Israel To Launch Major Escalation?

April 9, 2024

At Naked Capitalism Yves Smith links (thank you) to yesterday's Moon of Alabama piece:

Two Israeli Actions Misfired, Pushed Netanyahoo Into Retreat

She comments:

IMHO, this is a premature call. Israel so far has made only small-beer placating moves. Per above, it is doubling down on attacking Rafah, something the Biden Administration has noisily opposed.

Well, may be.

Yves also says this:

Someone with very strong diplomatic contacts described a specific, major escalation that Israel is primed to make. Would make the Iran embassy strike look like peanuts in terms of ripple effects. Am hoping to get a post from him. It would be hard to think the region does not wind up in a major conflagration if he is correct.

Ominous.

A direct attack on Iran?

Or what else might that major escalation be?

Posted by b on April 9, 2024 at 14:28 UTC | Permalink

Comments

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 10 2024 1:42 utc | 196
A very shallow answer Peter which, by the way, says a lot about you as a person.

Posted by: Siddhartha | Apr 10 2024 1:51 utc | 201

Since some people on this list are kind of snobby and like to talk down to others, I’ll just throw another piece meat into the barbecue pit.
l’etranger also = foreign countries.
a l’etranger = abroad.
It is quite possible that Camus intended his title to have multiple meanings. Writers often do that! In this case, it seems perfectly plausible in light of the ambiguous relationship between France and her colonies (Algeria was actually a departement of France after 1848) and of the identities of pieds-noirs such as Camus and the character Meursault.
Nighty night! Have fun!

Posted by: Jane | Apr 10 2024 1:51 utc | 202

karlof1 | Apr 10 2024 1:26 utc | 191 “Recall Crooke telling the Judge that Gaza is all Hamas and has cred whereas the PA doesn’t.”
Yes. Also did a bit of my own research on the 2006 election. The difference between the way the western elite looked at apartheid South Africa and Israel is also somewhat telling.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 10 2024 1:52 utc | 203

Posted by: james | Apr 9 2024 15:11 utc | 17 what is yves smith prediction track record??
This is the right question. There is a lot of circle jerking on NC. In this world a regular doctor in Tennessee , as long as he is a reader of NC, becomes a world historical figure and noted scholar on all matters. Someone with ‘high level diplomatic contacts’ could be a man who briefly worked in the State Dept. from ’87-89. To be fair, Mercouris sometimes has the same flavor, you can’t tell if he read a tweet from someone he follows or he got a call from Shoigu.
And really, what is the danger of predicting increasing insanity from the Israelis? I have it on good authority Israel will do something truly monstrous and escalatory in the near future… Thanks, Nostradamus.

Posted by: Lukacs | Apr 10 2024 1:55 utc | 204

A very shallow answer Peter
Posted by: Siddhartha | Apr 10 2024 1:51 utc | 200
Suck it up. I have no time for woke bullshit anymore.
A spade is a spade.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 10 2024 1:56 utc | 205

Posted by: Jane | Apr 10 2024 1:33 utc | 195
He was a ranking figure in the British intelligence service (MI6). Need you know more?
Posted by: Siddhartha | Apr 10 2024 1:44 utc | 197
============
As a matter of fact, yes, smarty-pants.

Posted by: Jane | Apr 10 2024 2:05 utc | 206

In French étranger can mean foreigner, outsider, stranger (synonym of inconnu), or a foreign place. Since L’étranger is a work of existentialist literature, its ambiguous title befits the mystery, ambiguity, imprecision, and enigmatic strangeness of the human condition: which is both exceedingly routine, familiar, repetitive, but also inherently, indeed so far insolubly mysterious. As they say life both biological & psychological doesn’t come with an instruction manual.

Posted by: Ludo | Apr 10 2024 2:11 utc | 207

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 10 2024 1:56 utc | 204
So are you the archetypal Australain?

Posted by: Siddhartha | Apr 10 2024 2:14 utc | 208

Could ‘Israel’ be planning a strike on Iranian nuclear power facilities?
The news on the JCPOA has been suspiciously scarce recently …

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Apr 10 2024 2:19 utc | 209

Siddhartha
Throughout history there has always been lesbians and homosexuals. Big deal. Marriage covers many different cultures, always man and woman that will produce a family. Family is the basic building block of any society. Marriage of two men, marriage of two women is woke ideology. Detachment from any form of reality.
That American tranny in Ukraine hugging the nazi’s. Many here were calling it a she. It went back to America, donned male clothing. What to call it?
Your woke crap, I have no time for it.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 10 2024 2:26 utc | 210

Trying to think of practical measures. It has bee suggested here and other places over and over that Iran could or should start bombing Israeli embassies.
Thereby committing same offence as Israel.
Posted by: oldhippie | Apr 9 2024 20:30 utc | 113
The “offense” doesn’t exist.
‘israel’ has proven international law to be null and void.
A system of suppositions, not law.
Therefore Iran bombing ‘israeli’ embassies is at worst a violation of good manners.
There is no Law where some can violate without punishment.

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Apr 10 2024 2:26 utc | 211

Posted by: scorpion | Apr 10 2024 0:59 utc | 177
##########
We are of a compatible mind when it comes to the scientific-materialistic paradigm.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Apr 10 2024 2:28 utc | 212

Posted by: karlof1 | Apr 10 2024 0:55 utc | 175
I oft wonder if Israel is a much bigger issue in the west than in the East, or is it considered just one of many conflicts, smaller and less relevant to the East than Ukraine, about the same as Syria, and bigger and more relevant than Armenia-Azerbaijan, because the East does not have abrahamic lore in any comparison to the Middle East / North Africa and Europe/Americas.
I would suspect so, as the whole Israel thing has a religious dimension simply not a factor in the East.
I am contrasting this to Europe/Americas in the attention of the ignorant masses, where Israel seems to be more important and certainly more interesting to them, than Ukraine.

Posted by: UWDude | Apr 10 2024 2:28 utc | 213

I would make a guess based on this quote from Boris Johnson…
“More alarming still, we are told that an Israeli arms ban is the subject of an active row in Cabinet, with only a handful of ministers positively sticking up for Israel. The contagion has spread pretty wide, and very fast. The proposed embargo is now supported by MPs on all sides, by the former head of MI6, by some former Supreme Court Justices, and by about 600 members of the legal profession, all of them clamouring for us to turn our backs on the only democracy in the Middle East,”
If true, Israels’ leadership would need pallets of audlt diapers. The same process is slowly picking up steam in the US. They would need a major escalation to stop this process by creating a major threat to their existence. Some type of another major false flag like claiming an Iranian missle took out the mosque. That would give the Zionists the Temple Mount. That would create massive tension in the region and that would stop any ideas of cutting off weapons.
Our existance is threatened help US. The Zionists need a few things, the Temple Mount, the land based on the original kingdom, and some slaves to make their lives easier.
Something along those lines… A bunch of spoiled brats they are. How do you deal with spoiled brats? Take their toys away. What do spoiled brats do? Throw a tantrum. Do not expect anything rational from a bunch of spoiled brats.

Posted by: circumpsect | Apr 10 2024 2:32 utc | 214

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 10 2024 2:26 utc | 209
Unforunately the term ‘woke’ has now become a pejorative adjective.
Originally it meant someone who was aware of racial prejudice and discrimination.
How times change.

Posted by: Siddhartha | Apr 10 2024 2:37 utc | 215

Siddhartha | Apr 10 2024 2:37 utc | 214
So the woke are based in reality? I have found they are most racist of all. Zero understanding of other cultures.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 10 2024 2:42 utc | 216

I remember a decade or so ago seeing a picture of Putin surrounded by government officials and their families presumably. It was a candid moment. What I detected on their face was worry and fear. (Russia had just intervened in Syria and cockblocked the empire) I think the fear on their faces was grounded in something that the west can no longer experience. We are so drugged out on fake, that unreality pervades everything in our life: our economy, our government, our media.
The U.S. is not a country. European states under the E.U. are not countries either.
What do you get when everyone is pretending that the place they are living in right now is an actual country when it is not? You get madness. Madness that doesn’t even know its way back. That can not drop the charade because our routine of going to work in a fake country is all we can remember anymore.
Russia is afraid, yes. Because they are not dealing with rational people who inhabit a country of origin. We are now something else, entirely. And my bones hurt from this infernal machine.
Posted by: NemesisCalling | Apr 10 2024 1:00 utc | 178
One of the reasons I hate people who complain about Putin being a wimp, or doing nothing, is because I still remember how weak Russia was in 2014 and 2015.
When the “Assad must go” campaign was the stage of its modus operandi where NATO’s masses attention had been diverted to the point of fugue, I thought, “Here we go again. The west gets away with mass murder, lies and chaos again, and nobody can stop them.”. It was time eighth or ninth in my lifetime by then, IIRC.
In 2015 he pushed back and then froze the madness in Syria. I could not believe it, and declared WWIII had begun.
However, I did note the creeping division and polarization that was starting to bubble to the surface here in America, and thought maybe America was not as strong as I thought, although, I still thought it was highly unlikely Russia even coming away with a draw in Syria. I was triumphantly proclaiming Russia would restore all of Syria in three years, quietly afraid NATO would sill get its way, Assad ended worse than Ghaddafi, while the zionists and neo cons and their billion minions squealed in bloody wargasm.
A ton has changed in ten years, and America has lost almost all culture it had, which was prided on freedoms, perceived freedoms, wealth and patronizing moral superiority “proven” by technological and economic superiority. Now its only cultural bunding norm is its currency, which is still world dominant by far, but its issues are also now bubbling to the surface.

Posted by: UWDude | Apr 10 2024 2:55 utc | 217

circumpsect | Apr 10 2024 2:32 utc | 213
*** Boris said:] The contagion has spread pretty wide, and very fast.***
So did another contagion — called the pandemic. That coke-headed bastard proudly announced he was happy for the bodies of the old, the ill and the disabled to heap up. And failed to introduce measures to limit its spread till conveniently too late. Then his cronies made billions ripping off the public via supply contracts for supposedly protective gear that was total crap. And, let it not be forgotten, the rancid fat arsehole gave certain of his trans-Atlantic corporate cronies a monopoly on vaccine supply … a noteworthy lot of people who had one or more of these propaganda-pimped “experimental” .. whatevers .. injected into them have not been quite the same since (including those who died).
Like the rest of the traitorous UK political Establishment, the former PM is of course keen to give Kiev — and Israel — blank-cheques while imposing austerity in the UK as its own infrastructure and public services continue to crumble or be asset-stripped (often by US predators).

Posted by: Cynic | Apr 10 2024 2:58 utc | 218

Saddam was its man in Iraq until he got uppity and thought he was in charge of Iraq, and that Iraq should be governed for the Iraqi people. Israel is obviously a special case, but the State Dept do have contingency plans for dealing with leaders who go off-script.
…
Posted by: Patroklos | Apr 9 2024 19:31 utc | 98
Excellent secular exegesis
Posted by: canuck | Apr 9 2024 20:09 utc | 105
making any kind of analogy between us control of iraq and supposed us control of israel seems mildly disingenuous. what evidence supports this?

Posted by: abornk | Apr 10 2024 3:11 utc | 219

For decades, the Israelis dealt with the Palestinians with violence. Attacking Gaza after Oct 7th was muscle memory. Like an animal biting someone who stepped on their tail, except this was no accident. Hamas jumped up high and deliberately landed as hard as it could on Israel’s tail, which prompted a vicious response (for the cameras).
I’ve been saying it for a week or two now. Israel has lost. Now the endgame has to play out. That could be a week, a month, or a year. I’d suggest under a year with the UN now talking about statehood for Palestine which will only make the Israelis behave more crazily, which will accelerate their collapse.
Creating a Palestinian state is why Hamas did what it did. To shatter an ossified paradigm. Israel was normalizing the settlement process internationally and forming economic partnerships with KSA, UAE, and India. Palestinians were an issue for very few, even in the Muslim Ummah (all Muslims everywhere).
This situation has also put America into a zugzwang scenario where every move that they make is bad which leads to paralysis and is a loss of initiative. The Yanks are losing their West Asian footprint in Israel, Iraq asked them to leave. The Yemenis have shown that they can choke freedom of passage to death in the region. There is nothing that the US or Western powers can do about it while Yemen provides competitor nations China and Russia free passage.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Apr 10 2024 3:17 utc | 220

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Apr 10 2024 3:17 utc | 219
#####
And … Assad is still in power. 🤣

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Apr 10 2024 3:23 utc | 221

LoveDonbass | Apr 10 2024 3:23 utc | 220 “And … Assad is still in power. ”
There’s quite a list of Assad must go proclaimers who have all gone.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 10 2024 3:29 utc | 222

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Apr 10 2024 1:02 utc | 181
Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 10 2024 1:15 utc | 189
Why did you find it appropriate to identify your foreign minister as a lesbian?
Posted by: Siddhartha | Apr 10 2024 1:28 utc | 192
Don’t worry yourself about that, she and most Aust politicians in the ALP and Liberal–National Coalition would gladly kiss the feet US any politicians without prejudice.

Posted by: Menz | Apr 10 2024 3:31 utc | 223

Hit post to quickly:
kiss the feet of any US politicians without prejudice.

Posted by: Menz | Apr 10 2024 3:33 utc | 224

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Apr 10 2024 3:17 utc | 219
This situation has also put America into a zugzwang scenario where every move that they make is bad which leads to paralysis and is a loss of initiative.

True. I imagine that Putin has a lot to do with engendering this zugzwang business; of course I might just be projecting.
But decades from now, when we are all dead and gone, somebody hopefully will write a masterful history of this period detailing exactly how it is that the Hegemon with its Judeo-Christian Black Money-Magic got well and truly zugzwanged (not to mention schlonged), an extraordinary, extraordinary thing.

Posted by: scorpion | Apr 10 2024 3:41 utc | 225

I imagine that Putin has a lot to do with engendering this zugzwang business; of course I might just be projecting.
Posted by: scorpion | Apr 10 2024 3:41 utc | 224
US is what it is and had to be put down. As Putin says – create the circumstances.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 10 2024 3:57 utc | 226

Doctor SHUTS DOWN Reporter’s INSULTING Al Shifa Hospital Question
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OkaX__X1R7k
Gaza Is Unlike Anything I’ve Ever Seen, Says NGO Head/Ex-CNN Journalist Arwa Damon
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VhQHYJcY7AA

Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Apr 10 2024 4:08 utc | 227

90 Patroklos. There may be people reading this who don’t know “The Stranger.” Maybe they didn’t have the same experience as all high-school’educated’ westerners. Anyway the book and the song are just another cliched expression of liberal guilt –social pathologies of those living in a colonizer nation toward the ‘other’ (Arabs in this case) reduced to the personal ‘story’. How old are ‘The Cure?

Posted by: Lavieja | Apr 10 2024 4:09 utc | 228

Posted by: Honzo | Apr 10 2024 0:53 utc | 174
All in all, good post. I agree with you in spirit and with regard to some names named.
That said, we can’t allow ourselves to become ideological purists with where we get our information. People do wake up at different speeds and junctures of life. Snowden worked for BAH/NSA. Manning for the US Army. Aaron Bushnell for USAF. Even some journalists take the proverbial red pill and begin to expose the system, which always corresponds with their careers being flushed like the battery pods in The Matrix.
Where I am with you is “former” CIA and “ex” MI-6, etc. Hard to trust those guys and it takes a LONG track record of them getting things right where the outcome is NOT favorable to their former employers for me to take them seriously or as a primary source of information.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Apr 10 2024 4:10 utc | 229

2 msm headlines.
Daily mail. Blinken can’t understand why no-one hates hamas
Guardian. Blinken can’t understand why no-one likes Israel
I mildly chuckled at the attempt

Posted by: Hankster | Apr 10 2024 4:15 utc | 230

Posted by: Lavieja | Apr 10 2024 4:09 utc | 227
I’m really curious to see what Patrokolos’ response is to subsequent comments ‘tomorrow’ (although it’s probably mid-afternoon in Oz right now) – he came across as uncharacteristically and unnecessarily rude, and to boot, on someone (me) with whom he has not only agreed in the past, but with someone (me) who’s stood up for him when he was being attacked by others.
And since we’re talking song lyrics, as a result struck me as a little too….
♪ It’s like ray-ay-ain, on your wedding day ♪
♫ A free-eeh ride, when you’ve already paid! ♫
🎶 Like good advice, that you just can’t take…🎶
🎤 And who would’ve thought it’ figure!🎤
A little too ironic!
[and now I await the lecture from someone on how Alanis Morrissette’s song lyrics aren’t actually ironic…LOL]

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Apr 10 2024 4:16 utc | 231

Peter AU1, acknowledging Penny’s sexuality may be bad manners in some social circles, but she and other publicly “out” gay members of our Aussie governments have long since faded into the irrelevant background in general Aussie society ..
But in the end, like most private-life matters, it has nothing to do with their jobs in Parliament. They are all neocons regardless of who they marry or date or create a family with. Even the far more common heterosexual male sexual predators and even celebrity or govt sex scandals dont really blip on Aussie radars unless it spills over into broader political conflict.
So from another Aussie, I dont think it needed to be pointed out either .. unneccessary, irrelevant at best, just personally nasty and provocative at worst.
As for “woke” .. my understanding is like yours, originating in racism awareness in the US, but almost immediately Latched onto all sorts of fictional “identities” like trans – which has nothing to do with gayness, whether socially, culturally, legally etc and the civil rights struggle against discriminatory laws and practices against homosexuality, were long done and dusted in the West so gay activist organisations should have wound down .. but I guess like NATO, with the original ‘enemy’ defeated, they had to justify their continued existence by creating “oppressed identities” or “enemies” to advocate and lobby for and buy political parties to keep or expand their share of the pies in Big Pharma and related industries.
…but in the case of “wokism” and trans .. big US billionaire bucks forced them to be lumped together and written into stupid laws. Including all the stupid laws about “hate speech”, which in turn has been extended and extended and extended

Posted by: Rain | Apr 10 2024 4:18 utc | 232

97 Jo. I’m afraid it seemed like business as usual — pretending to pull-in reins on the obscene entity. Which reading Bevin and other posters on moa tell me yes, fear the worst.
GAZA WIll LIVE!

Posted by: Lavieja | Apr 10 2024 4:23 utc | 233

Posted by: Rain | Apr 10 2024 4:18 utc | 231
I almost posted in response to PeterAU1, but decided it could wait.
As for “woke” .. my understanding is like yours, originating in racism awareness in the US, but almost immediately Latched onto all sorts of fictional “identities” like trans…
That’s actually where you’re both sort of right…and wrong. As an American with long ties to the black community, I know what I’m talking about. “Woke” simply meant – to black people – a white or other non-black person who actually knew the history from slavery to civil rights to Jim and Jane Crow to structural racism in the police and prosecutorial/criminal justice system in the USA. So on that you’re mostly right.
But the only people who “latched onto” it and started injecting/interjecting the term into everyday conversation or “culture war” BS were the right-leaning culture warriors who themselves co-opted the term from the regular black folks here that had a very simple, straightforward meaning for the term.
“Stay woke” or “that person is safe; they’re woke” was just an American black person’s way of conveying a message within the black community. As with many, many terms, the right has co-opted it. “Woke” only entered the dictionary less than 8 years ago despite being in use for over 40 years. That should tell us all we need to know.
IOW – TL/DR – anyone using the word “woke” now, is not using it in the way its original coiners intended.
Even more TL/DR: Why do any of us even care about the word “woke” anymore? It’s a figment of old (mostly white conservative) dudes’ imagination by this point.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Apr 10 2024 4:29 utc | 234

Rain 231
To my best recollection “woke” wasn’t latched onto by liberals/democrats for maybe 50 years rather than immediately. But once they latched on they began misusing it immediately.
Not disagreeing with your comment otherwise.

Posted by: Osori | Apr 10 2024 4:31 utc | 235

Isn’t it a sun tzu mantra to always leave you enemy with an escape route. Netanyahu is backed into a corner with his Zionist hubris of rules apply only to gentiles. 6 months of winning has destroyed Gaza but expanded the war. The resistance is going for strategic targets not flattening homes with Palestinians in it. Ports , airports, fuel storage , military bases, specific targets of high tech equipment vital for Israel’s dominance. Only a few here would read widely to even know this, msm sure aren’t writing about it. So as military commanders watching their tactical superiority disappearing, one thinks a desperate gambit to force the Americans and vassals into conflict is the only option to stave off a military defeat and a economic BDS that’s only gathering global momentum. UN sanctions haven’t even come yet.

Posted by: Hankster | Apr 10 2024 4:33 utc | 236

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 10 2024 4:33 utc | 237

I had to look into it further. Here’s Leadbelly in the spoken comments of a live performance during the 30s or 40s reminding his audience to stay woke.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VrXfkPViFIE
Skip to about 3:30 timestamp if you’re not into the music.
Go to Alabama and ya better watch out
The landlord’ll get ya, gonna jump and shout
Scottsboro Scottsboro Scottsboro boys
Tell ya what it all about
Go to Alabama and ya better watch out
The landlord’ll get ya, gonna jump and shout
Scottsboro Scottsboro Scottsboro boys
Tell ya what it all about
I’m gonna talk to Joe Louis
And it all angered me
Don’t even try to think about it
Alabama ree
Go to Alabama and ya better watch out
The landlord’ll get ya, gonna jump and shout
Scottsboro Scottsboro Scottsboro boys
Tell ya all about
Go to Alabama and ya better watch out
The landlord’ll get ya, gonna jump and shout
Scottsboro Scottsboro Scottsboro boys
Tell ya all about
I’m gonna tell all the colored people
Even the old nigger here
Don’t ya ever go to Alabama
And try to live
Go to Alabama and ya better watch out
The landlord’ll get ya, gonna jump and shout
Scottsboro Scottsboro Scottsboro boys
Gon’ tell ya all about
Go to Alabama and ya better watch out
The landlord’ll get ya, gonna jump and shout
Scottsboro Scottsboro Scottsboro boys
Tell ya all about
Go to Alabama and ya better watch out
The landlord’ll get ya, gonna jump and shout
Scottsboro Scottsboro Scottsboro boys
Tell ya all about
I’m gonna tell all the colored people
Livin’ in Harlem swing
Don’t ya ever go to Alabama
Just try to sing
Go to Alabama and ya better watch out
The landlord’ll get ya, gonna jump and shout
Scottsboro Scottsboro Scottsboro boys
Gon’ tell ya all about
Go to Alabama and ya better watch out
The landlord’ll get ya, gonna jump and shout
Scottsboro Scottsboro Scottsboro boys
Tell it all about
I’m gonna tell all the colored people
Livin’ in Harlem swing
Don’t ya ever go to Alabama
Just try to sing
Go to Alabama and ya better watch out
The landlord’ll get ya, gonna jump and shout
Scottsboro Scottsboro Scottsboro boys
Tell what it’s all about
Go to Alabama and ya better watch out
The landlord’ll get ya, gonna jump and shout
Scottsboro Scottsboro Scottsboro boys
Tell what it’s all about

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Apr 10 2024 4:34 utc | 238

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 10 2024 4:33 utc | 236
You Aussies need to stop already. “Woke” has NOTHING to do with gender -OR- climate!
FFS, man. Please.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Apr 10 2024 4:35 utc | 239

@ titmouse | Apr 9 2024 22:58 utc | 153
thanks! what does it all mean? i was a bit confused by it all… cheers..
@ Lukacs | Apr 10 2024 1:55 utc | 203
thanks for your interpretation on that… essentially the life is unpredictable, but people continue to make predictions all the time.. maybe there is some weird rivalry between bernhard and yves.. i don’t know… i don’t go on NC, so i am not following yves closely or at all although i do get briefings here at moa from time to time! the reality for me is there is very few people i listen to or follow.. i try to follow those who i respect and they are few and far between.. cheers..

Posted by: james | Apr 10 2024 4:37 utc | 240

Tom_Q_Collins | Apr 10 2024 4:35 utc | 238
Bullshit. Start talking to a rabid woke. And regardless of origin, I’m talking about the current woke.
Both Russia and China separate tolerance from woke. The uproar just because I said a lesbian was a lesbian. Well I feel like having a good old brawl at the moment.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 10 2024 4:43 utc | 241

the alternative is to post the ot stuff on the moa week in review… but it seems impossible to get people to follow that logic..

Posted by: james | Apr 10 2024 4:44 utc | 242

Posted by: Osori | Apr 10 2024 4:31 utc | 234
Neither liberals (perhaps other than center- and far-right corporofascists) nor progressives latched onto the term “woke” or “wokeness” – EVER.
It’s a right-wing American replacement for “politically correct” that serves as a catch-all for anything they don’t like.
There’s a good reason it didn’t enter the majority lexicon until the past 4 years despite being used by blacks for probably the last 100, and known to me for only the last 40.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Apr 10 2024 4:44 utc | 243

posted by: LoveDonbass | Apr 10 2024 3:17 utc | 219
sounds really nice but i think you are getting way ahead of yourself … israel has many more powerful friends and loser satrapies than the Palestinians do.
imo the israeli zionists – ie 90% of all jews in Palestine – need to be forcibly evicted – that requires force – that requires war – and israel has nukes and are evil enough to use them.
imo the US might need to be militarily defeated first …. but we’ll see. the UN meanwhile is a useless piece of shit … recognizing palestine there will change nothing on the ground. only overwhelming force will work against the zionist crazies …. a gun to the head iow.

Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Apr 10 2024 4:46 utc | 244

Rain | Apr 10 2024 4:18 utc | 231
Tolerance and woke. There is a major difference. Nothing forced them to be lumped together. And I separate them. Woke is gender and climate.
You pop out to crap on about this? Seems like the most important thing on your agenda? What do you think of Admiral Rachel? Biden diversity?
Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 10 2024 4:33 utc | 236
…Nuclear WW3, genocide, global poverty, wage slavery, basic political rights… all vastly more important than race, gender, sexual preference.
Climate is a real issue, but there is no fixing it without the overthrow of our ruling class and their system of capitalism which literally rewards the destruction of our ecosystem. So, to be a single issue climate obsessive is essentially to be a useful idiot of the same ruling class currently destroying it.
Kinda see where Pete is coming from…

Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Apr 10 2024 4:48 utc | 245

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 10 2024 4:43 utc | 240
Bullshit my ass. Bullshit is another American term that you non-Americans love to toss around as though you know what it means on an instinctual level.
You’re going off the Fox News/Breitbart/Elon/Trumper “definition” of a word you have zero idea about in any way.
Feel free to use words in any way you want, but your use of the term “rabid woke” is just like me saying “moron European/Aussie fascist lapdog sucker” as though it describes anything or anyone remotely definable.
I will repeat: Do you actually know anything about the actual/original/intended meaning of the word “woke” prior to your preferred online and on-air culture warriors MONETIZING it?

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Apr 10 2024 4:48 utc | 246

Posted by: james | Apr 10 2024 4:44 utc | 241
Is there really a point at this….point?

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Apr 10 2024 4:49 utc | 247

And I see what he means about strangers just “popping up” to chime in about secondary issues. It’s spooky. They got nothing to say about the key issues today, but then pop up and start attacking regulars with the old, green “racist, sexist, homophobic” crapola (a yank word, if there ever was one).

Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Apr 10 2024 4:52 utc | 248

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Apr 10 2024 4:29 utc | 233
Scroll of Truth:
“Woke”, was stolen from black people by upper class white women, who thought they were down for the struggle because they caught some lingo, who within months ended up being the laughingstock of the cult of kek, who then made the term what it means today.
I was online dating at the time in Seattle, about 2015, and many womens profiles used it unironically.
By 2016, the term was flipped on its head so far even black men quit using it.
This is similar to “fake news”, a NYT propaganda boardroom term invented because the rubes were too dumb to understand “misinformation” and “disinformation” because it was multisyllabic vocabulary of the erudite.
The eye of kek landed upon the NYT article premiering the new weaponized term, “fake news”, and the ensuing push by MSM to regularize its use.
Through the use of meme magic, and perhaps Dilbert Cartoonist Scott Adams’ hypnotic suggestion, Trump said to a CNN reporter, “You are fake news”, a couple pf months after the weapon’s premier, and many keks spilled forth, and much dankness wafted through the memo-sphere, and “fake news” was turned against its forger.

Posted by: UWDude | Apr 10 2024 4:57 utc | 249

Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Apr 10 2024 4:52 utc | 247
…And I see what he means about strangers just “popping up” to chime in about secondary issues…
Not remotely sure about what you had in mind there, but if you think that us denizens of MoA are going to be able change the trajectory of history in Ukraine, Gaza or the Global South, if only we could cut through or cut out all the discussions *bullshit* and *wokeism* occurring almost 250 comments into yesterday’s thread, then maybe you’re a tad more optimistic than I am.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Apr 10 2024 4:58 utc | 250

@ 245 tom… i suppose it happens as the threads wear on into a few hundred posts, people let it all hang out.. it happens… so, maybe not.. i suppose this is the nature of social places – things dissipate and get long in the tooth.. how many times has this conversation on woke – trans and etc. etc. come up? i too kind of see where peter au and Ahenobarbus @244 is coming from too.. what is important here? the identify politics seems to want to distract from the horrible shit that is happening at present in gaza or ukraine… maybe that is the point of it regardless what one calls it?

Posted by: james | Apr 10 2024 5:00 utc | 251

Tom_Q_Collins | Apr 10 2024 4:48 utc | 245
We also have bulls in Australia. And cows. A bloke I was working for when younger, said they didn’t have any shoes when kids, so on a frosty morning would jump from cow pat to cow pat to keep their feet warm.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 10 2024 5:00 utc | 252

going to read and then off to bed.. tomorrow is another day … adios!

Posted by: james | Apr 10 2024 5:01 utc | 253

Peter AU 1 @ 236:
The term to use for what you describe as “wokeness” is Identity Politics. This covers issues relating to race, religion and gender and the way in which the language and definitions used in discussing such issues are deliberately distorted and defined into something else altogether to advance an insidious divide-and-rule agenda that baits targeted groups and victims, and encourages people to abuse them in the belief that they (the abusers) are actually fighting discrimination.
In your previous comments, pointing out that the Australian Foreign Minister is a lesbian, without referring to other things she has done in the past that one would think she should not have done (given that she is a lesbian), was unnecessary and, as you have already seen in comments responding to yours, potentially inflammatory. Referring to Penny Wong as a lesbian only makes sense if, for example, she supports or has supported legislation favouring transgender women participating in women’s sports competitions or compelling biological women to share funding for safe spaces or other resources with transgender women.
It would have been better to have said that Penny Wong generally toes the government line on most issues, and on the occasions where she dissents, she does not stray far from the ALP agenda or she qualifies her position, as if conscious that she needs to preserve some semblance of being an independent thinker or a self-styled rebel. In that respect, she is something of a gatekeeper.

Posted by: Refinnejenna | Apr 10 2024 5:02 utc | 254

Posted by: UWDude | Apr 10 2024 4:57 utc | 248
Let’s stick to “woke” and ignore “fake news” for now. I think you have a point. What I’m saying is that the term/idea of “woke” or “wokeism” didn’t even come close to cracking the ‘big platform’ media or social media until within the 4 years. And in every traceable case it wasn’t “upper class white women” doing so unless you can find me some examples of Madcow or the like introducing the concept to a broad audience at the time, rather than who it really was – the Breitbart right-wing types that actually did so.
Yeah, sure many dumbass liberal white women with “black friends” probably knew the term. I actually grew up in a Pentecostal religious sect that was so poor and fucked up they HAD to send me to public school with mostly black and hispanic kids, so I learned the word a long time ago, and it’s got nothing to do with how the Hannitys and Aussies/Euros use it now.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Apr 10 2024 5:03 utc | 255

my reply was to tom @ 246 not 245 as mentioned initially..

Posted by: james | Apr 10 2024 5:03 utc | 256

Posted by: Siddhartha | Apr 9 2024 23:44 utc | 160
I think your explanation helps broaden the meaning, Siddhartha. Many eons ago I flew on a French airline. They had one line through customs for the French, and another clearly marked ‘Etranger’ — which meant ‘Everyone Else’. So that’s my translation: ‘Everyone who isn’t a frenchman or woman’. I wonder if that particular meaning is also implied, somewhat tongue in cheek, for this particular novel.

Posted by: juliania | Apr 10 2024 5:03 utc | 257

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Apr 10 2024 4:58 utc | 249
Wokism has damaged America and Europes war waging capabilities. It is one of the major factors in the eventual defeat of the west by the east and the multipolar world, as it is far more advanced than in the rest of the world, possibly even useful idiots to be discarded at empire’s defeat.
Some people lament this, some embrace it, and some laugh at it.

Posted by: UWDude | Apr 10 2024 5:03 utc | 258

what is important here? the identify politics seems to want to distract from the horrible shit that is happening at present in gaza or ukraine…
Posted by: james | Apr 10 2024 5:00 utc | 250
Add in Syria ect ect.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 10 2024 5:06 utc | 259

Israel threatens to bomb nuke sites as Iran backs down from direct attack – report
Like I said, no one is doing anything to Israel aside from pin prick attacks meant to annoy and disrupt.

Posted by: bored | Apr 10 2024 5:06 utc | 260

Posted by: UWDude | Apr 10 2024 5:03 utc | 257
In which case the usage is nothing whatsoever to do with the original term “woke.” Black people would never, ever think to use the term “wokeism” – and black people fought harder and more effectively in almost every foreign US war than any other group.
So yes, I think we’re probably in agreement. “Woke” – the original term and “Wokeism” – the epithet (albeit accurate in your usage) du jour are totally different things.
And like you pointed out (but didn’t provide the real reason), no self-respecting black person who’s tuned into the “culture wars” would EVER use the term “woke” in this day and age, because it’s been co-opted and ruined by a bunch of pissed off white folks.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Apr 10 2024 5:08 utc | 261

Refinnejenna | Apr 10 2024 5:02 utc | 253 “potentially inflammatory.”
🙂
Refinnejenna, say Wong had been a carpenter before entering politics and I said our carpenter foreign minister?

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 10 2024 5:15 utc | 262

because it’s been co-opted and ruined by a bunch of pissed off white folks.
Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Apr 10 2024 5:08 utc | 260
Or because its meaning has changed, and now means something most black men detest, regardless of the minstrel shows capitalizing on white guilt.
Much like gay used to mean happy. People didnt stop using it to describe themselves as happy, because it was “stolen” and they dont like stolen words (lol… Black anger because a slang was stolen), but because they did not want to identify themselves as homosexual.
Also, giving credit to Breitbart for turning woke around is an insult to kek. The big influencers were people like kim dotcom, sam hyde, seth rich, julien assange and the mysterious hacker known as 4chan. Breitbart and Drudge were already well known as normie shit by then.

Posted by: UWDude | Apr 10 2024 5:17 utc | 263

165 Aleph_Null. “Fathers and Sons” (can’t underline) is one of my favorites also. But I have understood nihilism within the Russian context of that movement during that time to mean it is necessary to get rid entirely of what is in order to replace it with what should and must be, rather than the postmodern negativity of believing in nothing. Or here is way of saying what Bazarov is — destroy what is within the context of a future, although I think he didn’t take responsibility to create the future.

Posted by: Lavieja | Apr 10 2024 5:19 utc | 264

Posted by: UWDude | Apr 10 2024 5:17 utc | 262
Like I said, the “meaning has changed” to a bunch of pissed off whites, and therefore downstream to the black community who can’t use it anymore.
Julian Assange??? Please expound. Trump and his anti-woke AG w/ Mike Pimpeous fucking indicted him. Am I missing something?
4chan wasn’t a hacker; it was an Internet meme message board that got overrun with disaffected (mostly) white kids with broadband.
Did you mean Anonymous? Because even that group – which spawned from 2chan and 4chan is really hard to pin down.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Apr 10 2024 5:23 utc | 265

Tom_Q_Collins | Apr 10 2024 4:48 utc | 245
Posted by: Siddhartha | Apr 10 2024 2:37 utc | 214
etc etc
Australia is a very diverse polity and culture which is generally very open minded and welcoming of the broad diversity of individuality in people and their interests, from gays lesbians (modern minded lgbtqi) and all other kinds of variations in international cultures food and clothing tastes music ancestral / racial history and the like. PeterAU1 is the resident extreme exception to the Norm.
He he-man muscle sports Gays are common and accepted and have been for decades here. It’s just NO BIG DEAL.
In the 1960s we were fairly racists and disliked “Poofs” (because they were an easy target to bully – more from ignorance and pride than nastiness) so not in a serious violent way as has been in other places in this earth. The woke bs has been hijacked by the typical narrow minded ultra conservative redneck brigade whose reactionary bs is typically based on unfounded fear and plain old small minded bigotry. Don’t worry about it – it is quite rare despite the outspoken few who falsely claim to speak for everyone in the country. Try to ignore it or just deal with the specifics of the individual concerned. (shrug) 2 cents spent

Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Apr 10 2024 5:24 utc | 266

UWDude: do you want the Black leftist take on “woke”?
https://blackagendareport.com/search?key=woke

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Apr 10 2024 5:25 utc | 267

re so not in a serious violent way as has been in other places in this earth. ….
Of course gays have been bashed up and murdered just for being gay in Australia too …. so it’s not all good. Like everywhere else, Australia is not entirely free of violent agro idiots and assholes.

Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Apr 10 2024 5:28 utc | 268

Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Apr 10 2024 5:24 utc | 265
The entire population of Australia is about 1/3 – 3/5 of the NYC and LA greater metro area combined.
Fine, it’s “diverse” (if not populous) but I’m just being realistic with the numbers. And trust me, someone tied into the US-AU-NZ-EU MIC the MAJORITY of Aussies are fine with the fantasy of “containing China.”

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Apr 10 2024 5:28 utc | 269

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