Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
January 10, 2023

Ukraine And Russia Agree - Russia Is Fighting NATO

Russia and Ukraine have publicly agreed on a fundamental and important issue.

The question is who Russia is fighting in Ukraine.

During an interview with a Ukrainian TV station the Oleksii Reznikov, the defense minister of Ukraine, answered that the Ukraine has "already become a de facto member of the NATO alliance."


The interview, given four days ago, is available on Youtube. English language subtitles can be generated by autotranslate. The sentence pictured above comes at about 1:25 minutes in.

Sputnik, which seems to be the only international outlet that has picked up on this, has more (from ~11:05 min):

“At the NATO Summit in Madrid” in June 2022, “it was clearly delineated that over the coming decade, the main threat to the alliance would be the Russian Federation. Today Ukraine is eliminating this threat. We are carrying out NATO’s mission today. They aren’t shedding their blood. We’re shedding ours. That’s why they’re required to supply us with weapons,” Reznikov said ...

The official said Kiev was being constantly reminded by its “Western partners” that it, “like a real shield, is defending the entire civilized world, the entire West,” from the Russians, and said that he personally has recently received holiday greeting cards and text messages from Western defense ministers to that effect.

Reznikov expressed “absolute” certainty in Ukraine’s eventual entry into NATO, saying he was “convinced that this is an absolutely realistic possibility... Of course they won’t accept this political decision via consensus before our victory. This is clear. But after the victory, after all this ends and some kind of peace arrives, NATO countries, first and foremost, will be interested in the construction of this security architecture. They have seen their own weak spots, they have seen who is strong and powerful. Today they are teaching us but tomorrow our officers, sergeants and even privates will be teaching them how to fight the Russians. Russia remains one of the threats to NATO, and for Europe as a whole.”

Reuters reports today that the Russian government agrees with the core of Reznikov's view:

Russian Security Council Secretary Nikolai Patrushev is seen by diplomats as one of the major hardline influences on Putin, who has promised victory in Ukraine despite a series of battlefield setbacks.

"The events in Ukraine are not a clash between Moscow and Kyiv - this is a military confrontation between Russia and NATO, and above all the United States and Britain," Patrushev told the Argumenti i Fakti newspaper in an interview.

"The Westerners' plans are to continue to pull Russia apart, and eventually just erase it from the political map of the world," Patrushev said.
Asked about Patrushev's remarks, Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov said NATO and the United States were part of the Ukraine conflict.

"De facto they have already become an indirect party to this conflict, pumping Ukraine with weapons, technologies, intelligence information and so on," Peskov told a regular news briefing.

As both sides now seem to agree on the real participants of the conflict we can assume that they will later also come to an agreement about its outcome. That however will still take a while.

The heavily fortified Ukrainian strongholds in Bahkmut (Artyomovsk) and Soledar are about to fall. The long fight over these cities has come at a high price particularly for their defenders. All the reserves the Ukrainian command has thrown into them have been ground up by massive Russian artillery applications.

Other reserves the Ukrainian army is still training up are waiting for new supplies of 'western' weapons. But what has been newly promised, mostly infantry fighting vehicles (aluminum cans), will only become available in late spring. The most likely plan the Ukrainian command will want to pursue is a move south towards Mariupol (bottom right) to severe the Russian land connection to Crimea.


There is however only a small chance that such a move during spring could be successful. Until then Russia has the time to make its own moves.

Posted by b on January 10, 2023 at 15:30 UTC | Permalink

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Russia Is Fighting NATO.
And NATO is nothing more than the United States.

Posted by: bevin | Jan 10 2023 15:43 utc | 1

Is that a classic saying the quiet bit out loud?
A brazen assumption by the Ukrainians?
Or Nato policy.?

Posted by: jpc | Jan 10 2023 15:45 utc | 2

Ukraine is saying it out loud because they are getting destroyed. It’s their way of guilting and begging the West for more money. It is also a strange way of feeling better about themselves, as if by “being part of NATO” it all makes sense now: the can feel like martyrs for a lost cause.

Ukraine is losing people, its electrical, energy and telecommunications infrastructure is being destroyed, millions of people have fled.

But hey, as they slowly but surely drown and gasp for air, they can tell themselves that they are a de-facto part of NATO.

Posted by: Augustus Caesar | Jan 10 2023 15:55 utc | 3

reznikov says "we (Ukraine), are the stooges of NATO" because he evaluates NATO positively, he does not suspect that to a large part of the world population it sounds like "we (Ukraine), are the stooges of the death squads of capitalist slavery".

Posted by: marquesatheresa | Jan 10 2023 15:57 utc | 4

Thank you b. Like so many things, this is just confirmation of what is long known by those who rise above the din of ubiquitous western propaganda about ALL things.

The difference in tone between 'west' and 'east' is remarkable. The West is a hysterical drama queen posing as Lady Liberty and the East; methodical, plodding, with a fixed mindset to get out from under for-profit Empire; aka The Great Satan.

Posted by: gottlieb | Jan 10 2023 15:57 utc | 5

Pity the Ukrainians who have been so lied to and completely deceived by the collective West. The beliefs and aspirations articulated by Reznikov are not much different and perhaps even less plausible than those of the (CIA trained and backed) Islamic jihadists of being martyred and going to heaven.

Posted by: Moses22 | Jan 10 2023 16:10 utc | 6


So attacking an energy grid 40 years old is a victory for coal, gas and nuclear power in the future? But if every home and business had their own renewable or zero-entropy supply, that would be a loss? I don't understand your (non)logic

Posted by: hedlykarok | Jan 10 2023 16:14 utc | 7

In this context one should also have a look at this here piece by Newsweek, citing the ukrainian ambassador to UK:

"The West now has a unique chance," Prystaiko said. "There are not many nations in the world who would allow themselves to sacrifice so many lives, territories and decades of development for the purpose of defeating the archenemy."

Posted by: renard | Jan 10 2023 16:14 utc | 8

Looks like I replied to a post that was removed

Posted by: hedlykarok | Jan 10 2023 16:15 utc | 9

Things seem to be turning around as the months of accrued damage on UA's military and infrastructure finally starts showing results. The collapse on the Blackmutt front is happening quickly. Pro-UA accounts are becoming hysterical. There is seething about the immediate need for western tanks. Even the official UA twitters are whining about needing tanks. And I'm feeling a shift in attitudes by Western glowies. The military aid they're "considering" is either unrealistic (any significant number of Challengers or Leclercs) or too small-scale to make a difference (realistically 10-20 Challengers or Leclercs at best). I don't think that NATO will totally cut the war loose, but they'll stop denuding their armies and fund a guerrilla or terrorist war instead of a conventional one, if things keep looking bad for Keev.

Posted by: catdog | Jan 10 2023 16:19 utc | 10

Looks like I replied to a post that was removed

Posted by: hedlykarok | Jan 10 2023 16:15 utc | 9

I would be happy to elaborate but why was my post removed? b?

Posted by: El Oso de Los Llanos | Jan 10 2023 16:20 utc | 11

NATO is giving aid, this is not a new or controversial revalation.

Can Russia really be considered a Great Power (like America or China), if they are struggling this badly from NATO giving a few percentage points of their 1980s surplus weapons to Ukraine, the most corrupt country in Europe and which according to some, sells a considerably amount of Western aid on the black market?

Posted by: Bernd | Jan 10 2023 16:21 utc | 12

^However, keeping in mind that Western aid depends on UA getting results, they're likely to try one last wave of offensives with whatever they can scrape together. NATO might want a guerilla war but Agent Z probably does not.

Posted by: catdog | Jan 10 2023 16:21 utc | 13

The USA can not back down against the Russians. To do so would be a certain loss of the United States Dollar (USD) losing its world reserve currency status. So the USA and the West it controls will continue to escalate both with sanctions and the war in Ukraine.

All talk about peaceful negotiations will prove to be in vain. Yes, this is the most logical thing for both sides. Yet, it would lead to a rapid loss of the special status that the USD enjoys.

If the USA fails to destroy the current Russian presence, then it loses the value of the USD. A month after that, the USA will be in worse conditions than any of the existing 3rd world nations.

So, the escalation continues in the hope of a breakthrough in destroying the Russians.

The sanctions have obviously failed backfiring more upon the European Union and the NATO nations than upon Russia. The only hope that the USA now has is on the Ukrainian battlefield where the Russians are also winning.

The only option left will eventually be the nuclear option. The USA will plan a first strike launch against the Russians.

However, the Russians will beat the USA to a first launch. This will be the decisive end of the USA and NATO.

The entire world is about to change drastically very soon. I estimate that the Russians will launch soon after they take and secure the Donbas. With Soledar about to go down, this could happen in the time frame of months, not years.

Posted by: young | Jan 10 2023 16:25 utc | 14

AnalEna Barecock has arrived to Kharkov.

Posted by: rk | Jan 10 2023 16:26 utc | 15

no truer words were spoken... but the western msm will not carry it... it highlights what is happening here, and they don't want that...

i agree with most all of the comments on this thread so far and think they all nail it..

Posted by: james | Jan 10 2023 16:27 utc | 16

Statement of obvious.
NATO trained Ukrainian Proxies and lavished attention and funds on them.

Now Ukraine "feels" it is NATO and wants NATO to "rescue" its protegy.

Russia knows Ukraine is NATO's 'Cat's Paw" and waits............

NATO ie US-UK keeps stretching out the cat's paw and hopes to entice Germany to return to 1942 by sending "Panzer" and pitch Germany into a 30-50 Year "conflict" with Russia (and China) to weak it permanently and eviscerate EU.

Posted by: Paul Greenwood | Jan 10 2023 16:28 utc | 17

Bernd @12

Who says Russia is “struggling so badly”?

Posted by: krypton | Jan 10 2023 16:30 utc | 18

Can Russia really be considered a Great Power (like America or China), if they are struggling this badly from NATO giving a few percentage points of their 1980s surplus weapons to Ukraine

Can USA really be considered a Great Power , if they are struggling this badly from Taliban ejecting them from Afghanistan after spending $2.3 TRILLION ?

Posted by: Paul Greenwood | Jan 10 2023 16:30 utc | 19

While some here are still waiting for the German public to wake up and start unrest, it's still completely in coma, unwakable. Only the German capital is desperately trying to resist US control over Germany's foreign and economic Policy, especially towards China. To no avail as it seems considering today's NATO-EU joint declaration that apparently even deepens EU's subordination.
I machine translated the teaser of a correspondent article. Unlike usual doesn't provide an english version.

Under increasing pressure from German industry on the one hand and the United States on the other, the dispute over Germany's China strategy is coming to a head. Passages from the draft paper, which is being prepared in the Foreign Office under Green leadership, had already become known at the end of 2022. They aim at a considerable aggravation of tensions between Berlin and Beijing. The German economy is now taking a determined stand against this: It obtains almost half of its strategically important imports from China; central sectors of German industry have their most important market there. The presidents of the leading German business associations are urgently warning against a break with the People's Republic; economists are criticizing Baerbock's draft China strategy for its considerable technical deficiencies. While the Chancellor's Office is trying to put the brakes on the Foreign Ministry's plans for China policy, NATO and the EU today want to agree on closer cooperation in the "growing geostrategic competition" with China as well. This would give the U.S. greater influence on German China policy as well.

Posted by: Mosed | Jan 10 2023 16:31 utc | 20

So at what point does the NATO/US alliance believe that Ukraine is a NATO member. They sure talk like it and are willing to sacrifice their economies and military for Ukraine. And therefore direct confrontation with the Russian military is justified. The situation looks like it is headed toward a shooting war between US/NATO and Russia. Sanna better get in a few more qwerking sessions before telling her people why no more electricity, railways, roads, and food.

Posted by: Erelis | Jan 10 2023 16:32 utc | 21

Dulce er decorum est pro NATO mori.

Posted by: Gerd | Jan 10 2023 16:40 utc | 22

Does anyone have an opinion on why the U.S. hasn't shipped Abrahms main battle tanks to Ukraine yet? It's always presented by media as "The U.S. can't because it risks drawing them and would be a big escalation". But is that western propaganda? Are MBTs really more of an escalation than MLRS systems that can and are hitting Russian territory near Belgorod (HIMARs)? More of an escalation than M777 long-range artillery and anti-personnel cluster munitions for the guns? I call b*llsh*t.

There's some other reason the U.S. won't ship M1A2s to Ukraine (but I don't know what). They've got five thousand of them sitting in reserve - full annual production for years now has been delivered straight to surface storage without even lubricants being placed in. The U.S. Army has extensive experience with them in the European theater (Germany).

Now the U.S. is taking tepid baby steps to provide Stryker 8-wheel IFVs to Ukraine, while U.K. says its sending a dozen of its MBTs and France and Germany are on the cusp of doing so also. Honestly, with friends like those, who needs enemies? Having some dozens of units of new heavy armor from a handful of completely different systems... is not going to help. Ukraine already has two main systems they can't maintain well (T-62 and T-72).

From a birds-eye view, watching the whole thing from an impartial perch (which I'm not, but if I was...), I'd say the U.S. is being very intentional in what they give and when they give it to the UAF. And it has nothing to do with Russia's perceptions, sensibilities, or red-lines, and every thing to do with "what draws this shit out until"... the superplan appears? WTF are they buying time for - is depopulation of Ukraine the actual end goal (perhaps for an ersatz Israel), and *not* the break-up of Russia?

Posted by: JoeSoldier | Jan 10 2023 16:41 utc | 23

@21 I suppose an open admission by NATO that Ukraine is a member would mean NATO would have to go all in and declare war on Russia. They don't seem quite ready for that.

Posted by: dh | Jan 10 2023 16:41 utc | 24

Humanity in the West waking up to the reality of Russia against NATO/US/UK is a prelude to humanity in the West waking up to the reality that the China/Russia axis is against the God of Mammon global private finance cult.

Then we will be getting somewhere as a species and maybe we can evolve beyond the jackboot top/bottom social organization of the West.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Jan 10 2023 16:43 utc | 25

This interview suggests the obvious that NATO's war against Russia would not appear to end even with the implementation of Ukraine's war aims. Once again they confirm the Russian narrative of the war as reported by Patrushev at Reuters, because the Russians themselves are telling less and less and are letting our actors act and report in order to cement their russian narrative for the whole world to see via direct arche sources from the West.

"We are carrying out NATO's mission today. They aren't shedding their blood. We're shedding ours. That's why they're required to supply us with weapons" (...) They have seen their own weak spots, they have seen who is strong and powerful. Today they are teaching us but tomorrow our officers, sergeants and even privates will be teaching them how to fight the Russians."

Somewhat more subtly, such attitudes depict the dangers for Europe based on complete self-exaggeration and the creation of legends in the ranks of Ukraine, i.e. in
a fragmented, indoctrinated, battered society in a rump state at the end of the war, which is bound to happen.

Integrating uprooted and ideologically charged soldiers into a post-war society can be complicated. A few will look for those responsible for their defeat, who will then suddenly sit in the NATO states or in Kyiv itself. It is not for nothing that Selensky becomes more and more hectic when it comes to implementing ideas such as "war tribunals" or naming "war crimes" in Ukraine, so that someone historically responsible can denounce for posterity. in that mindset a defeat for Ukraine would mean that others did not support Ukraine enough. Those voices are rising right now. It is a solid premise for the emergence of "stab-in-the-back" legends of defeat that can encourage attacks. It's also worth noting that Ukraine has become a thriving market for illegal arms deals thanks to NATO and pro-war sponsors.

Now, in March, the British and Dutch are inviting all the justice ministers in the world to a cabinet including a fundraising gala for The Hague, in order to promote this goal, because they would like to get a few more states than the sanction bearers to round off their show. In addition to questionable analytical skills, the West shows a desire to write history in the present before the history of the present overtakes it again.

One bitter irony is that Ukraine's nationalists needed this war to establish a culture of remembrance in a young nation that has been dominated by Russian cultural achievements for decades. Poroshenko already said in 2016 that Ukraine will never have any meaning on the side of Russia. Röper from the antispiegel translated an interview from Selensky's circle of advisers months ago according to which Kyiv will need a large war or even several wars against Russia in order to achieve its goals. Of course, this involves making sacrifices, which gives rise to a myth of sacrificial.

I fear that this war of ours and its consequences (big or small) will accompany the West and the world for a long time to come, which is why there is another expectation that there will be no reflection, self-criticism and an open discourse, so that the fronts will harden and other worldviews will simple fall under censorship. Just today, the unelected institutions NATO and the EU decided to work more closely together, among other things, in the area of "foreign disinformation" and after the Twitter files we might have an idea of what exactly that means.

Posted by: Konrad | Jan 10 2023 16:45 utc | 26

I don't think it's ever safe to go by something described with the phrase 'Reuters reports'.

Posted by: Figleaf23 | Jan 10 2023 16:46 utc | 27

Speaking of NATO... Canada announced yesterday that the Military are buying 88 F-35 aircraft for $16 billion. You have to wonder if Chrystia Freeland insisted on the 88 number

After Trudeau promised years ago to never to buy that particular plane.

Canada expects the first F-35s to be delivered in 2026 and for the fleet to be fully operational between 2032 and 2034, Defense Minister Anita Anand told a news conference.

Also interesting that the announcement came as the Mexico City summit kicked off.

Posted by: Opport Knocks | Jan 10 2023 16:46 utc | 28

Guerilla war requires the ability to blend in with the local population living under the rule of the enemy. This in turn requires a significant level of support and widespread sympathy from that population which means the same population can't as a group be part of the declared enemy.

Gaudy nazi ex-Ukrainians have enough trouble fitting in when living as refugees in Poland...

So much for yet another brilliant US plan (sarcasm) :)

[Just like the recent tragic "how the US can win in Taiwan (if one redefines losing as winning)" paper, which doesn't even pass as really bad fiction]

Posted by: Sunny Runny Burger | Jan 10 2023 16:48 utc | 29

However, keeping in mind that Western aid depends on UA getting results, they're likely to try one last wave of offensives with whatever they can scrape together. NATO might want a guerilla war but Agent Z probably does not.
Posted by: catdog | Jan 10 2023 16:21 utc | 13

No, that is only fake stories for people living in natostan to see on TV. Ukr never had any results, only Russian general staff retreating allowed for such fake news. You may say that it was on purpose, to drain nato, but I don't think so.
Russia has not reached new regions' borders and it seems to be a long time until then. So far they've successfully turned themselves into Syria with no control over their own, new, territory. Donetsk and other regions are still receiving large amounts of missiles and artillery daily, no change. Crimea gets drone attacks. Occasionally Belgorod gets missiles. All you have to ask now is where will be the next large terrorist attack, there was one every few months and it's time now.

Posted by: rk | Jan 10 2023 16:48 utc | 30

Posted by: JoeSoldier | Jan 10 2023 16:41 utc | 23

Long-range weapons like HIMARS could be easily, safely and deniably operated by NATO personnel in UA uniform. Tanks are training-intensive and their specific role is to go where enemy fire is heaviest. That is why NATO started out by trying to find every Soviet tank they could so that Keevans could use them competently.

Now Keevans have been training on Western tanks for almost a year, so it might finally be time to deliver them. The remaining obstacle now is how embarrassing it would be to see the smoking hulls of those tanks posted online. The Western public has a delusion that their military gear is far superior to Soviet gear.

Posted by: catdog | Jan 10 2023 16:50 utc | 31

Also interesting that the announcement came as the Mexico City summit kicked off.
Posted by: Opport Knocks | Jan 10 2023 16:46 utc | 28

Mexican president warned last year that US wants to annex Canada and Mexico

Posted by: rk | Jan 10 2023 16:51 utc | 32

The way the west is delivering their weapons is the most stupid thing ever. Some batches trikle in, they get where the russians want them to be, then they get destroyed and then they send another insignificant number of equipment, which gets destroyed again and then they start anew.
If the russians went on to the west they would probably feel the need to really do something coordinated, at the same time logistics would become more difficult for the russians. But the way this brainless "lets send 100 old tanks because the 100 tanks we send last week have been destroyed" strategy is so stupid that the west really is going to bleed out militarily. The point where even career idiots like barbock will realize that they have nothing left in their arsenal any more isnt far.

Posted by: Orgel | Jan 10 2023 16:55 utc | 33

Ukraine is telling the west that it will stop fighting unless it gets more money and weapons. So if ukraine is supplying the bodies the west must provide weapons as a moral equivalency.

I wouldn't want myself to be sold for money and weapons so this is a big narrative fail.

However the only thing that matters is victory. Russia must win on the battlefield nothing else matters. The die is cast, Ukraine will start losing until it gets its planes and tanks to conduct a sweeping offensive.

They've already broadcast about losing bahkmut/soledar. Losing is their leverage. Biden has to send in good money after bad, or it's all over.

Posted by: Neofeudalfuture | Jan 10 2023 16:56 utc | 34

Some updates.

Avtovaz will start making cars with automatic transmissions soon, airbags in a year. Russia has overcome Exxon's leaving in energy production. Volodin says about 75% of foreign companies have stayed. Kremlin says big Ukr. losses with missile strike DID happen. The word 'dominoes' is being used with regard to Ukr retreats. The US is worried that SU 35 fighters sold to Iran is a big strategic deal. Soledar is about to fall.
And Quora is still loaded with delusional questions about how Ukraine is 'winning'.

Posted by: Eighthman | Jan 10 2023 16:57 utc | 35

Things must be going really badly for the Ukrainians because the CBC actually reported that Soledar has been taken, but only due "mass wave attacks by Russian soldiers." When all else fails, the West resorts to WW2 propaganda excuses about "Russian kamikazes" and "General Winter."

Posted by: Victor Scarpia | Jan 10 2023 17:01 utc | 36

Mike Whitney's post in his article at UNZ posits UKR snucked into NATO through the back door. (paraphrased). Who knew of a thingy called "Enhanced opportunities partners"?

[.]right to the point. Ukraine didn’t need to be formally entered into NATO because the US stealthily bestowed defacto membership on them out of the public eye.
Naturally, Putin and his lieutenants knew what was going on, but the media made sure that everyone else remained in the dark. And all of this sleight-of-hand was going on just months before Putin was forced to invade. It’s actually shocking.[.]

Hmmm!? While the American sheeple were asleep there was a marriage 26 years ago.

The date of Ukraine's marriage to US led-NATO is September 04, 1996.The marriage certificate is H.R. 120.

Do read very slowly and digest at
LINK (H/t: Oliver Stone docu, "Ukraine on Fire")

{.} Calls upon the President of the United States to: (1) support continued U.S. assistance to Ukraine for its political and economic reforms, the safe and secure dismantlement of its weapons of mass destruction, increased safety of operation of its civilian nuclear reactors, the establishment of rule of law, criminal justice and law enforcement training, and promotion of trade and investment (provides that such assistance should leverage private-sector involvement as much as possible); (2) urge that the Government of the Russian Federation offer Ukraine its promised highest possible cooperation, recognizing Ukraine's sovereignty and territorial integrity and refraining from economic coercion; (3) ensure that Ukraine's national security interests are fully considered in any review of European security arrangements and understandings; (4) support continued U.S. security assistance for Ukraine; and (5) ensure continued U.S. efforts to assist Ukraine in its accession to the World Trade Organization and ensure exploitation of the potential for aerospace and space cooperation between Ukraine and the United States.{.}

Fast Forward: 2013-2014 Nanny Nuland's $5 billion worth of cookies. In 2022 tally is $112 billion and counting. Not enough, Z is milking the udders.
Gotta give the lad credit. He knows how to milk the USNATO cows; the real Holsteins, Jerseys and Guernseys, not so much.

The US$ spent 1996-2022 on and off the books, some deemed "national security, can't be disclosed could mitigate a number of ills.

Posted by: Likklemore | Jan 10 2023 17:02 utc | 37

Russia Is Fighting NATO.
And NATO is nothing more than the United States.

Posted by: bevin | Jan 10 2023 15:43 utc | 1

The euro rulers are full partners and making bank on nato. Many of these leaders and their followers are nazi's themselves because that is what America demands of them. That "our nazi" talk at the end of WW2 was all cover. Recall the aged quote; "We have met the enemy and we are them".

Posted by: Tard | Jan 10 2023 17:03 utc | 38

Is CDBE (capitalist dead body empire) down only to shale oil? I thought they had gazillions of Alaskan oil, considering it is similar to Siberia.

Posted by: RealBeast | Jan 10 2023 17:10 utc | 39

@36 touting enemy losses is always a fall back propaganda option.

It's weak though it can't be verified and is prone to unchecked lying. Both russia and ukraine indulge in it, but yes this is a consolation prize for losing the territory.

However don't be fooled, ukraine is angling for more resources, and losing is a good bet to pull more out of its sponsors. Losing for real works better than lies too. The west would know if they're faking.

Posted by: Neofeudalfuture | Jan 10 2023 17:11 utc | 40

Well, the slutty Western MSM won't be reporting Resnikof's confession. It blows the "Putin's unprovoked attack on Ukraine" meme clean out of the water.

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Jan 10 2023 17:12 utc | 41

I've posted the translation of the full interview with Patrushev by Argumenti i Facti here. Those wanting to access and translate it themselves can find it here.

All the main figures of Russian leadership have now said NATO is waging war on Russia--Putin, Lavrov, Medvedev, Patrushev, Volodin--and most Russians agree.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jan 10 2023 17:14 utc | 42

Mosed [20]

While some here are still waiting for the German public to wake up and start unrest, it's still completely in coma

You are completely out of touch with reality on the ground !!!!!!!!!
There are marches EVERY Monday across Germany especially in the East in you know why Mondays ? Because that is the day in GDR that people marched in Leipzig, Dresden and other cities in protest at SED-Stasi regime in GDR in anger.........

German Media is controlled by Political Parties like every institution in German State set up by US. Germany is a Party-State where TV networks are political party affiliated and the print media belongs to rich families or KKR like Axel Springer.

They IGNORE any protests just as they did over Covid.

YouTube blocks them. Blogs in Germany are controlled by NetzDG. There are very few rebel news outlets where you can find any need to go off-piste to find any real news in Germany which is very tightly controlled.

So keep reading and translating your beloved website from German News Information Services GmbH
Brabantstr. 10
D-52070 Aachen

but remember if they get too critical they will be closed down and raided...........

Recall that since Germany was permitted to Re-Unify through Anschluss in 1990 the German regime has destroyed Yugoslavia to recreate the wartime regime in Croatia - and destroyed Ukraine again..........and on both occasions Germany had a GREEN Foreign Minister - Joschka Fischer and now Baerbock

Don't forget just how deep Konrad Adenauer Stiftung (CDU) was involved in Kiev through its candidate Vitali Klitschko as presidential candidate

Posted by: Paul Greenwood | Jan 10 2023 17:16 utc | 43

@ Joe Soldier #23; catdog #31

I think catdog has it correct, the U.S. military/MIC doesn't want to see their "current" weapons defeated en masse. The U.S. has not fought a peer combined-arms war since perhaps Korea. If the U.S. government delivers even older M1 Abrams tanks and those get defeated by combined-arms before they actually accomplish anything real, it will be an embarrassing act of perhaps the "emperor has no clothes". What would worse yet would be heavy losses of "near front line" NATO aircraft to the Russians. That hasn't been tested at all and would be even more of a blow to the West.

I suspect that Jake Sullivan's and Mark Milley's panties are stating to twist fairly tightly trying to figure out a way out of the mess they have helped create...

Posted by: DakotaRog | Jan 10 2023 17:22 utc | 44

But the way this brainless "lets send 100 old tanks because the 100 tanks we send last week have been destroyed" strategy is so stupid that the west really is going to bleed out militarily.

You really should do some basic research........really........

When NATO faced Warsaw Pact the second biggest tank army it possessed was German with 6 tank divisions - today it has 300 tanks of which maybe a third are serviceable

UK has 227 tanks with only 148 being upgraded by 2025 - it has not produced ammo for its rifled cannon since 2006. Training is done with restricted use of munitions because stocks are low.

NATO had 35,000 tanks in 1980 and Warsaw Pact had 59,000

42 years later only Russia has a decent supply of tanks and manufacturing capacity. Ukraine gets what NATO can AFFORD to give because NATO has neither functional tanks nor functional ammo

Posted by: Paul Greenwood | Jan 10 2023 17:24 utc | 45

YES and NO.

YES, all NATO members supporting and sending weapons to Ukraine.

NO, because all assets of NATO are not deployed in Ukraine theatre. How. There is no air support for Ukraine from NATO. Also, AD is at low level supply. Also, NATO countries are arguing about sending modern heavy armor to Ukraine. So, the real answer is YES and NO.

Posted by: Vedran | Jan 10 2023 17:25 utc | 46

Bernd @12

Who says Russia is “struggling so badly”?

Posted by: krypton | Jan 10 2023 16:30 utc | 18


CNN, obviously. LMAO.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jan 10 2023 17:25 utc | 47

I am confused by this claim at this point - what about this is new information.
Clearly the west/US/NATO instigated the conflict - using Ukraine army as surrogate and Ukraine as theatre of conflict.
Clearly the Ukraine government is willing participant in this scheme - accepting the risk to it's country and it's citizens.
Clearly the Ukrainian public are aware of the above and at least tacitly supportive of the effort.
The benefit to the Ukraine is unclear - obviously (to rational, open minded, pragmatic people (of which seem to be short and diminishing supply) Russia would not care if Ukraine were in EU and had economic rations as such. Russia simply did not want the as member of NATO - for the reason taht they did not want NATO to establish presence in Ukraine. The logic is tragically obvious. Only people who dont want to see it could avoid seeing it.
So now it is the line between NATO supporting (wholly) the conflict and NATO as participant in conflict. As I have said previously, Russia is holding that card until it sees opportunity and need to address it.
I disagree with Mercouris on one point - clearly Russia will have a well defined criteria for when nukes are to be brought into the conflict - they are the last and worst option. West needs to hope that it does not get to that point - west best hope that Russia does not lose.

Anyway, the military action is the side-show (albeit important) - it is the economic issues that will decide the outcome.

Posted by: jared | Jan 10 2023 17:26 utc | 48

One learned, as an economics undergraduate 100 years ago, about externalities. Those are costs, not in the accounting sense, borne by others whilst the benefits are internalised. The US, through Nato, has had all the benefits of its war through Ukraine (massive de-stocking of its military inventory and public expenditure by the US and its poodles on manufacturing and selling its replacement at huge public cost, whilst the benefits have largely accrued to rentier capitalist oligarchs. And all the costs have been externalised, i.e. borne by the Ukrainian and Russian soldiers and civilians killed in the fighting as well as the mass starvation and health disasters suffered by the global south.

It’s only when these costs are internalised and the body bags bearing the Stars and Stripes, the Union Jack, the EU and Nato start appearing on the tv, will steps be taken to end this abhorrent state of affairs.

Posted by: Vragtes | Jan 10 2023 17:32 utc | 49

opport knocks @28

So the Puppet Trudy/Freeland regime in Ottawa is contracting to purchase a shitload of "Flying Turkeys/Hangar Queens" from Lockheed-Martin, as have a number of other puppet regimes.

Every knowledgeable airwar commentators I have accessed to date are in full concord that basically that F-35 is a piece of shit at the cost to American and in the future...of a Trillion Dollars and constantly rising. This is a great commercial and political victory for Lockheed-Martin and its primary owners, publicly revealed as "London Bankers".

Basically, what we are looking at here is the Puppet Regime $upreme in the Di$trict of Corruption, "sharing" the costs by shoving those flying turkeys down the throats of the lesser puppet regimes. The hegemonic entities are applying economic and political "force majeure" upon their "allied powers". The whole mess is a Pyramid Scheme, a totalitarian top-down arrangement created in order to maintain the primacy of the primary shotcallers.

What conceivable use will those planes be when faced with the no-nonsense fourth and fifth generation fighters produced in Russia by state-owned war-industries...with NO profit-motive as is the overall guiding policy implemented by bought and paid-for pro$titicians across the Western world

Posted by: aristodemos | Jan 10 2023 17:32 utc | 50

RealBeast @39--

That's an excellent observation but OT for this thread. The utter lack of development in Alaska means its resources will remain untapped, as well as ignoring its strategic location relative to Russia's Northern Sea Route.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jan 10 2023 17:35 utc | 51

@ Posted by: Paul Greenwood | Jan 10 2023 16:30 utc | 19

Objectively, the Taliban did not eject the US. They waited until the US left and then toppled the puppet government that the US installed.

Posted by: Opport Knocks | Jan 10 2023 17:36 utc | 52

young | Jan 10 2023 16:25 utc | 14

The only option left will eventually be the nuclear option. The USA will plan a first strike launch against the Russians. However, the Russians will beat the USA to a first launch. This will be the decisive end of the USA and NATO.

This time, you didn't mention that your prophecy is based on Revelation 18. It is tempting to go along with your interpretation, though, because

- we are indeed facing a potentially apocalyptic situation
- Rev. 18 paints the scenario of a large scale [nuclear] destruction of a country, turning it into an uninhabitable desert
- it does not predict the destruction of the remaining world, making it perhaps more inviting than reality
- it seems to predict the total decommissioning and disarmament of the US, so it promises to solve a global problem that we couldn't solve by our own means.

Hot, dangerous stuff. I tend to mistrust all political deciders if their decisons are motivated by prophecy in Scripture, Quran, Talmud or what have you. Because this is a mindset with which you cannot argue.

Posted by: grunzt | Jan 10 2023 17:39 utc | 53

Posted by: Opport Knocks | Jan 10 2023 17:36 utc | 52

You are describing the Soviet Withdrawal 15 May 1988 completed 15 Feb orderly withdrawal (unlike US rout). Gorbachev had agreed with Politburo 1985 to withdraw but needed to negotiate Geneva Accords for stability......the Najibullah regime was in place to run Afghanistan - but US was funnelling weapons to Taliban

Posted by: Paul Greenwood | Jan 10 2023 17:43 utc | 54


Thanks for keeping Moon posters informed on the reality on the ground in Deutschland. As you once again reported that most of the unrest focuses on the "Ossies", my take is that having been long experienced in dealing with the Stasi, etc. that those folks have managed to remove the scales from their eyes when it comes to dealing with a totalitarian puppet regime, currently ensconced in Berlin...with the abominable Greenies enjoying a level of power far above their level of public support by the supine masses of "whipped puppies" ,still bedizened by the 77-year under occupation status of their crippled nation.

Posted by: aristodemos | Jan 10 2023 17:48 utc | 55

The Russian Alliance adapts too swiftly for any military force that exists to counter. Then the ukrinazi's have twice committed expeditionary forces into the Donbas Arc in the Melitopol/Mariupol direction and on both operations where defeated in detail, and that was at the hands of the Donbas Arc Militia's, without Russian manpower assisting in direct combat operations.
It seems part of the inability of Ukrainian forces to mount and successfully conclude combined arms operations goes back to an inherent aspect of the nature of ukronazi and regular ukie forces, which is the underlying purpose of the Ukrainian military has always been as terror and reprisal - cleansing operations. They have never been a fully integrated defensive military organization created for national security reasons. Yeah they have such an appearance but appearances are deceiving. It must be remembered exactly who and what the client regime in Kiev is subordinate to and what for.
It was pretty obvious before and after Maiden some globalist interests where very much interested in obtaining their own "State" appearing military, per say, a really big plausibly deniable military force, their own pet army, which was totally not loyal to the citizenry of Ukraine, they wanted a regiment factory, for their own nefarious use. But, it had to fit the look and appearence of a NATO aligned legitimate State military. But to do the nefarious it was necessary it had a very strong inner hidden controlling element totally loyal in secrecy to the khazarian mafia and its global cabal, and that was/is its ukronazi neo-nazi paramilitary component. This does not an army make. No matter how its dressed up no matter how it is lavished with arms and filthy lucre, and why increasingly this Ukraiinian military requires foreign operators, mercs, and "advisors", because it was never a true State Military in the classic model, it is an army of thugs and criminals, it is inherently corrupt to the core, never mind its genocidal bent. Look at things right now. They are screaming for NATO munitions and weapons, crying poor mouth, but it never has any problem bombing mortaring and missiling the Donbas Arc uninterropted since 2014. Just this morning in 7 minutes 40 rockets hit Doneskt, and now Russia proper is receiving hourly arty and missile attacks upon its civilians and infrastructure, they are the targets, not Russian targets. Funny how that works. and right there is what priorities are ruling the ukie military operations. You can dress that up any way desired, it is acts of genocide by a genocidal paramilitary organization that commits acts of terror and reprisal on civilians under the guise it is a legitimate state military fighting its existential enemy. It is a terrorist army comprised of regiments of ideological fanatics in the form of fascism, with window dressing of a poorly trained poorly equipped poorly led poorly supplied conventional infantry army with no more combined arms remaining in effective amounts to win against the Russian Alliance, which in any case it never could win, it was all for plausible deniability so a criminal gang of truly depraved child blood drinking satanic megalomaniacs with an agenda to depopulate the earth in order for their own kind can rule earth with impunity, forever. And now its found itself in a pickle, its only remaining viable power to hurt is the use of nooks. There is no military capable of stopping the growing Russian Alliance. Its The Primal necessity, the number one rule in war, to know they enemy if one is to fight and win against they enemy. To now, this enemy has stopped at nothing during its centuries of rule over the western hemisphere and beyond, in all its time nothing is beyond the pale when it comes to maintaining its hegemon. How many wars, pogroms, genocides has to perpetrated upon mankind, how many hundreds of millions of dead it is responsible for. Do you believe using thermonuclear weapons to save itself is a moral issue for these monsters after all it has destroyed and murdered?
The only thing that is inhibiting them is retaliation and the risk of being annihilated by the Russians if they cross the use of nooks threshold. They do not have the delivery systems, countermeasures and high advanced war tech the Russians possess and make zero bones about using nuclear weapons for their defense. Because, the Russians know exactly who this enemy is and its evil. And why after two decades of preparing they are able to fight back with their nuclear defense capabilty having their conventional military's back. The only threat that is not completely having a defense for is precise targeted action in the form of decapitation attack, say a van with a suitable yield weapon inside it detonated close enough to where Putin is located to guarantee his death. Every other scenario employing first use nukes against Russian Alliance is pretty much a guarantee to end up getting you the nook dirt nap. The End.
But, these are inhuman evil incarnate monsters. Born and bred into a life where they reign supreme. For generations, they and their kind has controlled this planet. They will not go softly unless they are collectively taken out in one fell swoop. Or somehow, they are something like so inbred, having maintained their bloodlines so long they are become mentally retarded to the point they flub and self destruct, essentially the human self extinction movement, it gets up every morning, looks in the mirror, brushes its teeth and goes about with its global insanity, which at moments all sure seems so sure as the sun rises. I have zero knowledge all I have is my native wit, and some critical thinking skills, hardly if at all that, I'm a welder by trade working paycheck guy who just wants to be left alone, thats all, but in this world it ain't enough, its time to be thinking Men and be Citizen Warriors cause bad shits coming sure as the sun rises and knowing the enemy is rule number one.
I am only sharing what I believe I know is more or less some facsimile of truth and facts. Ain't nobody coming to save me and mine and anyways it all begins with each of us, then it can be lots of us dirt people, because solidarity, unity in common cause, is what will save us, save ourselves. We are all the Donbas Arc people now. Guarantee it.

Posted by: mtnforge | Jan 10 2023 17:48 utc | 56

"Flying Turkeys/Hangar Queens" from Lockheed-Martin, as have a number of other puppet regimes.

Great deal ! I am sure politicians will be boosting their pension funds with the kickbacks.

This is Yeltsin's Revenge. - Lockheed bought Yak-141 design the USSR could not afford to develop and used it as basis for a Harrier replacement.......

It is a Software Platform where USA controls the specifications and "permissions" of the platform - the Ring to Bind Them All

Now that British forces are integrated into US interoperability. - Japan has followed suit - and US will bind its island carriers UK and Japan into its military structures.........that is why Turkey does not want F-35 and why Erdogan bought S-400 so he has control over his own Air Force unlike during the coup

Posted by: Paul Greenwood | Jan 10 2023 17:49 utc | 57

@Bernd 12

What evidence leads you to imagine that Russia is, "struggling badly"?

Posted by: Hermit | Jan 10 2023 17:57 utc | 58

@1 bevin

The US finally managed to put it's big foot down in the middle of Europe. Too late though. The US is detorriating and Putin is ready. God help us all.

Posted by: Pentimento | Jan 10 2023 18:00 utc | 59

"good News" from Soledar per Intel Slava:
Units of PMC "Wagner" closed the boiler in the area of the Soledar outpatient clinic north of Salt Mine No. 4 and began to clean up the city.

The local administration (Soledar City Council) is already under the control of the musicians.

The whole Bakmut/soledar front is collapsing, can only hope this breaks the back of Ukraine resistance.

Posted by: ctiger | Jan 10 2023 18:01 utc | 60


Many of the so-called Christians...particularly the evangelicals, Southern Badtist's, Holy-Rollers and the oxymoronic "Christian" Zionists are totally caught up in the concept of Armageddon, while the clear translation of Revelations is the Greek term "Apocalypse". Those one-book idiots do not even realize that "apocalypse" means not a world-crushing final battle, but rather a revealing, an awakening, a new consciousness.

Thus, we attempt to tap-dance on a tightrope, between unbelievable destruction, a fiery chaos and an immense bloodbath (much desired by the satanic archon, Yahweh, piss be upon him)...and the alternative reality of many of those "Wokes" actually awakening into the Morning of the Magicians, where instead of destruction falling upon the deluded nations as a burial shroud; a dawning of a new age of peace and harmony will waft down like the feathers of doves.

All humans possess agency in this war of the worlds. Each individual posses power beyond imagination. Our ultimate focus should be upon upticks in general consciousness, where love for all one's brothers overcomes the primacy of fear.

Posted by: aristodemos | Jan 10 2023 18:02 utc | 61

Slava Russia!

Posted by: Pentimento | Jan 10 2023 18:03 utc | 62

The west is using the method of the Anaconda - it will remove constrain the supply of oxygen, the people will grow tired and uncomfortable and afraid, the country will grow weak and lose hope. Until finally they will be ready to accept he fate that the owners have planned for them.

No doubt they have assessed Putin - he is patient, cautious, would like to be seen as a "good" person, wants to be liked and respected. They are trying to turn these qualities against him. The west is run by a committee which has advantages and disadvantages and while Putin does not run Russia alone I suspect he is the focal point of leadership - that is of course a terrible responsibility. But also it allows him to be more flexible, even unpredictable. They think they have Putin figured-out, but he has shown that he can surprise them.

Merkel has warned Putin: Do not trust the west.

The west has tacitly admitted that there is no clear path to victory - if they win, they will be in great danger.
The only "safe" plan is removal of Putin.

Posted by: jared | Jan 10 2023 18:04 utc | 63

"...The euro rulers are full partners and making bank on nato. Many of these leaders and their followers are nazis themselves because that is what America demands of them." Tard@38

Dimitris Konstantakopoulos would agree with you:
"...Unfortunately, the youngest political leaders in Europe show the characteristics of political dwarves, with the ability to think no more than half a year ahead, or at most of the next election, while at the same time they prove to be extremely amenable to transatlantic calls. The foolishness of the rulers and the indifference/passivity of the populations, is leading Europe to the precipice, unless an uprising of the European peoples and societies, laying the foundations of a new democratic, independent and peaceful Europe, friendly to the environment and radiating to the world its example, is going to happen."

You have to bear in mind, however, that western europe, the UK included, has been effectively under US occupation. A lot of people will disagree. It is certainly true that the US found willing partners all over the continent, though only the British were so 'willing' that they bankrupted themselves and made one last round of plunder of the Empire (India's currency reserves?) before handing over everything to the US ruling class, without any more compulsion than frowns and angry coughs from Washington. Even a man of the world like Keynes was amazed at the treachery he found at Bretton Woods.
The shameful kow-towing that we see from the Scandinavians and Finns is taken as normal from London. Blair might have looked like an outlier but in toadying up to Uncle Sam he was doing just what Attlee had insisted on after 1945 and my namesake had cheerfully done.
The only European who dared to distance himself and his country from the US was de Gaulle and he didn't make it through 1968.

There is good news from Europe however. According to RT The German Parliament is considering a proposal to allow hungry people to search supermarket garbage for food. They probably got the idea from Ukraine.

Posted by: bevin | Jan 10 2023 18:06 utc | 64

Some of Patrushev's words:

— You once said that the leadership of Western countries does nothing to improve the situation not only in the world, but even in their own countries. Please explain what you are talking about.

Western politicians do not have the strength and opportunities to change life in their countries for the better, because they are no longer independent figures. Everyone has connections to big business, lobbyists, and foundations. They don't even hide these facts. There are very recent examples. As it turned out, dozens of MEPs were controlled by the structures of J. R. R. Tolkien. Soros, and the European Commission, at the behest of one of the world's largest American pharmaceutical companies, created a number of corruption schemes for the purchase of vaccines worth tens of billions of euros. It is obvious that the real power in the West is in the hands of resource-rich clans and multinational corporations.

— You don't mean the Rockefellers and Rothschilds, do you?"—

In fact, there are many more such corporations and clans. Thus, the total revenue of the 500 largest companies in the world, according to unofficial data, reached almost $ 38 trillion in 2021. The main share of multinational companies is accounted for by corporations with headquarters in the United States. Their revenues brought in about $ 16 trillion with a net profit of $ 1.8 trillion. The capital of a number of multinational companies exceeds the GDP of most of the world's economies, and the funds created by them for further enrichment claim to be a supranational mechanism for managing humanity. The same Soros Foundation has become almost the main world center for planning and implementing "color revolutions". [My Emphasis]

So, who/what does Russia negotiate with if the politicians have no real power? And is that the real reason why the West is incapable of agreement? Patrushev in my last emphasized passage is implying the WEF, which is due to meet again soon. The tie between Soros and CIA/MI6 is quite overt. So, again, who constitutes the actual enemy--is it really NATO or the craven Neoliberal and Neocon Capitalists that hide behind its skirts?

Today, Putin met with the Head of the Federal Antimonopoly Service Maxim Shaskolsky, an agency with no Western analog, although it's very clear that every nation needs such a regulatory agency with real powers. The Outlaw US Empire 130 years ago saw the need to establish such laws and regulatory bodies, but they were never used as designed and Fascist America is the result.

At the end of the 1990s a new protest item was created, the Brands & Bars Flag, which I thought would become an important protest tool that never lived up to its potential. I suggest it be modified to fit the current reality. Perhaps some artistic minded barflies will make some suggestions.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jan 10 2023 18:11 utc | 65

Jared 48

You are forgetting that Ukraine is run by nationalist fanatics, the same way that NYC was run by crime syndicates in the '70's. They don't have rational, thought out goals. During WW2, the Banderites in western Ukraine thought they could achieve their ends by collaborating with the German Nazis, in other words, they thought they could use the Germans. Fast forward to this century and the same Banderites think they can use the West to achieve their ends, which are not necessarily unified. A new Ukraine that includes a destroyed Russia after Ukraine's glorious victory, or the establishment of white supremacy throughout Europe for the more ambitious, or just a return to 1992 borders including Crimea, the point is the nationalists really haven't considered how realistic it is to achieve any of their goals, as fanatics are inclined to do. The Ukie nationalists always believe that they can use another state power to their ends, but they end up being the ones used. At this point the Ukies are hoping that the West will directly enter the fray and save them, but most of the West doesn't have the stomach to see thousands of their young men return in body bags.

As for Ukraine entering the EU, Russia was opposed because the EU proposal had a backdoor clause for NATO membership. EU membership was part of the Western effort to cleave Ukraine from Russia. Yanukovych rejected the proposal because he thought it a bad deal, and considering the terms and the recent experience of Greece, it actually was a bad deal. I imagine that Russia had some influence also.

Posted by: Mike R | Jan 10 2023 18:13 utc | 66

Ukraine is using its dams on the dnieper to lower the river levels. A move on Crimea is in the works. Russia seems aware and is watching the bridges in the south get blown up and building defence lines along highways. Building a river crossing is asking for a himar though, doesn't seem there's a lot of that though, drones being ramped up however. I assume new armor is being sent to assist this offensive.

Ukraine wants to move on Crimea big time. Maybe russian conscripts are being used for defence, wagner is handling offense? Certainly mariupol is being reinforced. There's been some closures on the Crimea bridge, presumably for equipment transfers. Russian naval activity is increasing in the sea of azov.

Something big is moving, some countries are anxious to finish russia off quickly, and Certainly russia would like a quicker resolution.

Posted by: Neofeudalfuture | Jan 10 2023 18:14 utc | 67

@Neofeudalfuture 34

Ukraine can't possibly "start losing" as that happened on August 24, 1991. Now they are past mere losing and in extremis.

Posted by: Hermit | Jan 10 2023 18:15 utc | 68

and Certainly russia would like a quicker resolution.
Posted by: Neofeudalfuture | Jan 10 2023 18:14 utc | 67

Really? Where do you get that idea from? You're projecting US mentalities onto Russia. The opposite is more like the truth.

Posted by: laguerre | Jan 10 2023 18:18 utc | 69


Thank you for your "Cri de Coeur" (crying out from the heart). Appears you understand much. May I regale you with words uttered by Benjamin Franklin at the crisis of the American Revolution: "If we don't all hang together, you may rest assured they shall hang us all separately."

Posted by: aristodemos | Jan 10 2023 18:19 utc | 70

LoL the only way I see Ukraine moving in Crimea is a Snake Island type of suicide operation. Where they drop some paratroopers on the island to plant a flag and taje some pics before being blown to smithereens.


Posted by: Comandante | Jan 10 2023 18:20 utc | 71

Posted by: Konrad | Jan 10 2023 16:45 utc | 26

Brilliant post Konrad.

Posted by: jpc | Jan 10 2023 18:23 utc | 72

@65 Cont'd--

More of Patrushev's words that follow those above:

— Are you saying that even the US authorities are not pursuing an independent policy?

In fact, the American state is just a shell for a conglomerate of huge corporations that rule the country and try to rule the world. For TNCs, even US presidents are just extras who can shut their mouths like Trump. All four murders of American leaders are linked to a corporate trail. It is no coincidence that an increasing number of Americans say that Republicans and Democrats are just two actors in one play that has nothing to do with democracy.

The US government, which has grown together with big business, serves the interests of multinational corporations, including the military-industrial complex. The assertive foreign policy of the White House, the unbridled aggressiveness of NATO, the emergence of the AUKUS military bloc and others are also a consequence of corporate influence. The draft US budget for 2023 is the best proof of Washington's plans to unleash new wars to the detriment of the well-being of its own citizens. Of the total amount of planned federal government spending of $ 1.7 trillion on defense, half will be allocated-more than $ 850 billion. Only for the continuation of hostilities in Ukraine and prolonging the conflict, it is planned to allocate 45 billion rubles [SIC]. [My Emphasis]

These would be considered the words of a far leftist in the West, but Patrushev is a traditional Russian Conservative who is merely speaking truths. Would Patrick Buchanan, Ron Paul or some other traditional Western Conservative mimic him? And if they did, would their words get published and then read and discussed?

Posted by: karlof1 | Jan 10 2023 18:26 utc | 73

Mosed - 20
I'm more and more coming to the tragic conclusion that, since there will be no popular revolt, the only thing that might save German economy is actually a coup by top Bundeswehr officers, paid and supported by some of the not totally crazy top German industralists. That's not something I'm happy to say.

Karlof1 - 65
The enemy has always been Kapital. And since the US is basically the military arm of the Capital, it has to be defeated. The country can't be reformed, it has to be brought down in some way, and go at the very least through what USSR and Russia went through in the late 1980s/90s. And the entire US sphere of influence has to dissipate and its vassals must be purged from any US influence, and all local traitorous Quisling leaders will have to be hanged (for Germany, this means at the very least Scholz, Baerbock and a handful of other current officials). Ideally, European national media and education systems will be fully purged as well.

Posted by: Clueless Joe | Jan 10 2023 18:30 utc | 74

I'm going to repost my comment from the end of the previous Ukraine thread because the CSIS link is directly applicable to NATO v. Russia, especially with Stoltenberg's recent statement that NATO stocks are being "depleted".

Interesting piece from CSIS covering public info quantities of US stocks sent to Ukraine, production rates, lead times and total inventory rebuild timeframes. The author was artillery and worked DoD procurement. One question not answered is whether the described production surges are realistic.

Posted by: Lex | Jan 10 2023 18:31 utc | 75

"De facto member of NATO"

While the defense minister of Ukraine is spot in with his analysis, he raises serious questions about what NATO really is.

The original role of NATO - and probably the only one that justifies member states delegating so much power to the organization - is the role of a defence alliance that provides support only in case a member state is attacked by another country (!) on its own territory.

Meaning that 9/11 was not a valid reason for the US to call for article 5-assistance. And Russia's conflict for Ukraine most definitely is no basis whatsoever for a defense alliance (!) to get involved.

If it was - # preemptive defense against a possible or likely future attack - if that was a legitimate reason for NATO getting involved: then Russia would have the same right to preemptively defend itself against a possible future strike by NATO forces.

Posted by: Marvin | Jan 10 2023 18:36 utc | 76

Posted by: Paul Greenwood | Jan 10 2023 16:30 utc | 19

A lesser power would spend orders of magnitude less. If someone can afford toilet from solid 24 kt gold without distributing payments with installment, this is the great person in his village even if the toilet is clogging.

Posted by: Piotr Berman | Jan 10 2023 18:46 utc | 77

The enemy has always been Kapital.

Posted by: Clueless Joe | Jan 10 2023 18:30 utc | 74

Always??? What tools did the elites use to control or enslave the masses before the existence of Kapital. The enemy has always been the human psychological desire to dominate and control. Kapital is just another tool.

Posted by: Opport Knocks | Jan 10 2023 18:51 utc | 78

konrad West shows a desire to write history in the present before the history of the present overtakes it again.

yes, this is what we're seeing. there's a mass delusion. i truly think we're seeing the beginning of the end of the US empire.

Posted by: annie | Jan 10 2023 18:54 utc | 79

Upcoming training of Ukrainians on Patriot missile defense....

The officials identified that it will take place at Fort Sill in Oklahoma, home to the Army's field artillery school, and the training is expected to take "several months".

Given the complexity of the Patriot batteries, which requires about 100 personnel to operate everything from its computers to radar controls to its engagement control station, the timeline commonly offered for a crew to be properly trained is at least six months to a year.

US officials are not giving a precise timeline at this point. Ukraine has been desperate to secure more advanced anti-air systems to protect against the devastating waves of Russian aerial assaults on its energy grid.

A day late and several billion dollars short.

Posted by: Opport Knocks | Jan 10 2023 19:01 utc | 80

Real Beast @39

You are smoking something good or you are a credulous fool. Last big exploration attempt in Alaska led to a billion dollar drilling rig being scuttled. If there were anything there worth the candle nothing would stop them. Fracking has been a nonstop financial hemorrhage and it has never stopped them.

All the ideologs here are convinced climate change is a hoax. Fine. Barrow set a record December high of 40F on December 4. For those who use the normal system that was 4.5C. Not only the highest December temp ever, higher than it had ever been between October 30 and March 22. Everything that moves to the oil fields moves on ice roads. Does not work when the road melts in dead of winter. Melting roads has been a problem now for two decades and it is getting worse.

Posted by: oldhippie | Jan 10 2023 19:01 utc | 81

Clueless Joe @74--

Thanks for your reply. IMO, Patrushev is rather clear that uncontrolled MNCs are the enemy of humanity. Russia's MNC situation is different as their out-of-control owners--the Oligarchs--were swiftly reined in by Putin et al before they could gain control of Russia's government, although they came rather close.

What I see developing is the slow erosion of Western MNC control of non-Western nations as those governments learn they must be made to obey the interests of the nations in which they reside or leave. You'll note that Patrushev implied some of that at the end of the interview. It will be very interesting to see how MNCs react to the bifurcation of the international trading regime into Dollar and Non-Dollar Blocs. And we will see how nations and trading associations like ASEAN deal with constraining MNC behavior. In case you missed the announcement, BRI and EAEU have officially merged, which is very positive for MNC containment. IMO, it's entirely possible the wording of corporate charters will be altered to have their primary goal being the service to humanity instead of the seeking of profits exclusively for their shareholders. Such a change IMO would be revolutionary as well as absolutely required for humanity's future development.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jan 10 2023 19:08 utc | 82

Posted by: jared | Jan 10 2023 18:04 utc | 63

1. "Merkel has warned Putin: Do not trust the west." It's hard to figure out whether Merkel was bragging about her past deceit or not so subtly telling Putin, and all others, that NATO/EU/USA are snakes in the grass.

2. Abrahams tanks have a heavy pounds per square inch footprint and need to be on a compactable surface. And worst of all they need 2 fuel tanker trucks following in close support. Perhaps the new version of the Abrahams will have both solar panels and windmills to dispense with the kerosene sucking turbine engine.

3. Canada finally agreed to buy the Garage Mechanic's F35 plane, once they received assurance that the CO2 belching engine would also be replaced with solar panels and windmills.

Posted by: kupkee | Jan 10 2023 19:09 utc | 83

oldhippie @81--

All the ideologs here are convinced climate change is a hoax.

That's incorrect unless I'm not regarded as an ideologue. After many irrefutable explanations, I just ceased wasting my time and aimed at finding areas of common agreement.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jan 10 2023 19:13 utc | 84

Russia has played a terrible ground game during the SMO. 11 months later the front line is still a mile from Donetsk.

Russia needs to get serious.

Posted by: Rhinoskerous | Jan 10 2023 19:14 utc | 85

karlof1 @ 84

I would say you are unusually flexible for a Marxist. You are a thinker, not an ideolog.

I've been here 71 years and know that the beautiful green planet I was born on is gone. Don't need anyone's gloss on the subject to see what has happened.

Posted by: oldhippie | Jan 10 2023 19:19 utc | 86

Russia's offensive is underway
by by Valentin Vasilescu
With interesting Maps....

On Sunday morning, southeast of Soledar, Wagner's fighters engaged the Ukrainian army in the town. Wagner's move turned out to be a diversionary maneuver, during which several units of Russian parachute scouts from Yakovlivka, mounted on armored vehicles, managed to infiltrate the northern outskirts of Soledar, establishing a head of the bridge. Instead of advancing to link up with Wagner, the paratroopers' mission was to neutralize the minefield on the east side of Soledar using UR-77 systems. Russian tanks and armored personnel carriers immediately entered the corridors laid out in the minefield. The Russian army operation surprised the enemy and was well planned and executed. As night fell, the 61st Assault Brigade began its withdrawal from Soledar to avoid encirclement
On Monday, south of Soledar, PMC Wagner stormed the town of Krasnaya Gora, which it occupied....
Zaluzhnyi has to the west of Krasnaya Gora, along the railway line, the 4th tank brigade (see map 4). The defense apparatus of the Krasnaya Gora region also included the Ukrainian 24th Mechanized Brigade, which succumbed to Wagmer and was withdrawn behind the 4th Tank Brigade....
After liquidating the Ukrainian outposts of Soledar and Krasnaya Gora at high speed, the Russian army found itself in front of the real Ukrainian defense position. It is difficult to predict how the situation will develop on this frontline segment. But we must bear in mind that the Russians are determined to quickly finish off the Ukrainians, the temperatures are between -6 and -13 degrees Celsius and the ground is frozen. This allows maneuvering over large spaces with armored vehicles and it gives the Russians an advantage.

Posted by: La Bastille | Jan 10 2023 19:22 utc | 87

Bernd @12:
Have a look at the latest interview of Garland Nixon with Scott Ritter and their discussion towards the end of the piece. Then you will see the 3rd world America in California and it is shocking.
The USA is already 3rd world.

Posted by: digital dinosaur | Jan 10 2023 19:24 utc | 88

…..The USA can not back down against the Russians. To do so would be a certain loss of the United States Dollar (USD) losing its world reserve currency status. So the USA and the West it controls will continue to escalate both with sanctions and the war in Ukraine…..

From post #14. Profound insight

Posted by: Exile | Jan 10 2023 19:25 utc | 89

@oldhippie | Jan 10 2023 19:19 utc | 86

I've been here 71 years and know that the beautiful green planet I was born on is gone.

Maybe you are an ideologue? The climate varies in periods of 60+ years and most people just experience one up or down turn of the sine curve.

Posted by: Norwegian | Jan 10 2023 19:28 utc | 90

Well, you know what they say...
Old people love Matlock...

Posted by: Josh | Jan 10 2023 19:29 utc | 91

Once it becomes clear that this is NATO vs. Russia, what would prevent Russia from going after NATO targets of opportunity outside of Ukraine?

Posted by: ian | Jan 10 2023 19:36 utc | 92

Can the US really be considered a Great Power, if they struggled for 12+ years in Afghanistan vs goat herders and couldn't claim any sort of lasting victory?

Fixed it for you.

Posted by: Fred | Jan 10 2023 19:37 utc | 93

We are carrying out NATO’s mission today. They aren’t shedding their blood. We’re shedding ours. That’s why they’re required to supply us with weapons,” Reznikov said ...

NATO doesn't owe them anything.

If they don't want want the war, they should not fight it.

They should let NATO troops fight with NATO weapons on NATO territory.

If they let NATO troops fight with NATO weapons on Ukrainian territory, they should charge them money.

But when they fight with Ukrainian troops and soviet weapons on Ukrainian territory and claim they are fighting NATOs war, then they are either not particularly bright, or they are lying.

Posted by: Vikichka | Jan 10 2023 19:39 utc | 94

Clueless Joe @ 74

The enemy has always been Kapital.

Opport Knocks @ 78
Always??? What tools did the elites use to control or enslave the masses before the existence of Kapital. The enemy has always been the human psychological desire to dominate and control. Kapital is just another tool.

Yes, and Capitalism is a specific historical term that shouldn't be thrown around to describe everything bad with humanity. In Europe for a thousand years the tools of control were the legion and the gladius, simple and direct. The centuries after that with the legions gone the elites had to get sophisticated and it was Bible indoctrination and obscurantism, the Dark Ages where dark because they elites wanted the lights out.

Capitalism necessitated a managerial and technological class and a worker consumerist class that could read and write which after a fair amount of struggle ushered in modern democracy and a semblance of power sharing with the bosses, the new tools were push media: newspapers, magazines, radio and TV.

Now we have the internet creating problems, but they are working on it, they got goofy seemingly innocuous perpetual adolescent oligarchs posing as forward thinking super-geniuses to buy up every square millimeter of it and turn it into a panopticon. As they drain your pockets they keep you busy and distracted thinking you are in control and pulling but you are still being pushed - just like from the point of a gladius.

Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Jan 10 2023 19:45 utc | 95

War crimes in Mariupol: These 3000 civilian victims of the Atlantic-Ukrainian army, who deserve justice

The International Social Tribunal for Ukraine has compiled information regarding the crimes committed in Mariupol and the publications are available here in Russian on his website...
The case was instituted under Part 1 of Art. 356 of the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation ( ill-treatment of prisoners of war or civilians, deportation of civilians, looting of national property in the occupied territory, use in armed conflict of means and methods prohibited by an international treaty of the Russian Federation )......

During the investigation, new information was obtained about the participation of foreign mercenaries in the units of the Ukrainian army. Thus, from the testimony of one of the prisoners, it appears that in the unit of the 36th Marine Corps Autonomous Brigade, there were citizens of Great Britain. They have been serving in the Armed Forces of Ukraine since 2020, actively participating in preparations for conducting combat operations in urban areas. Moreover, Ukrainian military personnel were trained by German instructors to storm buildings and fire foreign-made weapons. ........

Posted by: La Bastille | Jan 10 2023 19:46 utc | 96


The recent developments in the Ukrainian-Russian war can only support the conclusion that Joe Biden, and the neocons running his administration, Secretary Blinken and Victoria Nuland, are monsters. The battles taking place in cities of Soledar and Bakhmut, which are coming to their inevitable conclusion of defeat for the Ukrainian Armed Forces (UAF), have been described as “meat grinders” where Ukrainian soldiers are being killed by the thousands. While the western mainstream media gave intense coverage to a missile strike that killed 89 Russian soldiers, the far greater casualties suffered by the UAF are ignored. However, alternate western media, internet blogs, YouTube and telegram channels, all of whom have proved reliable over the last year, are reporting that over 600 UAF soldiers were killed in one strike, and over 100 young UAF officer recruits were killed in another, in just the past 24 hours. This is in addition to the daily UAF KIA count of 200 to 500 a day. All these lives of brave young men snuffed out and no end to the slaughter is in sight. It goes without saying that this slaughter could not happen without the material and financial support of the Biden Administration, which has made the continuation of the war a major priority.

What is the purpose for so much death? What goal is Biden and the neocons in the State Department? Knowing that Ukraine cannot defeat Russia Biden has stated that the goal is to weaken Russia and give the Ukrainians a better position at the negotiating table. This is monstrous and grotesque. So far 150,000 Ukrainian men, the sons, husbands, fathers and brothers of the people of Ukraine have been sent to their death to give Ukraine a better position at the negotiating table! This is a crime, and if it’s not it should be. These men who being sent to their deaths because of the Biden Administration’s incomprehensible polices are not lesser human beings than any others. They are no lesser people then say, Biden’s son Hunter. Ukrainian Men of Hunter Biden’s age are being pressed into service, given a cursory training, and sent into the meat grinder of Soledar and Bakhmut. But Biden must consider Hunter to be a superior human, who can smoke meth, screw whores, and live in a Malibu California mansion paid for by one of Biden’s wealthy donors, while he blithely helps to send tens of thousands of other peoples sons to their deaths. This is disgusting. I Impeachable offense, war crime, depravity, there are many words to describe what the monster Joe Biden, and his State Department neocons Blinken and Nuland are doing, but we all know they will not be held accountable for their actions, at least not in this life, but they should be. The least we can do is call them out for the monstrous and indefensible hypocritical actions. Then they will be judged, tried and convicted as monsters by history. Also, for those that hold the widely held belief that all people are judged by the Creator in the end, we can rest assured that the verdict Biden, Blinken and Nuland’s will receive in the world to come will not be the reward they expect.

Posted by: Thoughtcriminal | Jan 10 2023 19:46 utc | 97

bevin | Jan 10 2023 18:06 utc | 64

Thank you for your outline of postwar Europe under US-occupation, including the special role played by UK. Another special player is Germany because we had to surrender unconditionally in 1945 and lost much of our sovereignty as a result, with the US taking advantage. De Gaulle did the right thing. Yet today all European countries, including France, except Hungary and Serbia, appear to be under tight US control - as can be seen by their participation in the Ukraine hysteria, and their unwillingness to talk about the North-Stream sabotage. I wonder how this could have happened, for instance, to France, after a much more promising start.

Posted by: grunzt | Jan 10 2023 19:55 utc | 98

It is rather clear that at the moment the NATO is getting beaten by a private Russian company.

How embarrassing is that?

For me, the crucial thing now is how one proceeds combating and winning on that UKR/NATO/EU/US/UK construct and without burning the planet many times over.

So, to escalate it all just might be a good way of thinking, as that will (probably) force West to stop on doubling down when faced with grim reality.

The grim reality for the West would be destruction of arms delivery points outside of Ukraine and then some more. In Poland, Przemysl and Medyka railway knots, Rzeszow airport and Topraisar NATO base in Romania have painted bull eyes on them for some time.

Just to make a point to NATO that, if one f..ks around, one finds out.

Of course, Rammstein, and some other lucrative NATO targets come to mind, but let us leave those assumptions and decisions to those people who are more competent in RF politics and RF military.
I am sure that some of them might be thinking even harsher and more painful responses.

The issue here is that while indeed NATO is warring on Russia, Russia can't believe how far and low NATO can go into provoking it.

A picture comes to a mind;
Asterix and Obelix standing on top of a smoking pile of ruins, poking their helmets, rolling their eyes around and whispering: “...tzk-tzk-tzk, crazy Romans.”

Posted by: whirlX | Jan 10 2023 19:55 utc | 99


Thanks for linking the Patrushev interview. There is a lot of depth in the Russian leadership. Leaders not politicians. Some years ago - 2018? when Medvedev was replaced as PM and there was a general reshuffle and Putin created this security council from those who performed well over the years rebuilding the Russian federation, it is like a circle of elders whose only goal or job description is to guide the Russian Federation through a period of foreseen world turbulence.

On Ukraine, what we are seeing now is more weapons promises than weapon deliveries. Promises with delayed deliveries. I'm not sure that is hoarding for a summer offensive against Russia, or like US had to pull out of Afghanistan to be able to attack Russia through Ukraine, it now wants to pull out of Ukraine to attack China through Taiwan.

Musk is a bit of a wild card. US military has I think about one third share in Starlink which is used by Nato and their proxies in Ukraine yet he went on the kill list for half hour or so when he tweeted a peace proposal. US is somewhat divided as to attacking Russia or attacking China. Musk has major business interests in China. I guess there are many complexities within Patrushev's overview.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Jan 10 2023 19:58 utc | 100

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