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October 31, 2023
Palestine Open Thread 2023-256
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Israel is the only UN member state with three permanent seats on the UN Security Council. Two at the very least.
Posted by: pq | Oct 31 2023 13:04 utc | 3
Israel is the only UN member state with three permanent seats on the UN Security Council. Two at the very least.
Posted by: pq | Oct 31 2023 13:04 utc | 4
@pq : great point and why UN cannot help this issue though it was used to enable it. World leaders unable to remedy it either. Bad!
@pq : great point and why UN cannot help this issue though it was used to enable it. World leaders unable to remedy it either. Bad!
Since October 7, more than 3,257 children have been reported killed, including at least 3,195 in Gaza, 33 in the West Bank, and 29 in Israel, according to the Ministries of Health in Gaza and Israel respectively. The number of children reported killed in just three weeks in Gaza is more than the number killed in armed conflict globally – across more than 20 countries – over the course of a whole year, for the last three years.
Posted by: Apollyon | Oct 31 2023 13:09 utc | 7
Since October 7, more than 3,257 children have been reported killed, including at least 3,195 in Gaza, 33 in the West Bank, and 29 in Israel, according to the Ministries of Health in Gaza and Israel respectively. The number of children reported killed in just three weeks in Gaza is more than the number killed in armed conflict globally – across more than 20 countries – over the course of a whole year, for the last three years.
Posted by: Apollyon | Oct 31 2023 13:09 utc | 8
What do Barflies think are the war aims of Hamas ?
Posted by: Exile | Oct 31 2023 11:39 utc | 457
To draw in first Hizbullah then Iran which draws in the US, at very least to defend it’s huge bases if not also to finally realize PNAC goals and take Syria, attack Iran. China and Russia will step in too, mainly providing defense. This will
a) unify Arab and Persian Sunni and Shia Middle East and
b) reveal Wests impotence in a region in which they no longer belong
c) result in Middle Eastern autonomy and
d) severe reduction if not annulation of Israel along with
e) creation of Palestinian State.
That’s assuming the many stories of Hamas being an Israeli run group are untrue. If they are true, then the goal is to justify Israel getting rid of the Palestinians once and for all after which, perhaps, coming to agreement with her neighbours about borders plus possibly joining BRICS, originally conceived by Goldman Sachs.
2nd scenario feels more likely though both no doubt over-simplifications.
What do Barflies think are the war aims of Hamas ?
Posted by: Exile | Oct 31 2023 11:39 utc | 457
To draw in first Hizbullah then Iran which draws in the US, at very least to defend it’s huge bases if not also to finally realize PNAC goals and take Syria, attack Iran. China and Russia will step in too, mainly providing defense. This will
a) unify Arab and Persian Sunni and Shia Middle East and
b) reveal Wests impotence in a region in which they no longer belong
c) result in Middle Eastern autonomy and
d) severe reduction if not annulation of Israel along with
e) creation of Palestinian State.
That’s assuming the many stories of Hamas being an Israeli run group are untrue. If they are true, then the goal is to justify Israel getting rid of the Palestinians once and for all after which, perhaps, coming to agreement with her neighbours about borders plus possibly joining BRICS, originally conceived by Goldman Sachs.
2nd scenario feels more likely though both no doubt over-simplifications.
I didn’t see b had opened another thread. Here’s my two latest from the end of the previous thread:
Russia’s immediate aims in Palestine are revealed in this short PR, Special Presidential Representative for the Middle East and Africa and Deputy Foreign Minister Mikhail Bogdanov meets with Ambassador of the State of Israel to Moscow Ahmed Ben Zvi:
On October 31, Special Presidential Representative for the Middle East and Africa and Deputy Foreign Minister Mikhail Bogdanov met with Ambassador of the State of Israel to Moscow Alexander Ben Zvi.
During the conversation, the parties discussed the ongoing armed confrontation in the Palestinian-Israeli conflict zone. At the same time, the Russian side noted the importance of continuing relevant contacts in the interests of resolving pressing humanitarian issues as soon as possible, including the release of hostages, ensuring the safe evacuation of Russian citizens from the Gaza Strip, as well as ensuring the delivery of humanitarian goods to the Palestinian enclave.
Note what’s missing: An immediate cessation of the invasion and attendant bombing which is causing the humanitarian crisis. Why is that omitted; was it not discussed; and if so, why not?
And:
At the UNSC:
Nebenzya: I want to ask the US representative a question – explain why you are against a ceasefire? Does this mean that the United States, as a permanent member of the Security Council, supports the doctrine of “total retaliation” in Gaza? Where is your sympathy for civilians, which you so eloquently express at every meeting of the Council on Ukraine? And this is despite the fact that the lives of civilians in Ukraine are nowhere near as threatened as the Palestinians in Gaza. Or do you think only about those on the European continent, and no one in Washington cares about Palestinian lives?
I would like to address the same questions to the rest of the Western delegations in the Council, which shamefully abstained on all the draft resolutions that we introduced that would have called for a ceasefire. Colleagues, your “double standards” are more than obvious.
I didn’t see b had opened another thread. Here’s my two latest from the end of the previous thread:
Russia’s immediate aims in Palestine are revealed in this short PR, Special Presidential Representative for the Middle East and Africa and Deputy Foreign Minister Mikhail Bogdanov meets with Ambassador of the State of Israel to Moscow Ahmed Ben Zvi:
On October 31, Special Presidential Representative for the Middle East and Africa and Deputy Foreign Minister Mikhail Bogdanov met with Ambassador of the State of Israel to Moscow Alexander Ben Zvi.
During the conversation, the parties discussed the ongoing armed confrontation in the Palestinian-Israeli conflict zone. At the same time, the Russian side noted the importance of continuing relevant contacts in the interests of resolving pressing humanitarian issues as soon as possible, including the release of hostages, ensuring the safe evacuation of Russian citizens from the Gaza Strip, as well as ensuring the delivery of humanitarian goods to the Palestinian enclave.
Note what’s missing: An immediate cessation of the invasion and attendant bombing which is causing the humanitarian crisis. Why is that omitted; was it not discussed; and if so, why not?
And:
At the UNSC:
Nebenzya: I want to ask the US representative a question – explain why you are against a ceasefire? Does this mean that the United States, as a permanent member of the Security Council, supports the doctrine of “total retaliation” in Gaza? Where is your sympathy for civilians, which you so eloquently express at every meeting of the Council on Ukraine? And this is despite the fact that the lives of civilians in Ukraine are nowhere near as threatened as the Palestinians in Gaza. Or do you think only about those on the European continent, and no one in Washington cares about Palestinian lives?
I would like to address the same questions to the rest of the Western delegations in the Council, which shamefully abstained on all the draft resolutions that we introduced that would have called for a ceasefire. Colleagues, your “double standards” are more than obvious.
Another day of genocide, yet all RT seems to care about is the demonstration in Dagestan. Maria Finoshina should be fired.
Rania and Abby had a great discussion on yt.
Posted by: liveload | Oct 31 2023 13:25 utc | 13
Another day of genocide, yet all RT seems to care about is the demonstration in Dagestan. Maria Finoshina should be fired.
Rania and Abby had a great discussion on yt.
Posted by: liveload | Oct 31 2023 13:25 utc | 14
Is the plan to feast on Palestinain children until the rest of the world is drawn in through revulsion? This isn’t going to work. While most counties in the world are aghast at the crimes being committed in front of the world’s cameras, noone is going to risk WW3 to protect the Palestinians. Maerica, fascist state that she is, has plainly made clear her intent to strike anyone interfering with the genocide.
This is your country in 2023 Maerica. If I asked an average person they’d have not a clue what I was talking about. Taylor Swift?
My worry is the crazies appear intent on striking Iran no matter what. That’s ww3, period.
Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Oct 31 2023 13:34 utc | 15
Is the plan to feast on Palestinain children until the rest of the world is drawn in through revulsion? This isn’t going to work. While most counties in the world are aghast at the crimes being committed in front of the world’s cameras, noone is going to risk WW3 to protect the Palestinians. Maerica, fascist state that she is, has plainly made clear her intent to strike anyone interfering with the genocide.
This is your country in 2023 Maerica. If I asked an average person they’d have not a clue what I was talking about. Taylor Swift?
My worry is the crazies appear intent on striking Iran no matter what. That’s ww3, period.
Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Oct 31 2023 13:34 utc | 16
Posted by: karlof1 | Oct 31 2023 13:24 utc | 6
What’s the mystery? Russia has made it clear it wants a ceasefire and Israel has made it clear it does not. So why would Russia meed to burn the bridges if it can get the second best? This is so completely alien to how the US would “handle” this.
Posted by: Jonathan W | Oct 31 2023 13:35 utc | 17
Posted by: karlof1 | Oct 31 2023 13:24 utc | 6
What’s the mystery? Russia has made it clear it wants a ceasefire and Israel has made it clear it does not. So why would Russia meed to burn the bridges if it can get the second best? This is so completely alien to how the US would “handle” this.
Posted by: Jonathan W | Oct 31 2023 13:35 utc | 18
I can’t watch the footage Israel releases to honor themselves. They are not warriors. They’re cowardly killers. The whole thing is a giant atrocity designed to start a regional war. Disgusting.
Heads up..if aliens do invade I’m switching sides.
Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Oct 31 2023 13:35 utc | 19
I can’t watch the footage Israel releases to honor themselves. They are not warriors. They’re cowardly killers. The whole thing is a giant atrocity designed to start a regional war. Disgusting.
Heads up..if aliens do invade I’m switching sides.
Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Oct 31 2023 13:35 utc | 20
Global Times reports on today’s UNSC meeting, “UNSC seeks 5th attempt on resolution for cease-fire while US’ one-sided support of Israel hints at a blow to international efforts”:
After four failed attempts to come to an agreement on a resolution regarding Gaza, the UN Security Council (UNSC) met again in an emergency meeting to discuss the crisis to seek a binding resolution that demands Israel to accept a humanitarian pause in Gaza. But the US’ biased backing of Israel might once again undermine international efforts to press for a ceasefire, and its connivance with Israel’s excessive military actions in Gaza will exacerbate the humanitarian crisis.
The United Arab Emirates and China called for an emergency meeting of the UNSC on Monday after Israel expanded its ground operations into Gaza over the weekend, according to media reports….
China solemnly calls on parties of the conflict to cease all hostilities, disengage immediately, put in place a humanitarian truce, and make every effort to prevent the situation from escalating further, Zhang said, also calling on a certain major country with special influence on the parties concerned to put aside its self-interest and geopolitical considerations and make every effort to stop the war and restore peace.
The core on whether a new resolution can be passed by the Council relies on how the US chooses to act. However, given that Israel’s ground operations in Gaza are still in their early stages and have not yet achieved their strategic objective, the US may not abandon its prior biased backing of Israel at the Council, Liu Zhongmin, a professor at the Middle East Studies Institute of Shanghai International Studies University, told the Global Times.
Since 1945, a total of 34 UNSC draft resolutions related to the Israel-Palestine issue have been vetoed by the US. The majority of these resolutions were drafted to provide a framework for peace in the decades-long Israel-Palestine conflict, according to Al Jazeera. [My Emphasis]
Shouldn’t that “biased backing” be interpreted as abetting the carnage, being complicit in massive War Crimes?
Global Times reports on today’s UNSC meeting, “UNSC seeks 5th attempt on resolution for cease-fire while US’ one-sided support of Israel hints at a blow to international efforts”:
After four failed attempts to come to an agreement on a resolution regarding Gaza, the UN Security Council (UNSC) met again in an emergency meeting to discuss the crisis to seek a binding resolution that demands Israel to accept a humanitarian pause in Gaza. But the US’ biased backing of Israel might once again undermine international efforts to press for a ceasefire, and its connivance with Israel’s excessive military actions in Gaza will exacerbate the humanitarian crisis.
The United Arab Emirates and China called for an emergency meeting of the UNSC on Monday after Israel expanded its ground operations into Gaza over the weekend, according to media reports….
China solemnly calls on parties of the conflict to cease all hostilities, disengage immediately, put in place a humanitarian truce, and make every effort to prevent the situation from escalating further, Zhang said, also calling on a certain major country with special influence on the parties concerned to put aside its self-interest and geopolitical considerations and make every effort to stop the war and restore peace.
The core on whether a new resolution can be passed by the Council relies on how the US chooses to act. However, given that Israel’s ground operations in Gaza are still in their early stages and have not yet achieved their strategic objective, the US may not abandon its prior biased backing of Israel at the Council, Liu Zhongmin, a professor at the Middle East Studies Institute of Shanghai International Studies University, told the Global Times.
Since 1945, a total of 34 UNSC draft resolutions related to the Israel-Palestine issue have been vetoed by the US. The majority of these resolutions were drafted to provide a framework for peace in the decades-long Israel-Palestine conflict, according to Al Jazeera. [My Emphasis]
Shouldn’t that “biased backing” be interpreted as abetting the carnage, being complicit in massive War Crimes?
I’ll ask again (last time I was told they are gone now, usurped into the oligarchy agencies):
Where are Anonymous and even Dark Overlord when they are truly needed?
If not total collapse of zionist weapons systems, at least they could get internal plans/discussions/evil lies.
HACKERS UNITE TO FREE PALESTINE
Posted by: hedlykarok | Oct 31 2023 13:44 utc | 23
I’ll ask again (last time I was told they are gone now, usurped into the oligarchy agencies):
Where are Anonymous and even Dark Overlord when they are truly needed?
If not total collapse of zionist weapons systems, at least they could get internal plans/discussions/evil lies.
HACKERS UNITE TO FREE PALESTINE
Posted by: hedlykarok | Oct 31 2023 13:44 utc | 24
The bloodthirsty Zionist psychos in Israel and Washington will soon plunge us into WW3. And this will go nuclear very very quickly.
Posted by: anon | Oct 31 2023 13:45 utc | 25
The bloodthirsty Zionist psychos in Israel and Washington will soon plunge us into WW3. And this will go nuclear very very quickly.
Posted by: anon | Oct 31 2023 13:45 utc | 26
A quick recapitulation of the war aims successfully completed by Hamas:
– strenghtening the leadership of Netanyahu and the government of the Likud party, when they were threatened by a rising tide of scandals;
– rescuing Qatar from a difficult situation, when it was sidelined by the Chinese led Iran-Saudi rapproachment;
– sabotaging all the recent diplomatic efforts by China in the Middle East;
– strenghtening the position of Erdogan, both internally, by distracting Turkish people from their economy, and externally, by raising the tension over key issues like the gas fields and the migrant crisis;
– distracting the American public from the failure in the Ukraine.
Also the leadership of Hamas contacted me personally so that I can bring this thankful message to Giyane: «thanks to your devout zakat, dear Giyane, we are spending it all on coke and hookers here in Doha».
They have a message for Arch, too: «as you correctly pointed out, we aim at an honourable death, a heart attack while partying with the aforementioned coke and hookers».
The Five Eyes and the Jewish mafia, who offered the hookers and the coke (for a price obviously, those people are greedier than Epstein), are thankful too.
Posted by: SG | Oct 31 2023 13:46 utc | 27
A quick recapitulation of the war aims successfully completed by Hamas:
– strenghtening the leadership of Netanyahu and the government of the Likud party, when they were threatened by a rising tide of scandals;
– rescuing Qatar from a difficult situation, when it was sidelined by the Chinese led Iran-Saudi rapproachment;
– sabotaging all the recent diplomatic efforts by China in the Middle East;
– strenghtening the position of Erdogan, both internally, by distracting Turkish people from their economy, and externally, by raising the tension over key issues like the gas fields and the migrant crisis;
– distracting the American public from the failure in the Ukraine.
Also the leadership of Hamas contacted me personally so that I can bring this thankful message to Giyane: «thanks to your devout zakat, dear Giyane, we are spending it all on coke and hookers here in Doha».
They have a message for Arch, too: «as you correctly pointed out, we aim at an honourable death, a heart attack while partying with the aforementioned coke and hookers».
The Five Eyes and the Jewish mafia, who offered the hookers and the coke (for a price obviously, those people are greedier than Epstein), are thankful too.
Posted by: SG | Oct 31 2023 13:46 utc | 28
@ karlof1 | Oct 31 2023 13:39 utc | 11
—
The UNSC veto provision insures that the UN is dysfunctional.
The UN is broken by design.
Posted by: too scents | Oct 31 2023 13:49 utc | 29
@ karlof1 | Oct 31 2023 13:39 utc | 11
—
The UNSC veto provision insures that the UN is dysfunctional.
The UN is broken by design.
Posted by: too scents | Oct 31 2023 13:49 utc | 30
Another day of genocide, yet all RT seems to care about is the demonstration in Dagestan. Maria Finoshina should be fired.
Rania and Abby had a great discussion on yt.
Posted by: liveload | Oct 31 2023 13:25 utc | 7
The *entire point* of the operation, imo. Russia has been benefiting big from (very affordable) geopolitical posturing over this crisis. A very clever device by whoever did it. Agitate Muslims in a part of “Mother Russia” to go Jew hunting. Get it on reddit. And then sit back for the inevitable.
Someone enjoyed *forcing* the Russians to publicly do mea-culpas. These moments when the mask is dropped, or is forced to be shifted, are priceless.
Just priceless.
Posted by: robinthehood | Oct 31 2023 13:55 utc | 31
Another day of genocide, yet all RT seems to care about is the demonstration in Dagestan. Maria Finoshina should be fired.
Rania and Abby had a great discussion on yt.
Posted by: liveload | Oct 31 2023 13:25 utc | 7
The *entire point* of the operation, imo. Russia has been benefiting big from (very affordable) geopolitical posturing over this crisis. A very clever device by whoever did it. Agitate Muslims in a part of “Mother Russia” to go Jew hunting. Get it on reddit. And then sit back for the inevitable.
Someone enjoyed *forcing* the Russians to publicly do mea-culpas. These moments when the mask is dropped, or is forced to be shifted, are priceless.
Just priceless.
Posted by: robinthehood | Oct 31 2023 13:55 utc | 32
Jonathan W | Oct 31 2023 13:35 utc | 9–
My comment relates to the Bigger picture beyond Gaza, meaning the region and the world. The Messianic Zionists and their equally Messianic abettors the Cristo-Zionists are likely to initiate a much larger war with their continuing Messianic goals, which the peoples surrounding Palestine will not allow to occur as there’re far too many for the governments to restrain.
IMO, today’s UNSC meeting is being seen as the last chance by many, that if it fails to act and order a ceasefire–and provide the means to enforce it. If the Outlaw US Empire and/or its vassals Veto another resolution, IMO that will send a very loud message to those people surrounding Palestine that they must now act to save their brothers as the vetoes will continue to be invoked showing the UNSC powerless to halt the Genocide.
How to stop crazed, messianic people who think they are the good when they are actually the evil? I believe it was Crooke who made the comparison to The Crusades.
Jonathan W | Oct 31 2023 13:35 utc | 9–
My comment relates to the Bigger picture beyond Gaza, meaning the region and the world. The Messianic Zionists and their equally Messianic abettors the Cristo-Zionists are likely to initiate a much larger war with their continuing Messianic goals, which the peoples surrounding Palestine will not allow to occur as there’re far too many for the governments to restrain.
IMO, today’s UNSC meeting is being seen as the last chance by many, that if it fails to act and order a ceasefire–and provide the means to enforce it. If the Outlaw US Empire and/or its vassals Veto another resolution, IMO that will send a very loud message to those people surrounding Palestine that they must now act to save their brothers as the vetoes will continue to be invoked showing the UNSC powerless to halt the Genocide.
How to stop crazed, messianic people who think they are the good when they are actually the evil? I believe it was Crooke who made the comparison to The Crusades.
hedlykarok at 12, there was a post last topic about a Telegram comment that Anonymous got into Israel gov’ernment intelligence and got 11 terabytes of data. It’s somewhere in the lesser 200 posts. Rumor? No idea. Take it for what you will as the Fog of War hides much.
That said this site is good for gathering far rumor to be grist for the mill and sifted before consumption. You just need to keep an eye out for tidbits amid the general melee. I’d watch for interesting revelations in the coming weeks to confirm the above breach…
Posted by: titmouse | Oct 31 2023 13:57 utc | 35
hedlykarok at 12, there was a post last topic about a Telegram comment that Anonymous got into Israel gov’ernment intelligence and got 11 terabytes of data. It’s somewhere in the lesser 200 posts. Rumor? No idea. Take it for what you will as the Fog of War hides much.
That said this site is good for gathering far rumor to be grist for the mill and sifted before consumption. You just need to keep an eye out for tidbits amid the general melee. I’d watch for interesting revelations in the coming weeks to confirm the above breach…
Posted by: titmouse | Oct 31 2023 13:57 utc | 36
too scents | Oct 31 2023 13:49 utc | 15–
“Broken” is a good term. IMO, it was designed to allow for continuing unilateralism, which has always been US policy going back to 1783 when it formally became independent.
too scents | Oct 31 2023 13:49 utc | 15–
“Broken” is a good term. IMO, it was designed to allow for continuing unilateralism, which has always been US policy going back to 1783 when it formally became independent.
Oops, I forgot to mention one more “mission accomplished”:
– exposing the rifts in the so called “Global South”. Hindu nationalists are taking notes about “how it’s done”, right now.
Posted by: SG | Oct 31 2023 14:07 utc | 39
Oops, I forgot to mention one more “mission accomplished”:
– exposing the rifts in the so called “Global South”. Hindu nationalists are taking notes about “how it’s done”, right now.
Posted by: SG | Oct 31 2023 14:07 utc | 40
Posted by: anon | Oct 31 2023 13:45 utc | 13
Possible? Maybe. But I doubt it.
Do you remember the nuclear strike-scare of last year? That Russia is seconds away of using nuclear missiles in Ukraine? In my region (more than a thousand km away from the frontline) scared housewifes (and men) were buying Iodine tablets. What happened? Nothing.
Those in power want to keep the people in constant fear … like deer in front of the headlights.
Posted by: NoName | Oct 31 2023 14:08 utc | 41
Posted by: anon | Oct 31 2023 13:45 utc | 13
Possible? Maybe. But I doubt it.
Do you remember the nuclear strike-scare of last year? That Russia is seconds away of using nuclear missiles in Ukraine? In my region (more than a thousand km away from the frontline) scared housewifes (and men) were buying Iodine tablets. What happened? Nothing.
Those in power want to keep the people in constant fear … like deer in front of the headlights.
Posted by: NoName | Oct 31 2023 14:08 utc | 42
@ titmouse 18
Thank you for the info, I must have missed that. I try to keep up daily but when I miss 1 or 2, there’s too much info to catch up quickly.
Posted by: hedlykarok | Oct 31 2023 14:13 utc | 43
@ titmouse 18
Thank you for the info, I must have missed that. I try to keep up daily but when I miss 1 or 2, there’s too much info to catch up quickly.
Posted by: hedlykarok | Oct 31 2023 14:13 utc | 44
Someone enjoyed *forcing* the Russians to publicly do mea-culpas. These moments when the mask is dropped, or is forced to be shifted, are priceless.
Which has done basically fuck all for them. And will continue to do fuck all. These Maericans apparently consider themselves very clever but honestly what a waste of resources and time. They’re only preaching to the choir. The undecided group is exceedingly small here and of no consequence anyway.
What’s more notable is the massive revulsion rising access global civil society for Israels mass murder. No it won’t stop them, but time continues to move forward. The world is not going to easily change its view, leading to the increasing isolation of Israel – particularly as daddy Maerica goes full retard..that is, bankrupt.
Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Oct 31 2023 14:14 utc | 45
Someone enjoyed *forcing* the Russians to publicly do mea-culpas. These moments when the mask is dropped, or is forced to be shifted, are priceless.
Which has done basically fuck all for them. And will continue to do fuck all. These Maericans apparently consider themselves very clever but honestly what a waste of resources and time. They’re only preaching to the choir. The undecided group is exceedingly small here and of no consequence anyway.
What’s more notable is the massive revulsion rising access global civil society for Israels mass murder. No it won’t stop them, but time continues to move forward. The world is not going to easily change its view, leading to the increasing isolation of Israel – particularly as daddy Maerica goes full retard..that is, bankrupt.
Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Oct 31 2023 14:14 utc | 46
I have seen reports that there are around fifty war ships from varying Countries in the Environs of the Middle East.
Given that there is no obvious coalition of the willing and no obvious command structure, one can only conclude that in all probability their intended role is to evacuate Nationals from a war zone.
On hearing the deranged biblical rhetoric from Netanyahu, and the response from Erdogan, the conclusion has to be that the West fears that the “Muslim hordes” will invade Israel and do to the `Israelis what the `Israelis are trying to do to the Palestinians. A not impossible scenario which could quickly escalate into an uncontrolled massacre.
On the other hand, if this multinational fleet is intent on war under the same leadership that is being defeated in Ukraine, a favourable outcome seems unlikely.
It would not be a good look for the West to spend blood and treasure on evacuating the West’s dual citizens whilst completely ignoring the plight of murdered, starved and thirst wracked Palestinians, the victims of Israeli hatred and aggression.
Posted by: CitizenSmith | Oct 31 2023 14:15 utc | 47
I have seen reports that there are around fifty war ships from varying Countries in the Environs of the Middle East.
Given that there is no obvious coalition of the willing and no obvious command structure, one can only conclude that in all probability their intended role is to evacuate Nationals from a war zone.
On hearing the deranged biblical rhetoric from Netanyahu, and the response from Erdogan, the conclusion has to be that the West fears that the “Muslim hordes” will invade Israel and do to the `Israelis what the `Israelis are trying to do to the Palestinians. A not impossible scenario which could quickly escalate into an uncontrolled massacre.
On the other hand, if this multinational fleet is intent on war under the same leadership that is being defeated in Ukraine, a favourable outcome seems unlikely.
It would not be a good look for the West to spend blood and treasure on evacuating the West’s dual citizens whilst completely ignoring the plight of murdered, starved and thirst wracked Palestinians, the victims of Israeli hatred and aggression.
Posted by: CitizenSmith | Oct 31 2023 14:15 utc | 48
Posted by: SG | Oct 31 2023 13:46 utc | 14
Let’s not forget Russia. They got some choice freebies Someone helped them out bigly here.
Muslim Brotherhood cluster also needs to be mentioned. Turkey, Qatar, Egypt (suppressed), Syria (suppressed). These are all MB affiliated. Is it agreed that they have retaken control over the “Islamist” geopolitical discourse from the Khomeinist Shia?
Have you seen the Nasrullah short videos recently?
https://nitter.net/Terror_Alarm/status/1719117654852616591#m
https://nitter.net/Elias_the_Zeus/status/1719352642982261004#m
The only rational choice for the turbaned ones is to posture but loss of prestige is real.
Posted by: robinthehood | Oct 31 2023 14:18 utc | 49
Posted by: SG | Oct 31 2023 13:46 utc | 14
Let’s not forget Russia. They got some choice freebies Someone helped them out bigly here.
Muslim Brotherhood cluster also needs to be mentioned. Turkey, Qatar, Egypt (suppressed), Syria (suppressed). These are all MB affiliated. Is it agreed that they have retaken control over the “Islamist” geopolitical discourse from the Khomeinist Shia?
Have you seen the Nasrullah short videos recently?
https://nitter.net/Terror_Alarm/status/1719117654852616591#m
https://nitter.net/Elias_the_Zeus/status/1719352642982261004#m
The only rational choice for the turbaned ones is to posture but loss of prestige is real.
Posted by: robinthehood | Oct 31 2023 14:18 utc | 50
The only rational choice for the turbaned ones is to posture but loss of prestige is real.
Are you trying to convince yourself or us?
The loss of prestige?.
Holy shit Israelis really are as deluded as Maericans. You’re fighting a militia. A militia made of teenagers with small arms. Prestige! Israel is a fucking pariah.
Israel is showing the world public its a bunch of mass murders just like the Nazis. You think killing 10000 civilians is a win? Bizarre and outlandish understanding of how the world works.
Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Oct 31 2023 14:24 utc | 51
The only rational choice for the turbaned ones is to posture but loss of prestige is real.
Are you trying to convince yourself or us?
The loss of prestige?.
Holy shit Israelis really are as deluded as Maericans. You’re fighting a militia. A militia made of teenagers with small arms. Prestige! Israel is a fucking pariah.
Israel is showing the world public its a bunch of mass murders just like the Nazis. You think killing 10000 civilians is a win? Bizarre and outlandish understanding of how the world works.
Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Oct 31 2023 14:24 utc | 52
Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Oct 31 2023 14:24 utc | 26
Thank you. Thank you, thank you.
Posted by: Mexicana | Oct 31 2023 14:33 utc | 53
Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Oct 31 2023 14:24 utc | 26
Thank you. Thank you, thank you.
Posted by: Mexicana | Oct 31 2023 14:33 utc | 54
I can make a few points about what is happening in the Gaza Strip.
1. The whole world now has the opportunity to clearly see two methods of struggle – the openly barbaric one demonstrated by Israel (and its sponsors) in the Gaza Strip, and the emphatically civilized one demonstrated by Russia against the Ukrainian Nazis (I do not write ‘in Ukraine’, because combat actions are essentially carried out on the territory of the Russian Federation – the corresponding regions have become part of the Russian Federation and are part of its territory). Targeted, calibrated strikes from the Russian army VS. massive carpet bombing from the Israeli army. The absence of obstacles on the part of Russia in obtaining basic things (fuel, medicine, food, energy, etc.) for Ukrainians VS. blockade of the Gaza Strip by Israel.
2. Many of those who are now actively and even quite sincerely speaking out in support of the Palestinians are largely to blame for what is happening now in the Gaza Strip – if not directly, then indirectly. Countries such as Russia are also to blame. Ok, maybe ‘guilt’ is not a completely accurate term, but you can call it responsibility. Many of those who are now loudly worried about the fate of the Palestinians, who are loudly mourning the hundreds of killed children and thousands of civilians, who are loudly calling for a ceasefire – all these international players bear their share of responsibility. Including Russia.
I have said it several times, but I can repeat that impunity has corresponding consequences.
For many years and even decades, Israel was allowed to do everything that it did (and is doing) towards the Palestinians. The international community essentially turned a blind eye to many of Israel’s disproportionate actions, aggressiveness, cruelty, insolence, lawlessness and even crimes. This was the way it was accepted. This is still accepted (the hope that at least now this will change is negligible). Well, impunity has corresponding consequences.
I very much doubt that Israel could have done what it does if there had been an adequate, tough, concrete and unambiguous reaction from the international community – something similar, for example, to sanctions against the DPRK, but only much tougher and larger-scale. If you kill Palestinians, if you oppress them, if you seize and occupy their land (as well as Syrian land) – you must face the consequences. A kind of international ostracism towards Israel is what should have happened, at a minimum. Refusal or minimization of cooperation with this country, a ban on the supply of technologies there (at least critical ones), a complete ban on the supply of weapons to Israel, strict economic sanctions, a ban on investment in this country. A number of government officials in this country (for example, high-ranking military officials giving orders or government officials passing anti-Palestinian laws) had to be put on the international wanted list. No, it is not at all necessary to hunt for them. These people simply should not be able to travel outside of Israel – they should be denied access to other countries under threat of arrest. I have listed only the tip of the iceberg. There are more than enough measures to take. There is just no intention or desire to use these measures.
None of the above applied to Israel. This country was allowed to continue to do to the Palestinians (and Syrians) everything that it does. Yes, there was some condemnation in the media, there were even some UN resolutions, there were other condemnations. But this is all blah blah blah. It didn’t lead to anything. Just an empty (somewhat ‘ritual’/decorative) shaking of air. Israel saw perfectly well that the matter never went beyond a formal “condemnation” and interpreted it accordingly. Israel saw very well that it was allowed to do everything that it did.
Even Russia allowed Israel to behave this way. The matter did not go beyond the routine “expression of concern.” In Syria, Israel has repeatedly interfered with the Russian anti-terrorist operation. I remember very well the case in 2018 when an Israeli plane openly and brazenly covered itself with a Russian plane, as a result of which it was shot down by Syrian air defense and the Russian pilots were killed. The Russian Ministry of Defense stated then that the blame for the downing of the Russian plane and the death of the crew lay entirely with the Israeli side. So what? A harsh response, the recall of the ambassador, a decrease in the level of economic and technical cooperation, the court passing sentences in absentia to specific Israeli military personnel…? No. Nothing. Again, just an “expression of concern.”
It is no secret that Israeli mercenaries are now fighting on the side of the Ukrainian Nazis against the Russian army. There was a whole battalion of Israelis killing Russian soldiers. Absurdity, surrealism – Jews(!) are fighting on the side of the Nazis(!) against those whose ancestors saved them during the Second World War. Impossible, unimaginable, but it happens. And what did Russia do? Nothing.
Sometimes Israel “bribed” Russia with its play on the theme of the memory of the Second World War, knowing full well that for Russia this was very important (even critically important). I remember how President Putin in 2020 was present in Israel at the opening of the monument. The event was organized very pompously and solemnly. Putin became emotional and almost burst into tears. I don’t know how sincere Israel was then. At least I have doubts about this. But the important thing is that, seeing such “gifts” from Israel, seeing such a reverent attitude (again, I don’t know how sincere it is) towards the memory of the Second World War, Russia in some sense “turned a blind eye” to Israel’s policies regarding the Palestinians. Thus also allowing Israel to do everything that it does.
European countries, Asian countries, African countries, many other countries – they all traded well with Israel, cooperated with it, knowing full well about Israel’s policies and actions towards the Palestinians (and Syrians). The latest Israeli lawlessness was met by all these countries with either silence or only an “expression of concern.” No more. Thus, Israel was allowed to commit and continue lawlessness.
And now all these countries are loudly worried about the barbaric bombing of the Gaza Strip, about thousands of civilians killed, and are calling for an end to the genocide in Gaza… Ugh. There is something disgustingly hypocritical and ridiculous in all this. All of these countries (including Russia, unfortunately) should have been concerned much earlier, acting firmly and clearly, rather than silently allowing Israel to do whatever it has been doing for years.
Impunity has corresponding consequences. There is no point in expressing concern and sympathy now. Israeli impunity should not have been allowed.
I can make a few points about what is happening in the Gaza Strip.
1. The whole world now has the opportunity to clearly see two methods of struggle – the openly barbaric one demonstrated by Israel (and its sponsors) in the Gaza Strip, and the emphatically civilized one demonstrated by Russia against the Ukrainian Nazis (I do not write ‘in Ukraine’, because combat actions are essentially carried out on the territory of the Russian Federation – the corresponding regions have become part of the Russian Federation and are part of its territory). Targeted, calibrated strikes from the Russian army VS. massive carpet bombing from the Israeli army. The absence of obstacles on the part of Russia in obtaining basic things (fuel, medicine, food, energy, etc.) for Ukrainians VS. blockade of the Gaza Strip by Israel.
2. Many of those who are now actively and even quite sincerely speaking out in support of the Palestinians are largely to blame for what is happening now in the Gaza Strip – if not directly, then indirectly. Countries such as Russia are also to blame. Ok, maybe ‘guilt’ is not a completely accurate term, but you can call it responsibility. Many of those who are now loudly worried about the fate of the Palestinians, who are loudly mourning the hundreds of killed children and thousands of civilians, who are loudly calling for a ceasefire – all these international players bear their share of responsibility. Including Russia.
I have said it several times, but I can repeat that impunity has corresponding consequences.
For many years and even decades, Israel was allowed to do everything that it did (and is doing) towards the Palestinians. The international community essentially turned a blind eye to many of Israel’s disproportionate actions, aggressiveness, cruelty, insolence, lawlessness and even crimes. This was the way it was accepted. This is still accepted (the hope that at least now this will change is negligible). Well, impunity has corresponding consequences.
I very much doubt that Israel could have done what it does if there had been an adequate, tough, concrete and unambiguous reaction from the international community – something similar, for example, to sanctions against the DPRK, but only much tougher and larger-scale. If you kill Palestinians, if you oppress them, if you seize and occupy their land (as well as Syrian land) – you must face the consequences. A kind of international ostracism towards Israel is what should have happened, at a minimum. Refusal or minimization of cooperation with this country, a ban on the supply of technologies there (at least critical ones), a complete ban on the supply of weapons to Israel, strict economic sanctions, a ban on investment in this country. A number of government officials in this country (for example, high-ranking military officials giving orders or government officials passing anti-Palestinian laws) had to be put on the international wanted list. No, it is not at all necessary to hunt for them. These people simply should not be able to travel outside of Israel – they should be denied access to other countries under threat of arrest. I have listed only the tip of the iceberg. There are more than enough measures to take. There is just no intention or desire to use these measures.
None of the above applied to Israel. This country was allowed to continue to do to the Palestinians (and Syrians) everything that it does. Yes, there was some condemnation in the media, there were even some UN resolutions, there were other condemnations. But this is all blah blah blah. It didn’t lead to anything. Just an empty (somewhat ‘ritual’/decorative) shaking of air. Israel saw perfectly well that the matter never went beyond a formal “condemnation” and interpreted it accordingly. Israel saw very well that it was allowed to do everything that it did.
Even Russia allowed Israel to behave this way. The matter did not go beyond the routine “expression of concern.” In Syria, Israel has repeatedly interfered with the Russian anti-terrorist operation. I remember very well the case in 2018 when an Israeli plane openly and brazenly covered itself with a Russian plane, as a result of which it was shot down by Syrian air defense and the Russian pilots were killed. The Russian Ministry of Defense stated then that the blame for the downing of the Russian plane and the death of the crew lay entirely with the Israeli side. So what? A harsh response, the recall of the ambassador, a decrease in the level of economic and technical cooperation, the court passing sentences in absentia to specific Israeli military personnel…? No. Nothing. Again, just an “expression of concern.”
It is no secret that Israeli mercenaries are now fighting on the side of the Ukrainian Nazis against the Russian army. There was a whole battalion of Israelis killing Russian soldiers. Absurdity, surrealism – Jews(!) are fighting on the side of the Nazis(!) against those whose ancestors saved them during the Second World War. Impossible, unimaginable, but it happens. And what did Russia do? Nothing.
Sometimes Israel “bribed” Russia with its play on the theme of the memory of the Second World War, knowing full well that for Russia this was very important (even critically important). I remember how President Putin in 2020 was present in Israel at the opening of the monument. The event was organized very pompously and solemnly. Putin became emotional and almost burst into tears. I don’t know how sincere Israel was then. At least I have doubts about this. But the important thing is that, seeing such “gifts” from Israel, seeing such a reverent attitude (again, I don’t know how sincere it is) towards the memory of the Second World War, Russia in some sense “turned a blind eye” to Israel’s policies regarding the Palestinians. Thus also allowing Israel to do everything that it does.
European countries, Asian countries, African countries, many other countries – they all traded well with Israel, cooperated with it, knowing full well about Israel’s policies and actions towards the Palestinians (and Syrians). The latest Israeli lawlessness was met by all these countries with either silence or only an “expression of concern.” No more. Thus, Israel was allowed to commit and continue lawlessness.
And now all these countries are loudly worried about the barbaric bombing of the Gaza Strip, about thousands of civilians killed, and are calling for an end to the genocide in Gaza… Ugh. There is something disgustingly hypocritical and ridiculous in all this. All of these countries (including Russia, unfortunately) should have been concerned much earlier, acting firmly and clearly, rather than silently allowing Israel to do whatever it has been doing for years.
Impunity has corresponding consequences. There is no point in expressing concern and sympathy now. Israeli impunity should not have been allowed.
@ citizensmith #24
The ‘coalition’ warships in/around ME are mostly from NATO countries and Denmark, from what I read. Neither UN nor NATO has taken a vote on any military action nor are they ever going to get it (Turkey would veto).
I realize that the consensus is both are useless but the surefire way to enrage the ROW against the US and it’s vassals is to help the zionist state slaughter non-zionazis.
Also saw a report that China has sent 6 ships there as well and Russia is letting Iran use it’s base in Syria to send weapons through.
Posted by: hedlykarok | Oct 31 2023 14:40 utc | 57
@ citizensmith #24
The ‘coalition’ warships in/around ME are mostly from NATO countries and Denmark, from what I read. Neither UN nor NATO has taken a vote on any military action nor are they ever going to get it (Turkey would veto).
I realize that the consensus is both are useless but the surefire way to enrage the ROW against the US and it’s vassals is to help the zionist state slaughter non-zionazis.
Also saw a report that China has sent 6 ships there as well and Russia is letting Iran use it’s base in Syria to send weapons through.
Posted by: hedlykarok | Oct 31 2023 14:40 utc | 58
Posted by: too scents | Oct 31 2023 13:49 utc | 15
UN has been functional until it served the US (West) interest and until US could coerce it or disregard any decision.
In today world it can not more be used by US, so it’s necessary to delegitinate it.
Posted by: Mario | Oct 31 2023 14:43 utc | 59
Posted by: too scents | Oct 31 2023 13:49 utc | 15
UN has been functional until it served the US (West) interest and until US could coerce it or disregard any decision.
In today world it can not more be used by US, so it’s necessary to delegitinate it.
Posted by: Mario | Oct 31 2023 14:43 utc | 60
Given that there is no obvious coalition of the willing and no obvious command structure, one can only conclude that in all probability their intended role is to evacuate Nationals from a war zone.
Posted by: CitizenSmith | Oct 31 2023 14:15 utc | 24
There is no coalition of the willing because there is no need of one, all the the main western countries are now essentially a monolith when it comes to such matters.
The technical minutiae of command and control would be dealt with by NATO mechanisms I suppose.
Posted by: Satepestage | Oct 31 2023 14:46 utc | 61
Given that there is no obvious coalition of the willing and no obvious command structure, one can only conclude that in all probability their intended role is to evacuate Nationals from a war zone.
Posted by: CitizenSmith | Oct 31 2023 14:15 utc | 24
There is no coalition of the willing because there is no need of one, all the the main western countries are now essentially a monolith when it comes to such matters.
The technical minutiae of command and control would be dealt with by NATO mechanisms I suppose.
Posted by: Satepestage | Oct 31 2023 14:46 utc | 62
Posted by: karlof1 | Oct 31 2023 13:55 utc | 17
My point relates to the mindset. The west overpromises and underdelivers and when it does not get its way we see what happens. What we see Russians doing constantly is the direct opposite. We may expand the parameters all we want here but, as someone said, this is God’s way to teach Americans geography.
Posted by: Jonathan W | Oct 31 2023 14:52 utc | 63
Posted by: karlof1 | Oct 31 2023 13:55 utc | 17
My point relates to the mindset. The west overpromises and underdelivers and when it does not get its way we see what happens. What we see Russians doing constantly is the direct opposite. We may expand the parameters all we want here but, as someone said, this is God’s way to teach Americans geography.
Posted by: Jonathan W | Oct 31 2023 14:52 utc | 64
Posted by: hedlykarok | Oct 31 2023 14:40 utc | 29
According to the the Youtube channel „Defense politics Asia“ those 6 chinese ships have nothing to do with Gaza. Watch his video about that video and make of it what you want.
Posted by: NoName | Oct 31 2023 14:53 utc | 65
Posted by: hedlykarok | Oct 31 2023 14:40 utc | 29
According to the the Youtube channel „Defense politics Asia“ those 6 chinese ships have nothing to do with Gaza. Watch his video about that video and make of it what you want.
Posted by: NoName | Oct 31 2023 14:53 utc | 66
Maybe my “warning” calibrator is off, but I do sense danger on approach in the U.S.
Not the usual CIA/Mossad/FBI BS shootings, race card chaos,ect… but external. All the articles from Russia, Iran, China, Turkey, North Korea, even some within US, EU are pointing to an upheaval within US… no more money printing and exporting global inflation will be tolerated.
Many Nations are livid at the prospect of oil inflation & further economic crisis as initiated once again by Fed.and their printing mania for more war.
We will soon see an “external” internal campaign rock the money changers inside US.
Who knows how the press will spin it all, but my spider senses tell me it’s the chaotic web woven that catches the fly. All collaboration signs point to economic finish line. The rest of the world isn’t going to do the banker 3.0 WW so that the Anglos are that last one’s standing.
Hamas hitting Israel at its “weakest”… was just an “analogy” a “metaphor” for the coming US demise.
I’m honestly not even seeing bombs going off everywhere or anything like that, just economic chaos that Fed/Gov isn’t quite ready for that will lead to (just like Ukraine) outcomes they could never imagine or predict because of their own delusional bubble they live in, their own economic hitman “plan” for US citizens (like they had for Russia), not connected to us real, on the ground, citizens, nor taking into account the now decades of external planning for this very moment of weakness & hubris.
The symbolism of Rothschild Anglo global Banking vs rest of world, couldn’t be clearer, I’m not talking about “race” or “religion”, I’m talking about “money” & “power” “control”…
Times up….
Posted by: Trubind1 | Oct 31 2023 14:58 utc | 67
Maybe my “warning” calibrator is off, but I do sense danger on approach in the U.S.
Not the usual CIA/Mossad/FBI BS shootings, race card chaos,ect… but external. All the articles from Russia, Iran, China, Turkey, North Korea, even some within US, EU are pointing to an upheaval within US… no more money printing and exporting global inflation will be tolerated.
Many Nations are livid at the prospect of oil inflation & further economic crisis as initiated once again by Fed.and their printing mania for more war.
We will soon see an “external” internal campaign rock the money changers inside US.
Who knows how the press will spin it all, but my spider senses tell me it’s the chaotic web woven that catches the fly. All collaboration signs point to economic finish line. The rest of the world isn’t going to do the banker 3.0 WW so that the Anglos are that last one’s standing.
Hamas hitting Israel at its “weakest”… was just an “analogy” a “metaphor” for the coming US demise.
I’m honestly not even seeing bombs going off everywhere or anything like that, just economic chaos that Fed/Gov isn’t quite ready for that will lead to (just like Ukraine) outcomes they could never imagine or predict because of their own delusional bubble they live in, their own economic hitman “plan” for US citizens (like they had for Russia), not connected to us real, on the ground, citizens, nor taking into account the now decades of external planning for this very moment of weakness & hubris.
The symbolism of Rothschild Anglo global Banking vs rest of world, couldn’t be clearer, I’m not talking about “race” or “religion”, I’m talking about “money” & “power” “control”…
Times up….
Posted by: Trubind1 | Oct 31 2023 14:58 utc | 68
I just realised the video is 6 days old.
So you can find the video faster search for: Chinese Navy in Middle East vs Israel-Hamas War
Posted by: NoName | Oct 31 2023 14:59 utc | 69
I just realised the video is 6 days old.
So you can find the video faster search for: Chinese Navy in Middle East vs Israel-Hamas War
Posted by: NoName | Oct 31 2023 14:59 utc | 70
It’s a strategic mistake for the Likud to refuse a ceasefire, because the IDF appears to be not-winning. All the IDF seems capable of is blind rage attacks. The IDF can’t prevent Hezbollah and Hamas from their nightly raids.
The longer this hot war of attrition continues the worse off for the Jewish State. Hamas wants a long hot war.
Posted by: Exile | Oct 31 2023 15:06 utc | 71
It’s a strategic mistake for the Likud to refuse a ceasefire, because the IDF appears to be not-winning. All the IDF seems capable of is blind rage attacks. The IDF can’t prevent Hezbollah and Hamas from their nightly raids.
The longer this hot war of attrition continues the worse off for the Jewish State. Hamas wants a long hot war.
Posted by: Exile | Oct 31 2023 15:06 utc | 72
Posted by: karlof1 | Oct 31 2023 13:24 utc | 6
What’s the mystery? Russia has made it clear it wants a ceasefire and Israel has made it clear it does not. So why would Russia meed to burn the bridges if it can get the second best? This is so completely alien to how the US would “handle” this.
Posted by: Jonathan W | Oct 31 2023 13:35 utc | 9
Exactly, johnathon: Diplomacy is the art of the possible
Posted by: karlof1 | Oct 31 2023 13:24 utc | 6
What’s the mystery? Russia has made it clear it wants a ceasefire and Israel has made it clear it does not. So why would Russia meed to burn the bridges if it can get the second best? This is so completely alien to how the US would “handle” this.
Posted by: Jonathan W | Oct 31 2023 13:35 utc | 9
Exactly, johnathon: Diplomacy is the art of the possible
Israel knows it is easier to ask forgiveness than ask permission.
When they come and ask, it shall be denied.
There will only be peace when Israel and USA is no more.
Posted by: g wiltek | Oct 31 2023 15:23 utc | 75
Israel knows it is easier to ask forgiveness than ask permission.
When they come and ask, it shall be denied.
There will only be peace when Israel and USA is no more.
Posted by: g wiltek | Oct 31 2023 15:23 utc | 76
Can the world not intervene in the massacres going on in Gaza and West Bank.
The images of the naked dance of malicious violence in the West Bank have appeared. Massacres are not only going on but intensifying. The world is watching well aware of what is happening. But it is unable or unwilling to intervene. Israel is beyond reason and diplomatic persuasion. There has to be a credible military threat to Israel for it to relent. Israel need not be destroyed. But it surely needs to be humbled.
The US and the West are interested parties. Their approach is to let it go on as far as it can go, and halt it before reaching the brink. Followed by endless negotiations and dirty practices.
But what about the civilised world? The Multi-polar world, which is already supposed to have become a reality. Why then is this multipolar world unable to stop this rampaging military machine which is completely deaf to any humanitarian pleas, let alone calls for justice. It wants to destroy Palestine, or what remains of it.
As of now only the axis of resistance, Hezbollah and Iran and Yemen are the countries which have shown the willingness for a military intervention. They face dilemmas which are real, the risks involved. But why cannot there be any talk of the multipolar world giving Israel an ultimatum to halt. Is it because Israel has nuclear weapons. But Russia and China also have nuclear weapons. Can’t they warn Israel of destruction if Israel dares to use nuclear weapons.
It has to begin with an urgent political initiative to build a platform of the multipolar world. It can be a Coalition for Justice to Palestine. An immediate ceasefire, failing which maybe oil embargo and military intervention. There is sufficient sanity and astuteness in the multipolar world unlike the insane political class of the Western countries. Israel has to be humbled for the peace of the world. Conflicts have to be resolved and not allowed to fester. Currently the West is divided against itself. It has failed miserably in Ukraine. In contrast, there is an undercurrent of reconciliation in the multipolar world. They are in a position of strength and they should use it.
Posted by: Jhaji | Oct 31 2023 15:30 utc | 77
Can the world not intervene in the massacres going on in Gaza and West Bank.
The images of the naked dance of malicious violence in the West Bank have appeared. Massacres are not only going on but intensifying. The world is watching well aware of what is happening. But it is unable or unwilling to intervene. Israel is beyond reason and diplomatic persuasion. There has to be a credible military threat to Israel for it to relent. Israel need not be destroyed. But it surely needs to be humbled.
The US and the West are interested parties. Their approach is to let it go on as far as it can go, and halt it before reaching the brink. Followed by endless negotiations and dirty practices.
But what about the civilised world? The Multi-polar world, which is already supposed to have become a reality. Why then is this multipolar world unable to stop this rampaging military machine which is completely deaf to any humanitarian pleas, let alone calls for justice. It wants to destroy Palestine, or what remains of it.
As of now only the axis of resistance, Hezbollah and Iran and Yemen are the countries which have shown the willingness for a military intervention. They face dilemmas which are real, the risks involved. But why cannot there be any talk of the multipolar world giving Israel an ultimatum to halt. Is it because Israel has nuclear weapons. But Russia and China also have nuclear weapons. Can’t they warn Israel of destruction if Israel dares to use nuclear weapons.
It has to begin with an urgent political initiative to build a platform of the multipolar world. It can be a Coalition for Justice to Palestine. An immediate ceasefire, failing which maybe oil embargo and military intervention. There is sufficient sanity and astuteness in the multipolar world unlike the insane political class of the Western countries. Israel has to be humbled for the peace of the world. Conflicts have to be resolved and not allowed to fester. Currently the West is divided against itself. It has failed miserably in Ukraine. In contrast, there is an undercurrent of reconciliation in the multipolar world. They are in a position of strength and they should use it.
Posted by: Jhaji | Oct 31 2023 15:30 utc | 78
I can make a few points about what is happening in the Gaza Strip.
In summary, it’s Russia fault. (Of course, isn’t everything?)
Interesting how everyone is at fault except the instigator and primary patron of the little fascist terrorist state of Israel, the disunited states of Maerica, which apparently hardly warrants a mention.
Why is that do you suppose?
You say Israeli impunity should not have been allowed..that is of course true. But who allowed it? by your screed that would be Russia which is ridiculous.
Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Oct 31 2023 15:41 utc | 79
I can make a few points about what is happening in the Gaza Strip.
In summary, it’s Russia fault. (Of course, isn’t everything?)
Interesting how everyone is at fault except the instigator and primary patron of the little fascist terrorist state of Israel, the disunited states of Maerica, which apparently hardly warrants a mention.
Why is that do you suppose?
You say Israeli impunity should not have been allowed..that is of course true. But who allowed it? by your screed that would be Russia which is ridiculous.
Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Oct 31 2023 15:41 utc | 80
At least 100 Palestinians killed after Israeli attack on Jabalia camp in northern Gaza
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C-_GPXmucWw
Posted by: Apollyon | Oct 31 2023 15:45 utc | 81
At least 100 Palestinians killed after Israeli attack on Jabalia camp in northern Gaza
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C-_GPXmucWw
Posted by: Apollyon | Oct 31 2023 15:45 utc | 82
How to stop crazed, messianic people who think they are the good when they are actually the evil? I believe it was Crooke who made the comparison to The Crusades.
Posted by: karlof1 | Oct 31 2023 13:55 utc | 17
Given that Netanyahy and his team of zealots is basing his crusade upon their version of Biblical history, I am following in Martin Buber’s footsteps in critiquing that mistaken vision. I earlier pointed out that there was a practical reason for the Romans to eradicate the last of the Jewish temples in Jerusalem and forbid its continuance or the continuance of the Jewish state. It could not exist as an oppositional state, because of the very misapprehesions Netanyahu currently is operating under. He is an abberation, a throwback to Roman times. It was a mistake to award statehood to a religion such as this, and we are reaping the consequences.
As Buber advocated from Jerusalem, where as a Jew he had migrated before the state of Israel was established, the Jewish religious texts cannot be used in this manner, for, as a history of that ‘nation’ it presents a record of continual falling away from the original designs of Moses, not the promise of final victory, except in purely spiritual terms. Netanyahu’s edicts are a total misread of the texts of scripture, which even the Jewish people came to realize. The separation of church and state, which other nations have followed, is starkly presented in these texts, as I will attempt to show. The Romans knew the danger; so should we.
I am not a biblical scholar, and I won’t go further than the path I am choosing to follow. I will simply give examples of Buber’s thought. Others should feel free to find their own guiding examples, in concordance or in opposition. I’m beginning with the destruction of the third temple which Jesus predicted. He himself had taught in the synagogues of his time. He is recognized as a prophet by Moslems and Jews. So be it, for this discussion.
Thanks, everyone.
Posted by: juliania | Oct 31 2023 15:46 utc | 83
How to stop crazed, messianic people who think they are the good when they are actually the evil? I believe it was Crooke who made the comparison to The Crusades.
Posted by: karlof1 | Oct 31 2023 13:55 utc | 17
Given that Netanyahy and his team of zealots is basing his crusade upon their version of Biblical history, I am following in Martin Buber’s footsteps in critiquing that mistaken vision. I earlier pointed out that there was a practical reason for the Romans to eradicate the last of the Jewish temples in Jerusalem and forbid its continuance or the continuance of the Jewish state. It could not exist as an oppositional state, because of the very misapprehesions Netanyahu currently is operating under. He is an abberation, a throwback to Roman times. It was a mistake to award statehood to a religion such as this, and we are reaping the consequences.
As Buber advocated from Jerusalem, where as a Jew he had migrated before the state of Israel was established, the Jewish religious texts cannot be used in this manner, for, as a history of that ‘nation’ it presents a record of continual falling away from the original designs of Moses, not the promise of final victory, except in purely spiritual terms. Netanyahu’s edicts are a total misread of the texts of scripture, which even the Jewish people came to realize. The separation of church and state, which other nations have followed, is starkly presented in these texts, as I will attempt to show. The Romans knew the danger; so should we.
I am not a biblical scholar, and I won’t go further than the path I am choosing to follow. I will simply give examples of Buber’s thought. Others should feel free to find their own guiding examples, in concordance or in opposition. I’m beginning with the destruction of the third temple which Jesus predicted. He himself had taught in the synagogues of his time. He is recognized as a prophet by Moslems and Jews. So be it, for this discussion.
Thanks, everyone.
Posted by: juliania | Oct 31 2023 15:46 utc | 84
The misspelling of Netanyahu’s name was not intended; it was again my errant fingers that did it, sorry. I did proofread before I posted; my errant eyes overlooked the mistake.
Posted by: juliania | Oct 31 2023 15:49 utc | 85
The misspelling of Netanyahu’s name was not intended; it was again my errant fingers that did it, sorry. I did proofread before I posted; my errant eyes overlooked the mistake.
Posted by: juliania | Oct 31 2023 15:49 utc | 86
I’m beginning with the destruction of the third temple which Jesus predicted. He himself had taught in the synagogues of his time. He is recognized as a prophet by Moslems and Jews. So be it, for this discussion.
Posted by: juliania | Oct 31 2023 15:46 utc | 42
____
(Religious) Jews regard Jesus as a prophet? News to me…and to every Jew I’ve ever known.
Posted by: malenkov | Oct 31 2023 15:56 utc | 87
I’m beginning with the destruction of the third temple which Jesus predicted. He himself had taught in the synagogues of his time. He is recognized as a prophet by Moslems and Jews. So be it, for this discussion.
Posted by: juliania | Oct 31 2023 15:46 utc | 42
____
(Religious) Jews regard Jesus as a prophet? News to me…and to every Jew I’ve ever known.
Posted by: malenkov | Oct 31 2023 15:56 utc | 88
You cant judge this situation by what the polatitians are saying or the media. You all should know that.
What we see is blind panic from israel, england and the yanks.
————–
Here in england the torys have circyled the wagons and havent got a moral leg to stand on. The Gaza situation dropped down the reporting priority behind pathtic news items
(Cover up)
The whole country is aware of it.
The whole country is aware that england is now run by israel.
————-
Under the radar civil war has broken out in the oposition party Labour.
Its like lancing a boil ! (Kier Starma) the puss oozing from that man is clear to see.
————–
Keep an eye on the streets. World wide.
Whos streets ? Our streets.
Posted by: Mark2 | Oct 31 2023 15:57 utc | 89
You cant judge this situation by what the polatitians are saying or the media. You all should know that.
What we see is blind panic from israel, england and the yanks.
————–
Here in england the torys have circyled the wagons and havent got a moral leg to stand on. The Gaza situation dropped down the reporting priority behind pathtic news items
(Cover up)
The whole country is aware of it.
The whole country is aware that england is now run by israel.
————-
Under the radar civil war has broken out in the oposition party Labour.
Its like lancing a boil ! (Kier Starma) the puss oozing from that man is clear to see.
————–
Keep an eye on the streets. World wide.
Whos streets ? Our streets.
Posted by: Mark2 | Oct 31 2023 15:57 utc | 90
Hamas claims another IDF main battle tank knocked out of action today.
Posted by: Exile | Oct 31 2023 15:57 utc | 91
Hamas claims another IDF main battle tank knocked out of action today.
Posted by: Exile | Oct 31 2023 15:57 utc | 92
errant fingers
errant eyes
Posted by: juliania | Oct 31 2023 15:49 utc | 43
—
fingers ==> Matthew 5:30
eyes ==> Matthew 5:29
Corruption spoils the whole. Whither the Abrahamic Faiths?
Posted by: too scents | Oct 31 2023 16:00 utc | 93
errant fingers
errant eyes
Posted by: juliania | Oct 31 2023 15:49 utc | 43
—
fingers ==> Matthew 5:30
eyes ==> Matthew 5:29
Corruption spoils the whole. Whither the Abrahamic Faiths?
Posted by: too scents | Oct 31 2023 16:00 utc | 94
@ juliana
The correct spelling is Nuttyahoo
@ mark2
Any chance Jeremy could come back with a new party? My guess he would sweep the elections since Starmer is worse than Blair and of course the Tories are owned by the banksters.
Posted by: hedlykarok | Oct 31 2023 16:04 utc | 95
@ juliana
The correct spelling is Nuttyahoo
@ mark2
Any chance Jeremy could come back with a new party? My guess he would sweep the elections since Starmer is worse than Blair and of course the Tories are owned by the banksters.
Posted by: hedlykarok | Oct 31 2023 16:04 utc | 96
Posted by: NoName | Oct 31 2023 14:53 utc | 33
Shure, they are probably going fishing. 😎
Posted by: Mario | Oct 31 2023 16:17 utc | 97
Posted by: NoName | Oct 31 2023 14:53 utc | 33
Shure, they are probably going fishing. 😎
Posted by: Mario | Oct 31 2023 16:17 utc | 98
@ g wiltek | Oct 31 2023 15:23 utc | 38, who said, “There will only be peace when Israel and USA is no more.”
Yes, but unfortunately that will only be in the following scenario:
“Everything someday will be gone except silence
Earth will be quiet again
Seas from clouds will wash off the ashes of violence
Left as the memory of men
There will be no survivor my friend
Suddenly everyone will look surprised
Stars spinning wheels in the skies
Sun is scrambled in their eyes
While the moon circles like a vulture
Some stood at a window and cried
‘One tear I thought that would stop a war
But someone is killing me’
That’s the last hour to think anymore
Jelly and juice and bubbles, bubbles on the floor
Castles on the cliffs vanish
Cliffs like heaps of rubbish
Seen from the stars hour by hour
As splintered scraps and black powder
From here to heaven is a scar
Dead center, deep as death
All the idiots have left”
from “The House at Pooneil Corners” by Marty Balin & Paul Kantner, 1968
Posted by: Cabe | Oct 31 2023 16:18 utc | 99
@ g wiltek | Oct 31 2023 15:23 utc | 38, who said, “There will only be peace when Israel and USA is no more.”
Yes, but unfortunately that will only be in the following scenario:
“Everything someday will be gone except silence
Earth will be quiet again
Seas from clouds will wash off the ashes of violence
Left as the memory of men
There will be no survivor my friend
Suddenly everyone will look surprised
Stars spinning wheels in the skies
Sun is scrambled in their eyes
While the moon circles like a vulture
Some stood at a window and cried
‘One tear I thought that would stop a war
But someone is killing me’
That’s the last hour to think anymore
Jelly and juice and bubbles, bubbles on the floor
Castles on the cliffs vanish
Cliffs like heaps of rubbish
Seen from the stars hour by hour
As splintered scraps and black powder
From here to heaven is a scar
Dead center, deep as death
All the idiots have left”
from “The House at Pooneil Corners” by Marty Balin & Paul Kantner, 1968
Posted by: Cabe | Oct 31 2023 16:18 utc | 100