Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
July 1, 2023
Ukraine Open Thread 2023-155

Only for news & views directly related to the Ukraine conflict.

The current open thread for other issues here.

Please stick to the topic. Contribute facts. Do not attack other commentators.

Comments

i am getting this message on all the twitter links people have provided today –
Something went wrong. Try reloading.
— i try reloading and it still doesn’t work.. twitter links are now useless..
Posted by: james | Jul 1 2023 17:31 utc | 21.
I haven’t been able to view twitter for 2 days now. It takes me directly to the join/logon page. I’m guessing they shut it down to nonmembers the way telegram sometimes does.

Posted by: Mary | Jul 1 2023 20:20 utc | 101

@ Paul Greenwood | Jul 1 2023 19:44 utc | 80 and @ Cynic | Jul 1 2023 19:50 utc | 86
actually no.. i didn’t even read their content.. but upon reading it i see some capitalization which i never do.. i am sorry this is happening but this continues to plague moa and i indeed reported this.. there is a reason they are close to mimicking me, but it ain’t me..
@ ThusspakeZarathustra | Jul 1 2023 20:11 utc | 93
i have seen nothing of that.. i highly doubt it..

Posted by: james | Jul 1 2023 20:22 utc | 102

and @ karlof1 | Jul 1 2023 18:35 utc | 48
thanks again.. i appreciate those vk links you’ve provided for lavrovs interviews with the press.. great stuff.. everyone ought to read them..

Posted by: james | Jul 1 2023 20:24 utc | 103

It’s going to require a big bang to penetrate the znpp core buildings. I doubt himars or stormshadow would cut it. Nuclear power plants are designed to withstand extreme events. So a successful false flag would be very difficult to achieve, and which nation wants to be shown in the world community as the instigator.

Posted by: Oh | Jul 1 2023 20:24 utc | 104

Zet @ #47: What is a PUSH POLL?
Posted by: Ed | Jul 1 2023 19:44 utc | 79
Instead of talking BS you should have just googled; anyway, here are the details about the survey I quoted:

Ukrainian population aged 18 years and older in all regions except temporarily occupied territories of Crimea and Donbas and territories without Ukrainian mobile communications when the survey was taken. The results are weighted using up-to-date data from the State Statistics Service of Ukraine. The sample is representative of age, gender, and type of settlement. Sample population: 1200 respondents. Survey method: CATI (Computer Assisted Telephone Interviews). Research representativeness error: at 0,95 confidence probability: not more than 2.8%. Dates of the survey: 6–11 June 2023.

Here’s the summary: https://ratinggroup.ua/en/research/ukraine/ukraine_s_resilience_formula_the_essential_components_during_war_and_post-war_6_11_june_2023.html
Here’s the presser: https://en.interfax.com.ua/news/press-conference/919233.html
Here’s the detailed PDF: https://ratinggroup.ua/getfile/643/rg_nprsc_062023_press.pdf
“Fun” facts:
67% of interviewed believe that things are headed in the right direction in Ukraine
82% of Ukrainians consider Ukraine a successful state
77% determined that the priority after the war in Ukraine should be the development of the military industry
Look at the details and have a big laugh, there are more nuggets… like this one here: “Youth (50%), military and veterans (46%) are the categories of the population that, according to the majority of respondents, will contribute most to the effective development of Ukrainian society in the future.”
Lol, so half of Ukraine thinks that the youth and maimed veterans will be the most important parts of the population to build the future of Ukraine: the military industry.
Jesus, instead of sending weapons the West should think about sending brains…

Posted by: Zet | Jul 1 2023 20:26 utc | 105

@Posted by: gT | Jul 1 2023 19:42 utc | 76

Meanwhile Russians maintain that there would never have been Communism in Russia were it not for the Jews.

Then the people of Russia should feel incredible gratitude to the Jews, as communist rapid industrialization was the only thing that saved them from the same fate as the Amerindians in North America. Russia west of the Ural Mountains would have become the second lebensraum for the Germanic tribes (who populated Britain as the Anglo-Saxons), North America was the first.
Stalin did what he had to do to force through the industrialization required to defeat the Nazis. His speeches continually repeat his views that the USSR needed to become strong enough so as not to be defeated by other nations – as with France and Britain in the Crimean War, Japan in 1904-05, and the Germans in WW1. Hitler openly wrote about his view of the future of the Slavs. Those that prattle on about the “crimes” (some invented such as the “Holodomor” and others massively exaggerated during the Cold War) of communism should think what the Nazis did in the USSR even when they didn’t win, it would have been immeasurably worse if they had. The extermination and ethnic cleansing of the Soviet population (and quite possibly the Polish) all the way to the Ural Mountains.
Given how persecuted the Jews were in Imperial Russia and Europe, it makes sense for them to be drawn to revolutionary theories and groups that looked to overturn the status quo. One of the few activities they were allowed to do was banking, so of course they developed leading skills in that area.

Posted by: Roger | Jul 1 2023 20:26 utc | 106

@ james | Jul 1 2023 20:22 utc | 104
OT. I had a couple of strange post disappearances. Especially when containing some links.

Posted by: whirlX | Jul 1 2023 20:28 utc | 107

Posted by: Oh | Jul 1 2023 20:24 utc | 106
As I understand it, the most vulnerable part of the complex are the cooling ponds containing spent fuel rods.

Posted by: GT Stroller | Jul 1 2023 20:28 utc | 108

contrary to all the talk early in this smo, russia is not going to run out of missiles is now being reported from a usa think tank… i find this funny given all the earlier talk of ‘russia is running out of missiles’..
there’s some arsenic sprinkled in with the new reality seeing as its a usa think tank..
Russia Isn’t Going to Run Out of Missiles

Posted by: james | Jul 1 2023 20:30 utc | 109

I don’t understand why a zone of conflict has been permitted
Posted by: anon2020 | Jul 1 2023 20:13 utc | 96
Terrain. Since I gather you missed that Oct 2022 “evacuation” of RF mill and some 60K civilians or share the mind of some here that RF must capture Odesa NOW on the way to Poland, I will post ancient advice again.

Sunzi said: We come now to the question of encamping the army, and observing signs of the enemy. Pass quickly over mountains, and keep in the neighborhood of valleys. Camp in high places, facing the sun. Do not climb heights in order to fight. So much for mountain warfare. After crossing a river, you should get far away from it. When an invading force crosses a river in its onward march, do not advance to meet it in mid-stream. It will be best to let half the army get across, and then deliver your attack. If you are anxious to fight, you should not go to meet the invader near a river which he has to cross. Moor your craft higher up than the enemy, and facing the sun. Do not move up-stream to meet the enemy. So much for river warfare. In crossing salt-marshes, your sole concern should be to get over them quickly, without any delay. If forced to fight in a salt-marsh, you should have water and grass near you, and get your back to a clump of trees. So much for operations in salt-marches. In dry, level country, take up an easily accessible position with rising ground to your right and on your rear, so that the danger may be in front, and safety lie behind. So much for campaigning in flat country. These are the four useful branches of military knowledge which enabled the Yellow Emperor to vanquish four several sovereigns.

Last night RF sent an Iksander over head into the Antonov Bridge. Case closed.

Posted by: sln2002 | Jul 1 2023 20:31 utc | 110

@ whirlX | Jul 1 2023 20:28 utc | 110
hopefully they show up.. that has been an ongoing complaint here, but it rarely happens to me… sometimes there is a delay and after i hit refresh a few times, the post shows up.. cheers.

Posted by: james | Jul 1 2023 20:31 utc | 111

Posted by: karlof1 | Jul 1 2023 20:19 utc | 100
—————
The western MSM doesn’t seem to want to report on France burning…

Posted by: ostro | Jul 1 2023 20:32 utc | 112

He’s in a tricky position as an American academic and almost the only one opposing US imperialism’s war on Russia. Speaking truth in the US and not getting destroyed is an art.
What facts did he leave out of the analysis? Seemed pretty thorough to me…
Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Jul 1 2023 20:00 utc | 90
Enough left out to make the piece full of holes & fundamentally dishonest.
He’s an academic old enough to retire. He should be thinking about his legacy, not his next career move.
Here is a link to my reply with the facts he omitted, glossed over, etc.:
https://mearsheimer.substack.com/p/the-darkness-ahead-where-the-ukraine/comment/17828876

Posted by: Mary | Jul 1 2023 20:37 utc | 113

Only one reactor at ZNPP is not in cold shutdown, the one is in hot shutdown to produce enough energy to power the plant. Because the Ukrainians keep shelling the high voltage grid feed into the facility. So I’m not sure how shelling it, even with a missile barrage, or planting explosives would get it to go Chernobyl. And that’s what all the talk seems to suggest: that a reactor will melt down and explode.
That’s not to say that Kiev couldn’t make a huge mess of the area by blowing up spent fuel or that there wouldn’t be consequences of destroying cold shut down reactors. It’s most disturbing that Kiev’s sponsors refuse to forcefully dissuade Kiev of schemes like this. But given who the sponsors are it is not surprising.

Posted by: Lex | Jul 1 2023 20:38 utc | 114

Posted by: pyrrhus | Jul 1 2023 17:52 utc | 34
Nothing about the behavior of the RF indicates that they are willing to do their own operation timber sycamore even if Frances involvement in that act of criminality would make it fair game in my eyes. But I am an American so spreading evil is normalized to me even if I don’t agree with it. Memes are not just stupid pictures if you read the work of Dawkins where he coined the term.

Posted by: badjoke | Jul 1 2023 20:48 utc | 115

A bit more scientific, imo.
Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Jul 1 2023 19:47 utc | 83
No. At one point Mearsheimer states: “The Russian army is not large enough for such a task, which would probably require at least two million men.”
This is an error built on top of a false assumption.
The false assumption is that Russia would desire to occupy all of Ukraine. Remember Putin began his career as KGB officer in East Germany. Putin has witnessed first hand the cost and consequences of occupying a people against their will. IMHO, the desire of Russia to occupy is small. For historical reasons, Nazism is seen as undesireable. I guess even if Lviv asked to join Russia it would be refused. A possible outcome is that Russia first “disinfects” Galicia, and after negotiations hands Galicia over to the EU. Ukraine GDP per capita is half the current poorest EU member, Bulgaria. EU rules will result in a large flow of cash to a region that tends towards an ideology that is not officially supported.
The false assumption is that you can calculate the occupation army needed using rules of thumb like “40 million Ukrainians at one occupation soldier for every 20 citizens gives two million soldiers”. The Russian army might go over Ukraine with a fine tooth comb, yes. But Russia is not keen on adding new territory – Donbass and Lugansk have been knocking on the door since 2014. And you are talking abiut a region where the occupation army needed is negative – DPR and LPR actually supply soldiers that add to the Russian army.

Posted by: Passerby | Jul 1 2023 20:49 utc | 116

james no. 104
“KYIV, June 30 (Reuters) – Russia is gradually reducing the number of personnel at the occupied Zaporizhzhia nuclear power station in southern Ukraine, Ukraine’s military intelligence agency said on Friday.”
“It did not say why some people had left and Reuters could not independently verify the information. Russia, which has occupied the plant since March 2022, did not immediately comment on the assertion.”
I’ve seen it on other MSM too. And Zelensky said it as well. (If it’s true)

Posted by: ThusspakeZarathustra | Jul 1 2023 20:49 utc | 117

karlof1 @ 100
Keep in mind the situation in Italy in the 60s-70s, the Years of Lead and Operation Gladio. These riots are exactly what Macron needs to declare marshal law all at once putting an end to the gilets jaunes, pension protests, banlieue riots, and anything else collapsing French society throws at him. Put an other way, are these chickens coming home to roost or chickens cooked up on order, a French Gladio in the works?

Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Jul 1 2023 20:49 utc | 118

Posted by: Mary | Jul 1 2023 20:37 utc | 116
I just saw the interview with Greenwald, haven’t read the article. In the interview, he made it clear that he blamed the neocons for starting the war in 2014. I thought he was too evenhanded in giving equal credibility to the Ukraine position, and he claimed that the US has “lost its skill” at portraying itself as a country with good intentions. I pointed out that what it has lost is credibility. I don’t remember him saying Russia was the sole nuclear threat, though–I think the US is the sole threat to take this nuclear, and I think I would have noticed. But like I say I didn’t read the article, just saw the interview.

Posted by: pretzelattack | Jul 1 2023 20:51 utc | 119

Can historical parallels with the financing of conflict by London’s Bankers be found in the current conflict in Ukraine? Are the same players on the stage perhaps ?
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Jul 1 2023 18:04 utc | 37
All wars are Bankster Wars. And City of London is the Bankster’s Bankster.

Posted by: Mary | Jul 1 2023 20:52 utc | 120

He also pointed to a position taken in 2008 at some NATO conference as a major contributor to the war, and blamed the US in 2021 for ramping up the pressure on Russia by explicitly refusing to rule out Ukraine admission to NATO, and by integrating the military structures betwseen Ukraine and NATO which effectively made it a member.

Posted by: pretzelattack | Jul 1 2023 20:54 utc | 121

My read on Mearsheimer is that he thinks our war on Russia is a mistake because China is our true geo-strategic enemy, which doesn’t make him pro peace, anti-war, or particularity enlightened in my book. He’s better than a brick in the face but he’s not fighting for a better world, just a better hegenomic strategy. In these dangerous times, like RFK Jr., you take what you can get, but I would reserve plaudits.

Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Jul 1 2023 20:57 utc | 122

Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Jul 1 2023 19:49 utc | 85
No.
I see western sources the ISQ and the Daily Mail are still making up stories about Wagner building bases in Belarus. Until I see Belarus or Russia confirming that, it’s bullshit.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 1 2023 20:59 utc | 123

“isQ” s/b “ISW” I just got up, I can’t even see what I’m doing. 🙂

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 1 2023 21:02 utc | 124

On the ZNPP–The recent photos supplied by Simplicius still show a river channel running though a parched bottomland, whose baked-bricks appearing dirt still remains very soft and impassable to most vehicles unless they have very light ground pressure. As such, any attempt at a direct assault on the plant remains suicidal. Unless Ukie artillery can suppress all the HMGs posted in the defensive network and the Russian artillery deployed behind it AND have enough AD to clear the overhead skies, there’s absolutely zero chance of gaining the opposite bank from the Ukie side. The feared TOR-1 heavy flamethrower firing directly into that zone as infantry attempted to advance through the mines amidst the hail of bullets and shells isn’t at all what I’d agree to do as a Ukie. That not even probing patrols are undertaken is a message in itself.
IMO, all the White Helmet prequel crap being aired will be used for something else. If the UKies wanted to blow up a Nuclear plant, they have several under their control to use: Rivne in Varash, Khmelnytskyi in Netishyn and South Ukraine which is North of Odessa produce power, plus there’re several research reactors. Note that all the media focus is on ZNPP not any others.
I continue to argue for Russia to expand the perimeter to well beyond the river on the opposite side which they can do without undertaking a direct assault across the river by conducting an airmobile operation.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jul 1 2023 21:03 utc | 125

Today, there’s a sudden silence in TG channels…

Posted by: ostro | Jul 1 2023 21:03 utc | 126

Richard Steven Hack @ 126

Until I see Belarus or Russia confirming that, it’s bullshit.

I’ll accept that. Pretty positive Lukashenko himself said Wagner will be training Belarus forces, so, in Belarus they are but confirmed only as advisers.

Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Jul 1 2023 21:03 utc | 127

Interesting story on one of America’s most conservative news channels.
https://www.newsmax.com/newsfront/ukraine-counteroffensive-russia/2023/06/30/id/1125506/
I seriously doubt it. At current loss rates, all of the tanks, IFV’s, other armored vehicles, and artillery will be destroyed before Ukrainian troops even reach Russia’s first defensive line.

Posted by: Elmer Fudd | Jul 1 2023 21:05 utc | 128

@Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Jul 1 2023 19:44 utc | 78
Russia will not settle for a “frozen conflict,” and the west lacks the power to force that upon Russia. The victor determines the outcome. Mearsheimer is retarded if he believes otherwise. There are only two realistic endings for this war:
1. Decisive Russian victory
2. Nuclear exchange
And, of course, these two outcomes are not mutually exclusive.

Posted by: Reee | Jul 1 2023 21:06 utc | 129

Posted by: Exile | Jul 1 2023 18:54 utc | 54
“58%” of Ukrainians polled. That number (n) may not satisfy the minimum proportion of (N) total population required to describe normal distribution of responses (central limit theorem). Always dig for “methodology” endnote of a survey instrument. Believe me, sampling error is the number 1 source of poll smoke in the USA and UA—oooh boy howdy, have I seen some pathetic explanations by UA “political scientists” for excluding eligible respondents.

Posted by: sln2002 | Jul 1 2023 21:07 utc | 130

Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Jul 1 2023 20:57 utc | 125
better than the neocons, but he’s from the “realist” (so called) community which also includes Kissinger. but at this point, he’s a pretty effective voice against the current Ukraine crazies. i think our leaders are leading us straight off a cliff, maybe leading the whole world off a cliff, which is why I devoutly hope Russia wins this, and the US/NATO doesn’t respond with an escalation to nuclear war. I’m not real optimistic at this point, to be honest. Washington is irrational.

Posted by: pretzelattack | Jul 1 2023 21:07 utc | 131

Posted by: unimperator | Jul 1 2023 19:21 utc | 62
They could walk away from their crimes against humanity in Iraq because when it came down to it Saddam was cruel in some respects.
This time they have funded white supremacism neo-NAZI banderites to fight a genocidal war against a pluralistic multi ethnic social democratic state that at worst can be accused of being a bit socially conservative. When people start to see the truth of the matter they will lose all legitimacy. Make no mistake this is a existential threat to the power structures of the OUSE and its vassals.

Posted by: badjoke | Jul 1 2023 21:08 utc | 132

My read on Mearsheimer is that he thinks our war on Russia is a mistake because China is our true geo-strategic enemy,
Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Jul 1 2023 20:57 utc | 125
Agree. If MacKinder were alive today, he would see a hook-up between Russia and Germany as preferred to Russia joining with China. Russian arms development and Chinese manufacturing would be an awesome combination the USA cannot possibly match. But the only force that can produce this union is the USA, by attacking Russia and China at the same time, forcing Russia and China to join forces.

Posted by: Passerby | Jul 1 2023 21:08 utc | 133

@ ThusspakeZarathustra | Jul 1 2023 20:49 utc | 120
thanks.. those sources tend to be contrary indicators as much as anything else..

Posted by: james | Jul 1 2023 21:10 utc | 134

LightYearsFromHome | Jul 1 2023 20:49 utc | 121–
Time will tell. Before Twitter was cutoff, many cities had joined Paris making the revolt national. Plus, several police stations were invaded and their militarized police gear was taken. How that might be employed is unknown. IMO, the situation is similar to 1944 France without the Wehrmacht as we have what amounts to Resistance/Underground fighters engaged with Vichy forces. How war-like this becomes remains to be seen. One thing that’s certain is the French economy will suffer more that it would have, although Neoliberal accounting will turn all the negatives into positive inputs to GDP.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jul 1 2023 21:19 utc | 135

Passerby @ 136

Russian arms development and Chinese manufacturing would be an awesome combination the USA cannot possibly match

In WW3 China plays the industrial powerhouse and military roll the USA played in WW2. Russia provided the manpower and the lives to win WW2 the USA everything else. China last I looked isn’t lacking in manpower either. So, yes, bad idea to make Russia and China allies. Even worse idea is holding on to gangster capitalism and hegemony. None of this has to be this way.

Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Jul 1 2023 21:22 utc | 136

james no. 137
I appreciate that. Just wonder what’s their point.

Posted by: ThusspakeZarathustra | Jul 1 2023 21:23 utc | 137

Posted by: karlof1 | Jul 1 2023 21:19 utc | 139
I wonder how the turmoil in France will affect Germany, and how much internal opposition to NATO is brewing within Germany. I’m hoping the cracks in the NATO alliance widen.

Posted by: pretzelattack | Jul 1 2023 21:26 utc | 138

39.
Apparently Blucher resuscitated himself after the injury with a bottle of gin.

Posted by: canuck | Jul 1 2023 21:26 utc | 139

We are nearly 1-1/2 years into the SMO. Present assessment is such that Russia has achieved most of the objectives it set out to do:
1) NATO is now chicken to admit Ukraine into its fold. Except for brown noses whom have de facto cozied up to the Empire (for what? I don’t know, man! I’m talking about the two Scandinavia brown noses, by the way.) even before the SMO, and whom are waiting in anxies for a Turkish final pass, the rest of NATO aspirants? You can forget ’bout them! NATO from here on may shrink, but would nowhere near hell expand again!
2) The Ukie Nazies are either dead/wounded/AWOL, or neutered. They haven’t since the launch of SMO killed Russian-ethnic Ukrainians, and are now chicken to even think about doing so.
3) Ukraine is de-militarized, de facto! don’t let propagandists fool you into believing Ukraine still has a functional military. They are caput! Weaker than Estonia in military strength.
The only thing Russia hasn’t accomplished is the NATO commitment to abandon eastward expansion. That doesn’t really matter anyway. Even if they made such verbal commitment, you can’t trust them anyway, no???
What has Russia lost so far??? I can’t think of anything. Knowledgeable barflies here please give me some hints.

Posted by: Oriental Voice | Jul 1 2023 21:26 utc | 140

@Posted by: Lex | Jul 1 2023 20:38 utc | 117
“It’s most disturbing that Kiev’s sponsors refuse to forcefully dissuade Kiev of schemes like this. But given who the sponsors are it is not surprising.”
It’s the west that is advising them to attack the power plant in the first place. The scheme itself is western in origin. The Ukrainian state does not make independent decisions. Even if they did, attacking a nuclear power plant in a region they ostensibly intent to reconquer obviously makes no sense, so this scheme can only come from those who have nothing to lose from such a disaster.
The proof that the west is advising the Ukraine to attack the plant is the fact that the UN is involved in covering up the attacks. Who has sway over the UN? Not the Ukraine. The USA and the UK do, however, and they are responsible for covering up the attacks because they are the ones who have been giving the commmands to attack.

Posted by: Reee | Jul 1 2023 21:27 utc | 141

Crooke weighs in on Prigozhin’s revolt in his al-Mayadeen column, “The Prigozhin Convoy: ‘Everything Changes; Everything Remains the Same’”, with the following being the meat:

The Western media and ‘experts’ however, are spinning hard that everything did change: That cracks had emerged; that some of the officer cadres, the US says, may have supported the insurrection; and that Prigozhin had “captured” a main city in Russia: Rostov-on-Don.
This is all untrue. Prigozhin sauntered into Rostov — walked to the military HQ — and was filmed chatting on the balcony with a number of generals there. Citizens generally milled around, unconcerned (many videos are online).
This is huge. It is not just that the Prigozhin insurrection was ‘taken seriously’ by the West. It was its’ ‘last Hail Mary’ in respect to Russia. After the failure of its ‘financial war’; the failure of its attempt to drive a wedge between Moscow and Beijing; its failure to coerce the Rest of the World to join sanctioning Russia; and then, the unexpected failure of the Ukrainian ‘offensive’ to make a make breakthrough against the Russian defensive lines, fomenting chaos in Russia became the ‘last chance of last chances’.

Prior to the above, Crooke cites this The Grayzone, “The real casualties of Russia’s ‘civil war’: the Beltway expert class”, which were quite possibly the target of this event all along–to lead the chattering class off the cliff into mid-air like Wile Coyote and enjoy watching as they plummet to the canyon bottom far below. The few that watched the BigLie Media performance will now be fewer.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jul 1 2023 21:33 utc | 142

@karlof1 #14
Thanks for the translation of Lavrov’s 0630 interview. I noted one statement,
“They use Ukraine as expendables, drug Ukrainian soldiers so they don’t feel pain, and drive them to the front line like cattle. ”
Very sad to read.

Posted by: Richard L | Jul 1 2023 21:35 utc | 143

Posted by: Oh | Jul 1 2023 20:24 utc | 106
The spent fuel storage is apparently much more vulnerable than the reactors. The threat of attack with available weapons leading to large or catastrophic atmospheric release of radioactive material is real.
Posted by: sln2002 | Jul 1 2023 20:31 utc | 113
I am aware that RF evacuated civilians and personnel from ITS OWN territory, on ITS OWN side of the river. I am asking why RF has not attempted to create a buffer zone ON THE UA side of the river, as this is the only way to push attacking forces away from ZNPP. Nor do I say that RF should capture Odessa now, not that that is remotely germane to RF strategy around ZNPP.
What is this ridiculous advice from the mists of time? You think it analogous to the situation of having an enormous nuclear power station complex and radioactive material stores on one’s own side of the hypothetical river?
You do know that Islander is too expensive and available in too small quantity to be used, even in extremis, to engage dispersed, mobile targets?
Case closed? I am amazed at your lack of coherence.
Why has this Shoigu-Gerasimov axis, in which many place such great stock, allowed the high risk of Kakhovka HPP and the astronomical risk of ZNPP to be on the front line, embedded within the zone of active conflict.
Why has there been no attempt to clear and maintain a buffer zone on UA territory facing these high risk installations? Burning natural cover, remote mining approaches, instructing at-risk civilians to evacuate, running constant drone surveillance patrols backed by artillery, rocket artillery, FPV drones, Gerans and every other relevant and economical fire system in Russia’s considerable arsenals?
Go on, stick to the question and try to answer it, not straw man BS.

Posted by: anon2020 | Jul 1 2023 21:35 utc | 144

Posted by: Mary | Jul 1 2023 20:37 utc | 116
His analysis on Ukraine has been accurate and he’s an American intellectual opposed to the war on Russia. But, he’s old and should retire?
Ok, genius. 👍

Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Jul 1 2023 21:36 utc | 145

“..The European Welfare State was propped up on 2 pillars.
1. The U.S. taxpayer would pay for the defense of Europe (NATO).
2. Cheap energy from Russia….” kupkee@2
This untrue. And serves the interests of the Capitalist class. It is neo-liberal twaddle. European states are well able to look afyer their most vulnerable members- the USSR, which was far poorer and paid an enormous amount of its annual budget to fend off imperialist aggression ran a far more comprehensive ‘welfare state’ for many years.
As to the US taxpayer paying for Europe’s defence that too is nonsense: most of what Europe spends in arms not only ends up in the US but is completely integrated into US plans for aggression. Europe doesn’t need to spend a cent to defend itself from either Russia, China or Iran, none of whom has ever expressed the slightest interest in invading Europe.
European Defence budgets are a form of tribute paid to the hegemonic oligarchs, who are now saying that the people of Europe cannot afford both Uncle Sam’s MIC and pensions, so they must give up pensions, child allowances, free education, healthcare and unemployment pay.
It’s sad that their talking points are so quickly repeated here.

Posted by: bevin | Jul 1 2023 21:37 utc | 146

pretzelattack | Jul 1 2023 21:26 utc | 142–
Thanks for your reply. Cracks within NATO/EU were already apparent prior to Feb 2022 and have only widened since. Historically, Germans are rather passive politically, which is why they’ve been victimized so often. One would think that the very real prospects of losing livelihoods would arose Germans to protest, and some have but not nearly enough in relation to the reality faced. Perhaps the coming winter will awaken not just Germans but all Europeans as social spending gets gutted to give to Ukraine.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jul 1 2023 21:41 utc | 147

Posted by: Passerby | Jul 1 2023 20:49 utc |
Nice. Intelligent reaction. But, that’s such a minor point in his predictions. Perhaps the military burden of occupying the entire defeated Ukraine is why Putin doesn’t want it.

Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Jul 1 2023 21:43 utc | 148

Posted by: bevin | Jul 1 2023 21:37 utc | 150
thanks for responding to that. it’s more like US taxpayers paying to use Europe as a tool against Russia and China.

Posted by: pretzelattack | Jul 1 2023 21:48 utc | 149

LightYearsAtHome @125
I’ll grant that Mearshimer, on Russia, is among the least bad of a putrescent apple-barrel of Imperial Russia whisperers.
And though in the past, I’d found him at his weakest in the military component of his analyses, recently he seems to have come to a tenable position (Russia’s almost certain military victory on present trends)–if for some of the least compelling reasons (population size advantage over Kiev).
He fluently marshals arguments for NATO expansion as a cause of the war–but what I find grating in these arguments is that they are, as it were, beside the point. NATO expansion, per se, wasn’t the root problem. Hell, Putin was not even the first Russian/USSR leader to offer to join.
The primordial cause of the war is *why* NATO expands (which contains a clue to why Russian participation was at least twice refused).
In an alternate universe where the Western Imperial Oligarchy seeks global peace and prosperity, NATO unwisely” expanded *despite* warnings that it would lead to war.
No, NATO expanded *because* it would be part of a program to get Russia ensnared in a war, in the present universe, where the Western Imperial Oligarchy does not seek peace and prosperity for the many, but power, mastery, dominion, colonization for the few.
Russia has at least since Napoleon, but arguably for a thousand years, if not all the way back to the early Christian split between Constantinople and Rome, been both a special problem (vastness, strategic depth) and a prize (immense resources and potential for throwaway manpower–enslavement, of Slavs, if we needed a hint).
Cartago delenda est
Napoleon
1917 banker-fomented civil war & Western occupation
WW2–banker-fuelled Hitlerian misfire
1944 – Operation Unthinkable–Churchil proposes nuking Soviet cities
1945 — Hiroshima & Nagasaki as a warning to Soviets
1945 — rescue of Nazi assets, notably Gehlen’s secret police network in E, Europe, arguably running to this day.
1949 — NATO formation, heavily staffed for 2 decades by former Hitler officers.
Operation Gladio–fassassinations of socialists & communists sympathetic to USSR, false-flag terror attacks to discredit them.
1990s CIA/Wall Street plunder and infiltration of Russia
Yugoslavia / Serbia destruction
2001: Wolfowitz Doctrine, Full-Spectrum Dominance
Chechen wars
Georgia war
2014 Maidan coup
Minsk betrayals
2020 Munich security conference & loose talk of UKR nukes
Troop build up and massive increase in shelling–artillery preparation for UKR invasion of Donbass & Crimea…
Boris torpedoing April 2022 peace negotiations.
NATO expansion can only be seen to be a mistake insofar as the day comes when it is widely recognized that NATO and the West are damaged if not destroyed by it.
But after that digression (sorry), what strikes me about Mearshimer’s recent position–and this is central not ancillary to his conclusion that a deal is unlikely–is _because Russia’s goal is to leave Ukraine a crippled rump state_ and therefore obviously Ukraine can not be expected to choose to negotiate.
WTF?? At multiple points Russia has dangled the possibility of UKR not being left a failed state if Ukraine *will agree to terms*, which in April included Odessa & Kharkiv.
Why the hell would any state want a failed state on its borders? This is precisely the prospect that the West threatens RF with. Ukraine is like the kid ISIS has strapped into a bomb vest, while the West retains the detonator.
Hard for me to take Mearshimer seriously as a geopolitical analyst (at least as an honest one) after that.

Posted by: Paul Damascene | Jul 1 2023 21:48 utc | 150

Posted by: karlof1 | Jul 1 2023 21:03 utc | 128
Both the Challenger 2 and Abrams tanks have low ground pressure levels relative to their weight. The Iraqis found that out the hard way in 1991 when they crossed terrain that their own tanks could not. Given the total lack of rational military planning by the AFU and its sponsors I fully expect for them to place burned out monuments to western arrogance on the dried out bed of the former reservoir.

Posted by: badjoke | Jul 1 2023 21:49 utc | 151

Unfortunately; as an American, I resemble that remark. President Trump was the only President who refused to initiate a new foreign war without a declaration of war from Congress as our Constitution requires. For that grievous offense, he was impeached.
Posted by: Elmer Fudd | Jul 1 2023 15:57 utc | 5
You mean the guy who reversed policy to send American military assistance to Ukraine? And he waged no wars without Congressional approval? That’s news to Africa.

Posted by: Gengar | Jul 1 2023 21:49 utc | 152

@ ThusspakeZarathustra | Jul 1 2023 21:23 utc | 141
the point is this… they are not protecting it and are leaving and they have to destroy it to prevent it from getting in ukraine-nato hands… that is the twisted logic nato and friends use constantly… one has to be crazy to believe russia blew up nordstream or the dam, but now they are going for a hat trick of the illogical.. russia is going to blow up the nuke plant… complete twisted logic.. what is perhaps the most shocking if some will believe it if it is repeated often enough.. let me quote kissinger again from a copy and paste..
“It is not a matter of what is true that counts, but a matter of what is perceived to be true.” Henry Kissinger………..

Posted by: james | Jul 1 2023 21:51 utc | 153

It’s sad that their talking points are so quickly repeated here.
Posted by: bevin | Jul 1 2023 21:37 utc | 150
Amen.

Posted by: Gengar | Jul 1 2023 21:51 utc | 154

Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Jul 1
Definitely correct there.
He’s a nationalist and I wouldn’t join his party. Nonetheless, he’s bright and worth reading. He lays out several predictions in the article that are consistent with what the better element of MOA have said for a year or so.
As much as I’d like to see a revolution put an end to the nation-state system, we are still dealing with nations here. He seems to have a good mechanism for predicting their behavior.
Light dismissal of this guy is just foolish.

Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Jul 1 2023 21:53 utc | 155

@ Paul Damascene | Jul 1 2023 21:48 utc | 154
well said paul and i concur with your conclusion too.. thanks..

Posted by: james | Jul 1 2023 21:54 utc | 156

“But of course Jewish Bolshevism is just an antisemitic conspiracy theory.”
“… Russians maintain that there would never have been Communism in Russia were it not for the Jews.” gT@76
The Jewish Bolshevism nonsense is not just another conspiracy theory, it is central in the development of Nazi ‘thought.’ You are following in Goebbels’ footsteps, as idiots are meant to do.
As to the opinion that there would never have been Communism in Russia without the Jews, this indicates a deep warmth of feeling among Russians to those practising Judaism- given that most Russians lament the ending of the Soviet state.
Why don’t you take your fascist beliefs elsewhere and pollute a less innocent site?

Posted by: bevin | Jul 1 2023 21:57 utc | 157

Richard L | Jul 1 2023 21:35 utc | 147–
Thanks for your reply. If you recall, the same was done to Jihadists within Syria–pumped with drugs then shoved into combat. You may also recall from 1987’s Star Trek: Next Generation pilot program, “Encounter at Farpoint,” that during “Humanity’s Trial” with Picard as Defendant and Q as Prosecutor a replay of human history was shown that depicted “Western” appearing soldiers in our future 21st Century using drugs to enhance their performance; a brief fleeting glimpse at what reality would soon bring forth. Of course, drug and alcohol use has long existed within militaries, but the method of use depicted in 1987 was eerily similar to that of the 2010s.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jul 1 2023 21:59 utc | 158

Posted by: Passerby | Jul 1 2023 20:49 utc | 119
Russia will indeed occupy all of Ukraine for the reasons I’ve repeatedly stated here in past threads: the requirement to build a Military District in western Ukraine to counter the Aegis Ashore installations in Poland and Romania. The hostility of western Ukraine nationalists to Russia is not a significant factor when compared with Russian security concerns.
Russia doesn’t need two million men to occupy Ukraine. Ukraine doesn’t need to be “occupied” in the manner some people such as Mearsheimer think it would be because, despite the fantasies of idiots, Ukraine is not capable of a functioning insurgency, CIA-supported or not. Ukrainians are not a tribal society such as Iraq or Afghanistan, where babies are born with AK-47s in their cribs. Neither are they the result of a major war like WWII or the production of an anti-Russian army as existed between 1945-1956. In other words, once the Ukrainian army is destroyed and disarmed and sent home, it is unlikely to revert to being an insurgency in the manner of the Iraqi army after the 2003 US invasion, partly because most of the remaining forces were conscripts who didn’t want to be in the Ukrainian army in the first place and partly because they’ve already seen the capability of the Russian army.
Russia can destroy the Ukrainian military with the 500-750,000 troops it has now. It can control Ukraine with that number, by not bothering to put a soldier on every street corner like the US does or other countries might or even as it did in the post-WWII insurgency (see below). That is not how you control a country. You control a country by controlling the important government buildings and critical facilities in the capital city.
Go study coup d’etats. They don’t use rebelling forces to control every street corner. They control the government buildings, the radio stations, the armories, the banks (the ones that are important), etc. with much smaller forces.
The number of civilians in a city or country is irrelevant. The thing of relevance is how many people, civilian or military, with military hardware are available to shoot at your army and how vulnerable your army is based on its method of deployment.
Russia can march to Kiev, take the city with minimal casualties using a combination of Syrian tactics and Wagner/Chechens, and take control of the government. That’s it. That’s all that’s necessary to “occupy” Ukraine.
Once that’s done, Russia can bring in the GRU/SVR/FSB and start cleaning house of the neo-Nazis with any resources or influence.
While Russia is organizing, with Russian and Chinese civilian help, the recovery of Ukraine, Russia will start building a Military District in western Ukraine. No “insurgency” is going to be able to do any significant damage to that or to any Russians in Kiev who will be under guard by those 500,000 troops.
These “rules of thumb” are bullshit. It depends on what the invading army wants to do and how they intend to do it.
Conventional counterinsurgency (COIN) doctrine requires that the counterinsurgency forces 1) have credibility and support of the local population, 2) speak the language, 3) know the culture, and 4) put the equivalent of a platoon of soldiers in every neighborhood. If these requirements aren’t met – and with the US in Iraq and Afghanistan, they were not – counterinsurgency will usually fail unless it is particularly draconian in application and/or the occupying army is overwhelming.
Russia will have the support of many Ukrainians in the eastern half of the country. They can draw on that population for personnel to assist with dealing with the other half. At least 30% of Ukrainians speak both Russian and Ukrainian and I’ve read that the average Ukrainian can understand much of the Russian language and vice versa even if they can’t usually speak well in it. The Russians will pretty much understand Ukrainian culture. And in a sense, Russia will have “credibility” if not support by Ukrainians since there is a long history between both countries, unlike the US and Iraq/Afghanistan.
Here is how the Soviet Union did a successful counterinsurgency from 1945-1956 (albeit it took ten years):
Pacification of Ukraine:
Soviet Counterinsurgency, 1944-1956
http://www.infoukes.com/upa/related/uf.html
Russia doesn’t need to do all that now, perhaps only part of it. Russia can use its experience of Syria and Chechnya as well as modern counterintelligence based on the Internet. It can simply control the Kiev city center and the major city centers of each oblast. It can recruit pro-Russian Ukrainians into security services as part of its efforts to reconstruct local administration of the oblasts, backed by probably thousands of GRU/SVR/FSB agents and new hiring into those agencies in Russia. Penetration by the CIA into Ukraine will probably be as difficult as operating in Iran or China.
Once the economic redevelopment of Ukraine begins, most Ukrainians will be more interested in earning a living (as now, either legitimately or criminally) than conducting an insurgency.
The bottom line, however, is that Russia’s security concerns override any issues of insurgency, or expense of controlling Ukraine, or any other such issues. Russia will deal with any problems, whether imperfectly or not, as long as Russia has a satisfactory counter to the military threat from NATO.
I believe Russia wants an “iron wall” from the Black Sea to the Arctic, shutting out the West permanently and relying on its technological and economic advantages to maintain an edge over the West. Taking Ukraine entirely off the board and reverting it to its historical status of “border lands” will be necessary to accomplish this.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 1 2023 21:59 utc | 159

Posted by: Paul Damascene | Jul 1 2023 21:48 utc | 154
I don’t see any way Russia could tolerate a Ukrainian rump state, filled with the virulent Russia haters and ready to be used as a catspaw again by NATO. I’ve seen a suggestion Western Ukraine could be carved up between Russia and Poland, but Poland poses the same problems. Russia needs NATO to dissolve, to be secure, and that mean Europe needs to wake the f up. I’m hoping the riots in France are a step toward that goal.

Posted by: pretzelattack | Jul 1 2023 22:01 utc | 160

JustAMaverick @ 59
The only possible things I can think of are either a nuclear or biological false flag. Perhaps you can suggest another but given the recent hysterics in western propaganda about a potential incident at the ZNPP, I believe the most likely course of action will be a nuclear false flag event followed by a massive and concerted propaganda campaign against Russia. Given the psychotic nature of those involved this potential outcome becomes even more likely.
RESPONSE: The narrative is being set up for a nuclear false flag event. After that event is orchestrated by Ukraine and the West, it will be NATO initiating article 5. It would be convenient that this false flag event occurred before the NATO Vilnius summit (July 11-12). This way all the NATO players will be corraled at one location and forced to submit to the USA will.
When NATO directly attacks Russian territory, there will be a Russian response. Then we are off to the races with more escalation than anyone would have ever believed months ago.
This scenario is pretty much set in stone. The USA can not back down. To do so would mean a rapid loss of the world reserve currency status of the United States Dollar.
Anyone that thinks the current Russo/Ukrainian conflict is going to end in sincere negotiation and peace just does not know how trapped and desperate the USA is at this point. The USA is in a snare and can’t get loose at the negotiation table. The USA is in a snare and can’t get free the war route either.

Posted by: young | Jul 1 2023 22:04 utc | 161

… I continue to argue for Russia to expand the perimeter to well beyond the river on the opposite side which they can do without undertaking a direct assault across the river by conducting an airmobile operation.
Posted by: karlof1 | Jul 1 2023 21:03 utc | 128

Absolutely agreed. I think it is a simple statement of fact that almost all cases could be handled by drone surveillance and remote strike systems, rather than attempting to station troops on acknowledge Ukrainian territory. Buffer zones should reflect the risk level so clearing out a deep buffer zone facing ZNPP would be a given.
I am asking why nothing like this has even been attempted. One could be forgiven for noting that, once the fighting really starts, the adopted strategy puts ZNPP at so much risk that it is the rational choice for RF to cede control of it to some ad hoc “international” administration, rather than court certain disaster.
I am also asking the bar to refrain from making excuses, as you can bet that there are multiple entire departments of analysts within China’s People’s Liberation Army who are watching and dissecting every move in the Ukraine conflict, you can also be that they aren’t making any excuses.

Posted by: anon2020 | Jul 1 2023 22:04 utc | 162

Posted by: karlof1 | Jul 1 2023 21:33 utc |
Thanks for this Crooke article. I started reading him a few months ago after you posted another of his articles and can’t stop.

Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Jul 1 2023 22:06 utc | 163

Posted by: Crazy chump | Jul 1 2023 15:44 utc | 1
I can think of maybe 3 Latin American countries at the moment with open, violent corruption at scale. Mexico, Colombia and I guess El Salvador. All three are heavily influenced by…..Uncle Scam’s meddling and sabotage. And his incessant appetite for mind altering drugs. What’s Ukraine’s excuse?

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Jul 1 2023 22:10 utc | 164

badjoke | Jul 1 2023 21:49 utc | 155–
Sorry, but the table provided here says you’re incorrect, Table 1: List of Famous Tanks and Their Track Characteristics.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jul 1 2023 22:11 utc | 165

Ukrainian polls on support for everlasting war are garbage.
Ukrainians know that voicing support for the war is an existential issue, because if they don’t they will be disappeared into a Nazi cellar where they will meet an excruciating end.

Posted by: CitizenSmith | Jul 1 2023 22:15 utc | 166

Posted by: Paul Damascene | Jul 1 2023 21:48 utc | 154
Excellent summary and great comment.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Jul 1 2023 22:16 utc | 167

Posted by: karlof1 | Jul 1 2023 21:33 utc | 146
Crooke is wrong as is usually the case on Prigozhin. Examples:

Prigozhin moves to Belarus to build a Wagner off-shoot that can defend the Belarus southern border, and position itself adjacent to Kiev; the Wagner cadre is absolved of mutiny and, with a tweak to its legal status, largely continues ‘business as usual’.

It is not yet established that Prigozhin will be “building a Wagner off-shoot”. Lukashenko has indeed asked Wagner to train his troops, and there is allegedly evidence that planes belonging to the MoD and used by Wagner are delivering either personnel or materiel to Belarus. So all we know for now is that a small number of Wagner will be used to train Belarus’ army. This is in line with the Russian desire to integrate the Belarus military with the Russian army, so it makes sense that Wagner would be permitted to do that by Russia.
As for “defending the Belarus southern border” and “position itself adjacent to Kiev”, this is of course complete nonsense, which is the result of Crooke knowing zip about military matters. Wagner in its best day at full strength would not add significantly to either task without being supported by regular Russian (or in this case, Belarussian) military.

Putin was, however, less generous, when treating the “the enemies of Russia – the neo-Nazis in Kiev, their Western patrons and other national traitors” who would have benefitted, had the coup succeeded: “They miscalculated” (implying clearly, they had ‘calculated’ aforehand.)

Again, the same logical error committed by everyone who thinks the CIA was behind it. He misrepresents Putin’s remark which was about how the West RESPONDED to the stunt with the idea the West PLANNED the stunt. There remains absolutely zero evidence of that. You’d think Crooke would be a little more conversant with logical reasoning.

The head of the Russian National Guard, Gen. Viktor Zolotov, speaking after President Putin on Friday, seemed to think so: He noted with “certainty” that Prigozhin’s mutiny “was inspired by Western special services – whose foreign ‘inspiration’ had become overlaid by Prigozhin’s own inflated ambitions”.
General Zolotov only said that whether Western agents may, or may not, have been directly involved in conducting the operation is being fully investigated.

So they’re investigating something they’ve already decided is true. I doubt that. Note also the vague term “inspired”. Either the West concocted the plan or they didn’t – “inspiration” is bullshit.
The reality is that Western intelligence would have been aware of the stunt almost as soon as Russian security services. So any actions which occurred after that by the West can be misinterpreted as “foreknowledge” or “complicity”, which is exactly the error Crooke commits.
I’m unimpressed by this article. It says nothing we don’t already know. As for how “huge” it is, I still believe it will be non-news in a week, like much else during this war that has been blown up out of proportion and then forgotten. Moskva, anyone?

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 1 2023 22:21 utc | 168

Paul Damascene@ 154 / james @ 160

well said paul and i concur with your conclusion too

+ 1 Great take down of Mearshimer, too bad you can’t debate him, the eminent professor would be in trouble.

Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Jul 1 2023 22:21 utc | 169

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 1 2023 21:59 utc | 163
“Russia will indeed occupy all of Ukraine” -> When? This decade? Next decade? At the moment the Russians seem to be going backwards. True, not very far backwards, but not forwards.
“Russia can march to Kiev, take the city with minimal casualties” -> that was already tried once and failed.

Posted by: Tim2 | Jul 1 2023 22:21 utc | 170

I am also asking the bar to refrain from making excuses, as you can bet that there are multiple entire departments of analysts within China’s People’s Liberation Army who are watching and dissecting every move in the Ukraine conflict, you can also be that they aren’t making any excuses.
Posted by: anon2020 | Jul 1 2023 22:04 utc | 166
And you can bet that the PLA will be far more informed regarding Russia than you or anyone else here at the bar. Some here make endless conjectures and predictions others make “excuses” as you call it, they might call it counter conjecture though.
What’s the the difference?

Posted by: K | Jul 1 2023 22:24 utc | 171

By the way, as to Twitter…
Musk has imposed the following arbitrary limits, allegedly due to “excessive data scraping”, which I suspect is bullshit. I suspect these are attempts to get more people to pay to get “verified”. If things continue as they are, that will be probably be Twitter’s only income.
Verified accounts are limited to reading 6,000 posts a day
Unverified accounts to 600 posts/day
New unverified accounts to 300 posts/day
So the destruction of Twitter continues apace. It’s amazing how fast one moron can destroy a huge company. Plenty of examples of that in the past.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 1 2023 22:27 utc | 172

Posted by: Paul Damascene | Jul 1 2023 21:48 utc | 154
The primordial cause of the war is *why* NATO expands (which contains a clue to why Russian participation was at least twice refused).
I definitely agree, but that’s beyond the scope of his analysis. For those questions, we have Hudson or if you’re not frightened by him, Lenin on Imperialism.

Posted by: Ahenobarbus | Jul 1 2023 22:28 utc | 173

Posted by: karlof1 | Jul 1 2023 22:11 utc | 169
In the comments of the article you posted their is some clarification of the difference between static ground pressure and the dynamic pressures that occur in motion. M1 and Challenger tanks have very low peak ground pressures due to the arrangement of the road wheels. Either way they will burn without ever having a meaningful impact on combat.

Posted by: badjoke | Jul 1 2023 22:31 utc | 174

English Outsider | Jul 1 2023 17:43 utc | 27
Are there any Ukrainian sources that give an accurate picture of what opinion is in Ukraine itself?
No.
The owners of Ukraine have no need for “people’s opinions”.
Those conducting a war against Russia using Ukraine, have ensured Ukrainians are prohibited from having opinions. Especially opinions opposing the war.
Opinions in Ukraine are controlled. No opposition political parties. No protests. No social media posts that criticise the war. No social media posts showing the impact of the war. [yes, posts are made. And people are then prosecuted]
No one is paying for surveys that may discover “opinions”.
I ask my dog what he wants for dinner. Why? Because it amuses me.
He may very well have an opinion. But he gets what I put in his bowl.
My dog has more agency then the citizens of Ukraine.

Posted by: Melaleuca | Jul 1 2023 22:33 utc | 175

hat tip to karlof1 for comparing the West to Wile E. Coyote. apt.

Posted by: pretzelattack | Jul 1 2023 22:36 utc | 176

Posted by: anon2020 | Jul 1 2023 22:04 utc | 166
Air mobile assault is incredibly risky. Plus you really dont want a river at your back.
Suggesting Shoigu and Gerasimov have ulterior motives for not doing as you suggest is possible, but would only come off as true if you could provide a detailed strategy to not only take your so-called buffer zone, but to hold it. AFU is there, and even of pushed back, they would surely push back, as allowing that kind of beachhead would be a severe risk. If the beachhead was not strong enough to secure supplies for those on the right bank, it would be pointless, mraning Russia would have to drive and disable long range weaponry, even deeper in Ukrainian territory. What you ate proposing is essentially a salient, with tenable supply, that would be open to attack from three sides form the AFU, far enough for their own supply. The Russian front line right now has few salients for the reason, it is mostly a long jagged line.
For Russis to achieve what you ask, their beachhead would have to be strong enough to support supply across river, so if they were to establish one there, the cost would be enough they might as well make it the spear head of their counter-offensive, which is not exactly the ideal area for such a venture.
With regards to your “use your wonder weapons and wonder drones 24-7 to get it done” kind pf thinking and argument shows you are thinking like this is a video game, with unlimited resources. I mean, why did bakmhut take so long, they should have just used their wonder weapons and wonder drones and finished it in one day!
In fact, nothing you said was specific in any way, showed no actual insight on to the specifics of the geography. Indeed, what you said could be applied anywhere on the front, it is so generic, and indeed, could work even better where they dont have to cross a river first, and have it at their back, cutting off any reyreat.

Posted by: UWDude | Jul 1 2023 22:39 utc | 177

RSH’s description of Musk as a “moron” is accurate enough; I’m more inclined to think of him as a petulant, obstreperous child, but our views are hardly mutually exclusive.
More to the point: He’s a huckster, and hucksterism is his only talent. He’s invented nothing; all of “his” innovations were either purchased or developed by engineers in his employ.
It’s only natural he found a home in the land of P. T. Barnum.

Posted by: malenkov | Jul 1 2023 22:48 utc | 178

Posted by: malenkov | Jul 1 2023 22:48 utc | 182
If you past physics in high school and have listened to Musk talk at any length you should quickly realize he bribed his way into being accepted at Stanford.

Posted by: badjoke | Jul 1 2023 22:53 utc | 179

Put an other way, are these chickens coming home to roost or chickens cooked up on order, a French Gladio in the works?
Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Jul 1 2023 20:49 utc | 121
I saw in the ABC in OZ that France’s Police Union boss is insisting to the government that Police be give the power and aid to quell the riots. Also reported is 40,000 plus police dispatched to the riots. Up from 9000 police. Where did these numbers come from all of a sudden? Btw there is plenty of reporting on the riots in Australia, it won’t be impartial, but far more so than anything on Russia or China.
I agree with you that it looks like these riots are being fuelled for the purposes of imposing martial law, as is happening in different ways across the neoliberal world. That is not to say there is no grassroots uprising at all or that the government will be successful. Macron is truly a fascist little Napolean only he is at war with his own people.

Posted by: K | Jul 1 2023 22:55 utc | 180

“..The European Welfare State was propped up on 2 pillars.
1. The U.S. taxpayer would pay for the defense of Europe (NATO).
2. Cheap energy from Russia….” kupkee@2
This untrue. And serves the interests of the Capitalist class. It is neo-liberal twaddle. European states are well able to look afyer their most vulnerable members- the USSR, which was far poorer and paid an enormous amount of its annual budget to fend off imperialist aggression ran a far more comprehensive ‘welfare state’ for many years.
As to the US taxpayer paying for Europe’s defence that too is nonsense: most of what Europe spends in arms not only ends up in the US but is completely integrated into US plans for aggression. Europe doesn’t need to spend a cent to defend itself from either Russia, China or Iran, none of whom has ever expressed the slightest interest in invading Europe.
European Defence budgets are a form of tribute paid to the hegemonic oligarchs, who are now saying that the people of Europe cannot afford both Uncle Sam’s MIC and pensions, so they must give up pensions, child allowances, free education, healthcare and unemployment pay.
It’s sad that their talking points are so quickly repeated here.
Posted by: bevin | Jul 1 2023 21:37 utc | 150
Your argument is entirely sound. An attractive emotional rebuttal, but weak nonetheless. Europe would have had to spend something on defense from 1945 onwards, so for 88 years. I agree that the USSA has ulterior motives, yet Europe still, even with the disaster of Ukraine, still kowtows to American power and belligerence. A symbiotic relationship, not good for either party, but private war profits are addictive.
And it is naive in the extreme that a Pacifist, unarmed Europe could just sit there and stare down a potential invader on her borders. And this is especially true of the many historical grievances amongst the warring European states.
So you agree that the pillar of cheap Russian Energy does support the European Welfare State. Claiming Russia built her nation on State Welfare belies the facts of Russia’s energy, resources and educated people.

Posted by: kupkee | Jul 1 2023 22:59 utc | 181

badjoke: I can’t imagine how else Musk could’ve gotten into Stanford! With his Backpfeifengesicht he certainly couldn’t have Lewinsky’d his way into Stanford.

Posted by: malenkov | Jul 1 2023 23:02 utc | 182

Has anyone booked a vacation 8n France? Looks lovely this time of year.

Posted by: alek_a | Jul 1 2023 23:02 utc | 183

As for Twitter, Had a Chrome extension called “Breakthrough Twitter Login Wall” which by-passed the login prompt and went directly to posting. But now the extension no longer works. I click on a twitter link and go to Twitter login dialog. Hopefully someone will come along with another extension to avoid that login prompt.
I tried similar extension for Mozilla, and no luck.
Figure that Musk is trying to force people to become members of Twitter to read any posting.

Posted by: Erelis | Jul 1 2023 23:10 utc | 184

You mean the guy who reversed policy to send American military assistance to Ukraine? And he waged no wars without Congressional approval? That’s news to Africa.
Posted by: Gengar | Jul 1 2023 21:49 utc | 156
Max Blumenthal said in his recent times UN speech that Trump was continuing the Obama policy towards arming Ukraine until he ultimately caved to “he’s Putin’s puppet” pressure.
What wars did Trump start in Africa?

Posted by: Simon | Jul 1 2023 23:12 utc | 185

I just read Simplicius latest article…I call bullshit on most of it…It’s not that his facts are wrong – when he’s printing facts and not the latest Twitter rumor – but that his interpretations are all over the place.
He spends much of the article cramming in as much crap from Western media as he can. If I want to listen to the ravings of the Western media, I’ll visit Western Web sites.
Biggest problem: this statement:
“In light of such rumors, the decision to deploy Wagner to Belarus begins to look increasingly strategic.”
Bullshit. There was no “decision to deploy Wagner to Belarus”. Anyone who can provide ANY link to ANY Russian senior official who has said this, please do so. You can’t. It doesn’t exist.
Here is the sort of “news” about that you can read on the Web today (highlighting is mine):
Ukraine Recap: Wagner Forces Said to Be Regrouping in Belarus
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2023-07-01/russia-ukraine-wagner-latest-news-july-1-2023

Fighters from the Wagner mercenary group may be about to regroup en masse in Belarus, according to reports from the Associated Press and US analysts at the Institute for the Study of War. Satellite images show hundreds of large tents set up over the past week at a previously abandoned base in Asipovichy, about 150 miles north of the Ukrainian border, ISW said, adding that the militia forces will reportedly operate out of three field camps in Belarus.
Ukrainian military commanders met Saturday at the Rivne nuclear power plant to assess possible threats to the site and hear a report on the operational situation on the Belarusian border, President Volodymyr Zelenskiy said on Telegram. As many as 8,000 Wagner fighters may be deployed in Belarus, a Ukrainian border guard official told local media.

Complete bullshit. “Hundreds of tents” means probably no more than 2,000 troops, which is probably the lot that followed Prigozhin into Russia and could serve as trainers for the Belarus army. Or the entire report could be complete bullshit. Give me a legitimate – I stress LEGITIMATE – Russian source that confirms this. Lukashenko already said they could have an abandoned base, after previously denying the bullshit reports – which continue to be quoted today – about Belarus building bases.
Also see my comments above to Crooke article about what Wagner would be capable of doing in Belarus if they did indeed move there in full strength. Which I remind everyone has not been stated by anyone in Russia, and that the bulk of the Wagner forces are to be integrated into the Russian regular army, which will take weeks or months to complete.
Second, he continues to think this war will easily stretch into next year just because it will start raining again in October. So Russia has at least four months left to make a big offensive, which he thinks won’t happen. I continue to believe that this “everyone will be immobile” in winter is bullshit. Others have said that in WWII there were big offensives conducted in winter. The fact that Ukraine didn’t launch its offensive until now proves nothing. The fact that Russia didn’t launch an offensive – despite Macgregor’s presumption which he now admits was wrong – last winter proves nothing. It is already established that Russia prefers its “ground and pound” approach.
That says absolutely nothing about what happens when the Ukrainian army runs out of ammunition and people, which, based on the casualty rates I’ve estimated previously here, is likely to be precisely within those four months, give or take a couple months.
Now as to the ZPP. I call bullshit on everything being reported about this from both sides. We’ve been hearing about a “false flag” since before the war started. None has occurred yet. The IAEA has people on the ground, they are reporting nothing but that everything is calm, there is no “mining” or any of that crap. As someone above noted, if the Ukrainians want to blow up a nuclear plant, they have several under their control that they can choose from.
I see this whole ZPP business as just another Ukrainian propaganda campaign, supported by the West, to keep flinging shit at Russia to demonize Russia to the electorates in the West. All this reporting in his article about “Ukraine preparing for a nuclear incident” is either 1) an intent to blow up one of their own nuclear plants while deflecting everyone to the ZPP plant, or 2) just part of the propaganda campaign against Russia.
He spends a lot of time on “secret negotiations”, entirely from the Western side. It’s all bullshit, so why bother?
He says:

Russia does not have enough troops to go “all out” in major blitzkrieg attacks, particularly if it’s true that Shoigu plans to use the 150k+ newly mobilized troops as a reserve army.

So 500-750,000 troops aren’t enough for a “blitzkrieg attack”? Again ignoring what happens when Ukraine runs out of ammo? Can’t these people link two thoughts together to make a conclusion? And what does “150K newly mobilized troops” mean? What happened to the 370,000 they mobilized in the fall? This is bullshit.
Yet he’s willing to spend a ton of time on Poland building a huge army with 1,000 tanks and half a million men ready to invade Ukraine AND Belarus all at once! All of which is utter bullshit propaganda from the West intended to scare Russia and reassure the West’s electorate that the West can defend against and defeat Russia.
Good luck with that, West!
I’m unimpressed again with this article.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 1 2023 23:14 utc | 186

sln2002 | Jul 1 2023 20:11 utc | 94
I don’t have a TWTR account. But I accessed it every day.
Years back, when confronted with the “5 view limit now subscribe”, I’d just erase cookies. It was fkn annoying, but the “price” paid to see tweets. Sometimes I’d fall into a gap and wouldn’t see the pop-up for an extended period.
Even before musk I found I had entered an open unlimited access zone.
No account, so could only scroll tweets.
Now, like everyone else without an account, I am blocked with a sign in pop up.
I was obtaining the best non corporate info on Ukraine and everything else from twitter.
For those who despise twitter, I understand. But even our clay-foot heros have and use twitter. As do b and Simplicius.
If the intent was to restrict information access, it’s worked.
Telegram. Is not as “easy” as Twt. Also, I can’t as easily parse who is behind an account.
I could “triangulate” info on twtr. Suppress my barf reflex and trawl McFaul, Kofman, Rob Lee, Julian Ropche, even Zelensky’s twtr. A fact is a fact regardless of who tweeted it. Know the source, is to know the spin.
People post the most amazing and incriminating pics and info on twtr.
Like the 86th Airborne posting pics from their sniper positions, hours before 90 people were shot and killed in Kabul during the U$ “evacuation” from Afghanistan.
It’s only been 30+ hours and no twtr is a huge gap in my intel reconnaissance.
Especially with regard to Ukraine.

Posted by: Melaleuca | Jul 1 2023 23:15 utc | 187

Posted by: kupkee | Jul 1 2023 22:59 utc | 185
defense against what exactly? defense against the US losing its preeminent position in the world. you just keep buying into the bs. The US “defensive umbrella” just kept Europe in fealty to the US. and Europe did spend a lot at NATO direction. look at all the arms, no matter how useless, Europe is sending to Ukraine. In defense of Europe?? I don’t think so.

Posted by: pretzelattack | Jul 1 2023 23:17 utc | 188

@ UWDude | Jul 1 2023 22:39 utc | 181
Land troops, only, can achieve the only breaktrough there, supported by air and missile forces. And thinking on stopping a bit far from the river is silly and why, if in offensive run.
Without taking Kherson and Nikolaiev while bridgeheading in Ochakiv nothing happens on the south, and Odesa stays a dream. Listening to many strategies, I do not know which milestone has to be reached to initiate such move.
Point is it has been done before in many wars and RF kind of knows how to do it and where.
One good map is, to understand how and what, here .

Posted by: whirlX | Jul 1 2023 23:22 utc | 189

TASS tells us: “CIA Director William Burns called Director of Russia’s Foreign Intelligence Service (SVR) Sergey Naryshkin this week to tell him that the US had nothing to do with the mutiny attempt by the Wagner Private Military Company (PMC), The Wall Street Journal said on Friday citing its sources.”
It doesn’t confirm Naryshkin received such a call, just that the WSJ said the CIA said. As Lavrov and others have stated, since CIA is one of the root causes of the current situation all that followed from the 2014 Coup is the responsibility of those that organized it–period. As with the crime of Aggressive War, all the crimes that follow its enactment result from it thus making the initiators culpable. So, once again, the CIA and its mouthpiece have lied yet again.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jul 1 2023 23:32 utc | 190

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jul 1 2023 23:14 utc | 190
The priggy incident could still be a deception move. I have thought of at least two other scenarios it could be used for, that I have seen no-one mention, therefore I will keep it to myself.
Even if it was planned or not, Scorpion gave an I-ching reading of the incident, that I had thought as a possibility myself. An unplanned outburst, but a “crisitunity” as homer put it.
I’ve experienced such things, where something bad happened, only to come out as something great. Lemons, lemonade, all that.
I know western thinking, they love to focus on trivial matters and make them big deals, ive experienced it at my jobs many times, where some news event, holiday, or weather makes the management over-prepare. Just saying, I hope NATO starts stocking up on toilet paper and bottled water, because Covid might be the end of the world.

Posted by: UWDude | Jul 1 2023 23:33 utc | 191

Figure that Musk is trying to force people to become members of Twitter to read any posting.
Posted by: Erelis | Jul 1 2023 23:10 utc | 188
This is a typical capitalist tactic. Anybody using twitter is an active participant.

Posted by: dh | Jul 1 2023 23:37 utc | 192

It is going to be a long hot summer for Europe and the United States as the politicians display their gross incompetence and criminal activities!! Donald Trump is going to harp of the Biden Crime Family 24/7!! Our federal government is a disaster that can not be swept under the rug forever!!

Posted by: cousin lucky | Jul 1 2023 23:37 utc | 193

H@ck 190 / I’m unimpressed again with this article.
Simplicius here.
I’m weeping. Body racked by waves of inconsolable tears.
All that writing and yet Hack is unimpressed.
Woe, woe is me.

Posted by: Sad Sad Simp | Jul 1 2023 23:40 utc | 194

Posted by: kupkee | Jul 1 2023 22:59 utc | 185
defense against what exactly? defense against the US losing its preeminent position in the world. you just keep buying into the bs. The US “defensive umbrella” just kept Europe in fealty to the US. and Europe did spend a lot at NATO direction. look at all the arms, no matter how useless, Europe is sending to Ukraine. In defense of Europe?? I don’t think so.
Posted by: pretzelattack | Jul 1 2023 23:17 utc | 192
You mistake Offense for Defense. Of course, USSA policy is Offensive. And has been for a very long time.
But it is childish and naive to think Europe needs no defense, including from themselves.
Both World Wars got started and were mainly fought in Europe, over dirt that was more than adequate to sustain all Europeans. And entirely in a peaceful manner.
Yet those wars were started and fought. Mainly along the fertile ground of European deceit. I give you Merkel and Hollande. Case closed.

Posted by: kupkee | Jul 1 2023 23:41 utc | 195

Posted by: whirlX | Jul 1 2023 23:22 utc | 193
Not sure if disagreeing with something i said or agreeing, but it seems to be what I was saying.

Posted by: UWDude | Jul 1 2023 23:44 utc | 196

Posted by: anon2020 | Jul 1 2023 21:35 utc | 148
A river is a natural barrier. Sun Tzu says, any idiot can see that.

Posted by: sln2002 | Jul 1 2023 23:58 utc | 197

Posted by: sln2002 | Jul 1 2023 23:58 utc | 201
To lift an autumn hair is no sign of great strength; to see the sun and moon is no sign of sharp sight; to hear the noise of thunder is no sign of a quick ear.

Posted by: UWDude | Jul 2 2023 0:04 utc | 198

But of course Jewish Bolshevism is just an antisemitic conspiracy theory.”
“… Russians maintain that there would never have been Communism in Russia were it not for the Jews.” gT@76
The Jewish Bolshevism nonsense is not just another conspiracy theory, it is central in the development of Nazi ‘thought.’ You are following in Goebbels’ footsteps, as idiots are meant to do.
As to the opinion that there would never have been Communism in Russia without the Jews, this indicates a deep warmth of feeling among Russians to those practising Judaism- given that most Russians lament the ending of the Soviet state.
Why don’t you take your fascist beliefs elsewhere and pollute a less innocent site?
Posted by: bevin | Jul 1 2023 21:57 utc | 161

Why don’t you shut the fuck up if the only things you’ve got to say on the matter are insults and logical fallacies.
Perhaps you should read the latest book of, former anti-communist West’s darling and Nobel prize of literature, Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn, 200 Years Together. Of course, being born in 1918, he didn’t witness the revolution himself but he lenghthily experienced later one of its ugliest outcome, the Gulag, as everyone knows. When being asked why, in this book, he picked and choose to speak of only Jews when talking about the gulag’s staff and management, he answered that he didn’t pick and choose, that all those he knew and saw were Jews without a single exception…

Posted by: Mushroom | Jul 2 2023 0:08 utc | 199

@sln2002
No doubt. Although, are you sure that wasn’t Abraham Lincoln?

Posted by: Boris Badenov | Jul 2 2023 0:08 utc | 200