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July 16, 2023
Ukraine Open Thread 2023-169
Only for news & views directly related to the Ukraine conflict. The current open thread for other issues here. Please stick to the topic. Contribute facts. Do not attack other commentators.
Comments
Somewhat funny news from Sky News Australia: Foreign fighters leave Ukraine due to witnessing atrocities Posted by: Tuk | Jul 16 2023 23:06 utc | 101 Quoted from Orlov Posted by: Jason | Jul 16 2023 23:13 utc | 102 Posted by: Arch Bungle | Jul 16 2023 13:28 utc | 3 Posted by: Wanker Bungle | Jul 16 2023 23:21 utc | 103 Posted by: Tuk | Jul 16 2023 23:06 utc | 101 Posted by: hopehely | Jul 16 2023 23:21 utc | 104 Posted by: JustAMaverick | Jul 16 2023 19:40 utc | 68 Posted by: Ed | Jul 16 2023 23:46 utc | 105 The New York Crimes uses a photo of a nazi with the Pravii Sektor flag on its helmet as its lead photo. Posted by: arthur brogard | Jul 16 2023 23:51 utc | 106 Re: Posted by: Roger | Jul 16 2023 18:58 utc | 59 Posted by: Julian | Jul 17 2023 0:00 utc | 107 Norwegian | Jul 16 2023 17:47 utc | 47 Posted by: robjira | Jul 17 2023 0:15 utc | 108 The question I’m wondering about is what costs would Russia occur if it began digging entrenchments outside Odessa, and if they did that, what would be the odds of that causing the Biden administration to say it would “relieve the siege”, and openly use the American military to attack the Russian force outside Odessa. Posted by: Babel-17 | Jul 17 2023 0:31 utc | 109 Some videos for today. Posted by: Nate | Jul 17 2023 0:36 utc | 110 106@Arthur… Posted by: donten | Jul 17 2023 0:45 utc | 111 @ Babel-17 | Jul 17 2023 0:31 utc | 109 Posted by: whirlX | Jul 17 2023 0:48 utc | 112 @ Milites | Jul 16 2023 19:38 utc | 66 Posted by: paddy | Jul 17 2023 0:49 utc | 113 Poland is shaking in its pierogi-filled boots! Their army has been on an extended vacation from combat for several decades, sipping margaritas on a tropical beach while their weapons collect dust and their uniforms double as Hawaiian shirts. So, get this: Wagner is like, “Hey Belarus, I’m coming over to Ukraine to give them a serious case of second thoughts about entering!” It’s like a reverse psychology masterplan to protect those Ukrainian civilians. Talk about a plot twist! Did you hear about Wagner’s secret weapon? It’s called the “Polish Army Training Manual.” Apparently, it’s so poorly written that even a toddler could defeat them! Posted by: HERMIUS | Jul 17 2023 0:50 utc | 114 The stupid, fake-and-gay, phony nation of Ukraine needs to be completely erased and reabsorbed into Russia. The war will continue until that happens. There needs to be regime change in Kiev. I am at a loss to understand why that little shit, Zelensky, is still walking around and breathing. Posted by: Intelligent Dasein | Jul 17 2023 1:01 utc | 115 This breakdown has really accelerated since November 2013 – the breaking by Yanukovych of the EU-Ukraine accession agreement. Posted by: Ed | Jul 17 2023 1:10 utc | 116 Why doesn’t The Ukraine produce its own weapons anymore ? Posted by: Acco Hengst | Jul 17 2023 1:22 utc | 117 Inside Pfizer and AstraZeneca’s UKRAINIAN BIOLAB! Posted by: Melaleuca | Jul 17 2023 1:47 utc | 118 Posted by: Wanker Bungle | Jul 16 2023 23:21 utc | 103 Posted by: Arch Bungle | Jul 17 2023 1:50 utc | 119
Posted by: knighthawk | Jul 17 2023 1:55 utc | 120 @Nate Posted by: Melaleuca | Jul 17 2023 1:55 utc | 121 @ Acco Hengst | Jul 17 2023 1:22 utc | 117 Posted by: whirlX | Jul 17 2023 1:56 utc | 122 I say “copycat”, you say “reverse engineer”.
Posted by: Melaleuca | Jul 17 2023 2:31 utc | 123 Crimea’s bridge was hit and Vladimir Putin won’t do anything but extend the black sea grain initiative like the cuck he is. Posted by: La Mission Possible | Jul 17 2023 3:34 utc | 124 Posted by: Melaleuca | Jul 17 2023 2:31 utc | 123 Posted by: Lemming | Jul 17 2023 4:00 utc | 126 Guess we are in different time zones, see the Crimea Bridge has been hit again by Ukraine. Still waiting for official details on the level of damage. Posted by: Organic | Jul 17 2023 4:12 utc | 127 Posted by: La Mission Possible | Jul 17 2023 3:34 utc | 124 Posted by: Arch Bungle | Jul 17 2023 4:14 utc | 128 The UAC is a Russian corporation. Posted by: Melaleuca | Jul 17 2023 4:25 utc | 129 WSJ Video Report: This retired US General is explaining why the Russian defense line that the General Sergey Surovikin has designed is so hard for Ukrainian Army to break. The Surovikin Defense Line will be studied by military historians for years after the Ukraine War is over. Posted by: Jay Lee | Jul 17 2023 4:26 utc | 130 On the previously-introduced – several times – subject of air-to-air missiles being used in a surface-to-surface role to attack targets such as buildings, Bulgaria Military Blog had a recent and interesting article which maintains the Ukrainians are indeed repurposing the old S-200 missiles to attack land targets. I have previously argued that this is not feasible – but I did not allow for the possibility that such a missile might be used in a ballistic application. Crimean bridge – apparently road surface but not supports. We will see. Posted by: knighthawk | Jul 17 2023 4:48 utc | 132 Avia-pro often haves a bit old news but this I haven’t seen before:
Because of course MQ-9s are flying without any fear 17 months into this, knowing that nobody will touch them… Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Jul 17 2023 4:51 utc | 134 @Depewty Dawg | Jul 16 2023 22:41 utc | 96
Thank you for this well formulated bird’s eye-view of what is happening. I can identify with your description, and the terrible thing is that this just can’t be a coincidence. This is destruction by design. The Khmer Rouge was the aperitif, and we are now into the main course. Posted by: Norwegian | Jul 17 2023 4:55 utc | 135 Now without assumptions. It was a naval drone attack. One span of the bridge fell, the second – hung. Bases are intact. At night, a reconnaissance and strike UAV of the US Air Force MQ-9 Reaper flew over the Black Sea. Posted by: MiniMo | Jul 17 2023 5:32 utc | 136
Crimean Bridge Closed Due to Emergency: What We Know Posted by: Norwegian | Jul 17 2023 5:33 utc | 137
Posted by: Norwegian | Jul 17 2023 5:40 utc | 138 Erdogan is a snake.
Posted by: MiniMo | Jul 17 2023 5:41 utc | 139 A train was hit at the railway station in Kharkov carrying western equipment. Some rumors say it had Leopard tanks on the carriages. Posted by: unimperator | Jul 17 2023 5:50 utc | 140 Photos\video of parts of one span destroyed/dropped, other damaged. One hopes when they were making the past replacement spans, they started making some extras too, knowing a repeat at some point was inevitable. Posted by: knighthawk | Jul 17 2023 5:51 utc | 141
https://t.me/DDGeopolitics/73503 Posted by: Norwegian | Jul 17 2023 5:52 utc | 142 All those who keep making excuses for Russia not to fight and strike harder (…) are just mentally enabling endless terrorism and endless war against innocent people, and allowing evil to get its way. Posted by: rk | Jul 17 2023 5:57 utc | 143
The British responsible again. After all, we know Zelensky is personally handled by MI6 boss Richard Moore, attribute to Scott Ritter’s document ”Agent Zelensky”. Posted by: unimperator | Jul 17 2023 6:14 utc | 144 Reminded of the Japanese efforts to attack the West Coast of the US via submarine gunfire etc. – nil effect but energized the local population bigtime. Posted by: Exile | Jul 17 2023 6:30 utc | 146
Yes, symbolically and strategically. Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Jul 17 2023 6:31 utc | 147 Grain deal will end. Rumors that US is driving a cargo ship categorized grain transport into Odessa with US flag. To be honest, the ship could also be sunk with an underwater drone. Posted by: unimperator | Jul 17 2023 6:32 utc | 148 The Crimean bridge is a beautiful structure. I should imagine it is very difficult to protect such a lengthy exposed span. I see it as a weak spot. All those saying I told you so, stop being idiots. As if you would be able to wage war on either side let alone protect a bridge. This strike would be to prove to the west that Ukraine while down is not yet out. It’s all so terribly sad and dumb. All people really want is a roof over their heads, food, health care and a bit of culture but they get whacked down again and again. US and British recon aircraft and drones including Forte10 are flying close to the bridge, probably closer than ever before. Posted by: unimperator | Jul 17 2023 7:15 utc | 150 This is pressure at Russia over the grain deal. If they dont agree to it, then there will be sea-based warfare going on is the message. This is where Russia is vulnerable as it is a huge open space that is very costly to cover and the enemy has a lot of assets that NATO will make available. Posted by: alek_a | Jul 17 2023 7:17 utc | 151 The whole thing is brought about by the very effective new weapon: subsurface semiautonomous drones at open seas. Neither Russia nor others have a way to counter these unless in concentrated defensive areas like ports. But even then some go through. It gives a large asymmetric advantage to the waker side. Posted by: alek_a | Jul 17 2023 7:22 utc | 152
It very much will.
It isn’t just USVs/UUVs, it’s UAVs too. Iranian Shahed-type drones have a huge range and are very cheap. Anyone can launch large salvos of those at major cities very far away, and it will be hard to shoot all of them down. You can even put small nukes on them if you have such warheads. Posted by: shаdοwbanned | Jul 17 2023 7:30 utc | 153 Do Ukrainian army have to take Crimea by military force? I’d say no, they don’t and they will still retake it anyway. Posted by: Chris Za | Jul 17 2023 7:41 utc | 154 Posted by: unimperator | Jul 17 2023 7:15 utc | 150 Posted by: unimperator | Jul 17 2023 7:43 utc | 155 Regarding this incident, if I were Putin, which thankfully I am not, I would start by destroying 2-4 important bridges in Kiev or elsewhere ASAP. With any escalation that ratio would increase accordingly. Posted by: Gigo | Jul 17 2023 7:47 utc | 156 It’s giving Russian civilians a few days to get out of Crimea before the rail bridge, land bridge and ferries become unusable. The clock is ticking. Posted by: Chris Za | Jul 17 2023 7:47 utc | 157 Posted by: Chris Za | Jul 17 2023 7:41 utc | 154 Posted by: unimperator | Jul 17 2023 7:49 utc | 158 Posted by: Chris Za | Jul 17 2023 7:41 utc | 154 Posted by: alek_a | Jul 17 2023 7:50 utc | 159 Russia should level every single governmental building in Kyiev. Posted by: Apollyon | Jul 17 2023 7:52 utc | 160 Posted by: Chris Za | Jul 17 2023 7:47 utc | 157 Posted by: alek_a | Jul 17 2023 7:54 utc | 161 Another terrorist attack on civilians and the trolls come out the woodwork on MoA. Posted by: Lev Davidovich | Jul 17 2023 8:03 utc | 163 Posted by: Ed | Jul 16 2023 23:04 utc | 100 Posted by: Johan Kaspar | Jul 17 2023 8:05 utc | 164 Dolphins were trained against underwater drones but mostly to protect Sevastopol. Posted by: Lorene | Jul 17 2023 8:08 utc | 165 About the terrorist attack on the Crimea Bridge. Is it just me or is the MSM tired of arguing that the Russians must have done it themselves? Posted by: Jonathan W | Jul 17 2023 8:08 utc | 166 The Ukrainians say that Russia itself blew up its own bridge, these bastards are shit crazy. Nothing new. Posted by: Psycho | Jul 17 2023 8:13 utc | 167 Can’t they put anti-submarine networks? Posted by: alek_a | Jul 17 2023 8:19 utc | 168 Posted by: Lev Davidovich | Jul 17 2023 8:03 utc | 163 Posted by: Membrum Virile | Jul 17 2023 8:25 utc | 169 Another idea is to land a drone on top of it and attach. Tricky to do but quadcopter drones should be more maneuverable than semi-submersed drones. Once you attach the drone it can then even try to recover it intact by frying the electronics on its turret. Posted by: alek_a | Jul 17 2023 8:26 utc | 170 The new cover photo of the facebook site of the Kyiv Post: https://abload.de/img/screenshot-kyiv-post9ffw1.png Posted by: Apollyon | Jul 17 2023 8:28 utc | 171 @Apollyon | Jul 17 2023 8:28 utc | 171 Posted by: Norwegian | Jul 17 2023 8:42 utc | 172 Posted by: Membrum Virile | Jul 17 2023 8:25 utc | 169 Posted by: Lev Davidovich | Jul 17 2023 8:49 utc | 173 The Sirius Report suggested that the US may return to Afghanistan. The lure of easy drug money and lucrative casual warfare is the perfect MIC project. Note that the Taliban has almost wiped out poppy growing similar to 2001. The US got it back up to almost 10000T/yr and were shipping heroin into Ramstein if the rumours were correct. Great cashflow that paid for the war. Posted by: John jeffery | Jul 17 2023 8:51 utc | 174 los gringos are desperate it seems. Posted by: Timur | Jul 17 2023 9:00 utc | 175 The grain deal is terminated, Dmitry Peskov said. According to the presidential press secretary, Russia will immediately return to the deal as soon as the part of the agreement regarding Moscow is completed. Posted by: finally | Jul 17 2023 9:08 utc | 177 The only negotiation possible on the grain deal is that the west fulfills its part of the deal through action
https://t.me/DDGeopolitics/73522 Posted by: Norwegian | Jul 17 2023 9:13 utc | 178 A logical consequence of the second Kerch Bridge attack would be that Ukraine loses access to the Black Sea. Posted by: Norwegian | Jul 17 2023 9:15 utc | 179 Posted by: Lev Davidovich | Jul 17 2023 8:49 utc | 173 Posted by: Membrum Virile | Jul 17 2023 9:20 utc | 180 @93 Posted by: arthur brogard | Jul 17 2023 9:21 utc | 181 Re: Posted by: Chris Za | Jul 17 2023 7:41 utc | 154 Posted by: Trubind1 | Jul 17 2023 9:40 utc | 182 Anon 25 Posted by: Col from OZ | Jul 17 2023 9:49 utc | 183 Today, 17. July is the 9th anniversary of another Ukrainian terror attack: shooting down of MH17 Posted by: Norwegian | Jul 17 2023 9:50 utc | 184 Posted by: Norwegian | Jul 17 2023 9:50 utc | 184 Posted by: Boo | Jul 17 2023 9:54 utc | 185 Today, 17. July is the 9th anniversary of another Ukrainian terror attack: shooting down of MH17 Posted by: Tim | Jul 17 2023 10:01 utc | 186 UK Defence Secretary (Minister for War) Ben Wallace says he will step down as defence secretary at the next cabinet reshuffle after four years in the job. Posted by: Lev Davidovich | Jul 17 2023 10:07 utc | 187 @robjira | Jul 17 2023 0:15 utc | 108
Here is more of the same guy if you have Telegram:
https://t.me/DDGeopolitics/73529 Posted by: Norwegian | Jul 17 2023 10:08 utc | 188 @Boo | Jul 17 2023 9:54 utc | 185 Posted by: Norwegian | Jul 17 2023 10:10 utc | 189 A few days ago I hear a report about a gigantic explosion having taken place in Romania and then I hear a report saying Romania declared they blew all their ammunition so they don’t have to give it to Ukraine. I immediately try to check out the Internet to learn more about but that’s when I wake up and of course it didn’t happen. It was so vivid it felt like real. Posted by: Mushroom | Jul 17 2023 10:11 utc | 190 as i mentioned earlier: bomb the havens of the khokhols and kill americans abroad Posted by: Timur | Jul 17 2023 10:12 utc | 191 Looks like Wallace has been sacked for his blasphemous comments during the NATO summit, my interpretation anyway. Posted by: Mushroom | Jul 17 2023 10:14 utc | 192 192 – His impatience with Kiev ingratitude suggested he has some grip on reality, but perhaps you cannot say that kind of thing out loud. Posted by: Waldorf | Jul 17 2023 10:31 utc | 193 Posted by: Mushroom | Jul 17 2023 10:14 utc | 192 Posted by: Arch Bungle | Jul 17 2023 10:37 utc | 194 Re: Posted by: Col from OZ | Jul 17 2023 9:49 utc | 183 Posted by: Trubind1 | Jul 17 2023 10:37 utc | 195 Posted by: John jeffery | Jul 17 2023 8:51 utc | 174 Posted by: Arch Bungle | Jul 17 2023 10:42 utc | 196 The last time the bridge got attacked the Ukraine got deenergized. There will need to be a stronger response this time. Posted by: Ghost of Zanon | Jul 17 2023 10:47 utc | 197 Re: Black Sea Posted by: Exile | Jul 17 2023 10:49 utc | 198 I don’t think opium and its heroin derivative money is too much of an incentive in the fentanyl era, unless perhaps it turns out it kills too many cash cow addicts and consequently drives down the profits of the trade. Posted by: Mushroom | Jul 17 2023 10:50 utc | 199 I think the best response would be a destruction of 750 KV electric grid Posted by: Simplex | Jul 17 2023 11:14 utc | 200 |
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