Only for news & views directly related to the war in Ukraine.
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February 28, 2024
Ukraine Open Thread 2024-064
Only for news & views directly related to the war in Ukraine. The current open thread for other issues is here. Please stick to the topic. Contribute facts. Do not attack other commentators.
Comments
Of those areas that Russia might very sensibly take and keep, Odessa is the least geographically convenient. On the other side of it, the population would fit well into the Russian union, plus there would be considerable strategic value for Russian to control the area. Posted by: Jmaas | Feb 29 2024 4:39 utc | 101 I don’t see barflies understanding the the Ukraine military is collapsing and when that occurs there will be no need to invade Kiev, Odessa or other areas because the country will be forced to admit defeat. Posted by: psychohistorian | Feb 29 2024 4:56 utc | 102 Posted by: Jmaas | Feb 29 2024 4:39 utc | 103 Posted by: Jake Blanchard | Feb 29 2024 4:57 utc | 103 A 22 minute condensed version with English subtitles of the Russian film about the taking of Mariupol, At The Edge Of The Abyss. Very good, worth watching. The primary difficulty with taking the Odessa area is that these new smart munitions are good at taking out bridges, thus any troops across the Dnieper River could end up stranded. No doubt that is why the Russians abandoned Kerson early on. And for the same reason, the Ukranian force that crossed the river and went east were always for show only, with no expanded conquest ever possible. Posted by: Jmaas | Feb 29 2024 5:47 utc | 105 @62 Espelho Mágico. Posted by: Soviético | Feb 29 2024 6:16 utc | 106 Posted by: Jmaas | Feb 29 2024 5:47 utc | 107 Posted by: Oberbayer | Feb 29 2024 6:20 utc | 107 “However, it is also possible that NATO snuck in some tactical warheads there and Russia blew them up with a conventional strike, possibly not even being aware they were there. Notice that there are actually two huge explosions in the video, it’s not just one. Posted by: Greg Galloway | Feb 29 2024 6:36 utc | 108 Posted by: Jack A | Feb 29 2024 4:12 utc | 100 Posted by: OnceWere | Feb 29 2024 6:42 utc | 109 Posted by: psychohistorian | Feb 29 2024 4:56 utc | 104 Posted by: Jake Blanchard | Feb 29 2024 6:59 utc | 110 Re: Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Feb 28 2024 17:45 utc | 8 Posted by: Julian | Feb 29 2024 7:08 utc | 111 I don’t see barflies understanding the the Ukraine military is collapsing and when that occurs there will be no need to invade Kiev, Odessa or other areas because the country will be forced to admit defeat. Posted by: jpc | Feb 29 2024 7:13 utc | 112 Many of you are totally delusional. You have swallowed russian propaganda like a bunch of useful idiots. Posted by: James M. | Feb 29 2024 7:22 utc | 113 @snake | Feb 29 2024 3:22 utc | 99
Hear, hear… Posted by: Norwegian | Feb 29 2024 7:27 utc | 114 @Jake Blanchard | Feb 29 2024 6:59 utc | 112
By the end of this year, likely sooner, none of the above will be in a position to say anything meaningful. Posted by: Norwegian | Feb 29 2024 7:37 utc | 115
This is pretty much what happened.
Commies? Seriously? The only commies I know are in Cuba. Have you just woken up from a 35 year coma? Posted by: Modern Stoic | Feb 29 2024 7:49 utc | 116 Khmelnitsky ammo depot was probably vaporized with an Iskander-M with 1-5 kT warhead (a very small one). That would ensure it gets the job done. Posted by: MAKK | Feb 29 2024 7:59 utc | 117
Ah this is a mistaken view. Ukraine does need money but it is a tertiary priority. What the country needs is trained men along with trained officers and weapons to fight. It lacks all the above and can’t compensate in any way. A collapse of an army isn’t a continuous phenomenon by definition. It is an event. When it happens it will be obvious. In a way you are correct that the terminology “collapse” isn’t appropriate, the UAF are shrinking but they still fight. The only certain thing is that a collapse of the UAF is imminent regardless of mobilisation. Why? Because the UKIES are lacking officers. You can recruit cannon fodder all day but without officers to lead and coordinate them, they have zero combat efficiency. Posted by: Modern Stoic | Feb 29 2024 8:02 utc | 118 JEAN-LUC MÉLENCHON: La France doit négocier la paix en Ukraine Posted by: Stierlitz | Feb 29 2024 8:06 utc | 119 [The AFU] … will need to fall back behind the river to hold if at all. What remains to be seen IMHO is the situation in Vugledar. I expect it to fall soon and then the frontline in the south will collapse completely. Posted by: Jake Blanchard | Feb 29 2024 8:37 utc | 120 What I haven’t quite understood is this: Posted by: Modern Stoic | Feb 29 2024 8:39 utc | 121 https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2024/02/28/british-soldiers-help-ukraine-fire-missiles-olaf-scholz/ Posted by: Hankster | Feb 29 2024 8:43 utc | 122 What happens then? What EXACTLY does this “frontline collapsing” thing look like? Posted by: Modern Stoic | Feb 29 2024 9:00 utc | 123 Ukraine does need money but it is a tertiary priority. What the country needs is trained men along with trained officers and weapons to fight. It lacks all the above and can’t compensate in any way. Posted by: Jake Blanchard | Feb 29 2024 9:00 utc | 124 Jake Blanchard | Feb 29 2024 6:59 utc | 112 Posted by: Suresh | Feb 29 2024 9:00 utc | 125 Posted by: Modern Stoic | Feb 29 2024 8:39 utc | 123 Posted by: MAKK | Feb 29 2024 9:01 utc | 126 Today would have been the 56th birthday of Gonzalo Lira. :-/ Posted by: Apollyon | Feb 29 2024 9:07 utc | 127 Posted by: Jake Blanchard | Feb 29 2024 8:37 utc | 122 Posted by: Suresh | Feb 29 2024 9:19 utc | 128 that is irrelevant. ( always a good laugh: Russians shelling themselves. Posted by: Modern Stoic | Feb 29 2024 9:20 utc | 129 Jake is forgetting morale. Once that ” collapses” people desert , suicide, frag the commanders, all sorts of things that further degrade a fighting ability of the whole force. No need to be chased by tanks to flee the battlefield or lay down weapons .from what I’ve seen they new recruits obediently stay in a hole until they are dead. More of a necrocide for the 4 hr soldiers of ukraine Posted by: Hankster | Feb 29 2024 9:27 utc | 130 seeing all this posturing by nato members, and all their ever more insane rhethoric, i believe they will/have to escalate and do something about whats left of ukraine. Posted by: Justpassinby | Feb 29 2024 9:28 utc | 131 So, as long as ANY GOODIES keep flowing in, the Ukies will fight.
False. It is the latter not the former. A wall isn’t collapsing for hundreds of years.
Yes but this isn’t happening because the majority of the war is fought elsewhere. By the time they see the Russians assaulting their positions, it is already late for them. Also there is the matter of training. A tank needs an officer. An artillery system too. Who will train the rest of the crew if the officer himself in inexperienced with the hardware? Posted by: Modern Stoic | Feb 29 2024 9:28 utc | 132 Germany is accused of being ‘completely irresponsible’ after claiming British troops are helping Ukraine to fire missiles at Putin’s forces Posted by: Andreas | Feb 29 2024 9:30 utc | 133 Jake is forgetting morale. Once that ” collapses” people desert , suicide, frag the commanders, all sorts of things that further degrade a fighting ability of the whole force. No need to be chased by tanks to flee the battlefield or lay down weapons .from what I’ve seen they new recruits obediently stay in a hole until they are dead. More of a necrocide for the 4 hr soldiers of ukraine Posted by: Modern Stoic | Feb 29 2024 9:34 utc | 134 Putin speech with German translation: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nmf3JvjM6w4 Posted by: Apollyon | Feb 29 2024 9:38 utc | 135 Posted by: Jake Blanchard | Feb 29 2024 8:37 utc | 122 Posted by: Mario | Feb 29 2024 9:43 utc | 136 So… Posted by: Pierrot | Feb 29 2024 9:46 utc | 137 Administrative news from Ukraine: Posted by: unimperator | Feb 29 2024 10:22 utc | 138 The Z rated movie puppet has fled to Saudi Arabia to ask for peace. Posted by: rk | Feb 29 2024 10:26 utc | 139 Posted by: rk | Feb 29 2024 10:26 utc | 141 Posted by: Mario | Feb 29 2024 10:40 utc | 140 Posted by: Jake Blanchard | Feb 29 2024 6:59 utc | 112 Posted by: unimperator | Feb 29 2024 10:42 utc | 141 @whirlX | Feb 29 2024 0:56 utc | 89 Posted by: Father Dougal | Feb 29 2024 10:53 utc | 142 @MAKK | Feb 29 2024 7:59 utc | 119 Posted by: Father Dougal | Feb 29 2024 10:57 utc | 143 https://edition.cnn.com/2024/02/28/politics/pentagon-considering-tapping-last-source-ukraine-funding/index.html Posted by: JamesBond | Feb 29 2024 11:03 utc | 144 Posted by: JamesBond | Feb 29 2024 11:03 utc | 146 Posted by: unimperator | Feb 29 2024 11:10 utc | 145 Posted by: JamesBond | Feb 29 2024 11:03 utc | 146 Posted by: Mario | Feb 29 2024 11:13 utc | 146 Posted by: Modern Stoic | Feb 29 2024 9:20 utc | 131 Posted by: MAKK | Feb 29 2024 11:28 utc | 147 {interesting info} Posted by: MAKK | Feb 29 2024 11:34 utc | 148 @146 – @147, Posted by: JamesBond | Feb 29 2024 11:38 utc | 149 Father Dougal | Feb 29 2024 10:53 utc | 144 Posted by: JohninMK | Feb 29 2024 11:52 utc | 150 Today’s Russian Ministry of defence report Posted by: Lantern Dude | Feb 29 2024 12:01 utc | 151 Posted by: JamesBond | Feb 29 2024 11:38 utc | 151 Posted by: Mario | Feb 29 2024 12:02 utc | 152 Posted by: Giyane | Feb 28 2024 18:49 utc | 34 Posted by: Passerby | Feb 29 2024 12:06 utc | 153 Until the dollar becomes worthless, they will keep pumping this racket until there are no more living ukrops to fight with. Posted by: JohninMK | Feb 29 2024 12:06 utc | 154 @154, Posted by: JamesBond | Feb 29 2024 12:10 utc | 155 @156, Posted by: JamesBond | Feb 29 2024 12:16 utc | 156
https://t.me/rezident_ua/21848 Posted by: Down South | Feb 29 2024 12:29 utc | 157 Posted by: JamesBond | Feb 29 2024 12:10 utc | 157 Posted by: Mario | Feb 29 2024 12:30 utc | 158 expecially if isolated from the sea, with no people and a giant rebuilding cost will be practically useless for eu/Nato. Posted by: rk | Feb 29 2024 12:33 utc | 159 Posted by: rk | Feb 29 2024 12:33 utc | 161 Posted by: Mario | Feb 29 2024 12:36 utc | 160 How is the PMR supplied? Posted by: robin | Feb 29 2024 12:43 utc | 161
https://t.me/Slavyangrad/90174 Posted by: Down South | Feb 29 2024 12:48 utc | 162
Posted by: Down South | Feb 29 2024 12:52 utc | 163 In a way, it would be a bit of payback for the Russians on NATO soldiers if they ever get inside Ukraine to fight. However, the consequences could be catastrophic. Posted by: JamesBond | Feb 29 2024 13:14 utc | 164 https://t.me/vysokygovorit/14785
Posted by: anon2020 | Feb 29 2024 13:28 utc | 165 @23 echo chamber Posted by: Down South | Feb 29 2024 12:48 utc | 164
Simplicius also is noting this non-existent defense lines west of Avdeyevka. Posted by: Johan Kaspar | Feb 29 2024 13:58 utc | 168 Technical question: how many 500 kg bombs does it take to saturate a kilometer of poorly prepared defensive lines of the sort the AUK now appears to have west of Avdeevsky? I realize there are a number of factors to consider, just looking for a ballpark estimate. Posted by: dadooronron | Feb 29 2024 14:14 utc | 169 @168 canuck Posted by: Giuseppe | Feb 29 2024 14:16 utc | 170 @ snake | Feb 29 2024 3:22 utc | 99
The Nord Stream pipelines should be compensated but not rebuilt, and the most damning thing Russia could do to the Eurotoadies is honor their request to cease all trade in fuels—fossil and otherwise. Posted by: malenkov | Feb 29 2024 14:43 utc | 171 https://t.me/belarusian_silovik/30832
https://t.me/belarusian_silovik/30831
https://t.me/belarusian_silovik/30830
https://t.me/belarusian_silovik/30828
https://t.me/belarusian_silovik/30829
Posted by: anon2020 | Feb 29 2024 14:43 utc | 172 Re: Posted by: Julian | Feb 29 2024 7:08 utc | 113 Posted by: Old Sovietologist | Feb 29 2024 14:56 utc | 173 Posted by: dadooronron | Feb 29 2024 14:14 utc | 171
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermobaric_weapon
Posted by: anon2020 | Feb 29 2024 15:11 utc | 174 Thanks for that anon2020 | Feb 29 2024 15:11 utc | 176 Posted by: dadooronron | Feb 29 2024 15:26 utc | 175 Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Feb 28 2024 22:02 utc | 53
simply a lying pig Posted by: ghiwen | Feb 29 2024 15:35 utc | 176 Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Feb 28 2024 22:45 utc | 59
he can’t stop lying , twisting , drooling Posted by: ghiwen | Feb 29 2024 15:52 utc | 177 Khmelnitsky ammo depot was probably vaporized with an Iskander-M with 1-5 kT warhead (a very small one). That would ensure it gets the job done. Posted by: HB_Norica | Feb 29 2024 17:11 utc | 178
Here’s the thing. The problem has always been an economic one. Marks and Engles wrote about the inevitability of late stage capitalism devolving into wars fought over diminishing resources. Posted by: HB_Norica | Feb 29 2024 17:51 utc | 179 I think we can come up with a better solution today that allows for prosperity without the exploitation of capitalism. Posted by: too scents | Feb 29 2024 18:13 utc | 180 Which brings us to the quintessential question of all economics, “who is going to pay for it”? Posted by: HB_Norica | Feb 29 2024 19:24 utc | 181 Posted by: too scents | Feb 29 2024 18:13 utc | 182 Posted by: spare_truth3 | Feb 29 2024 19:34 utc | 182 the newly sampled more UKR-Guys for war may only come from UK, France, Germany, Spain & some from the Balkans .. Posted by: spare_truth3 | Feb 29 2024 20:18 utc | 183 Jake Blanchard | Feb 29 2024 8:37 utc | 122 Posted by: smuks | Feb 29 2024 20:32 utc | 184 Posted by: smuks | Feb 29 2024 of Y20:32 utc | 186 Posted by: spare_truth3 | Feb 29 2024 20:52 utc | 185 Posted by: spare_truth3 | Feb 29 2024 20:52 utc | 187 Posted by: Mario | Feb 29 2024 21:11 utc | 186 Posted by: Mario | Feb 29 2024 21:11 utc | 188 Posted by: spare_truth3 | Feb 29 2024 21:33 utc | 187 ..with most of AFU just going home … Posted by: Jake Blanchard | Feb 29 2024 21:52 utc | 188 If the “war” is extending towards the Black Sea by new UK-MIL reconn supplies and/or UK-Direct Rocket Targeting Electronic Target Support – on Russia main land .. Posted by: spare_truth3 | Feb 29 2024 21:56 utc | 189 Just goes to show that the money problem is just stupid propaganda. They always find the money. Posted by: knighthawk | Feb 29 2024 22:06 utc | 190 That would be a “DECLARE OF WAR AGAINST RUSSIA” Posted by: spare_truth3 | Feb 29 2024 22:09 utc | 191 Posted by: Jake Blanchard | Feb 29 2024 8:37 utc | 122 Posted by: Milites | Feb 29 2024 22:12 utc | 192 MR. SUNAK (President of UK), You’ll die before making any effective decisions about the Ukranian lands future (Contacts with Rockwell/German Mr.Merz will be folloed-up)- Posted by: spare_truth3 | Feb 29 2024 22:21 utc | 193
Posted by: malenkov | Feb 29 2024 14:43 utc | 173
Some readers have pointed out that the USA, the global parasite that it is, has been at the forefront of deindustrializing Europe so to move its manufacturing sector to the USA if not China or Russia. Posted by: joey_n | Feb 29 2024 22:32 utc | 194 You sure hear that Euro Mfg is moving to the US, I have yet to see any evidence that is the case, Posted by: SwissArmyMan | Feb 29 2024 22:41 utc | 195 (I pressed ‘Post’ before I could finish writing) Posted by: joey_n | Feb 29 2024 22:43 utc | 196 There has to be limits to the excess … we live in a finite world … something has to give. Can’t we just go through life without being greedy, homocidal assholes? Posted by: knighthawk | Feb 29 2024 22:51 utc | 197 We all know that the Ukraine is running out of soldiers. A MAJOR part of the reason why can be traced back to the EU in the recent past. Posted by: WMG | Feb 29 2024 23:00 utc | 198 The Chuckle brothers at the Duran have let themselves down again. Who the hell is this Tom Luongo guy ? Posted by: Echo Chamber | Feb 29 2024 23:24 utc | 199
Posted by: Parisian Guy | Feb 29 2024 4:15 utc | 101 Posted by: joey_n | Feb 29 2024 23:25 utc | 200 |
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