Only for news & views directly related to the Ukraine conflict.
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April 26, 2023
Ukraine Open Thread 2023-100
Only for news & views directly related to the Ukraine conflict. The current open thread for other issues is here. Please stick to the topic. Contribute facts. Do not attack other commentators.
Comments
So Xi Jingping finally talked to Zelensky. But why now? Posted by: mikee | Apr 26 2023 14:43 utc | 1 (Taken from what is now a dead thread on “b”‘s article “Biden Prepares To Give Up On Ukraine”.) Posted by: English Outsider | Apr 26 2023 14:44 utc | 2 Last Night Posted by: Dave Oneil | Apr 26 2023 14:50 utc | 3 ” I. “Historical” questions: Posted by: Deplorable Commissar | Apr 26 2023 14:57 utc | 4 Ukraine is going to be partitioned, and I believe cease to exist. Parts being absorbed by the neighboring countries, including Russia. The die hard Ukrainians, who are still alive, will move, most likely to Germany and Poland. The people staying behind will assimilate. Posted by: g wiltek | Apr 26 2023 14:58 utc | 5 ” . Eventually, Primakov introduced Kissinger to Putin, and they became close. That both Primakov and Kissinger took time to coach Putin on geopolitics and geosecurity was a clear demonstration that they saw in him the characteristics of a powerful leader. It also showed Putin’s capacity for listening to lengthy lessons on geopolitics — as I was soon to learn.” Posted by: Deplorable Commissar | Apr 26 2023 15:01 utc | 6 Everyone knew Ukraine never had a hope in hell. Just another bunch of useful idiots obeying their masters in the US. This whole ordeal has opened the eyes of the ROW to the absolute mafia style of the west and their lackeys. Russia exposes their BS on a daily basis which is far more important than winning outright in the conflict. Russia can continue to wear down and eliminate the threat on their border until all objectives are met. There will be no ceasefire or peace agreement unless it is exactly what Russia wants. Ukraine and the west will never agree to the terms so the SMO will continue on as long as it takes. Posted by: Watzov | Apr 26 2023 15:05 utc | 7 THE COUNTEROFFENSIVE IS ALREADY UNDERWAY IN SMALL STEPS – HUMENIUK Posted by: Paul Norway | Apr 26 2023 15:09 utc | 8 Ukrainians are saying, and looks like it, that Russia is on the defensive across the whole front except for trying to finish taking bahkmut where they are simply destroying every building left so it’s a done deal now, but the Ukrainians insist on making them do it so it’ll be done whenever. Posted by: Neofeudalfuture | Apr 26 2023 15:11 utc | 9 “Biden Prepares To Give Up On Ukraine”. Posted by: maskazer | Apr 26 2023 15:19 utc | 10 @English Outsider | 2
That was not really unexpected. That is the exact same strategy they employed in Syria: a small force, small enough to be economically sustainable, but strong enough to do the job. The U.S. (and allies) are trying to attract Russia in some quagmire, Georgia, Syria, Armenia and Azerbaijian, now Ukraine, for some time now. They failed, but they’ll try again. That is why I am saying, since the beginning of this war, that Russia beating Ukraine means nothing: they need to beat NATO and then try to disrupt NATO, i.e. driving a wedge in the “alliance”. Posted by: SG | Apr 26 2023 15:28 utc | 11
Posted by: English Outsider | Apr 26 2023 14:44 utc | 2 Posted by: First Time Poster | Apr 26 2023 15:34 utc | 12 ” 2) Why were outright swindlers put at the head of the People’s Republics of Donbass, who discredited the ideas of the Russian Spring by the very fact of their presence in power? How and in what way were the most famous heroes of 2014, commanders of the militia, physically eliminated? Who bore or will bear responsibility for the fact that instead of a “showcase of the Russian World” in the LDNR, for 8 years there was a swamp in which people lived much worse than in the Russian Federation and worse than in Ukraine? ” Posted by: Deplorable Commissar | Apr 26 2023 15:38 utc | 13 On a lighter note. . .
Posted by: Don Bacon | Apr 26 2023 15:39 utc | 14 This fast war crap: Russia can produce more arms than people. They are fighting to preserve human capital, because some Russian finally figured out how to calculate human life value. They are outproducing NATO and destroying NATO military assets. How long did it take to train all those officers killed with a Kinzhal. Modern war moves slowly. Sorry it doesn’t match a video-trained attention span. @maskazer 10 Posted by: San | Apr 26 2023 15:51 utc | 16 As it was buried deep in the Biden thread, here again: Posted by: CM of Berlin | Apr 26 2023 15:59 utc | 17 San 16 Posted by: Rob Campbell | Apr 26 2023 16:06 utc | 18 As blindingly dense as the fog of war competently tries to be and remembering my saying one could, it seems, deliver the Italian Alps into Ukraine quietly, it’s quite possible this war in Ukraine could reveal weapons not acknowledged by the US or even known to the Russians. War, the ultimate anything goes disaster, may well disrupt the current battle prognoses with something even more reprehensible than the current slaughter, especially concerning weapons deployments. Posted by: Elmagnostic | Apr 26 2023 16:06 utc | 19 LOL Posted by: Zamom | Apr 26 2023 16:08 utc | 20 Can any guess what their solution to this particular problem will be? I’ve been pondering it for the best part of a year now and still can’t. Posted by: Exile | Apr 26 2023 16:09 utc | 21 @Zamom | Apr 26 2023 16:08 utc | 20 Posted by: Norwegian | Apr 26 2023 16:10 utc | 22 Norweigan Posted by: Zamom. | Apr 26 2023 16:13 utc | 23
I’d suggest that a major part of Russia’s strategy has been to make western Ukrainians emigrate to the EU, caused by the slow degradation of the Ukrainian electricity grid. More than 10 million have emigrated, and few will want to return after the war. Posted by: Contrarian_Ed | Apr 26 2023 16:15 utc | 24 Posted by: Norwegian | Apr 26 2023 16:10 utc | 22 Posted by: Chris | Apr 26 2023 16:18 utc | 25 San | Apr 26 2023 15:51 utc | 16 Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Apr 26 2023 16:22 utc | 26 Posted by: Norwegian | Apr 26 2023 16:10 utc | 22 Posted by: CM of Berlin | Apr 26 2023 16:24 utc | 27 Oh, and the #1 boys name in England and Wales in 2021 was one of the 4 variants of “Mohammed”. Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Apr 26 2023 16:24 utc | 28 Ukraine has lost probably over half of the military base in the center of Bakhmut and getting smoked out of the high rise building area. The cauldron has really shrunk / is shrinking fast now. Posted by: unimperator | Apr 26 2023 16:26 utc | 29 Can Russia not sit in the Donbas or up to the Dneiper river and keep the power off in West Ukraine and the economy dead causing a financial, military and political black hole for the west until a friendly gov’t overthroes the fascists? West Ukraine is critical to secure the Balkans and Russians few European allies of Hungary and Serbia. Posted by: Jo | Apr 26 2023 16:33 utc | 30 BREAKING NEWS | SIGNIFICANT RUSSIAN BREAKTHROUGH | Bakhmut Front Update 26/04/23 Posted by: Don Firineach | Apr 26 2023 16:35 utc | 31
It’s funny but the Irish have been asking that question for quite a while now. Posted by: Due West | Apr 26 2023 16:36 utc | 32 Chinese readout of Xi-Zelensky phone conversation
https://www.eastisread.com/p/chinese-readout-of-xi-zelensky-phone Posted by: too scents | Apr 26 2023 16:36 utc | 33 Posted by: English Outsider | Apr 26 2023 14:44 utc | 2 Posted by: Archie P | Apr 26 2023 16:37 utc | 34 @ English Outsider, §2: Posted by: John Marks | Apr 26 2023 16:42 utc | 35 Global Times reports on the Xi-Zelensky phone call, “Xi says dialogue only viable way out for Ukraine crisis”, with the following being its most important content:
Interesting this wasn’t done yesterday so it could become a topic at Lavrov’s presser. Yes, Russia’s MFA was questioned about the call, which will provide the content for my next comment. Given future economic conditions in Europe, it seems likely the Ukrainian refugees will form cartels, along with the prior refugee populations from the Middle East and Africa. Those RPGs and machine guns will come in handy. Posted by: John Merryman | Apr 26 2023 16:46 utc | 37 Posted by: too scents | Apr 26 2023 16:36 utc | 33 Posted by: unimperator | Apr 26 2023 16:50 utc | 38 @31: Posted by: Chris | Apr 26 2023 16:53 utc | 39 Maria Zakharova on the Xi-Zelensky call:
So, it seems Moscow’s assessment is it’s just more theatre, action without substance, although it does seem to be intended to put pressure on team Biden. Xi, in other words, has threshed empty straw with Zel. Posted by: Oberbayer | Apr 26 2023 16:55 utc | 41 @Mikee 1 Posted by: Orchard 1 | Apr 26 2023 16:55 utc | 42 g wiltek @ 5 and Contrarian Ed @ 24 get it. Posted by: oldhippie | Apr 26 2023 16:56 utc | 43 Don Firineach @ 31 Posted by: young | Apr 26 2023 16:58 utc | 44 I see we have a genocide enthusiast with us. That’s the only drawback to open comments 🙁 Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Apr 26 2023 17:04 utc | 45 17 CM of Berlin said: Posted by: Ramsey Glissadevil | Apr 26 2023 17:04 utc | 46 Due West @ 32 Posted by: young | Apr 26 2023 17:08 utc | 47 @ English Outsider #2 Posted by: fanto | Apr 26 2023 17:10 utc | 48
Doesn’t work. Chernigov/Sumy is a huge strategic vulnerability and needs to be under firm control. Even if it has in fact been surprisingly Banderized over these last three decades.
Bessarabia isn’t anti-Russian. Where did that idea come from? It’s also not Romanian. Posted by: shadowbanned | Apr 26 2023 17:12 utc | 49 Ramsey Glissadevil | Apr 26 2023 17:04 utc | 46 Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Apr 26 2023 17:14 utc | 50
There still is, but it’s mostly old people who grew up in the USSR. Posted by: shadowbanned | Apr 26 2023 17:14 utc | 51 Back to the first comment, “why now?” Posted by: Chris | Apr 26 2023 17:14 utc | 52 @2 the only solution to remnant ukraine is that it can’t pose a threat. There’s two ways that works Posted by: Neofeudalfuture | Apr 26 2023 17:14 utc | 53 Another clue that the Xi-Xelensky call was abrupt, and not on Z’s terms: Posted by: Chris | Apr 26 2023 17:18 utc | 54 One more take on Bakhmut. It may be an unpopular opinion, but the reason why there wasn’t a particular “de-blocking” operation, which has been expected for months, is actually that the 80k or 60k or whatever troops, that were supposedly earmarked for it, were mostly stripped and sent to Bakhmut and the immediate western outskirts. So there might not actually be a possibility for the “deblocking” operation. Posted by: unimperator | Apr 26 2023 17:23 utc | 55 @ English Outsider #2 Posted by: Jmaas | Apr 26 2023 17:26 utc | 56 Ramsey Glissadevil | Apr 26 2023 17:04 utc | 46 Posted by: olaf22 | Apr 26 2023 17:26 utc | 57 Posted by: unimperator | Apr 26 2023 17:23 utc | 55 Posted by: Chris | Apr 26 2023 17:27 utc | 58
https://t.me/rezident_ua/17471
Posted by: Down South | Apr 26 2023 17:38 utc | 59 Posted by: Zamom | Apr 26 2023 16:08 utc | 20 Posted by: MorePain4Cakes | Apr 26 2023 17:39 utc | 60 Posted by: olaf22 | Apr 26 2023 17:26 utc | 57 Posted by: Ramsey Glissadevil | Apr 26 2023 17:45 utc | 61 But I’ll not be holding my breath waiting for either. Posted by: MorePain4Cakes | Apr 26 2023 17:49 utc | 62 @ shadowbanned,§49: Posted by: John Marks | Apr 26 2023 17:52 utc | 63 Given future economic conditions in Europe, it seems likely the Ukrainian refugees will form cartels, along with the prior refugee populations from the Middle East and Africa. Those RPGs and machine guns will come in handy.” Posted by: Elmer Fudd | Apr 26 2023 17:59 utc | 64 I see we have the reiteration of a well known Anti-Human troll in our midst yet again. Please let it starve.
I recall a world famous film from the 1960s where it’s lead male character says “the British need to set a good example” for the use of the English language and other forms of behavior. Unfortunately, it appears British leadership now inhabits the bottom of the swine trough from which it feeds and where it clearly seems satisfied to dwell. I have been trying to come up with a way that the US and NATO can pull out of this insanity of their in Ukraine without taking a mortal blow to their reputation and standing in the world community and without the total collapse of the faith of their brainwashed public. I cannot come up with one. They are in too deep. Literally their only hope is Russia allows a face saving way out. Posted by: JustAMaverick | Apr 26 2023 18:11 utc | 66 It’s no coincidence that, as has been pointed out here recently, Galicia’s leading literary figure was the author of Venus in Furs, the man immortalised in Krafft Ebing’s coining of the word ‘Masochist’. Posted by: bevin | Apr 26 2023 18:12 utc | 67 Posted by: Elmer Fudd | Apr 26 2023 17:59 utc | 64 Posted by: unimperator | Apr 26 2023 18:13 utc | 68 English Outsider@2 Posted by: bevin | Apr 26 2023 18:21 utc | 69 @English Outsider #387 & #2 here Posted by: Don Firineach | Apr 26 2023 18:24 utc | 70 @Contrarian_Ed
Explains a lot of the pro-Ukraine fervor here. Hell, the Deputy PM herself comes from Nazi/Banderite stock. Posted by: Frank McGar | Apr 26 2023 18:24 utc | 71 I just posted the following comment on the non-Ukraine thread, but it certainly concerns Ukraine so I’m also posting it here. @AaronLee in what fantasy world is the “primitive” Ukrainian army (that might be the appropriate adjective, but note that this is also at least the second best army in Nato) holding Bakhmut? Human shields and human wave tactics and an extreme disregard for the lives of Ukrainian soldiers have caused Russia to take a cautious approach, but this is not Stalingrad. Bakhmut is lost along with all the battalions wasted. Posted by: JT | Apr 26 2023 18:34 utc | 73 bevin: In terms of prominence in Germanophone literature one would have to rate Joseph Roth far above Leopold von S&M. But the latter is much more famous in the Anglophone world because the former’s novels translate so poorly, and poor Roth didn’t have the privilege of getting a kink named after himself. Posted by: malenkov | Apr 26 2023 18:39 utc | 74 @ English Outsider | Apr 26 2023 14:44 utc | 2 Posted by: MAKK | Apr 26 2023 18:52 utc | 75 Don Firineach@70….Russia will use the Chechen formula, local Ukrainians will nullify any Brit Bandit Brigade. How many Ukrainians on the Russian side have a score to settle with the Banderites….expect much blood letting, denazifcation be like that. Posted by: sean the leprechaun | Apr 26 2023 18:56 utc | 76 Anyone who doesn’t read the Bandera Blog is missing a lot: (the really bad stuff always begins in Canada) Posted by: bevin | Apr 26 2023 19:03 utc | 77 malenkov@74 Posted by: bevin | Apr 26 2023 19:06 utc | 78 The old 2S7 “pawns” turned “Malka” returned to college. Posted by: la bouteille | Apr 26 2023 19:10 utc | 79 @ bevin, §§67, 69: Posted by: John Marks | Apr 26 2023 19:16 utc | 80 If ever there was a left-liberal foe doing the bidding for the National Endowment for Democracy (NED) while pretending to speak for the “left,” Dr. Lawrence Wittner, a Professor of History emeritus at SUNY/Albany, must be at the top of the list. Posted by: Ed | Apr 26 2023 19:17 utc | 81 Posted by: karlof1 | Apr 26 2023 18:06 utc | 65 Posted by: Milites | Apr 26 2023 19:20 utc | 82 Judging Freedom & Macgregor up 23 minutes ago Posted by: AG | Apr 26 2023 19:30 utc | 83 78 – Roth was a polyglot Galician Jew whose work shows considerable nostalgia for Austria-Hungary. Mainly a reaction to postwar turmoil. (He was quite aware of the Danube Monarchy’s many weaknesses.) Hasek was contemptuous of Austria-Hungary, though after capture by the Russians in 1915 he took over half a year to go over to the Czechoslovak Legion – many Czech and Slovak POWs said yes to its recruiters the minute they were approached. Posted by: Waldorf | Apr 26 2023 19:32 utc | 84 @English Outsider, Posted by: Loncal | Apr 26 2023 19:33 utc | 85 John Marks: You say Austria is neutral, which is formally true, but you then correctly demonstrate how it really isn’t. As for the FPÖ, its chances of attaining a parliamentary majority are nil, and you can guess where the other three major parties stand on the matter of NATO vs. Russia. Posted by: malenkov | Apr 26 2023 19:35 utc | 86 What stood out for me of the Xi/Z conversation was that Z said that Ukraine supports the one China policy. Posted by: psychohistorian | Apr 26 2023 19:37 utc | 87 Don Firineach | 400 Posted by: Hereward | Apr 26 2023 19:38 utc | 88 John Marks@80 Posted by: bevin | Apr 26 2023 19:39 utc | 89 Waldorf: Yup. Someone who likes Hašek may not necessarily like Roth, and precisely because of the worldview. That, and Roth’s prose style loses a lot in translation. Posted by: malenkov | Apr 26 2023 19:40 utc | 90 “..Is this MI6 playing Biggles again?..” Hereward@88 Posted by: bevin | Apr 26 2023 19:45 utc | 91 Posted by: Don Firineach | Apr 26 2023 18:24 utc | 70 Posted by: unimperator | Apr 26 2023 19:48 utc | 92 Posted by: mikee | Apr 26 2023 14:43 utc | 1:
Why NOT now? The central part of this phone conversation was that China will send a special representative to Ukraine and other concerned nations to mediate a peace plan. Ukraine’s press release did not refute that, meaning they agreed to this process. So, NOW the peace process is rolling, even if the guns have not yet gone silent. Posted by: Oriental Voice | Apr 26 2023 19:49 utc | 93 @ Malenkov, §86: Posted by: John Marks | Apr 26 2023 19:50 utc | 94 karlof1 | Apr 26 2023 16:46 utc | 36 Posted by: Peter AU1 | Apr 26 2023 19:59 utc | 95 Posted by: karlof1 | Apr 26 2023 16:55 utc | 40: Posted by: Oriental Voice | Apr 26 2023 19:59 utc | 96 Russia will allow Poland, Hungary, and any other nation which lays claim to land currenly within the present Ukrainian State to be absorbed by anyone who wants the problems involved. Or Russia might do what it did to East Prussia make it a waste land for the next ten or twenty years then slowly develop it again. Posted by: Stritchplatte | Apr 26 2023 20:03 utc | 97 bevin | Apr 26 2023 19:45 utc | 91 Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Apr 26 2023 20:15 utc | 98 Posted by: Oriental Voice | Apr 26 2023 19:49 utc | 93 Posted by: Chris | Apr 26 2023 20:17 utc | 99 bevin | Apr 26 2023 19:45 utc | 91 Posted by: YetAnotherAnon | Apr 26 2023 20:20 utc | 100 |
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