Moon of Alabama Brecht quote
October 11, 2022
Ukraine – War Propaganda And News Items

Today Russia's missile and drone onslaught on Ukrainian infrastructure continues. I yesterday posted 25 headlines which over the last 7 month  predicted that Russia would soon 'run out of missiles'.

For laughs: The 'coping' mechanism after yesterday's 200+ missile and drones is the very same I had debunked:

Dmitri Alperovitch @DAlperovitch – 14:48 UTC · Oct 10, 2022

As horrible as today was for Ukraine today, the sliver of good news here is that Russia likely can’t sustain this rate of missile launches. It’s very telling that they have not had this rate of long range fires since the start of the war.

The NY Times is lying:

With Civilian Attacks, Putin Gives Hard-Liners What They Wanted

'Civilian attacks' when, as the NYT itself reports, only 14 persons were killed and less than 100 wounded yesterday during 200+ missile and drone strikes:

The attacks killed at least 14 and wounded scores of others, while countless more in cities across Ukraine were terrified by dozens of incoming missiles explicitly targeting civilian infrastructure.

How many of those were killed by Ukrainian air defense misses is not known. It is sad that people get killed in a war but sometimes unavoidable.

The Ukraine military has killed way more civilians by its artillery strikes on Donetsk city. In 2003 U.S. 'shock and awe' in Baghdad killed at least 10,000 people. Israel kills hundreds of civilians during each of its frequent onslaughts on Gaza. Russia is obviously avoiding to kill civilians but still gets accused of doing it.

Who is really killing Ukrainian civilians?

Max Blumenthal @MaxBlumenthal – 6:23 UTC · Oct 10, 2022

"We haven't any time to put them in jail. They disappeared… somewhere"
A local official jokes of massacring pro-Russian citizens of Ukraine in towns vacated by Russian forces
The human rights industry is basically forbidden from acknowledging this

Quoted Tweet
Анатолий Шарий @anatoliisharii – 18:50 UTC · Oct 9, 2022

A district deputy from Ukraine brags to a Zelensky-affiliated channel “journalist” how they killed many Ukrainians they considered to be “enemy agents.” "These people gone missing". It’s fun for them. Embedded video

Ukrainian is false flagging its murdering of civilian 'collaborators':

War CrimesDreizin Report

Russia had so far also avoided to hit significant Ukrainian infrastructure. Yesterday its President Vladimir Putin explained why it had to change that. The Dugina murder, sabotage attacks within Russia, NATO destroying Nord Stream 2, and the Kerch bridge attack changed the picture:

The President held a briefing session with permanent members of the Security Council, via videoconference. – Kremlin


Thus, the Kiev regime, by its actions, has actually put itself on the same level as international terrorist groups, and with the most odious of those. It is simply no longer possible to leave crimes of this kind without retaliation.

This morning, at the proposal of the Defence Ministry and in accordance with the plan of Russia’s General Staff, a massive strike was launched with long-range precision air, sea and land-based weapons against Ukrainian energy, military and communications facilities.

In the event of more attempts to stage terrorist attacks on our territory, Russia's response will be harsh and commensurate with the threats posed to the Russian Federation. Nobody should have any doubts about that.

Kit has a nice scoop:

Kit Klarenberg @KitKlarenberg – 18:25 UTC · 10 Oct 2022

Now, this is pretty big. Advise you read in full. In brief though, "audacious" plans for destroying #KerchBridge drawn up at request of infamous British military spook Chris Donnelly, at precisely the time London was sabotaging peace talks between Russia and Ukraine this April.
EXPOSED: Before Ukraine blew up Kerch Bridge, British spies plotted itGrayzone

MoA has previously exposed Donnelly and his Institute for Statecraft:

The 'Integrity Initiative' – A Military Intelligence Operation, Disguised As Charity, To Create The "Russian Threat"

Realism setting in:

Don't Buy the Narrative on UkraineAmerican Conservative
The Western party line about a struggling Russia and a resilient Ukraine overlooks hard realities.

Whitney is citing the OSCE reports without crediting MoA which covered them before the start of the war:

Some of Us Don't Think the Russian Invasion Was "Aggression." Here's Why. – M. Whitney / UNZ

Comments

“For its spectacular part in destruction, of what used to the European Union, Britain will have earned the undying hatred of numerous European nations and will presumably suffer wide destruction and the permanent isolation of what remains of its pathetic island “kingdom”.”
You have got to be kidding?
As long as the money flows in not a damn thing will happen.
I actually dread saying this, but the Brits love being Brits.
They love the aristocracy, they love the Socialism, they love the estates and tower blocks.
Remember all those long haired dope smoking reprobates called musicians?
Suddenly they get knghted and boom they become better than their peers. They forget their “poor” roots and rub elbows with the snobs and cheat the system. Right Bono and U2?
Shows like Absolutely Fabulous nailed the Brit mentality as did Shameless on the other side of the coin.
Shameless captured the change in Brit society over the near decade it ran.
Same is true with the Russian who wrote the Daywatch books.
People need to spend more time observing the popular medium. All those lovely writers and producers ALLOW certain ideas to slip through the cracks.

Posted by: Gully Foyle | Oct 11 2022 17:18 utc | 201

There are times when Borrell admits the truth but still manages to put his feet into his mouth and emit a howler, as RT reports:
“Borrell added, that while growing economically dependent on Moscow and Beijing, ‘we delegated our security to the United States.’ The over-reliance on Washington creates a sense of uncertainty in Brussels, especially if the next US leadership would be less favorable to the EU, he said.” [My Emphasis]
In reality, Trump was 1000000-times friendlier than Obama/Biden whose machinations have destroyed EU’s economy, something Borrell is apparently completely unable to see and admit, although he’s capable of seeing the folly of relying on the Outlaw US Empire for Europe’s security. Crazy World, indeed!

Posted by: karlof1 | Oct 11 2022 17:22 utc | 202

@karlof1
Middle East News …
Hezbollah/Lebanon agree maritime border with Israel for gas exploration with security pact. Netanyahu and extreme rightwing war hawks not amused.
Pentagon plan Arabian-Israeli NATO joint force for Middle East DOA
UAE leader MBZ visits Kremlin for meeting with Putin

Sheikh Mohamed bin Zayed Al Nahyan”will discuss with President Putin the friendly relations between the UAE and Russia along with a number of regional and international issues and developments of common interest.”

Posted by: Oui | Oct 11 2022 17:25 utc | 203

“Everyone likes the UK so much that when the queen died, black, native, Indian and Irish Twitter spent days absolutely destroying her, the monarchy and the UK. A real outpouring of grief that was. (It was beautiful)
Posted by: Lex | Oct 11 2022 17:17 utc”
Reminds me of an Abbie Hoffman quote, well someone like him.
He stated how most radicals spent their time masturbating to the description of how to make a Molotov cocktail the NYT carried.
I guess I missed the mass insurrections and boots on the ground like say Sri Lanka.
Then again MI5 and 6 still have implanted assets damn near everywhere.
I’m quite certain those same posters quickly returned to the same vapid empty nose over signal ideas withing minutes of the previous sharing of deeply held angry and desires to loot or violently attack an embassy.

Posted by: Gully Foyle | Oct 11 2022 17:26 utc | 204

“Posted by: Hereward | Oct 11 2022 16:50 utc | 182
What changed? What changed huh? Well how about all you Brit actors coming over here, taking jobs away from American actors because you do better American accents than we do. Huh? How about that? And THEN, switching back to your British accents to seduce our California girls. Huh? Huh? You duplicitous twats!
🙂
Posted by: gottlieb | Oct 11 2022 17:12 utc”
Dude, it’s the Aussie men portraying male US characters that are the real worry.
Right Longmire and Thor.

Posted by: Gully Foyle | Oct 11 2022 17:29 utc | 205

Posted by: Cynica
C-Span once had a right wing news guy (Emmet something}, can’t recall his name now. Anyway he pointed out that Bush senior was forced on Reagan at the convention.
Which could explain why the Bushes were never allowed in the Reagan section of the white House.
Anyway back to Brit bashing.

Posted by: Gully Foyle | Oct 11 2022 17:32 utc | 206

Posted by: Hereward | Oct 11 2022 17:05 utc | 191
The solution would be quite simple, ask Xi to make the port of Algeciras a terminal for the BRI, and Putin to place some S-400 on Ceuta and Melilla since those cities are not covered by NATO. For that to happen our Spanish elite would have to disappear, captive as it is of the Anglos. The area around Gibraltar is a depressed drug smugglers paradise, if the Spanish government would have some agency it would encourage huge investments to raise the region economically and make it enviable for the “llanitos”, then the toast would land on the other side. Now that the UK is not Europe closing the gate and letting those smugglers and racketeers stew in their own shit would do it. Gibraltar is a cancer, all sorts of financial rackets, smuggling and a workshop to repair UK atomic subs right at our doorstep. But the country is sold out and the inheritors of Franco who granted military bases to the US to save his fascist ass and the clique that ripped the country apart are happy to kowtow to the pirates. But it will come, that tumor will be extirpated, and do not worry about European borders, the Pyrenees won’t be moved any time soon, besides, easy to talk about borders when the pirates inhabit an island. Malvinas, Belize, and many other pustules around the world I won’t mention, but reckoning time will come.

Posted by: Paco | Oct 11 2022 17:33 utc | 207

OT——-FYI——-OT—-
For those interested, today beings Russian Energy Week where Putin is scheduled to speak tomorrow, and other Russian energy company CEOs are also expected to speak. It should be a major event with many OPEC+ members present.

Posted by: karlof1 | Oct 11 2022 17:34 utc | 208

Posted by: Gully Foyle | Oct 11 2022 17:29 utc | 204
Well where do you think you guys got it from, huh? Huh? Just another jewel in the crown!
(cheers!)

Posted by: gottlieb | Oct 11 2022 17:36 utc | 209

There has to be a point when a country, that is so widely disliked by its near neighbours, might start to reflect the problem may lie with them.
Posted by: Tom UK | Oct 11 2022 14:56 utc | 116
Are you talking about the UK in Europe by any chance?

Posted by: DaVinci | Oct 11 2022 17:37 utc | 210

Posted by: Tom UK | Oct 11 2022 15:40 utc | 138

the UK isn’t invading another European country.

Why do you lie so prolifically? The UK is occupying Kosovo as we speak

Posted by: Arch Bungle | Oct 11 2022 17:38 utc | 211

Posted by: B9k9 | Oct 11 2022 14:59 utc | 118
“Example: in defense of the Fed.res (aka credit money), the Bernak promoted the proposition that debt is an asset held by another party, and therefore possessed tangible ‘value’.
For the genius concept of ‘qualitative easing’ (which is now just straight up MMT), he’s being awarded the Nobel prize in economics.”
‘member how doped up Bernak was when they gad him testify in front of congress? nobel prize hahahahahahaha

Posted by: osi | Oct 11 2022 17:42 utc | 212

Dude, it’s the Aussie men portraying male US characters that are the real worry.
Right Longmire and Thor.
Posted by: Gully Foyle | Oct 11 2022 17:29 utc | 204
Sorry to nitpick but Thor is actually Scandinavian or Norwegian according to Odin in “Ragnarok”

Posted by: DaVinci | Oct 11 2022 17:51 utc | 213

The UK is as per 1244 illegally occupying Kosovo as we speak……
BTW didn’t English Military also participate in the criminal bombing of Libya killing some 10,000 civilians ? and I do believe the English Army helped murder some 1,000,000 civilians in the illegal destruction of Iraq too.

Posted by: Exile | Oct 11 2022 17:54 utc | 214

Oui @202–
Thanks for that. The escalation is occurring as I anticipated. MBZ is in St. Petersburg for Russian Energy Week as well as meeting with Putin.
Part of what Zakharova said about Ukraine at today’s briefing:
“We must not forget about the incessant shelling of cities and villages of the DPR, LPR, Zaporozhye and Kherson regions, acts of nuclear terrorism against the Zaporozhye and Kursk nuclear power plants. Representatives of the Kiev regime of all stripes are proud of this. And for many years, the Myrotvorets website has been publishing data on who was destroyed, cynically “painting over with a cross” this or that column with the surname. In different ways, they glorify the explosions of infrastructure, the destruction of objects, the murder of people.
“One could say that this is because there is nothing more to be proud of. ‘To break is not to build.’ I’ll put it another way. That’s not the point. It’s much more serious. The fact is that this is their global ideology: not creation, but destruction, not light, but darkness, endless deception, substitutions and global hypocrisy, behind which hatred and misanthropic ideology are hidden.”
The bolded segment describes those who actually run Ukraine as most would recognize. After a pause, she returned to the Main Terrorists:

Then, when morning came in Washington and those who lead and sponsor them woke up, the tactics changed dramatically – they began to cowardly deny what they had done and “move the needle.” Whether this is childish stupidity, or the action of some drugs that have a limited duration of action and periodically end. In moments of rare sobering, they begin to deny everything that was said under some kind of “dope”.
The same departments say the exact opposite things during the day: they were delighted, they say, there was a reason for national pride. They all recorded this action as an asset. All the “state institutions” of Ukraine were in solidarity and shared the success. Half a day passed. Apparently, Washington was “pulled away”, recalling that until now the states that consider themselves to be within the framework of international legal relations differ from quasi-state terrorist entities.
Enthusiastic, bravura, sincere congratulations on the act of a terrorist nature on the Crimean bridge were heard from officials from NATO countries. Those same countries that have been talking about human rights for decades are creating specialized institutions to protect every whim of a person that is not related to his basic needs, elevating to the rank of cult any lust. Here, suddenly, having lost the last thing that visually denoted reasonable people in them, they began to congratulate the Kiev regime on a successful terrorist act. We drew a line under any doubt as to who actually fulfilled it. They directly congratulated the Kiev regime on a successful diversion. It was the twenty-second year of the twenty-first century. Then these people meet each other at conferences and talk about how to save the environment, how flowers and trees suffer, that you can not conduct experiments on animals. Now I understand what they are about. It is considered wrong to conduct experiments on animals, since they consider it right to do it on humans. [My Emphasis]

Zakharova’s statement just about Ukraine is quite long–22 paragraphs-and ends thusly leaving IMO no doubt that my prediction and the opinion of Medvedev will be fulfilled:

We would like the international community to finally wake up from the suspended animation in which it finds itself and demonstrate impartiality and integrity in assessing the recent actions and statements of the Ukrainian authorities. It has demonstrated in fact that it is still an international community, ready and able to show empathy, sympathy, compassion. That this is not just a group of ideologically “minded” bureaucrats bought with Western funds and money.
We are well aware that the United States and other Western countries will never allow this to happen. They will do everything to create the illusion that the listed (in fact, single crimes affected, but numerous) do not fall into the field of view of human rights institutions, structures, and public figures. Not only are they blindly covering up Kiev’s permissiveness and impunity, but they are also demanding it from others by exerting unprecedented pressure on them.
Under these conditions, there is only one option – to continue a special military operation with the stated goals. All goals and objectives, as the Russian leadership has repeatedly said, will be fulfilled. [My Emphasis]

Posted by: karlof1 | Oct 11 2022 18:04 utc | 215

Alperovich is a Russian co-opted CIA agent !

Posted by: Leder | Oct 11 2022 18:05 utc | 216

osi @211: “the Bernak promoted the proposition that debt is an asset held by another party, and therefore possessed tangible ‘value’.”
And the feces I deposit into the toilet is a wagyu steak that has just passed through my digestive tract; therefor, it should have the same value! I should be able to go to the butcher and trade my scat pound for pound for the choicest beef!
Sure, one’s debt is someone else’s asset, but that doesn’t mean one can simply swap everything from the debit column in one’s ledger to the credit column! The Bernank’s lunacy basically magically doubles the apparent wealth held by financial institutions and green-lit the sale of “investment instruments” that have negative real world value. That anyone ever thought that could actually work in the real world beautifully illustrates the stunning depth of the delusion in the Empire.

Posted by: William Gruff | Oct 11 2022 18:07 utc | 217

cynica@197
THE BOGUS BUSINESS PLOT
Part 1: What Isn’t a Racket?
http://mileswmathis.com/butler.pdf

Posted by: SwissArmyMan | Oct 11 2022 18:09 utc | 218

…, equally the UK isn’t invading another European country.
Posted by: Tom UK | Oct 11 2022 15:40 utc | 138

It does not have to anymore.
For those interested.
The Spider’s Web: Britain’s Second Empire

Posted by: Nobody | Oct 11 2022 18:09 utc | 219

@Tom UK
“Finally, Russia started all this on 24 Feb, and Europe has taken heed. Russia will be isolated for several generations as a consequence.”
This isolation is limited only to the West. Russia has turned its trade in the other direction: BRICS+ and these deals are lucrative and have long since brought in Russia’s arms spending in the first half of the year.

Posted by: oldwoman | Oct 11 2022 18:10 utc | 220

While all this is going on, the Jewish Ukrainian Soon-to-be-Deported Ambassadör Melnyk berates German Politicians as he demands more Aid and his Draft-Dodging Son attends University in Berlin.
Figure Die Deutschen will wise up, round up Melnyk_Junior+Other_Ukrainian Draft-Dodgers(aged 16 to 70, were they?) eating their food and using up their NatGas/Coal/Crude/Electricity, and Airlift them directly to Kiev.
Not Sexy like Artillery Shells; but Kiev should appreciate more of their own to Fodder…

Posted by: IronForge | Oct 11 2022 18:10 utc | 221

Sorry for the English mistake…But, I mean : Alperovich is a Russian…but co-opted by the CIA!

Posted by: Leder | Oct 11 2022 18:12 utc | 222

Don Bacon @215–
Your point’s valid, Don. However, each of us needs to weigh where we place our emphasis since we only have so much time to comment. Personally, there’s so much occurring daily it’s hard enough trying to keep up, inform others about some of it, while also commenting on those events.

Posted by: karlof1 | Oct 11 2022 18:12 utc | 223

Blinken

The Kremlin’s strikes against Ukraine today again place the stakes of Russia’s brutal war into stark relief. Russian bombs hit children’s playgrounds and public parks in Kyiv; wave after wave of missiles struck Kyiv’s city streets and damaged heating and targets without military purpose throughout Ukraine. I extend my deepest sympathies to the people of Ukraine who have lost loved ones today. The United States stands with you.
Russia’s attacks are yet another reminder that its war against Ukraine presents a profound moral issue. No person of conscience – and no country of principle – could be unmoved by the devastation of these horrors. Ukraine, like every other country around the world, has the right to choose its own future and live peacefully inside its own internationally recognized borders. . . .here

Reminds me of all the cities that the US has laid waste to by aerial bombing and any other means available.. One especially grievous example was the use of artillery against Raqqa, Syria. The intent of using artillery to non-selectively destroy Raqqa, along with other means, like mortars, was to “liberate” the city.
from the web:

The U.S. Marine Corps’ artillery support for U.S.-backed forces fighting in the Syrian city of Raqqa was reportedly so intense that units on the ground “burned out” the barrels on two of their M777 155mm howitzers during the effort to liberate the city, rendering them unsafe to use. The unprecedented volume of fire underscores the vital role the long range guns, as well as guided rockets and even mortars, have played in the campaign against ISIS in both Iraq and Syria, something often overshadowed by withering air strikes against the terrorist group. . .here

Posted by: Don Bacon | Oct 11 2022 18:17 utc | 224

@Down South 68
Good article, but it misses the point that the Democrats are the same – or in the case of the Clintonites currently in control of Washington – far worse. Bear in mind that “Fuck the Europeans” Victoria Nuland, almost certainly a CIA asset, wife of Robert Kagan, consiglieri of the neocons and fervid Zionist, was special assistant to Dick Cheney and then, without even being required to wash her face and hands, to Hilary Clinton.
For more see my Monograph characterizing Nuland

Posted by: Hermit | Oct 11 2022 18:19 utc | 225

Latest from Gilbert Doctorow – https://gilbertdoctorow.com/2022/10/11/partial-mobilization-and-democracy/
Views of the Russian Public and civic activism
” the mobilization has turned what was a technical operation manned by professional soldiers into a ‘people’s war’ and the people now want a say in how it is conducted.
That is a sea change in Russian domestic politics. But it was to be expected, and its emergence so quickly is precisely why the Kremlin postponed mobilization as long as it could.”

Posted by: Aslangeo | Oct 11 2022 18:25 utc | 226

… But back to your main point. No, when it blows it’s zeros the whole way down. No residual waste, no overhang, no obligations. Just a broad repudiation of onerous debt settled on dummies.
Posted by: B9k9 | Oct 11 2022 14:59 utc | 118

Thanks for that. I take your point, straight repayment is out of the question, no overhang as such, there’ll have to be some kind of Plan B, but I wonder whether it all going to zero is the only or even the most likely outcome.
Sure, there could be a giant crash-event, but perhaps there is an outline of how US strategists hope to defend their dollar privilege in the freezing and seizure of Russia’s dollar denominated assets – effectively a punitive repudiation of all payment and transfer obligations on those assets. In this view, repudiation is transformed into a power play against holders of dollar denominated assets, including treasuries.
Fear of a confiscation / repudiation beatdown might be an important part of keeping a smaller US-dominated bloc intact, a Ponzi bloc with no exits. If you owe millions, that’s your problem, if you owe trillion, that’s your creditors’ problem?
The toxic waste analogy isn’t merely false, perhaps that debt is already weaponised to potential US advantage, assuming the whole scheme doesn’t unwind, otherwise it will all go to zero!

Posted by: anon2020 | Oct 11 2022 18:27 utc | 227

“Sorry to nitpick but Thor is actually Scandinavian or Norwegian according to Odin in “Ragnarok”
Posted by: DaVinci | Oct 11 2022 17:51 utc”
But he works for a US agency, The Avengers and he fell in the US and in the movies he is actually an alien.
Would you feel better if I added that the American special forces guy in both versions of Strike Back was an Aussie?
Yep, two of them.

Posted by: Gully Foyle | Oct 11 2022 18:27 utc | 228

don makes a good point but makes an ass of himself in the process… if you can’t tell a liar when it is very apparent, then there is no help from others… as for b – it is his website.. he’s allowed to use examples of idiocy to make any point he wants, unlike the trollls who have as you say ”different opinions and viewpoints.”

Posted by: james | Oct 11 2022 18:37 utc | 229

Posted by: Tom UK | Oct 11 2022 13:31 utc | 60

If there are casualties from Ukrainian air defences (possible), then the cause is Russian strikes on cities. After all, without the latter, there wouldn’t be the former.
Unless you think Russian missile strikes should be allowed to hit targets unimpeded?

You make the point that responsibility for the consequences of Ukrainian defensive measures lies with the attacker. It is a fair assessment, but only to a certain extent.
The trouble with this argument is that it isn’t presented in an honest fashion. Nowhere are we hearing about fallen air-defense missiles. Instead, the story being pushed is that Putin personally targets playgrounds. This objective lie is supported by footage, testimonies and all sorts of story telling which reinforce a carefully managed narrative. In fact, this narrative of an evil dictator furiously lashing out at Innocent populations and going against any sense of logic and morality is exactly what you write at | Oct 11 2022 15:10 utc | 119

Do you not have concern for civilian lives?
Attacking civilian targets is counter productive. It hardens the resolve of the population, increases nationalist sentiment and deepens the belief that Russia wishes to eradicate Ukrainians. It also eliminates room for peace negotiations (not that there is much room, but clearly both sides do talk as the recent prisoner exchange demonstrated).
Infrastructure targets are logical. Civilian targets is just dumb and does not impact the front line military situation. All Russia has done with the SMO is buy itself generations of hate from countries around it. And, militarily it is losing ground in the disputed territories. But if chucking missiles, drones, or whatever they are, at population centres makes everyone feel better then go ahead.

Posted by: robin | Oct 11 2022 18:38 utc | 230

@Tom UK | Oct 11 2022 15:10 utc | 119
Infrastructure targets are logical. Civilian targets is just dumb and does not impact the front line military situation. All Russia has done with the SMO is buy itself generations of hate from countries around it. And, militarily it is losing ground in the disputed territories. But if chucking missiles, drones, or whatever they are, at population centres makes everyone feel better then go ahead.
You prefer to nitpick the tiny details because the overall situation is horrifying for everyone involved in poking the Bear. Since 2014, what have the Ukrainians achieved? They have lost Crimea, wrecked their economy to such an extent that some African countries are richer now, and then lost four more oblasts containing 15% of their land and most of what was left of their economy. They may lose more territory to Poland, Romania, Hungary, and so on — and may soon become a totally landlocked country.
For Ukraine, the strategic situation is dismal. Therefore, you attempt to cope by overlooking the larger disaster, focusing instead on the nits. There is probably a psychiatric term for your condition, but I’m no psychiatrist.

Posted by: Cyril | Oct 11 2022 18:39 utc | 231

moaobserver | 10:33 utc | 11
I passed on the last half of that impressive and very knowledgeable comment.

Posted by: David G Horsman | Oct 11 2022 18:47 utc | 232

Posted by: Tom UK | Oct 11 2022 14:20 utc | 93

The only country preparing for war, proxy or otherwise, was Russia. The West had no desire or interest in this war. Europe just wanted Russian gas and a comfortable existence. We’re all latte soy boys remember? Albeit, with better weapons 🙂
The only ones banging on about ‘ethnic cleansing’ are Russian nationalists. Russian State TV at one point was quite keen on removing Ukraine and Ukrainians from the map. They have dialled that one back given recent events.
Finally, Russia started all this on 24 Feb, and Europe has taken heed. Russia will be isolated for several generations as a consequence.

While I cannot comment on the prediction about Russian isolation, I can call you out on the blatant lie denying Western belligerence in this conflict.
The belligerence goes back decades but we can point out the escalation since 2014, the mediatic and diplomatic onslaught and the fierce economic warfare. We even got a brief, honest glimpse at the covert dimension of the aggression with Victoria Nuland’s admission of her country’s 5 billion dollar operation in destabilizing Ukraine.
In any case, a country with no interest in war, as you write, wouldn’t act as the principal provider for Ukraine.

Posted by: robin | Oct 11 2022 18:54 utc | 233

All you geniuses out there. I’ve been reading for quite a bit.
I’ve had fun posting odds and ends.
I’ve read all the theories and speculations BUT>>>
What is the US/NATO end game?
Right now it’s laundering money and eating up old outdated weaponry.
In the long run I can’t see anyone but China gaining.
Eu breaks up, so what? No major manufacturing will come to the US. More immigrants will pour in.
It can’t be about developing a European Israel. Sure they are nice tech people, but the issue of immigrants will always haunt them and the, um Right wing (Nazi?) children/grandchildren in the Ukraine and Poland will not be happy. Which combined with the immigrants mean a LOT of bodies would object in various not to friendly ways.
Obviously Russia gets what it wants.
But even the Neo-con splinter group running this show can’t be stupid enough to think that long-term the US wins anything.
Unless the plan is for the US to collapse as the Soviet Union did, then rebuild itself over the next decade or two.
And I’m pretty certain that the EU strategists recognize the upcoming loss and destabilization.
Back to endgame, China and Russia win economically and look very strong in the eyes of the world. Eu breaks into little tiny pieces. US loses credibility and influence and suffers massive economic loss. England keeps being a money center for the world. But standards keep deteriorating for the “po folk”.
Twenty years from now most of the world has a much older population. Old people don’t buy new electronics or follow pop stars.
Africa becomes young and POSSIBLY forms a Pan-African power aided by China and Russia. Those resources that the US/UK/EU kept for themselves.
But is there a strong African leader? I’m not seeing ANY Mandela’s on the horizon
That suggests that China or/and Russia start creating a rising star.
Then you have India.
Nice except a very stratified culture. Anywhere where you are born into a class, not even racial, that is limited to working in sewers and treated with near total lack of respect isn’t exactly going places.
That isn’t even including the diversity of religion.
I know most of you will want to pick this apart. And you can.
Please do not ignore my original question regarding long term endgame to all this.
Every advanced nation in the world has crunched the numbers and done the scenarios and has a rough idea where this is all heading.
But the GENPOP are merely ignorant statistics who do not need, or maybe even should not, know where this ends.
Have at it
“I know nothing, except the fact of my ignorance.” – Diogenes”

Posted by: Gully Foyle | Oct 11 2022 18:57 utc | 234

Posted by: Gully Foyle | Oct 11 2022 18:27 utc | 227
Wait… are you saying that Thor is a… Quisling? Or at least in the service of the enemy?
Help Ma Boab!! Norwegian, anyone, say it ain’t so!

Posted by: Membrum Virile | Oct 11 2022 18:59 utc | 235

“@ Cynica | Oct 11 2022 17:05 utc | 192
Once it becomes clear that someone with a different point of view is also not interested in other points of view, or maybe even in learning anything new in general, engaging them further does not contribute to the discussion.
You have a good point there. Those bloggers are not going to change their screwed-up minds and think correctly, as we do, so why bother.
I tell you what Cynica. I’ve noticed that b responds a lot to writers in the MSM who are way off base and never change. So one of us, let’s say you, call b on it and tell him to stop responding to wrong-thinking people. You tell b first and I’ll be right behind you (not saying how far).
Posted by: Don Bacon”
Long song not gonna post all the lyrics
https://genius.com/Bob-dylan-its-alright-ma-im-only-bleeding-lyrics
(It’s Alright, Ma (I’m Only Bleeding)
Bob Dylan)
While one who sings with his tongue on fire
Gargles in the rat race choir
Bent out of shape from society’s pliers
Cares not to come up any higher
But rather get you down in the hole
That he’s in

Posted by: Gully Foyle | Oct 11 2022 19:04 utc | 236

It is no coincidence that the russian attacks took place right before the meeting of the “Rammstein format” group in brussels on wednesday where NATO, i.e. the US decide about further support for Ukraine.
The russians know that the US are all about money. As Long as they can make money with ukraine, they will support it. With the attacks and the destroyed infrastructure, russia has just presented the US with a huge bill – because if is the US that will have to pay for the reconstruction – with no profit to be made. It is one thing to send weapons made by Raytheon, McDonnell Douglas or Northrop Gumman that will make their Stocks go up, but no US company will profit from rebuilding the destroyed infrastructure. Plus, politically ukraine is a lialbility now that the democrats will not want as a risk before the midterm elections. They will just have to pay up. Or rather, they won’t.
Expect the final goodbye of the US to ukraine tomorrow and the day after in Brussels.

Posted by: Franz Beckenbauer | Oct 11 2022 19:08 utc | 237

Zakharova also reported the failure of the Outlaw US Empire to force OAS members into signing a formal document condemning Russia’s actions in Ukraine. Here is part of her report on that meeting:

At the same time, despite the pressure that was exerted on the regionalists and the efforts of the White House, the initiative was not supported by authoritative and influential states in the region: Argentina, Brazil, Mexico, as well as Bolivia, Honduras, El Salvador, Saint Vincent and the Grenadines, Dominica. Given the non-participation in the session of Venezuela, Cuba and Nicaragua, which have already left this organization or are in the process of leaving, almost a third of the states of the Western Hemisphere did not join the anti-Russian attack (which was initiated by Washington). This reflected the unwillingness of Latin Americans to unconditionally submit to the will of the United States. The idea of the Americans to organize a joint condemnation of our country and those who passed at the OAS site actually failed.
In this regard, we cannot but note that the incitement to such steps is carried out by the state, which has its own vast experience of interfering in the affairs of other countries, including the military. Latin America remembers and knows what I’m talking about. The results of these actions are known to everyone and are very sad – human casualties and destruction. This region is not the exception, but the rule. That’s what the U.S. does. This is the essence of their “logic”.
I would like to remind you that the countries of the region have already once been “burned” at the OAS site, following in the wake of US interests, when they were “used” against the legitimate government of Venezuela (remember how it was?), whose place in the Organization in 2019 was illegally transferred to the representative of the self-styled “president” Juan Guaido. Then the United States played a key role in this. After Washington’s failed attempts to overthrow the official authorities in Caracas, its presence in the Organization of American States increasingly looks like nonsense.
Now Washington has other interests. Something suddenly happened in the world energy markets and the United States sharply recognized the official authorities of Venezuela. All those who were then forced to bend under US pressure were left in shambles. This rule must be learned once. Americans always act in their own interests, forcing others to give up their national, indigenous needs, traditions, sometimes the future. Then, when the “wind” in Washington changes, it turns out that only the United States has interests.
Although now the suspension of the pseudo-representative from participation did not take place on procedural issues, it is obvious to everyone that this is only a matter of time. The realities of the day speak to this. It seems that this circumstance is well understood even in Washington: it is no coincidence that the Americans considered it a blessing not to shine a light on Juan Guaido’s emissaries at the forum, recommending that they refrain from traveling to the General Assembly. The United States is “throwing” everyone: those who were forced to recognize Juan Guaido, and now those who are now his “team”. Is this the first time? It’s always been like this everywhere.

Will Venezuela return to exporting oil to the Empire? Not anytime soon as Maduro needs to have Venezuela’s gold repatriated and all sanctions lifted, which will be difficult since many were applied via Congress which only it can remove. What Venezuela has in massive amounts is Orinoco Bitumin, which is a fluid form of that hydrocarbon that doesn’t require anywhere near the amounts of other resources to make into products. For the curious, here’s a USGS PDF factsheet published in 2009. Note Table 2 showing a 95% probability of 380 BILLION barrels of oil recoverable and 53 TRILLION cubic feet of gas. Yes, that’s The Prize.

Posted by: karlof1 | Oct 11 2022 19:10 utc | 238

@Gully Foyle | Oct 11 2022 18:57 utc | 233

What is the US/NATO end game?

That is the essential question. I don’t know the answer, but I would like to hear opinions on this.

Posted by: Norwegian | Oct 11 2022 19:14 utc | 239

A lot of Threats today:
G7 statement on Ukraine
We, the leaders of the Group of Seven (G7), convened today with Ukraine’s President Volodymyr Zelenskyy. bla bla We condemn these attacks in the strongest possible terms and recall that indiscriminate attacks on innocent civilian populations constitute a war crime. We will hold President Putin and those responsible to account.
The G7 firmly condemn and unequivocally reject the illegal attempted annexation by Russia of bla bla..
We deplore deliberate Russian escalatory steps, including the partial mobilisation of reservists and irresponsible nuclear rhetoric, which is putting global peace and security at risk. We reaffirm that any use [!] of chemical, biological or nuclear weapons by Russia would be met with severe consequences.
We condemn Russia’s actions at Ukraine’s Zaporizhzhya Nuclear Power Plant and the pressure exerted on the personnel of the facility. This is a further irresponsible escalation and we will hold Russia responsible for any [!] incident caused by their actions. The safety, security and safeguards of the nuclear facility are paramount and we support the International Atomic Energy Agency’s efforts in this regard.
We reiterate our call on the Belarusian authorities to stop enabling the Russian war of aggression by permitting Russian armed forces to use Belarusian territory and by providing support to the Russian military. The announcement of a joint military group with Russia constitutes the most recent example of the Belarusian regime’s complicity with Russia. We renew our call on the Lukashenko regime to fully abide by its obligations under international law. [?]
We reaffirm our full support to Ukraine’s bla bla.. We are committed to supporting Ukraine in meeting its winter preparedness needs.
With a view to a viable post-war peace settlement, we remain ready to reach arrangements together with interested countries and institutions and Ukraine on sustained security and other commitments to help Ukraine defend itself, secure its free and democratic future, and deter future Russian aggression. We will continue to coordinate efforts to meet Ukraine’s urgent requirements for military and defense equipment. We look forward to the outcomes of the International Expert Conference on the Recovery, Reconstruction and Modernisation of Ukraine on October 25.
No country wants peace more than Ukraine, whose people have suffered death, displacement and countless atrocities as the result of Russian aggression. In solidarity with Ukraine, the G7 Leaders welcome President Zelenskyy’s readiness for a just peace. This should include the following elements: respecting the UN Charter’s protection of territorial integrity and sovereignty; safeguarding Ukraine’s ability to defend itself in the future; ensuring Ukraine’s recovery and reconstruction, including exploring avenues to do so with funds from Russia; pursuing accountability for Russian crimes committed during the war.
We are deeply troubled by the deliberate damage to the Nordstream pipelines in international waters in the Baltic Sea and strongly condemn any deliberate disruption of critical infrastructure. We welcome ongoing investigations.
We will act in solidarity and close coordination to address the negative impact of Russia’s aggression for global economic stability, including by continuing to cooperate to ensure energy security and affordability across the G7 and beyond.
instructions for a fals flag and they want to loot 700 billion russian dollars.

Posted by: gary | Oct 11 2022 19:20 utc | 240

it’s funny how all posters denounce Tom UK (yenwoda, et al) as a troll and half of comments in this thread (and others) are about his comments. i wonder why so many idiots do that? meanwhile, Tom UK is laughing all the way to the bank.
i don’t understand, honestly, why this idiocy. some posters, in exasperation, ask not to feed the trolls, and there is a deluge of feeding by all barflies, left and right.
is it that those that engage with these trolls lack imagination, and being that they have an acute urge to just post, they don’t have any valuable contribution to their own to post so resort to attacking the trolls and their so called “ideas”?
if i come to an understanding within me that a poster is a troll (by my realization or by someone proving it) i skip that troll. forever. this is my understanding of not-feeding the trolls, i give my modest contribution to keep a clean environment here.
but maybe i’m wrong.

Posted by: albagen | Oct 11 2022 19:21 utc | 241

@Don Bacon 223
That does not take a lot of shells.
South Africa considered a G5/6 (a similar howitzer, also usable with base bleed ammunition for extended range operations) barrel to have an expected life of some 600 rounds, and with a cyclic rate of fire of 8 rounds per minute, this could be reached in a single engagement. Which is why they travelled in convoy with artificers and maintainance vehicles carrying spare barrels. Ukraine, trying to keep up with Russian rates of fire, have discovered this problem for themselves and are educating NATO about it. No such barrels appear to be available, and the Ukrainians would not begin to know how to change them out, which is why the few units that have survived Russian battery counter-fire and drones, are now standing dismally in a field in Poland waiting on non-existent parts.
Even if they were repaired, NATO is out of 155mm ammunition. Germany has apparently retained sufficient for its own use to sustain two days of combat. THe USA has put out an RFQ for delivery of 12,000 shells per month which will be deliverable in three years time. Meanwhile Russia is firing 12,000 a day, while simultaneously rebuilding it’s reserves.

Posted by: Hermit | Oct 11 2022 19:25 utc | 242

@ Norwegian | Oct 11 2022 19:14 utc | 237
they don’t have an end game…. they seem to think that serving the financial oligarchy is a requirement of the gig and it is the financial oligarchy that is pushing this… apparently us$ is supposed to go on forever… they can print endless amounts of the shit and everyone will continue to have faith in it.. of course it has to be backed by military muscle and bullying which has mostly worked very well since the camp bretton woods agreement was put in place to favour the same… nixon going off the gold standard was another step towards printing paper and having people believe it was relevant… the circus will eventually end, but US/NATO don’t have an end game and they are being caught out here.. this is also why UK is very much involved as they also represent this same financial oligarchy that remains hidden for the most part… see the post from @nobody where they linked to the spiders web – youtube link for more on that.. so US/UK/NATO are kind of stuck here.. they have to keep pushing and they have to keep zelensky, or a good servant like him, in a position of power in ukraine for this charade to continue…
as i have said many times, it is about money… the military industrial complex, along with the financial and energy complex continue to stack up the profits here – all at the cost of ukrainians… it is very doubtful ordinary people, tapped into the msm) will see or think of any of this.. they are being encouraged to think just the opposite – big bad russia and etc. etc… its a good question norwegian… i am curious of your take on it all..

Posted by: james | Oct 11 2022 19:25 utc | 243

Thor is actually Scandinavian or Norwegian according to Odin in “Ragnarok”
Posted by: DaVinci | Oct 11 2022 17:51 utc | 212
Thor is fiction. now that steaming hunk of man love who sleepwalks his way thru the idiocy of those movies portraying Thor…well, he was in the ghostbusters remake, so he sounds like a real american dumbass. even though he’s not. cultural diversity in action! one thing about actors in 5 eyes countries, you can play a gay black obese dwarf lesbian from middle earth in NZ or the UK (or Scotland or wherever.) see? diversity! just don’t say anything that would piss off Canada.

Posted by: rjb1.5 | Oct 11 2022 19:27 utc | 244

Paulg @ 170

The UK is the country that brought a lot of death and destruction to many countries and people in Asia and Africa.

That’s what empires do.
It happens to be the end of the US Empire right now, just as the Dutch and Spanish Empires preceded the British, and you can go right back to the Roman Empire to see something similar. Future empires will rise and fall in the same way, be they Russian, Chinese, Indian, or Nigerian.
If you don’t believe me, look at the last 4000 of Chinese history, you will see the same rise to prosperity followed by corruption, warfare and revolt.

Posted by: Hereward | Oct 11 2022 19:31 utc | 245

When the Soviet Union disappeared, the empire revealed its true nature.
What the East needs to assemble quickly is to show the Western elite that a new counter power has been created.
That will involve some pain.
Perhaps a city or two will evaporate.
At this point, if the neocons are still in power and the medical cartel continues to create plagues?
That’s it for the human race. Goodbye.

Posted by: sam | Oct 11 2022 19:36 utc | 246

@Beibdnn 134
Both is a likely option, as in “an incredible amount of self unawareness and blind idiocy”.
You are very welcome 😉

Posted by: Hermit | Oct 11 2022 19:36 utc | 247

@james | Oct 11 2022 19:25 utc | 240
Thanks for the considered thoughts. It will not end well.

Posted by: Norwegian | Oct 11 2022 19:37 utc | 248

If this is so, then Russia has been acting in extreme bad faith for the last decade. This begs the question as to why any nation in Europe would trust Russia on anything going forward.
Posted by: Tom UK | Oct 11 2022 13:15 utc | 54
You’re a funny guy Tom!
Genuinely!
The Russians aren’t remotely Europe’s least trustworthy partner.
Who was eavesdropping European leaders communications someyears ago?
It wasn’t the Russians Tom.
Whos national leader said they would shut NS2 down?

Posted by: jpc | Oct 11 2022 19:40 utc | 249

That’s what empires do.
Hereward @ 242
Doesn’t matter. I await the death of the UK. Quicker the better!

Posted by: Paulg | Oct 11 2022 19:42 utc | 250

It would be interesting to get some idea of what Russia production capacity might be for the more important ground-to-ground missile systems.
Cruise missiles, I think (without knowing) might actually more expensive and difficult to produce than ballistic missiles. So I will focus on ballistic missiles.
One just has to look at SpaceX mfg of Starship and boosters. There is really not that much to them. Rolled stainless steel. Welding. They even do a lot of it in tents and out doors. SpaceX can produce a new starship in 10 days. The way they do it, it’s old school.
I imagine if you have a rocket that you have designed to be simple, and you dont constantly fiddle with the design, they could be produced in large numbers.
In 2014, Russia reportedly produced 1.4 million rounds of artillery ammo. They must fire a lot of practice rounds or store it. Perhaps we can use that as a suggestion that the Russians have a habit of producing large numbers of weapons and storing them. Partly as a matter of necessity to keep a hot production line up and running. Much of the Russian MIC is state owned. Profit making and pleasing the shareholders is not the number 1 priority.
So might Russian ballistic missile production be 200 units per month – 50 units per week. That would not be enough to keep up with current expenditures, but we can presume they have been adding to inventory for many years and they do keep the old stuff around and pull it out and use it.
And the argument that Russia does not have access to microprocessors it might need. Is that true? Most military IC’s are commodities, not bleeding edge 7nm scale parts. The Russians do have the capacity to produce IC’s. Even if it’s 2 generations behind the leading edge, it would be good enough for 90% of what they need for all military applications.
Is the guidance and control system for a ballistic missile really that complex ? I’d say no. The rocket engines are probably the most expensive part of the weapon, but most solid fueled rocket engines, seem pretty simple. And even liquid fueled rockets should not be that difficult if not designed for reuse and maximum specific-impulse.
So it’s bending metal, plumbing, relatively unsophisticated electronics, big chemicals industry to produce fuel. All elements that Russia has in abundance.
I’d guess, that 200 units per month would be very reasonable on an assembly line. 2400 per year. They’ve been producing for 10 years. They use 1/3 of each years production in tests and exercise, so they can store 1600/year. That might mean they have 16,000 in inventory. Add in 1400 for the last 7 months of production and estimate that they have used 7200 thus far in the war (40 per day of the conflict). That would mean they still have 10,000 in the inventory.
I don’t know of course, but seeing how they approach artillery ammunition it fits with their thinking.

Posted by: Dan Farrand | Oct 11 2022 19:46 utc | 251

@ Gully Foyle | Oct 11 2022 19:04 utc | 235 with some of the words to It’s Alright Ma by Dylan
Thanks for the appropriate words from it for the occasion.
I live by earlier words in the song “Those not busy being born are busy dying.” (sic)

Posted by: psychohistorian | Oct 11 2022 19:48 utc | 252

“The greatest challenge to the “Mandate of Heaven” is to keep these creatures from gaining power, and to disincentivise these traits in the population.”
I would submit that the nature of the state incentivizes these traits. It attracts people who want to control their fellow man because all states allow some people to rule the rest of us and most importantly to plunder the fruits of our labor. They may use some ever-changing political definition or euphemism like the “the social contract”, “the right to vote” or “the greater good” to justify this theft(tax) by law. And God forbid! never call it theft. But it’s still theft when you can take a person’s rightful property without his permission. The mess the world is in and has been in since WW1 was created by people who run states who use the rest of us as fodder of one kind or another to glorify themselves or the ideas they wish to inflict on us.
That is not to say that there have not been men and women who have tried to make the state more ethical, more respectful of the sovereignty of the individual over his or her own person and honestly acquired property. But they are in a minority these days, and the monopolistic system of government and its legal ability to violate this sovereignty works against these efforts. Besides, now a days how many people really want to be free of the state?
I’m an American. In my lifetime we have gone from a relatively independent people to a weak society clamoring for the government to take care of our every need and shield us from the vicissitudes of life. We are weak because we don’t take care of ourselves like my parents’ and my grandparents’ generations did. We are weak because we have allowed the state to step far over the boundaries of a free people which the founders attempted to delineate, and we are paying the price in a decaying economy, in a decaying culture, in a divisive, polarized and intolerant society, and in a rogue and dangerous federal government that is destroying our economy and attempting to rule the world, decimating people and societies everywhere it goes. And because of this it has ruined its trustworthiness and reputation as the premier upholder of human freedom.
On the one hand I am sympathetic to China and Russia because they are promoting trade, and therefore peace and prosperity amongst the peoples of the world. But if and when
they become economic powerhouses superseding the US, will they follow in the footsteps of past empires and try to rule the world and have the world turn against them as the world has turned against the United States?
Or will they take to heart Shakespeare’s 94th sonnet?

Posted by: Art Thomas | Oct 11 2022 19:51 utc | 253

Unless the plan is for the US to collapse as the Soviet Union did, then rebuild itself over the next decade or two.
“I know nothing, except the fact of my ignorance.” – Diogenes”
Posted by: Gully Foyle | Oct 11 2022 18:57 utc | 233
Of all the many other points you offered I suggest this one most explains most of what is going on even if it is hard to explain why exactly.

Posted by: Scorpion | Oct 11 2022 19:52 utc | 254

Very few people or civilians at electrical substations/switching yards. Even the SBU office was hit before office hours to minimize casualties. No one is talking about the ukrop anti aircraft/flak that has to come down somewhere, indiscriminately.

Posted by: Suresh | Oct 11 2022 19:52 utc | 255

I have never seen (in 60+ years) propaganda as bad as it is right now in the MSM … and in the more conservative press too.
Many so-called conservatives and/or anti-Trumpers spent years telling us that the MSM was lying about Russiagate, Russian-Trump collusion. The media was just making shit up, remember? Not to be trusted at all.
Now suddenly many of those same voices are repeating the MSM Russian lies and shouting their newly found truth (and demanding war) without a trace of irony. Suddenly everything the MSM says is true?
I don’t own a TV but I saw a clip of Hannity the other day online and I was stunned. The same guy that told us the MSM was a dirty lying crooked commie mob – now believes everything they say – without question. All for the cause, you know. Ugh.
Back in the day, Radio Moscow’s propaganda was so bad it was laughable – never thought thought our media could top that. I have been proven wrong.
From an article by Caitlin Johnstone of Consortium News:
Normal person: I think it would be good if everyone didn’t die in a nuclear holocaust.
Crazy person: That means you love Vladimir Putin.
Normal person: No, I just think it would be a good idea to try to prevent the horrific death of literally everyone.
Crazy person: How much is the Kremlin paying you to say that?
Here’s a link to the article: Caitlin Johnstone link

Posted by: Just Observing | Oct 11 2022 19:56 utc | 256

@ Norwegian | Oct 11 2022 19:14 utc | 237
NATOland end game ?
Fight to the last Ukrainian
Skim as much loot from the aid sent to Kiev
Keep own citizenry placid
Rinse -Repeat

Posted by: Exile | Oct 11 2022 19:56 utc | 257

If the RF forces keeps on attacking the Ukr energy infrastructure for next 7-10 days, the Ukraine will fall back to dark ages. The Euro electricity grid will not be able to supply electricity to Ukraine. If there are any connections, even they will be attacked and destroyed. The EU countries are having a hard time keeping the electricity price down for their own consumers. They are having a hard time producing electricity these days, without the cheap Russian oil and gas.

Posted by: Paulg | Oct 11 2022 19:58 utc | 258

Talking of propaganda I see there are comforting words coming from Pavel Gubarev, Russia’s DPR man in Donetsk, who says about Ukrainians:
“We aren’t coming to kill you, but to convince you. But if you don’t want to be convinced, we’ll kill you. We’ll kill as many as we have to: 1 million, 5 million, or exterminate all of you.”
Well, that will convince many Ukrainians about Russia’s intentions as missiles strike their cities.
I wonder if he thinks the same about Poles, the Baltic states or other CEE countries? This will do wonders for Russia’s relationships with bordering States 🙂
Posted by: Tom UK | Oct 11 2022 13:27 utc | 56

And who is this Gubarev guy exactly? A vaguely remember that he used to be some kind of official (DPR?), but I thought he is strictly nobody right now, from the perspective of any official capacity. In any country of decent size it is always possible to find a person with of any specific flavor and extent of radicalism. What you are saying is that basically a (officially) nobody Pavel Gubarev says something and “This will do wonders for Russia’s relationships with bordering States”. Very funny! The mere fact that Gubarev is mentioned here talks of desperation to find somebody affiliated with Russian Government who would say things like that. On the other hand, there is Ukraine’s ambassador to Kazakhstan Petro Vrublevsky, who in an interview made comments about killing as many Russians as possible.

Posted by: velizhan | Oct 11 2022 20:04 utc | 259

Did we forget to wish Sergey Surovikin a happy birthday? How do Russian generals celebrate their birthdays? Do Librans make good generals? I notice he has the Moon in Virgo, so maybe he’s a bit of details man. Like Trump he has Mars in late Leo, close to Regulus. That must have been useful, in terms of propelling him to the heights.

Posted by: Technophobe | Oct 11 2022 20:04 utc | 260

@juliania #168
You said

Apologies for extracting from your important post this nugget, c1ue, but it needs further elaboration. Not only was what you describe here being accomplished during Clinton’s second term, but also a double ‘Lost Decade’ for the citizens of the US itself was about to begin and is still underway. How was this accomplished?

While I am against the wholesale promotion of illegal immigration which is presently occurring, I am not in any way against legal immigration.
And in that vein: What Clinton accomplished to fuck over Americans – on top of the export of neoliberal fuckwads into Russia and elsewhere – is legion:
1) Clinton is the one who pushed the WTO into accepting China
2) Clinton signed the acceptance of the law breaking Glass Steagall
3) Clinton passed NAFTA
There are many other areas to fault Clinton – principally his acceptance of banksters into the Democratic party thus abrogating their (until then) historical alliance with labor and the working class, but that is more vague.
Thus while Clinton is certainly not the only one at fault – Dubya Bush and Obama followed the same policies – the fact is that Clinton blazed the trail and turned the Democrat party from protesting opposition into enthusiastic cheerleader.
Similarly from my point of view – while certainly Democrats are historically “pro” immigration; also that “replacement theory” is not entirely untrue – ultimately neither replacement theory (which is bullshit) nor legal immigration per se is anywhere near the primary cause of the decline in American self-sufficiency, manufacturing, quality of life/jobs etc.

Posted by: c1ue | Oct 11 2022 20:08 utc | 261

@Gully Foyle #233
Why does there need to be a plan?
History is filled with innumerable examples of decadence, stupidity and arrogance leading to all manner of bad outcomes even for the ruling classes of nations.

Posted by: c1ue | Oct 11 2022 20:12 utc | 262

Posted by: Tom UK | Oct 11 2022 13:15 utc | 54
“This begs the question as to why any nation in Europe would trust Russia on anything going forward.”
That actually isn’t what “begs the question” means. “Begs the question” means to avoid the question, usually be arguing in a circular fashion.

Posted by: RTX | Oct 11 2022 20:13 utc | 263

Why are they known as Perfidious Albion.
Asking for a friend ..

Posted by: blueswede | Oct 11 2022 20:18 utc | 264

“What is the US/NATO end game?”
«That is the essential question. I don’t know the answer, but I would like to hear opinions on this.»
To me it is pretty obvious: DOD/CIA bases and biowarfare labs on the borders between Russia and China, from which to destabilise China by funding. training, arming many brigades of “freedom fighters” inside China.
To achieve that, trigger regime change inside Russia, by first engineering a very slow and bloody ukranian defeat, and second a very slow and bloody ukrainian guerrilla war against the russians, from DOD/CIA bases and biowarfare labs inside NATO countries like Poland and Romania, from which to fund, train, arm many brigades of ruthenian “freedom fighters” attacking constantly inside Ukraine and Russia.
It is standard “domino theory”.
https://dgibbs.faculty.arizona.edu/brzezinski_interview
«Q : When the Soviets justified their intervention by asserting that they intended to fight against secret US involvement in Afghanistan, nobody believed them. However, there was an element of truth in this. You don’t regret any of this today?
B: Regret what? That secret operation was an excellent idea. It had the effect of drawing the Russians into the Afghan trap and you want me to regret it? The day that the Soviets officially crossed the border, I wrote to President Carter, essentially: “We now have the opportunity of giving to the USSR its Vietnam war.” Indeed, for almost 10 years, Moscow had to carry on a war that was unsustainable for the regime , a conflict that bought about the demoralization and finally the breakup of the Soviet empire.
Q: And neither do you regret having supported Islamic fundamentalism, which has given arms and advice to future terrorists?
B: What is more important in world history? The Taliban or the collapse of the Soviet empire? Some agitated Moslems or the liberation of Central Europe and the end of the cold war?
»
https://newleftreview.org/sidecar/posts/the-russia-problem
https://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/asia/1997-09-01/geostrategy-eurasia
«An alternative solution was put forward by Zbigniew Brzezinski when he suggested turning Russia into an assorted bouquet of territories, even advocating for the dismemberment of Siberia: ‘A loosely confederated Russia – composed of a European Russia, a Siberian Republic, and a Far Eastern Republic – would find it easier to cultivate closer economic relations with its neighbours.’»
On regime change Navalny would be appointed by the USA as president of Muscovy (European Russia), and I am sure somebody could be found for the presidencies of the Siberian and Far Eastern Republics.

Posted by: Blissex | Oct 11 2022 20:27 utc | 265

The US is expediting delivery of two National Advanced Surface-to-Air Missile Systems, (NASAMS), to Ukraine as quickly as possible, the White House said Tuesday.
The joint US-Norwegian systems will help fulfill Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky’s requests for more air defense support.

CNN
Well, maybe Oslo is inviting Kinzhals and Sarmats. Or, the Norwegian oil and gas fields in the North Sea might have problems, you know, the type NS1 and NS2 got.

Posted by: Paulg | Oct 11 2022 20:34 utc | 266

Why do you lie so prolifically? The UK is occupying Kosovo as we speak
Posted by: Arch Bungle | Oct 11 2022 17:38 utc | 210
Not to mention part of its neighbour, Ireland.

Posted by: Lemming | Oct 11 2022 20:36 utc | 267

Posted by: Don Bacon | Oct 11 2022 22:51 utc | 265
With all due respect to a decent point, there’s a difference between engaging dishonest media figures with large platforms who tell lies and distort vs. wasting time on anonymous obvious (and possibly paid) trolls in comments on a blog.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Oct 11 2022 20:37 utc | 268

Posted by: Blissex | Oct 11 2022 20:27 utc | 262
While all of that is true, I think james nailed the actual ‘end game’ – Western FIRE and energy sector arch-capitalist cabals want access to the markets and resources of Russia, China, Iran, Cuba, etc. and the MIC and US gov’t are their mafia enforcers on a global scale. Smedley Butler was invoked earlier in the thread, and what was true in the 30s is still true in the 2020s – It’s all about the Benjamins.

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Oct 11 2022 20:41 utc | 269

If the RF forces keeps on attacking the Ukr energy infrastructure for next 7-10 days, the Ukraine will fall back to dark ages. The Euro electricity grid will not be able to supply electricity to Ukraine. If there are any connections, even they will be attacked and destroyed. The EU countries are having a hard time keeping the electricity price down for their own consumers. They are having a hard time producing electricity these days, without the cheap Russian oil and gas.
Posted by: Paulg | Oct 11 2022 19:58 utc | 255
.
It didn’t take 7 to 10 days more with attacks!
Russia is just not attacking the right targets!
And that on purpose it seems?
But what in turn says that Russia still has to have the cruise missiles it needs if the plan is to proceed slowly up to the ultimatum ???
Although I do NOT believe that this is the plan, what will we see if and how the attacks will continue or if there will be calm in the hinterland?
If that were the case, well, it would be a pity about the almost wasted ammunition, because…. Putin (army leadership) was probably on the right track with that, which one can unmistakably conclude from the clamor in the EU (G7)!
Almost hysterical reaction ( silence ) in the USA to this.
Should say enough because this defeat totally doesn’t fit Biden’s media!
When the bridge was attacked, the US media celebrated loudly!
Quiet now…defeats, victories Biden just doesn’t need successful actions by Putin !!

Posted by: Mo3 | Oct 11 2022 20:46 utc | 270

@Paulg | Oct 11 2022 20:34 utc | 263

Well, maybe Oslo is inviting Kinzhals and Sarmats.

We already had explosions in Oslo, I heard it myself even if I was quite far away from it. Ask Stoltenberg about it, he will know.

Posted by: Norwegian | Oct 11 2022 20:46 utc | 271

“@ Cynica | Oct 11 2022 17:05 utc | 192
Once it becomes clear that someone with a different point of view is also not interested in other points of view, or maybe even in learning anything new in general, engaging them further does not contribute to the discussion.
You have a good point there. Those bloggers are not going to change their screwed-up minds and think correctly, as we do, so why bother.
I tell you what Cynica. I’ve noticed that b responds a lot to writers in the MSM who are way off base and never change. So one of us, let’s say you, call b on it and tell him to stop responding to wrong-thinking people. You tell b first and I’ll be right behind you (not saying how far).
Posted by: Don Bacon | Oct 11 ”
I disagree.
Logically you can not decry censorship then delete posts from anyone.
You support censorship when that is accepted as normal.
Similar with up/down voting to create group think. People with weak ego’s will attempt to please the group. Manipulative people will “play” the group with the proper language, conmen. People who have a unique outlook will either then be ignored or challenged. Isn’t that the root of all discussions?
Eventually a poster will simply stop posting because they are ignored.
Ok Voltaire never said this, but what the hell…
“I wholly disapprove of what you say—and will defend to the death your right to say it.”

Posted by: Gully Foyle | Oct 11 2022 20:50 utc | 272

In May 1963, the Norwegian Government proclaimed sovereignty over the Norwegian continental shelf. A new act was adopted establishing that any natural resources on the shelf belong to the Norwegian state, and that only the King (in practice the Government) has the authority to award licences for exploration and production. Despite Norway’s proclamation of sovereignty over large sea areas, it was still necessary to clarify the delimitation of continental shelf, and primarily the boundaries with Denmark and the UK. In March 1965, agreements were concluded on the delimitation of the continental shelf on the basis of the median line principle.

That was so long ago, and those fields are far away in the sea, more than the standard 12-mile distance. So, anyone (with Kinzhals, Sarmats) can claim those areas for themselves. Norway’s borders aren’t exactly agreed upon with former Soviet Union/Tsarist Russia for ages.

Posted by: Paulg | Oct 11 2022 20:51 utc | 273

“To me it is pretty obvious: DOD/CIA bases and biowarfare labs on the borders between Russia and China, from which to destabilise China by funding. training, arming many brigades of “freedom fighters” inside China.”

Posted by: Gully Foyle | Oct 11 2022 20:52 utc | 274

Source: https://www.kp.ru/daily/27456/4660594/
Why Russia is ironing Kyiv, Lvov and Shepetovka for the second day
Russia is forcing the US to peace in Ukraine
– Putin fired so many missiles at once across Ukraine that he probably saved them all summer. He has no more missiles. Run out. And this is good news, – Arestovich, an adviser to the office of the President of Ukraine, philosophized on Monday, reassuring the population of cities left without electricity, water and the Internet.
The reason for the explosions in Ukraine October 11, 2022
It’s Tuesday, October 11, 2022. And “calibers” again flew over the critical infrastructure of Ukraine . The second day of Armageddon for the Kyiv regime. What is the reason for the explosions in Ukraine?
– Kiev, Lviv, Rivne, Zaporozhye, Vinnitsa region, Odessa, Khmelnytsky … – the military commander of Komsomolka Kots bent his fingers in his telegram channel . – In honor of the birthday of the commander of the special operation, General Surovikin, we broadcast the song by VIA Queen “Don’t stop me now.” *
And the rockets didn’t stop.
Under attack were railway junctions (in Shepetovka and Pavlovgrad), thermal power plants (none of which Ukraine has built itself over the past 30 years – all this is the legacy of the USSR), military warehouses and the Metallurg sanatorium in Zaporozhye (which became a barracks for mercenaries) …
Ukrainian air defense was powerless. Because Zelensky transferred it to the front in order to ensure his “counterattack”, leaving the cities naked. And where the remaining rare anti-aircraft guns still launched their anti-missiles, they hit cars on the streets, then next to the pedestrian “Klitschko bridge” (which certainly could not be a target for the “caliber”).
– Give us normal air defense! – Zelensky begs the US and NATO.
And they will. Well, as “normal” – American, German. Let’s see how it will show itself against Russian missiles.
Or maybe they won’t be able to.
Because driving Ukraine into the 18th century – without railways, electricity and water – is not only a response to the terrorist attack on the Crimean bridge. This is forcing America to peace in Ukraine.
Everyone understands that negotiations with Kyiv are useless. Zelensky decides nothing. The collective Biden writes cheat sheets for him (as well as for President Joe himself). And only when America sees that Ukraine is no longer capable of fighting, there is nothing more to take from it, it is time to evacuate from Kyiv by a large helicopter, as from Kabul, the collective Biden will agree to peace.
And this means one thing – “calibers” will arrive in Ukrainian cities tomorrow.
*Don’t stop me now

Posted by: Oblomovka daydream | Oct 11 2022 20:53 utc | 275

What is the US/NATO end game?
That is the essential question. I don’t know the answer, but I would like to hear opinions on this.
Posted by: Norwegian | Oct 11 2022 19:14 utc | 237
I’ll respond with what’s been said by the NATO Ringmaster: Defeat and damage Russia as much as possible. He hasn’t said anything about destroying EU in the process, but reality says that’s also part of the plan. And when we travel further back in time, the #1 policy goal remains attaining Full Spectrum Dominance over the planet. NATO has also extended its reach to the Pacific Ocean, so we might as well say it remains intent on attaining that policy goal. Pardon me for invoking a Scorpion’s song since I finally saw them in concert Sunday, but Bad Boys Running Wild is the NATO gang, but Russia, China, and allies don’t intend to get out of their way.
However, as we’re seeing, NATO’s resources aren’t as vast as its adversaries; indeed, they’re deficient, so there’s no way to attain that policy goal. Their game foiled, how will the Straussians react? IMO, that’s THE question. The Europe they ruined trying to takedown Russia does them no good, and their Neoliberal Parasite allies have done a good job of wrecking the home base and fomenting revolt. But since they’re fanatics, they’ll keep trying until they’re completely burned down–eliminated. How that will happen is another question.
Russia’s strategy of luring as much NATO hardware into Ukraine so it can be destroyed has worked well, but NATO still needs to be rolled back to its 1997 lines or eliminated in order for Russia’s minimum security demands to be met. Some nations might voluntarily leave, but the Baltics and Poland certainly won’t, which presents a problem and another question: How many years will Russia wait for its Long Game–rolling back NATO–to attain its goals? (European civil society could be a huge help but they must awaken in numbers well beyond those that are now aware.)
I estimated Putin would remain Russia’s president until 2030, but it’s quite likely Russia’s Long game will last longer, so who will see it through to its end–and it will end.
As you read Norwegian, I don’t see an early end to this global struggle. I didn’t mention the ending of dollar hegemony as a factor because it’s extremely difficult to say when that will occur since it’s dependent on so many variables and participants. If the Outlaw US Empire suffers an economic collapse and/or revolt that overthrows the Borg/Swamp, then some sort of peace will prevail, but note that’s an if, not a when.

Posted by: karlof1 | Oct 11 2022 20:55 utc | 276

On the question of when things ran off the rail in the US, perhaps it is linked to one’s age, I am 75 and after years of study believe it was just before I was born and it’s been bad ever since.

Posted by: SwissArmyMan | Oct 11 2022 20:56 utc | 277

Posted by: c1ue | Oct 11 2022 20:08 utc | 258
Because this is a recurring theme and you tend to accuse me of favoring one side over the other, I feel the need to lead off with a (n obvious) disclaimer. Clinton and the Democrats since are no better than Republicans, in many ways worse. But you spin an overly simple narrative on the matter and it (despite your predictable accusation of the same forthcoming) smacks of partisanship.
That said, to your points #1-3:
1) Clinton is the one who pushed the WTO into accepting China: Technically true, but missing extremely important historical context.
Pre-Clinton – https://bushchinafoundation.org/u-s-china-relations-legacy/
Post-Clinton – https://thediplomat.com/2016/12/bush-gave-china-permanent-normal-trade-relations-status-with-the-us-15-years-ago-what-did-that-change/
The push to add China to the WTO and establish formal normalized trade relations was bi-partisan.
2) Clinton signed the acceptance of the law breaking Glass Steagall: Technically true but missing important historical contemporaneous context.
https://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_votes/vote1061/vote_106_1_00354.htm
The only “Nay” votes in Congress were from Democrats and independents. Nearly universal support from Republicans because it was Republicans making the case for many years prior. It was (another) Republican initiative that Clinton signed into law.
https://www.eastvalleytribune.com/opinion/letter-repeal-of-glass-steagall-act-was-a-republican-plan/article_8f8c2ad4-a683-11e1-ba2a-0019bb2963f4.html (an opinion that I share)
https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/wallstreet/weill/demise.html
3) Clinton passed NAFTA: Technically specious if not actually false, and missing much important qualifying information and, again, history.
Clinton did not negotiate NAFTA, nor did he sign it. But he did put his political prestige on the line to get it approved by Congress — even as two top Democrats, House Majority Leader Richard Gephardt (Mo.) and House Majority Whip David Bonior (Mich.), opposed it. In the House, NAFTA passed 234-200; 132 Republicans and 102 Democrats voted in favor of it. The Senate approved NAFTA 61-38, with the backing of 34 Republicans and 27 Democrats.
Once again, more Republicans favored NAFTA because it was a dream conceived of by Chamber of Commerce types, who have historically favored Republicans.
https://ourpresidents.tumblr.com/post/70317618681/today-in-history-president-george-bush-signs-the (A picture of George H.W. Bush signing NAFTA)
Since even though I provided a straight forward disclaimer up front, I think you’re still going to accuse me of trying to ‘defend’ Clinton or that I’m some sort of partisan (I never voted for Clinton or Obama – I did vote for Gore, the last time I voted for a D as president). I don’t understand your fixation on Clinton in this regard. No doubt at all, the Democrats are the party who betrayed the working class in favor of Wall Street, but the Republicans were always on Wall Street’s side and not that of the working class. Also no defending Biden’s “tough on crime” or pro-Iraq invasion stands, nor Clinton’s gutting of welfare or presiding over the repeal of Glass Steagall when he could have tried the veto (which I believe could have been overridden). G-S ha also been eroded significantly since it was first passed, usually through Republican (and NYC Democrat “limousine liberal”) channels.
Why do we have to keep rehashing this here?

Posted by: Tom_Q_Collins | Oct 11 2022 21:01 utc | 278

fyi – quote unquote
Not much of anyone is sleeping peacefully in the Ukraine these days
https://twitter.com/colonelhomsi/status/1579743851409199104
Arestovich August: “The missiles are completely finished, we are winning”
Arestovich September: “The warehouses are empty, Ukrainians can sleep peacefully”

Posted by: michaelj72 | Oct 11 2022 21:06 utc | 279

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/the-unz-report/
great source

Posted by: sean | Oct 11 2022 21:07 utc | 280

more extreme than you.
https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/moon-of-alabama/

Posted by: sean | Oct 11 2022 21:09 utc | 281

Swiss army man no. 274
I think you’re right. Early 1950’s were tough, but stable. Downhill from therein. I agree.

Posted by: ThusspakeZarathustra | Oct 11 2022 21:09 utc | 282

“To me it is pretty obvious: DOD/CIA bases and biowarfare labs on the borders between Russia and China, from which to destabilise China by funding. training, arming many brigades of “freedom fighters” inside China.”
What is the expected timeline?
If we assume that the so called DEEP STATE maintains a single unbroken generational goal, it makes sense.
But the problem I have with any End Game scenario, is well generational.
It is virtually impossible to maintain the same amount of commitment from a new generation as with yourself.
Look at the Bush’s, Poppy was the last genius of the group. W was Cheney’s bitch and Cheney is never going to die ( God forbid he uploads into a Musk created Metaverse). He went so far as to replace his pacemaker with an unhackable one.
But he will die and Liz has no pull.
Obama and the Clinton’s have run out of juice.
I understand racking up the war bucks while one still can. except any reasonable person will understand all good things come to an end.
And, as you pointed out the WEST has plans. But so does the EAST.
I can not see where this is all maneuvered to except China’s belt and Road and the rise of everyone versus the “northern white West”.
In my original post I forgot Turkey.
Russia, Turkey, India, China. US, NATO, EU all planning against each other.
On the rise Africa if they can be united), Middle and South America (Already semi untied under the cartels, so a single governing body is an acceptable step).
Demographics will play a very huge role over the next few decades, young supporting old. That slightly gives traditional cultures the edge over those who dump their old folks in care homes.
Two quotes to end on, first Jm Butcher distills that joke into
“You don’t have to run faster than the bear to get away. You just have to run faster than the guy next to you.”
Second, I’m not certain how historically accurate it is but politically it is brilliant
“Oct 6 1014
Czar Samuil of Bulgaria dies after an army of 15,000 of his men is returned, blinded by his enemy Emperor Basil of the Byzantine Empire. One out of every hundred of his men was permitted to keep one eye, such that they were able to return home. For this victory Basil earned the title Bulgaroctonus, slayer of Bulgars.”

Posted by: Gully Foyle | Oct 11 2022 21:13 utc | 283

Muito bom ler os artigos desse site e de seus comentaristas, pena eu não saber escrever em inglês para tentar contribuir melhor, abraços.

Posted by: Claudenir | Oct 11 2022 21:13 utc | 284

“On the question of when things ran off the rail in the US, perhaps it is linked to one’s age, I am 75 and after years of study believe it was just before I was born and it’s been bad ever since.
Posted by: SwissArmyMan”
If I had a choice I would make every particle in the universe repel every other.
The heart of the universe involves perfect Math and that is highly inconsiderate and unkind to matter.

Posted by: Gully Foyle | Oct 11 2022 21:17 utc | 285

“I think you’re right. Early 1950’s were tough, but stable. Downhill from therein. I agree.
Posted by: ThusspakeZarathustra
Only if you were a rich white male.

Posted by: Gully Foyle | Oct 11 2022 21:18 utc | 286

@253 Justly Observing,
Indeed I share your experience. The press in Europe is vomiting propaganda nearly continuously, mostly propaganda of an extremely puerile kind. A mixture of contempt of and hatred for all things Russian. With all the usual nouns and adjectives: the Russian “regime”, the Russian “thugs”, the dictator, the war crimes…And of course, insisting daily that the Russian army is a bunch of incompetent fools with old rusty machine guns with which they shoot pregnant women, that Putin has Parkinson disease and leukemia while his doppelgangers surely suffer from a thousand cancers. And young intellectual Russians flee the country en masse but even then you know, even the trillions of Putin-hating Russians are not te be trusted: better bomb them all into oblivion. That’s about the intellectual level of the main newspapers we now have.
And lot’s of Europeans fall for it, but not all. I find it very difficult to say how many people dare to question this “official narrative”: one encounters them but I guess many people are undecided or don’t dare to express themselves. People will take to the street to protest because of economic hardships, but anti-war protesting (as we had in the sixties and seventies, even if some of that was manipulated) seems out of fashion. You can protest while drunk, but you won’t while loaded with Cannabis of MDMA. You won’t reason about political double crossings when you are addicted to watching pornography or reality shows. We can but hope enough people in Europe will start to understand “before it is too late” and we start breathing radioactive dust (“on the beach” or wherever).

Posted by: anthony | Oct 11 2022 21:20 utc | 287

—————–FYI—————
I’ve translated the two most recent Lavrov interviews with Argumenty i Fakty from 8 October and CBS‘s “60 Minutes” from today and posted them as an article here.

Posted by: karlof1 | Oct 11 2022 21:23 utc | 288

1947 had a least two very significant long term events, the CIA and Israel were born.

Posted by: SwissArmyMan | Oct 11 2022 21:29 utc | 289

About the end game: I think they think using nuclear weapons is the end game. See the following piece of news:
MINSK, October 11. /TASS/. The Belarusian State Security Committee (KGB) is aware that the West is considering using tactical nuclear weapons against the republic and Russia, the organization’s chairman Ivan Tertel said during a Belarus-1 TV broadcast on Tuesday.
“According to the information that we extract from the Western military and political circles, they believe that they must not lose in any case (in the Ukrainian conflict – TASS). That is why the possibility of using tactical nuclear weapons or using those groups that are created for direct aggression against our country and against our allies is being discussed,” Tertel said.
On October 10, Belarusian President Alexander Lukashenko said that the NATO leadership, as well as a number of European countries were considering options for possible aggression against Belarus, including a nuclear strike. According to him, Belarus and Russia are beginning to build up a joint regional grouping of troops due to the escalation of the situation on the western borders of the Union State (of Russia and Belarus – TASS).

Posted by: JB | Oct 11 2022 21:32 utc | 290

Everyone likes the UK so much that when the queen died, black, native, Indian and Irish Twitter spent days absolutely destroying her, the monarchy and the UK. A real outpouring of grief that was. (It was beautiful)
Posted by: Lex | Oct 11 2022 17:17 utc

Must admit, I didn’t watch any of the Queen’s funeral because I don’t care. But you’d have to be a loser to celebrate the death of some old woman who had nothing to do with your life.
In reality, Trump was 1000000-times friendlier than Obama/Biden whose machinations have destroyed EU’s economy, something Borrell is apparently completely unable to see and admit, although he’s capable of seeing the folly of relying on the Outlaw US Empire for Europe’s security. Crazy World, indeed!
Posted by: karlof1 | Oct 11 2022 17:22 utc | 201

The EU was already planning to destroy the EU economy, it’s what Net Zero is for. Their cooperation with the Americans is a natural one, since both powers hate and fear their own people.

Posted by: ZX | Oct 11 2022 21:40 utc | 291

There has to be a point when a country, that is so widely disliked by its near neighbours, might start to reflect the problem may lie with them.
Posted by: Tom UK | Oct 11 2022 14:56 utc
Sound advice for you on this site. But alas self reflection is lost

Posted by: Hankster | Oct 11 2022 21:44 utc | 292

I Know Things | Oct 11 2022 15:49 utc | 143
Appreciate your posts.
We once had a guy – Gordog – who “knew things”.
He was only here briefly, like a comet.
Thinking barflies wish he’d make another pass. Illuminate us.
It’s always better to have posters who “know things”, rather than TomUK, who makes thinking barflies want to “throw things”.
Aarnon | Oct 11 2022 16:37 utc | 172
Good post. But *Biden* doesn’t realise anything… they have now placed Jill on stage to literally guide dog him off. They don’t have to JFK him, or impeach him, they can Amendment 25 him any time. Heels Up Harris is insurance against that.
It’s the crew that are behind Joe… Blinken, John Kirby, and the hidden slew of Operatives…extending back to Clinton and Bush, versions 41 + 43 that keep pressing forward. Their hubris and egos are gonna take us to the brink.
Sam | Oct 11 2022 16:45 utc | 176
“>>… target England, instead of poor innocent Poland.
Fuck that. Poland has more than earnt itself a place at the top of the queue for whatever punishment is delivered. The Baltic chihuahuas (and post NS2) this by rights includes Sweden Finland and Norway. But forgot them, leave them to destroy themselves.
But if UK gets hit…. Poland is painful and really is another Ukraine – it’s all mostly Galicia historically anyway.
james | Oct 11 2022 16:46 utc | 178
Thanks for the Helmer link. I forget about him. He’s hit an miss. He was excellent on Skripals.
Brother Ma | Oct 11 2022 16:50 utc | 181
I did chortle through my coffee at dopey Drowsey comment that Russia bombed its own bridge.
karlof1 | Oct 11 2022 17:07 utc | 195
EU energy dependence is Structural. There are ways to avoid the fate that’s now staring at them; but to avoid it, individual nations will need to abandon the EU/NATO and restore relations with Russia.
Hungary and Serbia at front of that queue. And Turkey learnt its lesson a few years back. Now knows working with Russia is less painful than working against.
Lol. Threatening to cut weapons sales to Saudi. Another tar baby. Apart from its *adventures* in Yemen, Saudi was buying weapons to placate the U$. Being forced to stop wasting money on the U$ war toys comes at exactly the right time for Saudi. They want invest in their futuristic city, Neom, anyway…
Oui | Oct 11 2022 17:25 utc | 202
I was going to mention the Israel Lebanon agreement re the gas field in reply to karlof1.
Few here know of the Israeli plan to have the East Med gasfield replace Russian gas to Europe. The problem…. Gas was too cheap to make development of East Med viable.
Well. That problem has been fixed….gas is expensive, the field can go ahead and Russia has been removed from the market…. Neat how these plans (that I thought craaazeee when I first read about it in maybe 2015.), have come to pass..
karlof1 | Oct 11 2022 17:34 utc | 207
Do you do requests? I’m interested in more about Putin wrestling Sakhalin fields back from Chevron. It seemed to me the Japanese central bank, and the yen, hit a brick wall pretty much straight after… coincidence? (There’s no coincidences, right?)
karlof1 | Oct 11 2022 18:04 utc | 214
Interesting. Yes. When Washington woke up… to find Vlad citing international terrorism…. That again is a UN legal term. The US Congress was jabbing it wanted to declare Russia a terrorist state, or a state sponsor of terrorism….. that seemed to fade. And here is Ukraine, celebrating terrorism.!
Damn. Puppet governments aren’t what they used to be. Now every buffoon has a twitter, and feels compelled to use it. In the bad/good old days, the Masters could keep the lid on adventures like blowing up pipelines and bombing bridges.
Now. Tier C assets post just to earn “cred” online.
karlof1 | Oct 11 2022 18:12 utc | 222
It’s not that TomYuk has diverging opinion. It’s that he’s an ignoramus that infuriates the bar.

Posted by: Melaleuca | Oct 11 2022 21:45 utc | 293

@Hereward | Oct 11 2022 17:05 utc | 191 Gibraltar
Ohhh, good you mention it. I wasn’t aware that there are sooo many boundaries in Europe which were dictated under such obviously one-sided, amoral conditions that the UN bothers to discuss the status of these territories. Please tell us more. Don’t forget to lament the inconveniency Britain faces now in taking advantage of the slave trade monopoly granted by the same Utrecht “contract”. – The facts that a wrong has a long history and that others did similar things does not make it right. I repeat: UK is the only country, which holds a colony on European soil. Gibraltar is Spanish. It is, by the way, a tax heaven rat bag. Very British, indeed.

Posted by: OttoE | Oct 11 2022 21:46 utc | 294

Parsing collateral casualties:
The Western(Ziocon) narrative seems now to be that the astonishingly few casualties from Russian strikes of some hundred missiles is somehow proof that the vile Putin is a bloodthirsty cretin targeting parks and playgrounds.
This tells me several things.
1. That facts don’t matter to the Zog media.
2. That the general population is perceived by Western leaders (G7)to be stupid.
3. That strong psychotic projection is at play, The Ukraine having bragged of murdering scores of civilian Russian speakers recently as well as the years of indiscriminate shelling resulting in graveyards full of children and others.

Posted by: Stones | Oct 11 2022 21:53 utc | 295

Dan Farrand | Oct 11 2022 19:46 utc | 248
I found myself thinking the same thing about Russian capacity to build large quantities of missiles. Its obvious they are good at it, but what is even more compelling to me is that the whole machine is like an elongated PC with the software in the operating system being the intellectual property which makes it valuable.
If you turn your mind to the US Patriot missile it is much the same product except that it seems the Russian one is quite superior. Given that its an inferior missile the fact that US arms makers can charge so much for them is a prime example of profiteeering sustained I am sure by all kinds of threats against American allies that if they even think about buying another product they will be toast.
What is happening in Ukraine is proving to the world that US missiles are not all they are cracked up to be. And more importantly Russian anti-missile technology is pretty good.
So if I was Saudi Arabia or the UAE and saw that I was selling oil in USD that can be confiscated in an instant I would be worried about my requirement to spend those same USD on overpriced underpowered Patriots that cannot even intercept Houthi drones.
And given the threats likely if I was to stop putting my oil revenues in USD banks and investments I would be exploring the possibility of buying much better for value Russian weapons to ensure protection from US attempts to arrange a colour revolution in my country.
I wonder what the Arabs are talking to Putin about in Moscow right now?

Posted by: Cyberhorse | Oct 11 2022 21:54 utc | 296

@ Gully Foyle – if I may
Endgame: The Manufacturing of Greta Thunberg: We Don’t Have Time

As this term is quickly becoming the quote du jour as a collective mantra to address the ongoing environmental disaster that can best be described as a nod to the obvious, it’s true that we don’t have time. We don’t have time to stop imperialist wars – wars being the greatest contributor to climate change and environmental degradation by far – but we must do so. Of course this is an impossible feat under the crushing weight of the capitalist system, a US war economy, and the push for a fourth industrial revolution founded on renewable energy. Yet, inconvenience has nothing to do with necessity in regards to addressing a particular situation. What is never discussed in regard to the so-called “clean energy revolution” is that its existence is wholly dependent on “green” imperialism – the latter term being synonymous with blood.
But that’s not what this series is about.
This series is about new financial markets in a world where global economic growth is experiencing stagnation. The threat and subsequent response is not so much about climate change as it is about the collapse of the capitalist economic system. This series is about the climate wealth opportunity of unprecedented growth, profits and the measures our elite classes will take in order to achieve it – including the exploitation of the youth.

Russia connected to the world would be absolutely the richest country in this world. Hence annihilate before build back better .

Posted by: js | Oct 11 2022 22:02 utc | 297

Our resident dopey Drowsey here @bar thinks Russia bombed its own bridge…
But Australian media say Putin is bombing Ukraine in “spiteful revenge”. It can’t be both.
The retaliation propaganda means – evidently – that Australia must now “step up” and send troops (to train Ukrainians).
I was bitching about sending those 20 Bushmasters. I’ll send another 20 if it means we don’t do something as stooopid as sending troops (to train Ukrainians).
Because I know a mission creep the minute I first see one…..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhYGzi0wUpc
“Australia is now considering sending troops to Europe to help train Ukrainian soldiers after a major deadly bombardment.”…

Posted by: Melaleuca | Oct 11 2022 22:13 utc | 298

“In 2003 U.S. ‘shock and awe’ in Baghdad killed at least 10,000 people.”
10,000?
In 2000 The population of Fallujah was 185,000. In 2003 the US allowed 70,000 women and children out of Fallujah but all men were prevented from leaving, and many women and children stayed. The city was then systematically destroyed and every living person killed – controversially using white phosphorous (aka napalm) – there were barely a handful of survivors. But what raises this workaday slaughter into one of the greatest crimes in history is that the US scattered both depleted and enriched uranium over the city and then let the women back in (I guess after a bit of fun and games with them). The pictures of indescribable tangles of mangled flesh and guts that these women then gave birth to will stay with me forever. That was just Fallujah, one small city in the war.
In 2017 after the bombing of Mosul, western sources estimated that 30,000 were left to die of thirst and injuries under the rubble. The actual number is presumably much higher.
It is very difficult not to wish unpleasant death on the perpetrators of these atrocities. The more special forces the US sends to Ukraine the better.

Posted by: Tim | Oct 11 2022 22:16 utc | 299

The full transcript of Maria Zakharova’s Briefing including the Q&As in Russian is finally complete, and a video is available at the top of the page. The English version is not even 1/10th completed and probably won’t be finished until tomorrow can be found here. None of the Q&A was available when I provided those earlier extracts. Number 18 relates to a collective set entitled, “On the destructive actions of the United States in the world,” and was asked by a member of Yahoo! News. What follows is that exchange and the one that follows all of which are classic Zakharova responses suitable for framing:

Question: Why do you call the explosion on the Crimean Bridge a terrorist attack, and not an act of war?
A: What war? I would like to decide before we whirl in an interesting “dance”. You said “act of war.” I’m not arguing, just clarifying. When did it start?
Q: In February 2022.
Answer: It doesn’t “beat”. The Kiev regime spoke about plans to destroy the Crimean bridge long before February 2022, and openly stated, threatened with sabotage and explosions. It was part of the ideological work with its own population – to promise citizens that there would be no bridge. That is why we call it a terrorist attack. This was said by the Kiev leadership. We are talking about a deliberate, long-cherished intention to destroy civilian infrastructure. And this was voiced when everyone was focused on the implementation of the Minsk agreements and the desire to end the crisis by political and diplomatic means.
There was a referendum in Crimea. You have the right not to recognize it. We recognize. We have that right. This is the territory of the Russian Federation. A civilian infrastructure facility was built there.
You represent Yahoo News. Let me give you an example that will be more understandable to you than the situation in Ukraine. The U.S. is now in Syria. They occupied part of a sovereign state. They do not build bridges or buildings there, but only facilities that allow them to pump Syrian oil. You didn’t know? Entire areas are occupied there. I can drop geolocation, addresses, passwords and appearances so that you know where the representatives of the United States and its units are (I do not know what they are called – private / official) and pump oil. We’ve been talking about this for a few years.
Tell me, is the United States at war with Syria? Damascus every day tells Washington to leave, to leave the Syrian infrastructure, resources, to stop pumping oil, to trade it, to sell it, including to militants. The U.S. says it has a right to be there. Was there a referendum? Do the people of Syria want to give territory to America? Join? No.
Second example. The US armed forces have been on the territory of Iraq for a long time, disposing of subsoil and energy resources. How do you qualify that? The state of war, the special operation – what was it called? There are so many political scientists, so many opinions, if we live according to the concept of a “rules-based world order” imposed by the West. We have always advocated the law, with clear wording, the ability to adequately assess each other’s steps and check with a single law. We are constantly denied this.
Question: I don’t know about Syria.
Maria Zakharova: How can you know if the United States does not talk about it, and journalists do not write.
Question: But we are talking about Ukraine, not about American forces.
Answer: We are talking about the commonality of approaches. You say you don’t recognize referendums. We recognize. Just gave an example. Many don’t recognize what the U.S. is doing. But the U.S. wants to and does. We need a unified approach. There is the UN Charter, international law. It says in black and white: there is sovereignty and territorial integrity, and there is the right of peoples to self-determination. This is complemented by the fact that most countries have subscribed to the fact that democracy is good. Everyone can have it with its own nuances, but in general – good. Democracy is the ability of people to legally and legally exercise their will in various spheres (political, economic, cultural, etc.). One of the ways to implement it is through elections. The other is referendums, plebiscites, etc. You can’t pretend that this doesn’t exist and didn’t happen. As much as I’d like to, it’s there.
I’ve heard that referendums are due in the UK soon. Why do people there have the right to do this, but in other countries they do not?
Question: But the referendums are held not somewhere in India, but in the UK. There is a difference.
A: Thank you for saying. Crimea has held more than one referendum. In the 1990s, the legitimate (we recognized them) authorities in Kiev did not allow their citizens to hold a referendum. All of them were not recognized. But there is a referendum that even the United States has recognized, in the late 1980s in the Soviet Union, on whether the republics want to remain inside the USSR or gain independence. Then the United States, the European Economic Union, all countries recognized. The republics said they wanted to stay together. This was violated, no one referred to referendums, the USSR collapsed, No one asked Crimea where he wanted to be (although he had the right to express). Since 1990, Crimea has been fighting for the right to hold a referendum. As part of Ukraine, he did it. The Kiev authorities did not give the go-ahead then, but they were illegal. At that time, the legitimate government was overthrown in the course of an unconstitutional coup d’état.
You could say that the people of Ukraine rebelled and decided to carry out a coup. No. There was interference from Washington, Berlin, Paris, London, the EU as a whole. All of them: ministers, high representatives of foreign policy, even some presidents walked around the Maidan and stimulated people to unconstitutional actions. Here’s the story.
Question: The SBU has put you on the wanted list. Could you share your impressions?
Answer: I can tell you where I am. In the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Russia, in the hall of the Press Center. I didn’t hide it. There was an announcement.
Q: Are you not afraid that this will affect your movements around the world? In general, for life?
Maria Zakharova: Are you not afraid that in the center of the European continent there is a regime that professes extremism and terrorism as a state ideology? Do you think they’ll stop someday? People who do not deny, but implement and “glorify” such a method of doing business, never refuse it. They themselves have shrugged off all the ways to conduct negotiations, a political, diplomatic, international legal method of resolving the situation. We signed some papers, came up with some decrees. We chose only this method.
Aren’t you afraid? It is the center of Europe. Everyone believes that this is far away, it will not affect anyone. Better study history. Look at what happened to other areas of American “experiments.” They first created monsters, and then they got out of washington’s control. Remind? Al-Qaeda, W. bin Laden, ISIS, which appeared on the ruins of the Iraqi state. Nothing new. The world went through it all. At first, everyone believed that they would not be affected, but only those whom extremists and terrorists threatened. And then they didn’t know where to hide or what to do. When the ideology of misanthropy, terror and extremism appears somewhere in the world, the world must unite, close ranks and say a resolute “no” to such manifestations. Otherwise, it will be a universal problem. At the instigation of the West, it is.

And the final Q&A:
“Question: You said what signals the United States sends. Is Russia sending any signals to the United States about the possibility or impossibility of dialogue?
“Maria Zakharova: Not all the signals we send to the United States can be voiced. Not everything for the airwaves.”
There are some other very good Q&As, so I highly suggest awaiting the English transcript unless you can machine translate.

Posted by: karlof1 | Oct 11 2022 22:23 utc | 300