Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
April 9, 2023
The MoA Week In Review – (Not Ukraine) OT 2023-85

Last week's post on Moon of Alabama:


Other issues:

Empire:

Ukraine:

Signs of the time:

The Island:

Use as open (not Ukraine related) thread …

Comments

In a world that makes no sense, where everything seems to be getting even worse, I have a question, a puzzle.
Bananas.
It may seem utterly trivial or irrelevant, but I and others have noticed that bananas have little or no flavor. At first it was just a batch or two: annoying, but it happens, and the next bunch will be better, right? But then quickly it was more than a few. And now it’s all of them. Organic or non, whether from Mexico or Honduras or Colombia or wherever, regardless of the brand name on the label. All of them. Bananas have no flavor.
Why? How? Yes, they’re all the same cloned variety, but they always have been. No matter their country of origin or mode of cultivation, none have any flavor. And it happened in the space of a few weeks or months.
Bananas?

Posted by: pasha | Apr 12 2023 2:51 utc | 201

which countries have followed the anti-vaxxer credo of superfraud robert ruling class fascist kennedy? zero.
oh, but thanks to the “economy,” with mighty few if any exceptions, every country has adopted rfk’s public health policies re covid, i.e., “let her rip. let the bodies pile up.”
so 0% of countries are with rfk on vaccines
but
100% of countries have adopted rfk’s in abandoning any and all other public health measures against covid.
that is real fucking cute.
the ruling class has won.
please donald trump and ron desantis, save us from the pederasts!

Posted by: rjb1.5 | Apr 12 2023 2:59 utc | 202

ZH has a posting up with the title
US Deems WSJ Reporter ‘Wrongfully Detained’ – Paving Way For Possible Swap
The quote

But the US State Department is already moving faster on Gershkovich’s case (again, compared to either Griner or ex-Marine Paul Whelan), given Secretary Blinken on Monday declared Gershkovich to be “wrongfully detained” by Russia.
“Today, Secretary Blinken made a determination that Evan Gershkovich is wrongfully detained by Russia,” State Department spokesman Vedant Patel said in the statement.
“Journalism is not a crime. We condemn the Kremlin’s continued repression of independent voices in Russia, and its ongoing war against the truth.”
Patel continued, “The U.S. government will provide all appropriate support to Mr. Gershkovich and his family. We call for the Russian Federation to immediately release Mr. Gershkovich.”
The change of an imprisoned citizen’s status to “wrongfully detained” means the US can legally approach the case as a hostage negotiation and thus use all available means to obtain their release, including potential prisoner swap, as was controversially done with the WNBA’s Griner. At this point, the Special Presidential Envoy for Hostage Affairs can get involved, utilizing interagency resources as well.
Interestingly, it took some months for Griner to be declared wrongfully detained, which is what ultimately led to her being swapped for Russian arms trafficker Viktor Bout; but in Gershkovich’s case, it has only taken a few weeks. This suggests the US administration wants to see him back quickly.
Is another high-profile prisoner swap with Russia already being negotiated and planned?

Posted by: psychohistorian | Apr 12 2023 3:14 utc | 203

Below is a ZH posting title needing no further comment
Biden Signs Bill Formally Ending COVID-19 Public Health Emergency

Posted by: psychohistorian | Apr 12 2023 3:16 utc | 204

the alleys that the homeless kids of america pee and poop in are, i am sad to report, sometimes “unisex.”
my neighbor state is expanding child labor and in other notable ways adopting a pro-family agenda, like pursuing across state lines women who want to get an abortion pill. and forbidding anything of “gender-affirming care.” while passing out guns. and KJV versions of the bible.
meanwhile, my state of Washington, is all about affirmation, safe spaces, positivity, “we are all autistic”, etc., etc.
but in reality my state spends about 10000% more resources chasing down kids getting “illegal” food welfare benefits than it does in any kind of affirmation of anything at all. other than profit-taking via the lottery and student loan debt. and evicting people from their homes. and putting up fences all over the place.
once you scratch beneath the posters in the nurse’s office at school, at schools that are lucky to have a nurse that is, the kids in “liberal” Washington and “conservative” neighbor Idaho have it pretty much the same. none of them eat food or get a good night’s sleep. all their problems are in some way “medicalized” if not criminalized. ritalin, anyone? bipolar 3 year olds?
but look! jon bonet ramsey is on the runway…
if someone wants to get in to caring for kids, why not get all into I.C.E.’s butt crack? or the local jail?
cuz. same reason people “care” about fetuses.

Posted by: rjb1.5 | Apr 12 2023 3:22 utc | 205

https://www.jta.org/2023/02/27/global/frankfurt-cancels-roger-waters-concert-calling-him-one-of-the-worlds-most-well-known-antisemites
Waters should sue the city and principal figures involved for slander.
If it’s good enough for Alex Jones . . . .
And the conflation of Semite and Hebrew on the one hand, and race and ethnicity on the other, is a hallmark both of such hard Zionist–essentially Jewish ethnicist and racist supremacist–and “neo-Nazi” propaganda.

Posted by: John Kennard | Apr 12 2023 5:18 utc | 206

From Xinhuanet

THE HAGUE, April 11 (Xinhua) — French President Emmanuel Macron emphasized the importance of “European sovereignty” on Tuesday during a state visit to the Netherlands.
Delivering a speech at the Amare Theater in The Hague, Macron stressed that the concept of European sovereignty is “extremely important.”
“Identity and sovereignty are intertwined,” he said. “If you accept to lose your sovereignty, if you accept to depend on other powers, you put yourself in a situation not to decide for yourself, and not to be in charge of precisely continuing preserving and developing your own identity.”
It means that “we must be able to choose our partners and shape our own destiny rather than being, I would say, a mere witness of the dramatic evolution of this world,” he said.
“Pandemic and war have just pushed us to discover that we have to reduce our dependency if you want to preserve your European identity,” he added.
Macron started a two-day state visit to the Netherlands on Tuesday at the invitation of Dutch King Willem-Alexander.
Macron’s visit will “reaffirm the excellent ties between the two countries,” the Dutch Royalty said in a press release.
The two countries are “working together towards European strategic autonomy while preserving an open economy, which will enhance the European Union’s security and make it less dependent,” the release said.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Apr 12 2023 5:49 utc | 207

From Xinhuanet

BEIJING, April 11 (Xinhua) — China will work with Brazil and take President Luiz Inacio Lula da Silva’s upcoming visit as an opportunity to promote the upgrading of mutually beneficial cooperation in various fields, Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesperson Wang Wenbin said on Tuesday.
Wang made the remarks during a daily news briefing when asked about Lula’s state visit to China from April 12 to 15.
After Lula postponed his visit to China due to illness, the two sides have been in close communication on the visit, according to the spokesperson.
Lula will lead a large delegation to China shortly after his recovery, which shows how both sides have attached great importance to this visit and the development of bilateral relations, Wang said.
He added that the two countries will work together to upgrade mutually beneficial cooperation in various fields, which will inject positive energy into the promotion of solidarity and cooperation among developing countries and joint efforts to cope with global challenges.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Apr 12 2023 5:55 utc | 208

Hopeful news.
https://weltwoche.ch/daily/nationalrat-gegen-notkredit-das-parlament-sagt-nein-zum-109-milliarden-kredit-fuer-den-cs-ubs-deal/

machine translated
Parliament rejects the 109 billion credit for the merger of the big banks UBS and CS for the time being.
While the Council of States approved the 109-billion-franc emergency loan, the National Council rejected the project shortly before midnight by 102 votes to 71.
The deal thus goes back to the Council of States.

Posted by: too scents | Apr 12 2023 8:16 utc | 209

200 – Olivia Manning in “The Balkan Trilogy” described being evacuated from Greece in 1941. She said a British or Australian soldier threw her a banana – the refugees had little in the way of food with them. She wrote that “it tasted like a flower”. I presume that means it had little or no taste.

Posted by: Waldorf | Apr 12 2023 8:53 utc | 210

@ too scents | Apr 12 2023 8:16 utc | 208
thanks! that is interesting.. see how it develops..

Posted by: james | Apr 12 2023 15:02 utc | 211

Do you believe the following?
Buffett: ‘Nobody is going to lose money’ in a US bank

Posted by: psychohistorian | Apr 12 2023 15:20 utc | 212

I really shouldn’t be surprised at all the redirects and deflections received while asking a simple question, whether something is appropriate or inappropriate…sign of the times, eh?

Posted by: nathan in WA US | Apr 12 2023 16:58 utc | 213

Posted by: pasha | Apr 12 2023 2:51 utc | 201
Yes, I’ve experienced that too, and don’t eat them as often as I used to because of it. Another consideration is shipping, could the shipping bottlenecks and delays caused banana shipments to linger where they shouldn’t have, or shipping methods were changed, that degraded its quality?

Posted by: nathan in WA US | Apr 12 2023 17:07 utc | 214

Do you believe the following?
Buffett: ‘Nobody is going to lose money’ in a US bank
Posted by: psychohistorian | Apr 12 2023 15:20 utc | 212
I never believe anything I read or hear about economic matters, never. You are better off knowing nothing, and knowing that you know nothing, than believing any of the self-serving blather written about it. It is just like politics, there are no disinterested parties serving only the public good.

Posted by: Bemildred | Apr 12 2023 17:22 utc | 215

Nathan: In a school setting, the only thing kids (certainly at the preadolescent level) is that trans people are people too, and unless they’re hurting you, you treat them as you would like to be treated yourself. That’s the Golden Rule. Of course I do realize that most Christians, and more than a few non-Christians, have as little use for the Golden Rule as they do for the warm-fuzzy side of Jesus.
Cavendish bananas have always been an inferior product, bred for durability rather than flavor. Find an Asian market with Thai bananas (grown in Mexico of course)—vastly superior in flavor.

Posted by: malenkov | Apr 12 2023 17:29 utc | 216

*the only thing kids need to know/hear

Posted by: malenkov | Apr 12 2023 17:31 utc | 217

I really shouldn’t be surprised at all the redirects and deflections received while asking a simple question, whether something is appropriate or inappropriate…sign of the times, eh?
Posted by: nathan in WA US | Apr 12 2023 16:58 utc | 213
In general, things are precisely appropriate or inappropriate according to circumstances, not regardless of them, so in general, it is not possible to say whether something is appropriate or not without going into the circumstances. That is, it is not really a simple question.
“All truth is simple.” Is that not doubly a lie? — FW Nietzsche

Posted by: Bemildred | Apr 12 2023 17:35 utc | 218

@nathan in WA US | Apr 12 2023 0:01 utc | 189
@malenkov | Apr 11 2023 23:12 utc | 188
“I said nothing about being ‘forced'”
If it is not forced, then it is optional, so just avoid it instead of making a fuss.
“You are sidestepping the fact that it is inappropriate for children.”
Not at all. You have already stipulated that it is the parent’s choice, so unless you are changing your mind about that, you don’t get to make that determination for any children but your own.
“How convenient for you to compare it to violence and murder to deflect the core point I’m making – it is clearly inappropriate.”
I agree that violence and murder are clearly inappropriate – and not just for children. So why are you not focused on that, rather than being upset about non-issues like, entirely optional “drag shows or gay parades”?
“I’ve seen with my own eyes over the years how the exposure of children to adult-themed shit by careless parents has obviously gotten worse.”
Then don’t be a careless parent. The evidence is compelling that actual violence is an actual problem, in comparison to your surmised and inarticulable dangers of entirely optional “drag shows or gay parades”. The reality in the USA is that:
At least 1 in 7 children have experienced child abuse and/or neglect in the past year, and this is likely an underestimate. In 2019, 1,840 children died of abuse and neglect in the United States.
Each day, more than 1,000 youth are treated in emergency departments for physical assault-related injuries.
In 2019, about 1 in 5 high school students reported being bullied on school property in the last year.
8% of high school students had been in a physical fight on school property one or more times during the 12 months before the survey.
Each day, about 14 youth die from homicide, and more than 1,300 are treated in emergency departments for violence-related injuries.
Again these are real issues requiring a response. Entirely optional “drag shows or gay parades” are not actually an issue at all. If you prefer to ensure that your children be shocked and stunned when they eventually discover that these things exist and are a thing, possibly being traumatized by the experience, that is your choice. It doesn’t sound sensible to me, but as long as abuse is not involved, knock yourself out
As malenkov sensibly pointed out, when children are introduced to the world cautiously, by careful parents or trained educators who do not become hysterical, nothing non-violent need be an issue. Let me provide examples.
Appropriate reaction:

Daddy, daddy, what are you doing to mommy?
We are making a baby sibling darling.
Daddy, daddy, turn mommy over at once! I don’t want a sibling, I want puppies.
… Child returns quietly to bed and drops off back to sleep. No trauma.

Inappropriate reaction

Daddy, daddy, what are you doing to mommy?
Mommy scream “You forgot to lock the door and now our child is traumatized for life.”
Daddy, “Locking the door is your responsibility idiot!” Bitchslaps Mommy upside the head.
Both parents scream at the child, who stays awake all night wondering if the family is going to break-up and wondering what they did wrong but knowing that everything is their fault. Lifelong trauma ensues.

Lacking any support, I don’t know what you saw at the entirely optional “drag shows or gay parades” you elected to attend, which children participated, where you took part in them, or even if you can substantiate your claims, but anecdotes are not evidence of anything, not even alleged trauma. For that you need research. A good place to begin is how well adjusted each generation is, and GenX tend to be far better adjusted than prior generations despite US leaving them, broke, living on their parents and grand-parents pensions and income, with a fucked planet and dubious future. We know that privacy, including separate rooms and even beds is a very recent concept, which means that every human before the modern age experienced “adult-themed shit” without incapacitating trauma despite a total lack of educators and therapists to resolve any issues resulting from this. Studies reflect that Soviet citizens were veru well adjusted, even though communal family life completely lacking in privacy, which meant that many lived through “adult-themed shit” including sex, alcohol abuse and physical violence probably because they had effective therapeutic support and were taught self-criticism, both of which being largely inaccessible in the US, except for children in public schools who have limited access to psychologists.
Studies show that the worst traumatic damage is not done by non-violent experiences, but by family and social reactions, which cue children into how to respond to things. Access to psychiatric and psychological support and trained trauma councillors can prevent debilitating reactions that can result in long term effects. In other words, a critical part of children’s recovery is having a supportive caregiving system, access to effective treatments, and service systems that are trauma informed. This is significantly more important than avoiding “drag shows or gay parades”, but I don’t see Americans insisting on this. Instead, they appear to be hysterical about entirely optional “drag shows or gay parades”. This is not a mystery. Incessant streams of propaganda are directed at the population about the imaginary and inarticulable threats from entirely optional “drag shows or gay parades” in order to distract and divide by terrifying, horrifying and annoying the susceptible population.
“Sure it’s the parent’s choice,
Yes, it is. You have stipulated to that.
what great results we’re seeing.”
I’m not sure to what you are referring to by that. Better adjusted children, yes, we are seeing that. Increased chaos, we are seeing that too. In both cases, multi-variate analysis would be required to distinguish cause and effect. Do you even know what that is, let alone possess evidence reflecting that it has been undertaken, yielding these results?

Posted by: Hermit | Apr 12 2023 20:21 utc | 219

@#Grieved | Apr 12 2023 0:46 utc | 190
Now, I don’t have any sources to back this up,

sI never thought one would need to build a file in order to present evidence to people so immersed in their own picture of reality that they will argue from ignorance rather than open up to new thoughts.
A mirror might prove to be a great investment!
PS re
One child spoke back to a performer and said there were only two sexes, M-F. The performer came back with something like: “You’re hurting me by saying that” or words to that effect, directly engaging with the (male) kid who obviously had been taught correctly by his parents.
Putting my medical hat on, this is complete nonsense. Not only are their many genetic sexes, not all of which are necessarily fatal, we do not perform DNA tests at birth to assign sex, nor do we analyse DNA to determine where on the gender continuum a person is likely to end-up. Instead we look cursorily at the external genitalia and make a call. Sometimes things might be adjusted although the incidence is declining as we learn more about gender and grant patients more autonomy in determining their future. It is not the DNA that determines the self-perception of sex. That is the brain. Today we recognize that and the fact that a difference between self-perception and external sexual characteristics can be misaligned, and that children tend to recognize this at a very early age. When this happens, the prognosis for the person is not good, usually leading to depression and self-Harm from mutilation to suicide. So we provide supportive therapy and when indicated, treatment. In prepubescent patients, the recognized standard of care is to provide clinical treatment which delays puberty, allowing patients to determine for themselves what they want to do, understanding that there are costs and risks involved and that sex-reassignment is forever, without having to deal with the added psychological and physiological results caused by development of secondary sexual characteristics.
It is a great pity that the performer did not understand this and instead fell back on guilt-projection, a form of bullying, at the child.It is an even greater pity that no educator or other was present, knowledgeable and willing to address this. In my opinion, that is the problem with this anecdote, and why I would arrange appropriate therapy for my child, and might sue a school had something like this occurred involving my daughter.

Posted by: Hermit | Apr 12 2023 20:58 utc | 220

@rjb1.5 | Apr 12 2023 2:02 utc | 194
Thank-you for the encouragement 🙂

Posted by: Hermit | Apr 12 2023 21:01 utc | 221

@Peter AU1 | Apr 12 2023 2:08 utc | 196
@b

Posted by: Hermit | Apr 12 2023 21:02 utc | 222

@pasha | Apr 12 2023 2:51 utc | 201
We have been in a transition from a variety called the Gros Michel, or Big Mike to one called the Cavendish banana of the AAA banana cultivar since the 1950s when the Gros Michel was devastated by Panama disease. The Panama strain has a different flavor, but is tougher when green, which is how they are harvested, and chemically ripened, easing transport difficulties. Flavor, has been an unfortunate cost of this transition.

Posted by: Hermit | Apr 12 2023 21:13 utc | 223

@nathan in WA US | Apr 12 2023 16:58 utc | 213
But you did not ask that. You agreed that it is “up to the parents”. That’s a good simplification. Not perfect, because sometimes the parents are not competent to make decisions, or are incapable of contextualizing things in such a way as to prevent trauma, or are themselves too traumatized to help their children, or thing may be so awful that they should not be minimized. And definitely not a simple question, because any answer would be totally dependent on so many conditions that no easy answer is possible, other than that judgement is required, but for most situations, letting the parents decide until the children can choose for themselves is an adequate approach.
@rjb1.5 | Apr 12 2023 3:22 utc | 205
Great contribution to the discussion.
@Bemildred | Apr 12 2023 17:35 utc | 218
Snap! (Or as America’s might say, “Jinx”. And a wonderful quotation too. Along the same lines, I like Einstein’s “Things should be as simple as possible, but no simpler!”

Posted by: Hermit | Apr 12 2023 23:51 utc | 224

@John Kennard | Apr 12 2023 5:18 utc | 206
Waters is not only a great musician and a wonderful human, he is a hero for standing up for the oppressed Palestinians against genocidal Israel – and the belligerent US and servile UK over Massage.
Sadly, he probably could not prevail in a German Court, where history and facts appear to be irrelevant. See the trials of David Irving and Ursula Haverbeck for example.

Posted by: Hermit | Apr 12 2023 23:59 utc | 225

@Waldorf | Apr 12 2023 8:53 utc | 210
Here, flower is a homonym. If she had said it tasted of flour, I would have agreed, but flowers have complex scents and flavors which I think is more likely to what she was alluding.

Posted by: Hermit | Apr 13 2023 0:03 utc | 226

Snap! (Or as America’s might say, “Jinx”. And a wonderful quotation too. Along the same lines, I like Einstein’s “Things should be as simple as possible, but no simpler!”
Posted by: Hermit | Apr 12 2023 23:51 utc | 224
Aye, where to draw the line, that’s always the rub. But Wm. of Occam said it sooner.
Reading Nietzsche was more than fifty years ago, but he made a big impression at the time. A better source for snappy sayings than deep thoughts, but I still keep some of his observations around. I am a literary packrat.

Posted by: Bemildred | Apr 13 2023 0:12 utc | 227

@Bemildred | Apr 12 2023 17:22 utc | 215
“I never believe anything I read or hear about economic matters, never. You are better off knowing nothing, and knowing that you know nothing, than believing”
For me it is simpler, “I never believe anything I read or hear”, because of my problems with ‘belief’*.
I wait for evidence before assigning provisional truth values to assertions. I.e. Weyken. «Weyken: is significant intersubjectively verifiable provisional knowledge preferably derived by means of application of the scientific method (which is the end result of the proper application of agnosticism) to proximal and compelling evidence. Weyken is a provisional, mutable, revocable, testable datum or data agglomeration which has been intersubjectively verified.» [ex my Glossary]
May I again recommend «Kate Raworth explores this brilliantly in her 2017-03 -22 book, “Doughnut Economics: Seven Ways to Think Like a 21st-Century Economist”» from my Economics Rebooted.
*Belief: Usually the assignment of a truth value in the face of compelling confounding intersubjectively verifiable evidence, or occasionally the assignment of a truth value in the absence of sufficient intersubjectively verifiable supporting evidence. When sufficient intersubjectively verifiable supporting evidence is present, belief is not required, merely observation, evaluation, and acceptance of the preponderance of the evidence.
This follows from the dictionary definition of belief:
Belief:

“Assent to a proposition or affirmation, or the acceptance of a fact, opinion, or assertion as real or true, without immediate personal knowledge; reliance upon word or testimony; partial or full assurance without positive knowledge or absolute certainty; persuasion; conviction; confidence; as, belief of a witness; the belief of our senses.” –Webster’s Revised Unabridged Dictionary (1913)

From this it follows that belief can only occur where acceptance is not compelled, for if acceptance is compelled, then belief is not required to accept that thing.
Belief is thus the acceptance of some thing as being provisionally true where:
– contradictory evidence exists which throws doubt upon or compels the rejection of the thing being accepted as truth.
– insufficient evidence exists to compel or suggest acceptance of the thing as truth.
[Also ex my Glossary]
“You are better off knowing nothing, and knowing that you know nothing, than believing””
No better proverb to live by than this, even if it is reminiscent of the ‘Socratic Paradox’, “For I was conscious that I knew practically nothing…” (Plato; Trans. Fowler, Harold North (1966). Plato, Apology 22d,).

Posted by: Hermit | Apr 13 2023 0:49 utc | 228

No better proverb to live by than this, even if it is reminiscent of the ‘Socratic Paradox’, “For I was conscious that I knew practically nothing…” (Plato; Trans. Fowler, Harold North (1966). Plato, Apology 22d,).
Posted by: Hermit | Apr 13 2023 0:49 utc | 228
I think the basic point is not to get attached to your ideas, which after all are mainly borrowed and at best handy simplifications.
Admitted this a deep subject, I think experience is the best teacher, and then you hardly need to think about it at all. One builds up a superstructure of language, as you are doing, and are satisfied with it, but then still wind up depending mostly on habit, in daily life, which is after all something you do, and talk about afterwards.
And you find the language was just a handy tool to help you see. If you don’t like what you see, you can find a better way to talk about it.
I looked into Ms Raworth, she looks like my kind of gal. Assuming there are any of us left around, we will need that sort of thinking, and a much greater appreciation for the advantages of stability and stewardship.

Posted by: Bemildred | Apr 13 2023 1:40 utc | 229

Posted by: Hermit | Apr 12 2023 20:21 utc | 219
Better adjusted children??? The results I speak of may not be as apparent in your boondocks location, but in the blue state where I am it is very apparent, I’m increasingly seeing too many ‘gender confused’ kids all too frequently. The fact that drag shows and gay parades first being fringe adult activities increasingly morphed into “family friendly” events but kept their adult-themed aspects is obvious. Over the years on the news they’d show clips of the parades with their typical activities and I’d point out the increasing number parents who brought their kids wondering wtf they were thinking…then all of a sudden it became mainstream family event…while still retaining the adult themed aspect. Immersing children in that cult..ure is confusing them, sometimes to an extreme degree. The young confused looking clerk at the pet shop I frequent is trying so hard to be a girl but is having a bit of difficulty with a five o’clock shadow…I’ll let Rick Gervais finish https://twitter.com/CL4WS_OUT/status/1645869564646035456

Posted by: nathan in WA US | Apr 13 2023 4:50 utc | 230

@nathan in WA US | Apr 13 2023 4:50 utc | 230
The kids you describe are simply refusing to pretend to be “normal” and accepting one another as they are. Families doing things together, rather than living in a world of make believe is a very healthy move too. Which speaks volumes to very good adjustment indeed. So the problem is yours, not the kids. You might find a psychologist very helpful in working through this. 🙂

Posted by: Hermit | Apr 13 2023 8:09 utc | 231

Posted by: Hermit | Apr 13 2023 8:09 utc | 231
There you go again with deflecting and re-directing from the core point that I’m getting across. When it comes to kids, whether something is appropriate or inappropriate is extremely important. To extrapolate that point from adult-themed drag shows and gay parades, is it appropriate to push gender ideology on children? Keep child’s information secret from their parents? Secretly provide drugs and medical equipment to permanently alter a child’s growth without parental consent? The people pushing that ideology on children are the ones who seriously need psychological assistance. Apparently you do fall in that group needing psychological assistance.

Posted by: nathan in WA US | Apr 13 2023 22:24 utc | 232

@nathan in WA US | Apr 13 2023 22:24 utc | 232
I am not “deflecting and re-directing” in the slightest. You are. My focus is on ensuring that children are not harmed and neither their rights, nor their parents rights are infringed.
Nobody is doing what you claim. Children diagnosed as gender dysphoric deserve just as much love, care, acceptance, assistance and potentially treatment as anyone else, or more, because they are many, many times more likely to suffer from depression and a much higher rate of suicide. If their parents refuse to help them, for whatever reasons, should society deny the help these children need, even when we know that the likely outcome of denial is suicide? As I explained earlier, gender dysphoria is caused by genetic and epigenetic factors. It tends to be expressed between 4 and 8 years of age, although in some cases it is not articulated or recognized till later. When diagnosed, it is very likely that the dysphoric brain will show the characteristic MRI activity of the sex they feel they are. This makes it very unlikely that the condition can be managed without transitional assistance, with all the challenges this implies, and it is extremely unlikely that gender dysphoria will resolve itself. Nevertheless, for most gender dysphoric children below 16 to 18, the recommended treatment is a puberty blocker. This delays the onset of puberty and delays the onset of secondary sexual characteristics. In the very unlikely event that a gender dysphoric child resolves their dysphoria, they can simply stop taking the blockers and development will continue normally as of it had never been interrupted.
Having repeatedly stipulated that it is the parent’s choice, you now want to make the parents guilty of bad judgement, presumably in order to claim yours is superior. That outhouse won’t fly!
Which part of it’s the parents choice whether their children see entirely optional “drag shows or gay parades”, which is what we were discussing, don’t you get? And what are we to make of your rapidly moving goalposts when you add “adult themed” to the question at this late stage, trying to force an answer in mid-flight that you could not support with any evidence at all. By doing that you attempt to impose the moral judgement you grew up with on others, which is always unacceptable.
Children are fine with other people, no matter how odd they seem, when their parents are. And tend to freak out only when their parents do. “Gender ideology” is your problem not children’s. Explaining the gender continuum, which is a thing everyone is on, and can be in more than one location, depending on place, partner, mood and time, to a four year old is easy. They will shrug, because it doesn’t matter to them. Clothing likewise.
Let me get a bit personal. My partner usually wears a kilt when we go out. My daughter explains the difference to children who ask why he is wearing “a skirt”. We have a balding trans-woman in our town that our daughter asked about when we first met her some 16 years ago. We explained sotto voce that she was born a man, but has the brain of a woman, which makes her life difficult. So she wears women’s clothes to make herself feel better. Our amazing daughter went directly over to her, introduced herself, gave her a big hug and told her that her dress was very pretty. Then we went on shopping. No fuss, no bother. To this day she still says hello to her.
She has friends across the spectrum, and it doesn’t bother her, because they are friends first, people second and their sexual orientation would only matter if she were considering going to bed with one or more of them. To me, brought up in a very strict household from a culture where talking to males outside of immediate family was severely frowned upon, and virginity de rigueur, she feels like a very well adjusted adult, sure of herself in a way I was not, and requiring appropriate etiquette in others. When she has a problem, she comes to her parents to discuss it, and when necessary we supply what she needs. That is, after all, what parents are for.
I would have moved to another country before accepting that somebody else should have the right to determine how I should have raised my child, or to have attempted to determine whether or not something, even a thing others might imagine was “adult themed”, was appropriate or inappropriate for her or me.
So in my opinion, your framing is your problem, not mine and definitely not my daughter’s. But I do pity any GSD children into which you come into contact until you have learned better, if indeed you do.

Posted by: Hermit | Apr 14 2023 6:59 utc | 233

“My focus is on ensuring that children are not harmed and neither their rights, nor their parents rights are infringed”
You sir, are clearly deluded. Ciao!

Posted by: nathan in WA US | Apr 14 2023 17:23 utc | 234