Regime Change Watch
Tomorrow there will be elections in Turkey and Thailand. In both countries the U.S. would like to see the current opposition win.
Recent pieces in the New York Times leave no doubt about that.
A Crucial Question in Thailand’s Election: Can You Criticize the King?
Liberal voters have intensified their scrutiny of the Thai monarchy in recent years. Conservatives have responded with a campaign to defend the institution at all costs.
An Erdogan Loss in Turkey Would Stir Relief in the West and Anxiety in Moscow
European leaders would be delighted to have “an easier Turkey,” while Russia could lose an important economic and diplomatic partnership should the Turkish leader lose power in Sunday’s elections.
Polls in both countries seem to be between all over the place and tight but my hunch is that the incumbents have a good chance to win.
If the results are to the favor of the current governments the U.S. may well use its well honed color revolution schemes to change the outcomes.
It has done so before, not only in Turkey and Thailand, but also in many other countries.
For a long time, the US Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) has plotted "peaceful evolution" and "color revolutions" as well as spying activities around the world. Although details about these operations have always been murky, a new report released by China's National Computer Virus Emergency Response Center and Chinese cybersecurity company 360 on Thursday unveiled the main technical means the CIA has used to scheme and promote unrest around the world.
...
For decades, the CIA has overthrown or attempted to overthrow at least 50 legitimate governments abroad (the CIA has only recognized seven of these instances), causing turmoil in related countries. Whether it is the "color revolution" in Ukraine in 2014, the "sunflower revolution" in Taiwan island, China, or the "saffron revolution" in Myanmar in 2007, the "green revolution" in Iran in 2009, and other attempted "color revolutions" -- the US intelligence agencies are behind them all, according to the report.The US' leading position in technologies of telecommunication and on-site command has provided unprecedented possibilities for the US intelligence community to launch "color revolutions" abroad. The report released by the National Computer Virus Emergency Response Center and 360 disclosed five methods commonly used by the CIA.
...
We therefore need to keep an eye open for new regime change attempts.
Posted by b on May 13, 2023 at 16:31 UTC | Permalink
next page »Recep Tayip Erdogan has certainly mastered the art and science of political Durabity. He appears to have an unlimited supply of new-ish rabbits to pull out of his hat in an emergency. It's interesting that nobody is taking bets that he'll be toppled on Sunday.
Imo, the secret of his success is his willingness to talk to anyone to resolve a problem - unlike the dumbass Yankees who delight in blacklisting/ignoring the people they should be talking to.
Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | May 13 2023 17:03 utc | 3
Erdogan in the early part of his rule was part of a Western-sponsored "moderate Muslim" project. Later he was also useful in attempts to overthrow Assad in Syria. But his relations with the West started to deteriorate c.2011, and he blamed Western NGOs for widespread protests in 2013 that were eventually suppressed with some loss of life. A certain Osman Kavala is still in jail after being accused of coordinating NGOs behind the protests.
Erdogan also blames the USA for the strange failed coup of July 2016. However, Turkey has not left NATO. I would say Erdogan is not trusted by either side but the West wants Turkey fully under its control and that is not possible with Erdogan at the helm.
Posted by: Waldorf | May 13 2023 17:09 utc | 4
3 - One possible result is Erdogan is re-elected president but his party the AKP loses power. The AKP is a good deal less popular than Erdogan himself. Such a result would cause a good deal of instability.
Posted by: Waldorf | May 13 2023 17:13 utc | 5
the West wants Turkey fully under its control and that is not possible with Erdogan at the helm
Posted by: Waldorf | May 13 2023 17:09 utc | 4
That is true, however there is a newer post at The Cradle https://thecradle.co/article-view/24730/turkiyes-not-so-westward-facing-opposition that suggests the main opposition also might not entirely be to the West’s liking.
If the US does decide to stir things up I wonder if there’ll be spillover effects into those Western European countries with large Turkish heritage populations, thinking particularly of Germany?
Posted by: West of England Andy | May 13 2023 17:19 utc | 6
The US heightens the tempo at election time, but the compulsion to have puppets heading every government that counts is permanent.
Lula has just won an election but the next coup plot has already started
https://fair.org/home/nyt-signals-lulas-post-bolsonaro-honeymoon-is-over/
Maybe this has something to do with it
https://www.telesurenglish.net/news/Brazil-Amazon-Rainforest-Deforestation-Fell-67.9-In-April-20230512-0028.html?utm_source=planisys&utm_medium=NewsletterIngles&utm_campaign=NewsletterIngles&utm_content=8
Posted by: bevin | May 13 2023 17:26 utc | 7
I wouldn’t worry about Thailand. The status quo coalition parties can lose badly and still form a government with the votes of the Senate, all 250 members of which are appointed by the military.
But let’s pretend that the two frontrunner parties pull off a miracle. This wouldn’t last long because the Electoral Commission is about to ban one of them, the apparently reformist Move Forward Party, on bogus charges anyway. And Move Forward is the only party that might harbor pro-American sympathies. The other of the two parties, and the numerically strongest of all Thai parties, is Pheu Thai, the latest incarnation of the corrupt but populist Shinawatra clan, which values its business ties with China just as much as the military kleptocracy that effectively runs the country (and has done so, with brief interruptions, since 1932).
And anyway, a Pheu Thai-Move Forward coalition, in the impossible event that such came to pass, would soon fall to a military coup.
Never forget, if you knew it in the first place, that the Thai ruling class consists almost entirely of clans who are partly or filly ethnically Chinese. (Not for nothing did King Vajiravudh write a book describing diaspora Chinese as the Jews of Southeast Asia). Whatever animosity toward China that existed during the Mao era and the heyday of Thai anticommunism is pretty much gone: Thailand still hosts American military, but buys (unneeded) submarines from China.
Posted by: malenkov | May 13 2023 17:26 utc | 8
"The incumbents stand a good chance of winning."
"We must keep an eye out for new regime change attempts"
So happy OP is on the job sighting elections for prospects that nothing will change.
Maybe just skip elections altogether in the interest of continuity. The guys in charge know what they're doing and have already gamed everything. Democracy and war are spectator sports.
It's well understood the US makes the world in the image of its owners, and wrecks democracy at every turn, but at least the interests of the people have to be contended with if only at some base level.
Don't under-estimate the power of choice: In USA we get a gorgeous spread of two doddering geriatrics, alzheimer's patient who bangs on the table demanding more fruit cup and a pussy grabber! This is a real choice with actual effect on the progress of the world.
You can choose to stand up for even more involvement if you want.
Alzheimers or pussy?
The people will speak!
Posted by: Arrnon | May 13 2023 17:26 utc | 9
The whole world must stand on guard against the fascist imperialism of 'the west'.
Posted by: Figleaf23 | May 13 2023 17:40 utc | 10
6 - The USA in particular is not popular in Turkey, and in public statements Kilicdaroglu and those like him have to take account of this. But there is a long tradition in Turkey of behind-the-scenes servility to foreign interests being disguised behind all sorts of chauvinist BS. For example, Turkey sent a brigade to take part in the Korean War on the UN side in 1950. A cartoon in the most important Turkish newspaper depicted Uncle Sam as entreating a Turkish soldier for help and the soldier peering down from Fortress Turkey and accepting the entreaty. In reality Turkey was continuing to slip into the US orbit (it started doing so in 1945, largely out of fear of the USSR). But it was presented like important Turkey was generously doing the USA a favour.
Posted by: Waldorf | May 13 2023 17:42 utc | 11
Visiting Thailand next month so it will be interesting. I don't believe in big changes there.
Posted by: Norwegian | May 13 2023 17:47 utc | 12
thanks b... yes, indeed.. it bears watching... will know more in a few days..
Posted by: james | May 13 2023 17:59 utc | 13
I think the CIA outsourced most of the color revolution ploys to the NED, and other NGOs like Open Society.
Brian Berletic is a good source on Thailand and the election there.
Posted by: wagelaborer | May 13 2023 18:00 utc | 14
Brian Berlectic, who does the The New Atlas YouTube channel, lives in Thailand and has done quite a few excellent videos on how the US continues to work to install a government hostile to China.
See US-funded Fronts Hijacking Upcoming Thai Elections and Thailand: How the US Supports Penguin & the Student Mobs
Posted by: Perimetr | May 13 2023 18:22 utc | 15
Here is a short video about the 2016 American coup attempt in Turkey.
https://youtu.be/eo0dblx9JfE?t=22
And one about American coups in Thailand.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERRiRIClSns
Posted by: Carlton Meyer | May 13 2023 18:26 utc | 16
The real question for the Turkish electorate is are they going to remain primarily in the US/EU sphere of influence or are they going to transition to the Eurasian Union and it's influence?
It should be apparent to them that their current mode of operation as the major middle east fence sitter, playing west against the east and visa versa, is over. Europe and Russia are splitsville for generations and the Turkish fence sitter approach is dead.
This vote by the Turkish electorate will determine the economic future of the country. The choice is US/EU or Eurasia.
Posted by: Jerr | May 13 2023 18:52 utc | 17
Funny how the US isn't very weak after all. Many here would be crowing about its inevitable degenerate downfall, but they are wrong. The power of the US is rooted in the principles of geography and economics. The fluff of wokeism is nothing more than a bubble top in free money from being the currency of international trade.
If it falters for even a moment the true nature of power will reassert itself. Remember covid? It's being aggressively forgotten now, as will wokeism two seconds after it becomes a noticeable impediment to exercising power.
So, turkey is hopelessly dependent on foreign energy, black sea discoveries not withstanding. Erdogan has clung tenaciously but he can't order the tide back like king Canute. He will lose power because his country needs international energy flows, every minute of every day and russias days are numbered.
I dont know about Thailand but sounds like they're fucked too.
Posted by: Neofeudalfuture | May 13 2023 19:01 utc | 18
This is such a superficial analysis of Turkish politics. Indeed Erdogan has an anti-West rhetoric, and opposition has a pro-West rhetoric, but that doesn't mean that Kilicdaroglu would do the West's bidding. Sure, Kilicdaroglu will try to re-orient Turkey's foreign policy towards EU, he'll talk about the importance of human rights and democracy, and all that, but none of these will yield to a different tangible outcome than Erdogan's policies (or rather, his rhetoric).
The single most important foreign policy difference between Erdogan and Kilicdaroglu is on Syria (not on Ukraine-Russia or EU or US). Erdogan is the archenemy of Syrian regime whereas Kilicdaroglu is an ideological ally of theirs. Half of Kilicdaroglu's base is staunch seculars, who hate the fundamentalist Syrian opposition. Without Turkish intelligence' support, the armed opposition in Syria has no chance of survival. Of course, Kilicdaroglu is the candidate of an alliance, so I suspect he'll have to follow slow and moderate policies. Nonetheless, the ultimate outcome (normalization with Bashar al Assad) is certain.
Erdogan has served West's interests for years. Throughout Turkey's modern history, it's always the secular leftists like Ecevit who pursued policies conflicting with Western interests (partition of Cyprus in 1974, extradition of Ocalan in 1998, mending the relations with Syria in 2000 etc.).
Posted by: Nikopol | May 13 2023 19:02 utc | 19
Both incumbents will continue their duties as usual. No room for foreign intel scumbags ain't more ...
Posted by: AI | May 13 2023 19:06 utc | 20
Both China and Russia have stated they will actively work to prevent US colour revolutions. From what I make of it, Thailand's military are loyal to the king and are likely to take action.
Last attempted coup in Turkey against Erdogan, people came out on the streets and killed some of the military involved. Turkey is not as clearcut as Thailand though.
The Erdogan of 2015 when Russia first moved into Syria to the Erdogan of today. He has changed with the changing world order.
Hoarsewhisperer framed it well. "Recep Tayip Erdogan has certainly mastered the art and science of political Durabity. He appears to have an unlimited supply of new-ish rabbits to pull out of his hat in an emergency."
Posted by: Peter AU1 | May 13 2023 19:12 utc | 21
The opposition in Turkey is the one that's more affiliated with the dollar-centric world perhaps more so than the incumbent. If Turkish people vote for the opposition then it could mean they've made their last mistake before inviting societal collapse upon themselves brought on by some delusions about being a full-fledged member of the west or their pipedream of joining the European Union. Well the problem is if that ever happens Turks would have to embrace LGBTQ+ system, for instance, which is fundamentally at odds with the Moslem population. Anyway sticking with US$ world hegemony will be a harbinger of major political chaos and economic hardship for Ankara, from now on. For Turkiye just like Saudi Arabia it would be much better if it stays in Russia-China camp.
Posted by: maskazer | May 13 2023 19:12 utc | 22
Inside NATO - Erdogan can Veto who bombs Turkey
Outside NATO - Erdogan gets bombed
Simple
Posted by: Exile | May 13 2023 19:16 utc | 23
Peter AU1 writes:
“Thailand's military are loyal to the king”
—since 1932 very much the opposite. King Prajadhipok knew that the optimal relationship with the Thai military necessitated his living in Switzerland. King Bhumibol challenged the military exactly once, and that only after building up decades of moral authority.
The military allows the current king his (egregious) foibles, but as always, when it comes down to who can pump bullets into whom, it’s the military that calls the shots—and uses the monarchy as a shield of legitimacy.
Posted by: malenkov | May 13 2023 19:21 utc | 24
The foolishness of those that take the US dime, that believe the US bullshit...they cause death and destruction and receive death and destruction. More on the receiving end now with the rise of the multipolar world. ASEAN there appears to be something of a pacifist culture. Myanmar, the military took control over the US assets.That little tweetie bird backed by the US that oversaw ethnic cleansing.
Replace the US term "democratic forces" with demonic forces. Most are young and stupid. Many will not live to old age.
Posted by: Peter AU1 | May 13 2023 19:29 utc | 25
malenkov | May 13 2023 19:21 utc | 24
When I was in Thailand, most revered the monarchy. Taxi drivers would have a pic in their cabs. Siam is one country that never came under colonial control.
Posted by: Peter AU1 | May 13 2023 19:33 utc | 26
Funny how the US isn't very weak after all
Posted by: Neofeudalfuture | May 13 2023 19:01 utc | 18
The US is a bully and like all bullies has its weaknesses. These weaknesses are becoming more apparent to the rest of the world. Like some huge Diplodocus the pain signals haven’t reached its brain yet.
Posted by: West of England Andy | May 13 2023 19:37 utc | 27
Peter AU1:
As b would say: Na und?
Thais adored King Bhumibol; they’re carefully reserved (for obvious reasons) regarding King Vajiralongkorn; they all regard the monarchy as part of their national identity.
What does any of that have to do with the Thai military?
Posted by: malenkov | May 13 2023 19:38 utc | 28
@ Peter AU1 | May 13 2023 19:33 utc | 26
The Thai monarchy is an institution representing proud sovereignty. The Rama dynasty now has its 10th king, Vajiralongkorn (Rama X). Interestingly, King Chulalongkorn (Rama V) has a memorial in the north of Norway, he visited in 1907 to study fertilizer production among other things.
Posted by: Norwegian | May 13 2023 19:40 utc | 29
People dont vote on foreign policies. They vote on feelings, economics or ideologies.
Posted by: Orgel | May 13 2023 19:41 utc | 30
malenkov | May 13 2023 19:38 utc | 28
I believe the military uninstalled the last US proxy government.
Posted by: Peter AU1 | May 13 2023 19:42 utc | 31
Waldorf | May 13 2023 17:09 utc | 4
Erdogan survived a couple of US/Gulenist military/colour revolution attempts, but inflation has been high and the earthquake didn't help. He wouldn't be my favourite politician, but over the years I've developed a grudging respect for him, like Putin he's had to balance many forces to get and stay where he is.
From a Russian perspective, while he's no Putin fanboy he's at least not a wholly-owned Langley subsidiary.
Here in the UK our energy prices have doubled, not due to the war but to our Governments response to the war, cutting ourselves off from cheap Russian energy. We are paying the state-owned French EDF a fortune to build 3rd generation nuclear reactors which are still unproven in France.
Meanwhile Russia is building 4 nuclear generators on the Med coast at half the price the UK are paying for two. If Erdogan loses, that deal is likely off and Turkey will pay through the nose as the UK is doing.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akkuyu_Nuclear_Power_Plant
Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | May 13 2023 19:47 utc | 32
Peter AU1: Your ignorance astonishes. Oh wait, no, it doesn’t. The Shinowatra clan didn’t need—and didn’t get—any USA/CIA/NED help, as it’s pro-Chinese anyway and always enjoyed majority support among the Thai electorate. (Damn Lanna and Lao reproducing more than Bangkok amart, what’s up with that?)
The military uninstalls any government insufficiently deferential to the military’s perks. Fifteen times since 1932. And they’ll do it again in a heartbeat, don’t you worry.
Posted by: malenkov | May 13 2023 19:49 utc | 33
Norwegian | May 13 2023 19:40 utc | 29
That is interesting. Thanks. It strikes me how in some countries, hereditary leaders have a duty to their people. There upbringing and education is about feeding the people, bringing prosperity to the people.
Korea. Young Kim, well fed and in picks all the generals gaunt. So many men had to be in the standing army in case of US attack. Now with nukes, the faces of the generals have filled out. Men can be released from the army to grow food.
Posted by: Peter AU1 | May 13 2023 19:56 utc | 34
Erdogan is a wholly disloyal, wholly depraved, wholly double-crossing SOB. He was perfectly happy when his family was pillaging Syrian oil; he has no problem shooting down Russian planes, and his opposition to the behavior of Occupied Palestine is entirely for show.
And yet he seems to be the best Turkey has to offer.
Posted by: malenkov | May 13 2023 19:57 utc | 35
malenkov | May 13 2023 19:49 utc | 33
Until now I had respect for you.
I look at your shit post at malenkov | May 13 2023 19:57 utc | 36. What are you? A Russian larper? A Ukroid?
Posted by: Peter AU1 | May 13 2023 20:03 utc | 36
Peter, Peter, Peter. You never had respect for me. I’m a faggot, remember?
Well, maybe you don’t. You’re too frequently drunk, after all.
Posted by: malenkov | May 13 2023 20:08 utc | 37
Yes, the
( Great cheesy poof corn syrup revolution) by
New solyent green world order.
Make them beg to be slaves, pay to be programmed. Give them what they want.
Posted by: Miguel | May 13 2023 20:10 utc | 38
But more to the point, drunk Peter: Do you have anything to say about Thailand beyond your tourist experiences and a few minutes of Berletic?
Heck, even Gruff had enough Thailand to have had a crush on a tranny.
Posted by: malenkov | May 13 2023 20:12 utc | 39
We watch Russia and China bring peace to the middle east. Without retribution or demands for reparations. Peace vs war. A lesson to be learned.
That vitriolic comment by "malenkov | May 13 2023 19:57 utc | 36" is just war and moor war. Small minded piece of crap.
Posted by: Peter AU1 | May 13 2023 20:15 utc | 40
Muharrem İnce, a Kemalist, has a strong antipathy towards FETÖ and Gülenists …
Biden said in the video and verified by a transcript published in January 2020 by the NYT.
"He has to pay a price," Biden said at the time, adding Washington should embolden Turkish opposition leaders "to be able to take on and defeat Erdoğan. Not by a coup, not by a coup, but by the electoral process."
“We watch Russia and China bring peace to the middle east. Without retribution or demands for reparations. Peace vs war. A lesson to be learned.”
You do get some things right, Peter.
Posted by: malenkov | May 13 2023 20:18 utc | 42
Oui: Typical US/CIA/economic hitman strategy is destroy the middle ground. Always create a right-vs-unspeakably-evil scenario. Easier for the sheeple to digest.
Posted by: malenkov | May 13 2023 20:23 utc | 44
19 - Erdogan has served the West. In many ways he resembles Adnan Menderes, who brought Turkey into NATO but was later overthrown and executed, with at least the connivance of the USA. Kilicdaroglu is there to serve the West's bidding and is clearly the West's favourite, though this is probably going to be done in a somewhat covert way if he wins, as the West is not terribly popular in Turkey.
For a number of years Turkey broke off diplomatic relations with Israel, a move popular with his base and quite a few Arabs. Away from the statements and the media spotlight, Turkish-Israeli trade actually increased during that period. That is how things are done in Turkey - fine phrases on camera and pragmatism or worse behind the scenes.
Posted by: Waldorf | May 13 2023 20:46 utc | 46
the thailand troubles are not disimilar to indonesia with old corrupt family causing extreme chaos at a national level for personal power. well young marcos got in and now serves USA interests in phillipines, so i guess usa seas that advantageous and will press ahead,(whatever did become of that misssing picasso painting that was shown in his inauguration family photo... oopps) but i myself frequented thailand during the yellow red shirt dramas and know nobody wants to return to that. the military brought stability and for the majority of poor that all they want . usa has military bases in thailand actually important listening posts for electronic snooping . nothing has changed which ever gov came in .
Posted by: hankster | May 13 2023 20:53 utc | 47
@ Waldorf | May 13 2023 20:46 utc | 47
Israel’s Navy commando’s entered the Gaza flotilla towards Palestine and murdered nine civilians w/o cause … many incidents …
… the elite Flotilla 13 unit of the Israeli navy stormed the Mavi Marmara, the flagship of a flotilla crewed by an alliance of pro-Palestinian activists who had combined to deliver 10,000 tonnes of aid to Gaza.
Common cause was the overthrow of the Assad regime … Türkiye wanted to be a regional player … Russia managed to be a stronger force and Erdogan switched sides once again .. East Med gas reserves and Cyprus plays a critical role as does the Baku gas transport pipelines … plenty of Russian gas is imported … after the U.S. defeat in Afghanistan, borders became a national interest for Türkiye, see conflict w Armenia and Iran … intelligence cooperation between Mossad and MIT - see Hakan Fidan. MIT was involved in false flag sarin gas attacks inside Syria … precursor chemicals transported across border w Syria. Israel supported Al Nusra … Türkiye and Saudi Arabia do care about Palestine Jerusalem.
Malenkov, Norwegian and Peter AU 1:
I suggest you watch Carlton Meyer's short video "The American Colony of Thailand" which Meyer himself @ 16 links to. This video points to links among the CIA, the Thai military and the notorious Golden Triangle of heroin production that began in Thailand in the early 1950s and which later spread to Myanmar and Laos.
That the Thai political elite has mixed Chinese ancestry may be significant. Many Nationalist followers of former Chinese President Jiang Jieshi (Chiang Kaishek) fled to Thailand after the Communists took power in China in October 1949. (Though the bulk of the Nationalists and the Guomindang itself fled to Taiwan.) The Nationalists in northern Thailand abutting the Chinese border started opium production in that region.
At about the same time US govt funding for the CIA was decreasing after the end of World War II and the CIA started looking for funding sources that it could keep secret from the Truman govt. The opium production industry in northern Thailand fitted the bill. From there the CIA started working with the Chinese Nationalists, the political establishment the Nationalists must have infiltrated, and the Thai military to keep a tight leash on Thai governments. This has had the effect of making Thai politics and its institutions unstable under a constitutional monarchy arrangement.
Come to think of it, Turkish politics since the time of Kemal Ataturk (died 1938) also used to be unstable with the Turkish military overthrowing elected govts whenever the elected parties and politicians appeared insufficiently "secular" or too populist for the military's taste. The CIA may have had a hand in these coups as well. It was active after all in overthrowing Mohammed Mossadegh as Prime Minister of Iran in 1953 using similar Color Revolution-styled tactics by employing mobs to discredit Mossadegh. The famous CIA spy Miles Copeland was stationed in Beirut at the time and he is known to have had some involvement in organising the coup in Iran.
Posted by: Refinnejenna | May 13 2023 21:17 utc | 49
@ Refinnejenna
Yes, it took a while for the Thais to wriggle out from American control of the opium trade. God bless King Bhumibol; he thought the battle had been more or less won, when in fact we still have government officials smuggling cocaine (they call it “flour”). But I haven’t seen any compelling evidence that the USA is involved. Certainly it was during the Vietnam War, of course.
Posted by: malenkov | May 13 2023 21:28 utc | 50
malenkov | May 13 2023 21:28 utc | 51
The US is not involved. Wipe the snow off your nose.
Posted by: Peter AU1 | May 13 2023 21:32 utc | 51
Drunk Peter: That’s my point. It’s not a US matter AT ALL. Really, it’s just a question of how far the Thais are willing to go to accommodate the Chinese. It might depend on what CP (google that, you ignoramus) wants.
Now sober up and guard your penis.
Posted by: malenkov | May 13 2023 21:45 utc | 52
Current government, AKP party, has been in power over 20 years and it is corrupted like hell. It destroyed our economy, culture, laws, nature, health system, education, reputation and lots of stuff I don't remember right now.
It is an election of existence for Turkish people. If we lose this election, we probably will lose our future.
Tomorrow, there is an election and there is a high chance we will kick these dictatorship out and get our freedom back. There are tons of stuff we have to fix in our country and I know it will take time to restore it as they left 20 years of damage. Yet, with a right approach and management, I'm sure we will be able to make use of our full potential. Not everything will be fixed instantly, but the atmosphere will soon gain momentum for the better.
Once we have that momentum for the better, we will feel alive again.
This election is very important not only for Turkey but also for the world. It will be a proof to the world that dictatorships can be overthrown. It will inspire all countries living under dictatorships.
So I'm really excited that we will get rid of this dictatorship.
On May 15, we will either wake up to a new and bright Republic of Turkey or sink into darkness. I will vote tomorrow and share a new post about the results later.
Whoever reads this, please wish Turkish people luck!
Posted by: h8ist | May 13 2023 22:11 utc | 53
I’ve been to Germany, I’ve visited Germany. And from now I will refuse to ever step on German land. I actually feel relieved.
Posted by: Innuendo | May 13 2023 22:21 utc | 54
@ Carlton Meyer | May 13 2023 18:26 utc | 16
thanks carlton.. that is an excellent video and overview at the bottom of your post...
Posted by: james | May 13 2023 23:21 utc | 56
The US has lots of regime change operations going. Here is an excerpt from an article from Reuters.
“MEXICO CITY, May 3 (Reuters) – Mexico’s president asked his U.S. counterpart Joe Biden to stop the United States Agency for International Development (USAID) from funding groups hostile to his government, according to a letter presented to journalists on Wednesday, echoing previous Mexican criticism of U.S. interventionism
“The U.S. government, specifically though USAID, has for some time been financing organizations openly against the legal and legitimate government I represent,” he said in the letter. “This is clearly an interventionist act, contrary to international law and the relations which should prevail between free and sovereign states.”
The letter calls for Biden’s intervention, saying the U.S. State Department in recent days announced that USAID would increase its funding toward such organizations…..”
Posted by: Belle | May 13 2023 23:22 utc | 57
The likelihood of fair win of Erdogan is zero. However, there is a good chance he will try to hold onto the power a la Bolsonaro. In fact, it is certain that he already has plans to rig the election results and even then he is likely to lose and then he might even try to stay in power by force. So, Sunday will be a very tense day in Turkey
BTW, unlike a lot of people write on mainstream western media, the west really wants Erdogan to continue because they know they can make him do things with money while the opposition is a mix which contains a very strong faction of sovereigntists. US plan is to balance this by hijacking Kurdish party who has strong ties with the Kurds in Syria. They even inserted their men inside this party as MP candidates. Ironically, this party is called "Green" Left Party. They will have a key in the final parliament as majority cannot be won without their votes.
The opposition already openly declared that:
1. They will cancel the agreement with the EU about refugees, that is a big problem form the EU
2. They will re-establish ties with Syrian government for ending the civil war and return of refugees. This is a big problem for Erdogan's jihadis in northern Syria and thus for the US. This is why Assad did not want to help Erdogan by giving a chance for him to say anything about improvements in Syria despite Putin's efforts
3. They said they will not allow any warships in the Black Sea and strictly enforce Montreaux Treaty. They have long been protesting Erdogan for opening Montreaux to discussion.
4. They will not impose any sanctions not approved by the UN
Overall, even thought there is a broad uncertainty within power mix of the opposition, there is no possibility for a Turkish U turn of its foreign policy and for example take an openly anti-Russian stance; Turkey did not do that even during the cold war except for Menderes (who were executed for his crimes, btw) years where it also sent soldiers to Korea. And, Kilicdaroglu is not about to become a second Menderes
Posted by: kemerd | May 13 2023 23:26 utc | 58
Neofuedal at 18. Right because when someone else theoretically takes control of Russia's energy they wont sell it to Turkey? Even when it sounds good u still spin fairy tales.
Posted by: Tannenhouser | May 13 2023 23:48 utc | 59
Turkey could easily use some of those moderate rebels in Idlib for a plausible deniability strikes on US spy centers, ahem.. embassy.
Posted by: unimperator | May 13 2023 23:57 utc | 60
David Hearst at Middle East Eye, where it is still permitted to tell the truth about Israel, has a long article about Erdogan and the election:
"... the real reason the West has expressed such hostility to Erdogan has nothing to do with his authoritarianism or his crackdown on a free press - neither of which stop the rush to invest in Saudi Arabia where such concepts are for the birds.
"It is because Erdogan has fashioned Turkey into an independent state with its own powerful armed forces, that will not automatically toe the line dictated to it. This is the reason he has so many enemies in the West.
"His popularity as a leader in the Sunni Muslim world is a threat to the failing and ailing western consensus. Independent leaders like Morsi or Pakistan’s Imran Khan all meet the same fate.
"Erdogan has bucked that trend - so far..."
https://www.middleeasteye.net/opinion/turkish-elections-europe-erdogan-lose-wants-why
Posted by: bevin | May 14 2023 0:06 utc | 61
Kevork Almassian at Syriana Analysis gives us a good analysis of the Turkish elements in play as they rush to their ballot boxes.
Here is a treat with Garland Nixon and Brian Berletic: NEOCON FOREIGN POLICY TRAIN WRECK
And thank you for the laughs upthread. Some good quips here.
Posted by: uncle tungsten | May 14 2023 0:08 utc | 62
I expect that Erdoğan will win in Turkey, mostly because the Anatolian rural population benefited greatly under his rule and will likely vote en masse for him. From what I see, opinion polls typically ask only the rich urban elite, especially the liberals, what they think. This also happened in India in 2019 when it was widely expected Modi would lose. He won with a bigger majority. I can't say any Thailand because I know very little about Thailand.
I can absolutely assure you that there will be a colour revolution attempt in India starting from the second half of this year ahead of next year's elections. I have been predicting not just it but the timing since 2020. The plan will be to try and unseat Modi. This well predated the current conflict where Modi has rather surprisingly chosen a pro Russian stance, which the preceding Congress regime never would have. The reason for this prediction is Modi's primary economic sin: selling off the nationalised section of the Indian economy to his Indian oligarch cronies (primarily the Ambani and Adani groups) and even more not privatising India's huge banking and insurance institutions, most of which are still state owned and cater to poor and middle class people. It's significant that the "anti Modi" media people keep whining that Modi has not privatised enough, and those same people invariably support Ukranazistan. So a colour revolution against him in favour of the useless and unelectable Congress Party Gandhi dynasty heir Rahul Gandhi is inevitable. Gandhi recently was in Britain all but openly announcing his candidature for colour revolution stooge and right after that Soros bleated that he wanted to see a change in government in India soon...and right afterwards the liberals in India began attempts to legalise gay marriage, Starbucks posted a (Bud Lite level of unpopular) advert showing a "transgender" couple, and so on. You can see where this is going.
Posted by: Biswapriya Purkayast | May 14 2023 0:08 utc | 63
Imagine being as stupid as Duncan Idaho @56
Posted by: Biswapriya Purkayast | May 14 2023 0:12 utc | 64
Biswapriya Purkayast@65
Imagine being in a country in which @56 is just part of the crowd, perhaps even regarded as a deep thinker and a witty fellow.
Posted by: bevin | May 14 2023 0:48 utc | 65
From my conversations with Thais on the street it's clear they have no good options.
They hate corrupt, useless and arrogant Phrayud and the military government.
They know the Shinawatra merchant dynasty are nothing more than USA whores.
The one good political force, led by a true believer, is too small to count in elections.
Yet Thais on the street are hungering for a change and will take the Shinawatra dynasty over Prayudh.
From what I can gauge, the Thai people are poised to vote for Pro-USA parties, for no other reason than to kick Prayudh in the balls and damned be the consequences.
Ironically, the only thing stopping Thailand from falling fully within the US orbit is the corruption of Prayudh Chan Ocha.
But then again, is really better to choose the lesser of two evils?
Perhaps the only way to really unmask the Devil is to choose the greater one ...
Posted by: Arch Bungle | May 14 2023 1:26 utc | 66
Posted by: Duncan Idaho | May 13 2023 23:06 utc | 56
"moderate $Anything" ... One who is out of ammunition
(AKA - "Diplomat")
Posted by: Arch Bungle | May 14 2023 1:29 utc | 67
Even when Peter AU1 has heavily imbibed in his WC Fields medicine, he makes more sense than you Malenkov.
Posted by: Ново з | May 14 2023 1:31 utc | 68
Even when Peter AU1 has heavily imbibed in his WC Fields medicine, he makes more sense than you Malenkov.
Posted by: Ново з | May 14 2023 1:31 utc | 69
Posted by: Norwegian | May 13 2023 19:40 utc | 29
The Thai monarchy is an institution representing proud sovereignty.
That ended with Maha Bhumibol Adulyadej. It is now merely a shell of the nation's hopes.
The Rama dynasty now has its 10th king, Vajiralongkorn (Rama X).
It's unlikely he will ever rise to his father's stature.
Posted by: Arch Bungle | May 14 2023 1:46 utc | 70
I wouldn’t worry about Thailand. The status quo coalition parties can lose badly and still form a government with the votes of the Senate, all 250 members of which are appointed by the military.
Posted by: malenkov | May 13 2023 17:26 utc | 8
That is true. However the Opposition Future Forward Party is funded and trained by the US National Endowment for Democracy, a color revolution institution, the bigger Peua Thai is Taksin Shinawat's old party, he was also in bed with the US. We might recall his "red" shirts leading a violent counter revolution in the past.
Few favor inept military governments, however the choice for Thailand is that or complete US servitude and playing a leading part in the upcoming war on China. Like in most of the region China is the leading trade partner.
Posted by: Organic | May 14 2023 2:09 utc | 71
India: The Congress party just won a state election around Bangaluru while the BJP lost. This was an expression of unhappiness with the regional leadership, apart from the anti incumbent factor in Karnataka. On the National level Congress has still the same old unattractive Gandhi family dominated crew, so little chance.
https://www.thehindu.com/elections/karnataka-assembly/congress-surge-topples-bjp-in-karnataka/article66847235.ece
Posted by: Antonym | May 14 2023 2:10 utc | 72
Whoever reads this, please wish Turkish people luck!
Posted by: h8ist | May 13 2023 22:11 utc | 54
I do. I want to thank you and kemerd for sharing your views with us here.
Posted by: Bemildred | May 14 2023 2:11 utc | 73
From here in Thailand as a foreign spectator, having had a lifetime of living with the polished narrative management of the UK establishment, it is relatively easy to read what is afoot. After the rise of the cunning Thaksin Shinawatra, the man that, after 3 bankruptcies, settled into the lucrative world of 'brown envelope' government contract supply of computer equipment, lucked out when Hawaiian based US satellite TV business man William L. Monson partnered with Thaksin to get a foothold in Thailand, gifted him mobile phone tech. knowledge and organisation as a friendly gesture, and was subsequently shafted by Thaksin (the wikipedia articled used to have all the gory details in it many years ago), which led to Thaksin's domination of both markets with UBC and AIS. He used the immense wealth to build the Thai Rak Thai party, which outwardly focused on wooing the previously ignored masses of poor with populist polices and design a method of government control that had corruption in every department, e.g. he had a 'business manager' sitting in every government ministry to manage the budgets the ministers put forward, basically adding 15% for 'the cause'. While in government Thaksin, upon being instructed by the IMF to do the usual 'restructuring' said "The IMF is not my father" and organised commercial loans to get rid of them.
The royalty and military obviously didn't like the way Thaksin operated, so several coups overthrew him and his crony parties in subsequent election victories. Phua Thai is the current Thaksin vehicle with his children at the helm (he ran away from a conviction and is waiting in Dubai) no subtlety there.
The relatively new player was the Future Forward Party developed by the 'Thaksin 2' wealthy business man Thanathorn. Now called Move Forward Party. While they state that they are funded by people and not big business, their agenda includes some of the wokeness the US likes to peddle......
Posted by: NotEinstein | May 14 2023 2:13 utc | 74
Bungle: It is not the monarchy but the military that rules Thailand. Therefore your comment is correct but irrelevant.
Posted by: malenkov | May 14 2023 2:49 utc | 75
NotEinstein: There’s no such thing as “Phua Thai”. (That would mean “Thai Husband.”) If you’re that ignorant, then for the sake of your self-esteem please SHUT UP.
Posted by: malenkov | May 14 2023 2:53 utc | 76
Organic: Ignorant nonsense but par for the course around these parts. Not that it matters; the military will remain in power one way or another.
Posted by: malenkov | May 14 2023 2:56 utc | 77
@60 yes if russia falls under a nato occupation government it will blockade turkey if ordered too, if it's needed to bring turkey to heel.
The power of the US cannot be broken unless its control of the Mississippi River and new Orleans is broken. And do ya think France or Mexico can do it?
Of course not the people there have to do it themselves but how or why would they?
I mean I could think of two ideas:
Civil War
Failed state
Maybe nuclear war but that's a global problem, in theory solving the US power imbalance has to have a solution that doesn't wreck everything, just divide north America like south America.
Posted by: Neofeudalfuture | May 14 2023 3:15 utc | 78
Organic: Similarly there’s no “Peua Thai.” If you can’t master even the most basic Thai vowels in the names of major political parties, well…enjoy your “Thai massages.”
Posted by: malenkov | May 14 2023 3:16 utc | 79
malenkov | May 14 2023 2:53 utc | 77
OK, so my transliteration from Thai was incorrect - Pheu Thai - big deal!
Is that all you can say to my comment?
Does that mean you cannot disagree with any of it?
Posted by: NotEinstein | May 14 2023 4:48 utc | 80
Posted by: bevin | May 14 2023 0:06 utc | 62
Thanks for the article by David Hearst on the Turkish elections. I recall advising barfly James to read Hearst's excellent reference/history book, "The Gun and the Olive Branch, the roots of Violence in the Middle East". How's it going James?
https://www.middleeasteye.net/opinion/turkish-elections-europe-erdogan-lose-wants-why
Posted by: Paul GV | May 14 2023 5:04 utc | 81
80 do you say krap ka, ka or krap in your fluent thai? lol
Posted by: hankster | May 14 2023 5:19 utc | 82
Lukashenko's health is a regime change worry. He was reportedly rushed back to Belarus to sick to attend the Victory Day luncheon, and there have been no reports of his situation since.
Posted by: too scents | May 14 2023 5:28 utc | 83
@Innuendo 55
Quite alot of Germans are very very unhappy at the actions of the current traffic light coalition.
However the greens in my view are having an enormous influence on Germany's foreign policy with appalling results. And this with what, 20% of the electorate...
Just what specifically do you object to ??
Posted by: Judge Barbier | May 14 2023 5:59 utc | 84
malenkov | May 13 2023 21:45 utc | 53 "It’s not a US matter AT ALL. Really, it’s just a question of how far the Thais are willing to go to accommodate the Chinese."
You have to be incredibly naive to write something like that. US destruction and poverty vs Chinese infrastructure building. US tries to block Chinese infrastructure building in every way possible. The belt and road initiative. US is trying to block that everywhere.
The attacks on Chinese engineers in Pakistan, The attacks on the pipeline and road that Run from China to the Myanmar coast.
Thailand is part of the belt and road initiative. It's not a matter of "how far the Thais are willing to go to accommodate the Chinese". Its a matter of where do Thailand's economic interests lay and that is obviously with China.
On the other hand it could be said "how far the Thais are willing to go to accommodate the US" as US is only interested in political coercion that has no economic benefits to Thailand.
Posted by: Peter AU1 | May 14 2023 6:27 utc | 85
Posted by: Judge Barbier | May 14 2023 5:59 utc | 85
The creation of the postwar political system as a Party State functioned so long as Adenauer's CDU had a majority as a Catholic West German Party and could shame the SPD by its association with a sister party in GDR that sold out its people to the SED. It is why Dahrendorf's son had to join the FDP in West Germany so tainted was the father by his actions in the SPD in the Ostzone.
The Grand Coalition emerged 1966 under Kiesinger and modified the Allies Emergency Laws which created an APO - External Opposition of the Left which emerged as Baader-Meinhof in opposition to a Uni-Party State.
The fragmentation of German party politics continued and now there are as many parties as in Weimar Republic. Merkel was a Protestant in a Catholic Party and hollowed out its conservative core by flirting with Green voters..........that created AfD as a conservative offshoot.
Because of Merkel the Greens are now influential - they are bankrolled by oil interests like Pew Foundation and Rockefeller Foundation through Hal Harvey in USA. As Sahra Wagenknecht pointed out through Habeck's policies the oil/gas corporates in Germany have made €38 bn supernormal profit and Energy corporates have made €51 bn supernormal profit - and there is no Windfall Tax.
The transfer of wealth from ordinary citizens is unprecedented - Big Pharma, Big Oil, Big Energy - all making supernormal gains - and Food Processors too.
The Green voters are in about 5 major German cities - whereas Habeck is directly-elected, Baerbock is a List MP as are most Greens.
Currently there is NO Coalition possible in Berlin without Greens unless CDU accepted AfD.....and Merz is a Black Rock emissary who will not change course.
When Thuringia tried to change and FDP was supported by AfD Merkel (in South Africa) ordered the election result overturned.......https://www.faz.net/aktuell/politik/inland/merkels-aeusserungen-zu-thueringen-wahl-verletzten-rechte-der-afd-18104178.html
There has been no subsequent election and the parties keep postponing it to avoid crushing defeat by AfD - in Thuringen the young vote AfD and the old vote Communist (SED) "Die Linke" - the only state where the old GDR Communist Party still rules and where Merkel kept it in power
So the system is bubbling. German politics is not flexible but brittle. There is no capacity for reform or regeneration in the sclerotic German system - collapse is inevitable
Posted by: Paul Greenwood | May 14 2023 6:59 utc | 86
I wonder if the Americans ever pause to consider that they might engender more positive opinions and support for their policies if they refrained from poking their noses into everybody else’s lives?
Posted by: Microdigger | May 14 2023 7:24 utc | 87
Posted by: Peter AU1 | May 14 2023 6:27 utc | 86
On the other hand it could be said "how far the Thais are willing to go to accommodate the US"
The good thing about the Thais is that they only budge when the money comes in.
They have no loyalty whatsoever other than to their own bottom line.
And Kun Meh of course ...
Posted by: Arch Bungle | May 14 2023 8:14 utc | 88
Posted by: malenkov | May 14 2023 2:49 utc | 76
Therefore your comment is correct but irrelevant.
You're confused.
Those statements were not made on the premise of who rules Thailand.
They were made on the premise the Monarchy has *influence* in Thailand.
And that certainly is relevant.
(btw, looking at your other comments, you strike me as another rock-headed farang who think he knows everything about the Thai after a few years of hanging around with bar whores in Pattaya. Snap out of it, white man.)
Posted by: Arch Bungle | May 14 2023 8:21 utc | 89
Some African leaders/diplomats/officials have recently made some very good speeches on the difference between western imperialism and and the way they are treated by Russia and China.
The difference between win lose and win win.
The Solomon Islands in the last year. China does some deal to train and equip their police force. The howls of outrage from blatant imperialism. Australian political hacks screaming about China being in our backyard. The Americans similar who rushed to set up a regime change embassy in Solomon Islands. The imperialism was so bloody blatant.
An African woman listed a long list of infrastructure China had simply donated. I cannot rember which country, but she said the Americans landed at a Chinese airport, drove on a Chinese road, met in a Chinese building, and tried to tell them to break ties with China.
But what realy struck me in what that woman said - China does not advertise its charity. Just a very small plaque somewhere in the building saying "A gift from China"
That Australian gift to East Timor the cabinet building - fully bugged. Australian aid also donated a no doubt fully bugged building to Cambodia. The howls of imperial anguish when Cambodia demolished that building made it clear that had also been bugged.
Posted by: Peter AU1 | May 14 2023 8:50 utc | 90
malenkov
I sometimes get confused on user name. I watch your garbage on this thread and if I called you a faggot in the past, there was likely good reason for doing so. (booze does not help the memory cells) Your postings in this thread are very woke. Aligned with the US brainwashed faction in Thailand.
I have done my own reading but when it comes to the Asia pacific and the US, Berletic is very good.
It is sometime since I went to Thailand, and that was to take my youngest daughter on a holiday. But what struck me is how many revered their King and Queen. That was somewhere around 2013. I did not see that as a bad thing as Thailand is not an imperialist country.
Here in Australia we have a foreign monarch as head of state. British interests are not Australia interests. Our economic sphere of interest is in those countries to the north of us in the Asia pacific region.
Though I guess writing about these things to you is like painting lipstick on a pig.
Posted by: Peter AU1 | May 14 2023 9:34 utc | 91
@Paul Greenwood.
I would agree with your view in general terms. For those that don't believe everything on ARD Tageschau it's difficult to decide who to vote for....
Posted by: Judge Barbier | May 14 2023 9:46 utc | 92
92 peter i hung out in cambodia for a few years and was there when the king died a decade ago. if i recall everything was shut for days and on the actual day there was a city full of people all looking at the moon in the street. they all claim he flew to the moon and could be seen in it before going on to heaven . now try gettn anyone to believe such stuff for any european monarch. impossible. but such is the respect that wont be going away for quite a few more generations even with Soros funding some program of degeneracy. As far as Thailands laws about defaming the royals.
https://www.politico.eu/article/european-countries-where-insulting-head-of-state-can-land-prison-belgium-denmark-france-germany/#:~:text=Anyone%20who%20%E2%80%9Ccommits%20slander%20or,the%20offense%20is%20deemed%20serious.
Posted by: hankster | May 14 2023 10:10 utc | 93
In response to h8ist@54,
Certainly, best of luck to the people of Turkey, whoever ends up in power. However, I would like to say one thing. When a real opposition takes over after a long-running establishment group, it puts the state as a whole in a more vulnerable position.
The newly elected representatives, if they are to ever run the country effectively, need to consolidate power and push the establishment out of its entrenched positions in the state bureaucracy, or they will make a weak and ineffectual government. This process is always to some degree destabilizing for the state and, furthermore, its successful realization hinges on having enough political capital, chiefly built up during a single election campaign, to offset the political capital of the establishment built up basically over its entire lifetime. In a close election, that simply isn't the case, meaning that the newly elected government is constrained in its ability to properly control the levers of power, and essentially has to continue campaigning already on the job -- that means more talk and less work.
Its political capital is also more volatile and transient in nature than the inertial capital of the establishment, and even unavoidable compromises or readjustments of priorities can cause significant drops in support, in turn making the government weaker and less able to do meaningful work. If we're talking about a coalition composed of several political parties, you can multiply the number of problems with the number of different parties involved -- internal cohesion influences and is influenced by all of the above.
If the disparity between these political forces is as severe as you describe, a choice between ruin and prosperity, then the people of Turkey will need luck on their side to avoid a crisis -- whoever wins. The US might not have any viable candidates in the race based on electoral promises and policy statements, but if they could get any type of weak and fresh-faced government in Turkey, mired in internal political struggles, it would make it easier for them to destabilize the country, if that is what they intend to do. At that point, they would pick their favorite candidate out of the rubble and keep the crisis going until they get bored or get their way. It doesn't always work the way they want, but it's what they always go for.
Posted by: Skiffer | May 14 2023 10:13 utc | 94
hankster | May 14 2023 10:10 utc | 94
Interesting link. The hypocrisy of so called western democracy/dumbocracy is what I detest the most.
Hypocrisy - liars - snake oil salesmen. I have no time for those types.
Posted by: Peter AU1 | May 14 2023 10:42 utc | 95
Posted by: Judge Barbier | May 14 2023 5:59 utc | 85
In "liberal democracy" - read liberal oligarchy - people used to need 29-30% of votes to get to the leadership. Now it has sinked to below 20%.
With 20%, CIA fostered German Greens are poised to own the country, no doubt.
Posted by: Greg Galloway | May 14 2023 10:55 utc | 96
Posted by: Judge Barbier | May 14 2023 9:46 utc | 93
The German system is rigged against Independents by the List system.
Helmut Schmidt once stated a direct-mandate system was better for proper government. The German system was designed to stop strong government and allows the election losers to participate in government.......!!!!!
Posted by: Paul Greenwood | May 14 2023 11:01 utc | 97
My idiot daughter nearly got me into a fight in Thailand. She nearly pokes some bloke in the eye with a oversize toothpick.
He was no wimp that attacked women. He looks at me.
Muay Thai is right up there with Russian Sambo and Brazilian Jujutsu. He was obviously a hard fucker that did not attack women.
Travelling with woke children....
Posted by: Peter AU1 | May 14 2023 11:02 utc | 98
Apologies for always suggesting texts. I’m currently reading F William Engdahj‘s ´The Lost Hegemon: whom the gods would destroyˋ. He gives a clear, well evidenced account of the CIA’s fostering ( and financing) of Fetullah Gulen, who as we know has worked to destabilise and overthrow Erdoğan. Additionally the book offers a history of the creation, rise and deadly effect of the Moslem Brotherhood.
Posted by: Valerie Swales | May 14 2023 11:14 utc | 99
K1 had to change its rules of engagement when Baukaw came on the scene
Posted by: Peter AU1 | May 14 2023 11:19 utc | 100
The comments to this entry are closed.
The Cradle had this piece a few days ago: https://thecradle.co/article-view/24437/turkish-elections-what-if-putin-loses-erdogan which includes the following paragraphs that suggest a colour revolution might not be straightforward:
Unless, of course, the aim of any US meddling is to cause destabilisation and chaos, rather than full-on regime change. Wouldn’t be the first time.
Posted by: West of England Andy | May 13 2023 16:44 utc | 1