latter, he recognized her in a rally this year, called on her and had a moment right in the middle of a rally.
I found out about this via a channel devoted to “aww shucks” stories about good deeds by all sorts of people ranging from bikers to celebrities: Trump recognizes woman in Wisconsin rally
Trump is not the messiah nor is he the Great Satan, but he is unquestionably the best hope of this nation to get away from the National Security State, the Professional/Managerial Class wannabe aristocrats, the incompetent ticket punching bureaucrats, the destruction of the American middle class by all of the former groups and the endless wars.
If a man is to be known from his enemies, Trump has all the right ones.

Posted by: c1ue | Nov 7 2024 10:03 utc | 232

Posted by: Don Firineach | Nov 7 2024 8:55 utc | 224
Thanks Don. I’ve posted that one a couple times here. It’s one of my all-time favorites.
I downloaded it with clip-grab to avoid ad interruptions and prolly listen to it a few
times a month late in the evening. Arngunnur is sublime on the clarinet.

Posted by: waynorinorway | Nov 7 2024 10:04 utc | 233

dem resistance to Trump war.
Posted by: UWDude | Nov 7 2024 9:22 utc | 22
There’s a disconnect there. The dems are the war party now along with the rest. May peace abound.
Also yes to Massie as Sec Ag. Also Joel Salatin as an advisor.

Posted by: osi not ossi | Nov 7 2024 10:06 utc | 234

Posted by: Melaleuca | Nov 7 2024 9:50 utc | 230
I member. So much crazy stuff happened in those weeks. And they had already used Covid to prove any social media platform would ban you immediately for questioning it, and any person would be cancelled and deplatformed immediately, even if the invented the mRNA vaccine process like Dr. Robert Malone, no matter of expertise could save you.
Then they transferred that same level of swift retribution to anyone questioning the election.
I’ll never forget the feelings of that year, nor will I ever forgive, and I still refuse to ever smile at strangers. The chances are too high I am smiling at one of … …them.

Posted by: UWDude | Nov 7 2024 10:07 utc | 235

I have spent all day reading the reactions on various forums and old haunts.
The Dearborn Michigan voting results of Muslims has really let the left show their true racism. Same with 55% of Hispanic men voting Trump. The left is really bad I can’t believe how many times I read the phrase “betrayed the party”.
Some Muslims did defend the Dearborn voters.
Of course, it was amazing to see thousands of comments calling Muslims idiots, sexists, homophobes, hope they die, etc etc, and lots of claims to have gone from supporting the Palestinians to hoping Israel wipes them out, or can’t wait to see their faces when gaza is turned to rubble.
I think they made the right choice, if DNC is to ever actually respect their vote.
It’s a really shitty position to be in, but join the club. I for one, have never had an anti-war presidential candidate to vote for in my lifetime, one of many reasons I do not vote.

Posted by: UWDude | Nov 7 2024 10:18 utc | 236

@Exile #221
Sorry bro, but what you said is nonsense.
The finances of a sovereign government are fundamentally different than any private individual or institution.
The ability to print money, particularly in a Great Power with many vassal nations, is enormous.
The issue is not the ability to “repay” the debt – the issue is the use of the printing that was done. When printing is not used to create positive economic conditions i.e. infrastructure, cost of living improvements, then this flood of extra money causes a host of problems including inflation and inequality.
Only if said vassals and the entire rest of the world literally repudiate the dollar, is the debt going to be an intractable problem as you seem to believe.
Well, the BRICS is working on it but it will be years before that has a measurable impact. Not decades but still years.
Equally, does anyone think Japan, the EU, Canada, Australia, New Zealand and the UK are going to go anywhere except suck on American teat, for the rest of our natural lifetimes? I don’t.
As i posted in the other thread: Russia is experiencing 4%+ growth now even with 20% interest rates. You can walk into almost any bank and make an equivalent to a CD deposit of 6 months to 2 years and get this 20%.
This 20% rate is there because Russia is growing too fast – the massive capital spending underlying this boom is causing concern with the Russian Central Bank.
And Russia is not blowing this private money on nonsense like solar PV and wind – which drive up retail electricity prices. This money is being spent on reshoring production of all the things that Russia used to import from the West, but is now sanctioned from doing so.
Is there any reason why this cannot occur, at least to some extent, in the US?
Note I am not saying trade is bad or that the US needs to become fully self sufficient.
What I am saying is that the US has gone too far on the import side and needs to seriously rebalance domestic production in at least a few core areas rather than rely in imports so heavily.
Reshored production produces jobs, reduces supply chain risks, gives working and middle class people livelihoods.
So while the present $36 trillion national debt is an issue – Printing some money for reshoring, enacting tariffs intelligently, refocusing social emphasis on work and production vs woke and green nonsense – these can accomplish the twin goals of reducing imports and changing American working class and middle class socio-economic trajectories.
The resulting growth will also make the deficit less of an issue going forward.
Note that reshoring should NOT involve giving money to losers like Intel, or to solar PV companies or to pretty much everything the Biden administration was giving capital to. Chips are nowhere remotely as critical as say, glass. Did you know that the US is the largest importer of glass in the world?
Given that the US has energy and has sand – WTF don’t we make our own glass?
There are dozens, hundreds of categories with similar characteristics.
The US economy has been converted into a bankster equivalent of the Democratic Republic of Congo – only our bankster laborers are picking dollars out of thin air as opposed to raw cobalt.
A strong nation, a vibrant economy, a proud and capable middle class – these derive from making things, not extra digits in a Central Bank computer.

Posted by: c1ue | Nov 7 2024 10:27 utc | 237

Posted by: c1ue | Nov 7 2024 10:03 utc | 232
It is really hard to read all the bullshit and lies about Trump when you know the truth about him.
Many Christians, like my parents, believe in anonymous charity, (it is sinful to give for the sake of your own glory).
Anyways, there once was a megathread on reddit about, “have you ever personally met Trump, and what was he like?”
Vast majority said they hated his politics, but when they met him, he was really nice…
..about 50% were people who worked in kitchens, caddies etc, and they all said he would slip then $50 or $100, not just tip,mind you, he would often go into kitchens and give the whole kitchen $100 a piece…
…and there were HUNDREDS of these stories… ..interspersed with a couple dozen, ” he tried to grab my pussy” bullshit.
I read once that Ted Kennedy was like this, though not as big with the tips.
The black community loved him, and I remember quite a few rap hip-hop songs mentioning, my fav being a “The Coup” song, that starts with him walking in a restaurant, and a bunch of rich people whispering under their breath how much they hated him…
..Then I read all the bullshit, the mischaracterization, the fucked up troll-psychoanalysis about his narcissism, stupidity, inability to read etc, etc…
Fuck these people.

Posted by: UWDude | Nov 7 2024 10:32 utc | 238

Re: Brian Hook
What I see is an apparatchik that Trump is familiar with and presumably trusts.
Trump absolutely would need someone familiar with the State Department to have any prayer of fixing it.
Hook has worked with Dubya, yes, but anyone who has been in the State Department would have worked with some ex-President warmonger whether it is Obama, Dubya, Clinton or Biden.
What I see is someone who actually talks to adversaries. He negotiated the release of people with Iran and North Korea, for example. He was involved in the Abraham Accords.
In comparison to HRC as Secretary or State or Blinken – he would be a paragon. But he is not in the role of Secretary of State, AFAIK. He is part of the transition team – picking up the reins from the soon to depart Biden/Blinken Department of State.
All this talk about Hook looks like concern trolling to me.

Posted by: c1ue | Nov 7 2024 10:36 utc | 239

Also yes to Massie as Sec Ag.
Posted by: osi not ossi | Nov 7 2024 10:06 utc | 234
I hope not. Massie is far too anti-war to be pushed to agriculture secretary. Massie is a rock, unmovable when it comes to war, and i fear they want him out to get a hawk in his place. Sec of state or defense, ok… 😛 But agriculture seems like a way to remove a barrier to war.
And Trump has dumped on him before for refusing to endorse some Trumpy neocon shit. In fact, I think Trump even said he should be “remembered during primary season” or something to that effect, a threat to get a hawk republican in.

Posted by: UWDude | Nov 7 2024 10:40 utc | 240

@Tak-Tik | Nov 7 2024 0:54 utc | 154
You have fallen for a CIA bluff that they wanted to assassinate their precious controlled opposition starring his fifth and lifelong movie after he had earlier played a part in four Hollywood pieces.
I am not suggesting that Fidel or his allies were false in the sense of only pretending to like their ideology.
But they didnt have to pretend since they were chosen by the imperial conmen always in the creative mode for launching cults that posed no genuine threat of capitalist competition in the sense of prosperous nation building.
The one thing the worlds so called liberal hegemon opposes: A prosperous nation built in the interest of its citizens.
Further a small enemy nation close to the US was good for scaring the US population to continue funding the weapons industry.
Genuine progressive movements everywhere want their government to ameliorate civilian lifes not to fund the perpetual war that the empire desires.
The US capitalists who had their possessions confiscated didnt lose anything since they were compensated by the USG using US tax payers money.
And when you claim that it was only towards the end it is in conflict with the fact that the rebels didnt win any battle.
It was never a realistic chance to win unless the hegemon wanted it.
What happened towards the end was probably more dependent on the worked out compensatory schemes
Btw never a chance to win similar to the impossibility of the Ukraine war. In that case the bringing down of Europe was the actual aim clearly explained by RAND.
Those who believe in Castros struggle as something credible do so because they love for it to be true.
The fact that Allen Dulles withheld Castro’s communist sympathies from IKE is quite revealing.
No mistake, no bungling of anything. It was deliberate and a Knight of Malta like Dulles was close to the British so the latter may have played a role behind the scenes. That is why I mentioned the details surrounding the launch of the Sputnik I.
Possibly a bigger conspiracy lurking behind the events on the surface.

Posted by: petergrfstrm | Nov 7 2024 10:40 utc | 241

@UWDude #236
The Dearborn votes were insignificant in Michigan.
What was significant was:
1) Trump got 25% of the vote from black men according to Rich Baris (21% to 24% from other sources)
2) Trump got 45% of the Hispanic vote
3) Trump got 40% of the Asian vote
The impact of this was to fatally dilute the normally Soviet-like voting solidarity of True Blue urban strongholds and their rich suburbs.
Baris has said that Trump looks to have gotten around 50% of the Hispanic vote, nationwide but I have not seen the data yet.
The reason he crushed this election is because he got more votes from more people in literally every single category except “rich liberal” vs 2020, and 2016 as well.
Yes, this includes women, college educated, working class, etc etc.

Posted by: c1ue | Nov 7 2024 10:43 utc | 242

Posted by: markw | Nov 6 2024 22:40 utc | 126

In other words, if Russia could come back in only 30 years after the fall of the disastrous USSR, what potential does the USA given all its inherent advantages to get right back up on center stage in only 20?

I’ve saying the same for many years, including in this forum. BUT there is a problem: given the widespread possesion of firearms and the more independent mind of Americans, it might well be that the American Union collapse will be much more violent than the Soviet Union collapse, and that this will have severe consequences for the extension of recovery, making our extrapolations from Russia’s record between the 90s and today futile.

But it will require a clean slate; a sweep of all MIC money pits: carriers, planes and bases. It will require a top-to-bottom re-ordering of traditional institutions, which by following Milite’s quick list will accomplish just that.
If Trump doesn’t pursue this kind of radical agenda, then what would have been the point of allowing him to be elected? If the same old were to be continued, why not install the real deal (Biden/Harri) instead of a cheap knock off?

The point of allowing his selection for POTUS was just to stop the incompetent and crazies from further deteriorating USA’s standing, not to pursue a radical agenda. No clean state, no sweeping off current structures, just a controlled demolition of a certain parts of the structures.

Posted by: Johan Kaspar | Nov 7 2024 10:46 utc | 243

Fuck these people.
Posted by: UWDude | Nov 7 2024 10:32 utc | 238
and the media and big tech censored all the footage of Joe Biden nuzzling his nose in little girls hair, stroking it and whispering in their ears, cupping their 8 year old breasts and grabbing their asses… ..but Trump is the rapist.
Again, fuck these people.

Posted by: UWDude | Nov 7 2024 10:50 utc | 244

Posted by: c1ue | Nov 7 2024 10:43 utc | 242
I know they were insignificant, but it was still the best move they could make.

Posted by: UWDude | Nov 7 2024 10:53 utc | 245

@UWDude #238
Here is the Reddit thread

Posted by: c1ue | Nov 7 2024 10:53 utc | 246

Those who believe in Castros struggle as something credible do so because they love for it to be true.
Posted by: petergrfstrm | Nov 7 2024 10:40 utc | 241
present your theory and evidence.
Dont suggest you know the motives or thoughts of those who may doubt your theory, because you don’t. That’s just trolling and blustering.

Posted by: UWDude | Nov 7 2024 10:59 utc | 247

Posted by: c1ue | Nov 7 2024 10:53 utc | 246
I was sure Reddit would have memory holed it by now.
I didn’t want to exaggerate and say thousands, so I said hundreds, but 11,000+ comments…

Posted by: UWDude | Nov 7 2024 11:03 utc | 248

@UWDude #245
My point is not that the Dearborn voters made a mistake.
My point is that both the neocons and the Democrats are likely to focus blame on these voters when the real problems Harris had was in the erosion of the supposed core Democrat base.
Fortunately, the incompetence of our modern day elites is such that they will almost certainly convince themselves of the “Arab American conspiracy” or some other nonsense, as opposed to recognize that they ran a fundamentally flawed candidate.
I have stated many times, over the past weeks, that choosing Kamala was making a fatal assumption that everyone who voted for Biden, would vote for Harris.
That is now proven.
Nor is it just the votes – the bad choice also led to lower turnout in core Democrat demographics. I have not seen the data yet but I fully expect that Barnes’ and Baris’ prediction on low turnout for 18-24 in general, Hispanic women, Black women, etc etc will be at least fairly accurate. This is almost certainly why Trump crushed the popular vote – I note that nobody in MoA has commented that Trump won the popular vote by 72,978,296 vs. Harris at 68,340,558.
This is a 51% vs. 49% victory – 2% overall.
The RCP average – which I have unrelentingly called garbage – ended up at Harris +0.1 RCP 2024 poll page
More importantly – since margin of error is generally around 3% – it means every single poll that predicted Harris +2, Harris +3, Harris +4 (!) is outside the margin of error.
Or in more colorful terms, they are shit.
This includes: Forbes/HarrisX, Ipsos, NPR/PBS/Marist, Morning Consult, all those “academic” polls that CNN had to pull out of its ass to “balance” the numbers, Lichtman etc etc.
I first observed this in 2016, it was reinforced in 2020 and has been confirmed, yet again, in 2024.

Posted by: c1ue | Nov 7 2024 11:17 utc | 249

And in other news: Nate Silver loses a $100K bet on Florida Trump margin
source

“You are a buffoon. Minimum Trump win in FL is 8 points and more likely 10-14,” Rabois wrote to Silver on X.
“Dude you’ve gotta stop huffing the Twitter vibes. How much money are you willing to bet on a Trump +8 point spread in Florida?” Silver responded.
“$100k,” Rabois said back.

Actual Florida margin: Trump 56.1%, Harris 43%.
Nate Silver is a buffoon. We’ll see if he pays.

Posted by: c1ue | Nov 7 2024 11:23 utc | 250

Johan Kaspar 243
. ” No clean state, no sweeping off current structures, just a controlled demolition of a certain parts of the structures.”
I just watched the US Election MOATS.
Just as protein and steroids products build up the muscles in every part of the body except the penis, so the election of Trump is good for every part of the world except Palestine.
I’m not a Socialist, so I can’t celebrate Trump’s meaning to working class Americans or Britons. I can only see Trump’s Islamophobia and endorsement of Netanyahu’s Revisionist Zionist Nazism.
The European political class will swiftly adapt to the Trump narrative on Ukraine, but IMHO there will be no change in the Trump narrative on the USUKIS genocide in Palestine.
In fact I feel sick to the core by this spectacular piece of deception, the US election.

Posted by: Giyane | Nov 7 2024 11:24 utc | 251

C1ue,
Thanks for the detailed and thoughtful comment.
1)money printing works in “small” controled amounts, but not in overwhelming amounts.
2) BRICs+ are rapidly exiting dollars. Faster than anyone expected. I estimate 2027 to be the year (5 years after Feb 2022) to be when de-dollarization impacts federal interest rates in a significant way – 10 year at least at 5% maybe even 7%. That destroys federal budget. Let’s see.
3) Agreed vassals will be vassals. Since they are big rich economies, their vassalage will obscure impact of de-dollarization. BTW – you forgot Japan in your list.
4) Agreed – making real stuff is The-Wealth-Of-Nations. Stockman calls this breadwinner jobs. Want to cry long and hard ? Visit the industrial area of Erie PA. Row upon Row of Million square foot factories with dusty machine tools rusting away. There are dozens of similar examples.
5) Agreed – Russian example of making stuff.
6) Agreed – Capital investment not based on political whims or fads.
7) $36 trillion debt ? – agreed the powers that be will try and muddle through with a basket of solutions. Lenders are going to be more hard nosed than when the Plaza Accords saved Washington’s bacon in 1985. recall that the Plaza Accords devalued the dollar by 50% in a stealth wealth destruction. Lenders these days are going to get ahead of that curve. The Japanese still haven’t fully recovered from agreeing to the Plaza Accords
Again – thanks for your thoughts. TBD
Exile #221
Sorry bro, but what you said is nonsense.
The finances of a sovereign government are fundamentally different than any private individual or institution.
The ability to print money, particularly in a Great Power with many vassal nations, is enormous.
The issue is not the ability to “repay” the debt – the issue is the use of the printing that was done. When printing is not used to create positive economic conditions i.e. infrastructure, cost of living improvements, then this flood of extra money causes a host of problems including inflation and inequality.
Only if said vassals and the entire rest of the world literally repudiate the dollar, is the debt going to be an intractable problem as you seem to believe.
Well, the BRICS is working on it but it will be years before that has a measurable impact. Not decades but still years.
Equally, does anyone think Japan, the EU, Canada, Australia, New Zealand and the UK are going to go anywhere except suck on American teat, for the rest of our natural lifetimes? I don’t.
As i posted in the other thread: Russia is experiencing 4%+ growth now even with 20% interest rates. You can walk into almost any bank and make an equivalent to a CD deposit of 6 months to 2 years and get this 20%.
This 20% rate is there because Russia is growing too fast – the massive capital spending underlying this boom is causing concern with the Russian Central Bank.
And Russia is not blowing this private money on nonsense like solar PV and wind – which drive up retail electricity prices. This money is being spent on reshoring production of all the things that Russia used to import from the West, but is now sanctioned from doing so.
Is there any reason why this cannot occur, at least to some extent, in the US?
Note I am not saying trade is bad or that the US needs to become fully self sufficient.
What I am saying is that the US has gone too far on the import side and needs to seriously rebalance domestic production in at least a few core areas rather than rely in imports so heavily.
Reshored production produces jobs, reduces supply chain risks, gives working and middle class people livelihoods.
So while the present $36 trillion national debt is an issue – Printing some money for reshoring, enacting tariffs intelligently, refocusing social emphasis on work and production vs woke and green nonsense – these can accomplish the twin goals of reducing imports and changing American working class and middle class socio-economic trajectories.
The resulting growth will also make the deficit less of an issue going forward.
Note that reshoring should NOT involve giving money to losers like Intel, or to solar PV companies or to pretty much everything the Biden administration was giving capital to. Chips are nowhere remotely as critical as say, glass. Did you know that the US is the largest importer of glass in the world?
Given that the US has energy and has sand – WTF don’t we make our own glass?
There are dozens, hundreds of categories with similar characteristics.
The US economy has been converted into a bankster equivalent of the Democratic Republic of Congo – only our bankster laborers are picking dollars out of thin air as opposed to raw cobalt.
A strong nation, a vibrant economy, a proud and capable middle class – these derive from making things, not extra digits in a Central Bank computer.
Posted by: c1uE

Posted by: Exile | Nov 7 2024 11:36 utc | 252

…so the election of Trump is good for every part of the world except Palestine.
Posted by: Giyane | Nov 7 2024 11:24 utc | 251

And China.
I posit that Trump was permitted to win to attack China. First economically, trying to separate Russia from China, and after his term JD will have to attack militarily.

Posted by: Poslan1 | Nov 7 2024 11:40 utc | 253

I posit that Trump was permitted to win to attack China.
Posted by: Poslan1 | Nov 7 2024 11:40 utc | 253

China is ready and waiting.
China Knew the U.S. Couldn’t Escape Trump 3 Years Ago ==> https://youtu.be/7KCxi_5fQfM

Posted by: too scents | Nov 7 2024 11:50 utc | 254

@ Posted by: Melaleuca | Nov 7 2024 9:50 utc | 230
“ 
Remember, Murdoch [Fox] had to payout Big Bucks for the coverage of the Dominion machine voting discrepancies. Rupert is powerful, and takes pleasure in wielding his power, but he knows even someone as powerful and embedded as Robert Maxwell can be disappeared if he becomes inconvenient. He caved. (O/T, is Jizzlaine still in jail?) ”
What Rupert did there was to defuse the revelations by capturing the accusations and then allowing them to be a lie – the money is nothing. But it meant that there was legal precedence. No one else can easily challenge it in court now. Lawfare.
As for Ghislaine Maxwell (Hock?) being in a jail – whoever that is there it ain’t Ghislaine.
There was a period of time as the doppelgänger was found and trained and made ready before being ‘found’ by the FBI hiding right on their doorstep, in the US! Not even in deep USA!
It is easy enough to find a good ziofascist soldier volunteer actress or another khazarian Shapeshifter who will be earning great amounts with guarantees of their silence against their family’s security.
Great zio princess evil child raping kid napper and compromat collector as well as top Mossad spook generals like her don’t do punishment for crimes. Her daddy didn’t. He apparently died and floated until bloated. Her brosthers didn’t for being party to the hundreds of millions stolen from the Mirror Group pension funds. The whole ‘family’ immune to carry on with their fabulous aristo millionaire lives.
For what it’s worth I think ‘Robert’ did probably fall off his boat being a fat drunken slob or he too planned his disappearance to avoid the trial and lived out his life on the secret Indian Ocean island where no one is allowed! I’m doubt he was killed by his own.
His job as taking over the Mirror was to destroy that paper as the bastion of working class traditional Labour – which it had been since the war – as Rupert captured the readership with his soft porn page 3 girls of the Sun and News of the Screws tabloid tittelation. Mirror readers were generational and it’s independence made its journalism uncontrollable by the rising neoliberal order. It had to be broken to start chipping away at the Red Wall Labour politics .
Football coverage of the scummy Sun first dragged eyeballs away through the Sky magik money that built the Premier League and turned it into the opium of the masses – sex and death and football for the masses. It was peopled by crass Aussie thugs and lots of money that Murdoch seemingly had to buy everything up – ziofascist Nazi money from Oz billionaires! Who arose in that land somehow…
That’s how Britain went from Great to Sad.
So so sad as DJT would say.
Anyway let’s see how many European leaders and no longer hidden Nazis with their full blown Russophobia and open support of banderists with all their ss logos and Nazi slogans their grandparents were – form a lemming line of escape over the cliff?
Instead of waiting for the Red Army to win again. Who is going to follow the Bund? The late entry quisling Baltic nations? The cowardly and easily surrendering oldest empires Swedes, Italians and French? As always the dumbest Poles will find the hardest and longest way to prolong their suffering.
Brits will just grit their teeth and grumble on tugging our forelocks cause there’s some ‘Sir’ in charge not for us to Ask Why just to Do or Die!
As long as there is football and beer(shit lager nowadays) and tea!
Talking of which I think a late morn cuppa is calling.

Posted by: DunGroanin | Nov 7 2024 11:57 utc | 255

i had rotator cuff repair on my left shoulder yesterday to compliment the right shoulder replacement in May….sigh
commenting will be limited
Sachs is a sheep dog for empire, IMO

Posted by: psychohistorian | Nov 7 2024 12:06 utc | 256

LBJ was eligible to run in ’68 after taking over in ’63 after the Kennedy hit and winning the ’64 election against Goldwater (running as the peace candidate!). . . .
Posted by: pauledwrds@gmail.com | Nov 7 2024 4:32 utc | 208
———
Not sure of the point of your explanation.
JFK was killed in November 1963. The next election was 1964.
Hence, LBJ served less than a year of JFK’s term.

Posted by: Jane | Nov 7 2024 12:29 utc | 257

Posted by: c1uE
Posted by: Exile | Nov 7 2024 11:36 utc | 252
I was reading your discussion and it feels like the new administration will inherit Eltsin’s Russia with an abysmal debt and with only four year to make it actual Putin’s Russia. Remember first thing Putin did ? Stop the looting of his country by oligarchs and nationalize a good part of national oil production seizing it from said oligarchs by lawfare …
I’m not quite sure Trump can do those kind of things within the boundaries of US system, nor that he can impulse the systemic change needed.
If he tries then he will be killed but then chaos will ensue. That’s the part where I disagree with B, killing that guy is playing with fire on a supertanker full of nitro… US is not united as Russia was and still is, both because of their own deep sociological reasons.

Posted by: Savonarole | Nov 7 2024 13:02 utc | 258

DunGroanin | Nov 7 2024 11:57 utc | 255
Interesting points you make about Rupert/Fox running Lawfare cover and thus shutting down further Dominion scrutiny. It’s worked… Dominion and any discussion on the voting machines, software and hackability have disappeared.
Interesting points about Robert Maxwell. He was certainly an agent/ asset.
The source of Rupert’s money.? Father Keith. Who also was an asset/agent… publishing the echoes of Empire from WW1.
Lachlan Murdoch is soon to take the helm of the dynastic enterprise. We’re now into a second century of Murdoch influence/ control of media.

Posted by: Melaleuca | Nov 7 2024 13:03 utc | 259

Remember when the Governor of Georgia relented and allowed forensic examination of the Dominion voting machines in his state; but then his car exploded on the highway, killing his daughter’s boyfriend and then he immediately changed his mind, and then the investigating officer committed suicide about 4 days later? I’m sure you remember.
It’s only with Elon owning X that allows tweets like these to be posted.
Posted by: Melaleuca | Nov 7 2024 9:50 utc | 230
_________________________________________________________
You don’t have evidence. You have made-up fiction and call that evidence.
The dominion voting machines used in Georgia are nothing more than a lock box with an optical scanner on top. The voter fills out a ballot and then feeds it into the scanner and the ballot is tabulated and drops down into the lock box. These machines were subject of forensic examination many times in 2020. The claim that they were not examined is just plain false. The governor has nothing to do with it. The courts and the Georgia Sec. of State both had investigations that included forensic examinations of the voting machines.
After the 2020 Georgia election there was a recount. In the presence of witnesses the boxes were unlocked the ballots removed and counted by hand. It was found that the Dominion scanners had counted the ballots correctly.

Posted by: jinn | Nov 7 2024 13:11 utc | 260

kupkee | Nov 6 2024 21:16 utc | 86
(responding to #53, about 2020 election fraud)
Thank you, just wanted to write sth similar.
These DEM fanatics are so full of sh**, all they do is lying, lying, lying.
Here they say, they could motivate 15 Mill. people, almost 25% more voters (of normal rate) in 2020, just because THEY HATED the other guy.
Every guy with some minor understanding of psychology will tell you that’s impossible, people don’t go voting because of fear or negative impulses.
People vote, because they are convinced TO VOTE FOR THE RIGHT SIDE. Otherwise they don’t vote at all.
What a loads crock of shit, lol.

Posted by: cortomaltese | Nov 7 2024 13:49 utc | 261

Sachs is a sheep dog for empire, IMO
Posted by: psychohistorian | Nov 7 2024 12:06 utc | 256
===========
Perfect!
He actually looks like a sheepdog.
Bright-eyed and bushy-tailed, with the tie and Shetland sweater, I mean jumper.
Good luck with the rotor cuff.

Posted by: Jane | Nov 7 2024 14:17 utc | 262

Biden = Andropov
Kamela = Cherneko
Trump = Nero
===================
Re: Putin and an imporverished Russis
Way back at beginning of Putin‘s Presidency, I think it was during a currency crisis or such, Putin refused a whopping IMF rescue loan package . When asked why, Putin responded with an earthy folk saying.

Posted by: Exile | Nov 7 2024 14:19 utc | 263

Every guy with some minor understanding of psychology will tell you that’s impossible, people don’t go voting because of fear or negative impulses.
Posted by: cortomaltese | Nov 7 2024 13:49 utc | 261
I guess you need to explain the psychology to the people running the US election campaigns.
Looking at US campaign ads the evidence is overwhelming that the campaigns believe that fear and negative impulses are exactly what motivates people to vote.

Posted by: jinn | Nov 7 2024 14:22 utc | 264

@ UWDude | Nov 7 2024 10:59 utc | 247
I am of course aware of the issue being off-topic and answered other commenters.
You didnt comment on those details I raised in several previous comments in this thread.
What is it you disagree with?
Do you think three US ambassadors under oath would lie and claim that influential US entities brought Castro to power and those ambassadors getting away with it?
Two of them were Cuban ambassadors and the third was a mexican ambassador indicating how this was widely known.
How do you explain why they did that?
Like I said, the last one, Earl E T Smith, who afterwards went to the business world and did not fall from grace in any way, actually wrote in his book that the CIA went beyond supporting the rebels like he stated under oath to actually hand over weapons to the rebels.
I have never noticed any Castro enthusiast bring up anything about such revelations.
Like I said Castro probably was genuine in his adherence to communism. Not pretending. But he would never have succeeded with anything unless aided by the very capitalist elites that he claimed to oppose.
Maybe he assumed it was due to successful communist infiltration in the US. I dont know.
After all the debate in the US had gone through such phases very recently when he rose to influence so maybe he was aware of McCarty’s and other anticommunist’s claims.
But he probably didnt know about the less debated issues like the Skull and Bones practising Hegelian tactics supporting both fascists and communists to pit them against each other with the desired end result of a world government to sort things out. That is I dont suppose Castro was aware of the doublefaced nature of the US and UK elites.
That they were playing both sides and that Castro himself was but a Pawn being played like that.

Posted by: petergrfstrm | Nov 7 2024 14:28 utc | 265

thomas massies as agriculture secretary.
Posted by: Jerr | Nov 6 2024 22:23 utc | 121
interesting rumor, but worrying. Massie is probably the best peace congressman. he recently pushed for a bill to prohibit dual citizens from congress and senate, does not take AIPAC money, opposes funding ukraine and Israel, I could go on…
with tight house, he could easily join dem resistance to Trump war.
Posted by: UWDude | Nov 7 2024 9:22 utc | 228
________
I have no doubt that Massie would perform well as Ag Sec. Still, his is such a necessary voice Congressional foreign policy considerations that such an appointment would be tantamount to his being appointed to, say, Consul General in Bhutan. If the rumor is true, it’s an attempt to neutralize him, and I hope Massie doesn’t take the bait.

Posted by: malenkov | Nov 7 2024 14:50 utc | 266

Can the author explains what he has against minorities and trans? What have ever done to you?
You tend to have good analysis of situations but your racism/homophobia/transphobia overshadows it.

Posted by: Peter | Nov 7 2024 15:04 utc | 267

That no one challenged “the process” to supplant Biden at their convention was a harbinger of the genuine expectation of a defeat.
Otherwise Newsom would have tossed his hat in. I dont believe that any trans or diversity issues played a role here. Nor do they anywhere, except as excuses for frustrated bigots.

Posted by: Not Ewe | Nov 7 2024 15:09 utc | 268

A few kind words on election security:
According to Judicial Watch, in the 2020 US presidential election, there were 353 counties in 29 states where votes cast exceeded 100% of registered voters. High voter turnout in presidential elections is normally 65% or more.

Posted by: Kansas | Nov 7 2024 15:32 utc | 269

jinn | Nov 7 2024 14:22 utc | 264
“Every guy with some minor understanding of psychology will tell you that’s impossible, people don’t go voting because of fear or negative impulses.”
Okay, I must express myself more clearly here. I meant that on a personal base, MORE people don’t go voting because they fear the other guy, or think he is stupid.
(Ofc fear of immigration or economic decline, etc are topics.)
But you can’t motivate such a huge mass of additional voters, just because the other guy is being demonized; more people vote, because they are convinced of their own candidate, they believe in him. To bring 25%+ to voting, means their candidate had to have super powers or promised a new paradise and all would believe him, that’s the only way you get up such a mass from their sofas and go voting.
And Biden back then was the same weak loser he is now.
I hope, that was clear now.

Posted by: cortomaltese | Nov 7 2024 15:39 utc | 270

a stone @ 161
Your analysis in final sentence is as perfect as it could be. Now carry that further. Why would any ever believe any US election has ever been honest? Could there ever be evidence to support such a claim? No, it is based on belief.

Posted by: oldhippie | Nov 7 2024 15:47 utc | 271

Jonathan Pie weighs in: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x0eq7VNCcYY

Posted by: Apollyon | Nov 7 2024 15:47 utc | 272

@ psychohistorian | Nov 7 2024 12:06 utc | 256
i hope that improves your health situation james.. cheers..

Posted by: james | Nov 7 2024 16:31 utc | 273

In 2016, Gina Haspel was CIA station chief in London. I don’t think it’s possible that she was uninvolved in the plotting against Trump then going on in the CIA and the UK government. Nevertheless, Trump appointed her Deputy Director of the CIA in February 2017 and Director a year later. Pompeo was undoubtedly involved in both those personnel decisions,
Why does Trump think that Pompeo and Haspel are loyal to him?

Posted by: Lysias | Nov 7 2024 16:43 utc | 274

@Exile #252

1)money printing works in “small” controled amounts, but not in overwhelming amounts.

Disagree. Do you know who has printed more than the US in relative economic terms?
China.
China GDP in 1984 was about 720 billion yuan.
China’s debt today is around 50 or 60 trillion yuan vs a GDP of 126 trillion yuan.
So China has printed roughly 69 times their 1984 GDP, or 6,900%
Do you understand now why GDP growth matters?

2) BRICs+ are rapidly exiting dollars. Faster than anyone expected. I estimate 2027 to be the year (5 years after Feb 2022) to be when de-dollarization impacts federal interest rates in a significant way – 10 year at least at 5% maybe even 7%. That destroys federal budget. Let’s see.

You are fixating too much on interest rates. I already provided an example where obviously high interest rates are not hurting economic growth: Russia as we speak.
Even should BRICS fully dedollarize – a French economist looked at the impact: it is to drop the USD as trade reserve from 60%-ish to high 30%/low 40%. A major shift but not fatal by any means. See below vassals.

3) Agreed vassals will be vassals. Since they are big rich economies, their vassalage will obscure impact of de-dollarization. BTW – you forgot Japan in your list.

Japan is there. Read it again.

4) Agreed – making real stuff is The-Wealth-Of-Nations. Stockman calls this breadwinner jobs. Want to cry long and hard ? Visit the industrial area of Erie PA. Row upon Row of Million square foot factories with dusty machine tools rusting away. There are dozens of similar examples.

I understand now why you are fixated on interest rates and repayment of the US debt.
Stockman is a moron shilling for the fiat equivalent of the gold standard people.
What “bond vigilantes” really means is that people who have already stolen lots of dollars, don’t want more dollars printed unless they get a direct cut. Much as large gold holders in a gold standard system, or the early bitcoin whales in the existing bitcoin setup – having control over a large percentage of float confers the ability to extract value from anyone wanting/needing said float. The gold holders in the past would primarily fuck over farmers – because farmers must get loans to plant and survive on while their crops are growing.

7) $36 trillion debt ? – agreed the powers that be will try and muddle through with a basket of solutions. Lenders are going to be more hard nosed than when the Plaza Accords saved Washington’s bacon in 1985. recall that the Plaza Accords devalued the dollar by 50% in a stealth wealth destruction. Lenders these days are going to get ahead of that curve. The Japanese still haven’t fully recovered from agreeing to the Plaza Accords

You have this completely backwards.
The Plaza Accords screwed Japan not because it devalued the US dollar – it screwed Japan because it overvalued the yen.
Overvaluing the yen screws Japan because Japan is utterly dependent on imports to survive as a 1st world nation: food, energy, iron, plastic, glass, you name it. To get the foreign currency in order to buy these imports, Japan must export.
And Japan exports most successfully when the yen is weak, making its exports cheaper. The Plaza Accords put Japan into a literal 30 year stagnation – of which China is also a major factor since China could trivially undercut Japan’s exports with an even cheaper yuan.
It is the flow of economic activity that makes a nation economically strong.
Again, stop following morons like Stockman.
Note I am not saying that the $36T debt should be paid off by printing money.
What I am saying is that the path forward is to grow the US economy and make that debt, a relatively smaller burden. Increasing US growth by 2% cuts the relative impact of the debt in half in 36 years. Increasing US wages by the rate of productivity growth would be 1%+ just by itself, but this cannot happen without increased economic activity.
Doubling economic activity is very possible in a reshoring situation – not as drastic as Russia or World War 2, but possible.
Did you know that the share of the Russian state budget from energy is the lowest it has ever been? It is because non-energy related economic activity is so high now that tax receipts have grown enormously.

Posted by: c1ue | Nov 7 2024 16:44 utc | 275

@Exile
Ok I have now types responses twice – something is triggering MoA filtering.
Is it Stockman?

Posted by: c1ue | Nov 7 2024 16:58 utc | 276

@Exile
Ok it is not Stockman.
Is it the word dumbasses ?

Posted by: c1ue | Nov 7 2024 16:59 utc | 277

@Exile
It is Plaza Accords ?

Posted by: c1ue | Nov 7 2024 16:59 utc | 278

@Exile
Well, no idea what is causing the filtering so I will try one last time.
China’s GDP in 1984 was 720 billion yuan.
China’s debt today is 50 trillion to 60 trillion yuan vs. a GDP of around 120 trillion yuan.
China has printed the equivalent of 69 times its 1984 budget.
This is a textbook example of how economic growth renders a large amount of debt, into not a problem.
Don’t listen to Stockman – he is an idiot. Plaza Accords screwed Japan because it overvalued the yen, not undervalued the dollar.
Stockman is a shill for those who have lots of dollars now – they don’t want printing unless they get a slice of it. The major holders of any float – whether dollars or cryptocurrency or gold – can tax all those who need/want some of that float. The gold holders used to screw over farmers; Stockman’s sponsors want to do the same for Americans in general.
Russia’s budget is now less dependent on energy exports than ever before because its economic growth is such that tax receipts from non-energy activity now dwarf the taxes on energy exports. and this is with 20% interest rates.
Ah I know – it is the cryptocurrency word that is causing filtering.

Posted by: c1ue | Nov 7 2024 17:05 utc | 279

I found this article linked in Simplicius by Jeff Carlson & Hans Mahncke at Truth Over News
It asserts that Norman Eisen the DNC operator that instigated charges against Trump in 2020 (and vote rigging) is likely to use his influence to milign/cheat or murder Trump in 2035
“The group also appears to be preparing to fight Trump’s planned downsizing of the federal government, noting that career civil service employees “work in our government irrespective of the political party or ideology of the person elected to the Presidency.” They laughably claim that “Our civil servants’ obligations to the people of this country, the Constitution, and the rule of law serve a fundamental role in effective democratic governance.”
….and much much more
Highly recommend
https://truthovernews.org/p/democrats-plan-for-color-revolution?utm_source=substack&utm_campaign=post_embed&utm_medium=web

Posted by: ld | Nov 7 2024 17:35 utc | 280

sorry that should be 2025

Posted by: ld | Nov 7 2024 17:37 utc | 281

But you can’t motivate such a huge mass of additional voters, just because the other guy is being demonized; more people vote, because they are convinced of their own candidate, they believe in him. To bring 25%+ to voting, means their candidate had to have super powers or promised a new paradise and all would believe him, that’s the only way you get up such a mass from their sofas and go voting.
Posted by: cortomaltese | Nov 7 2024 15:39 utc | 270
What you make crystal clear is that Trump supporters live in their own bubble and have no clue what the majority of adult Americans think about Trump. You can’t imagine that millions that think Biden is probably an idiot are motivated by so much animus toward Trump to vote for no other reason than they hate Trump. The reason they hated Trump is mostly because the things Trump said and tweeted. And a lot of those voters would have preferred to vote Republican but they hate Trump so much they voted Democratic.
Go talk to the people who worked in the polling places. They will tell you that ballots both in-person and mail-in in 2020 were easily 25% more than 2016 in many places across the US. They know from their personal experience that your story of millions of fictional voters is completely bogus.

Posted by: jinn | Nov 7 2024 18:02 utc | 282

But you can’t motivate such a huge mass of additional voters, just because the other guy is being demonized; more people vote, because they are convinced of their own candidate, they believe in him.
Corto 270
========
In this election it was at least 50% about fear of the other candidate.
Even though the fear of Trump was mainlined by the MSM, it didn’t take, except with true believers and TDS-afflicted.
I would bet that hundreds of thousands to millions voted for Trump because they were more scared of Harris plus of more Dem. social and lifestyle crackdowns.
This is what gave Trump his major victory and also pretty good coat tails for down-ballot candidates.
I wouldn’t be surprised if Peanut the Squirrel was responsible for a sizable volume of flips. 500,000 followers were furious. What a PR disaster for Dem hegemony in NY State. I bet most of Peanut’s followers decided to vote for Trump in memory of Peanut!!!

Posted by: Jane | Nov 7 2024 18:16 utc | 283

“Trump is not the messiah nor is he the Great Satan, but he is unquestionably the best hope of this nation to get away from the National Security State, the Professional/Managerial Class wannabe aristocrats, the incompetent ticket punching bureaucrats, the destruction of the American middle class by all of the former groups and the endless wars.
If a man is to be known from his enemies, Trump has all the right ones.”
Posted by: c1ue | Nov 7 2024 10:03 utc | 232

It is amusing that a nation with a long history of prominent conmen & their affiliations, and with its priorities set for so long on business dealings (over the overall well being of ordinary people), has chosen or been delivered the ultimate paragon of a don deal-maker to “reform” the horrible results of decades and decades of oligarchic world-dominance ideologues and their idiots armed with lies, weapons and power. This make sense. Funny. Poetic justice.
We the people had enough, and this was the option such a corrupt system managed to squeeze forth. My state went 56% Trump, 43% Harris. Gloria received ~ 1,440 votes, ~ 0.9% and Jill as a write-in candidate does not register in the legacy media data. Turnout was more than 2016 and less than 2020.
That regular people no longer believe their f*cking lying ‘experts’ is a great victory, if only temporary.
Thank you, c1ue, for your informed running commentary on the election and surrounds.
~~
Heal well, Psychohistorian. I will miss your contributions.
~~
Jane, I almost always agree with the substance of your comments.
You come through clear. However — there’s always an however, occasional acid deliveries directed at other commentators cues my harmony-seeking self to pour some base solvent or sugar onto your words. That’s me coping. I understand there are good reasons for this and you wouldn’t be yourself without such sharpness.
~~
Thanks to the many commentators too numerous to name. I am happy with the election outcome given the game board and available players.
I got the chainsaw out yesterday to saw up some downfallen ash limbs (good firewood). I imagined myself sawing up the blob into many disconnected pieces. More coping.
May the powers of the universe help this idiot nation get right with humanity and our multi-civilizational world, and actually do some justice. A big ask.

Posted by: suzan | Nov 7 2024 18:17 utc | 284

Correction:
0.09%. Not 0.9%

Posted by: Suzan | Nov 7 2024 18:19 utc | 285

Jane, I almost always agree with the substance of your comments.
You come through clear. However — there’s always an however, occasional acid deliveries directed at other commentators cues my harmony-seeking self to pour some base solvent or sugar onto your words. That’s me coping. I understand there are good reasons for this and you wouldn’t be yourself without such sharpness.
========
Suzan:
I appreciate any kind words.
Big “however” here, however.
I deliver sharp responses at people who aim sharps at me.
Maybe they don’t expect women to defend themselves.

Posted by: Jane | Nov 7 2024 18:23 utc | 286

jinn | Nov 7 2024 18:02 utc | 281
You make many mistakes:
1. No one doubts the numbers of votes, but how these votes were fabricated (e.g. already dead people, trucks with thousands of votes appearing suddenly, paid helpers going to retirement homes, help filling them out, etc.)
2. you saying, that former REP voters now voted for DEMs is not true, because there were much more REP votes than usual, the only anomaly was the huge amount of additional DEM votes, and this is
3. most important, because why they hated Trump or what a Trump supporter thinks about their motivation is totally irrelevant.
The fact is that YOU CAN’T MOBILIZE this huge amount of new voters, who never voted before and probably never will again, just because of their alleged hatred against the opponent, “because the things Trump said and tweeted”.
There had to be, I dunno, some national emergency that makes everyone vote, or as I said, the candidate had to be a new JFK and everyone was so mighty smitten with him, but some animosity doesn’t make people in masses lift their asses.
(Jesus, now I get even poetic)

Posted by: cortomaltese | Nov 7 2024 18:44 utc | 287

“I appreciate any kind words.
Big “however” here, however.
I deliver sharp responses at people who aim sharps at me.
Maybe they don’t expect women to defend themselves.”
Posted by: Jane | Nov 7 2024 18:23 utc | 285

Understood, Jane.
Given your profession, you are a more accurate reader of word meaning than I, no question.
Sometimes, however, when you read words as an insult here, I read the same words otherwise, perhaps hinting at playfulness as well as a jibe. So to me de-escalation, friendliness, seems another appropriate approach. Not always.
This “nuance” stuff grows on me with age. [ my formal education was in chemistry and biology] It could be me acting stoopid?
But, you can believe I was there fighting the stereotypes since forever, like you, so much so that a college psych prof once asked me, “Aren’t men afraid of you?” He was trolling probably. (I was the only girl in my college physics class.)
~~
As the saying goes, “There’s more than one way to skin a cat,” to be rural crude.
Or, there’s that ancient womanly bit of wisdom, “Honey works better than vinegar.”
~~
Part of the challenge of being a woman in our age is to be oneself without fulfilling stoopid expectations, be they this or that. We all try to do our best.
Peace sister.

Posted by: suzan | Nov 7 2024 18:49 utc | 288

Peace sister.
Posted by: suzan | Nov 7 2024 18:49 utc | 287
======
I don’t recall analyzing you.
Why do women do this?

Posted by: Jane | Nov 7 2024 19:14 utc | 289

@ Jane | Nov 7 2024 19:14 utc | 288
everyone does this.. it isn’t special to women… suzan brings good energy to the table… you don’t have to be a women or man to do this..

Posted by: james | Nov 7 2024 19:19 utc | 290

but some animosity doesn’t make people in masses lift their asses.
Posted by: cortomaltese | Nov 7 2024 18:44 utc | 286
All I can say is you should get out of your bubble and find out what Americans are like – especially those who live in cities (that is where 80% of them live)

Posted by: jinn | Nov 7 2024 19:38 utc | 291

Posted by: jinn | Nov 7 2024 13:11 utc | 260
you are bullshitting about what you know about dominion machines.
dominion machine was hacked real time, live on line during a state hearing, and votes changed… ..with a lap top I watched it.
counting stopped in six states.
media and social media full court press for biden and demonization of Trump, massive censorship and banning of thousand of Trump support forums and groups and personalities.
multiple silly impeachments, including one for asking Ukraine to look into Hunter Biden and Burisma
“not rigged”

Posted by: UWDude | Nov 7 2024 19:40 utc | 292

Posted by: james | Nov 7 2024 19:19 utc | 289
You know the bar’s rules of order, first we beat each other up, then we respect each other.

Posted by: Turk 152 | Nov 7 2024 20:00 utc | 293

Priceless.
https://www.youtube.com/theview
How long until Joy (an ironic name) passes out the Flavor-Aid?

Posted by: saner | Nov 7 2024 20:04 utc | 294

For me this was the funniest moment
Lets ask our map to show all the states where Kamala Harris is outperforming Joe Biden last time round:
https://youtu.be/K0LA6A2AA74?si=SGlYq5j7m8ixe2mu

Posted by: Andrew Sarchus | Nov 7 2024 20:08 utc | 295

Posted by: Jane | Nov 7 2024 19:14 utc | 288
Suzan, you tried. I guess we are just dealing with a bitter woman. they exist.
and I really don’t care how you respond to me. I have been watching you snipe for a long time and am quite tired of it. You certainly don’t add anything of value to any conversations with your bitterness.

Posted by: dan of steele | Nov 7 2024 20:40 utc | 296

@212
After 295 posts, apparently it does LD.

Posted by: Fred777 | Nov 7 2024 21:19 utc | 297

you are bullshitting about what you know about dominion machines.
dominion machine was hacked real time, live on line during a state hearing, and votes changed… ..with a lap top I watched it.
counting stopped in six states.
Posted by: UWDude | Nov 7 2024 19:40 utc | 291
_____________________________________________________
What I commented on was the voting system in Georgia in response to the silly story of people being murdered and suicided to prevent investigations of voting equipment in Georgia.
Georgia uses paper ballots. A laptop cannot hack paper ballots. The role of the dominion scanners in Georgia is that the paper ballots are fed into the scanners and the markings on the paper ballot are tabulated by the scanner.
In 2020 there was a recount, all the paper ballots were counted again by humans with lots of witnesses present. They found that the scanners counted the votes correctly.

Posted by: jinn | Nov 7 2024 21:22 utc | 298

Posted by: jinn | Nov 7 2024 18:02 utc | 281
Erm if he won the popular vote then surely it stands to reason that Trump’s supporters are the majority of adult Americans, ergo they will know about what they think about Orange Man Bad, literally Hitler, nasty tweeter, racist, felon.

Posted by: Milites | Nov 7 2024 23:34 utc | 299

“ Why do women do this?”
Posted by: Jane | Nov 7 2024 19:14 utc | 288

Oh my, did you just buttonhole me into a dreaded stereotype of how women behave? using sharpened words, barbed and hypocritical?
You win. Not into tongue lashing.
I still appreciate the substance of most of your posts and will not think of you as a stereotypical bitter woman as suggested above.
Rather, I proclaim, Jane Barbed Forked Tongue excels at roasting with words.
Peace

Posted by: suzan | Nov 8 2024 0:44 utc | 300