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April 21, 2024
Ukraine Open Thread 2024-117
Comments
AI | Apr 21 2024 18:07 utc | 33
*** Country 404 will become the new Greater Israel the way this is going. It’s clear by now that comedian and charlatan Zelensky does not give a toss whether Ukranians live or die.***
Was yet another clip on Telegram a couple of days ago, of the future widow Zelensky giggling about the tens of thousands of ordinary Ukrainians being killed in NATO’s war. And one of Zelensky with a lot of shady looking Jewish (hat, beard, coat etc.) cultists … clearly his favourite people (or as they would argue, the only “real, human” people) especially notable for contriving to not appear in the front-line of war.
But when the war ends, they may acquire vacant possession if Kiev wins — and cannot be sure that if Russia wins, Putin would not also hand them it.
Posted by: Cynic | Apr 22 2024 15:44 utc | 201
Posted by: Republicofscotland | Apr 22 2024 14:34 utc | 189
Don’t you think they know that? It’s the whole point and part of the hybrid war, the USA’s hybrid war which may be different than their allies’ idea of a hybrid war. The USA is working towards an economic scorched earth against not just Russia and China but against Europe, Asia-Pacific, Middle East, friends and foes alike. When the smoke clears in 20ys they plan to be where they were in 1945, the only unscathed surplus capital country left (or at least in better condition than everyone else) and everyone will be forced to come running to them on their terms, and the terms will be that you isolate Russia and China and anyone else we tell you to. New cold war, new iron curtain.
Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Apr 22 2024 14:21 utc | 186
Do you think that Putin understands that?
Posted by: vargas | Apr 22 2024 15:03 utc | 195
I think that if anyone has analysts worth their salt they on all sides know that from 2040 onward we’ll be entering a 160 year period from which very little that we recognize as the modern global word, let alone civilization, remains.
What I think they have missed is that it is not a fall of rome but a collapse of the bronze civilizations level (at least). No Constantinople , no holy empire, and the level of population size, interconnection and food dependence may well destroy typical surviving cultures…
Posted by: Newbie | Apr 22 2024 15:49 utc | 202
Posted by: ossi | Apr 22 2024 10:24 utc | 161
ossi can you make a comparission about the current level of indoctrination in Germany with the one in GDR?
Posted by: vargas | Apr 22 2024 11:07 utc | 167
.
.
It’s not that easy because how should I put it?
“Through the Back Door” is more sensitive and, yes, more insidious.
In schools, entire history passages disappear from history books or are redefined. Example and even the German Chancellor said this in front of cameras in 2023: “Crimea has always belonged to Ukraine”
Russia’s victims in World War II are not mentioned at all: around 27 million.
In cinemas and TV you will only find films about wars that the Americans won, NOT the Russians or Poles etc.
DEVISE: America Saves the World
regardless of whether it’s from Russians or aliens, ONLY America is the good guy and the greatest.
In recent years it has been particularly bad in schools, for example:
A 14 year old posts a video with Blue Smurfs and the text “Germany is my home”
As a result, the director brings the girl to the police and interrogates her without parents for about 45 minutes and teaches her.
Example: German flag is undesirable at World Cup football etc. German flag is BANNED on police cars, they MUST put rainbow flags on their cars.
German flags are confiscated at demonstrations.
AFD members should be dismissed from civil service… open demand in the Bundestag not secret!
Thousands of civil servants have been hired in recent months, not based on knowledge but based on attitudes and party records.
Purpose apparently, a change comes in 2025 through elections then hinder this scon by doing NOTHING the new government
etc etc…
Is that enough?
Feedback geben
Seitenleisten
Verlauf
Gespeichert
Etwas beitragen
Posted by: ossi | Apr 22 2024 15:54 utc | 203
Surferket | Apr 22 2024 2:09 utc | 110 …..
Not that PM Sunak is still wearing (though probably tries to deny what it really is) a Kabbalist red bracelet.
Consistent with his fanatical support of the criminal Zionist regime in Israel.
Posted by: Cynic | Apr 22 2024 15:57 utc | 204
Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Apr 22 2024 14:21 utc | 186
I don’t think the US can go through all the shit they made unscathed. We’re not in twentieth century anymore and the shit some made abroad have even bigger direct consequences at internal level than back then.
The mafia think it’s safe cause it have “the power” : most of them can’t shoot a gun and you can’t print food like dollars. Things can go really awry pretty fast … more so if you import cartel members from all jails in the world. You see how is Haiti RN ? Same but in the whole US and with less food available.
A few month ago I was thinking about the RoW doing what it can to avoid US “soviet-style collapse” , there are quite a lot of risks in letting it happen , right now I’m not so sure anymore about the RoW willingness to help … despite the risks.
Posted by: Savonarole | Apr 22 2024 16:03 utc | 206
Again regarding @104:
The reference to possibly existing underground facilities currently still used by the UKR+Nazi forces, which could cause the current “slow capture” of the UKR cities, has not yet been shown or proven but is probably to be assumed.
So, first plug all holes (entrances and exits) and also block all support for the “hidden” AFU units of that city on all sides.
Posted by: Jake Blanchard | Apr 22 2024 1:26 utc | 104
.. So all the apparently piddling little villages and towns (and cities like Kharkov), are not just shitty wooden houses and apartment blocks to shoot and bomb. Some are, but some have miles of 50m deep hidey holes under and around them.
The AFU store their war needs in these (10 years of accumulation). They pop their heads out for little offensives and counter offensives, and are therefore very stubborn to exterminate and “win” the whole town.
.. slowly RF win back a city block or two, a field or two, and gradually the AFU lairs run out of men, food, ammo.
Besides some other reasons for this “slow motion”, RF is doing what it can currently do – no more and no less.
Posted by: spare_truth_01 | Apr 22 2024 16:12 utc | 207
Fiat money is based on debt, a lot of debt is bound to be wiped out in the west. This means, a lot of Fiat money will simply disappear, wiped out. Bad news for the general western population. Gold, instead, will not get wiped out, it will remain as true global sound money, shifting shape and form riding the wave on top of global power structure shifts.
unimperator | Apr 22 2024 10:43 utc | 165
Can’t resist commenting on (somewhat OT) monetary discussions, sorry…;-)
Today’s money isn’t ‘based on’ debt – it *is* debt. It could only ‘disappear’ if all banks’ computers go bust.
If/ when too many people want to exchange money for tangible stuff, its value decreases. When there’s far too much monetary demand and everybody realizes that, people will buy anything they can get a hold on; the currency becomes worthless.
Gold isn’t ‘money’, but it happens to be “the” traditional store of value. Which is why it’s far more expensive than its relative abundance and lack of practical usefulness would imply. In a serious economic crisis, both money and gold are devalued, relative to real necessities like food, energy.
The reasons for the current inflation are actually much more fundamental than what “experts” admit.
With the economic decoupling between the West and the RoW, the former can no longer appropriate 90% of global resources and labour. This causes a mismatch of (monetary) demand and physical supply in western countries, with infighting for their shrinking ‘piece of the pie’ increasing. EU & Japan are reducing consumption, so US/UK can keep over-consuming for a little longer, paying for it with bond issuance. That’s bad enough from an economic perspective – but the really scary thing is what political consequences this will entail. I’m afraid we ain’t seen nothing yet in terms of ‘populism’ (a.k.a. fascism).
That’s my explanation/ interpretation at least, and I’ve yet to read a better one.
Posted by: smuks | Apr 22 2024 16:12 utc | 208
Savonarole @ 206
A few month ago I was thinking about the RoW doing what it can to avoid US “soviet-style collapse” , there are quite a lot of risks in letting it happen , right now I’m not so sure anymore about the RoW willingness to help … despite the risks.
Waiting for your enemy to self implode is a bad strategy.
As the risks increase the willingness to help will decrease, that’s usually how it goes. I worry about India, it’s a vital swinging mass, it’ll be hard to keep the BRICS together. As for Russia I think China will prove a staunch ally, in terms of historical gravitas China is what the USA was going into WW2, it has the momentum. But Nazis don’t do history they make shit up with runes and ornaments, granfaloons and twisted mythology, and just like last time they don’t stand a chance. But they’ll leave hell in their wake.
Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Apr 22 2024 16:22 utc | 209
Ocheretino direction – breakthrough to the center of Ocheretino…
Another emergency situation has developed for the enemy near Ocheretino, which, of course, was a real feat by soldiers and an important tactical success, which could very soon become operational-tactical.
Days of constant pressure (from the air and ground) have yielded results and the hastily redeployed reinforcements of two brigades of the Ukrainian Armed Forces repeated the fate of the 115th Terrestrial Defense Brigade.
As I said above, unable to withstand the pressure, they surrendered their positions in the area of the railway station and allowed our forces into central Ocheretino, holding on to which is now becoming an even bigger problem for the enemy.
To fill the hole that has developed, the Ukrainian Armed Forces’ “lifesaver” in this sector, the 47th Mechanized Brigade, which has not yet fully recovered from previous battles, was again thrown into the battle, and is now trying to improve the situation with counterattacks and push our people back at least from the center, beyond the railway line.
Let’s keep our fingers crossed for our guys…
YURI PODOLYAKA
https://t.me/yurasumy/14721
https://t.me/Anlystintel/16709
Posted by: unimperator | Apr 22 2024 16:23 utc | 210
Cynic @ 204
Not that PM Sunak is still wearing (though probably tries to deny what it really is) a Kabbalist red bracelet.
Sunak is wearing platform shoes, otherwise he’d look like a member of The Lollipop Guild.
Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Apr 22 2024 16:31 utc | 211
@ Jake Blanchard | Apr 22 2024 7:00 utc | 131
speculation verses deduction…. i hear what you are saying, but without confirmation, i still see it as speculation.. thanks either way!
@ oldhippie | Apr 22 2024 14:39 utc | 191
thanks oh… i share your viewpoint on all of that as well… unless all hell breaks loose – nuclear armageddon… it seems some would like that…
Posted by: james | Apr 22 2024 16:35 utc | 212
Posted by: Anonymous | Apr 22 2024 11:03 utc | 166
In the military, their knowledge base would be derisively labelled, ‘PowerPoint deep’, perhaps we can think of a similar term for these YouTube generals. World of Tanks deep, perhaps, or RTS-deep. I like their use of graphics, but the analysis they offer is of limited value.
Posted by: Milites | Apr 22 2024 16:36 utc | 213
The Ukraine war is fundamentally a US war against Europe. I believe that stealing Russia’s assets is a trap the US is trying to get Europe to step in. It would make the US dominance of Europe completely irreversible- at least until the US has its own economic collapse, which may not be too far off. The seizure trap is two-fold- first it completely destroys RoW confidence in the western banking system; and second it guts a lot of private concerns, mostly European, that that money is owed to.
That being said, I’m not sure that investors will flee to the dollar. Much of it will flee to China, and a lot will move to local currencies that China is willing to trade in. Dedollarization is proceeding rapidly, and the asset seizure is likely to accelerate it further.
Honzo | Apr 22 2024 1:13 utc | 100
Mostly agree, though I’d point out that UK has even more immediate interest in weakening the EU and the Euro: Without access to EUrope’s financial markets, London is irrelevant. The whole “Global Britain” strategy is based on becoming an offshore tax haven for corporations and rich individuals who want to do business in the EU without being subjected to its laws and taxes. Same as HK was for China.
The City has been ripping off the EU for 30-40 years. When it became clear that Brussels wouldn’t tolerate this business model anymore, it answered with ‘Brexit’. And hatched a plan to force its way into the EU single market, in necessary at the price of destroying it.
If the Russian assets are in custody in EUrope, it means they’re Euro-denominated. So any substantial seizure would first and foremost destroy confidence in the Euro, not so much Dollar & Pound. (nb, The money is owed to Russia/ Russians, European states or companies are the debtors.)
Globally, De-Dollarization will certainly accelerate. However, capital owners who want to or have to hold their assets in western currencies will move towards Dollar & Pound, away from the Euro. And that’s all that matters, since it enables US/UK to run a permanent trade deficit with EUrope (& prob. Japan).
A lot of billionaires and multi-millionaires from the Global South would rather keep their wealth in western countries. Not because they think they’re economically stronger than BRICS, but because they know that US/UK-led West will never threaten private wealth. China might, or rather: will. Because US/UK are capitalist states, while China is a socialist state with capitalist elements in its economy.
Posted by: smuks | Apr 22 2024 16:38 utc | 214
Posted by: Newbie | Apr 22 2024 15:49 utc | 202
Al Gore? Is that you?
Seriously… humanity will be just fine after 2040. Enough with the alarmism.
According to the various alarmist hacks… Earth was supposed to be in either a new Ice Age by now, or so hot that continents would be unlivable… or flooded by sea level rise. :>) None of those things has happened.
People have a tendency to adapt, and honestly the Earth isn’t changing all that much despite the hype.
Please stop with the dates and the scare tactics, unless there is some real proof to back it up.
Posted by: Retaining_H2O | Apr 22 2024 16:43 utc | 215
Babel-17 | Apr 22 2024 5:37 utc | 122
I am no Hari Seldon but a big fan of Asimov. I chose my moniker with the claim to shorten the time humanity has to spend under the jackboot of global private finance by at least a butterfly’s wing beat…..its intention that counts for me.
Posted by: psychohistorian | Apr 22 2024 4:48 utc | 121
Posted by: psychohistorian | Apr 22 2024 4:48 utc | 121
Cool!
And my moniker, Babel-17, happens to refer to a SF novel wherein language is used as a weapon to subvert the enemy. I thought it was clever how in the language Babel-17, the name given by it to the opponent was “The invaders”.
Have you both re
Posted by: Sarlat La Canède | Apr 22 2024 16:54 utc | 216
Accidentally posted ! Grrr !
Let’s try again : Have you both read Eric Frank Russell’s Wasp ?
Posted by: Sarlat La Canède | Apr 22 2024 16:56 utc | 217
Posted by: unimperator | Apr 22 2024 16:23 utc | 210
From the military version of the Good Wine-metaphor guide.
Fire Brigade:Eastern Front, vintage ‘44-45
‘Initially sampled, it proves to be a heady wine that provides a warm, feeling of reassurance, however, after several glasses, the high spirits it engenders is rapidly replaced by a bitter aftertaste from the repeated appearance of bitter residues, making it nearly unbreakable. c.f. ‘Scraping the barrel’
Taste notes: a distinct sense of rubber, diesel and motor lubricants, with after notes of burning and a distinct, acrid smokiness.
Posted by: Milites | Apr 22 2024 16:56 utc | 218
Let’s try again : Have you both read Eric Frank Russell’s Wasp ?
Posted by: Sarlat La Canède | Apr 22 2024 16:56 utc | 217
No, thanks for the heads up about it. It sounds like some of the best SF of that era, like that of PKD or Harry Harrison. I’ll see if I can find it.
Posted by: Babel-17 | Apr 22 2024 17:35 utc | 219
Tucker Carlson: 70 percent of Americans don’t want help for Ukraine
.
US President Joe Biden is lying about protecting democracy by providing financial aid to the Kiev regime while most US citizens reject further support for Ukraine, journalist Tucker Carlson said in a podcast Joe von Rogan:
“Congressmen are passing a bill to provide $60 billion in funding for Ukraine, while 70 percent of the [U.S.] population doesn’t want it. They are ignoring the real problems in our country, such as the economy and the borders.”
According to Carlson, American authorities have been disregarding the interests of their citizens for decades and calling it democracy:
“You could simply say: We don’t care what you want, we get something from Ukraine’s funding, be it the thrill, the feeling of being ‘master of the universe’ or money from the defense companies. Whatever we “It’s more important to us than your opinion. You don’t run this country, we run it, so shut up and obey.”
If the U.S. government said something like that, Carlson continued, it would at least have been clear that these were the conditions.
“But if I heard one more damn speech from Joe Biden about how he’s defending democracy when it’s not even remotely a democracy, I’m going to go crazy because I just can’t handle those lies.”
On Saturday, the US House of Representatives passed a bill allocating nearly $61 billion to the regime in Kiev. This document will now be submitted to the Senate for consideration. The MPs also approved the confiscation of Russian state assets in favor of handing them over to Ukraine.
Posted by: ossi | Apr 22 2024 17:41 utc | 220
Pleasantly surprised to see Wasp was chosen for preservation at the internet archive.
https://archive.org/details/RusselEricFrankWasp/page/n1/mode/1up?view=theater
Posted by: Babel-17 | Apr 22 2024 17:42 utc | 221
Ukrainian volunteer admits: Western weapons are not very effective against Russian EloKa
Most of the weapons systems handed over to Kiev by the West proved ineffective against the Russian army’s electronic warfare, Maria Berlinskaya, a volunteer and the head of the Ukrainian Center for Aerial Reconnaissance Support, told the news portal Liga.net.
Berlinskaya emphasized that the effectiveness of the weapons in “current combat conditions” cannot be assessed “on a hypothetical training ground in Texas.” Western-made weapon systems, ammunition or missiles would constantly crash or be unable to reach their intended target because of the means of the Russian electronic warfare (EloKa). The reason for this is that the Russian Eloka is objectively one of the best in the world, Berlinskaja concluded.
Posted by: ossi | Apr 22 2024 17:43 utc | 222
EU shoots itself in the foot again and kneels before the USA
.
To once again shoot the European industry in the face, the European Union intends to include a ban on LNG supplies in the 14th package of anti-Russian sanctions.
As they say, this is nothing personal, just that the United States wants to sell to the EU more of its LNG gas, which is several times more expensive than Russian gas. In order to physically deprive European companies of the opportunity to buy Russian gas, the United States simply decided to introduce a ban at the level of the European Commission.
Let’s see how enthusiastically they will respond to such initiatives in France and Spain, which buy most of the Russian gas.
I’m sure they just want to pay Americans more for gas because there are more “molecules of freedom and democracy”)))
Posted by: ossi | Apr 22 2024 17:50 utc | 223
Babel-17 | Apr 22 2024 17:35 utc | 219
Babs, may I call you Babs ? Check the Gutenberg project, (gutenberg.org) they may have it ! Is free !
William Hope Hodgson is there, The Night Land is incredible but a lot the Carnacki stories are fun too !
It’s a wonderful resource, in many languages !
Posted by: Sarlat La Canède | Apr 22 2024 17:51 utc | 224
Babel-17 | Apr 22 2024 17:42 utc | 221
Pleasantly surprised to see Wasp was chosen for preservation at the internet archive.
“>https://archive.org/details/RusselEricFrankWasp/page/n1/mode/1up?view=theater
Nice ! Did not know of that site ! Thanks Babs ! You’re a doll !
Posted by: Sarlat La Canède | Apr 22 2024 17:58 utc | 225
@ Sarlat La Canède | Apr 22 2024 17:58 utc | 225 and Babel-17 about Wasp
Read the wiki page but not the book….so little time, so much to read….sigh
Posted by: psychohistorian | Apr 22 2024 18:26 utc | 226
speculation verses deduction…. i hear what you are saying, but without confirmation, i still see it as speculation.. thanks either way!
Posted by: james | Apr 22 2024 16:35 utc | 212
No. Ffs. Are you just trying to bait me? You really need to get your terms right and to understand the different thinking and speaking mechanisms — all the grey areas of language along the graph line of TRUE<....>FALSE with all the variables in between. Why tf does it “need confirmation”, for example, that Donbass has lots of coal mines. Don’t you read? Why is it speculation that tunnels help with military defence? Are you not familiar with Hamas in Gaza?
I’m not going to explain clear self expression AGAIN, because you (and so many others here) must have missed it, and because so many people here just don’t fucking realise the way they confuse opinion with fact, with conjecture, with speculation, with reason, with confirmation bias, with abject fantasy, with a pov, with a hunch, with “I think/I reckon”, with creative invention, with ambiguity, with prophecy, with self projection, with random late night intoxicated thought bubbles.
Oh fuck it. People today like you just have no idea how their utterances are formed through different ideations. You just think every idea is of equal relative merit because you are ideologically driven by some namby pamby “we are all equal” nonsense and that “everyone’s opinion has equal validity”. I’m sure you’ve got a lot of Participation Awards at home.
Posted by: Jake Blanchard | Apr 22 2024 21:48 utc | 227
Posted by: spare_truth_01 | Apr 22 2024 16:12 utc | 207
Thanks for taking the contrarian position against perfectly good facts, because we’ve read many times before here your endless confirmation bias on how Russia is struggling in everything it is doing. You’re one of those simpleton dildos who thinks that military conflicts don’t present difficulties for both sides. Day to day war tactics are much more complex than you can see from your armchair, poor sookums.
Posted by: Jake Blanchard | Apr 22 2024 21:59 utc | 228
Don’t know if this has been pointed out, but the hype about the destroyed Russian ship was probably bullshit.
https://twitter.com/simpatico771/status/1782528662870360525
⚡️🇷🇺Russia’s 100 year old ship apparently undamaged after particularly pathetic UA propaganda celebrating the Kommuna’s destruction
Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Apr 22 2024 22:05 utc | 229
Posted by: Sarlat La Canède | Apr 22 2024 17:51 utc | 224
I’m a guy, so it would sound odd as it is short for Barbra. But if you are a gal, I’m fine with you using that for me, lol.
Posted by: Babel-17 | Apr 23 2024 0:07 utc | 230
Russia’s 100 year old ship apparently undamaged after particularly pathetic UA propaganda celebrating the Kommuna’s destruction
Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Apr 22 2024 22:05 utc | 229
———————————————————–
If anyone wondered why Russia would keep a ship this old one the books it is because it has an incredible history, including the Battle of Leningrad. It was built as a submarine rescue and support ship and is twin hulled.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_rescue_ship_Kommuna%5D
It was last engaged in retrieval of items and bodies from the Moskva.
Posted by: Acco Hengst | Apr 23 2024 1:34 utc | 231