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February 18, 2024
The MoA Week In Review – OT 2024-052

Last week's post on Moon of Alabama:

Blogging:

Ukraine:

Middle East:

> On one occasion, a handful of children, all about ages 5 to 8, were carried to the emergency room by their parents. All had single sniper shots to the head. These families were returning to their homes in Khan Yunis, about 2.5 miles away from the hospital, after Israeli tanks had withdrawn. But the snipers apparently stayed behind. None of these children survived. <

Russia:

Misc:

—
Other issues:

Assange:

Germany:

Use as open (not related to Ukraine or Palestine) thread …

Posted by b on February 18, 2024 at 13:46 UTC | Permalink
Comments

As to Nutty Yahoo and his hardline rightwing cabal’s “intent” please skip to about 07:30 of this Glenn Greenwald interview with Jeffrey Sachs.
https://scheerpost.com/2024/02/19/jeffrey-sachs-tears-apart-bidens-ukraine-israel-catastrophes/

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Feb 19 2024 22:11 utc | 201

Posted by: UWDude | Feb 19 2024 22:09 utc | 200
Interesting, but it seems that the Elwah dam came down to competing economic interests with a naturalist component. The people who fish for salmon commercially aren’t typically “lefties” are they?

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Feb 19 2024 22:13 utc | 202

Jesus christ, every time my phone auto-updates, auto correct gets turned back on, and fucks everything up.

Posted by: UWDude | Feb 19 2024 22:13 utc | 203

@ Honzo | Feb 19 2024 21:49 utc | 195
good overview.. thanks…
@ Peter AU1 | Feb 19 2024 21:53 utc | 196
to your question – it is my understanding not only netanyahu, but a number of folks within israel worked at cultivating hamas as an alternative to the plo via financing hamas… pretty sure this is on record and can be found… i believe as recently as 2019 netanyahu was helping to fund hamas…

Posted by: james | Feb 19 2024 22:18 utc | 204

The people who fish for salmon commercially aren’t typically “lefties” are they?
Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Feb 19 2024 22:13 utc | 202
Nope. And salmon fishing has always been good out here because the salmon spawning issues was solved 75 years ago with trucks and or ladders transporting the spawning salmon past the dams.
Its not salmon fishers, its do-gooder liberals.
An anecdote, a vegan who i mentioned before, moved up here from california. She also hired an employee from California. Both of them global warming believers.
The vegan one day told me how the streams here were so shallow, (due to global warming, of course) that the salmon were dying on the shore, trying to swim, so she was picking the up, and throwing them in to the middle of the stream.
LoL!
Stupid Californians!

Posted by: UWDude | Feb 19 2024 22:25 utc | 205

@ UWDude | Feb 19 2024 22:25 utc | 205
lol… that is sad…. people are pretty dumb sometimes… do you live near the elwah dam? i used to live over on the other side of the juan de fuca straight in a small place called jordan river… that was over 20 years ago..

Posted by: james | Feb 19 2024 22:30 utc | 206

Posted by: UWDude | Feb 19 2024 22:25 utc | 205
From what I read the Elwha dam produced 14.8MW. By hydroelectric dam standards that’s incredibly tiny. Did its removal have any noticeable impact on electricity prices? I think that amounts to the ability to power about 8,000 homes in a year.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Feb 19 2024 22:35 utc | 207

as recently as 2019 netanyahu was helping to fund hamas…
Posted by: james | Feb 19 2024 22:18 utc | 204
I did look into it for an hour or two when this stuff came up. All I could find was that Israel was giving Quatar money to influence Hamas. I wasn’t able to find anything on Israel directly funding or directly anything Hamas. It was my thought that if Hamas was manipulated, it was indirectly and without the knowledge of Hamas leadership.
We only know Nutty manipulated Hamas because he said so at some point.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Feb 19 2024 22:38 utc | 208

@ UWDude | Feb 19 2024 22:25 utc | 205
lol… that is sad…. people are pretty dumb sometimes… do you live near the elwah dam? i used to live over on the other side of the juan de fuca straight in a small place called jordan river… that was over 20 years ago..
Posted by: james | Feb 19 2024 22:30 utc | 206
I hiked a good stretch of the Elwah a few times. I live some where in the mountains in Western Washington. Port Angeles, in particular, Hurricane Ridge, specifically,Obstruction Point used to be my favorite starting point for the Olympic Mountains.

Posted by: UWDude | Feb 19 2024 22:44 utc | 209

@ UWDude | Feb 19 2024 22:25 utc | 205
lol… that is sad…. people are pretty dumb sometimes… do you live near the elwah dam? i used to live over on the other side of the juan de fuca straight in a small place called jordan river… that was over 20 years ago..
Posted by: james | Feb 19 2024 22:30 utc | 206
The area has grown by over 8000 people since, for sure, so the power has got to be made up, and new coming from somewhere else.
As for power bill changes, no idea.

Posted by: UWDude | Feb 19 2024 22:48 utc | 210

Above was supposed to be in response to Tom Q.

Posted by: UWDude | Feb 19 2024 22:49 utc | 211

For your consideration:
https://uploadnow.io/es/files/YfRZV2M
No problem about copyright:

Posted by: Heart | Feb 19 2024 22:57 utc | 212

@ Peter AU1 | Feb 19 2024 22:38 utc | 208….
shared a times of israel link titled – For years, “Netanyahu propped up Hamas. Now it’s blown up in our faces” – but it doesn’t seem to post here at moa… it is in the same vein, but not specific to what i said.. do a search with the title and it will come up..
here is another one from the jerusalem post…
Netanyahu: Money to Hamas part of strategy to keep Palestinians divided
@ UWDude | Feb 19 2024 22:44 utc | 209
thanks.. i used to live on the shore on the other side of the juan de fuca and look out at cape flattery – for about 14 years ( when there was no fog, lol)..

Posted by: james | Feb 19 2024 23:01 utc | 213

@ Heart | Feb 19 2024 22:57 utc | 212
one has to have an account to access whatever it is you are sharing..

Posted by: james | Feb 19 2024 23:03 utc | 214

Take your time to read, at least, the introduction.
As Plato said: Enjoy it!

Posted by: Heart | Feb 19 2024 23:09 utc | 215

Nope! Darling, the link allows you to download the pdf (just 3.53 MB) free.

Posted by: Heart | Feb 19 2024 23:11 utc | 216

Posted by: james | Feb 19 2024 23:01 utc | 213
You can see Canada from hurricane ridge, probably not your old house, though.
I do not live in Port Angeles, it was just my favorite start point. I think my last comment was not clear.

Posted by: UWDude | Feb 19 2024 23:16 utc | 217

There is a “down point arrow” to download the file in pdf.
Free.

Posted by: Heart | Feb 19 2024 23:16 utc | 218

It opened in firefox with the paywall bypass. I’ll quote the main gist of it.

For years, the various governments led by Benjamin Netanyahu took an approach that divided power between the Gaza Strip and the West Bank — bringing Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas to his knees while making moves that propped up the Hamas terror group.
For years, the various governments led by Benjamin Netanyahu took an approach that divided power between the Gaza Strip and the West Bank — bringing Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas to his knees while making moves that propped up the Hamas terror group.
The idea was to prevent Abbas — or anyone else in the Palestinian Authority’s West Bank government — from advancing toward the establishment of a Palestinian state.
Thus, amid this bid to impair Abbas, Hamas was upgraded from a mere terror group to an organization with which Israel held indirect negotiations via Egypt, and one that was allowed to receive infusions of cash from abroad.
Hamas was also included in discussions about increasing the number of work permits Israel granted to Gazan laborers, which kept money flowing into Gaza, meaning food for families and the ability to purchase basic products.
Israeli officials said these permits, which allow Gazan laborers to earn higher salaries than they would in the enclave, were a powerful tool to help preserve calm.
Toward the end of Netanyahu’s fifth government in 2021, approximately 2,000-3,000 work permits were issued to Gazans. This number climbed to 5,000 and, during the Bennett-Lapid government, rose sharply to 10,000.
Since Netanyahu returned to power in January 2023, the number of work permits has soared to nearly 20,000.
Additionally, since 2014, Netanyahu-led governments have practically turned a blind eye to the incendiary balloons and rocket fire from Gaza.
Meanwhile, Israel has allowed suitcases holding millions in Qatari cash to enter Gaza through its crossings since 2018, in order to maintain its fragile ceasefire with the Hamas rulers of the Strip.
Bolstered by this policy, Hamas grew stronger and stronger until Saturday, Israel’s “Pearl Harbor,” the bloodiest day in its history — when terrorists crossed the border, slaughtered hundreds of Israelis and kidnapped an unknown number under the cover of thousands of rockets fired at towns throughout the country’s south and center.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Feb 19 2024 23:19 utc | 219

Yes, “Hamas Terror Group”
I will respect nobodies opinion who uses that phrase, and it shows what the whole narrative is all about: building moral equivalence, by trying to shame those who believe Hamas is righteous.
Hamas arent freedom fighters! They are tools of the Jews! Wake up maaan!
GTFOOH.

Posted by: UWDude | Feb 19 2024 23:24 utc | 220

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Feb 19 2024 23:19 utc | 219
Reference?

Posted by: Heart | Feb 19 2024 23:24 utc | 221

Reference?
Posted by: Heart | Feb 19 2024 23:24 utc | 221
4R3 U 4 1307? LoL

Posted by: UWDude | Feb 19 2024 23:27 utc | 222

My 219 was referring to the headline in james comment @213

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Feb 19 2024 23:35 utc | 223

Times of Israel link is auto censored by the looks.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Feb 19 2024 23:38 utc | 224

Posted by: UWDude | Feb 19 2024 23:24 utc | 220
Read the evidences, and then, make your point. Take your time to evaluate the historical context and the historical facts: genocide in plain text.
If you think that Suarez (2016) is incorrect, make your argument.
You have the free link to download, freely, the book. Feel free to read it free.

Posted by: Heart | Feb 19 2024 23:43 utc | 225

@ UWDude | Feb 19 2024 23:16 utc | 217
thanks.. sounds like a nice spot.. i haven’t been hiking in those mountains, but i have on the canuck side!
@ Heart | Feb 19 2024 23:16 utc | 218
what exactly is it that you are offering others to download?? the page you share is in a foreign language and asks for a password..
@ Peter AU1 | Feb 19 2024 23:19 utc | 219
i think that is the basis for honzo’s comment…
first time in a long while i have spent this much time on moa!

Posted by: james | Feb 19 2024 23:46 utc | 226

@ james
The article you linked is about the same as the other you gave the headline for
“Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu defended Israel’s regular allowing of Qatari funds to be transferred into Gaza,”
That appears to be the guts of Hamas being a Nutty creation. That and Palestinians from gaza getting work permits. 20,000 work permits, total Gaza population approx 2.5 million. I had read Israel had given Qatar money but that doesn’t seem to appear in the Israeli articles.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Feb 19 2024 23:47 utc | 227

“People that join a cult can no longer think objectively. Group think in often/mostly fictional stuff.”
@ Feb 19 2024 18:06 utc | 157
Such delusional anti-reality bigotry could never afflict Pete 🙂
Also said : “Man made climate change is a very recent phenomenon that arose in ……” (wait for it) MULTIPLE SCIENCE STREAMS … entailing more advanced physics biology and geology know-how than landing on the Moon or Mars required.
The proposed political / ideological / endless economic growth driven (BS) solutions are irrelevant to The Scientific Knowledge of What Is. That should be self-evident, but it is not. It is complex and it is complicated. Ask someone nicely to explain it to you if you’re not sure, such as:

The geological record provides us with evidence of rapid,
naturally occurring climate change. However, in terms of global-
scale events, in the entire geological record, only the instantan-
eous Cretaceous–Paleogene meteorite impact event occurred
more rapidly than the current human-induced global warming.
https://www.lyellcollection.org/doi/pdf/10.1144/jgs2020-239
The Holocene is Human Civilizations Goldilocks period which turned the corner / ended in the 20th century.
Graphs “>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geologic_temperature_record#/media/File:All_palaeotemps.svg

It’s not about if it was warmer or colder millions of years ago before humans before civilization established cities and nations and airports and Miami Hotels and Corporate Agriculture and Fish Farms.
It’s not only about CO2 or temperatures or climates changing it’s about the RATE of CHANGE, the speed beyond insects, animals and plants to adapt which kills things destroys things creates toxicity and causes mass extinctions of Life forms in the sky, the land and in the oceans.

The climate physics are now changing faster than at any point in geological history with the exception of when the 11 km wide meteor hit the Americas and wiped out most of the dinosaurs within a decade or two and 80% of all life forms in the process.
https://www.britannica.com/science/K-T-extinction

And if it was SIMPLE people would not need Scientists because they could work it out all on their own. Such as how to catch a bus and get to school. But it is not simple, it is not obvious, it is complex and confusing for most people. Even the scientists get things wrong and have blind spots.
Let’s have a peak at one slice of time: The late Eemian is a close proxy for where the Earth is currently heading with just a 1-3C increase in temperatures.

The Eemian was the interglacial period which began about 130,000 years ago at the end of the Penultimate Glacial Period and ended about 115,000 years ago at the beginning of the Last Glacial Period.
it was the second-to-latest interglacial period of the current Ice Age, the most recent being the Holocene which extends to the present day
The prevailing Eemian climate was, on average, ONLY 1 to 2 degrees Celsius warmer than that of the Holocene.
During the northern summer, temperatures in the Arctic region were ONLY about 2–4 °C higher than in 2011.
The Arctic Eemian climate was highly unstable, with pronounced temperature swings
The warmest peak of the Eemian was around 125,000 years ago
In Northern Europe, winter temperatures rose over the course of the Eemian while summer temperatures fell.
During an (Solar) maximum from 133,000 to 130,000 BP, meltwater from the Dnieper and Volga caused the Black and Caspian Seas to connect.
During the mid-Eemian, a weakened Atlantic Meridional Overturning Circulation (AMOC) began to cool the eastern Mediterranean region.
The period closed as temperatures steadily fell to conditions cooler and drier than the present, with a 468-year-long (dry) aridity pulse in central Europe at about 116,000 BC, and by 112,000 BC, when ice caps began to form in southern Norway, marking the start of a new glacial period
Meltwater pulse 2B, approximately 133,000 BP, substantially weakened the Indian Summer Monsoon (ISM).
Coastal Alaska was warm enough during the summer due to reduced sea ice in the Arctic Ocean for forests
Interglacial (warm) conditions ended on Antarctica while the Northern Hemisphere was still experiencing warmth
the West Antarctic Ice Sheet melted during the Eemian, and that ocean waters rose as fast as 2.5 meters per century (25 cms per decade) — other times SLR has rapidly risen half a metre per decade — enough to reek havoc in today’s industrialized world of coastal cities, ports, airports, subways and suburbs.
Sea level at peak was probably 6 to 9 metres (20 to 30 feet) higher than today – yet CO2 levels were less than now (time delays from cause to effect.)
Global mean sea surface temperatures are thought to have been higher than in the Holocene, and so melting of polar ice caps must also have occurred.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eemian

None of the above real physical geological climate events were driven by politics or greenies, unhinged fantasies or denier rhetoric, Carbon Taxes, Al Gore, Greta or Elon Musk. Nor are today’s very rapid global warming and climate changes.
So, allow me to repeat this: “People that join a cult can no longer think objectively. Group think in often/mostly fictional stuff.”
I believe that is fairly true. 🙂
Of course no one is obligated to believe the science or even look at the massive accumulated evidence either. Frankly most people can;t even understand it. I still struggle after 30 years of trying.

Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Feb 19 2024 23:51 utc | 228

Posted by: UWDude | Feb 19 2024 23:27 utc | 222
Are you drunk, UWDude?
The question for a reference and the link that I have provided are legitimate ones.
The free link to download the text:
https://uploadnow.io/es/files/YfRZV2M
You, yourself… .

Posted by: Heart | Feb 19 2024 23:51 utc | 229

Heart
I brought up the English language version of your link. No download link or arrow that works in either language.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Feb 19 2024 23:56 utc | 230

Heart | Feb 19 2024 23:51 utc | 230
You keep posting the same link. Either quote what’s in the thing or f off.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Feb 19 2024 23:58 utc | 231

Posted by: Heart | Feb 19 2024 23:51 utc | 230
01353RV3 7H3 130T 45K1NG F0R R3F3R3NC3 WH3N 1T5 0WN D0CUM3N7 15 QU073D!!
L0L!!
N0W 17 I5 C0NFU53D!!

Posted by: UWDude | Feb 20 2024 0:01 utc | 232

My goss!
It’s in spanish because I’m with texting from a different computer, but the file can be download touching the arrow ->/ at the side of the name of the file.
My f…ink anglos: is it so difficult to pass the mouse over the f…ink signs to figurate out how to download a f…ink file from a f…ink free link?

Posted by: Heart | Feb 20 2024 0:09 utc | 233

From Posted by: Honzo | Feb 19 2024 17:01 utc | 147
A few responses fwiw:
Honzo – Let’s be clear, though- reduced atmospheric CO2 contributes to deforestation.
LD — no it does not. In past ages with less CO2 ppm there were much larger forests, in more regions with larger trees growing. What you’re saying is factually not true. Any science refs?
Honzo – At some point, all other factors being equal, the process of bio-sequestration will reduced the amount of atmospheric CO2 below the level required to keeps plants- any plants- alive.
LD — No it will not. Got a science ref?
Honzo – This has come close to happening before, but the biosphere was rescued by vulcanism.
LD — Ref?
Honzo – … the fact that our current large-scale creation of atmospheric CO2 is very likely ALREADY staving off the next plunge to a glacial maximum needs to be factored in.
LD — Why?
Honzo – It seems unlikely that anthropogenic global warming can fully disrupt the glacial cycle in the time frame of the glacial maximum that is already overdue …
LD — Not correct. Any evidence to say it is? Science refs?
Honzo – but it might buy us some time to prepare for a civilized life when the temperature falls.
LD — Better first work out how to survive much higher temperatures than now. Falling temps are no where in sight in our collective future for thousands of years now. Check the scientific literature on this.
Honzo – the damage to human civilization of even ten degrees more average heat is nothing compared to glaciers covering the northern hemisphere.
LD — BOTH events would be catastrophic for human civilization and would wipe out billions of lives very quickly and much biodiversity – the heat being far worse an impact. Zero humans would survive. Please research- Logical Fallacies.
Honzo – I think that when the ……..
LD — Please try to educate yourself better. Less thinking less talking more reading first.
Honzo – I promise you, atmospheric CO2 drought is the real world-killer. Everything else can be managed.
LD — Really? Do I get a 100% money back guartee with that? (smile)
Cheers

Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Feb 20 2024 0:13 utc | 234

Another checked free link:
https://www.udrop.com/Lx8g/State_Of_Terror_How_Terrorism_Created_Modern_Israel_(Suarez_2016).pdf
…

Posted by: Heart | Feb 20 2024 0:20 utc | 235

@ Peter AU1 | Feb 19 2024 23:47 utc | 228
the main thing i get is israel needs terrorists to continue their genocide.. the fact that they had to pay, or encourage others to support these so called terrorists puts the lie to hamas being a ”terrorist” organization.. much closer to the truth are countries like canada, usa and uk continuing to support israel while they are committing genocide… these are the ”real” terrorists as i see it..

Posted by: james | Feb 20 2024 0:20 utc | 236

Another checked free link:
https://www.udrop.com/Lx8g/State_Of_Terror_How_Terrorism_Created_Modern_Israel_(Suarez_2016).pdf
…

Posted by: Heart | Feb 20 2024 0:20 utc | 237

@ Heart | Feb 20 2024 0:20 utc | 238
thanks.. now you make sense and one can understand what it is you are trying to share…

Posted by: james | Feb 20 2024 0:22 utc | 238

There is
1) What is really happening and why regarding global warming, climate changes and multiple impacts.
and
2) What various people, including scientists, say are the best ‘solutions’ to it. That is how to stop, manage, or fix it.
No matter what the people in Group 2) might say or propose, it will never effect the reality of 1)
I highly recommend everyone to recognise the critical differences here. (smile)

Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Feb 20 2024 0:24 utc | 239

Your welcome!
But, I was making sense from the first link, my precious…

Posted by: Heart | Feb 20 2024 0:26 utc | 240

Dog
“BOTH events would be catastrophic for human civilization and would wipe out billions of lives very quickly and much biodiversity – the heat being far worse an impact. Zero humans would survive. Please research- Logical Fallacies.”
Bloody moron. Best to read a little history. Humans past and modern have survived a number of glacials and interglacials. They run like a swell in the sea. The only reason humans have suddenly quickly advanced to the extent we have is mostly due to this interglacial instead of rising to a much higher peak then drooping into the next glacial has plateaued with a constant variation of only 4 degrees or so. Perhaps it will suddenly to the temperature of past peaks or perhaps it will simply drop into the next glacial event.
that is one thing I have never seen explained by global warming derangement syndrome sufferers, is why this interglacial plataeued instead of peaking.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Feb 20 2024 0:28 utc | 241

I have not flown in over 20 years, I don’t own a car but I do drive the farm truck now and then average between 800 to 1000 miles a year, all I do is plant, grow, harvest, process, cook, and share all of it.
I understand the scientific process better than most and practice it always. Should we dismiss the science around gravity, discuss it and maybe come up with a better BELIEF system that allows to fly? Some things are known, sure there is always more to be known but that does not mean you get to dismiss what is known.
We know with a great degree of accuracy how much heat/uv energy is comming into our atmosphere, and we know with a great degree of accuracy how much heat/uv energy is leaving or staying in our atmosphere, and we know why.

Posted by: jef | Feb 20 2024 0:33 utc | 242

The first link provided is ok for me:
https://uploadnow.io/es/files/YfRZV2M
Note that the web direction is a legitimate one. I can’t understand why you see something different in Usa or Europe. The first link is perfectly clear, for me.
In any case, I’m apologize for the mess.
The important thing is the text.
Hope you got it yah.
A salute and good night!

Posted by: Heart | Feb 20 2024 0:36 utc | 243

Heart | Feb 20 2024 0:20 utc | 238
That link works. the first was a sign in. no way round it.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Feb 20 2024 0:42 utc | 244

Excuses. The first link works fine for me. Good to see the 2nd is working.
I just… was trying to share a must reading text…
By

Posted by: Heart | Feb 20 2024 0:48 utc | 245

and we know with a great degree of accuracy how much heat/uv energy is leaving or staying in our atmosphere, and we know why.
Posted by: jef | Feb 20 2024 0:33 utc | 243
I’m really curious as to how “we know how much heat/uv energy is leaving or staying in our atmosphere” since most of the energy leaving our atmosphere is IR.

Posted by: Phil R | Feb 20 2024 1:07 utc | 246

Heart | Feb 20 2024 0:48 utc | 246 “Excuses.” and before that “precious”.
Another dog.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Feb 20 2024 1:10 utc | 247

I’m really curious as to how “we know how much heat/uv energy is leaving or staying in our atmosphere” since most of the energy leaving our atmosphere is IR.
Posted by: Phil R | Feb 20 2024 1:07 utc | 247
Also, over what period of time? Cloud cover greatly interferes with both entrance, absorption, radiation, and exit of heat, so does he mean, “how much is leaving or staying” per second, or month, or per year?”
Also, there is the heat of burning fuels and wood, forest fires, volcanoes, underwater vents, and radioactive elements, with the fuel and wood burning fluctuating chaotically.
And it is amazing how they’ll claim every ppm counts, but when urban heat islands are brought, NASA casts them off as “insignificant”, even though concrete cover, fuel consumption, and heat from other firms, like hydro, have at least multiplied by 50 in the past 50 years.
I understand the scientific process as well, and the entire bulk “average heat rise” is started on decades of widely dispersed, inaccurate readings taken at inaccurate times of day.
Back in 1924, taking a temperature reading at an airstrip in Omaha was not super scientific, and if the reader was an 15 or 30 minutes late or early, that could greatly diminish accuracy.
Not only that, the”resolution”, as they say, was far more dispersed. Vast tracks of the rockies, canada, eastern Russia, everywhere, had nothing at all, so one temperature reading is normalized across often hundreds of kilometers.
There is just know way we could even guess “average world temperature” from anything before the 1980s, and more accurately, the 1990s, when actual climate science started to get serious in its data acquisition.

Posted by: UWDude | Feb 20 2024 1:26 utc | 248

Fuck, i am so sick of autocorrect! “Know way”. “vast tracks”? Fucking baby+me technology constantly being for ed on us is literally making planes fall from the sky!
My fucking car locks itself every fucking time!
Every time anything updates now, i have to turn a bunch of shit I dont want back off! And that’s after I have to say “no thanks” or “remind me later” to a whole bunch of shit I dont want added! And they act like its some kind of convenience, when really it is useless gadgetry to “add value” or to spy on you!

Posted by: UWDude | Feb 20 2024 1:32 utc | 249

Posted by: Patroklos | Feb 19 2024 6:39 utc | 116
I agree, Patroklos. It doesn’t mean we aren’t affected by what we see is happening, and we need to be aware of it as well as of how it does importantly matter to live without damaging others or the planet. I, like everyone, constantly think of those who have lost loved ones as we all have done, and it is a helpless feeling sometimes. Especially in the heat of the moments as we all have been affected by the violence and only wish for it to end.

Posted by: juliania | Feb 20 2024 1:34 utc | 250

My fucking car locks itself every fucking time!
Posted by: UWDude | Feb 20 2024 1:32 utc | 250
Agree with your comment but got a chuckle out of this. I have a car that I use for field work at times and I drive short distances and get in and out of the car to get crap out of the back and I get p*ssed off because the doors autolock every time I start to move.

Posted by: Phil R | Feb 20 2024 1:39 utc | 251

@187 james @189 UWDude
White fibrous blood clots attributed to mRNA vaccines.
https://rumble.com/v4bzxwr-what-are-these.html
https://rumble.com/v4c5ry6-white-clots-are-common.html
https://rumble.com/v4e0gzx-white-clots-usa-part-2.html
UK Funeral Director
https://rumble.com/v4cgxbc-white-clots-and-sudden-death.html
https://twitter.com/CKellyUAP/status/1756437290287812993
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midazolam
VSRF
https://rumble.com/v4c2e79-vsrf-live-113-embalmer-data-revealed.html
Documentary: Died Suddenly
https://rumble.com/v1wcs7o-died-suddenly-2022-full-documentary.html

Posted by: Thurl | Feb 20 2024 1:43 utc | 252

6,000 year old (4 point something BC) artifacts emerging from under melting ice.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WNq_pqUEcb8
The wood is well preserved due to being frozen all that time. Melting ice cap, not a glacier otherwise the wooden artifact would have been ground to pieces.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Feb 20 2024 1:46 utc | 253

‘Pure Junk Science’: Researchers Challenge Narrative on CO2 and Warming Correlation
UN claims that human-caused CO2 emissions are imperiling the planet are ‘totally garbage,’ says scientist. ‘CO2 doesn’t cause a change in temperature.’
https://www.theepochtimes.com/article/fixation-on-co2-ignores-real-driver-of-temperature-say-experts-5588495

Title a tad inflammatory – as are many statements about this unfortunate topic – but some of the reportage, from experienced scientists, is sober. As usual, I wish we could move on from the topic and focus on environmental pollution and damage.
For example, where I live it’s a big story that Mexico City is running out of water in 90 days. They’ll probably figure something out but one thing they won’t do is make Coca Cola (and other such) illegal and forbid the shipping of water used in its production from out of the water table it comes from. Not to mention that the stuff is making Big Pharma rich by causing so many health problems.
No, they’ll shunt production around so they go cause another area to gradually run out of water ten years down the road. And meanwhile keep virtue signalling about man-made global climate change so nobody addresses more immediate issues like this, one of hundreds such not being covered, let alone solved.

Posted by: Scorpion | Feb 20 2024 1:49 utc | 254

In the light of the findings of Russian Ministry of Defence experts regarding international activities of Western biolaboratories, it may be relevant to take a closer look at some facts that unfolded a few years ago in Brazil.
Kirillov finally points to a correlation between the spread of the operations of these Western-linked biolaboratories and a growing incidence of unusual diseases in the territories in question.
The transgenic mosquito project, however, has the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation as its main backer, and Bill Gates himself has been one of the main spokespeople for this idea of fighting mosquito-borne diseases through transgenic mosquitoes.
https://strategic-culture.su/news/2024/02/19/brazilian-biosecurity-threatened-oxitec-and-the-new-dengue-outbreak/

Posted by: ld | Feb 20 2024 1:52 utc | 255

Posted by: waynorinorway | Feb 19 2024 7:39 utc | 120
On that model God must manifest as the asymptotic limit of complete ignorance. When I look at Gaza I can well believe that God is really an autistic teenager who likes to pull the wings off flies.
All power to you in your grand years, my friend! Age has not diminished your wit, that I can affirm 🙂
Posted by: Patroklos | Feb 19 2024 7:49 utc | 122
I can understand this sentiment, and only for myself refer to this passage at the beginning of Dostoievski’s ‘The Brothers Karamazov’:

…”Listen, mother,” said the elder. “Once, long ago, a great saint saw a mother in church, weeping just as you are over her child, her only child, who the Lord had also called to him. ‘Do you not know,’ the saint said to her, ‘how bold these infants are before the throne of God? No one is bolder in the Kingdom of Heaven: Lord, you granted us life, they say to God, and just as we beheld it, you took it back from us. And they beg and plead so boldly that the Lord immediately puts them in the ranks of the angels. And therefore,’ said the saint, ‘you, too, woman, rejoice and do not weep. Your infant, too, now abides with the Lord in the host of his angels.’ That is what a saint said to a weeping woman in ancient times. He was a great saint and would not have told her a lie. Therefore, you,too, mother, know that your infant, too surely now stands before the throne of the Lord, rejoicing and being glad, and praying to God for you. Weep, then, but also rejoice.”

To be comforted by this does, I will grant you, require faith, but that is afforded by faith in humanity whose good intentions are a reflection of the divine, (which is not the case for those who pull the wings off flies.) A pagan once demanded of a Christian: “Show me your God!” The Christian responded: “Show me your man!”
God is that, the best there is in all of us.

Posted by: juliania | Feb 20 2024 2:10 utc | 256

As usual, I wish we could move on from the topic and focus on environmental pollution and damage.
Posted by: Scorpion | Feb 20 2024 1:49 utc | 255
I have to respectfully disagree with you as the topic you wish to move on from and the (lack of) focus on environmental pollution and damage are inextricably linked.
You smacked it out of the park with your last sentence: “And meanwhile keep virtue signalling about man-made global climate change so nobody addresses more immediate issues like this, one of hundreds such not being covered, let alone solved.”
By blaming everything on “climate change” and scaring everybody with a faux apocalypse, they don’t have to address, let alone solve, the more immediate issues. As a matter of fact, they’re making bank off of many of these issues (as in your Coca Cola example) so it’s in their best interests NOT to solve the issues.
(Sorry, it’s late here. I hope this makes a little sense).

Posted by: Phil R | Feb 20 2024 2:11 utc | 257

Invoking incompetence is not a helpful guide to predicting the future. Understanding the interests of people in power and the mechanisms and limitations of the system they operate is much more useful.
Posted by: Honzo | Feb 19 2024 21:49 utc | 195
Well duh, no shit sherlock. All I said was that if I had to choose between illuminati cabal and incompetence I’d choose the latter. It’s not a philosophy of history, for which I’ll lean on Hegel and Marx (who say it better than you).

Posted by: Patroklos | Feb 20 2024 2:18 utc | 258

Posted by: UWDude | Feb 19 2024 19:26 utc | 163
———————-
Re persecution of xtian
Here’s the garden charge sheet on China

The pressure on religions in Hong Kong so far, however, is taking a different form from the persecution that Christians, Muslims, Buddhists, Falun Gong practitioners, and others in mainland China face. [sic]
Places of worship are not being dynamited, crosses are not being torn down, mosques and temples are not being closed, desecrated, or destroyed in Hong Kong as they are in mainland China. [sic]
Instead, the campaign against religion in Hong Kong is slow, subtle and insidious suffocation, with four main elements designed to coerce, co-opt and corrupt from within, rather than crackdown dramatically.

well,
When Bharat genocided the xtian Naga ,
When FUKUS trained and armed Indon troops abetted Muslim militants attacks on xtian villages ,
When xtian Chinese were genocided in Indon 1965 ,
Where’s this international xtian brohood, spanning the entire anglo/euro garden ?
There’s nuthin subtle, slow insidious about it, those were
cold blooded murder in broad daylight , abetted, instigated by the international xtian brohood !
…………
Where’s this xtian brohood ?
They were in ecstasy, celebrating CIA’s greatest hit of the century.
https://tinyurl.com/5xveydct
[comment 95]

Posted by: denk | Feb 20 2024 2:27 utc | 259

From the end of last thread
Posted by: karlof1 | Feb 20 2024 1:36 utc | 225
Karl,
Thank you for the article on ‘another Crooke Monday,’ on your substack.
I don’t seem to be able to comment there, so, the reply here. Others may enjoy too.
The Thierry Meyssan link in your article points to:
In Jerusalem, the “Conference for the Victory of Israel.”
Event held for Jewish supremacist Rabbi, Uzi Sharbaf, attended by Nutty, but no other politician.
Aside from all the other information therein contained in the article, the name of this, “previously unknown” Rabbi, is one for infamy. It just popped out at me. The name in Farsi means — Shar = evil, and baf = spinner/weaver).
I kid you not. There you have it. Event for spinner of evil. How apt.

Posted by: Sakineh Bagoom | Feb 20 2024 2:43 utc | 260

Posted by: Scorpion | Feb 19 2024 1:10 utc | 96
————————-
the scorpion must be running out of cow dung to smear China, its scratching the barrel bottom now.
China has long out grown that sweat shop for investment hardship ,it is moving up the value chain so fast the US orligards are pissing in their pants.
This wasnt their plan, whereby the chicom are supposed to slog in factories 24×7, selling 3 billions tee shirts in order to buy one Boeing
So they want to de couple from China now , wreck its supply chain, move to sweat shops in Mexico, VN, India…..where planty of cheap labors are ripe for plucking
Save your croc tears for the child labors in Mexico, India, touted as the next China , my dear pop

Posted by: denk | Feb 20 2024 2:48 utc | 261

Posted by: juliania | Feb 20 2024 2:10 utc | 257
I defer to the noble sentiment you have eloquently expressed. Perhaps that’s true, that God is both the meaning of suffering, our redemption, and the transformation of that suffering into joyin the utopian future. This is also how I imagine the revolution forever-to-come.

Posted by: Patroklos | Feb 20 2024 3:07 utc | 262

When Bharat genocided the xtian Naga
Where’s this international xtian brohood ?

‘I started by telling them that as a British man I knew I was part of their problem and I was ashamed of this. It was my country that betrayed them in 1947 and was carrying on betraying them by failing to say anything about what was happening now.

http://tinyurl.com/y2c95nkf

Posted by: denk | Feb 20 2024 3:22 utc | 263

There is just (no) way we could even guess “average world temperature” from anything before the 1980s, and more accurately, the 1990s, when actual climate science started to get serious in its data acquisition.
Posted by: UWDude | Feb 20 2024 1:26 utc | 249
Honestly, you wouldn’t know. What you’re doing here (it is common) is you are repeating what others (you choose to believe) have told you. But you have not gone and read what the experts who do this have to say on the matter, or why they do what they do for decades now, nor how they do it and why the averages are very accurate over the long term and how they keep fine tuning the data output to be more accurate now in the past results. It’s all a matter of stats and maths. If you and I had gone to Uni and done advanced math and statistics etc etc you’d know this in detail.
Now just because some outlier stats experts conclude it is BS this doesn’t mean it is when 20,000 others say ahem, no, the temps being measured are accurate (enough) to use as is. Various fine tuning adjustments due to new evidence of past ‘errors’ is also checked and justified.
Like when the sailors changed how ocean temps were being collected in sailing ship days switching from a standard wooden bucket size to a canvas bottle like unit, and then to a cylinder – it was a small difference and so the climatologists modellers changed the calculations to fit reality, though it didn’t change the overall picture of the past ocean temps global averages much at all. But it did change them.
The methods and maths are validated, and been checked multiple of times. Nothing has been hidden, it is all open source!
How can 1200 people being polled out of 150 million voters provide a consistent and reasonably accurate projection, within a few percent +/-, of who is leading in the current election campaign?
Because ….. There is just (no) way we could even ‘guess’ who was really the front runner – right? Or ‘know’ from polling ONLY 1200 people how popular the Presidents policies currently are. 🙂
Frankly, imo, it comes down to who you choose to be our ‘experts’ and why you chose them.
And how rationally skeptical we are and how good our own critical thinking skills are, and how easily we can pick up on people using sophistry and logical fallacies against us in their ‘very compelling and so believable’ rhetoric.
People do not generally believe what politicians say because they are telling the truth and handing out ‘the proven peer-reviewed scientific facts’. But for other reasons.
Cheers LD.
PS yes, scientists get things wrong too …. but not forever. They get caught out (eventually) and corrected …… that being said be wary the outspoken celebrity climate scientists who think they know everything about everything and their cult followers. That ain’t science that’s egotistical self-serving attention seeking at play. ( in my opinion, and don’t believe me either unless the evidence adds up )
PPS This is why god invented Scientific Method in the first place. To get above these kinds of biases and emotional triggers to filter out what the true objective facts were – because even scientists have their blind spots and biases.
(smile)

Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Feb 20 2024 3:23 utc | 264

by Lavrov’s Dog | Feb 19 2024 23:51 utc | 229
Interesting is how all those geological periods are defined and a science behind it is measuring a blink in time of the Earth history. We are also probably not meant to be permanent, as dinosaurs and others tried for almost 260 mil. years.
CO2 levels in the atmosphere have nothing to do with the sea levels. That is mixed up. Continents go up and down, too. The Sun has a slightly complicated and granulated activity to which the repetitive pattern we didn’t get. Yet. And all our climate and the atmosphere down to natural chemistry depends on those fluctuations. Those influence our climate to show variety of extremes over universally very short time that is why our current understanding is very limited. Despite the vast amount of data it still is not the end of a pattern.
So we build our environmentalist ideas, out of abilities to gather data, but interpret them in 50 different ways.
We just want to make ourselves important, but we are really not.

Posted by: whirlX | Feb 20 2024 3:33 utc | 265

Posted by Peter AU1, 248
So, apologizimg by your incompetence to download a file (“excuses”) and making a simple joke (“precious*,),
deserve to be called “another dog”?
Coming from a guy who has been flowing this blog during years with his miserables familiar affairs without any kind of decor or self-respect, I am fortunate. To be another dog is always better than to be a failed child unable to assume his vicious.
You can’t with the booze EH?
Failed human. Change your 24/7 drunk posts by 8/5 real work, and the bile you espout will be nectar.
BYE, FUCKING COWARD

Posted by: Heart | Feb 20 2024 3:38 utc | 266

@ whirlX | Feb 20 2024 3:33 utc | 266
Yeah there is some truth to that for sure.
The only climate any of us really ‘know’ is the one we see out the window. Or outside the tent when camping. 😉
It is also a valid position to dismiss everything that ever came out of a universities science dept. It is always valid to question what the scientific experts tell us. Definitely.

Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Feb 20 2024 3:52 utc | 267

Posted by Denk / 262
Another brick in the wall. Take your meds, your obsession with Scorpion is pathological.

Posted by: Heart | Feb 20 2024 3:52 utc | 268

What you’re doing here (it is common) is you are repeating what others (you choose to believe) have told you.
Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Feb 20 2024 3:23 utc | 265
No I’m not. I’ve never read anything like what I just wrote. I just started to think about the measuring tools of the time, how those measurements were recorded, and for what purpose, and proposed a thesis as to why accurate measurements from those times and before are impossible to a good degree of accuracy.
********
It’s all a matter of stats and maths. If you and I had gone to Uni and done advanced math and statistics etc etc you’d know this in detail.
*****”
Sigh. I posted a long bona fides of what I do, and what I am trained on, in pne of the last topics. I cant find it now, so I will try to shorten it for you.
I was trained on Fluent’s Airpak. (Now Ansys, look it up)
I have been doing 3d modeling, including physics and animation, and of course light and shading, for over 20 years.
I currently have coded own planet generator for a game. It does not have an accurate climate model, as it is fir a game, but it does include thing such as rain shadows and shadow pockets for ice packs, as well as jet streams for warming and cooling of coastal areas and deserts, both cold, hot, internal and coastal
U coded this, and it took lots of complex “maths”, so please, do not even try to tell me I dont know what I am talking about, because you assume everybody sucks at math like you do. I can do derivatives, i know radians, i do almost everything I code in normalized turns. I use tangents, sines and cosines daily, and understand what they mean, intimately. I could walk circles around your head about lacunarity, pseudorandomness, fractals, and frequencies.. so please, dont tell me I am dumb because you are…
(smile)
Finally, the science is checked. Those people are censored, banned, shunned when they bring up counter arguments. Apparently this is how “science works” now.
(smile)
I also read about how NASA and NOAA does

Posted by: UWDude | Feb 20 2024 4:02 utc | 269

Posted by: Heart | Feb 20 2024 3:52 utc | 269
——————–
Notice that scorpion and his entourage of supporters never once tried to challenge my points, ..cuz they couldnt !
Its always ad hominem , zero substance, telling me to fuck off, shut the fuck up, take your med blah blah !
Would you be the first scorpion fan boy who are able to engage me in debate instead of resorting to ad hominem ?
If not, you can fuck off now. !

Posted by: denk | Feb 20 2024 4:05 utc | 270

Posted by: whirlX | Feb 20 2024 3:33 utc | 266
Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Feb 20 2024 3:52 utc | 268
It’s raining here in Venice CA. I like you guys. I always read your posts. MoA makes me both sad and happy. Mostly sad though, unfortunately. Poking through the entrails.
For quite a while I haven’t been able to send b some money. Fortunately I sent some in, so I feel like I can comment. Thank you, b, for MoA. It really helps me make sense of the world.

Posted by: lex talionis | Feb 20 2024 4:08 utc | 271

Cont…
…does their “avg global temperatures”, except they dont. Instead they do a normalized value, based on the average between 1900 – 2000, using the pretty random data points they have been given since the 1850s.
You can go read it on their website yourself. In many areas, they have few points, so those they normalize in relation to adjacent data points. They have gotten more over time, but I again assure you, they had not very many comparatively from 1850, and there is no way those were accurate.
So there are areas of “high resolution”, like urban areas, and areas of “low resolution” like the saharah, mountains, and oceans.
Unfortunately, these are often the most chaotic and extreme areas, especially mountains.
Abd for mountains, they have an even less accurate mechanism, as most measurements are in valleys, (this is from their website, I am not just making shit up), so they normalize from the valley measurement to the mountaintop measurement,… If they even have a device at the tip of the measurement.
And once again, I assure you, most mountaintops have no such device. It is impossible. The maintenance would make it impossible.
Did i mention i have climbed dozens of unnamed mountains as well, never seen a weather station anywhere, or thermometer. The real world is difficult to get real world, accurate data

Posted by: UWDude | Feb 20 2024 4:12 utc | 272

Now,LD, I am afraid I may have lost you ability to follow at “normalization”, and i dont care to explain it
(smile)

Posted by: UWDude | Feb 20 2024 4:14 utc | 273

Heart | Feb 20 2024 3:38 utc | 267
The trashy stuff you and dog engage in reminds me strongly of the nafo clowns on twitter. They lost a lot if disillusioned employees when the mighty Ukroid offensive in a mass extinction event including the mighty leopards and bradlys.
Their mascot was a childish cartoon dog. The dog even has it in his name.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Feb 20 2024 4:24 utc | 274

Debate? You call him pop,racist, sinophobo, etc..
Your posts seem to be dis(ordered) by a schizo with Parkinson under the action of several benzodiazepinas. Are you Borderline?
Your are pathological obsessed without rational causes with the gay an the fucking issue of China.
No more waste of my time with a parasitic lunatic.

Posted by: Heart | Feb 20 2024 4:24 utc | 275

Thanks, Patroklos at| Feb 20 2024 3:07 utc | 263. I came to Orthodoxy the best way (for me) as first I studied at an east coast liberal arts college – two years of Greek, (which I loved after four of Latin in high schools, New Zealand and then California. Then two of German. And I would say nobody forced me to believe anything along the way. I just went with the flow, one experiece after the other, late Eisenhower/early Kennedy years. My German teacher was the sweetest little man who did confuse me as being an Australian those two years. He was Jewish, the gentlest, kindest person. We translated “Weg von Hier”, a short story by Kafka. I just remember not having the faintest idea what it was about. Well, I am still discovering Plato, so I’d better go back to Kafka as well!
[Warning: If you read “The Brothers Karamazov” Dostoievskian Russian Orthodoxy will assimilate you too. Be careful, small doses only.]

Posted by: juliania | Feb 20 2024 4:28 utc | 276

Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Feb 20 2024 0:13 utc | 235
You can do your own research, pupster. It’s all over the place and I’m not going to get into the whole ‘but that study doesn’t have enough data points’ etc mill with you. Many of the problems you assert are simply caused by lags between various effects, and these are of many kinds because there are many forces at work, of which CO2 is only one. As I pointed out, there are Milankovich and other cycles beyond any influence by human beings, and they drive major patterns that CO2, from whatever source, can either reduce or amplify. We are entering a period of Milankovich cooling.All things being equal, this will result in growth of permanent ice, will reduce crop yields, will destroy the very stories that global warming enthusiasts claim they wish to protect. Anthropogenic desequestration of CO2 has an effect, but in the coming period, and very likely right now, it’s a positive effect. The downward trajectory of temperature is rapid in geologic terms, but there is probably a lot of time to adapt to those changes- we don’t know because we can’t calculate the Milankovich impacts with the kind of precision that climate scientists claim for short-term forcing by CO2- calculations that ignore the Milankovich effects. Evidence continues to accumulate though, so keep your eye out.

Posted by: Honzo | Feb 20 2024 4:30 utc | 277

This video interview of Mike Benz is a must listen or read imo.
It is long. However, you can crank up the output speed up and read the subtitles to condense time needed to get the content. I noticed only three or so errors in translations, all minor.
The blob metastasized big time after 2014 when social media effectively was used to peacefully return Crimea to RF, ending a string of its uses by the collective waste for color revolutions. After Brexit, and the unexpected 2016 US election outcome, the blob took it upon itself to turn its tools on domestic populations of EU and US, and prolly AU. Details given by Mike Benz.
~~
Tucker Carlson
Ep. 75 The national security state is the main driver of censorship and election interference in the United States. “What I’m describing is military rule,” says Mike Benz. “It’s the inversion of democracy.”
https://twitter.com/TuckerCarlson/status/1758529993280205039

Posted by: Suzan | Feb 20 2024 4:32 utc | 278

@ Lavrov’s Dog | Feb 20 2024 0:13 utc | 235 points out a few humble facts:
Honzo – the damage to human civilization of even ten degrees more average heat is nothing compared to glaciers covering the northern hemisphere.
LD — BOTH events would be catastrophic for human civilization and would wipe out billions of lives very quickly and much biodiversity – the heat being far worse an impact. Zero humans would survive. Please research- Logical Fallacies.

To whit Big Pete seeing ‘morons’ everywhere and claims @ Peter AU1 | Feb 20 2024 0:28 utc | 242
(while deleting the context of what was being said by Da Dog) “Bloody moron. Best to read a little history. Humans past and modern have survived a number of glacials and interglacials.
Da Dog says: There were not 8 to 9 billion humans living on earth during ANY of the past glacials and interglacials You stupid drunk moron you! (big smile) Get a F***ing clue that it makes a f***ing difference if a new Ice Age covered most of the northern hemisphere again and Sea level dropped 130 meters again!
LOL
read a little history you say …

within just the past 12,000 years, our species, Homo sapiens, made the transition to producing food and changing our surroundings.
Between 80,000 and 60,000 years ago
Modern humans spread to Asia and Australia
About 74,000 years ago Humans Near-extinction! Modern humans almost become extinct; as a result of extreme climate changes, the population may have been reduced to about 10,000 adults of reproductive age.
By 70,000 years ago Extinction! Homo erectus becomes extinct
By 28,000 years ago Extinction! Neanderthals (Homo neanderthalensis) become extinct
By 17,000 years ago Extinction! Homo floresiensis becomes extinct, leaving modern humans (Homo sapiens) as the sole survivor in the once diverse human family tree
https://humanorigins.si.edu/human-characteristics/humans-change-world

Let’s see

It took most of human history for our population to reach 1 billion—and just over 200 years to reach 8 billion. From 100K to 20K years BCE Human population remained at most 1 million souls ….. Estimates of the population of the world at the time agriculture emerged in around 10,000 BC have ranged between 1 million and 15 million.
https://www.amnh.org/explore/videos/humans/human-population-timeline
“>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_population#Ancient_and_post-classical_history

(smile)
… people in glass houses shouldn’t be throwing stones telling others to read more says Da Dog.
While I truly hope seeing words like Homo Erectus in print didn’t send you into an emotional tail spin Big Pete. We all know how terribly sensitive you are around Homos. LOL
With Love, Da Dog!
You can run but you can’t hide Big Pete.

Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Feb 20 2024 4:33 utc | 279

Debate? You call him pop,racist, sinophobo, etc..
No more waste of my time with a parasitic lunatic.
Posted by: Heart | Feb 20 2024 4:24 utc | 276
—————
I dont just ‘call’ it racist sinophobe, back it up with tons of evidence.
Now whats it that you dont understand about comment 262, whats wrong with it ?
I give you 12 hrs to ponder over it, are u able to out up a rational answer ?
Not holding my breath btw.
ciao

Posted by: denk | Feb 20 2024 4:36 utc | 280

Re: Gaza SNAFU.
Hey, b! Thanks for Helena Cobban’s February 15 comprehensive and detailed summary of ALL of the events, both big and small, which followed the October 7 jail break (under the Middle East category). It’s the best I’ve seen.
One hopes that her follow-up article will include the result and ramifications of the scheduled Feb 26 meeting in Moscow between Team Russia and Team Palestine.

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Feb 20 2024 4:40 utc | 281

Peter AU1 275
I don’t even know what the Fuck are you talking about. Are you aware that your fantasies and deliriums are only in your MIND?
The thing is you called me “another dog”. Why? For apologize and call “precious” to other guy?
BYE
AND the end from my part

Posted by: Heart | Feb 20 2024 4:42 utc | 282

@ Peter AU1 | Feb 20 2024 4:24 utc | 275
Da Dog says you’re the Trashy one round these parts Big Pete … have another drink. 🙂
Honzo | Feb 20 2024 4:30 utc | 278 and UWDude | Feb 20 2024 4:14 utc | 274
That’s fine by me. Each to their own self be true ….. I don’t care. Really, I don’t. (smile)

Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Feb 20 2024 4:42 utc | 283

Sakineh Bagoom | Feb 20 2024 2:43 utc | 261–
Thanks for your attempted comment and refusal to be deterred. Our buddy james posted your inability to comment and most of its contents at my substack, which is why I was able to fand your comment and reply.
Yes, the translation is indicative. The term taken as a name is likely quite old and its etymology would be reveling, IMO. I don’t know why you’re unable to comment at the Gym as all commenting is enabled at my end.
The whole of West Asia could prosper if peace became the norm. The parasites in the mix are just that, but they aren’t all Zionists when the fence sitters are examined.

Posted by: karlof1 | Feb 20 2024 4:50 utc | 284

Posted by: Heart | Feb 20 2024 4:24 utc | 276
I’m with denk on China. Scorpion is a hair’s breadth away from open Sinophobia. I never interject to judge him for it; just observe and take notes. Is English comprehension the issue here?

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Feb 20 2024 4:51 utc | 285

@ lex talionis | Feb 20 2024 4:08 utc | 272
Thank you Lex, that was really nice of you to say so. Just being me. What else can I do? (smile)
also kudos to @ whirlX | Feb 20 2024 3:33 utc | 266 as well. Thank you too.
and with gratitude to B for providing the space for so many to find a little ‘sanity’ in such a crazy world as this.
Peace Out!

Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Feb 20 2024 4:51 utc | 286

Posted by: Heart | Feb 20 2024 4:42 utc | 283
How many more times are you going to say “bye” before you go there? Asking for a friend. Seriously, have a look in the mirror before casting PERSONAL aspersions.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Feb 20 2024 4:52 utc | 287

Posted by: Suzan | Feb 20 2024 4:32 utc | 279
Benz is very knowledgeable on the censorship state apparatuses. I watched the whole interview and was quite impressed. So I decided to look into him, and I’ll just say his past isn’t pretty. Hopefully that’s where he’s left it, because it would be a shame if he continued doing some of the crap he was doing and it ended up hurting his career exposing the blob’s censorship organs.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Feb 20 2024 4:54 utc | 288

@ Heart | Feb 20 2024
listen heart.. you’ve got the wrong attitude here and it ain’t going to work for moa… i can’t see you lasting long here.. regards..

Posted by: james | Feb 20 2024 4:57 utc | 289

Something I thought about and looked up. Lime stone. That is all carbonate and as far as I knew it came from ancient seabeds.
Turns out CO2 in water turns to carbonate and settles out of the water to form deposits on ocean floors. That can also be made from sea shells, but they also have to gain carbon from somewhere, I assume the water.
The greens running about madly planting trees is utter lunacy as they don’t lock carbon in the ground apart from a tiny amount that has formed only a very thin layer of topsoil. Peat bogs that eventually get covered over with alluvial do lock carbon in the ground.
I would assume the amount of carbon locked away as coal is minute compared to the amount locked away in limestone.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Feb 20 2024 5:22 utc | 290

@PeterAU
Posted by: Heart | Feb 20 2024 3:38 utc | 267
If that doesn’t build up your callouses I don’t what will 😂

Posted by: Patroklos | Feb 20 2024 6:40 utc | 291

Those Barflies who truely believe that manmade-climate-change requires immediate radical action NOW – should 1) immediately their driving and over the next 2-4 years live car free entirely and 2) stop using A/C
Mass Motoring is reponsible for ~40% of CO2 emmisions in the USA. About 3/4s due to tailpipe emissions and 1/4 due to producing the cars. BEVs are not a solution since they require ~2x the energy to produce versus ICEs.
If Americans and Europeans dramatically reduced their driving; we‘d nearly meet our climate goals. If you really believe in the dangers of man made climate change – then stop driving
.

Posted by: Exile | Feb 20 2024 7:42 utc | 292

Re: Reducing one‘s Vehicle Miles Traveled (VMT)
It’s possible – over the last 10 years, our annual household gasoline consumption has gone from approx. 4,750 liters to 115 liters. (2 person household )

Posted by: Exile | Feb 20 2024 7:53 utc | 293

Patroklos | Feb 20 2024 6:40 utc | 292
🙂

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Feb 20 2024 8:15 utc | 294

Good morning barflies on the open thread – though it seems that the other two have already veered out into every subject too. It’s ok as I suppose everything is connected!
Environment and Human Activities and exploitation for instance.
I don’t know how much the over fishing and extinction of the Whales (pretty much) has had on ‘climate change’ ; or moving from horses as the main source of transport did to the automobiles did? ; or the badly planned built environments of towns and cities; or in reality the chemicals and plastics industries and ubiquitousness in our air, rivers and seas by uncontrolled ‘capitalists’ which continues daily? Why are rivers still being poisoned? The Paris Olympics have given up the idea of using the Seine in Paris, as part of the swimming section of the triathlon. Most Western rivers are poisoned by agrochemicals, Pharma and discharge of untreated sewage by privatised water companies that put paying dividends above their primary purpose.
The beaches are un-clean with the rivers and direct discharges by pipes.
The sea lifecycles are affected and no one should eat any fish from such environs.
Finally the Oceans are now full of micro-plastics!
Any one got the science on what effect that has on the surface temperatures?
In fact where is the science modelling that has all of the above built into it and which doesn’t just relies on a simplistic single measured gas proportion in the air at some arbitrary heights? And worse, ties it into the modern fascist Malthusian anti people apocalyptic LIE, ensuring the very FEW get to decide how many Useless Eaters can exist as their servants and the rest are troublesome sub-humans destroying life on earth by their mere existence!
Nothing to do with the unfettered Exploitation by the Banker Ownere – who’s centuries long luxurious lives and dynasties is threatened by the MANY demanding their Human Rights!
Anyway – the two new big shows in town joining the genocide of Palestinians and rape of Ukrainie by the golden billionaire villains , are the ICJ and Assange hearings – which I hope to attend the protests against his deportation and demand freedom for.
I also hope b can make some postings for over the comming days.

Posted by: DunGroanin | Feb 20 2024 8:35 utc | 295

It’s not only about CO2 or temperatures or climates changing it’s about the RATE of CHANGE (today in our era), the speed beyond insects, animals and plants evolutionary capacity to adapt which kills things destroys things creates toxicity and causes mass extinctions of Life forms in the sky, the land and in the oceans.
Lavrov’s Dog | Feb 19 2024 23:51 utc | 229

Maybe a few more comments to flesh out the usefulness of the Eemian interglacial period for comparison to our present and future might help. First feel free to check the links in #229 first.
Coming out of the extensive Glacial Ice Age at 130,000 years ago, in the first 3000 years the temperatures rose in the order of 8-10C (please don’t quote me on any of these rough figures, only indicative). This something like +1C every 300 years. After 10,000 years temperatures began to decline again but at a much slower rate.
The end of this Glacial period was triggered by orbiting changes (Malenkovich) which ‘rapidly’ brought an end to that LGM (Global temps were minus 6-7C lower than today) and then antarctic and greenland and NH ice sheets melted ‘rapidly.’ Temperatures ‘rapidly’ rose to +4-5C higher than present.
The temperature rise was not caused by increasing CO2 levels however the Interglacial period was extended on previous cycles by rising CO2 across 20-30,000 years. The planet greened and the Sea levels rose as fast as 2.5 meters per century at one stage and is considered fairly ‘rapid’ in geological terms. Changes in albedo also affected this time period.
It took about 100,000 years to again hit a Glacial Maximum (Ice age) period, the last one stabilised for several thousand years before again rising about 6-8C to the present level of the Holocene where it took another 8,000 years for temperatures to ‘less rapidly’ rise. This has lasted another 12,000 years of stable temps and climate since then.
OK so let’s review-
The beginning of the Eemian warmed about +1C every 300 years for 3000 years.
The Eemian stayed at that level for 10,000 years all then began to cool
It cooled about -8C over 100,000 years to the next glacial maximum about 20K years ago.
That is about -1C every 12,500 years
Then it began warming again by 6-8C in the next 8,000 years or +1C per 1000 years.
Pre-industrial is calculated as 1850-1900 therefor temperature has risen much faster at the rate of +1.5C in 125 years.
Yet in reality Temperatures didn’t really begin rising until the middle 1970s, making the rise extremely fast at +1C in 50 years. And that rate is now increasing faster every year.
The IPCC / COP theories are that this will be stopped at or below +1.5C to 2C at the end of the century.
The facts are +1.5C is more or less broken already, in the next couple of years, and the +2C boundary will be broken in 2040 or even before then. The current trajectory (assuming BAU and no one hitting their Paris treaty goals) places us possibly hitting +3C or higher of warming by 2100.
+3.5C by 2120
+5-6C by 2200
This equates to 7.2C over 300 years versus the +1C over 300 years it actually was in early warming of the Eemian period, .
This was over 130,000 years ago when early homo sapians (humans) first started spreading out out of Africa…. and Neanderthals still walked this Earth and there was less than 1 million population globally.
As the scientists keeps trying to point out (hopelessly as their communication is terrible) – warming and cooling can have different causes and combinations of forces driving the changes. Even though today’s cause is different than other geological periods doesn’t change the basic climate dynamics involved except that today’s unprecedented warming is potentially 7 times faster than what has happened before in the rapidly changing inter-glacial periods.
Global warming (and climate change) has never been this rapid except for the K/T event that involved a massive meteorite that took out the dinosaurs and plunged a hot earth instantly into a cool one with mass extinctions followed a super hot one driven by massive increases in CO2 levels with even more mass extinctions and eventually toxic oceans saturated with hydrogen sulfide gas. This could eventually happen as well again.
If nothing is done (and really, nothing serious is being done yet), then by 2200 temperatures of +5C or higher are very possible, sea levels 5 to 10 meters or higher than today, with ongoing melting of the ice sheets on Greenland and the Antarctica, with extreme ocean acidification causing mass extinctions none of which can be stopped later this century or after. See Hansen et al and others.
The window to stop this is now and the next few decades. After that it becomes unstoppable, nothing can be done to reverse the warming, ecosystems will be wiped out, billions will suffer and starve as the world and ‘human civilisation’ we know it is progressively destroyed.
Unless it is all some terrible conspiracy or 60,000 plus paleontologists geologists mathematicians computer scientists and climatology climate related scientists don’t have a clue what each other has been doing the last 50 years.
It is not important that similar climate changes have happened before or not. What is critically important now is that 8-9 billion people and today’s material civilisation did not exist before either! They do now.

Refs:
https://www.lyellcollection.org/doi/pdf/10.1144/jgs2020-239
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eemian#/media/File:All_palaeotemps.svg
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eemian
https://www.pnas.org/doi/10.1073/pnas.1524766113
https://skepticalscience.com/LIG1-0706.html
https://skepticalscience.com/LIG2-1906.html
Ice melt, sea level rise and superstorms: evidence from paleoclimate data, climate modeling, and modern observations that 2 ◦C global warming could be dangerous, James Hansen et al.
4 Earth’s climate history
Earth’s climate history is our richest source of information
about climate processes. We first examine the Eemian or
MIS 5e period, the last time Earth was as warm as today,
because it is especially relevant to the issue of rapid sea level
rise and storms when ice sheets existed only on Greenland
and Antarctica. A fuller interpretation of late-Eemian climate
events, as well as projection of climate change in the An-
thropocene, requires understanding mechanisms involved in
Earth’s millennial climate oscillations, which we discuss in
the following subsection
https://acp.copernicus.org/articles/16/3761/2016/acp-16-3761-2016.pdf

Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Feb 20 2024 9:08 utc | 296

PS Sorry, I forgot to mention, my prognosis and forecast is that nothing will be done to curtail ongoing global warming or expanding ecosystem destruction. My view is the whole shebang the entire Meta-Crisis is bound to self-destruct human civilisation and societies across most of the globe. Who or what survives as chaos reigns supreme is imo a coin toss.
But I could be wrong. I just don’t think I am. Wiser better people than me see it similarly. Hope is fading fast in those who know and who have any left. Cheers Be Happy! 🙂

Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Feb 20 2024 9:26 utc | 297

Mass Motoring is responsible for ~40% of CO2 emmisions in the USA.
Posted by: Exile | Feb 20 2024 7:42 utc | 293
Um, no. TRy under 20% iirc. Do you have a ref?
But you still have a point. Except that what individuals choose to do individually is an emotionally charged logical fallacy distraction of no value. Stop blaming the victims, iow. And stop blaming the fossil fuel companies for providing a product service “the system” and almost everyone uses and demands and relies upon in the west. 🙂

Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Feb 20 2024 9:35 utc | 298

If nothing is done (and really, nothing serious is being done yet), then by 2200 temperatures of +5C or higher are very possible, sea levels 5 to 10 meters or higher than today, with ongoing melting of the ice sheets on Greenland and the Antarctica, with extreme ocean acidification causing mass extinctions none of which can be stopped later this century or after.
*******
Very possible? Is that a scientific term of probability? How much greater is it than regular possible?
We have heard all this for the past 30 years. Perhaps the Global Warmingists have been humiliated enough by their bold proclamations of no snow on kilamanjaro by 2015, glaciers left in Glacier National Park by 2012, (in fact All are still there), and water over New York by 2010.
Furthermore, CO2 output EXCEEDED projections, meaning these prophesized catastrophes should have happened sooner and been more dire…
…yet, at worst, we continue to see a slight warming, as it has been since the middle ages.
Is it possible none of these doomsday scenarios could happen? I mean if “Very Possible” means 75% chance, then would it be heresy to suggest a 25% chance the forecasts of doom are wrong?
I dont know, I never use probabilities like “very possible”, all my probabality ranges are between 0.0 and 1.0.
*******
ecosystems will be wiped out, billions will suffer and starve as the world and ‘human civilisation’ we know it is progressively destroyed.
********
Oh yeah, totally. Then Jebus will burn the world in fire and brimstone.
********
Unless it is all some terrible conspiracy or 60,000 plus paleontologists geologists mathematicians computer scientists and climatology climate related scientists don’t have a clue what each other has been doing the last 50 years.
******
Or, it is all based on faulty data, faulty assumptions, and brutal suppression of any who dare defy their sacred cash cows.
Why cant these people do anything productive, like say predict the next growing seasons and shit?
There measurements so precise, their models so infallible,maybe they can like, help end world hunger by predicting where there will be rain, less rain, etc ..
Instead of useless predictions of doom.

Posted by: UWDude | Feb 20 2024 9:40 utc | 299

Lastly –

The greens running about madly planting trees is utter lunacy as they don’t lock carbon in the ground apart from a tiny amount that has formed only a very thin layer of topsoil.
I would assume the amount of carbon locked away as coal is minute compared to the amount locked away in limestone.
Posted by: Peter AU1 | Feb 20 2024 5:22 utc | 291

Trees photosynthesis locks carbon in the trees (wood) and the soils as well. It’s basic science and it doesn’t matter what the ‘greens’ do. I would advise against assuming anything. Research it instead. Google scholar is your friend. 🙂
Basic Wiki Refs:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbonic_acid and ocean acidification from CO2
and
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limestone#Formation
The solubility of calcium carbonate (CaCO3) is controlled largely by the amount of dissolved carbon dioxide (CO2) in the water. And so, fwiw, calcium carbonate isn’t carbonate nor is it H2CO3, Carbonic acid.
Da Dog hath spoken 🙂

Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Feb 20 2024 9:52 utc | 300

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