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September 3, 2023
Ukraine Open Thread 2023-209
Only for news & views directly related to the Ukraine conflict. The current open thread for other issues is here. Please stick to the topic. Contribute facts. Do not attack other commentators.
Comments
Posted by: rk | Sep 4 2023 10:15 utc | 144 Posted by: Wondrous | Sep 4 2023 12:13 utc | 301 Posted by: rk | Sep 4 2023 10:15 utc | 144 Posted by: Wondrous | Sep 4 2023 12:13 utc | 302 One law good for me , one different law for thee, ha? Posted by: jpc | Sep 4 2023 12:23 utc | 303 One law good for me , one different law for thee, ha? Posted by: jpc | Sep 4 2023 12:23 utc | 304 Posted by: Wondrous | Sep 4 2023 12:13 utc | 152 Posted by: unimperator | Sep 4 2023 12:30 utc | 305 Posted by: Wondrous | Sep 4 2023 12:13 utc | 152 Posted by: unimperator | Sep 4 2023 12:30 utc | 306 If Putin agrees a new grain deal instead doing what he should which is declaring war on Erdogan then we know he is just protecting his oligarchs Posted by: Night Tripper | Sep 4 2023 12:37 utc | 307 If Putin agrees a new grain deal instead doing what he should which is declaring war on Erdogan then we know he is just protecting his oligarchs Posted by: Night Tripper | Sep 4 2023 12:37 utc | 308 Wondrous | Sep 4 2023 12:13 utc | 152 Posted by: rk | Sep 4 2023 12:39 utc | 309 Wondrous | Sep 4 2023 12:13 utc | 152 Posted by: rk | Sep 4 2023 12:39 utc | 310 The reason I believe Russia has not sought to end this conflict in a thunderous blitz of blood and bricks all over Kiev and Lvov and others is that they do not want a moral equivalence with the bloodthirsty tactics of the West. They also know innately that this is exactly what the West wants and then the screams of outrage will start all over media and internet. Russia is keenly aware of world opinion and wishes to keep that of the non western populace on its side. Yes, if pushed they could go all out, but when all dust is settled Russia knows that THEY will be left with the burden of rebuilding what they have destroyed. The West will not pony up a square Dollar unless its in the form of decades burdening loans paid to Blackrock etal. Essentially paying themselves. Even then,they will not give a conquered Ukraine the luxury of new loans. We can see this in what Russia is already doing in places like Mariupol. building houses, roads and schools even within 12 months of taking control. Posted by: DaVinci | Sep 4 2023 12:44 utc | 311 The reason I believe Russia has not sought to end this conflict in a thunderous blitz of blood and bricks all over Kiev and Lvov and others is that they do not want a moral equivalence with the bloodthirsty tactics of the West. They also know innately that this is exactly what the West wants and then the screams of outrage will start all over media and internet. Russia is keenly aware of world opinion and wishes to keep that of the non western populace on its side. Yes, if pushed they could go all out, but when all dust is settled Russia knows that THEY will be left with the burden of rebuilding what they have destroyed. The West will not pony up a square Dollar unless its in the form of decades burdening loans paid to Blackrock etal. Essentially paying themselves. Even then,they will not give a conquered Ukraine the luxury of new loans. We can see this in what Russia is already doing in places like Mariupol. building houses, roads and schools even within 12 months of taking control. Posted by: DaVinci | Sep 4 2023 12:44 utc | 312 Posted by: LoveDonbass | Sep 3 2023 16:08 utc | 26 Posted by: anon2020 | Sep 4 2023 12:56 utc | 313 Posted by: LoveDonbass | Sep 3 2023 16:08 utc | 26 Posted by: anon2020 | Sep 4 2023 12:56 utc | 314 @SCCC, I’m sure we are all on ASIO or other 3 letter agencies lists just for being on M of A. Posted by: Neal | Sep 4 2023 12:57 utc | 315 @SCCC, I’m sure we are all on ASIO or other 3 letter agencies lists just for being on M of A. Posted by: Neal | Sep 4 2023 12:57 utc | 316
How long were the ‘investigations’ into the Septemeber 11th attacks…4 years? Maybe you can at least give them the time it takes to complete an average inner city murder investigation in Maerica, land of the free. Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Sep 4 2023 13:00 utc | 317
How long were the ‘investigations’ into the Septemeber 11th attacks…4 years? Maybe you can at least give them the time it takes to complete an average inner city murder investigation in Maerica, land of the free. Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Sep 4 2023 13:00 utc | 318 Posted by: DaVinci | Sep 4 2023 12:44 utc | 157 Posted by: Membrum Virile | Sep 4 2023 13:11 utc | 319 Posted by: DaVinci | Sep 4 2023 12:44 utc | 157 Posted by: Membrum Virile | Sep 4 2023 13:11 utc | 320 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zB_iG2Wr4_M Posted by: pretzelattack | Sep 4 2023 13:19 utc | 321 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zB_iG2Wr4_M Posted by: pretzelattack | Sep 4 2023 13:19 utc | 322 I see European officials are making overatures to Russia, describing Russia as inherently “European” – seems to me an effort to keep Russia from gravitating too much toward east. While Russia would want to leave door open to commerce, seems a more constructive future to focus toward East – including Turkey, Middle East and then East. Posted by: jared | Sep 4 2023 13:21 utc | 323 I see European officials are making overatures to Russia, describing Russia as inherently “European” – seems to me an effort to keep Russia from gravitating too much toward east. While Russia would want to leave door open to commerce, seems a more constructive future to focus toward East – including Turkey, Middle East and then East. Posted by: jared | Sep 4 2023 13:21 utc | 324 james@105….and Russia bears no responsibility? It was over a year before they hit the SBU building on the island? Why? They know where all the bunkers are……they dilly dallied with fancy spectacular night time hits and left the command and control structures intact. It wasn’t until NATO tapped some Russian generals and cadet graduations before Russia concluded the Ukrainians er, NATO, were playing the long game, for keeps. Posted by: sean the leprechaun | Sep 4 2023 13:24 utc | 325 james@105….and Russia bears no responsibility? It was over a year before they hit the SBU building on the island? Why? They know where all the bunkers are……they dilly dallied with fancy spectacular night time hits and left the command and control structures intact. It wasn’t until NATO tapped some Russian generals and cadet graduations before Russia concluded the Ukrainians er, NATO, were playing the long game, for keeps. Posted by: sean the leprechaun | Sep 4 2023 13:24 utc | 326 Posted by: anon2020 | Sep 4 2023 12:56 utc | 158 Posted by: LoveDonbass | Sep 4 2023 13:29 utc | 327 Posted by: anon2020 | Sep 4 2023 12:56 utc | 158 Posted by: LoveDonbass | Sep 4 2023 13:29 utc | 328 RU MOD claims AFU launched another landing attempt in Crimea yesterday (probably same Snake island route) and aircraft destroyed 4 boats. Posted by: unimperator | Sep 4 2023 13:29 utc | 329 RU MOD claims AFU launched another landing attempt in Crimea yesterday (probably same Snake island route) and aircraft destroyed 4 boats. Posted by: unimperator | Sep 4 2023 13:29 utc | 330 @grunzt | Sep 4 2023 9:35 utc | 140 Posted by: Norwegian | Sep 4 2023 13:34 utc | 331 @grunzt | Sep 4 2023 9:35 utc | 140 Posted by: Norwegian | Sep 4 2023 13:34 utc | 332 Stop their imperialistic, land grabbing invasion, designed to leave Putin in history books as a conqueror? Posted by: LoveDonbass | Sep 4 2023 13:35 utc | 333 Stop their imperialistic, land grabbing invasion, designed to leave Putin in history books as a conqueror? Posted by: LoveDonbass | Sep 4 2023 13:35 utc | 334 Slavyangrad did nice, brief video update/analysis if situation at the front: https://t.me/Slavyangrad/61748 Posted by: jared | Sep 4 2023 13:36 utc | 335 Slavyangrad did nice, brief video update/analysis if situation at the front: https://t.me/Slavyangrad/61748 Posted by: jared | Sep 4 2023 13:36 utc | 336 Reports of Legionaires Disease Epidemic ravaging Ukie batallions… Posted by: Dr. George W Oprisko | Sep 4 2023 13:40 utc | 337 Reports of Legionaires Disease Epidemic ravaging Ukie batallions… Posted by: Dr. George W Oprisko | Sep 4 2023 13:40 utc | 338 Doctor Eleven | Sep 4 2023 13:00 utc | 160 Posted by: grunzt | Sep 4 2023 13:42 utc | 339 Doctor Eleven | Sep 4 2023 13:00 utc | 160 Posted by: grunzt | Sep 4 2023 13:42 utc | 340 @anon2020 | Sep 4 2023 12:56 utc | 158 Posted by: rk | Sep 4 2023 13:44 utc | 341 @anon2020 | Sep 4 2023 12:56 utc | 158 Posted by: rk | Sep 4 2023 13:44 utc | 342 Posted by: grunzt | Sep 4 2023 13:42 utc | 171 Posted by: LoveDonbass | Sep 4 2023 13:45 utc | 343 Posted by: grunzt | Sep 4 2023 13:42 utc | 171 Posted by: LoveDonbass | Sep 4 2023 13:45 utc | 344 https://t.me/sharednewsby/12079 Posted by: Biswapriya Purkayast | Sep 4 2023 13:53 utc | 345 https://t.me/sharednewsby/12079 Posted by: Biswapriya Purkayast | Sep 4 2023 13:53 utc | 346 @grunzt | Sep 4 2023 13:42 utc | 171 Posted by: Norwegian | Sep 4 2023 13:57 utc | 347 @grunzt | Sep 4 2023 13:42 utc | 171 Posted by: Norwegian | Sep 4 2023 13:57 utc | 348 Posted by: Dr. George W Oprisko | Sep 4 2023 13:40 utc | 170
Cue the headlined accusations of Russian ‘bio-warfare’ in the British press as the Empire casts around for someone, anyone to blame for their own incompetence. Posted by: Arch Bungle | Sep 4 2023 14:01 utc | 349 Posted by: Dr. George W Oprisko | Sep 4 2023 13:40 utc | 170
Cue the headlined accusations of Russian ‘bio-warfare’ in the British press as the Empire casts around for someone, anyone to blame for their own incompetence. Posted by: Arch Bungle | Sep 4 2023 14:01 utc | 350 Finally, corruption leading to substandard housing is taking a toll… Posted by: rk | Sep 4 2023 14:04 utc | 351 Finally, corruption leading to substandard housing is taking a toll… Posted by: rk | Sep 4 2023 14:04 utc | 352
Someone at MoA recently noted that as defense minister, Shoigu’s job is provisioning the Russian armed forces.
Posted by: David Levin | Sep 4 2023 14:06 utc | 353
Someone at MoA recently noted that as defense minister, Shoigu’s job is provisioning the Russian armed forces.
Posted by: David Levin | Sep 4 2023 14:06 utc | 354 Roger | Sep 4 2023 8:06 utc | 134 Posted by: Melaleuca | Sep 4 2023 14:07 utc | 355 Roger | Sep 4 2023 8:06 utc | 134 Posted by: Melaleuca | Sep 4 2023 14:07 utc | 356 doing what he should which is declaring war on Erdogan then we know he is just protecting his oligarchs Posted by: Arch Bungle | Sep 4 2023 14:12 utc | 357 doing what he should which is declaring war on Erdogan then we know he is just protecting his oligarchs Posted by: Arch Bungle | Sep 4 2023 14:12 utc | 358 Putin is smarter than that. Posted by: Night Tripper | Sep 4 2023 14:15 utc | 359 Putin is smarter than that. Posted by: Night Tripper | Sep 4 2023 14:15 utc | 360 My suggest to Russia: To create second capital located in east to facilitate commercial development and relations in that direction. Posted by: Bemildred | Sep 4 2023 14:16 utc | 361 My suggest to Russia: To create second capital located in east to facilitate commercial development and relations in that direction. Posted by: Bemildred | Sep 4 2023 14:16 utc | 362 GENICHESK, September 4. /TASS/. Ukrainian President Vladimir Zelensky has decided to sack Defense Minister Alexey Reznikov, effectively making him the scapegoat for Ukraine’s failed counteroffensive, Kherson Region Acting Governor Vladimir Saldo told TASS. Posted by: Arch Bungle | Sep 4 2023 14:18 utc | 363 GENICHESK, September 4. /TASS/. Ukrainian President Vladimir Zelensky has decided to sack Defense Minister Alexey Reznikov, effectively making him the scapegoat for Ukraine’s failed counteroffensive, Kherson Region Acting Governor Vladimir Saldo told TASS. Posted by: Arch Bungle | Sep 4 2023 14:18 utc | 364 Posted by: Night Tripper | Sep 4 2023 14:15 utc | 181 Posted by: Arch Bungle | Sep 4 2023 14:23 utc | 365 Posted by: Night Tripper | Sep 4 2023 14:15 utc | 181 Posted by: Arch Bungle | Sep 4 2023 14:23 utc | 366 Putin meets Erdogan today. What is the guessing on the outcome of that? Grain deal back on? Posted by: Bemildred | Sep 4 2023 14:31 utc | 367 Putin meets Erdogan today. What is the guessing on the outcome of that? Grain deal back on? Posted by: Bemildred | Sep 4 2023 14:31 utc | 368 Ukraine will mobilize men with HIV, tuberculosis, and mental illness. Any student who shows up for university classes seeks his own death. They announced the conscription of women and may get another 70K who escaped to Poland. Give them a gun, prime them with meth and send them to the meat grinder. Posted by: Eighthman | Sep 4 2023 14:37 utc | 369 Ukraine will mobilize men with HIV, tuberculosis, and mental illness. Any student who shows up for university classes seeks his own death. They announced the conscription of women and may get another 70K who escaped to Poland. Give them a gun, prime them with meth and send them to the meat grinder. Posted by: Eighthman | Sep 4 2023 14:37 utc | 370 Probably it was already discussed, but Dima’s latest suggests that the sacking of the defense minister Reznikov by Z means that Ye Olde Greateste Counteroffensive is officially over. Posted by: Ghost of Zanon | Sep 4 2023 14:48 utc | 373 Probably it was already discussed, but Dima’s latest suggests that the sacking of the defense minister Reznikov by Z means that Ye Olde Greateste Counteroffensive is officially over. Posted by: Ghost of Zanon | Sep 4 2023 14:48 utc | 374 sean the leprechaun | Sep 4 2023 13:24 utc | 164 Posted by: james | Sep 4 2023 14:50 utc | 375 sean the leprechaun | Sep 4 2023 13:24 utc | 164 Posted by: james | Sep 4 2023 14:50 utc | 376 If I was Russia I’d hire some science fiction writers like Alastair Reynolds and put them in charge of the drone weapons development programme. I’m not a science fiction writer but we’re in the realm of extreme forward blue sky (no pun intended) thinking, and imaginative minds will pay dividends in terms of leapfrogging several generations of drone warfare. Posted by: Due West | Sep 4 2023 14:51 utc | 377 If I was Russia I’d hire some science fiction writers like Alastair Reynolds and put them in charge of the drone weapons development programme. I’m not a science fiction writer but we’re in the realm of extreme forward blue sky (no pun intended) thinking, and imaginative minds will pay dividends in terms of leapfrogging several generations of drone warfare. Posted by: Due West | Sep 4 2023 14:51 utc | 378 Thoughts? Posted by: Arch Bungle | Sep 4 2023 14:52 utc | 379 Thoughts? Posted by: Arch Bungle | Sep 4 2023 14:52 utc | 380 New Grain Deal Posted by: Trubind1 | Sep 4 2023 15:04 utc | 381 New Grain Deal Posted by: Trubind1 | Sep 4 2023 15:04 utc | 382 Posted by: Stephane | Sep 4 2023 11:53 utc | 150 Posted by: Acco Hengst | Sep 4 2023 15:10 utc | 383 Posted by: Stephane | Sep 4 2023 11:53 utc | 150 Posted by: Acco Hengst | Sep 4 2023 15:10 utc | 384 Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Sep 4 2023 13:00 utc | 160
Certain Someones believed they needed Prigozhin dead. And so dead he now is. Posted by: Melaleuca | Sep 4 2023 15:11 utc | 385 Posted by: Doctor Eleven | Sep 4 2023 13:00 utc | 160
Certain Someones believed they needed Prigozhin dead. And so dead he now is. Posted by: Melaleuca | Sep 4 2023 15:11 utc | 386 Due West @190 Posted by: William Gruff | Sep 4 2023 15:14 utc | 387 Due West @190 Posted by: William Gruff | Sep 4 2023 15:14 utc | 388 Grain deal only if Russia reconnected to SWIFT. Maybe Russia will ship some additional grain to Turkey regardless. No real change to current situation. Posted by: the pessimist | Sep 4 2023 15:17 utc | 389 Grain deal only if Russia reconnected to SWIFT. Maybe Russia will ship some additional grain to Turkey regardless. No real change to current situation. Posted by: the pessimist | Sep 4 2023 15:17 utc | 390 Posted by: Trubind1 | Sep 4 2023 15:04 utc | 192 Posted by: unimperator | Sep 4 2023 15:17 utc | 391 Posted by: Trubind1 | Sep 4 2023 15:04 utc | 192 Posted by: unimperator | Sep 4 2023 15:17 utc | 392 @174 A Verse about the Ukrainians. @174 A Verse about the Ukrainians. William Gruff @ 195 Posted by: Due West | Sep 4 2023 15:21 utc | 395 William Gruff @ 195 Posted by: Due West | Sep 4 2023 15:21 utc | 396 Anyone want to speculate why Xi isn’t going to the G20? I’ll throw one out there, admittedly unlikely as it’s too humdrum, not 5 dimensional enough, but Xi could be doing Putin a kindness by not again leaving him the odd man out, as he was in South Africa. Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Sep 4 2023 15:24 utc | 397 Anyone want to speculate why Xi isn’t going to the G20? I’ll throw one out there, admittedly unlikely as it’s too humdrum, not 5 dimensional enough, but Xi could be doing Putin a kindness by not again leaving him the odd man out, as he was in South Africa. Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Sep 4 2023 15:24 utc | 398
Because they are concentrating work on BRICS. It is also reality, and a message, that G20 is a dead-end group, and everyone else should start operating in BRICS Format, too. Posted by: unimperator | Sep 4 2023 15:28 utc | 399
Because they are concentrating work on BRICS. It is also reality, and a message, that G20 is a dead-end group, and everyone else should start operating in BRICS Format, too. Posted by: unimperator | Sep 4 2023 15:28 utc | 400 |
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