MoA - Ukraine Open Thread 2022-230

December 20, 2022

Ukraine Open Thread 2022-230

Only for news & views directly related to the Ukraine conflict.

The current open thread for other issues is here.

Please stick to the topic. Contribute facts. Do not attack other commentators.

Posted by b on December 20, 2022 at 16:14 UTC | Permalink

Comments

In a month of 1000 Sundays, can't make this up:

An invitation !!! RSVP. View the invite at LINK to VOX H/t: ZH.

Dec. 16, 2022

This DC party invite shows all the money to be made off the Ukraine war

A Ukrainian Embassy reception, sponsored by America’s biggest weapons makers.

The invitation said the quiet part out loud.

The Ukrainian Embassy hosted a reception last week in honor of the 31st anniversary of the country’s armed services. Events like this are part of the social calendar of Washington’s smart set, with hobnobbing diplomats, think tankers, journalists, and US officials. Guests took photos with the Ukrainian ambassador. Even Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Mark Milley showed up.

But there was something so overt it led some observers to laugh out loud at the gathering’s invitation.

The logos of military contractors Northrop Grumman, Raytheon, Pratt & Whitney, and Lockheed Martin were emblazoned on the invitation as the event’s sponsors, below the official Ukrainian emblems and elegant blue script that said the Ukrainian ambassador and defense attaché “request the pleasure of your company.” [.]

(emphasis in italics mine)

Just leave it there. There is no applicable descriptor in any language.

Posted by: Likklemore | Dec 20 2022 16:27 utc | 1

So it appears that with zaluzny talking about Russian strength it appears that the Donetsk front is moving, at long last. Im guessing Zaluzhy meant he was leaving front line troops in while using reinforcements to build reserves.

Not coincidentally Zelensky visited bahkmut. Well a little morale pickup before they're left in line until dead.

If Russia is smart itll keep on Donbas and not try any lunges at kiev like they're talking about...because that's what they want....kiev will be a death trap for any Russian offensive. That's where the reserves will be assembling around.

Posted by: Neofeudalfuture | Dec 20 2022 16:30 utc | 2

This is a comment by user "Marman" I found on a site whose name begins with z and even mention of which seems verboten on MoA:

"Surprised NO ONE has figured it out yet.
Viktor Bout was NOT traded for Griner. No one in US government cares for her that much.
No. Bout was traded for one of the NATO generals captured in Ukraine and that part has been kept secret."

This actually...makes sense. Whatever happened to Cloutier, just for example?

Posted by: Biswapriya Purkayast | Dec 20 2022 16:31 utc | 3

I was mulling over the atrocious behaviour of the Leaders of the collective West compared to that of those in the Middle East, Asia and the RoW. It seems to me the reason Putin and Xijing Ping are welcomed so warmly and respectfully is because they are honourable, intelligent and trustworthy Presidents who are trying to build a fairer and better world.

They want other Nations to be free from USA corruption and domination and increase their wealth by trading their own resources on an equal footing. It is business conducted truthfully with a view to improving the quality of life for a Nation'so citizens.

The Leaders of the collective West have shown themselves to be Liars, complete incompetent bullies, hypocrites and a bunch of dishonourable power mad self aggrandising individuals. No civilised or educated Leaders in the RoW would want to do business with this feckless group of Fascists.

In Asia and the Middle East Honour Integrity and honesty is central to society. Just look at the contrast of the treatment of Biden by Saudi Arabia and the red carpet treatment Xijing received

The Leaders of the collective West are absolutely corrupt as the world can now see. They are morally and intellectually bankrupt. A bunch of idiotic sheep shaggers

Posted by: Jo Dominich | Dec 20 2022 16:35 utc | 4

Zelensky visits besieged Ukrainian city on frontline amid heavy fighting

Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky on Tuesday unexpectedly visited soldiers defending the eastern frontline city of Bakhmut that's been besieged by Russian forces, including mercenaries from the Wagner private military company, for months.
"Zelensky thanked the Ukrainian soldiers for the courage, resilience and strength they demonstrate by repelling enemy attacks," Sergii Nykyforov, a spokesperson for the president, said on social media.
Nykyforov said Zelensky also gave state awards to members of the mechanized and motor infantry, mountain assault, tank, artillery and airmobile units.
However, military analysts recently told Reuters that Russia will at best be able to achieve a pyrrhic victory — in which considerable losses outweigh the gain — over the city given how many resources it's devoted to the battle.
Ukraine's defense of the city has also bought it time to fortify defensive lines to the west of Bakhmut, meaning Russia will struggle to extend its breakthrough if it does fully capture the city, the analysts said. . . .here

Posted by: Don Bacon | Dec 20 2022 16:51 utc | 5

Posted by: Likklemore | Dec 20 2022 16:27 utc | 1

Lousy graphic design, art is no requirement for that kind of gathering.

Posted by: Paco | Dec 20 2022 16:59 utc | 6

"Russia could resume business with Germany if it ends Ukraine war - Scholtz"
Delusional.

"EU countries agree gas price cap"
Drunks agreeing on the price of beer.

Posted by: Passerby | Dec 20 2022 17:05 utc | 7

The EU elites for(the sake) their people need a little elbow space. That can be gained if supposedly all spectrum of politicos in France start demanding ww2 reparations from Germany and going slow on aid to Ukr. The ones in power can say that and if they are pressured or bought in order not to persist with it, the ones not in power can take up the slack, that would cause the ones in power to again take up the matter. In this manner the charade? bickering? can be continued. Following France's lead other euro nations can join the diatribe. France need not be the first state to start this. Of course everybody knows that it is only for creating some breathing living space for themselves. More space to bickering, less space to complying to US diktats. Only saying.

Posted by: RealBeast | Dec 20 2022 17:10 utc | 8

Life in the trenches for Russian forces is as bad or worse than conditions of the AFU... and morale not much better, assuming this account is representative. "We were allowed to be slaughtered"

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/dec/20/we-were-allowed-to-be-slaughtered-calls-by-russian-forces-intercepted

Posted by: Posa | Dec 20 2022 17:15 utc | 9

This actually...makes sense. Whatever happened to Cloutier, just for example?
Posted by: Biswapriya Purkayast | Dec 20 2022 16:31 utc | 3

Cloutier was never captured, he had documented public appearances in the west after the false claim was made. Western military tradition does not put Generals near the front lines. With pervasive instant electronic communications and remote sensing there is no need.

That does not mean there was no backroom deal for someone else of lower rank.

Posted by: Opport Knocks | Dec 20 2022 17:31 utc | 10

Was the Zelensky "visit to Bakhmut" filmed on a Hollywood lot or at the U.S. White House film stage?
Did he arrive by plane, chopper, car or bicycle? Did he entertain the troops in high heels and play the piano with his johnny?
Ukraine is Dead Man Walking.

Posted by: kupkee | Dec 20 2022 17:32 utc | 11

Posted by: Posa | Dec 20 2022 17:15 utc | 9

Life in the trenches is hard for everyone but my dear the disgusting ukrops are having a very bad time and you know it..the meat grinder is working well.I know you want to spew negativity about SMO, we get it, but it's not working.

Posted by: LuBa | Dec 20 2022 17:36 utc | 12

@ Jo Dominich | Dec 20 2022 16:35 utc | 4

A bunch of idiotic sheep shaggers

Priceless. Cheers.

@ Posa | Dec 20 2022 17:15 utc | 9

Independently verified & corroborated by Oryx OSINT or BellingCrap perhaps, one supposes, published in the highly credible MI6 Guardian ?

Read it, substitute RF for AFU, this is the AFU situation since day one, the sheer quantity online of unauthorized material they upload via cell phones & GoPro's literally everywhere all the time, same with the mercs, is astounding. The BS re intercepted comms re claimed RF Bucha massacre is a clear tell. Is sausage factory manufactured propaganda.

Oh, by the way, Guardian journos being permitted to travel throughout Russia visiting & interviewing deployed RF soldiers families ? Yeah, right, pull the other one. BS!

Posted by: Outraged | Dec 20 2022 17:36 utc | 13

@Posa
This account is not even an account. The source is the Ukraine, quoted by the Guardian. A sum total of negative believability.

Posted by: JT | Dec 20 2022 17:36 utc | 14

Tom_12 | Dec 20 2022 16:00 utc | 289
Thanks for translating the video!

Passerby | Dec 20 2022 17:05 utc | 7

Russia could resume business with Germany if it ends Ukraine war - Scholtz

How generous of Mr. Scholz. Rather than offering charity, why didn't he make a push for gas delivery via the remaining tube of North Stream 2, as the Kremlin has offered. Up to 27.5 million cubic meters per year, we need it badly.

Posted by: grunzt | Dec 20 2022 17:39 utc | 15

Haha guys check out Arnold Schwarzenegger's take on the war, I swear they got this propaganda thing down lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWClXZd9c78

Posted by: Dan | Dec 20 2022 17:59 utc | 16

@Posa

Listening in to a cell phone is not simply a matter of tuning a radio to the right frequency as you would to listen to unencrypted walkie talkie chatter. Calls are intercepted by law enforcement with a piece of specialized equipment that mimics a cell phone tower and forces phones in the area to connect to it by broadcasting a stronger signal than the genuine towers. Dangerous thing to be - a powerful radio emitter - in an active war zone. Does it seem more likely that Ukrainian-provided cell intercepts are recorded to a script in a basement in Kiev or that people are risking their lives on the frontline to capture essentially worthless human interest intelligence that could just as easily be faked ?

Posted by: OnceWere | Dec 20 2022 18:00 utc | 17

⚡️ (https://t.me/readovkanews/49304)🇷🇺🇺🇦⛓ Two Officers of the AFU's 80th Landing Brigade, whose Militants shot the Russian Military in the LPR, were taken Prisoner⚡️

It is reported that Russian Legion scouts, together with Akhmat units, have captured two stormtroopers of the 80th AFU Landing Brigade, whose fighters (https://t.me/readovkanews/47177) took part in the mass criminal execution (https://t.me/readovkanews/47169) of Russian captive soldiers. Two officers of the brigade that carried out the horrific punitive operation in the LPR were caught and handed over to the relevant authorities.

The brutality and inhumanity of the Ukrainian militants after the horrific video of the far from the first war crime (https://t.me/readovkanews/30068) by the AFU in November became evident even to the Western "partners", who demanded an investigation (https://t.me/readovkanews/47227) of the incident. Naturally, there was no reaction from the Ukrainian authorities, even after the international outcry.

https://t.me/sitreports/2358

Posted by: unimperator | Dec 20 2022 18:06 utc | 18

Whatever your opinion these are definitive interviews with Sachs and MacGregor, both interviewees here have honed their message, are succinct and on point also good comprehensive length too. Kudos to the Duran guys for such a good job.

If you have friends and kindred who ignore you but will listen to establishment figures these would be two good vids to pass on.

Global economic crisis & the geopolitical reaction w/Jeffrey Sachs (Live)

Massive Offensives by the Russians to Terminate Ukraine

Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Dec 20 2022 18:11 utc | 19

zelensky in Bakhmut at the frontline. Alive
Gerrasimov at front lines. Death
Zelensky walking in Bakhmut like at Miami Beach
Ukraine commandos taking out Russian Vips
Russia treating nazis like the holy christ
This braindead SMO and russian strstegy is breathtaking
and will go down in history as dumbest military operation
Either they re all from the top (putin) until the platoon leader
totally incompetent or traitors.
What an embarrasing 5D kabuki theater
Sorry former great Russia

Posted by: Ćevapčići | Dec 20 2022 18:20 utc | 20

@ Jo Dominich | Dec 20 2022 16:35 utc | 4

A bunch of idiotic sheep shaggers

Well-said Jo !!
Good post.

Posted by: Engineer-John | Dec 20 2022 18:22 utc | 21

If Russian soldiers are in the battlefield with cellphones I'm switching sides and best of luck to Ukraine. That's facetious and no way I believe Russians are on unsecure phones or coms with their families bitching. Not saying life for them might not be as bad as for the Ukrainians but if so the Guardian doesn't know crap about it. People really need to round out their education maybe read Scoop by Evelyn Waugh to get the picture before they go posting silly msm hype.

Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Dec 20 2022 18:23 utc | 22

Timestamps. LOL. 'Barraged', sorry Posa ...

@ OnceWere | Dec 20 2022 18:00 utc | 17

Excellent point.

Posted by: Outraged | Dec 20 2022 18:26 utc | 23

LightYearsFromHome | Dec 20 2022 18:23 utc | 22

In all the videos I have watched, I haven't seen a single frontline fighter on the combined Russian side with a phone. On the Ukraine side have seen phones often amongst frontline fighters.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Dec 20 2022 18:31 utc | 24

Sadly lacking of course is open source re-development plans for the region. The NATO-stan version appears to be Monsanto-Bayer glyphosphate-Roundup chemical agriculture with BlackRock to run it (a la Imperial Valley of California with one of the lowest per capita incomes of California). Russia seems rather mum, hopes of a bro-mance like with Byelorussia is not going to happen in Western Ukraine. Suffice to say, the devil is in the details.

In re Cloutier, yes the video appears quite real, a rah-rah for ROTC at his alma mater. He does keep an extremely low profile. Any info about the Canadian almost general who left a world of lawsuits to go fight in Ukraine would be appreciated.

Ignore the nisse. And as Samuel Day Jr used to always say, Nihil illegitimati corborundum.

Posted by: paxmark1 | Dec 20 2022 18:39 utc | 25

Cloutier was never captured ...

Posted by: Opport Knocks | Dec 20 2022 17:31 utc | 10

You can claim you personally believe he wasn’t captured if you want but your certainty is utterly ridiculous. What straw man is it that asserts his non capture on the grounds that had no need to be there or that his seniority alone precluded his presence?

Cloutier was loudly accused of being Azovstal during the siege and to be amongst the captured. These accusations were denied on the flimsiest of evidence by his colleagues and the western MSM. Your assertions are exactly as ridiculous as those official denials,

10 seconds of video chat from the man himself laughing off the accusations at the time would have done it.

He turned up for certain June 4th, search “roger cloutier rotc san diego”, not a word on the supposed falsity of his capture.

The time when any of those clowns accused of being trapped in Azovstal could have cleared their name by simply turning up somewhere else is long gone.

He wasn’t the only high ranking esprit de corp assclown rumoured to have been captured in Azovstal either, not one of them came forward at the time.

Doesn’t mean any of them were in Azovstal but it sure as shit doesn’t mean they weren’t. There is a conspicuous absence of timely evidence that would have refuted those allegations.

Posted by: anon2020 | Dec 20 2022 18:39 utc | 26

Sometimes I worry the empire actually has its shit together then I see something like this. That Arnold video is the best recruitment ad to join the RF army imaginable, they should not fear to run it on Russian TV.

Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Dec 20 2022 18:41 utc | 27

@Jo Dominich 4

And the sheep are lambs procured by Epstein, who photographed the shagging and sold the tapes to MOSSAD, the CIA, the Clintons or most likely, some combination of the above.

Posted by: Hermit | Dec 20 2022 18:44 utc | 28

ZH has a posting up with the title

Russian City Suffers Casualties - 14,000 Without Power After Ukraine Cross Border Attack

That city is Belgorod and the report talks about HIMARS being used outside agreed upon limits.....grin/sigh

All this for the God of Mammon cult to continue the projection of their barbaric patriarchy.....how sad a representation of our species.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Dec 20 2022 18:44 utc | 29

Today, Putin had the honor to preside over the ceremony awarding Russia's highest state awards to their recipients. I read some of the initial text then viewed the 32 photos of the event, which was held in the Catherine Hall of the Kremlin. I then did a search for that hall and found a photo tour of that part of the Kremlin. At least one of the awardees mentioned the reliefs that adorn the walls in the hall which can be seen in photo #2. To work in such a museum must be a humbling experience even for someone as coarse as Stalin or Khrushchev. I'm very pleased they weren't ruined by the American Barbarians during the 1990s and suffered the fate the British visited upon the Greeks. Picture 21 shows the Order of Courage being awarded to the correspondent head of the WarGonzo project Semyon Pegov, someone who is supposedly controversial. Twenty-two people were awarded, several of which will return to the front.

Posted by: karlof1 | Dec 20 2022 18:47 utc | 30

@Jo Dominich, #4:

Last name of China's president is Xi, his given name is Jinping. In Chinese name protocol, last name comes first. So, in Chinese propriety, he is referred to as Xi Jinping. In Western protocol, last name appears in the rear, so one may correctly refer to him as Jinping Xi in western protocol.

Just to clarify for what it is worth :-). No big deal. But to say Xijing Ping, it's like calling Brandon Den Joebi.

Posted by: Oriental Voice | Dec 20 2022 18:50 utc | 31

Don Bacon @5

Your anal Ists are full of it. In the first instance, what proof is there that Zelensky actually did visit Bakhmut? Is there photographic evidence (not photo-shopped) which would include evidentiary structural edifices which are particular to that location. Getting together a bunch of troops and handing out medals can be readily achieved...far, far away from the frontlines.

As for the beaten and battered Ukrainian army being able to overcome logistical nightmares and resupply their forces in Bakhmut/Artymevsk, to say nothing of even rescuing their masses of wounded; being able to hold out long enough for their homeguard-level reserves to build up another redoubt...pah!

Enough of the concern trolling. The Ukies are losing and losing badly. Bottom line.

Posted by: aristodemos | Dec 20 2022 19:10 utc | 32

Poseur @9

You actually have the chutzpah to cite the now totally MI6 controlled "Guardian" as an allegedly reliable source? Hey, I happen to own this marvel of engineering crossing the East River from Manhattan to Brooklyn. Such a deal I offer, to you only. Ask for my generous offer.

Posted by: aristodemos | Dec 20 2022 19:14 utc | 33

Why is Dima (military summary) losing respect on this site?
Can you recommend anybody better?
(Don't say Saker.. please)

Posted by: Kerensky | Dec 20 2022 19:24 utc | 34

Paxmark1@25

That Monsanto/Bayer/Cargill/Gates scheme to perform chemical warfare on some of the most productive black-soil farmland on the planet may be a primary reason for Russia to transform the entire Ukraine (Excepting the Galician Banderite nut-cases) into a reconstituted nation.

One of the primary instructions would be for the NovoUkrainia government to abnegate all those one-sided and highly corrupted agreements made by the Khazarian Mafiya regime in Kiev with some of the absolutely most dangerous corporations on the planet. All those lands need to be repatriated without compensation by the newly established state and for those lands to be returned to such younger Ukrainian families who wish to return to the Mir, the essential roots of their ancestors.

Posted by: aristodemos | Dec 20 2022 19:26 utc | 35

The Interview with Deputy Foreign Minister of the Russian Federation Sergey Vershinin to Rossiya Segodnya News Agency, December 20, 2022, touches mostly on human rights and legal issues facing Russia and Russians. Here's one excerpt I find particularly disgusting:

Question: The Russian Foreign Ministry recommended that Russians refrain from visiting countries unfriendly to Russia if they detect "interest" in themselves on the part of the United States. Does this mean that the "hunt" for the citizens of our country through the US special services will be conducted even more actively? How does Moscow intend to react?
Answer: For many years, the US authorities have been literally hunting for Russians around the world, especially in countries that have bilateral extradition treaties with them, seeking to detain our citizens on false charges with subsequent transfer to the hands of American punitive justice with a predictable result. Courts in the U.S. churn out long prison sentences of dozens of years.

This trend has only recently intensified in the context of Russophobia whipped up by the Biden Administration and a sharp aggravation of bilateral relations through Washington's fault.

At the same time, the Americans deliberately ignore the existing legal mechanisms and, in particular, the Russian-American Treaty of 1999 on Mutual Legal Assistance in Criminal Matters, preferring forceful methods within the framework of the "rules-based world order" imposed by them. The total number of Russian citizens, in fact, taken hostage, exceeds 60 people.

In addition to the official warning on the website of the Russian Foreign Ministry, we would like to remind you once again that any citizen of the Russian Federation traveling abroad, primarily to unfriendly countries, should weigh the risks in terms of possible consequences, if there is even the slightest reason to suspect that there is a specific interest in himself on the part of the US special services and law enforcement agencies. There is no need to count on fair treatment. To immigrants from Russia in the United States there is a presumption of guilt on the principle of "Russian, then - a criminal."

Of course, the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, our Embassy in Washington and the Russian Consulates General in Houston and New York will continue to provide maximum assistance and support to compatriots in distress, seeking respect for their rights and a speedy return to their homeland. As before, we will respond to the hostile actions of the United States in a tough and decisive manner. [My Emphasis]

Griner was properly arrested for smuggling illegal substances and would have suffered arrest in many states within the Outlaw US Empire, Georgia being one of those as my wife reminded me last night. Very Big Money campaigned very hard to get her traded for Bout, but it took months for that Big Money to tell the truth about Griner. Most importantly, she admitted her guilt, making it clear she wasn't framed as Russian's are by the Empire.

There's far more touched on in this interview than the excert I provided, but it's all in a similar vein. The upshot is Russia is told again and again by the West's actions that none of the West's institutions have any honor or credibility, and that Russia and RoW need to gut them or just bury them and rebuild. Indeed, that's my opinion about what should be done with the UN--the UN Charter needs to be retained and reworked to be more democratic, mainly in the realm of the Security Council, and it must be relocated from its current location to somewhere that's currently underdeveloped, like Malawi.

Posted by: karlof1 | Dec 20 2022 19:33 utc | 36

@ LightYearsFromHome | Dec 20 2022 18:41 utc | 27

The only thing I derive from Arnie is a plea to stop the SMO (the war), since Ukraine is losing it badly.
He appeals on stopping the anti-Russian sentiment, somehow excusing the real reasons.
I mean as someone mentioned (maybe Ritter), Putin didn't wake up one day, scratched his tummy and out of boredom decided to conquer Ukraine with 60.000 combat troops and 90.000 in direct and indirect support military personnel. That is how making this whole story up is developing.

I wish Croatian president's statements would be more looked into.
Regardless of Croatian Nazi past, at least there is a president of some rather unimportant EU member, saying more or less what might be a distillate of the last 230 Ukrainian threads made here. Hats off to this guy, regardless.
Basically what this guy (prez of Croatia) is saying from what I understand, is that there is no obligation to help Ukraine as it is not a partner, ally, and it is not bound by any mutual contract. It shames Western bureaucrats, directly asking who choose them and pokes specifically elected von der Leyen.
That guy also claims that EU is cynical and derogates USA as in 'yeah, as we send all our weapons to Ukraine, we (Croatia) will be defended by whom? Like the USA is defending Ukraine?' Basically, he is more or less having a go on general obedience of EU vassals, misled to support something that shouldn't be supported. Somehow way more direct and coherent that that Christian-conservative Orban.

A Croatian friend sent me a few links of his statements, so to understand it I just run them through translate machine and I copy it below.
Does that feel like EU puzzles are to be put back in the box or something more sinister? No clue, really.

Croatian president sez:

In his statement, the Croatian president also touched on the arrest of European Parliament Vice-President Eva Kaili, "some kind of Greek woman, relatively antipathetic, but not because she is Greek", asking why she was arrested, who did it and by what right.

"This is pure fascism," Milanović believes.

Kaili was arrested as part of a Belgian public prosecutor's investigation involving an alleged criminal organization, attempted influence peddling in a Gulf state, and allegations of corruption and money laundering. The media write that it is about Qatar, and bags of money were found with the arrested vice-president of the EU.

Milanović asked for "clear explanations" for whom she lobbied for, and emphasized that a large number of representatives were doing this and that some Croatians "sat on supervisory committees".

PRESIDENT Zoran Milanović said that the EU treats Croatia impermissibly, citing as an example the "cheeky and scandalous letter" from the head of European diplomacy, Josep Borrell, to Croatian Minister Gordan Grlić-Radman. He did not reveal the content of the letter, but hinted that it refers to Croatia's request to participate in the Althea mission in Bosnia and Herzegovina.

Speaking about European funds, Milanović said that the EU is flooding countries with "money that doesn't exist" and that Croatia is "collaterally lucky" because it got "crumbs from the table" as part of a plan intended for larger countries, such as Italy.

Milanović said that he did not want to talk about it earlier in order not to jeopardize Croatia's entry into Schengen, which "ended Croatian history" because "all thieves will be able to enter Croatia without supervision, without border control".

The High Representative of the Union for Foreign Affairs and Security Policy, Josep Borrell, sent a "scandalous, rude, lying, manipulative, inaccurate" reply to Grlić-Radman, says Milanović.

"They treat us like losers, like deaf-blind fools"
Milanović claims that Borrell, "who is hysterical and threatening", in his letter "invents Security Council resolutions and European Council decisions" so that Croatia does not participate in Althea.

More than a thousand soldiers from twenty countries are participating in the Althea mission, but not Croatia, whose participation is opposed by Bosniak politicians and some European countries.

Milanović, who recently returned from a visit to Chile, said that even that country is participating in the mission and has five soldiers in Bugojno (BiH).

The president requested that Grlic-Radman publish Borrell's response to the letter because it is not secret, announcing that otherwise he would do it himself.

"This should come to light so that it can be seen how official Brussels treats the Croatian top government," Milanović stressed

Regarding the leadership of the European Union, he said that they came to office on the basis of "political guesswork" and that, as leaders who were not elected by anyone, they do not have a democratic mandate.

"Who chose Von der Leyen?" he said about the head of the EU Commission and added that they are "ordinary bureaucrats who were not elected by anyone".

In his opinion, this is extremely "undemocratic", but he is "ready to live under it" and to a certain extent "respect it until it gets out of control", ie until the European leadership declares itself "masters of everything".

He said that the Croatian problem is not Bahmut, but the issue of Croats in Bosnia and Herzegovina.

"I recognize a lie better than a neurosurgeon when the EU starts lying," he says and adds that he differs from Orban, but that he defends him because "colorless bureaucrats terrorize states."

When asked whether Croatia should have remained among the five countries that do not want to participate in the EUMAM mission while the other 22 member countries are participating, Milanović replied: "Absolutely it should have."

"Ukraine is not an ally. They are trying to make it by force. It is cynically given the status of an EU candidate. That is today's EU. Alas, zero."

"The problem is robbery in Croatia, not Ukraine," he said, adding that inflation is also a huge problem in Croatia, because the value of the money that citizens have in banks is falling and because that money can buy much less.

"When they say we're looking at you, they don't know what kind of scumbags and sycophants are leading us. But those who are looking at us are the scumbags from Brussels, that's what part of the HDZ (ruling patry) belongs to," he added.

"It is my constitutional duty. I kept quiet for months, I wrote secretly to the prime minister because I thought that it should not be made public, but now that I see that the Germans and the French are talking about such things from their perspective, then we will also talk about what weapons Croatia has, what the situation is in Croatian warehouses", he said.

He wondered what Croatia had in terms of weapons.

"How many anti-tank missiles does Croatia have? How many? Come on, Bane, before they arrest you," he said.

"What did we try to order and get because you can see that it is not there. Even before the war, 1,000 shells were waiting for a year and a half. Forget it today, they are gone. Who is to blame for the terrible state of material and technical equipment of the Croatian army? We have Americans who will defend us as they defend the Ukrainians, that looks great", he said and added that "someone is criminally responsible for such a situation".

Posted by: whirlX | Dec 20 2022 19:34 utc | 37

Kerensky | Dec 20 2022 19:24 utc | 34

I watched him on Lira's roundtable. He has zero understanding of Russia. Towards the end he said Russia would most likely come in from Belarus and start shelling Kiev in revenge for Ukraine shelling Donetsk city.
I stopped watching his channel ages ago. Just a mass of inconsequential information that may or may not be right and as proved by what he said on Lira's show, a mindset that thinks Russia will shell civilian areas of Kiev in retaliation for Ukraine shelling civilian areas of Donetsk.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Dec 20 2022 19:37 utc | 38

Haha guys check out Arnold Schwarzenegger's take on the war, I swear they got this propaganda thing down lol
Posted by: Dan | Dec 20 2022 17:59 utc | 16

LOL indeed, using an Austrian to make a sales pitch to Russians is pretty funny.

I wonder how much the offered Ovetchkin?

Posted by: Opport Knocks | Dec 20 2022 19:38 utc | 39

In Chinese name protocol, last name comes first. ... In Western protocol, last name appears in the rear,

Posted by: Oriental Voice | Dec 20 2022 18:50 utc | 31

Europeans, but not Anglo-Saxons, often put the family name first. In France and Hungary are the ones I know.

Posted by: laguerre | Dec 20 2022 19:40 utc | 40

Posted by: OnceWere | Dec 20 2022 18:00 utc | 17 "Listening in to a cell phone is not simply a matter of tuning a radio to the right frequency"

It can be done that way with multiple "networked" receivers that follow the control channel. And the strength of the encryption varies.

A device like this https://www.crowdsupply.com/krakenrf/krakensdr

can be programmed to get you the signal, but then you have to decrypt it.

Posted by: Bill Smith | Dec 20 2022 19:48 utc | 41

Nazi's and Ukraine Jews joined at the hip.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IIJz7jPCNks
"The 2023 Kyiv Jewish Forum's special preview panel, featuring one of the world's foremost historians and commentators and one of its leading military experts, introduced audiences to the two most pressing issues of the day: the balance of military forces heading into winter, and the future of U.S. bipartisan support for Ukraine's war of survival. For more information about the 2023 Kyiv Jewish Forum, co-hosted by the Jewish Confederation of Ukraine and Tablet Magazine,"

There are always individuals that are exception to the norm and plenty can be found on the net, But Ukraine Jewish community siding with the nazi's that slaughtered them by the hundreds of thousands, The country that puts up monuments to those that slaughtered the Jews, Poles and many other "subhumans" - Israel saying nothing about the Nazi Ukraine state - the norm for the tribe is somewhat distasteful.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Dec 20 2022 19:52 utc | 42

Don Bacon | Dec 20 2022 16:51 utc | 5
_____

Cicked on your link, Don, expecting some inspiring green-screen pics or video of Zelensky rallying the frontline cannon fodder in Bakhmut. But strangely, your link is circular, linking directly back to this thread, like an ouroboros, a snake eating its own tail. How odd. Was that inadvertent?

Posted by: Doug Hillman | Dec 20 2022 19:54 utc | 43

@whirlX, #37:

Thank you for that Croatian bit of info.

Let the"Woke" tide roll and swamp Europe. After the debris clear, the world can focus on building Eurasia.

Posted by: Oriental Voice | Dec 20 2022 19:57 utc | 44

Doesn’t mean any of them were in Azovstal but it sure as shit doesn’t mean they weren’t. There is a conspicuous absence of timely evidence that would have refuted those allegations.
Posted by: anon2020 | Dec 20 2022 18:39 utc | 26

If the Senior Management of the US military responded to every false claim, it would only encourage more false claims. This one, apparently from the troll army, was likely deemed "not worthy of response".

Here is a video from his LinkedIn profile that others have cited. Go ahead, claim he had a subordinate look after that and perhaps the video was faked from earlier footage, etc. Dig a deeper hole that you should never have started in he first place.

https://www.linkedin.com/feed/update/urn:li:activity:6920327591182696448/

His main profile says he is now "retired" (since September) and he appears to be doing what retired senior military people do, sitting on Boards of Directors and supporting causes linked to the military.

https://www.linkedin.com/in/roger-l-cloutier-ltg-us-army-retired-752bb891/

Posted by: Opport Knocks | Dec 20 2022 20:00 utc | 45

"A Ukrainian Embassy reception, sponsored by America’s biggest weapons makers." (Merchants of Death logos printed on invitation.)

Likklemore | Dec 20 2022 16:27 utc | 1
______

Surely a gag, worthy of the Onion.

Posted by: Doug Hillman | Dec 20 2022 20:03 utc | 46

"Ukraine's Azov Regiment visits Israel: 'Mariupol is our Masada'
Azov officer Ilya Samoilenko, one of the defenders of the Azovstal steelworks in Mariupol, led the delegation to Israel."
https://www.jpost.com/international/article-725351

Masada was a last stand by a jewish community against the Romans. A hilltop fortress. They were all killed or killed themselves when the Romans breached the defenses.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Dec 20 2022 20:04 utc | 47

Actually Masada is an Israeli myth, drawn from the text of Josephus. The archaeological evidence more or less contradicted the myth, but the excavator, Yigael Yadin, was an Israeli nationalist and saw himself as proving the national myth.

Posted by: laguerre | Dec 20 2022 20:18 utc | 48

Dan@16 and Opport Knocks@39

Here's Arnold Schwarzenegger with another view on war:

link to Schwarzenegger video

Posted by: Objective Observer | Dec 20 2022 20:21 utc | 49

MUD: The 14 day weather forcast in Donetsk City does not show a day HI below freezing until January 4th. With the daily low temperatures being around freezing, the higher day temperture means the ground does not freeze solid.

This prevents or at least slows either side from mobilizing with heavy equipment which very well can get stuck in the mud.

The temperatures in the Donetsk City area have been unseasonably warm. Maybe HAARP or other is being used to manipulate the weather?

Posted by: young | Dec 20 2022 20:25 utc | 50

"As for the beaten and battered Ukrainian army being able to overcome logistical nightmares and resupply their forces in Bakhmut"

They are still there, no?

Posted by: Fnord73 | Dec 20 2022 20:26 utc | 51

"Does it seem more likely that Ukrainian-provided cell intercepts are recorded to a script in a basement in Kiev or that people are risking their lives on the frontline to capture essentially worthless human interest intelligence that could just as easily be faked ?

Posted by: OnceWere | Dec 20 2022 18:00 utc | 17
_____

Well yes. But then again, Posa may have just revealed yet another stunning weakness in RF operations. As we here freely offer our invaluable council to the Russian military planners (from our recliners ... with cup-holders of course), my advice is: just stop issuing cell phones to all the frontline troops; allocate that instead to your well-documented missile shortage.

Posted by: Doug Hillman | Dec 20 2022 20:30 utc | 52

Posted by: whirlX | Dec 20 2022 19:34 utc | 37
Interesting statement by Milanovic:

Milanović said that he did not want to talk about it earlier in order not to jeopardize Croatia's entry into Schengen, which "ended Croatian history" because "all thieves will be able to enter Croatia without supervision, without border control".

So he didn't want to stop "the end of Croatian history? Must be be a popular fellow with the voters, eh?

Posted by: Membrum Virile | Dec 20 2022 20:32 utc | 53

Posa may have just revealed yet another stunning weakness in RF operations. As we here freely offer our invaluable council to the Russian military planners (from our recliners ... with cup-holders of course), my advice is: just stop issuing cell phones to all the frontline troops; allocate that instead to your well-documented missile shortage.
Posted by: Doug Hillman | Dec 20 2022 20:30 utc | 52

The RF Military banned the use of personal cell phones in the conflict zone since the start. Even among the Chechen units and Wagner, they are rare. The LPR and DPR forces sometimes had them, but I suspect they are now banned as well.

Hence the probability that the call was either a fake or from someone captured by the Ukrainians and told what say in exchange for better food, a mattress, whatever.

Posted by: Opport Knocks | Dec 20 2022 20:41 utc | 54

Posted by: laguerre | Dec 20 2022 19:40 utc | 40

Europeans, but not Anglo-Saxons, often put the family name first. In France and Hungary are the ones I know.

Thanks for the clarification. I didn't know that. Learned something.

Posted by: Oriental Voice | Dec 20 2022 21:24 utc | 55

Posted by: Posa | Dec 20 2022 17:15 utc

assuming this account is representative.
....theguardian.com

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

Posted by: La Bastille | Dec 20 2022 21:30 utc | 56

Dan @ 16: Video is 9 months old. Even our Austro-German 'hero' may be disabused of this position by now.

Posted by: Paul Spencer | Dec 20 2022 21:40 utc | 57

meh,

seems something is cooking but it doesnt smell well

some people got dirty socks? :D

Posted by: Macpott | Dec 20 2022 21:42 utc | 58

Andrei Martyanov makes another comment about some of the "analysts" talking about the war on the pro-Russian side, in this case "Wargonzo":

Now, to yet another "voenkor" running with this BS about Gerasimov. This time it is Mr. Pegov of Wargonzo. Thanks to Martin Berndt for pointing this out.

On Telegram Semen Pegov (War Gonzo) wrote yesterday that every high Russian official who traveled to Donbass was a target and a lot of lower ranking officials in the region have been killed. The Russians know what's going on. Gerasimov missed the parade on the Red Square this year. He probably was wounded. Those were the rumors then.

Now, let me explain. Semen Pegov maybe considered by some a hot shot and a "combat veteran", especially when parading himself in military fatigue, but Semen Pegov is a graduate of the Smolensk State University, and you may have guessed it, Department of Journalism (in Russian), and apart from his "combat" exploits, he never served in the armed forces in any capacity, let alone officer capacity and has zero experience with any operational matter or high-end military technology. So, as any "voenkor" (a euphemism for BSer) his professional qualifications in purely military aspect are limited to reporting the suffering of civilians and tactical minutiae as provided by primarily low level personnel and traditional front-line rumors.

In other words, Pegov has zero understanding of the subject he is talking about, and this subject is an operational and strategic level ISR and means of countering it. If he doesn't understand who the Chief of General Staff of Russia is and what goes into provision of his safety and security when he enters combat zone, there is absolutely nothing to talk about with him....

So, my suggestion to Pegov and all those "analysts" from WarGonzo is to concentrate on what they do reasonably well--sell emotionally charged war footage and reporting to laypeople, and try to stay away from issues they have no clue about. After all, derogatory term "voenkorschina" appeared in Russia for a reason. It is a euphemism for selling primarily pseudo-military BS to housewives and househasbands, who are easily impressed by explosions, military uniform and as any normal people, yours truly included, react emotionally to war crimes and devastation of the war. In the end, if you want to know if some "voenkor" is a real deal (most of them are civilian BSers) ask them if they know how the resolution of uncertainties is done. Make sure to mention to them that it is directly related to Gerasimov's visit to the front-lines.

I agree, and this applies to people like Strelkov and a lot of commentators here (including me).

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Dec 21 2022 1:28 utc | 59

Opport Knocks | Dec 20 2022 20:41 utc | 54
____

Yes, but thank you for confirming that. My advice to the RF was tongue-in-cheek. Seems the UAF and Azov OTOH do carry phones and/or cameras (to document their atrocities).
----
Seems MoA was down for a while today, here in usa anyway.

Posted by: Doug Hillman | Dec 21 2022 1:38 utc | 60

Yes, MoA was down for me for perhaps an hour. Tried doing the post I put in the Iran thread a couple hours ago, it failed with one of those weird messages, then the site wouldn't load after several tries, so I gave up and came back a short while ago. At first, I thought it was a DNS issue. Thankfully it seems we're back to normal.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Dec 21 2022 1:44 utc | 61

https://www.globalresearch.ca/this-dc-party-invite-shows-all-money-made-off-ukraine-war/5802651

Greedy warmongers can be a good thing. Perhaps if there's money to be made, we won't have nuclear war.

Posted by: Eighthman | Dec 21 2022 2:19 utc | 62

MoA was unavailable for me today for about 4 hours and typepad was having sketchy/unavailable problems itself during that time

Posted by: psychohistorian | Dec 21 2022 2:26 utc | 63

Lol, about Arnold. I remember him in Red Heat, as Moscow Militia Captain Ivan Danko, with James Belushi. I liked how in was filmed on location in Chicago, and movies filmed on location are a lot more rare these days. The overseas parts were filmed in Budapest, and Austria.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Heat_(1988_film)

Ivan Danko Confronts Viktor In A Bar | Red Heat

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wp1eN-bjDN8

Posted by: Babel-17 | Dec 21 2022 2:33 utc | 64

RSH @59--

Mr. Pegov was one of the awardees at the Kremlin today: Order of Courage "PEGOV Semyon Vladimirovich – correspondent, head of the WarGonzo project." Photo here.

Posted by: karlof1 | Dec 21 2022 2:40 utc | 65

Excellent coverage as per usual b!

Can any barflies explain the washing machines? Is this a meme RF soldiers are acting out from fishki or somewhere? I don't quite understand its roots or origin. Anyone help?

Posted by: NJH | Dec 21 2022 3:10 utc | 66

Posa @ 9:

From that linked Guardian post:

"... They are just three of thousands of calls between soldiers in the trenches or advanced positions that Ukrainian experts have eavesdropped, pored over for snippets of intelligence and then, where there is propaganda value, made public ..."

When the source of these mobile phone calls between soldiers and their families is Ukrainian, there's something smelling very strongly of rotten rodents about the whole article.

As other MoA commenters have noted, Russian soldiers may not take mobile phones with them while on active duty. That The Guardian makes much out of the supposed number of calls - apparently a "huge scale of calls" - seems very suspect.

On the other hand, if it is true that Ukrainian soldiers are making use of mobile phones while on active duty, then they are endangering themselves and others around them. There is a reason soldiers don't take mobile phones with them, and it's not only a disciplinary reason. (Not to mention the likelihood that whoever wrote the article for The Guardian substituted "Russian" for "Ukrainian" wherever possible.)

Mention of Dmitri Alperovitch's name in the article as a source should be ringing alarm bells as well. Alperovitch helped cook up the Russiagate hacking hoax back in 2016 while a director of Crowd Strike. What else might he have concocted in the way of fake news and disinformation?

Posted by: Jen | Dec 21 2022 3:14 utc | 67

Posa @ 9:

That Guardian post smells very strongly of rotten rodents. Russian soldiers on active duty do not take mobile phones with them. The reason isn't just one of discipline.

On the other hand, to judge from online videos, tweets and numerous social media posts, Ukrainian soldiers are more ready to fire away in cyberspace than through real space. It would not be difficult to speculate that whoever wrote the article for The Fraudian substituted the adjective "Russian" for "Ukrainian" wherever possible.

Also the appearance of Dmitri Alperovitch's name in the article should be ringing alarm bells. As head of Crowd Strike which handled cyber-security for the Democratic National Committee in 2016, Alperovitch was one of the people along with Alexandra Chalupa among others who insinuated that Russia had been interfering in the US Presidential campaign on behalf of Donald Trump.

Posted by: Jen | Dec 21 2022 3:23 utc | 68

The ukie domestic propaganda meme at the start of the SMO was that Ruskies were so poor and backwards they didn't have phones or electrical appliances so they were looting them from Ukraine.

Posted by: Peter AU1 | Dec 21 2022 3:41 utc | 69

Fnord73@51... how's about you nip over there and report back. You are right though, they are still there, leg here, hand there, little bits and pieces, everywhere. Check out the video feeds, gruesome if that's your taste.

Cheers M

Posted by: sean the leprechaun | Dec 21 2022 3:50 utc | 70

"But then you have to decrypt it."

Posted by: Bill Smith | Dec 20 2022 19:48 utc | 41

There's the rub. By impersonating a cell tower you can signal the phone to downgrade its encryption. I believe the old 2G encryption is weak enough to be cracked in real-time now - so tell the phone to use that and you're in business. But passive methods don't allow you to do that - you can map networks and track individuals' phones but you can't get the content of their conversations.

Posted by: OnceWere | Dec 21 2022 4:27 utc | 71

Kerensky | Dec 20 2022 19:24 utc | 34
Why is Dima (military summary) losing respect on this site?
Cannot speak for the diverse, divergent bar.
For me…
I was an early Dima disciple. I think he had 7k subscribers when I made him an essential part of my morning information trawl.
At the time there was only the Nuland affiliated Institute for the Study of War maps, and all non corporate USNATO info was deleted in real time from twitter/ yt and the uploader banned…
Dima’s yt channel somehow survived the censors, and that had me ask: “how” “why”?
I recognised Dima was an enthusiastic amateur. And we’ve observed his English improve in real time.
What Dima offered me in AprilMayJuneJuly was what I could find nowhere else, at the time.. a voice, a perspective outside the tightly controlled western narrative.
He is Belarusian, (somewhat independent at the time), spoke Russian, had a Ukrainian wife and friends, and he could access Russian domestic sources …Russian media, - anecdotes from family, friends, - his neighbour’s vet’s cousin’s sister-in-law, who once went to school with someone who once spoke with someone who allegedly knew someone high in the Russian military.. … insider intel from somewhere.. maybe his arse, who knows..
Regardless, what he offered was non ISW maps showing what the ISW was hiding and blatantly lying about.
He had original content where he created a spreadsheet of what Ukrainian units were located where, and cataloguing their astonishing and (at the time) highly disputed KIA/WIA.
He is well meaning and offers a conduit from Russian open source info to a western clientele who know they are being kept corralled in a western info silo.

And then one day, for no reason at all, I just lost interest.
It wasn’t anything Dima did, or didn’t do…. He didn’t “lose” credibility with me… But one day, I just no longer wanted to know how many Ukrainian lads had been killed overnight.
The whole futility and obscenity just overwhelmed me.
The killing and grinding continues month after month, approaching a year now, across every town, village, street of Ukraine, and it sickens me.
I no longer want to know where Wagner is, or which town is now lying in ruins.
So for me, DIma didn’t “lose” credibility… he is now what he always was.. an enthusiastic amateur. He probably thought his youtube would run for 3months and the war would be over.

Along with my becoming sated and sickened that in 2022 “we” are still killing each other - having learnt nothing in the millenniums of human history…
I also became familiar with telegram…..
If I want info now, I don’t have to watch a 20min vid…. I can access Russian/English telegrams and know “enough” in a few minutes.

DIma is doing his best.

Which leads to your part 2:
Can you recommend anybody better?
In a word: No.
No one knows anything.
Not here, not at Martyanov, not Saker, Duran, Larry Johnson, Berletic, Macgregor, Ritter…..No one, not one, has a back channel to the Russian military.
We have the Russian MoD reports everyday (uploaded here by DownSouth).
But most want to dismiss these because they are provided by the Russian MoD. But in truth, ONLY the Russian MoD has any clue what’s happening.
The Ukrainians don’t know.
The U$ military doesn’t know (despite having 24/7 surveillance along the entire battlefront).
All of our preferred pundits and yt, bloggers, analysts are all only sourcing the same open source info we have @bar.
Some, like Macgregor and Ritter, have careers with seniority in the US military that gives them a wider perspective than mug punters here.
Berletic has US military experience, reads and researches widely, and has a deep intellect _ meaning his analysis is more sober and nuanced.
People here follow the Duran. I find the vids too long, so watch only if there’s a “surprising” development…
Macgregor is getting a following… he has first hand experience of destroying two countries, so he knows what to look for in the Russian military and what that might mean for future campaigns.
He might have contacts still serving…. But the US military itself is confounded by what the Russians are doing…

So…. This bar, Berletic, then Macgregor + Ritter (at the moment) are the “best” options.
Hang around the bar, find the patrons you think are offering something of value, and follow links to their sources.. that’s all anybody here or elsewhere is doing…
———
Just at upload…. There is one person here that is doing absolute heroic work…and that’s karlof1. Karl is working like Hercules to bring the bar primary material from Russian sources …. Putin + Lavrov pressers, speeches, documents.
I don’t know anywhere else apart from MoA that has this primary material.
But most here ignore it… too long, too laborious, too tedious.
And it’s discredited because it’s… Russian.
Laughable, when the ONLY ones who have *any* clue about what is planned is the Putin-military admin.

Posted by: Melaleuca | Dec 21 2022 4:30 utc | 72

On TASS this morning (the twentieth):

"Zelensky already on his way to Washington – CNN"

Unlike everybody else, I know little about war and the international machinations that start them and kept them going past all decency.

For instance, that you could pass a good part of the Alps mountain range into Ukraine or volumes of weapons and get away with it, I did not imagine. Or why Zelensky's plane is still in the air crossing that lone Atlantic flight.
As an amateur, I thought if they track every plane and gyrocopter flight in stunning detail on youtube,why are these two things able to happen?

Posted by: Elmagnostic | Dec 21 2022 4:38 utc | 73

Elmagnostic | Dec 21 2022 4:38 utc | 72
The Russians can track The Comedian’s plane.
They don’t want to shoot it down.
Z is more likely to be taken out by the U$.
He’s taking a risk visiting Biden.
They have fast acting cancers that took out Hugo Chavez.
Or a “covid”….

Posted by: Melaleuca | Dec 21 2022 4:50 utc | 74

Posted by: karlof1 | Dec 21 2022 2:40 utc | 65

Good for him. Irrelevant to whether he knows anything, as Martyanov noted.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Dec 21 2022 4:52 utc | 75

Posted by: Melaleuca | Dec 21 2022 4:30 utc | 71

Pretty much agree. I watched Defense Politics Asia's map for a while, but he keeps zooming in and out and moving the map around so it practically gives you a headache. I picked up on Dima, but then he blew it several times by making claims that didn't hold water (I forget which ones exactly) on various interviews.

Then I realized from Martyanov that all this village-by-village crap was completely meaningless. All that matters is the overall progress. Following day by day is a waste of time. Now I just let Mercouris summarize it in the first fifteen minutes of his video (the last half hour he tends to ramble and repeat himself about how he doesn't understand Ukraine tactics or lack thereof - who cares?), and frequently listen to Berletic take apart the NATO weapons "wunderwaffen" of the week. Occasionally Ritter or Macgregor for current overview, but until the Russian offensive starts it's pretty much same-old-same-old stuff I already know.

Not terribly useful following the war unless something special happens, like the Moskva, the Crimean bridge, the Kherson withdrawal and the like. I mean, Bahkmut has been going on for four months, for Christ's sakes. For at least three of those, the Russians have been "nearing the center of the city." Now for the last week or more, it's been "they're encircling the city." Anyone remember the "closing the cauldron" bullshit of the first month of the war? That was never true.

Best to wait for actual outcomes like actually controlling a major place like Mariupol. Everything else is a waste of time.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Dec 21 2022 5:06 utc | 76

melaleuca 21224:30@71

thank you, as always exactly what we are thinking, succinctly said. & yes as always a grateful thank you to karloff & peter & b.

Posted by: emersonreturn | Dec 21 2022 5:06 utc | 77

The logic of nazism leads to genocide. It's embarrassing that the neo-Nazi politics of USUKIS is able to point the finger at those fighting against genocide in Ukraine as being the ones doing genocide.

So long as the Nazi manipulation of the truth continues unchallenged in Western public discussion, the more likely that Westerners will lose their sensitivity to truth. This is how Nazism conquered the minds of the German people, by normalising deceit and demonising truth.

Only two outcomes are possible. Either the West as a collective mentality flips into Nazism as happened in Gernany and the rest of the world fights a world war agsinst us to defeat our delusional state of mind, or, the censorship of public discussion in the West is broken and sanity is restored.

If blanket censorship of the truth about USUKIS aggression over the last 50 years continues to control the narrative, we have to leave now, because Nazism is already here.
It's time to pack our bags and go when the state has achieved total censorship over all opposition. i.e. Now .

Posted by: Giyane | Dec 21 2022 5:11 utc | 78

@68 Peter AU1

Thanks for bringing me up to speed on that. I watched the most puzzling video of what was obviously homemade drone footage of two men moving a washer from a damaged home, makes a lot more sense knowing it was faked.

Posted by: NJH | Dec 21 2022 5:43 utc | 79

@ 77

Islamism is Islamic Nazism, as in Erdogan's assisting Nato to createcand run Islamic State. Turkey sided with Germany in WW1 and lost its Caliphate. Its membership of Nato means only one thing, that Turkey is still backing the wrong side 100 years later, now that USUKIS is playing Nazis.

Politics is not a fancy dress ball where masks are worn. If politicians continue to place """ national interests """ above the
nterests of humanity, the cxatastrophe of Armaggeddon or Global warming will kill us all. Politicians never had a lick of sense.
Pass the biscuits please.

Posted by: Giyane | Dec 21 2022 5:46 utc | 80

⚡️🇷🇺🇺🇦⚔️ #Chronicle of the Special Military Operation for 20 Dec 2022⚡️

♦️#Bryansk Region:

▪️ Ukrainian militants shelled the village of #Suzemka. Railway tracks and power lines were damaged. The power supply in the settlement was temporarily cut.

▪️ An AFU drone have hit the district electric networks in the Trubchevsky district, damaging an administrative building and a vehicle. There were no deaths or injuries.

♦️#Kursk Region:

▪️ Enemy militants struck the village of #Makhnovka in the #Suzhan district, residential buildings were damaged and a fire broke out on the site of the arrivals. One woman was injured.

♦️#Belgorod Region:

▪️ Ukrainian militants shelled #Shebekino. Residential buildings, warehouses and infrastructure were hit. There were temporary problems with electricity and water supply in the city. One civilian was wounded.

♦️#Starobelsk Direction (MAP):

▪️ In the #Kupyansk - #Svatovo section, units of the RF Armed Forces are attacking Ukrainian formations near #Dvurechnoye and #Petropavlovka.

➖ The Ukrainian command moved the 3rd Battalion of the AFU's 14th Mechanized Brigade to the area of #Sinkovka and #Berestovoye to reinforce the defence.

▪️ In the #Liman sector, the enemy is preparing for a large-scale offensive on #Dibrova with the aim of continuing to #Kremennaya and the #Svatovo - #Kremennaya highway.

♦️#Soledar Direction (MAP):

▪️ In the #Soledar sector, Ukrainian formations are spread information about the complete loss of #Yakovlevka and the advance of the RF Armed Forces towards #Soledar and #Razdolovka.

➖ In the northeast, fighting continues at the site of the gas compressor station near #Spornoye.

▪️ In the #Bakhmut (#Artyomovsk) sector, Wagner PMC assault troops are engaged in fierce fighting in #Bakhmut and #Opytnoye. Russian artillery is hitting the enemy strongholds en masse.

➖ In the southwest, Russian troops have pushed Ukrainian formations from the eastern outskirts of #Kleshchiyevka.

♦️#Donetsk Direction:

▪️ Fighting continues in #Maryinka. The motorized rifle units of the RF Armed Forces are pushing the enemy to the western outskirts of the town.

▪️ Ukrainian terrorists have shelled populated areas of the #Donetsk agglomeration with rocket and gun artillery. A clinic and a neurosurgery department in #Donetsk have also been hit. One patient was killed and another wounded.

♦️#Zaporozhye Direction:

▪️ In preparation for a possible offensive on #Tokmak, the AFU command continues to move additional forces into forward positions across the front.

▪️ Artillery duels continue along the line of contact. Russian troops have hit enemy positions in #Temirovka, Malaya Shcherbaki, #Dorozhnyanka, #Belogorye and #Novoandreyevka.

♦️#Kherson Direction on Southern Front:

▪️ The AFU is using drones and informers to search for positions of the RF Armed Forces and supply lines along the banks of the #Dnipro River.

▪️ Russian artillery shelled Ukrainian formations in #Berislav, #Chernobaevka, #Antonovka and the outskirts of Kherson.

For their part, enemy terrorists shelled a school and a polyclinic in Novaya Kakhovka with barrel artillery.

https://t.me/sitreports/2366

Posted by: Down South | Dec 21 2022 5:49 utc | 81

⚡️🇷🇺🇺🇦📜 Military Expert Boris Rozhin on the Prospects of Storming #Avdeyevka⚡️

🔹1. A frontal assault on #Avdeyevka through the industrial zone or from #Novobakhmutovka at the current stage does not promise any significant results, both due to the lack of forces for a frontal assault in this direction, and due to the presence of serious enemy fortifications and the undefeated #Avdeyevka group, which is in much better condition than #Artyomovsk (#Bakhmut), which is now bleeding to death.

🔹2. But even if, say, the RF Armed Forces command concentrates more substantial forces for such an assault, we can hardly talk about any swift rushes to #Avdeyevka, if we look at the pace of advancement in #Maryinka or #Artyomovsk. And, as is easy to guess, the shelling will continue.

🔹3. More promising is an increased pressure south of #Avdeyevka on #Tonenkoye, as well as renewed attacks in the direction of #Krasnogorovka north of #Avdeyevka and the establishment of stronger control over the #Kamenka area.

In other words, more active action against the flanks of the #Avdeyevka group is relevant. But even in the current realities, this will require pumping up the grouping in the #Donetsk direction with additional forces.

At the same time, the command must keep in mind the situation in the #Ugledar and #Zaporozhye directions, as well as the need for an offensive against #Artyomovsk and #Soledar.

🔹4. Therefore, during the current phase of the operation no rapid change is expected in the #Avdeyevka sector. The #Nevelskoye - #Vodyanoye, #Maryinka, #Artyomovsk and #Soledar areas appear to be more promising.

https://t.me/sitreports/2370

Posted by: Down South | Dec 21 2022 5:50 utc | 82

🇺🇸🇨🇳🇷🇺US Ambassador to NATO: Russia and China are developing joint strategies for the collapse of NATO

"Among the tools she named threats to energy supply and cybersecurity",added Julianne Smith.

US Permanent Representative Julianne Smith said that Washington does not intend to shift the attention of NATO allies to the Asia-Pacific region, but only seeks to ensure a strong internal defense policy of the alliance countries.

The United States is concerned that Russia and China may exchange tools and strategies aimed at undermining the unity of NATO. This was stated on Tuesday by the permanent representative of the United States to the alliance, Julianne Smith.

"They [Russia and China] are increasingly using common tools, which should be of concern to NATO," the Financial Times quoted Smith as saying. The American diplomat believes that Moscow and Beijing are "exchanging hybrid tactics," and points to factors such as risks to energy supplies and cybersecurity issues. "There is no doubt that they are working to divide the partners in the transatlantic alliance. We are well aware of these attempts and intend to fight them," she said.

The United States is increasingly inclining other members of the alliance to toughen their positions towards China, writes the Financial Times. Washington motivates this with Beijing's military developments, threats to the critical infrastructure of Western countries, in particular, transport and energy networks, and China's "unlimited partnership" with Russia, the newspaper said. Smith stressed that the United States does not intend to shift the attention of NATO allies to the Asia-Pacific region, but only seeks to ensure a strong internal defense policy of the alliance countries.

https://www.ft.com/content/3146a413-9aba-4fd4-86a7-671bce0e6c00

https://t.me/azmilitary11/31400

Posted by: Down South | Dec 21 2022 5:52 utc | 83

🇷🇺🇷🇺The Urals Defense Enterprise will switch to a six-day workweek.

Employees at Kurganmashzavod, who work under a special regime, will switch to a six-day work schedule. The employees will work 12 hours a day on weekdays and 8 hours on Saturdays. The rest of the core production staff will continue to work according to the previous schedule.

The decision was taken in connection with the fulfilment of 🇷🇺 the state defence order. The respective order has already been issued, and the new schedule is scheduled to take effect in 2023.

Earlier, it was reported that the💻 Urals factory workers will switch to Russian messenger

The Kurganmashplant (KMP) will implement IVA AVES, a new Russian messenger with video conferencing support. It was developed by Rostec Corporation, which also owns KMZ.The decision to use the Russian messenger was made on the basis of increased security requirements. It is claimed that the level of security in the software is higher than in Skype.

The company fulfils the state defence order and produces infantry and paratrooper combat vehicles.

https://t.me/Slavyangrad/25709

Posted by: Down South | Dec 21 2022 5:58 utc | 84

I am reading that Z is coming to the US and going to speak before the CongressCritters.

But we are suppose to believe that there are "No boots on the ground" related to Ukraine.

When does parts of the charade blow up?

I hope that a few of the CongressCritters make some noise about my tax dollars being spent of propping up nazis instead of fixing some US infrastructure.

The shit show continues until it doesn't

Posted by: psychohistorian | Dec 21 2022 6:51 utc | 85

Melaleuca #71

++ and thanks for the summary. Peter AU1 at his VK channel is maintaining a bible on bio labs and associated necessaries for when the Nuremberg 2 discussions begin.

I just heard the f#cking ground is still soft in Ukraine. So we wait until January for the deep freeze and mighty Russian sneeze. Sigh - more vodka please:)

Posted by: uncle tungsten | Dec 21 2022 6:53 utc | 86

Zelensky to appear before US Congress today, or a cunning plan do depose him? Or both?

https://t.me/Slavyangrad/25699

Posted by: Norwegian | Dec 21 2022 6:59 utc | 87

Posted by: anon2020 | Dec 20 2022 18:39 utc | 26

Iirc, there was a Canadian general with similar name to Cloutier who got in legal trouble back home, so packed his bags & headed to Ukr as a merc. His name turned up as the likely General trapped w/Azovs in Mariupol.

Posted by: Mary | Dec 21 2022 7:14 utc | 88

Posted by: Down South | Dec 21 2022 5:50 utc | 81

"But even in the current realities, this will require pumping up the grouping in the #Donetsk direction with additional forces. At the same time, the command must keep in mind the situation in the #Ugledar and #Zaporozhye directions, as well as the need for an offensive against #Artyomovsk and #Soledar."

300,000 more troops (or 150,000 more if we cut it in half as Macgregor suggests, ignoring support troops) - and they still can't get enough forces? Also, why are they planning offensives in four different directions? Why not finish Bakhmut and then go after the others with more concentrated forces? Are they afraid that if they pull any troops away from one of the four places that the Ukrainians will achieve a breakthrough somewhere? With 150,000 more Russian troops, 1,500 tanks (allegedly) and thousands of artillery, plus air power?

This implies one of two things: 1) they're holding the forces back for some reason, or 2) they are holding them back for an offensive somewhere else.

Or the entire report is bullshit.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Dec 21 2022 7:45 utc | 89

Posted by: Melaleuca | Dec 21 2022 4:30 utc | 71

I think it was during early summer - or summer – when Brian Berletic argued that leaving Kherson poses no problem for SMO. Turned out to be very true. One of the few predictions, so against the grain for that matter.

I appreciated that insight very much.

Posted by: js | Dec 21 2022 7:46 utc | 90

@Posa

Story is likely true, yet reported as a Russian problem, not Ukrainian. That's the nature of propaganda, after all. Take a truth and hide the others.

Posted by: Lysa | Dec 21 2022 7:57 utc | 91

js | Dec 21 2022 7:46 utc | 89

"I think it was during early summer - or summer – when Brian Berletic argued that leaving Kherson poses no problem for SMO."

That was before Kherson was solemnly proclaimed to be sacred Russian soil.

It remains a mystery why they held the Kherson referendum at all when they were already contemplating abandoning the capital.

Posted by: Flying Dutchman | Dec 21 2022 8:14 utc | 92

Posted by: js | Dec 21 2022 7:46 utc | 89

The Kherson withdrawal per se was never the problem. The problem was why Russia didn't reinforce the strategic bridgehead and prepare it for use against Ukraine in the event the Ukrainians retreat across the Dnieper (thereby allowing a flanking attack without having to cross the river under fire because it was already crossed) and/or to prevent the bridgehead from being threatened (not to mention Kherson City). And if the dam was a problem, why did it take nine months to discern that? Those reasons were mostly BS excuses for not having prosecuted the Kherson area properly from the get-go, as I said at the time.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Dec 21 2022 8:16 utc | 93

Posted by: Flying Dutchman | Dec 21 2022 8:14 utc | 91

Not a mystery. They screwed up. See above.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Dec 21 2022 8:17 utc | 94

Xi Jinping met with Dmitry Medvedev, today, in Beijing
Medvedev delivered President Putin's message to Chinese President Xi Jinping. Medvedev and Xi Jinping discussed the situation in the post-Soviet space, including the Ukrainian crisis.
https://t.me/azmilitary11/31416
"China is ready to move closer to Russia for the sake of more fair global governance"-Xi Jinping
~~~~~
Senator Penny Wong (Australia)
>…”I've just landed in Beijing for bilateral discussions with China's State Councilor and Minister of Foreign Affairs, Wang Yi.
Our talks coincide with the 50th anniversary of diplomatic relations between Australia and the People’s Republic of China.
https://mobile.twitter.com/SenatorWong/status/1605276933318934529

Wong:
…> “We have much to discuss.
Australia’s approach is to cooperate where we can, disagree where we must and engage in the national interest.”
ErrrUmm. Is she plagiarising Blinken @ Alaska meeting?
Better not be…. Words didn’t yield a good response the first time…

Posted by: Melaleuca | Dec 21 2022 8:20 utc | 95

The domino effect....

In Moldova, the pro-Western government is following the path taken by Ukrainian President Zelensky in 2021: all TV channels critical of the government have been banned and the parliamentary opposition arrested.