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August 6, 2023
Ukraine Open Thread 2023-187
Only for news & views directly related to the Ukraine conflict. The current open thread for other issues is here. Please stick to the topic. Contribute facts. Do not attack other commentators.
Comments
necromancer | Aug 7 2023 5:27 utc | 196 Posted by: S.P. Korolev | Aug 7 2023 6:06 utc | 201 >>The Federal Reserve, like all banks, raises money by borrowing. Posted by: The Accountant | Aug 7 2023 6:30 utc | 202 Posted by: Julian | Aug 7 2023 5:36 utc | 197 Posted by: Lev Davidovich | Aug 7 2023 6:45 utc | 203 Just came across this Mark Sleboda post on Twitter/X. Forgive me if others have already posted it: Posted by: Objective Observer | Aug 7 2023 7:07 utc | 204 Posted by: Membrum Virile | Aug 7 2023 5:59 utc | 200 Posted by: pretzelattack | Aug 7 2023 7:09 utc | 205 A footnote…… Posted by: Bartholomew Cubbins | Aug 7 2023 7:19 utc | 206 German Industrial Output Declines More Than Expected Posted by: maney | Aug 7 2023 7:29 utc | 207 Google Butcha. Posted by: laguerre | Aug 7 2023 7:55 utc | 208 Posted by: Ed4 | Aug 6 2023 23:54 utc | 152 Posted by: RB | Aug 7 2023 7:56 utc | 209 Posted by: Membrum Virile | Aug 7 2023 5:59 utc | 200 Posted by: Arch Bungle | Aug 7 2023 8:01 utc | 210 Posted by: Membrum Virile | Aug 7 2023 5:59 utc | 200
Sure we’ll hit 100 pretty soon. Posted by: Arch Bungle | Aug 7 2023 8:06 utc | 211 What changed? Posted by: RB | Aug 7 2023 8:08 utc | 212 This war is showing that it is hard to go on the offensive across farmland in modern times. Drones and satellites see vehicles and troop formations and then GPS guided bombs or GPS directed artillery guns can destroy them. Posted by: rk | Aug 7 2023 8:11 utc | 213 Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Aug 7 2023 0:44 utc | 163
The Russian federation has no control the western borders of Ukraine. Posted by: Arch Bungle | Aug 7 2023 8:18 utc | 214 What changed? Posted by: SCCC | Aug 7 2023 8:48 utc | 215 Anyone have any idea why RF doesn’t just take out Global Hawk drones? In Ukraine and Syria RF only interferes with them non destructively e.g. dropping fuel on them. Big, expensive, important, but still inanimate drones, I seriously doubt USA will declare WW3 over downed drones, all I can figure is there is a tacit and very grave agreement that if you fuck with our big drones we will fuck with your _ _ _ (fill in the blank). Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Aug 7 2023 8:55 utc | 216 The journalist Marat Khairullin congratulates the capture of Novoselovskoye village in the Svatovo district and highlights its importance. He then touches upon the Western propaganda’s assessment of the Ukrainian offensive in Zaporozhye and near Artemovsk-Bakhmut. While the offensive was seen as successful, with the Ukrainians gaining around 180 square kilometers, the losses incurred by the Ukrainian forces were significant. These losses included 43,000 soldiers, 4,900 units of armament, 1,831 units of tanks and armored vehicles, 26 planes, 9 helicopters, 747 units of artillery and mortars, and 84 units of self-propelled guns. The exact losses were estimated by the Ukrainian Defense Ministry, with the West remaining silent about them. Posted by: Avian | Aug 7 2023 9:33 utc | 217 Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Aug 7 2023 0:20 utc | 158
Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Aug 6 2023 20:11 utc | 105
Good catch Lavrov’s dog. I knew that shadowbanned post was bullshit because of not explaining what was “wrong” with Simplicius posts back in “December”. Lol! This is bullshit peddled without due dilligence. Posted by: Johan Kaspar | Aug 7 2023 9:43 utc | 218 For sure they will be driving them out eventually. Posted by: RB | Aug 7 2023 9:45 utc | 219 … But they (Poland) don’t want the useless Lviv, they want all the npps, pipes and Odessa, they want Transnistria and basically a new nato expansion by annexing Ukr. … Posted by: anon2020 | Aug 7 2023 9:53 utc | 220
1 to 10 Kt a mile inside the border at each of the ~25 crossings. Give a week warning for all civilians nearby to evacuate (some of those are small towns right next to the border). Ground burst, not an air burst, in order to leave it radioactive for as long as possible. Hit it again as soon as they try to build new crossings. Keep doing it after that. Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Aug 7 2023 9:54 utc | 221 Posted by: Arch Bungle | Aug 7 2023 2:30 utc | 176 Posted by: unimperator | Aug 7 2023 10:01 utc | 222
Yes, I messed up the date, but that doesn’t change much.
So did I “bullshit”? Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Aug 7 2023 10:08 utc | 223 New General GD Bakshi and his, as someone here called it, full raj-tache. First half is SMO background then counter offensive background, then situation now, nothing revelatory for barflies but it is an informed military analysis for a change: Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Aug 7 2023 10:10 utc | 224 @ LightYearsFromHome | Aug 7 2023 8:55 utc | 217 Posted by: whirlX | Aug 7 2023 10:11 utc | 225 Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Aug 7 2023 8:55 utc | 217 Posted by: anon2020 | Aug 7 2023 10:19 utc | 226 Posted by: Jmaas | Aug 7 2023 6:00 utc | 201 Posted by: Echo Chamber | Aug 7 2023 10:20 utc | 227 @ Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Aug 7 2023 10:08 utc | 224 Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Aug 7 2023 10:27 utc | 228 Echo Chamber | Aug 7 2023 10:20 utc | 228 Posted by: paddy | Aug 7 2023 10:40 utc | 229 Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Aug 7 2023 9:54 utc | 222
Brother, you need Christ Jesus in your life. Posted by: Arch Bungle | Aug 7 2023 10:41 utc | 230
The problem is that many thousands of Russian lives have been lost because of the Kremlin’s refusal to deal with this issue. Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Aug 7 2023 10:47 utc | 231 anon2020 @ 227 Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Aug 7 2023 10:47 utc | 232 shаdοwbanned | Aug 7 2023 9:54 utc | 222 Posted by: paddy | Aug 7 2023 10:49 utc | 233
There are probably many ways to answer that kind of question. My way would be to say Russians and there leadership have principles and high standards they choose to live by. Being authentic and having integrity seems to be important to them. The Americans used to be like such as the great generation that fought in the WW2. Ukraine appears to have been hollowed out morally and ethically. Therefore the 30 years of corruption and criminality they were unable to grow out of. Posted by: Lavrov’s Dog | Aug 7 2023 10:50 utc | 234 Posted by: Jmaas | Aug 7 2023 6:00 utc | 201 Posted by: Echo Chamber | Aug 7 2023 10:52 utc | 235 @ Echo Chamber, §168: Posted by: John Marks | Aug 7 2023 10:55 utc | 236
It wouldn’t be a problem if he wasn’t following The Saker’s pattern of regularly taking shots at the “2D bloggers-grifters” and generally making lots of such self-discrediting comments. Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Aug 7 2023 10:57 utc | 237 Gonzalo Lira. Posted by: Giyane | Aug 7 2023 11:01 utc | 238 Money is NOT debt. Posted by: Greg Galloway | Aug 7 2023 11:12 utc | 239 Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Aug 7 2023 10:47 utc | 232 Posted by: watcher | Aug 7 2023 11:14 utc | 240 @Giyane | Aug 7 2023 11:01 utc | 239
Posted by: Norwegian | Aug 7 2023 11:18 utc | 241 Just watched general Bahdrakumar’s recent video. Very carefully he explained the chronography of SMO, how AFU made advances with the help of Nato satellite recon detecting gaps in the line, the RU stretched thin to rush forces from Bakhmut to defend the Kherson salient, in contrast to the current situation where lines are tight and AFU suffering horrendous casualties. Posted by: unimperator | Aug 7 2023 11:18 utc | 242 Posted by: unimperator | Aug 7 2023 11:18 utc | 243 Posted by: unimperator | Aug 7 2023 11:19 utc | 243 Posted by: Jmaas | Aug 7 2023 6:00 utc | 201 Posted by: Echo Chamber | Aug 7 2023 11:20 utc | 244 @shadowbanned – good work in verification (or non-verification) of Simplicius’ past predictions. Posted by: Ghost of Zanon | Aug 7 2023 11:21 utc | 245
Precisely the opposite is happening. Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Aug 7 2023 11:33 utc | 246
It is a bit more complex … it was rather made to appear when strangers entered the equation, e.g. when passing armies had to be fed. Posted by: Erast Fandorin | Aug 7 2023 11:34 utc | 247 unimperator @ 244 Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Aug 7 2023 11:46 utc | 248 watcher | Aug 7 2023 11:14 utc | 241 Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Aug 7 2023 11:52 utc | 249 Right now, I think that NATO is prodding to see how far they can go without getting slapped by Russia. Russia also needs to take control of the Black Sea, set a temporary 200-mile no fly and no watercraft limit for all vessels and aircraft (including spy drones). This is not unheard-of during war time. Posted by: JohninMK | Aug 7 2023 11:53 utc | 250 I note the writer of that Kiev Independent story is American, the “paper” is funded by Canada and the editor is at the University of Chicago. Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Aug 7 2023 11:58 utc | 251 That was a rather odd comment on Military Summary. About NATO sending columns of hardware up against Russian defences in order that it be destroyed rather than fall into Russian hands intact. I guess the Yanks don’t want to repeat Afghanistan – where that happened. Why the Ukies would play along is a bit of a mystery thought Posted by: Guy L’Estrange | Aug 7 2023 12:01 utc | 252 History does not repeat itself. Posted by: Arch Bungle | Aug 7 2023 12:02 utc | 253 What the above meant to me is that they were trying to flood the zone. They had troops in the capital, Kyiv. They were trying have it look like there were Russian troops everywhere already, so Ukraine wouldn’t fight. But since Ukraine did fight, Russia didn’t have enough troops in most places. Posted by: arthur brogard | Aug 7 2023 12:05 utc | 254 @217 “So, why doesn’t the RF make the USA eat it over the Global Hawks, what sword of Damocles is over Russia’s head?” @217 “So, why doesn’t the RF make the USA eat it over the Global Hawks, what sword of Damocles is over Russia’s head?” Posted by: Arch Bungle | Aug 7 2023 12:14 utc | 256 Russia is patient. They realize that the SMO may turn into WW3. So they let Global Hawks etc. do thier thing-the pinpricks they manage on Russian positions is nothing compared to what the Russians can learn from FUKUS tactics. Posted by: JohninMK | Aug 7 2023 12:17 utc | 257 YetAnotherAnon @ 250 / watcher @ 241 Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Aug 7 2023 12:20 utc | 258 https://abcnews.go.com/International/woman-arrested-plot-kill-president-volodymyr-zelenskyy-ukraine/story?id=102065597 Posted by: Eighthman | Aug 7 2023 12:21 utc | 259 Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Aug 7 2023 10:47 utc | 233 Posted by: anon2020 | Aug 7 2023 12:23 utc | 260 GD Bakshi has very interesting commentary on the entire RF SMO. Posted by: william paul | Aug 7 2023 12:28 utc | 261 LightYearsfromHome 249 Posted by: Giyane | Aug 7 2023 12:39 utc | 262 So if the Ukrainian SUs can fly around unmolested, six of them, and they can fire 12 Stormy Mondays, but the Russians have the biggest baddest air defen…..my ass. And when the F16s show up, how would Russia find them, esp when they fly from 3rd party countries that suffer no SMO consequence……now makes sense when I read Donbas LOC reports of Ukrainian aircraft bombing their positions. Posted by: sean the leprechaun | Aug 7 2023 12:45 utc | 263 Posted by: Erast Fandorin | Aug 7 2023 11:34 utc | 248 Posted by: Echo Chamber | Aug 7 2023 12:51 utc | 264 Posted by: Membrum Virile | Aug 7 2023 5:59 utc | 200 Posted by: Cynic | Aug 7 2023 12:56 utc | 265 Could someone please direct me to the Ukraine thread ? Somehow I keep ending up on the Economy thread. Posted by: Featherless | Aug 7 2023 12:57 utc | 266 Arch Bungle @ 256
Most convincing explanation yet, but what I was getting at is that no matter how expensive or important for ISR a drone is just a piece of tech, whether costing $10 mil or $500 who cares, shoot them down if only for target practice. Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Aug 7 2023 13:10 utc | 267 Natukros successfully attacking and knocking out bridges Posted by: SlowSoft | Aug 7 2023 13:16 utc | 268 Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Aug 7 2023 13:10 utc | 267
Plausible. Posted by: Arch Bungle | Aug 7 2023 13:43 utc | 269 Re: Posted by: LogosApplied | Aug 7 2023 13:46 utc | 270 YetAnotherAnon | Aug 7 2023 11:52 utc | 250 Posted by: Cynic | Aug 7 2023 13:54 utc | 271 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DM4dbY6wZmE Posted by: Eighthman | Aug 7 2023 14:04 utc | 272 CONCERN/HATE TROLLING of RUSSIA in latest posts of user “shаdοwbanned” in Ukraine-open-thread-2023-187 [Aug 6 2023 20:17 – Aug 7 2023 1:08 utc]: Posted by: LongCovid | Aug 7 2023 14:10 utc | 273 Posted by: Arch Bungle | Aug 7 2023 13:43 utc | 270 Posted by: Ed4 | Aug 7 2023 14:13 utc | 274 Woman arrested in plot to kill Zelensky. Posted by: Aleph_Null | Aug 7 2023 14:26 utc | 275 RT is reporting a large explosion occurred at a Turkish grain elevator at a Black Sea port near Istanbul. Interesting – no suggestion of cause although a grain ship was being loaded at the time so could just be an accident. Video shows whole bank of silos going up at once. Posted by: the pessimist | Aug 7 2023 14:28 utc | 276 Not Russian style to do this type of sabotage (grain elevator explosion), but the Ukrainians might and try to blame Russia. Putin is supposed to meet Erdogan to discuss grain deal among other things at some point in the future and the Ukrainians would no doubt like to paint Russia as a bad faith actor and pressure Turkey to take a harder line against Russia. Posted by: the pessimist | Aug 7 2023 14:36 utc | 277
If only that was the reason… Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Aug 7 2023 14:47 utc | 278 Google Butcha. Posted by: polarbear4 | Aug 7 2023 14:48 utc | 279 Slow Motion Operation begin just after the peace talks failure. Since : Posted by: Savonarole | Aug 7 2023 14:57 utc | 280 sb@279 Posted by: the pessimist | Aug 7 2023 15:17 utc | 281 Posted by: Membrum Flaccide | Aug 7 2023 5:59 utc | 200
And that’s the tell. Posted by: Arch Bungle | Aug 7 2023 15:33 utc | 282 Posted by: Ed4 | Aug 7 2023 14:13 utc | 275
In those days they claimed their feeds were encrypted. Posted by: Arch Bungle | Aug 7 2023 15:36 utc | 283 In those days they claimed their feeds were encrypted. Posted by: Bemildred | Aug 7 2023 15:51 utc | 284 Posted by: Arch Bungle | Aug 7 2023 15:36 utc | 284 Posted by: Ed4 | Aug 7 2023 15:58 utc | 285 Re: Posted by: LogosApplied | Aug 7 2023 16:03 utc | 286 Ukraine has lost it is just how many more dead and wounded they want! Posted by: Peace | Aug 7 2023 16:17 utc | 287 Is this RAND Corp. doc legit? Even if it isn’t the content is probably true…US plans to use war to bolster US economic power at the expense of Europe/Germany. Posted by: Objective Observer | Aug 7 2023 16:20 utc | 288 @ unimperator | Aug 7 2023 11:19 utc | 244 Posted by: whirlX | Aug 7 2023 16:27 utc | 289 The topic of Maria Zakharova’s article in Rossiyskaya Gazeta has been seen here before, “The World Leader in Black Transplantology: Organs Are Sold Both Online and Offline in Ukraine”, in which she connects some dots and shows definited Ukrainian complicity in this criminal cartel. Here’s her concluding paragraph: @ 279 Posted by: fanto | Aug 7 2023 16:52 utc | 291 my mistake, my previous comment was to statement by Logos @271. sorry. Posted by: fanto | Aug 7 2023 16:54 utc | 292 The Russian federation has no control the western borders of Ukraine. Posted by: Englishman | Aug 7 2023 16:59 utc | 293 @235 Posted by: Fred777 | Aug 7 2023 16:59 utc | 294 I generally read B’s commentary, then only scan comments for “http” to see if there’s anything I’ve missed; so may have missed this. But is there any discussion about where the sea drones are coming from, now most Ukrainian ports have been destroyed, how they’re controlled, and what can be done about them ? If they’re not from the Ukraine, there’s a good chance they’re launched from Romania, perhaps following harbor tugs or coastal traffic. In Afghanistan, U.S. arial drones were controlled by satellite in real time, from the U.S., so sea drones may be also, or maybe from the UK since they’re UK manufacture. Their transponders need be no larger than the Star Link transponders on American cars, 2 inches by 6, for them to surface periodically, ping the current satellite, and get the most recent targeting instructions. Software similar to that guiding low-flying cruise missiles should be adequate to guide them to the the target, after which they’d surface enough for real-time targeting. Posted by: Seward | Aug 7 2023 17:18 utc | 295 Posted by: Seward | Aug 7 2023 17:18 utc | 296 Posted by: Ed4 | Aug 7 2023 17:43 utc | 296 Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Aug 7 2023 14:47 utc | 279 Posted by: SlowSoft | Aug 7 2023 17:48 utc | 297 Posted by: Eighthman | Aug 7 2023 12:21 utc | 260 Posted by: Membrum Virile | Aug 7 2023 17:51 utc | 298 Posted by: Seward | Aug 7 2023 17:18 utc | 296 “Maybe a Peresvet laser system, designed to blind recon satellites” Posted by: Ed4 | Aug 7 2023 17:53 utc | 299 Google Butcha. Posted by: 600w | Aug 7 2023 17:56 utc | 300 |
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