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August 5, 2023
Ukraine Open Thread 2023-185
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Looking forward to an enlightening and friendly discussion amongst friends today!
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Aug 5 2023 16:44 utc | 1
Summary of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation on the progress of the special military operation (as of August 5, 2023)
The Armed Forces of the Russian Federation continue to conduct a special military operation.
In the Kupyansk direction, the settlement of Novoselovskoye of the Luhansk People’s Republic was liberated by competent and professional actions of the units of the “Western” grouping of troops. In addition, during the conduct of offensive operations on a wide front, assault detachments improved the situation along the front edge in the areas of the settlements of Olshana and Pershotravnevoye of the Kharkiv region.
Three counterattacks of units of the 14th Mechanized and 25th Airborne Brigades of the Armed Forces of Ukraine were successfully repelled in the areas of the settlements of Sinkovka, Zagoruykovka and Berestovoye in the Kharkiv region. Assault and army aviation strikes, artillery fire defeated enemy concentrations of manpower and equipment in the areas of the settlements of Kupyansk, Petropavlovsk, Tabayevka of the Kharkiv region and Stelmakhovka of the Luhansk People’s Republic.
Up to 140 Ukrainian servicemen, two armored combat vehicles, three cars, a Polish-made Krab self-propelled artillery system, as well as D-20 and Msta-B howitzers were destroyed during the day. During the day, the armed forces of Ukraine made unsuccessful attempts of offensive actions in the Donetsk and Krasno-Limansk directions.
In the Donetsk direction, units of the “Southern” grouping of troops in close cooperation with aviation and artillery successfully repelled ten enemy attacks in the areas of the settlements of Belogorovka, Avdiivka and Staromikhailovka of the Donetsk People’s Republic. In addition, clusters of manpower and equipment of the Armed Forces of Ukraine were defeated in the areas of the settlements of Bogdanovka, Kleshcheyevka, Lastochkino, Maryinka and Krasnogorovka of the Donetsk People’s Republic.
The enemy’s losses amounted to up to 230 Ukrainian servicemen, four armored combat vehicles, three cars, a Polish-made Krab self-propelled artillery unit, a D-20 howitzer, three self-propelled artillery units “Carnation”, as well as an anti-tank gun “Rapier”.
▫️ In the Krasnolimansk direction, units of the Center group of troops, army aviation strikes and artillery fire successfully repelled three attacks by assault groups of the 42nd Mechanized Brigade of the Armed Forces of Ukraine in the area of the Serebryansky forestry.
Also, a complex fire defeat was inflicted on enemy manpower and equipment accumulations in the areas of the settlements of Novoegorovka, Nevskoye and Chervonaya Dibrova of the Luhansk People’s Republic. During the day, more than 100 Ukrainian servicemen, three armored combat vehicles, two cars, an Acacia self-propelled artillery installation, as well as two D-30 howitzers were destroyed.
▫️ In the South Donetsk direction, air strikes, artillery fire and units of the Vostok group of troops defeated the Armed Forces personnel and equipment in the areas of the settlements of Ugledar, Prechistovka, Staromayorskoye and Rovnopol of the Donetsk People’s Republic. The enemy’s losses in this direction amounted to more than 210 Ukrainian servicemen, two armored combat vehicles, three cars, an M777 artillery system manufactured by the United States, as well as a self-propelled howitzer “Carnation”.
In the Zaporozhye direction, proactive active actions of Russian units, air strikes and artillery fire defeated the AFU in the areas of the settlements of Chervonaya Krynitsa, Egorovka, Preobrazhenka, Novodanilovka and Pyatikhatki of the Zaporozhye region.
More than 175 Ukrainian servicemen, two tanks, four armored fighting vehicles, two Polish-made Krab self-propelled artillery units, four D-20 howitzers and one D-30 gun were destroyed.
▫️ In the Kherson direction, as a result of fire damage, enemy losses amounted to up to 35 Ukrainian servicemen, three cars, as well as the Msta-B howitzer.
Operational-tactical and army aviation, missile troops and artillery groups of the Armed Forces of the Russian Federation defeated 126 artillery units in firing positions, manpower and military equipment in 138 districts.
In addition, a radar station for detecting aerial targets was hit near the settlement of Rogan, Kharkiv region. In the area of the Torskoye settlement of the Donetsk People’s Republic, an ammunition depot of the 44th mechanized Brigade of the Armed Forces of Ukraine was destroyed.
Air defense means intercepted eight rockets of the HIMARS multiple launch rocket system during the day. In addition, 22 Ukrainian unmanned aerial vehicles were destroyed in the areas of the settlements of Olshana, Kharkiv region, Melovatka, Luhansk People’s Republic, Belogorovka, Semigorye, Zaitseve, Disputable, Berestove, Donetsk People’s Republic, Chapaevka, Chistopolye, Tokmak, Tarasovka, Novozlatopol, Zaporozhye region, Malaya Lepetikha and Bare Pier, Kherson region.
In total, since the beginning of the special military operation, 458 aircraft, 245 helicopters, 5518 unmanned aerial vehicles, 428 anti-aircraft missile systems, 11130 tanks and other armored combat vehicles, 1142 multiple rocket launchers, 5768 field artillery and mortars, as well as 12071 units of special military vehicles have been destroyed.
rumod
Posted by: rumod report | Aug 5 2023 16:45 utc | 2
@rumod report 2
thx for the update!
“In total, since the beginning of the special military operation, 458 aircraft, 245 helicopters, 5518 unmanned aerial vehicles, 428 anti-aircraft missile systems, 11130 tanks and other armored combat vehicles, 1142 multiple rocket launchers, 5768 field artillery and mortars, as well as 12071 units of special military vehicles have been destroyed.”
That´s RU MoD´s homepage I guess?
Do we have good numbers on the RU vehicle losses since SMO started?
Posted by: AG | Aug 5 2023 16:49 utc | 3
PSA. When the so called mr b shows up here I suggest you all ignore it. Way to much valulable space taken up by its clown world views
Posted by: Tannwnhouser | Aug 5 2023 16:55 utc | 4
After 2 months of Ukraines counter offensive
They have lost nearly 36,000 irreversible personnel (1/4 of all the personnel designed to participate in the counteroffensive), 1,700 armored vehicles, 650 tanks, and nearly 350 artillery systems, and with it too, they have lost billions in dollars of ammunition as a result of pre-emptive strikes of the Russian Aviation Forces, and not to mention what they lost in Odessa.
Posted by: Norwegian | Aug 5 2023 17:03 utc | 5
I doubt that it will be perceived in the warmongering West but the war in Ukraine should generate a particular possibility for peace : non aggression pacts.
Since the Soviet/Nazis days, these have gotten a bad rap but times have changed. Tens of thousands of Ukrainians keep wasting their lives by attacking with no surprise whatsoever. Stalin didn’t have satellites in orbit, nor the internet, nor drones to report on the Nazi invasion.
Posted by: Eighthman | Aug 5 2023 17:06 utc | 6
About the counteroffensive:
I said they lost over 160 tanks and we lost 54 tanks, some of which can be restored and repaired.
Meeting with war correspondents
Posted by: Passerby | Aug 5 2023 17:07 utc | 7
I am glad to see that they are still calling it a Special Military Operation as it has nothing to do with War as We Know it.
And by one key metric, it has been an unmitigated success: it has been very, very “special”.
Russian chldren will some day sing songs about the heroic Special Miltary Operators and visit the Special Military Operation Museum which will display all the trophies taken, including washing machines, air pods and bottles of tainted vodka.
Posted by: Noam A. Larkey | Aug 5 2023 17:32 utc | 8
@2:
Only two tanks destroyed. I guess that means the counteroffensive is officially over.
Posted by: Jörgen Hassler | Aug 5 2023 17:34 utc | 9
Rumors have it that the aerodrome in Starokonstantinov no longer exists. At least 10 hits are reported.
https://t.me/Slavyangrad/57963
Google Map Link
Posted by: Norwegian | Aug 5 2023 17:35 utc | 10
Please, please, put all G. Lira posts in “Other”. Wading through the back and forth, the froth is a fog.
Posted by: paxmark1 | Aug 5 2023 17:38 utc | 11
@ rumod report | Aug 5 2023 16:45 utc | 2
thanks…
@ Tannwnhouser | Aug 5 2023 16:55 utc | 5 and @ paxmark1 | Aug 5 2023 17:38 utc | 12
agree!
Posted by: james | Aug 5 2023 17:44 utc | 12
@paxmark1 | Aug 5 2023 17:38 utc | 12
Looks like you are the only one here
Posted by: Norwegian | Aug 5 2023 17:44 utc | 13
In total, since the beginning of the special military operation, 458 aircraft, 245 helicopters, 5518 unmanned aerial vehicles, 428 anti-aircraft missile systems, 11130 tanks and other armored combat vehicles, 1142 multiple rocket launchers, 5768 field artillery and mortars, as well as 12071 units of special military vehicles have been destroyed.
Posted by: rumod report | Aug 5 2023 16:45 utc | 2
____________________________________________________
What would be interesting is that someone knowledgeable in military material could be able to put up a total price tag for this whole lot, so a to evaluate how many western billions (stolen from their population through financial tricks and tax racket) have been smoked by the RF in only 18 months.
Posted by: Pierrot | Aug 5 2023 17:56 utc | 14
https://t.me/Slavyangrad/57956
David Wu, ex-Wall Street and IMF strategist, Ph.D. in economics from Columbia University:
– I think in a few weeks the Ukrainian counter-offensive will come to naught, and the Russians have already impressed. And it’s not that I’m pro-Russian or pro-Ukrainian, I’m a dispassionate observer of what is happening on the battlefield. Russians learn from their mistakes all the time. They have modern weapons: Lancets, Ka-52s, Su-34s, night optics… At the same time, their military technologies make revolutionary leaps forward every three months. They are fighting with what they did not have a year and a half ago. Because back then it just didn’t exist. I am impressed. The West is moving around in circles, while Russia is pumping. Ukrainians are excellent fighters, fearless patriots, they sacrifice themselves. But technology will have the last word. I think Russia will eventually crush them. And if Russia crushes Ukraine, it will be the end of American hegemony as we know it.
Posted by: anon2020 | Aug 5 2023 17:59 utc | 15
Sea drones need communications, especially if they are live streaming video. This is done with a US drone or spy plane. This was a US attack on Russia.
Ukraine is a war between the bolsheviks and the White Russians. It’s a continuation of what started in 1905. The Bolsheviks hate the White Russians, there will be no peace. And the Bolsheviks control the US government. They don’t care if there is a war. They want one, because they aren’t American and don’t care about the country, just their ideology.
Posted by: JackG | Aug 5 2023 18:03 utc | 16
Posted by: Pierrot | Aug 5 2023 17:56 utc | 15
Military costs and payments for Ukraine are peanuts compared to the other costs. I believe EU spent 700 billion euros for consumer energy subsidies in 2022. I bet we’ll see this fun continue next winter, and the one after that. Then there’s also the costs resulting from unemployment and lost business revenues from the businesses becoming uncompetitive and/or leaving the bloc.
I don’t really understand those who claim “Nato is just ramping up”. No it isn’t, it’s ramping down. By all measurable facts, it is Russia who is ramping up, as is China, and North Korea benefits as well. Nightmare scenario for U$A.
Posted by: unimperator | Aug 5 2023 18:28 utc | 17
Do we have good numbers on the RU vehicle losses since SMO started?
Posted by: AG | Aug 5 2023 16:49 utc | 4
Yes, divide Oryx reported RU losses by 2 or 3 (and multiply Oryx AFU losses by 3-4). RU is somewhere around 1000 tanks now.
Posted by: unimperator | Aug 5 2023 18:31 utc | 18
@ unimperator | Aug 5 2023 18:28 utc | 18 // 19
thanks for your posts unimperator…
Posted by: james | Aug 5 2023 19:01 utc | 19
Posted by: JackG | Aug 5 2023 18:03 utc | 17
Serious psychological issues with this one. Just for the record though, it is your Nazi friends in Ukraine that “decommunized” their country – with the blessings of their western masters obviously – while Russia still honours the Red Army. You know, the army that actually fought the “Whites”.
It is in Russia where, rather belatedly, they realized that “Memorial”, associated with the “Vicitims of Communism” outfits, is a western, anti-Russian tool. The Russians still have some way to go to leave their Yeltsinite complexes behind, but hopefully, they are on their way.
And of course, it is no coincidence that so many Russian neo-Nazis joined the Maidanist regime’s forces. All of them, when captured sported the swastikas and explicitly stated that they joined Ukraine “to fight the Bolsheviks”. It goes without saying that the Russian government has been described by them as “neo-Bolshevik”, whatever the hell that means, and that they despise the country’s federal system, itself a by-product of the RSFSR.
Just to conclude with a piece of info: the Civil War that started in 1918 (not in 1905 or 1917) was instigated by the Entente powers. The issue that the Reds had by May 1918 was the German Empire. Which is precisely why they repeatedly released or amnestied anti-communists like Krasnov, Vinberg or Purishkevich in May 1st 1918, while Lenin called for a reckoning with the Germans immediately after Brest-Litovsk when the conditions would be convenient (as in November ’18). It was Trotsky’s fiasco with the Czech Legion and the western support for said “Whites” who were a motley alliance of all sorts of opponents of the Reds that led to the Civil War.
But it’s hard to expect all that to be understood by someone who is convinced that the contemporary US of A is ruled by “Bolsheviks”…
Posted by: Constantine | Aug 5 2023 19:11 utc | 20
Posted by: Pierrot | Aug 5 2023 17:56 utc | 15
Funny thing about a pretty significant percentage of it is that it cost nothing (as in it had been paid for long ago) and actually saved money going forward having to pay to dispose of it.
For example, in case of the US supplied Bradley’s and the Strikers they were going to have to be eventually disposed of.
I don’t know if this case is specifically true, but for example:
https://twitter.com/secretsqrl123/status/1687080317054578688
Posted by: Ed4 | Aug 5 2023 19:36 utc | 21
Posted by: unimperator | Aug 5 2023 18:31 utc | 19
You might check “War Spotting” too. They have a more stringent list of criteria to get something added to their list.
They currently list 1896 Russian tanks lost since the start of the SMO and July 31, 2023.
Posted by: Ed4 | Aug 5 2023 19:43 utc | 22
Pierrot no. 15
Don’t know if there’s one for just military stuff. But here is a German tracker for combined support:
https://www.ifw-kiel.de/topics/war-against-ukraine/ukraine-support-tracker/
Posted by: ThusspakeZarathustra | Aug 5 2023 19:44 utc | 23
https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/1799089/russia-army-on-verge-disaster-says-colonel
Good God, how far does this psychotic behavior go?
Posted by: Eighthman | Aug 5 2023 19:49 utc | 24
Good article here on the background and impact of the deals involving shipping, sanctions, exports and so forth. TLDR: Europe is going to be feeling more pain for its support of this misadventure.
Whoops, looks like the URL did not post: https://unherd.com/2023/07/the-ukraine-war-is-about-to-get-worse/
Posted by: Ender | Aug 5 2023 19:50 utc | 26
Posted by: JackG | Aug 5 2023 18:03 utc | 17 “Sea drones need communications, especially if they are live streaming video. This is done with a US drone or spy plane.”
There are almost a dozen commercial satellite providers in the West that could have provided that capability. Starlink is only the best known.
In addition there are some other methods if the drones can use slow scan (frames per second) TV. However I haven seen any videos showing that.
Posted by: Ed4 | Aug 5 2023 19:51 utc | 27
https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/1799089/russia-army-on-verge-disaster-says-colonel
Good God, how far does this psychotic behavior go?
Posted by: Eighthman | Aug 5 2023 19:49 utc | 24
just replace Russia with Ukraine in those reports and you’ll know the real facts…
Posted by: Zet | Aug 5 2023 20:05 utc | 28
Posted by: unimperator | Aug 5 2023 18:31 utc | 19
The difficulty in using ‘lost’ as a metric for gauging military success is the relative nature of the term used. Technically an armoured vehicle can be killed three ways
FK: firepower kill, vehicle can no longer use its main armament, secondary weapons can still function
MK: mobility kill, vehicle has lost the ability to manoeuvre
TK: total kill, vehicle has lost its ability to fire and manoeuvre
CK: catastrophic kill, self explanatory vehicle is irrecoverable
Each of these is a loss and will often result in a crew bailing, lest their vehicle is hit again (the order for German tankers, during the Kursk offensive, to keep fighting their vehicles when disabled was a death sentence for many.
Russian statistics seem to suggest a 40% recovery rate, with 60% either KO’d or not viable for recovery, Ukraine suffers from poor recovery and repair capabilities and the Russian habit of targeting abandoned armour with artillery (Ukraine use drones to destroy disabled Russian armour).
So, Russian has lost approx 600 tanks which equates to less than 1.5 vehicles per day of the SMO, which matches the low tempo of the ground combat and penny packeting of armour. This is a loss rate easily sustainable for Russia with dedicated tank recovery units, and access to combat workshops. Ukraine have not only suffered far more, their recovery rate is far less, 20% at best so, taking the Russian figures and giving them a 50% haircut and rounding down, that means 4,000 total losses, or a daily rate of 7.5 machines, again realistic given Russian artillery/air superiority. Even if Ukraine is able to recover armour the lack of workshop capacity, interrupted power supply (another reason for the power grid strikes was to make it increasingly harder to repair vehicles damaged in the two offensives) and lack of spares create massive backlogs.
So roughly a 6:1 kill ratio, in favour of the Russians, seems both realistic and plausible. The latest offensives though have seen far higher ratios, perhaps 1.5 times as high, which is unsustainable for the Ukrainians and a disaster, with strategic ramifications comparable to the loss of German armour at Kursk.
Posted by: Milites | Aug 5 2023 20:06 utc | 29
@JackG (17)
“ And the Bolsheviks control the US government.”
That is the wackiest statement that I have seen on MoA in a very long time. It could only be true if your definition of “Bolsheviks” is billionaire oligarchs. Are you, by any chance, a descendant of Senator Joe McCarthy?
Posted by: Rob | Aug 5 2023 20:09 utc | 30
There are almost a dozen commercial satellite providers in the West that could have provided that capability. Starlink is only the best known.
In addition there are some other methods if the drones can use slow scan (frames per second) TV. However I haven seen any videos showing that.
Posted by: Ed4 | Aug 5 2023 19:51 utc | 27
Which commercial provider is providing real-time positioning for all ships in the Black Sea at a resolution that allows a strike with an USV?
This is the role that the NATO AWACS planes and drones are playing here.
This is a direct NATO attack on Russia any way you look at it. Putin must stop being a cuck and shoot them down.
Posted by: shadowbanned | Aug 5 2023 20:11 utc | 31
PSA. When the so called mr b shows up here I suggest you all ignore it. Way to much valulable space taken up by its clown world views
Posted by: Tannwnhouser | Aug 5 2023 16:55 utc | 5
————————————————–
Did anyone ever tell you that you are a dick? Well, I am telling you now!
Posted by: Ed | Aug 5 2023 20:20 utc | 32
Posted by: shadowbanned | Aug 5 2023 20:11 utc | 30
The ships own AIS transponder gives out course, speed, port of departure, port of destination all in real time.
Still probably done with NATO assets but does leave open plausible alternatives so you would want to do forensic investigation to make certain.
Posted by: badjoke | Aug 5 2023 20:21 utc | 33
Ukraine is a war between the bolsheviks and the White Russians. It’s a continuation of what started in 1905. The Bolsheviks hate the White Russians, there will be no peace. And the Bolsheviks control the US government. They don’t care if there is a war. They want one, because they aren’t American and don’t care about the country, just their ideology.
Posted by: JackG | Aug 5 2023 18:03 utc | 17
This is a batshit crazy comment.
There is an argument to be made that one can trace the intellectual lineage of Neocons to Trotskyist who flipped to the dark side.
But to equate that with “Bolsheviks” is just absolute madness.
Also, it is a deeply tragic misunderstanding of history to think of the “Whites” as the good guys in the Civil War. There is a reason the Bolsheviks won — the people supported them, but also a sufficiently large portion of the former Tsarist officers, who saw in them the only force capable of reconstituting and reforming (something that was desperately needed) the country, and backed them up for that reason. That combination was too strong for the Whites to overcome, despite the support of the whole West (including actually invading Russia on multiple directions). Russian society has repeatedly shown that capability of coming together to ensure the common survival throughout the centuries.
The Whites had some true patriots too but mostly it was the equivalent of modern oligarchs and liberal traitors who wanted to preserve the old system and thus their privileges and opulent parasitic lifestyle.
P.S. There were no Bolsheviks in power since the late 1970s. WWII made sure about that — barely any males of the generation that won the war (those born in the 1910s and 1920s) survived, so you had this big generational gap that formed around that time. Those born in the 1890s and 1900s stayed in power way too long, because there was nobody to gradually replace them, and then they were pushed out by those born in the 1940s and 1950s. Who had grown up pampered, without any personal experience of the existential struggles of the first half of the 20th century, and whose primary goal in life was to consume. To which end they were ready to betray everything, which they promptly proceeded to do.
Posted by: shadowbanned | Aug 5 2023 20:22 utc | 34
The ships own AIS transponder gives out course, speed, port of departure, port of destination all in real time.
Still probably done with NATO assets but does leave open plausible alternatives so you would want to do forensic investigation to make certain.
Posted by: badjoke | Aug 5 2023 20:21 utc | 32
The USV needs real time coordinates with precision within meters. I am not an expert in that area, but I highly doubt the publicly available info is sufficient.
In any case, the fact is that NATO ISR assets are there every time those attacks happen.
Posted by: shadowbanned | Aug 5 2023 20:24 utc | 35
Barflies might enjoy this piece by Gaius Baltar, on Larry Johnson’s blog:
The dysfunction of the West is far deeper than just the situation around the Ukraine project. It’s absolutely everywhere. The West can’t do diplomacy in general, it can’t run its cities or countries except into the ground, its high-tech projects fail almost as a rule, its infrastructure is crumbling, its economies are crumbling, and all public policies seem to have a civilizational suicide as a final goal. The West’s control mechanisms over the rest of the world are also crumbling, including the dollar, sanctions, color revolutions, military interventions and threats. Nothing seems to work and everything the West does seems to make things worse.
Any rational person upon hearing a western leader, diplomat or “expert” speak, asks himself this question: “Are they just lying or are they really this incompetent and delusional?” The answer is “both” but the incompetence factor is far greater than most people can imagine.
https://sonar21.com/why-is-the-west-so-weak-and-russia-so-strong-the-role-of-human-capital-and-western-education/
A related question: Are US Americans actually so very depraved, or merely stupid? Whether the subject is moral or intellectual laxity, we’re allocated generous wiggle room, out here amongst the proles of USA: forty acres and a mule.
Posted by: Aleph_Null | Aug 5 2023 20:24 utc | 36
Posted by: shadowbanned | Aug 5 2023 20:24 utc | 34
The AIS sends out it’s GPS signal in realtime. Still I agree they likely used the NATO assets. Easy to prove.An AIS receiver would be easy to spot in the recovered units. The RF will probably already know.
Posted by: badjoke | Aug 5 2023 20:31 utc | 37
Aleph_Null no. 35
The reason they are incompetent is because they are corrupt.
Posted by: ThusspakeZarathustra | Aug 5 2023 20:32 utc | 38
@ Tannwnhouser | Aug 5 2023 16:55 utc | 5 and @ paxmark1 | Aug 5 2023 17:38 utc | 12
agree!
Posted by: james | Aug 5 2023 17:44 utc | 13
———————————————————-
James, you agree with Tannwnhouser’s comment at #5? Either you are NOT james, or you have changed. The jerk said that b’s writings are: “Way too much valuable space taken up by its clown world views.” Or am I missing something here? Is Mr. b a name used by a troll.
If so, then I O Tannwnhouser | Aug 5 2023 16:55 utc | 5 an apology.
Posted by: Ed | Aug 5 2023 20:41 utc | 39
Posted by: Aleph_Null | Aug 5 2023 20:24 utc | 35
It’s the perennial question. Do they actually believe the shit they are saying? For the most part, yes. They begin knowing they are lying, because they are blindly ambitious with no moral boundaries, but then they inhabit the false world they have created with their fabrications, and convince themselves that it is real. That way, it’s easier to lie repeatedly. As such they become totally useless, actually destructive humans, a malignancy that metastasizes. I have no doubt that the US will collapse before long. First an economic collapse. Then, since the US has no cultural fabric other than the pursuit of goodies and cash that unites it, it’s remaining institutions will quickly disintegrate.
Posted by: Mike R | Aug 5 2023 20:46 utc | 40
Ed no. 38
“Is Mr. b a name used by a troll.”
I believe so.
Posted by: ThusspakeZarathustra | Aug 5 2023 20:46 utc | 41
Posted by: shadowbanned | Aug 5 2023 20:24 utc | 34
NATO ISR is up far more often that these strikes happen. But I don’t disagree with the general statement that NATO ISR is helping Ukraine quite a bit.
My disagreement was with JackG’s statement “Sea drones need communications, especially if they are live streaming video. This is done with a US drone or spy plane.” There are multiple commercial companies that can provide this capability.
AIS will provide the ship’s position so the drone can maneuver into position to strike it. Assuming that the drone camera is 2 feet above sea level looking at a ship that is 30 feet above sea level, the standard formula shows a distance to the horizon in miles. There is a added benefit that AIS would be telling the drone operator what direction to look. And as you say NATO ISR would be quite capable of confirming things.
In addition we don’t know if that ship was specifically targeted or the drone was on ‘patrol’ like the what happened in WWII with submarines on war patrols. Did the ship just stumble into the drone’s kill box?
Posted by: Ed4 | Aug 5 2023 20:46 utc | 42
Posted by: badjoke | Aug 5 2023 20:31 utc | 36 “Easy to prove.An AIS receiver would be easy to spot in the recovered units. The RF will probably already know.”
Not sure I follow the above. The drone doesn’t need an “AIS” receiver. It might have an SDR that would be capable of receive the frequencies that AIS is transmitted on. But even that is not needed. The drone’s home base just needs to be able to receive the AIS transmissions.
Posted by: Ed4 | Aug 5 2023 20:52 utc | 43
https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/1799089/russia-army-on-verge-disaster-says-colonel
Good God, how far does this psychotic behavior go?
Posted by: Eighthman | Aug 5 2023 19:49 utc | 24
So, rarely even look at these, but this time made an exception to know how the enemy’s logic works.
The article is based on:
-Russian army fights like sh*t
-Zaluzhny/Zelensky is trying to save as many of his mens lives as possible and uses them carefully and sparingly
-half of RU vehicles are on the verge of breaking down and un-roadworthy
Yeah. So basically AFU situation is flipped around and attributed as RU characteristics. Basically it works exactly how Scott Ritter, Dmitri Orlov etc. are saying – US/UK don’t like some characteristic of their own, so they project them onto their enemy (Russia).
Posted by: unimperator | Aug 5 2023 20:56 utc | 44
Posted by: shadowbanned | Aug 5 2023 20:11 utc | 30
RU VVS has the vectors for approach figured out for dropping the dirt cheap flares on the propellers to bring the multi-million dollar drones down LMAO!!!
The Russian way…much to learn from.
Posted by: nathan in WA US | Aug 5 2023 21:04 utc | 45
Posted by: Ed4 | Aug 5 2023 20:52 utc | 42
————————————————-
Mr. Ed4, you seem to know a lot about drones, so let me ask you a question. The recent drone attacks on the same building in the Moscow financial district. The wester press is making a big deal about hoe Russia can’t defend itself from Ukraine launched drones. Is it possible that these drones are actually being launched from inside or even from inside Moscow? From a close proximity, wouldn’t it be very difficult to stop such drones from reaching their target and/or, wouldn’t the Russian response also cause damage in the process of destroying a drone at such a close distance?
Ed4, or anyone qualified please feel free to respond.
Posted by: Ed | Aug 5 2023 21:10 utc | 46
Posted by: shadowbanned | Aug 5 2023 20:22 utc | 33
———————————————————
I agree with you, JackG @#17 is batshit crazy.
Posted by: Ed | Aug 5 2023 21:19 utc | 47
This is a little O/t. In England our government prepared us for heat pumps to replace gas boilers in 2009, so I dutifully trained in Refrigeration.
They won’t be switching for another 10
years imho because the refrigerants are much more problematic for global warming than CO2 etc .
The industry has offered governments proposals that they 100% know won’t work. Presumably because of some kind of commercial group think that changing everything completely, the electrical grid, the power stations, the heating systems and disposal systems, the training upgrades etc, will generate massive profits.
This is the feeding sheep on cows entrails syndrome, which led to mad cow disease and massive culling of animals.
A Toruy MP later said that nobody could have predicted this. Nobody but a 3 year old child maybe. Greed will persuade the highest educated elites to make unforgiveable errors of judgement.
Ukraine , Syria , Libya, Afghanistan , Iraq, all completely unforgiveable, and all from preferring to steal oil than buying it by fair-trade.
Posted by: Giyane | Aug 5 2023 21:22 utc | 48
Then, since the US has no cultural fabric… remaining institutions will quickly disintegrate.
@ Mike R | Aug 5 2023 20:46 utc | 39
Your forecast rings true, and yet, I’m interested in the exceptions to the rule, standouts like Jeffrey Sachs and Scott Ritter who see the proxy war in Ukraine for what it is (and are consequently ignored). Weavers of cultural fabric for all domains. Meaningful music can lift us out of this nihilistic funk, but we have to turn the volume up to eleven.
Caitlin Johnstone (another exception to the rule) quoting Noam Chomsky on the “filtering” theme treated above by Gaius Baltar:
“You’re expected to accept certain beliefs, styles, behavioral patterns and so on. If you don’t accept them, you are called maybe a behavioral problem, or something, and you’re weeded out. Something like that goes on all the way through universities and graduate schools. There is an implicit system of filtering… which creates a strong tendency to impose conformism.”
https://consortiumnews.com/2023/08/04/caitlin-johnstone-mainstream-journalists/
Johnstone mentions several journalists and commentators punished severely — made an example of — for refusing to color inside the stifling lines of USA’s media environment. But she forgot about Phil Donahue, Dan Rather, and the noble martyr Gary Webb.
Posted by: Aleph_Null | Aug 5 2023 21:29 utc | 49
Posted by: Tannwnhouser | Aug 5 2023 16:55 utc | 5
————————————————–
Did anyone ever tell you that you are a dick? Well, I am telling you now!
Posted by: Ed | Aug 5 2023 20:20 utc | 31
I believe he meant the troll “Mr B”, who chose to use this particular handle to sow confusion here.
Agree with comments re drones, must be within radio signal reach. There’s been chatter that the naval drones can be deduced by the NATO flights taking place. Hopefully, solutions will be worked out.
Posted by: Suresh | Aug 5 2023 21:39 utc | 50
@ED. Ur right I am a dick. No need to appolagise. That being said I should have said Mr.B. I didnt want to capitise its name tho. I guarantee I’m 100% not refering to Bernhard.
Posted by: Tannenhouser | Aug 5 2023 21:43 utc | 51
@unimperator 19
@Ed4 22
thx!!!
at least some figures and sources to start with.
(of course supplying the public with detailed accounts from all sides would be normal in a normal world with normal and decent MSM, sigh. But so we have to do that ourselves, too.)
I was puzzled because NATO Gen. Cavoli in Jan. 2023 at the SHAPE summit spoke about 2000 RU tanks destroyed which was much in my eyes (but on the other hand those 1800 tanks would approximate the 2000 tanks by Cavoli and the major losses for the RUs had been inflicted by then already, I reckon.)
Of course Cavoli´s was a pep talk and he did not mention those 8.000 (or more) UKR tanks/vehicles destroyed by that point in time.
But he did admit in the end of that very speech that in fact NATO is in way over their head with the conduct of war now.
(hat tip to Mr. Martyanov for this great source info.)
here (his “scale, scale, scale!”-speech):
https://shape.nato.int/saceur/saceur-cavoli-remarks-at-rikskonferensen–salen–sweden
In combination with Cavoli´s appearance at the House Hearing of the Committee for Armed Forces (I can never remember these terms correctly, argh) these things are good in any discussion. Just hurl it at people and they wont know what to answer.
https://edition.cnn.com/2023/04/26/politics/russia-forces-ukraine-war-cavoli/index.html
p.s. If a Mearsheimer looks at these figures which are public, apparently, how can he seriously speak about “stalemate”?
I mean by now even the fiercest Democrat will have understood that Ukrainian dead are staggering. If you add to that the immense loss in gear and the known lack of ammo, how can you equal those two sides, still?
Posted by: AG | Aug 5 2023 21:44 utc | 52
@ Aleph_Null | Aug 5 2023 21:29 utc | 48
Dan Rather? the guy who went to Afghanistan dressed up like one of the mujaheddin, and spent a week of on-site reporting praising the “Northern Alliance” to the skies?
Rather wasn’t evil, even fairly progressive for the times, but I’d hardly mention him in the same breath with Donahue, let alone Webb.
Posted by: malenkov | Aug 5 2023 21:52 utc | 53
Posted by: Aleph_Null | Aug 5 2023 21:29 utc | 48
my memory fades, I vaguely remember Rather shouting questions at Nixon? i dont remember what happened to him in response.
Posted by: pretzelattack | Aug 5 2023 22:00 utc | 54
yeah I knew who you meant Tannenhauser. there are so many trolls criticizing b himself it’s easy to make Ed’s mistake, and probably why the troll adopted its name.
Posted by: pretzelattack | Aug 5 2023 22:02 utc | 55
‘i know you’re writing an alternate history, but it should have some connection to reality. Putin annexed Ukraine in 2014? Really?’
‘Annexation’ is a technical term. But theft, larceny, loot will do just as well.
Posted by: Mr B | Aug 4 2023 21:42 utc | 325
———————————————————
Russia is the successor state to the USSR….
As such it has sole dominion over the entirety of the FSU…
Historically, it is the successor to the Russian Empire….As such it has sole dominion over the entirety of the former territories of the Russian Empire…
Therefore….Russia cannot invade Ukraine, Poland, Finland, Lithunania, Latvia, Estonia…. they are Russian provinces…
Please update your database accordingly….
INDY
Posted by: Dr. George W Oprisko | Aug 5 2023 0:07 utc | 335
————————————————————–
Dr. George, Gorbachev and the drunkard in chief, Boris Yeltsin, gave the “provinces” away. There were elections and the provinces were allowed their independence. As Julian said in another post: They WERE USSR provinces, but now they ARE independent states. You do agree with that don’t you because your comment sure doesn’t seem to reflect it.
I quarreled with Julian, but that was his fault, he offered no comment number or date, leaving it up to me to find your comment. I was surprised to find out that your comment was just as Julian said.
Posted by: Ed | Aug 5 2023 22:04 utc | 56
@ malenkov | Aug 5 2023 21:52 utc | 52
Hi there, malenkov. My humble opinion is that we may never know the full story with that coordinated sting to truncate Rather’s career. For some reason, Rather became irritating enough the system needed such an exquisitely choreographed, permanent ejection. The (lousy) character of his enemies speaks highly of Rather, I think, though he didn’t wind up dead of a suspicious suicide like my own patron saint of truth, Mr. Webb.
Furthermore, Dan Rather was not a total nobody, like every network anchor since. David Muir (of ABC Nightly News) is the new, disposable model of dogged devotion to doggerel. Not much going on upstairs, but hey — Muir is sorta cute in a t-shirt, and you can’t have everything.
Posted by: Aleph_Null | Aug 5 2023 22:11 utc | 57
Posted by: Aleph_Null | Aug 5 2023 22:11 utc | 56
he was making a comeback, then Rove ratf…… him with those faked documents on the Bush national guard service. i dont remember why he was making a comeback tho.
Posted by: pretzelattack | Aug 5 2023 22:14 utc | 58
Posted by: shadowbanned | Aug 5 2023 20:22 utc | 33
———————————————————
I agree with you, JackG @#17 is batshit crazy.
Posted by: Ed | Aug 5 2023 21:19 utc | 46
No, not any kind of crazy, just maybe over simplified. Washington, in fact, is now the spirit of the Bolshies. Spy on anyone, arrests anyone, destroy anyone. After all, what else should one do with those that hold “wrong” ideas? Huh? Huh?
Posted by: stones | Aug 5 2023 22:18 utc | 59
PSA. When the so called mr b shows up here I suggest you all ignore it. Way to much valulable space taken up by its clown world views
Posted by: Tannwnhouser | Aug 5 2023 16:55 utc | 5
————————————————–
Did anyone ever tell you that you are a dick? Well, I am telling you now!
Posted by: Ed | Aug 5 2023 20:20 utc | 31
—————————————————
yeah, I knew who you meant Tannenhauser. There are so many trolls criticizing b himself it’s easy to make Ed’s mistake, and probably why the troll adopted its name.
Posted by: pretzelattack | Aug 5 2023 22:02 utc | 54
—————————————————————-
@ED. Ur right I am a dick. No need to apologize. That being said I should have said Mr.B. I didn’t want to capitalize its name tho. I guarantee I’m 100% not referring to Bernhard.
Posted by: Tannenhouser | Aug 5 2023 21:43 utc | 50
—————————————————————-
No! No! But thank you for being so gracious. I am the dick in this matter. I never heard of Mr.B, but I found a a whole string where Mr.B made many comments (I think it was August 3 or 4). At any rate, on that string I made no comments, so I missed it all, and that was my BAD.
I was so pissed off that anyone, even a troll, would criticize “b” who provided this platform for people to comment and have a discussion, that I responded without thinking the whole thing through.
Best wishes, Mr. Tannenhouser
Posted by: Ed | Aug 5 2023 22:24 utc | 60
Posted by: AG | Aug 5 2023 21:44 utc | 51
Is that destroyed or killed? To a layman destroyed is blown up, to the military they have different categories of killed.
Mobility kill (MK): vehicle can no longer tactically move
Firepower kill (FK): vehicle can no longer use its main armament
The first two categories are seen as suppressing the vehicle not destroying it
Catastrophic kill (KK): vehicle is permanently rendered unusable
This is important because it relates directly to the ability of recovery and repair units to return the vehicle to combat duties. I doubt the West are just counting KK’s but deceptively adding all kills to that total. Russia, with well resourced, equipped and numerous teams recover and return approximately 40% of tanks killed in combat, with the remaining 60% written off. This explains the Ukrainian tactic of using drones, to convert MK and FK to KK, also allowing multiple counting for propaganda websites (e.g. Ugledar). In other words, Russia has lost 1,200 tanks since the start of the SMO, (To Jan 2023) or four tanks a day, a reasonable figure given the low intensity of the fighting in most areas. This deliberate conflation of categories of ‘destroyed’ might also explain the media claims that Russia has lost most of its tanks, it’s quite possible for a tank to be operational having been killed a number of times previously.
Ukraine’s losses are far worse, given their less comprehensively supplied and equipped armoured recovery system. I’d guesstimate only a 20% chance of recovering their armoured losses, roughly half that of the Russians. So if they have lost 8,000, (roughly two thirds the Russian estimates) it means 6,400 tanks are irrecoverably lost, or 20 tanks a day, again a realistic figure given the initial tactical ineptitude of the Ukrainians and unchallenged Russian supremacy in artillery and airpower.
Note, to get to even a 5:1 ration, in favour of the Russians, the Ukrainian statistics have to be weighted heavily in their favour. I think a more realistic ratio is probably 6-7:1; interestingly, roughly what the Germans achieved on the Eastern Front in WW2. The recent armour intensive offensives, launched by Ukraine, have seriously skewed the figures in Russia’s favour, again explaining the plethora of recent articles claiming equal loss rates to both sides.
Posted by: Milites | Aug 5 2023 22:46 utc | 61
Aleph_Null @ 35
The dysfunction of the West is far deeper than just the situation around the Ukraine project. It’s absolutely everywhere.
Crapification of everything, and it really is everything, not just politics or military but culture and commerce: food is crap, products are crap, music is crap, movies are crap, TV is crap, sports are crap. Price doesn’t matter, luxury today is crap, whether H&M or Saks 5th Ave, FIAT or Ferrari it’s all mass materialism crap. Ever been inside those luxury towers being built in all the popular cities of the world? They are projects, council housing for rich people, shame shit construction but for $3000 sq/ft. Rich zombies and poor zombies all rolling like pigs in crap.
Neoliberalism and its components – financialization, neocon, and woke, isn’t a brilliant plan to remake humanity, it’s an idiotic, one dimensional, misconceived, misadventure that’s turning everything to crap.
Have no fear that it’ll fail, that’s 100% guaranteed, humanity’s survival instinct will prevail but that certainty doesn’t bring hope as the damage the collapse of this late stage capitalism idiocy will do vast damage, create vast suffering and misery, and when it settles there will be a Herculean task of cleaning up all the crap left behind. Rich and poor they will all be stuck with the mess.
Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Aug 5 2023 22:52 utc | 62
‘i know you’re writing an alternate history, but it should have some connection to reality. Putin annexed Ukraine in 2014? Really?’
‘Annexation’ is a technical term. But theft, larceny, loot will do just as well.
Posted by: Mr B | Aug 4 2023 21:42 utc | 325
———————————————————
Russia is the successor state to the USSR….
As such it has sole dominion over the entirety of the FSU…
Historically, it is the successor to the Russian Empire….As such it has sole dominion over the entirety of the former territories of the Russian Empire…
Therefore….Russia cannot invade Ukraine, Poland, Finland, Lithunania, Latvia, Estonia…. they are Russian provinces…
Please update your database accordingly….
INDY
Posted by: Dr. George W Oprisko | Aug 5 2023 0:07 utc | 335
————————————————————–
Dr. George, Gorbachev and the drunkard in chief, Boris Yeltsin, gave the “provinces” away. There were elections and the provinces were allowed their independence. As Julian said in another post: They WERE USSR provinces, but now they ARE independent states. You do agree with that don’t you because your comment sure doesn’t seem to reflect it.
I quarreled with Julian, but that was his fault, he offered no comment number or date, leaving it up to me to find your comment. I was surprised to find out that your comment was just as Julian said.
Posted by: Ed | Aug 5 2023 22:04 utc | 55
No one can give Russian lands away….!!
Russia is not Argentina where the CIA installed a stooge, which undid the previous 8 years during which all foreign debt was eliminated…
Russia does not play by World Bank / IMF rules wherein all foreign debts are permanent…
So.. get a life….
Russia cannot invade either the lands of the FSU or the Russian Empire
BECAUSE
They are Russian Lands…
AND…
The sooner NATO/USA accept this…. the better…..
Don’t belive me???
Then why is Wagner in Belarus?? Niger??? Syria???
INDY
Posted by: Dr. George W Oprisko | Aug 5 2023 22:52 utc | 63
Speaking of Dan Rather, someone here must know the frequency?
Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Aug 5 2023 22:58 utc | 64
Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Aug 5 2023 22:58 utc | 63
oh yeah! completely forgot about the whole mugging thing.
Posted by: pretzelattack | Aug 5 2023 23:03 utc | 65
All hell let loose by Russia tonight.
It looks like 15 Tu-95M are in the air, around 50 Geran and salvos of Kalibre.
This is on top of the Kinzal strikes 5 hours or so ago.
Posted by: JohninMK | Aug 5 2023 23:04 utc | 66
Can’t be, heard they ran outta misiles many moons ago.
Posted by: blueswede | Aug 5 2023 23:11 utc | 67
Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Aug 5 2023 22:52 utc | 61
Late stage capitalism or simply fascism? The Western concept of society died when the spiritual element of humanity was seen as an impediment to power, not an enabler and sustainer. Ironically, the self-styled destroyers of genuine spirituality are creating copious amounts of evidence for its importance in many human endeavours. As a Russian film so eloquently puts it, ‘what is the point of a path if it does not lead to a church’.
I chose the term spiritual to firstly pre-empt some posters writing page long responses about the evils of organised religion and the supremacy of rational humanist thought, secondly as a term to reflect humanitie’s inherent creativity and decency. Though I realise my caveats will probably be in vain!
Posted by: Milites | Aug 5 2023 23:11 utc | 68
Posted by: AG | Aug 5 2023 21:44 utc | 51 “I was puzzled because NATO Gen. Cavoli in Jan. 2023 at the SHAPE summit spoke about 2000 RU tanks destroyed”
I didn’t see what words Cavoli actually used. So given the way MSN editing works there could be some nuance to the 2,000 tanks number. However, whatever he said, NATO has the ability to look behind the lines to see Russian tanks that entier Oryx or War Spotting would see.
Posted by: Ed4 | Aug 5 2023 23:22 utc | 70
@Milites 60
Naturally I dont know this.
But I do assume in the public sphere up into certain political spheres there would be NO fine lining the way you have demonstrated.
That would be the true Pros talking and those won´t get through to the WH. Even less the press.
So they would equal 8000 “destroyed” with CK. Even though in reality they would not be.
But how can you really find out whether those tanks are in any of those 4 categories for sure.
You have to track every single one of them I guess. The ones not moving from the battlefield are definitely gone.
The others who knows.
But that would make real-time documentation necessary.
A lot of work.
Does the Pentagon in fact have an interest in this.
Or do they no just extrapolate from a limited number of cases?
Which begs the question, who truly knows what in the US MIC about this war and tells his superiors?
Posted by: AG | Aug 5 2023 23:23 utc | 71
Posted by: blueswede | Aug 5 2023 23:11 utc | 66
If fully loaded 15 Tu-95M can carry around 90 cruise missiles. Maybe the Russians just found them in an old abandoned warehouse. Or more likely, the X-101 / X-555 are pouring off a production line.
Posted by: JohninMK | Aug 5 2023 23:27 utc | 72
Well, or they’ve thrashed lotsa washing machines and dish washers.
Posted by: blueswede | Aug 5 2023 23:36 utc | 73
Please Russia, for the love of sweet Mary!
Shoot every single arrogant American drone/Poseidon that is in the Black Sea, and if they go back to Romanian airspace, have the great courage to destroy it out of the sky. Do not fear the filthy American drones, they will not start any wars, they are crazy and arrogant, but they have limits and cowards in truth.
Posted by: CrazyCanuck | Aug 5 2023 23:39 utc | 74
I chose the term spiritual to firstly pre-empt some posters writing page long responses about the evils of organized religion and the supremacy of rational humanist thought, secondly as a term to reflect humanities inherent creativity and decency. Though I realize my caveats will probably be in vain!
Posted by: Milites | Aug 5 2023 23:11 utc | 67
—————————————————
Exodus 21:20–21 says, “Anyone who beats their male or female slave with a rod must be punished if the slave dies as a direct result, but they are not to be punished if the slave recovers after a day or two, since the slave is their property.”
How lovely, creative, and decent, for an omnipresent and all knowing “God” to allow slave owners to beat their property, but not if they die within three days: What a guy. The last nation to officially end legal slavery was Saudi Arabia in 1970. Why did they own slaves (mostly women) because Allah said they could in the Quran.
Posted by: Ed | Aug 5 2023 23:39 utc | 75
It seems to me Russia should shoot down every NATO drone over the Black Sea. It’s known that US/NATO drones are supplying target data to the Ukraine make them a perfectly legal target. The USA-NATO have no answer to Russia shooting down of a NATO drone over the Black Sea. I’m surprised Russia has not been very
aggressive over the Black Sea.
Posted by: Bill Miner | Aug 5 2023 23:50 utc | 76
Posted by: Dr. George W Oprisko | Aug 5 2023 22:52 utc | 62
———————————————————————–
Dr George, I have only one reply: Boris Yeltsin.
Posted by: Ed | Aug 5 2023 23:53 utc | 77
Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Aug 5 2023 22:52 utc | 61
As someone past 70 who has had time to observe this in my retirement years – Yes, there’s a lot of crap, especially media, music and art. Also the American populace, many morbidly obese and actually proud of it, convinced that the world is in their dumbphones and social media, lacking enough functional brain cells to complete a thought. The only thing that isn’t crap is the propaganda machine that feeds them crap. It’s efficient and capable.
Posted by: Milites | Aug 5 2023 23:11 utc | 67
“Late stage capitalism or simply fascism?”
Aren’t they the same thing?
Posted by: Mike R | Aug 5 2023 23:56 utc | 78
Ukraine attacked and destroyed the Russian ships in Russian naval yard with naval Drone.. Once again Russia has to do the catch up. When usa wanted to barge in Syria after Russian’s had been there, the USA needed only 7 days to establish her patch illegally inside Russia. While neither has Russia pacified in Syria nor has it got even upper hand in Ukraine. Shameful.
Cassad was right, types like Martyn or saker acted as enemy and not real friend of Russia.
Putin must not win next election-he is incompetent.
Posted by: Sam | Aug 6 2023 0:01 utc | 79
Interesting how the Gonzalo Lira fans have suddenly fallen silent after Scott Ritter and Eva Bartlett expressed their doubts about him. Where is all the frothing mouthed abusive outrage that was directed at us sceptics of the authenticity of his getaway tweets and videos? Shouldn’t the fans be attacking Ritter and Bartlett now?
Posted by: Biswapriya Purkayast | Aug 6 2023 0:06 utc | 80
Sam@78
By Martyn whom do you mean, Martyanov? I don’t know what Cassad said about him and the Faker but by opinions on the two of them are well known on this forum.
Posted by: Biswapriya Purkayast | Aug 6 2023 0:09 utc | 81
If Russia wants to stop Amerikastan and its vassals from attacking Russian ships (and inevitably the Kerch bridge) it has to destroy the Amerikastani surveillance drones over the Black Sea. In the same situation the Amerikastanis would not hesitate for a nanosecond. Destroy them and dare Amerikastan to do its worst.
Posted by: Biswapriya Purkayast | Aug 6 2023 0:12 utc | 82
Tangentially related to the US war in Ukraine is its increasing inability to finance its oversea military via other nations buying its debt. That’s the upshot of Crooke’s al-Mayadeen column, “A spooked White House rushes its Saudi fences: ‘Saving the dollar’!”. Do read the article’s body despite me providing its conclusion:
Today, the dollar situation is much more fraught. Inflation and interest rates are up and bond values correspondingly are down. US debt has exploded and the interest payments alone on that debt are set to reach one trillion dollars a year. More significantly, swaths of the world are switching to trading in currencies other than the dollar.
Saudi trading oil in renminbi, therefore, is a flashing “red light” — among many such warning lights are flashing around the globe. They all signal the wish to ‘de-couple’ from both Bretton Woods institutions and its colonial financial system.
Riyadh presently is fighting — in coordination with Moscow — to break one aspect of “the system”: the West’s hold over the pricing of commodities, including the price of oil. If that is MBS’ aim — in which he is having some success in setting the price of the marginal barrel — why on earth would he throw himself back into the dollar global hegemony and sever his good relations with China too?
It is worrying. The whole schema speaks to a White House severed from reality — and desperate. (If so, what would this say about its prospective handling of Ukraine and US management of its relations with Russia).
The noose is growing tighter while Uncle Sam tries to keep the three-legged chair he’s balancing on from falling.
As a Russian film so eloquently puts it, ‘what is the point of a path if it does not lead to a church’.
I chose the term spiritual to firstly pre-empt some posters writing page long responses about the evils of organised religion and the supremacy of rational humanist thought, secondly as a term to reflect humanitie’s inherent creativity and decency. Though I realise my caveats will probably be in vain!
Posted by: Milites | Aug 5 2023 23:11 utc | 67
Come on, Milites. Once you start explaining western decline by the absence of Christianity, you’ve made the topic fair game. You can’t make a point and then preempt all counter responses.
If thats what you want then find a religious site that covers the war. But, that doesn’t exist, because a true Christian doesn’t need all this analysis. He knows God has it figured out and can relax and perhaps that relaxing is good for him to an extent.
I have no beef with true Christians. Real believers tend to strive to be good human beings and have some principles. I’d take them over the freaks that run US imperialism any day. Nonetheless, as a means of solving complex social problems like those we grapple with here, “spiritualism” is inferior to materialism.
Another draw back is the servility that is bred when the world view is based on a paradise and rewards in another life. It’s really a perfect idea to promote amongst your slaves, which to a great extent is why an offshoot of Judaism that was developed thousands of years ago in the middle east is still with us today.
Nonetheless there is a spiritualism. It’s called thought. Man thinks about the material world around him, tests his thoughts against that material world and based on the feedback ultimately changes his way of thinking. That dialectical process is rooted in materialism but has a critical, spiritual component.
In this process of thinking about material world man sees himself as part of a much larger and older human endeavor which invokes a sort oceanic or Olympic feeling as being one with the species of man and it’s development, caring for it and for the species generally.
Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Aug 6 2023 0:12 utc | 84
Bill Miner @ 75
I’m surprised Russia has not been very aggressive over the Black Sea.
Everything about this war has been incremental, on both sides, I’m pretty sure that is true about all wars, how they start, as the sides feel each other out and learn to fight. The incremental part seems to be ending. Hopefully Ukraine will collapse so we can avoid the big ugly part.
Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Aug 6 2023 0:15 utc | 85
Mike R 77:
“Late stage capitalism or simply fascism?”
Aren’t they the same thing?
Yes.
Posted by: Biswapriya Purkayast | Aug 6 2023 0:28 utc | 86
Posted by: Aleph_Null | Aug 5 2023 20:24 utc | 35
Two things that everyone here seems to believe: that the american masses have any control over politics, and that all gay people are CIA.
Posted by: Deran deran | Aug 6 2023 0:40 utc | 87
What led Deran deran @86 to that conclusion?
Posted by: Biswapriya Purkayast | Aug 6 2023 1:00 utc | 88
Nonetheless there is a spiritualism. It’s called thought. Man thinks about the material world around him, tests his thoughts against that material world and based on the feedback ultimately changes his way of thinking. That dialectical process is rooted in materialism but has a critical, spiritual component.
In this process of thinking about material world man sees himself as part of a much larger and older human endeavor which invokes a sort oceanic or Olympic feeling as being one with the species of man and its development, caring for it and for the species generally.
Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Aug 6 2023 0:12 utc | 83
———————————————————-
A good response Ahenobarbus. There is some Marxist training in your comment.
Posted by: Ed | Aug 6 2023 1:01 utc | 89
Based on tiring satellite image analysis Ukraine is building up storages facilities in Rivne, Ternopil, Lutsk, Chernivtsi, Uhzhorod and Kemelnytski areas.
Seems like Ukies have received and are expecting a massive amount of US military donations. Russia must destroy weapons stores in these areas.
Posted by: Jason | Aug 6 2023 1:37 utc | 90
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Aug 5 2023 16:44 utc | 1
Hi LoveDonbass. Are you the one who published “Point of no return” in English translation. If so, can you tell me if the secknd volume “The Hot summer of Mariupol” is available. Its very interesting to see how the SBU transforned after Maidan and to have a glimpse of how it works.
Posted by: Richard L | Aug 6 2023 1:38 utc | 91
I am glad to see that they are still calling it a Special Military Operation as it has nothing to do with War as We Know it.
And by one key metric, it has been an unmitigated success: it has been very, very “special”.
Russian chldren will some day sing songs about the heroic Special Miltary Operators and visit the Special Military Operation Museum which will display all the trophies taken, including washing machines, air pods and bottles of tainted vodka.
Posted by: Noam A. Larkey | Aug 5 2023 17:32 utc | 9
By another key metric it is bigger than WWII. For the British. Apparently in WWII the British lost < 400,000 dead. Kiev Ukraine would be exceeding that figure by now I am sure.
And this time the British are on the side of the Nazis. Who would have thought? And who, in Britain, gives a damn?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II_casualties
Posted by: arthur brogard | Aug 6 2023 1:45 utc | 92
Ukrainians are excellent fighters, fearless patriots, they sacrifice themselves. But technology will have the last word. I think Russia will eventually crush them. And if Russia crushes Ukraine, it will be the end of American hegemony as we know it.
Posted by: anon2020 | Aug 5 2023 17:59 utc | 16
Ukraine is crushing Ukraine. Ukraine is not what you are making it out to be: i.e. the Kiev regime and its cannon fodder.
Ukraine is ALL the Ukrainian people, past, present and future. Nation names are balderdash. Note the ease with which you eliminate 10,000,000 people simply by calling Kiev Ukraine ‘Ukraine’ as though that were all of it.
No. Ukraine, or any other nation is the people or nothing. And the people of Ukraine are crushing Ukraine the people. Of course. By fighting and killing each other. In the name of this ludicrous ‘patriotism’ which is supposed to be high minded devotion to an ideal promoting the good of all but which in fact is slavish acquiescence to the dictates of a murderous insane few.
To be really ‘patriotic’ Ukrainians would refuse to kill their fellows.
The same as to be really ‘human’ humans would refuse to kill their fellows.
But it is ironic, isn’t it – as google translate etc. make languages ‘no barrier’ any more the total misuse of language and the ‘new speak’ of our Orwellian controllers makes all language but a trick.
Here is a glimpse of common soldier making a forlorn subdued plea for sanity: http://ukrainehonesty.com/donetsk.mp4
with a large helping of luck and a sudden outbreak of infectious sanity his plea could be echoed throughout the trenches and suddenly it could all stop and a Ukrainian nation truly arise which throws out the filth in Kiev and Washington and proudly declares that it will no destroy itself. wouldn’t that be good?
Posted by: arthur brogard | Aug 6 2023 1:56 utc | 93
Malenkov- Alsph
During the second Gulf War, Rather announced to a national audience, “If my president says jump, I say, how high?” That tells you what kind of “journalist” Rather was. I felt like puking.
At a meeting at Langely, William Casey, Reagan’s CIA director, famously said, “We will know our disinformation campaign is a success when everything the American public believes is false.” Mission accomplished. The American public is thoroughly indoctrinated. There isn’t anything that can be done about it.
Posted by: David | Aug 6 2023 2:02 utc | 94
Have we learned nothing? Recognize the same smear tactics against Julian Assange used to justify and manipulate public opinion against him, “he deserves what he gets “are being trotted out against Gonzalo Lira. “He’s a Putin puppet, a Kremlin stooge, an SBU agent,” etc. These are distractions. Gonzalo Lira is a dual US and Chilean Citizen who was arrested and tortured for political speech. The respective State Departments must demand his release, deportation and safe passage.
Posted by: Willow | Aug 6 2023 2:04 utc | 95
The 2nd half of the Escobar-Desai-Hudson talk about NATO/Russia/China is now available in all three formats here, and the previous half is on that same website in case you missed it. Radhika provides the intro:
So now today we are going to continue that discussion by focusing on the danger of NATO being transformed from a North Atlantic Treaty Organization to a North and South Atlantic and Pacific Treaty Organization, as Biden leads to an ever-widening and deepening hybrid war on China with trade, technology, diplomatic, and military aspects, but which is coming ever closer to some kind of military war.
So once again, we framed our discussion around several questions, so I will just begin by posing the first one:
What is the United States’ wider intention and strategy vis-a-vis China in the so-called Indo-Pacific region?
What do recent events mean for the region? I’m thinking of events such as the visit of high-ranking Chinese and Russian officials to Pyongyang to commemorate the 70th anniversary of the armistice in the Korean War.
I’m thinking of Western hysteria over the recent agreement between China and the Solomon Islands, one of a very large number of Pacific island nations.
The recent announcement of a new package of military aid to Taiwan from the United States, which essentially is going to be done by a kind of presidential decree, using the same military drawdown program that President Biden has been using to fuel the war in Ukraine.
And generally, I’m thinking of rising tensions in the region, thanks to the announcement of AUKUS a couple of years ago, and the reactivation of the so-called Quad alliance, or incipient alliance, whatever you want to call it, between the United States, South Korea, Japan, and India.
And of course, there has been the recent NATO declaration that it considers China a threat.
U.S. strategy is not easy to understand, because, while on the one hand, there seems to be some effort to promote dialogue with the visits of recent high-ranking U.S. officials, such as Antony Blinken and Janet Yellen, while on the other hand, U.S. actions continue to ratchet up tensions across all the fronts.
In response to Ed@76,
The question of territory and population is too complex to hinge solely on decisions made at the top, particularly in the post WWII paradigm. Yeltsin would have been in as much a position to give away lands as Putin would be now to take lands; and by this I mean, not at all. While it’s possible to occupy territory and to hold it by force for a temporary period of time, or likewise formally cede control over territory, incorporating lands and population into some new or already existing structure is an entirely different process and hinges on having sufficient support from said population to do so, which supersedes the authority of government structures formally in control.
Not that Yeltsin actually gave anything away, mind you — the borders of the Ukrainian SSR had been drawn up long before his tenure, to suit Soviet ideological requirements. Nevertheless, it was well understood, back in the 90’s, that the predominately Russian parts of Ukraine risked provoking a territorial dispute, both at the very onset and in the future, and it was for that very reason that the constitution of the burgeoning Ukrainian state was written in consultation with the Russian federation, with special emphasis on the constitutional rights of Russian Ukrainians. In other words, one could say that a certain number of lands and peoples were handed into Ukrainian care on a provisional basis, which subsequently expired when the unconstitutional transitional government in Ukraine wiped its ass on its constitutional obligations post the 2014 Maidan coup.
As an aside, the Russian government was generally reluctant to press the issue, but was gradually forced into action by demands from the populations on these territories for the restoration of their legal rights and the harsh military response issued by Ukraine with the approval of Western states, since further inaction increasingly posed a serious threat both to Russian political stability and security. In other words, Ukraine and the West systematically undermined any option that would allow the return of these territories and populations under Ukrainian care, despite Russian diplomatic efforts to the contrary, allowing only for the options which, I assume, their strategic thinkers thought would destabilize Russia — whether it chose to reject or accept these people back under Russian rule.
In addition, mutual recognition of territorial integrity between Russia and Ukraine was enshrined in a separate treaty from which Ukraine demonstratively withdrew in 2019. This was seen by many political pundits in Ukraine as a controversial decision, since the act essentially called for redrawing of the Russian-Ukrainian border and legalized the prospect of an open conflict, among other things. Although I stand by my opinion that the idea of giving and taking territory is too simplistic a view to ever be an accurate representation of reality, looking at this open rejection of formal Russian recognition of Ukrainian territory in this context would be akin to throwing the gift on the ground and spitting on it.
Posted by: Skiffer | Aug 6 2023 3:00 utc | 97
Posted by: AG | Aug 5 2023 16:49 utc | 4
Do we have good numbers on the RU vehicle losses since SMO started?
Yes, Ukraine sent counters to the front to add up Russian loses. None have made it back at this point.
Posted by: Dferg | Aug 6 2023 3:11 utc | 98
Some videos for today.
Mariupol begins to rebuild with ambitious reconstruction plan:
https://odysee.com/@RT:fd/Mariupol_0508:1
Russian forces liberated Novoselovskoye (in the northern LPR):
https://rutube.ru/video/3562149fcb70fee8829949f6f4b1e2ce/
‘I can confirm that Leopards burn well’ – interview with Russian tank crew that took out eight enemy armored vehicles:
https://odysee.com/@RT:fd/tank-crew-interview-:f
More Ukrainian soldiers surrender to Russian forces near the LPR’s Kremennaya:
https://odysee.com/@Overthrown:6/video_2023-08-04_00-01-51:2
Russian airborne forces strike enemy position in forest belt:
https://rutube.ru/video/1e79c2db2104a3f8a6f992d0ed45f8a0/
Posted by: Nate | Aug 6 2023 3:26 utc | 99
Posted by: Ed | Aug 5 2023 23:39 utc | 74
How lovely, creative, and decent, for an omnipresent and all knowing “God” to allow slave owners to beat their property, but not if they die within three days: What a guy. The last nation to officially end legal slavery was Saudi Arabia in 1970. Why did they own slaves (mostly women) because Allah said they could in the Quran.
Poor Ed, a God hater. Fact is we are all slaves to the Master, State or Nation we live in. No… slavery has not ended and never will end. The beating by the powers that be will continue until morale improves. Or you always have the option of being the slave of Jesus Christ. At least He died for you and will reward your efforts. Or you can continue being a slave to the state and receive the reward you deserve. I am proud I chose Jesus Christ as my Lord, King and Master.
Posted by: Dferg | Aug 6 2023 3:50 utc | 100