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March 17, 2024
Ukraine Open Thread 2024-081
Only for news & views directly related to the war in Ukraine. The current open thread for other issues is here. Please stick to the topic. Contribute facts. Do not attack other commentators.
Comments
SlowSoft | Mar 17 2024 14:18 utc | 548 Posted by: tesla | Mar 17 2024 14:52 utc | 1 Bill Clinton praised Putin’s honesty: Posted by: Afro | Mar 17 2024 14:58 utc | 2 SlowSoft | Mar 17 2024 14:18 utc | 548 Posted by: Moscow Exile | Mar 17 2024 15:09 utc | 3 Lord of War reporting an alleged drone attack on a Russian MI-8 helicopter in Transnistria. Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Mar 17 2024 15:16 utc | 4 Posted by: Afro | Mar 17 2024 14:58 utc | 2 Posted by: Johan Kaspar | Mar 17 2024 15:18 utc | 5 Re: Post by: YetAnotherAnon on Mar 17 2024 15:16 @ #4 Posted by: Quid Me Vexari | Mar 17 2024 15:32 utc | 6 On top of the attack in Transnistria, another Russian oil refinery was successfully attacked today, and more civilians were killed in Belgorod. Far from being on the defensive, it seems like Ukraine/NATO is taking the fight directly to Russia. Posted by: bored | Mar 17 2024 16:00 utc | 7 Posted by: bored | Mar 17 2024 16:00 utc | 7 Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Mar 17 2024 16:05 utc | 8
https://twitter.com/NovichokRossiya/status/1769394294584922164 Posted by: unimperator | Mar 17 2024 16:07 utc | 9 On top of the attack in Transnistria, another Russian oil refinery was successfully attacked today, and more civilians were killed in Belgorod. Far from being on the defensive, it seems like Ukraine/NATO is taking the fight directly to Russia. Posted by: Micron | Mar 17 2024 16:11 utc | 10 @10 micron Posted by: Neofeudalfuture | Mar 17 2024 16:19 utc | 11 its passivity and weakness (not to say cowardice) is pushing us all into the abyss. Paul Craig Roberts was right. Posted by: Peter AU1 | Mar 17 2024 16:19 utc | 12 Somebody is happy today, “bored ukrop” i “micro macron”! Enjoy while you can, it won’t last! Posted by: Preki | Mar 17 2024 16:20 utc | 13
https://t.me/rezident_ua/22053
https://t.me/rezident_ua/22054 Posted by: Down South | Mar 17 2024 16:34 utc | 14 Russian attacks against NATO territory would be exactly what would be used to convince western public opinion to support mobilization, with all its attendant costs, which while would not yield anywhere near the amount of equipment pro western supporters imagine would still be a non trivial amount. Posted by: Satepestage | Mar 17 2024 16:39 utc | 15 ts passivity and weakness (not to say cowardice) is pushing us all into the abyss. Paul Craig Roberts was right. Posted by: ableman | Mar 17 2024 16:46 utc | 16 Down South: “Our source in the General Staff said that the Ukrainian army cannot stabilize the front in the Avdeevsky direction due to intense shelling by artillery and aircraft.” Posted by: Anonymous | Mar 17 2024 16:46 utc | 17 The clock is ticking for Russia – its passivity and weakness (not to say cowardice) is pushing us all into the abyss. Posted by: Marvin | Mar 17 2024 16:51 utc | 18 “I judge each side how I judge women. By their actions, not their words.” Posted by: Victor G. | Mar 17 2024 16:53 utc | 19 a question to all energy engineers reading this blog: kommersant says that atmospheric and vacuum units were damaged in the latest refinery attack : https://www.kommersant.ru/doc/6578527 Posted by: gigi | Mar 17 2024 16:53 utc | 20 The silly propaganda line for the Western MSM today is the Thompson Reuters feed this morning portraying the lines of voters going in to the polling places as: “Thousands of “Navalny” demonstrators protesting Putin by lining up to vote.” You simply can’t make up sophomoric garbage this laughable. Whoever the spook twerp was who came up with that line for today must have been deep into the sauce last night. Posted by: wilsonK | Mar 17 2024 16:58 utc | 21 Attacking civilians or oil refineries are terrorist attacks that only have value as propaganda. Instinctively, I would like to see a strong Russian response, but the Russian strategy is the correct one and it will work out in the end: they are systematically destroying Ukrainian soldiers and NATO equipment with minimum losses. (Yes, civilians dying in a terrorist attack is tragic, but that doesn’t mean the Ukraine is any closer to advancing into Russia.) Posted by: Victor Scarpia | Mar 17 2024 17:04 utc | 22 Posted by: Victor Scarpia | Mar 17 2024 17:04 utc | 22 Posted by: unimperator | Mar 17 2024 17:08 utc | 24 NATO citizens have been willing to accept exploding prices and crumbling economies in order to fight a monster. They will not accept those hardships when they realize their own governments are the monsters, not the guy in Russia. Posted by: Satepestage | Mar 17 2024 17:11 utc | 25 Heureusement pour nous les occidentaux, Poutine garde calme et sang froid. Posted by: Dubourg | Mar 17 2024 17:14 utc | 26 @17anonymous Posted by: Neofeudalfuture | Mar 17 2024 17:16 utc | 27 Posted by: Neofeudalfuture | Mar 17 2024 17:16 utc | 27 Posted by: unimperator | Mar 17 2024 17:22 utc | 28 About Pope and “white flag”. Horrors of mobilization seep to Western press, eg. Washington Post cited by b. Kidnapping scenes and resistance scenes circulate, I know them from Military Summary, and what is germane in the context of Pope, there is resistance in Galicia, the part of Ukraine that got converted to Greek Catholic rite of Roman Catholic Church (by Polish lords in late 17th and 18 century, that was undone under Russian rule elsewhere). IMHO, the Pope was responding to the requests of his Catholic faithfuls. Posted by: Piotr Berman | Mar 17 2024 17:23 utc | 29 Posted by: bored | Mar 17 2024 16:00 utc | 7 Posted by: Capricorne | Mar 17 2024 17:34 utc | 30 @28 unimperator Posted by: Neofeudalfuture | Mar 17 2024 17:39 utc | 31 An assessment of the current state of play: Posted by: the pessimist | Mar 17 2024 17:45 utc | 32 I judge each side how I judge women. By their actions, not their words. Posted by: Honzo | Mar 17 2024 17:47 utc | 33 American funding was stopped because A) they were running out of Ukrainians, and B) they were not getting sufficient returns on investment. Posted by: Peter AU1 | Mar 17 2024 17:49 utc | 34 re: Afro | Mar 17 2024 14:58 utc | 2 Posted by: Perimetr | Mar 17 2024 18:01 utc | 35 American funding was stopped because A) they were running out of Ukrainians, and B) they were not getting sufficient returns on investment. Posted by: Honzo | Mar 17 2024 18:03 utc | 36 Posted by: Neofeudalfuture | Mar 17 2024 16:19 utc | 11 Posted by: badjoke | Mar 17 2024 18:06 utc | 37 Hey everyone. Posted by: lex talionis | Mar 17 2024 18:09 utc | 38 Oops. Lviv (Lemberg) at that time was in the Austro Hungarian empire when Sacher Masoch was alive. Posted by: lex talionis | Mar 17 2024 18:15 utc | 39 Posted by: Marvin | Mar 17 2024 16:51 utc | 18 Posted by: AI | Mar 17 2024 18:20 utc | 40
This is absurd cope.
What other option exactly is there left?
What alternative universe are people living in?
As has been explained many times, Putin has been losing support from the rest of the world, not gaining it by being so weak. Remember that Samarkand summit in September 2022 when everyone was at peak multipolarity-Eurasianist delusion? What are the main participants in it and some other “friends” of Russia doing right now? Shall we run a quick summary?
When Russian gas stations hang up the “out of gas” signs, we will see whether the only value of these strikes is propaganda.
Because the turn-the-other-cheek approach has absolutely not expanded the war. To deep inside Russia…
Taking out Ukraine in a blitzkrieg back in 2022 would have ended the war right then and there. And we wouldn’t be in this situation. NATO was stil scared back then
Peak delusions right here.
They are not hitting fuel tanks, they are hitting the distilation columns. The most sensitive and hard to repair parts. And small payload drone work very well on refineries because refineries by their very nature only need a spark to go up in flames. Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Mar 17 2024 18:27 utc | 41 I wrote here for some time about being able to hear the printing presses running continuously after 2008 when the US debt was $800 billion and now it is $34+ trillion. Posted by: financial matters | Mar 17 2024 18:33 utc | 42 I find it interesting that after the strike close to the place and time when the Greek PM was in Odessa first Macron and now Grant Shapps cancelled trips there, Shapps was supposed to visit Odessa, maybe Macron too. Strange too, after so much recent bluster and chest pounding. They definitely planned on following up the bold talk with a trip. Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Mar 17 2024 18:40 utc | 43 @SB Posted by: Neofeudalfuture | Mar 17 2024 18:41 utc | 44 Whew! I hate to follow such a great amount of verbal diarhea. It might run down the page onto me. This comment from Down South “The Ukrainian Armed Forces have now entered a phase where they are losing more infantry per day than they are mobilizing new ones.” is telling. I have thought of Nathan Hale many times in the last week. For those who were not indoctrinated by US schools, he is the Revolutionary spy who said as the noose was being tightened around his neck “I regret that I have but one life to give for my country.” It is beginning to look as though Ukraine is running out of Nathan Hales. Perhaps SB can volunteer soon and talk the Russians into submission. Posted by: Quid Me Vexari | Mar 17 2024 18:46 utc | 45 lex talionis | Mar 17 2024 18:09 utc | 38 Posted by: Peter AU1 | Mar 17 2024 18:53 utc | 46 Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Mar 17 2024 18:40 utc | 43 Posted by: unimperator | Mar 17 2024 18:55 utc | 47 LightYearsFromHome@43….well foreign diplomats and dignitaries have been thumbing their noses at Russia, flying in and out of 404 like they owned the place…. Posted by: sean the leprechaun | Mar 17 2024 18:57 utc | 48 Honzo | Mar 17 2024 18:03 utc | 36 Posted by: Peter AU1 | Mar 17 2024 19:01 utc | 49 @Honzo | Mar 17 2024 18:03 utc | 36 Posted by: LuReJia | Mar 17 2024 19:08 utc | 50 The USUKIS/CIA/Mossad/MI Conglomerate must’ve installed ALL the current European and EU NATO Sycophants and Order Takers. What a coup! EU countries self destruct as ordered. What a sick, demented world! Posted by: Chaka Khagan | Mar 17 2024 19:12 utc | 51 Posted by: financial matters | Mar 17 2024 18:33 utc | 42 Posted by: unimperator | Mar 17 2024 19:13 utc | 52 Dear and honored Vladimir Vladimirowitsch! Posted by: Aarsupilani | Mar 17 2024 19:17 utc | 53 @52 Posted by: unimperator | Mar 17 2024 19:20 utc | 54 @Aarsupilani | Mar 17 2024 19:17 utc | 53 Posted by: the pessimist | Mar 17 2024 19:20 utc | 55 Posted by: Aarsupilani | Mar 17 2024 19:17 utc | 53 Posted by: donten | Mar 17 2024 19:23 utc | 56 Posted by: Peter AU1 | Mar 17 2024 16:19 utc | 12 Posted by: Naive | Mar 17 2024 19:23 utc | 57 And then Russia will be done. Posted by: Satepestage | Mar 17 2024 19:25 utc | 58 Posted by: Aarsupilani | Mar 17 2024 19:17 utc | 53 Posted by: Naive | Mar 17 2024 19:25 utc | 59 Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Mar 17 2024 18:27 utc | 41 Posted by: Naive | Mar 17 2024 19:29 utc | 60 Aarsupilani @ 53 Posted by: Suresh | Mar 17 2024 19:38 utc | 61 Au secours, la France mon beau et doux pays est dirigé par un malade mental, sniffeur de coke et marie avec un transexuel. Posted by: Dubourg | Mar 17 2024 19:45 utc | 62 Au secours, la France mon beau et doux pays est dirigé par un malade mental, sniffeur de coke et marie avec un transexuel. Posted by: Dubourg | Mar 17 2024 19:45 utc | 63 Posted by: Dubourg | Mar 17 2024 19:45 utc | 62/63 Posted by: Matthew | Mar 17 2024 19:50 utc | 64 Some washing powder manufacturers monopolize supermarket shelves. They sell the same washing powder under half a dozen different brands, in order to get maximum shelf space for themselves, and push out competitors. Don’t know why this crossed my mind reading this blog. Posted by: Passerby | Mar 17 2024 20:10 utc | 65 FREE DRINKS AT THE BAR ALL EVENING FOLKS! Posted by: HERMIUS | Mar 17 2024 20:17 utc | 66
Scorched Earth, that’s USA UK Brussels fallback plan, leave Russia land that looks like the surface of the Moon. Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Mar 17 2024 20:20 utc | 67 gigi @ 20 Posted by: circumspect | Mar 17 2024 20:25 utc | 69 Au secours, la France mon beau et doux pays est dirigé par un malade mental, sniffeur de coke et marie avec un transexuel. Posted by: Passerby | Mar 17 2024 20:30 utc | 70 The defense west of Avdeevka that slowed Russia down was a wave of counter attacks. And that’s because there weren’t prepared defensive lines for those retreating troops. Everyone has consistently commented that preparing a large scale breakthrough is difficult on the modern battlefield because it requires concentrating forces and equipment. Had Russia done that and there was a successful HIMARS strike, people like shadowbanned would be here immediately to tell us how dumb the Russian MoD is. Instead the crew tells us how dumb they are because they didn’t exploit the fall of Avdeevka. Posted by: Lex | Mar 17 2024 20:30 utc | 71 Some interesting memes surfacing about the corruption in the Russian 2024 elections, but the evidence presented comes from the establishment’s fortifying of the 2020 elections in the US. There is definitely a seismic shift occurring, with tremors increasingly starting to radiate from across SM. Posted by: Milites | Mar 17 2024 20:31 utc | 72 This CNN headline on the MS greeting page caught my eye: “Putin set to extend one man-rule in Russia after stage-managed election devoid of credible opposition.” First sentence “President Vladimir Putin is set to tighten his grip on the country he has ruled since the turn of the century, with early results from Russia’s stage-managed election indicating a predictably large victory for the Kremlin leader in a result that was a foregone conclusion.” Posted by: Mike R | Mar 17 2024 20:47 utc | 73
Russia must play this game. It cannot escalate against the stronger opponent. Russia can only go nuclear against the West. Conventionally, Russia is weaker against the whole NATO and France is too far away. Posted by: vargas | Mar 17 2024 20:49 utc | 74 Bill Clinton praised Putin’s honesty: Posted by: Acco Hengst | Mar 17 2024 20:54 utc | 75 So, Russia cannot attack NATO countries. Posted by: vargas | Mar 17 2024 20:55 utc | 76 3/4 of France would be out on the streets banging pots and pans and cheering his demise. Posted by: rk | Mar 17 2024 20:58 utc | 78 Dima says that the stories about “collapse of Ukraine” are just maskirovka and that Ukraine is preserving shells and that we can accept a huge Ukro offensive. Posted by: vargas | Mar 17 2024 21:00 utc | 79 Pepe Escobar threw out that in the new administration Lavrov might be replaced. I don’t know enough about the pantheon of Russian honchos to make an educated guess and Pepe is usually so far out over his skis he’s already in the apre ski bar holding a beer while his tail is still getting off the lift, but if the last two years was 1939-1941, then Russia should best reorganize for 1942-1945. Maybe time for some cold hard bastards for the west to talk to, Naryshkin, Patrushev, Medvedev instead of Lavrov? Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Mar 17 2024 21:05 utc | 81 vargas @ 79
Duh. I keep saying it, here it is again, when in the history of warfare is someone running out of men, weapons, and ammunition make such a thing public? Of course it’s maskirovka on one side, and propaganda on the other to keep the western sheeple tuned in and forking over money. It’s like those old Jerry Lewis telethons where they’d bring out crippled kids to get your emotions up and ask you to send money. Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Mar 17 2024 21:17 utc | 82 The debt bubble will probably implode under pressure of demographics caused lower housing demand, and all the ZIRP real estate debt accumulated during 2009 – 2021, in addition to mass layoffs now in industrial and tech sectors across the west, and the general unsustainability of rising living costs and employment collapse in quantity and quality. Posted by: Acco Hengst | Mar 17 2024 21:17 utc | 83 Posted by: rk | Mar 17 2024 20:58 utc | 78 Posted by: Passerby | Mar 17 2024 21:21 utc | 84 On this election day, a tribute from the late Russian patriot Alexander Solzhenitsyn: Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Mar 17 2024 21:22 utc | 85 More broadly, anybody who has looked into strategic bombardment will not fail to notice how much actually difficult is to deliver a decisive blow against the war making capabilities of a large state with conventional weaponry. The number of potential targets to service is mind boggling and what is actually more critical, less resilient, replaceable etc. can be hard to guess beforehand even if there are some obvious priority targets, such as the fuel industry. Posted by: Satepestage | Mar 17 2024 21:24 utc | 86 Posted by: Down South | Mar 17 2024 16:34 utc | 14
Thanks for all the info in your post, I’m focusing on the one tidbit I quoted. Posted by: Babel-17 | Mar 17 2024 21:27 utc | 87 rk @ 78 Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Mar 17 2024 21:28 utc | 88 Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Mar 17 2024 18:27 utc | 41 Posted by: Macpott | Mar 17 2024 21:33 utc | 89 The Giant Galactic Scale Ponzi that undermines neoliberalism will collapse, and here’s a secret, it already has, but they have a new trick, this time they are not going to tell you. No panic, no mass unemployment, no over night breadlines, just a slow creep to destitution. Look around you, get it yet? Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Mar 17 2024 21:37 utc | 90 Russia’s oil refinery capacity idled by drone attacks in Q1 seen at 370,500 barrels per day (Reuters) Posted by: Passerby | Mar 17 2024 22:00 utc | 91 Posted by: vargas | Mar 17 2024 21:00 utc | 79 Posted by: Ghost of Zanon | Mar 17 2024 22:10 utc | 92 On Bill Clinton praising Putin’s: Posted by: Jack A | Mar 17 2024 22:10 utc | 93 I see our resident concern troll ShadowBanned has really hit the panic button @ 41. Posted by: Refinnejenna | Mar 17 2024 22:11 utc | 94 Lex Talionis @ 38:
For a moment you had me thinking President Zelensky was demonstrating his piano playing abilities to Ukrainian soldiers to show them that all is not lost when you have no arms and/or no legs left. Posted by: Refinnejenna | Mar 17 2024 22:13 utc | 95 Passerby @ 91
Sean Foo pointed that out too, and it’s not much of a problem bringing in refined fuel from China. And China is not a fair-weather friend, if it comes to war with NATO Russia will not lack anything. Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Mar 17 2024 22:16 utc | 96 Refineries… Posted by: Peter AU1 | Mar 17 2024 22:22 utc | 97 Use of shotguns for defense against micro UAVs: Posted by: UBAH | Mar 17 2024 22:32 utc | 98 Russian oil refining capacity approx 7m bpd. Some portion had been taken offline previously to meet OPEC targets. Russia had announced a ban on export of some refined oil products some time back. Estimates of what Ukraine’s drones have taken offline is likely inflated, especially as some facilities received only minor damage and will soon be returned to service. Russia surely has strategic reserves as well. What is the impact of Ukrainian sabotage? More than zero, but less than press reports guess in all likelihood. Posted by: the pessimist | Mar 17 2024 22:39 utc | 99 Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Mar 17 2024 18:27 utc | 41 Posted by: grunzt | Mar 17 2024 22:53 utc | 100 |
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