Palestine Open Thread 2023-322
Only for news & views directly related to the war in Palestine.
The current open thread for other issues is here.
Please stick to the topic. Contribute facts. Do not attack other commentators.
Posted by b on December 30, 2023 at 15:41 UTC | Permalink
next page »I don't know if it is a consolation to anyone but the US did have a successful military campaign in Grenada in 1983.
Posted by: Jonathan W | Dec 30 2023 16:11 utc | 2
Re: Yamashita Standard and Command Responsibility
The South African filing at the ICJ specifically referenced command resposbilty . The exact wording of the SA filing is;
Israel has "failed to prevent genocide and has failed to prosecute the direct and public incitement to genocide".
This is a significant accusation because the standard of responsibility required by military and civilian leaders is strict. The exact language of the Geneva Convention section relating to command responsibility is:
the fact that a breach of the Conventions or of this Protocol was committed by a subordinate does not absolve his superiors from ... responsibility ... if they knew, or had information which should have enabled them to conclude in the circumstances at the time, that he was committing or about to commit such a breach, and if they did not take all feasible measures within their power to prevent or repress the breach.
Therefore, in the execution of military operations, Article 86(2) obligates a commanding officer to "prevent, and, where necessary, to suppress and report to competent authorities" any violation of the Geneva Conventions ( from wiki ).
The South African Lawsuit casts a wide net. Arguably, civilian officials such as Blinken could be held accountable for delivering weapons…..
Posted by: Exile | Dec 30 2023 16:11 utc | 3
Posted by: Exile | Dec 30 2023 16:11 utc | 4
A concept used a lot in the Yugoslavia tribunal was "aid and abet". Which is what the US is doing.
Posted by: Jonathan W | Dec 30 2023 16:14 utc | 4
Posted by: Jonathan W | Dec 30 2023 16:11 utc | 3
I've often argue that the US should simply restage that War every year, with costumed actors and no fatalities, in order to remind itself of its glorious military record, instead of invading new countries. it could help the economy of Grenada, and think of the relief in other countries across the globe. The people who already like reenact the Civil War could latch onto it, spending money in local hotels and restaurants. It would be a win win situation for everybody.
Posted by: pretzelattack | Dec 30 2023 16:20 utc | 5
RE: Posted by: g | Dec 30 2023 16:08 utc | 1
…sure…***yawn***
Posted by: Trubind1 | Dec 30 2023 16:22 utc | 6
A twitter with a Guardian article-link of what to expect in Gaza from Prof.Devi Sridhar, Edingburgh Univesity
https://twitter.com/devisridhar/status/1740834350458089974
"We could see almost a quarter of Gaza’s population - close to half- a million human beings - dying within a year. Largely deaths from preventable health causes & collapse of the medical system. It’s a crude estimate, but one that is data-driven…"
Posted by: Poul | Dec 30 2023 16:25 utc | 7
@ “I don't know if it is a consolation to anyone but the US did have a successful military campaign in Grenada in 1983.
Posted by: Jonathan W | Dec 30 2023 16:11 utc | 3 “
Lol that was Clint Eastwood who won that all by his own self ! Before ridding off into the sunset …
Posted by: DunGroanin | Dec 30 2023 16:25 utc | 8
I give you Barfs the Archetype of Alchemical Reversal of Five! 🌟
Yes, they are high on the fumes of their foul dialectic!
They ramp up the 🔥, accelerate the progress.
But like imperfect combustion, they F*
Yeah,black smoke, soot, smut. Yeah they pushed it to far. In the imortal words of Scotty " She canee take any more captain!"
Yet they proceed.
They all participate in the game. They know it's the only game in town. The only question is" what are our options here"?
Space race. Cold War. War.
But we got Teflon and ballpoint pens right? Just a token of accelerated progress.
Now, for 2024, GET YOUR HEADS DOWN AND RESOLVE THOSE CONTRADICTIONS!
Happy New Year
Posted by: FuturePeaceGonzo | Dec 30 2023 16:28 utc | 9
The IDF reported to have found over 65 million digital files and half a million physical documents inside Gaza, which contained useful intelligence aiding in the battle against Hamas, and especially in locating the tunnels. In one case, a map was found in Beit Hanoun, in the home of a Hamas commander, and the legend to the map was found in the home of a different Hamas terrorist. The map led IDF forces to many tunnel shafts, which they then cleared and destroyed. Other such maps and intelligence materials led to the hiding spots of significant ammunition and explosives.
Posted by: g | Dec 30 2023 16:08 utc | 1
SURGICAL PRECISION FROM A TO Z. I AM IMPRESSED.
Posted by: Jonathan W | Dec 30 2023 16:29 utc | 10
Re: who started the 1948 War ?
Israeli Massacre of Deir Yassin was in April
The Arab Armies marched in May
Posted by: Exile | Dec 30 2023 16:32 utc | 11
"The IDF reported to have found over 65 million digital files which contained useful intelligence aiding in the battle against Hamas, and the Hezbollah fired over 50 rockets in the North on Kiryat Shemona and the surrounding area.
Posted by: g | Dec 30 2023 16:08 utc | 1
Has the IDF managed to recover the servers and drives HAMAS captured on 7 October?
Perhaps this "useful intelligence" the IDF (re)captured are the very same.
Of course, by now all ghost-copied and shipped to Iranian Intelligence for analysis ...
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Dec 30 2023 16:37 utc | 12
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Dec 30 2023 16:37 utc | 14
You are such a bore Arch. Can't you hear how excited we are that Israel is achieving its goals after it found that map?
Posted by: Jonathan W | Dec 30 2023 16:41 utc | 13
the conspicuous lack of genuine support for Hamas from Arab leaders
____
. . . most of them bought and paid for by the USA.
Posted by: malenkov | Dec 30 2023 16:43 utc | 14
Posted by: g | Dec 30 2023 16:08 utc | 1
#################
Remember when the IOF staged a hospital for the cameras after attacking it?
What matters is what is happening on the ground, not propaganda statements.
Hamas continues to erode racial supremacist forces, and Hezbollah is getting closer to capturing Northern Israel.
The Israeli economy is in tatters, and Israel has become a global pariah state outside of the colonial degenerate West. That's what happens when you perpetrate a genocide that the world can see via the internet.
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Dec 30 2023 16:44 utc | 15
Note to Self:
The next time a Western talking head mentions the disappearance of Russian journalists under 'The Putin Regime' (or any other) tell them to bugger themselves with a cactus:
The most lethal place for journalists by far this year was Gaza, where at least 13 journalists were killed while actively covering the war, according to the RSF’s annual report published on Thursday. The total number of journalists killed in Gaza – irrespective of the line of their work – was 56, RSF said.
If even one of these journalists had been an anti-Putin Russian the entire West and it's legion of NGO/NPO puppet instances would have been screaming blue murder and holding black candlelight vigils for months on end ...
But 56 Palestinians journalists? Some murdered effectively live on t.v?
Crickets.
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Dec 30 2023 16:44 utc | 16
"Gaza had the potential to be a mini Arabian Singapore - now it’s just a bombed out over-glorified wasteland - and it’s all the fault of Hamas."
THIS IS GOOD STUFF!
Posted by: Jonahan W | Dec 30 2023 16:45 utc | 17
Hamas raped and executed a 13 year old Jewish girl.
If you support Hamas you support pedophile rapists.
Posted by: g | Dec 30 2023 16:42 utc | 16
###################
It's much more likely that the IDF raped and executed that girl.
We've already seen that Israeli troops have no compunctions about killing their citizens.
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Dec 30 2023 16:51 utc | 18
Meditation #1:
If Gaza's HAMAS tunnel network is so extensive, how much more extensive are the tunnels of Lebanon's Hezballah?
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Dec 30 2023 16:52 utc | 19
Celebrating tunnel crap bullshit, interesting concept, really pathetic though.....thank God for Freud.....just need Bibi, grandson's drawing in hand, mugging to a camera, "look, Hamas is days away from developing the Mother of All Tunnels."
Cheers M
Posted by: sean the leprechaun | Dec 30 2023 16:54 utc | 20
The IDF raped and executed a 13 year old Jewish girl.
If you support IDF you support pedophile rapists.
.
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If IDF did to America what they did to Israel, Izzrael would be a parking lot right now being bid on by investors and the vast majority of the American population would celebrate the dropping of each bomb -- the international community be damned.
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The faster IDF surrenders, the more lives can be saved.
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A Palestinian woman got arrested in the West Bank for praising Hamas on facebook.
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IDF are monsters and needs to be vanquished. At the same time, Netanyahu is also a monster and needs to go.
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Every single IDF soldier who is killed becomes a "civilian" when reported as propaganda by the Izzrael Ministry - which is of course IDF. In reality many more than 8,000 of those killed were IDF combatants.
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It was always up to IDF to create peace. They established the monopoly on violence inside Izzrael. They could have eliminated Likud Extremeists and rooted out Zionist agitators, and then directed aid to tear down the machinery of occupation. They could have worked with HAMAS after the first elections to build trust and security. The border walls could have come down in time. But instead IDF chose to use Izzrael as a forward operating base for a racist Jewish war of Palestinian annihilation - and now they're crying about the consequences. Izzrael could have been a thriving city state with full employment. Now it's a bomb crater filled with white Jewish crackers. That's on them. What did they think would happen?
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Gaza the potential to be a mini Arabian Singapore - now it’s just a bombed out over-glorified wasteland - and it’s all the fault of IDF.
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If you add the 15 years of misery IDF siege of GAZA to the 10 years of misery coming while the strip is rebuilt, IDF will have robbed an entire generation of Palestinians of their lives. 25 years of wasted misery for the living, and thousands of dead.
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The IDF raided Palestinian money changes in the West Bank. Every IDF leader is living on borrowed time.
Posted by: g | Dec 30 2023 16:42 utc | 16
There, fixed it for you.
Before it was fuxxed.
Now it's fixxed,
you fuxxer.
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Dec 30 2023 17:03 utc | 21
1, does the bedwetting IDF actually think anyone but it's own partisans believe the lies they produce? The problem with using your state to cover industrial scale lying is that while it works for awhile, eventually noone believes anything you have to say. Israel has more than any nation in the modern era covered its hideous crimes with a wall of fabrication and deceit.
The stink of desperation is in the air as Israeli cowards are failing to slaughter enough children to meet their satanic leaders goal, while the paper thin lies Israel has used to justify its fascist oppression of Palestinians are being discredited in front of the entire world. There is no going back now that Israel has implemented its own holocaust while making false apologies for it.
Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Dec 30 2023 17:07 utc | 22
g.@1608
Only $hitheads and the terminally deluded describe Hamas as "terrorists". How do you plead?
Posted by: aristodemos | Dec 30 2023 17:10 utc | 23
Anyone know is Bibi‘s son is still living the high life in Miami or has he finally joined his IDF reserve unit on the front line ?
Posted by: Exile | Dec 30 2023 17:13 utc | 24
Gaza the potential to be a mini Arabian Singapore - now it’s just a bombed out over-glorified wasteland - and it’s all the fault of IDF
Posted by: g | Dec 30 2023 16:42 utc | 16
Note: Singapore became what it is because it realized it could never impose it's will on an Islamic majority (Malaysia) to it's left and an Islamic majority (Indonesia) to it's right and others like Brunei, Sarawak, Johor Baru or even South Islamic Thailand.
The Singaporean precursors asked merely for a tiny piece of land for their people, they asked NICELY, and they were granted it.
They built that piece of land, together with their own Islamic Malay population and Islamic Indonesian immigrants (among others) into a global force.
Being Asian, and not a bunch of Jewish crackerheads from Ukrainistan and other honkey backwaters, they immediately realized that cooperation with their Islamic neighbours was the only way forward.
They treated their Islamic neighbours with respect, and reaped the rewards of the good will of Muslims all across the region.
Not a single bullet was required.
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Dec 30 2023 17:13 utc | 25
g @1642
With all your pilpul and out and out garbage, it would seem that Unit 8200 is getting a bit desperate about the more than 3,000 IOF KIA casualties, along with at least 10,000 wounded and massive cohorts, such as the majority of the elite Golani Brigade currently and latterly suffering from PTSD. Suck it up, sukka.
Posted by: aristodemos | Dec 30 2023 17:18 utc | 26
To the Man defending JIF (jews in Palistine)
, If you were the best tree climber in the world I would have the right to point out that, no matter how competently you were doing it, in my opinion you were climbing the wrong tree.
The jews were a minority for 90% of the last 2000 years up to them being given part of Palestine unjustly by Britain. Since that time they stole, took by force, forced Palestinians out of their land up to the present where they have most of it , by no right except by violence. Therefore the Palestinians have the right and duty to push them back and recover their land. As time moves on and military might is levelled up by their neighbours who have the right also to nuclear armament just like Israel which cannot survive as a small postage stamp with a comparatively incompetent army and the USA, whose power is based largely on illusion and PR (wiich does not win wars) will not want to be dragged down or have a nuclear war over it. Even though they have infected the USA brain and control it.
Palestinians have a greater right to exist on this land than do the jews who arrived recently from Russia, Poland, Usa, etc,etc. When these jews pushed the Palestinians out , with no right of return, they did not care to where.. Similarly the Palestinians do not have to care where the jews go. They will be as nice, kind and merciful as the jews were to them. Crushing eight thousand children is worse swine than the Nazis and they are unfit to govern. Jews sing Psalm 136, third verse, ‘How happy we (the jews) will be when we smash their children’s heads on the rocks’. They must be very happy now in Gaza again today.
The adult solution is for these jewish squatters to talk to the owners of Palestine who may consent to some continued presence as rent paying citizens.
This is the tree you should climb. Not one of the millions of Olive trees the jews destroyed to ethnically clear Palestine.
Posted by: Boindub | Dec 30 2023 17:25 utc | 27
Posted by: Boindub | Dec 30 2023 17:25 utc | 30
Lifted to my notes, thank you!
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Dec 30 2023 17:28 utc | 28
Zionist barbarity in Gaza knows no bounds and in fact already exceeds the worst practices and atrocities of the Nazi genocide.
Over 1,000 Palestinian children have now had limbs amputated without anaesthetics. Zionist forces are stealing anaesthetics from the pitifully few aid lorries allowed through the main checkpoint.
Palestinian hostages rounded up by Zionist forces have been subjected to extreme brutality, starved and beaten for days and forced to sign ludicrous confessions. Old men, very young children have been the victims of this grisly farce. A distinguished surgeon was tortured and forced to confess to being a Hamas leader.
Rape and sexual assault are being practised on a large scale against both men and women as part of official policy to degrade and demoralise the civilian population, and not just as an expression of routine Zionist sadism.
Ghoulish Israeli body snatchers and organ traffickers are having a field day. Bodies of Palestinians are being stolen on a large scale for organ harvesting. Israel has long been the world centre of this illicit trade and the Gaza Genocide is a tremendous business opportunity for these people.
The Zionist Genocide is constantly testing the limits and finding ever greater depths to plumb.
Posted by: anon | Dec 30 2023 17:28 utc | 29
Gaza the potential to be a mini Arabian Singapore - now it’s just a bombed out over-glorified wasteland - and it’s all the fault of IDF
Posted by: g | Dec 30 2023 16:42 utc | 16
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Dec 30 2023 17:13 utc | 28
P.S:
The UAE is an "Arabian Singapore" - guess what?
Not a single Jewish settlement in the vicinity!
See what Arabs can do when they're not getting the land stolen from under their feet?
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Dec 30 2023 17:30 utc | 30
Being Asian, and not a bunch of Jewish crackerheads from Ukrainistan and other honkey backwaters, they immediately realized that cooperation with their Islamic neighbours was the only way forward.
They treated their Islamic neighbours with respect, and reaped the rewards of the good will of Muslims all across the region.
Not a single bullet was required.
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Dec 30 2023 17:13 utc | 28
This bit made me laugh. So, true. The Zionazi crackheads are so mentally unstable it's frightening. And the term honkey! Miss that one. Keep up the good, entertaining work AB.
I guess we didn't need Colin to keep the peace round here after all.
Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Dec 30 2023 17:36 utc | 31
Doctor admits Israeli pathologists harvested organs without consent
Ian Black, Middle East editor @ian_black
Mon 21 Dec 2009 10.10 EST
Israel has admitted pathologists harvested organs from dead Palestinians, and others, without the consent of their families - a practice it said ended in the 1990s - it emerged at the weekend.
10:53 AM • Nov 13,
Posted by: Exile | Dec 30 2023 17:37 utc | 32
A very good article:
https://www.middleeasteye.net/opinion/israel-war-on-gaza-encapsulates-entire-history-european-colonialism
A good illustration also from MEE today:
Israeli analyst Eliyahu Yossian said in an interview that Israel should level the ground in Gaza, and "kill as many as possible and spare no one".
He added: "The woman is an enemy, the baby is an enemy .. & the pregnant woman is an enemy."
Posted by: JB | Dec 30 2023 17:43 utc | 33
The New York Times has published another extensive “investigation” into alleged war crimes - this time on the presumed mass gang-rape spree on Oct 7. As with previous accounts of this allegation, there is no forensic evidence to back up the claims:
“Many people are looking for the golden evidence, of a woman who will testify about what happened to her. But don’t look for that, don’t put this pressure on this woman,” Orit Sulitzeanu, executive director of the Association of Rape Crisis Centers in Israel, told The Times. “The corpses tell the story.”…
Most of the dead were buried quickly to comply with Jewish religious rites. As a result, very few autopsies were completed following the massacre that left as many as 1,200 dead. Evidence of the sexual assaults is mostly in the form of witness testimony and photographs and video recovered from Hamas.”
The propaganda function of this alleged atrocity is obvious. Those inclined to support Israel will fervently believe this story, while others will be somewhat justifiably sceptical. Sceptics who speak out publicly on this issue will be loudly condemned as “rape apologists” and callous “terror supporters”.
https://nationalpost.com/news/world/israel-middle-east/new-details-hamass-sexual-violence-against-israeli-women
Posted by: jayc | Dec 30 2023 17:51 utc | 34
Decades on, Israel tries to bury its darkest times
The National – 22 March 2016
One might expect that only historians would care to revisit the 1948 war that created Israel. And yet the debate about what constitutes truth and myth from that period still provokes raw emotions…..
……That is why the unearthing of an Israeli soldier’s letter from 1948 detailing what was probably the war’s worst massacre – one long buried by Israel – is of more than historical significance…..
https://www.jonathan-cook.net/2016-03-22/decades-on-israel-tries-to-bury-its-darkest-times/
Posted by: Exile | Dec 30 2023 18:10 utc | 35
I don't know if it is a consolation to anyone but the US did have a successful military campaign in Grenada in 1983.
Posted by: Jonathan W | Dec 30 2023 16:11 utc | 3
Hey! Don't forget Panama!
Posted by: Honzo | Dec 30 2023 18:11 utc | 36
@37
It is not implausible that some rapes occurred. Invading troops have been known to do that. Such rapes are crimes for which the assailants bear responsibility.
But one can not decide which side of a conflict is right on the basis of rape. Thousands of Italian and German women were raped by allied soldiers from 1944 to 1945 but outside of Fascist propaganda, people do not conclude from that fact that historical justice was on the side of the Axis powers.
Posted by: Paul Cockshott | Dec 30 2023 18:12 utc | 37
Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Dec 30 2023 17:07 utc | 25
##################
Lying and deception seem to be part and parcel of Jewish culture.
Thus, everyone disbelieves everyone, while still feeling the tribal pressure to go along with the lies.
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Dec 30 2023 18:13 utc | 38
The war ends in one day if Hamas returns all hostages and lays down their arms. If Israel lays down their arms Israel would be destroyed.
Posted by: genocidal | Dec 30 2023 18:14 utc | 42
##############
I don't think you understand what is happening outside the Zionist media sphere.
Hamas is more popular around the world, and among Palestinians than ever before.
Israel doesn't need to lay down its arms to be destroyed. Its troops are not effective, its terror tactics don't work on people who are willing to be martyrs. Israel is a global pariah state now.
What Israel is doing is destroying its population, economy, and what little reputation it has managed to achieve through media and academic control in the West.
The Americans are not coming to save Israel. No one is coming to save Israel and Israel has shown a complete inability to save itself from its worst impulses and Zionist mental illness.
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Dec 30 2023 18:24 utc | 39
If any of the Hasbara posters here genuinely cared about and loved Israel, they would be agitating for recognition of a Palestinian state and a complete end to the violence.
Every day this goes on, Israel is getting closer and closer to its demise.
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Dec 30 2023 18:28 utc | 40
42
<>
—————
Israel’s survival is threatened by Israeli demographics… Regardless of how well armed Israel is, it is doomed… In addition, despite propaganda IDF is an incompetent military… Already, Israeli dual citizens are leaving in large numbers…. Expect Intel to cancel the plant it announced with much fanfare.
Posted by: Joseph B | Dec 30 2023 18:29 utc | 41
Slightly OT, but relevant:
What will the next dedicated open thread on MoA be about? This is not a facetious question, we are in the warm-up phase of WWIII, and it is going to spread, by one means or another.
I do not have a solid prediction at this point, but I believe two mechanisms will be in play- 1: perceptions by local actors that the time has come to boot their western overlords; and 2: the west taking actions to 'fortify' its current zones of control. I really doubt that anyone in the west wants to widen the Ukraine conflict itself into neighboring countries, or sacrifice its navy to annoy China about Taiwan. Neither of these are profit opportunities and the correlation of forces on those fronts favors the Axis of Resistance strongly.
There's a lot of talk about war with Iran, but from the hegemon's POV, this is a nonstarter- it would lead to the destruction of Israel, and all US bases in the region, at a minimum, the Gulf states would be unable to export oil, all producers within range of Iranian missiles would stop selling to the west, and it's very likely that the US would lose a lot of very expensive fleet assets.
My tendency is that the US will use as much 'war by other means' as possible, focused on the Western Hemisphere, where it is easiest for the US to project power and where Russian-made missile defense systems are in short supply, so that if the color revolution fails, they can back it up with bombing, and even boots on the ground. Most likely target from a military/economic standpoint would be Mexico, but the problem of millions and millions of Americans of Mexican descent is a strong argument against this. Trial balloons are already floating, though.
I'd love to see others' thoughts on this.
Posted by: Honzo | Dec 30 2023 18:30 utc | 42
The best way to create a secure and lasting peace for the Jewish remains for the Likud to finally accept UNR 181 and UNR 194.
Posted by: Exile | Dec 30 2023 18:31 utc | 43
Jewed-up BBC's Stephen Sackur has begun Hard Talk's 2023 roundup with a redux of Oinkrael's piggish genocide in Palestine.
Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Dec 30 2023 19:14 utc | 44
Honzo @2023
Not Mexico, by any means. The Western Hemisphere target would undoubtedly be Venezuela. Currently that nation is having a dispute with British-controlled Guyana over the recently discovered oil finds in the contested border area. So what does Perfidious Albion (controlled by the Rottenchild private bank in City of London) do? They send in a destroyer to threaten Caracas...sort of a shot across the bow, so to speak.
Harkening back to the days of "Rule Britannia...rules the waves", one single destroyer is certainly not a game-changer, in actuality a trip-wire. The City and Wall $treet Oilygarchs not only have their greedy eyes on that oil patch, but also upon the big one, with the messy crude in Venezuela proper.
Unlike the days when the Monroe Doctrine kept Latin America as a private playground for U$$A corporations.,..think "Banana Republics"...there are new players on the board. Both Russia and China are becoming involved in cooperative agreements with Venezuela. Should huffing and puffing on the part of the pro$titicians in the Di$trict of Corruption, most particularly by the totally Talmudist ruled Department of $tate, get a bit out of hand; it is not totally unreasonable to speculate that Caracas would welcome a Russian base in their land, similar to the Tartus operation in Syria.
Geopolitical reality is faaaaar beyond board-game simulations have produced. Events and possibilities are emerging more rapidly than commercial interests, to say nothing of governments, can possibly comprehend and contend with.
Posted by: aristodemos | Dec 30 2023 19:21 utc | 45
Looks like Jewish Internet Defense Force or JIDF (search it on the internet, that's a real organization, I am not being flippant) marked Moon Of Alabama for it's daily list of operations.
How to spot JIDF/Mossad/Hasbara propaganda? It blatantly tries to manipulate through emotions that it is easy to see through it. For example, "hamas are paedohphiles. If you question IDF reasoning for bombing civilians you must be a paedophile too".
It's obvious the Mossad/JIDF/Hasbara propaganda directors understand how people think & feel not through actually talking & interacting with people but by reading academic publications in sociology and psychology and
Posted by: FieryButMostPeaceful | Dec 30 2023 19:25 utc | 46
@ Arch Bungle | Dec 30 2023 16:44 utc | 19
your post is worth drawing attention to, so i am posting it again below..
"Note to Self:
The next time a Western talking head mentions the disappearance of Russian journalists under 'The Putin Regime' (or any other) tell them to bugger themselves with a cactus:
The most lethal place for journalists by far this year was Gaza, where at least 13 journalists were killed while actively covering the war, according to the RSF’s annual report published on Thursday. The total number of journalists killed in Gaza – irrespective of the line of their work – was 56, RSF said.
If even one of these journalists had been an anti-Putin Russian the entire West and it's legion of NGO/NPO puppet instances would have been screaming blue murder and holding black candlelight vigils for months on end ...
But 56 Palestinians journalists? Some murdered effectively live on t.v?
Crickets."
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Dec 30 2023 16:44 utc | 19
Posted by: james | Dec 30 2023 19:30 utc | 47
Re: the propaganda posted by g.
The NYT report was written by 2 israelis, and an american raised in a jewish neighborhood. That should explains the "creativity" (lies) of the reporting.
Posted by: hispanidad | Dec 30 2023 19:31 utc | 48
My tendency is that the US will use as much 'war by other means' as possible, focused on the Western Hemisphere, where it is easiest for the US to project power and where Russian-made missile defense systems are in short supply, so that if the color revolution fails, they can back it up with bombing, and even boots on the ground. Most likely target from a military/economic standpoint would be Mexico, but the problem of millions and millions of Americans of Mexican descent is a strong argument against this. Trial balloons are already floating, though.
I'd love to see others' thoughts on this.
Posted by: Honzo | Dec 30 2023 18:30 utc | 46
A reasonable speculation; taking a tighter grip on things closer to home makes sense, so I would expect it to happen at some point, but since these are not really reasonable people, there might be other things that they try to do first.
Trying to hold onto Europe was behind the Ukraine fiasco, so we know it is on their minds.
Posted by: Bemildred | Dec 30 2023 19:41 utc | 49
@ g | Dec 30 2023 16:24 utc | 8
You trolls don't quit. The Palestinians themselves were never consulted about the partition of 47-48. They were simply told you get 47% of the land for a population of 1300K christians+muslims while the rest went to the other 630K jews comprised of a majority of European refugees fleeing extermination, the majority of whome having arrived since 1922 (numbers based on Mandate era statistics compiled in 1947).
The Arab states invaded on behalf of the Palestinians and, admittedly, screwed things up even more...for the Palestinians.
But in the end, the Palestinians had actual little say in what happened then. And they were made to suffer. And let's be fair, the Zionist ideology of Ben Gurion had always been about the total eradication of non-Jews from Palestine. (I wish people like you would just be honest and admit this is what you want. Show some balls/ovaries and admit the truth instead of being sneaky.)
So my dear 'g', how does the uprooting of European Jews and their forced expulsion ultimately justify the forced expulsion and humiliation of a people that weren't responsible for your suffering? Since we often discuss morality in the bar, please lay out your justification for this position...if you can.
Posted by: CrazyTrain | Dec 30 2023 19:48 utc | 50
@ g | Dec 30 2023 16:42 utc | 16
Gaza had the potential to be a mini Arabian Singapore - now it’s just a bombed out over-glorified wasteland - and it’s all the fault of Hamas.
Classic Netanhayu and bloodthirsty Likudnik talking point. You aren't paid well are you?
Let me finish your sentiment then "and now we must destroy Gaza, and drive out its people in order to save it for Greater Israel."
Again, why don't you people come right out and admit your ultimate goal/desire? At least you'd get a lot more respect from people around here. Instead you act like a dirty little weasel living in the crevices of ambiguity by manipulating the language of morality. You make a mockery of your cause.
Posted by: CrazyTrain | Dec 30 2023 19:55 utc | 51
A poster from the previous thread linked to this Max Blumenthal video essay, which I think is worth viewing if you haven't already.
Much to say here, but this is clear ammunition to counter the claim that it is only Hamas that are the bloodthirsty crazies in this show. The truth is that Hamas are driven by bloodlust and extremism, all the while being the only viable resistance to Israel that was permitted by Israel to be there in the first place.
This fight over history, religion, land rights, justice/injustice, god et al. has reduced all these people into abject despicibility (sp?).
Posted by: CrazyTrain | Dec 30 2023 20:01 utc | 52
@ genocidal | Dec 30 2023 18:14 utc | 42
The war ends in one day if Hamas returns all hostages and lays down their arms. If Israel lays down their arms Israel would be destroyed.
Implicit in this position is a profound racism. It's the assumption that only the Israeli state and its functionaries (including the army) operate on good faith values, and anyone that is not Western or not part of your world consciousness is somehow less than human and only seeks your destruction, are a people that cannot operate on good faith. Its racist and colonial.
Deeply buried in all of this is something even more tragic. It's the idea of 'eternal antisemitism' (a phrase Hannah Arendt wrote extensively about in her criticisms of Zionism), the notion that if you aren't a jew then you automatically hate the jews -- which is itself a racist idea. This belief/assumption is something that according to its adherents applies to and cuts across all levels of society, from the individual right on up to the state.
According to this, no one in the world other than Jews and/or the State of Israel is to be trusted to look out for and/or respect the rights of Jews in any state. It's the epitome of ethno-religious mania and hatred. It's implicit in Israeli education and permeates common society. Lots of people there obviously don't believe any of it, but it is something that is all around and communicated on several simultaneous levels. I know, I lived there long enough....
Posted by: CrazyTrain | Dec 30 2023 20:16 utc | 53
Honzo @2023
"Not Mexico, by any means. The Western Hemisphere target would undoubtedly be Venezuela. Currently that nation is having a dispute with British-controlled Guyana over the recently discovered oil finds in the contested border area. So what does Perfidious Albion (controlled by the Rottenchild private bank in City of London) do? They send in a destroyer to threaten Caracas...sort of a shot across the bow, so to speak.
Harkening back to the days of "Rule Britannia...rules the waves", one single destroyer is certainly not a game-changer, in actuality a trip-wire. The City and Wall $treet Oilygarchs not only have their greedy eyes on that oil patch, but also upon the big one, with the messy crude in Venezuela proper..
Posted by: aristodemos | Dec 30 2023 19:21 utc | 49
I agree the City sent a trip wire in the forma of a destroyer to Venezuela. I also think the Eisenhower aircraft carrier, an old aircraft carrier near retirement sent to the Mediterranean maybe a 'trip wire' as well.
"My tendency is that the US will use as much 'war by other means' as possible, focused on the Western Hemisphere, where it is easiest for the US to project power and where Russian-made missile defense systems are in short supply, so that if the color revolution fails, they can back it up with bombing, and even boots on the ground. Most likely target from a military/economic standpoint would be Mexico, but the problem of millions and millions of Americans of Mexican descent is a strong argument against this. Trial balloons are already floating, though.
I'd love to see others' thoughts on this."
Posted by: Honzo | Dec 30 2023 18:30 utc | 46
Excellent analysis-new to me, but I think you may be right. America can more easily be Hegemon in the 'New World' and their signature terror attacks through indiscriminate bombing is tied to the greed of the MIC as bombing is quite lucrative with no 'blow back' as the Central and South American armies don't have the Russian AA.
The Empire also needs a 'win'
….. it is something that is all around and communicated on several simultaneous levels. I know, I lived there long enough....
Posted by: CrazyTrain | Dec 30 2023 20:16 utc | ……
Tell us more
Posted by: Exile | Dec 30 2023 20:42 utc | 56
The war ends in one day if Hamas returns all hostages and lays down their arms. If Israel lays down their arms Israel would be destroyed.
Posted by: genocidal | Dec 30 2023 18:14 utc | 42
Reposting this because it's a perfect example of the extreme paranoia that is inculcated into Israeli and Zionist (not all Jewish people) diaspora children from their first days of school - be it actual school or religious text.
This - coupled with the blatant racism against Palestinians, Arabs, and often white Gentiles - is necessary to create and maintain the type of mindset that makes the apartheid state possible and enables the outright, open genocide being carried out in Gaza (and soon to be the West Bank) right now as we speak.
There are documentaries and articles out there which go in to much more depth and detail than I will, but suffice it to say that it is also predicated on the Holocaust Industrial Complex which resides in Israel, but has very strong tentacles in Washington D.C., London, Brussels, Ottawa, and South America. It's a dead end philosophy and they will admit that among themselves, sometimes even to non-Zionists/Israelis. After all, they are God's chosen people and even if they initiate and/or participate in the end of humanity on Earth, they'll be fine - better than fine, actually. Nihilism with a cherry on top and a get out of jail free card.
At the end of the day, its ultimate purpose on Earth, however, is to "justify" the ethnic cleansing of the Levant and the emergence and survival of the "Zionist state" in a "pure" form. And the kicker is that doesn't mean that all diaspora Jews will be welcomed back nor that those diaspora Jews who constitute the "tentacles" will even want to actually move to Israel. They will remain in the RotW and continue their usurious and destructive actions there under the quasi-religious delusion that all Jews are always under immediate threat and faced with non-stop "anti-Semitism."
Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Dec 30 2023 20:46 utc | 57
"Being Asian, and not a bunch of Jewish crackerheads from Ukrainistan and other honkey backwaters, they immediately realized that cooperation with their Islamic neighbours was the only way forward."
Arch Bungle 28.
=====
I am no expert in the history of Singapore, but I urge you to read this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manasseh_Meyer
Posted by: Jane | Dec 30 2023 20:47 utc | 58
But 56 Palestinians journalists? Some murdered effectively live on t.v?
Posted by: james | Dec 30 2023 19:30 utc | 51
6 days ago it was 101 journalists in Gaza and 3 in Lebanon for a total of 104. But I am pretty sure I saw a couple more in the past few days. One journalist was being carried away on a stretcher, you could see him struggling and he died soon after. If hospitals were functioning, some might have survived like the Al Jazeera journalist who was left to bleed to death for five hours because Israel blocked the ambulance from going.
Posted by: pq | Dec 30 2023 20:56 utc | 59
What will the next dedicated open thread on MoA be about?
Posted by: Honzo | Dec 30 2023 18:30 utc | 46
Self inflicted agony: take your pick:
1. US civil war (not military exactly but politically violent or violently political) 2. Breakup of EU 3. Chaos in Argentina.
I'm looking at a world map and I can't find any country left that Empire hasn't tried to invade / regime change recently or given up on colonizing.
Posted by: pq | Dec 30 2023 21:02 utc | 60
Honzo @ 46 — The Red Sea ‘war.’ Big surprise as to its scope and effects.
Posted by: Pundita | Dec 30 2023 21:17 utc | 61
Posted by: aristodemos | Dec 30 2023 19:21 utc | 49
I think that Venezuela is the hardest nut to crack in the New World, harder than Mexico which is already chaotic, poorly militarized, disconnected from the Axis of Resistance, already bound to America's economy by hoops of steel. It's a matter of finding the right spin that neutralizes the inherent revulsion that Mexican Americans feel for the US killing Mexican Americans, especially in those already in the Army and Marines. A really clever hegemon might find that a Mexican Anschluss could be sold as giving citizenship to hard working people of color, on-shoring off-shored production, giving jobs to 'Americans' and of course, defeating the evil Chinese Fentanyl manufacturers behind the murderous Mexican drug cartels. We would, as usual, be rescuing oppressed people from their brutal overlords, fighting drugs, not Mexico, but only incidentally having to occupy the country and remove its corrupt leadership to prevent a resurgence of drug-gang control (meaning any resistance movement). I'm not saying it would work, but I think it's the kind of idea that appeals to our elites.
Venezuela, on the other hand, already has a large, trained military, armed in part with Russian technology, and Russia has made naval calls on its ports recently. China is also forging robust ties with Venezuela. While stopping all this is a goal, no doubt, it's not anywhere near as likely to succeed as many other possibilities, even in the shortest of short terms.
Posted by: Honzo | Dec 30 2023 21:29 utc | 62
Posted by: pq | Dec 30 2023 21:02 utc | 64
1: Maybe. The US Civil War is already politically violent and violently political, so I'm not sure what threshold would need to be crossed for it to become a regular thread. 2: That would be fun, but I expect it to be slow-rolling and episodic; a thing b will write articles about, but too extended in time frame for a standing open-thread for the foreseeable future. Individual episodes, like armed rebellion in France, for instance, would certainly get their own threads for a time, though. There are a lot of Barflies with relevant knowledge there, as well.
3: Possibly Argentina, it depends on whether the population wakes up and pushes back. There may not be that much to talk about for awhile.
Posted by: Honzo | Dec 30 2023 21:38 utc | 63
Honzo @ 46 — The Red Sea ‘war.’ Big surprise as to its scope and effects.
Posted by: Pundita | Dec 30 2023 21:17 utc | 65
That would be appropriate. Right now, MoA seems to regard it as an aspect of the genocide in Gaza, but it goes far beyond that, and exploring that explicitly would be a good use of energy.
Posted by: Honzo | Dec 30 2023 21:40 utc | 64
Jane @ 62.
Just reading further, and this account of the Peasants Revolt in Palestine of 1834 is a fascinating account of Palestine as territory control of which was contested by Egypt and the Ottomans. The Palestinian peasants and Bedouins and other local big men preferred the Ottomans to the Egyptians.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peasants%27_revolt_in_Palestine
This revolt is called the event that consolidated Palestinian nationalist consciousness.
". . . Kimmerling and Joel S. Migdal state that the revolt was a formative event for the Palestinian sense of nationhood in that it brought together disparate groups against a common enemy. Moreover, they asserted that these groups reemerged later to constitute the Palestinian people. The revolt represented a moment of political unity in Palestine. The goal of the rebels was to expel the Egyptian army and reinstate Ottoman rule to restore the Ottoman standards that defined the relationship between the government and the governed. These standards were made up of the religious laws, administrative codes and local norms and traditions that were disrupted by Egyptian reforms.[4]
Background Ibrahim Pasha led the Egyptian army in the LevantIn consolidating his power, Muhammad Ali, the rebel governor of Ottoman Egypt, was modeling his rule on the bureaucratic organization characteristic of modern European states.[7] Like earlier rulers of Egypt, Muhammad Ali sought to extend his control over greater Syria (the Levant) for its strategic value and natural resources. Syria also had a prospering international trading community with well-developed markets. In Muhammad Ali's strategy, Syria would serve as a captive market for goods being produced in Egypt. Moreover, Syria could serve as a buffer state between Egypt and the Ottoman sultan in Constantinople. Muhammad Ali was attempting to become independent of the Ottoman Empire.[8] . . ."
Unfortunately it seems like the Ottomans' eventually prevailing in Palestine opened the door for the Zionist project. The Wiki entry on Proto-zionism describes this. It is worth reading in its entirety as it basically demolishes the idea that Theodore Herzl was the founder of Zionism. Which leads me to wonder why this is repeated so often? Maybe to erase the actual roots of the Zionist idea?
Anyhow, here is an interesting graf:
"BackgroundMuhammad Ali seized power of Ottoman Egypt in 1805 following a civil war between the reigning Mamluks and Ottomans. Muhammad Ali dreamed of a new Egypt rising from the ashes of Ottoman decline: "I am well aware that the (Ottoman) Empire is heading by the day toward destruction... On its ruins I will build a vast kingdom... up to the Euphrates and the Tigris". He envisioned the Levant as the bread basket of Egypt, supplying Egypt with agricultural production and conscripts for their wars against the Ottomans. Most of the Muslim Arab peasantry in Palestine turned against Ibrahim Pasha, Ali's eldest son and successor, as his constant demands for conscript soldiers came to be seen as a death sentence leading to the 1834 Peasants' revolt in Palestine.[2] This was the backdrop against which proto-Zionism developed as more Jews started immigrating to the region under Ibrahim Pasha's rule. After the Ottomans regained control of the Levant in the Oriental Crisis of 1840 the legal structures of land ownership underwent significant reform in the Tanzimat era beginning with the Land Code of 1858. Once based on cultivation, land ownership was now based on title and register, paving the way for later land purchases by Zionists.[2] "
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proto-Zionism
This was the context within which Baron Rothschild (unclear which one) was reported to have tried in 1829 to lure the Ottoman sultan, via a huge loan, to turn all of Palestine over to him to become his private Jewish kingdom.
https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=mdp.39015058342257&seq=997
Posted by: Jane | Dec 30 2023 21:40 utc | 65
Posted by: Jane | Dec 30 2023 20:47 utc | 62
I'm no expert on Singapore either, and I found the article very interesting despite the source. It would be enlightening to see to what extent the Baghdadi Jews continue to prosper there.
Posted by: Honzo | Dec 30 2023 21:45 utc | 66
@ pq | Dec 30 2023 20:56 utc | 63
thanks.. that is even more depressing.. it does however shine another light on the hypocrisy of the west in its concern for journalists/reporters/investigative reporters with all the cheap talk of protecting access to information and those providing it..
Posted by: james | Dec 30 2023 21:47 utc | 67
According to this, no one in the world other than Jews and/or the State of Israel is to be trusted to look out for and/or respect the rights of Jews in any state. It's the epitome of ethno-religious mania and hatred. It's implicit in Israeli education and permeates common society. . . .
Posted by: CrazyTrain | Dec 30 2023 20:16 utc | 57
================
This is a centuries-old idea as described in the "History" section of the Wiki entry on Proto-Zionism:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proto-Zionism.
Posted by: Jane | Dec 30 2023 21:48 utc | 68
@Jane | Dec 30 2023 21:40 utc | 69
It is worth reading in its entirety as it basically demolishes the idea that Theodore Herzl was the founder of Zionism. Which leads me to wonder why this is repeated so often?
Because "white men bad" is the self-comforting creed of so many woke useful idiots. You cannot fight the so called "empire", if you embrace its most prominent ideology.
Posted by: SG | Dec 30 2023 22:03 utc | 69
Great post CrazyTrain @57. Agree wholeheartedly.
Just a small point: "It's the idea of 'eternal antisemitism' (a phrase Hannah Arendt wrote extensively about in her criticisms of Zionism).."
The racists in Israel and zionist jews everywhere have even appropriated for themselves the term 'semite' just like they did for 'holocaust.' The biggest antisemites are the mostly European non-semitic jews, speaking a resurrected once extinct language, currently living in the 'Jewish State' who oppress and wage war against the semites of Palestine.
Posted by: Panza | Dec 30 2023 22:03 utc | 70
Guyana is NOT British controlled (except of course in the sense that everything in the world is controlled by the City of London, operating a secret plan left to it by Cecil Rhodes who was an agent of the Rothschild family etc etc...)
There is an excellent article at the Declassified website which might help explain things for those who know little about Guyana
https://www.declassifieduk.org/the-sooner-we-get-these-people-out-of-our-hair-the-better/
In the real world we see that the power dictating events in Guyana since the 1940s has been the US, through the CIA, the CIO-AFL (yes, them) and the State Department.
As to the years when Britain still wielded independent power in Latin America consider the
Monroe Doctrine which was a hundred years old earlier this year and nothing exemplifies it better than the history of the Venezuela-Guyana disputes and the serial destruction and corruption of Guyanese governments.
The medical profession should seriously investigate the growing need for psychiatric assistance for those suffering from The City/Rothschild syndrome and associated Larouchian insanities.
Posted by: bevin | Dec 30 2023 22:05 utc | 71
Yes yes Israel is winning . Winning so much Eliat port is empty not one ship.
https://en.webangah.ir/2023-12-30/news=26611/
Posted by: Hankster | Dec 30 2023 22:20 utc | 72
Thousands of Italian and German women were raped by allied soldiers from 1944 to 1945 but outside of Fascist propaganda, people do not conclude from that fact that historical justice was on the side of the Axis powers.
Posted by: Paul Cockshott | Dec 30 2023 18:12 utc | 40
=================
And thousands of Russian women were brutally raped by German soldiers of the invading army. I have seen a documentary film that discussed this.
However, when I did a search for "WW2 rapes of Russian women" I got no hits. All the hits ---lots of them---were about Russian/Soviet soldiers raping German women.
Then I did a search for "Russian Women raped by German soldiers" and got one hit. This one:
https://academic.oup.com/edinburgh-scholarship-online/book/42225/chapter-abstract/356344246?redirectedFrom=fulltext
"This chapter focuses on sexual violence by German troops, which was a widespread reality in the Soviet Union and included coerced disrobement, sexual torture, rape, and sexual enslavement committed by individuals or groups. Women and girls but also boys and men suffered bodily and psychological wounds. Many did not survive to tell their stories. The account draws on narratives by perpetrators, victims and bystanders and elucidates the forms that sexual violence took, in what situations specific manifestations occurred, . . . Ultimately, [commanders] regarded male sexuality as something that could and should be productively incited."
I think it is worth noting because rape of German women by Soviet soldiers is assumed to reflect only the innate bestiality of Soviet soldiers. Obviously it is quite possible that Soviet soldiers---or some portion of them---were taking revenge on German women for what had been done to Russian women. It is also quite possible, as noted in the last sentence cited, that military commanders consciously incited their men to degrade the enemy's women as a weapon.
This whole Soviet soldier as monstrous rapist by dint of being Russian has taken on a life of its own and is still being weaponized against Russia, and is a kind of repeated echo when Hamas soldiers are accused of raping Israeli women.
As for the latter case, it is very convenient to say the women are too traumatized to provide any evidence. "Just believe whatever we, the rape experts, say." If these women were later buried under rubble, it is fair to say that Israel destroyed evidence of rape by killing the women. IF they buried the women without doing any autopsy, then likewise they destroyed the potential evidence and now should shut up.
Posted by: Jane | Dec 30 2023 22:23 utc | 73
the conspicuous lack of genuine support for Hamas from Arab leaders. . . most of them bought and paid for by the USA.
Posted by: malenkov | Dec 30 2023 16:43 utc | 17
It astonishes me that people expect “vassals” to defy two psychotic nuclear armed powers? Your comment reminds me of the blame shifting by a clown in a journalist costume asking the Saudi FM:
Q. Would the Arabs unite and take Palestinians as refugees? There’s been criticism that the weight has not been lifted by the Arab world.
He replied: “the weight has to be lifted by removing that weight and that is very easy by stopping the killing, by stopping the blockade and allowing aid. The Palestinians do not want to leave their land and we’re not going to encourage / force them to, we’re not going to work with anyone who has that agenda.”
Some seem unaware that there has been a 22 years & ongoing War of Terror based on the concept of one religion = terror.
By coincidence that religion (= terror) exists on resource rich lands that NATOstan covets.
It is a truth universally aknowledged that a single land in possession of resources must be in search of a NATOstan overlord.
Axis of Vassals + West Asian Axis of Evil together support EVERY religious terrorist group KNOWN TO HUMANITY.
Hamas is labeled “terrorist ” by the non-terrorist settler colonial supporting regimes of NATOstan.
So even if they don’t say they support Hamas, if Hamas = terror, by definition, they support Hamas!!
Posted by: pq | Dec 30 2023 22:25 utc | 74
Because "white men bad" is the self-comforting creed of so many woke useful idiots. You cannot fight the so called "empire", if you embrace its most prominent ideology.
Posted by: SG | Dec 30 2023 22:03 utc | 73
==================
I don't follow your argument re "white men bad."
Everyone, also the Jews, puts Herzl at The Creation of Zionism.
It just isn't true!
Posted by: Jane | Dec 30 2023 22:27 utc | 75
I am no expert in the history of Singapore, but I urge you to read this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manasseh_Meyer
Posted by: Jane | Dec 30 2023 20:47 utc | 62
I'm aware of that story.
It doesn't change the facts as they pertain to Singapore's creation and equilibrium with it's neighbours as I pointed out though.
One might say Singapore survived despite the presence of the Meyers because people like Lee Kwan Yew were able to navigate the interests of Imperial powers, regional powers and predatory business dynasties like the Meyers ...
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Dec 30 2023 22:35 utc | 76
Zionist forces in Gaza are routinely shooting civilians at random, in a manner reminiscent of ghettos in Eastern Europe in 1941, for no apparent reason other than hate and killing for its own sake, and to spread terror among the population.
Large numbers of male civilians of all ages, and some women, are being rounded up, starved, beaten and tortured, until they sign ludicrous confessions confessing to being "terrorists." The victims include very old men and young children. They are kept in makeshift barbed wire pens in the desert, handcuffed for days, deprived of food and water, and subjected to every form of mistreatment sick Zionist minds can imagine. Some are taken away and summarily shot, Einsatzgruppen style.
The "lucky" ones, released after a few days of this treatment as "guests" of their Zionist hosts, resemble Belsen concentration camp inmates released after MONTHS of Nazi mistreatment, emaciated, broken, all bearing wounds and torture injuries.
The crimes of the Zionist Regime surpass those of Nazi Germany at its worst. They make the Nazis look like rank amateurs.
The Nazis did at least try to conceal their crimes, either out of shame or for other reasons.
The Zionist Regime proudly celebrates its atrocities, shouts them out across the roof tops, and constantly threatens more of the same.
Posted by: anon | Dec 30 2023 22:41 utc | 77
Jane @69 there is little serious doubt that Theodore Herzl founded the modern Zionist movement.
But its historical roots are complex and involve many, many men who have urged the 'recreation' of a Jewish state, preferably in Palestine.
It was a myth of particular potency in Victorian England for reasons that are related to the nature of that society, its place in the world, the ruling class, evangelical christianity, guilt, greed and racism. Its transmission to the likes of Balfour and Ormsby Gore, Orde Wingate and Churchill was effortless and automatic.
Of course there is also a minor strain of zionist thought that William Blake celebrated and suggests that the real descendants of Israel are in fact the British people evangelised by Joseph of Arimathea:
In case many of the patrons-happy in their not being British- have not seen the poem I take the seasonal liberty of publishing it here in all its beauty.
And did those feet in ancient time
Walk upon Englands mountains green:
And was the holy Lamb of God,
On Englands pleasant pastures seen!
And did the Countenance Divine,
Shine forth upon our clouded hills?
And was Jerusalem builded here,
Among these dark Satanic Mills?
Bring me my Bow of burning gold:
Bring me my arrows of desire:
Bring me my Spear: O clouds unfold!
Bring me my Chariot of fire!
I will not cease from Mental Fight,
Nor shall my sword sleep in my hand:
Till we have built Jerusalem,
In Englands green & pleasant Land.
As to Mehemet Ali he was an Albanian who was, essentially, sponsored by the British in the years after Napoleon had left the region. Among his other achievements was his campaign against the stroppy wahhabi early in the C19th.
Posted by: bevin | Dec 30 2023 22:42 utc | 78
Arch Bungle 80
"Singapore became what it is because it realized it could never impose it's will on an Islamic majority (Malaysia) to it's left and an Islamic majority (Indonesia) to it's right and others like Brunei, Sarawak, Johor Baru or even South Islamic Thailand.
The Singaporean precursors asked merely for a tiny piece of land for their people, they asked NICELY, and they were granted it.
They built that piece of land, together with their own Islamic Malay population and Islamic Indonesian immigrants (among others) into a global force.
Being Asian,"
=============================
I am curious as to who the "precursors" were.
Who were the Asians who asked merely for a tiny piece of land for their people? Who were "their people"?
Meyer and Lee Kuan do not occupy the same historical time frame.
It seems like the modern commercial entity Singapore was basically a creation and outpost of the British Empire.
Posted by: Jane | Dec 30 2023 22:42 utc | 79
Do you have any valid evidence to support your claims. Historically IDF would not do the things you mention.
Posted by: genocidal | Dec 30 2023 18:14 utc | 42
- historically izzraeli doctors have admitted harvesting Palestinian organs.
- It's a fact that izzrael refuses to hand over the bodies of many Palestinians to their families
That's the evidence and admission in one package.
What the hell are you talking about?
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Dec 30 2023 22:47 utc | 80
What will the next dedicated open thread on MoA be about?
Posted by: Honzo | Dec 30 2023 18:30 utc | 46
____
Whatever its ostensible theme, the discussion will deteriorate quickly into one on MMT or climate change.
Posted by: malenkov | Dec 30 2023 22:48 utc | 81
What will the next dedicated open thread on MoA be about?
Posted by: Honzo | Dec 30 2023 18:30 utc | 46
the quite horrible false flag event that was planned long ago and has been waiting in the wings to be sprung whenever the bloodthirsty jews feel the need for it
a frightened government is an instant killer
will it be a nuclear event?
i won't be surprised
Posted by: DuchessAndBob | Dec 30 2023 22:51 utc | 82
It astonishes me that people expect “vassals” to defy two psychotic nuclear armed powers?
____
Frantic nonsense. They are vassals and I expect them to behave like vassals.
Posted by: malenkov | Dec 30 2023 22:53 utc | 83
"A new level of barbarism"
20 seconds of Irish MEP Clare Daly
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/Ef63CNnLV8U
Posted by: Don Firineach | Dec 30 2023 22:56 utc | 84
And before new years eve explodes - about South Africa filing the genocide charge: If it's true as somebody posted and the UNSC has the ultimate 'guilty or not' binding decision, I don't get why anybody thinks it's a big deal that it got filed. I mean, did jew-controlled amurdica absurdica get kicked out of the UN while i wasn't looking??
Posted by: DuchessAndBob | Dec 30 2023 22:59 utc | 85
james 51
The number of journalists murdered in Gaza by Zionist forces reached 91 a few days ago. It has probably risen since then. This does not include members of their families who were murdered when their homes were targeted and bombed.
But don't worry - they will soon get up into treble figures. Genocide Joe and Blinken have just announced they are sending another $150 million worth of bombs and shells to the Zionist forces, because as Zionist leaders helpfully explain, not enough children have been killed in Gaza yet, and they need to kill all of them.
This will go with the 50,000 tons of US bombs already dropped on Gaza, courtesy of the US taxpayer.
And don't worry about the all dead journalists in Gaza, because the US and UK regimes are hosting big conferences to condemn the harassment of journalists in China and Iran.
Posted by: anon | Dec 30 2023 23:02 utc | 86
Bevin @2205
You have thoroughly outed yourself as (1. a materialist (2. an apologist (3. a denialist and ultimately an unrepentant ideologue. If you had the stones to do some objective research you will discover that the Rottenchild Crime Clan, primarily seated in The City, happen to be the ultra-capitalists. It dawned on me that you do not consider yourself as pro-capitalism. N'cest pas? Why is it then that you refuse to countenance the existence of highest finance capitalism....a level of financial power which has full operative control over all Western governments. They decide policy. Consider the composition of the U$$A Department of $tate. Identities of the cast of characters heading that entity are most evident.
Oh, I will concede that Wall $treet,is effectually dominated by the Rottenfeller Crime Clan, with their 54% shareholding presence in the Federal Reserve Bank of New York. Their #1 Minion...and fixer, the finally late Heinrich Kissinger, the frontman dwarf, was suspected by some sources as an ingester of adrenochrome. Maybe. We do know that he lived to 100 and his longterm master, David Rottenfeller, lived to the overripe ordure of 101. Inheritors of inconceivable wealth and the power that it brings to essentially all major institutions across the fruited plain...are simply incapable of human empathy. Being spiritually vacuous they also fear their ultimate demise.
City of London is and remains the world center for banking, insurance, maritime affairs, mining and metals and international media...for starters. They have controlled British finance since their premiere Rottenchild broke the Bank of England immediately after Wellington's defeat of Napoleon in 1815. He took over the Bank from a consortium including the Montefiores and the Goldsmits.
Why do your ideological presumptions constantly deny history? As a materialist, such as my late Trotskyite friend David, perhaps you suffer from an existential fear of death, believing that we only live once and then we simply cease to exist. If that were indeed the case, then why do materialists even bother to keep living an essentially meaningless existence? Why are so many of them ensorcelled by possessions and power over the lives of others?
There is a spiritual dimension. Yes, it cannot be proven by the materialistic scientistic postulations of being able to prove a theorem by means of our five known primary senses. But as Hamlet admonished Horatio: "There is more to heaven and earth than is dreamt of in your philosophy, Horatio."
Posted by: aristodemos | Dec 30 2023 23:02 utc | 87
@Jane | Dec 30 2023 22:27 utc | 79
Everyone, also the Jews, puts Herzl at The Creation of Zionism.
Of course. They'd do everything to deflect criticism. To them it is convenient: «it is not the toxic talmudic creed that created Zionism, it is European "racism"».
It seems like the modern commercial entity Singapore was basically a creation and outpost of the British Empire.
Even the old one. Singapore was founded by the British and the British brought there the Chinese and Indian population, because they needed a workforce ("coolies") in their new colony. Singapore was then briefly incorporated into Malaysia because the British and the Singaporean elite feared a Communist takeover: after all muslims are the most impervious folk to socialism (among other things). However since Chinese and Malay were beating and stabbing each others daily, Singapore was made independent in a couple of years.
Posted by: SG | Dec 30 2023 23:04 utc | 88
@ anon | Dec 30 2023 23:02 utc | 90
your last sentence - exactly.. and thanks for the other details too.. cheers..
Posted by: james | Dec 30 2023 23:07 utc | 89
It seems like the modern commercial entity Singapore was basically a creation and outpost of the British Empire.
Posted by: Jane | Dec 30 2023 22:42 utc | 83
You really need to read the history to understand this.
The key points:
- There is a discontinuity between colonial Singapore and modern Singapore.
- This discontinuity is centered around it's status as part of the Malaysian federation (The Federation of Malaya) followed by it's subsequent expulsion from the federation.
Begin here:
https://www.nlb.gov.sg/main/article-detail?cmsuuid=dc1efe7a-8159-40b2-9244-cdb078755013
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Dec 30 2023 23:09 utc | 90
However since Chinese and Malay were beating and stabbing each others daily, Singapore was made independent in a couple of years.
Posted by: SG | Dec 30 2023 23:04 utc | 92
This never made sense and probably was a cover for the real reason: disputes over tax contributions to the federation.
The reason why I think it's a cover is that Malaysians, Chinese and Tamils were beating each other up well into this century, long after the creation of post-colonial Singapore.
A large part of Singapore's government goes into making sure race riots don't break out between it's Chinese population, Tamil Indians and the very large indigenous Malay community.
And just like that we're way off topic ...
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Dec 30 2023 23:16 utc | 91
Something got hit in the Red Sea again. Per @LordOfWar telegram.
The Houthis could really end up making a difference.
Intel announced a big new chip plant to be built in S. Israel.
It’d be a shame if it got bombed it into ruin.
Posted by: Ghost of Zanon | Dec 30 2023 23:19 utc | 92
Posted by: CrazyTrain | Dec 30 2023 20:01 utc | 56
The truth is that Hamas are driven by bloodlust and extremism, all the while being the only viable resistance to Israel that was permitted by Israel to be there in the first place.
There is much misconception on the lead up and aftermath to the Palestinian elections at the end of January 2006. Vanity Fair published a fairly detailed account in March 2008:
https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2008/04/gaza200804
Posted by: Menz | Dec 30 2023 23:19 utc | 93
Manooch Kargar منوچ کارگر
@ma000111
This container ship was previously owned by Zim Company of the Israeli regime, and now it is owned by another company. On Friday, while passing through #باب_المندب he wrote on his body: "We have nothing to do with Israel" and passed through #دریای_سرخ ) safely, presenting a certificate of ownership to the army #یمن and that he had no cargo headed for Palestine.
https://twitter.com/ma000111/status/1741202091266261237
Posted by: Menz | Dec 30 2023 23:20 utc | 94
Assal Rad
@AssalRad
·
Dec 29
Israel keeps bombing areas it tells Palestinians to move to:
https://twitter.com/AssalRad/status/1740648370862248380
Posted by: Menz | Dec 30 2023 23:22 utc | 95
13 mins
Noam Chomsky : Why America Holds Israel as a Sacred Cow?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hofWP7XeU5o
Posted by: Don Firineach | Dec 30 2023 23:24 utc | 96
But don't worry - they will soon get up into treble figures. Genocide Joe and Blinken have just announced they are sending another $150 million worth of bombs and shells to the Zionist forces, because as Zionist leaders helpfully explain, not enough children have been killed in Gaza yet, and they need to kill all of them.
This will go with the 50,000 tons of US bombs already dropped on Gaza, courtesy of the US taxpayer.
And don't worry about the all dead journalists in Gaza, because the US and UK regimes are hosting big conferences to condemn the harassment of journalists in China and Iran.
Posted by: anon | Dec 30 2023 23:02 utc | 90
--------------------------------------------------------------
Biden bypassed Congress (again) and approved the $150 million in new bombs because he said it was an emergency. What was the emergency Mr. Biden: Was the IDF running out of enough bombs to kill ALL the children in Gaza? My God! It makes you ashamed to be an American.
Posted by: Ed | Dec 30 2023 23:28 utc | 97
Jane @69 there is little serious doubt that Theodore Herzl founded the modern Zionist movement. ---Bevin.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++
I said that Herzl did not found Zionism.
But he is generally credited with doing so.
"modern Zionist movement" can mean different things.
Actually, Herzl's version of Zionism was soon overtaken by Jabotinsky's. And one could easily speculate that Jabotinsky, Trumpeldor, Ben Gurion, and their ilk got their ideas directly from earlier Zionist springs---not from Herzl's Viennese version.
Posted by: Jane | Dec 30 2023 23:42 utc | 98
109 humanitarian aid trucks were inspected at Nitzana and transferred to Gaza via the Rafah crossing today.
Posted by: g | Dec 30 2023 16:08 utc | 1
--------------------------------------------------------
So the Zio-Nazis allow the feeding of powered milk for the babies as a humanitarian gesture just before they bomb them into baby heaven. You area sick Jew Mr. g.
Posted by: Ed | Dec 30 2023 23:43 utc | 99
Arch 94.
"The key points:
- There is a discontinuity between colonial Singapore and modern Singapore. "
===============
Yeah.
What I said: Manassah and Lee Kuan occupy two separate historical time frames.
As for "Start here," your comments have not impressed me with their sagacity regarding the actual history of Singapore!
Are you by any chance playing catch-up? ((:-))
Posted by: Jane | Dec 30 2023 23:51 utc | 100
The comments to this entry are closed.
Ex Israeli Premier demands the US strike Iran directly
The suspense of a direct war with Iran kept everyone hanging for 3 months. If Washington can't decide just toss a coin already.
Also I see that as an admission of defeat by Israel in Gaza. IDF can't beat "Tunnel Vermin". Hilarious.
Posted by: FieryButMostPeaceful | Dec 30 2023 16:10 utc | 1