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April 7, 2023
Ukraine Open Thread 2023-84
Only for news & views directly related to the Ukraine conflict. The current open thread for other issues is here. Please stick to the topic. Contribute facts. Do not attack other commentators.
Comments
Posted by: Outraged | Apr 8 2023 1:49 utc | 101 Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Apr 8 2023 1:51 utc | 101 Simplicius the Thinker has just said Hello! Posted by: Don Firineach | Apr 8 2023 1:54 utc | 102 It’s a dumb psy-op. Nobody in the Russian camp takes it seriously. Posted by: Surferket | Apr 8 2023 1:59 utc | 103 @18 yes the gliding precision bombs do seem to be working well as a precise standoff weapon. Posted by: Neofeudalfuture | Apr 8 2023 2:01 utc | 104 Anyone got a link to this without the paywall? Posted by: Biswapriya Purkayast | Apr 8 2023 2:04 utc | 105 @ outraged 90 Posted by: Giyane | Apr 8 2023 2:06 utc | 106 @ Tom_Q_Collins | Apr 8 2023 1:51 utc | 102 Came back to post the link to Simplicius, but I see I was beaten to the punch. Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Apr 8 2023 2:21 utc | 108 @ karlof1 # 97 with the Lavrov quote…thanks
Posted by: psychohistorian | Apr 8 2023 2:24 utc | 109 Here’s the paywalled article linked to by Simplicius regarding *other* non-Russia/Ukraine related docs also having been leaked, which could help establish the authenticity of the ones we’re talking about here. Also, as he states, could still be a psyop. Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Apr 8 2023 2:26 utc | 110 @Thim | Apr 7 2023 20:38 utc | 42 Posted by: barstool | Apr 8 2023 2:31 utc | 111 @ Neofeudalfuture | Apr 8 2023 2:01 utc | 105 https://archive.ph/XdUD1 h/t to Outraged for the new handy site. Posted by: Surferket | Apr 8 2023 2:50 utc | 113 I live in China and Chinese social media are very open about the war in Ukraine. Lots of videos showing grenades dropped on Wagners in trenches. Latest is 3 groups of Wagners entered a building and got blown up when the Nazis detonated the building. Posted by: Surferket | Apr 8 2023 2:54 utc | 114 Pentagon Investigates More Social-Media Posts Purporting to Include Secret U.S. Documents Posted by: Chris | Apr 8 2023 2:57 utc | 115 West of England Andy | Apr 7 2023 19:26 utc | 23 Posted by: Melaleuca | Apr 8 2023 3:06 utc | 116 Looks like there are TWO LEAKS–one which centers on Ukraine but the 2nd supposedly contains a tranche of 100 documents related to Middle East and other topics that exposes USA and 5 Eyes. I don’t think either is True–FBI/CIA/DoD wouldn’t be asking Elon–they’d be telling him. Posted by: Dulles_Did_Dallas | Apr 8 2023 3:07 utc | 117 @unimperator | Apr 7 2023 21:19 utc | 55 Posted by: barstool | Apr 8 2023 3:08 utc | 118 Don’t get too excited by oil prices going up. Not going to hurt the US that much. Gas, coal, and uranium are still cheap. Europe is also prepared to do anything to keep electricity prices low. There were times in the winter when spot electricity prices in Europe were $0.00 in some markets. Subsidies in the European electricity market were an attempt to hold down gas prices. Almost all commodities are cheaper now compared to 12 months ago. Out of all the major Euro economies, only Germany is paying nearly double electricity price compared to last year. China is using bilateral trade to offset its dollar exposure. I just wrote about it today when replying to a comment Simplicius76 asked me. https://aaronlee.substack.com/p/the-russian-financial-superpower I expect commodity prices to burn Europe the most. Declining global trade will burn China. Russia will become the dominant partner in its relationship with China. After the war is over, Russian arms will be so cheap and battle tested, China will be forced to buy them, worsening their trade deficit with Russia… Latest vid on Chinese social media showed Nazis using airburst artillery rounds that send a rain of ball bearings dropping large numbers of Wagners at once. Posted by: Surferket | Apr 8 2023 3:12 utc | 120 Surferket | Apr 8 2023 2:54 utc | 115 Posted by: Jerr | Apr 8 2023 3:20 utc | 121 Posted by: Aaron Lee | Apr 8 2023 3:10 utc | 120 Posted by: Surferket | Apr 8 2023 3:23 utc | 122 psychohistorian @110–Thanks for your reply. Interesting essay about the nature of contemporary Europe, “The Imminent Collapse of Eurofascism”, which won’t surpise many barflies:
The author relates some other protest actions then later notes that all Europe must bond together to break the Eurofascism that oppresses them all. Overall, a good clear exposition of Europe’s crisis. Here’s a report on the non lethal police version of the Chinese EM gun. They already have the military lethal version. Posted by: Surferket | Apr 8 2023 3:26 utc | 124
Posted by: Down South | Apr 8 2023 3:32 utc | 125
Posted by: Down South | Apr 8 2023 3:33 utc | 126 @Babel-17 | Apr 7 2023 21:45 utc | 58 Posted by: barstool | Apr 8 2023 3:34 utc | 127 Posted by: Jerr | Apr 8 2023 3:20 utc | 122 Posted by: Surferket | Apr 8 2023 3:35 utc | 128 Bloomberg
These mongrel ‘news’ reporters should tell that to the USA oligarchs – ROFL. Posted by: uncle tungsten | Apr 8 2023 3:36 utc | 129
Posted by: Down South | Apr 8 2023 3:36 utc | 130 @52, natokraine, just remember, sometimes the light at the end of the tunnel is an oncoming train. FWIW, I feel that if NATO/US thought they could take Russia, they would’ve tried using their own troops instead of this bullshit proxy skirmish. Mostly, they wage war on relatively defenseless nations. Or on their own populace. Posted by: Immaculate deception | Apr 8 2023 3:36 utc | 131
https://t.me/Slavyangrad/40843 Posted by: Down South | Apr 8 2023 3:39 utc | 132
https://t.me/Slavyangrad/40845 Posted by: Down South | Apr 8 2023 3:42 utc | 133 Posted by: Surferket | Apr 8 2023 3:23 utc | 123 Posted by: Aaron Lee | Apr 8 2023 3:42 utc | 135 Posted by: Surferket | Apr 8 2023 3:47 utc | 135 So they have brought the good news from Artyomovsk to Donetsk. Posted by: uncle tungsten | Apr 8 2023 3:48 utc | 136 Two docs went to war… Posted by: Melaleuca | Apr 8 2023 3:59 utc | 137 Posted by: Surferket | Apr 8 2023 3:47 utc | 136 Posted by: Grishka | Apr 8 2023 4:12 utc | 138 How about another eclectic mix? “Shot in the Dark” Ozzie Osborne, “Crossfire”, Stevie Ray Vaughn, “No Quarter”,”Kashmir”, Led Zeppelin, and finally Yes, “Roundabout, South Side of the Sky”. Posted by: Immaculate deception | Apr 8 2023 4:15 utc | 139 Here’s another good news. Posted by: Surferket | Apr 8 2023 4:15 utc | 140 And in honor of b and Germany, The Scorpions,”Rock You like a Hurricane, Blackout, No One like You and Winds of Change.” Peace. Gonna get in the cups. Check you later. Posted by: Immaculate deception | Apr 8 2023 4:35 utc | 141 One more, before I check out. “Conquistador”, Procol Harem. Live with the Edmonton philharmonic orchestra. Posted by: Immaculate deception | Apr 8 2023 4:57 utc | 142 Posted by: Surferket | Apr 8 2023 1:59 utc | 104 Posted by: unimperator | Apr 8 2023 5:20 utc | 143 Bakhmut continues getting squeezed into smaller portions, meaning higher density of ukronato troops per m2. That in itself makes the casualty curve from artillery go up. They can no longer leave in cohesion, unless in most western part of city. Posted by: unimperator | Apr 8 2023 5:35 utc | 144 John Brunner’s Stand on Zanzibar, an excellent SF novel. Posted by: Drinky Crow | Apr 8 2023 5:44 utc | 145 Johnnycomelately: Posted by: Bernard Davis | Apr 8 2023 6:14 utc | 146 If these leaked documents are authentic and undoctored, then NATO troops are fed poor intelligence. Posted by: Passerby | Apr 8 2023 6:39 utc | 147 Posted by: Aaron Lee | Apr 8 2023 3:10 utc | 120 Posted by: Lalita | Apr 8 2023 6:44 utc | 148 Lula basically said Russia can’t achieve all their goals, must accept a deal. Should give back Donbass and if they’re nice, he lets them keep Crimea. He’s going to China to propose his piss plan to Xi Posted by: rk | Apr 8 2023 6:44 utc | 149 Posted by: Aaron Lee | Apr 8 2023 3:10 utc | 120 Posted by: Lulita | Apr 8 2023 6:52 utc | 150 Twitter thread on Ukraine’s AD from recently leaked documents.
https://twitter.com/War_cube_/status/1644390191627370498 Posted by: too scents | Apr 8 2023 6:54 utc | 151 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g1r_Hb6gmsY Posted by: pretzelattack | Apr 8 2023 7:21 utc | 152 Just watch this; Posted by: stranger | Apr 8 2023 7:30 utc | 153
https://t.me/Slavyangrad/40871
https://t.me/Slavyangrad/40873 Posted by: Norwegian | Apr 8 2023 7:47 utc | 154 TBH, the leak seems like it’s just supposed to take attention away from something else. Like Bakhmut. It’s possible that it is directed at the audience in US and EU. The Russian MOD doesn’t need these leaks, of course, they will still project the plans on what they see on satellite and drone recon and other signal intelligence data. Posted by: unimperator | Apr 8 2023 8:02 utc | 155
Posted by: Down South | Apr 8 2023 8:06 utc | 156 @unimperator | Apr 8 2023 8:02 utc | 155
https://t.me/DonbassDevushka/53417 Posted by: Norwegian | Apr 8 2023 8:07 utc | 157 Posted by: Surferket | Apr 8 2023 3:47 utc | 136 Posted by: anon2020 | Apr 8 2023 8:29 utc | 158 Posted by: too scents | Apr 8 2023 6:54 utc | 151 Posted by: Milites | Apr 8 2023 8:36 utc | 159 Medvedev is wrong as usual. Posted by: rk | Apr 8 2023 9:04 utc | 160 Very informative post. Thanks for sharing. Found more information on the portal https://myc.news/ . @ Posted by: Aaron Lee | Apr 8 2023 3:10 utc | 120 Posted by: Alex Vadim | Apr 8 2023 9:36 utc | 162 The Russians are seeing the “leaked” documents as part of the information support for the coming “offensive”. On “60 minutes”, one of the most watched Russian political talk show, journalist A. Medvedev lays it out very clearly, that the aim of the release is to influence the decision makers as much as possible, but more importantly to prepare psychologically the Russian populace to expect something larger and more sinister. Posted by: Boo | Apr 8 2023 9:46 utc | 163 Posted by: rk | Apr 8 2023 9:04 utc | 160 Posted by: Paul Greenwood | Apr 8 2023 10:00 utc | 164 @ myc.news | Apr 8 2023 9:29 utc | 161
Fantastical re balance of forces & capabilities. LOL. Oh come on. The classified documents are authentic. Russkies will of course leverage & exploit the leaks opportunity to their own internal political & propaganda advantage. Foolish not to do so. Who wouldn’t … Posted by: Boo | Apr 8 2023 9:46 utc | 163 Posted by: unimperator | Apr 8 2023 10:22 utc | 166 Posted by: Boo | Apr 8 2023 9:46 utc | 163 Posted by: _newbie_ | Apr 8 2023 10:27 utc | 167 Enlightening, brief aerial view of only a short section of the Muddy Track of Death (MToD), the fragile tenuous MSR for the trapped AFU remnants in Bahkmut, under RF Fire Control. Those AFU that manage to attempt to retreat from Bahkmut, will have to do so on foot, over muddy open fields & the MToD. TG, videoclip, 34s.
Expect launch/deployment sites will soon receive some visitors of their own, SRBMs, cruise missiles & drones. @Boo | Apr 8 2023 9:46 utc | 163 Posted by: rk | Apr 8 2023 10:33 utc | 169 Paul Greenwood | Apr 8 2023 10:00 utc | 164 Posted by: rk | Apr 8 2023 10:44 utc | 170 @ rk | Apr 8 2023 10:44 utc | 170 Slavyangrad reports Russian MOD reporting UAF planning chemical weapon false flag in Chasov Yar, dropping mustard gas on “evacuating civilians”. Yet another scheme to bring Poles into west Ukraine or beyond. Posted by: unimperator | Apr 8 2023 11:26 utc | 172 @ Immaculate deception | Apr 8 2023 3:36 utc | 132 Posted by: natokraine | Apr 8 2023 11:26 utc | 173 Minimum, incomplete, low-ball KIA(only)(FEBA only) 595+ … Translated:
Of course it’s a cheesy government leak. But take heart. This is their off-ramp. Posted by: Elmagnostic | Apr 8 2023 11:45 utc | 175 Posted by: Outraged | Apr 8 2023 11:06 utc | 171 Posted by: Milites | Apr 8 2023 11:53 utc | 176 ⚡️ (https://t.me/msgazdiev/1177)🇷🇺🇺🇦💀 Promised News from #Bakhmut / #Artyomovsk⚡️ Posted by: unimperator | Apr 8 2023 11:54 utc | 177 Voenkor Yevgeny Poddubny reports: Posted by: unimperator | Apr 8 2023 12:03 utc | 178 @rk “there is no war in Kiev” Posted by: Chris | Apr 8 2023 12:09 utc | 179 @karlof1: thanks for that link. Lavrov is always required reading. Posted by: Kaiama | Apr 8 2023 12:09 utc | 180 Surferket | Apr 8 2023 3:12 utc | 121 Posted by: olaf22 | Apr 8 2023 12:16 utc | 181 Aaron Lee | Apr 8 2023 3:10 utc | 120 Posted by: olaf22 | Apr 8 2023 12:20 utc | 182 @ unimperator | Apr 8 2023 11:26 utc | 172
Amoral Nazi insanity. What does the bar think of the likelyhood of Esch scenario, assumed the Ukraine will launch a Major offensive. Posted by: Arminius | Apr 8 2023 12:52 utc | 184 The burning question is what happens now? They still do the offensive anyway, pretty much knowing it’s going to be a blood bath? They already make statements about still needing support if an offensive fails (not much of an expectation). Posted by: Eighthman | Apr 8 2023 13:04 utc | 185 Posted by: rk | Apr 8 2023 10:33 utc | 169 Posted by: Paul Greenwood | Apr 8 2023 13:07 utc | 186 @ Eighthman | Apr 8 2023 13:04 utc | 185 Posted by: MAKK | Apr 8 2023 13:11 utc | 187 I think of Polish, Romanian, French and German troops Posted by: Paul Greenwood | Apr 8 2023 13:15 utc | 188 reply to 187 Posted by: Eighthman | Apr 8 2023 13:26 utc | 189 Posted by: Eighthman | Apr 8 2023 13:26 utc | 189 Posted by: unimperator | Apr 8 2023 13:39 utc | 190 reply to 190 Posted by: Eighthman | Apr 8 2023 13:46 utc | 191 https://www.globaltimes.cn/page/202304/1288707.shtml Posted by: Arminius | Apr 8 2023 13:55 utc | 192 Madness
https://t.me/ukr_leaks_eng/1964 Posted by: Norwegian | Apr 8 2023 13:56 utc | 193 Facing critical ammunition shortage, Ukrainian troops ration shells WAPO, Apr8’23, archive.today
The question of Russia’s ridiculously discounted oil sales to India, and others, has been perplexing me for awhile now, however I think I’ve found my answer. Based on RT’s own admission, Russia sells insanely cheap oil to India. India raises the price to match the price cap set on Russian oil and then sells it to the EU. This makes perfect sense, because if India, and others, were making too much profit off the sales, the EU and the USA would retaliate in a major way, yet they havent, which is very telling. It also explains, why the EU has had plenty of oil supplies this whole time. Posted by: Deplorable Commissar | Apr 8 2023 14:28 utc | 195 @ rjb1.5 39 Posted by: JessDTruth | Apr 8 2023 14:32 utc | 196 Anything written by the MSM is false. So if the MSM is telling you Ukraine is out of shells it means they have surpluss. If they are leaking stories about an attack in the sount, the attack is going to be in the north. Posted by: steve | Apr 8 2023 14:40 utc | 197 Putin stating the obvious. Posted by: Deplorable Commissar | Apr 8 2023 14:53 utc | 198 “The great Alexander Cockburn” was a POS, too. Using the word “left” in describing anything domestic US is an equal fail. Lumping antiwar activists? Fail. Posted by: Not Ewe | Apr 8 2023 15:17 utc | 199 About those “leaked” documents. Most Russian channels are poohpoohing them, Readovka for example. Poorly constructed from open sources with lots of contradictions in them. Posted by: Slat1 | Apr 8 2023 15:20 utc | 200 |
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