Only for news & views directly related to the Ukraine conflict.
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March 2, 2023
Ukraine Open Thread 2023-52
Only for news & views directly related to the Ukraine conflict. The current open thread for other issues is here. Please stick to the topic. Contribute facts. Do not attack other commentators.
Comments
“China and Russia refused to sign the G20 resolution demanding the withdrawal of Russian troops from the territory of Ukraine , – Deutsche Welle. Posted by: james | Mar 2 2023 16:51 utc | 2 This text is one of the best reflections on the operational aspect of the war so far – https://bigserge.substack.com/p/russo-ukrainian-war-schrodingers Posted by: Vit5o | Mar 2 2023 16:53 utc | 3 And with that out of the way…. Posted by: BroncoBilly | Mar 2 2023 16:56 utc | 4 bigsergei: rommel’s plan in 1943 at kasserein pass in tunisia was to wreck a us army armored thrust in a prepared kessel, then send the 10 panzer into us lines….. Posted by: paddy | Mar 2 2023 17:09 utc | 5 Ukrainian clown Zelensky keeps trying to “win the press conference” while losing on the battlefield. The latest stunt is a terrorist attack on a small village on the border, just inside of Russia. Posted by: Chris | Mar 2 2023 17:11 utc | 6 Ukraine is the straw to break what Lavrov at the G20 describes as “neocolonial habits and ambitions.” Posted by: Elmagnostic | Mar 2 2023 17:15 utc | 7 Slavyangrad and Donbass Debuska all lit up over the Posted by: paxmark1 | Mar 2 2023 17:17 utc | 8 https://t.me/intelslava/45316 Posted by: anon2020 | Mar 2 2023 17:23 utc | 9 Fuzzy, initial stated kidnapping of civilians – but Posted by: paxmark1 | Mar 2 2023 17:28 utc | 10 RT is saying that the intruders were forced back to Ukrainian territory and then hit with a “massive” artillery strike. Posted by: the pessimist | Mar 2 2023 17:33 utc | 11 Evidence For an Extensive Bakhmut Tunnel Network Posted by: GoFast | Mar 2 2023 17:35 utc | 12
The bar in the comment section was pretty low already. Posted by: Vikichka | Mar 2 2023 17:46 utc | 13 Posted by: GoFast | Mar 2 2023 17:35 utc | 12 Posted by: Golddiggr | Mar 2 2023 17:56 utc | 14 The main obstacle to Russia winning the war was Russia’s lack of economic mobilization. Posted by: Colin | Mar 2 2023 18:04 utc | 15 NATO’s war aim: violent ethnogenesis
Posted by: Petri Krohn | Mar 2 2023 18:12 utc | 16 According to clobber list, in the Donetsk (Bakhmut) direction, Ukraine lost 6 IFV, 3 AFV and 9 converted vehicles. That probably means, as Military Summary noted, that Ukraine is attempting to reinforce into Bakhmut, or maybe transport supplies with the one road through the town “Kanal” and fields to Bakhmut they have left. Which is turning out to be quite costly. Posted by: unimperator | Mar 2 2023 18:12 utc | 17 I want to thank Nate for his post on the last Ukraine Open Thread of the following video: Posted by: juliania | Mar 2 2023 18:19 utc | 18 OK, had to hold my nose and go there: https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/inside-crimea-russian-military-annexed-ukraine-retake-putin-rcna72606
A few barbs in there, but not the complete MSM hatchet-job one might expect. Cracks in the narrative? Posted by: West of England Andy | Mar 2 2023 18:35 utc | 19 Petri Krohn@16 Posted by: bevin | Mar 2 2023 18:40 utc | 20 Habermas’s appeal is a symbol. Posted by: Colin | Mar 2 2023 18:51 utc | 21 @Petri Krohn | Mar 2 2023 18:12 utc | 16 Posted by: the pessimist | Mar 2 2023 18:57 utc | 22 Continuing my thanks for links – thank you, uncle Tungsten for your link @ 240 on the previous ukraine thread to Pepe’s important article at Strategic Culture – here it is again: Posted by: juliania | Mar 2 2023 19:08 utc | 23 Petri Krohn | Mar 2 2023 18:12 utc | 16 Posted by: Scotch Bingeington | Mar 2 2023 19:12 utc | 24 Aaron Mate interviews Seymour Hersh at The Grayzone… Available at his Substack (a free post) and The Grayzone Youtube channel. Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Mar 2 2023 19:13 utc | 25 Posted by: West of England Andy | Mar 2 2023 18:35 utc | 19 Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Mar 2 2023 19:19 utc | 26 It been months (Sept 2022) since the Nordstream pipelines were blown up by the US and Norway, yet still Russia has receive no information on supposed investigations by the West, and still the West forbids Russia from investigating the sabotage of the pipelines, pipelines that it owns. Posted by: Republicofscotland | Mar 2 2023 19:40 utc | 28 Simplicitus’ take on the terrorism attack in the Bryansk area, smells of desperation by the Ukies to deliver some “good” news. Richard Steven Hack @ 26
After 78ys the time has come to show their ugly face again. They are now recruiting openly. Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Mar 2 2023 19:41 utc | 30 Not sure if this has already been linked to but there is a video of Julia Hartley-Brewer and Peter Hitchens debating if and how the war should end. Hitchens makes some excellent points and does a great job of putting things into historical perspective, at least when he can get a word in edgewise. Hartly-Brewer spews the usual mainstream BS. Posted by: farm ecologist | Mar 2 2023 19:42 utc | 31 Ukrainian forces using chemical weapons on a regular basis now, the West will do nothing about this serious breach of international regulations. However if Russia used these weapons the West would be the first to speak out about it. Posted by: Republicofscotland | Mar 2 2023 19:44 utc | 32 I’m sure the BrainTrust that is pulling the strings on the Ukrainian DRG groups that terrorized the town in Russia proper are aware that this will further galvanize the will of the public and increase the general bloodymindedness of the troops in battle. One has to wonder if that was not the intent in the first place, because certainly there is no real military advantage in doing so. Posted by: Chevrus | Mar 2 2023 19:51 utc | 33 @James 2 Posted by: John Schmeeckle | Mar 2 2023 19:57 utc | 34 Am I missing something or is this not a “smoking gun” of sorts.? Posted by: d | Mar 2 2023 20:07 utc | 35 Ukrainian forces using chemical weapons on a regular basis now, the West will do nothing about this serious breach of international regulations. Posted by: rk | Mar 2 2023 20:16 utc | 36 “Chemical” Zee, the clown must be a distant cousin of this fellow: Posted by: Chris | Mar 2 2023 20:19 utc | 37 @d Posted by: Wilbur | Mar 2 2023 20:24 utc | 38 Posted by: Chevrus | Mar 2 2023 19:51 utc | 33 Posted by: unimperator | Mar 2 2023 20:27 utc | 39 Ukraine continues to make weak attacks within Russia, as they did in Belarus, in order to claim there is some kind of uprising in the country by disaffected military or “partisans”. This is a clear sign of desperation by Kiev. Posted by: HERMIUS | Mar 2 2023 20:37 utc | 40 Holy f*cking brazenness…and cold. Posted by: Irish | Mar 2 2023 20:41 utc | 41 Following up on D’s comment above, here is the Zelensky interview in which he said that NATO membership would never come to Ukraine but that the door had to remain open for public relations purposes: Posted by: Wilbur | Mar 2 2023 20:44 utc | 42 @ John Schmeeckle | Mar 2 2023 19:57 utc | 34 Posted by: james | Mar 2 2023 20:45 utc | 43 Curious report on Russian RT from a Buryatian tank crew, who recorded the event of their first engagement into battle near Ugledar on smartphone (I thought this was not allowed) https://russian.rt.com/russia/article/1118182-tankisty-geroi-video Posted by: Oblomovka daydream | Mar 2 2023 20:55 utc | 44 @ Chevrus | Mar 2 2023 19:51 utc | 33 Posted by: Ciaran | Mar 2 2023 21:00 utc | 45 Posted by: Irish | Mar 2 2023 20:41 utc | 41 Posted by: unimperator | Mar 2 2023 21:04 utc | 46 Inching closer to formal declaration of war NATO v. Russia – the conditions now exists.
A stark warning which likely will be ignored. And then? Posted by: Likklemore | Mar 2 2023 21:12 utc | 47 interesting in that china is now more fully onside with russia openly.. Posted by: Longhorn | Mar 2 2023 21:27 utc | 48 Posted by: Likklemore | Mar 2 2023 21:12 utc | 47 Posted by: unimperator | Mar 2 2023 21:27 utc | 49 Intriguing times in United Germania(1991) As the United Germania peons support for country 404 in 2023 is in rapid decline. Posted by: Bad Deal Motors On | Mar 2 2023 21:27 utc | 50 Posted by: Longhorn | Mar 2 2023 21:27 utc | 48 Posted by: unimperator | Mar 2 2023 21:29 utc | 51 Posted by: unimperator | Mar 2 2023 21:29 utc | 51 Posted by: unimperator | Mar 2 2023 21:31 utc | 52 Posted by: unimperator | Mar 2 2023 21:29 utc | 51 Posted by: Longhorn | Mar 2 2023 21:37 utc | 53 This has likely already been said, but I can’t read every post. I wish that I could. Sorry. Posted by: barstool | Mar 2 2023 21:38 utc | 54 Posted by: Likklemore | Mar 2 2023 21:12 utc | 47 Posted by: Longhorn | Mar 2 2023 21:41 utc | 55 Posted by: unimperator | Mar 2 2023 21:31 utc | 52 Posted by: Longhorn | Mar 2 2023 21:46 utc | 56 Petri Krohn | Mar 2 2023 18:12 utc | 16 Posted by: rjb1.5 | Mar 2 2023 21:46 utc | 57 Posted by: Longhorn | Mar 2 2023 21:46 utc | 56 Posted by: unimperator | Mar 2 2023 21:48 utc | 58 Longhorn | Mar 2 2023 21:41 utc | 55 Posted by: paddy | Mar 2 2023 21:53 utc | 59 Habermas’s appeal is a symbol. Posted by: OohCanada | Mar 2 2023 21:54 utc | 60 https://www.ceskatelevize.cz/porady/10095426857-interview-ct24/215411058040126/ Posted by: Oblomovka daydream | Mar 2 2023 21:59 utc | 61 Posted by: paddy | Mar 2 2023 21:53 utc | 59 Posted by: Longhorn | Mar 2 2023 22:00 utc | 62 Likklemore @47– @ Longhorn | Mar 2 2023 21:27 utc | 48 Posted by: james | Mar 2 2023 22:05 utc | 64 Likkelmore (47): There is a simple reason that Western aircraft are not being sent to Ukraine–they would all be quickly destroyed. The F-16’s and F-15’s are obsolete (less effective than what Ukraine already once had) and the “myth” of the F-35 cannot be allowed to be destroyed. The F-35 is slow and maintenance-prone and hardly a match for the latest Russian anti-air defenses, but what would happen to its reputation if it were actually sent to the fray and shot down? Who would buy it anymore? There is an old saying: “better to keep silent and be thought a fool than to speak up and confirm that you are one”. As long as the F-35 never attacks a competent enemy, it can still be sold as a wunderwaffen and make a few corrupt US defense contractors flush. Posted by: FHTEX | Mar 2 2023 22:05 utc | 65 @ unimperator | Mar 2 2023 21:48 utc | 58 Posted by: james | Mar 2 2023 22:07 utc | 66 Did you know Russia just cut production by 500K bbl a day, because the price is so low? It costs Russia $45 just to get the oil out of the ground….then add on transportation costs and graft. Posted by: jpc | Mar 2 2023 22:07 utc | 67 I think some F-16, even (or especially) if operating from a Polish airfield won’t be able to achieve very much in Donbass. They can maybe try to lob a HARM somewhere there before attempting to sneak back to their base. I think Russian AWACS will pick them up coming long distance away. Posted by: Likklemore | Mar 2 2023 22:12 utc | 68 Posted by: FHTEX | Mar 2 2023 22:05 utc | 65 Posted by: rjb1.5 | Mar 2 2023 22:19 utc | 69 We’ve seen numerous photos of large Ukrainian cargo planes downloading heavy equipment. Why are long runways still operable? Why not target Kiev’s airport with hypersonics? The Brits executed a very complex plan to bomb the Malvinas’ runway back in 1982. Posted by: Sektion2B | Mar 2 2023 22:19 utc | 70 Posted by: rjb1.5 | Mar 2 2023 22:19 utc | 69 Posted by: unimperator | Mar 2 2023 22:25 utc | 71 Posted by: Accidentshappy | Mar 2 2023 22:25 utc | 71 Posted by: unimperator | Mar 2 2023 22:32 utc | 72 @ FHTEX post 65 Posted by: Likklemore | Mar 2 2023 22:38 utc | 73 Somebody has repeatedly requested this declaration made on February 24th: Posted by: Kankel | Mar 2 2023 22:43 utc | 74 Longhorn is a third rate troll. People like him have been responsible for the deaths of millions in the past seventy years. Posted by: bevin | Mar 2 2023 22:48 utc | 75
https://scheerpost.com/2023/03/02/patrick-lawrence-the-return-of-non-alignment/ Posted by: Aleph_Null | Mar 2 2023 22:50 utc | 76 Watch NATO fissures in real time. Who will be the first to exit?
Posted by: Likklemore | Mar 2 2023 22:50 utc | 77 Re: Likklemore | Mar 2 2023 22:12 utc | 68 Posted by: Perimetr | Mar 2 2023 23:14 utc | 80 Bemildred@79 Posted by: Bemildred | Mar 2 2023 23:15 utc | 81 Posted by: FHTEX | Mar 2 2023 22:05 utc | 65 / Posted by: Likklemore | Mar 2 2023 22:12 utc | 68 Posted by: Bill Smith | Mar 2 2023 23:19 utc | 82 I want to point out that the neocons always double down. What Russia does or does not do changes nothing about that. Posted by: Bemildred | Mar 2 2023 23:22 utc | 83 @Colin #21 Posted by: David O’Donnell | Mar 2 2023 23:32 utc | 84 @ Perimeter Post 81. Posted by: Likklemore | Mar 2 2023 23:33 utc | 85 Posted by: Longhorn | Mar 2 2023 21:37 utc | 53 Posted by: Lex | Mar 2 2023 23:50 utc | 86 President Biden on Wednesday (March 1, 2023) issued a continuation of a previous executive order that declared a “national emergency” in the U.S. related to the yearlong conflict between Russia and Ukraine. Posted by: Ed | Mar 2 2023 23:56 utc | 87 Posted by: West of England Andy | Mar 2 2023 18:35 utc | 19 Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Mar 3 2023 0:26 utc | 89 Ukraine is just the latest bloodbath waged to preserve the wealth and power of the capitalist class in the United States. Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Mar 3 2023 0:32 utc | 90 China likes cheap energy. Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Mar 3 2023 0:35 utc | 91 Quite often on these Ukraine Open Threads, I read questions (or accusations) about why Russia is not destroying Western equipment right when it crosses the border to Ukraine, or at least once it is moving closer to the front line. After reading Simplicius76′ recent piece on how this war is actually morphing into “modern unknowns:” electronics, AI, drones, etc. on a large (WWII style) battle field, I am starting to think that Russia may want to engage it in battle. Posted by: Semyony | Mar 3 2023 0:45 utc | 92 Posted by: Ed | Mar 2 2023 23:56 utc | 88 Posted by: Chris | Mar 3 2023 0:49 utc | 93 A quote from: Vit5o | Mar 2 2023 16:53 utc | 3 Posted by: Jmaas | Mar 3 2023 1:08 utc | 94 Posted by: Chris | Mar 3 2023 0:49 utc | 94 Posted by: Ed | Mar 3 2023 1:20 utc | 95 Jmaas 95 Posted by: Paul Greenwood | Mar 3 2023 1:23 utc | 96 Posted by: Jmaas | Mar 3 2023 1:08 utc | 95 Posted by: Jmaas | Mar 3 2023 1:27 utc | 97 I remember David Harris- had a New American Revolution class from him, until Reagan cancelled credit for it. Posted by: Duncan Idaho | Mar 3 2023 1:43 utc | 98 Ciaran 46 Posted by: Chevrus | Mar 3 2023 1:52 utc | 99 @Kankel | Mar 2 2023 22:43 utc | 75 Posted by: barstool | Mar 3 2023 2:07 utc | 100 |
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