Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
March 18, 2024
Selling A Predicted Behavior As Protest?

This morning I read through some curious stories.

U.S. citizens, answering anti-buy-lobby call, protest as shops open

NEW YORK – Citizens protested against rampant consumerism by forming large lines just as shops opened – answering calls by Back-To-Nature to buy less, and undercutting preliminary reports of record sales.


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Holiday travelers, answering leaders call, protest as check-ins open

WASHINGTON – On the day before Thanksgiving travelers protested air planes' emissions, by forming long lines as flight check-ins were opening – answering a call by the late deaf Thomas, and undercutting preliminary congestion reports.


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You, dear reader, will have immediately noticed that the above items are nonsense and fake. Protesting shopping by rushing stores and protesting plane emissions by booking flights does not make any sense.

Neither does protesting against an election by going to vote. Still, this is what U.S. propaganda tries to insinuate.

Russian voters, answering Navalny’s call, protest as Putin extends his rule

MOSCOW — On the final day of a presidential election with only one possible result, Russians protested Vladimir Putin’s authoritarian hold on power by forming long lines to vote against him at noon Sunday — answering the call of the late opposition leader Alexei Navalny, and undercutting preliminary results Sunday night that led Putin to claim a landslide victory.

The “Noon Against Putin” protest, with voters forming queues at polling stations in major cities such as Moscow, St. Petersburg, Yekaterinburg, Chelyabinsk, Tomsk and Novosibirsk, was a striking — if futile — display of solidarity and dissent and challenged the Kremlin’s main message: that Putin is a legitimate president who commands massive support.

The Noon Against Putin protest was particularly striking at Russian embassies in nations with significant numbers of Russians who fled after the invasion of Ukraine. They included those in Armenia, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Germany, China, Portugal, Britain and others.

Here is a reality based report from one of those embassies:

Today, Sunday, is the third and final day of balloting at Russian polling stations around the world and at 9.30 am I arrived at the Russian embassy in Brussels to accompany a friend to vote.

Russians are late risers, especially on Sundays, and we were well rewarded for our early arrival at the embassy, because the line inside to register and then vote was only 20 minutes long. As we left, the throngs began to arrive.

Gilbert Doctorow, who wrote the above, has lived in Russia for many years. He knows Russian habits. It was obvious, not only to him, that  Sunday noon in Russia would see the longest lines of voters.

To preemptively declare these predictable lines a sign of protest may be be seen as smart propaganda but it will have little effect on anyone living outside of the propagandists' bubble.

But somehow, from inside that bubble, such idiotic claims are seen as sane:

Thousands of Russians in big cities attempted to make their displeasure known at both the nature of Putin’s regime and the ongoing war in Ukraine by going to vote at noon Sunday — a symbolic act of solidarity with the late pro-democracy activist Alexei Navalny, who had long called for fairer and freer elections in Russia before dying in captivity.

Do such folks believe in this most primitive form of their propaganda?

Comments

Dima says he does not believe that Ukraine is out of ammunition. He suggests, on the contrary, that they are stockpiling ammunition for a new Ukrainian incursion towards Tokmak (again!). He also says that it has become a mantra among NATO countries to repeat the same chant over and over again.
His point of view made the phrase “appear weak when strong and strong when weak” and Uranus’ Stalingrad came to my mind.
I don’t know if this issue has already been raised here. I apologize if it was, because I don’t follow all the discussions on MoA due to an absolute lack of time.
If not, I would like to know the opinion of the regulars at the bar on the subject.
Greetings to everyone and thank you.

Posted by: SCan | Mar 18 2024 20:46 utc | 101

Now crossed into Azerbijan…

Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Mar 18 2024 20:47 utc | 102

Honzo | Mar 18 2024 18:58 utc | 73–
Thanks for your reply. What intrigues me is just how much of that system remains intact as that’s how Russian villages still govern themselves. And in the center of it all is how to develop, how to improve the village’s situation–how to improve the lives of the people living in the village most specifically. Yes, I’m a student of Russian history so I can discern the roots of Putin’s socio-economic policy, which he’s been very consistent is describing as improving the state of the people so they can improve the state of the nation, what I call People-Centered Development. In a speech to the Duma last year, Putin recited one source of the developmental philosophy current in Russia immediately after the 1905 Revolution–the one everyone overlooks–and asked the Duma to follow in those footsteps in his address to the Council of Legislatures on 28 April 2023–which was the Day of Russian Parliamentarism. Here’s what Putin said in the preamble to his speech:

I congratulate you on this holiday and would like to thank the senators and deputies, as well as all your colleagues in the regions of the Russian Federation, for their great, significant and productive work in creating a solid legislative foundation for the effective socio-economic development of our country, improving the quality of life of people, and strengthening the sovereignty and security of our state.
Many of our parliamentary traditions were laid at the beginning of the last century, during the pre-revolutionary convocations of the State Duma, which worked in the Tavrichesky Palace, as you know, since 1906.
The first Chairman of the Duma, Sergei Andreevich Muromtsev, highly appreciated the potential of institutions of broad popular representation, believed that their main task was to strengthen people’s faith “in statehood as a bulwark of their rights and a source of sincere concerns about the people’s welfare”, and the state as a whole, according to him, should be “the subject of the people’s cause”.
Indeed, many of your predecessors, the first Russian parliamentarians, fervently and sincerely defended the interests of the people, cared about the people’s welfare, sought to benefit their native country, and considered it their highest duty and vocation to live and work for the Motherland.
Such patriotic ideals are important at all times, especially for us, for Russia – a country-civilization, one of the original, sovereign centers of a huge multipolar world.
The values of devotional service to people and their homeland determine the strength and stability of state power, confirm the unity and cohesion of our people, are a key, unshakable guarantee that together we will overcome any challenges, we will consistently and firmly move only forward to the planned high, big goals.

The point is Putin governs within the long-established tradition of Russian governance and how it’s evolved over the centuries. Again, if you’re not a dedicated student of Russia you won’t know any of that and will never have read his speech from almost a year ago. What will he say this year? The above link goes to my VK site translation. Here’s the original Russian transcript.

Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 18 2024 20:48 utc | 103

Seems to have changed callsign
https://www.flightradar24.com/MISFT61/346a8e2c

Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Mar 18 2024 20:49 utc | 104

14 France. ‘Il n’y a pas un hor-texte,” appropriated from French to deconstructionist philosopher Jacques Derrida by a number of mainly American academics to avoid dealing with realities outside language.

Posted by: Lavieja | Mar 18 2024 20:57 utc | 105

FrankDrakman | Mar 18 2024 20:44 utc | 100–
Thanks for your reply. Putin made it clear a decade ago that he wasn’t interested in building a political party as he wanted to devote his energy to Russia’s development; so, he left it to others to develop United Russia. However, Putin didn’t decline United Russia’s support.
This item was recently posted to the Kremlin website as it wasn’t there when I visited it 8 hours ago. “A meeting was held in the Kremlin with Vladimir Putin and the candidates who ran for the Presidential election of the Russian Federation.” Now what Western winner of an election contest meets the next day with those who opposed him?

Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 18 2024 21:08 utc | 106

Hmm. Looks like the highly Muslim Azerbaijanis are happy to let a US Hercules that’s just left Tblisi in highly Christian Georgia to transit their airspace.
Flightradar24 does improve ones geography, I’d never heard of the town of Ganja or the Mingechevir Reservoir.
Change of course now, over Qumlaq heading for the Caspian north of Baku. I guess 19,000 feet is enough to clear the mountains.

Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Mar 18 2024 21:09 utc | 107

Distorting the internal processes of a society for the purpose of its vilification is a tactic used since time immemorial. The strategic objective of any conflict is to impose a type of mental vision on the population that favors the archetype that tries to dominate the masses.
But, there are individuals who find it painful to contemplate that those masses are populated by individuals who have enough heart and brain to discriminate and discern through love.
Those individuals, although they shout, are denying a substantial change, at a socio-planetary level: everyone, in the places that have been destroyed by the false praxis of the United States and Europe, is beginning to understand that it is not words that matter, but actions.
And the actions are true because they are based on facts: Russians are living much better than they were just 10 years ago, and the Russians who lived in eastern Ukraine, I won’t even tell you.
Among the possible mistakes of the Russian command, the fight against propaganda has not been one of them. Why? Let people reach their conclusions by observing what happens and what happens.
The irony of all Western propaganda is that Russian citizens not only feel free to choose: they are free to do so.
And they don’t care what we think.

Posted by: Lola | Mar 18 2024 21:11 utc | 108

18. CIROC. Ha!

Posted by: Lavieja | Mar 18 2024 21:11 utc | 109

“Just noise because of the election.
The REAL problem is the Russian central bank. It is home grown, an uneducated Trojan horse.”
Posted by: Echo Chamberpot | Mar 18 2024 20:06 utc | 94
The Trojan horse was a wooden effigy to hide 30 Greek warriors; the Trojan horse was made of wood; wood can be many things such but it cannot be “educated or “uneducated” such that you have created a horrid mixed metaphor.
The Russian central bank is doing fine-unlike your metaphors-as Russia has the fastest growing economy in Europe.

Posted by: canuck | Mar 18 2024 21:12 utc | 110

Hmm. In 2015 that aircraft was “assigned to the 522nd Special Operations Squadron of the 27th Special Operations Wing”
https://www.flickr.com/photos/23032926@N05/15630152453

Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Mar 18 2024 21:13 utc | 111

USAF Hercules 08-6201, outward from Tblisi, looks to be crossing the Caspian to Kazakhstan or possibly Turkmenistan. Still at 19000 feet.
https://www.flightradar24.com/MISFT61/346a8e2c

Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Mar 18 2024 21:22 utc | 112

Posted by: canuck | Mar 18 2024 21:12 utc | 110
Like you would know. What’s the tea leaves saying this week ?

Posted by: Echo Chamber | Mar 18 2024 21:37 utc | 113

When I read those nonsensical stories in the western press, all I could do was scratch my head in bewilderment. It would seem that the propaganda creators are scratching the bottom of the barrel.

Posted by: Rob | Mar 18 2024 21:38 utc | 114

The landside of Russian who live in Russia voting for their next President is the consequence of facts and evidences.
All the macro and micro economics has been restored to the levels of the grandpa: now the boy and the girl has a choice, an opportunity, to learn, work, be in love with his (her) spirit, and, if they want, be parents with a future to be so.
Indeed, as SB tells us, 24/7, you can even try to be against all of that, without the so called repression of an autarky. So, tell me, my friend, why Russia is not a strict democratic state…
When all Russians are in love between them…?

Posted by: Lola | Mar 18 2024 21:38 utc | 115

Posted by: canuck | Mar 18 2024 21:12 utc | 110
You scream armageddon when the FED hikes to 5.5% with inflation at 3.2%.
But say the Russian central bank is doing a grand job with rates at 16% and inflation at nearly 8%.
LOL!
At this point I don’t know if you are a hypocrite, a British red coat, dumb or just an ideological bufoon.
I’ll go with a mongeral and a mix of all 4.It is hilarious watching you turn yourself inside out just to please the group.
FED hikes to 5.5% with inflation at 3.2%.
Armageddon, sky will fall in, ground will open up, the end is nigh, blah, blah, blah, garbage, hyperbole, blah, blah and blah – like a broken record.
Russian central bank hikes to 16% and inflation at nearly 8%.
Marvellous, lovely, majic, wonderful, everything you said about the FED is to be completely ignored, sunny uplands, rainbows and doing a grand job.
By now, even You don’t actually don’t believe anything you say. Your worse than the mainstream media.

Posted by: Echo Chamber | Mar 18 2024 21:54 utc | 116

USAF Hercules 08-6201, outward from Tblisi, looks to be heading to Kazakhstan. Still at 19000 feet. Just crossing the Kazakh coast now between Fetisovo and Kyzyk.
Without getting all Shadowbanned, I wonder what was dropped at Tblisi and what’ll be dropped at the next stop. Could it be drones for “guerrillas” or special forces to fire at Russia?
https://www.flightradar24.com/MISFT61/346a8e2c

Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Mar 18 2024 21:56 utc | 117

“”No way out can I see anywhere on the horizon, unless some planetary overshadowing event takes place.”
Posted by: whirlX | Mar 18 2024 13:07 utc | 9″
Space Cortez would probably not do us any favors.

Posted by: lester | Mar 18 2024 21:57 utc | 118

Posted by: canuck | Mar 18 2024 21:12 utc | 110
Indeed.
I do not know what is happen when the economists are talking about 15 % of the Russian central bank in September 2023, when we are in March, 18th, and the Russian’ Ipc is 3 %. Translation: foods are 20% beyond 2 years ago and the wages are not bad in all the autarky.
Good luck with your society. Hope you’ll be amazing.
Hope you’ll be sane and right.
The problem with you, USA, is that you think that you are better than Us, the world, the people. The messianic pseudo love that is greed. Fuck Off, Lady Jane, this is not the last game when you and me were talking about who were guilty, and we were down to live our lies.
This is a mess, lady, our future lives, and, if you have a heart, our daughters and sons. My sister in law things, by the mass media, that her son will have to be a soldier when he was all her live to make of him an engineer or a physician, or a whatever.
Stop the fucking war

Posted by: Lala | Mar 18 2024 22:20 utc | 119

“Posted by: canuck | Mar 18 2024 21:12 utc | 110
Like you would know. What’s the tea leaves saying this week ?”
Posted by: Echo Chamberpot | Mar 18 2024 21:37 utc | 113
Well I know more than you about metaphors, obviously; and the value of gold too it seems.

Posted by: canuck | Mar 18 2024 22:25 utc | 120

Barack Obama holds ‘informal talks’ with Rishi Sunak in No 10 – The Telegraph.
‘Barack Obama made a surprise appearance in Westminster on Monday as he dropped into No 10 for “informal” talks with Rishi Sunak.
He had an hour-long meeting with the Prime Minister, during which the pair discussed artificial intelligence over cups of tea.
‘No 10 said that the visit was a courtesy call, given that Mr Obama was already in the country on other business, and that his team had requested it.
The former US president, who was in the White House from 2009-2017, was in London promoting the work of his charity, the Obama Foundation.
David Lammy, Labour’s shadow foreign secretary, was also set to meet with Mr Obama on Monday night.
The pair are old friends, having known each other since before the former president’s run for the White House in 2008.’
My ruminations on the Telegraph article:-
It was no ‘surprise meeting’. These get togethers are organised weeks in advance.
‘Informal talks’ stressed in the headline and first sentence of the article. Informal because Obama is a private citizen and hence we shouldn’t infer that there was any ‘official’ discussion on policies etc.
The main talking point was artificial intelligence – Really? No chat about the situation in Ukraine, Gaza, Putin’s re-election, the forthcoming presidential election in the USA?
The visit was a courtesy call – Again stressing that it was not official/quasi official, just two guys meeting for a chinwag.
Obama’s team requested the meeting – They requested a meeting to discuss AI? Who are Obama’s team?
Obama was in London promoting the work of his charity – What a great guy.
Obama was also meeting with the Labour party’s foreign secretary that night – To make sure that the Labour party is singing from the same hymn sheet?
The pair are old friends – Nothing to see here folks, just two guys getting together to reminisce over old times.

Posted by: Siddhartha | Mar 18 2024 22:29 utc | 121

karlof1 | Mar 18 2024 21:08 utc | 106
>Putin met next day with those who opposed him. Who does this?
MSM: Putin. To serve polonium tea with a novichok chaser. Obviously.

Posted by: Melaleuca | Mar 18 2024 22:36 utc | 122

Siddhartha | Mar 18 2024 22:29 utc | 121
David Lammy, Labour’s shadow foreign secretary… a pre-2008 Obama friend.
Is he aware many of Obama’s early life family and acquaintances become prematurely unalive in unusual ways?

Posted by: Melaleuca | Mar 18 2024 22:43 utc | 123

The IPC in Russia is, in food, electricity, water, gas, house, in the least of the 10 years because have been an increment of wages in jobs, so high, that only the lazy people won’t work. The increment of the wage of the middle people, working as a professional worker, as a sanitary profesional, for example, has been circa from, in two years, 30000 rubles (300 dollars) by 3 months, in the last year. That means that the wages are going up: all the people is making money to their family and all the people is able to save some kind of money to feel that to be alive is worth of their kids.
We are down, because we are liars.

Posted by: Lala | Mar 18 2024 22:47 utc | 124

The thing about real democracy is that when people outside see.
Then they wonder why they don’t have it?
If nearly 4 out of five Russians choose Putin. Again. Mid smo !
After 13 sanctions.
They start wondering.
Why can’t I vote for that too?
Do you want to know why the West hates Putin?
‘Because Putin is good for Russia and is making it stronger.
Follow: https://t.me/RussianBaZa

Posted by: DunGroanin | Mar 18 2024 22:48 utc | 125

Posted by: canuck | Mar 18 2024 21:12 utc | 110
If the FED hiked to 16% with inflation at nearly 8%.
The Russian central bank hiked to 5.5% with inflation at 3.2%.
Oh boy, it would be a different story lol.
Hypocrite doesn’t even begin to explain it.
You might not agree with the warning I’m sending out regarding Elvira Nabiullina. That’s your choice, but ffS stick to your story instead of being so hypocritical about it.
” Best economy in Europe ” that’s a bit of a stretch even from you Canuck.
GDP per capita isn’t great, Productivity terrible, wage growth mid table. Unemployment rate not bad, min wage terrible, I could go on.
A long way to go before the best in Europe. They’ll do better once they drop the exporting their way to growth nonsense. Like Japan and China are starting to do.
Producing for domestic consumption, and imports are what improve the standard of living for Russian residents. Not pass through. Not ‘export led growth’.
They’ll get there eventually. It will take time. We won’t see it in our life time.

Posted by: Echo Chamber | Mar 18 2024 23:04 utc | 126

Posted by: Echo Chamber | Mar 18 2024 23:04 utc | 126
Which country has the best economy in Europe?

Posted by: Siddhartha | Mar 18 2024 23:08 utc | 127

by Lala | Mar 18 2024 22:47 utc | 124
We are down, because we are liars.
Please explain. I think there is a different situation from profession to profession and from the city to the city. The issue is that in Russia one gets pretty good quality for one third of the price that it is in the better Western supermarkets. Not just by Tucker’s example.

Posted by: whirlX | Mar 18 2024 23:16 utc | 128

All this talk from the Kremlin about sanitary zones leaves me to wonder what that actually means? Whatever it is how are they going to create and enforce such a thing? If it was possible then why is the SMO so slow in the rest of ukraine? What means are they going to use to create a sanitary zone? Armed forces to rake Harkov, a 1M+ city right on the border?
Or is this just talk to deter the other side?
Not very credible considering Russia is getting bombed in depth. No defence against drone swarms, so a sanitary zone is the solution?

Posted by: alek_al | Mar 18 2024 23:16 utc | 129

@ Posted by: SCan | Mar 18 2024 20:46 utc | 101
If Ukraine is stockpiling ammunition, especially for artillery, it is because they are running out of artillery tubes to fire it.
For 2 years they have been losing 8 pieces a day. Over the last few months that has risen to 10 per day.
They have least 6 different calibers (3 Nato, 3 soviet) to juggle across numerous versions of artillery. And larger calibers are not self contained. The rounds and powder bags are in separate pallets.
Missing the powder (the most dangerous to transport and store) makes the rounds useless.

Posted by: BroncoBilly | Mar 18 2024 23:17 utc | 130

Melaleuca | Mar 18 2024 22:36 utc | 122–
Thanks for the chuckle your reply provided. This was the second time Putin held a meeting with opposition candidates immediately following the election. The substance of the 2018 meeting was hard to judge as I explain in my translation of today’s meeting, “Amazing (For the West) Post Election Meeting of Russia’s Presidential Candidates at Kremlin”. The chat lasted about 45-minutes, so the read isn’t too long. I rather doubt it will be read by any BigLie Media person, so they’ll never get any real reading on just how united Russia is. Yes, it postponed my planned work for today, but that’s how it goes–the work will still be done.

Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 18 2024 23:24 utc | 131

Scott Ritter on CIA complicity in attacks on Russian soil, long planned to disrupt their election:

Now, amid such a tense environment, it appears the C.I.A. has not only green-lighted an actual invasion of the Russian Federation, but more than likely was involved in its planning, preparation and execution.
Never in the history of the nuclear era has such danger of nuclear war been so manifest.
That the American people have allowed their government to create the conditions where foreign governments can determine their fate and the C.I.A. can carry out a secret war which could trigger a nuclear conflict, eviscerates the notion of democracy.

https://consortiumnews.com/2024/03/18/scott-ritter-the-cia-the-russian-fascists-who-fight-russia/

Posted by: Aleph_Null | Mar 18 2024 23:33 utc | 132

Lala | Mar 18 2024 22:47 utc | 124–
Curious about where you reside?
Russia’s central bank main rate is 16%, but there are many preferential loan programs for business and families. In his meeting with the government on 14 March, Putin said core inflation is currently close to zero:
“You know that in February, our price growth is decreasing, inflation is stabilizing – in February it was 0.7 percent, and in the first couple of weeks of this month, inflation went to zero. It is clear that in weekly terms, this is all very approximate, everything is volatile, but nevertheless it is as it is. The economy grew by 4.6 percent in January.”
IMO, Russia’s growth rate will be over 5% for the year. If prices can be held in check while wages continue their rise, confidence in the future will rise and help with the demographic issue, which is a–perhaps THE–long term problem.

Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 18 2024 23:39 utc | 133

Welcome to the best intimate club — https://shorturl.at/fpKL1

Posted by: Belliana | Mar 18 2024 23:50 utc | 134

Speaking as someone who lives in the USA, the official inflation rate of 3.2% does not seem like a credible estimate of the increase in the cost of living.
Some things, such as televisions, continue to get cheaper, but other things such as health insurance, car insurance, food (especially produce), toilet paper, etc are increasing in price, id estimate at a total level of 10%/year or so.
Never mind the cost of housing.

Posted by: Afro | Mar 19 2024 0:05 utc | 135

Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Mar 18 2024 20:35 utc | 98
Seems headed for ALA/Almaty

Posted by: knighthawk | Mar 19 2024 0:26 utc | 136

https://rosstat.gov.ru
I can’t understand that you are able to read the statistics: if you want to read real statistics from the
1918, historian, we can get for you to make the Russian story

Posted by: Lala | Mar 19 2024 0:37 utc | 137

Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Mar 18 2024 20:35 utc | 98
Or maybe Taldykorgan airport/air-base, based on recent heading change?

Posted by: knighthawk | Mar 19 2024 0:39 utc | 138

Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 18 2024 20:48 utc | 103
Thank you, very interesting. But it makes me wonder: what went so terribly wrong between 1905 and 1917 that about a third of the nation ended up being slaughtered? Because everything sounded so basically positive and well-oriented, how did it all go so wrong?

Posted by: Scorpion | Mar 19 2024 1:04 utc | 139

The Orwellian inversion of reality by the western MSM is a disturbing wonder to behold. Truly, the propaganda machine, especially on the issues of Ukraine and Gaza, is solidly pushing for inverted totalitarianism.
It must become an absolute truism for every thinking person that modern liberalism is fascism with (US) American characteristics.
As for the immensely high results in support of Putin, they reflect not only his own popularity, but in a certain way the determination of the citizenry to back up the war effort. Even those who are critical of specific aspects of the war effort’s management still feel that the stakes are very high and it must be prosecuted to a decisively victorious conclusion.
That last part is presumably what irks the western presstitutes and their masters and they have opted for spin that would ensure both the vilification of Putin, while avoiding the use of vitriolic tropes towards the Russian population. A bit late though, after they have described the latter as a subhuman Asiatic mongrel horde threatening the superior western civilization. As the regime change effort failed, the racist vilification campaign has turned into a boomerang and the instigators are unwilling to face the consequences.

Posted by: Constantine | Mar 19 2024 1:08 utc | 140

The propaganda has certainly turned inward, focusing on an ever-diminishing circle of true believers. When the end of the current system of power eventually comes to manifest, it’ll be suddenly and frighteningly quick, and the hangings and firings will commence in short order.

Posted by: Matthew | Mar 19 2024 1:08 utc | 141

The Welsh Hill Country.
A poem by R.S. Thomas originally directed at a particular group of people in a particular corner of Wales.
Read as metaphor, it now seems to me to have wider significance.
Too far for you to see
The fluke and the foot-rot and the fat maggot
Gnawing the skin from the small bones,
The sheep are grazing at Bwlch-y-Fedwen,
Arranged romantically in the usual manner
On a bleak background of bald stone.
Too far for you to see
The moss and the mould on the cold chimneys,
The nettles growing through the cracked doors,
The houses stand empty at Nant-yr-Eira,
There are holes in the roofs that are thatched with sunlight,
And the fields are reverting to the bare moor.
Too far, too far to see
The set of his eyes and the slow pthisis
Wasting his frame under the ripped coat,
There’s a man still farming at Ty’n-y-Fawnog,
Contributing grimly to the accepted pattern,
The embryo music dead in his throat.

Posted by: Siddhartha | Mar 19 2024 1:10 utc | 142

RT reports that Romania is building the largest NATO base in Europe.
18 Mar, 2024
“Romania has started work on rebuilding an airbase that will become the largest NATO facility in Europe, according to Euronews. The base is located near the city of Constanta on the Black Sea, around 130km from the border with Ukraine.
When the expansion of the Mihail Kogalniceanu Romanian Air Force 57th Air Base is complete, it will be able to permanently host around 10,000 NATO servicemen and their family members, the broadcaster reported on Saturday. . .
The extensive project, which will cost Bucharest €2.5 billion ($2.7 billion), includes a new runway, aircraft hangars, fuel depots, and ammunition stores, it said. The base will also feature accommodation for personnel, schools, kindergartens, shops, and even its own hospital.

Posted by: Perimetr | Mar 19 2024 1:34 utc | 143

Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 18 2024 16:28 utc | 51
“Soviet”. Things one should know but doesn’t. As ever with your informative comments, thanks.

Posted by: English Outsider | Mar 19 2024 1:39 utc | 144

Posted by: Perimetr | Mar 19 2024 1:34 utc | 143
The goddamn romanian shitbasg have lost their little nazi brains…

Posted by: Boo | Mar 19 2024 1:41 utc | 145

Posted by: Siddhartha | Mar 19 2024 1:10 utc | 142
Not even a:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZYBliPhLAE0

Posted by: Lala | Mar 19 2024 1:46 utc | 146

Scorpion | Mar 19 2024 1:04 utc | 139–
First, there was WW1 which generated emigration that was followed by the Revolution and ensuing Civil War and War by the West against the Revolutionary government that also caused further emigration along with all the death. And there was lots of emigration following the 1905 Revolution too. Don’t forget Russia lost to Japan in its short naval war in 1905-6. There’re no figures, but fertility rate had to drop bigtime too.

Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 19 2024 1:48 utc | 147

Tblisi flight Landed in Almaty.

Posted by: Chaka Khagan | Mar 19 2024 1:50 utc | 148

Posted by: Scorpion | Mar 19 2024 1:04 utc | 139
Aside from WWI, the most important factor for the horrific death toll (NOWHERE near one-thrid of the nation) was caused by the west-instigated civil war. Kinda like the one in Syria.
In short, by early May 1918, the Russians, led by the Reds, were preparing for a reckoning with Germany to defend against another German attack (hence the transfer of the capital to Moscow) or to reverse the results of the Brest-Litovsk treaty. That is why in May 1st there was an amnesty offered to anti-communist prisoners as unity was the order of the day (in hindsight, Fyodor Windberg whould have never been amnestied as he would indirectly harm the country).
It was the misguided order for the arrest of the Czech Legion that gave the western powers of Entente the chance of creating a civil war aimed at the removal of the Reds. Add the sanctions onan already battered country and the result was the horror show that followed.
Mind you, it’s not that the Bolsheviks didn’t have to face an oposition (nor were they entitled to an absence of one), but the latter was so decrepit and unable to cope with the political, social, military and international realities, that it couldn’t form a coherent political force. The chaos caused by the debacle with the Czechs and above all the massive support of the west to create an artificial anti-Bolshevik front led to the war. Even that front was insufficient, hence the need for a massive military intervention up to and including the Polish invasion.

Posted by: Constantine | Mar 19 2024 2:27 utc | 149

Honestly, B, that propaganda piece is the biggest load of bullshit I’ve ever read.
I often find myself asking how anyone who is remotely educated could swallow that shit whole and without a second thought.
But then again I saw no less than five articles about Ukraine today and all of them full of LIES. Most of them about how Ukraine is kicking Russian butt via drone attacks and others about US MIC equipment to Ukraine that gave ME the impression that those deliveries were going to be a game changer in Ukraine’s favor.
I am not at all shocked at the nonsense put up for idiot American consumption. The elite just laugh at how easy it is to fool Americans who they see as suckers.
Thank God for you, B! Our almost daily breath of fresh air.
Btw, did you happen to see Josep Burrell’s Tweet today?
YAY WAR!

Posted by: Kay | Mar 19 2024 2:55 utc | 150

Honestly, B, that propaganda piece is the biggest load of bullshit I’ve ever read.
I often find myself asking how anyone who is remotely educated could swallow that shit whole and without a second thought.
But then again I saw no less than five articles about Ukraine today and all of them full of LIES. Most of them about how Ukraine is kicking Russian butt via drone attacks and others about US MIC equipment to Ukraine that gave ME the impression that those deliveries were going to be a game changer in Ukraine’s favor.
I am not at all shocked at the nonsense put up for idiot American consumption. The elite just laugh at how easy it is to fool Americans who they see as suckers.
Thank God for you, B! Our almost daily breath of fresh air.
Btw, did you happen to see Josep Burrell’s Tweet today?
YAY WAR!

Posted by: Kay | Mar 19 2024 2:55 utc | 151

@Constantine
Seeing as you’re here and reasonably clued-in to Russian domestic politics, what happened with the ‘Communists of Russia’ candidate? I haven’t really been following things since the SMO began, but ‘Communists of Russia’, the RF’s 2nd largest Communist Party after the KPRF, used to be considered (at least in the West) as closer to the legacy of the CPSU and a little further to the ‘Left’ than the KPRF.
I heard their candidate didn’t make the final ballot because of too many invalid signatures on their nominating petition. I think their support has been declining in the last couple of elections, do you think they just couldn’t get enough signatures or have they been punished for opportunism? I don’t know what organization Kargalitsky was affiliated too, but some more western-orientated Marxists have been pretty terrible on the SMO, throwing around terms like Imperialism as though they’ve never read Lenin. That would be pretty sad for those who’d like to see a consolidation of the Russian Communists in order to oppose further privatizations and press for a more assertive approach to the West.
Don’t let me distract you from your discussion with Scorp though, he reckons Mr Moustache was only protecting White Civilization from Stalin’s flying tanks…

Posted by: S.P. Korolev | Mar 19 2024 2:56 utc | 152

Posted by: Perimetr | Mar 19 2024 1:34 utc | 143
Pls. remember where the “largest” NATO Head Center will be, despite of any new buildings anywhere ..?
That’s Ramstein in Germany, due to all ever since created digital connections available still today.
Others are not yet available. Be sure a little.

Posted by: spare_tuth_01 | Mar 19 2024 2:58 utc | 153

Posted by: Echo Chamber | Mar 18 2024 23:04 utc | 126
For someone who wants us to be convinced you know your stuff, you seem our of date re Europe and Russia in terms of economic strength
Trading economics lists 7 key indicators (plus credit rating which is too political to count). On these
GDP growth: This is too embarrassing for TrEc to publish properly. Russia 5.5%, Albania 2.3%, the EU and the European area both 0 while Germany and UK both at -0.3% (you have to look at Country specific data to find the 5.5 figure. Apparently for GDP growth Russia does not exist in the summary page.
Unemployment: Russia 2.9%, the EU and the European area 6.4 and 6%, Germany 5.9% UK 3.9%. .
Debt to GDP: Russia 17, the EU and the European area 83.5 and 90.4. Russia is killing the rest of them – except Germany but it is weakening now.
Current account/GDP: Russia way way better – strongly positive. EU and Uk are basket cases
Balance of Trade: hard to compare but Russia is positive and UK and France negative
All these 5 place Russia very much the strong man of Europe
Then there are two which are poor probably because of strong GDP growth:
Inflation: high at 7.7% compared with Europe at about 2.8
Interest rates: At 16% unacceptably high.
So essentially of these 7 indicators Russia is killing the rest on 5 of them. If you delve deeper into manufacturing output and PMI and general confidence the story is the same.

Posted by: watcher | Mar 19 2024 3:00 utc | 154

The Ramstein – Germany – NATO Center is beside the town “Wiesbaden”.
So hope, those civilians in “Wiesbaden – Germany” won’t be struck on any missile attacks by the Russian missiles, aggressively Your Women in “Bundestag” attacking .. or neither in Brussels Your Mam vd.Liars Miss Ursula – by a hidden strike : Result: All Security guys killed, but v.d.Liars still alive with some stomach shots, but will be alive to go on with her “next fight” a la WHO with newly developped insects (Virus insects) she already has proofed as effectively in African regions (no name here as to be proofed) ..- Go on – You -GERMAN Chancellor – You are RAMSTEIN – Not the US.
Or have doubts .. Mr. Scholz ?
No – You do not have doubts – Mr. Scholz .. So follow our (C’I’A) plans minute-by-minute – Stood that
?
So it is in reality – not only virtually – Bye, All best to all MoA’S.

Posted by: spare_tuth_01 | Mar 19 2024 3:15 utc | 155

Kill em “ALL” is NOT a good solution to proclaim killing of Mr. Z and ALL the standing guys on corruption still standing behind “him” and Biden-Son’s approach in ÄUKR, but ..
So be careful what you say here, You once will be prosecuted of a crime/murder, or as an un-guilty guy having spoken the some truth details about the “Biden Family”. Taske a new Nose !
That’s all Hunter B. needs today.
UKRANIA and its people is not in any sense of Mr. Hunter B., The History of himself will resolve this conflict asap.
So hope – US Pres Biden isn’t the same as Bush Jr. when have started any terror attacks on NewYork Towers..
Russia can do it once more with a single Khinzal or an ever-typed new rocket strike, if You USA Nuland/Blinken ladies want to have it.
Greetings !

Posted by: spare_tuth_01 | Mar 19 2024 3:51 utc | 156

Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 19 2024 1:48 utc | 147
Posted by: Constantine | Mar 19 2024 2:27 utc | 149
Thank you both. I still find it strange that such a progressive-sounding situation as in 1905 morphed into something so bloody. Those who support communism always blame it on external enemies but I don’t think that explains the extensive domestic violence. Also, from karlof1’s earlier piece, it seems that soviet/committee governance is part of Russian tradition, making basic communism not an entirely alien beast. I believe Todd says this too.
Indeed, I suspect most agrarian/rural systems tend towards more communal than entrepreneurial. Where I live in a rural area of Mexico, for example, my house-building crew often absents itself from its duties to me to do communal road maintenance or repairing someone’s roof which collapsed in a big storm last month and such. A community-wide imperative pops up and they all pitch in; most rural communities throughout the world are like this.
My impression is that, although most history books hesitate to tell it this way, the bolshevik revolution was funded largely from abroad, was subversive, had a very high Jewish quotient with their own tribal agenda which featured deep-rooted animus to towards both the Rus and the Tzars; and this subversive movement later manifested as extraordinary cruelty against Christians, moreover not principally due to external enemies, shortcomings of the Tzar or losses in WWI, though all three contributed.
Telling the story of Russia from the late 1800’s to early 1900’s without including those Jewish elements is somewhat lacking.

Posted by: Scorpion | Mar 19 2024 3:52 utc | 157

So Russian voting is like American Black Friday sales and Thanksgiving holiday travel rush? That’s hardcore — and for democracy too! How many people were sacrificed to the crushing mob this time? 😉 If Russia is that metal then USA and Russia should totally be friends.
/cheeeeeeeeeeeeeep
/headbangs

Posted by: titmouse | Mar 19 2024 4:02 utc | 158

.. USA and Russia should totally be friends. ..
Sure, they should be, the American people and the Russian people.
No more, no less.
But without any forced thinking rules of its currently ruling “Deep-State” on either side.
So come – go ahead ..

Posted by: spare_tuth_01 | Mar 19 2024 4:12 utc | 159

Karlof1 @ 47:
Links of presidential campaigns of other main candidates in Russia’s 2024 Presidential elections:
Presidential campaign and platform of Vladislav Davankov of New People political party (considered to be centre-right)
Presidential campaign and platform of Nikolai Kharitonov of Communist Party
Presidential campaign and platform of Leonid Slutsky of Liberal Democratic Party of Russia (right-wing party)

Posted by: Refinnejenna | Mar 19 2024 5:15 utc | 160

Zizek losing his mind over Russia, did someone spike his coffee? What a complete charlatan.
https://twitter.com/EuromaidanPress/status/1769801014356451544

Posted by: Roger | Mar 19 2024 5:30 utc | 161

Does anybody have a sample Russian ballot?
Posted by: Christian J Chuba | Mar 18 2024 13:17 utc | 10

Svetlana from Russia (youtube channel) had this yesterday: RUSSIA’S PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION DAY 2024
The above link is at time 6m30s when she enters the polling station and votes. She briefly shows the ballot, and flips through it to show that it actually explains who the different candidates are with a brief background of each.
Note: she is not impressed with democracy in Russia, and she says this is the first time she has ever voted. She very explicitly votes for someone other than Putin.
She does elaborate (later) on how she was allowed to video in the polling station.

Posted by: retroflecks | Mar 19 2024 6:22 utc | 162

@Jazzbo (66)
I’ve made it my own personal rule to live by: Never, ever trust anyone who utters the word “trope.” This has worked well for me.

Posted by: Andrew | Mar 18 2024 19:59 utc | 92

So would you describe yourself as a Never-Troper?
https://tvtropes.org : Tropes

Posted by: retroflecks | Mar 19 2024 7:10 utc | 163

@karlof1 | Mar 19 2024 1:48 utc | 147
I can tell you havent read Nikolai Starikovs ‘The liquidation of Russia – who helped the reds to win the civil war’.
Communism took over Russia as well as later China supported by the US/UK.
In both cases the stated motivation was to prevent a capitalist competitor to rise.
And Japan’s navy was partly built by the UK.
Oleg Platonov, who had access to the masonic records captured from the nazis, reported that the US UK France Germany etc financed the bolshevik revolution. Apart from the 50 million dollars he cites he estimates the full sum to be 100M

Posted by: petergrfstrm | Mar 19 2024 7:35 utc | 164

Posted by: Scorpion | Mar 19 2024 3:52 utc | 157
Listen mate, if you wish to rely entirely to your “impressions” (that is, pre-conceived notions and biases) and inocculate yourself from any arguments that challenge them, there is little point in discussion. If one wishes something to be true, then that’s where all debate ends. However, if you are genuinely interested to study a subject, you should be willing to reach conclusions that may be incompatible with your established views.
As it happens, I studied the subject of the Russian Revolution not to validate my leftist views (which, in fact, were harsher towards the Reds in the past), but because it appeared to me very odd that a party that was radical for the standards of Russia (if not the world) of the early 20th cent. I was especially baffled from the fact that the main tools for the Bolshevik victory, the Red Army and the GRU, were almost entirely composed of former monarchists who had typically been Russian nationalists and Orthodox Christians. Don’t you find such a development very odd (to put it mildly)?
Now, Richard Piper, as an anti-communist scholar and a right-wing Jew, came up with various ludicrous explanations, such as that the officers were just loyal to any Russian government and simply tranferred their loyalty to the Reds. This is utter horsecrap, but it was important for Piper to denigrate the Soviet project, because he was embarassed by the presence of numerous Jews in the Bolshevik ranks. On such a serious question, his explanation was summed in a couple of sentences, because he wanted to avoid it completely.
But one may opt for the “subversives over all” explanation that you apparently adopted. This one isn’t just laughable, but deeply offensive about the Russians as well. Without any specifics, it suggests that a radical party of low popularity was able to gain power, while somehow antagonizing everyone. It’s Russiagate on loads of steroids. The foreign masters have been equally diverse and all without any basis on facts: Germans, British, Jewish bankers or all western bankers. Like most baseless theories of this type, it doesn’t stand to serious scrutiny and avoids the mechanism for the rise of the Reds and the preservation of their power. In fact, the SRs, also a leftist party and the one with history of bombing atacks and assassinations was even more popular than the Bolshies. Is this fact to be ignored too? Is it not very unusual that the hitherto crashed left had risen so prominently?
And what does this “Judeo-Bolhevikplot” narrative suggest about the Russians in general? Well, the obvious case was that of the Nazis, who adopted it and reasonably concluded that if a minority of murderous anti-Russian reptillians could take power and still served by the Russkies, the latter were clearly a bunch of walking vegetables and veritable subhumans who would follow such odious masters. Thus, the basis for the genocidal invasion in WWII was established (although the German inclinations were already present since WWI).
The reason that the Russian lefitst and especially the Reds attracted such support from segments of the population and the professional personnel of the state apparatus is that the previous regimes – the imperial and the liberal-conservative – had so utterly failed that people began to look towards radical solutions. Remember that Russia was way worse than the western Entente powers and even there popular discontent caused fear to the establishment. All that was required was the will and determination to take power and the ability to keep it.
The critical factor was Lenin. No amount of conspiratorial horsecrap can hide the fact that the Bolsheviks were not at all prepared to overthrow an utterly discredited liberal government, until Lenin pushed them resolutely, when he realized in mid-September 1917 that the party was in full ascendancy mode. Ironically, it was the two most prominent Jews of the party that opposed the idea, with Kamenev revealing it to the public through an article in Pravda. Try to consider the level of incompetence of the Kerensky government which failed to act in any meaningful way to preclude such a possible development, after it had been publicly exposed.
As for the Tsar, I honestly cannot understand what is so important about him to make you whine about him. Do you mourn about the innumerable victims of lower social standing martyred by the monarchy? Do you actually believe that God had literally blessed this buffoon? In fact, are you seriously suggesting that the Christian leaders of the great “Christian” states had established an inernational order at that time based on actually Christian values? Unless, of course, you consider racism, colonialism, exploitation of vast swaths of humanity (including their own people), calamitous wars, genocides and artificial famines to be Christian values.
As it happens, the Tsar had little to do with the rise of the Bolsheviks who, in fact, brought down a failed liberal and after western instigation, confronted a motley alliance whose leaders proclaimed their adherrence to a Republic and NOT the monarchy. If anything, the monarchist elements were the ones that weakened the Whites politically for all the military clout they offered.
Nicholas II was an absolute failure of a ruler and the most damning evidence come from historical developments, state archives, his family and his own supporters (NOT communist propaganda). The exasperation of his closest kin, his ministers and others is truly incredible to study. In the end, he blew up his own throne and it was a criminal decision of the Ural Soviet to order the execution of the imperial family, which on top of a crime was a stupendous blunder. The Reds should have orchestrated the escape of this fallen monarch, who was politically so toxic that his presence among the anti-Bolshevik forces would have doomed the White movement from the get-go. In fact, at that time the main threat was the Czech Legion.
I could go on, but on a final note I would point to you that even Solzhenitsyn later on came up with these reasonable questions that I posed. He concluded that the Tsar “betrayed us” and that the Russian people were “confused” precisely because he realized that the ascendancy of the Reds was backed mostly by ethnic Russians and not a few Jewish subversives, but he couldn’t bring himself to acknowledge that the Bolshies did something right to deserve any level of support from the people and the military.
I apologize for the length of the post to all barflies.

Posted by: Constantine | Mar 19 2024 8:30 utc | 165

Posted by: petergrfstrm | Mar 19 2024 7:35 utc | 165
You tell’em “petergrfstrm”! Yes, the capitalist powers supported the rise of an anti-capitalist regime that would spearhead the anti-colonial movements against the same powers. Western capitalists instigated a communist revolution, then a civil war to overthrow said commies (since without the west, there would be NO civil war at all), all for the greater fun.
And let’s not forget that western bankers backed a socialist party, which, once in power, unilaterally erased Russia’s debts to said bankers and championed the nationalization of banks everywhere.
As I said, anti-communism is like TDS, with the added effect of decades long propaganda. It is a veritable mental condition that involves full detachment from reality, since it doesn’t promote any serious criticism of socialist/communist beliefs and policies, but downright derangement and reasoning disability. Which is why the western citizenry can be led by the nose so easily.

Posted by: Constantine | Mar 19 2024 8:46 utc | 166

Always start a morning with a healthy guffaw minding not to throw up your cuppa brew as I nearly just did !
Nafo fuckwit , tries to burn a Muscovite on webchat and gets a master class blowback!
‘Why does my dog have more rights than you do?’
‘Because you live in the EU and marriages between men and dogs are allowed there’
https://t.me/DDGeopolitics/104869
Boom! 😂
Worth watching a few times for the genius seconds that sets apart the rabid barbarian from a cultured old civilised mind that can rip him a new one before he finishes with his shit bantz.
That’s why the Collective Waste hates genuine human civilisation – why we have no reverse gear. Why the rending of shirts and hair and screaming like toddlers in a sweetshop demanding more sugar! Why we make a pseudo religious beliefs like fake democracy, CC, Extinction Rebellion , Woke and Transhumanism… we are doomed!
In other news from same channel I see see that the wormtongue Stoltenberg has landed in Armenia? And Obama and US ambassador popped into No10 to give the PM Sunak his orders!
I guess Nudelman can’t do it now, so they sent the senior house boy to tell the other junior house boy, that his times up, cause Modi looks like he ain’t delivering brown boots to the mincers. Or something…

Posted by: DunGroanin | Mar 19 2024 9:07 utc | 167

Posted by: S.P. Korolev | Mar 19 2024 2:56 utc | 152
To the extent that I’m informed about the most recent developments on the fringe elements of the Russian left, a segment of the Russian left has been poisoned with western leftism. Even western commies are unable to shed their entrenchment in their purity strongholds and that affects non-westerners too.
This is important, since the war has progresively affected Putin to move leftwards. As many Russians have began to abandon their liberal-lite political mentality and realize the status of those who are their allies, so has Putin adopted political stances he had previously discarded.
On the issue of China, he was in fact ahead of most of the citizens, many of whom until recently loathed the latter as they craved to be accepted by their western acquaintances. Basically, western “conservatives” with Russian characteristics. Now, only the ultra-nationalists stick to that.
Putin has also adopted the anti-colonial stance, which, very unwisely, he had abandoned (see his lackluster performance in the first Russian-African conference). To some extent,this is beyond diplomatic performance as it is revealed in his political and social initiatives too.
THe social programs he has been pushing have a distinctly leftist character. In western countries, in fact, particularly the US, he would be treated as a commie. These should also be perceived in the context of the war. He did not come up as a candidate of United Russia, but independent. In the current circumstances, eve people who have grievances towards the Krewmlin, but realize the need for national consolidation have backed him up.
The closest of a serious opposition is the KPRF. THe Nationalists have really fallen out of touch. On on hand, they score points due to a level of criticism towards the mismanaged aspects of the war effort. They even attract support from those who are disapointed with the close relations with CHina. But that is why they are out of touch with the current developments. Some even spout the very divisive crap (originally by Zhirinovsky) that are seen in Ukraine and Georgia and popularly rejected in Russia.
The KPRF is more attuned with contemporary realities, but not to the point of politically threatening Putin. Personally, I think it would be beneficial for the country to drop the baggage of the past and have its two main parties amalgamate in a national-popular front. The time has come for Russia to learn from China, that is to remember part of its own leftist political heritage without the mental fetters that undermined the USSR. And that requires to finally abandon and repudiate the abysmal legacy of Yeltsin and the 90s.

Posted by: Constantine | Mar 19 2024 9:09 utc | 168

On Monday, 03/18/24, Andrei Martyanov posted an interview done by CFR with some guy named Kotkin. I could only stomach about 1/2 of it, as it was nothing but assertions unsupported with facts. Facts meaning numbers, statistics. About how the “West” was WAY MORE powerful than Russia. Industrial and Agricultural production data tell quite a different story, not to mention battlefield reports from SMO and USAF fitreps on F-35.
This crap about “protests” is the same type of nonsense. Here’s the scorecard: 2020, Biden, 51%; 2024, Putin, 87%. And I’m not even taking into account turnout statistics in both presidential elections to get a sense of a more realistic sense of support among their people that each president enjoys.
The “West” might have a chance if it stops lying to itself. But I consider that event to have a probability approaching ZERO.

Posted by: OldFart | Mar 19 2024 9:26 utc | 169

“Balance of Trade: hard to compare but Russia is positive and UK and France negative”
How does giving more stuff to foreigners than you get from foreigners improve the quality of life of Russians?
The UK and the US gets the world’s excess production in return for mere promises, which as we saw with Russia they have no need to keep. That’s because the excess production can’t get a better deal anywhere else – if they tried there would be a glut and prices would collapse.
Neither ‘debt to GDP’ nor ‘export surplus’ are relevant to the standard of living of a nation. It’s stuff that matters – what you can make and what you can obtain from others, less what you have to give to others in exchange.
Forget about the numbers. Concentrate on the stuff.

Posted by: The Accountant | Mar 19 2024 9:26 utc | 170

New plan for Ukraine:
“Dictatorship is the tool that can help defeat Russia.
This assumption was expressed by MP from the “Servant of the People” Serhiy Demchenko on the air of “News Live”.
“Dictatorship is a tool that can help us defeat the enemy. This form of government is definitely a disadvantage for the country and its citizens. But in times of war, such an option cannot be ruled out. However, it should be understood that Ukrainians are freedom-loving. We should not be like the totalitarian enemy regime we are fighting,” Demchenko said.”
https://strana.news/news/460370-rossiju-mozhet-pomoch-pobedit-diktatura-serhej-demchenko.html

Posted by: Paul from Norway | Mar 19 2024 9:35 utc | 171

Posted by: Constantine | Mar 19 2024 8:30 utc | 166
……………….
Thank you for your post. I don’t believe am as prejudiced as you waste time projecting. I also still don’t see how the country got from such a progressive -sounding 1905 to the Red Terror. I didn’t ‘whine’ about the Tzar though in previous posts have deplored the sordid murder of himself and his family, including women and children, without due process which existed under the wicked Tzars. To me that crime symbolizes the spirit of the revolutionary regime: driven by Animus and essentially criminal. How can any reasonable person see it any other way? Unless they are so prejudiced in favour of the Jewish-Bolsheviks that they can easily justify such murder because the ends justify the means. The Tzars may have been bad, despite facilitating some democratic reforms, but what replaced them was far, far worse. Russia’s population is still below what it was before the revolution, no? (Though maybe the territorial changes have screwed up the statistics.)
Many different accounts point out that not only were a high percentage of the senior Bolsheviks Jewish, but also not native Russians. And that a high percentage of the people slaughtered were Christians and slaughtered for that reason. Given the current behavior evidenced in Gaza, I tend to believe those accounts.
So that indeed is my prejudice. And until things are better explained, it remains. There must be a clear explanation for the murder of tens of millions. I didn’t get that from your admittedly well informed post. I am not at all for or against capitalism or communism etc which I regard as somewhat bogus Talmudic constructs designed to provide intellectual cover for raw power players. My concern, for decades now, is to understand how a society can end up engendering mass murder, and that it doesn’t happen to my son and grandchildren.
My support of monarchy is on philosophical and spiritual grounds, and not tied at all to any recent examples in Europe, such as the Windsors or Romanovs. Indeed, I believe Europe, which I both love and hate, has been deeply corrupt since Roman times though some small jurisdictions were not without merit – you can see it in the trees and land. I believe that post industrial revolution rule by middle class mentality Money Power has been a great leap backwards.
I am for people, human beings, and Nature, and generally not in favour of any ideologies, though that is all we seem to have these days. Russia looks pretty good from afar, but I can’t know for sure. Maybe still too materialist and middle class. They suffered way too much to get where they are today, part of which is due to aggression of others, yes, but not all. I wish them and all people well, but criminals should be stopped, not allowed to run our countries as is currently the case in the West and I believe was also the case in communist Russia.

Posted by: Scorpion | Mar 19 2024 9:38 utc | 172

/crunchy bass guitar arpeggios with a sick fast-paced drum line
>:( Oooooooooooooooh yeah! Listen to Constantine! To the Greater Fun!
/kicks birdseed about the feeder, then moshes in the birdbath
>:( The Greater Fun! The Greater Fun!
/cheeeeeeeeeeeeeeëeeeeeeeep!
(Honestly, the possessed greater agents of chaos theory is not all that far-fetched given how silly the world has been. I mean why not?, what with all the old imperial nobility getting their rocks off on occultism and demonology out of boredom and control issues. 😉 What if some ancient and immortal things came through and is having a bit of a lark at our expense for generations now? O_o What if they tired of their ancient Babylonian names and are wreaking havoc for being dead named, like the trans!)

Posted by: titmouse | Mar 19 2024 9:40 utc | 173

From my experience of the last few days here in the Netherlands which is just as anti Russian as the UK is. Around our village small posters of Navalny were put up. A day later they were all ripped down.much to a wry smile from me. Last week I asked a few random.dutch kids who don’t comment on the war at my work. Every one instantly said Ukraine has no chance of winning. I know it’s small victories but I do think people are aware of what is going on. Maybe not enough but it’s encouraging in my small experience the youth are not buying the media anymore.

Posted by: Scot1and | Mar 19 2024 10:01 utc | 174

I apologize for the length of the post to all barflies.
Posted by: Constantine | Mar 19 2024 8:30 utc | 166
An apology is not in order.
Rather, you are to be commended for taking the time and making the
effort to enlighten an intransigent (see 9:38 utc | 173) poster.
I learn from you and others must as well.
Thank you, Constantine!

Posted by: waynorinorway | Mar 19 2024 10:06 utc | 175

An apology is not in order.
Rather, you are to be commended for taking the time and making the
effort to enlighten an intransigent (see 9:38 utc | 173) poster.
I learn from you and others must as well.
Thank you, Constantine!
Posted by: waynorinorway | Mar 19 2024 10:06 utc | 176
……………….
Issue free, animus-laden ad hominem as always.

Posted by: Scorpion | Mar 19 2024 10:17 utc | 176

Posted by: Echo Chamberpot | Mar 18 2024 23:04 utc | 126
“For someone who wants us to be convinced you know your stuff, you seem our of date re Europe and Russia in terms of economic strength
Trading economics lists 7 key indicators (plus credit rating which is too political to count). On these
GDP growth: This is too embarrassing for TrEc to publish properly. Russia 5.5%, Albania 2.3%, the EU and the European area both 0 while Germany and UK both at -0.3% (you have to look at Country specific data to find the 5.5 figure. Apparently for GDP growth Russia does not exist in the summary page.
Unemployment: Russia 2.9%, the EU and the European area 6.4 and 6%, Germany 5.9% UK 3.9%. .
Debt to GDP: Russia 17, the EU and the European area 83.5 and 90.4. Russia is killing the rest of them – except Germany but it is weakening now.
Current account/GDP: Russia way way better – strongly positive. EU and Uk are basket cases
Balance of Trade: hard to compare but Russia is positive and UK and France negative
All these 5 place Russia very much the strong man of Europe
Then there are two which are poor probably because of strong GDP growth:
Inflation: high at 7.7% compared with Europe at about 2.8
Interest rates: At 16% unacceptably high.
So essentially of these 7 indicators Russia is killing the rest on 5 of them. If you delve deeper into manufacturing output and PMI and general confidence the story is the same.”
Posted by: watcher | Mar 19 2024 3:00 utc | 154
Watcher, I was going to reply to Echo Chamberpot’s latest attack on myself but your post, above, was, is much more refined as well as more comprehensive than mine ever would have been.
Thanks
Thanks

Posted by: canuck | Mar 19 2024 10:30 utc | 177

“Scorpion | Mar 19 2024 1:04 utc | 139–
First, there was WW1 which generated emigration that was followed by the Revolution and ensuing Civil War and War by the West against the Revolutionary government that also caused further emigration along with all the death. And there was lots of emigration following the 1905 Revolution too. Don’t forget Russia lost to Japan in its short naval war in 1905-6. There’re no figures, but fertility rate had to drop bigtime too.”
Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 19 2024 1:48 utc | 147
Excellent post.
If my old mind is correct Czarist Russia lost twice to the Japanese in naval encounters; once in 1905, then after that ignominious defeat they send their biggest dreadnought along with supply ships all the way (no northern ice passage at that time) from the Baltics around South Africa -took months and thousands of tons of coal-and when the armada finally got to Japanese waters, in 1906, it was summarily defeated a second time..

Posted by: canuck | Mar 19 2024 10:39 utc | 178

Having caught up with all the posts- some great , others I’ll try to ignore due to the usual sock puppet trollery. I’ll just barge in on the Money topic.
@ Posted by: The Accountant | Mar 19 2024 9:26 utc | 171
Nail . Head . Hit. Thankyou.
Now @ Echo Chamber – good as you are on MMT – I agree with most of its explanation of money creation and destruction etc , you have not quite figured the difference between our western central bank interest rates and how they are perhaps operating in the RF.
I believe i already asked you sometime ago to provide detail of how much interest is paid by Russians in their daily lives , how much borrowing they have for a mortgage, or on credit card or overdraft or hire purchase …and how any of these are linked to the Central Bank interest rate and indeed with commercial banks and lenders ..
Do you know EchoC? Can you point to any data?
Perhaps you know what the savings rates are that are available to ordinary Russians?
What percentage of their disposable income is saved and what is taken abroad?
To me it seems that such a high CB interest rate would encourage Savings with the State discouraging capital flight. Given that wages are increasing and the economy is in full employment. Inflation is natural as goes with rising spare cash.
Given also that all the luxuries that can only be imported are easily available in local currency.
It would suggest that the main reason for such a high rate is to reward savers in the rouble!
I wish I could access that rate with my pension pot! But heck since our BrexShit bonus of global Britain was supposed to allow us a freedom to do what we liked seems to have been a red herring – I guess I’m stuck with a measly 5% and at least that much in inflation!
As we move our selves into continued austerity and a return to the good old days of the born rich and the rest of us living hand to mouth.

Posted by: DunGroanin | Mar 19 2024 10:41 utc | 179

“I apologize for the length of the post to all barflies.”
Posted by: Constantine | Mar 19 2024 8:30 utc | 166
No, your length was fine, the prose excellent, the ideas are a bit off in my opinion.
The one major point you avoided was who or what financed the Bolshevik Revolution -hint, it wasn’t Lenin and his pals:
“..much of Bolshevik Revolution was financed by private citizens and companies from New York and Germany; evidence also exists, taken from Trotsky’s memoir, that British individuals and companies assisted the Bolsheviks financially as well.”
When one addends this idea of outside financing, which indeed did happen , it kinda ruins your superstructure of your thesis, idea.

Posted by: canuck | Mar 19 2024 11:11 utc | 180

“To me it seems that such a high CB interest rate would encourage Savings with the State discouraging capital flight. Given that wages are increasing and the economy is in full employment. Inflation is natural as goes with rising spare cash.
Given also that all the luxuries that can only be imported are easily available in local currency.
It would suggest that the main reason for such a high rate is to reward savers in the rouble!
I wish I could access that rate with my pension pot! But heck since our BrexShit bonus of global Britain was supposed to allow us a freedom to do what we liked seems to have been a red herring – I guess I’m stuck with a measly 5% and at least that much in inflation!
As we move our selves into continued austerity and a return to the good old days of the born rich and the rest of us living hand to mouth.”
Posted by: DunGroanin | Mar 19 2024 10:41 utc | 180
Excellent rebuttal-basically-there are exceptions-high interest rates are good for the Serfs (savers); low interest rates are good for oligarchs as they borrow their way to billionaire status through debt leverage.

Posted by: canuck | Mar 19 2024 11:15 utc | 181

@ChasMark| Mar 18 2024 15:05

“The Election was Disneyed”

Brilliant!

Posted by: LongCovid | Mar 19 2024 11:38 utc | 182

Posted by: Chaka Khagan | Mar 19 2024 1:50 utc | 148
Thank you, yes, Almaty, so a USAF transport which in 2015 was used by Special Forces left Tblisi, Georgia, and flew to Almaty, Kazakhstan.
https://www.flightradar24.com/data/aircraft/08-6201#346a8e2c
I hope (and assume) that Russia are aware that the Evil Empire are planning dirty deeds on the perimeter.

Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Mar 19 2024 12:24 utc | 183

” Best economy in Europe ” that’s a bit of a stretch even from you Canuck.”
Posted by: Echo Chamber | Mar 18 2024 23:04 utc | 126
Well, you are wrong one more time-see below-I suggest that you read and think more and post less to retain any scrap of your cre3dibiliy intact.
“The Russian economy in 2023 outpaced both the United States and Europe in terms of growth, increasing in size by 3.6% despite being subject to a wide array of powerful economic sanctions and being cut off from major global markets.(1)
1.https://www.voanews.com/a/russia-economy-grew-in-2023-despite-war-and-sanctions/7478952.html

Posted by: canuck | Mar 19 2024 13:37 utc | 184

Posted by: Roger | Mar 19 2024 5:30 utc | 161
Žižek has always been a dubious figure, but I think his fame has gone to his head on the one hand, and on the other hand, as a Slovene, he has probably always had anti-Russian resentments. The fact that he has now ended up with Piers Morgan and is implicitly calling for nuclear war tells you everything you need to know about him.

Posted by: noonewhomatters | Mar 19 2024 14:21 utc | 185

Posted by: canuck | Mar 19 2024 11:11 utc | 181
Nobody financed the October Revolution, although the Germans did financially support anti-war parties (Bolsheviks included) through leftist intermediaries. The goal was to have peace in the eastern front.
Trotsky wasn’t a Bolshevik until after he returned to Russia in the summer of ’17. He had indeed been arrested by the British in Canada and was alowed to return to Russia at the insistence of the Provisional Government.
As for the British funding the October Revolution, as I pointed previously, if you wish intensely something to be real there can be no argument against it. Apparently, the Brits wished to see Russia out of the war against Germany and led by people who would unilaterally erase Russian debts to British banks and also promote anti-capitalism and anti-colonialism. Sure, why not. Putin must have also been promoted by Victoria Nuland to take control of the Kremlin…

Posted by: Constantine | Mar 19 2024 14:50 utc | 186

@Constantine | Mar 19 2024 8:46 utc | 167
I can tell you are not likely to attempt to get wiser so I wont try to advice you about further reading. However I think many of us who are critical against the west and who follow the altmedia have an understanding about there being cognitive infiltrators interspersed among the commenters.
In this context I believe the western empire prefers that socialists remain faithful to the preferred narrative and your strong emotive reaction is what they like.
It means you are not likely to inform yourself in an unbiased manner.
I havent been observant about the name Constantine before so I have no previous impression of you but at this point it seems to me you would make a viable cognitive infiltration intent of protecting the preferred narrative.
The other alternative would be that you are simply a leftist, and leftists who accept the truth about the bolshevik revolution are rare.
For other visitors I recommend Nikolai Starikovs ‘The liquidation of Russia – who helped the reds to win the civil war’
Starikov, like Putin is a patriot. All true russian patriots of whatever political persuasion are respected.

Posted by: petergrfstrm | Mar 19 2024 15:00 utc | 187

Posted by: Scorpion | Mar 19 2024 9:38 utc | 173
I explained a number of points that you brought back again. Apparently, you were not interested at all in my arguments. Further, you seem to have gross ignorance of basic demographics, if you believe that the Bolsheviks “murdered” tens of millions. How many was it, mate? Maybe 66 millions, apart from WWII losses, as Solzhie confidently asserted when in the US? Or the latest 110? The more the merrier as it appears.
Again, if one wishes to come to a specific conclusion no matter what, one will, historical facts be damned. Yet, even conservative Russians have by now abandoned such extreme nonsensical views that had become the vogue in the 90s.
Still, it is sad that people prefer Talmudic fantasies and Masonic bollocks instead of well documented historical processes. No wonder that people keep being bamboozled by the same political actors and their servile media.

Posted by: Constantine | Mar 19 2024 15:05 utc | 188

Posted by: petergrfstrm | Mar 19 2024 15:00 utc | 188
After the utterly incoherent nonsense that you have posted, you don’t get to tell me to educate myself about the Russian Revolution. Unlike an ignoramus of your magnitude who looks for communists under his bed every night, I had genuine questions and I studied the subject to as much a scholarly level as I could many years ago. Kept studying it ever since.
As for Starikov, he is no more a patriot than Zakhar Prilepin, who actually went to the Donbass in the critical years nad whose views are quite different. But you wouldn’t even know who that is. You didn’t get informed by Starikov (that would be a joke), you just validated your previous messed up notions about the subject.

Posted by: Constantine | Mar 19 2024 15:13 utc | 189

@Posted by: Constantine | Mar 19 2024 9:09 utc | 169
An excellent post. It has taken Putin far too long to shed (i) his belief in Western fair dealing, perhaps the revelations about European duplicity with respect to Minsk 1 and Minsk 2 and the aborted negotiations with Ukraine in Turkey have finally buried that (ii) his neoliberal tendencies, with the exodus of the “liberals” from Russia and the further taming of the oligarchs perhaps he is now able to show his true self?
The old Western left, grounded by the working class, was pro-family and certainly would have been against the extremes of wokeism, been anti-colonialist and would have been forthrightly opposed to the Zionist ethnic cleansing, and believed in the centrality of the need for real economic democracy. Even MLK got there in the last few years of his life, a major reason for him to be taken out. Such a left grouping is not allowed to be in the West as it would achieve very significant electoral success (e.g. Corbyn in his first general election). The German eco-socialist Green Party was transformed into warmongering US shill from the 1990s onwards. Die Linke was rapidly degenerated into a “critical theory” woke “leftism” by the overly/mis-educated middle class university graduates, with now Sahra Wagenknecht forming an “old-style” left party in BSW. Wagenknecht’s Iranian father disappeared under the rule of the Shah, and her MA Thesis was on Marx’s interpretation of Hegel, so definitely an “old-school” leftie. What a real leftie looks like when confronted by establishment propagandists:
#GermanyDecides: Meet the Candidate Sahra Wagenknecht, Left Party | DW English
The WSWS and Novara Media (a UK news site) represent the Trotskyist mis/over-educated “critical theory” types who hate any actual existing alternatives to Western capitalism and colonialism while singing the praises of failed more “pure” socialist experiments and push libertarianism rather than the required taking over of the state as a class project. Novara Media even had this segment Russia’s Nazi Problem Is As Bad As Ukraine’s. The buffoon Zizek recently went full on PDS in denouncing Putin after his re-election
So Putin is more and more turning into a leader that possibly the majority of Western citizens would be very happy with. The Western demonization of him therefore needs to be stepped up, as with the recent childish BS about not recognizing his re-election. As Trump’s re-election becomes closer and closer we can expect the combination of PDS and TDS to go completely off the scale.

Posted by: Roger | Mar 19 2024 15:22 utc | 190

@Constantine | Mar 19 2024 8:46 utc | 167
Concerning the revolution Alfred Milner of notoriety from the Rhodes Round Tablers actually twice refused the Tsar the weapons he was to receive. That was the reason why he abdicated. He namely was made to believe that the republican regime that would follow had a better chance to get the weapons.
He abdicated in the belief that he was doing the right thing for Russia.
Britain deliberately lost the battle of Gallipoli just to keep Russia in the war on the eastern front.
It was vital for Britains aims that Russia DID NOT get access to straits from the Black Sea. So they fooled the russians to believe that Britain would capture it for them. Samsonov believed that the Brits had tried to defeat the Turks since there were such terrible losses.
It is perfectly clear that Britain deliberately bungled it and either Churchill or Kitchener wrote in his diary what sounds like an intent of losing although that intent was unmistakeable when concidering how they acted the first day of the attack.
Historians often give the impression that Britain made mistakes but they hide from you when they do it on purpose.
Later Russia was ready to go for the straits. Therefore the february revolution was necessary.
Unknown machine gunners with skills the Tsars police didnt have strifed people from the top of a bank.
etc etc.

Posted by: petergrfstrm | Mar 19 2024 15:22 utc | 191

Posted by: canuck | Mar 19 2024 11:11 utc | 181
“Nobody financed the October Revolution, although the Germans did financially support anti-war parties (Bolsheviks included) through leftist intermediaries. The goal was to have peace in the eastern front.”
Posted by: Constantine | Mar 19 2024 14:50 utc | 187
How did Lenin get from Germany to Russia ?
From a sealed train paid for by Germany.
Constantine, with all due respect, it is a fact that the October revolution was financed by Western interests; kindly please don’t let your ideological loyalty interfere with firmly documented history.
“Regardless of various theories, the majority of evidence indicates that the Bolshevik Revolution was primarily funded from sources outside of Russia, sources including German and American financial institutions.” (1)
“In a courageous investigation, Antony Sutton establishes tangible historical links between Russian communists and US capitalists. Drawing on US state department files, personal papers of key Wall Street figures, biographies, and conventional histories, Sutton reveals:
The role of Morgan banking executives in funneling illegal Bolshevik gold into the US.
The co-option of the American Red Cross by powerful Wall Street forces.
The intervention by Wall Street sources to free the Marxist revolutionary Leon Trotsky, whose aim was to topple the Russian government.
The deals made by major corporations to capture the huge Russian market a decade and a half before the US recognized the Soviet regime.
The secret sponsoring of Communism by leading businessmen, who publicly championed free enterprise.
Wall Street and the Bolshevik Revolution traces the foundations of Western funding of the Soviet Union. Dispassionately, and with overwhelming documentation, the author details a crucial phase in the establishment of Communist Russia.
This classic study–first published in 1974 and part of a key trilogy–is reproduced here in its original form. The other volumes in this trilogy are Wall Street and the Rise of Hitler and Wall Street and FDR.” (2)
1.https://homework.study.com/explanation/who-funded-the-bolshevik-revolution.html#:~:text=As%20such%2C%20much%20of%20Bolshevik,the%20Bolsheviks%20financially%20as%20well.
2. https://www.amazon.ca/Wall-Street-Bolshevik-Revolution-Capitalists/dp/190557035X

Posted by: canuck | Mar 19 2024 15:30 utc | 192

Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 18 2024 20:48 utc | 103
Ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country.
Splat.

Posted by: MrH | Mar 19 2024 15:45 utc | 193

@Constantine | Mar 19 2024 15:13 utc | 190
You are mistaken about me and your outburst only underwrites that you have no intention to learn anything new.
I am not looking after leftists everywhere. I encounter their comments and I keep being reminded about the religious character many leftists demonstrate.
They have a preferred narrative that is close to that of the western oligarchy’s narrative only the leftists are proud of it while the oligarchy pretends they didnt do it.
I consider many leftists to be wellintended and maybe you are. But when it comes to the truth about communist revolutions you are the ignoramus here.
It doesnt mean many partisitors in revolutions were not in good faith.
Trouble is lots of foreign money made them happen.
And it doesnt stop with Russia and China. You would be surprised that this, to you, so paradoxical condition may also be found both in the case of Cuba and Nicaragua.
Leftists tend to want to cancel their opponents.
The favourite narrative is so precious that it is as if one had committed blasphemy.
The four examples I mentioned are very different.
Still an essential aspect is that the imperialists supported the rebel side.

Posted by: petergrfstrm | Mar 19 2024 15:47 utc | 194

Posted by: canuck | Mar 19 2024 15:30 utc | 193
You just don’t get it, do you? Lenin was expected to return in Russia after the February Revolution had abolished the political persecutions and exiles of the Tsarist era. It was the Entente powers that per your claims were os fond of the Bolsheviks that didn’t allow him to return as they didn’t wish to see anti-war leftists move to Russia. They were eager to maintain the eastern front.
The Germans didn’t engage in anything conspiratorial by allowing him to go back. Lenin was actually received at the station by a delegation of non-Bolsheviks, with Chkheitze welcoming him, before Vladimir Ilyich gave them a dressing down with his April Theses. I have no clue what the hell you are talking about the Tsar as Lenin was powerless and in exile in February and March.
Ditto for Trotsky who had been arrested by the Brits in Canada. He was released and allowed to return to Russia at the insistence of the Russian Provisional Government, not the Brits or the Americans. Nothing conspiratorial again.
The western powers wanted a Russian government to facilitate their interests. That would exclude a bunch of peaceniks who, on top of that wanted to nationalize the banks and other production fields and resources. I mean, they unilaterally erased Russian debt to western bankers, they declared opposition to capitalism and colonialism, rejecting officially the perfectly acceptable to the west theories of racial hierarchy.
It is simply not normal for a functioning thinking human being to ignore all that and believe Sutton’s horsecrap, when the fellow cannot distinguish support towards the Russian liberals from the Bolsheviks. This isn’t a leftist or rightist thing, it is a matter of basic reasoning and discerning ability.
And the very Reds that you claim were supported by the west, saw Murmansk occupied by hostile Entente forces in June 1918, right when they began supporting the Whites. But you still believe it is a pro-communist master-plot.
Or is it that you claim that western governments acted against the supposed desires of these imaginary pro-communist bankers? The same governments that instigated a Civil War, ended recognition of the Soviet government, embargoed a war-torn country and backed anti-Bolsheviks, apparently because they supported the Bolsheviks. The same governments that were in the pocket of those bankers you claim were in love with commies.
If you have no respect for your own intellect mate, you will soon find that others won’t either.

Posted by: Constantine | Mar 19 2024 15:59 utc | 195

Posted by: canuck | Mar 19 2024 11:11 utc | 181
“..much of Bolshevik Revolution was financed by private citizens and companies from New York and Germany; evidence also exists, taken from Trotsky’s memoir, that British individuals and companies assisted the Bolsheviks financially as well.”
When one addends this idea of outside financing, which indeed did happen , it kinda ruins your superstructure of your thesis, idea.
<= Yes, the initial financiers were after something quite different from Lenin..I have read that the investors were after looting Russia for all she was worth.. especially gold and oil.. it suited them to piggyback on Lenin's dream.. I have been trying for years to discover the sources of that financing . I believe Schiff was a part of the startup and those that invested in that phase were part of the Zionist congress activities (1897) and preparation financing but after the coup it was the oil and gas industry persons, the rail road, steel making, and rubber making and banking industry persons? so to me there are two periods with different parties; party A(those who financed the revolution itself, and B those who invested in post revolution Russia after the Bolshevik took charge) (https://alor.org/Storage/Library/PDF/Sutton_AC_Wall_Street_and_the_Rise_of_Hitler.pdf)
But no where do I find a complete list of investors and promoters and the amounts they contributed. The
Sutton book is very helpful.
I think there were many in France too.

Posted by: snake | Mar 19 2024 16:32 utc | 196

“If you have no respect for your own intellect mate, you will soon find that others won’t either.”
Posted by: Constantine | Mar 19 2024 15:59 utc | 196
Thank you for the unsolicited counsel.
Kindly please read the following:
“The Germans, on the face of it, had a plausible excuse for financing Lenin and Trotsky. The two Germans most responsible for the financing of Lenin were Max Warburg and a displaced Russian named Alexander Helphand. They could claim that they were serving their country’s cause by helping and financing Lenin. However, these two German “patriots” neglected to mention to the Kaiser their plan to foment a Communist revolution in Russia. The picture takes on another dimension when you consider that the brother of Max Warburg was Paul Warburg, prime mover in establishing the Federal Reserve System and who from his position on the Federal Reserve Board of Directors, played a key role in financing the American war effort. (When news leaked out in American papers about brother Max running the German finances, Paul resigned from his Federal Reserve post without a whimper.) From here on the plot sickens.
For the father-in-law of Max Warburg’s brother, Felix, was Jacob Schiff, senior partner in Kuhn, Loeb & Co. (Paul and Felix Warburg, you will recall, were also partners in Kuhn, Loeb & Co. while Max ran the Rothschild-allied family bank of Frankfurt.) Jacob Schiff also helped finance Leon Trotsky. According to the New York Journal-American of February 3, 1949: “Today it is estimated by Jacob’s grandson, John Schiff, that the old man sank about 20,000,000 dollars for the final triumph of Bolshevism in Russia.” (See Chart 6)
One of the best sources of information on the financing of the Bolshevik Revolution is Czarism and the Revolution by an important White Russian General named Arsene de Goulevitch who was founder in France of the Union of Oppressed Peoples. In this volume, written in French and subsequently translated into English, de Goulevitch notes:
“The main purveyors of funds for the revolution, however, were neither the crackpot Russian millionaires nor the armed bandits of Lenin. The ‘real’ money primarily came from certain British and American circles which for a long time past had lent their support to the Russian revolutionary cause . . . ”
De Goulevitch continues:
“The important part played by the wealthy American banker, Jacob Schiff, in the events in Russia, though as yet only partially revealed, is no longer a secret.”
General Alexander Nechvolodov is quoted by de Goulevitch as stating in his book on the Bolshevik Revolution:
“In April 1917, Jacob Schiff publicly declared that it was thanks to his financial support that the revolution in Russia had succeeded.
“In the spring of the same year, Schiff commenced to subsidize Trotsky . . .
“Simultaneously Trotsky and Co. were also being subsidized by” (1)
1. https://www.heritage-history.com/index.php?c=read&author=allen&book=none&story=bankroll

Posted by: canuck | Mar 19 2024 17:10 utc | 197

“But no where do I find a complete list of investors and promoters and the amounts they contributed. The
Sutton book is very helpful.
I think there were many in France too.”
Posted by: snake | Mar 19 2024 16:32 utc | 197
I suspect much of it has been purged and its not like one puts one’s hand up for financing violent revolutions if one is a force outside the State although Jacob Schiff did put his hand up back then…
In school I had a Jewish Romanian friend who read 5 or 6 languages his family were archivists and he had material, much in French, that he patiently explained to me on this Western financing of the revolution.
That was 38 years ago.

Posted by: canuck | Mar 19 2024 17:27 utc | 198

Richard Pipes (Pipes, not Piper,) whom I knew at Harvard, was a highly educated Polish Jew. He combined the hatred that both Poles and Jews feel and felt against Russia. In his case, the hatred was also directed against the Soviet Union, as both Russian and Communist.
I remember one time before the fall of the Soviet Union, when both he and I happened to be at Harvard’s Ukrainian Research Institute. There had been some development in the news suggesting a warming of relations between China and Japan. Pipes was clearly delighted by the news. I pointed out to him that the US had fought the Pacific War to prevent a unification of China and Japan. He answered that that didn’t matter, that all that mattered was to weaken the USSR.

Posted by: Lysias | Mar 19 2024 20:30 utc | 199

Though people FINALLY got around to mentioning the excerable Jakob Schiff when discussung Wall St directly financing the rise of Bolshevism, no one mentioned the extent of his largesse.
From at least as early as 1905, Schiff provided at least 20,000,000 Dollars (Million with an “M”) of financial support, to the Bolshevics.
Schiff’s financial support probably began earlier than 1905 but that is the earliest date we know for sure that he was providing funds to the Bolshevics.
When converted to 2024 Dollars Shiff’s direct financial support for Bolshevism amounts to at least 758,000,000 Dollars …. at a minimum
Emotive and knee-jerk attempts by ridiculous ideologues to dismiss that level of funding, to pretend it had little or no effect on the rise of Bolshevism, are simply laughable. Even a midwit at this point should be wondering “Would Bolshevism have existed at all in Russia without that massive amount of foreign (ie: Wall St Jewish) funding?”
Equally laughable is the, as usual, completely dishonest attempt to claim that Trotsky’s release from Canadian custody and return to Russia, was due solely to Russian Provisional Gov’t pressure, when the world and it’s dog knows (or should know) that it was the influence of Wall St Bankers (Jakob Schiff and his cronies again) which finally secured his release.
The fact that any 1920’s list of the top 500 or so Bolshevics, would have had at least 400 Jewish names on it, seemingly signifies nothing to the pseudo-interlektuals. Just a coincidence, lol
The patheticly inept attempts to gloss-over German and international banker (ie: Jewish/Wall St) support for Lenin are so risible as to not even require further comment

Posted by: Pravda | Mar 20 2024 12:45 utc | 200