Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
November 8, 2022
Ukraine Open Thread 2022-193

Only for news & views directly related to the Ukraine conflict.

Please stick to the topic.

The current open thread for other issues is here.

Comments

” RUSSIA IS FIGHTING A WAR OF ATTRITION BY DESIGN and it will take whatever time required to destroy the Ukrainian military COMPLETELY and destroy European unity COMPLETELY. Why bother to even post? Let’s all just sit back and let it unfold!
Posted by: FHTEX | Nov 9 2022 0:05 utc | 98 ”
If true, how would Russian soldiers and their families feel about the fact that they are being ” attritioned ” by design also ? If you actually believe thats a valid strategy then your soul has turned dark.

Posted by: Deplorable Commissar | Nov 9 2022 0:43 utc | 101

@ bevin | Nov 8 2022 17:50 utc | 14
thanks and thanks again for sharing that!
@ Chevrus | Nov 8 2022 18:02 utc | 16
i agree, but they are taking their time getting round to it….

Posted by: james | Nov 9 2022 0:44 utc | 102

It’s somewhat OT concerning ex-Ukraine but I was thinking about commenting on “the big one” and as far as I could see Johnstone didn’t have a link to the official DoD article so I’ll add a little to her article and Karlof1’s comment.
This is my incomplete comment that I haven’t yet posted. I’m not going to complete it.
It’s only a different take on things, maybe not a good one.
Here it is:
(Incomplete)
About those Public Relations “victories”
‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾
“Vantablack comedy™” warning.
It’s bots all the way down.
These guys (“the west”) aren’t going to be able to protect the US, they’re not even going to be able to protect Guam, Alaska, Hawaii, or Canada 🙂
Don’t let this get to you, stop if it does, enjoy life without caring for these fools, be unhealthy if you have to 🙂
Ask ten thousand people in “the west” about what the US Stratcom commander said on November the 3rd and you’re unlikely to find anyone who knows, just like me until today. [“Today” was the somewhere between the 6th and early 8th.]
The US Stratcom commander is the guy who’s work description ought to read “try not to end humanity”.
Well it’s not like he’ll care about his job if or when he messes up that badly so until then anything goes 😛
What was said is not under-reported, it’s in the MSM, it’s just not important enough because no one actually takes the US seriously when they say this because in one way or another they’re always saying this. It’s one of many reasons people don’t follow the news and will parrot whatever they think most people are saying.
It they engage their brains they might go “this guy is crazy” but at the cost of increased blood pressure or other detrimental effects, so they’re better off not caring or paying attention.

“The big one is coming”

—public and official statement given by U.S. Strategic Command commander Navy Admiral Charles A. Richard in charge of the US nuclear triad ie. all US nuclear weapons during the US Naval Submarine League’s 2022 Annual Symposium & Industry Update’s Awards Luncheon on November 3rd 2022 and later published by the US DoD.
Stratcom is short for “US Strategic Command” aka “US’Nukes’Я’Us”.
They published it in an article named “Stratcom Commander Says U.S. Should Look to 1950s to Regain Competitive Edge” which is a very funny title and idea.
Of course “the big one” is always around the corner and just in case it wasn’t the US would have their very best hard at work to ensure it got back on track and is again due to arrive shortly.
1. US officials are a persistent global public health hazard.
2. Remember that there is zero justification for US belligerence anywhere in the world.
[And that’s all I wrote. Well, at least I’ve shared the link now]

Posted by: Sunny Runny Burger | Nov 9 2022 1:04 utc | 103

It’s an important read; please do so!!
Posted by: karlof1 | Nov 9 2022 0:32 utc | 100

Yet another analysis that frames the issue entirely within a political context. If you only have a hammer, you’re always looking for a nail …
Readers, please do yourself at least the favor by reviewing m king Hubberts conclusions in 1956, the club of Romes report from 1972, and more currently, Agenda 2030.
There’s a reason behind the global events playing out today, and it’s not just an ego trip or demonic quest for power by the evil empire.
Someone is going to win, and by doing so will control the resources by which the various population control schemes and other de-growth programs are implemented.
If it makes you feel better simply finding someone else who agrees with you that the US is a crazed dog that is threatening the world and needs to be put down, well knock yourself out.
But if you value intelligence, rationality and meaning, then focus on what’s really happening so that you can understand the players, goals and motivations driving current events.

Posted by: B9k9 | Nov 9 2022 1:06 utc | 104

Posted by: Featherless | Nov 8 2022 17:26 utc | 11
Posted by: morongobill | Nov 8 2022 17:39 utc | 12
Concern troll alert.

Posted by: Ed Nelson | Nov 9 2022 1:08 utc | 105

Massive breakdowns in voting machines in multiple states during the US midterm elections. … Voting precincts have run out of ballots, and (get this) have even run out of paper. … Voters are being turned away. … Voters are being given ‘provisional ballots’ that may be challenged and thrown out. … Irregularities are everywhere. … Mail-in ballots using old databases with dead people, people who moved out of state, etc.
So, remember when Tony Blinken called the Donbas Referendums a ‘Sham’?
American arrogance on display tonight.

Posted by: Mummer | Nov 9 2022 1:19 utc | 106

1. US officials are a persistent global public health hazard.
2. Remember that there is zero justification for US belligerence anywhere in the world.
Posted by: Sunny Runny Burger | Nov 9 2022 1:04 utc | 103
Yep.

Posted by: Saint Jimmy | Nov 9 2022 1:19 utc | 107

At some point there has got to be some sort of critical mass of Germans collectively saying WTF in regard to the US sponsored sabotage of NordStream?
Posted by: Chevrus | Nov 8 2022 18:02 utc | 16
Put a mustache and taupe on Olaf Scholz and he looks amazingly like another German Chancellor.

Posted by: Ed Nelson | Nov 9 2022 1:21 utc | 108

Last weekend ZH posted Chrystia Freeland will lead NATO as Sec General…. finally we will have a hardline and granddaughter of a NAZI leading NATO…
Posted by: JC | Nov 8 2022 17:59 utc | 15

If it gets her out of government and the country and into harm’s way, then I am all for it.
Her Ukrainian grandfather Michael Chomiak edited a pro-Nazi Ukrainian paper called Krakivski Visti in Krakow. Perhaps she could move into his old office.

Posted by: Opport Knocks | Nov 9 2022 1:25 utc | 109

Put a mustache and taupe on Olaf Scholz and he looks amazingly like another German Chancellor.
Posted by: Ed Nelson | Nov 9 2022 1:21 utc | 108
Amazing, isn’t it? He even claims to have socialist tendencies while kissing the azz of imperialist corporations and militaries. Germans must be as ignorant and numb as are Americans.

Posted by: Saint Jimmy | Nov 9 2022 1:28 utc | 110

@ whirlX 26
Thanks for your realistic description of the situation in Germany. A large part of the people in East Germany are on Russia’s side. But they are also realistic enough to know that demonstrations and uprisings do nothing. The system of repression works perfectly and is merciless. Corona has given us a taste. It might be different if Russia openly declared its intention to take back its sovereign rights in East Germany and armed the resistance. After all, that’s what the Yanks are doing. Those who believe in or want a future leave the country. Like so many people in the last 2 years that I care about. Fittingly, there is a Jewish saying, “The pessimists went to America, the optimists went to concentration camps.” Or for those who know the fairy tale by the Brothers Grimm, “The Bremen Town Musicians,” “We can find something better than death anywhere.”
Abroad, people have a certain image of Germans and their virtues such as punctuality, diligence, bravery, reliability and inventiveness. These qualities are at most still represented by the 50+ generation. But also by some early immigrants or Russians with German roots who came to Germany from Kazakhstan etc. in the 90s. The younger generation is a characterless, easily malleable, historically and politically uneducated mass, without ambition and will. That’s why they don’t find anything wrong when the government destroys a secure energy supply and wants to replace it with random power. They only understand the catastrophe caused by the destruction of the Nordstream pipelines when they are sitting in the dark and there is nothing left to eat. But then, of course, Putin was to blame for that, too.
We are facing an energy crisis, a financial crisis, a food crisis and possibly a major war. There has never been such a concentration in history. Each problem on its own can be enough to plunge a country into chaos. So everything is going according to plan.

Posted by: Uwe | Nov 9 2022 1:34 utc | 111

@GoFast 2:
The Junkyard Of The Faker posted an article in mid February promising victory on 3 to 4 days. A lot of people grabbed on to it like divine writ and began sharing it around.
Of course Russia didn’t envisage a war lasting over 6 months. This is why the 6 month contracts ran out and there was nobody left to defend Kharkov and a new army had to be built up from scratch by mobilisation.
And this is something I and others had been warning for years: by failing to destroy the nazis in 2014-15, Putin ensured that they would be built up to be a NATO army in all but name, while Ukrainian society was systematically nazified, and that Russia would ultimately have to fight a NATO regular army in Ukranazistani uniform. And for saying this the towering geniuses on comment fora like this one – among whom were the very same people sharing around the Junkyard Of The Faker article – called us “idiots” and “trolls”.

Posted by: Biswapriya Purkayast | Nov 9 2022 1:44 utc | 112

Posted by: Biswapriya Purkayast | Nov 9 2022 1:44 utc | 112
Pfffft…. It doesn’t matter. Ukraine will never get those provinces back. It will now be an impoverished, backwater, hillbilly Slavic rump state begging from its arrogant, disdainful Germanic and Latin owners.

Posted by: Saint Jimmy | Nov 9 2022 1:50 utc | 113

I was looking around on the Hromadske website today and all they had new was some boring video about a returnable drone that can drop a small bomb. I saw a “Sun” video about how the Ukies had taken Kupyansk but I thought I had remembered that they really hadn’t or it was back in September. Supposedly this video was put out by the Sun yesterday but the deciduous trees and brushes all had green leaves and hadn’t lost any yet, although as person watches, its obvious that this video has been spliced together over time, as well as having pieces and parts of other video added to it. The opening infantry scene in a house yard and garden looks staged as there seems to be no return fire coming for their “enemy”. But for most of the people seeing this in the West would have no idea that this was a month to 6 weeks old or that much of it wasn’t “live action.” It shouldn’t be surprising but…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XUAyNLw5H7E
P.S. This is the first Ukie video where I’ve seen their infantry carrying American rifles. Maybe because they are the “Kraken” and the’re special…

Posted by: DakotaRog | Nov 9 2022 1:52 utc | 114

#77, #79
Don’t think I’m a moron, but could be. One sent a pic with battle music and great tough music….but still silly TOA fireworks, MOAB was dropped in Afghanistan not Iraq. My bad. Please show me the destruction of a TOS 1a battlefield destruction. Make me change my mind.

Posted by: RicK | Nov 9 2022 1:56 utc | 115

@B9k9 104
I agree with them. These contexts in the past surprisingly almost nowhere publicized. While I encountered these issues several years ago, I could not or would not believe that the plans would become reality. People would fight back after all. Would they? Now it feels like the evil werewolf, the character of scary stories around the campfire, has now taken shape and is descending upon the audience.
We live in a very strange time. Whereas in the past we had to rely on deep research, whistleblowers and dropouts who revealed sinister plans, now the criminals at congresses and their homepages tell us more or less openly to our faces what they are planning for mankind. Billions of “useless eaters” (Harari) are to disappear. And how do the future victims react? With enthusiasm. “Yes, destroy the economy, destroy the farmers, eliminate a reliable energy supply, give us lethal gene therapy!” You were afraid of the zombie apocalypse? It’s already here.

Posted by: Uwe | Nov 9 2022 2:04 utc | 116

#89
Only American industry could turn a 1000 gallon barrel of gasoline into 16m bucks.

Posted by: RicK | Nov 9 2022 2:19 utc | 117

“Russia has air superiority, but not air supremacy”.
Air superiority apparently covers a situation where your planes get shot down. And shot down when they are flying close to the ground and only on the edge of the front. Not a good condition for “carpet bombing runs”.

Posted by: Simon | Nov 9 2022 2:21 utc | 118

If you actually believe thats a valid strategy then your soul has turned dark.
Posted by: Deplorable Commissar | Nov 9 2022 0:43 utc | 101
Millions of civilians died under US invasions, and one US official even said: “We don’t do civilians.” The darkest hearts are in the US Government.
War is war, especially war against darkly brutal Ukraine.
No Monroe Doctrine, no peace. No mercy.

Posted by: KitaySupporter | Nov 9 2022 2:31 utc | 119

@ Posted by: Mummer | Nov 9 2022 1:19 utc | 1o6
———-‐-
I voted to cancel my wife’s vote. 😀

Posted by: Forest | Nov 9 2022 2:42 utc | 120

GreyRaven | Nov 8 2022 21:16 utc | 64
____
Well said, Grey. When karlof1 offers his pearls of wisdom, some are also cast before swine and trampled in the mud. They are unable to comprehend the critical value of historical context.

Posted by: Doug Hillman | Nov 9 2022 2:47 utc | 121

@ karlof1 | Nov 9 2022 0:19 utc | 99
Lavrov has refuted the many lies so many times he can do it in his sleep.
re: And if Russia’s Lavrov has ever responded publicly to these repeated lies it has gone largely unnoticed.
Then surely you can provide some published and noticed statements by Lavrov (when he wasn’t asleep) that refute Blinken’s lies?

Posted by: Don Bacon | Nov 9 2022 2:51 utc | 122

Russia is not killing masses of civilians. If it were, every western media source would be plastered with the evidence. Even in the great raid after the Kerch Bridge attack the death toll never went about 20 claimed by Kiev. It’s months into this. We can safely surmise that the low civilian death toll from Russian actions is by clear choice.
There are good reasons for it, and the decision is rational even though it also limits behavior. Behavior limits are compounded by Kiev’s genera unwillingness to evacuate civilians. Contrast with Russia’s orderly evacuation of Kherson. There won’t be carpet bombing because there can’t be carpet bombing because there are civilians.
Russia has other limits on its behavior including preparing for the last war at the battlefield level, the corruption endemic in all militaries, etc etc etc. But the limiting factor is avoidance of civilian casualties followed closely by an avoidance of Russian losses. Those are top Russian priorities. They shape everything else. Until a terrible attack against Russia is successful, they’ll remain the top priorities.

Posted by: Lex | Nov 9 2022 3:02 utc | 123

Posted by: karlof1 | Nov 8 2022 19:00 utc | 31
‘the Truth must be upheld, and the West’s Master be held accountable.’
Those words should be ‘holy’ – but they are not. The funny and interesting interpretation of the Old Testament by Leszek Kolakowski in his collection of short stories ( Der Himmelsschlüssel) considers the tale of Jacob and Esau, sons of Isaak and Rebecca. Esau was the first-born and exchanged his right as the first-born for the meal of lentils prepared by his younger brother Jacob. The truth was exchanged for a narrative… Kolakowski’s comes to one of four conclusions that “the past does not determine the future, but other way around”…
The accountability of West’s Master is also not a “must” – it is optional, and depends on many things, one of the determinants is who will win.
Having said that – I agree with your thinking and appreciate and learn from your comments, as well as others.

Posted by: fanto | Nov 9 2022 3:20 utc | 124

Below is the ZH title of an interesting posting and I will provide a quote
China Cancels Top EU Official’s High-Profile Video Address For Ukraine War Comments
The quote

European Council president Charles Michel was set to deliver an address at the opening day of the China International Import Expo (CIIE) hosted in Shanghai on Friday, but Chinese authorities have pulled the pre-recorded video address in a very brazen act of censorship of a top official and diplomat, Reuters reports.
“As requested by the Chinese authorities, we had indeed provided a pre-recorded message which was ultimately not shown. We have addressed this through the normal diplomatic channels,” a statement from EC President Michel’s office confirmed.

Posted by: psychohistorian | Nov 9 2022 3:44 utc | 125

@ psychohistorian | Nov 9 2022 3:44 utc | 125
China Cancels Top EU Official’s High-Profile Video Address For Ukraine War Comments . . European Council president Charles Michel was set to deliver an address
Perhaps China is not impressed with the credentials of the European Council president, at a time when China is promoting states’ rights and the EU is promoting war. There in nothing in the UN Charter regarding continental councils. — “The Organization is based on the principle of the sovereign equality of all its Members.”

Posted by: Don Bacon | Nov 9 2022 3:57 utc | 126

” War is war, especially war against darkly brutal Ukraine.
No Monroe Doctrine, no peace. No mercy.
Posted by: KitaySupporter | Nov 9 2022 2:31 utc | 119 ”
You missed my point completely, but thanks for playing.

Posted by: Deplorable Commissar | Nov 9 2022 4:07 utc | 127

@Posted by: whirlX | Nov 8 2022 18:35 utc | 26
I agree with your observations – also just came back from visiting Germany – the atmosphere is subdued even in the former West Germany – my close friends believe the MSM, hate Putin, will burn wood in their oven (those who have them), and the better educated are just reluctant to talk politics; the newcomers from Ukraine behave in a demanding style (observed a whole group – about 30 men and women in 30s and 40s – coming to a free breakfast in the hotel where I was staying, they come there regularly once a week, ordered by the authorities of city or county) – even the other foreigners who served (from Afghanistan) were put off by that behavior ( saw that by exchanging glances with them and from their short comments). The Westerners in Germany have not experienced the crude Soviet style propaganda so that they are not ‘immunized’ against the lies in media, they do not have the skill to see through the tricks of lies and omissions and believe the badmouthing rather than the facts. Clearly, the welcoming atmosphere from the first big wave of refugees in 2015 is absent. This did not escape the attention of the rulers of media on both sides of the Atlantic : on the same day (Nov.6, 2022) the Frankfurter Allgemeine wrote about it on front page with huge title “Wir koennen nicht mehr”, and the NYT “Refugee crisis stirs discomfort in Europe”. Is this a random coincidence again that the media are so in unison? Or is it a secret hand behind the screen which moves the marionettes?

Posted by: fanto | Nov 9 2022 4:13 utc | 128

Posted by: Deplorable Commissar | Nov 9 2022 0:43 utc | 101

If true, how would Russian soldiers and their families feel about the fact that they are being ” attritioned ” by design also ?

How would they feel one day when they wake up an realize they’ve been turned into Iraq, Libya, Syria and US forces are occupying Moscow?

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Nov 9 2022 5:00 utc | 129

Posted by: RicK | Nov 9 2022 1:56 utc | 115
Fuck you. Do your own research instead of just running off at the mouth. Fucking troll.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Nov 9 2022 5:03 utc | 130

Despite the fighting and losses, Naftogaz has already distributed huge bonuses
Naftogaz demonstrates to all Ukrainians, how corruption can be legitimized in the form of giant bonuses, and that is considering that Vitrenko [*CEO of Naftogaz] could not cope with the elementary function and fill in the underground storage of gas for the winter.
Despite the fact that there are still two months until the end of the year, and Ukraine has an extremely difficult and unpredictable winter ahead, the management of Naftogaz has already distributed bonuses. About 3 billion hryvnias should be spent on the payment of remuneration to the staff of the company “for good work”.
And while the management of Naftogaz divides the premiums of UAH 3 billion during the war, a report on the company’s losses in the first half of 2022 has appeared. Only one thing surprises everyone: is everyone paid billions in bonuses if their company has gone into big losses instead of the planned profit?
Thus, according to the consolidated financial statements of the company, the damage for the first quarter of 2022 amounted to UAH 57.58 billion.

https://t.me/Slavyangrad/19302

Posted by: Down South | Nov 9 2022 5:07 utc | 131

⚡️🇷🇺🇺🇦⚔️ About the True Situation in #Bakhmut Direction at 8 Nov 2022⚡️
In recent days, unreliable information has appeared about the situation in the #Bakhmut direction. Therefore, I have contacted the guys on the ground and am reporting to you the true situation as of 8 November 2022:
▪️ Wagner PMC units have eliminated one of the two strongholds on the #Nikolaevka 2 – Gorlovka road section and advanced towards #Kurdyumovka;
▪️ Musicians also eliminated four AFU strongholds west of #Otradovka, advancing significantly towards #Andreevka and #Kleshcheevka;
▪️ The #Soledar suburb of #Bakhmutskoye was completely cleared; the Wagnerians joined their right flank with units of the 6th Cossack Regiment of the LPR People’s Militia at the KNAUF-Gypsum factory;
▪️ The storming of #Belogorovka continues. Wagner PMC units expanded their control zone in the village to the north of the road. In #Belogorovka itself, AFU units have established a major stronghold – the advance is complicated by heavy mine contamination, private buildings with long-term firing points and dugouts connected by communication passages.
▪️ Fighting continues near #Berestovoye, #Spornoye, #Verkhnekamenskoye, to the east and southeast of #Bakhmut, as well as in the northern #Belogorovka area, west of #Lysychansk.

https://t.me/Slavyangrad/19309

Posted by: Down South | Nov 9 2022 5:08 utc | 132

⚡️🇷🇺🇺🇦⚔️ Battle for #Kherson: Ukrainian Propaganda Fake Exposed 👻 – Situation in the #Snigirovka Front Section until the End of 8 Nov 2022⚡️
🚨 The Anatoly Shariya’s video “Defeat of RF Armed Forces at Snigirovka”, now actively published by Ukrainian and Russian sources, was shot more than a month ago in #Makeevka, LPR. The cameraman’s lens caught a Russian convoy hit by an AFU missile strike.
Coordinates: 49.224492, 37.977662
🩸 Amid rumours of the imminent withdrawal of Russian forces from the Right Bank and the abandonment of the north of the #Kherson region, Ukrainian formationd have been conducting combat reconnaissance in three areas: Posad-Pokrovskoye, #Berislav and #Snigirovka.
While in the first two the enemy suffered losses and retreated, heavy fighting took place in the morning in the #Snigirovka front section.
▪️ The enemy tried to break through by moving reserves from #Visunsk and #Bereznegovatoye.
▪️ We have no indications of a Ukrainian breakthrough. It is unclear whether the enemy managed to entrench themselves along the railway tracks on the northern outskirts of #Snigirovka. However, fighting is taking place along the northern edge of the city.
The settlement is now in the combat zone where aircraft, artillery and equipment are engaging the enemy. The 205th Brigade is holding the defences.
▪️ Polish and English-speaking mercenaries are involved in the offensive.
▪️ The AFU launched a missile attack on Russian equipment near #Snigirovka. They tried to cover the area where the convoys were forming. According to preliminary information, the equipment is on the move, there were no casualties, they got away with a light scare.

https://t.me/Slavyangrad/19310

Posted by: Down South | Nov 9 2022 5:10 utc | 133

I posted this in the tail end of the previous thread, I don’t think anyone in this thread has mentioned it yet and it’s important enough to repost.
One of the most significant Col Macgregor interviews yet, right up to date.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZJvLVc0gA6M

Posted by: Saul Goode | Nov 9 2022 5:44 utc | 134

Don Bacon @122–
That’s a very curious question since your moniker’s been active here for almost as long as mine. So how could you thus possibly have missed the many links to and excerpts from Lavrov’s many speeches and pressers? I’ve many captured at my VK for the inquisitive to read.

Posted by: karlof1 | Nov 9 2022 6:10 utc | 135

The Kherson regional authorities report that the front near Snigiryovka is being held and that no breakthrough has taken place.
This information is confirmed by Ukrainian sources, admitting that the Armed Forces of Ukraine failed to break through the Russian Armed Forces’ defensive lines “as it did in Kharkov” and that the Banderovites are suffering heavy losses.

https://t.me/Slavyangrad/19312

Posted by: Down South | Nov 9 2022 6:12 utc | 136

One of the issues most noticeable about the current Ukraine conflict which many here and at the usual blogs & vids have much commented on is the failure of any organised peace movement to appear.
This is particularly strange given the fact that many believe this conflict could with one slip-up by the charlatans, idiots and foolishly greedy types pushing it, cause that which has always been most worrisome for peace advocates, a full on nuclear conflict between the two nations with the biggest nuclear arsenals, amerika and Russia.
If that did happen there is little doubt that such an exchange would cease all life on earth, yet we hear little from any peace movement.
In one way this is not surprising as both amerika and england have, in addition to the usual blatant propaganda on their ‘news’ sites & vids overwhelmed vid audiences with a plethora of stories both contemporary and historical, which demonstrate by way of thriller, spy flick and straight out drama to their audiences that Russia = bad and USuk= good.
In fact anyone wanting evidence which demonstrates this war was entirely planned for by the west, would only have to point out to a credulous naif that since the earliest lead-in time for a TV drama, let alone a Hollywood flick is 18 months to 2 years all this anti-Russia trash that western citizens have been subjected to in 2022, was written & planned 2 years ago minimum to conclude ‘the west’ knew exactly what was coming well before the last prez beauty contest in 2020.
Still the lack of any organised peace movement is an obstacle to working for peace.
Hang-on what about the Plowshare Movement? That mob of dedicated anti-Nuclear Peace Activists is still going strong despite the participants never-ending rolling imprisonment.
No one can accuse a group of such dedicated, apolitical peace activists of being ‘Putin’s Puppets’ if they have seen this doco “The Nuns Priests and the Bombs” made in 2018 and mostly unviewed since then this doco shows us the history and participants in the Plowshare Movement without asking anyone to hold an opinion other than nukes will be the death of us all if we ordinary humans allow them to be used.
As such it is an excellent way to get people to think of the consequences of this conflict and why we all need to lean on governments to slow t’fuck down without forcing those people to alter their deep indoctrination around those evil Russkies.
Click the link grab a copy and circulate among friends & family.

Posted by: Debsisdead | Nov 9 2022 6:55 utc | 137

Election interference? Those damn Russkies again…
Good to know that us red blooded Americans would never dream of interfering in another sovereign’s politics. Probably.
The USA is a Christian, God fearing, peaceful nation-right?
I am wondering what my allegiance has been to exactly.
In all fairness, we don’t fear Satan much either.
Do your own research. Documented facts are available online.
“…since World War 2, U.S. imperialism has killed at least 36 million people globally in Japan, Korea, Vietnam, Cambodia, Laos, Indonesia, Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria, Yemen, the Congo, Chile, El Salvador, Guatemala, Colombia, Haiti, Puerto Rico, Cuba, Dominican Republic, Nicaragua, Chad, Libya, East Timor, Grenada, Honduras, Iran, Pakistan, Panama, the Philippines, Sudan, Greece, Yugoslavia, Bosnia, Croatia, Kosovo, Somalia, Argentina, Bolivia, Brazil, Paraguay, Uruguay, and Palestine”
https://mronline.org/2022/06/06/mapping-u-s-imperialism/
That’s just since WWII.
Before that we conquered and tried to exterminate an entire nation of people, Native Americans, first peoples, right here in America, home grown genocide.
Another example of “American Exceptionalism”?
Since we did a pretty good job of killing the first Americans, when do we get to stop slaughtering the rest of the world?
I know, I know – we only murder those who disagree with us.
It’s their fault.
Wave the red, white and blue and our government will kill more brown skinned (or even white skinned) people for you…by any means necessary.
Now they demand more blood. Another war. This time in Ukraine with Russia. Corporate profits are at stake.
No.

Posted by: Just Observing | Nov 9 2022 7:09 utc | 138

Posted by: Saul Goode | Nov 9 2022 5:44 utc | 134
Yes, it is very insightful.
It would be devastating for the US to enter such a major killing zone on the frontiers of the Russian Federation and put US exactly where Hitler’s forces were 80 years ago
https://research.calvin.edu/german-propaganda-archive/stalingrad1.htm

Posted by: Paul Greenwood | Nov 9 2022 7:30 utc | 139

Last night Ukrainian resources announced that Zelensky had demanded that the AFU command take Kherson before the G20 summit, which starts on November 15 in Indonesia, so that he would go to the summit as a real winner.
This message caused mixed reviews even in Ukraine, “I think Volodymyr Oleksandrovych will go to the G20 not as a winner, but as a sucker.
However, his usual condition. “he may also take the clay rooster with him, which he gave to Boris Johnson, so to speak, to complete his image” – writes one of the Ukrainian TG channels. I wonder another thing – is what is happening in Snigyrevka linked to Zelensky’s order, and is this the very same offensive, or another reconnaissance battle?
The first option is supported not only by the number of forces engaged by the Armed Forces of Ukraine, but also by the fact that the offensive began at an unusual time for such actions – not in the morning, as usual, but in the late evening.

https://t.me/Slavyangrad/19319

Posted by: Down South | Nov 9 2022 7:38 utc | 140

The battle for Kherson – the situation in the morning 09.11.22
After processing all the information received yesterday, we can conclude that the attack of the Armed Forces of Ukraine on Kherson, which they have been waiting for so long, has begun.
The enemy attack came from three sides at once – from Nikolaev to Kherson (Pravdino), to Snigirevka, from Dudchan along the reservoir to Melovoe.
Our troops beat off the first attack and forced the enemy to retreat. In the Snigirevka area, the enemy approached the settlement, but did not enter it; in the third, he also managed to move forward a little and gain a foothold.
Obviously, today the attacks will continue because the enemy has little time and he needs a significant result in the very near future.

https://t.me/Slavyangrad/19326

Posted by: Down South | Nov 9 2022 8:01 utc | 141

It would be devastating for the US to enter such a major killing zone on the frontiers of the Russian Federation
Paul Greenwood | Nov 9 2022 7:30 utc | 139
They don’t have to enter and fight, just send the brainwashed peasants from Poland and Romania. Poland begs for it already. Like they do in Syria, without directly fighting Russians and Syrian army, they use other terrorists to do the fighting. Russia doesn’t even touch the nazis in Ukr, and you think they’ll fight US troops sitting in their bases?
And why Russia is selling so much LNG for euro/usd to EU? NS1/2 are gone, no more money at all. Another half action turned useless just a few months later. Did some people get their accounts unfrozen in secret? They even announced other products will be sold only for rubles. That was quickly forgotten the next day, like the announced proof that UK exploded NS. Where is it, it was supposed to be “tomorrow” and it’s almost a week now?

Posted by: rk | Nov 9 2022 8:06 utc | 142

Posted by: Down South | Nov 9 2022 8:01 utc | 141
It’s on, like Donkey Kong!

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Nov 9 2022 8:06 utc | 143

alexander kamyshin ceo of Ukraine Railways spoke of plan b for electric trains….diesel locos. then theres a plan b for diesel …no kidding he said steam locos…
too much loco
well heres his post so you can actually believe it. yes and the steam train is a museum old soviet piece for cheese and wine trips in better days
https://t.me/cheburashkas_war_room/10232

Posted by: hankster | Nov 9 2022 8:07 utc | 144

Posted by: rk | Nov 9 2022 8:06 utc | 142

They don’t have to enter and fight, just send the brainwashed peasants from Poland and Romania.

They don’t make peasants like they used to.
Today’s soy sipping, playstation addicted, safe-space dependent, pronoun-sensitive peasants make poor cannon fodder.
It won’t take long for the Poles and Romanians to realise that this fight is really not theirs.
Not even the Azov Komissars will be able to keep them in the field.

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Nov 9 2022 8:10 utc | 145

The actor got himself an oscar after doing a few lines with Sean the super intellectual Penn. Alternate reality springs to mind, thousands of Ukrainians getting butchered every week down the road from his office and Hollywood hand him a gold statue. You couldn’t make it up, unless of course you’re a Hollywood producer.

Posted by: Eoin Clancy | Nov 9 2022 8:18 utc | 146

Posted by: Uwe | Nov 8 2022 22:30 utc | 215 ( from an older tread )
the link doesnt work

Dieses Video ist aufgrund einer Beschwerde wegen Urheberrechtsverletzung von BASF nicht mehr verfügbar

but why do you hide behind “… IEA and BASF analysts…” ?
the problem is simple enough
your statement was
“Now it’s official: Our gas will only last until February 2023.”
I claim this statement refers to the storage of gas in germany
According to the last data from GIE
germany has in storage 26,97% “filling level compared to annual consumption” at 99,55 % full storage
lets say 100% full and sufficient for a quarter of a year = 3 months
my argument “storage is NOT a 100% substitute for ongoing deliveries”
the reason for storage is the differnt levels of comsumption and a steady supply during a period ( year )
on the supply-side:
– 2020 consumtion in DE was 90,8 Billion cubic meters
– 2020 Delivery from russia 56,3 Billion cubic meters
thats a difference of 34,5 Billion cubic meters
question: what does this diffence means ?
the numbers alone means nothing:
because of the sanctions against russia and the fallout of the war in ukraine these numbers are changing
consumption is sinking because of demand destruction ; saving etc. ? sufficient ? sufficient for what ?
supply is changing ? enough ? enough for what ?
– LNG tankers idling off the spanish coast
political decisions are changing the daily live , society , the economy ….
BUT for your statement to be true germany must immediately cut all supplies ( pipeline, LNG , own production )
🙂 and no further savings; demand destructions …
we have enough garbage + half-truths +fakes in the internet !!
“..auch die halbe Wahrheit ist eine ganze Lüge..”

Posted by: ghiwen | Nov 9 2022 8:47 utc | 147

NS1/2 are gone, no more money at all.
Dear rk, the Contracts between Gazprom and German importers are TAKE OR PAY with 25 year term

Posted by: Paul Greenwood | Nov 9 2022 9:01 utc | 148

It won’t take long for the Poles and Romanians to realise that this fight is really not theirs.
In Operation Uranus 1942 the Red Army broke the Romanians at Stalingrad and encircled von Paulus’ 6th Army. – Romanians lost 158,000 dead and only 3,000 became POWs………
I think they well know the cost of fighting the Russians

Posted by: Paul Greenwood | Nov 9 2022 9:05 utc | 149

1942 there were 15 million Romanians so losing 158,000 dead would be 1,05%
US lost 58,000 dead in Vietnam from a population of 203 million = 0.02%
So if US had lost 2,200,000 dead in Vietnam …………

Posted by: Paul Greenwood | Nov 9 2022 9:09 utc | 150

Posted by: ghiwen | Nov 9 2022 8:47 utc | 147
If your point is Storage = Stock; and Usage = Flow; that is obvious.
The level of capacity filled in underground storage is irrelevant – the temperature is unseasonably high and 2022 in Germany has been one of warmest on record – ergo less heating is needed
On the other hand my air reeks of wood burning – and I mean pallets and treated woods with chemical residues………
German heating is oil in areas with no gas mains – heating oil is fractionated with diesel – so diesel runs into short supply.
BASF uses gas for the chemical feedstocks in the gas – that is why it built Nordstream – it has a huge facility at Ludwigshafen with thousands of kilometres of piping in an integrated chemical complex which cannot function without gas – and BASF alone consumes 5% German imports.
Mild weather means LNG prices fall so they pay $150,000/day to have tankers sitting offshore until the cold snap comes and prices rise
UK has no storage facilities because politicians in Cameron regime (Ed Davey) refused to permit them so UK sends gas to Belgium from N Sea and then buys spot in winter from Belgium – but maybe not this year when French nuclear is offline and France has strikes no-one likes to talk about
Nor does anyone mention IG Metall on strike so factories are idling
Nor does anyone mention strike ballots in UK
Nor does anyone mention 100,000 people every Monday in Eastern Germany protesting……..

Posted by: Paul Greenwood | Nov 9 2022 9:18 utc | 151

Proud Western puppet actor finally gets the recognition he deserves for his role of a lifetime:
https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-europe-63561236
“Hollywood actor Sean Penn gives his Oscar to Zelensky”
Ze probably would have preferred a direct line to Sean’s Mexican drug cartel contacts who hooked him up with El Chapo. Once Ukraine becomes Russia and Poland, he will need to find a new criminal enterprise to profit from…

Posted by: Et Tu | Nov 9 2022 9:26 utc | 152

Don Bacon @122–
Posted by: karlof1 | Nov 9 2022 6:10 utc | 135
“That’s a very curious question since your moniker’s been active here for almost as long as mine.”
Because it’s not “our” Don Bacon… It’s the fake one from Antiwar.com. I’ve pointed this out before. We called him “Fakin’ Bacon” over at Antiwar.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Nov 9 2022 9:26 utc | 153

Posted by: Saul Goode | Nov 9 2022 5:44 utc | 134
Ditto. Thank you for the link. I just viewed it. It’s definitely looking like the US is going to try a really stupid intervention over the winter once the Russian offensive begins – unless, of course, the Pentagon gets scared off after viewing that offensive’s effectiveness.

Posted by: Richard Steven Hack | Nov 9 2022 9:50 utc | 154

I find Wolfgang Streeck is always good. He has the EU summed up very well.
Posted by: bevin | Nov 8 2022 17:50 utc | 14
I never cease to be amazed by the failure of political understanding here, implying the underlying hatred of the EU so common among North American commenters on MoA (even those pretending to be British) (BTW it’s good to see so many supposed leftwingers enthusiastically furthering the interests of the Empire here).
Streeck is saying the precise reverse of what bevin claims. S says effectively that Scholz is betraying German interests here, and indeed EU interests. That this is poorly received in Germany is confirmed by the later comments by whirlX | Nov 8 2022 18:35 utc | 26 or fanto | Nov 9 2022 4:13 utc | 128. It is a revolution in policy which has nearly brought down Germany in a few months. Merkel balanced different strands, and kept things on the level over many years. Scholz has failed in a few months, along with idiot VDL (it reminds me a lot of the 45 days of Liz Truss in UK, But because it’s not the banksters, but US interests at issue, the punishment is not so immediate). Lesson in politics no.1: never confuse (as bevin does) the future of an institution with the idiots currently in power. One day they will be out, and others with other policies, will take their place.

Posted by: laguerre | Nov 9 2022 9:54 utc | 155

Posted by: fanto | Nov 9 2022 4:13 utc | 128
The situation is worse than that: most understand very well how mendacious officialdom has become but have no problem with that as long as their creature comforts are not disturbed (“go with the flow”, “the nail that sticks out will get hammered”,…)
Many have the quality of “anticipating obedience” and act as repeaters and amplifiers of official lies in hopes of ensuing benefits.
In short: there is a moral problem.

Posted by: bottle | Nov 9 2022 9:56 utc | 156

Aggregating from Slavyangrad and other reports.
Kupyansk: AFU 14th mech brigade on defensive after heavy losses
Lyman: AFU 66th brigade made unsuccessful storming attempt on Russian positions in Makeevka. AFU 81st airmobile brigade and 25th airmobile brigades tried to break through Russian lines near Kremennaya, but failed.
DPR: fighting in Avdeevka and Maryinka continue. UAF continues shelling civilian areas and electric stations
South Donetsk: weather turns to mud, hindering movements. Ugledar/Pavlovka advance has stopped due to clear need to destroy UAF forts and artillery posts with artillery(Kaskad).
Kherson / Zaporizhe / Nikolaev: UAF launched attack in Berislav area, which seemed to have some success and enabled to entrench in Dudchany. In Snigirovka AFU managed to entrench near railway tracks. UAF launched missile attacks in Snigirevka trying to cover RU columns. Lots of English and Polish chatter detected on radio channels.

Posted by: unimperator | Nov 9 2022 10:17 utc | 157

Ukrainian channel Legitimnyi on the events of Kherson area.
#Layout
We partially confirm yesterday’s information of colleagues that (https://t.me/ZE_kartel/6300) the Armed Forces of Ukraine could not take Snigirevka from a swoop, they ran into breakwaters.
As explained by the source.
1. – They were expected there.
2. – The motivation and readiness of the Russians is now much higher than it was six months ago.
3.- APU has no clear numerical superiority now. On the Kharkov direction there were 10 Ukrainian soldiers for one Russian. That was one of the reasons for the success.
The Armed Forces of Ukraine underestimated the enemy and suffered heavy losses.
The source indicates that the military hospitals are overcrowded.
https://t.me/legitimniy/14023

Posted by: unimperator | Nov 9 2022 10:27 utc | 158

⚡️🇷🇺🇺🇦⚔️ Battle for #Kherson: Situation in the #Andreevka – #Berislav Section at the End of 8 Nov 2022⚡️
▪️In the #Berislav sector, the AFU also conducted combat reconnaissance with forces today.
➖ Three mechanized platoons of the 60th Infantry Brigade and a platoon of the 515th Special Forces Battalion, supported by artillery and six SAUs, went on the offensive northeast of #Dudchany village.
➖ During the fighting, the combined units of the AFU managed to break through and gain a foothold in the farmland area 2 kilometres west of #Dudchany.
➖ Almost simultaneously, artillery calculations and SAU crews of the AFU’s 60th Separate Infantry Brigade in #Trifonovka and #Petropavlovka shelled Russian positions at #Borozenskoye and south of Novaya Kamenka.
➖ Already laid minefields and active shelling by Russian forces halted the advance of the Ukrainian formations. The combined assault teams are currently entrenched in the occupied areas and demining the terrain.
🩸 The AFU command is now preparing to continue the offensive. A preparatory command briefing was held at the 9th Composite Battalion’s Command and Observation Post.
On the morning of 9 November, the combined assault grouping, together with reserves and equipment of the 17th Tank Brigade and 128 Mountain Assault Brigade, will continue the attack towards the southern outskirts of #Dudchany in order to advance further towards #Mylovoye.

https://t.me/Slavyangrad/19333

Posted by: Down South | Nov 9 2022 10:28 utc | 159

⚡️🇷🇺🇺🇦⚔️ #Chronicle of the Special Military Operation for 8 Nov 2022⚡️
#Kursk Region:
▪️ Ukrainian militants attacked the Glushkovskaya power substation from a drone. The power station was not damaged in the incident and there were no casualties.
#Starobelsk Direction (MAP):
▪️ In the #Kupyansk frontline sector, units of the 14th Mechanized AFU Brigade have gone on the defensive, losing a large amount of personnel and equipment.
▪️ In the #Svatovo sector, Ukrainian formations from the 1st Battalion of the 92nd Mechanized Brigade and the 128th Territorial Defence Brigade again attempted to storm #Kuzemovka, but were stopped by aviation and artillery fire.
▪️ In the #Lyman sector, the 66th Mechanized Brigade made an unsuccessful attempt to storm the Russian positions in the direction of #Makeevka.
➖ At the same time, units of the AFU’s 81th Separate Airmobile Brigade and 25th Airmobile Brigade tried to break through the Russian defence line in the direction of #Kremennaya, but failed and withdrew.
➖ In an artillery duel, the Russian forces succeeded in destroying a radar station, a communications vehicle and several BMPs of the enemy.
#Donetsk Direction (MAP):
▪️ DPR People’s Militia units continue their operation to flank the Ukrainian grouping in the #Avdeevka stronghold. Fighting has resumed for #Vodyanoye, #Opytnoye and #Pervomayskoye.
The capture of the settlements will make it possible to expand the security zone around the #Donetsk agglomeration and flank the AFU grouping in #Avdeevka.
▪️ Tense fighting continues in #Maryinka. While MLRS and artillery calculations of Russian troops are engaging targets on the western outskirts of the settlement, assault groups are advancing towards Druzhba Avenue, 200 metres away.
▪️ Ukrainian militants have once again shelled major populated areas of the DPR. Several civilians were killed in the attacks in #Donetsk – including a young girl.
▪️ As a result of the strike on the power substation in #Yasynuvata, a large part of the city was left without electricity and three boiler houses were put out of service. Work is underway to restore power supply.
#Southdonetsk Direction:
▪️ Near #Novomikhailovka, the advance of Russian troops has slowed due to weather conditions. The Ukrainian formations are taking advantage of this and are moving additional reserves into the frontline area.
▪️ Sakhalin warriors acting as part of reconnaissance and assault contours, keep the #Ugledar – #Maryinka road under fire control, cutting off enemy supply routes with fire.
#Dnipropetrovsk Region:
▪️ Russian forces carried out several strikes with the Geran-2 kamikaze drones on AFU facilities in Krivoy Rog. At the same time, Russian troops hit enemy positions in #Marganets, #Ilyinka and #Vyshetarasovka.
#Nikolaev – #Berislav Direction on Southern Front (MAP):
▪️ In the #Berislav area, several units of the AFU, supported by artillery, launched an offensive northeast of the village of #Dudchany.
The enemy managed to penetrate deep into Russian territory and entrench itself on a farm near #Dudchany. The AFU command is currently preparing for a further offensive to reach #Mylovoye.
▪️ In the #Snigirovka sector, the enemy, after gathering reserves from #Visunsk and #Bereznegovatoye, managed to entrench on the northern outskirts of the #Snigirovka settlement itself near the railway tracks (unclear if done or only fights for).
Polish and English-speaking mercenaries are involved in the offensive.

https://t.me/Slavyangrad/19334

Posted by: Down South | Nov 9 2022 10:29 utc | 160

I haven’t seen any evidence that the ship was even hit by a weapon. Naval ships handle many dangerous things, and carry many explosive things. Fires are common during peacetime.
My US Navy ship suffered a huge fire because the people refueling it overflowed a tank that vented into a paint locker in after steering. I don’t know how it ignighted, but the host country cut our lines and towed us for hours into the middle of the Med to keep us from destroying much of their country if we exploded, and that is just counting the non-special weapons.
Somebody had stowed cases of a chemical that we no longer used to clorinate water in that paint locker. It reacted with oil to give off very large quantities of chlorine gas, which is an oxidizing agent. The standard method of smothering an oil fire with a foam doesn’t work if the fire also supplies an oxidizing agent. Fighting a fire in a clorine filled environment is, shall we say, not conducive to breathing.
Eventually all of the clorinating chemical was used up, and the fire was extinguished. We remained afloat, and made it to the shipyards. This was during peacetime with nobody trying to sink us, and we were not only not handling special weapons, we weren’t handling any weapons at all.
Naval ships are dangerous places. We don’t have any indication that the Russian one sunk was hit by any weapon. Somebody could have been handling one onboard and dropped it. A similar incident almost sank the USS Forest Fire, uh, the USS Forestall. A weapon for a plane was dropped on deck.
While Ukraine celebrated the Russian ship sinking, I haven’t heard any creditable claims that it was sunk by an enemy weapon.

Posted by: barstool | Nov 9 2022 10:48 utc | 161

Latest news is that RF will be withdrawing from one or both sides of Ingulets River. Leaving only the area immediately around Kherson and city itself in RF control.
Massive push by AFU starting.

Posted by: moaobserver | Nov 9 2022 10:50 utc | 162

barstool | Nov 9 2022 10:48 utc | 162
“A similar incident almost sank the USS Forest Fire, uh, the USS Forestall. A weapon for a plane was dropped on deck.”
I read that was one of John McCain’s many fuck-ups.

Posted by: Flying Dutchman | Nov 9 2022 11:17 utc | 163

Posted by: moaobserver | Nov 9 2022 10:50 utc | 163
Sources, please.

Posted by: unimperator | Nov 9 2022 11:19 utc | 164

@Debsisdead 137
Perhaps the peace movement has realised that its efforts are futile. In Germany, millions of people demonstrated against the deployment of nuclear missiles in the early 1980s. Unsuccessfully. In 2003 we tried to prevent the Iraq war. In 2014, we stood in the streets for peace in Ukraine. Most people didn’t know at all where the country was and what was happening there. The government and the media divided the movement, claiming that they were radical right-wing demonstrators with whom one should not demonstrate for peace. I lost several FB accounts where I posted info from Ukraine, which I translated together with Ukrainian acquaintances because there was hardly any information in German. In between, there were always demonstrations in front of the base in Rammstein. Without success. Our efforts for peace are a story of failure. In the meantime we are old and most of the younger people don’t care. Or they stick to the streets for a fistful of climate dollars or persecute “right-wing” peace demonstrators and drive them out of the country.

Posted by: Uwe | Nov 9 2022 11:35 utc | 165

moaobserver | Nov 9 2022 10:50 utc | 163
Who are you observing MoA for, rumormonger?

Posted by: sippy the shot glass | Nov 9 2022 12:05 utc | 166

⚡️Russian Defence Ministry report on the progress of the special military operation in Ukraine
(9 November 2022)
Part I (See Part II (https://t.me/mod_russia_en/4934))
The Armed Forces of the Russian Federation continue the special military operation.
In Kupyansk direction, the active actions of Russian troops, artillery fire and air strikes repulsed the attack of the reinforced motorised infantry battalion of the Armed Forces of Ukraine in the direction of the settlement of Kuzemovka (Lugansk People’s Republic). In total, 60 Ukrainian servicemen were killed, as well as two infantry fighting vehicles, and five pickup trucks.
In Krasny Liman direction, the enemy, with the forces of four motorised infantry and one tank company, reinforced by foreign mercenaries, attempted simultaneous attacks on the positions of Russian troops in the directions of Makeyevka, Ploshchanka, Golikovo, and Kremennaya (Lugansk People’s Republic). Artillery units, heavy flamethrower systems, and strikes of army aviation thwarted the enemy’s units and pushed them back to the initial lines.
Moreover, preemptive fire damage prevented the attempts of the offensive of two company tactical groups of the Armed Forces of Ukraine in the direction of Chervonopopovka and Stelmakhovka (Lugansk People’s Republic).
In Krasny Liman direction, in total, up to 100 Ukrainian troops and mercenaries, one tank, two armored fighting vehicles, a Grad MLRS combat vehicle, and three pickup trucks were destroyed during the day.
In the South Donetsk direction, the enemy attempted to counterattack in order to impede the offensive efforts of Russian troops. By inflicting fire damage and actions of assault groups in the areas of Novomikhailovka, Pavlovka, and Vremevka (Donetsk People’s Republic), the AFU units were dispersed and thrown back to their original positions. Over 80 Ukrainian personnel and militants, one tank, six armoured fighting vehicles, and three pickup trucks were eliminated.
In the Nikolayev–Krivoy Rog direction, the AFU forces of up to three company tactical groups made unsuccessful attempts to attack the positions of Russian troops in the direction of Kachkarovka, Pyatikhatki, and Sadok (Kherson region). Following the fire attack, the opposing forces were scattered and fled, having suffered considerable losses. Furthermore, during the day, Russian troops detected and repulsed attempts by twelve AFU’s sabotage and reconnaissance groups to break through the rear areas of defence. In total, up to 110 Ukrainian personnel, eight armored fighting vehicles, and 14 vehicles were destroyed in this direction.

Posted by: Summary | Nov 9 2022 12:17 utc | 167

In terms of weaponry, first place in current Ukraine warfare goes to guided weapons. That would be rockets and drones. Second place goes to artillery, which benefits from a symbiosis with drones. Third place goes to airplanes, which are vulnerable to, but can also shoot guided weapons. After that comes tanks, which have been painted with a large target by the tech. This hierarchy would seem to hold whether the ground is dry, muddy or frozen.
If the above hierarchy is largely correct, it has relevance for a RF winter offensive, which it seems that many observers are expecting to be a kind of blitz with tanks and the newly mobilized. I doubt that the current weapon tech is going to allow that, because of tank vulnerabilities which are weather independent. OTOH, perhaps that very WWII-like scenario can still happen. Perhaps stocks of ATGM are too low on the Ukrainian side. Perhaps the RF can bring overwhelming forces to bear anyway. Perhaps we will have to wait and see.

Posted by: Zed | Nov 9 2022 12:18 utc | 168

… never confuse (as bevin does) the future of an institution with the idiots currently in power. One day they will be out, and others with other policies, will take their place.
Posted by: laguerre | Nov 9 2022 9:54 utc | 156

The current EU leadership, every member of every parliament, commission, committee, cooperative, outhouse and dive bar is marinating in the same scalding hot latrine of US-backed surveillance, influence peddling and power politics.
As I’m sure you are well aware, the current EU leadership will almost certainly be replaced by persons of even less substance and character. There are no alternatives waiting in the wings, it is continuity of subordination for as far as the mind’s eye can see.
I wonder why you fail to acknowledge this obvious backdrop.

Posted by: anon2020 | Nov 9 2022 12:56 utc | 169

🇨🇳 It is necessary to concentrate all efforts on military affairs.
“The world is going through epochal changes faster and faster. It is necessary to focus all efforts on military affairs, to quickly improve the skills of our troops in conducting a victorious war. It is necessary to strengthen the comprehensive training of the armed forces and ensure their readiness for combat operations” Chinese President Xi Jinping
https://t.me/loordofwar/58935

Posted by: unimperator | Nov 9 2022 12:57 utc | 170

The more things change…
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=QUS4cZE3GIc
Germany supplies jet fuel to Russia during ongoing (phony?) war..

Posted by: Scorpion | Nov 9 2022 12:59 utc | 171

Or they stick to the streets for a fistful of climate dollars or persecute “right-wing” peace demonstrators and drive them out of the country.
Posted by: Uwe | Nov 9 2022 11:35 utc | 166
Hey, hey.. We live in Democracies, no? That means we have the sacred right to vote. So vote. Expecting anything more is not on the table. So just vote and be grateful we live in countries in which we can vote.

Posted by: Scorpion | Nov 9 2022 13:04 utc | 172

Posted by: Scorpion | Nov 9 2022 12:59 utc | 172
While everyone in Germany seems happy on surface of US occupation, I’d think there is a heck of a lot of resentment beneath the waves. They are not directly but in indirect ways doing everything to sabotage US enterprises in EU and Germany. The industrialists will not surrender themselves to the pre-determined fate of surrendering assets to US corporations for a nickel on the dime, they have taken proactive action in order to relocate and secure operating environment in the Eurasian markets.
EU may go bust, but the benefit for US should be significantly diminished compared to the original RAND ideas. Eurasian, including relocated German industrial and R&D capability will strike back and push the US companies out of EU markets through superior cost and other advantages.

Posted by: unimperator | Nov 9 2022 13:09 utc | 173

The cock is crowing. Vigorously. Dawn near?
Former Russian President Dmitry Medvedev this Wednesday morning:
“The initial results of the elections in the United States and yesterday’s hysterical ‘ultimatum’ by Ukraine’s green leader in a green unwashed T-shirt is proof that the familiar world of grandpa Biden is slipping away, global support for US policy is on the decline, and betting on a ‘stoned hetman’ was a huge mistake”

Posted by: Elmagnostic | Nov 9 2022 13:24 utc | 174

(Sunny Runny Burger writing. It’s a bit verbose but I have to post and go, I should be doing other stuff)
A piece of peace
‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾‾
The current lack of a popular or widespread “peace movement” about Ukraine or about the world at large might be due to how it is likely that a lot of those who more or less see reality for what it is are keenly aware that the nature of the beast is a re-implementation of nazism or at least the same goals as nazism had concerning Russia; that what we are seeing from “the west” is a new attempt at implementing Lebensraum (would I on my own have understood or realized this if not for reading many MoA comments from different people? I strongly doubt it, the credit for seeing this clearly has to go to the people here and elsewhere and most likely collectively).
There are some exceptions but the relatively small peace protests that we see so far in Europe that directly concern themselves with the current situation do not seem to acknowledge reality in the way that many here would and are instead centered on their own material dismay. I’m not saying that it isn’t understandable or “reasonable” but they leave a lot to be desired from my point of view. Still they may end up doing something good –I don’t know– and at least they and all the strikes express dissatisfaction and grievances.
Speaking for myself I am not a peace activist because I see it as insufficient. Instead I am a Russia supporter, a China supporter, an Iran supporter, a Korea supporter, an Asia supporter, an Africa supporter, a Latin or South America supporter, and a “real Europe” supporter. This is despite all kinds of small and large differences in opinion and outlook which have been made irrelevant by the situation. I want them to win because they have justice on their side despite any flaws. I want the criminals and madmen ruling “our” side to be defeated and removed if at all possible.
Fortunately those same criminals and madmen are working very hard against their own interests because their ambitions are inherently self-defeating. This includes the threat of nuclear annihilation of humanity and most life which takes their self-defeating nature to an extreme.
I certainly do not want to see any repeat of Chamberlain’s “peace for our time” travesty.
The Lebensraum approach is a kind of hidden fallacy and excuses are made on account of “needs” that would instead be fully met and wildly surpassed by genuine cooperation and further scientific and technical improvements. The excuses are dreamt up purely for the purpose of masking the most base and destructive kinds of greed and the limitless idiocy of such ideas as “useless eaters” expressed by those that cannot comprehend or acknowledge the most basic facts of life (all life) and structural complexity.
For genuine peace I want our “industrious idiots” removed from power but yes all I can do is to “shout at the clouds” (as some poster here poetically described it not long ago), so whenever I can I do 🙂

Posted by: Sunny Runny Burger | Nov 9 2022 13:34 utc | 175

Found this: The Greens – recently called ‘the most hypocritical, aloof, mendacious, incompetent and, measured by the damage they cause, the most dangerous party we currently have in the Bundestag’ by the indestructible Sahra Wagenknecht – are rather more afraid of nuclear power than nuclear arms.
Haha, this piece of shit, cares nothing for the men who during the long cold war, manned the trenches, were the soldiers who would face an enormous enemy, who would eventually defeat us.
People like that deserve to die early, she is pure thrash, and should be burnt, at the stake is prolly too much but approbate!
Holy Mother, I live to see this statement, from a German politician, befuddles my mind.

Posted by: Den Lille Abe | Nov 9 2022 13:38 utc | 176

Kirill Stremousov, the Russian-installed deputy head of Ukraine’s southern Kherson region, died in a car crash, Russian state news agencies reported.
Bad move, the lights may go out over the remaining part of the so-called Ukraine this week.

Posted by: Night Tripper | Nov 9 2022 13:47 utc | 177

Pro Russian Telegram channels are almost unanimous in proclaiming that Putin is about to abandon Kherson even though all Ukranazi offensives have been decisively beaten and though Russia is much stronger there now than even a month ago.
If true, I wonder how exactly the inveterate (and invertebrate) Putin cultist geniuses online – whether blowhard armchair generals like the Faker and Martyanov, or the MENSA candidates here on the MOA comments – are going to spin it as a great victory against Ukraine. By the way, when, oh when, is that Kharkov pincer counterattack doubting whose existence got me blocked by Martyanov going to take place? In 20022?

Posted by: Biswapriya Purkayast | Nov 9 2022 13:55 utc | 178

This is going…uh great
Donetsk shelled seven times since midnight, DPR reports
https://tass.com/politics/1534253
Deputy of Kherson region – Kirll Stremousov, is killed in a car crash
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11408027/Russian-installed-head-Kherson-region-killed-car-crash.html
Kiev troops try to advance north of Kherson, heavy fighting underway — official
https://tass.com/russia/1533957

Posted by: Zanon | Nov 9 2022 14:00 utc | 179

Posted by: Biswapriya Purkayast | Nov 9 2022 13:55 utc | 179
Its counter-intuitive – its to make sure that they shame Putin into doing the opposite of what they say – kind of an insurance policy.

Posted by: Night Tripper | Nov 9 2022 14:00 utc | 180

Biswapriya Purkayast
LOL you beat me to it.
I have said the same for months, it is going horribly bad for Russia. But the yes-men-cult-slash-denialists here will frame the Kherson retreat as a victory along the lines like:

*”Oh Kherson was not that important anyway, shut up troll!”
*”Russia have a secret agenda and Ukraine just walked into it in Kherson, just relax and see, Putin is God so he knows what to do, he can not be wrong!”
*”Russia saved civilians by the evacuation so it does not matter if they retreat from Kherson, Ukraine can have Kherson!”
*”According to Sun Tzu this is the way to go, in fact Russia is obviously winning by this move anyone saying something differently is a troll!”

Same with Kharkiv, but these yes-men morons never learn, they are brainwashed.
Russia’s debacle in Kharkiv

By all indications, Russia has suffered a catastrophic military defeat near Kharkiv, the second-largest city in Ukraine, located in the country’s northeast.

https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2022/09/12/pers-s12.html

Posted by: Zanon | Nov 9 2022 14:09 utc | 181

Musicians also eliminated four AFU strongholds west of #Otradovka, advancing significantly towards #Andreevka and #Kleshcheevka;
Posted by: Down South | Nov 9 2022 5:08 utc | 132

Musicians? Does anyone know what word might have been a more accurate translation?

Posted by: David Levin | Nov 9 2022 14:23 utc | 182

Musicians == Wagner PMC

Posted by: Simplicius | Nov 9 2022 14:24 utc | 183

laguerre@156
You appear to have a view of the EU based entirely on your experience with its several predecessors, all of which claimed to be “social’, vehicles leading to greater equality between and within nations.
Such were the times- the post war era was one in which, for reasons well known to us all, including the Soviet example and the left wing ideas of the resistance to fascism in Europe, there was very little support, even in conservative and Christian political parties, for what we now call neo-liberalism.
That ended in the 1980s since when there has been a shift in political philosophy which has produced, among other things, the current EU with its fundamental neo-liberalism. A neo-liberalism which removes large areas of economic and social policy from the political arena and empowers the Central Bank and Courts.
The ‘democratic’ aspects of the EU are merely window dressing- the Parliament has no power, the Commission is unelected and, as we have seen during the March madness of von der Leyen, irresponsible.
The EU is and was designed to be a means of ensuring that the populace should not be allowed to interfere in the making of policies affecting the wealth of the ruling class.
As to Streeck’s opinions, he has written widely on just these subjects and, in the few examples of his work that I have seen, he has impressed me as a source worth recommending to others.
I have no interest in exploring laguerre’s nationality or opinions, neither being of any interest- his opinions are those of the bourgeoisie, he regards the appalling Macron, clearly in the Petain collaborator tradition bearing the mantle of the oldest European school of fascists, the original French version, as praiseworthy. He sees his ruthless employment of the police against protestors as justifiable and commendable.
Laguerre sees opposition to the EU as support for the Empire- that is not the way that von der Leyen, the US or anyone except perhaps the Boris Johnson Tories (who find their own elbows mysterious) see it. The EU is the latest iteration of the socio-economic underpinning of NATO. And NATO is the means whereby its European members are dragooned into following Washington’s orders
laguerre who appears to see the EU as independent of the Empire, is living in a political fantasy world.

Posted by: bevin | Nov 9 2022 14:26 utc | 184

Well, the fact is that there are a lot of factor influencing whether events like this (assumed Kherson retreat) occur or not. It’s math and likelihoods for military planners.
-UAF strength
-RUAF strength on lines NW,N,NE of the city
-ability to supply air defense, artillery systems, troops on front
-success of UAF attacks, success of RU defense, also in terms of ATTRITION rate, which alters force balance
-risk of encirclement
-relative projected force strength ratio (are more reserves coming? early enough or too late to affect UAF attacks meaningfully)
-expected rate of change of forementioned force strength ratio over given time
-opportunity cost (let UAF occupy Kherson, where they redeploy forces vs. where can you redeploy forces, how changes total picture)
-river bank is rock solid to defend, able to done with smaller forces -> reallocate more force to Ugledar, DPR etc. ?
Now anyone with solid data on forementioned items, feel free to present them and then start making predictions. Instead of “he said, she said”.

Posted by: unimperator | Nov 9 2022 14:28 utc | 185

Rolling stock on fire in Jekaterinburg. Let me guess: another day, another Ukrainian.

Posted by: Passerby | Nov 9 2022 14:28 utc | 186

Et Tu (152).
Ben Stiller a fellow actor and also a CIA asset travelled to Ukraine under a UN banner and denounced Russia, he’s also banned from entering Russia.

Posted by: Republicofscotland | Nov 9 2022 14:41 utc | 187

Sunny Runny Burger | Nov 9 2022 13:34 utc | 176
“I certainly do not want to see any repeat of Chamberlain’s “peace for our time” travesty.”
Me neither. Supposedly the Russian political leadership was ready to do just that in April – Minsk III – but Boris Johnson of all people saved them from themselves, and saved us all from it.
But now the imperial propaganda is trying to float the idea again, even such an abomination as a “Christmas truce” the empire would use cynically to reinforce and re-equip the Borderland force while staving off the expected Russian winter offensive.
https://southfront.org/a-christmas-truce-for-russian-ukrainian-war/

Posted by: Flying Dutchman | Nov 9 2022 14:43 utc | 188

Europe will be sacrificed along with Ukraine by the USA in an attempt to defeat Russia.
https://ria.ru/20221109/ukraina-1830145307.html

Posted by: Republicofscotland | Nov 9 2022 14:47 utc | 189

How can the fruit and nut zelensky refuse to attend the G20, because Pres Putin is going, when ukrane is not a member of the G20 in the first place?

Posted by: HERMIUS | Nov 9 2022 15:02 utc | 190

Kit Klarenberg
@KitKlarenberg
BREAKING: Sergei Surovikin and Sergei Shoigu set to make an urgent statement in 15 minutes. This follows an announcement from Zakharova that Moscow is ready to negotiate with Ukraine, “taking into account the realities currently unfolding.” Abandonment of Kherson imminent?!

https://twitter.com/KitKlarenberg/status/1590356144861896707

Posted by: Down South | Nov 9 2022 15:02 utc | 191

The Russian Federation is ready to negotiate with Ukraine, taking into account the realities currently unfolding – Russian Foreign Ministry Spokeswoman Zakharova.
TG IntelRepublic: is NOT good. Negotiate WHAT? This may suggest an imminent abandonment of Kherson. Which would qualify as a serious, even if partial, Russian STRATEGIC/MILITARY DEFEAT. That’s the price you pay if you fight a low-cost “military operation”. This is bloody WAR. And General Armageddon already knew it was bound to happen.
Who knows what will happen in the next few days but I’m not surprised, it was the BS coming out of the MoD daily briefings that put me on to the failure, exactly as Vietnam. Glad I stopped paying attention to the MoD otherwise I would have been left staggered.
If Kherson is abandoned I fear it’s all down hill from there. USA finally got something right, Ukraine is about vast territory and vast manpower and being able to accept the associated vast casualties, DoD finally did some background and read some history books. Russian military followed the post Vietnam Rumsfeld model and forgot everything, forgot their own geography and history. MoD thought they could fight Ukraine as if it was Syria, few troops and a wunderwaffen shock and awe. That’s what happens when you follow the west, you become stupid – and a step behind.
I had thrown out the idea that this could be a ruse pre-arranged btwn USA and RF to wind it down, if only temporarily. In that case it’s not impossible Russia killed Stremousov to get him out of the way. Have to watch how it all plays out – if withdrawal from Kherson leads to a truce with papers signed and all that or NATO forces just keep pressing in the south, especially towards Belarus.

Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Nov 9 2022 15:03 utc | 192

If true, this could change things dramatically.
“The United States has now said that any country can purchase oil from Russia like India amid Ukraine war. According to the report in the Dawn, a U.S state department official said that U.S has no sanctions as of now on Russian energy exports. His response came to the development that Russia had become India’s top oil supplier in the month of October. Watch this video for more details.”
https://www.hindustantimes.com/videos/world-news/us-changes-tune-after-russia-becomes-india-s-top-oil-supplier-every-country-can-report-101667903606816.html

Posted by: Republicofscotland | Nov 9 2022 15:06 utc | 193

^^^ “…keep pressing in the south, and especially towards Belarus.”

Posted by: LightYearsFromHome | Nov 9 2022 15:07 utc | 194

🇷🇺🇺🇦Surovikin reports to Shoigu
Surovikin: the situation in the area of the Special Operation is generally stable
Surovikin: the combat capabilities of the combined group and forces have increased significantly, the combat strength has been increased at the expense of the mobilized, reserves have been created
There are street battles on the eastern outskirts of Artemovsk –
All attempts of the APU offensive in the Kupyansk and Lyman directions have been stopped
Surovikin: despite the high losses in manpower and equipment, the enemy does not abandon attempts to attack, all his attacks are stopped in a timely manner
Surovikin: active actions are underway in the Donetsk direction to block Artemovsk from the southern direction, fighting is taking place on the eastern outskirts
Shoigu drew Surovikin’s attention to the need to deploy the mobilized in the rear areas before sending them to combat areas
Shoigu: the defense in the Kherson direction is stable, but there are its own peculiarities

https://t.me/azmilitary11/28093

Surovikin: in October, the Ukrainian army lost over 12,000 soldiers
Our losses are 7-8 times less than the enemy’s losses
Russian troops have resumed offensive actions in some areas

https://t.me/azmilitary11/28094

Posted by: Down South | Nov 9 2022 15:07 utc | 195

193, 194
Damn, not even 20 minutes after my #190 fearing capitulation-by-“negotiation”. I sure hope it’s not as bad as the abandon-Kherson scenario being touted. What sane Russian soldier would be willing to fight any further after such obscene mismanagement?

Posted by: Flying Dutchman | Nov 9 2022 15:09 utc | 196

Surovikin from August to October,AFU army lost more than 9500 people killed and wounded in the Kherson direction
The city of Kherson and adjacent settlements cannot be supplied and function

https://t.me/azmilitary11/28095

Posted by: Down South | Nov 9 2022 15:09 utc | 197

Re: Posted by: Biswapriya Purkayast | Nov 9 2022 13:55 utc | 179
The Russian “strategy” in winning the war in Ukraine is utterly baffling to me.
Retreat. Retreat. Retreat.
What exactly is the plan? Nikolaev? Odessa? Black Sea Coast? Not interested?

Posted by: Julian | Nov 9 2022 15:10 utc | 198

Withdrawal from Kherson? What the fuk is Russia doing? Ukraine and NATO are evil. However, I’m about done with Russia’s pussyfooting around and apparent cowardice and incompetence.

Posted by: Saint Jimmy | Nov 9 2022 15:10 utc | 199

Bad move, the lights may go out over the remaining part of the so-called Ukraine this week.
Posted by: Night Tripper | Nov 9 2022 13:47 utc | 178
No, they don’t care about him or anyone else killed. Strikes happen only for propaganda reasons, little to zero effect in war. If they run from Kherson they’ll fake 1-2 nights of strikes and that’s it. Remember how long the shortage of fuel lasted a few months ago after “large” strikes ? 2 weeks max, no problems since

Posted by: rk | Nov 9 2022 15:10 utc | 200