Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
September 28, 2023
China’s ‘Shared Future’

The U.S. fears that China's growth will lead to a competition between the countries over hegemony on earth.

But China rejects hegemony. No only the one the U.S. is obviously trying to achieve but, more general, also for itself.

Yesterday the Global Times editorial pointed to a new guideline paper issued by China's State Council:

On September 26, China's State Council Information Office released a white paper titled "A Global Community of Shared Future: China's Proposals and Actions." Against the backdrop of the 10th anniversary of President Xi Jinping's proposal of building a global community of shared future, China has introduced the theoretical base, practice and development of a global community of shared future, and points the way toward a better future for the world. Anyone, be they are developing countries seeking to learn from China or individuals from Western countries who are interested in gaining a deeper understanding of China, will find inspiration in it as long as they approach it without biased views.

Human society is now facing a "life-or-death choice:" whether to enter into a vicious cycle of continuous confrontation and division or to seek a path of cooperation and win-win, ultimately allowing more than 7 billion people to have a better life. The whole world is searching for answers. This also confirms the highly prescient and forward-looking nature of the concept of a global community of shared future.

Today's world has become a community of shared future, with countries riding together on a ship of shared fate. A small boat cannot withstand the wind and waves, only a giant vessel can withstand the stormy seas. No matter how powerful a country may be, it cannot dominate the world alone and must engage in global cooperation.

As the white paper says, "This is an integrated world. Those who turn their back on it will have no place in it." In such a world, the true power that transcends time is contained in the silent and subtle ideas, just like the practical greatness demonstrated by the concept of global community of shared future.

The paper is available here.

It is 22,000 words long but quite readable. It is a recipe for a just and equalitarian world that will peacefully develop for everyone while allowing for a diversity of cultures and ideologies. It is thus building on China's decade old concept of a Community of Common Destiny for Mankind.

The most interesting part is probably this paragraph:

There is no iron law that dictates that a rising power will inevitably seek hegemony. This assumption represents typical hegemonic thinking and is grounded in memories of catastrophic wars between hegemonic powers in the past. China has never accepted that once a country becomes strong enough, it will invariably seek hegemony. China understands the lesson of history – that hegemony preludes decline. We pursue development and revitalization through our own efforts, rather than invasion or expansion. And everything we do is for the purpose of providing a better life for our people, all the while creating more development opportunities for the entire world, not in order to supersede or subjugate others.

Other strategic statements by China, like the one issued in 2013 that laid the ground for its Belt and Road program, had been dismissed when they were issued. But the record shows that China acts on such programs exactly as its papers promise to do. It profits from doing so.

Is its thesis in this new paper, that hegemony preludes decline, valid?

Should we therefore trust its claims that it rejects hegemony, not only of others but also for itself?

Comments

I don’t know whether the thesis that hegemony preludes decline is true or not, but history says it is.

Posted by: marcel | Sep 28 2023 9:01 utc | 1

I don’t know whether the thesis that hegemony preludes decline is true or not, but history says it is.

Posted by: marcel | Sep 28 2023 9:01 utc | 2

Can we ask a Uighur living in China for their feedback?
I mean that.
I accept and embrace the principle of global cooperation that you quote from this paper. I hope it is sincere. But if the Chinese exempt themselves (just like we preach “democracy” and then undermine our own elections (e.g., 2020) from these principles, then count me as pessimistic.

Posted by: Paul Schneider | Sep 28 2023 9:15 utc | 3

Can we ask a Uighur living in China for their feedback?
I mean that.
I accept and embrace the principle of global cooperation that you quote from this paper. I hope it is sincere. But if the Chinese exempt themselves (just like we preach “democracy” and then undermine our own elections (e.g., 2020) from these principles, then count me as pessimistic.

Posted by: Paul Schneider | Sep 28 2023 9:15 utc | 4

Posted by: Paul Schneider | Sep 28 2023 9:15 utc | 2
You can ask of course, let us know what they say instead of pumping NAFO|OFAN pure propaganda before you ask.

Posted by: martin | Sep 28 2023 9:20 utc | 5

Posted by: Paul Schneider | Sep 28 2023 9:15 utc | 2
You can ask of course, let us know what they say instead of pumping NAFO|OFAN pure propaganda before you ask.

Posted by: martin | Sep 28 2023 9:20 utc | 6

Historically China has rejected hegemony. But are they talking about global hegemony or regional? The US hegemon will fall sooner than later. At that point what will take its place? Likely regional hegemonies and multipolarity, and China already has outsized influence in East Asia. Does that count as a hegemony?

Posted by: James M. | Sep 28 2023 9:35 utc | 7

Historically China has rejected hegemony. But are they talking about global hegemony or regional? The US hegemon will fall sooner than later. At that point what will take its place? Likely regional hegemonies and multipolarity, and China already has outsized influence in East Asia. Does that count as a hegemony?

Posted by: James M. | Sep 28 2023 9:35 utc | 8

I don’t know about hegemony but the fate of the world depends upon Xi’s successor which is unfortunately both completely opaque and soon approaching.

Posted by: too scents | Sep 28 2023 9:38 utc | 9

I don’t know about hegemony but the fate of the world depends upon Xi’s successor which is unfortunately both completely opaque and soon approaching.

Posted by: too scents | Sep 28 2023 9:38 utc | 10

US global hegemony is under threat, and like all empires before it thinks it is invincible. But everyone forgets uncomfortable history – thinking in the present all has changed. They ignore the chilling logic of imperialism: every empire/civilization eventually meets the war it is trying to avoid – its own defeat; everyone wants to avoid WW III; therefore nuclear Armageddon awaits. Until those in power grasp this simple syllogism humanity’s fate is sealed.
https://patternofhistory.wordpress.com/

Posted by: peter mcloughlin | Sep 28 2023 9:51 utc | 11

US global hegemony is under threat, and like all empires before it thinks it is invincible. But everyone forgets uncomfortable history – thinking in the present all has changed. They ignore the chilling logic of imperialism: every empire/civilization eventually meets the war it is trying to avoid – its own defeat; everyone wants to avoid WW III; therefore nuclear Armageddon awaits. Until those in power grasp this simple syllogism humanity’s fate is sealed.
https://patternofhistory.wordpress.com/

Posted by: peter mcloughlin | Sep 28 2023 9:51 utc | 12

– The idea that hegemony leads to decline is like saying there is sunshine after rain: it’s bound to happen if you wait long enough. You don’t know how long this hegemony will last even if you can see mechanisms that accelerate it once it gets going.
– I would distinguish between organic dominance and making it a strategic aim. If China becomes more powerful it will dominate more and there will be more cases where it gets it way. It will control the South China Sea if it can, because it is strategically important for them to keep it open.
The approach where dominance is a goal in itself comes naturally for the US and less naturally for China but when there are advantages to it it may still happen for China as well.

Posted by: Tuyzentfloot | Sep 28 2023 9:57 utc | 13

– The idea that hegemony leads to decline is like saying there is sunshine after rain: it’s bound to happen if you wait long enough. You don’t know how long this hegemony will last even if you can see mechanisms that accelerate it once it gets going.
– I would distinguish between organic dominance and making it a strategic aim. If China becomes more powerful it will dominate more and there will be more cases where it gets it way. It will control the South China Sea if it can, because it is strategically important for them to keep it open.
The approach where dominance is a goal in itself comes naturally for the US and less naturally for China but when there are advantages to it it may still happen for China as well.

Posted by: Tuyzentfloot | Sep 28 2023 9:57 utc | 14

Hegemony means leadership, supremacy, predominance or even constraint. Not only in terms of governance, but in cultural, ideological, economic and religious areas. I believe in leading by one’s own example. Don’t do to others what you don’t want to suffer yourself. Live and let live. Not only sharing prosperity with others, but also adversity such as climate change. This means fair trade agreements that leave room for the other party’s development. Abolition of patents and therefore 100% sharing of discoveries.
On a global scale, this requires a reformed United Nations that builds on existing international law and has executive powers. In such a system, the degree of development worldwide gradually increases. Mature economies will still be able to grow, but less rapidly than those of countries that have not yet reached a “mature” degree of their economy. There does not necessarily have to be a decline. Many people will label such a state as idealistic, daydreaming or even naive. But it is a situation worth defending on a global forum and demonstrating it through ones own actions, setting an example.

Posted by: Paul-Robert | Sep 28 2023 10:08 utc | 15

Hegemony means leadership, supremacy, predominance or even constraint. Not only in terms of governance, but in cultural, ideological, economic and religious areas. I believe in leading by one’s own example. Don’t do to others what you don’t want to suffer yourself. Live and let live. Not only sharing prosperity with others, but also adversity such as climate change. This means fair trade agreements that leave room for the other party’s development. Abolition of patents and therefore 100% sharing of discoveries.
On a global scale, this requires a reformed United Nations that builds on existing international law and has executive powers. In such a system, the degree of development worldwide gradually increases. Mature economies will still be able to grow, but less rapidly than those of countries that have not yet reached a “mature” degree of their economy. There does not necessarily have to be a decline. Many people will label such a state as idealistic, daydreaming or even naive. But it is a situation worth defending on a global forum and demonstrating it through ones own actions, setting an example.

Posted by: Paul-Robert | Sep 28 2023 10:08 utc | 16

Posted by: Paul Schneider | Sep 28 2023 9:15 utc | 2
Can we ask a Russian living in USAEU for their feedback?

Posted by: tesla | Sep 28 2023 10:18 utc | 17

Posted by: Paul Schneider | Sep 28 2023 9:15 utc | 2
Can we ask a Russian living in USAEU for their feedback?

Posted by: tesla | Sep 28 2023 10:18 utc | 18

Good golly the synchronicity is amazing. I just read comments & wrote for last few hours and posted this on the last thread only to find this new post has gone up.
I guess it equally belongs here. Right will need a few days to read that white paper!
@ Posted by: drezz0 | Sep 28 2023 7:10 utc | 201
Exactly – the trajectory of history that is curiously missed by many. Wilfully?
Anyway a screed to tail this thread.
The natzios weren’t invented by a religious sub group , they have always been around.
The Holy Roman Empire has never gotten over the loss of the Byzantine ’brother’ and the great silk, spice and fertility Road that is the jewel of the World Island.
The millenia and half has been a never ending attempt to gain supremacy over that majority of humanity and the majority of the land mass of the Earth.
Within that context many variations of imperialism have been tried using every single part of European identity creation – the ‘Nation States’. Including the creation of the hybrid , mongrel , nationality of ‘American’.
The current panicked enrolment of millions more into that American Dream is to fight the next centuries war , to gain control of the World and its resources. Because this attempt has also failed and the there will be many billions who will refuse to kowtow, hand over their wealth and lay down and die as is expected of them , and most of us!
Tens of millions will be needed , hundreds even, to fight to the last again in the old madness of imperialism and slavery of the majority.
There is not much difference between the Nazis and their creators.
That is the purpose of hopefully the last empire in the chain now, the USA. But the City of London never diminished! Neither did the few aristos and financiers of Old Europe – who have never stopped benefiting from every empire.
That should be the easiest pointer for many to how interconnected all Collective Western imperialism is and why. As a few here have clearly seen it is an Empire of Lies.
The true destiny of humanity is in a robust interconnectedness.
This is best achieved by a grid system for all necessities – including Gas. The natzios didnt want that and they work against the inevitability.
Some did realise and have tried to move instead to true democratic socialism which puts the raising of the poorest above all else. That provision of security for ALL is the highest aim. Through collaboration and mutual support. They moved the EU in that direction , that is why that EU has been targeted and is nearly destroyed now under the jackboots of unelected Nazis.
https://x.com/canthavepudding/status/1707084734868881699
Julien Benda on X
😆
That’s why there was a delay until Mutti was gone.
Merkel did build the pipeline ! Even though she was just an imperial lackey, She did work with Putin. Putin has worked with Xi. They knew this was a once in several lifetimes chance to finally lift the yoke of the bereft, jealous, avaricious brother who broke from the one world and decided to live behind a walled garden with its ‘happy slaves’ whilst engaging in furious pillage and murder beyond these walls.
The destruction or what seems at best delaying of a EU/EuraAsian block is the aim. The attempt will fail as has every attempt at ‘taking Russia’ and Central Asia and China.
The centuries long grasp and exploitation of Africa, Indo pacific and Latin Americas is too failing. The BRI is coming to their aid.
With actual investment and if needed- the largest armies in the world – now fully battle hardened.
Hell yeah, this is our Masters and Owners running for the hills , by opening the borders and destroying their industries in Europe which they see slipping away finally into the arms of its World Island family.
They need 10’s of millions of canon fodder, brainwashed like the current Ukrops. Yanks, Canuks and Europeans in our 5 eyed dystopia who have never realised they were made to harbour their grandparents enemies aren’t enough – the golden billion plan can’t succeed otherwise. The very few who live in the high palaces will fall and they are fighting to the end. They would kill billions in the attempt leaving waste lands behind that they can’t own.
The answer is to stop them before they do.
They need ‘exterminating’ like the old witch doctors and priests who exploited ignorance.
The multipolar is the answer.
There will be many more pipelines, railways and security for all.
Posted by: DunGroanin | Sep 28 2023 9:53 utc | 215

Posted by: DunGroanin | Sep 28 2023 10:18 utc | 19

Good golly the synchronicity is amazing. I just read comments & wrote for last few hours and posted this on the last thread only to find this new post has gone up.
I guess it equally belongs here. Right will need a few days to read that white paper!
@ Posted by: drezz0 | Sep 28 2023 7:10 utc | 201
Exactly – the trajectory of history that is curiously missed by many. Wilfully?
Anyway a screed to tail this thread.
The natzios weren’t invented by a religious sub group , they have always been around.
The Holy Roman Empire has never gotten over the loss of the Byzantine ’brother’ and the great silk, spice and fertility Road that is the jewel of the World Island.
The millenia and half has been a never ending attempt to gain supremacy over that majority of humanity and the majority of the land mass of the Earth.
Within that context many variations of imperialism have been tried using every single part of European identity creation – the ‘Nation States’. Including the creation of the hybrid , mongrel , nationality of ‘American’.
The current panicked enrolment of millions more into that American Dream is to fight the next centuries war , to gain control of the World and its resources. Because this attempt has also failed and the there will be many billions who will refuse to kowtow, hand over their wealth and lay down and die as is expected of them , and most of us!
Tens of millions will be needed , hundreds even, to fight to the last again in the old madness of imperialism and slavery of the majority.
There is not much difference between the Nazis and their creators.
That is the purpose of hopefully the last empire in the chain now, the USA. But the City of London never diminished! Neither did the few aristos and financiers of Old Europe – who have never stopped benefiting from every empire.
That should be the easiest pointer for many to how interconnected all Collective Western imperialism is and why. As a few here have clearly seen it is an Empire of Lies.
The true destiny of humanity is in a robust interconnectedness.
This is best achieved by a grid system for all necessities – including Gas. The natzios didnt want that and they work against the inevitability.
Some did realise and have tried to move instead to true democratic socialism which puts the raising of the poorest above all else. That provision of security for ALL is the highest aim. Through collaboration and mutual support. They moved the EU in that direction , that is why that EU has been targeted and is nearly destroyed now under the jackboots of unelected Nazis.
https://x.com/canthavepudding/status/1707084734868881699
Julien Benda on X
😆
That’s why there was a delay until Mutti was gone.
Merkel did build the pipeline ! Even though she was just an imperial lackey, She did work with Putin. Putin has worked with Xi. They knew this was a once in several lifetimes chance to finally lift the yoke of the bereft, jealous, avaricious brother who broke from the one world and decided to live behind a walled garden with its ‘happy slaves’ whilst engaging in furious pillage and murder beyond these walls.
The destruction or what seems at best delaying of a EU/EuraAsian block is the aim. The attempt will fail as has every attempt at ‘taking Russia’ and Central Asia and China.
The centuries long grasp and exploitation of Africa, Indo pacific and Latin Americas is too failing. The BRI is coming to their aid.
With actual investment and if needed- the largest armies in the world – now fully battle hardened.
Hell yeah, this is our Masters and Owners running for the hills , by opening the borders and destroying their industries in Europe which they see slipping away finally into the arms of its World Island family.
They need 10’s of millions of canon fodder, brainwashed like the current Ukrops. Yanks, Canuks and Europeans in our 5 eyed dystopia who have never realised they were made to harbour their grandparents enemies aren’t enough – the golden billion plan can’t succeed otherwise. The very few who live in the high palaces will fall and they are fighting to the end. They would kill billions in the attempt leaving waste lands behind that they can’t own.
The answer is to stop them before they do.
They need ‘exterminating’ like the old witch doctors and priests who exploited ignorance.
The multipolar is the answer.
There will be many more pipelines, railways and security for all.
Posted by: DunGroanin | Sep 28 2023 9:53 utc | 215

Posted by: DunGroanin | Sep 28 2023 10:18 utc | 20

China has repeatedly declared they are not interested in hegemony in any form.
They are interested in win-win formula, without interference in internal affairs.
Posted by: Paul Schneider | Sep 28 2023 9:15 utc
What utter rubbish are you gibbering! What interference in your elections?
What Uyghurs do you want to ask?
Get a tourist visa and enter China, then go straight to Xinjiang and you can ask every Uyghur you see.
I live in China for 10 years and the CPC is the best pro people govt in the world. There are Uyghurs in my tier 4 Angyang City.

Posted by: Surferket | Sep 28 2023 10:19 utc | 21

China has repeatedly declared they are not interested in hegemony in any form.
They are interested in win-win formula, without interference in internal affairs.
Posted by: Paul Schneider | Sep 28 2023 9:15 utc
What utter rubbish are you gibbering! What interference in your elections?
What Uyghurs do you want to ask?
Get a tourist visa and enter China, then go straight to Xinjiang and you can ask every Uyghur you see.
I live in China for 10 years and the CPC is the best pro people govt in the world. There are Uyghurs in my tier 4 Angyang City.

Posted by: Surferket | Sep 28 2023 10:19 utc | 22

Posted by: too scents | Sep 28 2023 9:38 utc | 6
You’re not paying attention.
The next Chairman is Li Qiang the current Premier who appeared in the G20 to let world leaders get to know him.

Posted by: Surferket | Sep 28 2023 10:22 utc | 23

Posted by: too scents | Sep 28 2023 9:38 utc | 6
You’re not paying attention.
The next Chairman is Li Qiang the current Premier who appeared in the G20 to let world leaders get to know him.

Posted by: Surferket | Sep 28 2023 10:22 utc | 24

This is Karloff’s own article on the new Chinese paper.
https://karlof1.substack.com/p/chinas-many-proposed-global-initiatives

Posted by: Surferket | Sep 28 2023 10:25 utc | 25

This is Karloff’s own article on the new Chinese paper.
https://karlof1.substack.com/p/chinas-many-proposed-global-initiatives

Posted by: Surferket | Sep 28 2023 10:25 utc | 26

That’s it, the US will never tolerate such blaspheme. An egalitarian world ruled by justice and fairness? WTF, this goes against EVERYTHING the USA stands for. War, domination, subjugation, chaos, violence, genocide. ThIS WILL NOT STAND!

Posted by: deepblue | Sep 28 2023 10:26 utc | 27

That’s it, the US will never tolerate such blaspheme. An egalitarian world ruled by justice and fairness? WTF, this goes against EVERYTHING the USA stands for. War, domination, subjugation, chaos, violence, genocide. ThIS WILL NOT STAND!

Posted by: deepblue | Sep 28 2023 10:26 utc | 28

@soothsayer
The hallmark of all IDIOTS is talking without knowledge:
GDP/Capita (PPP) (IMF 2023)
Russia 34,837$
China 23,382$

Posted by: tkilian | Sep 28 2023 10:28 utc | 29

@soothsayer
The hallmark of all IDIOTS is talking without knowledge:
GDP/Capita (PPP) (IMF 2023)
Russia 34,837$
China 23,382$

Posted by: tkilian | Sep 28 2023 10:28 utc | 30

With the exception of the Mongols, China has rarely been internationally aggressive. It’s international authority has long been through trade and scientific development, so this strategy paper is a comfortable fit for it. As a (still largely Buddhist) culture, it thinks about issues differently from the West. Hegemony as practiced by the US makes little sense to it because – although a stable center is desirable – the three poisons of greed, anger and stupidity are self destructive. Government which does not take responsibility for the people may look strong, but it is actually weak because it must fight with itself and externally to prove itself. Real strength is achieving harmony. That’s the lesson from a very long history of dynasties and emperors.

Posted by: TPaine | Sep 28 2023 10:30 utc | 31

With the exception of the Mongols, China has rarely been internationally aggressive. It’s international authority has long been through trade and scientific development, so this strategy paper is a comfortable fit for it. As a (still largely Buddhist) culture, it thinks about issues differently from the West. Hegemony as practiced by the US makes little sense to it because – although a stable center is desirable – the three poisons of greed, anger and stupidity are self destructive. Government which does not take responsibility for the people may look strong, but it is actually weak because it must fight with itself and externally to prove itself. Real strength is achieving harmony. That’s the lesson from a very long history of dynasties and emperors.

Posted by: TPaine | Sep 28 2023 10:30 utc | 32

The PRC’s real intention is a balanced world where developed/upper developing countries (Europe, Iran, Russia, Vietnam etc) live freely in peace while bottom third world countries (Africa, Iraq) will be colonies. Since the latter situation is obviously not available to PRC, you can embellish the situation with saying of ‘equality for everyone’ and economically compromised trading and superficial donation, which is better than nothing.

Posted by: T6 | Sep 28 2023 10:31 utc | 33

The PRC’s real intention is a balanced world where developed/upper developing countries (Europe, Iran, Russia, Vietnam etc) live freely in peace while bottom third world countries (Africa, Iraq) will be colonies. Since the latter situation is obviously not available to PRC, you can embellish the situation with saying of ‘equality for everyone’ and economically compromised trading and superficial donation, which is better than nothing.

Posted by: T6 | Sep 28 2023 10:31 utc | 34

OMG, the naivety on this site only about one group – the CPC; all other power groups on Earth are questioned, rightly.
Salving words vs contrary actions on the ground; did two millennia of Roman Christianity not teach anything? The CPC is financial dire straights so it will tell foreigners now exactly what they want hear. Local Chinese know the actual ground reality there and it aint pretty. The Great Chinese Firewall blocks 95% of views in or out.
Chinese “communism” is just a new gift wrapping of the same – faulty content: Homo sapiens inability to live harmoniously due to (group) egoism. Its is not only Western robber “capitalism that is broke.
Luckily Evolution is on the move, and we can participate personally by dropping desires, greed, ideologies, tunnel visions etc. Then the move becomes more visible, with or without internet.

Posted by: Antonym | Sep 28 2023 10:36 utc | 35

OMG, the naivety on this site only about one group – the CPC; all other power groups on Earth are questioned, rightly.
Salving words vs contrary actions on the ground; did two millennia of Roman Christianity not teach anything? The CPC is financial dire straights so it will tell foreigners now exactly what they want hear. Local Chinese know the actual ground reality there and it aint pretty. The Great Chinese Firewall blocks 95% of views in or out.
Chinese “communism” is just a new gift wrapping of the same – faulty content: Homo sapiens inability to live harmoniously due to (group) egoism. Its is not only Western robber “capitalism that is broke.
Luckily Evolution is on the move, and we can participate personally by dropping desires, greed, ideologies, tunnel visions etc. Then the move becomes more visible, with or without internet.

Posted by: Antonym | Sep 28 2023 10:36 utc | 36

Thank you tkilian for setting the “sootsayer” straight.

Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Sep 28 2023 10:39 utc | 37

Thank you tkilian for setting the “sootsayer” straight.

Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Sep 28 2023 10:39 utc | 38

Posted by: Antonym | Sep 28 2023 10:36 utc | 19
Thus spoke the official Bharat troll, congenital Hater of China and all things China.

Posted by: Surferket | Sep 28 2023 10:41 utc | 39

Posted by: Antonym | Sep 28 2023 10:36 utc | 19
Thus spoke the official Bharat troll, congenital Hater of China and all things China.

Posted by: Surferket | Sep 28 2023 10:41 utc | 40

Posted by: T6 | Sep 28 2023 10:31 utc | 18
Changing the countries this is the ‘de facto’ situation in the west dominated world.
This is not what China claims it want to do.
If China claim is true it’s to be verified.
Shure a multipolar ‘governance’ , let’s say Russia, China & India has more chances to be equilibrate than an hegemonic one, think about monopolism Vs competition.

Posted by: Mario | Sep 28 2023 10:44 utc | 41

Posted by: T6 | Sep 28 2023 10:31 utc | 18
Changing the countries this is the ‘de facto’ situation in the west dominated world.
This is not what China claims it want to do.
If China claim is true it’s to be verified.
Shure a multipolar ‘governance’ , let’s say Russia, China & India has more chances to be equilibrate than an hegemonic one, think about monopolism Vs competition.

Posted by: Mario | Sep 28 2023 10:44 utc | 42

Read this. Its simpler and gives a general summary of the paper.
https://www.globaltimes.cn/page/202309/1298963.shtml

Posted by: Surferket | Sep 28 2023 10:48 utc | 43

Read this. Its simpler and gives a general summary of the paper.
https://www.globaltimes.cn/page/202309/1298963.shtml

Posted by: Surferket | Sep 28 2023 10:48 utc | 44

China is now opened to foreign visitors. Get a visa and see China with your own eyes. Not the gibberish of paid trolls, the fabrications of US and their vassals.
https://www.visaforchina.cn/YVR2_EN/

Posted by: Surferket | Sep 28 2023 10:51 utc | 45

China is now opened to foreign visitors. Get a visa and see China with your own eyes. Not the gibberish of paid trolls, the fabrications of US and their vassals.
https://www.visaforchina.cn/YVR2_EN/

Posted by: Surferket | Sep 28 2023 10:51 utc | 46

This is the result of this “hegemony” that all of you love. No money for her own citizens. Why US don’t have high speed train? Ah China’s fault.
China spend her money on her people. That’s 1.44 billion reasons why China under the CPC will not be hegemonic in any way.
——-
US Secretary of Transport said Chinese don’t deserve better things than Americans.
“And for my dime, there’s no good reason why we should settle for less, why we should be content that — it’s nothing against Chinese citizens, but I’m not content that a Chinese citizen can count on a dramatically better standard of, let’s say, train travel than a U.S. citizen. I think Americans should always have the best, and I think that’s the tone that the President sets every day.”
https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/press-briefings/2021/04/09/press-briefing-by-press-secretary-jen-psaki-and-secretary-of-transportation-pete-buttigieg-april-9-2021/

Posted by: Surferket | Sep 28 2023 10:59 utc | 47

This is the result of this “hegemony” that all of you love. No money for her own citizens. Why US don’t have high speed train? Ah China’s fault.
China spend her money on her people. That’s 1.44 billion reasons why China under the CPC will not be hegemonic in any way.
——-
US Secretary of Transport said Chinese don’t deserve better things than Americans.
“And for my dime, there’s no good reason why we should settle for less, why we should be content that — it’s nothing against Chinese citizens, but I’m not content that a Chinese citizen can count on a dramatically better standard of, let’s say, train travel than a U.S. citizen. I think Americans should always have the best, and I think that’s the tone that the President sets every day.”
https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/press-briefings/2021/04/09/press-briefing-by-press-secretary-jen-psaki-and-secretary-of-transportation-pete-buttigieg-april-9-2021/

Posted by: Surferket | Sep 28 2023 10:59 utc | 48

***
I greatly admire China… Same cannot be said for the so-called Russian Federation, which … now has a GDP per capita below that of China. Best future for Russia would be for it’s natural resources to fall under competent Chinese management.
Posted by: Soothsayer | Sep 28 2023 9:36 utc | 5
***
52 Russia GDP/C PPP $36,485 GDP/C NOM $15,482
72 China GDP/C PPP $21,476 GDP/C NOM $12,598
https://www.worldometers.info/gdp/gdp-per-capita/
***
SOOTHSAYER = TRUTHDENIER?
Get facts right, then post.

Posted by: Kaiama | Sep 28 2023 10:59 utc | 49

***
I greatly admire China… Same cannot be said for the so-called Russian Federation, which … now has a GDP per capita below that of China. Best future for Russia would be for it’s natural resources to fall under competent Chinese management.
Posted by: Soothsayer | Sep 28 2023 9:36 utc | 5
***
52 Russia GDP/C PPP $36,485 GDP/C NOM $15,482
72 China GDP/C PPP $21,476 GDP/C NOM $12,598
https://www.worldometers.info/gdp/gdp-per-capita/
***
SOOTHSAYER = TRUTHDENIER?
Get facts right, then post.

Posted by: Kaiama | Sep 28 2023 10:59 utc | 50

If you look at Chinese propaganda posters from Mao’s era, everyone is chubby. That’s because there was mass starvation in China thanks to Mao’s policies. I suspect this article is similarly reality-based.

Posted by: JDaveF | Sep 28 2023 11:16 utc | 51

If you look at Chinese propaganda posters from Mao’s era, everyone is chubby. That’s because there was mass starvation in China thanks to Mao’s policies. I suspect this article is similarly reality-based.

Posted by: JDaveF | Sep 28 2023 11:16 utc | 52

This is really going to piss the warmongers off. Good.
@marcel #1:
Yes, I quite agree, the one thing immature people cannot handle is supreme success. And nothing is more excessive than thinking you are going to rule the planet forever.

Posted by: Bemildred | Sep 28 2023 11:22 utc | 53

This is really going to piss the warmongers off. Good.
@marcel #1:
Yes, I quite agree, the one thing immature people cannot handle is supreme success. And nothing is more excessive than thinking you are going to rule the planet forever.

Posted by: Bemildred | Sep 28 2023 11:22 utc | 54

Well done to China for rejecting hegemony, at least in its rhetoric, and to be fair, in its lack of military aggression on the way to achieving its superpower status.
Can someone explain how that rhetoric fits into its 9-Dash line, which blatantly encroaches on territorial claims of its smaller neighbours? Which is the chicken, which is the egg, when one considers China’s perceived threat from the US Navy surrounding its shipping routes and ports on one hand, and its hegemonic attitude in bullying its smaller neighbours on the other?

Posted by: Rubiconned | Sep 28 2023 11:23 utc | 55

Well done to China for rejecting hegemony, at least in its rhetoric, and to be fair, in its lack of military aggression on the way to achieving its superpower status.
Can someone explain how that rhetoric fits into its 9-Dash line, which blatantly encroaches on territorial claims of its smaller neighbours? Which is the chicken, which is the egg, when one considers China’s perceived threat from the US Navy surrounding its shipping routes and ports on one hand, and its hegemonic attitude in bullying its smaller neighbours on the other?

Posted by: Rubiconned | Sep 28 2023 11:23 utc | 56

Posted by: Rubiconned | Sep 28 2023 11:23 utc | 29
That’s a concerned troll.
Start with 11 Dash Line. Who did it and who supported it with the ships to mark it.
Come back and tell us your findings.

Posted by: Surferket | Sep 28 2023 11:27 utc | 57

Posted by: Rubiconned | Sep 28 2023 11:23 utc | 29
That’s a concerned troll.
Start with 11 Dash Line. Who did it and who supported it with the ships to mark it.
Come back and tell us your findings.

Posted by: Surferket | Sep 28 2023 11:27 utc | 58

China is not perfect, China is not my friend. Noble words on paper about not seeking hegemony are just words on paper, we will see.
However: after Mao’s disastrous “strength through numbers” pro-natalist population explosion nearly tore the country apart, the Chinese government has lifted over a billion people out of poverty. Unlike the United States, which has opened the borders to unlimited third-world invasion specifically to drive wages down and rents and profits up, China has not declared war on its working class.
Compare this to India, where the country is now in the grips of the Malthusian catastrophe, and population growth is tracking food production at a low level of subsistence, people have few children but only because they are so miserably impoverished that it is physically impossible for them to have more, and the government thinks this is great, wonderful! All that cheap labor, how profitable!
For all its flaws, current-day China deserves a lot of respect. If I were ethnic Chinese, I would probably not want to moe there now, but I would certainly keep it in mind for the future.

Posted by: TG | Sep 28 2023 11:28 utc | 59

China is not perfect, China is not my friend. Noble words on paper about not seeking hegemony are just words on paper, we will see.
However: after Mao’s disastrous “strength through numbers” pro-natalist population explosion nearly tore the country apart, the Chinese government has lifted over a billion people out of poverty. Unlike the United States, which has opened the borders to unlimited third-world invasion specifically to drive wages down and rents and profits up, China has not declared war on its working class.
Compare this to India, where the country is now in the grips of the Malthusian catastrophe, and population growth is tracking food production at a low level of subsistence, people have few children but only because they are so miserably impoverished that it is physically impossible for them to have more, and the government thinks this is great, wonderful! All that cheap labor, how profitable!
For all its flaws, current-day China deserves a lot of respect. If I were ethnic Chinese, I would probably not want to moe there now, but I would certainly keep it in mind for the future.

Posted by: TG | Sep 28 2023 11:28 utc | 60

Posted by: TG | Sep 28 2023 11:28 utc | 31
Have you been to China?
I’m ethnically Chinese and I’m in China for past 10 years. I’d give my left balls for Chinese citizenship But there are 1.44 billion reasons against.
“, I would probably not want to moe there now”
Have you actually lived in China to make such an informed opinion?

Posted by: Surferket | Sep 28 2023 11:31 utc | 61

Posted by: TG | Sep 28 2023 11:28 utc | 31
Have you been to China?
I’m ethnically Chinese and I’m in China for past 10 years. I’d give my left balls for Chinese citizenship But there are 1.44 billion reasons against.
“, I would probably not want to moe there now”
Have you actually lived in China to make such an informed opinion?

Posted by: Surferket | Sep 28 2023 11:31 utc | 62

Whenever the subject matter concerns Russia and China, you see the armchair experts pontificating on bad Russia and bad China.
This shows how successful the media brainwashing has been on global level.

Posted by: Surferket | Sep 28 2023 11:35 utc | 63

Whenever the subject matter concerns Russia and China, you see the armchair experts pontificating on bad Russia and bad China.
This shows how successful the media brainwashing has been on global level.

Posted by: Surferket | Sep 28 2023 11:35 utc | 64

Surely the thing about Chinese leadership (and Russian to an extent) is that they don’t actively seem to hate their own people, indeed they seem rather proud of them.
I wish Western leaders were like that, instead they seem determined to diminish and impoverish us.

Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Sep 28 2023 11:41 utc | 65

Surely the thing about Chinese leadership (and Russian to an extent) is that they don’t actively seem to hate their own people, indeed they seem rather proud of them.
I wish Western leaders were like that, instead they seem determined to diminish and impoverish us.

Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Sep 28 2023 11:41 utc | 66

Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Sep 28 2023 11:41 utc | 34
You’re kidding. You mean rulers should hate their ruled subjects?
The mandate of the CPC to rule China comes from the Chinese people since 1921, founding of the CPC. During the course of the Chinese civil war between the CPC and the KMT it was the Chinese people who backed the CPC, enabling them to beat the KMT.
Today that’s 1.44 billion people to keep happy. And hegemony is not what the Chinese people wants.
The Chinese people want to see a better tomorrow, not nation’s wealth and blood of the people squandered in Wars of conquests.
And China has 56 ethnic groups to keep happy.

Posted by: Surferket | Sep 28 2023 11:52 utc | 67

Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Sep 28 2023 11:41 utc | 34
You’re kidding. You mean rulers should hate their ruled subjects?
The mandate of the CPC to rule China comes from the Chinese people since 1921, founding of the CPC. During the course of the Chinese civil war between the CPC and the KMT it was the Chinese people who backed the CPC, enabling them to beat the KMT.
Today that’s 1.44 billion people to keep happy. And hegemony is not what the Chinese people wants.
The Chinese people want to see a better tomorrow, not nation’s wealth and blood of the people squandered in Wars of conquests.
And China has 56 ethnic groups to keep happy.

Posted by: Surferket | Sep 28 2023 11:52 utc | 68

Same cannot be said for the so-called Russian Federation, which despite sitting on oodles of oil and gas, now has a GDP per capita below that of China.
Best future for Russia would be for it’s natural resources to fall under competent Chinese management.
Posted by: Soothsayer | Sep 28 2023 9:36 utc | 5

I disagree…..
Russia’s natural resources should be under Soothsayer’s management….
After which…
Russia’s GDP / capita will fall to the desired asymptote….. ZERO!!
For….
That is what Soothsayer’s handlers…. MI6/CIA/NSA/SBU…. crave….
INDY

Posted by: Dr. George W Oprisko | Sep 28 2023 11:53 utc | 69

Same cannot be said for the so-called Russian Federation, which despite sitting on oodles of oil and gas, now has a GDP per capita below that of China.
Best future for Russia would be for it’s natural resources to fall under competent Chinese management.
Posted by: Soothsayer | Sep 28 2023 9:36 utc | 5

I disagree…..
Russia’s natural resources should be under Soothsayer’s management….
After which…
Russia’s GDP / capita will fall to the desired asymptote….. ZERO!!
For….
That is what Soothsayer’s handlers…. MI6/CIA/NSA/SBU…. crave….
INDY

Posted by: Dr. George W Oprisko | Sep 28 2023 11:53 utc | 70

@2 Paul Schneider
“Can we ask a Uighur living in China for their feedback?”
About what, Paul?
Do you want to ask them about their opinion of the inevitability or otherwise of global conflict between great powers?
Or do you want to ask them about their opinion of being a minority ethnicity within a predominantly Chinese nation-state?
Which one?
Because you do understand that those are not at all the same question, right?
“I mean that.”
No, I doubt that very much.
How a country deals with minority rights amongst its own citizenry is not even REMOTELY related with how that same country interacts with other states on the global stage.
A case in point: the USA insists upon the equality of all its citizens within its union-state. But it bullies, browbeats, invades and stomps upon the independence of other states around the globe.
These two things are not related to each other, and there is no reason to assume that they should be related.
“I accept and embrace the principle of global cooperation that you quote from this paper.”
As does China.
“I hope it is sincere.”
Apparently it is.
“But if the Chinese exempt themselves (just like we preach “democracy” and then undermine our own elections (e.g., 2020) from these principles,”
Whoah, hey, hang on a minute. In what way is Chinese treatment of their own minorities within its own borders in any way an “exemption” from how states interact with each other?
One is an entirely internal affair, the other is a case of international relations.
They are not the same thing. They aren’t REMOTELY the same thing.
“then count me as pessimistic.”
Not pessimistic. “Muddled” would be the better word, and that’s being generous.

Posted by: Yeah, Right | Sep 28 2023 12:01 utc | 71

@2 Paul Schneider
“Can we ask a Uighur living in China for their feedback?”
About what, Paul?
Do you want to ask them about their opinion of the inevitability or otherwise of global conflict between great powers?
Or do you want to ask them about their opinion of being a minority ethnicity within a predominantly Chinese nation-state?
Which one?
Because you do understand that those are not at all the same question, right?
“I mean that.”
No, I doubt that very much.
How a country deals with minority rights amongst its own citizenry is not even REMOTELY related with how that same country interacts with other states on the global stage.
A case in point: the USA insists upon the equality of all its citizens within its union-state. But it bullies, browbeats, invades and stomps upon the independence of other states around the globe.
These two things are not related to each other, and there is no reason to assume that they should be related.
“I accept and embrace the principle of global cooperation that you quote from this paper.”
As does China.
“I hope it is sincere.”
Apparently it is.
“But if the Chinese exempt themselves (just like we preach “democracy” and then undermine our own elections (e.g., 2020) from these principles,”
Whoah, hey, hang on a minute. In what way is Chinese treatment of their own minorities within its own borders in any way an “exemption” from how states interact with each other?
One is an entirely internal affair, the other is a case of international relations.
They are not the same thing. They aren’t REMOTELY the same thing.
“then count me as pessimistic.”
Not pessimistic. “Muddled” would be the better word, and that’s being generous.

Posted by: Yeah, Right | Sep 28 2023 12:01 utc | 72

DunGramin 11
I agree multipolar is the answer.
But once the multiploar society gets rich, they then want dominance.
Multipolarity is the entrance door, but then the poor immigrants turn out to aspire to hegemony. Anybody , even China, who thinks hegemony is now within their grasp, will seize the opportunity. Whoever it is and wherever they come from. Human nature.

Posted by: Giyane | Sep 28 2023 12:09 utc | 73

DunGramin 11
I agree multipolar is the answer.
But once the multiploar society gets rich, they then want dominance.
Multipolarity is the entrance door, but then the poor immigrants turn out to aspire to hegemony. Anybody , even China, who thinks hegemony is now within their grasp, will seize the opportunity. Whoever it is and wherever they come from. Human nature.

Posted by: Giyane | Sep 28 2023 12:09 utc | 74

Imperial double speak. Everyone speaks of noble causes but none act upon them. Empire is expansive:
China – Xinjiang, Tibet, Inner Mongolia, Qinghai, etc.
Russia – Tatar, Khazak,Buryat, Titulars, etc.
UK- Northern Ireland, Scotland, Wales, Falklands, Diago Garcia, Gibraltar, etc
USA – Northern Mariana Islands, Guam, American Samoa, etc.
France – Saint Martin, Reunion, New Caledonia, etc.
Netherlands – Netherlands Antilles, etc.
Turkey – Turkey.
Every nation today is product of a few if not dozens or hundreds of conquests over mellenia. Prime example Mongols from away have displaced local population and we have Turkey. Americas are inhabited by imperialists from away after slaughtering local populations.
Just like a Chihuahua by any other name is still a rat in a sweater. You can call it what you wish but, game of empires continues.

Posted by: Saag | Sep 28 2023 12:12 utc | 75

Imperial double speak. Everyone speaks of noble causes but none act upon them. Empire is expansive:
China – Xinjiang, Tibet, Inner Mongolia, Qinghai, etc.
Russia – Tatar, Khazak,Buryat, Titulars, etc.
UK- Northern Ireland, Scotland, Wales, Falklands, Diago Garcia, Gibraltar, etc
USA – Northern Mariana Islands, Guam, American Samoa, etc.
France – Saint Martin, Reunion, New Caledonia, etc.
Netherlands – Netherlands Antilles, etc.
Turkey – Turkey.
Every nation today is product of a few if not dozens or hundreds of conquests over mellenia. Prime example Mongols from away have displaced local population and we have Turkey. Americas are inhabited by imperialists from away after slaughtering local populations.
Just like a Chihuahua by any other name is still a rat in a sweater. You can call it what you wish but, game of empires continues.

Posted by: Saag | Sep 28 2023 12:12 utc | 76

Never forget that China is about to collapse because of a overabundance of modern housing. (At least according to NPR)

Posted by: Exile | Sep 28 2023 12:14 utc | 77

Never forget that China is about to collapse because of a overabundance of modern housing. (At least according to NPR)

Posted by: Exile | Sep 28 2023 12:14 utc | 78

I shall put faith in their nice words if they create a good settlement for passage in the South China sea and settle differences with India. OTOH, even if China does become Number One, I doubt they will ever create the sort of wreckage that the US and its EU vassals have done. They’re just too inward looking and alien relative to the rest of the world.

Posted by: Eighthman | Sep 28 2023 12:17 utc | 79

I shall put faith in their nice words if they create a good settlement for passage in the South China sea and settle differences with India. OTOH, even if China does become Number One, I doubt they will ever create the sort of wreckage that the US and its EU vassals have done. They’re just too inward looking and alien relative to the rest of the world.

Posted by: Eighthman | Sep 28 2023 12:17 utc | 80

Humans (regardless of race, creed or colour) have some well earned/deserved idioms based on long enduring cyclical historical validity.
Here are a couple that come to mind in regards to this article:
1) Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts, absolutely.
2) Everyone supports a competitive environment, until one player finds a way to achieve monopoly power, then the last thing the new monopolist wants is to maintain this competitive environment.
Humans are corrupt and all we are witnessing now is new competitors, cooperating for the time being, to oust the current monopolist power, in order to create space for the fight for a new monopolist power to fill the void.
Human nature! The players are different, but the plot is the same.

Posted by: James Cook | Sep 28 2023 12:21 utc | 81

Humans (regardless of race, creed or colour) have some well earned/deserved idioms based on long enduring cyclical historical validity.
Here are a couple that come to mind in regards to this article:
1) Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts, absolutely.
2) Everyone supports a competitive environment, until one player finds a way to achieve monopoly power, then the last thing the new monopolist wants is to maintain this competitive environment.
Humans are corrupt and all we are witnessing now is new competitors, cooperating for the time being, to oust the current monopolist power, in order to create space for the fight for a new monopolist power to fill the void.
Human nature! The players are different, but the plot is the same.

Posted by: James Cook | Sep 28 2023 12:21 utc | 82

@29 Rubiconned
“Can someone explain how that rhetoric fits into its 9-Dash line, which blatantly encroaches on territorial claims of its smaller neighbours? ”
Our key phrase for today is “territorial claims”.
You are describing a territorial dispute, which is not at all uncommon.
China insists that its territorial claim to those islands is superior to those of its neighbours. Vietnam and the Philippines disagree because, gosh!, it wouldn’t be a territorial dispute otherwise.
“Which is the chicken, which is the egg, when one considers China’s perceived threat from the US Navy surrounding its shipping routes and ports on one hand, and its hegemonic attitude in bullying its smaller neighbours on the other?”
A country has to defend its own territorial integrity. The Chinese are very touchy about that concept, as well they should be after a century of humiliation where colonial powers forced China to cede or lease territory against its will.
Again, I have to stress that the Chinese aren’t saying that these are Vietnamese islands or Philippine Islands, that they want to take from the rightful sovereign and annex to China.
No, they are insisting that China has *always* been the rightful sovereign, and that the principle of sovereign territorial integrity is something they should not be required to compromise on.

Posted by: Yeah, Right | Sep 28 2023 12:24 utc | 83

@29 Rubiconned
“Can someone explain how that rhetoric fits into its 9-Dash line, which blatantly encroaches on territorial claims of its smaller neighbours? ”
Our key phrase for today is “territorial claims”.
You are describing a territorial dispute, which is not at all uncommon.
China insists that its territorial claim to those islands is superior to those of its neighbours. Vietnam and the Philippines disagree because, gosh!, it wouldn’t be a territorial dispute otherwise.
“Which is the chicken, which is the egg, when one considers China’s perceived threat from the US Navy surrounding its shipping routes and ports on one hand, and its hegemonic attitude in bullying its smaller neighbours on the other?”
A country has to defend its own territorial integrity. The Chinese are very touchy about that concept, as well they should be after a century of humiliation where colonial powers forced China to cede or lease territory against its will.
Again, I have to stress that the Chinese aren’t saying that these are Vietnamese islands or Philippine Islands, that they want to take from the rightful sovereign and annex to China.
No, they are insisting that China has *always* been the rightful sovereign, and that the principle of sovereign territorial integrity is something they should not be required to compromise on.

Posted by: Yeah, Right | Sep 28 2023 12:24 utc | 84

When I look for the link, it’s not there. Is the west blocking the paper?

Posted by: scepticalSOB | Sep 28 2023 12:27 utc | 85

When I look for the link, it’s not there. Is the west blocking the paper?

Posted by: scepticalSOB | Sep 28 2023 12:27 utc | 86

All it boils down to exporting my inflation to you in my denominated currency. Are you taking the deal ?

Posted by: KD | Sep 28 2023 12:28 utc | 87

All it boils down to exporting my inflation to you in my denominated currency. Are you taking the deal ?

Posted by: KD | Sep 28 2023 12:28 utc | 88

Regarding those who want to ask Uyghurs:
– fly there for yourself and ask them
– alternatively start here and follow the hundreds of sources:
https://www.qiaocollective.com/education/xinjiang

Posted by: Zet | Sep 28 2023 12:34 utc | 89

Regarding those who want to ask Uyghurs:
– fly there for yourself and ask them
– alternatively start here and follow the hundreds of sources:
https://www.qiaocollective.com/education/xinjiang

Posted by: Zet | Sep 28 2023 12:34 utc | 90

@41 Eighthman, it may have escaped your notice but the Chinese have never blocked any ship seeking passage through the South China Sea.
Not a one. Not ever. Not a single merchant ship of any nationality has ever been prevented from sailing through that sea.
They don’t even seek to block passage by US Navy warships.
They simply complain – correctly, in my humble opinion – that such exercises are deliberate provocations done for no other reason than to rile the Chinese and, as such, can not be regarded as falling into the category of “innocent passage”.
But again, they complain through the proper channels: they don’t block passage, they go to the relevant international bodies and they protest such boorish behavior.
As for India, that is a territorial dispute. Lots and lots of countries – big ones, little ones, middling-sized ones – have territorial disputes with neighbors.
They are usually very messy things, and in this case there are two very large and very powerful countries locked in this territorial dispute, I wouldn’t be quite so quick to point the finger of blame at China over this one.

Posted by: Yeah, Right | Sep 28 2023 12:36 utc | 91

@41 Eighthman, it may have escaped your notice but the Chinese have never blocked any ship seeking passage through the South China Sea.
Not a one. Not ever. Not a single merchant ship of any nationality has ever been prevented from sailing through that sea.
They don’t even seek to block passage by US Navy warships.
They simply complain – correctly, in my humble opinion – that such exercises are deliberate provocations done for no other reason than to rile the Chinese and, as such, can not be regarded as falling into the category of “innocent passage”.
But again, they complain through the proper channels: they don’t block passage, they go to the relevant international bodies and they protest such boorish behavior.
As for India, that is a territorial dispute. Lots and lots of countries – big ones, little ones, middling-sized ones – have territorial disputes with neighbors.
They are usually very messy things, and in this case there are two very large and very powerful countries locked in this territorial dispute, I wouldn’t be quite so quick to point the finger of blame at China over this one.

Posted by: Yeah, Right | Sep 28 2023 12:36 utc | 92

By the way, a non-PDF version of the original doc can be found here:
https://www.fmprc.gov.cn/mfa_eng/zxxx_662805/202309/t20230926_11150122.html
It’s better to link to as well as to annotate.

Posted by: Zet | Sep 28 2023 12:38 utc | 93

By the way, a non-PDF version of the original doc can be found here:
https://www.fmprc.gov.cn/mfa_eng/zxxx_662805/202309/t20230926_11150122.html
It’s better to link to as well as to annotate.

Posted by: Zet | Sep 28 2023 12:38 utc | 94

Posted by: Eighthman | Sep 28 2023 12:17 utc | 41
since when China has blocked passage in SCS where 80% of the shipping go to /from China, HK, DieOne. China blockade China?
China doesn’t even block the extremely provocative passages of US Navy and their poodles through the Straits of Taiwan, even though China could do it asymmetrically.
China settled all border disputes with Russia. India absolutely refused to negotiate, insisting on taking Tibet, Arunachal, parts of Sichuan.
Who is being unreasonable?
You do know where Sichuan is right?

Posted by: Surferket | Sep 28 2023 12:49 utc | 95

Posted by: Eighthman | Sep 28 2023 12:17 utc | 41
since when China has blocked passage in SCS where 80% of the shipping go to /from China, HK, DieOne. China blockade China?
China doesn’t even block the extremely provocative passages of US Navy and their poodles through the Straits of Taiwan, even though China could do it asymmetrically.
China settled all border disputes with Russia. India absolutely refused to negotiate, insisting on taking Tibet, Arunachal, parts of Sichuan.
Who is being unreasonable?
You do know where Sichuan is right?

Posted by: Surferket | Sep 28 2023 12:49 utc | 96

Posted by: Surferket | Sep 28 2023 10:19 utc | 12
Get a tourist visa and enter USA, then go straight to Chikago and you can ask every Russian you see.
Did the Chinese take
ur financial assets ?
ur property?
ur car?
and gave to Russians?
P.S
Why u dont take the Uigurs and give them housing, food, car ?

Posted by: tesla | Sep 28 2023 12:52 utc | 97

Posted by: Surferket | Sep 28 2023 10:19 utc | 12
Get a tourist visa and enter USA, then go straight to Chikago and you can ask every Russian you see.
Did the Chinese take
ur financial assets ?
ur property?
ur car?
and gave to Russians?
P.S
Why u dont take the Uigurs and give them housing, food, car ?

Posted by: tesla | Sep 28 2023 12:52 utc | 98

With the exception of the Mongols, China has rarely been internationally aggressive.
Posted by: TPaine | Sep 28 2023 10:30 utc | 16
That statement is anachronistic.

Posted by: sln2002 | Sep 28 2023 13:00 utc | 99

With the exception of the Mongols, China has rarely been internationally aggressive.
Posted by: TPaine | Sep 28 2023 10:30 utc | 16
That statement is anachronistic.

Posted by: sln2002 | Sep 28 2023 13:00 utc | 100