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January 7, 2023
Ukraine Open Thread 2023-06
Comments
Bemildred @ 186
“…Russians clearly are/were not in a hurry.”
Posted by: oldhippie | Jan 8 2023 16:05 utc | 200
Yes, not being in a hurry, I see it as a sign of control, but what do I know? MSM, being in show-business, worries only about appearances.
Freezing a conflict and letting it stew is one thing I consider Putin-like, he has been inclined to do that.
Posted by: Bemildred | Jan 8 2023 16:10 utc | 201
I notice today RT is saying Kiev is saying Russia is offering to freeze the conflict. Who knew? Personally I think that is likely a Western trial balloon.
Posted by: Bemildred | Jan 8 2023 16:13 utc | 202
@ Bemildred | Jan 8 2023 16:00 utc | 199
Before one can take out the drones, you first have to utterly destroy the opposing AD 100kms deep protective umbrella, all of it (DEAD). Otherwise your trading best case, an $80M F-35 deathtrap for a $10K-$200,000K drone or two ?
Empire has nothing other than old analogue, non-integrated, being scrapped/cannibalized/salvaged hanger queen(no parts) F-22 Raptors, that have any possibility of DEAD, and their prospects in isolation are, well, marginal.
Eventual evolution therefore implied is hunter/killer air-to-air drones that do not cost $80M+ & the very expensive pilot/s included, as consumable/expendable pseudo-fighter aggressors to conduct suppression/destruction of the opposing fighter & surveillance drones & AD.
Hence, speculative replication of current opposing AirForces(AFs) as concurrent additional combat arm: Unmanned Air Combat Drone mini-Air Forces, one suspects. A reversion to a mini unmanned Aces of the Sky contestation by drone fighter vs drone fighter, ultimately after destruction of defended surveillance drones/AD. New definition: ‘Drone’ Air Supremacy or Dominance ? No Aerial Knights of old with their scarves though.
@ oldhippie | Jan 8 2023 16:05 utc | 200
Well said. My take as well.
@ Bemildred | Jan 8 2023 16:10 utc | 201
Re freezing the Ukraine conflict ? Long past that, not this time, IMV.
@ outraged and richard steven hack.. thanks for your posts…
@ Merlin2 | Jan 8 2023 7:20 utc | 139
although it is OT, that is an excellent post.. maybe as you note, it is not completely ot.. great post, either way.. thank you…
————
b has deleted the post by ‘welldone’ that drew my wrath earlier.. thanks for the feedback and support…
Posted by: james | Jan 8 2023 16:45 utc | 204
Outraged | Jan 8 2023 14:28 utc | 194
Drones and observation;
Taken to it’s logical conclusion, there is now NO way that either side can amass enough troops and vehicles secretly to make a large scale attack.
Unless a) starting from a long way off. ie. in Belarus for the Rus, or in Roumania for the AUF.
or b) Maskirovka.
Plus satellite observation.
***
They may as well all do it on “prime time” TV, as in a Si-fi novel of the 70s’, where the tranked up sheep watch (Trank = tranquilized through a drug) and “support/like” their favourite soldiers. (Who then gets a promotion and bonuses). The useable arms were strictly limited to WWI or earlier, and the whole thing reduced to a real time TV circus with real deaths.
(In the story, the “hero” introduced unpowered gliders for aerial observation rather than balloons, and got thrown out of the “warfield” for cheating, so lost promotion and revenue.)
*
Not yet of course, as the Propaganda machine has yet to catch up with reality and other possibilities of making money.
****
@ Bemildred | Jan 8 2023 14:47 utc | 197
“Reminds me of the Brits WWI Field Marshal Douglas Haig performance …”
He used a very big oak tree, about ten miles from the front to sit in (Somme), as a command center. Now salt mines serve almost the same purpose, but the view is not as good.
@ Stonebird | Jan 8 2023 16:53 utc | 205
there is now NO way that either side can amass enough troops and vehicles secretly to make a large scale attack.
Perhaps have another read. You do not appear to have understood/comprehended the content of the post. ISR Sats or long distance, even maskirovka is simply irrelevant. Speed reading …
They applied that technique to some underground sections in Azovstal, then pumped the water out afterwards…
Posted by: Nathan in WA US | Jan 8 2023 17:22 utc | 207
@ Bemildred | Jan 8 2023 14:47 utc | 197
“Reminds me of the Brits WWI Field Marshal Douglas Haig performance …”
He used a very big oak tree, about ten miles from the front to sit in (Somme), as a command center. Now salt mines serve almost the same purpose, but the view is not as good.
Posted by: Stonebird | Jan 8 2023 16:53 utc | 205
That was Outraged, I believe, although I approve.
Posted by: Bemildred | Jan 8 2023 17:48 utc | 208
@200 A minor correction if I may OH. Punishment battalions or Strafbataillio are likely composed of criminals and soldiers who misbehave. Azov are the ones keeping them in line.
Posted by: dh | Jan 8 2023 18:16 utc | 209
Posted by: james | Jan 8 2023 16:45 utc | 204
James, some of us don’t appreciate your apparent gloating over the “Jewish generals “ post by Welldone being taken down by b.
To my mind the only valid reasons for b to remove that post were , not exclusively, 1) it was off-topic or 2) it was explicitly racist hate – speech 3) he feared overly powerful interests would shut his website down even over welldone’s observably mild post .
The post simply mentioned he believed many of the Nazi leaders/ generals had Jewish antecedents. It is either a true or false proposition. It could have been rebutted by you if you had more knowledge or verve. You didn’t even try to rebut it in part which implies you were not informed enough or brave enough. You simply exhibited handwringing “woke “behaviour of an emotional denialist ,who just cant cope with it even being discussed or God forbid being true.
I happen to know the Race laws of Nazi Germany quite well and I can categorically tell you that is is entirely plausible that many of his generals could have been Jewish three of four generations back . No big deal to Hitler at all. I don’t care if they were or weren’t Jewish but I would not be surprised if they were. Jews are not immune to supremacist or violent motives or actions. I could quote you many bloodthirsty acts in History committed by Jewish groups ,all off the top of my head.
Kindly keep your emotive screeching denialist behaviour away from this site. As for your supporters, they must be similar to yourself; never allowing inconvenient things to be discussed or tested for truth, or much much worse; knowingly wanting to hide the truth.
Posted by: Brother Ma | Jan 8 2023 18:54 utc | 210
@ Brother Ma | Jan 8 2023 18:54 utc | 210
you can characterize it however you’d like – as you have! we see it differently, and i’ll leave it at that..
Posted by: james | Jan 8 2023 19:25 utc | 211
@ Outraged | Jan 8 2023 16:28 utc | 203
$80M F-35 deathtrap
re: unit cost
They wish. Actually the F-35 program, estimated to cost over $1.7 trillion, has never been audited by the Defense Contract Audit Agency. In fact the government never mentions the unit cost. There was a GAO Report on F-35 last April — “Cost Growth and Schedule Delays Continue” — that didn’t mention unit cost, only program cost. The military media DOES mention unit cost provided by Lockheed-Martin; that’s where the $80M fictitious number comes from.
Then there’s this:
Dec 14, 2022
WASHINGTON — German government leaders on Wednesday announced a deal to buy 35 F-35 fighter jets from the United States, a package pegged at $8.4 billion by the Pentagon in its offer from the summer. . .here
That’s $240M each.
Posted by: Don Bacon | Jan 8 2023 20:35 utc | 212
Dec 14, 2022
WASHINGTON — German government leaders on Wednesday announced a deal to buy 35 F-35 fighter jets from the United States, a package pegged at $8.4 billion by the Pentagon in its offer from the summer. . .here
That’s $240M each.
Posted by: Don Bacon | Jan 8 2023 20:35 utc | 212
I hope that the price includes free shipping.
Posted by: David Levin | Jan 9 2023 0:42 utc | 214