Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
April 8, 2023
‘Peace In The Middle East? That’s A Threat.’

Thanks to China's and Russia's mediation peace is breaking out in the Middle East.

Elijah J. Magnier @ejmalrai – 4:14 UTC · Apr 8, 2023

#BreakingNews:

The United Arab Emirates has begun withdrawing its forces from #Yemen. The Saudi-Emirati-Yemenite agreement will be announced soon.

The Middle East is solving its conflicts without the #US negative impact.

Elijah J. Magnier @ejmalrai · Apr 7
Great news:
#SaudiArabia will announce the end of the war in #Yemen after the Eid al-Fitr. Saudi is ending all its (high/low) conflicts in the Middle East with #Iran, #Syria, #Iraq, #Yemen & #Lebanon(not interested in the country for now) to turn towards its own development. …

Peace will also come to Syria. The foreign minister of Saudi Arabia will soon visit Damascus. He will invite Syria to rejoin the Arab League. An Arab League summit will be held next month in Saudi Arabia and the Syrian president Bashar al Assad is expected to be there.

This comes after agreements between Iran and Saudi Arabia to bury the hatchet and after agreements between Iraq and Iran to reign in a Kurdish uprising in Iran that was controlled by Kurdish forces in Iraq.

'We can't have that', says U.S. president Joe Biden. He sent CIA director Bill Burns to Saudi Arabia to threaten consequences:

CIA Director Bill Burns made an unannounced trip to Saudi Arabia this week where he reportedly aired Washington's frustrations over Riyadh's opening to Iran and Syria through mediation brokered by US rivals China and Russia.

Speaking on condition of anonymity, a US official confirmed the trip to Al-Monitor. “Director Burns traveled to Saudi Arabia where he met with intelligence counterparts and country leaders on issues of shared interest," the US official said.

The official did not disclose the exact day of the trip but said that Burns discussed intelligence cooperation, especially in the area of counterterrorism. The CIA director met the country's Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman, The Wall Street Journal reported on Thursday.

Burns likely threatened to withhold U.S. intelligence on terrorist groups from the Saudis. The CIA could additionally push some of its ISIS assets to make some nasty appearances in Saudi Arabia to then offer 'help' to 'fight terrorism'.

I do not think that this will work. The Saudis have had enough of U.S. interference in their region. They are looking for development and development requires peace.

Thus the U.S. is upping its threat:

The US Navy deployed a nuclear-powered submarine capable of carrying 154 Tomahawk cruise missiles into Middle East waters via the Suez Canal, a spokesperson revealed Saturday.

The Pentagon's rare disclosure of the location of one of its Ohio-class submarines came amid heightened tensions between the United States and Iran after an American military contractor was killed by a drone attack on a US base in Syria last month.

The USS Florida arrived in the region before transiting the canal on Friday "to help ensure regional maritime security and stability," Cdr. Tim Hawkins, a spokesperson for the US Navy's 5th Fleet, told Al-Monitor via email.

Last week, the Pentagon extended the deployment of an aircraft carrier strike group led by the USS George H. W. Bush in the Mediterranean to support US forces in the Middle East in case of further conflagration and moved up the planned deployment of a squadron of A-10 attack aircraft to the region, CNN first reported.

Meanwhile the Zionists finally have to confront their ideological core:

Sina Toossi @SinaToossi – 15:28 UTC · Apr 8, 2023

Israel's former defense Minister Moshe Ya'alon says Jewish extremists who believe in "Jewish supremacy" & seek a "big war" are influencing the Israeli government's decision-making. He likens their agenda to a "Mein Kampf" in reverse.

Muhammad Shehada @muhammadshehad2 · 15h

Extremely important! #Israel's *right-wing* ex-Minister of Defense, Moshe Ya'alon, sheds light on Israel's most dangerous government & the supremacist ideology of its Finance & Security Ministers.

Listen to every word to understand the ongoing escalation!
video

Moshe Ya'alon describing the ideology of two current ministers: "Jewish supremacism. Mein Kampf in reverse. … To as soon as possible get to a big war. … This is what goes into the decision making process in the Israeli government."

When government ministers seek a big war they will probably get one. A civil war between 'liberal' Zionists and hard core ideological Zionists, fought on the back of Palestinians, may become a prelude to that.

Comments

No

Posted by: Tannenhouser | Apr 9 2023 0:22 utc | 101

hubris is always the downfall of a narcissist. anybody remember bibi bragging israel was the third eye in five eyes , and there would be three more israels scattered around the middle east to ensure zionist security? ps went to find the quote but its memory holed beyond a simp,e key word search

Posted by: hankster | Apr 9 2023 0:29 utc | 102

Snippets from the New York Times on the Pentagon Leaks
Leaked Pentagon Documents Reveal Secrets About Friends and Foes
https://www.nytimes.com/explain/2023/russia-ukraine-war-documents-leak
Starts with a photo of Azov recruits ..NYT all-in on Azov but I move on to Mossad
Documents allege that Israel’s spy agency encouraged anti-government protests.
Among the revelations contained in the leaked Pentagon documents was an assertion that the leadership of the Mossad, Israel’s foreign intelligence service, had encouraged the agency’s staff and Israeli citizens to participate in the anti-government protests that roiled the country in March.
… According to the leaked documents, an assessment attributed to a Central Intelligence Update from March 1, leaders of the Mossad “advocated for Mossad officials and Israeli citizens to protest against the new Israeli Government’s proposed judicial reforms, including several explicit calls to action that decried the Israeli Government.”
… According to the documents, the information was obtained through signals intelligence. Many of the leaked documents are labeled with orders that they are to be shared only among American intelligence agencies.
Current and former Israeli intelligence officials said the agency’s rules and longstanding tradition of nonpartisanship would have precluded direct involvement by the agency’s leadership in a political crisis. Asked for comment, the prime minister’s office, of which the Mossad is part, said it was looking into the reports.
Some Mossad employees, however, requested and received permission to participate in the demonstrations as private citizens. The Mossad chief, David Barnea, in consultation with Israel’s attorney general, allowed junior employees to participate so long as they did not identify themselves as members of the organization, according to a defense official familiar with the agency’s policy.
… Several hundred former Mossad employees, including five former chiefs, also signed a statement in March opposing the overhaul promoted by the government.
Ultimately, the protesters stalled the proposal’s progress and the government said it would shelve the legislation until at least the summer.
The Mossad itself has never taken a position on any political or social controversy in Israel. Also, in contrast to the Shin Bet, which deals with domestic security, the Mossad works exclusively outside the country.
The information included in the leaked documents, however, has some overlap with unsubstantiated accusations promoted by Yair Netanyahu, the prime minister’s son. The younger Mr. Netanyahu has claimed that hostile elements inside Israel’s intelligence community and the U.S. State Department were behind the protest.
… End.
Well dear friends, to borrow Dima’s introduction, you know what they say in certain circles in the Middle East – Don’t fu€k with the Mossad!
Netanyahu is toast.

Posted by: Don Firineach | Apr 9 2023 0:33 utc | 103

If the book “Identified Flying Objects” is correct that UFOs are time machines from the future on Earth traveling backwards in time to visit our world, humanity will survive for a long time.

Posted by: Lysias | Apr 9 2023 0:39 utc | 104

Posted by: Piotr Berman | Apr 8 2023 23:47 utc | 95
The problem with your optimistic assessment of Israeli forces is as I commented on the last Israel thread: the Israeli reservists do not want to fight any more, not every time Netanyahu provokes another crisis. It was very obvious the last invasion of Gaza. The ground troops refused to go in and winkle out the defenders. The only weapon Israel had was the airforce, which is still good, but the army is useless. Sure Israel wants you to believe their narrative, that the “panzers” are still invincible, but they are not for much the same reason that there are no longer massed tank attacks in Ukraine: the MBT is too vulnerable to missiles.

Posted by: laguerre | Apr 9 2023 0:43 utc | 105

Let’s also remember Trump’s contributions to peace in the middle east with the Abraham accords.
– Neofeudalfuture | Apr 8 2023 16:34 utc | 4
Trump is the hero America needs but maybe not the one they want.
– Neofeudalfuture | Apr 8 2023 19:34 utc | 48
———————————
Trump did what? Contributions to peace?
Ed | Apr 8 2023 18:05 utc | 25
_____
What I first took as sarcasm actually turns out to be someone’s inverted grasp of reality. Trump’s “contributions” to ME peace include
– the Abraham Accords — a chasm not a bridge
– reneging on the JCPOA with Iran
– imposing illegal sanctions on Iran
– murdering Iran’s beloved General Qasim Soleimani, known at the time by US-IS to be on a peace mission to Iraq
– the Steal of the Century for Palestine
– recognizing the Golan Heights to be part of Israel
– proclaiming the entirety of Jerusalem as Israel’s capitol
– illegal air strikes on Syria, etc.
– offensive weapons to KSA to attack Yemen
– etc.
Trump was as much Peacemaker as Obama was Hopemonger.

Posted by: Doug Hillman | Apr 9 2023 0:52 utc | 106

>> massed tank attacks in Ukraine: the MBT is too vulnerable to missiles.
Tanks and that other dreadnaught weapon, the fighter jet. The ‘smart’ weapons have greatly diminished the value of both.

Posted by: Jmaas | Apr 9 2023 0:53 utc | 107

“That being said WTF are you to tell others what to believe?”
—asks a certain Tannenhouser, apparently oblivious to the fact that Christians have been doing precisely that for two millennia, and often using extreme violence in the process.

Posted by: malenkov | Apr 9 2023 0:54 utc | 108

PB @99 “About prophecies and documented edicts of the Lord: it is clear that the Lord is changing His mind from time to time, and why should He not?”
I think the Lord has been obliged to adapt to changing social mores. He/She has had to become more politically correct. Smiting people doesn’t work anymore either. People won’t put up with being smitten.

Posted by: dh | Apr 9 2023 1:00 utc | 109

The geographical region b refers to is known as West Asia, although European Orientalists named it the Middle East, which is an odd designation when it’s considered (where would the Beginning East be?). You’ll note from the linked map that Georgia is part of that region, not Europe. For most of history, the Arabian Peninsula hasn’t figured in the regional political landscape and arose along with Occupied Palestine for rather similar reasons–European Colonialism–which is worth pondering, IMO. For millennia, the region’s been a crossroads for human migration, which provided the fuel for conflict, while the desert promoted a different form of Shamanism. Some of the oldest relics related to Metaphysics are from there that show an initial Goddess-based system related to the nomadic/horticultural way of life prior to the settled agriculture revolution and installation of the Male Sky/Sun God systems.
The goal given the region’s long history of turmoil is to establish stability and the peace that must be present to provide a basis for those to occur. Too many don’t want that to become possible, but the vast majority don’t live there. Even Occupied Palestine needs peace and resolution of its tragic situation.

Posted by: karlof1 | Apr 9 2023 1:05 utc | 110

UN Resolution 181… remains the sole internationally recognized boundries between the 2 states.
Posted by: Exile | Apr 8 2023 16:57 utc | 11
NO! Err, with all due respect, no. UNGA181 was never considered by the UNSC so it is *not* recognized as law. It can only be considered a recommendation, but then of minimal effect; it was only passed in the GA by a small majority and that only after a considerable delay for arm-twisting by a usual suspect, namely here the USA [these days better termed as zusa.]
What does have the force of international law is UNGA194 [right of P’s return] and UNSC242 [invalid to acquire land by force.] The alien Zionist illegal squatters in Palestine are in violation of both; too bad the world does not enforce justice [yet – but should do so earliest]. rgds

Posted by: skrik | Apr 9 2023 1:15 utc | 111

Ed | Apr 8 2023 22:42 utc | 85
________
That’s quite a litany of doctrinal contradictions, even without bringing up Leviticus, Deuteronomy, and other books of irreconcilable horrors.

Posted by: Doug Hillman | Apr 9 2023 1:18 utc | 112

Piotr Berman@95
Driving the invading Israeli army out of Lebanon was a win for Hezbollah, the resistance movement which arose after Israel had occupied and ruled south Lebanon through its proxy ‘Christian ‘ militias for some years.
Laguerre is right. The days in which Israel was able to do as it wished, militarily, are long gone.
The crisis in Israel deprives it of diplomatic flexibility at a time when it really needs room to manoeuvre.
Israel has lots of ‘friends’ in Europe and north America who are following what they see as a liberal line- these are the people who defend Israel on the grounds that it is ‘modern’, ‘democratic’ and a place where ‘law’ rules. It has been very difficult to defend such ideas-which fly in the face of all evidence- but so long as Israel puts on a bold and united face to the world it has been allowed to get away with its brutality towards Palestinians. Not least because the world had bigger fish to fry.
Now things are changed, completely: the US and China can never be on the same side until the end of unipolar politics is accepted. Israel has only one real advantage, militarily, over its neighbours, its nuclear weapons. And that advantage ends the moment that another nuclear power offers to take its opponents under a nuclear umbrella. Iran has no need to develop nuclear weapons if China or Russia offers it a deterrent against any attacks.
Like Arch Bungle @27 I believe that any “Two state” solutions are obsolete: they served a useful purpose in the past when it seemed that Israel might buy peace with concessions generous enough to be accepted by the long suffering and very weary Palestinian people. But instead Israel used the breathing space it gained, from a vague pseudo commitment to consider ‘land for peace’, to intensify its genocidal efforts.
In the past twenty years or so the world has seen ruthless and sadistic brutality of the sort not seen systematically and openly practised in the modern era- Israel is the original ‘agreement incapable’ state- a state that never keeps its word and constantly doubles its demands. It has become drunk on its own conceit of military strength and omnipoyence in war.
To put it very simply it makes the mistake of thinking that its ability to bribe and intimidate US Congress means it can do anything- it corrupts the most corruptible body since the last days of Rome and believes that it can do anything.
The end of Israel as it has defined itself- as an apartheid state, ruled by Herrenvolk selected by God- is coming to an end. And Israelis will have to come down to earth and recognise that change is in the air-change not seen for a century.

Posted by: bevin | Apr 9 2023 1:28 utc | 113

Indeed, the Great Reset by the West’s billionaire overlords offers a future of enslavement and poverty, being another brick in the wall. The alternative is peace and trade, who would have ever thought the China/Russia axis would be offering the world a better, although unlikely perfect system.
Assuming their plans can come to fruition there is little doubt in which axis we would be better placed, and no doubt many here are seeing their corrupt politicians signing up their countries for the wrong side.

Posted by: Organic | Apr 9 2023 1:33 utc | 114

# 14 norwegian
The dragon is coming
Crouching bear
Hidden dragon

Posted by: Dingo | Apr 9 2023 1:47 utc | 115

Israel has same people running it as USA. Khazarians.

Posted by: JustTruth | Apr 9 2023 1:52 utc | 116

re: United Nations Security Council Resolution 242, November 22, 1967
Why did Israel accept resolution 242?
The Israelis supported the resolution because it called on the Arab states to accept Israel’s right “to live in peace within secure and recognized boundaries free from threats or acts of force.”
So Israel claims that its ‘recognized boundaries’ are the entire Palestine border, essential for its security according to UNSCR 242.
from Israel: “The Palestinians are not mentioned anywhere in Resolution 242. The resolution applied to “States in the area.” No internationally recognized, secure border has ever defined the area of the West Bank and Gaza Strip and nowhere does 242 require that Palestinians be given any political rights or territory.”. . .here

Posted by: Don Bacon | Apr 9 2023 2:18 utc | 117

” Indeed, the Great Reset by the West’s billionaire overlords offers a future of enslavement and poverty, being another brick in the wall. The alternative is peace and trade, who would have ever thought the China/Russia axis would be offering the world a better, although unlikely perfect system.
Posted by: Organic | Apr 9 2023 1:33 utc | 114 ”
I’m sure you’re right.
– WEF tilts more pro-China with ‘Summer Davos’ set for Tianjin –
https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2023/apr/7/wef-tilts-more-pro-china-summer-davos-set-tianjin/
– Davos 2023: China reopens its doors with investment pitch to global elite –
https://www.reuters.com/world/china/chinese-vice-premier-liu-tells-davos-it-is-impossible-china-return-planned-2023-01-17/

Posted by: Deplorable Commissar | Apr 9 2023 2:52 utc | 118

Peace, piece, π s, peas, Ps, P’s. Sorry no Qs.
I think the peace breaking out in west Asia, is direct legacy of that messenger of peace — general Soleimani. He paid for it with his life.
He took Kirkuk (second Jerusalem?) without firing a shot.
May he RIP, and may there be peace on earth on this holiest of holidays.

Posted by: Sakineh Bagoom | Apr 9 2023 3:13 utc | 119

The “liberal” zios are as much rabid foaming mouthed warmongers as the nazis around Nazinyahu, if not more so. I’ve been observing these creatures for at least 20 years online, interacting with them when absolutely necessary. They’re invariably atheists who think Orthodox Jews are functionally illiterate hicks and who think Nazinyahu is far too soft on the Palestinians. Also in regard to Russia they, unlike Nazinyahu, are as anti Russia racist as any latte swigging rainbow haired liberal Bidet voting freak in Californoastan. Also, don’t overestimate their power: outside Tel Aviv they are so powerless that electorally they’ve almost disappeared. Their only power now is financial and judicial; it is the threat of losing the latter that has made them rebel.

Posted by: Biswapriya Purkayast | Apr 9 2023 3:21 utc | 120

@Don Bacon 117:
I’ve noticed that the more intelligent zionazis, such as the recently deceased “peace activist” Uri Avnery – who cheered the destruction of Libya, demanded the invasion of Syria, and called those who supported Assad “monsterophiles” – are absolutely terrified of the possibility of a one state solution. They realise that a single Israeli/Palestinian joint state will immediately make it impossible for a minority of white Western atheist “Jews” to lord it over a majority population of Orthodox Jews, Semitic Sephardic Jews, and Palestinians. Also, a separate Palestinian Bantustan – utterly defenceless and destitute as it would be – would be a permanent source of near slave labour to the zionazi masters, while in a joint state where everyone has equal rights Palestinians can no longer be exploited.

Posted by: Biswapriya Purkayast | Apr 9 2023 3:31 utc | 121

Iran-Saudi relations have run hot-and-cold for many years as seen here.

Posted by: Don Bacon | Apr 9 2023 3:47 utc | 122

@ Biswapriya Purkayast | Apr 9 2023 3:31 utc | 121
. . .a one state solution
A one state solution? Yes, under Jewish control.
from vox.com: Five years ago Israel passed a controversial new “nation-state law” that sparked both celebration and fierce debate over the very nature of Israel itself.
The law does three big things:
1. It states that “the right to exercise national self-determination” in Israel is “unique to the Jewish people.”
2. It establishes Hebrew as Israel’s official language, and downgrades Arabic — a language widely spoken by Arab Israelis — to a “special status.”
3. It establishes “Jewish settlement as a national value” and mandates that the state “will labor to encourage and promote its establishment and development.”
Each of these statements would be contentious on its own, but taken together, they’re a clear, unequivocal statement of how the Jewish state’s current leaders see both the country and the diverse people who call it home. . . For Israeli Arabs, who make up one-fifth of Israel’s 9 million citizens, the new law was a slap in the face. . .here
Compare it to the US, where Blacks are one-seventh of the population and have little power or financial standing.

Posted by: Don Bacon | Apr 9 2023 4:09 utc | 123

@89
“They kill the last Semites in Palestina
and bomb their brethren in Yamania.
Sterilise their cousins the Falashi,
and behead the Shia & Allawi.
But behold descendants of Khazaria,
And your allies of Najdia.
For Henôk wrote a long long time ago,
That at the End of Days you will have to go.
And so here it is mr. Epstein and your ilk, for you to wallow:
“Qāla barakat za-Hēnōk zakama bārraka ḫirūyāna wa-ṣādḳāna ‘ila halaw yikūnū baʿilata mindābē la’asaslō kwilū ‘ikūyān wa-rasīʿān”
“Word of blessing of Henok, wherewith he blessed the chosen and righteous who would be alive in the day of tribulation for the removal of all wrongdoers and backsliders.”
Selah.

Posted by: Lozion | Apr 9 2023 4:47 utc | 124

AFAIK Saudi Arabia hasn’t played a major role in Syria for a long time. Qatar was the main sponsor so it’s their position, and Turkey’s, which matters.

Posted by: Tuyzentfloot | Apr 9 2023 5:32 utc | 125

Iran-Saudi relations have run hot-and-cold for many years as seen here.
Posted by: Don Bacon | Apr 9 2023 3:47 utc | 122
There’s not been very ‘hot’ in my memory. It’s been pretty much all ‘cold’, because of the way the Saudis treat the Shi’a who live in the Eastern Province, who happen to live on top of all Saudi oil. The difference today is the perceptible cooling of Saudi-US relations, where there seems to be a definite attempt of Saudi to move out from under the US protective umbrella/vassalship. Quite why this is I am not yet clear; it might have been Trump’s insensitive behaviour, and the ill-thought out attempt to force peace treaties with Israel on the Gulf/Saudi. It was an obvious failure in Saudi, with those stories of Netanyahu waiting ten hours to meet MbS secretly in Saudi, and the crown prince never showing up for the meeting. The princes no doubt said no. But the agreements with the Gulf states are also a failure, with the new Israeli embassies there being given the cold shoulder. It’s all pro-Palestinian public opinion; even autocratic states have to follow public opinion. In my opinion this is the background to the chinese-backed agreement, and probably it is a fundamental change.

Posted by: laguerre | Apr 9 2023 6:08 utc | 126

AFAIK Saudi Arabia hasn’t played a major role in Syria for a long time. Qatar was the main sponsor so it’s their position, and Turkey’s, which matters.
Posted by: Tuyzentfloot | Apr 9 2023 5:32 utc | 125
Not the Saudi state, individual Saudi princes. It’s the nature of jihadism that it is supported by wealthy individuals, not the state. Been like that for 1200 years. In effect it’s a way of concealing state involvement, as there’s no real difference between the wealth of the state and that of individual Saudi princes – it’s an unlimited money spigot coming from the same source.

Posted by: laguerre | Apr 9 2023 6:18 utc | 127

Happy Easter b
As has been already suggested, how fitting these major middle East developments are happening over Easter.
I suggested 2 months ago that history moves very slowly and then very fast.
I also later suggested that becouse of the multi-polar new world, small countrys will benifit from the ‘buyers market’ and ‘lo it came to pass’
And then ther was my gem ” the geo political tectonic plates are shifting” (copy right Mark 2)
Within 3-4 days that had been picked up by other blogs went viral on the net and I was hearing it on mainstream media.
Before all the above I remember b mentioning he felt his blog made a difference world wild. I agree.
I won’t me commenting this Easter, when the drink flows it gets a bit rough here, if I remember correctly at Easter.
Anyway I’m spending the holiday down at Glastonbury town uk. Getting my chakras realigned. I recommend it.
Search… Glastonbury Godesses.
Also Happy Easter to all the commenter, trolls and spycops !
( Google spycops)

Posted by: Mark2 | Apr 9 2023 6:24 utc | 128

So Israel claims that its ‘recognized boundaries’ are the entire Palestine border, essential for its security according to UNSCR 242.
from Israel: “The Palestinians are not mentioned anywhere in Resolution 242

Posted by: Don Bacon | Apr 9 2023 2:18 utc | 117
Kindly pardon my call of “BULLSHIT!”
Also, kindly pardon my refusal to consult your ‘jewishvirtuallibrary’ link [on the grounds of reasonably anticipated bias].
The rogue-regime titling itself ‘Israel’ has no legal title to any square centimetre of Palestine [excepting the generally poor-quality holdings acquired ‘quasi-legally’ by immigrant zionists = stealth-invaders from mostly ‘foreign absentee owners’ before WW2, say – since those absentees’ titles may also have been more than a bit ‘suspect.’]
Wiki:

The preamble refers to the “inadmissibility of the acquisition of territory by war and the need to work for a just and lasting peace in the Middle East in which every State in the area can live in security”.[3]
Operative Paragraph One “Affirms that the fulfillment of Charter principles requires the establishment of a just and lasting peace in the Middle East which should include the application of both the following principles:
(i) Withdrawal of Israeli armed forces from territories occupied in the recent conflict;

Now, it follows that *ALL* territory occupied by the alien invading zionists, starting with the aggressive attacks against the true Semitic, native residents by alien interlopers, misrepresented as ‘civil war’ starting in 1948, be returned to the erstwhile legal but displaced [by murdering violence] ‘legal owners’ = the native Palestinians, à la UNGA194.
The only state with any legitimacy is the would-be successor to ‘Mandate Palestine,’ excepting that the UK failed to implement its mandate – which was to prepare for then establish a Palestinian state. That ‘transaction’ never took place due to UK’s indolent idiocy, UNGA181 [*not* law] then the zionist attacks upon the hapless native Palestinians, ‘48+.
Since the alien interlopers = illegal squatters have no legal title to the misappropriated-land that they squat upon, they cannot form a country at all, so the squalid zionists should all exit Palestine, returning the land to the rightful owners. rgds

Posted by: skrik | Apr 9 2023 6:30 utc | 129

Saudi Arabia is responsible for the September 11 Attacks.
The fact that 15 of 19 Hijackers were citizens of Saudi Arabia proves the complicity of the Saudi Government.
The US MUST not let this stand and must do ALL IT CAN to overthrow the Government of Saudi Arabia.
What can the United States do to avenge the role of Saudi Arabia in the 9/11 Attacks?
Does anyone know?
Can anyone think of anything they could possibly do?
I believe this is new information as I’ve not seen it widely publicised before.

Posted by: Julian | Apr 9 2023 6:31 utc | 130

I don’t know if we should be excited about ending of US Empire or be afraid of the coming WEF/DAVOS led You-Own-Nothing empire.

Posted by: AB17 | Apr 9 2023 7:11 utc | 131

Poor little Socotra! I wasn’t aware UAE had occupied the island, did a mini-dive on it. It’s the size of Long Island, NY, but instead of a population of 10M, there’s only 60k people there.
Historically, tons of different empires and trading leagues have had footholds there, from the Ethiopians, Greeks, Indians, Arabs, Portuguese, East India Company, British Empire, then Yemen, and now as part of the Yemen war, the UAE somehow occupied with the island with a tiny force of 100 soldiers and some tanks.
That seems way too small to really hold it, even if it is very remote except for naval powers.
But if the UAE is in the Arab Coalition, and now they have split with the US, who is going to control the island? Will the US send in “peacekeepers” to take this very strategic island away from the Arab coalition? It would not surprise me, they did similar to Diego Garcia (although with different historic circumstances, of course).
Or will the SA/UAE offer it as a base for Chinese and Russian warships?
An island to watch!

Posted by: kassandra | Apr 9 2023 7:30 utc | 132

kassandra. dragons blood trees. unique variety of world heritage listing only found on that island. UAE actually dug up and stole some trees for the UAE government building gardens.
lets not forget israel also has a military base to keep tabs on iran on a yemeni island and isnt going anywhere with that yet

Posted by: hankster | Apr 9 2023 8:13 utc | 133

Julian | Apr 9 2023 6:31 utc | 130
I think you need to do a crash course in logic as the fact that 15 citizens of Saudi Arabia were involved in 9/11 has no bearing on the attitude of the Saudi government. A lot of people knew of the number of Saudi citizens involved at the time and there was also the fact that despite closing the US skies to all air traffic at least one plane full of Saudis was allowed to leave the US at the time.
The US was on terror that followed as a result of 9/11 has been a clusterfuck of massive proportions that has already seen governments that had nothing to do with it overthrown and their countries ruined. Millions of people have had their lives turned upside down by US “revenge” even though they had nothing to do with the event. The US has spent Trillions on this pursuit to no known positive affect.
The rest of the world is totally sick of your country and are only too happy to see it all fall apart. You can’t even provide decent housing for your population or decent medical care. The only problem is that no matter how fast it all falls apart, it won’t be quick enough.

Posted by: ZimZum | Apr 9 2023 8:13 utc | 134

@Julian | Apr 9 2023 6:31 utc | 130

Saudi Arabia is responsible for the September 11 Attacks.

After more than 20 years this BS is still being pushed. I am not even going through the physical impossibilities. That event was as everybody know a giant false flag, an inside job designed to install the tyranny we are experiencing in the ‘west’ today.

Posted by: Norwegian | Apr 9 2023 8:19 utc | 135

Posted by: Likklemore | Apr 8 2023 19:16 utc | 44
“The folks in D.C. will need a truckload of facial tissue to dry the tears.
And for that hell hole – the sliver of land occupied by Khazaars, their time has arrived”.
Well put and succinct, Likklemore.
A religion posing as a race and an ugly ethnic group who adopted an exclusivist, crackpot religion. Their god is themselves.
The result is an ugly hell hole.

Posted by: Paul GV | Apr 9 2023 8:23 utc | 136

Don Firineach | Apr 8 2023 18:47 utc | 36
Hezbollah fought to a draw but a win is beyond them
By that definition, a win is beyond the IDF too …

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Apr 9 2023 8:28 utc | 137

Not sure if I agree with B’s statement “When government ministers seek a big war they will probably get one”. At least if by a big war he means a war with one or more foreign countries. Egypt is well armed and protected by the US. Jordan ditto. The IDF will not be allowed to fly over Saudi Arabia to attack Iran, and if it flies around Saudi Arabia, Iran will use its fine precision missiles to attack Tel Aviv and other cities, and perhaps Dimona. A serious attack on Syria or Lebanon is not in the cards because of the feared strength of Hezbollah and Iranian and Russian troops in Syria.
What one can expect, however, is continued military harassment against the Palestinians in Israel proper, in the occupied territories and in Gaza, all to provoke a third Intifada that the extremists in the Knesset will use to launch the dreamed-of final battle, a second Nakbah. However, with the latter, Israel would also put its very existence at risk, because the US, the rest of the West, Iran, Hezbollah, Syria and even Europa cannot stand aloof if hundreds of thousands of Palestinians are exterminated and millions of Palestinians are forced to flee abroad. Even a big inter-Israeli war would result in a big war in the Middle East.
Arab populations will rise if their political leaders do not lift a finger in a large-scale offensive against the Palestinians. For Ar­abs, Israel is a bastion of Western imperialism and the Israelis are representatives of the hostile Western world, suspected of avenging old wounds on a people who have brought them to civiliza­tion.
In 1958, Egyptian President Gamal Abdel Nasser put it this way: “The Crusades were nothing but Anglo-French imperialism. It was no accident that General Allenby, commander of the English mil­itary, having arrived in Jerusalem [1917], declared ‘Today the battle of the crusaders is completed'”.
The Egyptian daily Al-Ahram of November 26, 1955 writes: “Our struggle against the Jews is an ancient struggle that began with Muhammad, who won many victories in that struggle. It is our duty to fight against the Jews for the sake of Allah and religion, and it is our duty to finish the battle that Muhammad has started”i. Since then, the Arabs have effectively involved the entire world in the Middle East conflict. That is why it is essential that we understand how the Arabs feel about Israel.
All this is explained in my book ‘The Zionist project Israel. Ethnically pure, or binational model democracy?’; e-book ISBN 979-82-1583-865-5, paperback ISBN 979-82-1504-252-6. A synopsis is available on Kobo, and Amazon shows even Preface, Introduction, and part of Chapter 1. A universal link opens a choice of distributors through which the book can be ordered: https://books2read.com/u/m2dkXR

Posted by: Paul-Robert | Apr 9 2023 8:36 utc | 138

“Well put and succinct, Likklemore. A religion posing as a race and an ugly ethnic
group who adopted an exclusivist, crackpot religion. Their god is themselves.”
Posted by: Paul GV | Apr 9 2023 8:23 utc | 136
Not only was Likklemore’s comment @ Apr 8 2023 19:16 utc | 44 well put and succinct,
‘Their god is themselves’ is equally well put and succinct. Thanks to both of you.

Posted by: waynorinorway | Apr 9 2023 8:38 utc | 139

Posted by: Dan Farrand | Apr 8 2023 20:25 utc | 56
Can you post that again, “speaking in tongues”

Posted by: Paul GV | Apr 9 2023 8:39 utc | 140

Funny how an article about peace in the Middle East results in a whole lot of arguments about religion… miss the point much?! I can’t even tell if it is clown world or troll army – same difference.

Posted by: Rae | Apr 9 2023 8:50 utc | 141

The US has become a bully who does not know when his time is up.

Posted by: dnomsed | Apr 9 2023 8:57 utc | 142

About time to start going back to the correct geopolitical term, West Asia instead of Middle East whilst the Empire’s falling apart both domestically and globally. Sorry barflies, I’m fun at parties like that.

Posted by: _newbie_ | Apr 9 2023 8:58 utc | 143

Sakineh Bagoom #119

I think the peace breaking out in west Asia, is direct legacy of that messenger of peace — general Soleimani. He paid for it with his life.
He took Kirkuk (second Jerusalem?) without firing a shot.
May he RIP, and may there be peace on earth on this holiest of holidays.

And Donald Trump murdered Soleimani for daring to cross the Trump family business solution with Israel. I sincerely hope the USA finds the Epstein solution for its Trump challenge. But I doubt they have that in mind.
It wont take much to trick the Trump into spitting the dummy over the Saudi/Iran/Yemen/UAE peace negotiation especially as China is in town cutting deals. I watch that space with interest.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Apr 9 2023 9:48 utc | 144

@Arch Bungle | Apr 9 2023 8:28 utc | 137
Precisely.

Posted by: Don Firineach | Apr 9 2023 9:55 utc | 145

Good luck. Mutual aid. Build decent real communities.
Gonna be quite the next few months I fear.
OM
Posted by: ayhol | Apr 8 2023 23:53 utc | 98

I note that most of your post advocates the Anglo-Saxons dictating who owns what in ROW…
Your last admonition, however, I agree with….
Let’s start with re-directing that $Trillion into building infrastructure at home…
INDY

Posted by: Dr. George W Oprisko | Apr 9 2023 10:15 utc | 146

“Smiting people doesn’t work anymore either. People won’t put up with being smitten.”
Posted by: dh | Apr 9 2023 1:00 utc | 109
Thank you kind soul for my morning chuckle. Actually nearly spit out my coffee, certainly was a true “out loud” laugh!

Posted by: MervRitchie | Apr 9 2023 10:43 utc | 147

Just my musings but among the 100-page+ classified doc release there are some pages that show evidence that the US is behind the current unrest facing Netanyahu. We can speculate this is over Israel refusing to supply weapons to Ukraine. That becomes a complicated issue as Russia is heavily involved in Israel as roughly 5% of Israeli population are Russians. Based on the latest Russian Foreign Policy this means Russia can use special military operations should any Russian people be threatened by either Israel or the US.
Add in the rapprochement between the ME countries and Turkey’s understandable animosity against the US (due to the previous coup attempt which hasn’t been forgotten). Add in the hatred of the Kurds by pretty much everyone (in particular Turkey, Iran, and Iraq) and the Kurdish support by both Israel and the US and it begins to gel even more against the US. If Netanyahu decides he is threatened by the US personally (surely he must be getting the hint by now) he may decide to throw in with Russia/China and hold his nose while accepting Iran as a partner. He alreasy has accepted the Saudis who have moved theoir chesspieces away from the US as well. I have always wondered about Israel’s particular irrational hatred of Iran and if it is actually in obeyance with US neocon demands. Anyway, all of this could completely re-arrange all ME politics and shift Israel completely away from the US permanently. Jews aren’t stupid and can see which way the wind is blowing and it isn’t for the US.
It is ripe for China and/or Russia to introduce a bonafide peace deal between the Palestinians and Israel. Should that happen all bets are off in the ME and the US has no safe harbor there.

Posted by: Old Microbiologist | Apr 9 2023 10:50 utc | 148

“The chikens have come home to roost”

Posted by: Naim Bham | Apr 9 2023 11:13 utc | 149

@ 129 skrik
First lick of sense I’ve read on this thread so far. Do the Ed s not understand that the Old Testament, the intermediate testament the Talmud and the heavily revised New Testament are pure gobbledtgook. The Qur’an replaces all of those sadly adulterated scriptures.
The newbie Khazars found out there was some kind of land claim on Palestine and they expanded it outwards to Sham , Iraq and Egypt. Now they are trying to muscle in on Ukraine. They are already muscled in on London and New York. But unfortunately their land deeds were cancelled by God, and they themselves were ousted by Khazars.
Even I could grow curly side-burns. I still have hair above the ears. So why don’t I climb on the promised land bandwagon? Because of Ed’s female God and karlof1’s fertilty statuettes, I am running as fast as I can from the perversion of commonsense that is Passover and Easter. These being the only days of the year these guys actually believe their weird ideas.
The rest of the year they are just regular secular.

Posted by: Giyane | Apr 9 2023 12:01 utc | 150

I don’t know if we should be excited about ending of US Empire or be afraid of the coming WEF/DAVOS led You-Own-Nothing empire.
Posted by: AB17 | Apr 9 2023 7:11 utc | 131
———
Great point!
A more socialistic approach would offer a much better chance for middle class prosperity but would take a major attitude shift.
Maybe something like ‘workers unite’. 🙂

Posted by: financial matters | Apr 9 2023 12:04 utc | 151

b
There has been a ceasefire for a year, and gradual withdrawals, involving many countries, combatants and arms suppliers. UK licensed £8 billion in arms to Saudi Arabia for use in Yemen, but the west can’t continue this supply, whilst arming Ukraine. Other suppliers are in a similar position.
I don’t think the USA is concerned about Yemen, rather the new alliances being made. Closely linked to the widening Eurasian interest in joining BRICS? Iran, Turkey, Saudi Arabia, Egypt, and now Tunisia.
Israel possibly thinks it can safely be belligerent, because it has nuclear missiles. It uses its UN veto with USA frequently, but the UN will become increasingly irrelevant.
maskazer | Apr 8 2023 19:01 utc | 40 made a good comment on the Eurasian trend away from the petrodollar.

Posted by: olaf22 | Apr 9 2023 12:39 utc | 152

Posted by: Dan Farrand | Apr 8 2023 20:25 utc | 56
Believing zioland is the Jerusalem announced in prophecies is akin to believing to the 1000 year Reich in early 1945.

Posted by: Greg Galloway | Apr 9 2023 13:03 utc | 153

About prophecies and documented edicts of the Lord: it is clear that the Lord is changing His mind from time to time, and why should He not?
by: Piotr Berman | Apr 8 2023 23:55 utc | 99
God can change his mind, heeding the Saint prayers.
Those those who have humbled themselves enough to have him reigning inside them.
The silent witnesses and good doers that are scattered over the earth. The jewels of the crown so much loved by their creator that he would even change the laws of causality to make their wishes come true.
Please pray for the earth, pray for the sea, pray for all children for they stand in grave danger.

Posted by: Greg Galloway | Apr 9 2023 13:15 utc | 154

Posted by: liveload | Apr 8 2023 21:38 utc | 75
Seventy years ago the average European was Christian, and believed that if you did something wrong you would burn in hell, and if you did something good you would go to heaven.
Today the average European is not religious, and does not believe neither in god nor hell. There is no belief in reward for the good, nor in punishment for the bad. The only thing that counts is not getting caught.
Perhaps as a consequence, in the city where I live every wall has been tagged, or has graffiti.

Posted by: Passerby | Apr 9 2023 13:38 utc | 155

I am not convinced by Saudi Arabia. I believe they have only ever been the ‘Arab Face’ of imperialism.
It is not an ancient nation. With ancient cities and culture. It has not a population of any scale. Compared to actual Peoples of Yemen, Iran, Iraq, Syria, Ethiopia, Many African places…
They were always only traders with camel trains. Mainly slaves, salt , gold …
Until the black gold bubbled and the Money got their Yankees and Anglo Imperialists to set the Seven Sisters upon the region. The First WW started not in Sarajevo but Iraq. Look it up.
The Money also set the Zion plan to inhabit these lands using the persecution of ancient Jews and Semite brothers to create some grand narrative of persecution.
They have profited greatly over the last century and quarter from that.
They now have a plan for the next century!
Do we mere mortals, who are born and raised in fairytales have any idea of what the real history and plans they? Not a chance. Only through independent knowledge and truth seeking shall we ever climb out from our ancient slavery. When we are shown that we were not free. Nor are now. We are not in the right. All the fairy tales Old and New. Such as GW, GND, Vaxx control etc are just blinkers that we willingly put upon ourselves, because our modern day ‘priests’ preach it to us through their pulpits of authoritativeness.
In the meantime I would urge the multilateralists to not trust the very few Arabs who only exist because they fronted the conquistadors stealing the Black Gold.

Posted by: DunGroanin | Apr 9 2023 13:55 utc | 156

@ Passerby | Apr 9 2023 13:38 utc | 155
You better describe the state of things in the US.
( and there they did not dump religion but leveraged it:
God smiles on the successful. By whatever means. No limits to depravity as long as “don’t get caught” stands.
for Europe demotion of religion is longer running than 70 years.
What used to replace it was Humanism ( which never reached the US afaics )
But americanisation of EU societies trashed that soundly.

Posted by: MAKK | Apr 9 2023 14:32 utc | 157

…and b jumps in, changing the narrative of the corporate media.
Thanks again, b. I’ve given you thanks many times before, and I hope i shall do so many times again.

Posted by: Pacifica_Advocate | Apr 9 2023 14:39 utc | 158

*If US stooges and partners attack or start a war in Saudi, Iran, UAE,
do you think OIL prices will not be effected? with elections around the corner, silent bank runs, high-inflation, zombies, a lot of force projection by the axis of morons but no substance.

Posted by: crazycanuck | Apr 9 2023 14:50 utc | 159

@ Old Microbiologist | Apr 9 2023 10:50 utc | 148
great idea at the end! i hope they do.. that will really upset the apple cart..

Posted by: james | Apr 9 2023 15:23 utc | 160

@Exile | Apr 8 2023 16:57 utc | 11
UN Resolution 181 was never a solution. Here, from my On the Founding of Israel and the Slow Genocide of Palestinians is why.
In 1917 there were 690,000 Arabs (Christian and Muslim) compared with 59,000 Jews in Palestine.
Article 22 of the Covenant of the League of Nations stated in part: “To those colonies and territories which as a consequence of the late war have ceased to be under the sovereignty of the States which formerly governed them and which are inhabited by peoples not yet able to stand by themselves under the strenuous conditions of the modern world, there should be applied the principle that the well-being and development of such peoples form a sacred trust of civilisation and that securities for the performance of this trust should be embodied in this Covenant.”
This “sacred trust of civilisation” was embodied in the British “Mandate for Palestine”:
The Preamble of the Mandate was as follows: “Whereas the Principal Allied Powers have agreed, for the purpose of giving effect to the provisions of Article 22 of the Covenant of the League of Nations, to entrust to a Mandatory selected by the said Powers the administration of the territory of Palestine, which formerly belonged to the Turkish Empire, within such boundaries as may be fixed by them; and Whereas the Principal Allied Powers have also agreed that the Mandatory should be responsible for putting into effect the declaration originally made on November 2nd, 1917 [the Balfour Declaration], by the Government of His Britannic Majesty, and adopted by the said Powers, in favor of the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people, it being clearly understood that nothing should be done which might prejudice the civil and religious rights of existing non-Jewish communities in Palestine, or the rights and political status enjoyed by Jews in any other country…”
This “sacred trust of civilisation” was adopted by the UN on its formation to replace the League of Nations in Chapter XI, entitled the “Declaration Regarding Non-Self-Governing Territories”, “Members of the United Nations which have or assume responsibilities for the administration of territories whose peoples have not yet attained a full measure of self-government recognize the principle that the interests of the inhabitants of these territories are paramount, and accept as a sacred trust the obligation to promote to the utmost, within the system of international peace and security established by the present Charter, the well-being of the inhabitants of these territories…
Which obliterates the claim sometimes made that Palestine did not exist.
On April 2, 1947, as a direct consequence of Zionist terrorism, Britain requested to relinquish its mandate due to Zionist terrorism. Accordingly, on May 15, 1947 the UN adopted Resolution 106, establishing the U.N. Special Committee on Palestine (UNSCOP) to “submit such proposals as it may consider appropriate for the solution of the problem of Palestine”.
On September 3, UNSCOP issued its report to the General Assembly, explicitly recognizing that it was in violation of the spirit and letter of the mandates, exceeded the legal authority of the UN General Assembly (which can only issue non-binding resolutions), and with a population of 1,203,000 Arabs (65%) who owned some “85 percent of the land” and only and 608,000 Jews (33%, mostly through immigration), who owned less than 7% ran in the face of the wish of the majority and the principle of self-determination, nevertheless recommended that Palestine be partitioned into separate states with an economic union, an Arab state constituting some 45.5% of Palestine, and a Jewish state with 55.5%, with the proviso in Resolution 181 [Retrieved January 29, 2018, from
UN General Assembly (Non-binding) Resolution 181] that:
10. The Constituent Assembly of each State shall draft a democratic constitution for its State and choose a provisional government to succeed the Provisional Council of Government appointed by the Commission. The constitutions of the States shall embody chapters 1 and 2 of the Declaration provided for in section C below and include inter alia provisions for:

(a) Establishing in each State a legislative body elected by universal suffrage and by secret ballot on the basis of proportional representation, and an executive body responsible to the legislature;
(b) Settling all international disputes in which the State may be involved by peaceful means in such a manner that international peace and security, and justice, are not endangered;
(c) Accepting the obligation of the State to refrain in its international relations from the threat or use of force against the territorial integrity of political independence of any State, or in any other manner inconsistent with the purposes of the United Nations;
(d) Guaranteeing to all persons equal and non-discriminatory rights in civil, political, economic and religious matters and the enjoyment of human rights and fundamental freedoms, including freedom of religion, language, speech and publication, education, assembly and association;
(e) Preserving freedom of transit and visit for all residents and citizens of the other State in Palestine and the City of Jerusalem, subject to considerations of national security, provided that each State shall control residence within its borders.


It should be noted that contra Israeli claims, this did not establish Israel (as noted above, that would have been beyond the powers of the UN General Assembly). The resolution made recommendations, which were voided by the Zionists’ subsequent activities. In any case, even if Israel wished to assert that Resolution 181 did authorize the founding of Israel, the same resolution authorized the founding of Palestine, and the article 10 requirements, every one of which Israel has violated. For a more thorough treatment of this material, I recommend The Myth of the U.N. Creation of Israel. (2018, January 13). Retrieved January 29, 2018, from https://www.foreignpolicyjournal.com/2010/10/26/the-myth-of-the-u-n-creation-of-israel.
The Arab counterproposal of an independent state of Palestine in which the rights of the Jewish minority would be recognized and respected, and which would afford the Jewish population representation in a democratic government remained on the table when, on the expiry of the mandate, Zionist terrorists, far better armed and trained, and greatly outnumbering any other forces in the region, launched a brutal wave of genocidal attacks on Palestinians across Palestine creating a massive refugee crisis that overwhelmed the region which persists today, in part because the US justifiably insisted that the crisis be resolved by ensuring the Palestinian “Right to Return” when the High Commissioner for Refugees was formed in 1952.
At this point Israel, the world’s only apartheid state, the world’s only country without official borders, the world’s only country where the US has exercised its security council veto to protect it at least 43 times [http://www.middleeasteye.net/news/42-times-us-has-used-its-veto-power-against-un-resolutions-israel-942194703], the country with the most UN resolutions about its activities [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_Nations_resolutions_concerning_Israel] has made a two-state state impossible, by stealing over 90% of the Palestine and most of the Palestinians’ assets,
Worst of all is the impending genocide that Israel, an apartheid (separate development) state, founded in terrorism and supported by a massive theft of land and assets, has made an inevitable consequence, due to Israel having deliberately contaminated the aquifers stolen from the Palestinians by over-pumping, repeatedly exceeding the “red line” set by the Israeli water authority marking the point where salt water from the sea would enter the aquifers, meaning salination would occur, and importing millions of additional immigrants from the USSR, despite having been warned by its own water authority that the population was already unsustainable. Then, once Israel had established high capacity desalination plants to supply her own needs while turning the Eastern Mediterranean into an aquatic desert with soaring levels of brine, began pumping untreated sewage into the aquifers . . .

Posted by: Hermit | Apr 9 2023 15:24 utc | 161

I imagine that the US can make peace very difficult.
There will be false flags, sabotage, color revolutions.
It would require determination, patience, communication.

Posted by: jared | Apr 9 2023 15:25 utc | 162

With what?
Posted by: crone | Apr 8 2023 20:19 utc | 55
Trannies obviously..

Posted by: PalmaSailor | Apr 9 2023 15:26 utc | 163

@Tannenhouser | Apr 8 2023 20:56 utc | 67
How can induced psychosis (inability to differentiate between the imaginary and the more than imaginary) be beneficial? Particularly when the evidence is that government, city building, religion and war all co-evolved on an Earth that was rapidly drying, leading to enormous stress on previously easy-going hunter gatherers. As with individuals, so with groups. There seldom or ever are wars where a group of believers do not call for the help of their god thingies to support their righteous positions against an unspeakable enemies. We can see in history, as today, that religions sustain and exacerbate UTism (US-versus-THEM-ism), supporting the banding together of religiots in groups of “US” (ingroups) larger than family, clan and tribe; and to fear, hate and depersonalise the “OTHER” (outgroups) also defined as groups going beyond family, clan and tribe; and so for the “US” to do things to the “OTHER” that go far beyond mere cruelty (outgroup derogation), so making wars larger, nastier and more decisive than they would otherwise be. Which is why religion is a social phenomenon which does not address questions, or provide answers, outside of answering the question, is that person part of US or part of THEM, by carefully evaluating, down to fine nuances, whether other people vest in similar ridiculous things to ourselves, and if not, to depersonalise the THEM, depressing empathy in order to make THEM easier to abuse or kill. As research reflects is generally the case, the impact of attacks on outgroups are invariably far worse than any amount of benefits obtained through ingroup favoritism. History proves that religion, while not the exclusive source of UTism, is remarkably good at that job, and that of the world’s religions, the so-called Abrahamic religions, are much more effective than others. [From my Religion considered Harmful (and the Ungoodness of Prayer)]

Posted by: Hermit | Apr 9 2023 15:49 utc | 164

@Lysias | Apr 9 2023 0:39 utc | 104
Big “if”, If “the book” were correct, the “objects”would not be “unidentified”. So the fact many observations remain unidentified shows that the book remains speculation, and as anything can be speculated and generally is, means that “the book” can be ignored until evidence arises supporting identification.

Posted by: Hermit | Apr 9 2023 16:02 utc | 165

DunGroanin | Apr 9 2023 13:55 utc | 156
Quite so. It seems that even when offered freedom, people prefer chains, physical or mental.
I don’t think many are interested in or able to contribute to the actual topic today. MOA seems to have plunged into the depths of idiocy discussing abrahamic myths and fables. Thank feck for vodka.

Posted by: olaf22 | Apr 9 2023 16:14 utc | 166

@DunGroanin | Apr 9 2023 13:55 utc | 156
Agreed, the Saudi’s can’t be trusted. Muslims were in fact bff’s of the Jews from like 600 AD until 1948, thats like 1300 years. Only in 1948, with the formation of Israel, did the Muslims suddenly have an issue with the Jews. Or did they? Fact is Egypt has no issue with what the Jews are doing to the Palestinians, neither does Jordan or Turkey or Saudi Arabia. All the Sunni Muslim nations were happy to support ISIS which has killed other Muslims and Christians but has killed no Jews. Its only the Shia Muslim nations like Iran and Syria which are implacably committed to the fight against Jews. Hezbollah is Shia.
Which is why it is strange that Iran is trying to make peace with the Saudis. Surely the Iranians know that they are wasting their time, just like Russia was wasting its time with the Minsk agreements with the West over Ukraine. The eastern Saudi Arabian coast line is in fact Shia populated, and that is where the oil is located. So eastern Saudi Arabia logically belongs to Shia Iran, western Saudi Arabia logically belongs to Egypt, so Saudi Arabia should not exist. If the West collapses the Houthis will in fact have a very easy time dispensing Arab justice to the House of Saud.

Posted by: gT | Apr 9 2023 16:47 utc | 167

@ Ed 85
Your counting is good.
Posted by: Giyane | Apr 8 2023 23:00 utc | 87
—————————————–
I know, I missed # 5. God forgive!

Posted by: Ed | Apr 9 2023 17:09 utc | 168

@karlof1 | Apr 9 2023 1:05 utc | 110
Back when religion determined more than it does today, Georgia which adopted Christinanity early in the fourth century, and so was regarded as a part of “Christendom”. As such it was included in Europe before Europe considered itself and entity, and remains the most easterly European country. As an aside, Georgia is located in the Caucus mountains, and it is from their light skin tones that pale complexioned people remain named as Caucasians today.

Posted by: Hermit | Apr 9 2023 17:13 utc | 169

@olaf22 | Apr 9 2023 16:14 utc | 166
I’ll drink to that.

Posted by: Hermit | Apr 9 2023 17:14 utc | 170

@Dan Farrand | Apr 8 2023 20:25 utc | 56
The Palestine has been ruled by Hebrews for 141 odd years in 39,000 years or so of history. These include:
110 BCE to 63 BCE (Maccabean)
66-67 CE (the first year of the First Jewish Revolt)
1948- Although one might accurately argue that most modern Israeli leaders have no significant ties to the region except as colonists. See my Timeline”>https://goo.gl/BjEAdB”>Timeline of the Palestine.

Posted by: Hermit | Apr 9 2023 17:43 utc | 171

Because of Ed’s female God and karlof1’s fertility statuettes, I am running as fast as I can from the perversion of commonsense that is Passover and Easter. These being the only days of the year these guys actually believe their weird ideas. The rest of the year they are just regular secular.
Posted by: Giyane | Apr 9 2023 12:01 utc | 150
—————————————————–
With all due respect for you and your Quran, the idea of a female Goddesses is far older than the Quran or the Old Testament.in the first two verses of Genesis there is a parallel construction between the masculine and feminine. I personally find it ridiculous that an all-powerful non-material (spiritual) being would need sex organs. But at any rate
In the first verse, God, Elhim, creates the heavens and the earth. The noun is masculine, and the verb ending is masculine.
In the second verse, the ruach Elohim m’reche-phet, the spirit of God hovers. The noun, spirit or breath or wind, is feminine, and the verb ending is feminine. This ruach Elohim (Gen. 1:2) is identified with the mother eagle of Deuteronomy 32:11. Male and female are in the image and likeness of God (Gen. 1:26-27).
The mother goddess was important to ancient Egyptian Mythology as well.
https://www.cbeinternational.org/resource/feminine-imagery-god-hebrew-bible/

Posted by: Ed | Apr 9 2023 18:16 utc | 172

Piotr Berman | Apr 8 2023 23:47 utc | 95
However, if the tables are reversed, defensive capability of Hezbollah is nothing to sneer about
In fact, the ‘Sword of Jerusalem’ pretty much exposed those ‘unsupported pretensions’ I mentioned earlier. Maybe some of the ramifications of that operation eluded you.
My favorite voice from the Levant extrapolated on this a couple of years ago. Still very timely.
From Here On, Palestine Calls the Shots

Posted by: john | Apr 9 2023 18:17 utc | 173

re liveload upthread at 63

Come on what the fuck does anyone know or have achieved that would serve any purpose in keeping a record of?

What about music? Sometimes it appears that even the angels in heaven are waiting for our basslines

Posted by: persiflo | Apr 9 2023 18:39 utc | 174

Ed: Isn’t “Elohim” a plural form?

Posted by: malenkov | Apr 9 2023 20:19 utc | 175

It is hard to get into the minds of the District of Corruption cobblers who installed shrunken-head Biden as the ostensible President of the U.S.
Yet, unintentionally, they installed the personification of the U.S. polity.
An arrogant, temperamental, stunted cognition, country, unaccustomed to reason or balance.
The mythical Wild-West Hollywood Cowboy, “Yer either with us, or yer agin’ us”
And the World has finally replied, “Well, since you put it that way. We’re agin’ ya.”

Posted by: kupkee | Apr 9 2023 21:10 utc | 176

Ed: Isn’t “Elohim” a plural form?
Posted by: malenkov | Apr 9 2023 20:19 utc | 175
————————————————–
Yes, it is Gods (plural) but that is another curiosity that goes back to ancient Mesopotamia l long, long, time before YAWA was ever dreamed of, or Allah for that matter.

Posted by: Ed | Apr 9 2023 23:27 utc | 177

@ Posted by: gT | Apr 9 2023 16:47 utc | 167
Thank you for that considered reply. However having considered it, I can’t escape coming to a conclusion about your response :
LIAR. To be more precise. You are a LIAR.
Kindly, feel free to prove me wrong about my opinion.
Explain and justify your statements and give citations.
I’ll happily state facts. Can you?
I invite you to dance. If not here then on any thread we meet.
Happy Easter Monday.

Posted by: DunGroanin | Apr 9 2023 23:37 utc | 178

@ Posted by: gT | Apr 9 2023 16:47 utc | 167
🤭🤔
And my response above. It’s a joke just in case. The separation of the Umma has been the biggest mindfuck.
The way Muslims have been moved to fight against Muslims is no different to the way the Orthodox Church is being fought against now.
I believe we are on the same page. It’s about the set up of the Arab League going back over a century. The historical documents show the whole charade being constructed.
Let’s keep exposing the truth.

Posted by: DunGroanin | Apr 10 2023 0:04 utc | 179

History proves that religion, while not the exclusive source of UTism, is remarkably good at that job, and that of the world’s religions, the so-called Abrahamic religions, are much more effective than others. [From my Religion considered Harmful (and the Ungoodness of Prayer)]
Posted by: Hermit | Apr 9 2023 15:49 utc | 164
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I agree with what you say about religion and UT-ism, a prime factor for many wars throughout history. I would like to add to that the fact that extreme nationalism, which includes religion, language, race, and a deep concern for established borders which combined are part of the glue that determines a national culture. Extreme nationalism is historically the primary cause for most wars. It seems to me that, with modern international communications, old fashion Nationalism is evolving into something new and different.
The ideology of the collective west (Americanism) is not sufficient, nor desired, by the rest of the world, therefore the concept of a multi-polar collection (alliance) of national interest has emerged in opposition to US hegemonic aspirations. As a result of the desire and necessity for national entities to combine into multipolar alliances and coexist in harmony, extreme religious views will, over time, must lose their commanding role as a part of the nationalistic glue, which means that religion will eventually become unnecessary for the nationalistic but collective enterprise of multipolar alliances. To paraphrase Hegal: All that is necessary is real and all that is unnecessary becomes unreal.

Posted by: Ed | Apr 10 2023 1:25 utc | 180

@Ed | Apr 10 2023 1:25 utc | 180
My own thinking is that direct democracy, weighted for proximity, involvement and testable expertise (perhaps with educational or experience based equivalence) allows establishment of a single organizational structure with local variations to whatever level is sought, as long as we can agree about basic ethics.
This is a lot safer than preservation of “national” characteristics including wars.

Posted by: Hermit | Apr 10 2023 4:28 utc | 181

@malenkov | Apr 9 2023 20:19 utc | 175
@Ed | Apr 9 2023 23:27 utc | 177
Ed is precisely correct.
As I explain in my Once Upon A Time in Genesis”

The word usually translated as “God” here is definitely plural. “Elohim”, literally means “the sons of El”. El was the High God of the Canaanites (And the Hebrews were indisputably Canaanites). His title was usually, “God of gods and lord of hosts.” He had 70 sons, the Yahwehs, each of which lead a people and possessed a holy mountain (or hill) where he supposedly lived with his consort or Asherah, and to whom the Hebrews paid tribute and addressed prayers

And in my On the Bible
AS we see in Psalm 29, A Psalm of David, “Ascribe to Yahweh, sons of Gods (bênê ’Ēlîm), Ascribe to Yahweh, glory and strength” and in psalm 89:6 (verse 7 in Hebrew), “For who in the skies compares to Yahweh, who can be likened to Yahweh among the sons of Gods (bênê ’Ēlîm)” as well as in “The Song of Moses”, Deuteronomy 32, “The Most High God (El) gave the nations their lands. He divided up the human race. He set up borders for the nations. He did it based on the number of the angels (Elohim, sons of Gods) in his heavenly court. The Lord’s [Yahweh’s people) people are his share. Jacob is the nation he has received.” the Elohim of the Hebrews (אֱלֹהִים‬ ’ĕlōhîm) were undoubtedly the 70 Yahweh, the children of El (or “god”) and rabat ‘Atirat yammi (“she who walks on the sea”) also known as qaniyatu ‘ilhm (“Mother of the Elohim”), or ‘l-h-m found in Ugaritic, and the pantheon of Canaanite gods, also vocalized as “Elohim”, and that we find that the Song of Moses parallels the Ugaritic Baʿal cycle (as does the Book of Daniel, particularly the seventh chapter) written millennia before. where we read of the “seventy sons of Asherah” each with their nations.
And (ibid.)

We are reasonably sure that the god thingie of darkness (Exodus 20:21) who supposedly spoke to Moses was the Volcanic Yahweh and his Asherah of Hala-‘l Bedr, one of the 70 sons of El or Elohim, the “father god most high”, another son of which would later become the god thingie of the Jews.

And in my Timeline of the Palestine

The Hebrews evolved from the Canaanites, arising from the Ugaritic hill peoples and worshiping some of the 70 Yahweh, sons of El, the Canaanite High God. We see this in the 8th century BCE Sherds found at Kuntillet Ajrud as well as in writings preserved at the Synagogue at Elephantine, where at least two of the Yahwehs of High places (and their Asherah) were stiLL being worshipped and sworn by in around 450 BCE (Toynbee, Arnold ((1939) 1964). A Study of History, vol.5, p125).

Posted by: Hermit | Apr 10 2023 6:01 utc | 182

@DunGroanin | Apr 10 2023 0:04 utc | 179
Now I am very confucius about the 2 different responses you have written. But just like Christianity has been heavily Jew infiltrated and subverted over the centuries, just so Islam has been heavily infiltrated and subverted. It is rumoured that the ISIS Caliphate was in fact a Jew pretending to be a Muslim, but that sort of a phenomena is not unknown off in the Muslim world, it has been encountered time and time again.
There is truth to the speculation that both Turkey and Saudi Arabia are run by crypto Jews pretending to be Muslim, which is why the Sunni Muslims always seem to be on the side off and in cahoots with Israel and America. The Shia Muslims on the other hand always seem to be consistently opposed to Israel and America. There is no escaping these generalizations.

Posted by: gT | Apr 10 2023 9:30 utc | 183

1). “But just like Christianity has been heavily Jew infiltrated and subverted over the centuries, just so Islam has been heavily infiltrated and subverted.”
2). “…the Sunni Muslims always seem to be on the side off (sp) and in cahoots with Israel and America. The Shia Muslims on the other hand always seem to be consistently opposed to Israel and America.
Posted by: gT | Apr 10 2023 9:30 utc | 183
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gT, I suspect that the infiltration of Christianity by Jews is due in large part because Jesus was a Jew, don’t you think?
1). After all the Christian “New” Testaments was founded on the Jewish Old Testament, i.e. the Torah or the Tanakh. The modern (70 years) Christian attachment to modern Israel is, I believe, is due to Christian fundamentalist belief that the establishment of modern Israel as a State is the fulfillment of Jewish biblical prophecy.
2). The primary reason for the current borders for most Muslim nations (Saudi Arabia, for example) are the creation Western Nations after WW-1, and the US and oil producing Muslim nations form, until recently, an unbreakable bond that included making the US dollar the required currency to purchase oil internationally. Since the US also has an unbreakable bond with Israel, I suspect that that explains the cozy relationships between many Sunni Muslim countries and Israel. I know that my explanation seems a bit too simple, but I am sure that the Saudi Royal family consider the oil sales to western (mostly Christian, and therefore pro-Israel) nations is far more important that a silly feud with the Jewish State.
However, Iran has a different history with the west, especially the US, the British, and Israel, i.e. the U.S. and British intelligence agencies help elements in the Iranian military to overthrow Iran’s democratically elected prime minister, Mohammed Mossadeq, after Mossadeq’s nationalization of the Britain-owned Anglo-Persian Oil Company, which led London to impose an oil embargo on Iran. The rest is history as they say.
I am not one to see a Jew behind every unsavory event, Anglo Saxon’s are mischievous enough with or without the Jews.

Posted by: Ed | Apr 10 2023 21:26 utc | 184

@Julian | Apr 9 2023 6:31 utc | 130
It’s old news. When 911 occurred, the US government instituted a lockdown when all flights were grounded. During the lockdown GW Bush, the then president, sent at least four privately chartered 747s to Saudi Arabia carrying Saudis from the USA. Amongst them we’re 140nmembeta of the House of Saud (the Royal family) and their wealthy friends, the bin Laden family. These flights and the private jets that shuttles them.arpumd the USA to their flights, required presidential authorization (see e.g Unger, Craig (2009-09-18). Saving the Saudis. Vanity Fair. The Bush administration also sent at least two 747s carrying Israelis back to Israel , and later returned other Israeli agents to Israel without interrogation. These agents had followed some of the 911 terrorists around the country and knew enough about 911 to have positioned a camera crew on a New York rooftop to videotape the impacts with the WTC, and who danced when the collisions occurred (see the The Israeli Files at Antiwar.com).
Nothing was done then and Saudi involvement was quashed and redacted from reports, as was the facts that Afghanistan offered to use their deportation agreement with Germany to deport anyone in Afghanistan against whom the US could support had committed what would be regarded as a crime by Afghanistan, that the planning for 911 was conducted in Germany and Malaysia, and that they knew that Iraq had absolutely nothing to do with it.
Now, with the US having passed a law permitting American civil trials against Saudi Arabia, and the Saudi government working with Russia and China, dumping investments in the US and the petrodollar, while brokering peace all over the Middle East, you can anticipate many new attacks against the Saudi government – which is no more the same as it was when 911 occurred as America’s government is.
It would be foolish in the extreme to take these attacks seriously. Particularly as Saudi Arabia financed the Pakistan thermonuclear weapons program and has access to the resulting documentation and materiel.
PS Saudi Arabia will reject any US court findings on the basis of sovereign immunity, and in all likelihood the US will embarrass itself further by abusing the International system trying to enforce any judgements that result as they have so many other countries, including Iraq, Iran, People’s Republic of Korea, Libya, Russia and more.

Posted by: Hermit | Apr 11 2023 3:26 utc | 185

@Ed | Apr 10 2023 21:26 utc | 184
Ahhh, but the Anglo Saxon elite is very Jewish infiltrated. In the 1800’s already the Germans were complaining that the English elite looked and acted just like Jews (from Occidental Observer), and the Germans, for all their faults, make very meticulous observations. The Jews are famous for marrying their daughters into the upper crust Goyim families, intent on the age old infiltrate and subvert strategy. That was apparently the same way the Hyksos made it to the top in Egypt for a while, through a honeypot working from the inside who then put all her own people into crucial positions to direct matters.
As many say, WASPS = ZIONISTS, most of the Protestant religions are more pro-Israel than the Jews themselves, which is why the Russian Orthodox Saker coined the term AngloZionist.
But yes, Christianity is Jewish, unfortunately. Though that hasn’t stopped the Jews from making alterations to the Christian religion over the course of the centuries to suit the Jewish agenda at the time. I much prefer the thought of Greco-Christianity than Judeo Christianity, which means getting rid of the Old Testament with all its Hebrew nonsense and only referencing the New Testament, which was written in Greek and Aramic. What books constitute the bible has been changed in the past (Vatican) so it can be changed yet again. Some say that it was the Jews who forced the old Testament into the bible to gain control over the new Christian religion. Compare that to the Muslims who only really acknowledge what Mohamed wrote, and ignore much from before his time. Just so, Christianity is supposed follow Christ’s teachings, and ignore everything from before Christ’s time.

Posted by: gT | Apr 11 2023 8:40 utc | 186