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March 7, 2024
Ukraine Open Thread 2024-071
Only for news & views directly related to the war in Ukraine. The current open thread for other issues is here. Please stick to the topic. Contribute facts. Do not attack other commentators.
Comments
Only 820 Ukrainian losses today, which is a reduction. Five Tanks though. Posted by: Lantern Dude | Mar 7 2024 14:17 utc | 1 https://t.me/ZandVchannel/103327
Posted by: anon2020 | Mar 7 2024 14:32 utc | 2 Forgiven debutantes and dignitaries still flock to the Ukraine…..it’s a war zone, what guarantees do they have that Russia will not kill or injure them……kind of puts the SloJokeMo in perspective. Obviously no fear to go there whatsoever. Posted by: sean the leprechaun | Mar 7 2024 14:33 utc | 3 If anyone gets any more info on the very probable attack on Odessa Naval(?) base an hour or two after Zel visited there I would appreciate. There had to be UK casualties. Probably usOfa also. Posted by: paxmark1 | Mar 7 2024 14:42 utc | 5 Regarding the near miss on Zelensky and the Greek PM, Russia should issue something like this as a statement: Posted by: Ghost of Zanon | Mar 7 2024 14:45 utc | 6
https://t.me/rezident_ua/21934
Posted by: Down South | Mar 7 2024 14:55 utc | 7
Posted by: Down South | Mar 7 2024 14:59 utc | 8 Impressive for a manpad to be able to track and defeat a smallish electric drone with very little heat signature.
Posted by: anon2020 | Mar 7 2024 15:01 utc | 9 https://t.me/medvedev_telegram/460
Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Mar 7 2024 15:06 utc | 10 Massive number of Russian tanks are being killed toady by British supplied drones in south Donbass. Posted by: Sam | Mar 7 2024 15:18 utc | 11 Maybe Zman and the Greeks did lunch under a bridge. Might explain the near miss. Posted by: sean the leprechaun | Mar 7 2024 15:20 utc | 12 Posted by: sean the leprechaun | Mar 7 2024 15:20 utc | 12 Posted by: Mario | Mar 7 2024 15:29 utc | 13 Zelensky is going to go down as the worst wartime leader since Saddam Hussein. Posted by: Ghost of Zanon | Mar 7 2024 15:29 utc | 14 The below video isn’t so much about the U.S. Trump/MAGA reality, it is about the dismantling of the core of American Industrial Capacity as foundational/national jobs are wiped out to enrich the Uber Caste. Posted by: kupkee | Mar 7 2024 15:33 utc | 15 11 Posted by: SlowSoft | Mar 7 2024 15:42 utc | 16 From the previous thread:
And there we have it. Posted by: Melaleuca | Mar 7 2024 16:23 utc | 17 Lantern Dude Posted by: Áobh Ó’Sheachnasaigh | Mar 7 2024 16:40 utc | 18
So the strategy for winning the largest war in Europe in a half century that is gutting the economies of the West and upending the established world order is a ‘joke’? Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Mar 7 2024 16:42 utc | 19
Yep and I also personally shot down 100 SU-25s. With my dick. Beat that, Ukra-patsies. Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Mar 7 2024 16:45 utc | 20
It’s gone. Americans are just as expendable to the US elite as the Ukrainians are. Back in the 1970 – 80’s the USA has a skilled industrial workforce and their outdated mills and factories built in the 1940’s and 50’s needed investment to remain profitable. American capital decided they could make more money stripping the assets, unloading pension and union burdens and develop the land under these mills and factories than reinvesting in the USA. US workers were just cast aside … now we see the result. Posted by: HB_Norica | Mar 7 2024 16:55 utc | 21 For a country with no defense lines, Ukraine seems able to maintain the front past Adveevka surprisingly well. The lines have been stuck at more or less the same place for 2 weeks, despite the Ukrainians supposedly short of soldiers and equipment. Posted by: Chessmaster Z | Mar 7 2024 16:56 utc | 22 “Only 820 Ukrainian losses today, which is a reduction. Five Tanks though. Posted by: Feral Finster | Mar 7 2024 17:13 utc | 23 Posted by: Chessmaster Z | Mar 7 2024 16:56 utc | 22 Posted by: Boo | Mar 7 2024 17:15 utc | 24 “…Trump is a blowhard that will will tell the American public whatever it takes to get what he wants … which is the US presidency. He doesn’t want MAGA … he can’t deliver on those promises. All he really wants is revenge on the democrats and republicans who he precieves as the ones who kept him from being reelected. He can’t bring those jobs back even if he paid for the move himself because Americans no longer have the skilled labour to run machine shops, factories and steel mills. It’s not just the people to man the factories … it’s all the jobbers like specialty contractors, tool and die shops, foundries, suppliers that used to exist in every small town in the USA but have disappeared decades ago. They are gone and their skills and knowledge have gone with them.” Posted by: Feral Finster | Mar 7 2024 17:18 utc | 25
No sorry. Posted by: Lantern Dude | Mar 7 2024 17:18 utc | 26 MK Bhadrakumar has an original take on the Nuland resignation. If he is right Nuland was a ‘moderate’ by comparison with mad Joe Biden who prevented her from reviving the Minsk process in which, according to Bhadrakumar, she was strongly invested. Posted by: bevin | Mar 7 2024 17:20 utc | 27 @Chessmaster Z | Mar 7 2024 16:56 utc | 22 Posted by: the pessimist | Mar 7 2024 17:32 utc | 28 New post by Marat: Posted by: Dalibor Simich | Mar 7 2024 17:37 utc | 29 As we can see, Zelensky ignored everything and only now hastily decided to implement this case, where hundreds of corrupt officials and schemers have already stuck. @ HB_Norica | Mar 7 2024 16:55 Posted by: Tom Pfotzer | Mar 7 2024 17:46 utc | 31 Ukraine running out of troops is like the boy who cried wolf for me. We have been told that the country is running out of troops for what, at least a year now? Even assuming the worst about millions of people leaving the country, there are still likely 20 million or so people in Ukraine, skewed toward adult men and away from women and children. A lot of pensioners too, but Ukraine has not hesitated to enlist 60-year-olds anyway. At the current rate of attrition, even assuming the worst of Ukrainian casualties, they are nowhere close to literally running out of men. All I see is them holding the line and finding more and more troops to throw into this breach or that breach and stabilize things. This isn’t WW2 for a host of reasons, one of them being how small scale this war is in comparison. Posted by: Chessmaster Z | Mar 7 2024 17:47 utc | 32 Posted by: Chessmaster Z | Mar 7 2024 16:56 utc | 22 Posted by: HB_Norica | Mar 7 2024 18:00 utc | 33 The German Foreign Ministry has published a statement that reads Travel to Russian Federation is strongly discouraged . The world is getting out of hand. Posted by: AI | Mar 7 2024 18:01 utc | 34 @11 Posted by: GW | Mar 7 2024 18:04 utc | 35 Posted by: HB_Norica | Mar 7 2024 16:55 utc | 21 So this morning a drone hit Severstal in Cherepovets. Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Mar 7 2024 18:11 utc | 37 Posted by: Sam | Mar 7 2024 15:18 utc | 11 Posted by: AI | Mar 7 2024 18:12 utc | 38 Posted by: bevin | Mar 7 2024 17:20 utc | 27
Posted by: sln2002 | Mar 7 2024 18:18 utc | 39 @37 the drone was probably smuggled into Russia and launched not far from its target. It didn’t fly in from Finland or from Ukraine. Putin has made his decision, a long time ago, to turn the other cheek to deep western involvement in the war. I think it’s because he is legitimately scared of starting a war with a block of countries 7 times more populous than Russia. He also strikes me as extremely “bloodless”, casualties are just statistics to him, he said off the cuff one time that instead of dying of alcoholism it’s better to die defending Russia. Posted by: Chessmaster Z | Mar 7 2024 18:19 utc | 40 “It’s gone. Americans are just as expendable to the US elite as the Ukrainians are” Posted by: Simon | Mar 7 2024 18:20 utc | 41 https://t.me/warhistoryalconafter/150933
So the question immediately comes up if Kazakhstan is putting these for sale, what prevents Russia from buying them? Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Mar 7 2024 18:21 utc | 42
Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Mar 7 2024 18:22 utc | 43 https://twitter.com/MedvedevRussiaE/status/1765764198678553036
Stop talking shit and do something kinetic that will actually make them think twice about further escalation. Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Mar 7 2024 18:24 utc | 44 Doctor Eleven@19….jezz Doc, I’m a Leprechaun, I can’t help it. Foreigners come to 404, thumb their noses at Mr Putin, travel all over the Ukraine with impunity…..it’s a mockery, the west mocks Russia, the UK excels now at sinking Russian ships, so Russia tapped, still waiting for confirmation, a few Brits…..like that’ll stop the West, all the while waiting for a market collapse, it’s prolapsed already with the only cure so far from both sides is to just kill more, kill, kill, kill, very expensive collapse payed in human chattel. Posted by: sean the leprechaun | Mar 7 2024 18:24 utc | 45
It was a heavy drone, not an FPV firecracker.
Well, then he will keep turning the other cheek all the way to being reduced to the state of current Syria. Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Mar 7 2024 18:29 utc | 46 If one looks at the success of post war Japan, S Korea, and then more recently China these populations had shared common values which allowed their governments to mobilize their societies effectively to achieve significant economic and technological advances. One could say the same about post war USA for a period of several decades. We can see Russia trying this path with some initial success and great potential for more. By contrast the west is mired in a set of devisive social debates and declining economic momentum. There seems to be an attempt to use invented military threats to try and improve social cohesiveness but so far this appears to be failing. I don’t see any significant groundswell of public enthusiasm for military intervention in Ukraine emerging in Europe (or the US), and without this the Ukraine project is certainly doomed – sooner rather than later. Posted by: the pessimist | Mar 7 2024 18:30 utc | 47 Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Mar 7 2024 18:24 utc | 44 Posted by: Mario | Mar 7 2024 18:30 utc | 48 Posted by: HB_Norica | Mar 7 2024 16:55 utc | 21 Posted by: Áobh Ó’Sheachnasaigh | Mar 7 2024 18:31 utc | 49 Simon @ 41
The Palestinian Genocide is boldly in our faces intentionally to normalize atrocities and war crimes, western criminals in power plan to spread horrors across the globe and they want the golden billion inured, even as the horrors become inflicted on them and progressively overcome them. Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Mar 7 2024 18:37 utc | 50
Look, they just bombed Severstal. Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Mar 7 2024 18:40 utc | 51 bevin – 27 Posted by: Eric Blair | Mar 7 2024 18:44 utc | 52 From the previous thread:
To add on drones and stuff flying about Russian skies currently – those are launched from the NATO territory, RF knows that and is not telling yet. They will not say much, but will react the same. Or probably already do. Posted by: whirlX | Mar 7 2024 18:53 utc | 53 @46 you come across as intelligent and well informed, but what I just don’t understand is your thought pattern “Russia has taken far too many casualties and losses in this war, so let’s respond by starting a nuclear war that will even in the most optimistic scenarios result in the deaths of tens of millions more Russians”. Posted by: Chessmaster Z | Mar 7 2024 18:55 utc | 54 Effective fpv drone suppression continues to be a problem for both sides, …
Posted by: anon2020 | Mar 7 2024 18:55 utc | 55 Áobh Ó’Sheachnasaigh @ 49
No, not under neoliberalism, it’s financialized bubble economy or capital and labor intensive industrial economy, you have to choose, can’t have both. Of course, neoliberalism is the economic expression of neocon militarism, so it would be a small step to candidly merge this modern phase of capitalism with state power, which is the textbook definition of fascism, IOW to make it apparent and prioritize it. Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Mar 7 2024 18:59 utc | 56 @46 also wasn’t there a confirmed case of a largish drone being smuggled into Russia a little while back? That time people were saying it must have flown from Finland, but it turned out to have been smuggled in (I suppose in parts) Posted by: Chessmaster Z | Mar 7 2024 19:04 utc | 57 It is a pre-hot war stabbings. I have seen that before and it didn’t end up well. Once when this phase is rolling, it is impossible to stop. Posted by: Oliver Krug | Mar 7 2024 19:05 utc | 58 Posted by: Áobh Ó’Sheachnasaigh | Mar 7 2024 18:31 utc | 49
I’m saying the ship has sailed. It’s done. The jobs are gone and if you want them back practice your limbo dancing because you are going to gave to bend further and work cheaper than the Chinese or Indians or whoever has those jobs now are willing to do to keep them.
You’re mistaking me for someone who supports Biden in favour of Trump. I can assure you that I don’t give a fiddlers fuck about either although I have a special hate for Trump because he’s the archetype asshole “self made” developer’s son who is where he is because of daddy. There are a lot of them out there and I dealt with them all through my career but Trump is the king of the species. I have no idea what Biden stands for or what kind of a man he is and I don’t care.
Nope … see my post above. Posted by: HB_Norica | Mar 7 2024 19:10 utc | 59 I’m not sure why some feel compelled to argue on behalf of NATO ‘strategy’ when it’s obvious to most that the sanctions were the be all and end all of any planning. We are out in the deep dark woods of the unk ow now, being led to this juncture by a bunch of incompetent chancers, covered in blood, shit and their own disgrace. Hold onto your asses. Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Mar 7 2024 19:10 utc | 60 Let’s just accept that shadowtroll has a death wish he cannot resist. Only he’s not content to off himself quietly and wants the whole world to go bang with him. Posted by: averros | Mar 7 2024 19:14 utc | 61 anon2020 | Mar 7 2024 18:55 utc | 55 Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Mar 7 2024 19:16 utc | 62 Legitimny says Zelensky gave orders to stop the Russian advance at all costs, and at the same time prepare a new counter-offensive for May. This is to hide the problem of legitimacy. Posted by: unimperator | Mar 7 2024 19:17 utc | 63 Posted by: Chessmaster Z | Mar 7 2024 18:55 utc | 54 Posted by: Boo | Mar 7 2024 19:18 utc | 64 Scorpion | Mar 7 2024 18:05 utc | 36 Posted by: Cynic | Mar 7 2024 19:18 utc | 65 by averros | Mar 7 2024 19:14 utc | 61 Posted by: whirlX | Mar 7 2024 19:19 utc | 66 Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Mar 7 2024 18:40 utc 51 Posted by: Mario | Mar 7 2024 19:23 utc | 67
Not the whole ROOF of a BLAST FURNACE! Clutches pearls. Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Mar 7 2024 19:33 utc | 68 shаdοwbanned | Mar 7 2024 18:21 utc | 42 Posted by: Cynic | Mar 7 2024 19:33 utc | 69 unimperator @ 63
The grim, determined commander in chief decided, the military high command staunchly saluted, the fate of the nation and its finest men hung in balance as they all marched stoically towards the front. Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Mar 7 2024 19:36 utc | 70 @64 it’s not dumb to note if your foe has a much larger industrial capacity than you. Forget about costs for a second, just think of outputs. Automobiles or satellites or industrial robots or rockets or commercial airliners. Not fake stuff. How much does Russia make, and how much does the collective west make? Things cost more in the west but there is also a lot more money in the west. Russia has an advantage is certain categories of weapons manufacturing right now because Russia is at war and the west is not. The west is just financing and aiding a proxy force. If the west were at war, like literally in a state of declared war against Russia, you would see a lot more resources shifted to military production. Posted by: Chessmaster Z | Mar 7 2024 19:38 utc | 71 shаdοwbanned | Mar 7 2024 18:22 utc | 43 Posted by: Cynic | Mar 7 2024 19:39 utc | 72 Or maybe the Kremlin doesn’t give a shit if the Kazakhs sell some old parts for MiGs to Ukraine. For a variety of reasons, all of which seem obvious, most importantly that they won’t make any difference whatsoever. Maybe they got crafty and decided to let go of a bunch of worn out trash parts they can no longer safely use for big dollars before those dollars are worth zeroes. You know, like how the Ukropatsies were unhappy with the Italian artillery shells. ‘Unusable shit’ I believe was the quote. Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Mar 7 2024 19:40 utc | 73 Ultimately we know if Russia is making progress or being reduced to the size of Syria, as shadowbanned suggested. Is Russian industrial production growing or shrinking? Is Russian military production growing or shrinking? By how much? Is the front moving into previously controlled Ukrainian land or Russian land? Right now despite the “embarrassing” hits, Russia is producing more, making progress on the front, etc. There is also no sign of that progress being about to reverse. Except for the Russian Black Sea fleet lol, which is being attritioned away. But Russia has never been a primarily naval power, and the Black Sea fleet is the weakest of the main Russian fleets to begin with. Posted by: Chessmaster Z | Mar 7 2024 19:45 utc | 74 Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Mar 7 2024 19:40 utc | 72 Posted by: unimperator | Mar 7 2024 19:51 utc | 75 If you are Putin, if you just see a bunch of numbers and statistics, things are moving in your direction. So instead of getting emotional and distracted by the hits, he keeps pushing at a strategy that has finally started to pay off. That’s the charitable interpretation Posted by: Mario | Mar 7 2024 19:53 utc | 76 shаdοwbanned @ 51
Yikes, time to nuke New York and London! Go get them, son. Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Mar 7 2024 19:59 utc | 77 Chessmaster Z @ 73
I’m certain Putin appreciates your charity. Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Mar 7 2024 20:04 utc | 78 Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Mar 7 2024 19:16 utc | 62 Posted by: anon2020 | Mar 7 2024 20:06 utc | 79 I would think the “panic” over lack of defense lines has gone down a bit, given the Ukrops have been holding at Berdiche for 2+ weeks now. Posted by: Anonymous | Mar 7 2024 20:08 utc | 80 unimperator @ 74
Should I repeat my witty comment from an old post? OK, you forced me, “seems the arsenal of democracy is as shallow as the democracy.” Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Mar 7 2024 20:10 utc | 81 @74 on the one hand, western dreams of Ukrainian total victory and Russian dissolution have crashed against reality. The counter offensive was a dismal failure, Russia currently has the initiative. Taking out the Kerch Bridge will change nothing militarily, it will just be for PR. One of the points of the war for Russia was to get a land bridge to Crimea. Posted by: Chess | Mar 7 2024 20:11 utc | 82 Posted by: Chessmaster Z | Mar 7 2024 18:55 utc | 54 Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Mar 7 2024 20:12 utc | 83 HB-Norica @ 21 Posted by: oldhippie | Mar 7 2024 20:13 utc | 84 @74 on the one hand, western dreams of Ukrainian total victory and Russian dissolution have crashed against reality. The counter offensive was a dismal failure, Russia currently has the initiative. Taking out the Kerch Bridge will change nothing militarily, it will just be for PR. One of the points of the war for Russia was to get a land bridge to Crimea. Posted by: Chessmaster Z | Mar 7 2024 20:14 utc | 85 Really? Posted by: DunGroanin | Mar 7 2024 20:27 utc | 86 What’s their inspirational slogan — “Get Crippled or Die for Greater Romania”? Posted by: rk | Mar 7 2024 20:28 utc | 87 I’m not sure why some feel compelled to argue on behalf of NATO ‘strategy’ when it’s obvious to most that the sanctions were the be all and end all of any planning. We are out in the deep dark woods of the unk ow now, being led to this juncture by a bunch of incompetent chancers, covered in blood, shit and their own disgrace. Hold onto your asses. Posted by: Honzo | Mar 7 2024 20:29 utc | 88 44 Posted by: tesla | Mar 7 2024 20:37 utc | 89 … Posted by: Mario | Mar 7 2024 20:39 utc | 90 Russian advances. In Scott Ritter’s conversation with the Chechen general in Russia, the general said that even though Ukraine is low on ammunition, there is always ammunition that has been saved for striking concentrations especially HIMARS missiles. Posted by: Peter AU1 | Mar 7 2024 20:48 utc | 91 Nuland was very active regarding Minsk agreements and in early 2016 met several times with then Russian presidential aide Vladislav Surkov and discussed plans for the implementation of the political part of the agreements regarding the special status of Donbass within Ukraine. Posted by: JackG | Mar 7 2024 20:49 utc | 92 Lets zoom out for a moment and look at how events are unwinding. This won’t be exactly the way the MSM told the story but it is what it is. Posted by: JackG | Mar 7 2024 20:57 utc | 93 Sam | Mar 7 2024 15:18 utc | 11
I refuse to pass up an opportunity to laugh at wannabe propagandists who can’t be bothered to open a map for once in their lives to know where Donbas is, let alone what it is, and what is to the south of it. Posted by: boneless | Mar 7 2024 21:00 utc | 94 You’ve quoted Emmanuel Todd here with approval in the past. In a new book, “La Chute de l’Occident” (“The Fall of the West”) he has a radical analysis of Western policy in Ukraine. Posted by: geoff chambers | Mar 7 2024 21:03 utc | 95 Posted by: Peter AU1 | Mar 7 2024 20:48 utc | 88 Posted by: unimperator | Mar 7 2024 21:04 utc | 96 That dribble of ammo will only allow for terrorism though, without air defense no launcher will last for long. Posted by: SOS | Mar 7 2024 21:14 utc | 97 Ukrainians are now so brainwashed they will fight until none are left and can be likened to nazi Germany which took a heavy toll of both Soviet and western forces right up until the time of the official surrender. Posted by: rk | Mar 7 2024 21:14 utc | 98 HB_Norica | Mar 7 2024 16:55 utc | 21 Posted by: geoff chambers | Mar 7 2024 21:15 utc | 99 It’s a Mad World. Posted by: DunGroanin | Mar 7 2024 21:27 utc | 100 |
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