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July 8, 2023
Ukraine Open Thread 2023-162
Comments
Posted by: karlof1 | Jul 9 2023 4:49 utc | 228
I tend to read every word of your posts. I don’t always (or often, even) reply, but trust me, for one; you’re not being ignored or glossed over by the barflies who actually possess intellectual curiosity or respect for your long history of excellent commentary here.
Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Jul 9 2023 4:53 utc | 216
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Posted by: JB | Jul 9 2023 11:56 utc | 292
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Idem ditto
Posted by: Acco Hengst | Jul 9 2023 13:16 utc | 301
Gold reserves:
US 8133
Germany 3355
Italy 2452
France 2457
Russia 2427
China 2068
All others well below 1000 ton
Posted by: RB | Jul 9 2023 8:08 utc | 256
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To my knowledge, Fort Knox has not been audited. Nixon didn’t close the gold window because the US could keep supplying gold.
I’d be very skeptical of any US statements about domestic gold reserves.
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jul 9 2023 13:24 utc | 302
Posted by: karlof1 | Jul 9 2023 4:49 utc | 214
I beg to disagree.
History never repeats itself. The presence of nuclear, biological and chemical weapons are excluding any repetition.
About the Amerindians. Genocides happened everywhere where the white men set their feet on. In several islands, the native population was exterminated (Haiti, Tasmania). In Asia the task was too difficult because of the size of the populations, in Africa because of the tropical diseases. Massacres did occur everywhere: Algeria, Madagascar, Cameroon, Congo (see Congo-Ocean railway), India, Burma, etc.
Posted by: libegafra | Jul 9 2023 13:36 utc | 303
I’d be very skeptical of any US statements about domestic gold reserves.
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jul 9 2023 13:24 utc | 301
Me too.
Tungsten, anyone?!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tungsten
Posted by: libegafra | Jul 9 2023 13:40 utc | 304
JB@292
Absolutely correct, JB. But even when History was taught in the schools it was twisted by self perspective. No curriculum ever taught anything but “our” own writing of it. Today, the schools aren’t even teaching our own “mythologies,” let alone real History.
We’re not Jewish, but I had my grandsons in the car a few months ago.(Both smarter kids than me). I can’t remember why, but I mentioned the Holocaust. The 12yr old said “What?” The 14yr old said “That’s where some people killed some Jews.” I could have wept.
There’s no point in even trying any more.
Posted by: HOGGY | Jul 9 2023 15:21 utc | 306
karlof1 | Jul 9 2023 4:49 utc | 214
*** see we have a problem with historical knowledge…
‘Those who fail to study history are bound to repeat it’.***
The situation with regard to the level of historical knowledge within the general public in Britain is nowadays rather disturbing. Apart from isolated chunks of primarily propaganda rather than fact — or utter crap absorbed off films and tv scripts — there seems to be a widespread blank.
Clearly a deliberate arrangement on the part of those who rule and set curriculums and “news” agendas.
To such a degree that most people now seem unable to recall and analyse a decade or two of the immediate past, even though they themselves were alive then.
Which make it extremely difficult to have any serious argument or discussion. Sometimes if something was as long ago as (say) last year, it is regarded as already the ‘distant past’, therefore irrelevant.
But why the dumbed-down compliance? Is it social media, or aspartame, or statins, something else, or just vaguely induced mental laziness?
Posted by: Cynic | Jul 9 2023 15:51 utc | 307
S.P. Korolev | Jul 9 2023 6:43 utc | 243–
Thanks very much for your reply. What you note are very important forced alterations to Europe’s political balance that are still having an effect. And of course, there’s the turmoil in Occupied Palestine that’s related to all that. Again, many more nuances to the Big Picture that escape notice by most.
Posted by: HOGGY | Jul 9 2023 15:21 utc | 305
It is quite disheartening; this age of Great Ignorance at a time of the greatest opportunities for access to true knowledge. It is a vast, important subject partially related to events in Ukraine, so I refrain from further debate.
Instead of pessimism, it’s good to remember that everything humans have made does not have to be the way it is now, it can be different.
We can have different social and economic organisation and we certainly must create anew the education systems so that they are not indoctrination tools. The humanities should be the core so that the young learn about man, his (bloody) history, society, culture and power (relations). With such knowledge humans will be better equipped to make decisions about the optimal utilisation of progress in natural sciences so that it serves real human needs in harmony with nature.
Posted by: JB | Jul 9 2023 16:08 utc | 309
Tom_Q_Collins | Jul 9 2023 5:00 utc | 218 …
You reveal your intellectual flaw — an overly keen “anti-racism” which may at times blind you to the fact that people who have not done anything amiss don’t generally like being constantly attacked and, effectively, dismissed and destroyed / displaced as a ‘national’ identity. So sometimes they (eventually) react in overtly ‘extreme’ ways. While the attackers are not regarded by outsiders (ie. media and politicians) as ‘extreme’ — which in turn tends to multiply the resentment.
A fact that’s very useful to the present “divide and rule” political establshment, which is loyal only to itself and its corporate / financial cronies.
Posted by: Cynic | Jul 9 2023 16:08 utc | 310
Tom_Q_Collins | Jul 9 2023 5:07 utc | 220 …
So where and what was the religious underpinning (even if selectively filtered) and environmental shaping of their thought processes derived from?
Texts and doctrines imported from the Middle East.
Posted by: Cynic | Jul 9 2023 16:18 utc | 311
“But why the dumbed-down compliance? Is it social media, or aspartame, or statins, something else, or just vaguely induced mental laziness?”
Posted by: Cynic | Jul 9 2023 15:51 utc | 306
Perhaps all of the above. I was at school in the UK in the 50’s and there was a lingering sense of pride in being a great empire ‘on which the sun never set’ etc. I recall being told about the wonderful things Britain did for less civilized people. I think it was the Suez Crisis that got me questioning that narrative.
I don’t know what they teach there now. Kids are probably told it was an era of shameless, ruthless exploitation.
Posted by: dh | Jul 9 2023 16:24 utc | 312
Observer | Jul 9 2023 6:13 utc | 234
*** The swap also reminds people that the leaders of Azov were hardcore ethnonationalists (I hesitate to call them “Nazis”, because one of the fundamental tenets of Nazism was extreme anti-Semitism, whereas the Ukrainian nationalists’ primary hatred is towards Russians, not Jews – and their sponsor Kolomoiskyy and Zelenskyy are “Jews” as well).***
Towards the end of WW2 future leaders of Israel amongst others graduated from SS officer training academy … they were to lead a Jewish SS regiment formed for fighting Britain and its allies in Palestine.
So there isn’t really so much odd about the setup in present day Kiev-Ukraine — Zelensky’s “New Israel” — after all.
But you’re not supposed to know or notice that.
Posted by: Cynic | Jul 9 2023 16:35 utc | 313
Comacho in Chief | Jul 9 2023 8:07 utc | 255
*** Either way, I wonder what the lifespan of these returned commanders is going to be…***
Or, conversely, Zelensky and his inner circle. Recall at the time of the Azovstahl battle, the trapped Nazis were calling for a Ukrainian relief column to be sent … and in response got described as “martyrs” by Kiev, despite being still alive. They were also told they’d always be rmembered, and (if I remember correctly) promised a statue. None of which was greeted with wild delight.
So maybe, behind forced smiles, some very serious grudges there…..
Posted by: Cynic | Jul 9 2023 17:24 utc | 314
Posted by: Cynic | Jul 9 2023 16:35 utc | 312
You should provide some sources for your claims. Jewish SS division? BS.
Posted by: RB | Jul 9 2023 18:17 utc | 315
The returned Azovs will not go back to the front. They may pretend they will but I think they will try to enjoy the rest of their lives despite the nightmares.
The difference between fascists and NAZIs was/is racism. It doesn’t make much difference which group you hate as long as there is someone to hate.