News & views not related to the war In Ukraine …
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November 2, 2022
Open (Not Ukraine) Thread 2022-188
News & views not related to the war In Ukraine …
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Must read Michel Hudson: Thanks b! Posted by: leaf | Nov 2 2022 13:20 utc | 2 @ Posted by: denk | Nov 1 2022 4:28 utc | 208 Posted by: Bad Deal Motors On | Nov 2 2022 13:25 utc | 3 @ Posted by: denk | Nov 1 2022 4:28 utc | 208 Posted by: Bad Deal Motors On | Nov 2 2022 13:39 utc | 4 “..Their aim is to shift economic planning out of the hands of elected governments to Wall Street and other financial centers under U.S. control. U.S. diplomats use the International Monetary Fund and World Bank to demand privatization of the world’s infrastructure and dependency on U.S. technology, oil and food exports…” Posted by: bevin | Nov 2 2022 14:09 utc | 5 Interesting read from Tom Luongo
Dear Twitterati – Leave the Road to Serfdom, Learn to Code Posted by: Down South | Nov 2 2022 14:11 utc | 6 @ Posted by: Down South | Nov 2 2022 14:11 utc | 6 Posted by: fnord | Nov 2 2022 14:39 utc | 7 @leaf Posted by: Seneschal | Nov 2 2022 14:57 utc | 8 From: Tom Pfotzer Posted by: Tom Pfotzer | Nov 2 2022 14:58 utc | 9 From: Tom Pfotzer Posted by: Tom Pfotzer | Nov 2 2022 15:00 utc | 10 Below is a quote from the Michael Hudson piece that b linked to in comment #1
My problem is with the statement saying the aim is to shift economic planning when it was shifted at least 50+ years ago. I know because I participated in elected government planning back then and saw it get shut down. Posted by: psychohistorian | Nov 2 2022 15:03 utc | 11 Below is a quote from the Michael Hudson piece that b linked to in comment #1
My problem is with the statement saying the aim is to shift economic planning when it was shifted at least 50+ years ago. I know because I participated in elected government planning back then and saw it get shut down. Posted by: psychohistorian | Nov 2 2022 15:07 utc | 12 In response to Posted by: psychohistorian | Nov 2 2022 15:11 utc | 13 I must congratulate b for posting Michael Hudson’s latest before I even knew it was available–Bravo!! Now to read it. b – thanks for the link to michael hudsons article… i read it.. i think it is quite good.. however i think there is a typo near the beginning of this article – Posted by: james | Nov 2 2022 15:37 utc | 15 Scott Ritter got rebanned by twitter. shocked face emoji. Posted by: pretzelattack | Nov 2 2022 15:38 utc | 16 I must congratulate b for posting Michael Hudson’s latest before I even knew it was available–Bravo!! Now to read it. I see Typepad’s problems remain…. at least I’ve learned to assume my posts probably get through, even though it gives me error messages. Posted by: pretzelattack | Nov 2 2022 15:43 utc | 18 and if it wasn’t already clear………….. Posted by: james | Nov 2 2022 15:45 utc | 19 @16 Posted by: suzan | Nov 2 2022 15:48 utc | 20 Posted by: Tom Pfotzer | Nov 2 2022 14:58 utc | 9 Posted by: SwissArmyMan | Nov 2 2022 15:52 utc | 21 In a post on the last open thread I misspoke aggregiously, confusing the labels of two Naomis. Posted by: suzan | Nov 2 2022 16:01 utc | 22 @ suzan | Nov 2 2022 15:48 utc | 21 Posted by: james | Nov 2 2022 16:03 utc | 23 Hudson’s account of the Pope and the Holy Roman empire is different. It would be interesting to hear a medieval historian’s point of view. Posted by: bevin | Nov 2 2022 16:05 utc | 24 “…there are statisticians and then there are statisticians. Hard to know who to believe these days.” Posted by: bevin | Nov 2 2022 16:10 utc | 25 Can’t recall where I read this info but the Asian Development Bank passed the World Bank in the terms of development loans issued; so, one of the Empire’s hegemonic levers has already been weakened. As I provided yesterday, Russia’s PM urged his SCO mates to hasten dedollarization efforts by erecting a clearing system within SCO, some of which is already in use. Posted by: psychohistorian | Nov 2 2022 15:03 utc | 12 Posted by: Jax | Nov 2 2022 16:20 utc | 27 The initial Q&A from the interview linked above is quite informative: Back at the end of Aug, Eurasia Group analyst Mujtaba Rahman tweeted about Scholz’s speech in Prague. A lengthy thread summarizing the speech, he wrote: Posted by: Bruised Northerner | Nov 2 2022 16:21 utc | 29 @23 SwissArmyMan: Posted by: Tom Pfotzer | Nov 2 2022 16:30 utc | 31 Posted by: karlof1 | Nov 2 2022 16:27 utc | 31 Posted by: Jax | Nov 2 2022 16:42 utc | 32 I will say that the intensity of talk around Germany perhaps suggests that we ought to reflect on the true nature of the relationship between 1) the US and Germany, and 2) the Hegemony (h/t the Saker) and Germany. Posted by: Bruised Northerner | Nov 2 2022 16:45 utc | 33 karlof1 | Nov 2 2022 16:27 utc | 31 Posted by: sippy the shot glass | Nov 2 2022 16:46 utc | 34 bevin @25–
A toast ought to be made to Hudson for making this historic parallel which is likely a product of the research he did for his upcoming book, thus his tight grasp on the primary sources. His essay is the sort of lecture students ought to receive tying “ancient” history to current conditions/events that makes the study of history important and relevant. So again, another toast to Hudson the teacher! In response to Posted by: psychohistorian | Nov 2 2022 16:53 utc | 36 They don’t care who you are, and they don’t care what you say. They have bigger fish to fry than worry about picnic ants. Posted by: Old canadian | Nov 2 2022 16:58 utc | 37 An impressive précis by Hudson referenced by b in first comment. Posted by: DunGroanin | Nov 2 2022 16:59 utc | 38 Posted by: sippy the shot glass | Nov 2 2022 16:46 utc | 35 Posted by: Jax | Nov 2 2022 17:05 utc | 39 …Scholz…or else Germany will impose sanctions on China…
Just compare the BASF related information in the linked article (“…biggest investment project of the company…”) with the news that the company announced to leave Germany as soon as possible. Posted by: OttoE | Nov 2 2022 17:13 utc | 40 Thanks b, for giving us an anchor link to Michael Hudson’s latest essay! I will answer some queries, including bevin @ 25 concerning his medieval analogy. As far as the Eastern Church is concerned, what he writes is basically correct:
Orthodox Christianity had two objections to the primacy of Rome. One was theological,in that the Roman church had inserted an extra phrase into the Nicene Creed when it came to the description of the Holy Trinity. But the main one was the question of the power of a bishop – previously the bishop of Rome was held to be “first among equals” as are bishops themselves in the Orthodox hierarchy, not specifically more powerful than the least of the flock (in fact if children are given that lower status it goes against what Christ himself taught. Babies come forward for Communion participation during the Orthodox liturgical celebrations.) And it can be said that Orthodox churches are multipolar in their very nature, many different traditions growing from local orientation but single in the basic form of their Christianity. Posted by: juliania | Nov 2 2022 17:25 utc | 41 I have a lot of respect for Michael Hudson but he is still alive because he pulls punches in spite of the historical clarity. Posted by: psychohistorian | Nov 2 2022 17:27 utc | 42 Lavrov in English on the world situation:
And all that is taken in by the world as they watch the Outlaw US Empire’s vassals threatening other nations to join or be given the Russian treatment, Serbia being the current target while Europeans continue to revolt despite their efforts being censored. @37, 38 Psychohistorian, Old Canadian Posted by: Tom Pfotzer | Nov 2 2022 17:31 utc | 44 Well, which is it? Are you an irrelevant picnic-ant, or are you a budding Ghandi whose bud must be nipped? Posted by: StirThePot | Nov 2 2022 17:45 utc | 45 Russia Russia China China… Posted by: JC | Nov 2 2022 17:52 utc | 46 Maria Zakharova’s weekly briefing provides lots of useful information as usual, particularly the long passage regarding atomic power, which could be an article on its own. The transcript’s still being compiled as I type and for now only wish to share her descriptive about Ukraine: B-61 bomb bunkers. There has been annual protests against their stationing in various Nato countries. Brian Terrell was supposed to go into trial Nov 23 in Germany (Buechel) for actions in 2019, 2021 and 2022, but he was informed that he can not be found so no trial. He plans on returning in 2023. No word on the group he was with in Belgium that went under the fence. Posted by: paxmark1 | Nov 2 2022 18:02 utc | 48 Thank you, karlof1 @ | Nov 2 2022 17:30 utc | 45 for Lavrov’s speech on what I take to have been the medieval “All Hallows E’en” or Halloween in the west. His description of the eve is comfortingly all-inclusive:
Keeping on keeping on. Posted by: juliania | Nov 2 2022 18:03 utc | 49 @ Jax | Nov 2 2022 16:20 utc | 28 Posted by: james | Nov 2 2022 18:13 utc | 50 Posted by: OttoE | Nov 2 2022 17:13 utc | 41 Posted by: JC | Nov 2 2022 18:17 utc | 51 @47 StirThePot, who said: Posted by: Tom Pfotzer | Nov 2 2022 18:25 utc | 52 Re: Scholz, Germany, and China Posted by: NemesisCalling | Nov 2 2022 19:21 utc | 53 The Rome Patriarchal attack on the Eastern Patriarchies (what became Eastern Orthodoxy) was only the latest; I have noted many times before of the prior attacks on the Oriental Orthodox Patriarchies in Egypt and what is now Syria. Posted by: c1ue | Nov 2 2022 19:40 utc | 54 Does Canada, like Russia and other northern countries, need conscription? Not “the draft”, and definitely not while Ukraine is an active combat zone but for longer term defence of this territory, land and coastline? Posted by: Bruised Northerner | Nov 2 2022 20:52 utc | 55 “We need to forgive one another for what we did and said when we were in the dark about COVID,” Emily Oster, a Brown professor wrote this week in The Atlantic. Posted by: DG | Nov 2 2022 21:18 utc | 56 Something I picked up from brasilwire.com… complaints from Argentina about British military flights refueling in Brazil. With the change in administration in Brazil (which has always supported Argentina’s claims to the Malvinas/Falklands) I would not be surprised if one of the last “lifelines” propping up British occupation were to be cut off. Posted by: Alta4710 | Nov 2 2022 22:08 utc | 57 Another “Must Read”. They Rule Over Dysfunctional Ruin, but They Rule Posted by: OttoE | Nov 2 2022 22:21 utc | 58 Here goes…. Imma gonna post….. 🤪 3-2-1——— Posted by: Melaleuca | Nov 2 2022 22:36 utc | 59
It seems hard to dispute that. Posted by: David Levin | Nov 2 2022 23:35 utc | 60 Posted by: OttoE | Nov 2 2022 22:21 utc | 61 Posted by: B9k9 | Nov 2 2022 23:44 utc | 61 David Levin | Nov 2 2022 23:35 utc | 63 Posted by: Melaleuca | Nov 2 2022 23:51 utc | 62 David Levin | Nov 2 2022 23:35 utc | 63 Posted by: Melaleuca | Nov 3 2022 0:05 utc | 63 @B9k9 64 Posted by: Hermit | Nov 3 2022 0:15 utc | 64 @ 62 Posted by: Forest | Nov 3 2022 0:26 utc | 65 Can anyone explain to me the difference between “multipolarity” and the old “spheres of influence”? Posted by: John Kennard | Nov 3 2022 0:59 utc | 66 Thanks to whoever posted the Michael Parenti video link. Posted by: K | Nov 3 2022 1:13 utc | 67 via RT report
Posted by: SeanAU | Nov 3 2022 1:25 utc | 68 @ B9k9 | Nov 2 2022 23:44 utc | 64 Posted by: John Kennard | Nov 3 2022 1:33 utc | 69 Tom Pfotzer | Nov 2 2022 14:58 utc | 9 Posted by: SeanAU | Nov 3 2022 2:19 utc | 70 The clue-free will be far too lazy to check out your references. Such is life. 🙂 Christine Ahn , Anti war activist
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Jeju is just the tip of an iceberg. Posted by: denk | Nov 3 2022 2:50 utc | 71 Until and unless the folks moving the levers behind the curtain of global private finance give up that control along with historic accumulation of private property/inheritance…. Posted by: SeanAU | Nov 3 2022 2:56 utc | 72 @56-58 DG | Nov 2 2022 21:18 utc – 21:22 utc (that’s not snarc, I’m just not sure which of the duplicates, if any, that b will delete) Posted by: Grieved | Nov 3 2022 3:16 utc | 73 Posted by: james | Nov 2 2022 15:37 utc | 15
Quite a large text omission. The comments at NC found other places in the essay that needed rewording, and he helped on those also. Posted by: juliania | Nov 3 2022 4:34 utc | 74 @OttoE | Nov 2 2022 22:21 utc | 61 Posted by: SeanAU | Nov 3 2022 6:28 utc | 75 typo @72, not ‘self-emulating’ but: Posted by: SeanAU | Nov 3 2022 8:45 utc | 76 Grieved | Nov 3 2022 3:16 utc | 73 Posted by: Melaleuca | Nov 3 2022 9:54 utc | 77 Grieved | Nov 3 2022 3:16 utc | 73 Posted by: john | Nov 3 2022 11:17 utc | 78 @ Grieved | Nov 3 2022 3:16 utc | 73 Posted by: DG | Nov 3 2022 11:54 utc | 79 B9k9 | Nov 2 2022 23:44 utc | 61 Posted by: OttoE | Nov 3 2022 12:39 utc | 80 The kick off for the World Cup in the demented hellish hot sand dunes of the sheiks is now less than two weeks away – before even the turkey eating brain damaged thanks givers feasting Thursday ( a dumber ‘holiday’ I don’t think has ever been invented ). Posted by: DunGroanin | Nov 3 2022 14:22 utc | 81 @70 SeanAU: Posted by: Tom Pfotzer | Nov 3 2022 16:06 utc | 83 @ juliania | Nov 3 2022 4:34 utc | 74 Posted by: james | Nov 3 2022 17:53 utc | 84 Below is a posting title at Reuters followed by a take away quote
But, but, but what about profit? Covid is just one example of the financialization of the West and the above is another Posted by: psychohistorian | Nov 3 2022 18:14 utc | 85 from msn:
democracy — a system of government by the whole population or all the eligible members of a state, typically through elected representatives. Posted by: Don Bacon | Nov 3 2022 20:18 utc | 86 @denk #71 Posted by: c1ue | Nov 3 2022 21:44 utc | 87 Speaking of the US midterm election next week: Posted by: c1ue | Nov 3 2022 22:03 utc | 88 Another fairly good review of the current situation in Iran and quick study of the history leading up to it, from a pro-Iranian pov on the Saker site.
Posted by: SeanAU | Nov 3 2022 22:29 utc | 89 I can understand the natural gleeful expectation of the Dems getting a shellacking in the mid-terms. What I fail to understand is any semblance of enthusiasm that the Republicans GOP are any kind of answer or intelligent rational solution to the problems besetting the American people and their nation – as opposed to more of the same or even worse. There is no red or blue, the whole place is purple with varying hues. The whole country is a dumpster fire that’s run out of water. Posted by: SeanAU | Nov 3 2022 22:40 utc | 90 @OttoE | Nov 3 2022 12:39 utc | 80 Posted by: SeanAU | Nov 3 2022 22:50 utc | 91 @ SeanAU | Nov 3 2022 22:40 utc | 90 Posted by: james | Nov 3 2022 22:50 utc | 92 More interesting, IMO, than the silly Atlantic article asking us to forgive ourselves* is this recent revelation, or rather, string of revelations put into a nice comprehensive timeline. Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Nov 3 2022 23:11 utc | 93 Typically a good analogy will be expressed in terms of an idea the reader already knows deeply. Few readers of Hudson would know jack shit about Papal and Monarchist machinations over finances and lending practices of the 11th century, let alone slow boiling geopolitical events of the age. Good analogies (like metaphor) are instead simple and quick without a thought required to see the connections. They work instinctively with well known ideas, concepts and accepted practices of the everyday. In this case Hudson’s article here reminds me of elitist academics living in ivory towers who could come down to earth for a walk among the hoi polloi peasants more often to smell the daisies; instead of being more interested in themselves and what they’ve been up to than their readers needs for clarity and timeliness. If authors wish to remain relevant, popular and understandable to the average Joe in this fast paced world of info overload and manipulations, they’d be wise to avoid unnecessary complexity and time wasting self-indulgences. Whilst the essence of the article is clearly worthy and on point, I see it gets unnecessarily lost in obscure historical details that must sidetrack the typical readers attention away from the key points, those really critical ideas being made about the present and near future. I feel that Hudson could easily have shaved at least 20% off the length of it had he applied a better suited analogy not requiring a documentary style rendering of the distant unknown past. But that’s just me hoping for the best only to be disappointed (oh, woe is me.) Others may find such embellishments titillating, informative or even self-enhancing and prefer this approach. Which is perfectly fine too. Because – each to their own – may personal preferences prevail! Posted by: SeanAU | Nov 4 2022 0:04 utc | 94 Typically a good analogy will be expressed in terms of an idea the reader already knows deeply. Few readers of Hudson would know jack shit about Papal and Monarchist machinations over finances and lending practices of the 11th century, let alone slow boiling geopolitical events of the age. Good analogies (like metaphor) are instead simple and quick without a thought required to see the connections. They work instinctively with well known ideas, concepts and accepted practices of the everyday. In this case Hudson’s article here reminds me of elitist academics living in ivory towers who could come down to earth for a walk among the hoi polloi peasants more often to smell the daisies; instead of being more interested in themselves and what they’ve been up to than their readers needs for clarity and timeliness. If authors wish to remain relevant, popular and understandable to the average Joe in this fast paced world of info overload and manipulations, they’d be wise to avoid unnecessary complexity and time wasting self-indulgences. Whilst the essence of the article is clearly worthy and on point, I see it gets unnecessarily lost in obscure historical details that must sidetrack the typical readers attention away from the key points, those really critical ideas being made about the present and near future. I feel that Hudson could easily have shaved at least 20% off the length of it had he applied a better suited analogy not requiring a documentary style rendering of the distant unknown past. But that’s just me hoping for the best only to be disappointed (oh, woe is me.) Others may find such embellishments titillating, informative or even self-enhancing and prefer this approach. Which is perfectly fine too. Because – each to their own – may personal preferences prevail. Posted by: SeanAU | Nov 4 2022 0:05 utc | 95 ‘US didn’t like Imran Khan’ – Afshin Rattansi on assassination attempt in Pakistan Posted by: SeanAU | Nov 4 2022 0:54 utc | 96 SeanAU | Nov 4 2022 0:05 utc | 96 Posted by: John Kennard | Nov 4 2022 1:09 utc | 97 Has anyone noticed how close the UK’s two pretty new and expensive carriers are hanging to home? Posted by: John Kennard | Nov 4 2022 1:12 utc | 98 @ james | Nov 3 2022 17:53 utc | 84 Posted by: suzan | Nov 4 2022 1:28 utc | 99 Catch up on a few China matters which I have raised and commented on in recent weeks, while I have what may be a brief window of opportunity… Posted by: Walt | Nov 4 2022 1:28 utc | 100 |
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