Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
June 14, 2023
Astroturfing For More War In Ukraine

Fellaraktar🇺🇦@fellaraktar – 14:46 UTC · May 29, 2023

As a British citizen I want to say that arming Ukraine is the single best use of tax payer money for decades

My only criticism is that the west aren’t sending enough, fast enough

Ukraine is paying for political posturing with the lives of their sons and daughters

Do more now

Karen Goetz📯🇺🇦 @KarenGoetz362 – 22:18 UTC · May 29, 2023

As a German citizen I want to say that arming #Ukraine is the single best use of tax payer money for decades. My only criticism is that the west aren't sending enough, fast enough. Ukraine is paying for political posturing with the lives of their sons and daughters. Do more now!

Oksanna Oricia (Оксана Збігла) 🇺🇦🇨🇦 @Roxanne_Oricia – 1:46 UTC · May 30, 2023

As a 🇺🇦 #Canadian I want to say that arming #Ukraine is the single best use of taxpayer money in decades.

My only criticism is that the west isn’t sending enough, FAST enough.

Ukraine is paying for political posturing with the lives of their sons & daughters.
#ArmUkraineNow ✊🏼

Thomas C. Theiner @noclador – 4:57 UTC · May 30, 2023

As an Italian citizen I want to say that arming Ukraine is the single best use of taxpayer money for decades.
My only criticism is that the west aren’t sending enough, fast enough.
Ukraine is paying for political posturing with the lives of their sons and daughters.
Do more now!

brit engr 🇬🇧 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿🇺🇦 @brit_engr – 8:15 UTC · May 30, 2023

As a British citizen, I want to say that arming Ukraine is the single best use of taxpayer money for decades.
My only criticism is that the West aren’t sending enough, fast enough.
Ukraine is paying for political posturing with the lives of their sons and daughters.
Do more now!

bitiv @bitiv30 – 9:29 UTC · May 30, 2023

As a #Romanian citizen, I want to say that arming #Ukraine is the single best use of taxpayer money for decades. My only criticism is that the West isn’t sending enough, fast enough. Ukraine is paying for political posturing with the lives of its sons and daughters. Do more now!

Anne @KidsFromUkraine 🌷❤🌻 @AnneFella – 17:03 UTC · May 30, 2023

As a 🇳🇱#Dutch citizen I want to say that arming #Ukraine is the single best use of taxpayer money in decades. My only criticism is that the west isn’t sending enough, FAST enough. Ukraine is paying for political posturing with the lives of their sons & daughters. #ArmUkraineNow

Thibaud Ochem @Thibaud_Ochem – 18:51 UTC · May 30, 2023

As a 🇫🇷 citizen I want to say that arming #Ukraine is the single best use of taxpayer money 4 decades. My only criticism is that the West isn't sending enough, fast enough.🇺🇦is paying 4 political posturing with the lives of their sons & daughters. Do more now! #weapons4Ukraine

MH @Mickhavoc – 1:14 UTC · May 31, 2023

As a Canadian citizen I want to say that arming #Ukraine is the single best use of taxpayer money for decades. My only criticism is that the west aren't sending enough, fast enough. Ukraine is paying for political posturing with the lives of their sons and daughters. Do more now

Bogdan Stech @BogdanStech – 22:07 UTC · May 31, 2023

As a #Poland citizen, I want to say that arming #Ukraine is the single best use of taxpayer money for decades. My only criticism is that the West isn’t sending enough, fast enough. Ukraine is paying for political posturing with the lives of its sons and daughters.

Well, by now you will have understood the idea …

There are many more such tweets.

In total I count more than one hundred by various NAFO troll accounts. All the tweets were issued between May 29 and June 6.

This is astroturfing on a fairly sophisticated level:

Astroturfing is the practice of hiding the sponsors of a message or organization (e.g., political, advertising, religious or public relations) to make it appear as though it originates from and is supported by grassroots participants. It is a practice intended to give the statements or organizations credibility by withholding information about the source's financial backers. The term astroturfing is derived from AstroTurf, a brand of synthetic carpeting designed to resemble natural grass, as a play on the word "grassroots". The implication behind the use of the term is that instead of a "true" or "natural" grassroots effort behind the activity in question, there is a "fake" or "artificial" appearance of support.

I wonder whose taxpayer money gets wasted on it.

Yesterday the Russian President Vladimir Putin had a public talk with war correspondents. Yekaterina Agranovich, a blogger, asked him about 'western' propaganda and the people deceived by it. Putin responded:

The information space is a battlefield, a crucial battlefield.

So, if someone uploads or writes something and provides an address, this is one thing. However, if there is no address and it is not clear who is writing or speaking, this is a completely different story. You and I are well aware that you can post things online using well-known technical means, and you can make it look like millions of people have seen these videos and commented on them when in fact there is just one person behind it who simply uses modern technology to replicate it endlessly. But, of course, there certainly are people who have a certain frame of mind, and they can express their point of view.

What can we do to oppose this? I think this audience will know what I mean. This can and should be countered not so much by restrictions or administrative or law enforcement constraints, but by effective work in the information environment on our part. And I am really counting on your help.

Well, he did not talk to me. And no, I do not post at Moon of Alabama to help Russia or Putin, but to lay things out as I see them. If that is at times consistent with whatever this or that other public person says, it is likely to be a coincidental and temporary state.

Hat tip: Syriacide

Comments

@shаdоwbаnnеd | Jun 14 2023 16:42 utc | 83
…a lot of disastrous decisions followed as a direct result of that trip?
I was quite young when he visited the US. I vaguely remember him being upset that he couldn’t visit Disneyland. That should have been a warning right there. Disney was definitely a fascist-lover, anti-union reactionary. He knew how to exploit: he paid his animators pennies and wouldn’t allow them to organize. He was a fraud: even his trademark “signature” wasn’t his but a product of one of his animators. IIRC, he was also an FBI informant for both Hoover and McCarthy. Anyway, I’m not sure if any of that is relevant to his “disastrous” decisions. His decision to promote over 60 lies about Stalin at the 20th Party Congress surely had very little to do with any memes he encountered in the US. Like I mentioned earlier, I think the whole “meme” idea is more about cultural issues.

Posted by: zeke2u | Jun 14 2023 17:26 utc | 101

“Ukraine is taking significant casualties and making slow progress towards the Russian main line of defence, western officials have admitted in one of the west’s first assessments of the Ukrainian counteroffensive launched on 4 June.
The officials’ sombre tone was clearly designed to lower expectations of a transformative breakthrough. However they nevertheless insisted the counteroffensive was “going in the right direction” and the losses were not unexpected.”
Live feed at guardian

Posted by: ThusspakeZarathustra | Jun 14 2023 17:29 utc | 102

As a peace advocate I want to express the idea destroying NATO is in the best interests of the working class and the world.

Posted by: Wilikins | Jun 14 2023 17:30 utc | 103

⚡️ Report of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation on the progress of the special military operation (June 14, 2023)
Posted by: rumod report | Jun 14 2023 14:07 utc | 22
We should remember that the ongoing slaughter of Ukrainians was arranged by American Zionists and neocons.
Here is the context:
The Jewish Lobby has been extremely aggressive against any honest research in WWII, which exposed Elie Wiesel & Otto Frank’s lies. People were imprisoned for chemistry and physics studies related to the impossible “oven & soap” slanders. And yet, during the last nine years, the US/EU Jewish community has been mostly mum about the rise of neo-Nazism in Ukraine — while the Jewish Lobby and all 37 Jewish members of the US Congress have been demanding to finance and weaponize the self-proclaimed Ukrainian Nazis. The ADL calls Banderites “freedom fighters.”
The Nuland-Kagan putsch in Kiev in 2014 was a joined Zionists & Nazis enterprise. The commandant of the Zionist-Nazi putsch, Andrij Parubiy, was the founder of the Ukrainian Nazi Party.
Is it really surprising that the world Jewish community approved of the putsch? The mediocre and aged playboy Bernard-Henri Lévy has been squeaking Stepan Bandera’s battle cry “‘Slava Ukraini’ tirelessly all over Europe. Someone needs to remind the aged playboy Lévy about his recent squeaking “nazi& hiter,” this foundational meme for the profitable extraction schema of holobiz. Guess, it stopped being profitable enough.

Posted by: Cerena | Jun 14 2023 17:31 utc | 104

A bot named Karen , that gave me a laugh,

Posted by: hankster | Jun 14 2023 17:31 utc | 105

As an American citizen, I want to say that arming Cuba, Mexico, and Nicaragua are the three best use of taxpayer money in decades.
My only criticism is that Asia isn’t sending enough, FAST enough.
The Global South is paying for political posturing with the lives of their sons & daughters.

Posted by: William Haught | Jun 14 2023 17:32 utc | 106

I am an American. Please take my money so more ukranians and russians can kill each other. They are not real white people.

Posted by: oicu812 | Jun 14 2023 17:34 utc | 107

Sushi | Jun 14 2023 15:59 utc | 63–
Congratulations on discovering Bastiat!! It’s very sad he died in 1850 far too young as he was just beginning to show how erudite he was. When he succumbed to cancer, he was supposedly working on a manuscript dealing with what he called the Age of Plunder, which is where I got the term.
Your example and the Ukie testimony within serve to buttress my contention that NATO set Ukraine up to fail, but was that policy or just happenstance? IMO, my hypothesis deserves serious consideration: Why no Apache attack helos or other types; why such paltry dribblings of all types of vehicles MBTs, AFVs, SPAs, etc; why so very few AD systems, particularly mobile AD systems; and then there’s the ammo issue, along with the uselessness of many grandly touted NATO weapons? From 2015 to 2022–almost 7 full years–were available to prep the Ukie military, most of which now appears to have been wasted–an opportunity cost that cannot be redeemed. Russia certainly used those same years much better, but then its weapon systems actually work and work very well, and that includes EW/SigInt assets too.
I recall WW2’s “Phony War” period where the French and Benalux nations did nothing during that time to improve their disposition thinking their “wunderwaffen” defensive fortifications would be more than enough while discounting German potential. Sounds familiar, yes? Why was NATO blind to the Air Domain reality where Russia has complete control, particularly when NATO doctrine says that its control must be held by NATO? Did something happen during the Trump years within NATO causing it to perform so bad? We know he wanted Europe to do more, but did he somehow actively withhold despite evidence that he didn’t have 100% control over the Outlaw US Empire’s military? Did Covid act as a mighty disrupter in training and logistics? Yet, NATO was very confident and had the Ukies ready to open their own offensive @ March 1 2022, which events proved the Ukies to not be ready at all.
Lots of very serious questions needing answers that will likely never come, although we do have some testimony as you revealed, plus Ukie/NATO army performance.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 14 2023 17:35 utc | 108

Posted by: Blissex | Jun 14 2023 17:25 utc | 99
DNR and LNR “declared their autonomy”, not the Kharkov (although iirc there was an attempt at a referendum in 2014), Kherson and Zaparozhye oblasts. When Russia sent troops to help DNR and LNR, that was not an invasion stricto sensu.
When Russian forces established a land bridge to Crimea, invading the Zaparozhye and Kherson oblasts in 2022, that was an invasion. Whether the people in those oblasts actually welcomed the Russian troops or not.
You may have a point about the legitimacy of the Ukrainian government however. Whether we recognize post-coup Ukraine as “the real Ukraine” or not will change the status of the current Russian military op. Legally speaking, though, I think the UN recognized it.

Posted by: Lemming | Jun 14 2023 17:36 utc | 109

Posted by: Lemming | Jun 14 2023 17:07 utc | 93
Agree to disagree again. My father in WWII did not participate in an invasion of the Philippines, but rather its liberation. Fortunately he was in the process of getting sent home, after serving since just after Pearl Harbor, before the United States started to invade Okinawa, which is part of Japan. And fortunately the Home Islands of Japan were never invaded, albeit the price Japan had inflicted on it for that was horrendous.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philippines_campaign_(1944%E2%80%931945)
My dad had his picture taken with some of those who were grateful for being liberated. Okinawa was a much different story for the United States military. Not much picture taking with civilians afterwards.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Okinawa_Island#Pacific_war
So I maintain a distinction between a war fought as a liberation versus a war fought as an invasion.

Posted by: Babel-17 | Jun 14 2023 17:37 utc | 110

Note one thing all those fake Twitter accounts have in common – they are pitching their crap to NATO countries. I don’t see any Brazilian or African fakes.
Meanwhile, the Rest of the World laughs.
Martin Armstrong’s model gives it less than 8 years until the collapse of the US empire:
https://www.armstrongeconomics.com/international-news/politics/word-of-warning-they-cant-put-trump-in-prison-but-they-can-you-for-protesting/
The best we can hope for if you live in Europe or the US is that the next few years are relatively calm, with the big shitstorm hitting at the end of the decade. I say relative because increased crackdowns on dissent and excess mortality levels are not as bad as what is likely coming – a return to 1800’s living standards.

Posted by: Ghost of Zanon | Jun 14 2023 17:39 utc | 111

#ArmCubaNow #Weapons4Cuba #ArmMexicoNow #Weapons4Mexico #GlobalSouthPayingThePrice #ArmNicaraguaNow #Weapons4Nicaragua

Posted by: William Haught | Jun 14 2023 17:41 utc | 112

Hate to say it, don’t want to dis my peeps but in my estimation, around 75% of UK citizens are msm brainwashed BORGWURST!
I mean, even if a tactical nuke popped off in Uke, a good proportion of them could easily be distracted with a, I’m guessing here, “Phillip Scofield Destroyed My Ass!”, said Rent B.O.Y X
Pains me to say it, but you gotta give credit where credit is due?

Posted by: Big Johnny Potatoes | Jun 14 2023 17:43 utc | 113

Posted by: Babel-17 | Jun 14 2023 17:37 utc | 109
“My father in WWII did not participate in an invasion of the Philippines, but rather its liberation”
-> indeed, and why was that called “liberation” instead of “invasion”? because the Philippines had just been invaded by Japan in 1942. So the US putting military units in the Philippines in 1944 was not a case of a country invading another, but of a country invading an already-invaded country, restoring control of that country to its former authorities. So, a liberation.
You may argue with some success that Yanukovitch is still the de-jure president of Ukraine, and so that could make it a liberation of Ukraine instead of an invasion. But then are we talking about the UN standard, or whatever one country says is legitimate?

Posted by: Lemming | Jun 14 2023 17:44 utc | 114

Posted by: William Haught | Jun 14 2023 17:41 utc | 111
Just think about it – the evil colonialist companies Raytheon and Lockheed refused to pay protection money to peace loving Mexican cartels and got hit by the MafIskander-K to deliver the message of self protection against evil neo-colonialism, racism and anti-LGBTQ transphobism.
The UN would hold an emergency meeting where the Global Community™ would approve their just cause to fight such evil.

Posted by: unimperator | Jun 14 2023 17:46 utc | 115

If MoA had an edit feature, I would change “citizen” in my 2nd most recent post to “subject.”

Posted by: William Haught | Jun 14 2023 17:49 utc | 116

Two Storm Shadows shot down, no mention of any SUs or MIGs being shot down. Not good. A pic posted state side, shows the building where the Russian officers were when the Storm Shadow hit. Hard to believe after the hit on the Cadet Graduation building at New Year’s that Russia still feels it has impunity to lodge officers out in the open. Brits salivate at such an opportunity to show how well their cruise missiles kill Russians and nary a hair on a Brit head is tussled. Steady as she goes.
Cheers M

Posted by: sean the leprechaun | Jun 14 2023 17:52 utc | 117

What we (the Germnas) can hear dayly by a reapetedly penetrating music on the “SAW-Radio.” today is an anyway fake musics based on English messages acc.to. that “songs”.
I give you MoAs here the very original source of those “sound-like” mp3s – Okay?
But pls. do not further have a listen to that Radio “German SMA – East German’s alike”.
That’s the current influence made by ALEXA US/DeepState channels – the music is very good (even playing Genesis/Clapton/etc.
What shall’s ?
The newly engaged Snipers (from whom ..) are still waiting for an concrete order, to go on on onto Piano-Cock-Player bomb attack – and then ? .. who’s the follower : Mr. Blinken ? .. (ref. China FM)

Posted by: spare_truth | Jun 14 2023 17:53 utc | 118

A senior Chechen commander and member of Russia’s parliament has been reported wounded in Ukraine, although colleagues have been quick to say he is alive and well.
– BBC
Well, Biden is reported to be the president of USA, and his sidekicks/sponsor are quick to say Biden can think by himself and decide by himself, not a dead-man-walking…

Posted by: ostro | Jun 14 2023 17:55 utc | 119

@ English Outsider | Jun 14 2023 16:31 utc | 77
i agree with you.. that is a huge point and the most significant propaganda point that everything else rests on..
@ sean the leprechaun | Jun 14 2023 17:52 utc | 116
they are going to continue to ramp this up.. that is obvious..

Posted by: james | Jun 14 2023 17:55 utc | 120

Posted by: shаdоwbаnnеd | Jun 14 2023 13:35 utc | 3
##################
New rule, all critics should report to the front ASAP. Be the change you want to see in the world…
If one is not putting their body on the line, I could care less about their perspective in print. Talk is cheap, and getting cheaper every day in the age of bots and AI.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 14 2023 17:58 utc | 121

Who are these people who like paying taxes to kill people?

Posted by: Gravedigger | Jun 14 2023 18:00 utc | 122

Posted by: shаdоwbаnnеd | Jun 14 2023 13:35 utc | 3
After the first paragraph I knew who was the poster.
I would really like to be able to see posters name at the top of the post.

Posted by: 2+2=5 | Jun 14 2023 18:01 utc | 123

Not only astroturfing or gaslighting. This is a hoax to make taxpayers part with their money and finance the malarkey of the experts.

Posted by: Ionathan W | Jun 14 2023 18:03 utc | 124

As an attractive and lonely young woman who lives very close to you and is available for dating, I want to say that arming Ukraine is the single best use of taxpayer money for decades.
My only criticism is that the west aren’t sending enough, fast enough.
Ukraine is paying for political posturing with the lives of their sons and daughters.
Do more now! #Babes for Ukraine!!

Posted by: BroncoBilly | Jun 14 2023 18:03 utc | 125

Posted by: Lemming | Jun 14 2023 17:44 utc | 113
Good, I think we’re at the point where we can “bottom line” this.
If the majority of those living on the land see you as Invaders, you were to them part of an invasion. If on the other hand they see you as being a Liberator (Blake’s 7 anyone?), you weren’t to them part of an invasion. Their land, their lives, their definitions, and we should respect all three.
George Washington did not cross the Delaware to invade part of the British Empire, lol, he liberated Trenton from Hessian (German) mercenaries. 🙂
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Washington's_crossing_of_the_Delaware_River
The Western powers have been drawing lines on maps for centuries, and using the borders they create to justify their selfish interests. Russians are not “The Invaders”, and I’m pleased to finish on a note that calls back to my earlier post about Babel-17, the novel. lol 🙂 Have a very nice day!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Babel-17
https://www.enotes.com/topics/babel-17/in-depth

The word for a member of the Alliance—the alliance of humans and aliens—in the Babel-17 language used by the Invaders means “invader.” This makes the Invaders the heroes, and the Alliance—which Earth is a part of—into the actual invaders.

Posted by: Babel-17 | Jun 14 2023 18:04 utc | 126

Pls. note:
the “REAL” sources, whether the Men nor fielding devices power will drop the next monthes.
But more once declared. the GERMAN RADIO “SAW” news proclaimed a further “war” against “RU State” in general whatever it costs . means until “open-end” – SCHOLZ is a target of missiles ..!
If noone have understood here above facts, those guys can’t be “helped” anymore. That’s it!
HELP GERMANY asap. ! ..

Posted by: spare_truth | Jun 14 2023 18:05 utc | 127

Posted by: T.h.omas | Jun 14 2023 13:56 utc | 15
We call that the post-truth society.

Posted by: alek_a | Jun 14 2023 18:05 utc | 128

« Quand le gouvernement viole les droits du peuple, l’insurrection est, pour le peuple et pour chaque portion du peuple, le plus sacré des droits et le plus indispensable des devoirs. »
Déclaration des Droits de l’Homme, 1793
Posted by: La Bastille | Jun 14 2023 17:06 utc | 92
The unmentioned aspect in all of this is definition of insurrection. Who decides whether the insurrection is a grassroots revolt or a colour revolution financed and organized from outside. The authors of the Declaration seem not to have thought of that aspect. Unfortunately, practically all of the insurrections in recent history were instigated from abroad, frequently with foreign mercenaries and criminal gangs. R2P in that respect is just one more ruse to meddle in the affairs of other countries.

Posted by: Pagan | Jun 14 2023 18:07 utc | 129

Thanks B. Now we know who “ShadowBanned” @3’s workmates are

Posted by: Maximus | Jun 14 2023 18:20 utc | 130

Posted by: Babel-17 | Jun 14 2023 18:04 utc | 125
Agree to disagree, then. Defining an invasion on whether a majority of the invaded people call it so or not is tricky, and can’t be used as a proper definition. What is a majority? 50% + 1? What if it varies from town to town? How do you measure this? the number of smiley faces you see when cruising through a town in a tank?
Citing an insurrection (the American revolution) as a counter-example is not relevant. Were the USans invading the British? no! Were the French and Spanish invading British territory during the same war? yes!
Of course, I agree to the legitimacy of Russia’s current operation for the same reasons you cited. I am still forced to call it an invasion.
Have a nice day as well!

Posted by: Lemming | Jun 14 2023 18:32 utc | 131

Posted by: sean the leprechaun | Jun 14 2023 17:52 utc | 116
source, please? I’m not seeing any report of that on the usual TG channels, nor the Ukie propaganda sites that would surely be jumping with joy.

Posted by: Ghost of Zanon | Jun 14 2023 18:32 utc | 132

As a retired billionaire living on a luxury yacht I would like to recommend offshore banking as the best way to avoid paying tax. Most offshore banks don’t care if you are American, Russian or Ukrainian as long as you’ve got money.
https://statrys.com/blog/offshore-accounts-countries

Posted by: dh | Jun 14 2023 18:33 utc | 133

I’ll repeat my conviction that this is a PR industry ‘show-run’ escapade.
These are the people at the top of the pyramid.
Have been since the 90’s.
It is wholly professional.

Posted by: DunGroanin | Jun 14 2023 18:33 utc | 134

Posted by: dh | Jun 14 2023 18:33 utc | 132
You’re certainly correct that most banks (especially “off-shore”) don’t GAF what your nationality is if you have enough money. But your comment made me think that I’d probably be more worried about security than banking (again, given if you’re a billionaire and not directly sanctioned, you’re fine). Do you have a security detail to take care of potential pirates or do you just avoid any areas where they might be operating? I saw the movie “Triangle of Sadness” not too long ago and there was a sequence involving exactly that, except these guys had shoulder mounted SAMs, LOL.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Jun 14 2023 18:38 utc | 135

The west-bots bark.
The meatgrinder caravan keeps on.

Posted by: Richard Whitney | Jun 14 2023 18:42 utc | 136

Last week BBC, announced that a Russian chopper pilote had defected,
to Lithuania, but not from the SMO, but from the military air force. He was against, the SMO, and claimed he wasn’t alone.
But what became about it, we waited
for the whole pony and dogshow, but
not a word since then in public media.
He appears as Wagner-man in Norway, going to Sweden for to buy cheap cig’s but was apprehended on the road and sent back to Norway, it was bad PR, but maybe MoA knows more about the chopper man?

Posted by: Reader | Jun 14 2023 18:45 utc | 137

Re: De-dollarization
Federal Reserve (Banking Cartel) Board agrees at last meeting to run printing presses for just-a-little-bit

Posted by: Exile | Jun 14 2023 18:46 utc | 138

Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 14 2023 17:35 utc | 107

.. Lots of very serious questions needing answers that will likely never come, although we do have some testimony as you revealed, plus Ukie/NATO army performance. ..

Their land (who/where since 2001 CIA-Striking twin-Towers by a fake strike and more, ever heard of the 3rd one..?), their lives, …
Good, I think we’re at t left in conrete-graves – never reported ? The point where we can “bottom line” this approach or behaviour beside the “USA-made Rules” …
BE CAREFUL – Mr. Pres Of USA – who ever You are or will be !!
the majority of those living on Your land see you as Invaders on to foreign states !
, you were seemed to them part of an “INVASION” – kept that ? Mr. low-level intelligent Blinken ?
. If on the other hand they see you as being a Anti-Liberator (Blake’s 7 anyone more?), you were not to go them as a part part of an invasion ..
Amy go HOME !
I do not like Your current MIL-OPs over Germany, hindering my flights to China, or elsewhere starting from Frankfurt, Hamburg/Berlin/Stuttgart/Duesseldorf, or elsewehere ..
Think about “GERMAN RAMSTEIN BASIS”, You would loose that within 4 minutes, if You starting against RU – … – … BE SURE ..!
!
Posted by: Babel-17 | Jun 14 2023 18:04 utc

Posted by: spare_truth | Jun 14 2023 18:47 utc | 139

RE: oicu812 | Jun 14 2023 17:34 utc
Hope that is sarcasm or facetiousness, but if that is not what American cockatoos who watch the news and believe everything actually believe, why are they watching it? Or are they mindless cockatoos who cockatoo whatever they hear on the tell-lie-vision, the device used to “tell a lie to your vision.”

Posted by: William Haught | Jun 14 2023 18:49 utc | 140

Tom_Q_Collins | Jun 14 2023 18:38 utc | 134
Thanks for your concern. One thing I have learned is there is no such thing as absolute security in life. I don’t even trust my own family or my bodyguards. But I try not to let paranoia spoil my retirememt.

Posted by: dh | Jun 14 2023 18:50 utc | 141

A good article in the New Zealand editor in trouble for enriching Reuters despatches with gobs of truth
It’s by the former diplomat and honest Aussie, Tony Kevin
https://consortiumnews.com/2023/06/13/suspended-for-providing-balanced-news-on-ukraine/
“…Okinawa, which is part of Japan….” Babel-17@109
No it isn’t. And its people don’t want it to be either.

Posted by: bevin | Jun 14 2023 18:52 utc | 142

Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 14 2023 17:35 utc | 107
The training and equipment given to Ukraine before the SMO was extensive. It resulted in a large, formidable and well motivated army. It was the only large army of any significance at NATO’s disposal in Europe and it was a good one in comparison to the rest.
But it was given training and equipment suitable only for small unit fighting and urban fighting. As far as can be ascertained it was never trained and equipped for combined arms war. The Ukrainian General Staff was never schooled in or prepared for that type of warfare. Setting aside the question of whether we in the West are ourselves prepared for that type of large scale combined arms war, there’d have been no point in training up the Ukrainian General Staff for that. They didn’t have the kit for it anyway.
They didn’t need it. Before the SMO it was recognised on all hands that conflict between Ukraine and Russia could only go one way. General Milley was confidently expecting the Russians to be in Kiev within three days.
The Ukrainian army as we had trained it up had two functions.
The first was to break into the Donbass. It would have had little difficulty doing that had it been faced only with the smaller LDNR forces and it would have been a catastrophe for the Donbass had they done so. But as soon as Russia had recognised the Republics on 21st February the fate of the Ukrainian army was sealed.
As we are seeing now. Russia wrong-footed our plans by not taking Kiev immediately but by trying first for peace and then focusing on attrition. Nevertheless the arming and training of the Ukrainians we had carried out achieved its purpose. The Ukrainians were able to mount a credible threat to the Donbass that the LDNR forces could not have coped with and thus force a Russian military response.
That Russian military response allowed the West to proceed to the strategy that was really intended to defeat Russia. The impositions of sanctions. Without the claim that this was an unprovoked Russian invasion the European and American electorates would not have supported the sanctions as they did. And maybe also – I’d not like to push this point too far – there’s a certain dislike of Russia in Europe that made it easier to advance that claim. Maybe we were ready to “have a go” at the Russians – plenty in the UK are, for certain – and we are not in any case too bothered about the pretext for doing so.
So that first function we had trained up the Ukrainian army for was a function it performed successfully. It was there to provoke the Russians to military action and thus enable the sanctions war that was to break Russia.
The sanctions war failing, and the military war always unwinnable, our leaders are now at something of a loss. All they can now do is segue into Cold War II.
But what of the second function?
Had the Russians done what General Milley and others expected and taken Kiev in three days, they would have achieved “Victory” well enough – but would then have been faced with an insoluble problem. Hundreds of thousands of men, many of them fanatically determined, armed with just the sort of weapons useful in large scale insurrection. Ukraine would have become, in the terms I saw used so often at the time, “Russia’s Afghanistan”. I disagree with Ritter’s early judgment that Ukraine was not terrain suitable for that type of fighting. The cities and settlements will do to harbour groups of fanatically determined men as well as the mountains.
And that is what we are still hoping for in remnant Ukraine. That there will be an area of the old Ukraine that will either have to be occupied by the Russians, with sporadic outbursts of guerrilla activity that will be difficult to suppress, or that will not be occupied by the Russians and will perform the same function as Ukraine did before the war. A spearhead of NATO aggression indefinitely.
If we continue to hope for that then we are forcing the Russians to occupy right up to the NATO border. As things are that is surely what is likely to happen. But I doubt there will be as much guerrilla activity as we are hoping for. The determined fanatics will either be dead or will have fled to Europe.
And those fanatics, and we who have backed them to such a degree, will have turned what could have been one of the finest countries in Europe into a depopulated and deindustrialised rump state. And it will have led to the death of so many ordinary Ukrainians, Ukrainians who are not all by any means vicious and fanatical but who will be, as indeed we in Europe will be to a lesser extent, victims of a Western strategy fully as evil as those strategies we in the West have pursued in Syria and so many other countries.
Does that address the question of why we failed to train and equip the Ukrainian Army for combined arms war? We never expected or hoped they’d have to fight one.

Posted by: English Outsider | Jun 14 2023 18:54 utc | 143

Posted by: dh | Jun 14 2023 18:50 utc | 140
At least you have bodyguards. But yeah, keep a weapon or two hidden where only you know how to find them in a pinch. And like Joseph Heller said – ‘Just because you’re paranoid doesn’t mean they aren’t after you.’

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Jun 14 2023 18:56 utc | 144

Posted by: bevin | Jun 14 2023 18:52 utc | 141
I had seen the original Graun article yesterday and immediately began excerpting it in a chat with a few friends in which I said nearly verbatim what the author at Consortium News wrote this morning. I found the Graun’s explanation/justification/rationalization here pretty friggin’ weak sauce.
The Guardian, in its effort to “correct” the story, says: “Ukraine says these claims are discredited Kremlin propaganda …
LOL “Ukraine says”? WTF so they’re somehow totally incapable or unwilling to engage in lies and propaganda of their own? But more interestingly, the Graun didn’t even try to refute the claims directly.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Jun 14 2023 19:00 utc | 145

Posted by: bevin | Jun 14 2023 18:52 utc | 141
I see that Japan’s takeover of it was hurtful, but afaik the governments of the world stipulate it to be part of Japan. I’m willing to look at a link that shows otherwise. I’d be happy to see it get an independent status, but in reality the United States has an interest in maintaining the status quo.
Wait, maybe I’m not interpreting “prefecture” correctly? Assuming it’s an important distinction, afaik that doesn’t give it independence from Japan, again afaik.
https://www.britannica.com/place/Okinawa-prefecture-Japan
“In 1972 the United States returned Okinawa Island to Japan, although the extensive U.S. military installations there remained operative. Area prefecture, 877 square miles (2,271 square km). Pop. (2010) 1,392,818.”

Posted by: Babel-17 | Jun 14 2023 19:03 utc | 146

@ Babel-17 | Jun 14 2023 18:04 utc
Sorry, I’ve not that all posted in Your sense by Your address.
But I suppose that would have been matched some of Your’s “feelings today” ..
Excuse so far ..
A war – once declared by either side – is a “war”.
So nobody should complain about any “personal losses”.
The RU-population – citizens that have remainig in Donbass – seem to be understood and has evaluated that “fact of a war” – converning their own ‘lives’ before their own ownimgs ..
So that’s it, before Mr. Cock-Player gets his new FERRARI device – Really – no liar by EU v.d.Liar’s schoenem Gesaess!

Posted by: spare_truth | Jun 14 2023 19:03 utc | 147

something needs to be done to clip the wings of the UK.
It has always been a dangerous and treacherous country, but it’s day has gone and it really needs to learn to chill and not try to burn the planet down now that it is a two bit player.

Posted by: cafe con leche | Jun 14 2023 19:04 utc | 148

The colleagues fom German-Foreign-Policy Blog today about the infight of NATO re: troops on the ground:
https://www.german-foreign-policy.com/news/detail/9266
I assume Poland / Baltics are abusing the threat as bargaining chip for various things.
The problem is that Moscow will most likley not accept any serious NATO-membership commitment agreement regarding Ukraine.
Unless it says something like year 2080.
My guess.
That however hightens serious dangers here.
On the other hand, peace in Ukraine now makes war over Taiwan, much more likely.
Fucking Catch 22.

Posted by: AG | Jun 14 2023 19:17 utc | 149

Tom_Q_Collins | Jun 14 2023 18:56 utc | 143
It’s hard to find reliable bodyguards th4se days. The last lot I had couldn’t stay out of the drinks cupboard. I got some now who say they used to work for Zelensky so I’m hoping for the best.

Posted by: dh | Jun 14 2023 19:21 utc | 150

As a flag-waiving, loud and proud, morbidly obese, diabetic, three-quart pound triple cheeseburger eating, blind American with no health insurance and gangrene in both feet I want to say that arming Ukraine is the single best use of tax payer money for decades. My only criticism is that the west aren’t sending enough, fast enough. Ukraine is paying for political posturing with the lives of their sons and daughters. Do more now!!! #DiabeticAmericansWithoutHealthInsurance4Ukraine

Posted by: William Haught | Jun 14 2023 19:21 utc | 151

The big question is the formal ending of WW2. This has to happen at some point. It is almost 80 years since that war and those temporary arrangements make no sense anymore.
That really means the ending of US/UK occupation of Germany/Italy and US occupation of Japan.
WHy now?
Because a declining US can no longer lay claim to occupying these two forever.

Posted by: cafe con leche | Jun 14 2023 19:28 utc | 152

..Sorry, but pls have left all of the previous commentators hopes that claim a with-stand within 2 month against the the so-called UAF Offensive, be sure, RuAF won’t have a chance anymore if not restored its defensive lines properly.
If RF’s supply roads behind in back-land are destroyed resp. mined by AFU by the same tactics prior applied by RF against them, the UAF-NAZI & ASOW battalions, (placing new mines on the back-way),
even RF has no further chance to defeat the Cock-Player leaded NAZI forces.
That’s to state for a “while”, let’s saay 4 weeks.

Posted by: spare_truth | Jun 14 2023 19:28 utc | 153

Posted by: Reader | Jun 14 2023 18:45 utc | 136
If it was on BBC, it must be true.
To be honest, probably 90% of the time these stories work in the way that they find some RU neoliberal who left RU to a Euronatostan country. Then they make up a story and offer a carrot if he plays a/the role.

Posted by: unimperator | Jun 14 2023 19:28 utc | 154

@ dh | Jun 14 2023 19:21 utc | 149
You can always swap them for mine. They have some strange numbers tattoos, A3OB. Never asked what it means, I’m sure they are ok.

Posted by: whirlX | Jun 14 2023 19:30 utc | 155

@whirlX #153
I think A3OB is “Azov” (“B” is “V” in Russian)

Posted by: zeke2u | Jun 14 2023 19:40 utc | 156

Posted by: William Haught | Jun 14 2023 19:21 utc | 150
Good one! I’ll try to add a bit of a variant:
As a bankrupt, hamster wheel-riding servant of corporate scum, living in a typical American city with rotting infrastructure, street crime, living in constant fear of mass shootings, with living standards declining to those of third-world banana nations, I want to say that arming Ukraine in order to commit a mass genocide of Slavic people is the best use of taxpayer money ever.
My only complaint is that they’re not depopulating and defoliating other places I can’t find on a map without Google fast enough. I need more death and destruction in foreign lands to distract from my own miserable life.
#MiseryLovesCompany

Posted by: Ghost of Zanon | Jun 14 2023 19:42 utc | 157

… Just:
Russian Army isn’t the same League.
A General, even a general Staff can make mistakes.
The Russian Army “not”.
It’s a living organism, well rooted in history and training hard.
A mistake is just an opportunity to built back better.
Posted by: La Bastille | Jun 14 2023 16:37 utc | 81

You don’t really believe that stuff, do you?
Consider the failure of Kakhova Dam, I’m happy to stand corrected but it looks for all the world like MoD strategists were suckered by Ukraine’s western handlers into filling the dam right to the top in order to make its subsequent failure all the more damaging and costly to RF. A simply astounding and unforgivable error of judgement.
At what point are you making excuses for intellectual defectives and sorry-assed pigeons who’s innate unsuitability to face Russia’s adversaries is laid pitifully bare? If MoD strategists were manipulated in this way there is no cure for that level of stupidity, there’s no “build back better”, and the situation is currently such that the Russian protagonists in this disaster are unlikely even to suffer a horizontal transfer!
What next, will the same dismal fools be hustled into another mega-flood. or perhaps something with a chemical or radiological dimension. Is that still “build back better” or is there a threshold where the astronomical costs and losing the conflict are the same thing?
The stakes are already too high to tolerate the MoD’s fungal careerist and the whole constellation of censorious bullshitters that trail in their wake.
But, hey, have it your own way, “build back better”.

Posted by: anon2020 | Jun 14 2023 19:52 utc | 158

@ dh | Jun 14 2023 19:21 utc | 149
lol.. so they’re working for the 2nd comedian now… you’re a funny guy dh..

Posted by: james | Jun 14 2023 19:53 utc | 159

whirlX | Jun 14 2023 19:30 utc | 153
I’m sure they are fine. I also hear good reports of ex-convicts from El Salvador.

Posted by: dh | Jun 14 2023 19:54 utc | 160

james | Jun 14 2023 19:53 utc | 158
There isn’t a lot to do here on the yacht to be honest james. Thank goodness for MOA.

Posted by: dh | Jun 14 2023 19:56 utc | 161

As a Martian citizen I just want to say blah blah blah etc because it will make it easier to take over Earth and make you humans into egg cases for us. Oh — and DEMOCRACY!!!!

Posted by: HELMHOLTZ SMITH | Jun 14 2023 20:01 utc | 162

@ zeke2u | Jun 14 2023 19:40 utc | 155
Heh. I know, was just reacting to dh’s Zelensky bodyguards meme.
I am imagining Zaluzny (if alive) and likes seeking jobs after the war, walking from yacht to yacht along in Monaco’s Port Hercule.

Posted by: whirlX | Jun 14 2023 20:04 utc | 163

Defining an invasion…
For now it is a debate between the two sides. If Russia successfully annexes the territory, in the future it will be a liberation. Otherwise an invasion.
My take is that eastern Ukraine should be part of Russia. The western part harder to say. But then that is just my opinion.

Posted by: Jmaas | Jun 14 2023 20:07 utc | 164

Sorry, for giving an advive here just today, actually for some of the RF-MIL commanders working in order of following Mr. Shoigu’s ‘estimations’ to go on “defensively” (what have made sense til today)..
If someone would command “me” (as a Soldier/Officer) to attack just today/this night) for the “first time” to destroy a military suspenseful AFU-targets, I would refer to my brain, as far as available, but I won’t follow those comands of my commander. Why :
I would follow him (as a soldier) without any questions – and acc.to his special commands – if I could nearly understand that of the currently ongoing “operation” to be tasked!
So I have my trust for the RF-Guy I can speak in RU language to him – my RF-commander. Otherwise, when newly having a new commander from Belgium or from Poland, etc., I could not follow all of that foreign commands immediately.
Stand that ?

Posted by: spare_truth | Jun 14 2023 20:07 utc | 165

Interesting that all the examples are written in English. Also Interesting that the link to more examples doesn’t actually show any of those examples.
Haven’t read all the comments, so apologies if this has already been pointed out.

Posted by: David F | Jun 14 2023 20:09 utc | 166

@ Babel-17 | Jun 14 2023 17:12 utc | 95
Any country can warn any other country against doing what the first country is about to do themselves.
And that wasn’t a Ukrainian fleet and “anti-mine exercise” swirling around there for weeks.

Posted by: John Kennard | Jun 14 2023 20:11 utc | 167

Such blatant Astroturfing always reminds me of the sketch from the satirical 80’s programme, ‘Not the Nine O’clock news’, dealing with the license fee.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ukun8nc5Y8U

Posted by: Milites | Jun 14 2023 20:11 utc | 168

Posted by: anon2020 | Jun 14 2023 19:52 utc | 157
I replied to your query in respect to RF “control.” See the dam thread post 438.

Posted by: Sushi | Jun 14 2023 20:12 utc | 169

@ Milites | Jun 14 2023 20:11 utc | 167
Yup. Barry Took is an undercover BoJo. Or the other way around.

Posted by: whirlX | Jun 14 2023 20:15 utc | 170

‘Yet, NATO was very confident and had the Ukies ready to open their own offensive @ March 1 2022, which events proved the Ukies to not be ready at all.”
Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 14 2023 17:35 utc | 107
You see all kinds of absurd pronouncements on this website, but that is peak silliness.
NATO and everyone in the West expected Russia to run roughshod over Ukraine.
Here’s a typical assessment from February 2022, by Martin van Creveld.
“* The Russians will not find it too difficult to “overrun” (whatever that may mean) most of a country as large and as sparsely populated as Ukraine. However, taking the most important cities—Kiev, Kharkov, and Odessa—will be a different matter and will surely only be accomplished by heavy and very destructive fighting. Followed, most probably by guerrilla and terrorism. The way, say, things happened in Iraq.”
https://www.martin-van-creveld.com/2022/02/
“From 2015 to 2022–almost 7 full years–were available to prep the Ukie military, most of which now appears to have been wasted–an opportunity cost that cannot be redeemed.”
The conclusion is obvious: NATO was not, in fact, preparing Ukraine to fight a war with Russia during that time.

Posted by: zinjanthropus | Jun 14 2023 20:24 utc | 171

English Outsider | Jun 14 2023 18:54 utc | 142–
Thanks for your very well considered reply. If what you describe was NATO’s plan and expectations, then why the massive effort to deindustrialize Europe–particularly Germany–via the Sanctions from Hell regime? As soon as those were laid, Dr. Hudson and others saw that Germany and the overall EU were the main target, not Russia for Russia had proven very resilient to the great raft of sanctions laid in 2014/2015, the rebound from them being very well publicized with unimpeachable data that any decent intelligence agency would have seen correctly–unless it/they was/were told not to.
However, your point that the Ukies got no combined arms training is well noted along with the lack of proper equipment to prosecute such warfare–again the utter lack of mobile AD systems being the most noted. As I’ve written several times here and elsewhere, neither side had previously fought an industrial combined arms war–practiced in FTXs, yes, but even Syria wasn’t that sort of operation. Yes, Russia had mostly kept previous Soviet doctrines and had practiced them, while NATO was unfit for that purpose, meaning Ukraine was unfit too.
Then there’s the longstanding ideological conflict you mentioned; but that also begs an important question: How was NATO supposed to reduce Russia then take on China with the doctrine, small amount of manpower and weapon systems it had? Did it revise WW2 too much?! Did it not recall the vast difference made by Chinese troops in Korea? Was there no respect given for Russian AD systems given their performances in Vietnam and Serbia, and the fact that Ukie airspace was owned by Russia well prior to 2022?
IMO, our discussion leads to the conclusion that the Outlaw US Empire envisioned this conflict becoming yet another Forever War and has gamed it for that outcome.
I’ll be posting our interaction that began with Sushi’s commentary to my VK once you and others get the opportunity to reply.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 14 2023 20:24 utc | 172

something needs to be done to clip the wings of the UK.
It has always been a dangerous and treacherous country, but it’s day has gone and it really needs to learn to chill and not try to burn the planet down now that it is a two bit player.
Don’t worry, they have Boris and Blair
Both destined to burn in hell.
That should sort them out, I guess.

Posted by: G wiltek | Jun 14 2023 20:29 utc | 173

zinjanthropus | Jun 14 2023 20:24 utc | 170–
You are what’s known as a Ninny. I’ve followed this whole affair beginning with the Maidan Color Revolution that began in late 2013. In Russia’s December 2021 Security Proposals that are still unanswered, it was stated outright that such a response or something similar would be met by a “military technical operation,” which is exactly what was performed at the outset on 22 February. The move toward Kiev was clearly a feint, the aim being to mke it clear that Russia wasn’t at all bluffing. That feint almost produced the desired outcome within Ukraine, but the negotiations were killed by the Outlaw US Empire’s diktat.
Don’t try and rewrite history with me!

Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 14 2023 20:33 utc | 174

Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 14 2023 17:35 utc | 107
I want to mostly concur with English Outside @142 in response to your question, which is a good question. In addition to that, the US and the west isn’t really built to supply large quantities of the sort of material needed for the war Ukraine is fighting. Even though the Apache has been in production since 1975 there have only been 2,400 built total and only a little over 800 in service. I doubt that the US really has/had the ability to supply Ukraine in the quantity necessary if it was thought to be a war of tanks, planes, artillery and helicopters. Granted, that could have been the impetus to expand military industrial production but also a tenuous link that would likely have run into political/funding issues within the US.
Doctrinally the US generally thought that this type of war was over, mostly because it didn’t plan on fighting one. So I’m not sure that anyone at DoD or in DC was capable of thinking about this war going this way and how to build up Ukraine to fight it back in 2014 or earlier.
But as English Outsider laid out, I think the more poignant answer to your question is that the “plan” was very much to sucker Russia into a large scale, debilitating insurgency that combined with international isolation and sanctions would topple Putin. Early on several US “leader” types were talking about it publicly. Clinton actually said that “we’ll give Russia its Afghanistan” (this made me laugh because it shows how clueless she is for a “wonk” since we gave the USSR its Vietnam in Afghanistan and besides, Iraq would be a better comparison). It was a good plan with a strong chance of success. Except Russia didn’t do what the US expected it to do. Now the quagmire facet of the conflict has been reversed because supplying a conventional war is not what the US is well prepared for but that’s what it has to do.

Posted by: Lex | Jun 14 2023 20:33 utc | 175

Lex | Jun 14 2023 20:33 utc | 174–
Thanks Lex. Do see my further reply @171 and supply further comment.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 14 2023 20:36 utc | 176

If you look at the numbers of who watches what on youtube

It is hard, but don’t believe the hype. Those numbers are not real.

Posted by: Rae | Jun 14 2023 20:38 utc | 177

B looks like you are being astroturfed as well. As if this conflict was all about Putin and the Russians are losing….

Posted by: Carol Davidek Waller | Jun 14 2023 20:44 utc | 178

Posted by: Sushi | Jun 14 2023 20:12 utc | 168

We may “think” still today anything about of what ever has a ‘consequences’ of the dam has been desroyed by UAF.
That is a new signal given by NATO (NAh-Tod) given to RF and to escalate asap. against RF, surely that is and will be answered by RF- but by what?
Evil the US-man FM “Blinken” has announced just today the possibility of an ATOM-NUCLEAR-Strike vs. RUSSIA.
Chinese FM just has sent some strong words to his counter-part of USA-Minister of Foreign States.
What shall’s .. Nothing to wait how much increase “Rhein Netall! ia earning just today –?
Where are the pretty well engaged Snipers focused on v.d.Liars, Gates etc.?
I have sampled 300 EUR for that assasination project – seems not enough for the “while” have anyone more to offer..? I do not think so ..!
So thanks a lot on b and all MoAs commenters here .. All best ..

Posted by: spare_truth | Jun 14 2023 20:47 utc | 179

In addition to that, the US and the west isn’t really built to supply large quantities of the sort of material needed for the war Ukraine is fighting.
Posted by: Lex | Jun 14 2023 20:33 utc | 174
—————-
It is exactly that. The US, or the West that produces the armament, but private companies, who are only interested in profit. More such companies produce one type of a product, more they’d produce lesser quality product. Such ‘products’ get knocked off, and has to be replaced. The private companies in the ‘west’ will produce a bit more, but who is going to check the fighting quality of that weapon? The other side. And, that other side would knock them off again. So, how would the US, and the other ‘western’ countries going to prove, at least for themselves, their weapons are good, or better than the other side?
In Russia, the private companies would produce weapons, and for the country. Of course, there will be profit, and most importantly honour. No ‘western’ country can ever match that.
Interestingly, North Koreans are also producing quite a lot of weapons, which can knock of few cities, and maybe few military control points in the US. They produce for honour too!

Posted by: ostro | Jun 14 2023 20:49 utc | 180

Information war is a euphemism for lying. Advertising is the art of lying artfully. American culture has been conquered by advertising. 2 entire generations have been raised in a advertising saturated environment which has habituated them to accept the lie as normal.
The problem with the liar is that eventually the liar himself believes the lie and can no longer recognize reality.
America is a car being driven by remote control, where the remote driver is navigating by a false digital map. A wreak is inevitable and indeed is probably already happening.

Posted by: Dan Farrand | Jun 14 2023 20:50 utc | 181

The biggest “errors of judgement” among the Russians are an insistent failure to recognize the depths of depravity plumbed by their “partners”. In truth, it is no exaggeration whatsoever to liken the West to a rabid dog. There is no intellect there to appeal to. No moral structure, no compassion, no human decency at all in the West for the Russians to connect with. While the Russians yet insist upon viewing America with the plastic Disney-esque glow of mistaken cultural superiority, America truly has the mass, collective equivalent of a degenerative brain disease like rabies that leaves its society tormented by agonies it cannot identify as its cognitive abilities approach that of a cabbage.

Posted by: William Gruff | Jun 14 2023 20:50 utc | 182

I don’t want to give you advice because it’s obviously useless, but try to get a detailed map of the fighting in Ukraine on your office wall, where all the changes in the course of the fighting will be noted daily. Which it is advisable to submit to you personally after the daily report of the current Chief of the General Staff, General Gerasimov, or even Minister of Defense Shoigu. Maybe then you will not be disgraced to the whole world by ignorance of the situation at the front?
Posted by: shаdоwbаnnеd | Jun 14 2023 13:35 utc | 3
Yep. Great stuff. It’s been sticking in my craw for a year: that lack of progress.
I have told myself that
1. The REAL war is being fought in the financial and world economics, politics sphere and
2. The REAL onground war has changed its nature so much that a wise commander would not attack over the ground in the old style, not in a world of satellites, drones and smart munitions and
3. The Russian military machine was so riddled with ‘parquet generals’ and a mistaken formation structure (TBG’s) that a pause was needed for all those things to get sorted out: quite a long pause.
My faith is strong. Has been strong. But it begins to flag a little at the edges…
You’re questions, suggestions really do need addressing full on and right now I think…

Posted by: abrogard | Jun 14 2023 20:52 utc | 183

@ spare_truth | Jun 14 2023 20:47 utc | 178
I have sampled 300 EUR for that assasination project – seems not enough for the “while” have anyone more to offer..?
I am not sure that I understand what is it you want to point out, but miss von der Leyen has 35.689 Euros monthly wage.
Unless you are around that paygrade you can not hire the gunsling. She can.
And surely 300 Euros is not enough to rent a hooligan to punch her bike tyres.

Posted by: whirlX | Jun 14 2023 20:55 utc | 184

Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 14 2023 17:35 utc | 107
“I recall WW2’s “Phony War” period where the French and Benalux nations “
Glad you know something about Europe. Except you seem to know fuck all.

Posted by: Membrum Virile | Jun 14 2023 20:57 utc | 185

LOL “Ukraine says”? WTF so they’re somehow totally incapable or unwilling to engage in lies and propaganda of their own? But more interestingly, the Graun didn’t even try to refute the claims directly.
Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Jun 14 2023 19:00 utc | 144

Remember that piece of paper that Colin Powell held up in the prelude to the invasion of Iraq? The one that was plagiarized from someones dissertation? I seem to remember Powell thanking his British counterparts for providing the intelligence about Saddam’s dastardly weapons programme.
The upshot being it gave them “legitimacy” to act on it and when the truth came out they could now feign surprise as they were “acting in good faith”.
Liars all, that’s how they roll.

Posted by: SattaMassaGana | Jun 14 2023 20:57 utc | 186

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 14 2023 17:58 utc | 120
———
I just want this person to provide one hint of experiential standing or bona fides to give us some reason to accept any of his overwrought representations. Who is he, what does he really know and what experience does he have to make the unending charges and negative analysis vis-a-vis Putin, MoD etc. he does?
And, this place WILL be trolled given its increasing exposure – with “concern trolls” manning the front lines – but I just wish he’d be a bit more SUCCINT. He’s one of the guys who almost mandate you read this blog from the bottom up because the dude cannot help but bloviate beyond tolerance. Why say something in 30 words when you say it in 3,000?

Posted by: Drake Schroeder | Jun 14 2023 20:58 utc | 187

William Gruff (181)
Well written, I couldn’t agree more. I have been using the rabid dog analogy as well.
There is only one thing you can do with a rabid dog, same with those who rule the western world….

Posted by: JustAMaverick | Jun 14 2023 21:01 utc | 188

Wakey wakey now. That which has inspired the above screams of hopeless rage into the face of perceived bots is an ironic comment. Look at the word “posturing” for heaven’s sake! Ukraine is in the grip of a shallow malicious political posture. They are paying for this stupidity with the lives of their youth. The more money they get the more they will pay. The sponsors, conscious or otherwise, are evil. It is monstrous but it is what the the Ukrainian’s unfortunately deserve. They are a people who self harm.
Identify the sponsors. It is easy. Beware of both Ukrainians and them.
For example, this relates to Taiwanese people who unfortunately are presently displaying similar characteristics.
Beware!

Posted by: Anon | Jun 14 2023 21:02 utc | 189

All of south Ukraine including Odessa and Nikolaev are historically russian-founded cities, with pre-2014 majorly ethnic-russian, russian speaking population. All these regions voted for Yanukovich. It is just that they are farming and sea-trading dominanted, they have little urban and dense terrain that is beneficial for rebels and is found a plenty in Donbas, so rebellion wasn’t rised there. And the population is slightly smaller. (Before WW2, the cities were also majorly populated by jews, greeks and germans, together even more than russians. But there were no Ukrainians.) Actually learn about the subject before spewing wrong stuff that is cartoonishly based entirely on simple assumptions you also make on the rest of the world.
Posted by: A200 | Jun 14 2023 17:07 utc | 94

In fact, of the Novorossiya regions, the one most Banderized is Denpropetrovsk (in large part because the city was the major oligarch center ruling the country for a long time, and where a lot of the decisions to push nationalism forward as a way to separate from Moscow were made), but after that the most pro-Ukrainian was Kherson, for various weird reasons.
And we saw that Russia ruled Kherson without all that much trouble last year. There were a lot more car bombings and sabotage acts in Melitopol than in Kherson.
We also saw how local elites handed it over without a fight.
Odessa and Nikolaev can and must be returned, and presumably there are still plenty of local elites that will play ball. The problem early in the SMO was that in Nikolaev there are nationalist fanatics in charge, and the bloodless recovery of the territory did not work the way it did in Kherson. Had that happened, Odessa may have been Russian now.
It will be hard from here on — it has been thoroughly infested with NATO operatives.
P.S. The situation in Nikolaev is very curious — the governor there is Vitalii Kim, as rabid Russophobe and Ukrainian nationalist as you will find. It does not get more schizophrenic than that — a very common Banderite talking point is how Russians are mongoloid mongrels while Ukrainians are purebred Slavs (clearly they have never seen a non-retouched full-body picture of Bandera), but Vitalii Kim himself is half-Korean (a lot of Koreans from the Far East either moved themselves or were moved to Central Asia and the European parts of the USSR). By the idiotic Banderite logic, he is subhuman, and yet he is a nationalist fanatic. You can’t make this up…

Posted by: shаdоwbаnnеd | Jun 14 2023 21:03 utc | 190

Again with not a western tax payer in sight. Not even in the room.
Posted by: Derek Henry | Jun 14 2023 16:21 utc | 75
I think this is the point all over the Western world. It is in fact a demonstration of the total inadequacy and unsuitability of Democracy as a political system.
Yes, the people are ‘not even in the room’. And they don’t ask to be. They are not knocking on the doors.
They didn’t in Covid and they don’t now.
Democracy, representative democracy has a tremendous inherent flaw: it presupposes two things that are simply not true of perhaps all humanity but certainly of all Western citizens.
They are:
1. A desire to stay abreast of all current issues, get the information, digest it, talk about, form opinions.
2. The energy and desire to communicate these opinions as directions to the elected rep and to stay in touch with same, monitoring their activities and controlling as necessary.
Nothing remotely like that takes place in our vaunted western democracies. Nothing at all like it. We reluctantly elect, in fact, one or other party from a selection of two and then turn our backs, walk away and leave them to it like leaving the plumber to fix the faucet.
And THAT is our preferred modus operandi. THAT is how human beings, western human beings at least, prefer to live. INSIST on living.

Posted by: abrogard | Jun 14 2023 21:11 utc | 191

I was quite young when he visited the US. I vaguely remember him being upset that he couldn’t visit Disneyland. That should have been a warning right there. Disney was definitely a fascist-lover, anti-union reactionary. He knew how to exploit: he paid his animators pennies and wouldn’t allow them to organize. He was a fraud: even his trademark “signature” wasn’t his but a product of one of his animators. IIRC, he was also an FBI informant for both Hoover and McCarthy. Anyway, I’m not sure if any of that is relevant to his “disastrous” decisions. His decision to promote over 60 lies about Stalin at the 20th Party Congress surely had very little to do with any memes he encountered in the US. Like I mentioned earlier, I think the whole “meme” idea is more about cultural issues.
Posted by: zeke2u | Jun 14 2023 17:26 utc | 100

The problem is that starting somewhere in the 1960s a cargo cult towards everything Western developed. With zero rational thought given to the actual characteristics of items, it was always assumed that everything Western is dramatically superior. Consumer items, technology, cultural exports, etc.
That is what I mean by winning the meme war.
You can still see the effects to these day — there was that video the other day with Russian soldiers approaching an abandoned Leopard tank and say something in the spirit of “see, we defeated it, there is nothing to fear here”. Of course, there was never anything to fear — Russian tanks were and are better (which is only logical — nobody has more experience fighting tank was and nobody has had to think about tanks longer and more seriously than Russians), and are proving themselves to be better now in real life, but the mentality is hard to shake off.
The ability to instill that inferiority complex in its enemies is the West’s greatest weapon.
The solution was to wall off the USSR, developed independently, and not allow the corrosive influence to permeate. That is exactly what North Korea did, and North Korea survived, although of course it has to be admitted that it is much easier for East Asians to deal with total separation from the West because they have never been part of it, while Russia is European in nature, so the influence has much easier time getting through.
The exact opposite decision — to follow and copy the West — was made by Khrushchev and Brezhnev, with fateful consequences.

Posted by: shаdоwbаnnеd | Jun 14 2023 21:12 utc | 192

Posted by: karlof1 | Jun 14 2023 20:33 utc | 173
“ The move toward Kiev was clearly a feint, the aim being to mke it clear that Russia wasn’t at all bluffing.”
Clearly. And the master strategist was so serious about it, that he felt the need to sacrifice hundreds of his most highly trained troops in it. Because his thinking is as clear as your writing.

Posted by: Membrum Virile | Jun 14 2023 21:16 utc | 193

Military summary today. Apparently all UKR attacks in the line from Kamyanske to Novodonetske were repulsed. Bakhmut is the most potent area where AFU could achieve some success (apparently) but not so far.
There were also pictures from Nikopol, opposite shore of Energodar. The river is quite shallow there. Zelensky has long requested an assault through that strait, and they are conspiring something with IAEA / Rossi. Whatever it is, it probably needs to happen soon as there is a certain window of opportunity.
Obviously the strait / river is 6km wide and they will be in plain sight and just a turkey shoot for arty / aircraft, but on the other hand they only need one successful crossing to claim something. Not sure how viable this whole thing is, but it is valuable from PR / political standpoint. They are probably planning terror actions on ZNPP.

Posted by: unimperator | Jun 14 2023 21:17 utc | 194

William Gruff | Jun 14 2023 20:50 utc | 181
…. In truth, it is no exaggeration whatsoever to liken the West to a rabid dog. ”
It is so. Brings to mind 2 thoughts…
1. In a word…”psychopath” literally means “diseased spirit”
2. I vividly recall a very bright Chinese who, upon being annoyed, uttered something in Chinese. I begged translation and she answered “raised by dogs”. I immediatey recognized our decidedly weak english equivalent “son of a bitch”.

Posted by: chu teh | Jun 14 2023 21:19 utc | 195

@shadowbanned
“It will be hard from here on — it has been thoroughly infested with NATO operatives.”
Yes, but they will be the first rats to scurry away to safety when the Wagnerians come a-knockin’ on their door.
Thanks for the informative comment.

Posted by: Ghost of Zanon | Jun 14 2023 21:20 utc | 196

Posted by: Membrum Virile | Jun 14 2023 21:16 utc | 192
source please

Posted by: pretzelattack | Jun 14 2023 21:21 utc | 197

New rule, all critics should report to the front ASAP. Be the change you want to see in the world…
If one is not putting their body on the line, I could care less about their perspective in print. Talk is cheap, and getting cheaper every day in the age of bots and AI.
Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jun 14 2023 17:58 utc | 120

This is the person who wrote that:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viktor_Alksnis
He is 73, so kind of past the age for putting one’s body on the line. That doesn’t make what he has to say false in any way.
P.S. Some more:
https://vk.com/wall701885602_77545

Russia and Ukraine wanted to negotiate a 15-year Russian lease of Crimea during peace talks in Istanbul in March 2022. This was stated today by the President of Belarus Lukashenko in an interview to the Rossiya-1 TV channel.
But Crimea has been a subject of the Russian Federation since 2014, right? And such negotiations in March 2022 fall under the article of the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation ” Treason”.
Putin’s press secretary Peskov immediately denied Lukashenka’s statement.
But in my opinion, there is no smoke without fire, and Lukashenka is unlikely to have invented this.

It seems like everyone wants to sweep this under the rug and not pay too much attention to it, but why would Lukashenko lie about it? Seems to be true. And if it is true, it is an absolute bombshell. Putin is indeed a traitor, or the very least, he was back in March 2022. Things might have changed since then (w can only hope so).

Posted by: shаdоwbаnned | Jun 14 2023 21:23 utc | 198

Posted by: Membrum Virile | Jun 14 2023 21:16 utc | 192
Sorry, Ukraine has been Hollywood BS as long as mind carries. Propaganda is done by everyone, but it is done beyond Goebbels level by Natostan/Ukraine. They even claimed to shoot down the transport aircraft with para’s which never happened. Not to mention ghost of Kiev with 50 fighter kills. All this stuff is still in there, AFU MOD statistics if someone ever wonders where they came from.

Posted by: unimperator | Jun 14 2023 21:24 utc | 199

Posted by: Ghost of Zanon | Jun 14 2023 16:55 utc | 90

.. The problem with that is what happens when Russia controls the farmland, gas, and all Ukrainian industry is destroyed? You cannot extract rent from an asset you don’t own. Or one that does not exist. ..

Sorry Master Ghost Z.,
Your assumption hinks a little on Your “left leg”, because:
The UKR Industry is still today on-going very well producing (never checked about that fact?).
So, what You meant, when RF will have occupied total UKR land structures, You pls. have to notice that “ALL that agriculture land” will be wasted by mines, that You have to remove bevore giving a new harvest actions after 4 years of cleaning (pls. refer to Laos, the USA mines of Vietnam-War are still there hidden in the earth gronds of local farmers.
That’s story about “hidden mines”, You hopefully never will touch by foot within the next 40 months a such of “US-made deadly children-killing devices” , next years!

Posted by: spare_truth | Jun 14 2023 21:26 utc | 200