Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
January 30, 2023
Size Matters – On A U.S. Ground Intervention In Ukraine

A European financial research company has sent me one of their quarterly research letters. It is a 'contrarian review of political and military ramifications' of the war in Ukraine. It analyzes 'winners and losers' of the war.

It is contrarian only in the sense that it counters the false views of 'western' mainstream media with reality. The losers of the war are all on the 'western' side with the only two winners being the owners of the U.S. defense industry and Russia.

I was sent the courtesy copy because, as the company writes, the discussions at Moon of Alabama were "immensely helpful" in forming their view.

Note to the authors: You are welcome.

I will not quote from the paper as it seems to be a somewhat confidential business product. But I will steal two graphics from it that will help to understand the size of the war in Ukraine and how it will NOT end.

There have been theories that Poland or some U.S. led coalition force would intervene with their troops on the ground in Ukraine to 'kick the Russians out'.

The two graphics though dispel any hope for such an operation.

The following is an operational map of Desert Storm. The U.S. led operation in spring 1991 to kick Iraq out of Kuwait.



bigger

It took the U.S. some nine month to assemble a forces of some 700,000 U.S. and 250,000 allied troops with all their equipment. Iraq had an estimated 650,000 troops in the theater. The U.S. first created total air superiority by destroying Iraq's fighter aircraft and air defense forces. With that done it took only 100 hours of ground operation to destroy a third of the Iraqi forces. The rest of the Iraqi army retreated under fire towards Baghdad.

There are some 550,000 Russian troops in and around Ukraine. A hypothetical operation to 'kick Russia out' would thereby have about the same size as Desert Storm. But the geographic dimensions differ drastically.

The following is an operational map of Desert Storm from above overlaid in scale on the map of Ukraine.


bigger

The map was turned to the left by 90 degree. North is to the left, east at the top and Crimea in the south to the right.

Russia occupies some 87,000 square kilometer of Ukraine. The Desert Storm theater around Kuwait was five times smaller.

A hypothetical U.S. coalition of the size of Desert Storm could probably cross the Dnieper and cut of Crimea. But it could do little more than that. The Donetz and Luhansk oblasts and Crimea itself would still be in Russian hands.

But there are many reasons why no such operation will ever be planned and executed.

  • The U.S. no longer has a force of the size it committed to Desert Storm. Nor do its allies.
  • The U.S. was able to create air superiority in Iraq because it could fly from nearby Saudi airfields and from aircraft carriers in the Persian Gulf. Air superiority in eastern Ukraine could only be achieved with the destruction of long range air-defenses within Russia. The next safe air fields the U.S. could use are in Poland and Romania. No U.S. aircraft carrier will dare to enter the Black Sea. U.S. fighter planes to not have the necessary reach for combat missions in eastern Ukraine. 
  • The Ukrainian rail system is by now a mess. It is incapable of moving a large force from the west into east Ukraine.
  • Any attempt to move a large force through Ukraine would be subject to deep battle interdiction by Russian and Belorussian forces.
  • Iraqi equipment was badly maintained and Iraqi forces were barely trained. Russia has a well trained high tech army.

I could go on but you can certainly see the point.

No U.S. ground troops will move into Ukraine. It is ludicrous to think otherwise.

Comments

Perhaps some good will yet come out of the war:
https://bruceohara.substack.com/p/a-silver-lining-perhaps

Posted by: newsnongrta | Jan 30 2023 19:10 utc | 101

Most interesting. A sad case idiocracy politicians sacking the military cynics. Then hired a replacement bunch of retards to spew the only diet the will ever understand. It is called secondhand lies.
By now most people would understand. The Russian Federation operates radar in the HF(OTH=early warning for inbound ICBMs/pesky SR71As/other commercial plane tracking*) .VHF, and UHF bands. Complete with the standard military 3D microwave bands. No Cessna will ever be allowed to land in red square. * IDF hides attacking aircraft in the radar shadow of commercial jets. Then fire off a barrage of stand off weaponry. Thus one can track and trace from military airfield to link up)
Not even the legendary fake stealthy F-117 or F-111 flying in TF mode could penetrate that air defense zone. The RF version of an AWAC plane. The upgraded BE-50 with look down and smart FPGA software. Clearly can track everything country 404 has flown to the eastern front. Turning them all into widow-makers, quite literally!
The trashy cold war obsolete USSA made F-16 first gen disposable PR planes. Have zero ability for use on rough country strips or roads. It is either a paved runway or replace the jet engine every five to ten hours. Only if it can survive a diet of stones destroying the turbine.
As for the top of the line NATO main battle tanks. In hot dry arid desert conditions. Other than the wheeled variants. The tracks and every other piece of kit on the MBTs. Had an extremely long list mechanical and electrical failures. Track pins failed often. To replace and or repair just one Euro/yankee tank track.Is an eight hour repair job.
The Turkish Army has amply demonstrated in the Kurdistan semi autonomous region. The Leon 2 is extremely vulnerable to Soviet anti-tank infantry weapons designed in the late 1950s. As for the latest fire and forget helicopter A-T missiles used in country 404. The committee designed Leon 2 is just a mobile can of spam. Fully equipped with a flying turret T-64 style!
In Iraq, the vaunted allegedly invincible M1. Was easily destroyed in combat by untrained rebels. Thus making the M1 a mobile iron coffin. An IED based on the 152mm HE/frag shell. Could and did shred any passing M1 quite literally. In short whilst very few were destroyed in the combat phase. What the Yankee military brass hid was the sheer number destroyed in the rebellion phase of the Iraq war of occupation. Along with the number of M1s totally destroyed or abandoned no fuel on board units operated by the Yankee directly controlled Iraqi puppet government!
Too little, too late she cried!
In the interim the rats of Kiev are all scurrying away. Complete with the stolen embezzled funds.

Posted by: Bad Deal Motors On | Jan 30 2023 19:10 utc | 102

The intention never was for the US to go to war against Russia. It was to drive a wedge between Europe and Russia (Cold War 2.0), break the cheap and abundant supply of Russian energy to Europe and crush Europe economically (high energy costs with the resultant spillover effect on the manufacturing sector and related) whip the vassals back in to line.
What the original stated purpose of NATO? Keep Germany (Europe) down, the Russians out and the US in.
All round, they’ve been very successful so far.

Posted by: Down South | Jan 30 2023 19:13 utc | 103

@ Posted by: Passerby | Jan 30 2023 18:55 utc | 88
I suspect Germany is not so different from US – law is no impediment when it matters.
Same goes double for treaties.
And an order of magnitude more so for speeches.

Posted by: jared | Jan 30 2023 19:14 utc | 104

A predominantly Polish ground force may intervene at some point, not to kick the Russians out, but to create a ‘safe’ haven (‘humanitarian corridor’) from which the West could essentially support the Ukrainian war effort.
Posted by: Boo | Jan 30 2023 17:25 utc | 35
——————
Doing so would void Poland’s recourse to Article 5 in the event the Russians decide to simply wipe them out.

Posted by: Cato the Uncensored | Jan 30 2023 19:15 utc | 105

“No U.S. ground troops will move into Ukraine. It is ludicrous to think otherwise.”
100% Correct. It would be too costly in all aspects, not make it’s main goal of breaking up the Russian Federation any more reachable while on the contrary, and would at the same time solidify China’s rise to its own detriment. I do expect some more enticements/pressure on it’s regional vassals (especially Germany) to get actively involved, some increased NATO troop presence disguised as international legion mercenaries as well as active deployment of regional vassals like Britain, the 3 chihuahua’s and surely Poland which will try to grab land as much as possible of a tattered Ukraine.

Posted by: xor | Jan 30 2023 19:18 utc | 106

@ Posted by: Blissex | Jan 30 2023 18:56 utc | 89
All very rational of course, except:
To accomplish regime change by the plans they have afoot, they must –
1) Damage Russia financially, either acutely or chronically and/or
2) Drag Russia into an Afghanistan-like conflict.
A possibility that the great minds did not consider, I think.
I believe that the smell of panic is in that those things don’t appear like they are nor are going to happen – quite the reverse seems possible.
We shall see.

Posted by: jared | Jan 30 2023 19:20 utc | 107

@25–“ All that’s missing is MIC sponsorships before the news broadcast…”
Pfizer has those time slots locked in, at least for now

Posted by: LordBydon | Jan 30 2023 19:21 utc | 108

Argentina’s Malvinas…
Posted by: migueljose | Jan 30 2023 18:49 utc | 84

Good one, the Falkland Islands never belonged to Argentina.
Logical consistency suggests if we support self-determination for Crimea, Donbass, etc., we should also support it for the Falklands. In the last referendum, 3 people voted against remaining a British protectorate.

Posted by: Opport Knocks | Jan 30 2023 19:21 utc | 109

Bruce O’Hara –
Thanks for that link to your Substack blog. I agree with your thinking and the polling you cite in Taiwan. While our captured corporate-military-surveillance media can lie endlessly to the people of the “west”, the rest of the world isn’t subject to the same ‘information totalitarianism’ and can plainly see what happens when you get into bed with the USA on matters like this.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Jan 30 2023 19:21 utc | 110

One of the many events listed is the interview by Izvestia of Deputy Minister of Foreign Affairs Sergey Vershinin where we get to read this important information:

Question: The UN Secretary-General said he was ready to assist in establishing a dialogue on the Ukrainian settlement, “if there is a request from both sides.” What is the attitude to this in Russia?
A: Since the beginning of the Ukrainian crisis in 2014, the UN Secretariat has taken an ambiguous position. We have not heard from his representatives direct criticism of Kiev, even when it was waging a real war against its citizens in the eastern regions. Nor have we heard calls for a direct dialogue with Donbass, as required by UN Security Council Resolution 2202, which approved the Package of Measures for the Implementation of the Minsk Agreements.
At the same time, from the first days of the special military operation, direct and largely far-fetched claims against Russia were made. In response to our reasonable questions about the reasons for such blatant “double standards,” it was explained to us that the Secretariat’s actions are forced to be guided by the decisions of the UN General Assembly, which are only advisory in nature for member states. First of all, we are talking about the UN General Assembly Resolution 68/262 of March 27, 2014 and the documents of the anti-Russian 11th Emergency Special Session of the General Assembly.
And one more important circumstance. None of these initiatives was approved by consensus – all of them were adopted through a vote. I have already spoken about how the results of the vote were achieved. In other words, in its statements, the Secretariat relies on documents that, as obviously, do not enjoy the unconditional and unanimous support of the UN member states due to their blatant politicization.
The question arises: what will guide the Secretary General if he receives an appeal for assistance in the settlement. Frankly, it is difficult to expect that in such a case the Secretariat will arm itself with Article 100 of the UN Charter, which requires absolute impartiality from international officials. The current situation, unfortunately, shows that, under the guise of General Assembly resolutions, the Secretariat voluntarily rejects for itself the possibility of any neutral mediation.
Question: Does what you have said mean that it is impossible to involve the UN in resolving the situation around Ukraine?
A: Unfortunately, the credibility of the Organisation’s Secretariat has been largely undermined by years of inaction by international officials, against which Poroshenko and then Mr Zelensky sabotaged the implementation of Kiev’s obligations under the Package of Measures approved by UN Security Council Resolution 2202.
The only way out is to restore sanity in the UN Secretariat and stop trying to “hide” behind politicized non-consensual decisions of member states. Judge for yourself. Over the years, the UN General Assembly has adopted a huge number of resolutions on complex political issues without finding consensus between the countries concerned. Nevertheless, the Secretariat of the Organization does not always rely on them in its statements and, moreover, does not do so proactively to criticize one side or another. If there is a political will of the UN leadership to restore trust, and, consequently, mediation capacity, the UN should strictly comply with Articles 97 and 100 of the Charter of the Organization in their actions. [My Emphasis]

Very damning indictment of Guterres. The Outlaw US Empire has corrupted the UN for decades, indeed since it began breaking the UN Charter in 1945 for which it’s never been denounced. Even the grain and fertilizer deal brokered through the UNSG has yet to be fulfilled because the SG’s office is corrupt and impoverished people starve.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jan 30 2023 19:21 utc | 111

karlof1@163
Broad-scale, en masse offensive: I like it. With the shape the Ukie army is currently in, there will be no possible viable defense.

Posted by: aristodemos | Jan 30 2023 19:24 utc | 112

To think that Russia will just sit and watch as US/NATO is building up its troops I think is not realistic. That worked with Desert Storm but it won’t work here. These are the days of Napoleon.
———————————————-
Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Jan 30 2023 18:40 utc | 81
«every officer from Colonel on up in Belarus is being offered villas on Costa del Sol and stuffed Swiss bank accounts.»
I suspect anyone taking that offer will not enjoy it long. The Iraqis that took the deal knew Saddam was going down and the risk was worth taking. But then who knows, perhaps Iraqis found a way to pay these people back with a lead bullet.

Posted by: Tom_12 | Jan 30 2023 19:25 utc | 113

The only encounter with Russia forces that had been backed by half-decent research was Barbarossa. We know it stalled and fell apart famously, but arguably that was as much a political/ideological failure than a military one. If the objective had been the ‘demilitarization’ of everything west of the Volga then all sorts of political expedients could have come into play.
Even for a Red Army still reeling from purges and neglect (“We only have to kick in the door and the whole rotten structure will come crashing down”) the Wehrmacht assembled 3.8 million men across 153 divisions. The equipment alone was immense. They almost pulled it off. But they forgot the golden rule: do not poke the bear. “But the bear was a scrawny old wretched thing lying on the ground!” Mmm. Don’t poke it.
That’s the last time that kind of stunt could have been tried with any prospect of success. The historical moment of mass mobilisation, big manoeuvre, coalition-army wars was the 20th century. Except for Russia. Russia always bucks the trend. Don’t poke the bear.

Posted by: Patroklos | Jan 30 2023 19:27 utc | 114

A prolonged insurgency, feeding it from EU territory, human meat from the smaller “partner” states as Poland to the Balkan, and equipment [US, Germany, Italy, UK and others] justifies grafting thus was appetizing enough in all they do [West], is very much in the interest of the International Jewry, the Finance Cabal and their whore-politicians and media of second tier “White Europeans”. No finance capitalism without military bluff up till today. The long/short on Ukraine is very much “pile ou face”, “can-do [or not]” as to how the “war” stretches into the years to come.
I predicted a long prolonged low-intensity conflict(s) as much as a year ago over the coming half century, or as short “war games” as a game-changer might appear in military/real-science domains. It is obvious that asymmetrics will play as much, and i do have my doubts on the alignments of Turkye and Iran, China to name some in that sense.
The mapping and suggestion of square mileage is a great step into overview, away from narrow bandwidth discussions, as to the geo-political checks and balances of power. But still …too narrow a base to draw on.
The owner/editor of this zine is Jewish, my apologies to the few, that by brutal faith were set into this world with Ashkenazim taint. Your zine is closer to anything in the public domain on the subject of Ukraine.

Posted by: PetrOldSack | Jan 30 2023 19:28 utc | 115

87
WRT: The Australian soldier interview.
Billions spent and corrupted away. Extreme equipment disparity.
More and better equipment is badly needed. (after billions $ down the shitter already)
When a Ukraine soldier is wounded, he will likely die.
(Sad and brutal. No proper evac, no proper medical care)
Wagner guys are mean and nasty.

Posted by: Chaka Khagan | Jan 30 2023 19:29 utc | 116

No, but every officer from Colonel on up in Belarus is being offered villas on Costa del Sol and stuffed Swiss bank accounts. That is a very real risk for Russia.
Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Jan 30 2023 18:40 utc | 81

Costa del Sol….
once upon a time Heaven was supposed to be found in New-York….then Miami.


I’m going where the sun keeps shinin’
Through the pourin’ rain
Going where the weather suits my clothes
Bankin’ off of the northeast winds
Sailin’ on a summer breeze
And skippin’Skripal’ed over the ocean like a stone

Posted by: Nuremberg | Jan 30 2023 19:32 utc | 117

LLYFH@74
Thanks for the links + commentary. Oh, me, oh my: Could be that the old meme of “dumb Polaks” may be going by the wayside. If that many soldiers are dropping out of the Polish army; it would seem that there has been a significant uptick in national intelligence…as least when it comes to self-protection from getting involved in a suicidal strut.

Posted by: aristodemos | Jan 30 2023 19:32 utc | 118

On Gonzola Lira’s latest round table episode 45 with Weeb nation, Dima from military summary and Brian Beletic.
Brian talked a lot of sense and used the example of how Russia dealt with the Syria situation.
1 hour 48 mins into the roundtable and the Question will NATO invade Ukraine and Brian said a lot of Russians will be devastated if Russia used the Syria situation as the blueprint. As Russia decided to play the long political game.

Posted by: Derek Henry | Jan 30 2023 19:35 utc | 119

I have to admit that there’s a little part of me that would like to see the Seppoes running westwards, casting away their arms in the face of the enemy. ;O)

Posted by: Squeeth | Jan 30 2023 19:37 utc | 120

Posted by: charles shamey | Jan 30 2023 16:35 utc | 3:

….The American public is solid behind this war. They continue to be the easiest group to bamboozle. They have been bamboozled into one war after the other since Korea.

Hear, hear! You’re ABSOLUTELY right. The American public is solidly behind this war, any other way of looking at it is being wishy washy. American public, since the Korean War, wants the USA military to bully the world, much as the immigrant White men wanted to wipe out the Injuns in the 16/17/18 centuries. That’s why every politician running for office runs as a hawk. That’s why, with China emerging as America’s true rival, the sure way to win office is to be a China-hawk.
The only way this may change is for America to wear a loooooong bleeding nose for a loooooooong time at the hands of a worthy adversary. The ‘may‘ is the possibility of the American public doing some trueful reflection on life and humanity then. This may come about in the upcoming generation.

Posted by: Oriental Voice | Jan 30 2023 19:38 utc | 121

@ AntiSpin | Jan 30 2023 18:37 utc | 78
i agree.. it is more then the usa defense industry that profits off this… it is also the banking complex and as i have said many times, this is about money more then anything else… who gets to control it financially? that is what this is about… the west would like to rape and pillage russia, but it is a hard nut for them to crack and it appears they are destroying themselves in the process… meanwhile, ukraine is the sacrificial lamb led to the slaughter, although no one in the west will openly say this..

Posted by: james | Jan 30 2023 19:39 utc | 122

Posted by: Neofeudalfuture | Jan 30 2023 18:29 utc | 71
«It’s russias nukes, space program and resources in that order that compels a global hegemon to destroy them.»
Because of the notion that the RF is “a gnat on the butt of an elephant” (and Putin himself has pointed out the enormous inferiority the RF has) the USA were prepared to let the RF be as a made-up threat for the sake of USA military keynesianism:
George Kennan “At a Century’s Ending: Reflections 1982-1995” “Part II: Cold War in Full Bloom” page 118 (1997) ISBN 0-393-31609-2
“Were the Soviet Union to sink tomorrow under the waters of the ocean, the American military-industrial establishment would have to go on, substantially unchanged, until some other adversary could be invented. Anything else would be an unacceptable shock to the American economy.”
But the problem the USA have is not the RF, it is the PRC, because the PRC, however inward-looking as the “Middle Kingdom” tends to be, has the *capability* (which the RF does not have) to be a global rival to the USA, and the RF (with Kazakhstan) is the biggest buffer state the PRC has, just as Ukraine and Belarus and Finland were the biggest buffer states the RF had.
Until the US can’t pursue hegemony any more there’s more war coming regardless of where this one ends.»

Posted by: Blissex | Jan 30 2023 19:39 utc | 123

B:
I think the flaw in your analysis is that the size of the US army doesn’t matter. It will not be just the US military fighting Russia, it will be all the professional armies and all the conscripts and all the volunteers the Empire can muster. Do not doubt the Empire’s ability to get average people to fight in its wars.
In November 1941, 90% of Americans were opposed to entering the war in Europe. Two months later it was likely the opposite, 90% in favor.
Do not doubt the ability of the West’s propaganda machine to generate hatred for all things Russian. It’s been done before. The Russian people are fighting all the people in the West who will let themselves be used as cannon fodder to kill Russians. Let’s say that there are about one billion people in the West against 146 million Russians. About seven to one in favor of the West. It’s my understanding that the causality ratio in the Ukraine ‘meat grinder’ is about eight to one in favor of Russia. I believe the above calculation is why Russia is husbanding its troops. They know they are not just fighting Ukrainians. They are fighting the ‘golden billion.’ This is the ultimate war of attrition.
TheBAG

Posted by: TheBAG | Jan 30 2023 19:41 utc | 124

AntiSpin@78
Hey! You’re perfectly welcome to use a term I’ve long developed to describe what Ike called the MIC. A deeper investigation revealed that it should rather be called the “WarDefense Industry”. My unpatented meme simply calls it as it is. The whole scheme is to defend the “merchants of death” as they were popularly described after WWI. It’s about defending war in the first instance and in the more critical second, it signifies defense of the profiteering by those merchants of death.
Psychologically, our subconscious minds are in play here. “WarDefense Industry” adheres in that Universal Unconscious, so well developed by Carl Jung. On a subconscious level and only occasionally the conscious one, people realize that the whole project is all about not only defending war, but the nefarious creeps who profit from blood-money.
Thus, the more that people encounter the term “WarDefense Industry”, the more they will gradually tend to awaken to the reality of massive fortunes advanced and enhanced by blood-money. Dead Bodies=Big Profit$.

Posted by: aristodemos | Jan 30 2023 19:43 utc | 125

The NATO countries are also stumbling into a situation where – like Poland and Baltics -the group identity is based more on what it is “against” (i.e. Russia) rather than what it is “for”.
Not only harmful, but not sustainable.
A decade or more ago it was readily apparent the West’s leadership class was relentlessly mediocre, and now they’ve stoked the crisis for which they are not equipped. A year ago, when the EU went immediately to the top of the escalation ladder with the sanction packages, and did so via a fit of expressed emotion, that was clear signal these people were lost in deep water.

Posted by: jayc | Jan 30 2023 19:43 utc | 126

dh@80
Correct: You and Paddy have got it right. The professionals in the Pentagon are always kept up to date on war-gaming situations played out by their mass of aides, techies and gophers. So they know the score. Ultimately, even the political generals such as Milley and Austin get the message and USUALLY act accordingly.

Posted by: aristodemos | Jan 30 2023 19:48 utc | 127

thx b!
since as “b” has pointed out with today´s post strategic means shift and Europe shall take more military responsibility.
This is not new. But the action taken is.
Here following new text on the German site Overton Magazin.
It points out the dangers of the upcoming plans & discussions on German “leadership” combined with European war economics.
https://overton-magazin.de/hintergrund/politik/wer-entscheidet-darueber-ob-deutschland-auch-militaerische-fuehrungsmacht-europas-werden-soll/
as linked in that text:
Munich Security Conference in 3 weeks will most likely be a new major push for hybrid warfare and a permanent state of emergency in Europe.
shiny propaganda material “Munich Security Report” for 2023 and 2020
https://securityconference.org/publikationen/msr-special-editions/germany-2020/
The so-called “Zeitenwende” – “sea-change” (?) in German politics as announced by Chancellor Scholz in Febr. is not that new as claimed everywhere.
It first was prominent (see link above) already in 2020, 2 years before its alleged cause did take place on Febr. 24th.
As bad as it all may sound for civil society it does offer points for public resistence.
The only major obstacle will of course be suppression via climate change arguments.
And:
Joint Declaration on EU-NATO Cooperation, 10 January 2023:
https://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/press/press-releases/2023/01/10/eu-nato-joint-declaration-10-january-2023/?utm_source=dsms-auto&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Joint+Declaration+on+EU-NATO+Cooperation%2c+10+January+2023

Posted by: AG | Jan 30 2023 19:52 utc | 128

Posted by: Michael Droy | Jan 30 2023 19:38 utc | 122
Or the Med if there is open conflict and US carriers are a legitimate target.
Unless it is sitting in a port, is a carrier these day nothing but a big sitting duck waste of money?
Carriers that only are safe in port are kind of worthless in the days of hypersonic missiles – I mean this ain’t a repeat of WWII is it?
I doubt it.
BK

Posted by: Buffalo_Ken | Jan 30 2023 19:53 utc | 129

Posted by: rjb1.5 | Jan 30 2023 19:08 utc | 100
«just ask Kabul. and Boeing.»
Even clever, realistic people get something wrong, and it is just buffoonery to take some mishaps as proof of enduring stupidity.
What to say then of the incredible imbecility over decades of the russian strategists, who lost Afghanistan, Poland, Bulgaria, Romania, Hungary, Yugoslavia, Georgia, Azerbaijan, Ukraine, and ended up with russian cities and military installations being bombed for months nowadays? Not many successes instead: Chechenya, Abkhezia, south Ossetia, Syria don’t remotely compensate for all that.
How many successful regime changes and invasions have the RF or PRC done in the past 30 years, compared with dozens for the USA?
Also anyhow abandoning Kabul to the Taliban was a minor but significant success, both tactical and strategic, for the USA.
«though it seems highly unlikely, it’s not impossible, but did these strategists strategize what they will do when they are under the guillotine or swinging from a noose where they belong?»
Given that they have available thousands of nuclear weapons, that is unlikely to happen unless there is big-time regime change in the USA, and that is decades if not centuries away. That’s “realpolitik”. Those people will retire like Pinochet in comfort, celebrated by their “sponsors” and fans, while the people of the Donbas (and Ukraine and RF) will suffer for decades the consequences of their strategies.

Posted by: Blissex | Jan 30 2023 19:54 utc | 130

MiguelJose@84
Muchos Gracias for the insights. Useful information for all of us who tend to want to think geopolitically. My take from this is that the entire house of cards that the Bank$ter rulers of the collective West are getting quite nervous right about now. Their entire global control scheme is crumbling. Soon enough, their realm will include only the EU puppet regimes along with Japan, South Korea (both nervous regarding North Korean artillery so close to “Seoul and to their nuclear capacity) along with the Five Eyes.
Those “people” love to claim that they represent the “Global Community”, but beyond those forenamed puppet regimes, they don’t own shit.

Posted by: aristodemos | Jan 30 2023 19:55 utc | 131

On Gonzola Lira’s latest round table episode 45 with Weeb nation, Dima from military summary and Brian Beletic.
Brian says it makes sense to allow NATO into Ukraine to create a buffer zone. Exactly like they did in Syria. That this would allow Ukraine to build their nation state like Syria did when everything seemed lost as both Russia and the US were escalating rapidly in Syria. He meant a Ukrainian state under Russian influence not the Ukrainian state as it is now. Says look at Syria now as a good example of Russia playing the long political game.
I’m not so sure as the West psychopathic mindset has changed dramatically since then. I think it is way past that scenario. 1 hour 48 mins into the roundtable discussion if you want a listen. So that I don’t mis represent what Brian was saying.

Posted by: Derek Henry | Jan 30 2023 19:57 utc | 132

Posted by: Zet | Jan 30 2023 17:05 utc | 18
The Organizers and Attendees of the Dismember Russia conference are guilty of Class A war crimes.
This is the EU and NATO’s Wannsee conference. A bureaucratic confession of guilt.

Posted by: Northern Observer | Jan 30 2023 20:01 utc | 133

Scholz goes to South America looking for business and weapons
Scholz visited Chile, Argentina and is now in Brazil (Monday, Jan. 30). Here’s a piece on what he talked about with Argentina’s Fernandez… disappointing to say the least.
“Regarding the Ukraine crisis, Fernández insisted that “we have already stated our condemnation to the hostilities unleashed by Russia on Ukraine, and, on that point, we have supported the European position and we continue to support it; in the northern hemisphere missiles are flying and people are dying, and in the southern hemisphere this translates into hunger and higher costs, so what I intend is that Russia understands the damage that all this is causing to the southern hemisphere.”
“The Chancellor already knows my position on the conflict between Russia and Ukraine, he knows of Argentina’s predisposition to collaborate and find a solution, today I raised again things that the Chancellor had already heard before,” said Fernández.
Fernandez visited Russia and China a year ago in early February and stressed his desire to build relations with both. He got criticized then and is being pressured hard now.
https://en.mercopress.com/2023/01/30/fernandez-and-scholz-discuss-ukraine-climate-change-and-energy-resources
Scholz is likely to leave South America without more support for Ukraine.
” Argentina and Chile’s leaders dialed down hope they might lend more support for Ukraine during German Chancellor Olaf Scholz’s inaugural South America tour, underscoring ongoing differences between the West and its allies in lower-income countries.”
https://news.yahoo.com/1-scholz-bid-rally-ukraine-182702057.html

Posted by: migueljose | Jan 30 2023 20:03 utc | 134

Crooke’s SCF essay finds him in great form, “‘At War with Russia’, Europe Peers Down the Abyss”, and includes the demise of Davos as you’ll discover. Crooke’s preceding al-Mayadeen column almost always has some point(s) carried over into the longer essay, and we finally get to it with this:
“‘Serendipitously’ – at this moment of Davos decay – a raucous, distracting noise started up: Abrahams M1s and Leopards for Ukraine. German FM, Baerbock declares Germany and the EU family are “at war with Russia”. The noise, as usual, succeeds in obscuring any wider picture.
“Yes, point one, we do have mission creep: We won’t send offensive weapons, but then they did. We won’t send long-range weapons M777), but then they did. We won’t send multiple missile launch systems (HIMARS), but then they did. We won’t send tanks, but now they are. No NATO boots on the ground, but they have been there since 2014.”
And all that relates to the ever shifting narrative and the very interesting question regarding the media: Will it admit Ukraine/NATO/Outlaw US Empire are losing and Russia’s winning? And that’s the point where Crooke dishes out the meat of his essay. I’ll pause my comment for now and resume it after barflies have had an opportunity to digest the meal Crooke serves.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jan 30 2023 20:05 utc | 135

@ Opport knocks 6
Russian domestic population being spied upon is not the same as Britain populations being spied upon because Britain Israel and US support terrorism and racism. People who are spied on for no reason by criminals for criminals reaent spying.

Posted by: Giyane | Jan 30 2023 20:05 utc | 136

Posted by: aristodemos | Jan 30 2023 19:43 utc | 126
MIC = necrocapital

Posted by: anon2020 | Jan 30 2023 20:08 utc | 137

Indeed, a large NATO force moving into eastern Ukraine to push Russia out seems unlikely for the near future, at least.
However, it is foolish to discard the possibility of direct NATO, or members, intervention into Ukraine. A direct involvement does not need to directly confront Russian forces. For instance, I can imagine a reasonably sized force taking over the guard/standoff duties at Kiev, Odessa and Kharkiv, freeing Ukrainian resources to be used at the front.
Furthermore, from the way things currently look and sound, the conflict isn’t ending any time soon. Russia may advance or even in the event of taking the whole of Ukraine, they’re still going to face partisan and guerrilla warfare as well as friction at the borders of controlled territory unless a some kind of comprehensive, mutually acceptable agreement is made between all the involved parties. This I don’t see happening the way things currently stand.
As some commenters suggest, the bigger war then may be coming later. The question of where these troops may come from, and who is willing to die for Ukraine then may very well be the Ukrainians themselves. Lots of children among the Ukrainian refugees, and from what I’ve been reading, a good part of them are receiving remote Ukrainian schooling, which I can imagine being somewhat nationalistic in nature. Given the current animosity, revanchism and nationalist fervor, in the above imagined possible future outcome it’s not a big stretch to assume even a few percent of these children willing to pick up the fight. They would be motivated, well trained and equipped by their host countries.

Posted by: Bar regular | Jan 30 2023 20:09 utc | 138

Posted by: jared | Jan 30 2023 19:20 utc | 107
«To accomplish regime change by the plans they have afoot, they must –
1) Damage Russia financially, either acutely or chronically and/or
»
Rather they just need to damage the living standards of enough people for long enough that they will support or not fight against regime change.
The goal is not to destroy the RF economy, but to make continuing the war too expensive in blood and money for RF public opinion to continue supporting Putin. There is already an important minority of RF public opinion, usually upper-middle class globalists, who think that vassalage to the USA would make them personally more money than full independence, which is something they care about much less than making money. The UK upper and middle classes made the same calculation during and after WW2.
«2) Drag Russia into an Afghanistan-like conflict.
A possibility that the great minds did not consider, I think.
»
The training of “stay behind” “freedom fighters” has been going on for 7 years already:
https://news.yahoo.com/cia-trained-ukrainian-paramilitaries-may-take-central-role-if-russia-invades-185258008.html
«The CIA is overseeing a secret intensive training program in the U.S. for elite Ukrainian special operations forces and other intelligence personnel, according to five former intelligence and national security officials familiar with the initiative. The program, which started in 2015, is based at an undisclosed facility in the Southern U.S., according to some of those officials […] “The United States is training an insurgency,” said a former CIA official, adding that the program has taught the Ukrainians how “to kill Russians.” […] the CIA and other U.S. agencies could support a Ukrainian insurgency, should Russia launch a large-scale incursion. […] “We’ve been training these guys now for eight years […]”. […] If the Russians launch a new invasion, “there’s going to be people who make their life miserable,” said the former senior intelligence official […] “All that stuff that happened to us in Afghanistan,” said the former senior intelligence official, “they can expect to see that in spades with these guys.”»
That insurgency may well fail, just as the french maquis and the italian partisans failed, but it may help along with many other things a faster regime change. The USA strategists don’t expect things to happen soon, they most likely have a 10-15 year horizon, or even more. The “containment” of the USSR lasted for 40 years, until it crumbled, and the Afghanistan intervention was must one of the steps. The USA have taken 15 years and $5 billion to install a fascist government in Ukraine. Their strategists are patient.

Posted by: Blissex | Jan 30 2023 20:11 utc | 139

Reason, and something resembling fundamental military discernment, would say your right. However, we’re talking about the Interagency. There is no such thing as peak stupid where a large sprawling bureaucracy utterly devoid of personal accountability is involved.

Posted by: Tom S. | Jan 30 2023 20:15 utc | 140

Posted by: TheBAG | Jan 30 2023 19:41 utc | 125
«In November 1941, 90% of Americans were opposed to entering the war in Europe. Two months later it was likely the opposite, 90% in favor.»
More recently:
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/europe/ukraine-s-ex-president-petro-poroshenko-the-army-is-like-my-child-1.4885308
«The idea of Nato was “not very popular in Ukraine” to start, Poroshenko says, with just 16 per cent of Ukrainians supporting integration to Nato in 2013 right before he was elected president – but by the time he finished his term, 61 per cent did.»
When the RF could not prevent the USA from purchasing the installation of a fascist government in Ukraine they made a big, big loss.

Posted by: Blissex | Jan 30 2023 20:15 utc | 141

In reply to Posted by: karlof1 | Jan 30 2023 20:05 utc | 136
~
In the article it is stated:
Russia however, is unlikely to take the bait: It has the real strategic advantage in all areas of engagement with the Ukrainian forces. Whereas, the West has only the ephemeral optical escalatory advantage.
That seems to be the fact of the matter – I mean Russia has the initiative no doubt. They have the troops at the ready, the arsenal demanded, a huge logistical advantage, and most important of all, best I can sense they have the will to do what needs to be done. The media has dug their grave – let them die in it, but those of us paying attention don’t plan on going down with that ship.
Best to you,
BK

Posted by: Buffalo_Ken | Jan 30 2023 20:15 utc | 142

I apologize once again, I didn’t place the “*/i*” proper…..I’m still trying to get the hang of posting here, so hopefully it is evident when the italics were intended to end even if it wasn’t types as such.
…. oh well …..
BK

Posted by: Buffalo_Ken | Jan 30 2023 20:17 utc | 143

Poland can still enter, go to Kiev or Odessa or just Lvov. They have to risk 100k which they have. US can enter with a few thousands like in Syria. They don’t have to attack Russia, just train terrorists. Again, exactly like in Syria. Can be now, can be this summer or next years.
The failure of the Russian general staff can’t be repaired anymore. But they can invade before nato, last chance.

Posted by: rk | Jan 30 2023 20:18 utc | 144

opport knocks@109
You old British Raj Imperialist, You.
Perhaps you presume that there were no indigenous inhabitants in the MALVINAS before the imperialist British Navy moved on in with a bunch of displaced English and Scots farmers (upon destruction of the commons by the Lordlies, shipped over on hulks in order to sustain a British presence on that S.E. flank of South America and send home a bit more wool for the mills of Manchester.
Fie on you and your Neo-imperial yearnings. Now that Argentina has de-platformed their fascist military schemers; it should be high time for your mangy old lion to graciously get your folks outta Dodge and resettled as shepherds in Scotland’s heathers and lochs.
After all, such a move would be good for international comity and to resurrect some of the bad Karma that the Raj has so massively accumulated.

Posted by: aristodemos | Jan 30 2023 20:21 utc | 145

I see Mr. “Lie Cheat & Steal” Pompeo, now a candidate for President, has chimed in on the conflict:

“Every day this goes on creates enormous risk for us, for America,” Pompeo told Dave Rubin in a YouTube interview, published on Sunday. “We’ve got to get this to end. I only know one way to get it to end and that is to provide the Ukrainians with the tools that they need … We should then find a solution that had two features – one, it’s going to have to be acceptable to both, to Russian people and the Ukrainian people.”
A solution needs to have a permanency, Pompeo stressed.
“We have the capacity to use American power – not our soldiers, airmen, marines – but American power to facilitate a hastier conclusion to this and a relatively permanent conclusion,” he said. “I am convinced there are very few conflicts like this when end with one side totally annihilating and defeating the other… they always end up with some level of compromise. I am confident this one will end up this way as well.”

Still pretending that it is Ukraine, not the USA, that has any agency over the present course of the conflict.
The “tools that Ukraine needs” are an ejection seat for every US Military expert and CIA operative in the country.

Posted by: Opport Knocks | Jan 30 2023 20:23 utc | 146

Idiots will dare anything, that’s how you can tell.(Michel Audit, French dialogue writer).
Washington and Brussels are overflowing with idiots.

Posted by: thierry bruno | Jan 30 2023 20:26 utc | 147

The Saker Andrei Raevsky has just announced on his website ‘The Vineyard of the Saker’ that he will close this website at the end of February. He doesn’t want to lose his green card that allows him and his family to live in Florida (Raevsky has the Swiss nationality).

Posted by: Oblomovka daydream | Jan 30 2023 20:28 utc | 148

sad news, the Saker just announced that he will be discontinuing his website effective the end of February. Previously, he said he would shut down his website if he thought Russia and NATO would go to war, a bad sign of things to come, made worse by the fact English speakers have lost one of the few genuine anti-World War 3 websites left.

Posted by: Kadath | Jan 30 2023 20:30 utc | 149

@149
it’s not that clear to me – he seems to expect a full-blown world-war and he often said he would need to shut down his blog in that case. But he wants the archive of the blog to remain, so how does that translate in legal niceties? And what is Amarynth going to do? I, for one, will miss him.

Posted by: Anthony | Jan 30 2023 20:35 utc | 150

Blissex @131
Wet-blanketing again, I see. If you are getting paid for such, it has some minor level of personal validity for you, I suppose. However, it’s inanity and lack of insight gets tedious and boring after awhile…so reconsider or take a hike.

Posted by: aristodemos | Jan 30 2023 20:37 utc | 151

Outraged | Jan 30 2023 18:52 utc | 86
I was in fact referring to the invasion of Iraq and not the “liberation” of Kuwait. Sorry if I was not clear.
I would like to say I am pleased to see you back here. Your knowledge of things I know a little bit about but nowhere near yours is much appreciated. I am mightily impressed with your ability to present those things using only open source information. It was so difficult for me to know what I could and could not talk about that the only real solution was to say nothing at all…..you know, neither confirm nor deny.
at any rate, I do still believe that our military can inflict horrible damage and at least the pilots I know of are quite prepared to do so. They train hard and have all the best toys to help them. Even if the other side has its great aviators…and some of them are indeed very talented, they don’t have a lot of the super duper electronics the USAF has.

Posted by: dan of steele | Jan 30 2023 20:40 utc | 152

Who cares about Saker, Martianov or others? Stay on topic or move to those sites. Or move to Kiev, safest city on planet.

Posted by: rk | Jan 30 2023 20:41 utc | 153

@ Posted by: aristodemos | Jan 30 2023 20:21 utc | 146
Correct, there were no indigenous populations before the Europeans arrived. The status of the Falkland Islands was determined by colonial settlement, piracy, war and treaties between European powers. Just like everywhere else on the west side of the Atlantic.
Perhaps you can convince the US government lead by example, and give Manhattan back to the Dutch, New Orleans and Florida back to Spain, California and Texas back to Mexico, the Alaska panhandle back to Canada, etc… too many to list.

Posted by: Opport Knocks | Jan 30 2023 20:42 utc | 154

Bar Regular @139
Not so certain about your regularity. Perhaps it is about time to resume your intake of prune-juice. That nostrum is said to be efficacious for comfortable regularity.

Posted by: aristodemos | Jan 30 2023 20:43 utc | 155

@B
Thanks a lot for your creativity and insight – It seems sites like these will soon cease to exist but I hope they wont and you can continue your great work 🙂

Posted by: Macpott | Jan 30 2023 20:45 utc | 156

Just been looking at Institute for the Study of War’s map and it’s showing a weird, narrow corridor of Russian advance west/southwest of Bakhmut heading for the T0504. Russian forces have been positioned just east of Berkhivka for a while now, threatening where the E40 and T0513 cross. Wondering if GLOC to Bakhmut are about to cut?

Posted by: rube | Jan 30 2023 20:45 utc | 157

“Winners and looser?” Does the majority of the population not know the difference between ‘loose’ and ‘lose’?
Every day I see this.
Posted by: Peter Hegger | Jan 30 2023 16:49 utc
Will someone please pull long suffering Pete Hegger off that cross he’s nailed to? His martyrdom might eventually lead someone to distraction. “What NATO war? Everyone look at me instead.” Sure, Pete

Posted by: Samm | Jan 30 2023 20:45 utc | 158

Blissex @140
This most recent screed of yours lays your position out quite nakedly. Do you have a dog in the fight, as per one might expect by a third-gen Ukie living in Canuckistan or the U$$A? Should that not be the case, then some will automatically and axiomatically assume that you are receiving some compensation for your tedious efforts.

Posted by: aristodemos | Jan 30 2023 20:46 utc | 159

US troop-carrying ships could be sunk at sea, I should think, with relative ease. All US bases in Europe could be blown to smithereens within the first week of fighting. How on earth would the United States military operate in such conditions? Nuclear weapons would be the only field-leveler, albeit a suicidal one.

Posted by: Rob | Jan 30 2023 20:52 utc | 160

Posted by: Oblomovka daydream | Jan 30 2023 20:28 utc | 149
Posted by: Kadath | Jan 30 2023 20:30 utc | 150
Posted by: Anthony | Jan 30 2023 20:35 utc | 151
I find Andrei Raevsky’s (The Saker) position of choosing to live in the US odd, given his obvious hatred of the place. Then Florida as his chosen place of residence. Bizarre.
Lots of options in Europe for a man of his faith and ideals.

Posted by: Opport Knocks | Jan 30 2023 20:54 utc | 161

opport knocks @155
You missed one and maybe two. The big one is Hawaii. There is an ongoing movement amongst many indigenous Hawailans to recover their status as an independent nation. That archipelago was seized on behalf of sugar and pineapple planters, Yankees the lot of them.
Something similar is going on in Puerto Rico, but the independencia movement is currently overtaken by Uncle $hmuel’s many welfare checks.

Posted by: aristodemos | Jan 30 2023 20:56 utc | 162

Posted by: Nuremberg | Jan 30 2023 19:32 utc | 117
Now in Villaverde Baja California
or
even safer
Iquiqué Chile : permanent summer and playa.
Southern Hemisphere = little fall-out just in case …

Posted by: Greg Galloway | Jan 30 2023 20:58 utc | 163

Another president/country becoming tired of this fiasco:
“Croatian President Zoran Milanovic became the latest critic to condemn the decision of Western countries, including the United States, to send dozens of tanks to Ukraine to help fight the war against Russia, warning that continued military escalation will not help bring the conflict to an end.
“I am against sending any lethal arms there,” Milanovic said at a press conference. “It prolongs the war.””

Posted by: ThusspakeZarathustra | Jan 30 2023 21:03 utc | 164

Can somebody answer this question? Or I mean the question here:
~~~~~~~~~~ Are Aircraft Carriers still considered the “flagship” in the US Navy? ~~~~~
If so why?
If not, then what are the capabilities of the US Navy with a doctrine not based upon Aircraft Carriers?
I think it ought be evident Aircraft Carriers out in the open sea are sitting ducks nowadays given known missile technology, so really – how can the US Navy assert its will? How many submarines are in the US Navy I wonder – conventional ones of course – how many of those and do they get a free pass through tight places?
~
As a novice in some of these matters, I still think those are questions worth consideration at the bar.
Any feedback would be appreciated, but if need be, I’ll look it up myself more than I already have.
Ain’t it great to live in the 21st century with so much at our fingertips?
I want peace.
BK

Posted by: Buffalo_Ken | Jan 30 2023 21:11 utc | 165

Posted by: Zet | Jan 30 2023 17:05 utc | 18
———————-
It is crazy 🤪 how the collective west can talk about Russian “imperialism” and “colonialism” when the US and NATO have some 700 bases planted all over the world outside the US, while Russia has less than twenty.
The collective west (the EU/US/UK) is organized into an offensive Imperialist Military alliance (NATO) that could theoretically pounce on any smaller, and poorer, nations at any time if they refuse to tow the US unipolar Rules-Based International Order: They can and they do!
But Russia is the imperialist colonizer according to the EU? Up is down and down is up.

Posted by: Ed | Jan 30 2023 21:16 utc | 166

ew; Blissex | Jan 30 2023 20:11 utc | 140
you wrote, “The training of “stay behind” “freedom fighters” has been going on for 7 years already
As Colonel Douglas Macgregor has pointed out, this is one more very good reason for Russia to go all the way to the borders of Ukraine. Why leave some nazi-infested rump state to be filled with “insurgents” trained by the USSA?

Posted by: Perimetr | Jan 30 2023 21:18 utc | 167

I hope the Saker will consider turning his website over to Amarynth (I think I have the name right lol), who did a good job of running it while he was out for health reasons. Actually a better job . . .

Posted by: Perimetr | Jan 30 2023 21:21 utc | 168

Now that Ukraine has become a bloodbath for Russian and Ukrainian citizens (and zero involuntary casualties for ZATO citizens), I’m wondering why Putin didn’t simply blackmail ZATO into telling Ukraine to stop shelling Token Russian civilians in Eastern Ukraine?
He could have nominated several targets for remote destruction in Ukraine and/or ZATO countries. And if ZATO really wanted a war with Russia they could have said No 11+ months ago…

Posted by: Hoarsewhisperer | Jan 30 2023 21:22 utc | 169

Outraged #15

ZERO non Black Sea coast nations naval vessels, of any kind, are permitted through the Bosphoros whilst a conflict is in progress.
Turkiye administers the Convention & has enforced it from the commencement of hostilities.

Agreed – but who manages Turkiye from one week to the next. I assume that if Turkiye wavers and some adventurous NATO skipper attempts the run they would not get too far into the Black Sea itself before encountering difficulties. The Convention is one thing but today the retaliation capacity is vastly different.
I assume the Baltic Sea/Poland as a landing zone will be more likely but equally a loser’s choice.

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Jan 30 2023 21:26 utc | 170

Posted by: Ed | Jan 30 2023 21:16 utc | 167
They should directly target those London and Tel Aviv investment bankers, WEF, Davos puppets, Rotshchilds etc. Everyone who is financing, scheming, manipulating this war, and soon, a much larger war. They are the real enemies, as long as they don’t feel consequences for their actions, nothing will change.

Posted by: unimperator | Jan 30 2023 21:26 utc | 171

Rob | Jan 30 2023 20:52 utc | 161
US have a long chain of proxies, they will wait. Ukr was the last and most retarded kamikaze. The second ring is the Poland Baltics Finland line, then the rest of Europe mixed with others.
France will train pilots, they said today. In addition to ammo. Nato can easily give 30-50 f16s or other models, their oldest junk first, in less than a month. The question is what terrorist acts they’ll perform, the Russian army isn’t the main target here.
Don’t forget Israel is going for the first time to kiss Zely’s hand.

Posted by: rk | Jan 30 2023 21:27 utc | 172

Thanks @ b. on finally giving some perception on the sizes and measurements of front lines.
@ xor | Jan 30 2023 19:18 utc | 106
“No U.S. ground troops will move into Ukraine. It is ludicrous to think otherwise.”
100% Correct.

I also agree. It would be lot worse than WWII was for Germans.
For US/NATO and ‘the coalition of the willing’ it would be suicide.
I think that most of the people in Western militaries are only theoretically aware of the size of Russo-Ukrainian theatre, let alone warmongers and various bureaucrats making current carnage possible.
In practice that means endless rolling hills, lots of criss-crossed irrigation channels with local roads, long forest plantations and mostly muddy and almost endless fields.
And it just goes on and on. For hundreds of kilometres.
And that is just small Ukraine, small of course from the Russian perspective.
Now imagine Russian territory and some imaginary operational theatre stretching about 3,800 kilometres, that approximately accounts for the total length of Russian western border.
Who, how, where and with what would one attack such huge territory?
Let alone attacking such territory being actively defended by a formidable army, with plenty of weapons that just work and are easy to use, let alone hi-tech stand-off stuff and almost endless ammo.
It would take probably about 4-5 years of preparation and still US/NATO would be short of manpower and probably would be a massive fail.
It already is as it is.
It is a bit silly, but not uninteresting to compare Iraq and current Russo-West conflict.
Outraged put a really nice Iraq’s ‘vertical scan’ somewhere up the page, but what he forgot to mention is that when US troops moved some 100 miles deep into Iraq, they run out of batteries and spare parts for vehicles in 2 days.
Russofobia and hatred towards Russia can be a really deadly disease, if one doesn’t think twice. And since the US and some Western countries are conditioned over decades for it, their future doesn’t look very good.

Posted by: whirlX | Jan 30 2023 21:33 utc | 173

Buffalo_Ken | Jan 30 2023 21:11 utc | 166
“Are Aircraft Carriers still considered the “flagship” in the US Navy? ~~~~~
If so why?”

Path dependency, sunk costs (soon literally), fighting the last (world) war, chickenhawk politicians and scribblers feeling tough by touting them, believing their own propaganda about the lack of Chinese, Russian, Iranian capabilities, no alternative if they remain determined to try to control the sea lanes, kickbacks from the manufacturers and jobs in their districts…
These apply to the carrier-based planes as well.

Posted by: Flying Dutchman | Jan 30 2023 21:36 utc | 174

Kiev – 500,000
EU plus England etc – 450,000
US plus minor vassals – 450,000
Mercs etc – 100,000
Assume they can assemble above troops in dreamland.
That scenario needs full mobilization, including logistics, plus resources, including energy resources. For that purpose they should, in first place, occupy Saudi Arabia and Persian gulf sheikhdoms, and secure energy resources, then go to fight in Ukraine.
Come on, out of your imaginative world.
Posted by: Arata | Jan 30 2023 18:33 utc | 76
———————————————————————————-
Can they do this for Ukraine? They already are getting volunteers wherever they can find them plus also working on extraditing all those that left. Will they get that many is another story.
Can the EU and US get nearly a million or more? Don’t know, but they can sure as heck try. The US righ th now has about 450,000 already on active duty – you can recall some of them but not not nearly enough. What they can do is call up the Reserves and National guard…..which is what they did to get such huge numbers in 1991. They can also manufacture a false emergency/issue and activate the draft/conscription mechanism which could easily pull
In the numbers needed. EU would likely have to that route much sooner as the numbers of active on duty for most EU countries is way too small for the job.
The big questions are will they and how long would it take? My guess would be about two years, right when they want to take on China. So the rough plan is good for DMZ area now in Ukraine, then prepare everyone for the big one: cross over seemingly in force across Ukraine DMZ to occupy Russian while taking on China from air and sea tie them up. End goal is not to necessarily win, just not lose…making just enough noise and fuss to keep the dollar on top.
Yes, it sounds crazy, but it had been their strategy for nearly 70 years now….not to win, just not to lose dollar supremacy.

Posted by: dr smith | Jan 30 2023 21:39 utc | 175

The training of “stay behind” “freedom fighters” has been going on for 7 years already.

@Posted by: Blissex | Jan 30 2023 20:11 utc | 140
Sounds terrible.
But I have trouble to envision how that works.
Do they have to stay in foxhole living on K-rations?
I believe Russians are dealing with this already as they can – “mop-up operations” they are calling it.
They hypotheticals seem like they are very tenuous.
We shall see.

Posted by: jared | Jan 30 2023 21:41 utc | 176

LOL. I want to see it. It will be enjoyable to watch from my bunker
World leaders who invaded Russia: Napoleon, Hitler, now BIDEN
Peak Clown World!

Posted by: Charles E. Fromage | Jan 30 2023 21:41 utc | 177

Looks like the situation for Ukraine is getting more and more desperate per Telegram:
Every male between 20 and 55 years of age to be conscripted in Ukraine—regardless of family status, profession, physical or mental health, or any other consideration.
Lists are to be prepared by every employer, organization, or institution (the document in question concerns the Kiev region specifically). I anticipate the summons will be handed out directly through the workplace as well.
As Roman Donetsky (@donrf22), who posted this document, writes, “the end is near, Ukrainians.”

Posted by: ctiger | Jan 30 2023 21:43 utc | 178

@136 Cont’d–
Crooke’s initial showcasing the demise of the WEF foreshadows his observation of Europe’s political reality and the end of Bubblenomics:
“The point here is that the Rockefeller-Davos prescription was always a scam for blowing a new financial bubble to keep the dollar hegemony project afloat. The world however, is moving on from the Davos unitary world governance prescription, to de-centralisation and multi polarity – in pursuit of the renaissance of autonomy, historic values and sovereignty. At the WEF this year, it was obvious: Davos is passé.
“The more important effect however, often missed, is the import of ‘the Agenda fail’ on the financial war: The Davos ‘new economic system’ envisaged a tidal wave of spending on renewable tech; on subsidies (like CO2 credits) and on liquifying the transition. It was about incubating a new bubble, based on zero-cost new money (known as MMT).”
Thus later the formation of a small elite anti-war faction within the Outlaw US Empire–the Neoliberal Parasites whose fortunes will suffer massively when interest rates are hiked to deal with inflation caused by the war(s):
“But what is evident is that there is a faction in the U.S., that like the Europeans, opposes the Biden Team predisposition towards escalation. The Europeans fear kinetic war in Europe, whereas the American faction more fears the prospect of financial melt-down, should the war widen.”
The European fear is well founded as we discover from this revelation:
“Germans understandably are very uneasy. A recent report by the Polish edition of German Die Welt – based on discussions with Polish diplomatic sources, including a senior Polish Foreign Ministry official – reported that ‘every day, Polish politicians say what the representatives of Germany or France usually do not dare to say, and thus formulate one of the goals of the war, that Russia must be unconditionally weakened as far as possible. Our goal is to stop Russia forever. A rotten compromise must not be allowed’. And further, ‘A truce on Russia’s terms would only lead to a pause in the fighting, which would only last until Russia recovers’, the senior diplomat explained.”
Most will note that the above is based upon belief in the false narrative that’s been ongoing for over 8 years now. Crooke goes on to reveal what some of us have known for years–the West’s bad governance is driven by belief in the false narrative. Now that the narrative is disintegrating, those in power are incapacitated, frozen, and rendered incapable of doing much. And yes, the Twitter revelations went global and viral resulting in an even more discreditied West and a more confidant RoW that now knows more than ever before the West isn’t to be trusted whatsoever–particularly the Outlaw US Empire as it flails away trying to invoke its best Mafiosi to get nations to do its bidding. But the RoW now has a solidarity that it’s never had before, and it’s growing stronger daily.
IMO, an escalation will occur, but not the sort that NATO/EU/Outlaw US Empire want to see, and that’s the growing political insurrection within their nations against the narrative–the entire narrative that’s lasted several generations. And perhaps the most important one will be within the Outlaw US Empire over Biden’s fitness, although it ought to be about his corruption. Currently, the polling within the Empire is very negative toward all vestiges of the Establishment as the ongoing recession deepens further. Tomorrow the FOMC meets and many anticipate a 50 basis point rise in rates that will escalate the recession and related inflation.
And on that final note, I again highly recommend the Hudson/Desai discussion about inflation and related economic points.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jan 30 2023 21:43 utc | 179

@175
current us navy carrier aviation range restriction are so bad that some f-18 are devoted to aerial refueling.
it is worse with short “legged” f-35
100 thousand ton dinosaur, except maybe to shut china from Saudi oil

Posted by: paddy | Jan 30 2023 21:43 utc | 180

What the original stated purpose of NATO? Keep Germany (Europe) down, the Russians out and the US in.
All round, they’ve been very successful so far.
Posted by: Down South | Jan 30 2023 19:13 utc | 103
######
Vassals who are weak are liabilities, not an assets.

Posted by: LoveDonbass | Jan 30 2023 21:45 utc | 181

@ dan of steele | Jan 30 2023 20:40 utc | 153
Is all good. 🙂
I hear you. Indeed, not easy, not easy at all.
Peace

Posted by: Outraged | Jan 30 2023 21:49 utc | 182

It took the U.S. some nine month to assemble a forces of some 700,000 U.S. and 250,000 allied troops with all their equipment.

That right there is Iraqs mistake. The should have attacked before the US ammased 1 million solders.

Posted by: Vikichka | Jan 30 2023 21:52 utc | 183

At 9 or in ur case looser. Like it matters when u know the intention. Clutchin pearls over grammer is 100% weak sauce.

Posted by: Tannenhouser | Jan 30 2023 21:53 utc | 184

My apologies B.

Posted by: Tannenhouser | Jan 30 2023 21:55 utc | 185

I believe the above calculation is why Russia is husbanding its troops. They know they are not just fighting Ukrainians. They are fighting the ‘golden billion.’ This is the ultimate war of attrition.
TheBAG
Posted by: TheBAG | Jan 30 2023 19:41 utc | 125

Good point. That has also been my feeling for awhile. Russia needs to position its troops along a line that can be held at a low cost. Western Ukraine is easily supported from the West and it will remain a source of troubles for Russia for a long time. The best scenario for Russia is to let Western Ukraine be absorbed by the bordering countries. That would save the need for peace-keeping forces to be positioned in a hypothetical independent Western Ukraine country. My question is: What would be the easiest less costly line for Russia in Ukraine? That line would be a wide demilitarized zone, but how wide?

Posted by: Richard L | Jan 30 2023 21:57 utc | 186

According to Czech commenters on FB there are about 250.000 male Ukrainians hiding in the Czech Republic who are dodging the draft into the UAF.

Posted by: Oblomovka daydream | Jan 30 2023 22:01 utc | 187

Russia cannot afford a WWII style war where they don’t count their dead to achieve an objective. That could pass in an age where women had 5-10 children (and even then was forced on them by circumstance with near catastrophic outcomes) but in these demographic times it would be stupid and suicidal.
Besides, it is not a war of conquest fought for territory. They’re fighting an idea, that being Ukrainian nationalism, and early phase nationalism of ‘unfinished’ states tends to absorb tremendous casualties ‘for the cause’. It would be extremely wasteful to meet it head on in the same fashion and it’s not like any concrete territorial or material objective would destroy it. It has to burn itself out. In Ukraine’s case, Ukrainians being basically Russians, i.e. stubborn and long-suffering – it means that horrendous numbers of people will die before the nationalist flame goes out.
Sadly this is what the West (from the Catholic church to the US and EU) worked diligently to achieve, and achieve it they did.

Posted by: Boo | Jan 30 2023 22:07 utc | 188

Only thing NATO could really do is jump ahead of Russia and take territory where there is no Russian presence in order to “block” further Russian advance. This is what the US did in Syria by seizing the land east of the Euphrates where they knew Russia had no presence. However, it is likely to be some uncontested location that the US is fully confident Russia has no interest in going (such as Lviv, for example). It would just be some PR move for NATO to look like they’re doing something.

Posted by: let’s get bizzay | Jan 30 2023 22:08 utc | 189

Posted by: aristodemos | Jan 30 2023 20:46 utc | 160
Nothing Blissex writes says “paid” to me. Rather, I read their commentary as pessimism for Russia’s future plans/stability informed by the history of the USA and its evil deeds of the past. He/she seems to be saying what I think we all know in the back of our minds – the goal isn’t necessarily to destroy Russia, but to force regime change and balkanization of the federation so that global private finance ala The City and Wall Street, along with western petroleum extraction companies can move in and steal/privatize any asset without resistance such as that put up by Putin. Personally I think they should be careful what they wish for, because whoever does end up replacing him could be even more hard line and not as patient with the collective west/NATO.
Of course they are TOO pessimistic, which may lead some to believe they are pro-NATO/FUKUS, but that’s not my takeaway. I kinda wish Blissex would lay it all out in one mid-length post so we know where he/she is really coming from.
For now I’m going with “the pessimist” or maybe even “devil’s advocate.” Regardless, I do think it brings something to the conversation because it makes others have to grapple with the negative nancy angle.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collinst | Jan 30 2023 22:08 utc | 190

Oblomovka daydream @ 149

Saker Andrei Raevsky has just announced on his website ‘The Vineyard of the Saker’ that he will close this website at the end of February.

The owner of the Saker stated right at the start of the SMO that he would shut down his blog should it turn into an official war between the USA and Russia. To me, and I’m pretty doom and gloom, the news is still a bucket of ice water in the face, the last voices being rounded up and silenced.
It’s been the trajectory for over 20ys now, Chomsky’s “lively discourse” needed to manufacture consent systematically wound down, the parameters quietly tightened, debaters of reason and integrity pushed out across the msm, clearly seen with the likes of PBS, NPR, BBC, NYT, all reduced to idiotic comic books.
They are no longer trying to manufacture consent, just giving out proclamations and marching orders to a fully zombified populace. Firing trigger words to the brainwashed to proceed to the assigned task.
I’ve said before we are not headed towards dictatorship, we are well in it, have been for at least 20ys. People didn’t notice because it was the inverted totalitarianism of Sheldon Wolin, but that phase is over now, now comes the stark in your face era of western totalitarianism. First the dark clouds appeared, then filled the sky, bit more they will blot out the sun. No more grey area, just a black and white world of fighters and victims.

Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Jan 30 2023 22:08 utc | 191

Buffalo_Ken @166–
A flotilla/fleet’s flagship is almost always the most powerful, least sinkable, capital ship available, but not always. Battleships were often, but many types came before. The “flag” is usually associated with the Admiral of the Fleet, but again not always. Armies have Command Posts; Navies have Flagships. The name derives from the use of flags to communicate orders to the fleet. When the ship used becomes compromised, the flag gets transferred along with its admiral and staff.
Aircraft carriers by doctrine are the most important capital ship in the USN, but not so in the Russian Navy. Generally, carriers have special combat centers from which the Flag operates that are an adjunct to the carrier’s own combat center. Other USN ships aren’t thus equipped. That all might change now that the entire nature of warfare has changed with the advent of hypersonics and very sophisticated anti-ship missiles designed to destroy carriers. Indeed, the Outlaw US Empire cannot project power like it once did merely ten years ago with the rapid deployment of such missiles by nations who believe themselves targeted–Iran and North Korea being the two most obvious.
Does the flagship concept have a future? Yes, particularly with convoys. Russia envisions its Northern Sea Route as a convoy seaway with its nuclear powered icebreakers being the Flagship, which are known as Leader Class. In military applications, a lead vessel will probably always be designated; however, whather it will continue to be called the Flagship is unknown.

Posted by: karlof1 | Jan 30 2023 22:11 utc | 192

The US isn’t in the business of winning. According to Julian Assange, the US in the business of “endless war.” However the US is no longer the global manufacturing powerhouse of the post WW2 era, so the US is dependent on China to supply all consumer products — iPhones, laptops, car parts, vitamins, medicine, petfood, coffee cups, toys, etc. Yet according to 4 star Air Force General Mike Minihan, the insane self-immolating US leaders will instigate war with China in 2 years. Mock them not, we’re all “preppers” now, as China makes sure Walmart shelves and car lots remain empty. Meanwhile, Saudi Arabia just announced the end of petrodollar supremacy, making dollars worthless, and the US unable to afford, much less produce or procure weapons for itself or NATOstan. The US business of endless war is bankrupt. Who will tell Zelinsky and the EU that the wedding is off?

Posted by: Willow | Jan 30 2023 22:12 utc | 193

Is it reasonable to assume that Poland or a US-led coalition force will intervene on behalf of Ukraine with ground troops in that country?
It is more likely that the US will try to delay Russia’s victory by pushing Ukraine to commit more of its own troops, supplemented by foreign mercenaries perhaps, or an ISIS-style de facto army of “volunteers” lured by social media platforms, to fight the Russians no matter how many Ukrainians end up dying horribly.
Once Ukraine is completely exhausted, Zelensky will either escape into exile or end up dead (by whose hands, we can guess) and the country will be partitioned by whichever ghoulish EU members have historical claims to its bits and pieces. Then those EU members can be made responsible for continuing the “good fight” against Russia.
The US will do anything to defend its corporate interests in Ukraine right down to the last EU member nation. This is the way of the bully and the coward.

Posted by: Jen | Jan 30 2023 22:14 utc | 194

Posted by: Boo | Jan 30 2023 22:07 utc | 189
IIRC several million Ukrainians have left Ukraine during 2022. Surprisingly, most of them have not even gone to EU, but Russia.
Martianov put it pretty well – the Russians don’t really give a damn about Ukraine or the narrative of “brotherly nation” is false. Those who wanted to Russia already went there. The rest will probably leave somewhere over years, from large swaths of territory.
There will be a pretty wide area of no mans land, or unutilized land. My guess it will run somewhere west of the entire Dneper. No one can enter without permissions, drones, artillery and mobile groups patrol continuously preventing Nato sent terrorists from traversing it to cause attacks in Russia.

Posted by: unimperator | Jan 30 2023 22:15 utc | 195

@Opport Knocks | 6

The domestic population will not be happy.

The Russians are unhappy with the fact that they have to kill the Ukrainians, many of whom are gang-pressed into the trenches, and to destroy Ukraine in the process. I sense they would rather be fighting war with NATO — direct confrontation, bare knuckles, no ambiguities, full-on. Holy war against their historic nemesis, not some soft-cock corrective surgery shit against close relatives whom they dream to liberate. I think in some ways this grand option would make the Russians feel happier, actually. If only because it is more meaningful.

Posted by: Nomad | Jan 30 2023 22:23 utc | 196

I am wondering if the Russian-Ukraine war is just an excuse for the US to upgrade its defense industry for the purpose of taking on China and maybe Russia at a later date. To do so without an active war to support would have been problematic as Congress would not fund it plus it would have alarmed China who would understand its purpose was probably directed at them.
In World War II it was a fairly simple process to convert US industrial and manufacturing base to a war footing, but much of this has been outsourced today. Now the production base is being expanded to produce weapons thanks to the situation in Ukraine which poses little military threat to the US but may be degrading Russias capability in a future WWIII.
Meanwhile TSMC is set to start producing chips in Arizona within the next year, and a US General is predicting War with China by 2025

Posted by: Pete22 | Jan 30 2023 22:24 utc | 197

Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Jan 30 2023 22:08 utc | 193
Knowingly or not you almost quoted Frank Zappa:
The illusion of freedom will continue as long as it’s profitable to continue the illusion. At the point where the illusion becomes too expensive to maintain, they will just take down the scenery, they will pull back the curtains, they will move the tables and chairs out of the way and you will see the brick wall at the back of the theater.

Posted by: Vikichka | Jan 30 2023 22:30 utc | 198

Posted by: karlof1 | Jan 30 2023 22:11 utc | 194
~
Thanks.
It is hard not to ponder, if one just studying can get a fair assessment on things, so I suppose there is always uncertainty, but it seems to me the US military has been such a waste of funds and currency – I mean really a big waste in all ways.
~
No wonder good faith is diminishing.
~
As a side note, in the future, when I think I’m gonna quote something, I think I will just do it old-fashioned style….you know…” something “.
~
Can I offer you a drink?
Thanks,
BK

Posted by: Buffalo_Ken | Jan 30 2023 22:30 utc | 199

“According to Czech commenters on FB there are about 250.000 male Ukrainians hiding in the Czech Republic who are dodging the draft into the UAF…. Oblomovka daydream@188
And the best of luck to them. They are not ‘dodging service’ but refusing to kill their fellows in order to please Uncle Sam.
Like that generation of American heroes who came to Canada-and greatly contributed to it too- rather than massacre Vietnamese they are deserving of our respect and the thanks of every Russian too.

Posted by: bevin | Jan 30 2023 22:31 utc | 200