Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
March 02, 2023

Ukraine Open Thread 2023-52

Only for news & views directly related to the Ukraine conflict.

The current open thread for other issues is here.

Please stick to the topic. Contribute facts. Do not attack other commentators.

Posted by b on March 2, 2023 at 16:47 UTC | Permalink

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NUmero Uno!!

Posted by: BroncoBilly | Mar 2 2023 16:50 utc | 1

"China and Russia refused to sign the G20 resolution demanding the withdrawal of Russian troops from the territory of Ukraine , - Deutsche Welle.

The rest of the G20 participants supported the summit's final statement calling for a "complete and unconditional withdrawal" of Russian troops."

interesting in that china is now more fully onside with russia openly..

Posted by: james | Mar 2 2023 16:51 utc | 2

This text is one of the best reflections on the operational aspect of the war so far -

Posted by: Vit5o | Mar 2 2023 16:53 utc | 3

And with that out of the way....
DPA reports that russian hacker sources report that mutiny's are taking place in and around Bahkmut for Ukrainian forces.

3rd hand info, but this is the way Lysichansk (sp) fell.

The reserves refused to go into the Zelote (sp) encirclement, which allowed Russian forces to sweep in on the southern end while Chechens kept attacking from the east across the river. It all fell in 48 hours.

The only reason any Ukrainian troops got out was because Russian forces could not keep artillery moving fast enough to bombard the 1 road out fast enough. I don't thin that will happen this time.

Posted by: BroncoBilly | Mar 2 2023 16:56 utc | 4

bigsergei: rommel's plan in 1943 at kasserein pass in tunisia was to wreck a us army armored thrust in a prepared kessel, then send the 10 panzer into us lines.....

why interupt the kiev ganag in the middle of a blunder?

Posted by: paddy | Mar 2 2023 17:09 utc | 5

Ukrainian clown Zelensky keeps trying to "win the press conference" while losing on the battlefield. The latest stunt is a terrorist attack on a small village on the border, just inside of Russia.

Increasing desperation is not lost on his western puppet masters. A bullet in the skull might be coming.

Posted by: Chris | Mar 2 2023 17:11 utc | 6

Ukraine is the straw to break what Lavrov at the G20 describes as "neocolonial habits and ambitions."

Yes. Exactly. But why characterize it as somehow new. There's nothing neo about these 20-21st c. power maneuvers--nothing new about NeoNazis, Neoliberals, Neoconservatives and certainly not Neapolitan Ice Cream. They are who they were when we last left them. They have never left us or changed.

Posted by: Elmagnostic | Mar 2 2023 17:15 utc | 7

Slavyangrad and Donbass Debuska all lit up over the


"Ukrainian saboteurs who crossed the border region of Bryansk show no signs of activity, they could have left Russian territory, eyewitnesses of the events in the region told TASS.

"There is no one from the Ukrainian group on the territory of the Russian Federation, they all left. Now there is a search, possibly, for the remaining fighters of the Armed Forces of Ukraine on our territory," one of the interlocutors of the agency said."

Entered, retreated, dead child.

Posted by: paxmark1 | Mar 2 2023 17:17 utc | 8

🚨🇺🇦 Seems Ukrainians are trying to cover their tracks now about their culpability in the terrorist actions in Bryansk today.

Ukro-tweeter identifies a Bryansk gunman as one of their.

Posted by: anon2020 | Mar 2 2023 17:23 utc | 9

RT is saying that the intruders were forced back to Ukrainian territory and then hit with a "massive" artillery strike.

Posted by: the pessimist | Mar 2 2023 17:33 utc | 11

Evidence For an Extensive Bakhmut Tunnel Network

Extensive salt mines in the Bakmut-Soledar area
Mines Beneath Bakhmut-Soledar

Cave-related business west of Bakhmut
Google Maps Link to Cave-Diving Donbas (temporarily closed)

Cave-related business east of Bakhmut
Google maps link to Завод "Artwinery (you must scroll though the Google Reviews to see photos of the tunnels)"

Could the tunnel complex start east of Bakhmut and run west of Bakhmut?

Could these tunnels facilitate re-supply or evacuation of troops long after the city is formally encircled?

Is underground warfare the real reason why Ukranians call Russians 'orcs'?

Posted by: GoFast | Mar 2 2023 17:35 utc | 12

Is underground warfare the real reason why Ukranians call Russians 'orcs'?
Posted by: GoFast | Mar 2 2023 17:35 utc | 12

The bar in the comment section was pretty low already.

Posted by: Vikichka | Mar 2 2023 17:46 utc | 13

Posted by: GoFast | Mar 2 2023 17:35 utc | 12
Re mines and tunnels:

Tunnels and mines are a poor place to hide. Russia will just use Thermobarics underground. Which will destroy any Ukraine tunnel rats. Then just bury the portals.

Posted by: Golddiggr | Mar 2 2023 17:56 utc | 14

The main obstacle to Russia winning the war was Russia's lack of economic mobilization.

Ukraine has received hundreds of billions of dollars in aid from the West, while Russia has increased its military spending by only $20 billion.

The lack of economic mobilization led to Russia's inability to further increase military spending, which led to the initial speculative blitzkrieg attempt, the Kharkov and Kherson retreats and the current stagnation.

What is really shocking is that Russia has not been defeated by Ukraine.

This reflects the (more) inefficiency of Western weapons and the (more) corruption of the Ukrainian nationalist authority.

Posted by: Colin | Mar 2 2023 18:04 utc | 15

NATO's war aim: violent ethnogenesis

Many have asked the question, why is Ukraine fighting in Donbass and Bakhmut? All answers so far have been wrong. The aim is not to reconquer Crimea or even Donetsk. It is not even to hold on to the rest of Donbass. The aim of the war is war itself. NATO knows that the war cannot end as long as Ukrainian troops remain in Donbass on DPR territory.

In the 1980s Ukraine and Russia were one nation. They shared the same Soviet identity and nationality, just as Americans share the same identity despite their different ethnic origins. In the 1990s a small minority had adapted a Galician identity, while most Ukrainians remained Russia-speaking Soviet people.

To create a Ukrainian ethnos all this must change. NATO needs a new language, a new religion, a new church, a new history. The only history Ukraine has, that is separate from Russian history, is its role as Nazi collaborators.

Changing the identity and ethnicity of a people by force is an act of cultural genocide. Such genocidal policy is only possible under the guise of war. Therefore Euromaidan was from the very beginning in 2013 a war against Russia. Not against the Russian Federation, but against Ukraine's own people, its internal "Russia".

Even if Russia wins this war militarily, it has not managed to stop the cultural genocide, the de-Russification of Ukraine. This is NATO's greatest victory.


I will repost some comment on the topic I have posted here earlier.

Apr 28 2022 1:51 utc

Ukraine is a hate group masquerading as a country

I wrote 15 years ago, that "Ukraine is not a nation. Ukraine is a racist theory about the inferiority of the Russian people." By paraphrasing John McCain the idea can be expressed in even fewer words.

Komsomolkaya Pravda has an article today, that explains why...

May 3 2022 0:47 utc
Why? Everyone in Ukraine speaks Russian. The exception is the western one fourth of Ukraine, where people actually use Ukrainian for written communication. Until a few years ago Ukrainian television was in Russian. The Servant of the People was a Russian language TV show. Poroshenko and Zelensky could hardly speak Ukrainian when they were made president.

Ukraine's policy of cultural genocide aims to abolish the Russian language. The first step was taken eight years ago, right after Maidan, when all Russian media was banned. The latest step was the ban on shop assistants and other service workers from speaking Russian to customers.

A recent video from a health center from some liberated town in Donbass showed signs on doors with a Ukrainian and a Russian flag. The text – in Ukrainian – on the Russian flag said "This language listened to." Even if the Russian speaking patient demands that the Russian speaking doctor speaks in Russian to her, he will not, as this would be a criminal offense. The doctor cannot know if the patient is for real, an informant, or a mole sent by the Language Police. (A similar "Language Police" has operated in the Baltic States for decades.)

P.S. - Derussification is a policy of cultural genocide. It aims to destroy the language, culture, religion, history, symbols, monuments, and identity of Soviet Ukrainians.

Jan 26 2023 9:12 utc

Re: genocide

The systematic de-Russification of Eastern Europe by NATO is the greatest act of genocide in the 21st century.

The Kyiv regime is not only anti-Russian. It is genocidal. It aims to deny and deprive Ukrainians of the right to language, culture, religion, history, nationality and identity and replace them with a Galician ethnicity, a Nazi ideology, and a hate-based Satan-worshiping religion.

Posted by: Petri Krohn | Mar 2 2023 18:12 utc | 16

According to clobber list, in the Donetsk (Bakhmut) direction, Ukraine lost 6 IFV, 3 AFV and 9 converted vehicles. That probably means, as Military Summary noted, that Ukraine is attempting to reinforce into Bakhmut, or maybe transport supplies with the one road through the town "Kanal" and fields to Bakhmut they have left. Which is turning out to be quite costly.

Also one BUK and one S-300 system destroyed.

Posted by: unimperator | Mar 2 2023 18:12 utc | 17

I want to thank Nate for his post on the last Ukraine Open Thread of the following video:

(If this doesn't get you there, Nate's post was at 155, numerous links with this one at the bottom of the list). I came to it late last night, so had't time to reply. It is VERY informative, and uplifting, in Pepe's usual style.

Posted by: juliania | Mar 2 2023 18:19 utc | 18

OK, had to hold my nose and go there:

By Keir Simmons, Natasha Lebedeva and Tatyana Chistikova

SEVASTOPOL, Crimea — Soldiers kiss loved ones goodbye at train stations. Fighter jets circle overhead. Military vehicles bearing war-supporting Z's on their grills power down the Tavrida Highway, a 155-mile road linking this peninsula’s main cities.

Crimea is a territory teeming with Russian forces.

Nowhere is that truer than in Sevastopol, a city that has long embodied naval might in the Russian imagination.

Fishermen watch as Russia’s Black Sea Fleet docks and sails. “Special Military Operation for the future of Russia,” a billboard declares en route to the port. Sevastopol’s “Victory” cinema now also sports a massive Z. Roads like Lenin Street are lined with red, white and blue Russian Federation flags.

This is not Russia, according to Kyiv, its Western allies and the United Nations. It was annexed by the Kremlin in 2014, with the U.N. calling on Russia to return to its "internationally recognized borders." And following Moscow’s broader invasion launched a year ago, President Volodymyr Zelenskyy has vowed Ukraine will take Crimea back.

But Praskovya Baranova, 73, speaks Russian, feels Russian and lives here.

“This is our land,” she said Monday. “We will all put on uniforms and will go to the border to defend ourselves.”Her comments echoed those of most people NBC News spoke to in Crimea this week. While the government of President Vladimir Putin has cracked down on free speech everywhere, including in Crimea, the peninsula’s majority Russian-speaking population was considered more pro-Moscow than in other parts of Ukraine when it was annexed.

Russia says life has improved.

Modern-looking gas stations along the highway sell Coca-Cola imported from Belarus, a beverage hard to find in Moscow these days.

But Zelenskyy has said Crimea is one of the reasons he wants more powerful weapons from the United States and NATO. “Crimea is our land, our territory,” he said in January. "Give us your weapons — we will return what is ours." And if Ukraine does try to take the peninsula back by force as its leaders have promised, many of the 2.4 million people living here will be caught in the middle.

“He wouldn’t take it,” Ruslan Nalgiev, 36, said. “Even if there is a war here, we would still defend Sevastopol. Because, if we don’t defend our motherland, we would become slaves. No one wants to become a slave.”

Sevastopol — home to the Black Sea Fleet in Soviet times and the era of the Russian empire — might be the king on Putin’s chess board: The Russian leader may be determined to protect it at any cost, but Kyiv may now fear any peace deal that left Russia’s navy in the port would threaten its coastline for years to come.

After explosions rocked strategic sites in Crimea and Kyiv’s forces seized back the nearby southern hub of Kherson late last year, the door appeared to be open to a campaign to retake the prized peninsula. But Russian forces have regrouped and dug in.

NBC News traveled to Crimea by train from Moscow, across the Kerch Bridge that was blown up in a strategic and symbolic blow to Putin last fall. It is now fully restored but would likely be targeted again if the fight came to this peninsula.

Doubts persist, however, about whether the U.S. and other allies are willing to give Ukraine the firepower it may need for such an ambitious operation — especially given the Kremlin’s stance that Crimea represents a red line.

“The question of Crimea, and the question of what happens down the road, is something that we will come to,” White House national security adviser Jake Sullivan said on NBC News’ “Meet the Press” on Sunday. Undersecretary of State Victoria Nuland recently said that "at the very least, Crimea needs to be demilitarized," though she didn’t say how that could be done.

Sevastopol is steeped in Russian military culture. It even has a Russian army store with toy tanks, Kalashnikovs and artillery for kids. For adults, it stocks clothes with “Victory is ours” emblazoned on them.

With war just a few hundred miles away, there are now makeshift signs for the nearest basement in Sevastopol.

Diana Galastyan, 26, denies that the Russian authorities may be trying to scare people. “No one imposes fear on us. No one is saying to us that it will be scary. Nothing like that. They don’t plant fear in us.”

Still, fear lives here if you look for it.

A U.N. committee recently accused Russia of extrajudicial killings, abductions, politically motivated prosecutions, discrimination and violence in Crimea. The targets of many of these human rights abuses, it said, were the Muslim ethnic minority Crimean Tatars, who have been oppressed over the years and who have often led the opposition to Russia’s rule.

For a community like this one, speaking out can be frightening.

In the historically Tatar town of Bakhchisarai, Olga, who declined to give her last name, broke down in tears when she talked about the war.

“All mothers are crying. Both Russian and Ukrainian mothers are crying,” she said. “Why did it even start? Can’t we all live in peace? Can’t we just share this piece of bread in two halves?”

Now the conflict is threatening to once again engulf Crimea.

Zelenskyy has said the war that started here will end here, a prospect that — for residents of the peninsula and the rest of this war-torn region — may mean that an end to the bloodshed is a long way off.

“I have lived a long life already and I always thought that our generation would live without the war,” Olga says. “And you see, I was mistaken.”

A few barbs in there, but not the complete MSM hatchet-job one might expect. Cracks in the narrative?

Posted by: West of England Andy | Mar 2 2023 18:35 utc | 19

Petri Krohn@16
Thank you for this excellent summary of the situation. The one thing that I suspect (rather than know) needs adding is an examination of the role played by Canadian and US governments and Universities in preserving and nurturing the discredited remnants of Ukrainian nationalism after 1945.
Few people realise to what an extent the Cold War was between the forces of darkness and the waxing light in the east.

Posted by: bevin | Mar 2 2023 18:40 utc | 20

Habermas's appeal is a symbol.

He is the spokesman for (parts of) the German ruling class, which indicates that (some of) the ruling class is beginning to want to reach some kind of peace that does not make them visibly ashamed.

I think Putin is also willing to make peace, considering his apparent inability to mobilize for a proper war and his attempts at peace in the early stages of the war.

Ukrainian bourgeoisie like Ihor Kolomoisky also has a willingness for peace, which leads him to be a target of regime strikes.

Posted by: Colin | Mar 2 2023 18:51 utc | 21

@Petri Krohn | Mar 2 2023 18:12 utc | 16

This is the true war crime and the evil intent of the west. Somehow a majority of people in Europe fail to understand this fact.

Posted by: the pessimist | Mar 2 2023 18:57 utc | 22

Continuing my thanks for links - thank you, uncle Tungsten for your link @ 240 on the previous ukraine thread to Pepe's important article at Strategic Culture - here it is again:

I was outside in nature reading this; it is magisterial. Thank you, Pepe, especially for the linking comparison of spiritual values -- I loved that! Also, for more reading to do, your links as well -- thanks very much!! As at my #18, go to uncle's 240, previous UO thread if mine above doesn't work. Trust me, it will be worth it!

Posted by: juliania | Mar 2 2023 19:08 utc | 23

Petri Krohn | Mar 2 2023 18:12 utc | 16

Powerful post!


West of England Andy | Mar 2 2023 18:35 utc | 19

Thanks for sharing! Have you ever been to Sevastopol? I seem to remember that getting around the canyon/river, from the northern side to the southern, took forever. I also remember how my friend was snarled at by an elderly lady for having one foot on the bench at the waterfront. Plus giant old steam locomotives and soldiers and sailors everywhere.

Posted by: Scotch Bingeington | Mar 2 2023 19:12 utc | 24

Aaron Mate interviews Seymour Hersh at The Grayzone... Available at his Substack (a free post) and The Grayzone Youtube channel.

Aaron's Substack article which provides an audio version as well as a link to the Youtube channel (44 minutes):

Hersh: US bombed Nord Stream to prolong the Ukraine proxy war

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Mar 2 2023 19:13 utc | 25

Posted by: West of England Andy | Mar 2 2023 18:35 utc | 19

See my post in the last thread. The Ukrainians put Keir Simmons on their hit list which raises the question whether NBC will admit that and whether the presstitutes elsewhere will complain about it - both of which are highly unlikely since it disrupts the narrative about "democratic Ukraine".

What's amusing to me is how Ukraine, with its insanely radical neo-Nazi nationalism, continually shoots itself in the foot militarily, economically and geopolitically. The reason, of course, is that they're guided by the neocons and other Western politicians who are, as Martyanov continually says, both ignorant imbeciles and ideological fanatics.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Mar 2 2023 19:19 utc | 26

Russia should raze Kiev to the ground.

Posted by: jgalt | Mar 2 2023 19:25 utc | 27

It been months (Sept 2022) since the Nordstream pipelines were blown up by the US and Norway, yet still Russia has receive no information on supposed investigations by the West, and still the West forbids Russia from investigating the sabotage of the pipelines, pipelines that it owns.

Posted by: Republicofscotland | Mar 2 2023 19:40 utc | 28

Simplicitus' take on the terrorism attack in the Bryansk area, smells of desperation by the Ukies to deliver some "good" news.

Posted by: Roger | Mar 2 2023 19:41 utc | 29

Richard Steven Hack @ 26

What's amusing to me is how Ukraine, with its insanely radical neo-Nazi nationalism, continually shoots itself in the foot militarily, economically and geopolitically. The reason, of course, is that they're guided by the neocons and other Western politicians who are, as Martyanov continually says, both ignorant imbeciles and ideological fanatics.

After 78ys the time has come to show their ugly face again. They are now recruiting openly.

Why not earlier, why in the shadows before? They had to wait for the very last of the WW2 generation to die off. They literally waited for 78 years, checking off the years getting more and more exited and feisty around 2010. 2021 was Night Of The Living Dead, the Nazis all crawled out of their graves at once.

Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Mar 2 2023 19:41 utc | 30

Not sure if this has already been linked to but there is a video of Julia Hartley-Brewer and Peter Hitchens debating if and how the war should end. Hitchens makes some excellent points and does a great job of putting things into historical perspective, at least when he can get a word in edgewise. Hartly-Brewer spews the usual mainstream BS.

Posted by: farm ecologist | Mar 2 2023 19:42 utc | 31

Ukrainian forces using chemical weapons on a regular basis now, the West will do nothing about this serious breach of international regulations. However if Russia used these weapons the West would be the first to speak out about it.

"The Ukrainian military used chemical munitions near Artyomovsk and Donetsk in recent days, Yan Gagin, an advisor to the leader of the Donetsk People’s Republic (DPR), told TASS on Thursday.

"(Ukrainian forces - TASS) have been reported using munitions with chemical components in several locations at once," Gagin said. Specifically, prohibited weapons were used in the Donetsk and Artyomovsk directions, he added.

On February 10, acting DPR leader Denis Pushilin said that reports about the use of chemical weapons by the Ukrainians had intensified across the frontline. The latest incidents, he said, were registered near Artyomovsk, Mayorsk, and Ugledar. According to Pushilin, the people exposed to the chemicals developed irritation of the mucous membrane, a cough, and felt general malaise.

Gagin told TASS earlier that Ukrainian forces had used chemical weapons along the Soledar and Artyomovsk frontlines on February 5. He added that Ukrainian troops themselves made no secret that they had banned weapons on them, as they had been sporadically posting videos showing foreign-made gas grenades and drones designed for dropping them."

Posted by: Republicofscotland | Mar 2 2023 19:44 utc | 32

I’m sure the BrainTrust that is pulling the strings on the Ukrainian DRG groups that terrorized the town in Russia proper are aware that this will further galvanize the will of the public and increase the general bloodymindedness of the troops in battle. One has to wonder if that was not the intent in the first place, because certainly there is no real military advantage in doing so.
It seems that The Great Turning Away is in full swing now. The USA will not be in any kind of position to dictate much of anything to any non-vassal states in the RoW once the smoke clears. SWIFT, IMF, WorldBank and various other institutions will likely be bypassed or ignored in favor of a better system. We are hearing noises in the direction on a regular basis, coming from the “equatorial south” in particular. It seems that Russia and China offer a better deal. Well at any rate it cannot be any worse than the “deal” the Europeans and NorthAmericans gave them for the past few centuries…

Posted by: Chevrus | Mar 2 2023 19:51 utc | 33

@James 2

China has to be concerned about the western goal of breaking up or balkanizing Russia. This would create new, unstable states along China's northern border, opening the door to foreign meddling and encirclement. Best to stop that before it happens, so supporting Russia would seem to be a prudent choice.

Posted by: John Schmeeckle | Mar 2 2023 19:57 utc | 34

Am I missing something or is this not a “smoking gun” of sorts.?
“’Ukraine Proposal for NATO-Style Security Guarantee Greeted With Skepticism In bid to end war with Russia, negotiators for Kyiv offering neutrality for a defense pledge from western countries” .
We know now from statements made by the former Israeli prime minister and the Turkish foreign minister that “The West” appeared not to want to support any negotiated settlement to the war. This article in the WSJ clearly states that there was a UKRAINIAN PROPOSAL put on the table that neither the US nor European leaders had any intention of pursuing. Note:
1. There was no indication that Russia rejected the idea;
2. It was essentially a rephrasing of the Minsk11 accords, which of course Russia was urging the West to get behind and encourage Ukraine to accept;
3. It proposed that Russia be included/among the security arrangement/guarantors;
4. It called for a “special status” cut-out regarding security guarantees pertaining to Crimea and Donbas areas.--Matters to be negotiated over time but directly between Ukrainian and Russian authorities;
5. The silence and “skepticism” from West was clearly about committing any security guarantees -- the very core of NATO membership, paradoxically exactly that which US/NATO had been promising to Ukraine for over a decade.

So the only conclusion that seems reasonable is that the promise of NATO membership for Ukraine –most steadfastly touted by the US – was actually a ruse; that is, the perilous “”primrose path” that Mersheimer has for decades claimed the US was leading Ukraine down.
In other words they never had any intention of coming to the defense of Ukraine via Article 5. They were, however, quite willing to NATO-ize it, provoking Russia into an attack, while rolling the dice gambling with “house money” (i.e, Ukrainian lives) -- hoping to kill a lot of Russians, take yet another step toward weakening/destabilizing Russia, while selling a lot of weapons to enrich defense contactors, and “maybe” even breathe life into the corpse of the idea of “full spectrum dominance” we now know took its last gasps in the humiliating misadventures in Afghanistan, Iraq, etc.

Here are the excerpts:

“Western officials are balking at Ukraine’s proposal for a NATO-style mutual-defense pledge that could draw their military forces into a war with Russia, even as they expressed some receptiveness to the idea of international security guarantees as part of a deal to end hostilities.
At peace talks in Istanbul on Tuesday, Ukrainian negotiators handed Russia a detailed proposal of a neutral status for Ukraine with its security guaranteed by the U.S., U.K., France, Turkey, Germany, Canada, Poland and Israel. The Ukrainian proposal would ask countries to respond to a violation of its sovereignty the way members of North Atlantic Treaty Organization would act under Article 5, the alliance’s mutual-defense promise.
‘That’s what we call Ukrainian NATO,’ said Ukrainian negotiator David Arakhamia, the majority leader in the country’s parliament, in an interview in Istanbul. ‘So we get neutrality but our idea is to get fortified neutrality status.’
President Biden has yet to comment on the proposal, but White House communications director Kate Bedingfield declined to say Wednesday whether the U.S. would be willing to serve as a security guarantor for Ukraine
A number of Western leaders have expressed support for some form of security guarantees for Ukraine, yet none have articulated what those would look like. Their reluctance to embrace a key plank of Ukraine’s blueprint—the notion of a NATO collective defense mechanism—shows how far apart all sides remain in finding a negotiated end to the war.
U.S. lawmakers also appeared skeptical of the proposal. Sen. Dick Durbin of Illinois, the No. 2 Senate Democrat and co-chair of Ukraine Caucus, said he thought the proposal was a ‘little premature’ adding that he doesn’t trust Russia.
(The double speak here is astounding; The whole point of security guarantees is to bridge any lack of trust. Later the article notes that “The Ukrainian government, however, seems set on a proposal that would provide strong security guarantees from western countries.”)
U.K. Deputy Prime Minister Dominic Raab also expressed skepticism over a proposal to provide a security guarantee to a non-NATO member. ‘We’ll consider anything [Ukrainian President Volodymyr] Zelensky says he needs very carefully,’Mr. Raab said Wednesday on BBC radio. ‘But we’re not going to, I think, replicate unilaterally the NATO commitments that apply to NATO members.’
Other countries named as possible guarantors of Ukraine’s security expressed interest in the idea, but avoided committing to the proposal.
‘The activation mechanism is even stronger than NATO. In NATO if something happens you have to do the consultations first,’ said Mr. Arakhamia, the Ukrainian negotiator
Germany’s chancellor Olaf Scholz told Mr. Zelensky that Berlin was “broadly willing” to act as a security guarantor for Ukraine as part of a peace deal, a German government spokesman said Wednesday. It is, however, ‘too early to discuss such commitments’, government spokesman Steffen Hebestreit said.
A senior German government official later clarified that the discussion was in an early stage, and it included a proposal for a group of countries including Russia to guarantee Ukraine’s security as part of a peace agreement under which Kyiv would declare independence of any military alliances, including NATO.
The German official said that the Ukrainian proposal was yet to be fleshed out, and that it could only work if Russia was part of it.
France is open to supporting a form of neutrality for Ukraine with its security guaranteed by several countries, according to a person familiar with the matter. The person cautioned, however, that France is unwilling to sign up for a security guarantee that includes a mechanism similar to NATO’s Article 5. Much will also depend on the details of Ukraine’s neutrality, including the status of its national army, the person added.
Crimea and Donbas—two Ukrainian regions Russia occupies—wouldn’t be a part of the guarantees, said Mr. Arakhamia. Those territories would be excluded until their status is settled in separate negotiations, he said. Ukrainian officials proposed on Tuesday that the status of Donbas would be negotiated by the presidents of Ukraine and Russia, while Crimea would be subject to a 15-year period of negotiations on a separate track. “

Posted by: d | Mar 2 2023 20:07 utc | 35

Ukrainian forces using chemical weapons on a regular basis now, the West will do nothing about this serious breach of international regulations.
Republicofscotland | Mar 2 2023 19:44 utc | 32

The West sends the banned weapons there. Started with banned mines last year, now it's chemicals and probably depleted uranium next. And some were surprised contract soldiers didn't want to stay forever...

Posted by: rk | Mar 2 2023 20:16 utc | 36

"Chemical" Zee, the clown must be a distant cousin of this fellow:

Posted by: Chris | Mar 2 2023 20:19 utc | 37


Quite possible. Remember Zelensky went on CNN soon after Feb 24 and said that he has been told the Ukraine would never be in NATO. Aaron Mate posted a link to this interview on the Greyzone last year. I can't seem to find it now.

The implication is that Ukraine has never been anything but kamikaze cannon fodder for Washington against Moscow. It is so evil.

Posted by: Wilbur | Mar 2 2023 20:24 utc | 38

Posted by: Chevrus | Mar 2 2023 19:51 utc | 33

If there's one metaphor to be made, it's that Ukraine is pumped full of pervitin (metamphetamin). One can run for quite a while with high endurance when high. One can even take a bullet hit or two when high and keep going. But once the effect runs out or the mental capability simply exceeds the physical capability, it's over. Then one is dead very quickly.

In fact it's not only a metaphor, during the summer-Autumn of 2022, they spoke of literal zombies on the front. Yes, they are on Captagon or something similar, they can take a bullet hit or two without stopping or falling to the ground. If I recall correctly those reports also mentioned of under-aged people in the front. That's some superhuman and scary stuff.

Posted by: unimperator | Mar 2 2023 20:27 utc | 39

Ukraine continues to make weak attacks within Russia, as they did in Belarus, in order to claim there is some kind of uprising in the country by disaffected military or "partisans". This is a clear sign of desperation by Kiev.

Posted by: HERMIUS | Mar 2 2023 20:37 utc | 40

Holy f*cking brazenness...and cold.

"Ret. Gen. Keith Kellogg, ex-advisor to Mike Pence, says it's the "acme of professionalism" to use Ukraine to fight Russia because that "takes a strategic adversary off the table" without "using any US troops." And then "we can focus" on "our primary adversary, which is China."

Posted by: Irish | Mar 2 2023 20:41 utc | 41

Following up on D's comment above, here is the Zelensky interview in which he said that NATO membership would never come to Ukraine but that the door had to remain open for public relations purposes:

In other words, Ukraine was a sacrificial tool of the evil empire.

Posted by: Wilbur | Mar 2 2023 20:44 utc | 42

@ John Schmeeckle | Mar 2 2023 19:57 utc | 34

yes, i agree, but i think there is even more at play here then just this.. cheers..

Posted by: james | Mar 2 2023 20:45 utc | 43

Curious report on Russian RT from a Buryatian tank crew, who recorded the event of their first engagement into battle near Ugledar on smartphone (I thought this was not allowed)

“My best crew”: tankers from Buryatia spoke about the rescue of a colleague near Ugledar

The tankers, who were able to get out of the burning tank, save a colleague and return to their positions, went on a special operation as volunteers. This was told to RT by the gunner and mechanic of the combat vehicle. Earlier, a video was circulated on social networks, in which tankers, sitting in a shell crater on the battlefield, say hello, smile and say “Glory to Russia.” Next to them lies a fighter to whom they provided first aid. How the soldiers were able to maintain good spirits, despite the injuries - in the material RT.

Russian tank crews, who accidentally became famous after a video of the battle near Ugledar, went on a special operation as volunteers. The tank commander, gunner and driver are all from Buryatia and met in the training unit.

The battle, during which they were blown up by an anti-tank mine, but were able to survive and help the wounded, was their first combat exit. This was told to RT by the 27-year-old gunner Geser and the 37-year-old tank driver Dmitry.

“We are all volunteers: in October we signed a contract and met already in training (educational part. - RT ), at the end of December we were already here. This was our first attack. When I got into the tank, maybe it was scary, but when they were already driving, they were shooting, there wasn’t much fear,” says Geser.

“Glory to Russia, there is no market!”
The video, which became popular on social networks, was recorded by the tank commander. On the recording, the crew of the combat vehicle is sitting in a shelter - a shell crater. A tank smokes on the horizon.

“Big hello to everyone from the front line ... Here f***** what’s going on, but we’re pushing!” — says the author of the video, smiling at the camera.

Then he shows his comrades, one of them says: “Glory to Russia!”, To which the tank commander replies: “Glory to Russia, there is no market!”

The video was recorded after the tankers completed their combat mission. They had to clear the site so that the next combat vehicles could freely go on the offensive and shoot through part of the forest belt. After the tankers had done their job, they drove over a mine.

“We were blown up when we were returning from a combat mission. We had to go in reverse, in our own footsteps, and we began to turn around and there it was literally enough to move off our rut by one meter to catch that very mine, ”recall the gunner and tank mechanic.

According to them, the car jumped at least one and a half meters from the explosion. The commander received a fracture of the vertebrae from the blow, two other crew members received a concussion.

“It’s good that we hit a mine with the back of the tank, if we hit the front one ... The driver, he sits in front, well, I think we would have left him there,” says Geser, who said in the video “Glory Russia!

The tank had to be abandoned, and the soldiers began to return to their positions along the same road along which they were driving in a car - so as not to be blown up by other mines. When they crawled to their own, an infantryman called them out of the funnel from an exploding shell.

“He saw how our equipment drove past him, but he could not call - they were far away. When they injected him with painkillers, he began to fall asleep, we talked with him - for the house, for life, for the family. They encouraged him as much as they could so that he would not turn off, ”the tankers said.

After resting, they managed to follow the trail of their tank back to our positions and pull out the wounded.

“I will pray for this tanker”
Now the crew commander and infantryman Andrei are in the hospital for treatment. Andrei's family recognized him on the video, despite the fact that his face is not visible on the recording: he lies with his back to the camera.

His wife told RT that she recognized the man by his physique. In addition, the video mentions that he is from the village of Dzhida in Buryatia, and Andrei is the only one mobilized from this locality.

The man was drafted into the army on September 23, before that he worked on the railway, and in his youth he served in the border troops, so he expected to be called up.

The last time she heard her husband's voice was two weeks ago. Andrei's wife and children still cannot contact him by phone. RT helps the fighter's family find out exactly where he is so they can talk to him in person.

The operator and driver of the tank, despite the concussions, are ready to continue their service. Now they are waiting for a new tank. They do not consider themselves heroes and did not expect the video to become so popular.

“To be honest, I would not want everyone to see this video. We didn't do anything heroic. The tank was lost - it's a pity, - says Geser. Now let's be more experienced. But the combat mission was completed, everyone seems to be happy. The fighting spirit of all the guys is excellent, and in general, everything is fine!”

According to Geser and Dmitry, the morale in their units is greatly supported by their commanders. Thus, the commander of the battalion in which they serve, 35-year-old Major Enver Nabiev, was awarded the title Hero of Russia last fall.

“Our battalion commander and company commander are the best! We look up to them. Our battalion commander is a Hero of Russia, an example for us,” the servicemen say.

During the service, they have not yet been at home and miss their relatives and even colleagues very much.

He and his colleagues regularly receive parcels from the residents of Buryatia. Soldiers value not only things, but also letters written to them by relatives, as well as unfamiliar compatriots. So, since the New Year, Geser always carries with him a letter from schoolchildren from Buryatia. It was with him in the first combat output.

"Dear soldier! I am in the sixth grade, I am fond of sports, but most of all I love basketball. I want the war to end as soon as possible, so that all countries become friendly with each other and that there will never be a war again. I wish you health, good mood, good luck and a speedy return home,” reads the tanker.

Posted by: Oblomovka daydream | Mar 2 2023 20:55 utc | 44

@ Chevrus | Mar 2 2023 19:51 utc | 33
“ I’m sure the BrainTrust that is pulling the strings on the Ukrainian DRG groups that terrorized the town in Russia proper are aware that this will further galvanize the will of the public and increase the general bloodymindedness of the troops in battle. One has to wonder if that was not the intent in the first place, because certainly there is no real military advantage in doing so.”

Terrorism does have military purposes:
—Distract an enemy
—Create disorder and dissension among a populace
—Undermine trust in those tasked with protecting
—Create conditions under which emotional reactions may be more likely.

Posted by: Ciaran | Mar 2 2023 21:00 utc | 45

Posted by: Irish | Mar 2 2023 20:41 utc | 41
Posted by: Wilbur | Mar 2 2023 20:44 utc | 42

Holy cow indeed.

Now that it's said out loud, there are no obstacles for China to flood the whatever weapon they want to Russia, as US has declared that Ukraine war is intended to make a future war against China more advantageous to the US side.

Posted by: unimperator | Mar 2 2023 21:04 utc | 46

Inching closer to formal declaration of war NATO v. Russia – the conditions now exists.

Medvedev: Delivery of NATO Aircraft to Kiev Will Mean Alliance's War Against Russia

MOSCOW (Sputnik) - The delivery of NATO aircraft to Ukraine and their maintenance on the territory of the alliance will be a direct entry of NATO into the war against Russia, Russian Security Council Deputy Chairman Dmitry Medvedev said on Thursday. 

Since the 1920s, there has been an understanding that a country can be recognized as a participant in hostilities if, in addition to supplying weapons, it trains personnel to use them, Medvedev recalled. 

"This is how it is happening today: Canadian and German instructors in the EU are already teaching Ukrainian killers how to handle Leopards," Medvedev said on Telegram.

"If we imagine that NATO aircraft delivered in the future will be serviced by their military on the territory of some overgrown Poland (the only possibility, taking into account the deplorable state of the defense industry in Malorossia), this will be a direct entry of the Atlanticists into the war against Russia with all the ensuing consequences. [.]

"All persons making decisions on the supply (repair) of such equipment or weapons, along with foreign mercenaries and military instructors, will become legitimate military targets," he added.

Events in Bryansk Region Show US, NATO & EU Support Terrorists [.]
(emphasis added)

A stark warning which likely will be ignored. And then?

Posted by: Likklemore | Mar 2 2023 21:12 utc | 47

interesting in that china is now more fully onside with russia openly..

Posted by: james | Mar 2 2023 16:51 utc | 2

China likes cheap energy.

Posted by: Longhorn | Mar 2 2023 21:27 utc | 48

Posted by: Likklemore | Mar 2 2023 21:12 utc | 47

I think some F-16, even (or especially) if operating from a Polish airfield won't be able to achieve very much in Donbass. They can maybe try to lob a HARM somewhere there before attempting to sneak back to their base. I think Russian AWACS will pick them up coming long distance away.

Nevertheless it's a stark statement of how the facts are.

Posted by: unimperator | Mar 2 2023 21:27 utc | 49

Intriguing times in United Germania(1991) As the United Germania peons support for country 404 in 2023 is in rapid decline.

Sgt "I know nothing" Sholz at a recent pro rally was seen bewailing against the daily yet massively growing in numbers. The brand new 2022 "Peace in Our Time Party"! At a recent send everything plus the kitchen sink eastward rally to the fewer attending party faithful.

At the kill all United Germania "Peace In Our Time Party(new in 2022)" rally. RT shows Sgt Scholz with a half-raised right fist(oopsie moment). Almost like the former Germania(1919) salute. Well, clearly Sgt Scholz is a closet NDSAP(1933) supporter throwback.

Who knew apart from the Lipp family? Should one hold an open dissenting opinion? Running counter to the official posterior passing wind from Sgt Scholz.
Makes one a criminal terrorist. Clearly, Sgt Scholz has recreated STASI 2.0!

First, they came for................

Posted by: Bad Deal Motors On |

Posted by: Bad Deal Motors On | Mar 2 2023 21:27 utc | 50

Posted by: Longhorn | Mar 2 2023 21:27 utc | 48

Did you know that Russia actually has the luxury of prioritizing who to sell? They are prioritizing oil sales to India over China and getting above $70 sale price. Oil production volume has not been affect much.

Posted by: unimperator | Mar 2 2023 21:29 utc | 51

Posted by: unimperator | Mar 2 2023 21:29 utc | 51

And one more mention on oil. There are over 600 tankers servicing Russian oil shipments from Far East ports.

Posted by: unimperator | Mar 2 2023 21:31 utc | 52

Posted by: unimperator | Mar 2 2023 21:29 utc | 51

Did you know Russia just cut production by 500K bbl a day, because the price is so low? It costs Russia $45 just to get the oil out of the ground....then add on transportation costs and graft.

Posted by: Longhorn | Mar 2 2023 21:37 utc | 53

This has likely already been said, but I can't read every post. I wish that I could. Sorry.

Russia didn't choose to make the large battle at Artemovsk; Ukraine did by choosing to send large numbers of their troops there. Russia would have taken the main battle to wherever Ukraine chose. Russia won't choose when to complete the action either. As long as Ukraine is sending reinforcements in, Russia will keep the eastern edge of the cauldron open and keep destroying the forces in the city. When Ukraine stops sending reinforcements or starts pulling back their forces, Russia will close the opening, the noose, on the eastern side. They will complete taking the city then.

I can guess where Russia will focus next, but you're smart enough to recognize it as only a guess. Russia has made large strategic moves to keep it's forces in a line. Forces more out in front of those in the line move more slowly or pause altogether. That concentrates the forces and simplifies supply and reinforcement. A specialized unit would have less distance to cover. Of course, ground truth outweighs the abstract almost every time.

The game will soon change for Russia. It will hold much of the territories that now belong to it. It has been turning control of areas that it has cleared over to the local governments. What does it do as it starts demilitarization and denazification in territories that haven't declared independence from Ukraine? In Putin's statement at the start of SMO, he stated the objectives the Ukraine be a neutral non-militarized country that would never be a part of NATO and would be a buffer between Russia and NATO. The denazified and demilitarized objectives were in that same document that seems to have been eliminated from the Internet. (I'd love to have a link to the original!)

Posted by: barstool | Mar 2 2023 21:38 utc | 54

Posted by: Likklemore | Mar 2 2023 21:12 utc | 47

Medvedev is executing a Russia information operation to dissuade the West from supporting Ukraine. Its not working on the West, but apparently you believe it lol.

Posted by: Longhorn | Mar 2 2023 21:41 utc | 55

Posted by: unimperator | Mar 2 2023 21:31 utc | 52

What size are they? VLCC? Panamax? Aframax? Small dirty tanker? Dirty Panamax?

Posted by: Longhorn | Mar 2 2023 21:46 utc | 56

Petri Krohn | Mar 2 2023 18:12 utc | 16
surely the millions killed through "shock and awe" in the 90's are part of the story?

the millions of dead and tens of millions of refugees created from Libya to Afghanistan were and are, at least in part, pieces of the plan to destroy Russia.

there's plenty of historical precedent and context to confirm the West's genocidal intentions. just since 1990.

but the West has become so insane that the real manly men are skipping the march on Tehran and heading straight for Beijing. and Moscow hasn't even burned down yet! no Leningrad besieged, but China: look out! war profiteers have you in their sights.

now why wouldn't Taiwan be begging to join at least a defensive alliance with China? "We don't want to wind up like Ukraine, so we can we come in out of the cold, under a made-in-China umbrella?"

Posted by: rjb1.5 | Mar 2 2023 21:46 utc | 57

Posted by: Longhorn | Mar 2 2023 21:46 utc | 56

Well read it from CNN, they told there are 600 tankers (accounting 10 % of global tanker fleet or liquid capacity) and more are joining in. India is also prioritized as a buyer because it's more lucrative, even if China could buy all the oil that is produced.

The way the oil and fuel market works is that the oil goes to India to get refined, after which it's shipped to Europe. According to Ursula von der Leyen, Russia is isolated from the global economy.

Posted by: unimperator | Mar 2 2023 21:48 utc | 58

Longhorn | Mar 2 2023 21:41 utc | 55

provision aircraft to ukrastan is more than having x 'ukranazi' pilots qualified per aircraft donated.....

to "turnaround" a jet requires dozens of highly skilled technicians, loads of ground servicing equipment, pol areas and armaments storage and preparation. and these areas would be beyond range of russia forces....

all this is not in the capacity of the ukranazis.

nato participations on jets is a line.

worse to make them survive a lot of support aircraft and sensors will be required none available now to ukranazis except to guide their donated rocket attacks on infantry.

seems the russians are more willing to describe the tail donated by nato than the natostanis have planned to run the operations.

Posted by: paddy | Mar 2 2023 21:53 utc | 59

Habermas's appeal is a symbol.

He is the spokesman for (parts of) the German ruling class, which indicates that (some of) the ruling class is beginning to want to reach some kind of peace that does not make them visibly ashamed.

I think Putin is also willing to make peace, considering his apparent inability to mobilize for a proper war and his attempts at peace in the early stages of the war.

Ukrainian bourgeoisie like Ihor Kolomoisky also has a willingness for peace, which leads him to be a target of regime strikes.

Posted by: Colin | Mar 2 2023 18:51 utc | 21

The Russians have not had a mass mobilization for a proper war because they are fighting a proxy war against NATO using mostly Mercs and the locals who have been force mobilized after the “vote” to join Russia.
After every round of infrastructure attack the Russian MOD states “all intended targets were hit” the exact same thing NATO said after they lost in Syria and launched an air raid after a fake chemical attack.
The Russians brought up “Syrian approach” before Butcha. They brought up “terrorist operation” before terrorizing the Ukies with Iranian drones.
This is a weirdo revenge war and the Ukies are paying for everything the Russians hate about NATO. I can see the Russians making this last as long as possible before it’s China’s turn to bleed NATO dry in the Pacific.

Posted by: OohCanada | Mar 2 2023 21:54 utc | 60

Felix Kolmer is a survivor of Theriesienstadt & Auschwitz/Birkenau. In 1915 he was interviewed by Czech television and asked whether there existed a gradation of bad and worse in the behavior of the SS guards. Felix Kolmer affirms that for sure there existed this gradation. He then names in particular the SS members of Ukrainian and Estonian origin to have the worst in their attitude towards the prisoners of the concentration camps.
Felix Kolmer dies in 2022, 100 years old. What would he have said from special Russophobe alliance between Ukrainian and Estonian political leaders?

Posted by: Oblomovka daydream | Mar 2 2023 21:59 utc | 61

Posted by: paddy | Mar 2 2023 21:53 utc | 59

Agreed. The West is completely supplying Ukraine at this point though. My point is that nobody believes Medvedev except the propagandized.

Posted by: Longhorn | Mar 2 2023 22:00 utc | 62

Likklemore @47--

NATO aircraft have already been delivered to Ukraine and used--Turkish Bayraktar drones--and drones produced by other NATO nations.

Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 2 2023 22:02 utc | 63

@ Longhorn | Mar 2 2023 21:27 utc | 48

yeah.. and europe likes expensive energy from the usa too, lol... it all makes sense...

Posted by: james | Mar 2 2023 22:05 utc | 64

Likkelmore (47): There is a simple reason that Western aircraft are not being sent to Ukraine--they would all be quickly destroyed. The F-16's and F-15's are obsolete (less effective than what Ukraine already once had) and the "myth" of the F-35 cannot be allowed to be destroyed. The F-35 is slow and maintenance-prone and hardly a match for the latest Russian anti-air defenses, but what would happen to its reputation if it were actually sent to the fray and shot down? Who would buy it anymore? There is an old saying: "better to keep silent and be thought a fool than to speak up and confirm that you are one". As long as the F-35 never attacks a competent enemy, it can still be sold as a wunderwaffen and make a few corrupt US defense contractors flush.

Posted by: FHTEX | Mar 2 2023 22:05 utc | 65

@ unimperator | Mar 2 2023 21:48 utc | 58

Ursula von der Leyen puts up a good front, however phony and hypocritical it is... i guess that is why she is in power, to serve those who she is ordered around by...

Posted by: james | Mar 2 2023 22:07 utc | 66

Did you know Russia just cut production by 500K bbl a day, because the price is so low? It costs Russia $45 just to get the oil out of the ground....then add on transportation costs and graft.

Posted by: Longhorn | Mar 2 2023 21:37 utc | 53

Can you verify that $45 number?

Posted by: jpc | Mar 2 2023 22:07 utc | 67

I think some F-16, even (or especially) if operating from a Polish airfield won't be able to achieve very much in Donbass. They can maybe try to lob a HARM somewhere there before attempting to sneak back to their base. I think Russian AWACS will pick them up coming long distance away.
Nevertheless it's a stark statement of how the facts are.

Posted by: unimperator | Mar 2 2023 21:27 utc | 49

Those air-crafts, if they take off, are targeted like wild turkeys. And the underlying message, let it sink in for a minute:
"All persons making decisions on the supply (repair) of such equipment or weapons, along with foreign mercenaries and military instructors, will become legitimate military targets," he added.[.]
In plain english language; where ever located, a legitimate military target. Coming from Medvedev, deputy chairman, Russia Security Council and former president, it's the lede to a formal declaration of war.

Posted by: Likklemore | Mar 2 2023 22:12 utc | 68

Posted by: FHTEX | Mar 2 2023 22:05 utc | 65
all true, but then why do other countries buy the F35?

it's a form of tribute? it ties industry to the US? what other explanations could there be, since kicking the F35's tires is risky, to the F35? even putting on a "captain maverick" halftime show w/these things is risky, isn't it? honor America's crashing an the Superbowl.

seems like the Chinese balloon threat is an excellent chance to show off what the F35 can really do. or maybe it's too risky. are balloons fooled by stealth technology? maybe DARPA should study that. maybe they'll find that Santa Claus is the only target worthy of the awesome F35.

Posted by: rjb1.5 | Mar 2 2023 22:19 utc | 69

We've seen numerous photos of large Ukrainian cargo planes downloading heavy equipment. Why are long runways still operable? Why not target Kiev's airport with hypersonics? The Brits executed a very complex plan to bomb the Malvinas' runway back in 1982.

Posted by: Sektion2B | Mar 2 2023 22:19 utc | 70

Posted by: rjb1.5 | Mar 2 2023 22:19 utc | 69

You said it very correctly. F-35 is more a political form of tribute, and a golden ring of servitude and obedience of vassals. It is also a significant treaty of transferring economic wealth and power to the core of the empire.

During the 2010 decades I saw so many bad reviews of that plane even from western air force experts I can't even count. IIRC Australian Air force made a very broad review of the F-35 and announced it as a flawed and flying turkey, or something to similar effect.

In a way, the Russians should probably be thankful that Nato has chosen it to be the de-facto almost sole multipurpose aircraft well into the 2050s.

Posted by: unimperator | Mar 2 2023 22:25 utc | 71

Posted by: Accidentshappy | Mar 2 2023 22:25 utc | 71

The most recent article by Simplicius had a few news items from the field. A Ukrainian commander from Bakhmut said they are losing up to two companies per day, which can be up to 400 people. Wagner is maybe losing 20-40 men per day.

In every other front UAF is basically crumbling, albeit there are still some troublesome spots in Ugledar, but even there the UAF claimed successes were overstated, and a recent counterattack was fraudulent. Sure, the casualties are still mounting but at least Ukraine will never again pose a threat by itself.

The fertility rate in Russia is heaps better than the eurozone. The eurozone is a catastrophe, which is being "fixed" with loads of young African and Middle Eastern males. That's a demographic disaster down the line.

Posted by: unimperator | Mar 2 2023 22:32 utc | 72

@ FHTEX post 65

@ NATO aircraft have already been delivered to Ukraine and used--Turkish Bayraktar drones--and drones produced by other NATO nations.

Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 2 2023 22:02 utc | 63

Karlof1; Were those the MiGs downed by sling shots? I ask because over the last days I read there is a hesitancy by Stollenberg and Biden to supply the F-16s

Posted by: Likklemore | Mar 2 2023 22:38 utc | 73

Somebody has repeatedly requested this declaration made on February 24th:
Address by the President of the Russian Federation

Posted by: Kankel | Mar 2 2023 22:43 utc | 74

Longhorn is a third rate troll. People like him have been responsible for the deaths of millions in the past seventy years.
Ukraine can only be understood in the context of the anti-communist crusade which scarred the history of the last century. Edward Curtin explains in this essay prompted by the death of David Harris on February 6:

"...But it was no mistake; it was an intentional genocidal war waged to torture, kill, and maim as many Vietnamese as possible and to use drafted (enslaved) American boys to do the killing and suffer the consequences. It’s Phoenix Program, the CIA’s assassination and torture operation, became the template for Abu Ghraib, Guantanamo, CIA black sites, hybrid wars, terrorist actions, etc. up to today. Harris writes:

'...calling the war a mistake is the fundamental equivalent of calling water wet or dirt dirty. . . . Let us not lose sight of what really happened. In this particular ‘mistake,’ at least 3 million people died, only 58,000 of whom were Americans. These 3 million people died crushed in the mud, riddled with shrapnel, hurled out of helicopters, impaled on sharpened bamboo, obliterated in carpets of explosives dropped from bombers flying so high they could only be heard and never seen; they died reduced to chunks by one or more land mines, finished off by a round through the temple or a bayonet through the throat, consumed by sizzling phosphorous, burned alive by jellied gasoline, strung up by their thumps, starved in cages, executed after watching their babies die, trapped on the barbed wire calling for their mothers. They died while trying to kill, they died while trying to kill no one, they died heroes, they died villains, they died at random, they died most often when someone who had no idea who they were killed them under the orders of who had even less idea than that.'

"That’s the truth. Unvarnished. But such historical truth hurts to consider, for it reminds us that the belief in the U.S.A.’s good intentions is a delusion. The war against Vietnam was immoral, but even that word fails to grasp it. Pure evil is truer. And to consider that war on military terms alone, one must accept the fact the U.S. lost the war despite all its military technology..."

Ukraine is just the latest bloodbath waged to preserve the wealth and power of the capitalist class in the United States.

Posted by: bevin | Mar 2 2023 22:48 utc | 75

There is Europe’s astonishing surrender of its interests to a voraciously coercive administration as it leads America into its late-imperial phase. Related to this, there are the regrettable pledges of allegiance sworn by Finland, Sweden, and Germany—three nations whose honorable but now-abandoned role was to serve as bridges between West and East. These are realignments, each in response to the Biden regime’s decision to make Ukraine the crucible of its defense of a fading hegemony.

This radical new subservience to Washington is freighted with consequence in its own right. Born of insecurity and a profound lack of vision and imagination, it is a very bad call on the part of America’s “allies and partners” and will leave them at a considerable disadvantage as our new century progresses. Can they not hear history’s wheel turning?

Posted by: Aleph_Null | Mar 2 2023 22:50 utc | 76

Watch NATO fissures in real time. Who will be the first to exit?

Europe needs ‘NATO’ without US – Orban

The EU is doing Washington’s bidding since “Americans have the last word,” the Hungarian prime minister believes

Europe needs its own military bloc, one that’s free of American influence, Hungarian Prime Minister Viktor Orban told the Swiss Weltwoche weekly on Thursday. The US is dragging Europe into a conflict that cannot be won and risks a global war, he believes.

“The solution would be a European NATO,” Orban said, adding that the US’ desire for further expansion of its influence is what has led to the tensions between the West and Russia.

Moscow is concerned about NATO expanding further east into Ukraine and Georgia, Orban claimed, referring to his conversation with Russian President Vladimir Putin just weeks before the ongoing conflict between Moscow and Kiev broke out in late February 2022.

“Putin told me his problem was with the American missile bases in Poland and Romania and possible NATO expansion in Ukraine and Georgia,” Orban told the Swiss media, noting that the Russian leader was concerned about the US potentially deploying its weapons to these nations as well.

According to Orban, that was one of the underlying reasons behind the ongoing conflict in Ukraine. “I understand what Putin said. I do not accept what he did,” the Hungarian prime minister explained, referring to the Russian military operation in Ukraine.[.]

Posted by: Likklemore | Mar 2 2023 22:50 utc | 77

I remember David Harris:

If I Knew

Posted by: Bemildred | Mar 2 2023 22:53 utc | 78

Thanks for that.

Posted by: bevin | Mar 2 2023 23:05 utc | 79

Re: Likklemore | Mar 2 2023 22:12 utc | 68

I am not disagreeing with your statement, but I recall a number of somewhat similar warnings in the past that seem to have been ignored. Have the neocons have concluded that there are few consequences for ignoring Russian warnings? Or are they deliberately creating provocations in hopes that Russian retaliation can be used as a justification for direct US/NATO intervention?

Newsweek › ... › Vladimir Putin
Dec 16, 2022 — Medvedev suggested on Friday that NATO nations that help Ukraine could be "legitimate military targets." Mikhail Svetlov/Getty Images.

Russia: US air defense systems could be targets in Ukraine
AP News › article › russia-ukraine-politics-d...
Dec 15, 2022 — KYIV, Ukraine (AP) — Russia's Foreign Ministry warned Thursday that if the ... them would be a “legitimate target” for the Russian military, ...

Axios › World
Oct 27, 2022 — Commercial satellites that the U.S. and its allies are using could become "legitimate" targets for retaliatory action by Russia, a senior ...

Russia says private satellites are 'legitimate target' in wartime › News › Spaceflight
Sep 16, 2022 — As the United States military continues to use more commercial satellites, Russia warns that these craft may become a 'legitimate target' ...

Irish Examiner › arid-40827380
Mar 12, 2022 — Moscow now considers arms shipments to Ukraine "legitimate targets" for military attacks, a senior Russian diplomat has warned.

Daily Express › News › World
Mar 13, 2022 — RUSSIA has warned that Western shipments of weapons to Ukraine could become 'legitimate targets' for attacks by Vladimir Putin's forces.

Posted by: Perimetr | Mar 2 2023 23:14 utc | 80

Thanks for that.

Posted by: bevin | Mar 2 2023 23:05 utc | 80

My pleasure. Some things you never forget.

It is odd how that one act, refusing to fight, can get you called a saint and a scum-sucking coward.

Never heard anybody quite like her either.

Posted by: Bemildred | Mar 2 2023 23:15 utc | 81

Posted by: FHTEX | Mar 2 2023 22:05 utc | 65 / Posted by: Likklemore | Mar 2 2023 22:12 utc | 68

Ukraine is flying Mig’s and SU’s of various types every day. It looks like about 10 to 20 flights a day. The Russians shoot one down from time to time. Ukraine manages to maintain those that remain.
Posted by: Bill Smith | March 02, 2023 at 23:17

Posted by: Bill Smith | Mar 2 2023 23:19 utc | 82

I want to point out that the neocons always double down. What Russia does or does not do changes nothing about that.

Expecting them to ignore or not ignore Russias warnings misses the point. Only when the neocons have the controls removed from their hands will they stop. So the idea is to shepard them to that point sub-critically. A process well along now.

Posted by: Bemildred | Mar 2 2023 23:22 utc | 83

@Colin #21

Do you have a link to that 'Habermas appeal'? when?


This is what he wrote about a year ago.

Posted by: David O'Donnell | Mar 2 2023 23:32 utc | 84

@ Perimeter Post 81.

Thanks for your inputs.

My observation; you are citing western media including; a yellow tabloid rag not worthy to wrap rotten fish.

what is being misunderstood; when one is warned several times "do not do this" and the warning is ignored and failure to take heed then the axe falls.

Russia can say: "You cannot say you were not warned."

Russia planned for this SMO over many years as they warned...SMO is now approaching a formal war with all the legitimate targets...from the incremental escalation we observed over the past 12 months.

Posted by: Likklemore | Mar 2 2023 23:33 utc | 85

Posted by: Longhorn | Mar 2 2023 21:37 utc | 53

Russian production costs are nowhere near $45/bbl. The primary budget is set at $45/bbl (or near to it). Russian production costs are closer to $20/bbl. It’s cutting production because it’s harder to get oil to market through the sanctions but the prices it’s getting are still high enough to offset the cut in production.

Posted by: Lex | Mar 2 2023 23:50 utc | 86

President Biden on Wednesday (March 1, 2023) issued a continuation of a previous executive order that declared a "national emergency" in the U.S. related to the yearlong conflict between Russia and Ukraine.

Executive Order 13660 was initially signed by former President Barack Obama in 2014 after Russia's annexation of Crimea from Ukraine, but it was expanded over the years with additional executive orders as the conflict between the two states intensified and culminated in the invasion launched by Russia last year.

The orders include certain sanctions related to Russia's actions in Ukraine with respect to U.S. interests.

In February 2022, just days before Russia launched its invasion of Ukraine, Biden issued another executive order that expanded the "national emergency" scope of the previous orders that were set to expire on March 6. The continuation Biden issued Wednesday will extend the orders for an additional year.

The actions and policies addressed in these Executive Orders continue to pose an unusual and extraordinary threat to the national security and foreign policy of the United States," the White House said in a press release announcing the continuation.

Emergency Powers that can be exorcised by the President of the United States under a state of emergency.

Bank accounts can be frozen.
Bans on biological or chemical agents can be lifted.
Civil liberties, such as the right to a peaceful assembly, can be halted.
The president can order incarcerations.
Elections can be postponed indefinitely.
Federal leases can be suspended when the country faces dangers.
Foreign individuals can be ordered to leave the nation, and the borders can be closed.
National resources can be ushered into play to confront a natural disaster.
Sanctions pertaining to property and finances can be removed or initiated.
Soldiers and naval vessels may be ordered to engage in combat during a crisis.
The government can take control of the internet, radio, and TV because of a perilous matter, and production and distribution of goods can be seized.
The military can be mobilized domestically in a crisis, martial law can be declared by the president.
The leader of the Executive branch can launch a nuclear strike if necessary.
The president may order an assassination resulting from an emergency
The right of habeas corpus can be suspended as a consequence of crises.
Transportation networks can be taken over by the government.

Caught this Emil Cosman video on You Tube, and thought it might be interesting, especially to US posters.

Posted by: Ed | Mar 2 2023 23:56 utc | 87

Likklemore @74--

Smile!! Yess, the modern version of wrist-rocket slingshots.

Posted by: karlof1 | Mar 3 2023 0:02 utc | 88

Posted by: West of England Andy | Mar 2 2023 18:35 utc | 19

Even the NAFO trolls on tweeter and my Red White and Blue pom pom toting cheerleader friends and family have a hard time refuting the numerous polls, conducted by "western" outlets since 2014 that demonstrate the population of Crimea is super happy to have joined Russia and left Ukraine. The people I'm referencing immediately jump to "but you can't have a legitimate/accurate poll in a country where people fear for their lives!" or "these polls must have been conducted by Russia friendly agencies!" Neither, of course, are true.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Mar 3 2023 0:26 utc | 89

Ukraine is just the latest bloodbath waged to preserve the wealth and power of the capitalist class in the United States.

Posted by: bevin | Mar 2 2023 22:48 utc | 76

I haven't looked into any recent evaluations of the Vietnam death toll, but if you include all those who have died from cancer and other illnesses, starved, etc. Then I'm pretty sure it far exceeds the 3,000,000 cited - and by "far" I mean in the further millions.

It's going to be a long time before we can see a realistic toll from Ukraine - dating back to 2014, preferably.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Mar 3 2023 0:32 utc | 90

China likes cheap energy.

Posted by: Longhorn | Mar 2 2023 21:27 utc | 48

Typical NAFO bro argument. China likes having a stable neighbor to its west; one that isn't broken up into easily manipulable statelets crawling with CIA and other western spooks and saboteurs. China also likes the thought of a multi-polar world, not dominated by the USSA and her petro-dollar. China likes a lot of ideas and "cheap energy" is probably near the bottom of the Chinese government's list no matter how hard you find it to think in a manner other than you've been programmed.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Mar 3 2023 0:35 utc | 91

Quite often on these Ukraine Open Threads, I read questions (or accusations) about why Russia is not destroying Western equipment right when it crosses the border to Ukraine, or at least once it is moving closer to the front line. After reading Simplicius76' recent piece on how this war is actually morphing into "modern unknowns:" electronics, AI, drones, etc. on a large (WWII style) battle field, I am starting to think that Russia may want to engage it in battle.

Think about it, this kind of war does not happen every other year. This type of war may happen once in 50 or 100 years. Russia knows the West's hegemony is in tatters, and the West will lash out and fight its demise as it goes down. What better way to prepare than letting your enemy come at you, showing what they got. Scanning electronic signatures, training AI, deciphering communication... Russia will be in a good spot after this episode, ready to face NATO if it ever dares.


Posted by: Semyony | Mar 3 2023 0:45 utc | 92

Posted by: Ed | Mar 2 2023 23:56 utc | 88

Thanks for that message. I’m certain that should a significant anti war movement arise in the US, some of not all of those illegal and unconstitutional measures would be taken to crush it.

Sadly, most Americans are brainwashed sheep who wouldn’t get off their couch to protest if the pudding-for-brains Commander in chief suspended the constitution.

Posted by: Chris | Mar 3 2023 0:49 utc | 93

A quote from: Vit5o | Mar 2 2023 16:53 utc | 3

"The Russian army utilizes a mixed model of professional contract soldiers and conscripts, and these two types of personnel have an important legal differentiation. Conscripts cannot be deployed in combat outside of Russia without a declaration of war."
A curiosity of the current situation is that Russia has legally adsorbed the five big Oblasts in the eastern end of Ukraine. Technically the great majority of Russian troops are not invaders as they are operating on Russian soil. One wonders, have the conscripts that were taken out of military units been reintegrated back into the group? If they have been, will Yeltsin be willing to break the law and move troops beyond the already annexed Oblasts?

Posted by: Jmaas | Mar 3 2023 1:08 utc | 94

Posted by: Chris | Mar 3 2023 0:49 utc | 94
I wonder if the "state of emergency" provides Biden with the cover to do things like destroying pipelines and foreign infrastructures?

Posted by: Ed | Mar 3 2023 1:20 utc | 95

Jmaas 95

As in LOTR. Yeltsin will mobilise an Army of the Dead where conscript and contract have no distinction. Putin i do not know about

Posted by: Paul Greenwood | Mar 3 2023 1:23 utc | 96

Posted by: Jmaas | Mar 3 2023 1:08 utc | 95

Oops I meant Putin. I guess my mind is slipping.

Posted by: Jmaas | Mar 3 2023 1:27 utc | 97

I remember David Harris- had a New American Revolution class from him, until Reagan cancelled credit for it.

Saw him years later, and had a conversation about the old times.

Posted by: Duncan Idaho | Mar 3 2023 1:43 utc | 98

Ciaran 46
All good points.
In this case I don’t think they will succeed though
If anything it will strengthen their resolve

Posted by: Chevrus | Mar 3 2023 1:52 utc | 99

@Kankel | Mar 2 2023 22:43 utc | 75
Thank you very much for posting this link! It is Putin explaining the war in Ukraine on the day that SMO began. It lays out objectives and reasoning that have been hidden by western media. Here's a small excert:

"In this context, in accordance with Article 51 (Chapter VII) of the UN Charter, with permission of Russia’s Federation Council, and in execution of the treaties of friendship and mutual assistance with the Donetsk People’s Republic and the Lugansk People’s Republic, ratified by the Federal Assembly on February 22, I made a decision to carry out a special military operation.

The purpose of this operation is to protect people who, for eight years now, have been facing humiliation and genocide perpetrated by the Kiev regime. To this end, we will seek to demilitarise and denazify Ukraine, as well as bring to trial those who perpetrated numerous bloody crimes against civilians, including against citizens of the Russian Federation.

It is not our plan to occupy the Ukrainian territory. We do not intend to impose anything on anyone by force. At the same time, we have been hearing an increasing number of statements coming from the West that there is no need any more to abide by the documents setting forth the outcomes of World War II, as signed by the totalitarian Soviet regime. How can we respond to that?

Excerpt from

Posted by: barstool | Mar 3 2023 2:07 utc | 100

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