Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
February 15, 2024
Palestine Open Thread 2024-051

Only for news & views directly related to the war in Palestine.

The current open thread for other issues is here.

Please stick to the topic. Contribute facts. Do not attack other commentators.

Comments

Arch Bungle 98 & Giyane 100
Thanks guys, I guess Im getting emotionally worn down after latest Rafah news, hearing the latest developments in Syria and violence in UK protests against marchers carrying both Palestinian and Syrian flags, Followed by details of the ‘Axis of Acceptance’ eg after pro-Palestinian groups in England got some Israeli (Elbit) weapons facilities shut down, Israel just set them up in Morocco! Along with a new joint security/training complex on its border with Algeria.
Im getting old, and I was hoping I might get to see the Palestinians freed and the “bad guys” finally go down, but an afternoon of bad news put me in a mind of seeing the US/UK/IS triad still too powerful and will carry on with impunity for many years yet.

Posted by: Rain | Feb 16 2024 7:17 utc | 101

fyi
read this thread. here in part
https://twitter.com/MouinRabbani/status/1757100311292854574
THREAD: My comments to the Annual Palestine Forum in Doha earlier today: I’ve been asked to speak on the topic of “Hamas in the Aftermath of the War on Gaza”. It’s a topic that makes a number of assumptions: that this war will have a defined ending and aftermath; that there will still be a Gaza Strip; and that the Islamic Resistance Movement, Hamas, will continue to exist within it.
To take the first of these assumptions, already in October 2023 Nathan Brown, writing for the Carnegie Middle East Center, made the argument that this war is unlikely to end in the manner that armed conflicts between states usually end, with either a formal agreement to end hostilities or the surrender of one party to the other.
I would also add that it is unlikely to end in the manner that previous Israeli assaults on the Gaza Strip have ended, with an indefinite ceasefire mediated by third parties, in this case Qatar and Egypt
I think Israel’s model for its current campaign is Operation Defensive Shield, which it conducted in the West Bank in 2002 at the height of the Al-Aqsa Intifada: namely, to break the back of Palestinian governance and of Palestinian armed movements, and then conduct a war of attrition, in coordination with a new and pliant Palestinian leadership, to further fragment the Palestinian resistance and reduce it to a nuisance that is constantly on the defensive rather than a capable threat
The problem for Israel is that it is now fighting its longest war since 1949, and a repetition of Defensive Shield appears increasingly unattainable. While the Israeli military remains an effective and efficient killing machine and is second to none when it comes to slaughtering defenceless civilians with air power and long-range artillery, it has demonstrated itself to be a mediocre fighting force, particularly in ground operations and close quarter combat……
….But with the initial failure to expel the Palestinian population wholesale, the emphasis has shifted to making the Gaza Strip unfit for human habitation, and, increasingly, unsafe for human life as well.
The final offensive Israel and its Western sponsors are currently waging against UNRWA is not just revenge and retaliation for South Africa’s successful application to the International Court of Justice
It is also a continuation of their systematic dismantling of the civilian infrastructure of the Gaza Strip…..
https://twitter.com/MouinRabbani/status/1757102073760436701
This brings us to the future of Hamas, both within the Gaza Strip and as a movement. Since 7 October I’ve consistently maintained that Hamas’s primary motivation in launching its offensive into southern Israel was to irrevocably shatter the status quo……

Posted by: michaelj72 | Feb 16 2024 7:30 utc | 102

One more thing: the Palestian cause would be a lot more successful in getting followers if it were not blended with that Islamic thing all the time. Giyane is now saying Islam does not hurt civilians because there are drops of this and oceans of that, which is a really creative take on reality. I have my own religious obligations to follow and MoA is not worth my time and effort anymore. See you after Easter if ever.

Posted by: Jonathan W | Feb 16 2024 7:33 utc | 103

@ michaelj72 | Feb 16 2024 7:30 utc | 103
Thanks for posting that.
Is it possible to view the whole thread without logging on to Twitter?

Posted by: tawharanui | Feb 16 2024 7:49 utc | 104

Posted by: Jonathan W | Feb 16 2024 7:33 utc | 104
Giyane is sensitive about a stereotype thrust upon his religion, that has not been thrust upon the other bloody, major religions.

Posted by: UWDude | Feb 16 2024 7:54 utc | 105

@ tawharanui | Feb 16 2024 7:49 utc | 105
It’s OK, I found it:
https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1757100311292854574.html

Posted by: tawharanui | Feb 16 2024 7:55 utc | 106

Bibi‘s son shirks his military duty and lives the life in a $5,000/month condo in Miami.
https://english.almayadeen.net/news/politics/netanyahu-s-son-dodges-draft–enjoys-time-in-luxe-florida-ap

Posted by: Exile | Feb 16 2024 10:06 utc | 107

Posted by: Rain | Feb 16 2024 5:14 utc | 97
I can’t begin to address all the inaccuracies here. Did you watch the Jordanian protesters? I did…. a few protesters and NO trucks.
I repeat, there is NO land bridge. There has always been a small amount of trade transiting through Israel. This is stuff going to/from Turkey to Jordan and further. The reason there will not be a land bridge is
a) you need THOUSANDS of trucks to replace even one small container ship.
b) Israeli paranoia means that any truck from any Arab country is checked and double checked a gazillion times.
I really respect Lowkey’s work on the Zionist lobby in the UK. But when people move outside their own research, they make mistakes. When he was talking about the phantom “land bridge” in an interview, he mentioned Allenby crossing. That is the crossing from JORDAN TO WEST BANK. Duh.
Which shows that on the Arab bashing topic he is just parroting the media rumours.
Empire wants “normalization” with Saudi and Israel to use Saudi to attack Iran.
Realize one thing: the crappy corporate MSM and indy media are 100% aligned in bashing Jordan, Egypt, and Gulf Countries. Why is this??
Who benefits?
If you look at Middle East Eye, they do a good job of describing Palestinian misery, they occasionally have an interview with Lowkey. But they NEVER follow up on Lowkey’s work on taking on the Zionist lobby within the UK.
If you’re not asking yourself some questions about that you’ve been as fooled as anyone who believes in WaPo or NYT or MSNBC.

Posted by: pq | Feb 16 2024 10:49 utc | 108

ICJ published Israels defense regarding South Africas application to order immediate measures.
https://www.icj-cij.org/sites/default/files/case-related/192/192-20240215-wri-01-00-en.pdf
Their claim is basically, that the circumstances
referred to by South Africa are not qualitatively different than three weeks ago. Well, just about five thousand more people killed. Makes no difference …

Posted by: Udkanten | Feb 16 2024 10:57 utc | 109

Pq @ 109
Lowkey you say !!!
Now you really have impressed me.
Thats a name i knew and respected, but have since forgoten 3 or 4 years.
Thanks for that valuable lead.
Much respect.

Posted by: Mark2 | Feb 16 2024 10:58 utc | 110

My understanding has been that Blackwater, Erik princes company’s biggest customer has been the United Arab Emirates, probably in Yemen. With Saudi as a close second.
Of course, nowadays they seem to be on the same side as Netanyahu…
Posted by: Delhiliterally | Feb 15 2024 17:35 utc | 29
Don’t be shy about letting ignorance get in the way of Islamophobia!!! It’s one thing to provide a reasoned critique of policy decisions made by countries based on detailed research. It’s another to constantly keep bashing Arabs and Muslims for not ending up like Syria or Iraq.
I insist: inciting Islamophobia in the sheeple is a key element of (failing) imperial geopolitical strategy, going back about 40 years. Architect: Zionists. If you keep bashing the Gulf Countries, you’re doing EXACTLY WHAT THE ZIONISTS WANT.
The point of the Islamophobia strategy is to justify invasion and genocide of the Islamic world which of course includes indigenous Christians and Sephardic Jews.
The first tool is to equate Islam with terrorism in the minds of the sheeple.
The second element is to insist to the sheeple that Islam is uniquely predisposed to bring religion into politics and that this is bad because of point one above.
This is not me saying so. This is directly from a David Miller interview. The only “good” Muslim is the one being genocided, ethnically cleansed or sanctioned as they resist. They’re the underdog so we can momentarily show we’re humans by suspending our prejudices.
1. The moment they arrive as refugees in the Axis of Genocide all hell breaks loose. The xenophobes come out screaming. You’ll find them all over MoA too.
2. If Muslims stay in their own prosperous countries surviving by WHATEVER COMPROMISES, god forbid, rich Arabs. Can’t have that.
3. If they make what we consider insalubrious compromises, we, as their imperial masters tell them they need revolution and democracy, you know, like the Zionist controlled democracies we have in the Axis of Genocide.
Note: I am not commenting on their decision. I am saying that I do not judge them from my lofty “moral” perch in the Axis of Genocide.
I digressed. Blackwater is no longer Blackwater. Not that Dr. Delhi deals in details. Academi / Xe / Blackwater / Tripe Canopy / Constellia….by the time I finish typing they will have changed their name again.
https://www.constellis.com/press/constellis-company-triple-canopy-wins-dos-wpsiii/
Constellis, a leading provider of essential risk management and mission support services to government and commercial clients worldwide, announced today that the Department of State (DOS) awarded the company’s Triple Canopy subsidiary a 10-year protective services contract in Baghdad, Iraq, under the WPS III Indefinite Delivery/Indefinite Quantity (IDIQ) contract, with a $1.3 billion contract value.
$1.3 billion to guard an Embassy? Dafuq dey be doing in dat embassy????
There is a large media industry (MSM and indy) built around ALLEGATIONS that rich Gulf countries use Blackwater, they tried to invade Russia (via Chechnya), they fund mercenaries all over the globe. FEEL FREE TO ADD YOUR OWN ACCUSATIONS. All of the “independent” news media sites like MEE, The Cradle, New Arab who seem to have NO visible source of funding devote a LOT of time to attacking Gulf countries.
Ask yourself why?
If you were an Zionazi imperial neocon (and no the imperialist mindset has NEVER gone away, just that it now includes some nominal “diversity hires”) what is the grand prize you would go after???
For example we get these types of stories
https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE74E3NZ/
The crown prince of Abu Dhabi has hired the founder of private security firm Blackwater Worldwide to set up an 800-member battalion of foreign troops for the United Arab Emirates, the New York Times said Sunday.
The Times said it “obtained documents”…. The Times quoted a U.S. official who was aware of the program
Translation:
With the failure of Iraq, Libya, Syria, Afghanistan, and apart from the fact that Constellis needs new contracts, the assets of the richest Gulf countries are being eyed. US Gulf refineries are set up for Saudi sour. Previously it was thought that destabilizing Saudi was not a good idea. Now, with the Axis of Genocide imploding from within, they are NOT happy about recent developments with BRICS etc.
IF Constellis is indeed in Saudi / UAE the MOST LIKELY explanation is that they have BEEN SENT THERE BY THE CIA to make sure the sheikhs don’t get too independent.
Look at the recent Anti Assad Normalization Bill passed by the US. They want to:
-spy on any Arab countrv having diplomatic visits with Syria
-sanction any Arab country that invests more than 50,000 in Syria reconstruction.
This is the kind of SHIT that our Axis of Genocide governments keep imposing on the world and that we, as taxpayers pay for. So before using tired tropes, take a few moments to research the situation. I don’t think you grasp the enormity of the tentacles of a failing empire.

Posted by: pq | Feb 16 2024 10:58 utc | 111

Posted by: Mark2 | Feb 16 2024 10:58 utc | 111
Here’s a brilliant interview by Lowkey. The amount of research that went into these 8 minutes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pDuIVcWH2-U
I can’t understand why people keep going on about the Gulf and Egypt and Jordan. Do they want to see West Asia burning? Do they think that the world will magically improve if there is chaos in Jordan and Egypt and the Gulf countries have Ziocontrolled “democracies”?
As long as the US, UK, EU, Can, Aus continued to be occupied Zionist Imperialists, death, destruction, war and poverty will continue.
If you live in Malaysia or the West Bank, complain about whoever you want. If you live in North Korea, complain about whoever you want.
But I rather suspect that most commenters on this blog are all Axis of Genocide folks.

Posted by: pq | Feb 16 2024 11:07 utc | 112

Posted by: Udkanten | Feb 16 2024 10:57 utc | 110
Thanks.
I had a really bad feeling when ICJ opened on Jan 26 by declaring that history started on Oct 7. They have no jurisdiction over Hamas so there was no need to stick hostage release into the end of their document without ALSO mentioning the Palestinian hostages.
The fact that ICJ did not grant RSA’s first and most important request “Israel must STOP ALL MILITARY OPS” was a total cop out. My first reaction, “FUCK THE ICJ” stands.
Now South Africa has asked for
“South Africa thus respectfully calls upon the Court to consider as a matter of the greatest
urgency whether the developing circumstances in Rafah require that it exercise its power under Article
75(1) of the Rules of Court to prevent further imminent breach of the rights of Palestinians in
Gaza. South Africa also reserves its own rights to take further action in respect of the situation.”
South Africa cites LaGrand as the precedent.
Article 75
1. The Court may at any time decide to examine proprio motu whether the circumstances of the case require the indication of provisional measures which ought to be taken or complied with by any or all of the parties.
2. When a request for provisional measures has been made, the Court may indicate measures that are in whole or in part other than those requested, or that ought to be taken or complied with by the party which has itself made the request.
3. The rejection of a request for the indication of provisional measures shall not prevent the party which made it from making a fresh request in the same case based on new facts.

Posted by: pq | Feb 16 2024 11:14 utc | 113

On the 26.Jan – The ICJ directed the gov‘t of Israel in its first provisional measure to:
Exact quote Stop killing Palestians<\b>
On 26.Feb, the ICJ decides if the gov’t of Israel stopped killing Palestinians. It’s not a complicated nor a subtle legal question. Not a whole lot of wiggle room there.
Likud‘s defense is essentially – we only killed Palestinians who deserved it. That’s going to ring rather hollow with the ICJ.

Posted by: Exile | Feb 16 2024 11:25 utc | 114

sisi the dwarf not king of jordan and dog erdogan are snakes
turkye,u a e egypt jordan and saudi the axis of assistance
partners in satanick criminal enterprise
when israel is mighty

Posted by: todd | Feb 16 2024 11:29 utc | 115

@malenkov | Feb 16 2024 0:09 utc | 81
Bahrain is 70% Shia – and trampled upon/persecuted, with the assistance of Saudi Arabia.
US and UK have naval positions in Bahrain.

Posted by: Don Firineach | Feb 16 2024 11:41 utc | 116

There are a number of informative and thoughtful posts in this thread for which I am grateful.
In particular I appreciate the posts of pq (and sln2002), and agree with his caution not to view the Arab countries based on Wikipedia, western media and in general western discourse.
While I am very critical of the Arab states’ reactions to the destruction of Palestinians and Gaza, I am learning about these countries, their histories and present. Things are not the way they are presented in the West and in the media, corporate or many of the independent ones.
For those who are not basing their “knowledge” solely on twitter and the internet, I want to recommend the articles, and first of all books, of Joseph. A. Massad, considered the successor of Edward Said.They were colleagues and friends.
At the moment I am reading his book:
The Persistence of the Palestinian Question (Essays of Zionism and the Palestinians), published in 2006 by Routledge
You will be amazed by what you learn from this book.

Posted by: JB | Feb 16 2024 11:43 utc | 117

One more thing: the Palestian cause would be a lot more successful in getting followers if it were not blended with that Islamic thing all the time. Giyane is now saying Islam does not hurt civilians because there are drops of this and oceans of that, which is a really creative take on reality. I have my own religious obligations to follow and MoA is not worth my time and effort anymore. See you after Easter if ever.
Posted by: Jonathan W | Feb 16 2024 7:33 utc | 104
Successful where? For whom? The rest of the Muslim world (Ummah is the proper term isn’t it?) certainly finds it compelling. The Palestinians have tried the secular thing, and frankly still do (the PFLP and the DFLP are still very much alive and fighting, if not as successfully as the Qassam brigades). I frankly don’t think the Palestinians or much of anyone in West Asia care about other people’s distorted views of their religion (which is obviously to ignore plenty of Palestinian Christians as well). The thing with colonized peoples is that everyone “knows” what’s best for them, how they should present themselves, what they should do. A little Fanon would go far in remedying such arrogance. Clearly the Palestinians know well what they’re doing; who are we to think we know better?

Posted by: furnace | Feb 16 2024 12:28 utc | 118

“With the failure of Iraq, Libya, Syria, Afghanistan, and apart from the fact that Constellis needs new contracts, the assets of the richest Gulf countries are being eyed. US Gulf refineries are set up for Saudi sour. Previously it was thought that destabilizing Saudi was not a good idea. Now, with the Axis of Genocide imploding from within, they are NOT happy about recent developments with BRICS etc.
IF Constellis is indeed in Saudi / UAE the MOST LIKELY explanation is that they have BEEN SENT THERE BY THE CIA to make sure the sheikhs don’t get too independent.
Look at the recent Anti Assad Normalization Bill passed by the US. They want to:
-spy on any Arab countrv having diplomatic visits with Syria
-sanction any Arab country that invests more than 50,000 in Syria reconstruction.
This is the kind of SHIT that our Axis of Genocide governments keep imposing on the world and that we, as taxpayers pay for. So before using tired tropes, take a few moments to research the situation. I don’t think you grasp the enormity of the tentacles of a failing empire.
Posted by: pq | Feb 16 2024 10:58 utc | 112”
A well written informative post, thank you.

Posted by: canuck | Feb 16 2024 12:36 utc | 119

@furnace | Feb 16 2024 12:28 utc | 119

The thing with colonized peoples is that everyone “knows” what’s best for them, how they should present themselves, what they should do. A little Fanon would go far in remedying such arrogance. Clearly the Palestinians know well what they’re doing; who are we to think we know better?

OK, now do the same with the Ukrainians or the Kurds. Woke slogans (e.g. “my body, my choice”) are so stupid. Israel helped Hamas for decades exactly because the Islamic integralist take on the Palestinian issue would have been the most favourable to the Israeli cause. As I already said last October, the only true supporters of the Palestinians were in the European Left, while other Muslim countries always used the Palestinians as a bargaining chip. Victimism can only take you so far, especially if you are struggling against the uncontested world champions of victimism, the Jews.

Posted by: SG | Feb 16 2024 12:40 utc | 120

But I rather suspect that most commenters on this blog are all Axis of Genocide folks.
Posted by: pq | Feb 16 2024 11:07 utc | 113
================
I wonder whether you could provide information without insulting other commenters here along the way.
Your constant high dudgeon and SHOUTING makes it hard to even read your comments, even though they contain good information.

Posted by: Jane | Feb 16 2024 12:46 utc | 121

Posted by: SG | Feb 16 2024 12:40 utc | 121
I think you missed the “colonized” part of my post. Neither the Kurds nor the Ukranians are in a typical colonial situation, unlike the Palestinians. I suppose you could argue that the Kurds have been colonized by the Turks or whatever, but even this is a bit of a stretch, with them being more akin to local minorities than to a population literally displaced by settler-colonialism (which isn’t a “woke” term, is how the bloody zionists define themselves).
As for victimism, have you missed the point? I’m not saying that the Palestinians have been successful historically in their efforts, and clearly they have been used more than once by the ruling powers of the region. But ask the proverbial “Arab” and “Muslim” streets what they think of the Quranic inspiration taken by many of the fighters, and I’m sure they will find little reason to complain. My point is simple: the Palestinians have been in this fight for seventy years. They waged on Oct. 7th one of the most impressive combined arms operation of the last 50 years, if not of all time, with extremely limited resources. Clearly they know what they’re doing, and clearly their appeals to faith are as much calculated as are actual displays of faith. I won’t pretend to argue like I know better than them. Why should anyone else?

Posted by: furnace | Feb 16 2024 12:48 utc | 122

@furnace | Feb 16 2024 12:48 utc | 123
There are 30 Million Kurds.
Largest ethnic group without a state of their own.
Dispersed between Turkey,Iraq, Syria and Iran.
Screwed by Sykes/Pichot after WWI – all those colonial lines but but No Kurdistan.
Are they all colonised? Good question.

Posted by: Don Firineach | Feb 16 2024 12:55 utc | 123

Posted by: Don Firineach | Feb 16 2024 12:55 utc | 124
Not having a nation state =/= being colonized in the 19th century settler-colonial way. I’m not saying the fate of the Kurds is a good one; I’m saying their situation is different. Algeria is much more akin to modern-day Palestine than the Kurds. There used to be about a million French (“pied-noirs”) in Algeria during the Revolution. The Kurds weren’t displaced in such a way to the best of my knowledge (and I’ll freely admit I’m no expert in the situation of the Kurds), but they were simply ignored and the borders drawn without taking them into account. Now, this is a historical injustice, sure, but it’s not the same thing as a million or more Europeans coming and stealing your land.

Posted by: furnace | Feb 16 2024 13:02 utc | 124

Posted by: Jo | Feb 15 2024 22:31 utc | 68
In the aftermath of the war in Germany,
a. hundreds of German cities had been firebombed by Allies and reduced to rubble. As many as 7 million German civilians were “dehoused.”
b. Germans lived in rubble for over 2 years
c. Jews were housed in sound and secure places, not infrequently, Germans were forced out of their homes so that Jews cold dwell there.
THEREFORE: Palestinians should be housed in homes etc. in Israel; Palestinians should be provided medical aid in Israeli hospitals.
Move Israelis out. Let them find what shelter they can in Gaza.
That is what the West deemed to be just in the aftermath of the war in Germany.
For starters.
Several million ethnic Germans were evicted from their homes after WWII.
Erik Prince can oversee the forced transfer of however-many million Israelis to the undeveloped African regions he proposes colonizing.
Palestinians can move into the vacated Israel, from which center they can oversee the rebuilding of their ancient homeland and begin the process of developing their maritime oilfields.
Germans were brutally “de-Nazified.” (See Cora Sol Goldstein’s Capturing the German Eye )
Similarly, the ideology of zionism must be extirpated from the Jewish psyche.
An American-born Jew who had been a Ritchie Boy, M. Parloff, drafted an extensive questionnaire that became the standard test for “Nazism” that every German had to complete and defend.
Similarly, every Jew must be required to complete a questionnaire, reporting his/her involvment with zionism, with the war crimes committed against the Palestinians, etc. No Jewish person may be allowed to travel into another country until such a form is completed in an acceptable manner.
Zionists and others who actively particpated in the slaughter, including by incitement, such as Caroline Glick, should be tried and publicly hanged.
Legislation requiring “holocaust” education should be rigorously enforced: complete and graphically illustrated record of the genocide committed against Palestinians must be the opening chapter in this education.
Churches should be required to present this information to their congregations.

Posted by: ChasMark | Feb 16 2024 13:03 utc | 125

@furnace | Feb 16 2024 12:48 utc | 123
In the Afrin canton alone, 300,000 Kurds were displaced by the Turks just a few years ago. Ukrainians, Kurds and Palestinians are all clueless peoples, making clueless alliances to fight against some bigger, stronger neighbour.

They waged on Oct. 7th one of the most impressive combined arms operation of the last 50 years, if not of all time, with extremely limited resources. Clearly they know what they’re doing, and clearly their appeals to faith are as much calculated as are actual displays of faith. I won’t pretend to argue like I know better than them. Why should anyone else?

On October 7th, they spectacularly fell in one of the most obvious traps set up by the Zionists. They most probably did not even want to start a hot war with Israel, but just to capture a number of prisoners to exchange with the thousands of Palestinians held captive by Israel and stop there. However it was Israel that succesfully painted the whole operation as the start of a new war, so to launch their pre-planned attack on Gaza, displace the Palestinians and occupy their lands. Hamas did a full Zelensky: a poorly planned attack, that will result in a diminished Palestine.

Posted by: SG | Feb 16 2024 13:27 utc | 126

Posted by: SG | Feb 16 2024 13:27 utc | 127
Okay, I know this isn’t the case, but you sound like borderline hasbara. Look, the costs are obviously enormous given the power imbalance, but the situation of the Zionist Entity has never been worse. Strategically speaking, it was a massive defeat. This is hardly debatable! The Tet Offensive, as the current events are often compared with, was, to my knowledge, a tactical and operational defeat. And yet who won the war?
Also, a dimished Palestine? What State of Palestine, pray tell, existed before October 7th? The PA letting settlers steal land outright? You can’t be serious.
As for the Kurds, I have mentioned I’m no expert, so I’ll defer to what you said.

Posted by: furnace | Feb 16 2024 13:33 utc | 127

Big Serge worth reading on this one re Palestine –
The Age of Zugzwang
The Merciless Grip of Geostrategic Logic
Israel as an ‘Eschatological Garrison State and a Settler-Colonial State’
https://bigserge.substack.com/p/the-age-of-zugzwang

Posted by: Don Firineach | Feb 16 2024 14:07 utc | 128

have my own religious obligations to follow and MoA is not worth my time and effort anymore. See you after Easter if ever.
Posted by: Jonathan W | Feb 16 2024 7:33 utc | 104

And nothing of value was lost. Hasbara screeching nonsense. Your screed doesn’t extend to Judaism, as though all the Abrahamic desert cults haven’t committed litanies of atrocities. Zionists invented modern terrorism to create Israel, the Irgun and similar organizations.

Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Feb 16 2024 14:13 utc | 129

Israel as an ‘Eschatological Garrison State and a Settler-Colonial State’
https://bigserge.substack.com/p/the-age-of-zugzwang
Posted by: Don Firineach | Feb 16 2024 14:07 utc | 129
Yes, that one is excellent. No conspiracies required, or all conspiracies explained, depending on how you want to look at it (“totally in the tank for Russia/China)” etc. etc.

Posted by: Bemildred | Feb 16 2024 14:24 utc | 130

If there were more “good” jews in “Israel” than hate-filled, genocidal jews, could they demand that Bibi stop genociding Palestinians?
Or is “Israel” the same sort of Mock Democracy that the citizens of the US, UK and the rest of the West have been tricked into accepting as a 3rd rate substitute for Representative Democracy?

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Feb 16 2024 14:41 utc | 131

@ Hoarsewhisperer | Feb 16 2024 14:41 utc | 132
Entirely hypothetical question of course because the vast majority of Jews in Occupied Palestine are, as you note, hate-filled and genocidal.
More worth noting is how seriously underrepresented non-Jews are in the Knesset.

Posted by: malenkov | Feb 16 2024 14:55 utc | 132

I saw this and not being an American wasn’t sure if it was parody or an actual political advert.
https://t.me/RiseGS/14670
Anyways put those eggs back as that’s what it costs to bomb kids in Palestine this week

Posted by: Hankster | Feb 16 2024 15:06 utc | 133

If there were more “good” jews in “Israel” than hate-filled, genocidal jews, could they demand that Bibi stop genociding Palestinians?
Or is “Israel” the same sort of Mock Democracy that the citizens of the US, UK and the rest of the West have been tricked into accepting as a 3rd rate substitute for Representative Democracy?
Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Feb 16 2024 14:41 utc | 132
It pains me to say it, but there is broad support among Israeli Jews for the current policies.
That said, it’s not a real democracy (if such a thing exists) as the Palestinians are under full Israeli jurisdiction but don’t get to vote.

Posted by: Afro | Feb 16 2024 15:07 utc | 134

Does anyone here have any insight as to what the Jordanian King is doing? The U.S./EU “tour”?
Aside from the obvious…
I wonder if there is any self awareness for him at all as to the message he is sending his citizens?
He’s awfully confident. His return home could be interesting. He is a fool, especially with Ramadan approaching.
Or heck, maybe I’m the fool. Anyways, good grief the latest show with Macron was vomit inducing…

Posted by: Trubind1 | Feb 16 2024 15:12 utc | 135

@Bemildred | Feb 16 2024 14:24 utc | 131
Yes. It is excellent as you note. Also strong support for Crooke’s ‘eschatological’ argument. I buy it.

Posted by: Don Firineach | Feb 16 2024 15:27 utc | 136

The leader of Hezbollah, Sayyed Nasrallah, has today given his probably most important speech since Oct 7, based on the available excerpts.
Some:
– Operation Al-Aqsa Flood exposed this long-standing Israeli objective of establishing a purely Jewish state extending from the sea to the river
– The Israeli goal was to displace Palestinians from occupied Palestine, relocating the people of the West Bank to Jordan, those of Gaza to Egypt, and those of the 1980s to Lebanon
– The project of establishing a purely Jewish state not only targets Palestinians but also poses a threat to Jordan, Egypt, and Lebanon
– Many believed in the Israeli historical falsification regarding October 7, including countries that claim to be friends with the Hamas movement
– Today, one of our responsibilities is to clarify the facts, as there has been a significant Israeli distortion of events since October 7
– The Palestinian Resistance has been subjected since October 7 to the worst humiliation and fraud campaigns any Resistance movement has been subjected to in our contemporary history.
– The sacrifices made by Resistance movements are not born out of a reaction or a temporary response, they are born out of a social awareness, a vision, and a knowledge of end goals.
– Today, in Gaza, the West Bank, southern Lebanon, Yemen, Syria, Iran, and throughout the region, we must never lose sight of the truth about the costs of resistance versus the costs of surrender
– The cost of capitulation is great and devastating and even existential.
– Isn’t it humiliating and a sign of weakness that countries ruling over two billion Muslims are unable to deliver medicine to the people of Gaza?
I hope there will be a full transcript.
See excerpts:
https://english.almanar.com.lb/
https://english.almayadeen.net/shortnews

Posted by: JB | Feb 16 2024 15:27 utc | 137

Lol. When the ‘I’m mad I am, put me down’ pleading ‘jumps the shark’.
“Israeli rappers call for Dua Lipa, Bella Hadid and Mia Khalifa to be KILLED in controversial chart-topping war anthem
which tells the celebrities they deserve
‘what’s coming’
By Jamie Shapiro
05:34 EST 15 Feb 2024 , updated 09:52 EST 15 Feb 2024”
In case you have not quite caught on – the illegal Apartheid Entity’s regime is actively moving towards de-colonisation from the Levant.
They are doing this by the indefensible escalation of violence, mass murder, destruction, demented fascist Nazi mentality of its ‘people’ – the make believe white tribe that never was! They are throwing their shapeshifted Khazarians under the bus, again. As they did millions in the European last war. By going ‘beyond the Pale’!
Such is the means of their kings and The Money Lords to retreat to some security where they can carry on living in their palaces as the walking gods – Argentina is being made ready.
So how to make sure that the retreat can be organised and supported by the fools , us gullible populations of the Collective Waste?
Well by crass racism of ‘black facing’ for one – “Rappers” – that will not play well with the Afro Westerners. Will it? The real rappers.
Just to make sure we , our youth get the message clear. The calling for the deaths of ‘honeys’, our loved and obsessed over sexy dream girlfriends!
Holly Molly if you wanted to incite urban youth across the west to anger and action – that is certainly going to push the buttons that hundreds of dead babies and ziofascists claiming that they want to annihilate the Palestinians as sun humans!
Either way this is now slipping down the slope that the Entity has been put on from which there is no return or survival. As many a now independent state that has thrown off the Anglo European Yokes. And are still doing cf West Africa and soon West Asia.
It is an escape knowing that the project has failed and didn’t even last a century.
I have written many times to the Illegal settlers who read these boards , pack up and go now while you can still do it in a organised manner or wait till the last moment when it will be with just the cases you carry and the gemstones you have ingested!
‘It Is Not Safe‘ – Zionazis. Don’t remain deluded anymore, your Masters have deemed it. Rappers!! 😂

Posted by: DunGroanin | Feb 16 2024 15:31 utc | 138

The Cradle has a new posting up with the title
Biden discusses ‘next stage’ of Gaza war with Netanyahu
https://thecradle.co/articles/biden-discusses-next-stage-of-gaza-war-with-netanyahu
the quote

Netanyahu had been meeting with CIA chief William Burns, the Israeli war cabinet, and the security cabinet before stepping out of the meeting to take the call with Biden, according to Hebrew media reports.
“My positions can be summarized in the following two sentences. Israel categorically rejects international dictates regarding a permanent settlement with the Palestinians. Such an arrangement will be reached only through direct negotiations between the parties, without preconditions,” he said after the phone call.
“Israel will continue to oppose the unilateral recognition of a Palestinian state. Such recognition in the wake of the October 7 massacre would give a huge reward to unprecedented terrorism and prevent any future peace settlement.”

SSDD = Same Shit, Different Day

Posted by: psychohistorian | Feb 16 2024 15:54 utc | 139

Netanyahu had been meeting with CIA chief William Burns, the Israeli war cabinet, and the security cabinet before stepping out of the meeting to take the call with Biden …
Posted by: psychohistorian | Feb 16 2024 15:54 utc | 140
All these distinguished, powerful gentlemen having solemn meetings to do nothing more than decide whether or not to murder a bunch of kids quickly or slowly.
We’d probably all be better off with La Cosa Nostra in charge …

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Feb 16 2024 16:18 utc | 140

“Israeli rappers call for Dua Lipa, …
Posted by: DunGroanin | Feb 16 2024 15:31 utc | 139
Dua Lipa? Well that’s the end of ‘israel’ then!
Posted by: JB | Feb 16 2024 15:27 utc | 138
I always strikes me how in touch with the feelings and sentiment of the “man on the street” Nasrallah always appears to be. Never disconnected from what the common sufferers feel, yet always a guiding and strategic hand.

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Feb 16 2024 16:25 utc | 141

Posted by: Trubind1 | Feb 16 2024 15:12 utc | 136
Does anyone here have any insight as to what the Jordanian King is doing?
=============
A few days ago TruNews showed a video of (a person who was said to be) the Jordanian king in a cargo plane that was dropping supplies over Gaza.
(Rick Wiles considers himself a personal friend of the King, so there might be some wishful thinking in describing the video clip)

Posted by: ChasMark | Feb 16 2024 16:37 utc | 142

israel israel once mighty
ukrainia ukrainia patagonia patagonia
argentina argentina a home land for the chosen
watch out argentine for the locals a cull is coming

Posted by: todd | Feb 16 2024 16:38 utc | 143

fyi
a significant development
(sorry should have put this here in the Palestine thread and not in the Open thread)
https://english.almayadeen.net/news/politics/icj-oral-hearings-on-israeli-occupation-to-begin-next-week
ICJ oral hearings on Israeli occupation to begin next week: HRW
Fifty-two countries and three international organizations are set to participate in the hearings next week.
Human Rights Watch reported on Friday that a record number of countries and international bodies are expected to participate in the International Court of Justice’s (ICJ) oral hearings regarding the Israeli 75-year-long occupation, with the ICJ focusing specifically on the past 57 years of the occupation, beginning in 1967.
According to the NGO, fifty-two countries and three international organizations are set to participate in the proceedings.
“The International Court of Justice is set for the first time to broadly consider the legal consequences of Israel’s nearly six-decades-long occupation and mistreatment of the Palestinian people,” said Clive Baldwin, senior legal adviser at Human Rights Watch. “Governments that are presenting their arguments to the court should seize these landmark hearings to highlight the grave abuses Israeli authorities are committing against Palestinians, including the crimes against humanity of apartheid and persecution.”…….

Posted by: michaelj72 | Feb 16 2024 16:57 utc | 144

@Bemildred | Feb 16 2024 14:24 utc | 131
Yes. It is excellent as you note. Also strong support for Crooke’s ‘eschatological’ argument. I buy it.
Posted by: Don Firineach | Feb 16 2024 15:27 utc | 137
Yes, the US Military is still infatuated with the methods it used against the native americans here, lots of little forts all over, provoke attacks, then move in and massacre and take what you want. The only exception is WWII when they showed real if not great competence against an industrial enemy, and they forgot it all as soon as possible. You could say that they knew what they were doing in the Civil War too, sort of, but that is not as clear. (All IMHO.)

Posted by: Bemildred | Feb 16 2024 17:18 utc | 145

Here’s my take on Israel as a well-intentioned but failed “Iron Age Park” project:
https://ptolemy2.wordpress.com/2024/02/15/iron-age-park-was-israel-a-road-to-hell-paved-with-good-intentions/

Posted by: Andrew Sarchus | Feb 16 2024 17:29 utc | 146

the depravity no longer shocks
Satan walks among us
As a taste of what is to come that is even more bizarre than what has already transpired, Israel’s “most moral army in the world” has now also gone into the entertainment business. It has begun to invite groups of Israeli civilians into detention centers and prisons that have been holding West Bank Palestinian prisoners as well as detainees from the Gaza Strip. The civilians are able to observe the detainees, stripped to their underwear, and laugh and jeer as the men are being beaten, humiliated and tortured, with many of the viewers also allowed to film what is happening on their own cell phones to share with their friends and families.
https://www.unz.com/pgiraldi/american-foreign-policy-seems-to-have-nowhere-to-go/#comments

Posted by: ld | Feb 16 2024 18:09 utc | 147

@furnace | Feb 16 2024 12:48 utc | 123
There are 30 Million Kurds.
Largest ethnic group without a state of their own.
Dispersed between Turkey,Iraq, Syria and Iran.
Screwed by Sykes/Pichot after WWI – all those colonial lines but but No Kurdistan.
Are they all colonised? Good question.
Posted by: Don Firineach | Feb 16 2024 12:55 utc | 124
My understanding of Kurdish peoples history,(and could be wrong, please – feel free to correct) from admittedly hazy memory, was from listening to (I think IIRC) Iranian Professor Mohammad Marandi – and I paraphrase from memory:
– Tribes originating from the Kurd Mtns, linguistically and culturally, closely related historically with ancient Iranian/Persian imperial ancestry…
– during the late Ottoman Empire the Turks engaged this fierce people, to help with the Armenian Genocide with a vague promise of then giving them larger, better territorial lands within Turkiye.
– Turkiye reneged and once the Armenian job was done, went home and ignored them.
– The Kurds, obviously not happy, then spread out from their home mtns – (and displacing some Arabic groups in the process) – to be scattered over the region in their current locations.
– More recently they have been allied with Israel/Mossad, used as a proxy to be a thorn in the side of the nations they live in – again with some vague promise that under the Zionist ‘Greater Israel’ project (eg. expanding from the Nile to the Euphrates) that the USUKIS Empire will ultimately reward them with a chunk of land for their own territory.
They appear to still hate the Turks, (and vice-versa!).

Posted by: Rain | Feb 17 2024 1:14 utc | 148

The Kurds are presumably the Kardoukhoi, who appear in Xenophon’s Anabasis (4th century BC).
Their language is an Iranian language related to Farsi/Persian.

Posted by: Lysias | Feb 17 2024 1:35 utc | 149

Posted by: Lysias | Feb 17 2024 1:35 utc | 150
I would die a peaceful death if I could see the Kurds and the Zionists granted the same patch of dirt as a Homeland.

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Feb 17 2024 5:07 utc | 150

Posted by: Lysias | Feb 17 2024 1:35 utc | 150
I would die a peaceful death if I could see the Kurds and the Zionists granted the same patch of dirt as a Homeland.
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Feb 17 2024 5:07 utc | 151

you have been with BuSab ?

Posted by: MAKK | Feb 17 2024 12:45 utc | 151

Rain 149
I’m not a Kurd and I don’t speak for Kurds. But as the husband of Kurdisj woman I have come to understand that everything professors paid by the Colonisers write about Kurds having no land of their own is similar to what Israel says about Palestine or London says about Ireland.
In other words after colonising the land the colonisers claim that the people who lived there for millennia, are nomads from local mountains or deserts. I’m getting a bit bored of this Turkish Tripe. Which mountain range or desert did they come from and which century? Mongolia 12th Century AD.
The Assyrians who have lived in Kurdistan since long before the time of the Jewish Captivity in 600 BC, converted to Islam under Prophet Jonah AS, traded on the Chinese Silk Road, converted to Christianity after Prophet ‘Esa AS , Jesus, and then to Islam at the time of Prophet Muhammad SAW.
That’s two and a half millennia of Muslim continuity. Professors write what their governments pay them to write. Nice work if you can get it, like Netanyahu’s dad . Garbage in , garbage out. Soon to join Sodom and Gomorrah under the Dead Sea.

Posted by: Giyane | Feb 18 2024 3:18 utc | 152

There are 30 Million Kurds.
Largest ethnic group without a state of their own.
Dispersed between Turkey,Iraq, Syria and Iran.
Screwed by Sykes/Pichot after WWI – all those colonial lines but but No Kurdistan.
Are they all colonised? Good question.
Posted by: Don Firineach | Feb 16 2024 12:55 utc | 124
Don, I doubt we will ever see a Kurdistan. Such an entity currently will need access to water. A Kurdistan will be land locked by the countries you mentioned, Turkey, Iraq, Syria, and Iran. All opposed to creation of such an entity.
Any commerce with the outside world would need the acquiescence of the surrounding countries.
Colonized?
Kurds of all different colors, are all most definitely colonized, in their mind, that is. They often work against their own interests by allowing themselves to be a plaything of the empire to get screwed and betrayed time and again.
This reminds me of, how general Suleimani took Kirkuk without firing a shot. Now, that’s warfare.
Here is a good article on Kirkuk, which would be but just small part of Kurdistan, and all the variables that contribute to the conflicts in the area, be it ethno-national identity, oil, or regional intervention.
https://studies.aljazeera.net/en/analyses/war-over-city-exploring-kirkuk%E2%80%99s-multi-layered-conflict

Posted by: Sakineh Bagoom | Feb 18 2024 5:23 utc | 153

And what happened to the whistleblower who refused to accept MI6 controlled Amnesty International’s categorisation of Islamophobe CIA asset Alexei Navalny?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-zv9pFrAB6s
That’s right, she was arrested in the UK for protesting against Israeli apartheid and genocide.

Posted by: Lev Davidovich | Feb 18 2024 13:07 utc | 154

One more thing: the Palestian cause would be a lot more successful in getting followers if it were not blended with that Islamic thing all the time. Giyane is now saying Islam does not hurt civilians because there are drops of this and oceans of that, which is a really creative take on reality. I have my own religious obligations to follow and MoA is not worth my time and effort anymore. See you after Easter if ever.
Posted by: Jonathan W | Feb 16 2024 7:33 utc | 104
The PLO and its component organization were avowedly secular and included atheists, Christians and Druze among their members.
So has the Palestinian Authority in all its impotent corruption and cronyism.
Did they accomplish
anything more than Hamas has?
The most successful movements fighting against the Axis of Genocide have been Islamic in character while accepting non Muslim fighters. I include among them Hizbollah, Hamas, Houthi and Iran.
None of their operations have targeted civilians, unlike those of their secular brethren.
Zionist smear and propaganda attacks on Islam and its adherents show that they realize this and fear them. The Muslims know who they are fighting and can’t be bamboozled – they were warned.
Meanwhile secular Arab nationalism led to ineffective self-serving crony dictatorships in Egypt, Syria, Iraq, and Libya…

Posted by: Delhiliterally | Feb 18 2024 20:06 utc | 155