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January 7, 2023
Ukraine Open Thread 2023-06
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Summary by the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation on the progress of the special military operation on the territory of Ukraine (07.01.2023)
◽️ The combined grouping of Russian troops (forces) in the area of the special military operation has been observing the ceasefire along the entire line of contact since 12 noon Moscow time on 6 January. At the same time, the Kiev regime has continued to shell populated areas and Russian positions over the past 24 hours.
◽️ In the Krasno-Limansky direction, the Ukrainian armed forces fired eleven mortar shells at Russian positions.
In the Soledar, Avdiivka and Maryina directions, the enemy used artillery on Russian units fifty times.
◽️ More than 60 large-caliber shells were fired by Ukrainian troops into residential areas of the city of Donetsk, and an American HIMARS multiple-launch rocket system struck the populated area of Makiivka in the Donetsk People’s Republic.
◽️ In Zaporizhzhia region, the AFU opened artillery fire thirty-one times. In the Kherson and Krivoy Rog directions, the enemy fired seventeen artillery rounds. All of the AFU positions from which the shelling was carried out were suppressed by return fire of the Russian forces.
◽️ Despite the artillery shelling of Ukrainian armed forces on populated areas and Russian positions, the implementation of the declared ceasefire will be continued by the Russian grouping of troops (forces) until 24 hours today.
◽️ In the Kupyansk direction near the village of Sin’kovka in the Kharkiv region during the past day, an attack by units of the 14th mechanized brigade of the AFU was repelled. More than 20 Ukrainian servicemen, a tank, a Grad MLRS vehicle and two vehicles were destroyed by return fire.
◽️ In the Krasno-Limansky direction in the area of Serebryansky forestry, an attack by two assault groups of the 80th and 95th Airborne Assault Brigades of the AFU was repelled. Total losses of these enemy units amounted to more than 30 servicemen, two D-20 howitzers, an armored fighting vehicle and a pickup truck.
◽️ In the Donetsk direction, an attempt by units of the 110th Mechanized and 79th Airborne Assault Brigades of the AFU to attack Russian positions in the areas of Krasnogorovka and Georgievka of the Donetsk People’s Republic was foiled. The enemy’s losses as a result of return fire amounted to up to 50 Ukrainian servicemen killed and wounded, a tank and a vehicle.
◽️ In the South Donetsk direction near the Novomayorske settlement of the Donetsk People’s Republic, a counterattack by units of the 108th AFU Territorial Defense Brigade was thwarted. More than 20 Ukrainian servicemen, two D-30 howitzers, an armored personnel carrier and two pickup trucks were destroyed by return fire.
💥 The air defense forces destroyed four Ukrainian unmanned aerial vehicles in the areas of Ilchenkovo, Zaporizhzhia Region, and Genichesk, Kherson Region, during the day.
◽️ In addition, five Uragan and HIMARS rockets as well as a US-made HARM anti-radar missile were intercepted in the areas of Makiivka, Guselske of the Donetsk People’s Republic and Ocherivatoye of the Zaporizhia region.
📊 In total, since the beginning of the special military operation destroyed ((+?) over preceding 24hrs):
360(+1) aircraft,
199 helicopters,
2,843(+19) unmanned aerial vehicles,
400 surface-to-air missile systems, (Each AD Radar destroyed, no(Soviet pre ’91) spares/replacements, effectively: Unclaimed Kills)
7,441(+19) tanks and other armored combat vehicles,
972(+1) multiple rocket launcher combat vehicles,
3,787(+6) field artillery and mortar guns, and
7,957(+20) pieces of special military vehicle equipment.
So, is one of the several purposes of the cease fire to provide a reminder that when Russia makes a promise in regards war and peace, it keeps it?
Western politicians and diplomats who will inevitable be forging a peace agreement between Russia and what remains of Ukraine will appreciate being able to point to Russia’s record of keeping its deals.
And Russian diplomats will appreciate being able to remind everyone of all the deals it has honored in the past. Eventually even the the American voters will be asked to understand that the deal being negotiated is one that Russia can be expected to honor.
Soon after that we can maybe finally see something resembling a lasting peace in the area between Ukraine and the newly formed Russian Republics.
Posted by: Babel-17 | Jan 7 2023 18:49 utc | 2
Intel Slava Z
🇷🇺🇺🇦 Map (animated), showing the advancement and directions of the main strikes of the Wagner Group’s assault units in the battles for Soledar.
&
Intercept Z (ПЕРЕХВАТ (Z)) regarding above animated map:
Battle for Soledar: current highlights
From December 30 to January 7, AFU units defending Soledar lost at least 500 people killed and wounded.
According to the Military Chronicle, the largest losses were suffered by the 1st, 2nd, 3rd and 4th battalions of the 46th Independent Airmobile Brigade of the AFU. At the end of December, this unit was re-staffed with mobilized from Kirovohrad, Sumy and Ternopil regions, but due to lack of combat training, more than half of the mobilized recruits died six days after arrival to the front.
On January 3, because of the large number of casualties, the brigade command sent a company of radiation, biological and chemical protection to the first line of defense. Twenty-four hours after being sent to the front, the unit stopped communicating and is now considered missing.
After the front line shifted into the urban area to Lev Tolstoy and Chernyshevsky streets in the northeast of the city and to Oktyabrskaya, Naberezhnaya and Tenistaya streets in the southeast of Soledar, the AFU faced heavy losses in armored vehicles.
Since late December, the tank battalion of the 61st Army Infantry Brigade of the AFU has suffered the heaviest losses. On the narrow access roads of Soledar, the AFU’s T-64BV and T-72M1R tanks cannot actively maneuver and are destroyed by the Kornet and Konkurs RTG crews deployed by the Wagner PMC west of Yakovlevka.
In addition to the ATPK crews, “reactive” T-80BV tanks are actively engaged against the AFU combat equipment from the dominant heights.
To the south, a section of the road between the village of Blagodatnoye and the northwestern suburbs in the area of Sovetskaya Street is taken under the fire control of Giacint-B and Giacint-S guns of the Wagner PMC. Because of this, reinforcements from the 17th AFU Tank Brigade cannot arrive in Soledar. Now the support of AFU units inside neighborhoods with heavy equipment is complicated not only by fighting in the narrow streets, but also by the inability to quickly transfer new armored vehicles and reinforcements.
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Ukraine suffers enormous human losses, “losing people left and right,” Ukraine’s ambassador to Great Britain, Vadim Pristayko, told Newsweek magazine.
“We don’t advertise how many of them are military and civilian, but you can imagine that the numbers are huge, uncomfortable,” he said. According to him, some cities were “completely destroyed.”
At the same time, Pristayko stressed that with the conflict in Ukraine, the West “had a unique chance.” “There are not many countries in the world that would allow themselves to sacrifice so many lives, territories and decades of development to defeat the sworn enemy,” the Ukrainian ambassador said.
In the beginning of the special operation they used Zelensky’s Jewish heritage as proof the Azov’s weren’t Nazis. “They can’t be Nazis, Zelensky is Jewish” was proclained throughout the land.
And now the Jewish Zelensky is actively persecuting Christians, and no one says a word.
Posted by: gottlieb | Jan 7 2023 18:55 utc | 4
Regimist Media tonight are all full of the evil Pootin violating its own ceasefire and the maddog Patriarch Kiril braying for blood.
Just saying what Normies are getting as information.
Posted by: Exile | Jan 7 2023 19:10 utc | 5
Babel-17 @2–
You wrote:
Western politicians and diplomats who will inevitable be forging a peace agreement between Russia and what remains of Ukraine will appreciate being able to point to Russia’s record of keeping its deal.
I very much doubt the West will be “forging” any such document. The West will be faced with Russia issuing a diktat regarding European Security and another by China regarding Global Security, both based upon the same principle of Indivisible Security enshrined in the UN Charter and broken so many times by the Outlaw US Empire and its NATO vassals. I don’t expect that to occur until 2024-25 as the West must be taught it’s now the inferior dog, and it will take that long for the lesson to be recognized. What I wrote about the energy picture at the end of the previous thread will have major impact on the changing Geopolitical situation. The wild card remains the European public and its ability to alter EU/NATO idiocy by taking control of their governments away from those idiots. The escalating immiseration of Europeans caused by EU/NATO policies can’t help but have a political impact, some of which is already visible, as is the dysfunction within the Outlaw US Empire’s government.
“It is the first such truce covering the whole battlefield since the Russian invasion 11 months ago and serves Russian interests more than those of Ukraine.
The Russian temporary truce is apparently unconditional and has the propaganda advantage of making it appear that it is Moscow that wants to stop the fighting and Ukraine that wants to continue it.”
from Patrick Cockblockburn at this weekend’s CP. I’ve never been under fire but I would never believe Cockblockburn had been under fire either just from this statement. Not pulling the trigger is a trick, a ruse, a media stunt for a “propaganda advantage.”
i feel sick reading western media. pay some kind of gesture of filial duty to the happily dead pope rottweiler but gloat over +/- 90 soldiers getting killed. oh wait, but it magically means something that another pope will be withholding the blood of christ (ie wine) from the parishioners at another funeral. but will it be performed in latin? ooogah boogah bunga.
“was the blizzard real???” welcome to the twitterverse of madness. back to Babel. Enzeit als Urzeit. it’s all glossalalia from here on.
Posted by: rjb1.5 | Jan 7 2023 19:18 utc | 7
Posted by: Outraged | Jan 7 2023 18:51 utc | 3
On January 3, because of the large number of casualties, the brigade command sent a company of radiation, biological and chemical protection to the first line of defense. Twenty-four hours after being sent to the front, the unit stopped communicating and is now considered missing.
Why ‘a company of radiation, biological and chemical protection’?
Posted by: Patroklos | Jan 7 2023 19:23 utc | 8
“At the same time, Pristayko stressed that with the conflict in Ukraine, the West “had a unique chance.” “There are not many countries in the world that would allow themselves to sacrifice so many lives, territories and decades of development to defeat the sworn enemy,” the Ukrainian ambassador said.”
I think he meant “There are not many countries in the world stupid enough to allow themselves to sacrifice so many lives, territories and decades of development to defeat the sworn enemy,”
Posted by: Patroklos | Jan 7 2023 19:28 utc | 9
Ukraine denies soledar is under Russian control, however doesn’t deny some Russian progress.
Perhaps putin will really pull back for a cease fire now and let reserves back into soledar. Dumb but seems like Russia still wants to have a cease fire. Maybe Wagner went rouge and surprised everyone.
Still fits the profile of Putin purposefully sabotaging the war effort. They really need to send him to the front with the Wagner prisoners.
Posted by: Neofeudalfuture | Jan 7 2023 19:28 utc | 10
“There are not many countries in the world that would allow themselves to sacrifice so many lives, territories and decades of development to defeat the sworn enemy” the Ukrainian ambassador said.
Posted by: Outraged | Jan 7 2023 18:51 utc | 3
This is the essence of it all.
Imagine a country that hates you so much that they are ready to cease to exists it if means they defeat you.
Such people must never get nuclear weapons, because they are sure to use them.
Posted by: Vikichka | Jan 7 2023 19:32 utc | 11
How long Soledar lasts for UKR is going to be a metric I will use for how close the UKR forces can last without coming unglued, falling apart at the seams. On the one side aging conscrtipts, cold, food?, lack of weapons versus extremely readoutable artillery vantage point in NW and the very resilient salt mine series of interconnected caverns.
And for whatever salient(s) that RF force attacks along this winter, I doubt that they will utilize the security forces to grease any palms for an easy entry. It worked in Kherson, but that was about it.
Posted by: paxmark1 | Jan 7 2023 19:35 utc | 12
Much was made of the nazi units groups and battalions. There is a saddening loss of life on the battlefield. Can anybody shed some light as to the losses of the nazis compared to total AFU losses. For me the forced conscripts’ loss of life is a sad matter, of the nazis’ not. Are the nazis fighting in forefront and losing their numbers at a higher rate? Or are they the ones who call the shots and sending others to die at the front while they themselves are staying behind?
Posted by: RealBeast | Jan 7 2023 19:35 utc | 13
Looks like Soledar is about to fall to the Russians. If so, Bakhmut will fall soon after with the Russians attacking the city from the North, East, and South. Also, the Siversk region to the North of Soledar will also quickly fall.
Whenever Bakhmut falls, the rest of the Donbas will rapidly fall compared to what has been happening on the battle field the last 6 months.
At the same time the temperature is now finally falling in the Donbas. The cold temperature is one month late this year in the Donbas.
A falling temperature is important because it freezes the mud. The frozen ground allows the heavy tanks and other heavy military equipment to move across the ground without getting stuck in the mud. This helps Russia a lot since it has a lot of heavy equipment that I am sure General Surovikin is wanting to move in a massive mobilization in the Donbas.
Whenever, it looks like all the Donbas is going to fall to the Russians, this could be the last days/weeks before the Russians take down Babylon USA in one hour.
Posted by: young | Jan 7 2023 19:36 utc | 14
Why ‘a company of radiation, biological and chemical protection’?
Posted by: Patroklos | Jan 7 2023 19:23 utc | 8
Isn’t it obvious? They didn’t have anyone else.
Posted by: laguerre | Jan 7 2023 19:37 utc | 15
Posted by: Exile | Jan 7 2023 19:10 utc | 5
Skimming through the Sydney Morning Herald and The Guardian (Australian Edition): no Ukraine articles to be found. Their rampant woke mafia staff writers will quietly lose the conflict down the memory hole now that Soledar and Artemovsk are effectively lost.
Ukraine? Oh yeah, whatever happened with that?
Posted by: Patroklos | Jan 7 2023 19:39 utc | 16
The wild card remains the European public and its ability to alter EU/NATO idiocy by taking control of their governments away from those idiots. The escalating immiseration of Europeans caused by EU/NATO policies can’t help but have a political impact, some of which is already visible, as is the dysfunction within the Outlaw US Empire’s government.
Posted by: karlof1 | Jan 7 2023 19:14 utc | 6
That will not happen unless significant the Police and Military arms of the governments defect and join the ranks of the dissident citizens. I see no signs of that happening.
Even in the Ottawa trucker protests, where some factions of local police were providing intel to the protesters, it was eventually resolved by bringing in outside police.
Posted by: Opport Knocks | Jan 7 2023 19:39 utc | 17
Posted by: laguerre | Jan 7 2023 19:37 utc | 15
No it’s not obvious. That’s why I was asking. But I guess a know-all smartass response is better than nothing.
Posted by: Patroklos | Jan 7 2023 19:45 utc | 18
@ Patroklos | Jan 7 2023 19:23 utc | 8
Why ‘a company of radiation, biological and chemical protection’?
Numerous reports of the Ukies firing concentrations chemical surface-breathing-eyesight-irritant rounds. An RF formation were affected prior to remainder entering RF equivalent of TOPP-3. Hence moving forward RF NBC support Coy. Expect an investigation if true.
If confirmed, possible War Crime, depends on the specific nature of the chemical rounds (Dangerous, potentially lethal in high concentrations, anti-riot(tear-gas variants) is accepted use in wartime). 🙁
@ Vikichka | Jan 7 2023 19:32 utc | 11
@ Patroklos | Jan 7 2023 19:23 utc | 8
OUN-B Banderastan Nazi is as Hitlerite ersatz Riech Nazi does.
Why ‘a company of radiation, biological and chemical protection’?
Posted by: Patroklos | Jan 7 2023 19:23 utc | 8
Isn’t it obvious? They didn’t have anyone else.
Posted by: laguerre | Jan 7 2023 19:37 utc | 15
Comedy gold. Zelensky can use that when he returns to his day job.
Russian channels have videos of Zelensky’s comedy tours in Russia where he mocks Ukrainians in general and Poroshenko in particular. Too bad they are not translated.
Posted by: Opport Knocks | Jan 7 2023 19:46 utc | 20
Since there is a lots of fuss about Bakhmut/Artemovsk and adjacent Soledar, the chief of PMC Wagner sheds some light on the strategic importance.
TL;DR: Salt mines, underground networks, essentially a giant natural bunker and weapons store.
“Bakhmut is the central point of the Eastern Front and a serious logistics center. And our task there is to die as little as possible, and to destroy the enemy as much as possible.
Bakhmut’s feature is in its unique historical and geographical defense capabilities, which include, first, the division of the city into several parts by water barriers. Secondly, the neighborhood of Bakhmut is a complex of settlements that create a unified defense system. Thirdly, this is a unique landscape, ravines and heights, which are natural tunnels. And the icing on the cake is the system of Soledar and Bakhmut mines, actually a network of underground cities. In which there is not only a cluster of people at a depth of 80-100 meters, but also tanks and infantry fighting vehicles move. And stockpiles of weapons have been stored since the First World War ”
(c) Prigozhin via Intel Slava Z
Thought I’d share.
Posted by: Nervous German | Jan 7 2023 19:48 utc | 21
Patroklos @ 8, Laguerre @ 15:
Seems to me to be an odd way of saying that a field hospital unit with specialised protective equipment was sent to the frontline. That is how I interpreted the statement.
That unit is now missing and its people presumed KIA or MIA or, given current Ukrainian practice, compelled to fight.
Posted by: Jen | Jan 7 2023 19:48 utc | 22
@ Outraged | Jan 7 2023 19:46 utc | 19 Oops, apologies.
Correction: Hence moving forward NBC support. Ukie NBC Coy likely used to launch CW attack, likely ‘Topped’ by RF response.
Outraged @3: “the brigade command sent a company of radiation, biological and chemical protection to the first line of defense. Twenty-four hours after being sent to the front, the unit stopped communicating and is now considered missing.”
Ludicrous levels of desperation and incompetence! Why don’t the Ukro Nazis send their maintenance technicians to the front lines too? Send their medical staff and their remaining aircraft-less pilots to the trenches as well! Why not? Just drive everyone into the trenches!
What does it say about someone who uses their finest tools as hammers?
Posted by: William Gruff | Jan 7 2023 19:55 utc | 24
Posted by: laguerre | Jan 7 2023 19:37 utc | 15
Isn’t it obvious?
Numerous reports of the Ukies firing concentrations chemical surface-breathing-eyesight-irritant rounds. An RF formation were affected prior to remainder entering RF equivalent of TOPP-3. Hence moving forward RF NBC support Coy. Expect an investigation if true.
Oh, so no, not obvious at all. Turns out there could be a reason for that specific detachment being sent in.
Posted by: Patroklos | Jan 7 2023 19:58 utc | 25
@ Patroklos | Jan 7 2023 19:58 utc | 25
that was what i was thinking.. when you are really losing, call in the chemical weapon option..
Posted by: james | Jan 7 2023 20:00 utc | 26
RealBeast | Jan 7 2023 19:35 utc | 13
They sit in the back, shoot those who retreat. Everything is made in suicide mode by nato, they have no interest in soldiers. Not even their nato mercenaries. Remember that close to 1k and many aircraft were lost by Bojo trying to land on Snake island for absolutely no other reason than news for bbc.
young | Jan 7 2023 19:36 utc | 14
Some chemical weapon was used today against musicians in that area. So probably they have to stop until TOS arrives. I doubt anything will fall soon because the attacking force is tiny, as always. Reaching the new regions borders seems planned for next years, not this one.
Posted by: rk | Jan 7 2023 20:08 utc | 28
“Still fits the profile of Putin purposefully sabotaging the war effort. They really need to send him to the front with the Wagner prisoners.”
I’m certain that Russia could set up a Movie Stage for Putin just like the “courageous, in harm’s way” staged Photo Shoot for Zelensky in Bachmut.
And as far as the Peaceful Protest in Ottawa, it was Prime Minister PeeWee Herman who bad-mouthed, lied and deceived, along with the 100% paid-for and controlled-by-tax-subsidies Canadian Media who drummed up the protests as if they were some insurrection.
Canada once had businesslike relations with the Soviet Union, even under Pierre Trudeau. Alongside a pragmatic approach to other nations, Canada was known far and wide for her Diplomacy and Peace-Keeping. Now Prime Minister PeeWee Herman has turned Canada into a supplicant nation, kowtowing to the WEF and U.S. Neocons.
Posted by: kupkee | Jan 7 2023 20:10 utc | 29
Patroklos | Jan 7 2023 19:45 utc | 18
Your written response was just what I was thinking.. No it was NOT that obvious actually.. Your reply was justified and measured.
Posted by: Sean in Ireland | Jan 7 2023 20:10 utc | 30
Patroklos @ 16:
You should have picked up a copy of The Weekend Australian (nauseous Murdoch broadsheet publicatipn). A full 1 1/2 pages reprint of a London Times article in the arts reviews section is devoted to flogging a “diary” by 12-year-old Kharkiv girl Yeva Skalietska who apparently kept a journal from 14 February 2022 onwards and which covers her 12-day escape from Ukraine to Ireland where she now lives in Dublin with her grandmother. The article goes into much detail about the book “You Don’t Know What War Is: the diary of a young girl from Ukraine” and the publishing frenzy around it but says very little about the grandmother who seems to have been instrumental in promoting the diary to journalists and publishers.
Shades of Bana Alabed and her mother who texted the tweets and pretended the child was the author.
Posted by: Jen | Jan 7 2023 20:13 utc | 31
@29
Dont badmouth peewee Herman he is just a Rookie u know ,)
Posted by: Macpott | Jan 7 2023 20:15 utc | 32
In response to
”
In the beginning of the special operation they used Zelensky’s Jewish heritage as proof the Azov’s weren’t Nazis. “They can’t be Nazis, Zelensky is Jewish” was proclained throughout the land.
And now the Jewish Zelensky is actively persecuting Christians, and no one says a word.
Posted by: gottlieb | Jan 7 2023 18:55 utc | 4
”
Seems there is a bit of monotheist agnotology going on here. Pope Frank seems to agree with “fallen” Christian persecution and isn’t monotheism, by definition, a fight for religious supremacy?
I continue to posit that the one ring that binds them all is the God Of Mammon ring and Pope Frank, King Chuck and seemingly some of the Muslims all march to the barbaric patriarchy form of social organization with global private finance at the core.
Posted by: psychohistorian | Jan 7 2023 20:21 utc | 34
Posted by: Jen | Jan 7 2023 20:13 utc | 31
Of course, I forgot the Murdoch press. That sounds truly nauseating. I must confess I’ve read the Australian only ever a few times. The Oz is about as Tory-liberal as it gets: smug, superior, condescending, bourgeois, craven in the face of UK/US hegemony, hates the ALP/Unions. When I was a child in the 70s my grandmother (who had been a member of the CPA in the late 40s) refused to let any Murdoch publications in the house, an allergy I have inherited.
ps. always enjoy your posts.
Posted by: Patroklos | Jan 7 2023 20:26 utc | 35
Shades of Bana Alabed and her mother who texted the tweets and pretended the child was the author.
Posted by: Jen | Jan 7 2023 20:13 utc | 31
Creativity is not a strength of NATO intel.
Posted by: Nervous German | Jan 7 2023 20:34 utc | 36
It is a coincidence that Zelensky is a Khazarian Jew? no, nothing is a coincidence.
Posted by: Athanasios | Jan 7 2023 20:35 utc | 37
And the icing on the cake is the system of Soledar and Bakhmut mines, actually a network of underground cities. In which there is not only a cluster of people at a depth of 80-100 meters, but also tanks and infantry fighting vehicles move. And stockpiles of weapons have been stored since the First World War ”
Posted by: Nervous German | Jan 7 2023 19:48 utc | 21
Thank you. Hadn’t picked up on that rather YUGE fact about that zone before. This explains why just bombing the sh*t out of the area on the surface wouldn’t (or didn’t?) work. Does this also have to do with why the Ukies can keep bombarding Donetsk or is that stuff coming from a different sector?
Reminiscent of the Viet Cong tunnel networks making the regular US carpet bombings relatively useless against enemy field troops. Presumably once the RF can enter, take and hold those underground spaces that will be the end of that in that area.
Posted by: Exile | Jan 7 2023 19:10 utc | 5
Skimming through the Sydney Morning Herald and The Guardian (Australian Edition): no Ukraine articles to be found. Their rampant woke mafia staff writers will quietly lose the conflict down the memory hole now that Soledar and Artemovsk are effectively lost.
Ukraine? Oh yeah, whatever happened with that?
Posted by: Patroklos | Jan 7 2023 19:39 utc | 16
You are in Australia?
I am still trying to come to grips with what that means now. Always thought I knew. Was comfortable, happy and proud, even.
But three years of covid insanity and now this….. and Julian Assange, and offshore camps, and etc. etc..
A unique country. I learned the only country in the world where the US dollar is worth less than it is worth in the US.
That seems somehow significant… somehow, I don’t know how…
Please note:
Ukraine has signed the Chemical Weapons Convention(CWC), yet has ‘NEVER’ ratified it. Not obligated. No compliance requirements.
‘Remnants’ of the then pre ’91 Soviet chemical warfare infrastructure still remain in Ukraine. Much akin to many other pre ’91 Soviet aspects/equipment/infrastructure/facilities re The Ukraine.
PS MOPP-3 not TOPP-3, old age is catching up with me, so is the lysdexia …
At the same time, Pristayko stressed that with the conflict in Ukraine, the West “had a unique chance.” “There are not many countries in the world that would allow themselves to sacrifice so many lives, territories and decades of development to defeat the sworn enemy,” the Ukrainian ambassador said.
That shows the priorities:
harming the sworn enemy, priority 1, 2, …..
lives, territories, decades of development: zilch
———
Incidentally, two most cherished allies of the West, Ukraine and Israel, both are more fascistic than ever, an ongoing process. Shining beacons of Western values. Mind you, the authoritarianism is not limited to those “fringes of the West”.
There is a bit of paradox here. On one hand, “rule-based world order” is supposed to be world-wide, but in the same time, siege mentality leads to a separation of the West from the rest.
Posted by: Piotr Berman | Jan 7 2023 20:56 utc | 41
@39 arbitrage the price difference in dollars and its free money.
I mean I doubt they’ll let you, but it’s like negative interest rates
Posted by: Neofeudalfuture | Jan 7 2023 20:56 utc | 42
Jen | Jan 7 2023 20:13 utc | 31
“…>Shades of Bana Alabed and her mother who texted the tweets and pretended the child was the author.”
My mind went to Anne Frank, and her faux “diary”.
It seems the man her father paid to write it sued for outstanding payment and won… it was also written using a biro, which wasn’t commercial available until 1945, and presumably not easily obtainable in an attic in Holland.
So from Anne to Bana (of whom you reminded us) to the nauseating tweets by woke celebs, influencers and journos.
>Make a pithy, clever one sentence observation about The Current Thing.
Attribute to their child: “She’s 5” “He’s 8”, or whatever.
It’s formulaic at this point. It’s even practiced by the childless. They simply appropriate a niece/nephew, neighbour’s child for attribution.
Posted by: Melaleuca | Jan 7 2023 21:02 utc | 43
Thirdly, this is a unique landscape, ravines and heights, which are natural tunnels. And the icing on the cake is the system of Soledar and Bakhmut mines, actually a network of underground cities. In which there is not only a cluster of people at a depth of 80-100 meters, but also tanks and infantry fighting vehicles move. And stockpiles of weapons have been stored since the First World War ”
(c) Prigozhin via Intel Slava Z
Thought I’d share.
Posted by: Nervous German | Jan 7 2023 19:48 utc | 21
Thanks a lot for this. The kind of real significant believable detail one hungers for and rarely finds.
When reading of such underground installations I always wonder where’s the problem? Surely once overrun they’re trapped and totally defeated? They can perhaps surface in small numbers and without heavy equipment from a few concealed, as yet unfound, exits – fewer and fewer these days I imagine with IR and acoustic and satellite and drone monitoring – but in the main they’re buggered, surely?
As Scott Ritter claimed they did in Iraq wouldn’t underground installations simply be ‘bulldozed in’ ? Leaving one or two exits for surrender I suppose.
I constantly think that ‘bulldozer tanks’ are what’s missing here. The RPG with variants seems to be what’s holding everything up. So clad tanks with skins of sacrificial armour. Even use remotely steered tanks. Once overrun entrenchments are quickly inoffensive aren’t they? For they go underground if they can or get killed if they can’t. And then: bulldoze the trenches, bulldoze those massive concrete portals we’ve seen that they put in position as entrances. We’ve seen the allies doing it recently in Kherson.
Ukrainian generals (military and intelligence) have told strategic thinkers Gregory R. Copley that they are angry at what Zelensky has done to their country. When the fighting is over they say they will “get rid” of him.
Posted by: Jennifer | Jan 7 2023 21:05 utc | 45
From Vicktor’s telegram channel….
https://t.me/vicktop55/11233
The defense of the Armed Forces of Ukraine near Soledar is crumbling like a house of cards.
In a few days, the system of defensive positions crumbled, which were occupied by units of the 28th mechanized and 17th tank brigades. During their flight, five more strongholds were abandoned. Many wounded and dead. A sharp cooling significantly complicated the already critical situation. There is nothing to take out the wounded. There are numerous cases of frostbite and hypothermia. No one even thinks about the removal of corpses in these brigades.
Morale fell to a minimum even in units that were considered the elite of the Armed Forces of Ukraine. Yesterday, in the Soledar region, junior officers and soldiers of the detachment of the Special Purpose Center “West” (the former 8th separate regiment of the Special Forces of the Special Operations Forces of the Armed Forces of Ukraine) refused to carry out a combat mission.
The Ukrainian command tried to rectify the situation by sending more than 20 units of various Western-made lightly armored vehicles on trawls. However, almost all of these armored vehicles turned out to be technically faulty, and the cold snap made their use for counterattacks completely unsuitable. The manpower reserves in this area at the command of the Armed Forces of Ukraine are also practically exhausted.
The most savvy Ukrainian military understand the hopelessness of their situation and leave the Soledar area in small groups. “>https://t.me/svarschiki/7078
https://t.me/vicktop55/11232
Quotes Condolezza Rice as follows:
Ukraine’s economy has been completely destroyed, and the Armed Forces of Ukraine have become directly dependent on Western supplies of equipment and weapons,” former US Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice signaled in an article for the Washington Post.
“The turning point in the war with Russia must be reached before the beginning of the summer of this year, otherwise the situation will become irreversible: Ukraine will finally turn into a drug addict tightly hooked on Western aid
Sounds like collapse of this part of the front is imminent…
INDY
Posted by: Dr. George W Oprisko | Jan 7 2023 21:15 utc | 46
My 2 cents…
Today I walked past the Ukrainian church of Paris in the 6th arrondissement.
Naturally it was FULL of people for the Christmas mass…which goes to show that despite the clown from Kiev’s silly attempt to celebrate the birth of Jesus on 24/12 Ukrainians do celebrate in unison with Russians.
No what struck me was the absolute GLOOMY mood of the assembly. They KNOW what’s going on at home, they KNOW it’s a f’king bloodbath. I’m sure each and every person I saw in front of that church has lost 5, 10, 20 male acquaintances.
As much as I despise the fascists, the Hitler nostalgics, the torturers of the Donbass I almost felt pity for them.
Ukrainians know they’ve been played, and soon they’ll be betrayed by Biden.
Vae victis.
Posted by: Nanker | Jan 7 2023 21:18 utc | 47
Scorpion no. 38
Eeeeh the tunnel rats. I saw a dvd. It was horrendous.
And your classical piece on your website reminded me of this:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=WfGMYdalClU
Posted by: ThusspakeZarathustra | Jan 7 2023 21:19 utc | 48
Athanasios | Jan 7 2023 20:35 utc | 37
Zelensky is a native Russian speaker.
He had to learn Ukrainian for his role as Presidential candidate.
Reportedly, in the early campaigning days, he struggled and would slip back into Russian.
Allegedly, from Russian to English telegram (so questionable objectivity) …while seated beside Biden in the White House, the English translation was too precisely Ukrainian, and the Big Z couldn’t understand.
Posted by: Melaleuca | Jan 7 2023 21:19 utc | 49
Correction: Oh My Dog. Further apologies …
Ukraine ultimately ratified CWC 10/16/’98. Therefore IS Treaty obligated. Hence, IF unconfirmed reports are subsequently confirmed, & IF there was use of other than non-lethal riot-agents, Ukraine would be, prima facie, in breach.
On a downward roll, some time-out in LurkerLand for me …
@ abrogard | Jan 7 2023 21:02 utc | 44
Was posted in previous Ukraine thread. Hm, ‘buggered’, previously ‘arse’ … Sean_UA ?
If Putin ordered a ceasefire, and his military largely ignored it and continues the momentum of attack, doesn’t that say a lot about Putin and Russia? Why does NATO want Putin gone? Whoever would replace him would be exponentially more difficult for NATO to deal with. They really don’t know how good they have it with Putin, a man of reason, mercy, and super-human patience. Will there come a day when the western powers wish to go back to the Putin years?
Posted by: Dmitri Karamazov | Jan 7 2023 21:29 utc | 51
@young 14
Whenever, it looks like all the Donbas is going to fall to the Russians, this could be the last days/weeks before the Russians take down Babylon USA in one hour.
I’ve read your original post on the subject and therefore know what you mean. I understand your prophecy is based on Revelation 18 and on the assumption that Russia, contrary to its published policy, will launch a nuclear first strike of massive proportions against the continental US. And I even understand why Russia would resort to a first strike when is has gathered intelligence that Washington is preparing a similar one – thus a stage has been reached where mutual deterrence is no longer working. What I didn’t get is, how do you reach your precise prediction about the timing. Somehow, the timing will have to depend on what the US does, won’t it?
Posted by: grunzt | Jan 7 2023 21:30 utc | 52
Patroklos (31),
Shades of Greta Thunberg, whose posts were written by her father evidently.
Exile (39): Actually, the USD is worth a lot in Australia the AUD and NZD are both in the toilet. The NZ economy in particular is in desperate shape after Jacinda’s regime of 5 years has left it in a state of collapse.
Posted by: FHTEX | Jan 7 2023 21:30 utc | 53
Outraged @3, Patroklos @ 8, Laguerre @ 15 @ Jen 22.
company of radiation, biological and chemical protection to the first line of defense. Twenty-four hours ……the unit stopped communicating and is now considered missing.
My first read was the chemical team had been sent forward to do nasty chemical stuff, but had (hopefully) fucked up and had chemically cancelled themselves…
Or, that’s what I’d like to think it means.
Posted by: Melaleuca | Jan 7 2023 21:32 utc | 54
I’m having a difficult time following this so-called ceasefire. From the Telegram channel posts (including in this thread) enumerating Ukie casualties in, one would guess, Russian defensive actions (i.e., repelling attacks on positions) that fire from both sides continues. As no student of war, I have to ask: Is a ceasefire not inclusive of defensive fire?
Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Jan 7 2023 21:32 utc | 55
Posted by: young | Jan 7 2023 19:36 utc | 14
The smart thing for Russia to do, IMO, would be to decapitate the snake rather than launch a full scale attack. Chances are very high that the new government that emerges from the ashes of Washington D.C. would be more friendly to them and would likely have much higher approval ratings here as well.
Unfortunately, or fortunately, depending one’s opinion, this won’t happen and neither will the massive strike. The Russians aren’t stupid and they know it’s only a matter of about 20 years max before The Evil Empire collapses. Plenty of time to build up defenses of all kinds to ward off any flailing blows and death throes.
Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Jan 7 2023 21:37 utc | 56
@ Tom_Q_Collins | Jan 7 2023 21:32 utc | 55
No. Russia specified that their ceasefire was purely from offensive actions, not defensive or reactive ones.
Posted by: Featherless | Jan 7 2023 21:46 utc | 58
Tom_Q_Collins | Jan 7 2023 21:32 utc | 55
Ceasefire?
Didn’t State, Biden, and Zelensky insta laff, point and mock Putin for suggesting?
A ceasefire takes both sides to agree and observe.
I don’t think Putin was suggesting Russia was offering a free fire day.
If the Ukrainians rejected the ceasefire, and kept firing, Russian soldiers are gonna fire back.
Posted by: Melaleuca | Jan 7 2023 21:49 utc | 59
@patroklos, laguerre and others
So we have this report from 3.1. concerning the “special company” for chemical, biological and radiation protection – a Ukrainian unit. Strikingly high losses… And we have the report about presumably chemically induced injuries on the Russian side from today (or yesterday?). Nobody here knows what exactly is going on there, we can only wait and see (and speculate, conjecture). But you, patroklos, can do that yourself.
Variant 1 (all variants are equally valid): There was a spill of chemicals from the surrounding area (industry, warehouse or something) due to the acts of war. Ukraine was affected first, then also Wagner/Russia.
Variant 2.: The Ukrainians help a bit (with chemicals) and use the anyway high losses to prepare the accusation of Russia regarding the use of chemical weapons (so many brave Ukrainians even the Russians cannot kill in time without resorting to forbidden means…). Send a special unit for this, which of course disappears without a trace – evil Russians… more to come soon.
Variant 3: Russia/Wagner used chemical warfare agents, which went well for a few days, then they themselves got hit slightly, for whatever reason.
For me, that would be the state of the halfway realistic possibilities.
@Scorpion: Look at the course of the front line, there are so many ways of shelling Donetsk, it can’t just be turned off. Rocket launcher driven in, set up, shot down, driven away – a few hours. The same with artillery…
@general: Prigoshin’s account of Soledar, posted by my esteemed compatriot Nervous German, should give food for thought to all those who keep nagging here that it’s not happening fast enough, that Russia is making so many mistakes etc. blah blah blah.
I would like to add the example of Avdeevka, also a location from which Donetsk was shelled for a long time and probably still is. Look at it closely, this huge coke factory, one of the biggest in the world, such a tremendous amount of chemicals [1]. It was mentioned here months ago. You can’t just bomb it or something. It would be a disaster of unimaginable proportions. And of course Ukrainian troops are entrenched there. And of course there is a large underground bunker complex there – as in all such Soviet Union Cold War-era facility [2 – a few good impressions, the report is clearly biased].
Many even here have no clue what war means, even more so there.
Greetings, S.
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avdiivka_Coke_Plant
[2] https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-32336354
Posted by: SW (also Berlin) | Jan 7 2023 21:51 utc | 60
Interesting times. Some divergence is noted.
Country 404. A country where corruption infests every level of the government Z and below. Courtesy of NATO is doomed! Locked into a never-had-a-chance war.
Ten ways to detect online misinformation
Posted by: Bad Deal Motors On | Jan 7 2023 22:00 utc | 61
Vikichka #11
Imagine a country that hates you so much that they are ready to cease to exists it if means they defeat you.
Such people must never get nuclear weapons, because they are sure to use them.
Well said. That is the essence of it.
And we must remember this same country keeps pleading to the USA for long range missiles. Watch that space.
Posted by: uncle tungsten | Jan 7 2023 22:08 utc | 62
To me the report regarding the chemical unit just sounds like they’re plugging gaps with whatever troops they can find.
Posted by: Boo | Jan 7 2023 22:09 utc | 63
Clearly a number of people missed Medvedev’s Telegram comments on the West’s rejection of the Truce which I posted en toto to the previous thread. Essentially, he said the rejection by the West was a relief for Russian troops as it removed any ambiguity about how they should respond to Ukie attacks. Those who deliberately lie and attempt to spin the Truce into something it’s not only out themselves as trolls.
Melalueca no. 49
“He had to learn Ukrainian for his role as Presidential candidate”
Was that in addition to his role as a comedian?
Posted by: ThusspakeZarathustra | Jan 7 2023 22:17 utc | 65
“At the same time, Pristayko stressed that with the conflict in Ukraine, the West “had a unique chance.” “There are not many countries in the world that would allow themselves to sacrifice so many lives, territories and decades of development to defeat the sworn enemy,” the Ukrainian ambassador said.”
That’s clear, overt, bold and unequivocal screaming insanity. Not an ounce of logic or reason in it anywhere. Hopefully the non-Western world is not this insane.
addendum
See the Soledar salt mines for example here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soledar_Salt_Mine
And in general, almost everything I’ve learned since the beginning of the SMO suggests that Russia and the Allies are proceeding very carefully, cautiously, to a large extent, even if that seems to be a contradiction, a kind of contradictio in adjecto, careful warfare.
In any case, something completely different than bombing a country into rubble and ashes as quickly and effectively as possible, also using uranium ammunition (or worse – fuck the people, the children, the future, these “animals” don’t care) and so on, you you know it too.
Posted by: SW (also Berlin) | Jan 7 2023 22:26 utc | 67
Posted by: karlof1 | Jan 7 2023 19:14 utc | 6
“…The escalating immiseration of Europeans caused by EU/NATO policies can’t help but have a political impact, some of which is already visible, as is the dysfunction within the Outlaw US Empire’s government”.
Thanks for your insights. The word “dysfunction” is striking for me because in my little corner of the crumbling empire, dysfunction is evident and obvious all the time. The way the government at every level acts is counter productive and against the countries best interests. . Foreign policy is no exception.
It would be boring and seem petty to list the many examples.
I presume it is a post colonial hangover from the British colonial bureaucracy. They are addicted to meaningless bureaucratic paperwork rituals.
Few cabinet members in Australia or NZ have experienceI in running a successful commercial enterprise and it shows. The public is aware of this and their constant stream of lies.
This is how empires die.
Posted by: Paul GV | Jan 7 2023 22:29 utc | 68
Patroklos #25
“Oh, so no, not obvious at all. Turns out there could be a reason for that specific detachment being sent in.”
Agreed, such a specialised unit would be used not simply ‘wasted’. The UK has form in these illegal means of war.
The squad’s disappearance is intriguing. Somehow I hope that their move was spotted and every effort taken to destroy them. It wouldn’t be too difficult co call in some huge incendiary munition attack.
Posted by: uncle tungsten | Jan 7 2023 22:31 utc | 69
Pet Intel Slava, tb has surfaced in Ukes on front lines.
Posted by: Mary | Jan 7 2023 22:31 utc | 70
@ welldone | Jan 7 2023 22:31 utc | 69
more anti semite shit… b will delete your post and rightfully so…
Posted by: james | Jan 7 2023 22:45 utc | 71
Posted by: james | Jan 7 2023 22:45 utc | 71
I hope so!
Posted by: SW (also Berlin) | Jan 7 2023 22:48 utc | 72
Dr. George W Oprisko #46
Quotes Condolezza Rice as follows:
Ukraine’s economy has been completely destroyed, and the Armed Forces of Ukraine have become directly dependent on Western supplies of equipment and weapons,” former US Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice signaled in an article for the Washington Post.
“The turning point in the war with Russia must be reached before the beginning of the summer of this year, otherwise the situation will become irreversible: Ukraine will finally turn into a drug addict tightly hooked on Western aid
That is precisely what the USA set out to do with the Maidan coup. They installed a team of fascists, corrupt to the core to run the country, murder Slavic people and poke the Russian bear. They no doubt had permission to siphon off sufficient to keep them in place and keen to obey. This project goes on.
It was the USA way in Ukraine and many countries prior and current.
The FTX scam was likely set in place during the Biden Ukraine special envoy period to siphon cash back to the empire of unending addiction. We know how far Hunter Biden was intertwined in the kleptocratic oligarchy and CBW research bases that was Ukraine during the Obama and Trump years. Perhaps more will come to light given the falling out among the FTX prosecutions but I won’t hold my breath as so many investigative reporters are chasing the twitter red herrings. Good timing I guess :/
Posted by: uncle tungsten | Jan 7 2023 22:57 utc | 73
I think we are doing it all wrong.
Those of us that believe the prevailing narrative is all wrong. We who believe Kiev is evil and destructive and the mad comic murdering his own and the USA a machiavellian monster and so on.
We are doing it all wrong. Mainly we’re doing nothing. Which is wrong. But what we should be doing is supporting Ukraine. Definitely.
Like this:
“Equal Rights for Ukraine”. “Help for Ukraine!” “Do not forget the Ukrainians” “Do not victimise Ukrainians” and so on.
Followed by such as “10 Million Ukrainians need your help” and ” Four oblasts in terrible trouble” ” Millions of Ukrainians shelled mercilessly for eight years” ” Millions of Ukrainians losing homes and lives ”
Followed by:
“send donations to DPR and LPR at this address” and “Congress should vote money for 10 millions Donbas Ukrainians”
and so on. Get it? Clever writers, publicists, propagandists, journalists and whatever should be promoting that line.
The line? Simply to appropriate the word ‘Ukainian’ and put it where it belongs. Put the whole thing in its proper terms: Kiev Ukrainians against Donbas Ukrainians.
ALL about Ukrainians. ALL of it.
We don’t need any fine toothed hair splitting logic. We are dealing with the sheeple of the world who couldn’t give a damn and allow their manipulators to perpetuate this monstrous farce simply because they believe the prevailing lying mantra: it is ‘Ukraine’ v “Invader russia”.
We know it is not. We know that today Russians are present only on ground they’ve been invited to. And there not ‘invading’ but helping.
We know that UKRAINIAN Donbas militias have been and are fighting Kiev Ukrainians.
All those bleeding hearts and sanctimonious lying hypocrites professing to love Ukraine and Ukrainians conveniently forget a little matter of 10 MILLION UKRAINIANS. And we let it happen.
We should drown out their cries for support for Ukraine by our cries for support for Ukraine.
Where we ask for support for a sane, Christian Ukraine which simply seeks to live in peace and drive the invading Kiev Ukrainians and their bloodthirsty foreign mercenaries OUT of their lands.
The narrative has been totally – TOTALLY – commandeered by that evil USA. ‘Evil’. Yes, such a quaint word. Biblical. But I know of no other. The callous indifference to human suffering is staggering. The arrogance. They even declare their ambition to destroy the whole of Europe, to destroy all of Russia. They don’t care who knows it. They blow up their own ‘allies’ energy life support.
I know of no other word that comes near describing them: ‘Evil’.
They have, as the devil is said to do, managed to call black white and white black, they have reversed everything.
On pretext of ‘defending Ukraine’ they destroy Ukraine.
They have, with a word – the pen is mightier than the sword – obliterated 10 millions Ukrainians !
The sheeple of the west give no thought for that 10 million for they DON’T KNOW THEY EXIST !
They think there are only two entities: ‘Ukraine’, which is Kiev, and ‘Russia’ and how totally wrong is that?
We need to help the Ukrainians. I know they are now part of Russia. But the world does not accept that and they are in any case part of the ‘Russian Federation’ aren’t they? They still exist. And they are still ‘native Ukrainians’.
They need our help. Every single one of us. Private citizens with no more power than a computer keyboard. But we could constantly loudly and piercingly scream for ‘Justice for Ukrainians’ and ‘Help for Ukraine’ and then baffle and hopefully enlighten the sheeple when they dully protest ‘but that’s what we’re doing isn’t it?’
No. It is not. They are killing Ukraine and Ukrainians is the sad truth isn’t it? Shorn of all accessory detritus about history and fault and blah, blah, the simple fact is they are killing Ukraine and Ukrainians.
HELP UKRAINIANS. Get onside with every shout you see ‘supporting Ukraine’ and add your weight – inserting ‘send help to this address’ at the opportune moment. Spread doubt and uncertainty. Throw them off balance. It’s all judo. Currently we, the supporters spread thinly across the western world, seem to be as ineffectual and uncertain and riddled with bullshit and colonel blimps and the Russian military itself which itself via its propaganda arm could adopt this precise same tactic but doesn’t.
HELP UKRAINIANS. 10 MILLION OF THEM.
If we help them we help them all is the truth.
@ welldone | Jan 7 2023 22:31 utc | 69
Wasn’t this same post debunked a few weeks ago ?
In any case it’s taboo to speak about them, except as victims, and they’re not really semites, and it’s all just a coincidence, or because they’re just so good at politics, that’s why they rise to the top.
Also, b is in Germany, where these talented, meritocratic non-semites have the country by the balls, just like in the US.
So ixnay on the oozjays.
Posted by: Featherless | Jan 7 2023 22:58 utc | 75
“Thought I’d share.
Posted by: Nervous German | Jan 7 2023 19:48 utc | 21”
Thanks for sharing, that is very good information!
“Eeeeh the tunnel rats. I saw a dvd. It was horrendous.
Posted by: ThusspakeZarathustra | Jan 7 2023 21:19 utc | 48”
I highly recommend The Tunnels of Cu Chi book It’s one of the best war books I’ve read. Can you imagine the willpower and stamina it takes to live in underground tunnels for over 2 years while fighting a war?
Posted by: Nathan in WA US | Jan 7 2023 22:58 utc | 76
not sure how it got cut off, but here’s the rest…
The Tunnels of Cu Chi bookThe Tunnels of Cu Chi by Tom Mangold John Penycate
Can you imagine the stamina and willpower it takes to live in underground dirt tunnels for over two years while fighting a war?
Posted by: Nathan in WA US | Jan 7 2023 23:03 utc | 77
William Schryver aka imetatronink posted a Substack piece addressing the doubts of pro-Russian observers…
Ok, Doomer
Legendary Russian fatalism may be alive and well, but it will be ashamed of its doubts in the end.
https://imetatronink.substack.com/p/ok-doomer
I have struggled in vain for almost a year now to comprehend the frequently expressed fears of potential defeat from a great many Russian observers of this war – as though they are constantly haunted by a sense that inevitable humiliation is lurking in the shadows just ahead, and they’d best prepare themselves accordingly.
The abundantly manifest facts of the ongoing NATO proxy war against Russia, as I have been able to ascertain them, are that Ukraine has now suffered approximately five hundred thousand irretrievable casualties and virtually the entirety of their original inventories of military hardware – the equivalent of ALL the personnel and equipment (both active and reserves) with which they commenced this conflict.
Their military strength was partially reconstituted over the summer of 2022, infused with the best equipment NATO could spare, but which, in both quantity and quality, are simply no longer capable of being replenished.
In addition to this substantial infusion of NATO armaments, several thousand “sheep-dipped” NATO soldiers appeared on the battlefield, mostly in the form of shock troops and technical specialists to operate and maintain the more complex systems such as M-777 howitzers and HIMARS rocket artillery.
This partially rebuilt army has now been effectively wrecked over the course of the previous four months of futile – arguably suicidal – Ukrainian “offensives” against layered Russian defensive lines.
We know this to be true because now the Ukrainian high command is desperately begging the west to provide it with yet a third fully equipped army to throw against Russia’s overwhelming firepower…
From the perspective of this author and observer of events, and notwithstanding the fatalistic and often fearful inclinations of many who call themselves Russians, Russia simply cannot and will not be defeated in this war. Quite to the contrary, I am convinced it will emerge more self-confident, more self-sufficient, and more globally influential than it has ever been.
Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jan 7 2023 23:05 utc | 79
“..Few cabinet members in Australia or NZ have experience in running a successful commercial enterprise and it shows…” Paul GV@67
Are you suggesting that experience in running capitalist enterprises should be a qualification for political office?
In my experience, in Canada, the very worst governments are those full of greedy, ruthless and criminal capitalists intent on ripping off the public and giving away public property to their mates, who will always employ them when the public has caught up with them and kicked them out.
Posted by: bevin | Jan 7 2023 23:06 utc | 80
james #71
“more anti semite shit… ”
Thank you. But it is worse than that it is invention and an entirely ridiculous distraction.
WW2 is long ago and the conditions in Ukraine are fuelled by fanatics and oligarchical manipulators – of all religions and affiliations. It is fanatics and their mechanisms of survival that are our business today. The USA in particular is the problem as its economy and machinery is being used to constantly develop fanatical forces and attack humanity.
Every nation that financially and militarily supports the Ukrainian regime needs to be condemned for their crime against humanity. That these nations are so manipulated is truly disgusting.
Posted by: uncle tungsten | Jan 7 2023 23:08 utc | 81
…
“Thirdly, this is a unique landscape, ravines and heights, which are natural tunnels. And the icing on the cake is the system of Soledar and Bakhmut mines, actually a network of underground cities. In which there is not only a cluster of people at a depth of 80-100 meters, but also tanks and infantry fighting vehicles move. And stockpiles of weapons have been stored since the First World War ”
(c) Prigozhin via Intel Slava Z
Thought I’d share.
Posted by: Nervous German | Jan 7 2023 19:48 utc | 21…
I constantly think that ‘bulldozer tanks’ are what’s missing here. The RPG with variants seems to be what’s holding everything up. So clad tanks with skins of sacrificial armour. Even use remotely steered tanks. Once overrun entrenchments are quickly inoffensive aren’t they? For they go underground if they can or get killed if they can’t. And then: bulldoze the trenches, bulldoze those massive concrete portals we’ve seen that they put in position as entrances. We’ve seen the allies doing it recently in Kherson.
Posted by: abrogard | Jan 7 2023 21:02 utc | 44
Barflies, this seems to be bigger than Azovstal. Much bigger.
Posted by: Nervous German | Jan 7 2023 23:09 utc | 82
Andrei Martyanov interviewed by Ania of “Through the Eyes of” Youtube channel:
ANDREI MARTYANOV ON HOW LONG IT WILL TAKE EUROPE TO RECOVER? HOW RUSSIA WAS ABLE TO KEEP THE VALUES?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TBoNRLj_GF8
At Andrei’s own site, he discusses the order to Italy from the US to send more advanced air defense systems to Ukraine:
Italy Must Oblige…
No matter what Italy does, and her ridiculous proposals for being a “mediator” between Russia and 404 have been flatly rejected by Russia, she will remain the US lap-dog and will do as ordered. As la Repubblica reports:
Washington chiama Roma: “Mandate a Kiev lo scudo anti-missile”. Il consigliere per la sicurezza nazionale Sullivan telefona a Palazzo Chigi e sollecita l’approvazione del sesto decreto di aiuti militari.
Translation: Washington calls Rome: “Send the anti-missile shield to Kiev”. National security adviser Sullivan telephones Palazzo Chigi and requests the approval of the sixth military aid decree.
Sullivan wants Rome to send SAMP/T air-defense complexes to 404. Well, SAMP/T is an Aster missile family complex which in its tactical characteristics is somewhat similar to Patriot PAC2/3, with a slightly shorter range but with a fully vertical start, and demands to Rome to send it are just another manifestation of the US reluctance to satisfy mom’s basement dwelling community of military porn masturbators to see further NATO technology being obliterated in 404 by Russia. But the trend on increasing NATO involvement by supply of what passes for “top of the line” technology in NATO is obvious and the US continues to exert pressure on its NATO vassals “to do something”.
He goes on to discuss the Gorshkov deployment and its radar capabilities which are important for targeting.
Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Jan 7 2023 23:15 utc | 83
Posted by: welldone | Jan 7 2023 22:31 utc | 69
The thing about this Jew business is that implied ‘togetherness’, ‘collusion’, ‘conspiracy’ thing isn’t it?
The minute you hear two people are both Jews you assume they know each other and are cooperating, are in collusion.
That’s about as ridiculous as when you’re abroad and meet people who say ‘Oh, you’re from that country! I had a friend from there. Do you know him?’
We do know the Jewish ostensibly makes them a more solidly connected group than is our norm. They observe practices amongst which is attending their ‘community centre’, the synagogue much as Muslims attend the Mosque and Christians the church.
But what right do we have to think they are any more attentive to this ritual, these customs, than Muslims or Christians are?
And if they were to be how can we assume they’d carry these associations beyond the synagogue – take them home, weave them into their daily lives? Any more than we do with our Church acquaintances, if any.
And if that were so what right to think they then settle down to plot and plan atrocious things rather than simply discuss their children and gardening or such?
There’s also a kind of natural social force that perhaps ought to be considered: reaction to Jewish teachings.
A ‘Jew’ is not by profession, not something you profess, but by birth. A Jew is a Jew, considered such by the outside world, simply because of accident of birth, regardless of what the person actually professes as a religion or belief structure.
And the ‘force’ I speak of is the force that causes rational people to see absurdities and illogicalities in the Jewish religious teachings. Causing many to turn away from them. Which is rather a powerful thing in anyone’s life. We see ubiquitous and multitudinous example of the destruction or warping of personality amongst christians who find they cannot accept the narrative and react against it and become agnostics or atheists in name but in actuality kinda rabid ‘anti-goddists’ who jump down your throat should you even accidentally say something like, perhaps: ‘god willing’.
But, of course, the more powerful the more intense the religious background. If you predicate an intense, close, coherent and fervent Jewish background then you have to accept the likelihood of extreme reactions to it on the part of many.
Perhaps many of the most evil with Jewish surnames that might indicate lingering Jewish religious environments were that way because of such a fierce and violent reaction against the Jewish religious narrative. Coming to believe in nothing at all. Finding it all to be merely a chamber of horrors this earth. Perhaps steeped by the elders in the awful history of the Jewish persecutions throughout the ages and cognisant of that incredible clever trap they’re in that makes it impossible for them to ever deny being a Jew no matter how ‘unjewish’ they get. Unfair. A hostile world that has sought them out.
Such disordered personalities may well become very nasty people indeed. But it wouldn’t be because their supposed religion colluded to decide upon this course of action.
It would be an accidental accumulation of like peoples in the one place at the one time.
Much like the accumulation of the totally amoral insane in govt in the USA today. Would that we had a convenient common denominator to hang that on as a cause. Perhaps exposure to too much Hollywood? Too much American bullshit and possession of too much wealth?
Posted by: gottlieb | Jan 7 2023 18:55 utc | 4
You quote: “In the beginning of the special operation they used Zelensky’s Jewish heritage as proof the Azov’s weren’t Nazis. “They can’t be Nazis, Zelensky is Jewish” was proclained throughout the land.
And now the Jewish Zelensky is actively persecuting Christians, and no one says a word”.
What people failed to see back then, and some still don’t get is that this time Zelensky’s support for Nazism was not about targeting Jews but using the same extreme nationalism of the Nazis to attack Ukrainians with Russian blood or pro-Russian views. These are the new untermensch or lesser humans in Ukraine as the Jews were under Hitler. So it is has always been adaptation of a Nazi techniques unrelated to Jews. If people are aware of Hitler’s targets it was never only Jews anyway, it was also gypsies, homosexuals, sometimes black people, the physically and mentally disabled, and others that Hitler decided were “degenerate artists”.
The Western media has also treated Ukrainians living in the Donbas region as if they do not exist enforcing the view that these people are lesser humans or untermensch that are not even worth talking about.
One only has to look at the black and red flag favoured by the Nazi battalions and Kiev’s leaders where the red stands for the blood of the pure Ukrainian ‘race’ and the black stands for the Earth to see that the goal of Ukrainian Nazis is to purify the country so there is no Russian blood left (ethnic cleansing) and only pure Ukrainian blood remains. This, like Hitler’s folly, is absurd, because if you actually submitted Ukrainians to DNA blood test many would show they have the genetic background that includes Russian genes and thus Russian blood.
Ironically the West exposed much of this in documentaries over the last 8 years, but when the War started they seem to have undergone a bad case of chronic amnesia.
Posted by: George | Jan 7 2023 23:20 utc | 85
Every nation that financially and militarily supports the Ukrainian regime needs to be condemned for their crime against humanity. That these nations are so manipulated is truly disgusting.
Posted by: uncle tungsten | Jan 7 2023 23:08 utc | 81
True that. There will come a time of reckoning. Global South is realigning, and its not in the favor of the collective so-called West. New alliances are being forged, old hostilities set aside. Major example: Reconciliation between Iran and Saudi Arabia.
To quote the ending of the latest and to date probably greatest Pepe Escobar masterpiece guest starring Credit Suisse big-picture analyst Zoltan Poszar:
The year 2023 will proceed with China playing the New Great Game deep inside, crafting a globalization 2.0 that is institutionally supported by a network encompassing BRI, BRICS+, the SCO, and with the help of its Russian strategic partner, the EAEU and OPEC+ too. No wonder the usual suspects are dazed and confused.
And add to this mix Africa. Russia really is kicking butt, blending soft power with Wagner orchestra hard facts, in Burkina Faso and Côte d’Ivoir — while the old EU colonists are having an increasingly rough time with Borell’s racist “jungle”, having nothing to offer than more of the old nebulous blabber, more of the old promises never kept.
Posted by: Nervous German | Jan 7 2023 23:23 utc | 86
Summary by the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation on the progress of the special military operation on the territory of Ukraine (07.01.2023)
[…snip…]
📊 In total, since the beginning of the special military operation destroyed ((+?) over preceding 24hrs):360(+1) aircraft,
Posted by: Outraged | Jan 7 2023 18:29 utc | 1
The count for destroyed aircraft matches that in the previous day’s report and should thus appear without “(+1)”. I mention this quibble mainly to assure the poster that these summaries are read with some care and are appreciated.
Posted by: David Levin | Jan 7 2023 23:29 utc | 87
Posted by: abrogard | Jan 7 2023 22:57 utc | 74
Thats quite intelligent. Fight them with their own tools. But I see the following two problems.
1. It is in fact narrative engineering and morally many of us are averse to spin, although the facts are in principle true. Probably because we have become experts at detecting narratives and very allergic to it.
2. Narrative engineering on that scale takes skill, access to information conduits and a lot of money.
However it is still better than what many do at the moment, trying to argue with logic and truths. Modern Western society has seen that the material physical world obeying rules and logic does not bring enlightenment or betterment of one’s situation. Emotional satisfaction is the only thing that counts at the moment.
This difference in worldview lies at the root of the current conflict.
Oh, and the fact that empire needs more subjects from which to collect its dues.
Posted by: alek_a | Jan 7 2023 23:30 utc | 88
Posted by: bevin | Jan 7 2023 23:06 utc | 80
“….Are you suggesting that experience in running capitalist enterprises should be a qualification for political office?”
Thanks bevin, I knew someone would make that observation. Mixed economies seem to work best. Look at China.
In Australia and NZ the so called left come from university debating clubs and trade union organiser backgrounds and the so called right from university debating clubs and only have experience working as staffers for their side of the uni party.
Few know how or care how to make their country and the population more prosperous. Politics has become a debating marketplace for the exchanging of favours with each other and donors. how’s that for real world experience? You get what you pay for with these charlatan no hopers. Then they are promoted by adherence to the party ideology, not by merit or the contribution of new ideas.
As they say, “they couldn’t run a hot dog stand”. We might be better off with hot dog vendors.
The ordinary people are suffering from rule by second rate dead beats.
Posted by: Paul GV | Jan 7 2023 23:33 utc | 89
psychohistorian | Jan 7 2023 20:21 utc | 34
re– …rhe one ring that binds them all is the God Of Mammon ring…
What follows [in quotation] is from comment by Max Power at ZH, FRIDAY, JAN 06, 2023 – 08:20 PM Afghan-China Oil Deal, as follows:
“…Another strong point on the Orient is the absence of religious messiahship inherently built into all Abrahamic religions. This allows modern Eastern nations to cooperate despite very different political regimes. Everyone mind their own business. But Western nations still can’t give up the insufferable degree of self-righteousness.”
Note the relevance of implanted ideas, AKA implants, and the widespread feeding of data that is automatically ingested by infants in their, say, first 3 years. Later, as adults, they [we?] unconsciously operate using residues of that totally uninspected data.
Posted by: chu teh | Jan 7 2023 23:34 utc | 90
ThusspakeZarathustra | Jan 7 2023 22:17 utc | 64
“……in addition to his role as a comedian?”
I know you’re being flippant…but when in the role of a comedian… he made most of his money speaking Russian in Russia telling jokes about Ukrainians.
It was all just good hearted fun…
I’m myself now curious… his tv program… Servant of the People… what language was that? Russian? I suspect so. I read years back the tv show was also popular in Russia…
Posted by: Melaleuca | Jan 7 2023 23:43 utc | 91
Since the comments on this thread are all over the place, this will fit just fine, “Bye Bye 1991-2022”:
The end of 2022 did seal the frying of the Big Ukraine Negotiation Fish. It has now been served on a hot plate – and fully digested. Moscow has made it painfully clear there’s no reason whatsoever to trust the “non-agreement capable” declining superpower….
Meanwhile, deputy chairman of the Russian Security Council Dmitry Medvedev, visibly relishing his totally unplugged incarnation, expanded on the Fried Negotiation Fish saga. “Last warning to all nations”, as he framed it: “there can be no business with the Anglo-Saxon world [because] it is a thief, a swindler, a card-sharp that could do anything… From now on we will do without them until a new generation of sensible politicians comes to power… There is nobody in the West we could deal with about anything for any reason.”…
Arguably the biggest fish to be fried in 2023 is the myth of NATO. Every serious military analyst, few Americans included, knows that the Russian Army and military industrial complex represents a superior system than what existed at the end of the U.S.SR, and far superior to that of the U.S. and the rest of NATO today.
U.S. military power is the supreme myth of the fish to be fried variety. Essentially, they hide behind proxies – as the Ukraine Armed Forces. U.S. forces are worthless except in turkey shoots as in Iraq in 1991 and 2003, against a disabled opponent in the middle of the desert with no air cover. And never forget how NATO was completely humiliated by the Taliban.
2022 ended an era: the final breaking point of the “rules-based international order” established after the fall of the U.S.S.R.
The Empire entered Desperation Row, throwing everything and the kitchen sink – proxy war on Ukraine, AUKUS, Taiwan hysteria – to dismantle the set-up they created way back in 1991.
Globalization’s rollback is being implemented by the Empire itself. That ranges from stealing the EU energy market from Russia so the hapless vassals buy ultra-expensive U.S. energy to smashing the entire semiconductor supply chain, forcibly rebuilding it around itself to “isolate” China.
Pepe opens 2023 with two serious overviews. We share the same POVs, but his language is a bit more colorful at times:
“So bye bye 1991-2022. The hard work starts now. Welcome to the New Great Game on crack.”
By “crack,” IMO Pepe means the speed, intensity and multiplicity of events occurring as we move forward.
I saw this on my Telegram Slavyangrad thread, if it is anywhere near true it provides a devastating account of Ukrainian losses (and probable earlier emigration):
Forty thousand people live in the glorious city of Yuzhnoukrainisk in the Nikolaev region. Of these, 5 thousand are elderly, 15 thousand are children, about 10 thousand are women, a thousand are unfit for service in the armed forces for heath reasons, and about 3.5 thousand thousand are left after February 24.
The AFU just announced that two men from the city were killed in the war. Locals report that there are no more men left on the streets of the city. Given the scale of the Ukrainian mobilization and the scale of the emigration and losses, this is believable.
Also, the taking of Podgorodnoye by the Wagner’s has been announced, in addition to the progress in Soledar where the Wagners have reached the Salt Mine near the center. It looks like the north flank of Bakhmut is at last giving way, leading to the cutting off of the roads from the north into the city. Also, unconfirmed reports of the Ukrainians leaving Krasnaya Gora which is also on the note flank.
A coming destruction of the US does not need to be nuclear and certainly not “first strike nuclear”; it can be non-nuclear hitting various Achilles heels to devastating effects (tsunamis, volcanoes, fault lines) or it can be nuclear retaliation to a mostly (or completely) failed US first strike* or similar.
* It’s not like anyone is sitting around passively waiting for whatever to hit them. Well anyone except “the west” perhaps where politicians seem to assume their superiority complex is an impenetrable shield, or if that fails that they’ll have time to escape (magically, on their own, without any of their support structure interfering, and to some supposedly safe destination not in “the west” where they for some reason aren’t supposed to stick out like a sore thumb and be hunted down).
As already pointed out by others neither Russia nor China are currently in any hurry, nor in my opinion Iran or North Korea.
If anything like it happens (it’s better if it doesn’t) it will be due to some action by the US “government” etc. or some mistake (or “mistake”) on their part. Maybe something as simple as them believing they would have a chance of explaining it away despite “everyone” not corrupted by them trying to warn them repeatedly.
I was worried it would happen last summer, since it didn’t I’ll be worried it will happen this summer, and if we survive again and things are still not settled then the next summer thereafter and so on.
I don’t know precisely why but the US crazies don’t seem to have much confidence during winter, maybe it’s related to thermal signatures of all kinds (wild guess, could be a trap).
Posted by: Sunny Runny Burger | Jan 7 2023 23:54 utc | 94
Melaleuca @ 54:
The same thought occurred to me after I posted @ 22, that a unit “experienced” in the use of chemical weapons had been sent to the frontline but its members had got into difficulties with what they were given and maybe … snuffed themselves out.
I daresay that using such weapons in trenches where proper ventilation is an after-thought, and the risk of their coming into contact with other noxious chemicals or heat or water is also high, would be inadvisable.
Reminds me of an incident I read about online during the early years of the war in Syria in which ISIS fighters were moving chemicals in a tunnel and an accident occurred resulting in possibly hundreds dead.
Posted by: Jen | Jan 7 2023 23:54 utc | 95
Since the comments on this thread are all over the place, this will fit just fine, “Bye Bye 1991-2022”:
…
Posted by: karlof1 | Jan 7 2023 23:45 utc | 92
Ukraine is at the center of it all.
Ukraine is the West’s new Afghanistan.
I’d like to quote Adam Curtis from his 2015 BBC film “Bitter Lake“:
Increasingly, we live in a world where nothing makes any sense. Events come and go like waves of a fever, leaving us confused and uncertain. Those in power tell stories to help us make sense of the complexity of reality. But those stories are increasingly unconvincing and hollow.
This is a film about why those stories have stopped making sense. And how that led us in the West to become a dangerous and destructive force in the world. It is told of the prism of a country at the centre of the world. Afghanistan.
Posted by: Nervous German | Jan 8 2023 0:00 utc | 96
I don’t know how many will be able to view this very short but hilarious video. The caption at the original said:
“Who can save Amerika?
…better recycle it instead!”
Patroklos @ 35, Melaleuca @ 43:
Long after the mainstream news media drops Ukraine and moves onto something else without any pangs of regret, the rage will be maintained in the arts and culture review pages of the so-called quality press, aimed among others at schoolteachers and their captive audiences – schoolchildren. I suppose that’s why this new literary phenomenon Yeva Skalietska exists – she’d have to be invented otherwise. What’s a war without its Anne Frank or Bana Alabed?
Posted by: Jen | Jan 8 2023 0:04 utc | 98
@Nervous German 21
Thanks. Hadn’t seen that. Water above, saltmines below, the solution writes itself. See the Lake Peigneur Drilling Accident.
Posted by: Hermit | Jan 8 2023 0:07 utc | 99
Thanks. Hadn’t seen that. Water above, saltmines below, the solution writes itself. See the Lake Peigneur Drilling Accident.
Posted by: Hermit | Jan 8 2023 0:07 utc | 99
Wow, thanks, this one is new to me. Wouldn’t seem like a very Russian solution, but that’s why they’ve got their Orchestra. That’s to say: only if it can’t be saved.
Posted by: Nervous German | Jan 8 2023 0:11 utc | 100