Tom_Q_Collins | Jan 19 2024 15:52 utc | 15 (quoting)
***The reasonable conclusion to draw is that the American electoral system is broken. It does not represent the will of the people.***
Nor does the system in Britain.
Though the blinkered public are partly to blame. For example, was surprised the other day when an elderly (in his 80s) and usually intelligent friend mentioned that at he next election he was going to vote Labour as usual, since they represented “ordinary working people”.
Which they in fact — even by their own statements — stopped doing at all a long time ago.

Posted by: Cynic | Jan 19 2024 22:59 utc | 203

Nice insight in RT today: https://www.rt.com/news/590937-russia-us-long-confrontation/

At the end of 2021, in the acute phase of the Ukraine crisis, the US made a big mistake, in my opinion, by deciding to apply a strategy to crush Russia instead of a positional strategy. In world history these have been the two classic military-political variants. The strategy of crushing is always based on significant material, power, and ideological advantages, the possession of the initiative, and belief in the rapid defeat of the opponent. This was the idea of Alexander the Great when he began his campaign: a very advanced army, possession of advanced military technology for the time, the principle of the phalanx developed by the Thebans and then adopted by the Macedonians, with strong cavalry units.
They did not suffer a single defeat during the entire campaign. The main obstacle for the Macedonians was the confrontation with the Greek mercenaries from Athens, who used the classic positional strategy. What is the point of such a plan? It gives up the initiative, allows the other side to act, and relies on the need to mobilize and concentrate resources. It avoids a decisive battle for as long as possible and only engages in it when it is impossible to lose. From this description we can see the typical strategic behavior of Russia in different periods of war.
The US tried to crush our country while not possessing superior resources, and misjudged both its own and its allies’ capabilities, in an attempt to achieve its goals – which were to isolate Russia, to stimulate internal protests and undermine support for the government, to create major obstacles on the front line and, as a result, to defeat the country as quickly as possible. Now the confrontation in the military sphere has entered a different phase and the Americans are forced to look for a way out of this situation.
US strategic culture is characterized by a transitional approach to allies, and it is to be expected that at some point the cost of owning ‘the Ukrainian asset’ will be too high for the Americans to continue to benefit from it.

Posted by: Scorpion | Jan 19 2024 23:01 utc | 205

Dadi | Jan 19 2024 22:15 utc | 197
The short and sweet of karlof1’s comment is that once a signatory has ratified a UN agreement, that both goes onto that countries domestic law and makes that country liable under international law.
…………..
According to Putin, veto power was primarily to prevent war between great powers in the nuclear age but I very much agree with Karl on current permanent member UNSC being past its use-by date as more countries are now nuclear armed, more large populations pulling themselves out of poverty and illiteracy and has been designed around westphalian power and the world of that day. The golden billion.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jan 19 2024 23:11 utc | 207

Exile | Jan 19 2024 19:51 utc | 181
The crazy adventurer. There was a case not so many years back where an around the world solo literaly went arse over head as as a ver steep or curling wave came up behind it at night. He set off his eperb and I think aircraft quickly found him sitting on the hull of his upturned boat in the southern ocean between Australia and Africa. A large naval ship had to go out the 12 hundred k or whatever to rescue him and I thought who pays the cost of this stunt? I don’t know how many millions to rescue him but it would have been a few. My thought was those pulling stunts like that were they sail the rough southern ocean to catch the wind should either put up a sufficient rescue bond or be refused and eperb and head off at their own risk.
The Russian guy seems to accept the risk be it ignorance or otherwise so an interesting adventure.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jan 19 2024 23:29 utc | 209

whirlX | Jan 19 2024 23:16 utc | 209
Prior to the nineties, Putins thought were very much as you here and others before have described. Most Russians thought it was only ideology that came between them and the west.
But as Putin said, after the collapse, the CIA had a victory parade on red square.
Another term he used was that they sat on our heads and chewed bubble gum.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jan 19 2024 23:35 utc | 211

It appears the best way to change their behavior is to relegate them to the Out Group until they prove their behavior’s changed and they’ve atoned for their outlaw past.
Posted by: karlof1 | Jan 19 2024 21:52 utc | 193

So Karl, your “solution” is to do exactly what you are complaining about the US and others of doing.
Meet the new boss, as bad and demented as the old boss.
I have read the GSI several times, I really like what it says to me, and the ambitions it articulates. I can see many times where the text points to the kinds of unilateral (anti-UN Principles / Law) actions by the US and others which they are calling out as unacceptable and in urgent need of change.
Here is the full text of
“The Global Security Initiative Concept Paper.”
https://www.globaltimes.cn/page/202302/1285900.shtml?id=11
Karl could you please point me to, or copy/paste the section that says anything like :
1) “relegate them to the Out Group”
and
2) “(GSI), which is essentially a restatement of the UN Charter specifying no hegemonic nations will be allowed to join.”
and
3) “they will exist outside the primary global organization and will remain outlaws since they choose to be outside the laws of nations.”
Because, I cannot see anything like that written, or meaning those things, in the The Global Security Initiative Concept Paper’s text. Maybe I missed it?
I believe you are over-egging the souffle! Seeing things that are not actually there. 🙂
Thanks.

Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Jan 19 2024 23:41 utc | 213

Posted by: karlof1 | Jan 19 2024 21:52 utc | 193
For the Bar:
When a law is passed, it’s either obeyed or violated. The UN Charter is a corpus of laws that was signed and ratified by all nations wanting to become UN members–one must be done for the other to occur. Once a nation agrees to obey a law it becomes an outlaw if it disobeys.

That’s the first time I’ve read an explanation for your moniker ‘Outlaw US Empire’. I thought it was a Cowboy-Indian expression or some such, like ‘the Outlaw Josey Wales’ but now I see what you mean by it. Thank you. And good point.
I understand the rest of your post except this part:

Part of my Big Picture argument is that WW2 never really ended as the fixtures that were to provide for a lasting peace were never attained: Denazification of Europe was prevented by the USA, UK and France, meaning they immediately broke the covenant by which they were rewarded with permanent UNSC seats and vetoes. Thus, the three main Plundering nations immediately gained outlaw status by November 1945, and have retained that status ever since.

What do you mean by ‘denazification’?
I grew up in a West wherein the word ‘Nazi’ basically meant all that was worst and most despotic in human nature, personified by The Fuhrer and those who perpetrated industrial mass murder on helpless, innocent Jews. Didn’t the three nations you mention (plus Russia, including the same Judge that oversaw many of the show trials in Russia only a decade before) prosecute Nazis and execute them? Wasn’t the Reich disbanded and to this day Germany doesn’t have a full constitution and is still under occupation?
This is what I think when I read your statement that the West never denazified. I don’t know what you mean. No doubt you have a different meaning in mind so I would be grateful if you could unpack it, especially since your terminology is often used by other barflies here of longer standing than myself. Perhaps your explanation will help me understand Putin better too, since he often talks about denazification, though in Ukraine there are overt Nazi battalions at least.

Posted by: Scorpion | Jan 19 2024 23:59 utc | 215

Posted by: karlof1 | Jan 19 2024 21:52 utc | 193
Amen, karlof1; amen.

Posted by: juliania | Jan 20 2024 0:17 utc | 217

Posted by: persiflo | Jan 19 2024 22:59 utc | 205
All men are equal before god, as they say (while sometimes adding the tax office). But the modern idea of equality, enshrined in the battle cry “liberté! egalité! fraternité!” is already fully grounded in the mindset of the renaissance, where the state is the guarantor of individual freedoms and indifferent to religion. Since modern states are very much defined through their power to craft legislation (and issue currency, I might add), the current “systematic” translation of the old battle cry would be that “all shall be equal in front of the law”.
FWIW, as an addendum, in the notorious “Protocols” you can read one of the elders, giggling incessantly, describing how they were able to dupe folks with this slogan during the “french revolution” ff/psyop.

Well actually, I’ve always thought that the maxim ‘all are equal under the law’ is a genius level insight and principle. But it’s not the same as ‘all are equal’. All equally share certain rights and privileges as fellow citizens, but all are not equal. My admittedly shaky understanding of the old communist attempts a century or so ago were to create an essentially classless society, or at least one without an upper class any more, moreover ideally as All Under Heaven here wrote: ‘a dictatorship of the proletariat’.
Leaving aside the impossible absurdity of such a topsy turvy notion, my objection is that concept, or ideology, cannot be imposed on living, breathing, pulsing reality. It never works. So also materialist explanations of reality are abstract constructs way too clunky or, as I like to say, ‘narrow bandwidth’ to serve their intended purpose which is to define reality and guide decision-making accordingly. Of course theories can help clarify and explain things whilst providing shared vocabulary but they cannot be taken for reality themselves. It’s like confusing a map for the terrain; maps can be very helpful, but actual terrain they can never be.
Equality under the law is admirable. Forcing all to BE equal because an ideology says so is the Way to Hell which, as we all know, is paved with Good Intentions!

Posted by: Scorpion | Jan 20 2024 0:22 utc | 219

Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Jan 20 2024 0:19 utc | 219
It’s the right tree, Lavrov’s Dog. karlof1’s lifting a heavy load. We need to cut him some slack. Suggest improvements; your points look like adjustments are possible, but his main argument is not affected by them.

Posted by: juliania | Jan 20 2024 0:39 utc | 221

Scorpion | Jan 19 2024 23:59 utc | 216
I think that what is meant is a semi judicial process whereby all those who were functionaries of the German state during the war years were to be questioned, and, if preliminary questioning regarding their roles and locations in the machinery of state justified doing so, referred to prosecution and trial.
The basis of such proceedings being that the Nazi regime was a criminal conspiracy guilty of an enormous number of crimes which could be specified and described.
That sort of approach was agreed upon at the top level during wartime conferences between the allies.
As it turned out there was little interest, particularly on the western side, in pursuing the matter thoroughly. The reasons are fairly obvious.
Take the case of one Werner von Braun for example. The charges against him were in two board categories. One, of particular interest to the British, was his role in the design and production of the V One and Two rockets- Terror weapons it was charged. The second charge of great interest to the Soviet people was his role as an employer and supervisor of slave labour, in very large numbers. This labour was treated very badly, starved and worked and beaten to death in the case of tens of thousands, including many at Peenemunde and other Rocket sites.
Then there was the case of von Gehlen who was head of one of the military intelligence outfits on the Eastern Front. He was implicated in the deaths of many civilians as well as partisans. Given the well known orders under which the Wehrmacht and SS operated on the Eastern Front he was clearly guilty of war crimes. And lots of them.
Both men were of such eminence that for any de-Nazification programme to have its desired effects-on the population of Germany, on future generations,on the world at large- they were obvious candidates for trials and, if found guilty, exemplary treatment.
Instead one went onto head NASA and the other to head the West German Intelligence arm and become a trusted confidante of Allen Dulles, as well as the director of neo-fascist militias operating in Ukraine, the Baltic states and eastern Europe.

Posted by: bevin | Jan 20 2024 0:45 utc | 223

bevin | Jan 20 2024 0:45 utc | 224
German companies that produced the chemicals for the gas chambers. Big names in the chemical industry today. To me, they should have been disbanded.
The German rocketman. All american hero that sent America to the moon.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jan 20 2024 0:52 utc | 225

So (if anyone is interested, and I doubt it) this all starts with Karl posting Lavrov’s comments @ karlof1 | Jan 18 2024 16:40 utc | 2
on – Open (Neither Ukraine Nor Palestine) Thread 2024-019
Later:

“His latest major speech was soft in that sense, but the emphasis on who would be allowed to join in Humanity’s shared future didn’t include the West as its behavior disqualifies it.”
Wang Yi’s 9 January speech is here.
https://karlof1.substack.com/p/xi-jinping-and-wang-yi-new-year-addresses
@ karlof1 | Jan 19 2024 2:05 utc | 108

OK so I have read Wang Yi is China’s Foreign Minister, and earlier today he was at the 2023 International Situation and China’s Diplomacy Symposium where he delivered a speech reviewing China’s diplomacy for 2023.
Wang says:

“These six highlights have left behind wonderful moments of China’s diplomacy, written a new chapter of win-win cooperation with the world, embodied distinctive Chinese characteristics, Chinese style and Chinese style, and demonstrated China’s increasing international influence, innovation leadership and moral appeal in the new era.”

All excellent achievements imo.
Wang goes on to say (according to the translation provided):

“The China-EU Comprehensive Strategic Partnership has gone through 20 years. In the past year, President Xi Jinping has had in-depth communication with leaders of many European countries and EU institutions such as France and Germany, and high-level dialogues in the fields of strategy, economy and trade, green and digital have achieved fruitful results. China-EU relations are not targeted, dependent on, or controlled by any third party, and if China and the EU join hands, bloc confrontation will not be fought, and a “new Cold War” will not be fought.
China-Australia relations are back on track, and the comprehensive strategic partnership between the two countries has regrouped and set off again, presenting a virtuous circle of healthy and stable development. The leaders of China and Japan affirmed that they are willing to comprehensively promote a mutually beneficial strategic relationship, properly address existing problems, and build a constructive and stable China-Japan relationship that meets the requirements of the new era.”

All are western nations afaik.
After discussing US relations, Wang states:

“We resolutely oppose geopolitical coteries and destabilizing cliques, and are committed to building a new type of international relations and consolidating and expanding global partnerships.”

Nothing new there.
Reemphasizes that China:

“We firmly unite with the Global South and share a common destiny with developing countries.” […] and “Modernization should not belong only to a few countries and a few people, but to all countries and all people.” .

For all the Anti-Globalists on this Forum there was this from Wang:

“China believes that the process of globalization is irreversible and that the sea of the world economy cannot retreat into isolated lakes. “

Wang states forcefully that:

“We resolutely oppose hegemonism and power politics, resolutely resist the monopoly of international affairs by a few countries, call for greater representation and voice of developing countries in the global governance system, support the priority of addressing historical injustices against African countries, urge the lifting of all illegally imposed unilateral sanctions, firmly safeguard the common and legitimate rights and interests of developing countries, and promote the development of the international order in a more just and equitable direction.
Defying power and defending justice is, of course, also reflected in safeguarding China’s national sovereignty, national dignity and territorial integrity.”

On the only mention of the GSI Wang says:

” We will fully implement the Global Security Initiative, adhere to fairness and justice, actively promote peace talks, constructively participate in the resolution of global and regional hotspots such as the Palestinian-Israeli conflict and the Ukraine crisis, put forward more Chinese proposals, contribute more Chinese wisdom, and provide more public goods conducive to world peace and development.”

So the question that arises is this:
Where does Wang Yi ever, say anything like, Karl suggests:
“His latest major speech was soft in that sense, but the emphasis on who would be allowed to join in Humanity’s shared future didn’t include the West as its behavior disqualifies it.” – ???
For I cannot find it anywhere in the Text. Can you? Maybe I missed it.
LD

Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Jan 20 2024 1:05 utc | 227

by canuck | Jan 20 2024 0:48 utc | 225
To me it looks like the whole world is waiting what is in the chamber under the left paw of the Sphinx, but nothing is happening.
Sphinx is very old, even before the pyramids. It is known by syncing the ancient sky to a position and the direction.
Aside of what you rightly say. A legend tells us, that the keyhole is behind the right ear.

Posted by: whirlX | Jan 20 2024 1:06 utc | 229

Lavrov’s Dog | Jan 20 2024 1:05 utc | 228
Your life is your problem.
Why do you engage in antagonism by others?
If you feel right, why so much bad mouth?

Posted by: Filemon | Jan 20 2024 1:12 utc | 231

Lavrov’s Dog | Jan 19 2024 23:41 utc | 214–
The last sentence in point #3:
The Cold War mentality, unilateralism, bloc confrontation and hegemonism contradict the spirit of the UN Charter and must be resisted and rejected.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jan 20 2024 1:13 utc | 233

Scorpion | Jan 20 2024 1:14 utc | 235 “OOOh!…”
So much of your thinking is adolescent girl level. My sister said to me she makes decisions based on emotions. Facts have no meaning to her.
Another common trait amongst many here is I think pure westphalian ignorance of other non westphalian peoples – y’know, the savages that inhabit Borrels jungle – but the ignorant emotional driven thinking that all leaderships are the same psychopaths as the Westphalia leadership circles.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jan 20 2024 1:23 utc | 235

Lavrov’s Dog | Jan 20 2024 0:19 utc | 219–
I’ve been writing here for 10+ years and have explained my Outlaw US Empire concept at least once in every one of those years. At my substack that you cited, that refers to MY appraisal and use of that term having been formulated then.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jan 20 2024 1:34 utc | 237

canuck@109
Geologists are more purely scientific (as against scientistic) than the archaeologists. Once the desert sands were carted away from the base of the Sphinx; discoveries were made. All sides of the question agreed that the erosion of that base was definitely caused by long immersion in WATER. As diligent in their science, most, if not all geologists are schooled in testing by means of chemical analysis. When they subjected the samples of the limestone which they tested, all those samples revealed that the erosion factor was due to FRESH and not to salt water.
Long immersion in fresh water? How could that be. Here’s the leap, the retroprojective reality test, which the academicist archeologists refuse to recognize; indicates that the most pressing probability for that phenomenon would have been a worldwide effusion of glacial meltwater in the northern hemisphere, most probably the result of a massive bolt from the blue during the Younger Dryas era; a strike which most logically occurred in the region of Hudson’s Bay and the Canadian islands of the Nunuvut lands.
Beginning with Ignatious Donnelly’s “Atlantis, the Ante-Deluvian World” and thenceforth graduating in the mid 20th Century’s works by Emanuel Velikovsky: “Worlds in Collision” and “Earth in Chaos” and more recently to be discovered in the several works of Graham Hancock; the academically and progressivist ideology of a mere 6,000 years of human civilization is at long last beginning to be seriously questioned by those who seek the holy grail of true history.
Materialistic and reductionist ideologies are rapidly going on the defensive, due ultimately to the timelines of great historical cosmic cyclicality, as originally proposed and developed , so far as we have yet learned, by Vedic philosophers who were highly observant of the heavens, most particularly of the precession of the equinoxes. Their conclusions leading to the theories they propounded were based on generations of careful and diligent observation.
A genuinely scientific perspective is foundationed upon maintaining an open mind and not getting bogged down in the many diversions and deviations characteristic of the Kali Yuga, an Epoch which currently recessional.

Posted by: aristodemos | Jan 20 2024 1:51 utc | 239

Filemon | Jan 20 2024 1:50 utc | 239
Denk has been around awhile. Disregard the style. Hes very good on Asia China. Scorpian et al are not.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jan 20 2024 1:55 utc | 241

aristodemos | Jan 20 2024 1:51 utc | 240
Until around six thousand years ago, the Sahara was savanna land. The area has obviously had much higher average rainfall in the past.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jan 20 2024 2:03 utc | 243

Scorpion does not deserve treated as a bitch. Period. He has wrote different opinions as All we have made. Respect.
Are we trying to make of him a scapegoat?
Fuck off!

Posted by: Filemon | Jan 20 2024 2:08 utc | 245

pop

China is anti religions
CPC used brutal police tactics to intimidate its citizens
denk is a frequent liar

Not a single evidence presented .
Who’s the serial lying pos here ?
Here’s more.

Im not championing TW independence, just wondering why they cant enjoy the right to self determination, like Donbass.

More lie.
The pop more than wondered about TW, he declared China’s claim to TW NULL and void, the Chinese are total hypocrites in his
debut , 2022
If the pop is a equal opportunity cynic, [sic], how come he never ‘wonder’ about the plight of Chagosians, for a start.
Now thats classic ethnic cleansing…

Cutting off water and electricity supply, gassing the islanders pet dogs , force them outta their ancestral homes to made way for a FUKUS military base.

If the pop is such a equal opportunity cynic, How come he never once wondered about the west’s total impunity from international law. ?
Exhibit A
I seem to remember FUKUS gave ICJ the finger when the latter declared Diego Garcia an illegit property
You and your ilks decry Israel teflon country.
Well Tel Aviv at least senD their man to stand trial at ICJ, tHats’ more than one can say about the total hypocrites in whasington/London, and their apologist here, the pop.
PS
filemon
The pop is playing dumb here,
How about you reply on his behalf or…FUCK OFF

Posted by: denk | Jan 20 2024 2:29 utc | 247

https://letter.palladiummag.com/p/how-late-zhou-china-reverse-engineered
For those interested in older civilizations, this one about the period around -300 BC especially. Of course that is not as ancient as some discussed here today, but interestingly it is a period after many centuries of decline/corruption during which some sort of reformation had to be undertaken, something the West will soon have to get into (hopefully).

Like material technologies, people can develop social technologies to facilitate the flourishing of society and its people. One might naturally wonder whether great social technology has ever been lost. Just as material technologies like the Antikythera mechanism can be forgotten or destroyed, are some social technologies lost to history?
Ancient China may be one such case—specifically the Shang and Early Zhou dynasties, from roughly 1600 BC to 800 BC. That era met its end as relevant knowledge on how to govern the country was corrupted and lost during the Later Zhou dynasty. With the knowledge fragmented and missing, societal decay ensued. The Warring States Period, which extended from the 5th century to the 3rd century BC, was a chaotic era which resulted from the disrepair and malfunction of this social technology. This spurred the era’s leading thinkers to recognize what was happening, albeit quite late in the process, when it was too late in many ways.
However, that these thinkers recognized what was happening at all is important and noteworthy. The blatant decline of the late Roman Empire did not lead its great thinkers to do the same. The insights and debates of the Later Zhou dynasty about the social technologies behind civilization are worth studying to apply to our own era.
What to Do When Civilization Is Breaking Down
The major figures of China’s intellectual renewal came to define the famous Hundred Schools of Thought. China was unusually sophisticated when compared to the other great powers of the era….

Posted by: Scorpion | Jan 20 2024 2:36 utc | 249

fyi
Adios and good riddance to the wicked USA rules-based international order, which was never written down nor ever agreed upon by the global community of nation-states, and which has been imposed upon them by the imperialist powers of the USA, UK and Nato et. al.
we are far more advanced towards another form of world order largely freed of imperialism, financialized economies, and neo-colonialism than almost any Western analysts are aware; not surprising given how blinded and incorrect all their analyses have been regarding the strengths and abilities of Russia, China, South Africa, Iran and others, many of whom have resisted Western domination for decades…
https://strategic-culture.su/news/2024/01/19/gaza-and-yemen-sound-death-knell-for-us-led-rules-based-global-order/
Gaza, Yemen & Ukraine Sound Death Knell for U.S.-Led ‘Rules-Based Global Order’
“….The irony is that the threats and chaos that these political charlatans adduce are largely the result of Western lawlessness, as evidenced by their de facto support for the genocide in Gaza and the relentless funding of a Neo-Nazi regime in Ukraine to provoke Russia. For decades, the Western powers have gotten away with mass murder, illegal wars, and global vandalism. The difference now is that a convergence of crises has exposed their malevolence and machinations.
The slaughter in Gaza has exceeded 100 days and the death toll is approaching 30,000. It is the most transparent genocide in history, as Richard Falk deplores. And, what is more, the United States and its European allies are fully complicit in the shocking crimes committed by the Israeli regime…..
Indeed, when South Africa presented its charges of genocide against Israel at the United Nations International Court of Justice at the Hague last week, it was apparent to the world that the U.S., Britain, and other European powers were de facto in the dock as well over their complicity…..
The world has reached a point of no return. The fraud of Western powers is spectacularly exposed and has become untenable. The Western imperial facade is imploding from its inherent corruption. It is a perilous time but the harsh truth can set the world free of hegemony and the systemic violence of Western elitist power.”

Posted by: michaelj72 | Jan 20 2024 2:53 utc | 251

@ karlof1 | Jan 20 2024 1:13 utc | 234 The last sentence in point #3:
The Cold War mentality, unilateralism, bloc confrontation and hegemonism contradict the spirit of the UN Charter and must be resisted and rejected.

Which you assert means:
” but the emphasis on who would be allowed to join in Humanity’s shared future didn’t include the West as its behavior disqualifies it.” @ substack and
@ karlof1 | Jan 19 2024 2:05 utc | 108
And I say to you, I do not agree. I say you are wrong. I say you are overstating it, and exaggerating what it means. I say you are in fact putting words into Wang Yi’s mouth (aka Strawman). I ‘resolutely’ suggest you not do that. My comment @ Lavrov’s Dog | Jan 20 2024 1:05 utc | 228 was my effort to indicate why you should not do that. Unfortunately you have doubled down and rejected my input outright.
That’s your choice.
Now, I quite like the phrase “Outlaw US Empire” idea, and have reused it myself copiously; though personally I much prefer The Outlaw US Empire of Lies!
However that idea, that text, does NOT equal what Lavrov said:

“”Since the adoption of the Charter in 1945, not a single foreign policy action of the West in the international arena has taken into account or respected the principle (as stated in the Charter)….. ”
@ karlof1 | Jan 18 2024 16:40 utc | 2

Because, I say again, that statement is not true, it is false.
And it begs the question why have we been kept waiting 80 years to hear it, when PUTIN wanted Russia to join NATO in the early 2000s, and the rest of history since 1945 that directly conflicts with that statement? (smiling)
I am calling Lavrov out for that, and you for agreeing with him. I disagree with you both and said so here. You have gone off and written new substack article about this and copied the text here as well. Over-reaction much. That’s your choice. 🙂
However what Lavrov says here, I find totally acceptable and true:
““The West cannot be trusted. Even now, it wants only one thing – to live at the expense of others and to be more clever than others.”” RT
https://www.swentr.site/russia/590896-russia-cant-trust-west-lavrov/
I suspect the Chinese think the same, but they have not said it. I hope that is all clear as day now. 🙂

I’ve been writing here for 10+ years and have explained my Outlaw US Empire concept at least once in every one of those years. At my substack that you cited, that refers to MY appraisal and use of that term having been formulated then.
Posted by: karlof1 | Jan 20 2024 1:34 utc | 238

Is it Trademarked Karl? Calm down and get a grip mate. You are not Vladimir Putin. :-/

Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Jan 20 2024 2:55 utc | 253

The details matter. Words matter.
repost from @ Lavrov’s Dog | Jan 20 2024 0:19 utc | 219 for Karl
So is it?
“the outlaw nature of the USA was formulated in the mid-1980s”
https://karlof1.substack.com/p/commentary-on-a-few-lavrov-points
Or is it?
“they’ve been serial outlaws for almost 80 years and even longer before that ?
above @ karlof1 | Jan 19 2024 21:52 utc | 193
Maybe he missed it? 🙂

Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Jan 20 2024 3:04 utc | 255

Scorpion | Jan 20 2024 2:36 utc | 250
Human social structure… we are mammals so I look at what we are as mammals in the natural environment. Animals in the wild live in the natural environment and domesticated animals do not so some difference can be seen.
Different mammals have different social structures so we have look at what as primates is the natural human social structure. That can be seen in the hunter gather peoples.
Australian aboriginal people are a window into the far distant past, very conservative and little changed since they migrated here. Their society structure has all the essential basics many of which have been forgotten or discarded in the era of so called civilized world.
Here in the west, we are moving into the absolute madness of the woke, everything essential to the human social structure discarded. For an old and advanced civilization with high density population, China still has much of that.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jan 20 2024 3:11 utc | 257

Lavrov’s Dog | Jan 20 2024 3:08 utc | 257
“Because, I say again, that statement is not true, it is false. Lavrov just looks stupid and desperate making untrue statements like that.”
What a dog you are, totally disloyal. Waf, waf, wef, WEF is you true master.

Posted by: Antonym | Jan 20 2024 3:20 utc | 259

Filemon | Jan 20 2024 3:15 utc | 259
regarding Denk jumping on Scorpion: “If not, I can’t understand your obsession.”
Not despéchate girlfriend; $ 0.50 is a lot of money these days in the cash strapped PRC!
By the way, how about a new “One Taiwan policy”? Reunite the Western provinces with the original, legitimate and democratic Republic Of China!

Posted by: Antonym | Jan 20 2024 3:26 utc | 261

Posted by: Scorpion | Jan 20 2024 3:31 utc | 263
———————-
So IM a ‘her’, are u a MCP ?
Still no proof of his accusations.
More ad hominence.
i’LL let the reader to judge for themselves, who’s the serial lying pos ?

Posted by: denk | Jan 20 2024 3:42 utc | 263

Pop says
“Im not championing TW independence, just wondering why they cant enjoy the right to self determination, like Donbass.”
@ denk | Jan 20 2024 2:29 utc | 248 (because I dont read Pop.)
Not sure why this is even a question or an issue.
TW can enjoy their right to self determination, like Donbass. They can Vote for Independence from China anytime they want. They can self-declare themselves as a nation anytime they want to. I assume so long as there is a (super) majority of Taiwanese who affirm that, and are willing to stand up for it.
They can call their new nation state anything they choose…. they can write their own new constitution as well… all things being equal.
And then all the other nations get a choice of whether or not they want to recognize them as an independent state. That’s their own choice for self-determination too. The TW people cannot force other nations what they choose to do.
The same way the Confederate States of the US South was able to enjoy their right to self determination, long before the UN or Ukraine was created out of nothing.
The same as the majority of the Donbass made their choice in free and fair votes to self-declare their Republic in 2014, so can the Taiwanese people do the same.
No one is stopping them, except themselves.
So Taiwanese people go ahead — assert your self-determination anytime you wish. 🙂

Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Jan 20 2024 3:51 utc | 265

The facts are this: The Taiwanese people have been self-determining their existence since 1945 after the Japanese left and the defeated KMT civil war army arrived.
How is this in any way controversial?
btw listened to a BBC radio show last night with several Taiwanese commentators, all women. Most of them sounded somewhat schizophrenic (split) about their identity of who they were. Chinese or not Chinese. IT was really enlightening actually (as a mere anecdote of course.) They were all internally conflicted people. No wonder they cannot make up their mind as a distinct group of people on an island.

Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Jan 20 2024 3:59 utc | 267

@ denk | Jan 20 2024 4:00 utc | 269
Yes.
And unlike Donetsk City, Taipei is not being shelled every day by ethnic cleansing genocidal racist Neo-Nazis.
But give it time. Who knows what the Outlaw US Empire of Lies might decide to do in the future. (smile)

Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Jan 20 2024 4:09 utc | 269

denk | Jan 20 2024 4:00 utc | 269
Top work denk. The dog raised his colors with the 270.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jan 20 2024 4:27 utc | 271

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jan 20 2024 4:27 utc | 272
—————
Nice to see you back in form,
Take care
Signing off

Posted by: denk | Jan 20 2024 4:37 utc | 273

” The precision required is in the maths as gear ratios are the secret to the gadget. To convert the solar system to gear ratios, mathematics is required. A good craftsman can then achieve the rest. Some gears are I believe elliptical to mimic rotational speed of an elliptical orbit. Modern machining is not required. It is a highly complex mechanism for the day but that is in the number of parts and the gear ratios.
Off memory the gear teeth are simple triangles rather than the gear teeth of today. Very easy to cut with a file.
Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jan 19 2024 22:16 utc | 198 ‘
Thats alot for alot of words which tell me you didn’t watch the video and failed to grasp the time period and technology available during that time. Additionally, anyone who studies these things doesnt come to certain conclusions just based on a single object but a whole plethora of evidence. Watch the Egyptian vase video and come and tell me how they were made. Then we’ll talk.

Posted by: Moonie | Jan 20 2024 5:27 utc | 275

Filemon | Jan 20 2024 1:50 utc | 239
Denk has been around awhile. Disregard the style. Hes very good on Asia China. Scorpian et al are not.
Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jan 20 2024 1:55 utc | 242
Absolutely correct Peter.
Denk’s style is a bit difficult at times but he’s right on.
Criticism of his style is a cowardly way to avoid the reality Denk brings.

Posted by: waynorinorway | Jan 20 2024 5:51 utc | 277

The Māori Liberation Army ( Māori King Movement ) is currently having having ‘emergency’ meetings in Aotearoa . The Outlaws , In-laws , are about to get a nose bleed which might embarrass the cyclops of five eyes . The indigenous are not taking kindly to the treaty getting torn up by wranglers . Divide and conquer won’t work on this mob . Negotiate or start packing to go to Australia !

Posted by: Paleologos | Jan 20 2024 6:16 utc | 279

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jan 20 2024 1:23 utc | 236
It’s possible that I misread, but your use of the qualificative “Westphalian” seems to me wrong and misleading. Quote from Wikipedia:
“Westphalian sovereignty, or state sovereignty, is a principle in international law that each state has exclusive sovereignty over its territory. The principle underlies the modern international system of sovereign states and is enshrined in the United Nations Charter…”
So, it’s obvious that Putin and Xi are the champions of the Westphalian order; and the Collective West its adversary.

Posted by: Alberto | Jan 20 2024 7:55 utc | 281

Posted by: Alberto | Jan 20 2024 8:13 utc | 283
Still, to my understanding:
ICJ, International Law: Westphalian;
ICC, Rule based order: non-Westphalian.

Posted by: Alberto | Jan 20 2024 8:25 utc | 283

Alberto | Jan 20 2024 7:55 utc | 282
You used the term ‘Collective West’. But the ‘west’. Used often, loosely or undefined. The west are all the countries involved in the treaties of Westphalia. The Holy Roman Empire… orthodox, Muslims ect not included in the ‘West’

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jan 20 2024 8:36 utc | 285

Alberto
Protestants are a breakaway from the Church of Rome. The treaties of Westphalia ended the thirty year war between the Protestants and the Catholics. Not sure what to term the probably the Balkans was part of the Ottoman empire at that time. I’m not sure of the flavour of religion of all those countries but Greece is orthodox as is Serbia. So I guess that part of Europe could come under the term Collective west, But the core of the west is the catholic and protestant countries that attended those negotiations. US I guess is a bit of a black sheep in this regard but Canada Australia NZ colonies all still have the Monarch of England or the office of the Monarch of England as head of state so all of five-eyes is part of the core west.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jan 20 2024 8:59 utc | 287

Leon Simons: “Aerosol Demasking & Global Heating”
https://www.thegreatsimplification.com/episode/105-leon-simons
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RPAnoSt6FnY
https://nitter.net/LeonSimons8
Global Warming Acceleration: Causes and Consequences
12 January 2024
James Hansen, Makiko Sato, Reto Ruedy
http://www.columbia.edu/~jeh1/mailings/2024/AnnualT2023.2024.01.12.pdf
2021 – Satellite and Ocean Data Reveal Marked Increase in Earth’s Heating Rate
https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1029/2021GL093047

Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Jan 20 2024 9:50 utc | 289

Alberto | Jan 20 2024 9:14 utc | 289
Regardless of anything else he was, Kissinger was a top strategist. He often used the term Westphalia. Borrel used the term -The garden and the Jungle. Your description may be ok for abstract theory but looking at the Garden and how the elites of the garden view the savages of the jungle, my take on it is the actual working definition. Regardless of the pretty words in the treaties.
It is like the US declaring a war on terror and always referring to it as a war on terror when practice, it was a war of terror.
Borrels garden is the Holy Roman Empire of the treaties of westphalia. We see it in Ukraine where the Church of Rome meets the Church of Constantinople – catholic west orthodox east and the burning of orthodox churches.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jan 20 2024 9:53 utc | 291

The mindset of the elite within Borrels garden.
Victor vicktop55
@vicktop55
Macron’s Napoleonic plans – NATO from the EU’s eastern border to the Caucasus and Central Asia. Won’t your face crack, Macron?
Macron: “We can’t let Russia think that it can win. What awaits us the next day, Europeans? I said from the very beginning that we are not at war with Russia, but our duty is to make its victory impossible. A Russian victory would mean the end of European security. This will be the end of a possible security architecture in Europe from the eastern border of the EU and NATO to the Caucasus and Central Asia. That is why we will continue to support Ukrainians. We will do this pragmatically and specifically, while continuing to train and equip them in critical areas such as artillery, air defense and long-range strike. We will also innovate to address the challenges posed by the widespread use of drones.”
………………
This is the mind set of the elite of the group of nations that gathered to negotiate the treaties of westphalia.
What we are seeing now, mindset of the European elite is rooted in history. Borrels garden and the jungle. A very blatant and in your face reminder of that. The culture, the historical racism and bias and hatreds of the elite is quite different to that of the average people in these countries, although there is always an underlying racism towards people/cultures outside this grouping.
Perhaps another term could be used for this core group of nations, but as the gathering for the treaties denotes who they are, westphalia is a good name for for the core group of this vague term “The West”. The collective west being the addons, plugins, possessions of this group.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jan 20 2024 10:58 utc | 293

This piece from Macron I quoted in my previous comment –

Macron: “We can’t let Russia think that it can win. What awaits us the next day, Europeans? I said from the very beginning that we are not at war with Russia, but our duty is to make its victory impossible. A Russian victory would mean the end of European security. This will be the end of a possible security architecture in Europe from the eastern border of the EU and NATO to the Caucasus and Central Asia. That is why we will continue to support Ukrainians. We will do this pragmatically and specifically, while continuing to train and equip them in critical areas such as artillery, air defense and long-range strike. We will also innovate to address the challenges posed by the widespread use of drones.”

His crap about the security architecture and how Europe will lose its security if Russia wins. The utter hypocrisy after rejecting any mutual security treaty with Moscow. They thought they could defeat Moscow therefore eliminating the need for mutual security.
It was plain from the moment Nato rejected mutual security after Putin’s warning that if there was no agreement then Russia would use military technical means to achieve its own security at the expense of the gardens security.
Now the clowns are going to double down.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jan 20 2024 11:41 utc | 295

Have been thinking about the elliptical gears in the ancient gizmo from the shipwreck that was designed to represent the solar system.
Those ancient mathematicians understood angular velocity and how speed of rotation increases when an elliptical orbit is at its narrowest and increased when at it its longest, which occurs when the velocity of the orbiting body remains constant.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jan 20 2024 13:07 utc | 297

https://nitter.net/thesiriusreport/status/1748605049024979114#m
The Sirius Report
@thesiriusreport
5h
It appears people genuinely believe that comments about NATO apparently warning of an all out war with Russia in 20 years is a reality:
It’s utter nonsense and is purely rhetoric to ensure the masses continue to support the belief that Russia is the bogeyman. We must defend ourselves and spend huge sums of money on defence in doing so.
When we finally have to admit Russia has defeated Ukraine, but we won’t say that, you will continue to support NATO and our defence of you against Russian aggression.
We are also fearful that you might elect governments who will seek to leave NATO and build bridges with Russia. So we have to try and stop that by making you all believe Russia is the enemy.
It’s not rocket science what is going on. It is a mythical threat to lead you by the nose. Stop falling for this nonsense. It is embarrassing.

Posted by: MD | Jan 20 2024 13:08 utc | 299